WEBVTT - Make Vulnerability Your Superpower (with NBA star Kevin Love)

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<v Speaker 1>Pushkin as a happiness researcher. I'm grateful to live in

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<v Speaker 1>twenty twenty five, a time when there's been an explosion

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<v Speaker 1>of conversations about the importance of taking care of your

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<v Speaker 1>well being. But we're honestly still in the early stages

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<v Speaker 1>of breaking the silence around to mental health issues that

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<v Speaker 1>so many of us struggle with, and in some communities,

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<v Speaker 1>the stigma against dealing with these issues still runs deep. Men,

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<v Speaker 1>for example, are much less likely than women to seek

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<v Speaker 1>counseling or treatment for mental health challenges, and among athletes,

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<v Speaker 1>that stigma can be even higher. I've seen this firsthand

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<v Speaker 1>with my student athletes at Yale. Many of them hold

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<v Speaker 1>themselves to incredibly high standards, both in the classroom and

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<v Speaker 1>on the field. Many of them worry that admitting to

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<v Speaker 1>mental struggles could seem like a weakness or proof that

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<v Speaker 1>they're not fit to play. It often takes someone accomplished, respected,

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<v Speaker 1>and at the top of their game to model vulnerability

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<v Speaker 1>and open these conversations up for others. Fortunately, I'm lucky

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<v Speaker 1>to have one of those figures here today, five time

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<v Speaker 1>NBA All Star Kevin Love, who I was thrilled to

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<v Speaker 1>speak with even though I'm a Boston Celtics fan.

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<v Speaker 2>I love having these conversations because I get to learn,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, if you're not so against the Miami Heat,

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<v Speaker 2>that we can have.

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<v Speaker 3>That conversation continue. Yeah, okay.

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<v Speaker 1>This week marks the beginning of Kevin's eighteenth season in

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<v Speaker 1>the NBA. I should note that even though he was

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<v Speaker 1>playing for the Miami Heat at the time this was recorded,

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<v Speaker 1>he was recently traded to the Utah Jazz. I spoke

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<v Speaker 1>with Kevin about his experiences with grief, anxiety, and depression

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<v Speaker 1>and how he went from keeping those struggles private to

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<v Speaker 1>becoming a public leader in the mental health space.

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<v Speaker 4>So we usually start with an introduction, So can I

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<v Speaker 4>just have you introduce yourself and to all our listeners.

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<v Speaker 2>What you do. Yeah, last night we had to describe

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<v Speaker 2>how we looked, you know, people with disabilities in the

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<v Speaker 2>blind Oh yeah, funny, Like I'm Kevin Love. I'm thirty six,

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<v Speaker 2>but I have gray hair and blue eyes and very tall,

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<v Speaker 2>very tall, and yeah, I was like I'm six. I

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<v Speaker 2>literally did say that. I'm like, I'm six a plus,

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<v Speaker 2>but my contract height once said I was six' ten

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<v Speaker 2>and MAYBE i, Shrunk BUT i. Digress, Sorry Now I'm

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<v Speaker 2>Kevin love ball, player professional athlete in THE nba for seventeen.

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<v Speaker 2>Years i'll be haating into my eighteenth. Year i'm not

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<v Speaker 2>the best at, intros But i'm a father of two,

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<v Speaker 2>girls one that just turned two years, old another that

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<v Speaker 2>is four, Months my Wife, kate and a beautiful six

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<v Speaker 2>year old puppy Named. Vestri who is you. Know they

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<v Speaker 2>say you live longer when you have. Dogs so very

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<v Speaker 2>good for my mental. Life so it gets me. Outside

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<v Speaker 2>and that's what unconditional love looks.

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<v Speaker 4>Like So i'm curious to hear how you get started in.

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<v Speaker 4>BASKETBALL i understand that a lot of. Ways it started

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<v Speaker 4>with your Dad's, yeah tell me about.

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<v Speaker 2>That, Yeah so my dad he played three years The

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<v Speaker 2>university Of, oregon was drafted ninth in nineteen seventy one

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<v Speaker 2>by The Baltimore. Bullets played for The lakers as, well

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<v Speaker 2>played for The, hawks played for The spurs and short.

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<v Speaker 2>Stints and you, know he was my first. Hero he

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<v Speaker 2>was like a giant to. Me he was a protector

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<v Speaker 2>and he's six'. NINE imposing, i mean it would have

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<v Speaker 2>been great IN today's nba because he, could run he,

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<v Speaker 2>could jump he. Could shoot have photos that, you know

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<v Speaker 2>date back to nineteen eighty EIGHT when i, was Born

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<v Speaker 2>and i'm in my stroller with, the basketball and, you

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<v Speaker 2>know from, Then on i'm just kind of looking at

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<v Speaker 2>everything that my, dad did try to, emulate HIM and

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<v Speaker 2>i just wanted to just mimic his every move and

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<v Speaker 2>just wanted basketball to be a part of.

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<v Speaker 3>My life it was truly my.

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<v Speaker 4>FIRST love i can imagine that makes you love basketball.

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<v Speaker 4>A lot i can also imagine that comes with a lot.

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<v Speaker 2>Of, pressure yeah it, certainly did Especially in portland being

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<v Speaker 2>not a. BIG city i was a big fish in

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<v Speaker 2>a small pond, very early and that came with a lot,

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<v Speaker 2>of expectation and with a father who played at the,

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<v Speaker 2>highest level compete at the, highest level having Gone To,

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<v Speaker 2>universus oregon just a little bit down the Road, in

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<v Speaker 2>eugene there was certainly a lot. Of pressure i'm still

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<v Speaker 2>learning to unpack the weight of expectations for the last

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<v Speaker 2>at least, twenty years because when it came to my

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<v Speaker 2>early teenage years in primarily, high school there was certainly

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<v Speaker 2>a lot. Of that so there was a lot, of

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<v Speaker 2>pressure and a lot Of that i'm. Thankful for but

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<v Speaker 2>on the other side, of that there was an ugliness,

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<v Speaker 2>to it and at, THAT age i didn't have the

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<v Speaker 2>language to be able to EXPRESS what i, was feeling

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<v Speaker 2>and especially as a, YOUNG man i just had the

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<v Speaker 2>playbook to bury it and compartmentalize and try and be

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<v Speaker 2>stoic within my masculinity and. My feelings and that drove

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<v Speaker 2>me to be pretty emotion phobic over the course, of time.

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<v Speaker 4>Which must have been especially HARD because i know you've

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<v Speaker 4>talked about kind of the anxiety you experienced early on.

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<v Speaker 4>In life you had this quote where you noted that

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<v Speaker 4>your default setting was often one. Of, Dread yes i'm

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<v Speaker 4>sure a lot of folks listening right now can recognize

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<v Speaker 4>the signs, of anxiety but how did that manifest for you?

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<v Speaker 2>Early? On well AND when i speak, about that it's

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<v Speaker 2>dread because my whole entire identity was built up to

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<v Speaker 2>be just a. Basketball player and HOW am i going

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<v Speaker 2>to work myself out of this depression or. This anxiety,

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<v Speaker 2>i'm LIKE if i can just get that one, more

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<v Speaker 2>accolade or we can win one, more CHAMPIONSHIP or i

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<v Speaker 2>can be not just the state player of, THE year

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<v Speaker 2>i got to be the national player of.

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<v Speaker 3>The year we have to win the.

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<v Speaker 2>National championship in, some ways it's, like masochistic like it hurts, so,

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<v Speaker 2>good right chase those things and, That's okay like that

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<v Speaker 2>can be an admirable quality in. Some cases but your

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<v Speaker 2>brain is going to, go back dopamine is going to.

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<v Speaker 2>Go down you're going to go back to. That BASELINE

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<v Speaker 2>and i think that's when when you think that these

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<v Speaker 2>things are going to for lack of a, better term,

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<v Speaker 2>fix you those anxieties and especially the dark spells, and

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<v Speaker 2>depression those, you know emerged. From dormancy they just come,

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<v Speaker 2>in waves and in some cases, when STILL when i,

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<v Speaker 2>have failures it can be a house of cards and

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<v Speaker 2>just burn down. Very quickly so that's what happened, with

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<v Speaker 2>me and maybe even more so with.

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<v Speaker 4>High, achievers yes and this is the kind OF thing

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<v Speaker 4>i totally see in my Students. At, YALE right i

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<v Speaker 4>work with a lot of amazing. Student athletes don't if

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<v Speaker 4>they're going to play it for, the heat but, you know.

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<v Speaker 4>We'll see, but yeah but this idea that their whole

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<v Speaker 4>identity is caught up in, their performance that they're, you

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<v Speaker 4>know an, athlete first a basketball, player first, you know lacrosse,

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<v Speaker 4>player first and then a. Human, second right and then

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<v Speaker 4>just this like incredible perfectionism where you just have to

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<v Speaker 4>be perfect all. The time my students are fond OF

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<v Speaker 4>This dj college SONG All i Do, is win but, it's,

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<v Speaker 4>like well if all you do, is win then the

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<v Speaker 4>first time, you lose it's like the whole world has

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<v Speaker 4>crumbled down, Right right and it seemed like you were dealing,

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<v Speaker 4>with that but also this super hyper masculine culture like

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<v Speaker 4>where you. Grew UP but i, think also, you know

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<v Speaker 4>having your dad in the early days of the sport

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<v Speaker 4>where this stuff really wasn't.

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<v Speaker 3>Talked about and it's.

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<v Speaker 2>GENERATIONAL too i mean there's some generational trauma within. MY family,

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<v Speaker 2>I Mean brian wilson just died. As well and, you

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<v Speaker 2>know my dad was the caretaker in a Bodyguard for

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<v Speaker 2>brian when he had struggled with. Substance abuse and just to, Be,

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<v Speaker 2>clear brian you're. A becaus, You Know beach boys were

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<v Speaker 2>started in a Garage, In, hawthorne california and it was,

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<v Speaker 2>you Know the. Love's side their cousins Were, the wilsons

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<v Speaker 2>and It, was brian and It, was carl and It

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<v Speaker 2>was dennis and it was, you know My, uncle mike

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<v Speaker 2>and they Created The west coast sound and you know

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<v Speaker 2>he dealt with his share of mental health problems as

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<v Speaker 2>WELL as i mean. THE loves I think i've always

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<v Speaker 2>been prone to melancholy and, dark spells dating back almost

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<v Speaker 2>a hundred, YEARS now i keep looking back and unpeeling

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<v Speaker 2>layers of all of That where, i'm, like yes this

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<v Speaker 2>helps tell.

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<v Speaker 3>The story it.

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<v Speaker 2>Is generational and that was something that my DAD and

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<v Speaker 2>i spoke about towards the end of, his life when

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<v Speaker 2>he was. In hospice we really finally opened up. About

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<v Speaker 2>it his emotional regulation was never quite there because of

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<v Speaker 2>his father being a, physical father and so when my

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<v Speaker 2>dad was, in hospice he started seeing some of those

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<v Speaker 2>things in his dreams and a lot of those memories

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<v Speaker 2>had come up in a very. Ugly way but it

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<v Speaker 2>allowed him to be a lot more vulnerable and. Face

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<v Speaker 2>it but it was him coming to peace with how.

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<v Speaker 2>He lived the true lesson that he taught me through all,

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<v Speaker 2>of this as well as. Our relationship we were in

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<v Speaker 2>strange for a number, of years and, you know he

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<v Speaker 2>taught me two true wisdoms that were reconciliation and forgiveness.

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<v Speaker 4>As well it's so great that you were able to

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<v Speaker 4>reconcile with your father before, he passed and also kind

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<v Speaker 4>of come to terms with the fact that he struggled

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<v Speaker 4>with emotion regulation and it wasn't.

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<v Speaker 2>His FAULT well i get, it, NOW yeah i, Get

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<v Speaker 2>it like it all. Makes sense he did the best

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<v Speaker 2>that he could and he, wasn't equipped and there's such.

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<v Speaker 2>A stigma there's, still stigma huge stigma around speaking about

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<v Speaker 2>mental health and WHAT am i going to do? After

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<v Speaker 2>basketball what if there's nothing for me after? My sport

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<v Speaker 2>and my dad certainly fought, as WELL and i think

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<v Speaker 2>he felt like he, failed OFTEN but i kept, TELLING him, I,

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<v Speaker 2>go dad all you wanted at the end of your

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<v Speaker 2>life was your kids to be there when, you passed

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<v Speaker 2>and for mom to be here when you pass and

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<v Speaker 2>to be at home and to die. At HOME and, I,

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<v Speaker 2>go dad. You're successful you. Are enough, you're here your kids.

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<v Speaker 2>Are here we want to. Be here and success is

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<v Speaker 2>having your kids come home like. We're here we got you.

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<v Speaker 3>So awesome, i'm like. You're successful you can die, knowing

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<v Speaker 3>that like.

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<v Speaker 4>You're, good yeah it's so cool to hear you, say

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<v Speaker 4>that because it feels like that must have been such hard, one,

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<v Speaker 4>knowledge right like hearing about how things. Started off it really,

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<v Speaker 4>was like don't talk about your. Mental health even as

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<v Speaker 4>your dad was Dealing With, brian wilson it sounds like

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<v Speaker 4>his kind of way to deal with substance use and

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<v Speaker 4>mental health issues, was like let's get you on, the

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<v Speaker 4>court let's. Exercise more and this was something THAT you,

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<v Speaker 4>i know took on early.

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<v Speaker 2>On.

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<v Speaker 4>Too right we often talk On The happiness lab podcast

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<v Speaker 4>about how exercise is really good for, mental health but

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<v Speaker 4>it seems like your exercise pushed, into like, you know

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<v Speaker 4>trauma of perfections than his.

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<v Speaker 2>Mental, HEALTH yes i think that in SOME ways i

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<v Speaker 2>was killing two birds with. One STONE and i do

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<v Speaker 2>love to, work out but there is still something There that,

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<v Speaker 2>i'm LIKE am i doing THIS because i have to?

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<v Speaker 2>Be Perfect or i'm doing THIS because i have to

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<v Speaker 2>stay in?

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<v Speaker 4>My sport and early on that was in some ways.

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<v Speaker 4>Really reinforced because you, get very very good at. Your

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<v Speaker 4>schools when did you first realize that you could be,

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<v Speaker 4>a professional.

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<v Speaker 5>Kind of like?

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<v Speaker 3>Your dad my best friend's dad tells it all.

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<v Speaker 2>The time first day, at preschool driving us home and,

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<v Speaker 2>you know he kind, of, asked, you know what do

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<v Speaker 2>you want to be when you? GROW up, I said

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<v Speaker 2>i'm just gonna be IN the nba like, my dad

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<v Speaker 2>and he tells a story all the time and talks

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<v Speaker 2>about how he's like. This kid there's just something about

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<v Speaker 2>HIM where i. ACTUALLY believed i really truly. Believed him

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<v Speaker 2>i'm being honest. WITH you i always. Believed it there

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<v Speaker 2>was no doubt in. My MIND and i think it.

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<v Speaker 2>Helped that, you know the. DOCTOR said i heard them

0:11:05.676 --> 0:11:07.916
<v Speaker 2>SAY when i, was young and, the pediatrician, they, said.

0:11:07.756 --> 0:11:11.276
<v Speaker 3>Well he's gonna be. Very tall this is going to

0:11:11.356 --> 0:11:13.276
<v Speaker 3>be a. TALL kid I knew i.

0:11:13.356 --> 0:11:16.196
<v Speaker 2>HAD that i liked the idea of being tall like,

0:11:16.276 --> 0:11:18.756
<v Speaker 2>my dad and being a basketball player WAS all i

0:11:18.796 --> 0:11:22.156
<v Speaker 2>ever wanted. To be but it was probably around eighth

0:11:22.236 --> 0:11:24.476
<v Speaker 2>grade and my freshman year of high SCHOOL when I

0:11:25.316 --> 0:11:27.516
<v Speaker 2>know i played up with. MY brother i was playing

0:11:27.556 --> 0:11:29.156
<v Speaker 2>two grades up, with him AND then i was playing

0:11:29.196 --> 0:11:33.276
<v Speaker 2>against college players and then. Pro PLAYERS once i got into,

0:11:33.396 --> 0:11:35.316
<v Speaker 2>high SCHOOL and i thought, to MYSELF if i just

0:11:35.396 --> 0:11:38.836
<v Speaker 2>keep on this same track and keep this, SINGULAR focus

0:11:39.476 --> 0:11:41.356
<v Speaker 2>i can have a lot. Of success and if you

0:11:41.396 --> 0:11:43.756
<v Speaker 2>have to have a little bit, of luck, it's timing,

0:11:43.876 --> 0:11:46.356
<v Speaker 2>it's culture, it's demographic, it's luck it's all of. These

0:11:46.396 --> 0:11:48.236
<v Speaker 2>THINGS but i certainly had.

0:11:48.076 --> 0:11:52.556
<v Speaker 4>That definitely involved, some luck but also involved a tremendous card. Working,

0:11:52.596 --> 0:11:56.036
<v Speaker 4>skill yeah you became Super successful ariel in, your career,

0:11:56.156 --> 0:11:59.116
<v Speaker 4>You Know, all star Twenty Ten, world champion twenty Ten tall.

0:11:59.156 --> 0:12:02.516
<v Speaker 4>Olympic gold but in SOME ways i feel like that

0:12:02.676 --> 0:12:05.356
<v Speaker 4>luck was kind of contrasted with a lot of tough

0:12:05.356 --> 0:12:07.796
<v Speaker 4>stuff that happened early on in. YOUR career, i know

0:12:07.836 --> 0:12:10.876
<v Speaker 4>in twenty thirteen you had a. Huge, hit yes tell me.

0:12:10.876 --> 0:12:13.876
<v Speaker 2>WHAT happened i just never went through the grieving process with,

0:12:15.076 --> 0:12:18.076
<v Speaker 2>my grandmother and she was the. Corner stop she was

0:12:18.116 --> 0:12:20.596
<v Speaker 2>like the pillar of. Our family she lived right next

0:12:20.596 --> 0:12:25.316
<v Speaker 2>door to us our, entire life and she was just.

0:12:25.356 --> 0:12:27.556
<v Speaker 3>So special she didn't. Need much she just.

0:12:27.556 --> 0:12:30.756
<v Speaker 2>Wanted family she wanted to volunteer at. The school she

0:12:30.796 --> 0:12:33.396
<v Speaker 2>wanted to help raise, my sister who was a. Premi

0:12:33.476 --> 0:12:37.556
<v Speaker 2>baby as, you know my dad worked a backbreaking job at.

0:12:37.836 --> 0:12:42.276
<v Speaker 2>A warehouse but she was just the absolute rock and the.

0:12:42.316 --> 0:12:44.996
<v Speaker 2>Best WOMAN and i DON'T think i appreciated it or

0:12:45.076 --> 0:12:49.676
<v Speaker 2>had the presence of mind to lean into that type

0:12:49.716 --> 0:12:51.836
<v Speaker 2>of a figure in, our life and she was. Right

0:12:51.876 --> 0:12:55.236
<v Speaker 2>there so there was so. MUCH regret i talked about

0:12:55.236 --> 0:12:57.476
<v Speaker 2>it all. The. Time regret it's more tied up in

0:12:57.476 --> 0:13:00.076
<v Speaker 2>inaction rather, Than, action like of course there's THINGS that

0:13:00.836 --> 0:13:04.956
<v Speaker 2>i did and especially offloaded hurt on people that were

0:13:04.996 --> 0:13:06.916
<v Speaker 2>the closest to me or just did not. Deserve IT

0:13:06.956 --> 0:13:09.196
<v Speaker 2>so i certainly regret, that action but the inaction of

0:13:09.236 --> 0:13:10.756
<v Speaker 2>not spending more time with.

0:13:10.796 --> 0:13:11.716
<v Speaker 3>My grandmother and you go.

0:13:11.716 --> 0:13:14.556
<v Speaker 2>To her little cottage and you go around there and

0:13:14.596 --> 0:13:18.356
<v Speaker 2>you just see photos of like everything that her family had,

0:13:18.356 --> 0:13:23.396
<v Speaker 2>ever done because she understood what. Really MATTERED and i

0:13:23.396 --> 0:13:27.716
<v Speaker 2>DON'T think i appreciated. THAT enough i didn't go back

0:13:27.796 --> 0:13:32.636
<v Speaker 2>when she was cremated or get to grieve with my

0:13:32.676 --> 0:13:36.356
<v Speaker 2>family back Home. IN portland i just kept on being

0:13:36.356 --> 0:13:38.356
<v Speaker 2>with the Team. IN minnesota i was there for. SIX

0:13:38.436 --> 0:13:41.036
<v Speaker 2>years i just kept being with them and lost myself.

0:13:41.076 --> 0:13:43.716
<v Speaker 2>IN basketball i was just running. FROM it i didn't

0:13:43.756 --> 0:13:47.116
<v Speaker 2>want to go to the extremities of, those FEELINGS so

0:13:47.116 --> 0:13:50.036
<v Speaker 2>i never got to, unpack that and that manifested in

0:13:50.116 --> 0:13:53.156
<v Speaker 2>my body in. Different ways the body and they. Keep

0:13:53.196 --> 0:13:56.636
<v Speaker 2>score everybody loves to, say that but it's. So true in,

0:13:56.676 --> 0:13:58.436
<v Speaker 2>some way shape, or form that's going to have to.

0:13:58.436 --> 0:14:01.116
<v Speaker 2>Come out and, for me it was in, panic attacks

0:14:01.116 --> 0:14:04.476
<v Speaker 2>it was, rage fits it, was agoraphobia and not wanting

0:14:04.516 --> 0:14:07.636
<v Speaker 2>to go out for maybe fear of public embarrassment or

0:14:07.676 --> 0:14:08.596
<v Speaker 2>FELT like i was doing.

0:14:08.716 --> 0:14:09.796
<v Speaker 3>Something wrong and.

0:14:09.716 --> 0:14:11.556
<v Speaker 4>That must have been a really awful one, to punch

0:14:11.596 --> 0:14:14.276
<v Speaker 4>because my sense, is like you had, her loss but

0:14:14.316 --> 0:14:16.196
<v Speaker 4>then you also had kind of a loss on. THE

0:14:16.196 --> 0:14:18.596
<v Speaker 4>court i understand that you suffered an injury pretty soon, after,

0:14:18.636 --> 0:14:19.876
<v Speaker 4>THAT right, i DID.

0:14:19.716 --> 0:14:24.316
<v Speaker 2>And i broke, my HAND and i only played eighteen games,

0:14:24.356 --> 0:14:28.196
<v Speaker 2>that YEAR and, i was, you know, suicidal gestures suicidal

0:14:28.236 --> 0:14:31.236
<v Speaker 2>ideation didn't ever leave. My apartment it was kind of

0:14:31.236 --> 0:14:34.716
<v Speaker 2>LIKE how i was often. GROWING up i remember just

0:14:34.756 --> 0:14:37.476
<v Speaker 2>being my Room and i'd go, To school i'd go to, basketball.

0:14:37.076 --> 0:14:39.236
<v Speaker 3>Practice And then i'd just kind of be. In there.

0:14:39.316 --> 0:14:41.516
<v Speaker 2>YOU know i looked at my dad, as well not

0:14:41.556 --> 0:14:43.316
<v Speaker 2>wanting to get out, of bed and just kind of,

0:14:43.356 --> 0:14:44.956
<v Speaker 2>lay there THROW the, tv on be in a, dark

0:14:45.036 --> 0:14:48.596
<v Speaker 2>room sleep, often early, and often, you know go eat

0:14:48.596 --> 0:14:51.156
<v Speaker 2>at the dinner table and my mom's just. FINISHING up

0:14:51.196 --> 0:14:52.476
<v Speaker 2>i would sit there with Her and i'd, be like,

0:14:52.476 --> 0:14:53.756
<v Speaker 2>you know. Where's dad and.

0:14:53.716 --> 0:14:55.596
<v Speaker 4>In some ways this must have been worse because this

0:14:55.716 --> 0:14:58.276
<v Speaker 4>is now on the, professional stage where you're in, your

0:14:58.356 --> 0:15:00.716
<v Speaker 4>room not coming out kind of recovering from. An injury

0:15:00.716 --> 0:15:02.356
<v Speaker 4>and what was it like going. Through that did you

0:15:02.396 --> 0:15:03.716
<v Speaker 4>talk to anybody about what you're Going?

0:15:03.716 --> 0:15:07.356
<v Speaker 2>To no and my agent and he always talks. TO

0:15:07.356 --> 0:15:09.476
<v Speaker 2>me i talked, to you is, Your friend i'm gonna

0:15:09.476 --> 0:15:11.756
<v Speaker 2>talk to you as. Your agent but he didn't know

0:15:11.796 --> 0:15:13.996
<v Speaker 2>how to speak. To me but he would, just say,

0:15:14.636 --> 0:15:16.996
<v Speaker 2>you know snap out. Of it, I'm like i've never

0:15:17.036 --> 0:15:19.716
<v Speaker 2>thought of. That before, oh yeah let me just snap out.

0:15:19.716 --> 0:15:21.876
<v Speaker 4>OF it, i mean it's just remarkable how little people

0:15:21.956 --> 0:15:23.676
<v Speaker 4>get how mental health issues.

0:15:23.716 --> 0:15:26.676
<v Speaker 2>Really, work yes but now, it's like, you know, My Agent,

0:15:26.756 --> 0:15:30.036
<v Speaker 2>jeff schwartz he has three beautiful daughters who Are like

0:15:30.516 --> 0:15:33.676
<v Speaker 2>I'm uncle kevin NOW and i love them that he,

0:15:33.756 --> 0:15:37.156
<v Speaker 2>gets it and. They're athletes, so again he's evolved and

0:15:37.196 --> 0:15:41.596
<v Speaker 2>he understands it. Far more but in, TWENTY thirteen i

0:15:41.676 --> 0:15:44.596
<v Speaker 2>wasn't equipped at all to deal, with IT and i

0:15:44.596 --> 0:15:49.756
<v Speaker 2>didn't have the language to, express IT and i was

0:15:49.876 --> 0:15:53.436
<v Speaker 2>just in bed, a lot in a dark room. A,

0:15:53.476 --> 0:15:57.276
<v Speaker 2>Lot eventually kevin found a way to heal and to

0:15:57.316 --> 0:16:00.596
<v Speaker 2>share his story, with others but as is often, the

0:16:00.596 --> 0:16:02.956
<v Speaker 2>case things had to hit rock bottom before they.

0:16:02.996 --> 0:16:05.516
<v Speaker 1>Got better when we get back from, The break i'll

0:16:05.556 --> 0:16:08.476
<v Speaker 1>Talk with kevin about his very public panic attack and

0:16:08.516 --> 0:16:12.436
<v Speaker 1>the viral art that detailed. His Experience The happiness lab

0:16:12.476 --> 0:16:13.076
<v Speaker 1>will be back in.

0:16:13.076 --> 0:16:13.756
<v Speaker 2>A moment.

0:16:21.076 --> 0:16:21.876
<v Speaker 5>And so how did you wind?

0:16:21.916 --> 0:16:26.796
<v Speaker 2>Up, feeling well it WASN'T until i really started doing.

0:16:26.796 --> 0:16:29.756
<v Speaker 2>The work and, YOU know i it's not TO say

0:16:29.876 --> 0:16:32.676
<v Speaker 2>i didn't have these like great moments and Times when

0:16:33.236 --> 0:16:35.316
<v Speaker 2>i'd come out. Of it, you know maybe it was,

0:16:35.396 --> 0:16:38.756
<v Speaker 2>three weeks maybe it was three months of these really,

0:16:39.036 --> 0:16:43.876
<v Speaker 2>dark spells and my best friends. Didn't know but things

0:16:43.916 --> 0:16:49.276
<v Speaker 2>got so much worse in our seventeen. Eighteen season, you

0:16:49.316 --> 0:16:52.276
<v Speaker 2>know that very public panic attack and mental health EPISODE

0:16:52.276 --> 0:16:55.756
<v Speaker 2>that i know we'll speak. About happened it got a

0:16:55.796 --> 0:16:57.836
<v Speaker 2>lot worse before it. Got, better, Yeah.

0:16:57.676 --> 0:17:00.116
<v Speaker 5>Yeah so what happened to that season to make things get?

0:17:00.156 --> 0:17:05.196
<v Speaker 2>Worse again it was unpacking the pressures of expectations of

0:17:06.396 --> 0:17:09.436
<v Speaker 2>fifteen to twenty years and the weight of, you know

0:17:09.476 --> 0:17:12.996
<v Speaker 2>an organization and ownership and the front office put in

0:17:13.116 --> 0:17:15.156
<v Speaker 2>pressure that we have to win and. Win now and

0:17:15.196 --> 0:17:18.556
<v Speaker 2>while we love that because it drove us to do these.

0:17:18.556 --> 0:17:22.276
<v Speaker 2>Great things we went to four straight finals from fifteen.

0:17:22.316 --> 0:17:25.876
<v Speaker 2>Through eighteen we won in twenty sixteen first major sports Championship.

0:17:26.036 --> 0:17:29.756
<v Speaker 2>In cleveland but, YOU know i was at that time

0:17:30.676 --> 0:17:33.796
<v Speaker 2>not speaking to. MY parents i was strange. From them,

0:17:34.076 --> 0:17:36.076
<v Speaker 2>you know within my my love life and my, personal

0:17:36.076 --> 0:17:39.396
<v Speaker 2>life things had, gone wrong as well as always feeling

0:17:39.396 --> 0:17:42.516
<v Speaker 2>these things and never facing it head on and not

0:17:42.596 --> 0:17:45.876
<v Speaker 2>going to therapy or having a trusted CONFIDENT that i could.

0:17:45.996 --> 0:17:47.996
<v Speaker 2>SPEAK to i DON'T think i wanted to admit that

0:17:48.036 --> 0:17:49.796
<v Speaker 2>there was. A problem i FELT like i was a

0:17:49.796 --> 0:17:53.756
<v Speaker 2>failure of even having these feelings and that idea of

0:17:54.236 --> 0:17:58.116
<v Speaker 2>masculinity and. Showing emotion of course i'd get angry and

0:17:58.156 --> 0:18:00.156
<v Speaker 2>get a technical foul and that sort, of thing but

0:18:00.196 --> 0:18:02.836
<v Speaker 2>in terms of, saying like, You know i'm at, home

0:18:02.996 --> 0:18:07.116
<v Speaker 2>Crying or i'm at home and my anxiety is coming

0:18:07.196 --> 0:18:10.316
<v Speaker 2>up in a way that is, SEVERELY unhealthy i, just

0:18:10.356 --> 0:18:13.196
<v Speaker 2>said like everybody else has these problems worse, Than ME

0:18:13.316 --> 0:18:17.236
<v Speaker 2>and i was, comparing GRIEF but i was also withholding

0:18:17.356 --> 0:18:21.956
<v Speaker 2>compassion for myself and not having grace. Within THAT and

0:18:22.716 --> 0:18:26.596
<v Speaker 2>i believe that nobody benefits from THAT that i just

0:18:26.676 --> 0:18:31.476
<v Speaker 2>all bottled up into a moment and it was PUBLIC

0:18:32.116 --> 0:18:34.716
<v Speaker 2>and i was on, the court it WAS. ON tv,

0:18:34.876 --> 0:18:37.396
<v Speaker 2>i mean we were a team that had nationally, televised

0:18:37.436 --> 0:18:39.316
<v Speaker 2>games and, You know i'd had these, feelings before these

0:18:39.316 --> 0:18:40.796
<v Speaker 2>type of things, That Happened but i've always just been

0:18:40.836 --> 0:18:43.396
<v Speaker 2>able to remove myself from a situation where have like

0:18:44.196 --> 0:18:46.716
<v Speaker 2>rage fits in my space at home right like it

0:18:46.796 --> 0:18:50.316
<v Speaker 2>manifested in. DIFFERENT ways i had nowhere, to GO so

0:18:50.396 --> 0:18:53.196
<v Speaker 2>i just ran to the locker room or tried to

0:18:53.276 --> 0:18:56.396
<v Speaker 2>ESCAPE like i. Always did but this is around my

0:18:56.756 --> 0:19:00.916
<v Speaker 2>teammates that we're back in the. Locker room it was around.

0:19:00.956 --> 0:19:05.316
<v Speaker 2>OUR trainers i Feel like i'm having. CARDIAC arrest i

0:19:05.356 --> 0:19:07.236
<v Speaker 2>can't catch, MY breath i can't get oxygen to. MY

0:19:07.276 --> 0:19:10.836
<v Speaker 2>brain I don't i've never had this type of attack,

0:19:11.036 --> 0:19:13.356
<v Speaker 2>happened before so this is.

0:19:13.556 --> 0:19:14.996
<v Speaker 3>LIFE threatening i end.

0:19:14.956 --> 0:19:17.676
<v Speaker 2>Up passed out on the floor of our, Head Trainer steve,

0:19:17.716 --> 0:19:20.836
<v Speaker 2>spirou's office and he's the one who finds. Me THERE

0:19:21.476 --> 0:19:23.756
<v Speaker 2>so i ended. Up leaving, after that they put me.

0:19:23.756 --> 0:19:26.116
<v Speaker 2>On oxygen i'm able to sit back up think, of

0:19:26.196 --> 0:19:28.556
<v Speaker 2>myself what the hell? JUST happened i go and they

0:19:28.636 --> 0:19:31.876
<v Speaker 2>run several tests At the, Cleveland clinic who's and still

0:19:31.956 --> 0:19:37.516
<v Speaker 2>is just, so amazing and everything checks out like there's.

0:19:37.556 --> 0:19:40.756
<v Speaker 2>Nothing Wrong but i'm asking, the question what?

0:19:41.116 --> 0:19:41.196
<v Speaker 3>Just?

0:19:41.276 --> 0:19:43.556
<v Speaker 2>Happened then is this going to? Happen again who's going

0:19:43.636 --> 0:19:45.556
<v Speaker 2>to know. About it so it's like this negative feedback

0:19:45.596 --> 0:19:48.516
<v Speaker 2>LOOP that i don't Know if i'm going to, survive

0:19:48.636 --> 0:19:52.276
<v Speaker 2>professionally and then how is that going to now impact

0:19:52.396 --> 0:19:54.956
<v Speaker 2>not only my livelihood but this safe space that was

0:19:55.036 --> 0:19:58.996
<v Speaker 2>once the. Basketball court so it got a lot worse

0:19:59.276 --> 0:20:02.236
<v Speaker 2>before it. Got BETTER but i think there is a

0:20:02.236 --> 0:20:03.876
<v Speaker 2>lot of good that came. From that it made, Me,

0:20:04.236 --> 0:20:05.836
<v Speaker 2>say okay things aren't.

0:20:05.836 --> 0:20:07.156
<v Speaker 3>ADDING up i need to.

0:20:07.236 --> 0:20:10.516
<v Speaker 2>Change something so it was my FIRST time i had gone,

0:20:10.876 --> 0:20:14.676
<v Speaker 2>to THERAPY and i was incredibly lucky to find a.

0:20:14.716 --> 0:20:18.036
<v Speaker 2>Great therapist he just said in my medication, this morning

0:20:18.116 --> 0:20:24.836
<v Speaker 2>so RESPECT but i had finally come to Terms, that

0:20:25.076 --> 0:20:28.156
<v Speaker 2>okay it's time to start doing.

0:20:28.196 --> 0:20:30.556
<v Speaker 4>The work so amazing to hear you talk about this

0:20:30.596 --> 0:20:34.356
<v Speaker 4>transition to understanding therapy and being more, self compassionate because

0:20:34.636 --> 0:20:36.676
<v Speaker 4>the amazing thing about the oxygen mask that you put

0:20:36.676 --> 0:20:38.796
<v Speaker 4>on is having put yours, on first you're now able

0:20:38.836 --> 0:20:42.516
<v Speaker 4>to help others put their oxygen. Mask on, YOU know

0:20:42.596 --> 0:20:44.956
<v Speaker 4>i know you as AN amazing, nba PLAYER but i

0:20:45.036 --> 0:20:47.956
<v Speaker 4>first got really familiar with you when you became like

0:20:47.996 --> 0:20:48.756
<v Speaker 4>a huge mental.

0:20:48.756 --> 0:20:50.636
<v Speaker 5>Health advocate tell me about.

0:20:50.396 --> 0:20:52.156
<v Speaker 4>The article that you put out in, twenty eighteen because

0:20:52.196 --> 0:20:54.196
<v Speaker 4>that WAS when i first started hearing your name and

0:20:54.316 --> 0:20:55.036
<v Speaker 4>learning about what you're.

0:20:55.116 --> 0:20:58.076
<v Speaker 2>Up, To right so, FAST forward i go. To therapy

0:20:59.556 --> 0:21:02.076
<v Speaker 2>it Was An all star. That year it's My Fifth all,

0:21:02.076 --> 0:21:05.476
<v Speaker 2>star APPEARANCE and i had a great, year statistically, very,

0:21:05.476 --> 0:21:11.636
<v Speaker 2>efficient statistically producing at a very. High line and then

0:21:11.676 --> 0:21:15.916
<v Speaker 2>a couple of. THINGS happened i had Another Attack oklahoma

0:21:15.916 --> 0:21:21.596
<v Speaker 2>CITY that i am recently just starting to speak about because,

0:21:22.676 --> 0:21:24.676
<v Speaker 2>You know i've had to unpack my team kind of

0:21:25.156 --> 0:21:29.196
<v Speaker 2>at the time turning. On me after, THAT game i

0:21:29.196 --> 0:21:32.996
<v Speaker 2>had mispracticed the, next day and everybody, was, like, no,

0:21:32.996 --> 0:21:36.036
<v Speaker 2>no we need to, address THIS and i just wasn't ready,

0:21:36.076 --> 0:21:38.356
<v Speaker 2>to expose LIKE what i was going through at. The

0:21:38.396 --> 0:21:43.116
<v Speaker 2>time we LEFT for I Think, san antonio AND again i.

0:21:43.116 --> 0:21:46.836
<v Speaker 2>Felt isolated my anxiety went absolutely through, the ROOF and

0:21:46.876 --> 0:21:49.036
<v Speaker 2>i still had to go out there, and compete AND

0:21:49.076 --> 0:21:50.716
<v Speaker 2>so i FELT like i was on. An island and that,

0:21:50.796 --> 0:21:52.676
<v Speaker 2>same trip we Were, IN detroit i broke, My hand

0:21:52.716 --> 0:21:54.796
<v Speaker 2>so again the game was taken away. FROM me i

0:21:54.796 --> 0:21:58.436
<v Speaker 2>had NO outlet i know where. To go, It's, like

0:21:58.516 --> 0:22:00.636
<v Speaker 2>okay here's, a game we're paying this guy, Helps money

0:22:00.876 --> 0:22:03.076
<v Speaker 2>we're supposed to go to. The finals we have no

0:22:03.116 --> 0:22:04.916
<v Speaker 2>idea what's going on with. Our teammate we feel like

0:22:04.956 --> 0:22:07.516
<v Speaker 2>we can't. TRUST him i think it was that as

0:22:07.516 --> 0:22:12.156
<v Speaker 2>well as our our. MEDIA availability i started getting questions

0:22:12.516 --> 0:22:18.316
<v Speaker 2>in front of a group about my, mental health and that,

0:22:19.476 --> 0:22:24.356
<v Speaker 2>scared ME and i didn't want anybody to tell my story.

0:22:24.996 --> 0:22:27.036
<v Speaker 2>BUT me i had to have it be in my,

0:22:27.116 --> 0:22:30.316
<v Speaker 2>own WORDS and i told, MY agent i wrote, the

0:22:30.356 --> 0:22:33.196
<v Speaker 2>same made, some adjustments only wanted to take it so

0:22:33.356 --> 0:22:35.036
<v Speaker 2>far at that POINT because i.

0:22:35.076 --> 0:22:35.756
<v Speaker 3>Was scared it's.

0:22:35.876 --> 0:22:38.756
<v Speaker 2>REALLY scared i didn't know what this was going. To

0:22:38.876 --> 0:22:42.076
<v Speaker 2>do is this going to? End everything is this going

0:22:42.116 --> 0:22:45.396
<v Speaker 2>to end my? Basketball career and what is pressing send going?

0:22:45.476 --> 0:22:49.956
<v Speaker 2>To DO but i THINK one i was. Just exhausted it,

0:22:50.036 --> 0:22:52.756
<v Speaker 2>was EXHAUSTED and i was playing this character and putting on.

0:22:52.756 --> 0:22:57.756
<v Speaker 2>THIS facade i was just tired of struggling and being

0:22:57.756 --> 0:23:00.356
<v Speaker 2>in a, terrible place in silence and in. The shadows

0:23:00.436 --> 0:23:05.396
<v Speaker 2>so press end and then my life inherently.

0:23:05.596 --> 0:23:08.956
<v Speaker 1>Changed forever the article published in twenty eighteen In The

0:23:09.116 --> 0:23:13.516
<v Speaker 1>player's tribune Was titled everyone is Going. Through something, In

0:23:13.556 --> 0:23:17.036
<v Speaker 1>it kevin acknowledged his mental, health struggles describe the panic

0:23:17.036 --> 0:23:19.316
<v Speaker 1>attack as a turning point and his decision to seek

0:23:19.356 --> 0:23:22.716
<v Speaker 1>help and encourage others facing similar challenges to do. The

0:23:22.716 --> 0:23:27.916
<v Speaker 1>same the Reaction to kevin's piece was. OVERWHELMINGLY positive i

0:23:27.996 --> 0:23:28.636
<v Speaker 1>would have never.

0:23:29.196 --> 0:23:32.636
<v Speaker 2>EXPECTED it, i thought in, the comments people are going, to,

0:23:32.716 --> 0:23:35.836
<v Speaker 2>say like you're, a bitch and how are these guys

0:23:35.876 --> 0:23:38.116
<v Speaker 2>going to be able to be with him out there

0:23:38.116 --> 0:23:40.196
<v Speaker 2>on the core when he knows he struggles with this

0:23:40.396 --> 0:23:41.476
<v Speaker 2>and is he just going to leave?

0:23:41.516 --> 0:23:43.556
<v Speaker 3>ANOTHER game, i mean.

0:23:43.556 --> 0:23:48.996
<v Speaker 2>It's primitive we're so it's ingrained in, us psychologically like

0:23:49.236 --> 0:23:54.836
<v Speaker 2>to perceive. Threat FIRST and i think, as athletes criticism

0:23:55.236 --> 0:23:57.916
<v Speaker 2>is a tax. On success if we do decide to

0:23:57.956 --> 0:23:59.556
<v Speaker 2>go through the comments and we want to respond, to

0:23:59.596 --> 0:24:01.836
<v Speaker 2>people and we go through and it's all these great

0:24:01.916 --> 0:24:04.956
<v Speaker 2>things and it's like we're relating to people and there's

0:24:04.996 --> 0:24:08.396
<v Speaker 2>empathy or there's just like you know that, raw rah,

0:24:08.436 --> 0:24:10.516
<v Speaker 2>like yes like this, is great and then.

0:24:10.436 --> 0:24:13.116
<v Speaker 3>It's like, you know you suck and we're like that's.

0:24:13.156 --> 0:24:14.356
<v Speaker 3>The one, but yeah.

0:24:14.396 --> 0:24:18.716
<v Speaker 2>OVERWHELMINGLY positive i think we had ten thousand plus emails

0:24:18.756 --> 0:24:20.556
<v Speaker 2>in the first week we had. TO create i mean

0:24:20.556 --> 0:24:24.556
<v Speaker 2>my inboxes, were full my texts, were full and then

0:24:24.556 --> 0:24:26.716
<v Speaker 2>we had to create a separate email because there was

0:24:26.836 --> 0:24:30.516
<v Speaker 2>just so. Many people there were so many people that

0:24:30.556 --> 0:24:34.076
<v Speaker 2>had reached out and shared, their stories whether it be

0:24:34.596 --> 0:24:37.476
<v Speaker 2>their first hand experience with their own mental health or

0:24:37.516 --> 0:24:41.716
<v Speaker 2>their child's. Mental health that was incredibly. Eye opening. Press sad,

0:24:41.796 --> 0:24:46.316
<v Speaker 2>that morning we had left for a multiple game road

0:24:46.316 --> 0:24:50.276
<v Speaker 2>TRIP and i was back playing at. That point we

0:24:50.356 --> 0:24:54.036
<v Speaker 2>meet at the plane three, pm DEPARTURE and i remember

0:24:54.076 --> 0:24:56.436
<v Speaker 2>just sitting in, my seat throwing my, hoodie on throwing my.

0:24:56.436 --> 0:24:58.996
<v Speaker 2>Headphones on, i'm like what are my teammates? Gonna think

0:24:59.436 --> 0:25:01.636
<v Speaker 2>what are my teammates going? To THINK but I Remember

0:25:01.716 --> 0:25:05.876
<v Speaker 2>kyle korber coming across the aisle and shaking my hand

0:25:05.996 --> 0:25:09.356
<v Speaker 2>and just telling me that there's going to be. Something

0:25:09.396 --> 0:25:11.036
<v Speaker 2>here you're going to make a huge difference in. People's

0:25:11.076 --> 0:25:15.236
<v Speaker 2>lives and that was my first time where my shoulders had,

0:25:15.276 --> 0:25:17.436
<v Speaker 2>just dropped like maybe this is going to. Be okay

0:25:17.516 --> 0:25:20.756
<v Speaker 2>we'd gone through. THE flight i slept and might just

0:25:20.796 --> 0:25:22.756
<v Speaker 2>like turned to the side towards the window and, you

0:25:22.756 --> 0:25:25.356
<v Speaker 2>know ACTED like i. Wasn't available i'm always the first off.

0:25:25.356 --> 0:25:27.116
<v Speaker 2>THE plane i like to just go and get settled

0:25:27.596 --> 0:25:30.316
<v Speaker 2>on the bus and sitting there the, whole time like

0:25:30.396 --> 0:25:33.476
<v Speaker 2>just get me to, my room the, bus stops everybody,

0:25:33.516 --> 0:25:37.116
<v Speaker 2>gets off and then it's, You know lebron who comes,

0:25:37.116 --> 0:25:39.596
<v Speaker 2>to me just kind of shakes my hand in like

0:25:40.036 --> 0:25:42.836
<v Speaker 2>knowing approval and kind of wraps me up in the.

0:25:42.876 --> 0:25:45.956
<v Speaker 2>Big hug and that was, you know you spend almost

0:25:45.996 --> 0:25:48.956
<v Speaker 2>more time with your teammates in that space than you

0:25:48.996 --> 0:25:51.436
<v Speaker 2>do your, actual family so they. Become family but that

0:25:51.716 --> 0:25:54.516
<v Speaker 2>just pushed our our friendship and our brotherhood into.

0:25:54.956 --> 0:25:57.036
<v Speaker 4>NEW space, i mean you're making it such that any

0:25:57.076 --> 0:25:59.156
<v Speaker 4>basketball player can be more than a, basketball.

0:25:59.156 --> 0:25:59.956
<v Speaker 5>Player right they can, be.

0:25:59.996 --> 0:26:03.236
<v Speaker 4>Vulnerable they, can struggle and also they can have an identity.

0:26:03.356 --> 0:26:05.396
<v Speaker 4>BEYOND it i think one of the amazing things is

0:26:05.436 --> 0:26:07.796
<v Speaker 4>that now forever you to be known not just as

0:26:07.796 --> 0:26:10.796
<v Speaker 4>an amazing, basketball player also as an advocate for these.

0:26:10.836 --> 0:26:12.756
<v Speaker 4>IMPORTANT issues, i mean what does that feel like now

0:26:12.796 --> 0:26:15.756
<v Speaker 4>to be kind of to have come from being so

0:26:15.916 --> 0:26:18.916
<v Speaker 4>scared about talking, about this from such a hyper masculine

0:26:18.916 --> 0:26:20.956
<v Speaker 4>culture to now being in some ways the face of

0:26:21.036 --> 0:26:22.076
<v Speaker 4>talking about mental health.

0:26:21.956 --> 0:26:24.236
<v Speaker 2>And right there is a weight, to it but at the,

0:26:24.276 --> 0:26:28.316
<v Speaker 2>same time just speaking about it gives me LEVITY because

0:26:29.116 --> 0:26:29.836
<v Speaker 2>i get to be an.

0:26:29.836 --> 0:26:32.036
<v Speaker 3>Open book, I'm allowed i'm empowered to be.

0:26:32.276 --> 0:26:34.836
<v Speaker 5>Like open, The curtain, you're like. Curtains, open yeah this IS.

0:26:34.836 --> 0:26:37.796
<v Speaker 2>Who i am and this is what. You, get honestly

0:26:37.796 --> 0:26:39.636
<v Speaker 2>if you don't, like it that's your problem because my

0:26:40.076 --> 0:26:44.596
<v Speaker 2>intention is to help the next person and it's just

0:26:44.716 --> 0:26:47.836
<v Speaker 2>authentic TO who, i am and it IS who i want,

0:26:47.876 --> 0:26:49.436
<v Speaker 2>to Be and i'm, not PERFECT like i think that's

0:26:49.436 --> 0:26:50.996
<v Speaker 2>the beauty of. It too it's like, with basketball you

0:26:50.996 --> 0:26:52.636
<v Speaker 2>can wake up every day and, Be like i'm going to.

0:26:52.676 --> 0:26:54.756
<v Speaker 2>Get better you can never get too big to do the.

0:26:54.756 --> 0:26:56.836
<v Speaker 2>Little things you can never get too big to refine.

0:26:56.836 --> 0:26:58.996
<v Speaker 2>Your skills and THAT'S how i feel about what we're

0:26:59.036 --> 0:26:59.516
<v Speaker 2>doing here in.

0:26:59.556 --> 0:27:00.636
<v Speaker 3>This space it's going.

0:27:00.596 --> 0:27:03.636
<v Speaker 2>To take a, long time but, LONG term i think,

0:27:04.276 --> 0:27:08.196
<v Speaker 2>legacy naturally as a, basketball player you talk about that word,

0:27:08.236 --> 0:27:11.796
<v Speaker 2>A lot But now i've started to think about like

0:27:12.276 --> 0:27:14.076
<v Speaker 2>legacy virtues versus.

0:27:14.436 --> 0:27:15.876
<v Speaker 3>Eulogy virtues it's been.

0:27:15.916 --> 0:27:20.876
<v Speaker 2>Deaths Obviously, brian wilson, my FATHER and i think about

0:27:21.356 --> 0:27:22.356
<v Speaker 2>what are people.

0:27:22.116 --> 0:27:25.716
<v Speaker 3>Going to SAY when. I pass are they going to say.

0:27:25.956 --> 0:27:29.996
<v Speaker 2>He BROKE the NBA and aba merger for double doubles

0:27:30.036 --> 0:27:34.236
<v Speaker 2>when he played in his. Third, Season, No no they're

0:27:34.236 --> 0:27:37.116
<v Speaker 2>going to talk about how he made. People feel they're

0:27:37.116 --> 0:27:40.316
<v Speaker 2>going to talk about, His relationships they're going to talk

0:27:40.356 --> 0:27:43.916
<v Speaker 2>about how he made an impact on other. PEOPLE'S lives, i, mean,

0:27:43.956 --> 0:27:47.036
<v Speaker 2>like sure they'll touch. On basketball but what my hope

0:27:47.076 --> 0:27:49.316
<v Speaker 2>IS when i get to, that POINT if i just

0:27:49.676 --> 0:27:52.556
<v Speaker 2>be my authentic self and be more comfortable in my

0:27:52.596 --> 0:27:55.356
<v Speaker 2>own skin by exposing, these things that when that, time

0:27:55.396 --> 0:27:58.756
<v Speaker 2>comes it's going to be more about eulogy. Than legacy

0:27:58.876 --> 0:28:01.196
<v Speaker 2>but my hope would BE if i keep living my

0:28:01.236 --> 0:28:04.036
<v Speaker 2>life with that type, of intention that the universe will

0:28:04.116 --> 0:28:04.796
<v Speaker 2>unfold as.

0:28:04.796 --> 0:28:07.876
<v Speaker 1>It should so what does living with that kind of

0:28:07.876 --> 0:28:11.396
<v Speaker 1>intention look Like for? Kevin today after, the break we'll

0:28:11.396 --> 0:28:13.756
<v Speaker 1>talk About how kevin is trying to break the stigma

0:28:13.796 --> 0:28:17.276
<v Speaker 1>for the next generation. Of Athletes The happiness lab will be.

0:28:17.356 --> 0:28:18.116
<v Speaker 3>Right BACK.

0:28:26.876 --> 0:28:30.036
<v Speaker 1>When Nba Star kevin love finally went public about his mental,

0:28:30.036 --> 0:28:33.716
<v Speaker 1>health struggles the response. Was overwhelming it was clear that

0:28:33.756 --> 0:28:36.356
<v Speaker 1>people were hungry to change the stigma that so many.

0:28:36.396 --> 0:28:41.276
<v Speaker 1>Athletes Face Enter The Kevin, love fund a nonprofit dedicated

0:28:41.316 --> 0:28:44.076
<v Speaker 1>to helping the next generation develop the skills they need

0:28:44.276 --> 0:28:46.996
<v Speaker 1>to manage mental. Health challenges and.

0:28:46.956 --> 0:28:50.756
<v Speaker 2>We wanted to support both physical and, emotional wellbeing and

0:28:50.796 --> 0:28:53.756
<v Speaker 2>we wanted to just keep having these conversations to eliminate

0:28:53.796 --> 0:28:58.676
<v Speaker 2>the stigma and provide resources educate. As WELL and i

0:28:58.756 --> 0:29:01.956
<v Speaker 2>think that education space IS where i look back and

0:29:02.036 --> 0:29:06.676
<v Speaker 2>coming into, high school all of, those, expectations, athletics college

0:29:06.676 --> 0:29:08.676
<v Speaker 2>you have to consider those things much. Younger NOW but

0:29:09.516 --> 0:29:11.836
<v Speaker 2>I know i didn't have, The LANGUAGE but, i thought

0:29:11.876 --> 0:29:15.916
<v Speaker 2>if we can learn about physical health and, sexual health

0:29:16.556 --> 0:29:21.276
<v Speaker 2>why aren't we being taught about emotions and? Mental health

0:29:21.276 --> 0:29:24.476
<v Speaker 2>why aren't we putting this into. The CLASSROOM so i

0:29:24.516 --> 0:29:30.076
<v Speaker 2>thought it would be really meaningful because everybody's going through

0:29:30.116 --> 0:29:32.436
<v Speaker 2>something that you. Can't see how can we implement this

0:29:32.556 --> 0:29:37.396
<v Speaker 2>into the classroom starting at that age and create a

0:29:37.436 --> 0:29:42.716
<v Speaker 2>curriculum that's modeled. Around vulnerability Sarah and elier educators have

0:29:42.836 --> 0:29:46.036
<v Speaker 2>done such an incredible job in rounding out this curriculum

0:29:46.076 --> 0:29:49.116
<v Speaker 2>and continuing to add to it and get it taught

0:29:49.116 --> 0:29:52.276
<v Speaker 2>in many different countries and many, different languages and continuing to.

0:29:52.356 --> 0:29:54.476
<v Speaker 2>Grow it, right now we're working on getting it into

0:29:54.636 --> 0:29:56.756
<v Speaker 2>the third largest school district in, the country And. That's

0:29:56.796 --> 0:29:58.436
<v Speaker 2>miami part of.

0:29:58.396 --> 0:30:01.596
<v Speaker 1>This new curriculum involves prompts designed to help students open

0:30:01.676 --> 0:30:04.636
<v Speaker 1>up about the things they're, struggling with but teachers get

0:30:04.636 --> 0:30:07.956
<v Speaker 1>to answer first modeling what a response looks like and

0:30:07.996 --> 0:30:11.316
<v Speaker 1>showing that adults are. VULNERABLE too I asked kevin to

0:30:11.316 --> 0:30:13.676
<v Speaker 1>tell me about an experience from early in the programs,

0:30:13.676 --> 0:30:16.836
<v Speaker 1>develop it one that made him realize just how powerful

0:30:16.876 --> 0:30:17.236
<v Speaker 1>this work.

0:30:17.236 --> 0:30:20.116
<v Speaker 3>Could be, you know the teacher. Models it they go around.

0:30:20.156 --> 0:30:23.236
<v Speaker 2>The classroom and the amazing part about that day was

0:30:23.796 --> 0:30:26.676
<v Speaker 2>the basketball team and some of the football team was in,

0:30:26.716 --> 0:30:30.036
<v Speaker 2>that classroom and once we got, to them, you know

0:30:30.076 --> 0:30:32.516
<v Speaker 2>they were kind of hiding, AND like i don't want,

0:30:32.556 --> 0:30:34.476
<v Speaker 2>to share but we just kept going around and then

0:30:34.476 --> 0:30:37.876
<v Speaker 2>we got, to THEM and i remember the first share

0:30:37.996 --> 0:30:40.356
<v Speaker 2>he had, talked about, YOU know i come to school

0:30:40.396 --> 0:30:44.996
<v Speaker 2>to get food and my dad's, not around and my

0:30:45.076 --> 0:30:48.756
<v Speaker 2>mom's having to work with my SISTERS and i don't

0:30:48.796 --> 0:30:50.196
<v Speaker 2>get enough time, with her and it's just.

0:30:50.236 --> 0:30:52.276
<v Speaker 3>Two Jobs and i'm, just like this.

0:30:52.396 --> 0:30:55.836
<v Speaker 4>Is amazing like everybody's open amazed in, that. Classroom right

0:30:55.876 --> 0:30:57.676
<v Speaker 4>they can amise, each other they can help, each other

0:30:57.756 --> 0:30:58.076
<v Speaker 4>and this is.

0:30:58.516 --> 0:31:01.916
<v Speaker 3>An athlete like at, THAT age i WAS like i wasn't.

0:31:01.716 --> 0:31:06.396
<v Speaker 2>Doing THAT but i just want to tell everybody, out

0:31:06.436 --> 0:31:08.756
<v Speaker 2>there like it's a free curriculum and so this is

0:31:08.756 --> 0:31:12.076
<v Speaker 2>something that you can integrate into. Any school, you know

0:31:12.116 --> 0:31:15.636
<v Speaker 2>this is a you know as potential to really have

0:31:15.956 --> 0:31:17.876
<v Speaker 2>a huge impact on a. Kid's life and it's just

0:31:17.956 --> 0:31:20.996
<v Speaker 2>early intervention in a time where, you know in your

0:31:20.996 --> 0:31:24.236
<v Speaker 2>early teens you start to really feel what being self.

0:31:24.316 --> 0:31:26.276
<v Speaker 3>Conscious IS like i.

0:31:26.316 --> 0:31:29.796
<v Speaker 4>Certainly did it's, early intervention but it might also be. Generational. Intervention,

0:31:29.956 --> 0:31:33.076
<v Speaker 4>yes yes those kids on the football team who started

0:31:33.116 --> 0:31:35.436
<v Speaker 4>talking about how the food and security makes, them feel

0:31:35.796 --> 0:31:37.516
<v Speaker 4>that's going to mean that it's easier for them to do.

0:31:37.556 --> 0:31:39.636
<v Speaker 5>It right they have a kid who's on the football, team.

0:31:39.476 --> 0:31:42.836
<v Speaker 2>Yearsly and it just goes to show you WITH what

0:31:42.876 --> 0:31:45.516
<v Speaker 2>i said OR what i wrote in, that article is

0:31:45.556 --> 0:31:48.436
<v Speaker 2>that everybody's going through something that you, can't, See right

0:31:48.636 --> 0:31:52.196
<v Speaker 2>so let's. Be compassionate let's allow ourselves to be a.

0:31:52.236 --> 0:31:54.556
<v Speaker 2>Sounding board pay, it forward if you want to use.

0:31:54.556 --> 0:32:02.516
<v Speaker 2>Your voice there is room for. Generational healing kid brought

0:32:02.516 --> 0:32:05.596
<v Speaker 2>a sign to a game that said everybody's going, through

0:32:05.636 --> 0:32:08.556
<v Speaker 2>SOMETHING and i told our security, or like grab him,

0:32:08.796 --> 0:32:11.516
<v Speaker 2>for me grab him and his family. For me and

0:32:11.556 --> 0:32:14.876
<v Speaker 2>he came BACK and i just spoke to the FAMILY

0:32:15.236 --> 0:32:17.916
<v Speaker 2>and i started to realize through what they said that

0:32:18.836 --> 0:32:22.796
<v Speaker 2>you're not just changing the, kid's life you're changing how

0:32:22.836 --> 0:32:28.116
<v Speaker 2>he's relating with, his, friends potentially, his team, his teachers,

0:32:28.716 --> 0:32:33.956
<v Speaker 2>his family. His community what is changing that one life actually?

0:32:33.996 --> 0:32:34.596
<v Speaker 3>Look like what does?

0:32:34.636 --> 0:32:36.876
<v Speaker 2>IT do i don't know if we can quantify it

0:32:36.996 --> 0:32:41.156
<v Speaker 2>or it's something that you, can measure but there's a

0:32:41.156 --> 0:32:44.836
<v Speaker 2>LOT of i think healing to be had through, all

0:32:44.876 --> 0:32:49.516
<v Speaker 2>that and it's not just that. One person it has

0:32:49.636 --> 0:32:53.556
<v Speaker 2>a ripple effect that is just an. Amazing thing and

0:32:53.636 --> 0:32:54.916
<v Speaker 2>seeing it firsthand is.

0:32:55.396 --> 0:32:58.796
<v Speaker 4>IT'S inspiring i remember when your article came out and

0:32:58.796 --> 0:33:00.836
<v Speaker 4>it get sent to me by like tons and tons

0:33:00.916 --> 0:33:04.596
<v Speaker 4>of my students and many of my student athletes, Were

0:33:04.596 --> 0:33:06.956
<v Speaker 4>like i'm so happy he. Said it because only you

0:33:07.116 --> 0:33:08.956
<v Speaker 4>know you're an all star you can say it can't

0:33:08.996 --> 0:33:11.396
<v Speaker 4>be somebody who hasn't achieved the things that, you did which.

0:33:11.436 --> 0:33:13.276
<v Speaker 5>Is, sad yeah but it doesn't meant.

0:33:13.316 --> 0:33:15.556
<v Speaker 2>So much we've worked with a lot of student athletes

0:33:15.596 --> 0:33:18.276
<v Speaker 2>and it's. Been amazing and after they come out of

0:33:18.276 --> 0:33:21.596
<v Speaker 2>college and they struggle, With identity but how do you

0:33:22.476 --> 0:33:27.876
<v Speaker 2>help these student athletes and their coaches have these conversations

0:33:27.956 --> 0:33:30.836
<v Speaker 2>because you know these colleges or institutions that.

0:33:31.116 --> 0:33:31.996
<v Speaker 3>You know now money.

0:33:32.076 --> 0:33:35.956
<v Speaker 2>Is involved it makes it so much More complex at,

0:33:35.956 --> 0:33:38.236
<v Speaker 2>that age a kid is even. More worried it has

0:33:38.276 --> 0:33:41.276
<v Speaker 2>even more Pressure, about OKAY if i expose THIS or i,

0:33:41.396 --> 0:33:43.476
<v Speaker 2>tell this like this college isn't going to, Want me

0:33:43.556 --> 0:33:46.156
<v Speaker 2>they're going to take away. My, scholarship yeah it's.

0:33:45.996 --> 0:33:47.956
<v Speaker 3>Not UNLIKE what i had at the at the.

0:33:48.036 --> 0:33:51.436
<v Speaker 2>Highest level But also i've already, made It like i'm

0:33:51.436 --> 0:33:54.876
<v Speaker 2>already in. THIS space i can't imagine the pressures but

0:33:54.916 --> 0:33:57.516
<v Speaker 2>also the pain of having to feel like you need

0:33:57.556 --> 0:34:00.156
<v Speaker 2>to hide that with your coaches or with, you know

0:34:00.196 --> 0:34:02.116
<v Speaker 2>these people that are potentially going to give you an

0:34:02.116 --> 0:34:05.036
<v Speaker 2>opportunity of a lifetime and in high school that might

0:34:05.076 --> 0:34:06.236
<v Speaker 2>be the only chance that.

0:34:06.316 --> 0:34:08.996
<v Speaker 4>You HAVE but i think you opening up, the conversation

0:34:09.156 --> 0:34:12.316
<v Speaker 4>it MEANS that i think college high school coaches will have.

0:34:12.356 --> 0:34:15.156
<v Speaker 2>The conversation so That's the, it's like, you know the teacher,

0:34:16.596 --> 0:34:19.556
<v Speaker 2>models it it has to be. The coaches i'm very

0:34:19.556 --> 0:34:22.516
<v Speaker 2>proud to be part OF the nba who's backed us

0:34:22.596 --> 0:34:24.396
<v Speaker 2>so much in this and been driving, for us and

0:34:24.396 --> 0:34:27.236
<v Speaker 2>they'll continue to evolve in. This space, but Really The miami,

0:34:27.276 --> 0:34:31.036
<v Speaker 2>Heat coach Spolstra coach bo he's so open to these

0:34:31.036 --> 0:34:33.836
<v Speaker 2>conversations and sometimes he'll just bring it in and be like.

0:34:34.316 --> 0:34:37.356
<v Speaker 2>Blackout day nobody, come in get, some sun get some.

0:34:37.436 --> 0:34:39.756
<v Speaker 2>Vitamin date it's good, for, you right spend time with,

0:34:39.796 --> 0:34:41.676
<v Speaker 2>your families play the long game because we.

0:34:41.756 --> 0:34:43.476
<v Speaker 3>Need that it's an.

0:34:43.556 --> 0:34:46.916
<v Speaker 2>Unforgiving league so when he, models that and he's one

0:34:46.916 --> 0:34:50.036
<v Speaker 2>of the greatest coaches of, all time and we Have Doctor,

0:34:50.196 --> 0:34:54.396
<v Speaker 2>derek anderson who's our licensed therapist, on staff. He's amazing

0:34:54.756 --> 0:34:58.516
<v Speaker 2>so that also gives me hope that that will then

0:34:58.636 --> 0:35:02.556
<v Speaker 2>trickle down to college athletes as well as high. School

0:35:02.596 --> 0:35:04.836
<v Speaker 2>athletes and there's always going to be exceptions to. The

0:35:04.916 --> 0:35:07.876
<v Speaker 2>rule there's going to be people that aren't open. To

0:35:07.916 --> 0:35:10.036
<v Speaker 2>this but, you know vulnerability. Is.

0:35:10.236 --> 0:35:12.196
<v Speaker 3>Superpower strength well.

0:35:12.036 --> 0:35:14.716
<v Speaker 4>Also raises a question of like what's actually going to make?

0:35:14.836 --> 0:35:17.556
<v Speaker 4>Play better and we could say play better on the court,

0:35:17.556 --> 0:35:21.236
<v Speaker 4>that night but also, play better, you know having a

0:35:20.796 --> 0:35:23.796
<v Speaker 4>long career of longevity with your injuries where you, don't

0:35:23.916 --> 0:35:26.796
<v Speaker 4>know blow yourself up and get canceled on. Social media you're, so,

0:35:26.916 --> 0:35:29.196
<v Speaker 4>ANGRY right, I mean i think we really need to

0:35:29.196 --> 0:35:30.716
<v Speaker 4>have a conversation of whether or.

0:35:30.756 --> 0:35:32.036
<v Speaker 3>Not it could be a.

0:35:32.076 --> 0:35:34.436
<v Speaker 4>Better, PRODUCT well i think even just, you know in

0:35:34.516 --> 0:35:37.716
<v Speaker 4>terms of like, physical performance we figured. That out, you

0:35:37.716 --> 0:35:40.196
<v Speaker 4>know people get. Rest days, you know you, take. BREAKS

0:35:40.276 --> 0:35:42.636
<v Speaker 4>right i think we've come to realize that the body

0:35:42.716 --> 0:35:44.956
<v Speaker 4>is not just this crazy machine that you, push, push, push.

0:35:45.036 --> 0:35:46.796
<v Speaker 4>RIGHT right i think when we come to think about

0:35:46.796 --> 0:35:51.316
<v Speaker 4>people's mental health their human performance side, of things we

0:35:51.556 --> 0:35:53.796
<v Speaker 4>probably need to be a little bit more compassionate, there

0:35:53.836 --> 0:35:56.276
<v Speaker 4>too and ultimately like the result will be. Better off

0:35:56.836 --> 0:35:58.276
<v Speaker 4>thank you so much for all the great work that

0:35:58.316 --> 0:36:00.516
<v Speaker 4>you're doing and where can folks learn About The kevin

0:36:00.556 --> 0:36:02.236
<v Speaker 4>love fun kevinlovefund.

0:36:02.356 --> 0:36:05.076
<v Speaker 2>Dot org and thank you as well for being. AN

0:36:05.836 --> 0:36:08.516
<v Speaker 2>ally i always say like we're, tribal beings we should

0:36:08.516 --> 0:36:11.356
<v Speaker 2>start acting, like it and we are part of a.

0:36:11.396 --> 0:36:13.916
<v Speaker 2>Tribe together this is. Community driven we all want to

0:36:13.956 --> 0:36:15.876
<v Speaker 2>be on the winning side. Of HISTORY but i think it's.

0:36:15.916 --> 0:36:21.076
<v Speaker 1>ALL hope i hope we're finally at the beginning of

0:36:21.116 --> 0:36:23.996
<v Speaker 1>a mental, health revolution but there's still lots of work

0:36:24.036 --> 0:36:26.756
<v Speaker 1>that each of us can do to fight. The, stigma

0:36:26.956 --> 0:36:30.876
<v Speaker 1>First as kevin's viral article, put it remember everyone is

0:36:30.916 --> 0:36:34.196
<v Speaker 1>going through something and a little compassion can go a very.

0:36:34.236 --> 0:36:37.716
<v Speaker 1>Long way so if you're a teacher or, a coach

0:36:37.836 --> 0:36:40.276
<v Speaker 1>or a parent or, a leader it's vital that you

0:36:40.356 --> 0:36:42.876
<v Speaker 1>model vulnerability to the people who look up, to you

0:36:43.356 --> 0:36:46.596
<v Speaker 1>and give yourself a little. Compassion too by, doing so

0:36:46.876 --> 0:36:49.436
<v Speaker 1>we can help the next generation break the cycle and

0:36:49.476 --> 0:36:54.276
<v Speaker 1>feel safe having tough. Conversations Openly The happiness lab will

0:36:54.316 --> 0:36:58.076
<v Speaker 1>soon be back with A spectacular. Halloween episode we'll be

0:36:58.116 --> 0:37:01.236
<v Speaker 1>exploring the connection between fear. And joy we'll speak to

0:37:01.276 --> 0:37:04.996
<v Speaker 1>a behavioral scientist who's studying why certain people just love

0:37:05.276 --> 0:37:08.396
<v Speaker 1>to Be scared. All that next time On The, Happiness

0:37:08.476 --> 0:37:11.396
<v Speaker 1>Lab Doctor laurie santos