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Speaker 1: Very pleased once again on the warning to be joined

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Speaker 1: by the Congressman from the tenth District of the Empire

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Speaker 1: State of New York, Dan Goldman. Welcome, Congressman, Thanks so

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Speaker 1: much for having me.

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Speaker 2: Steve. Great to be with you as always.

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Speaker 1: Let me ask you a question about the forthcoming impeachment,

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Speaker 1: kangaroo court, debacle, disgrace, whatever it is you wish to

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Speaker 1: think of it as that the country will be subjected

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Speaker 1: to regarding the president's impeachment by the radical Republican House.

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Speaker 1: Why is the president being impeached? And I asked that

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Speaker 1: very narrowly. What if you were the spokesman for the

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Speaker 1: Republican cause here right he's being tell me why they're

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Speaker 1: impeaching the president of the United States.

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Speaker 2: Well, the real reason why is because Donald Trump wants

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Speaker 2: them to and they operate at his direction.

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Speaker 1: He could say what would they do? Like what what? What?

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Speaker 1: What is it? Before we rebutted, well, like what is it?

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Speaker 1: They are alleging at the at the core here.

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Speaker 2: So the allegations are somewhat convoluted, in part because they

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Speaker 2: change seemingly weakly because there is not no actual evidence

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Speaker 2: to support them. But what they are essentially saying is

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Speaker 2: that that Joe Biden knew. I mean, I think the

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Speaker 2: best case scenario is Joe Biden assisted his son to

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Speaker 2: use Joe Biden's power and connections to benefit him financially

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Speaker 2: with business dealings around the world. And that you know,

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Speaker 2: I cannot even say this with a straight face because

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Speaker 2: this was entirely debunked and delegitimized during the first impeachment

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Speaker 2: where I was the lead counsel. But they're going back

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Speaker 2: to this Barisma allegation that then Vice President Biden encouraged

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Speaker 2: Ukraine to fire its prosecutor general while Hunter Biden was

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Speaker 2: on the board of Barisma. It is, in fact the

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Speaker 2: exact opposite. And we had so many witnesses in that

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Speaker 2: first impeachment who testified to this, who were Ukraine experts,

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Speaker 2: who were on the ground in Ukraine in the embassy,

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Speaker 2: who knew in great detail everything that was going on,

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Speaker 2: and they all said that the reason why, not only

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Speaker 2: Vice President, but official US policy, a bipartisan group of senators,

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Speaker 2: the EU, the IMF, everybody wanted this prosecutor general to

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Speaker 2: be removed because he was not prosecuting corruption, including Barisma.

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Speaker 2: And now there's evidence during this investigation from Debon Archer,

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Speaker 2: who is Hunter Biden's business partner, was also on the

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Speaker 2: board of Barisma, that Barisma believed that that Prosecutor General

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Speaker 2: Choken was helpful to Barisma because he was corrupt, and

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Speaker 2: that his removal was bad for Barisma. So the only

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Speaker 2: real evidence of Joe Biden's involvement in any official action

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Speaker 2: that has any tangential connection to Hunter Biden was actually

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Speaker 2: bad for Hunter Biden.

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Speaker 1: So I think this is a very important point here

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Speaker 1: as we continue on in the conversation, and I want

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Speaker 1: to put a pen in it. There's no actual evidence

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Speaker 1: as described by what we would consider as evidence in

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Speaker 1: this country, going back literally to the colonial era. There

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Speaker 1: is hearsay, there is smearing, there is accusations, there is

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Speaker 1: wish casting. There's even the reality that and I know

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Speaker 1: that you are in this camp that I don't want

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Speaker 1: to see any of the highest leaders of the country's

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Speaker 1: kids working for any foreign companies right doing any type

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Speaker 1: of lobbying across the board. But that being the case,

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Speaker 1: Hunter Biden is not alone in that A and B.

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Speaker 1: There's no evidence whatsoever of there being any proof written, email, electronic,

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Speaker 1: direct testimony at all. Am. I am I correct about that.

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Speaker 2: You are correct. One of the problems that I think

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Speaker 2: we keep running into is, well, I don't know that's

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Speaker 2: a problem. One of the things that the Republicans are

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Speaker 2: doing is they continue to cite the types of evidence

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Speaker 2: that they have, So they will say, we have bank records,

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Speaker 2: we have emails, we have testimony, and it all shows

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Speaker 2: that Joe Biden or Hunter Biden was engaged in all

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Speaker 2: of these crimes. I mean, Chairman Comer goes on television

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Speaker 2: and starts accusing Hunter Biden of committing the crime of

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Speaker 2: a fair of violation, for failing to register as a lobbyist,

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Speaker 2: of money laundering, of these very serious crimes. Now, I

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Speaker 2: was a federal prosecutor for ten years. I charged those charges.

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Speaker 2: There's nothing remotely close to any evidence to support that.

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Speaker 2: But what they do is they go from the types

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Speaker 2: of evidence to the charges without actually specifying any direct,

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Speaker 2: credible evidence linking the two.

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Speaker 1: So I want to stop right there because and I

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Speaker 1: want to go slowly through this before we kind of

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Speaker 1: quicken up to conversation, because I think this is important.

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Speaker 1: If you were sitting into Congress in nineteen seventy four

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Speaker 1: and you are a Richard Nixon dead ender, I'll never

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Speaker 1: vote to impeach the president. It certainly would have been

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Speaker 1: over uh, a fact that would be indisputable by both sides,

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Speaker 1: that there are recordings, there are tapes, and therefore evidence

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Speaker 1: right that some of us think are grounds for high

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Speaker 1: crimes and misdemeanors. You go, you go forward to Bill Clinton,

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Speaker 1: and you look at though it was approached with tremendous hypocrisy, Right,

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Speaker 1: there's a there's an actual argument to be made, right, President,

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Speaker 1: President lied under oath, no matter what what side you're

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Speaker 1: on in this, and I think we're across an important line.

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Speaker 1: Tell me why I'm wrong here? Am I? Am I

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Speaker 1: watching the state, the powers of the state be directed

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Speaker 1: against citizens of the United States by elected office holders

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Speaker 1: abusing their power. Am I watching an abuse of power

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Speaker 1: with regard to Hunter Biden in the Justice Department? Because truthfully,

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Speaker 1: I don't understand why the tax delinquency for Hunter Biden

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Speaker 1: seems to be treated as a crime uniquely among three

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Speaker 1: hundred and forty million American citizens, just like the gun

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Speaker 1: crime or charges. And secondly, right, you have a chairman

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Speaker 1: of a Congressional committee comer who routinely makes criminal allegations

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Speaker 1: as a committee chairman investigating matters of fact. And you

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Speaker 1: have all of this playing out at a moment when

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump, who commands everything behind the scenes, is promising

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Speaker 1: mass deportations, concentration camps, and the locking up of political prisoners.

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Speaker 1: So before the hurricane reaches the shores, the weather picks up,

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Speaker 1: and I guess unimpeachably. So to me, what I'm watching

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Speaker 1: is the level levers of the state, the power of

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Speaker 1: the state, the substantial powers of the legislative branch, the

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Speaker 1: Justice Department be leveled in a way that is indisputably

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Speaker 1: seems to me singular venomous, directed for political purposes at

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Speaker 1: the president, but more ominously the destruction of his surviving son,

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Speaker 1: who is a larger societal matter. No matter what it

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Speaker 1: is that he has done, we should all want him

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Speaker 1: to live in grace and recovery, or at least I

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Speaker 1: thought that's what he's employee. He's never going to be

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Speaker 1: a government employee. He's never gonna elected office, he's never

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Speaker 1: going to hold a position of public trust. But it

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Speaker 1: doesn't mean and never did, by the way, right, he

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Speaker 1: did from children and well he was he was an

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Speaker 1: officer in the US Navy, and he he he was

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Speaker 1: he was forced out. But but you're he will never

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Speaker 1: hold a position of public trust, So we should decency.

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Speaker 1: Maybe we have a lot of people recovering from addiction

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Speaker 1: in the country. You want people to be able to

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Speaker 1: contribute positively, and and certainly as a guy in his

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Speaker 1: early fifties, he has a lot of room for that.

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Speaker 1: But but but is is am I? Am I watching right?

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Speaker 1: That something that that it was impossible to conceive of

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Speaker 1: growing up. That am I watching the state target an

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Speaker 1: attack a citizen who happens to be the president's son

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Speaker 1: with kind of a reverse fortunate son syndrome, where we're

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Speaker 1: going to come after your family. This is the mob

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Speaker 1: era of politics, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: It's shocking and startling, and I think you capture it

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Speaker 2: very well. This is truly the weaponization of the federal

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Speaker 2: government by the House of Republicans. And the irony, of course,

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Speaker 2: is that they created a subcommittee called the Weaponization of

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Speaker 2: the Federal Government, which has not uncovered any weaponization of

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Speaker 2: the federal government during the Biden presidency, although we have

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Speaker 2: touched upon a lot of weaponization during the Trump presidency.

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Speaker 2: But this is absolutely abusing their power for purely political

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Speaker 2: purposes and in an effort not just to muddy up

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Speaker 2: the president, but to actually imprison a private citizen. And

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Speaker 2: the House Republicans wrote a letter to hunter Biden's judge

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Speaker 2: to urging her to reject his plea deal.

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Speaker 1: That is gross.

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Speaker 2: Improper conduct for the legislative branch to try to interfere

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Speaker 2: in an ongoing prosecution in the executive branch in the

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Speaker 2: Department of Justice. And it is slanderous for sure, because

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Speaker 2: it is so baseless and frivolous, and because whatever Hunter

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Speaker 2: Biden may have done, and there's no question that he

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Speaker 2: he engaged in misconduct. The Department of Justice did an

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Speaker 2: investigative colonoscopy on him for five years, and we had

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Speaker 2: testimony in the Oversight Committee. They interviewed over sixty witnesses,

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Speaker 2: They got hundreds of thousands of documents. And I can

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Speaker 2: tell you that for a two million dollar tax fraud investigation,

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Speaker 2: that is a tremendous amount of resources.

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Speaker 1: That is a lot of time cost. If you had

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Speaker 1: to put a number on it, it's hard.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know how you measure it, but

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Speaker 2: I mean it looked it was thousands of man hours,

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Speaker 2: thousands of man hours, and they ultimately concluded that he

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Speaker 2: did not commit a far a violation, that he was

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Speaker 2: not lobbying on behalf of anybody, even though he had

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Speaker 2: business interests overseas, and that he was not money laundering,

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Speaker 2: and that he was not doing any of these other

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Speaker 2: crimes outside of the possession of the gun and the

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Speaker 2: potential tax fraud. And so it's he should be dealt with.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the Department of Justice should do it.

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Speaker 2: I do think that the Republicans have had an influence

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Speaker 2: on undoing the police agreement, which by the way, was

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Speaker 2: only different because of Hunter Biden's concern that Donald Trump

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Speaker 2: would become president and would retributively and politically prosecute him.

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Speaker 1: But there's no.

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Speaker 2: Evidence connecting any of that activity to President Biden. And

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Speaker 2: we've been doing this a year. They will claim this week, Steve,

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Speaker 2: the Republicans will claim that they need an formal impeachment

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Speaker 2: inquiry because they've been quote stonewallt. I can tell you

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Speaker 2: because I led the impeachment of Donald Trump. Donald Trump

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Speaker 2: provided zero documents to the impeachment investigation.

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Speaker 1: Zero.

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Speaker 2: The Biden administration has provided close to seventy five thousand

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Speaker 2: documents from the archives, two thousand pages of Treasury reports

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Speaker 2: and FBI documents, more than ten government witnesses. They've obtained

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Speaker 2: thirty six or seven thousand pages of bank records. There's

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Speaker 2: no dearth of material. There's just a dearth of inculpatory evidence.

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Speaker 2: And they are trying to use smoke and mirrors and

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Speaker 2: to gaslight the American people into thinking that because they

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Speaker 2: either have a lot of documents that he Joe Biden,

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Speaker 2: did something, or that because a couple of witnesses, lower

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Speaker 2: level witnesses at the Department of Justice whose bosses have

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Speaker 2: already testified, are not being allowed to testify, that somehow

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Speaker 2: that's obstruction. There's no new evidence here. From the first

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Speaker 2: impeachment hearing in September, where their own witnesses, the Republican

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Speaker 2: known witness Jonathan Turley, who has turned into a complete

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Speaker 2: hack for the Congressional Republicans, even that said himself that

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Speaker 2: there is not insufficient evidence to move forward with impeachment.

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Speaker 2: And yet here they are moving forward with impeachment even

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Speaker 2: though they have gotten no new evidence. The only evidence

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Speaker 2: that they have cited since then are loans that Joe

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Speaker 2: Biden gave to his brother and his son and that

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Speaker 2: we're paid back.

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Speaker 1: Let me ask you, Let me ask you this question,

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Speaker 1: which is that new Speaker of the House. And I

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Speaker 1: don't say this in a recriminatory fashion, but he believes

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Speaker 1: and has said people in dinosaurs walked around together. A

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Speaker 1: couple thousand years ago. Somebody asked him, what do you believe?

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Speaker 1: He points at a Bible and he says every thing

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Speaker 1: in that just did an interview where he's not Aaron

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Speaker 1: but instead Moses leading his people out of the Promised Land.

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Speaker 1: And I wonder how this implicates the impeachment. Is he

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Speaker 1: a guy who believes the ends justify the means? Or

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Speaker 1: is he someone who simply will believe anything and is

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Speaker 1: addled enough to chase down every conspiracy, down every rabbit hole,

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Speaker 1: and is a nut with power who lives in an

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Speaker 1: alternate reality. What is the zeitgeist in the House Republicans

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Speaker 1: right now? Is it a vengeful bloodlust We're out to

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Speaker 1: get them for cynicism and power. Is it a real

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Speaker 1: devotional cause, a religiously tinged effort to fulfill God's word

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Speaker 1: as they are about to invoke on the Great Kangaroo

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Speaker 1: Court of early twenty twenty four, on the unjustified impeachment

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Speaker 1: of a president directed from Mara Lago. What is the

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Speaker 1: zeitgeist inside the House Republican conference right now when you see.

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Speaker 2: Your colleagues, well, I think you have to frame it

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Speaker 2: with the understanding that this Republican majority has arguably been

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Speaker 2: the most inept majority in the history of the House

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Speaker 2: of Representatives.

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Speaker 1: Say something, and I just as a historical matter rights

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Speaker 1: it is almost almost certain, almost certainly.

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Speaker 2: Trip because we obviously had the removal of a speaker,

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Speaker 2: but they have other They have not passed on their

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Speaker 2: own any bills that have become legislation other than a

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Speaker 2: continuing resolution, a few, you know, smaller than There are

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Speaker 2: plenty of suspension bills and the bill to lift the

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Speaker 2: debt ceiling. But they cannot pass their own appropriations bills.

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Speaker 2: They cannot pass anything that is going to get signed,

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Speaker 2: passed by the Democratic Senate and signed by the President.

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Speaker 2: They have done nothing to help the American people, and

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Speaker 2: they show no signs of being able to because they

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Speaker 2: do not even bring substantive bills to the floor anymore. So,

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Speaker 2: because of that ineptitude, they are trying to distract the

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Speaker 2: American people through the investigative pathway through a complete bogus

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Speaker 2: sham impeachment that they hope will take all the headlines

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Speaker 2: that will provide fodder for Donald Trump against President Biden,

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Speaker 2: and that will hopefully, in their mind, give them something

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Speaker 2: to talk about that they did, because right now, as

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Speaker 2: chip Roy said on the House floor, he doesn't have

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Speaker 2: one thing to point to that this Republican Congress has done.

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Speaker 2: And so they are in a pickle because they can't

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Speaker 2: actually help the American people. They can't lower costs, they

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Speaker 2: can't create jobs, they can't they really can't do anything

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Speaker 2: that makes the lives of the American people better because

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Speaker 2: they're unwilling to compromise. And therefore they're trying to distract

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Speaker 2: with this gas lighting and this bogus investigation, and there's

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Speaker 2: just there's no evidence and there's no basis to move

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Speaker 2: forward with an impeachment inquiry, and.

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Speaker 1: It really sullies a very very.

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Speaker 2: Precious power in the Constitution, the impeachment powers. And you know,

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Speaker 2: you pointed out the Nixon impeachment, the Clinton impeachment lying

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Speaker 2: under oath. You know, in the Ukraine impeachment, we had

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Speaker 2: seventeen fact witnesses come in testify under oath and painted

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Speaker 2: a very clear picture that Donald Trump used his power,

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Speaker 2: abused his power as president for his own personal partisan gains.

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Speaker 2: And you can, you know, come up, you can say, oh,

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Speaker 2: that's not a high crime, that's not a misdemeanor. But

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Speaker 2: it was a fact based investigation that very clearly showed

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Speaker 2: as many Republican senators who even voted to convict him

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Speaker 2: said that he abused his power, but that was based

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Speaker 2: on evidence that was not based on allegations. And right now,

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Speaker 2: if you look at the evidence, Joe Biden did nothing wrong,

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Speaker 2: much less a high crime or misdemeanor.

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Speaker 1: I want to ask you one last thing, and it

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Speaker 1: if you sat down, we wanted your Republican colleagues, and

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Speaker 1: maybe maybe maybe it's completely hypothetical and that it's not

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Speaker 1: a person you can sit down with on the Chip

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Speaker 1: Roy wing, the Marjorie Taylor Green wing, But you just

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Speaker 1: set at a human level. Boy, there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: people in this country that have an addicted relative in

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Speaker 1: their in their in their families.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: It's it's tens of millions of people, and you just

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Speaker 1: said to them, what do you want? He never he

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Speaker 1: never served in government. How long do you want Tom

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Speaker 1: locked up for? Do you do you want them to

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Speaker 1: pick up a crack pipe again? Do you want them

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Speaker 1: to go back down the addiction rabbit hole? Or you

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Speaker 1: are you hoping that he kills himself? Would that satisfy you?

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Speaker 2: What? What? What?

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Speaker 1: What do you want as an as an outcome right

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Speaker 1: from all of this from on our body?

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Speaker 2: Like?

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Speaker 1: What will satisfy you in terms of his destruction?

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Speaker 2: Right? What?

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Speaker 1: And I asked that, I asked that sincere sincerely in

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Speaker 1: a disoriented way. Right, It's that they're coming after him.

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Speaker 1: He's a person in life who's who's privileged in one

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Speaker 1: way but has suffered greatly, has had a lot of problems, right.

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Speaker 1: I mean, if there's a target for destruction, right, like

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Speaker 1: somebody you just want to get and just burned down.

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Speaker 1: I don't understand why the impulse would be to make

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Speaker 1: it Hunter Biden, But but apparently it is. But but

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Speaker 1: do you have any sense right at a at a

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Speaker 1: at a human level, from withinside that what would satisfy them?

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Speaker 1: What do they want? What does victory look like to them?

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Speaker 2: Victory for this Republican Party is power. It is political power.

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Speaker 2: That is all that they care about. And they will

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Speaker 2: use any means necessary, including to try to destroy a

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Speaker 2: private citizen who happens to be the son of the president,

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Speaker 2: whose brother died, whose mother and sister died in a

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Speaker 2: car crash when he was a baby, his brother died

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Speaker 2: of cancer, which led to a lot of his addiction problems,

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Speaker 2: and it's all for political purposes. Now, if you actually

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Speaker 2: were to put the Republicans on a lie detector test,

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Speaker 2: I think some of them would absolutely be true believers.

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Speaker 2: And you know, Marjorie Taylor Green is a true believer.

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Speaker 2: What you see on TV is what you see behind

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Speaker 2: the scenes. But there would be a lot of Republicans

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Speaker 2: who would acknowledge that. And there are a lot of

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Speaker 2: Republicans who acknowledge that this investigation is a failure, and

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Speaker 2: that they I would recognize that the means justified the ends,

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Speaker 2: if it means that Donald Trump wins the presidency and

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Speaker 2: if the House Republicans can hold on to the majority,

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Speaker 2: any means necessary.

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Speaker 1: I just want to close it by saying what Congressman

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Speaker 1: Dan Goldman has just said here is extremely important, and

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Speaker 1: I urge everybody who hears it to understand it and

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Speaker 1: to spread it. What they're doing demonstrates fearlessness, and it's

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Speaker 1: a warning, and it's saying you oppose our quest for power,

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Speaker 1: we'll destroy you. Look what we did to the son

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Speaker 1: of the President of the United States, and if we

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Speaker 1: can do it to him, we can do it to you,

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Speaker 1: to anyone you love, to anybody you care about. This

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Speaker 1: is intimidation, It is wrong. It is an American and

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Speaker 1: it is contrary to every spirit of Americanism, a fairness

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Speaker 1: of justice that there has ever been. Thank you very

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Speaker 1: much for your time, and I hope you'll come back

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Speaker 1: and keep us updated because this is as much a

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Speaker 1: psychological thriller as it is a political one, where the

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Speaker 1: stakes are extremely high heading into a year that I

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Speaker 1: think is going to be as momentous a year in

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Speaker 1: this country's history as we've had in a very, very

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Speaker 1: long time.

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Speaker 2: You put it very well, Steve, That's exactly right, and

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Speaker 2: it's always a pleasure to chat with you. I think

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Speaker 2: the perspective that you bring is incredibly important because you've

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Speaker 2: been on all sides of this, and you've seen this

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Speaker 2: Republican Party transform from the Grand Old Party to a

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Speaker 2: maga party that is unrecognizable. And I believe that we

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Speaker 2: need to cut the head off the snake, and I

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Speaker 2: don't mean that literally, but that figuratively. Donald Trump needs

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Speaker 2: to be removed from public life once and for all.

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Speaker 2: And I'm optimistic that once that happens, that the rest

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Speaker 2: of the snake can, over time shrivel up and we

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Speaker 2: can get back to, you know, disagreeing about policy, but

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Speaker 2: all focused on doing what's best for America. And that

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Speaker 2: is not what this Republican Party.

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Speaker 1: Is right now. Congressman Dan Goldman, thank you, thank you,

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Speaker 1: thank you for watching. Make sure you subscribe to our

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