1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,640 Speaker 1: Guess what, Mango, what that will? So you know how 2 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:05,760 Speaker 1: tons of kids want to be princesses, right like there's 3 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:09,040 Speaker 1: Sophia the First and Disney movies. I know, you know, 4 00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:12,399 Speaker 1: my my, my daughter, four year old Ruby actually wants 5 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: none of that. She wants to be a professional golfer, 6 00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 1: she says right now. She's also been telling people she 7 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: wants to be a professional t ball player. And uh 8 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:23,880 Speaker 1: and when she does ballet, it's honestly like less delicate 9 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:27,360 Speaker 1: and more aggressive than any stylent ballet you've ever seen before. 10 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: Oh I love that, and I love Ruby's ideas. And 11 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:32,560 Speaker 1: you know what, I actually believe her if she wants 12 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:35,080 Speaker 1: to be a professional golfer, I believe she will be 13 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:38,440 Speaker 1: a professional golfer. So though, but anyway, I'm glad Ruby's 14 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:40,680 Speaker 1: got her own ideas. You know. The funny thing about 15 00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:43,680 Speaker 1: history is that people have always looked up to princesses 16 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,840 Speaker 1: and you know, tried to imitate their style. And one 17 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:49,960 Speaker 1: really strange version of this was the Alexandra Limp. Have 18 00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 1: you heard about this? So? So the limp is named 19 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: for the Princess Alexandra of Denmark. Now, initially she had 20 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 1: a scar on her next so she started wearing a 21 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 1: choker to conceal it, and immediately all the fashionable women 22 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 1: in society did the same thing, and overnight chokers became 23 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: all the rage, which I guess makes a certain type 24 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: of sense. We see this kind of thing happened. But 25 00:01:11,720 --> 00:01:14,480 Speaker 1: but then when Alexandra had a bout of rheumatic fever 26 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 1: that left her with this pronounced limp, so people actually 27 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 1: started trying to imitate that too, and and they weren't 28 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:24,440 Speaker 1: being ironic with this, It just fascinating to read about. 29 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 1: So they purposely started wearing mismatch shoes to imitate her walk, 30 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:31,400 Speaker 1: and then shoemakers even got in on the act. They 31 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 1: started selling these one tall heeled shoe and one low 32 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 1: shoe as a pair, so that you could get a 33 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: little bit more of that natural Alexandra limp. I'm not kidding. 34 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:43,920 Speaker 1: That's ridiculous. How long did this last for? I think 35 00:01:43,959 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 1: it was maybe a season or two, And you know, 36 00:01:46,120 --> 00:01:49,800 Speaker 1: most commoners thought that high society folk looked like idiots. 37 00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 1: But the BBC reports that there was a fashion journal 38 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:54,920 Speaker 1: that called for an immediate end to the trend a 39 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:58,000 Speaker 1: year or two after it started. I think instead they 40 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 1: suggested quote. The skirt of the season, we are informed, 41 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 1: is to clean closely round the feet in consequence, whereof 42 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: ladies will be obliged to walk because if their feet 43 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 1: were tied together. Which doesn't sound like much of an improvement, No, 44 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: it definitely isn't, but it does show society's obsession with princesses, 45 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 1: or at least a certain kind of princess, and today's 46 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: show is all about breaking that stereotype. So we're gonna 47 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 1: be talking about princesses behaving badly, warriors, schemers, Charlatan's and 48 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: a whole lot more. So let's dive in. Hey, their 49 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 1: podcast listeners, welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm Will Pearson 50 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 1: and as always I'm joined by my good friend man 51 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 1: Guesha Ticketer and sitting behind that soundproof glass wearing a 52 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 1: shirt that just says inconceivable, which is a nice Princess 53 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:06,680 Speaker 1: Bride reference from Tristan over there. That's our friend and 54 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 1: producer Tristan McNeil. Now, speaking of Princess Bride, do you 55 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:12,240 Speaker 1: know how that book was written? Mango, I don't so. 56 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:14,560 Speaker 1: The author, William Goldman, he wanted to write a book 57 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,360 Speaker 1: for his daughters and they were four and seven years old, 58 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:19,680 Speaker 1: I think at the time, and so he just asked him, like, 59 00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 1: what should it be about? And one set of princess 60 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: and the other one said a bride, And so that's 61 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:27,799 Speaker 1: how I got his title. That's pretty fun, and it's 62 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,680 Speaker 1: perfect for today's show because it isn't really a safew 63 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:33,359 Speaker 1: princess story, right, yeah, I mean it's it's definitely one 64 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:35,760 Speaker 1: of my favorites, but but we should jump in. So 65 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:38,160 Speaker 1: today on the program, we've got an old friend and 66 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: one of our favorite writers from our Mental Floss days, 67 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,440 Speaker 1: Linda Rodriguez McRobbie. Now, she wrote a book called Princesses 68 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 1: Behaving Badly, Real stories from history without the fairy tale endings, 69 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:51,240 Speaker 1: and we can't wait to ask her all about it. 70 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: So welcome to the show, Linda, Hi, thank you so 71 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 1: much for having me on. Why don't we start with 72 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,560 Speaker 1: one of my favorite badass princesses from this lot, who's 73 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 1: uh could have? Lunit think? I don't know how you 74 00:04:00,920 --> 00:04:04,120 Speaker 1: pronounced it. Could you tell us a little bit about her? So? 75 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 1: She was a Mongolian princess. She was um, she was 76 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: a relative of Genghis Khan. She was a great great 77 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: granddaughter of Genghis Khan. She was the only girl in 78 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:18,440 Speaker 1: a family of fourteen boys, and she was impressive. I 79 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:22,240 Speaker 1: mean she you know, Marco Polo, who's the you know, 80 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 1: the famous Venetian traveler and chronicler. Um, he saw her 81 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:29,200 Speaker 1: in action, and one of the things that she was 82 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:31,440 Speaker 1: particularly good at, she was you know, she was she 83 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 1: was an archer and an excellent horsewoman, and those were 84 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:37,800 Speaker 1: things that were fairly common to Mongolian courship culture at 85 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: the time, even among women. But she was an amazing wrestler. 86 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 1: She could not be beaten. And supposedly, by the time 87 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:47,280 Speaker 1: Marco Polo saw her, she had amassed a herd at 88 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 1: like ten thousand horses, because the common thing to do 89 00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:55,040 Speaker 1: was to bet horses on the outcome of this match, 90 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:59,280 Speaker 1: and so she would just always win and she and 91 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 1: it so by the time that Marco Polo finds her, um, 92 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:06,280 Speaker 1: the rumors got around and that she refused to marry 93 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:09,080 Speaker 1: anyone who couldn't beat her on the wrestling mat. And 94 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:12,200 Speaker 1: so at that point she was still unmarried, and that 95 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:13,840 Speaker 1: was kind of getting a little bit sticky, a little 96 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 1: complicated for her family. Um. But from what the historical 97 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:20,719 Speaker 1: record seems to show she never was beaten, and she 98 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 1: eventually just chose to marry someone even though they could 99 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 1: beat her on the wrestling that so and and Linda. 100 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 1: Part part of the amazing thing about her dominance in 101 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:33,920 Speaker 1: wrestling is it actually affected the clothes that athletes were, right. So, yeah, 102 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 1: supposedly now even in today, when Mongolian men wrestle, they 103 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 1: wear this kind of long sleeved best that's open in 104 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:44,920 Speaker 1: the front to show their opponents that they don't have rest. 105 00:05:45,880 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: And supposedly it's men as a tribute to the female 106 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 1: wrestler who was never defeated. Yeah, that's pretty great. And 107 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,760 Speaker 1: you know, obviously kulun Is is certainly one of our 108 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:56,599 Speaker 1: favorites from the book. I mean, do you have a 109 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,320 Speaker 1: favorite warrior princess? I know there's so many to choose from, 110 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 1: but I'm I'm curious of in doing the research for 111 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: the book, that was one that just really stuck out 112 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 1: to you. One of my absolute favorites is Outfield, the 113 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 1: Pirate Princess. So she's there isn't a lot of great 114 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:17,160 Speaker 1: evidence that she actually existed, but I just love her story. Um, 115 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:20,840 Speaker 1: she was a she was a princess of the fifth 116 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 1: century and daughter of a of a Goth king. So 117 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:26,039 Speaker 1: this is all sort of out of the like you know, 118 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:30,919 Speaker 1: icy cold Scandinavian North, and she's certainly in the tradition 119 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:34,840 Speaker 1: of the kind of shield maiden warrior Princess model Um, 120 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,240 Speaker 1: and her story starts a little bit funny because she's 121 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 1: she is meant to be so beautiful that she was 122 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 1: forced by her family to cover her face lest she 123 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:49,560 Speaker 1: provoked the men around her into just you know, connections 124 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 1: of lust or whatever they thought was right to happen. Um. 125 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: And she was given by her father, the king. She 126 00:06:56,120 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 1: was given a viper and a snake to rear Um, 127 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:02,599 Speaker 1: wishing to defend her chastity by the protection of these 128 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:04,839 Speaker 1: reptiles when they came to grow up. So basically she 129 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 1: has these two deadly reptiles as her guard animals Um, 130 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:15,080 Speaker 1: and the idea was that, you know, if somebody could 131 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 1: get through that, then then maybe he could be worthy 132 00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:24,520 Speaker 1: of her Um. And eventually someone dead and this is 133 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:26,440 Speaker 1: the part that kind of cracks me up because the 134 00:07:26,440 --> 00:07:29,000 Speaker 1: guy who eventually was able to kill both of the 135 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 1: snakes and make it alive to alfhild Um was named 136 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 1: Alf so if they got married, they would have been 137 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 1: Alf and Elf Hills. Um. But where this story starts 138 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: to kind of beer away from the whole sort of 139 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 1: you know, princess and a castle rescued by the handsome 140 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 1: prince thing is that she was given the decision once 141 00:07:52,440 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 1: once he made it through killed pets. Um, she give 142 00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:58,480 Speaker 1: a decision do you actually want to marry him or not? 143 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 1: And she actually chose not to and instead became a 144 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:06,200 Speaker 1: pirate with a crew of lady pirates with her, and 145 00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 1: they tore up and down the Baltic Sea around the coast, 146 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:14,280 Speaker 1: and she amassed a flotilla and she basically came became 147 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 1: like a pirate admiral, and um, I just I just 148 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:21,880 Speaker 1: loved this idea of her sort of you know, being 149 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:25,360 Speaker 1: like I could get married or I could be a pirate, 150 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:29,320 Speaker 1: and that's just way more fun. And so you know, 151 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:31,240 Speaker 1: this is also kind of one of the like ancient 152 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 1: meat cute stories because Alf, of course has never forgotten 153 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:38,960 Speaker 1: about this, this beautiful maiden who um, you know, was 154 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,840 Speaker 1: so chased and so modest and yet spurned his advances 155 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:44,079 Speaker 1: and decided to become a pirate take to the sea 156 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 1: that he's been following her. He's been trying to find her, 157 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:50,120 Speaker 1: and eventually he comes across this this you know, this 158 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 1: flotilla of of pirate ships, of kind of Viking pirate ships, right, 159 00:08:54,679 --> 00:08:57,959 Speaker 1: and in his head he's thinking like, right, nothing will 160 00:08:58,040 --> 00:08:59,800 Speaker 1: keep me from my love. I know, I'm so close 161 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:01,560 Speaker 1: to her. I'm going to find her. It's gonna be great, 162 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:03,400 Speaker 1: it's gonna be awesome. I just gotta get to these 163 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:05,640 Speaker 1: pirates first. So they're fighting, he's fighting on the deck. 164 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 1: He's found the pirates. Fun he accidentally knocks off one 165 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:14,839 Speaker 1: of the pirates helmet and it's herd and so, you know, 166 00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:16,839 Speaker 1: and then and then the story gets a little bit 167 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,040 Speaker 1: like a little bit disappointing because oh, they got married, 168 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:24,079 Speaker 1: and and not long after that Elf got on her 169 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:27,640 Speaker 1: a son. So it's, you know, that's a little bit disappointing. 170 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:31,640 Speaker 1: But the start of the story is is really really exciting, 171 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:33,920 Speaker 1: and the fact that she was able to kind of 172 00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 1: pursue her own destiny in a way that was was 173 00:09:38,360 --> 00:09:41,359 Speaker 1: different certainly to other women and was kind of contrary 174 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:45,800 Speaker 1: to that that what would later become an established fairytale story. 175 00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:48,400 Speaker 1: I think it's really compelling and kind of fun, and 176 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 1: I think I'm going to choose to believe that that 177 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:52,440 Speaker 1: was true. Let's just go with this as a as 178 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:55,760 Speaker 1: a real story. I want to believe that she's a 179 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:58,360 Speaker 1: real person. I mean, the story came out like six 180 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 1: hundred years after this was meant to have and in 181 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:04,080 Speaker 1: a sort of you know, history that also included it 182 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:06,560 Speaker 1: was like a history of the Danes that also included 183 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 1: like giants and dragons and other things that we're probably 184 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:21,200 Speaker 1: not true. So one of the things we've been fascinated 185 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:24,079 Speaker 1: in recent culture is like watching things like down Abbey 186 00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:27,960 Speaker 1: or even like Prince Harry's engagement where these like commoners 187 00:10:28,080 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: sort of marry in and uh. And I was curious 188 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 1: about the story that you tell about Clara Ward, who's 189 00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 1: I guess hails from Detroit. Can you tell us a 190 00:10:36,160 --> 00:10:40,679 Speaker 1: little bit about her? Yeah, Clara Ward was, I mean 191 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: her her story is very very much in line with 192 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 1: a lot of what was happening at the end of 193 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:51,400 Speaker 1: the nineteenth century. Essentially, Europe was a Europe was the 194 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: tough place to be. Um the sort of the national 195 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:58,280 Speaker 1: borders were changing all the time. Um, the fortunes of 196 00:10:58,320 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 1: the European aristocrats were tumbling, and at the same time 197 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:08,319 Speaker 1: America was ascending in a big way, and particularly um 198 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:12,880 Speaker 1: American wealth was was becoming very very attractive, and so 199 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:17,959 Speaker 1: you saw a lot of these marriages between European aristocrats 200 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:21,960 Speaker 1: and American heiresses, and essentially the heiresses were bringing the 201 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: money and the aristocrats were bringing the sort of you know, 202 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,480 Speaker 1: the titles, yeah, and the social standing and and all 203 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:33,079 Speaker 1: of that. That seemed sort of very very important then. 204 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 1: And Clara Ward, who was the daughter of an American industrialist, 205 00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: she came from Detroit. She her her mother seems to 206 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:47,440 Speaker 1: have really wanted that life for her, and starting when 207 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:50,360 Speaker 1: she was in her teens, had her educated in London, 208 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:54,480 Speaker 1: in Italy and France. And the sort of most notable 209 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:56,560 Speaker 1: thing about those times was that Clara Ward got kicked 210 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,839 Speaker 1: out of every single school she went to, was just 211 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:04,440 Speaker 1: scribed as sort of far too wild to ever fit 212 00:12:04,559 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 1: in into this kind of European society. But she eventually 213 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 1: did marry. Um. She was very young, she was, you know, 214 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:14,440 Speaker 1: in her teens still when she married the Prince Caraman 215 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 1: de Chimayum she was a Belgian prince, and they stayed together. 216 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:22,840 Speaker 1: Sort of it wasn't a good match. I mean, as 217 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:25,480 Speaker 1: as much as you can sort of you know, assume 218 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:29,160 Speaker 1: from a lot of these these marriages of wealth and title. 219 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:34,199 Speaker 1: People weren't always in it for love. Everything weren't in 220 00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:37,000 Speaker 1: it for love. So Clara was seventeen years old when 221 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 1: she met Prince Joseph Dick Caraman Chimay. He was the 222 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,640 Speaker 1: son of the Belgian foreign affairs minister. He was in 223 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:46,280 Speaker 1: serious debt, but of course he had this this title, 224 00:12:46,880 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 1: and they got married in Paris in the eighteen ninety 225 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,679 Speaker 1: Her dress costs like like ten thousand dollars, I mean, 226 00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:57,080 Speaker 1: which is just an insane amount of money in you know, 227 00:12:57,160 --> 00:13:01,520 Speaker 1: in eighteen ninety. Um. Once they were married, they traveled 228 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: to all of the sort of European hot spots. They 229 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:08,400 Speaker 1: were in the Belgian court, and they went to the Riviera, 230 00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 1: the Paris, went all over the place, and she you know, 231 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 1: had two children this time. But it was clear from 232 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 1: the reports that she was not happy, um, and that 233 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 1: her relationship with her husband, which had you know, from 234 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:26,320 Speaker 1: the beginning not been great, was getting worse, and that 235 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:29,840 Speaker 1: she was potentially cheating on him and he didn't really 236 00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 1: care enough to stop her. Um. Things really came to 237 00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:35,960 Speaker 1: the head when she was in the Belgian court. And 238 00:13:36,040 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 1: evidently she says that King Leopold the Second showed so 239 00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: much attention to her too, that she was shunned by 240 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,200 Speaker 1: the rest of the court and became a sort of 241 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 1: social pariah. And I think at that point really kind 242 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:53,880 Speaker 1: of crystallized her dislike of the European aristocratic circles that 243 00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:56,959 Speaker 1: she was traveling in. So eventually, um there, Now, by 244 00:13:56,960 --> 00:14:00,160 Speaker 1: the time they get to Paris, things are really you know, 245 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 1: we've we've set the stage for a break between her 246 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 1: and her husband, and sort of one of the first 247 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:09,360 Speaker 1: kind of best opportunities she takes it. And that opportunity 248 00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:13,559 Speaker 1: happened to be a Hungarian gypsy violinist called Rigo Jancy. 249 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 1: It's November eighteen ninety six. She's at a cafe, she 250 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:20,480 Speaker 1: sees him playing his violin. They smile at each other, 251 00:14:20,680 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 1: and then ten days later she runs away with him. 252 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:27,800 Speaker 1: And two months after that she's divorced from her husband 253 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,120 Speaker 1: and separated from her children and also forced to pay 254 00:14:30,480 --> 00:14:35,680 Speaker 1: him alimony for the rest of her life. She's now free, right, 255 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:37,520 Speaker 1: so this this like you can imagine too, I mean, 256 00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 1: this must have been this was incredibly scandalous. At the time. 257 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:44,160 Speaker 1: The courtroom for her divorce trial was packed. She didn't 258 00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:46,640 Speaker 1: actually show up. All of her statements were actually went 259 00:14:46,680 --> 00:14:50,040 Speaker 1: out by her lawyers. But she was just she was 260 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 1: just done with it. And she even said, you know, 261 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 1: she said, I wanted to be free. I am done 262 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 1: with it. I don't think And she says later on 263 00:14:57,280 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 1: too that that American went and could not fit into 264 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:06,240 Speaker 1: this kind of lifestyle, that it's too stifling, that it's 265 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:10,120 Speaker 1: too petty, and and she just hated it. But from 266 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:14,120 Speaker 1: that point on she lived her life to the fullest. 267 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:18,120 Speaker 1: I mean, she was you know, the she was painted 268 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 1: by Vito loose law track. She was a star of 269 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 1: Bellapoc friends. She you know, she posed in in these 270 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 1: like skin tight leotard things with strange things on her head, 271 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: had her pictures taken. She showed her ankles, I mean, 272 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:41,320 Speaker 1: she was having She she divorced Rigo Gout was involved 273 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 1: with someone else, got married again who I think he 274 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:47,160 Speaker 1: was the handsomest man in Naples. I think that was 275 00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:50,720 Speaker 1: his sort of you know, claimed the fame. And then 276 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:53,000 Speaker 1: they divorced and she married somebody else, and and it 277 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 1: sort of you see that her you know, interest in 278 00:15:56,920 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 1: her life is perpetual all the way up until the end. 279 00:15:59,080 --> 00:16:02,880 Speaker 1: But details and actual facts about it are pretty slim 280 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:05,880 Speaker 1: on the ground. You don't really get a lot of great, 281 00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:09,040 Speaker 1: great information about and reliable information about what happens to 282 00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:13,280 Speaker 1: her after all these subsequent divorces. But um, she ended 283 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 1: up I mean sadly. You know, she she died really young. 284 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 1: She was only forty three. She died of pneumonia. And 285 00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:25,160 Speaker 1: at the time, there were all these rumors that she 286 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,040 Speaker 1: was penniless, that she was completely cut off from her family, 287 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,640 Speaker 1: that you know, she had no friends and all these things. 288 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:34,200 Speaker 1: And while she may have been very much cut off 289 00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 1: from society, she wasn't penniless by any means. Um. She 290 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:40,160 Speaker 1: was certainly cut off from her children, but she hadn't 291 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 1: been completely disowned. And you know, in the end, all 292 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,200 Speaker 1: of her obituaries just remembered her as this sort of 293 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: you know, bright spark that blew out too quickly. And yeah, 294 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,080 Speaker 1: I mean you wrote about how she'd been at a 295 00:16:57,160 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: convent and she shocked the nuns at the convent, like 296 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 1: the waiter and a station manager, and I mean, she 297 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 1: has such a remarkable life, and I think it's also 298 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: kind of difficult, Like all the stuff that she's doing 299 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:13,160 Speaker 1: is you know, the kinds of things that if if 300 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:16,359 Speaker 1: we're to happen to a modern celebrity celebrity now, you know, 301 00:17:16,359 --> 00:17:18,400 Speaker 1: it would be equally as interesting. But this is all 302 00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:20,440 Speaker 1: happening at the turn of the century. This is this 303 00:17:20,520 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 1: is the eighteen nineties to the nineteen tents. I mean, 304 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:27,320 Speaker 1: she died in nineteen sixteen, you know, so this is 305 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 1: all like like she is she is. You know, she 306 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:33,919 Speaker 1: is a celebrity in the vein of celebrities now, but 307 00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:37,400 Speaker 1: without the kind of machinery around promoting that celebrity. So 308 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:40,240 Speaker 1: if there's always kind of wonderful gossip columns and stuff 309 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:43,400 Speaker 1: that you read. And the Library of Congress, by the way, 310 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 1: is a treasure trope and has everything. And I found 311 00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 1: out a lot from all the newspapers that they had 312 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 1: their um But you know, you can see the beginnings 313 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:54,639 Speaker 1: of the steeds of the kinds of celebrities that we 314 00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:58,399 Speaker 1: have now. And you know, her claimed aime was that 315 00:17:58,480 --> 00:17:59,879 Speaker 1: she had a lot of money and she did some 316 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,040 Speaker 1: dosy things with it. She feels very modern in that regard, 317 00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 1: But I also just appreciate that she lived the life 318 00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 1: that she wanted to lead and wasn't going to be 319 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,560 Speaker 1: put into the boxes that her family wanted her to 320 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:15,920 Speaker 1: be in, or the European Court wanted her to be in, 321 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:18,919 Speaker 1: and or even you know, the public wanted her to 322 00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:23,000 Speaker 1: be in. She she, she did her and good honor. 323 00:18:24,119 --> 00:18:26,840 Speaker 1: We have several more fascinating lives that we want to 324 00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 1: ask you about, but before we do that, let's take 325 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 1: a quick break. Welcome back to Part Time Genius. We're 326 00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 1: talking to Linda Rodriguez McRobbie, the author of Princesses Behaving Badly. Now, Linda, 327 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:52,159 Speaker 1: before we get back to some of the other specific princesses, 328 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:54,439 Speaker 1: I did appreciate, you know, so many of the side 329 00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:57,440 Speaker 1: stories and sidebars and other guides that you had in 330 00:18:57,480 --> 00:18:59,840 Speaker 1: the book, and one of these was a guide to 331 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:03,040 Speaker 1: faking prince's Hood. And I was, curiously, can you tell 332 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:06,280 Speaker 1: us some of the better strategies for pretending you're a 333 00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:10,800 Speaker 1: royal if you're not actually a royal? Uh? Well, there 334 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:14,359 Speaker 1: are some fantastic examples of people doing that, and my 335 00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:17,960 Speaker 1: favorite at Christmas Princess Cariboo. Who's in it? But um, 336 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:20,920 Speaker 1: it seems like the best way to pretend that you're 337 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 1: royal when you're not is to just put your all 338 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,640 Speaker 1: into it and and stay it with confidence. It's sort 339 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 1: of like people will believe you more if you just 340 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 1: say it really loudly. Princess all of the Cumberland. She 341 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:38,560 Speaker 1: her story. This was This was in the early eight hundreds, 342 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 1: right around the time in England when the press was 343 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:47,000 Speaker 1: becoming really really powerful and there were a lot of 344 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:50,560 Speaker 1: places where you could get pamphlets printed. And these pamphlets 345 00:19:50,560 --> 00:19:52,879 Speaker 1: were probably they're just everywhere, like pretty much every it was. 346 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:55,800 Speaker 1: It's basically the same thing as having something self published. 347 00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:57,880 Speaker 1: Now and you said, you will see tons of them 348 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:01,600 Speaker 1: where you know, the George Wilson, the Black Heath Pedestrian, 349 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:04,160 Speaker 1: a man who's walked a thousand miles, like, he gets 350 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,560 Speaker 1: his pamphlet printed and tells his story, it sells it. 351 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,280 Speaker 1: So she had her pamphlet printed and claimed to be 352 00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:13,880 Speaker 1: Princess Olive of Cumberland, the sort of a legitimate sort 353 00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 1: of illegitimate, illegitimate daughter of the king's brother. Um. And 354 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: any time that somebody says these things confidence, they put 355 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: it down in paper, they put it down in writing, 356 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,879 Speaker 1: they tell enough people, they say it with enough power, 357 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:30,840 Speaker 1: they use the prince, people are going to start to 358 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:33,920 Speaker 1: believe it. Yeah, and it's it's amazing. I feel like 359 00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:36,560 Speaker 1: there was one u one story in there. I can't 360 00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:39,720 Speaker 1: remember who, but like there was a woman who refused 361 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:44,159 Speaker 1: to speak German unless unless a fellow queen or princess 362 00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:47,239 Speaker 1: spoken to her. Like there's such elaborate ways out of 363 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:50,040 Speaker 1: like you know, explaining away the reason that you can't 364 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 1: speak a language or whatever. It's just kind of amazing. 365 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,439 Speaker 1: It's also I think because people, you know, people do 366 00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:58,080 Speaker 1: want to believe like there's there's I think this is 367 00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 1: part of the sort of really interesting world that um 368 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:04,920 Speaker 1: that royalty and habits that because it feels so special 369 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:08,840 Speaker 1: to people around you feel special by being connected to you. 370 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:11,639 Speaker 1: So if you know that that and of itself is 371 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:14,480 Speaker 1: enough for people to want to support your idea and 372 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:17,639 Speaker 1: to support you in your claim, and you know, so 373 00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:20,920 Speaker 1: it becomes this kind of self perpetuating thing. I mean, 374 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: it feels you know, royalty still feels special. So I 375 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:28,680 Speaker 1: I want to get back to some of the seedier 376 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 1: sides of being a princess and h and can you 377 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:34,440 Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about Charlotte of Prussia who 378 00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 1: threw a notorious party. Oh yeah, she's one of my 379 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:44,000 Speaker 1: favorites too, because I think she's the granddaughter of Queen Victoria. Right, 380 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:46,120 Speaker 1: so who you know, we think of Queen Victoria as 381 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:51,639 Speaker 1: um Victorian. Yeah, I mean, just you know, everything about 382 00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 1: Victoria in the Victorian era is buttoned up in prim 383 00:21:55,400 --> 00:22:01,080 Speaker 1: and proper. But in eight Charlotte of Prussia, um chain 384 00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:05,680 Speaker 1: smoking Princess Victoria Elizabeth August Charlotte, granddaughter in Queen Victoria, 385 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:08,520 Speaker 1: the daughter of the Prussian rulers, the younger sister of 386 00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 1: Kaiser Vilham, the second um through a sex party at 387 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:18,919 Speaker 1: a hunting lodge in the woods, and evidently dozens of 388 00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 1: aristocrats showed up. It was you know, it was drinking 389 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:30,080 Speaker 1: and dancing and sex and lots of things going on. 390 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:33,160 Speaker 1: And the only reason that people found out about this 391 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:37,440 Speaker 1: was that there was someone in the party that night 392 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 1: who leaked the story and started to blackmail the other 393 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 1: people who were there, and they could describe in detail 394 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: some of the naughty things that everybody who was up to. 395 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 1: And it came out that um that Charlotte was the 396 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:53,439 Speaker 1: one who had thrown the party, and she had a 397 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: reputation for being snobby and for being rude. Um. She 398 00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:04,320 Speaker 1: did not have an academic mindset, so to speaking. Um, 399 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,200 Speaker 1: she was a flirt, you know. So so there was 400 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 1: there's not a lot going for him, and this was 401 00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:12,520 Speaker 1: all coming from her own mother too, which is not 402 00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 1: very nice. Yeah. Um, And so you know, after the 403 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:19,720 Speaker 1: sex party happened, there was this this massive blackmail scandal 404 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:24,200 Speaker 1: that just rocked the cord and and um and became 405 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:27,760 Speaker 1: you know, a really really really big scandal. There was 406 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 1: a police investigation that lasted years, and eventually it came 407 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 1: out that it was the kaiser's brother in law and 408 00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:41,399 Speaker 1: his French mistress who were behind the black mail of 409 00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:46,639 Speaker 1: the sexy aristocratic swinger party. But even by that time, 410 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,399 Speaker 1: you know, Charlotte's reputation was already in treads. It wasn't 411 00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:53,320 Speaker 1: gonna it wasn't going anywhere good. You know, there's one 412 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,120 Speaker 1: other scandal I wanted to ask you about as well, 413 00:23:55,320 --> 00:24:08,160 Speaker 1: But before we get to that, let's take a quick break, 414 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: all right, Linda. So we were talking about scandals before, 415 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,280 Speaker 1: and actually there's another one I've been wanting to ask 416 00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,680 Speaker 1: you about about Princess Margaret, you know, the princess who 417 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:20,159 Speaker 1: may have actually caused the bank robbery. Can can you 418 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,040 Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about that? Yeah? Okay, So 419 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:25,520 Speaker 1: if anybody's seen the movie The Bank Job. I think 420 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,840 Speaker 1: it came out in I want to say two thousand 421 00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:31,360 Speaker 1: and eight. It's the Jason stith In movie, so you'll 422 00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:34,440 Speaker 1: be you'll be familiar with the story from that. But 423 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:39,360 Speaker 1: but it is based on a real thing that happened. 424 00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 1: So um in a gang of thieves dug into the 425 00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:50,639 Speaker 1: safety deposit fault box fault at Lloyd's Bank here in London. 426 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 1: It was around Baker Street and Marlabum so Sherlock Holmes 427 00:24:55,040 --> 00:25:00,560 Speaker 1: area by the way, um and made off with huge 428 00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:04,720 Speaker 1: amounts of money, I mean untold amounts of money, because 429 00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:07,280 Speaker 1: you know, people put things in safety deposit boxes that 430 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:10,160 Speaker 1: they don't necessarily want people other people to know about. 431 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:16,040 Speaker 1: And eventually the men were caught. Um four men were 432 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:18,520 Speaker 1: arrested in jailed for the crime, but the mastermind behind 433 00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 1: the whole thing was never actually arrested. The thing that 434 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 1: was weird about this, and the thing that got people talking, 435 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:32,800 Speaker 1: was that um, four days after the the incident, four 436 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:37,119 Speaker 1: days after the brobbery itself, the newspapers stopped talking about it, 437 00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 1: and I mean the British newspapers still stopped talking about 438 00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:45,000 Speaker 1: anything unless it's you know, completely dead buried in the ground. 439 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:49,480 Speaker 1: So what people started to say was that the authorities 440 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:52,520 Speaker 1: had put a d notice basically a gag order, preventing 441 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:55,160 Speaker 1: the media from talking about what might have happened in 442 00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:59,240 Speaker 1: because on the theory that the whole heist was actually 443 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:03,080 Speaker 1: set up by m I five to steal compromising photographs 444 00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,680 Speaker 1: of Princess Margaret. It was supposedly photos of our having 445 00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:10,919 Speaker 1: a threesome, quite possibly with a gangster called John Binden. 446 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:15,240 Speaker 1: Nobody really knew. But I mean, even even without the 447 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:18,840 Speaker 1: whole big job thing, you know, Margaret's life was kind 448 00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:22,680 Speaker 1: of both tragic and also scandalous, and also sort of 449 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:27,760 Speaker 1: evocative of the changes that were rocking the British monarchy 450 00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:31,119 Speaker 1: at the time, um, changing social barris, all those things. 451 00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 1: You know. I think it's really worth noting that Margaret 452 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:40,480 Speaker 1: was prevented from marrying the first person that she loved, 453 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:42,600 Speaker 1: marrying the man that she wanted to marry because he 454 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:47,080 Speaker 1: was divorced and at the time, the church, you know, 455 00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:48,800 Speaker 1: the Queen is the head of the church here in 456 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:52,159 Speaker 1: this country, the church could not allow her to marry 457 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 1: someone who had been divorced. So it's really worth noting 458 00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:59,360 Speaker 1: that Prince Harry is marrying someone who is divorced. It's 459 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:03,040 Speaker 1: at least significant to show in just two generations how 460 00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 1: much things have changed from what it was like in 461 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies and before and to what it's like now. Right, Linda, So, 462 00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:14,120 Speaker 1: what do you want people to come away with when 463 00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:17,640 Speaker 1: when reading about these princesses in your book? I think 464 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,000 Speaker 1: the biggest thing that I want people to realize is 465 00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 1: that underneath the title of princess there's a person, a real, living, 466 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:31,159 Speaker 1: breathing or formally breathing human being, who made good decisions 467 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:36,240 Speaker 1: and made bad decisions, who had feelings and sometimes loved 468 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:39,520 Speaker 1: the wrong people, sometimes did the right thing, sometimes did 469 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:42,280 Speaker 1: the wrong thing for the right reasons, or the right 470 00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:45,960 Speaker 1: thing for the wrong reasons. That these were humans. And 471 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:49,320 Speaker 1: I think the most important thing is that, you know, 472 00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,240 Speaker 1: there are so many princesses in this book, right, I mean, 473 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,479 Speaker 1: I I really was just jamming them in because there 474 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:59,080 Speaker 1: are so many women whose stories are not being told, 475 00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:03,080 Speaker 1: and I want people to see this book as an 476 00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:06,000 Speaker 1: invitation to find out more about those women. Yeah, and 477 00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:07,960 Speaker 1: and there's so many that we didn't get to today. 478 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,200 Speaker 1: I mean, there's a great story of a punk princess 479 00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:13,760 Speaker 1: or you know, the Mafia Princess Lucretia. It was such 480 00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 1: a fascinating story. You know she she wore a hollow 481 00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 1: ring full of poison that she could pour into somebody's 482 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: drink at any time. Well, I'm gonna go with the 483 00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:25,960 Speaker 1: hollow ring story. But there's so many and I hope 484 00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:29,160 Speaker 1: our listeners will all check out the book Princesses Behaving Badly, 485 00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:33,280 Speaker 1: real stories from history without the fairy tale endings. But Linda, 486 00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:35,320 Speaker 1: thanks so much for joining us today. Thank you guys 487 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:50,760 Speaker 1: so much for having me on. Thanks again for listening. 488 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:53,040 Speaker 1: Part Time Genius is a production of how stuff works 489 00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:55,640 Speaker 1: and wouldn't be possible without several brilliant people who do 490 00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 1: the important things we couldn't even begin to understand. Tristan 491 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 1: McNeil does the editing. Noel Brown made the theme song 492 00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: and does the MIXI mixy sound thing. Jerry Rowland does 493 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 1: the exact producer thing. Gave Blues Yer is our lead researcher, 494 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:10,640 Speaker 1: with support from the research Army including Austin Thompson, Nolan 495 00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:13,000 Speaker 1: Brown and Lucas Adams and Eve Jeff Cook gets the 496 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:15,160 Speaker 1: show to your ears. Good job, Eves. If you like 497 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:17,080 Speaker 1: what you heard, we hope you'll subscribe, and if you 498 00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:19,080 Speaker 1: really really like what you've heard, maybe you could leave 499 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:21,560 Speaker 1: a good review for us. Do we do we forget Jason? 500 00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:22,440 Speaker 1: Jason who