Speaker 1: My next guest is Adina Menzel. She has a new
Speaker 1: album called Drama Queen and a children's book called Proud
Speaker 1: Mouse out September twelfth. Make sure to watch and read.
Speaker 2: My son is Mixed. I don't want my whiteness to
Speaker 2: be something that I know people say you're the mom.
Speaker 2: He's going to love you, but there's going to be
Speaker 2: things that I can't understand for him because I'm not
Speaker 2: in his skin. And as he's getting older, he's becoming
Speaker 2: more and more aware of the society that he lives
Speaker 2: in and the violence, the racism, and I just want
Speaker 2: to be someone he can come to, you know. The
Speaker 2: best selling author in the post.
Speaker 1: The number one health and wellness.
Speaker 2: Podcast On Purpose with Jay Shetty.
Speaker 1: Hey everyone, welcome back to On Purpose. I am so
Speaker 1: grateful for our community here at the number one health
Speaker 1: podcast in the world. Thanks to each and every one
Speaker 1: of you that come back every week to listen, learn
Speaker 1: and grow. And I know that you're always looking for
Speaker 1: new stories, new ideas, new things to bring into your
Speaker 1: life so that you can feel better, feel happy. I
Speaker 1: feel healthier and feel healed. And today I'm talking to
Speaker 1: a guest who has a really unique experience of life.
Speaker 1: And that's what I love. I love learning about people
Speaker 1: who've come from different backgrounds, different walks of life, taken
Speaker 1: different parts. And I'm speaking to all of you about
Speaker 1: Idina Menzel, a powerhouse multi hyphenet, a singer, an actress
Speaker 1: in film and TV, a songwriter, a Broadway star, and
Speaker 1: a philanthropist. And I mean her accolades are absolutely unbelievable.
Speaker 1: Adina rose to fame for her role as Maureen in
Speaker 1: the popular Broadway musical Rent, and their career took off
Speaker 1: when she won a Tony Award for her role as Alphabet,
Speaker 1: the Wicked Witch of the West in the musical Wicked.
Speaker 1: If you haven't seen it, it's phenomenal. I can't believe
Speaker 1: you haven't seen it yet. Adina's voice can be heard
Speaker 1: as Elsa in Disney's Oscar winning Frozen, the second highest
Speaker 1: grossing animated film of all time, with more than one
Speaker 1: point two billion dollars in worldwide box office revenue, and
Speaker 1: right now she's out talking about her children's book Loud Mouse,
Speaker 1: which we'll be hearing about today as well. Please welcome
Speaker 1: to the show, Dinna Manzelle, and thank you for.
Speaker 2: Doing this, Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so grateful to meet you and so happy
Speaker 1: to get to spend this time with you. I know
Speaker 1: you've had a long day. We're just talking about. You've
Speaker 1: been up since four am.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm on the LA time. So that's what
Speaker 2: that was weird because I couldn't get to bed, yeah,
Speaker 2: with my jet lag, so I'm running on empty. But
Speaker 2: I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 1: I'm just coming as well three days ago, and so
Speaker 1: I know that feels like But I guess the question
Speaker 1: is that you've been up since four am, You've been
Speaker 1: doing so much work today. What drives you? What motivates you?
Speaker 1: What what keeps you going?
Speaker 2: My son, my thirteen year old son Walker, I think
Speaker 2: that's the main driving force. I mean, obviously creativity and
Speaker 2: my you know, artistic soul, my desire to keep creating
Speaker 2: and finding new ways to express myself. But if I'm
Speaker 2: being completely honest, it's you know, it's how can I
Speaker 2: be a better mom? How what am I doing today
Speaker 2: to help my son? You know? My relationship with my husband.
Speaker 2: I think it's because I'm I've turned fifty now, and
Speaker 2: the ambition starts to weigh a little bit when you
Speaker 2: when you have a little success too, you know, like
Speaker 2: start to feel okay, like I can afford to pay
Speaker 2: for his schooling, and I can pay my mortgage, and
Speaker 2: I'm doing wonderful things and working with terrific people, and
Speaker 2: so I can relax a little bit. When I was younger,
Speaker 2: I was just pounding the pavement so hard, you know,
Speaker 2: and really I believed in myself, but I was just
Speaker 2: really working hard and playing gigs everywhere and trying to
Speaker 2: get noticed. And so at this age it starts to
Speaker 2: you know, you go, Okay, everything's everything's going to be okay,
Speaker 2: you know, and so you want to give a lot
Speaker 2: of energy to your relations, to your marriage, to your child.
Speaker 2: And that's why this children's book is. I guess this
Speaker 2: sort of an organic step in the evolution of things,
Speaker 2: you know, because people always ask me to do one,
Speaker 2: you know, because I guess my trajectory of characters and
Speaker 2: this sort of alpha us and Elsa's and these amazing
Speaker 2: young women that have all this incredible power and our
Speaker 2: role models for kids, and it's all about, you know,
Speaker 2: embracing that power and harnessing it and not being afraid
Speaker 2: to send it out into the world. You know, there's
Speaker 2: for some reason. There's the universe has thrown these things
Speaker 2: my way. I don't know if it's the chicken or
Speaker 2: the egg. Is it me, you know, choosing these somehow,
Speaker 2: even though they were jobs I needed and I had
Speaker 2: to do for them. So I think that there's in
Speaker 2: the tradition of those characters. I felt that I wanted
Speaker 2: to write a children's book that was about really me
Speaker 2: having those very similar experiences when I was little, and
Speaker 2: really believing in myself at a young age, really recognizing
Speaker 2: that I had something special to offer, but also being
Speaker 2: hesitant to share it out of fear of being alienated,
Speaker 2: being disliked, feeling like I was calling too much attention
Speaker 2: to myself. How much space can we take up in
Speaker 2: the world, what's allowed? You know, especially as women, I
Speaker 2: think we're always sort of second guessing ourselves. So that's
Speaker 2: what the book's about. But that's what I do with
Speaker 2: as a grown up too. Every day. I'm still second
Speaker 2: guessing when I walk in a room, how much space
Speaker 2: I can take up, how big my voice is literally
Speaker 2: and metaphorically.
Speaker 1: Well, and how do you think your view has changed
Speaker 1: of what you view as important from that time when
Speaker 1: you were like grinding and hustling and busy, working hard
Speaker 1: to now having a bit more I guess structure and
Speaker 1: peace and a bit of arrival feeling, if that makes sense.
Speaker 2: The desperation isn't there, you know, it doesn't mean that
Speaker 2: I'm not still dreaming and there's not things that I
Speaker 2: There are still things I want. There's a lot of
Speaker 2: things that I find still elusive to me. We could
Speaker 2: talk about that. But so I still have ambition, but
Speaker 2: the fear of literally not being able to pay my
Speaker 2: rent or not making good on my commitment to myself
Speaker 2: as a young girl, of working hard to have my
Speaker 2: dream come true. My dreams have come true. I perform
Speaker 2: on a stage, I perform in all these incredible venues
Speaker 2: for thousands of people and Disney Princess Queen for God's sakes,
Speaker 2: you know. So, But you know, the more you get,
Speaker 2: the more you want, and you see things differently through
Speaker 2: different a different lens when you become a mom.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was two things you hit there which I
Speaker 1: read about you when I I was looking for this interview.
Speaker 1: You said, do you have many dreams? But then one
Speaker 1: of the dreams I've heard you've had is your teeth
Speaker 1: falling out right. I know that's a different time, different
Speaker 1: type of dreams. That's not the kind of dream that Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's my night. You Have you ever looked into all
Speaker 1: the meetings behind?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's all about anxiety.
Speaker 1: Have you ever found a meaning that sits well with you,
Speaker 1: that gives you some comfort in life?
Speaker 2: No, not that dream. It's always such anxiety. And that's
Speaker 2: what I've read about it. And I also usually the
Speaker 2: teeth come out and you can hear the sound of
Speaker 2: them slinking against Yeah, I have that one. And I
Speaker 2: have one that I never actually graduated college and I'm
Speaker 2: too credit short. I have it so much that I
Speaker 2: still wake up with a feeling of like, why do
Speaker 2: I feel unseubtled? Oh you think you didn't. Let's a wait, No,
Speaker 2: I was there, I got my diploma.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I get the dream of like I have another
Speaker 1: exam again. I think that's the one that sets me up.
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, I don't want to do another exam. God,
Speaker 1: enough exams in my life. But no, that that that's interesting.
Speaker 1: And yeah, that lack of control, I think that's what
Speaker 1: I've seen it as well, Like when you're losing your
Speaker 1: teeth in a dream, it's like feeling like the anxiety
Speaker 1: and losing control.
Speaker 2: And then then I have cracked a tooth and a
Speaker 2: bagel close like my nightmares coming true, you know whatever, yeah,
Speaker 2: oh my gosh, yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeahs and hearing the teeth that sounds sounds make me
Speaker 1: very like skirmish, I feel like sounds tough. And then
Speaker 1: also with working hard, I mean before this, you used
Speaker 1: to well, not before this, a long time ago, you
Speaker 1: used to perform at the mitzpahs and weddings. Yeah, which
Speaker 1: which one did you prefer? Was there a better one?
Speaker 2: Well? I went through different phases. When I was fifteen
Speaker 2: years old, my parents parents divorced, and I wanted to
Speaker 2: get a job to kind of help out that, you know,
Speaker 2: dad was supporting two households. And my mom started dating
Speaker 2: this guy who was really sweet and saw talent in me.
Speaker 2: And he knew some guy that had a wedding band
Speaker 2: out in Long Island, and he said, you should auditionize.
Speaker 2: I don't know en f songs, you know. And we
Speaker 2: lied about my age because we didn't want them to
Speaker 2: worry that I was still kid, so we said I
Speaker 2: was eighteen, like that's so old. And I started learning
Speaker 2: a bunch of songs. I put on kind of a
Speaker 2: slutty dress and I went in and I sang what
Speaker 2: I sing back, I'm dating myself, but I sang Evergreen
Speaker 2: like a Barber Streisen sung, and I sang We're walking
Speaker 2: on sunshine. Oh, I remember I saying a flash dance song. Anyway,
Speaker 2: and I got the job and I started working all
Speaker 2: the time, weddings, permits, visit, it didn't matter. They all
Speaker 2: can be bad because nobody's listening. They can be really wonderful,
Speaker 2: especially for a young girl becoming trying to figure out
Speaker 2: my identity as a vocalist, having to learn so many
Speaker 2: kinds of genres of music, you know, like motown, pop, rock, jazz.
Speaker 2: So I really that was kind of my education of music.
Speaker 2: And I'm working. There's a lot of incredible musicians that
Speaker 2: do it as a side gig just to make extra money.
Speaker 2: So the good thing about people not listening is you
Speaker 2: can try a lot of it. And one of my
Speaker 2: favorite times would be when they say, like ladies and gentlemen,
Speaker 2: please take your seat, your salad is being served, and
Speaker 2: then the band would take a break except for me
Speaker 2: and like the keyboard player, and then we'd sing, you know,
Speaker 2: a Billie Holiday Tune or Eli Fitzgerald. And at a
Speaker 2: young age, I learned what melody is and I would
Speaker 2: listen to them on the car ride to the gig,
Speaker 2: and then I'd learned what I was contributing to it,
Speaker 2: how to improvise, and where were my instincts, my impulses
Speaker 2: as a singer. And so I actually still identify with
Speaker 2: I still see myself as that girl, the chick gig singer,
Speaker 2: a wedding singer. And it's been so much longer that
Speaker 2: I've not been that than I was, but I still
Speaker 2: just feel like that's who I am when I'm on stage.
Speaker 2: I could be at Madison Square Garden. I'm still with
Speaker 2: my band. I want a jam. I'm okay with spontaneity.
Speaker 2: You walk on. I was fifteen years old, and they
Speaker 2: call it tune. You have to call it in the
Speaker 2: right key. You have to know the lyrics. If you
Speaker 2: don't know the lyrics, you tape. Now they have iPads,
Speaker 2: but I would pull out a little Rolodex cheat sheets
Speaker 2: and I'd tape them to the mic and I'd sing
Speaker 2: the songs. Like I said, nobody's paying attention to the band,
Speaker 2: so they don't see but I still identify as that person,
Speaker 2: and no matter what when I go to a wet
Speaker 2: someone else's wedding or burmits, or when I get paid
Speaker 2: to like a lot of money to be a guest
Speaker 2: or somebody's and sing a couple. So wow, and I'm
Speaker 2: really taking back. So I'm like, I used to make
Speaker 2: a hundred bucks, you know, for the night to sing,
Speaker 2: and then I'm up there and I still feel like
Speaker 2: that that unknown girl just trying to do a great
Speaker 2: job and get the song done.
Speaker 1: That's amazing. Yeah, that's incredible. What are the next steps?
Speaker 1: Like when you when you hear about that experience that
Speaker 1: you're in and I am doing a bit of biography
Speaker 1: chatting because I do find it fascinating, Like, you know,
Speaker 1: you look at the stage you're on today and you
Speaker 1: look back there and you're like, wow, that's that's a
Speaker 1: long long way. And I think it's easy externally to
Speaker 1: be like, oh yeah, there was these line of great
Speaker 1: things that happened and it took off, But like what's
Speaker 1: the next step from that? Like happen like the pretty
Speaker 1: much immediately like after you're doing that and guessing is
Speaker 1: that building your confidence? Is it just allowing you to
Speaker 1: pay for a few things on the side, like what
Speaker 1: is that doing for you?
Speaker 2: To be a working singer? To make a living as
Speaker 2: a singer, especially at that age, was a source of
Speaker 2: deep pride ye me. Then as I kept getting rejected
Speaker 2: at auditions, I was writing my own music. I was
Speaker 2: trying to get a record deal. Nothing was happening. Now
Speaker 2: I'm doing it six seven years. Now, I'm getting a
Speaker 2: little bit annoyed.
Speaker 1: You were seeing a weddings and but mins was for
Speaker 1: like six seven.
Speaker 2: Yeah. It go in and out depending. When I was
Speaker 2: in college, I went to NYU, and certain semesters it
Speaker 2: was rough, but then other semesters I could pick up
Speaker 2: gigs and so then I would be a little bit
Speaker 2: more I'd like to say disgruntled. And I'd stand and
Speaker 2: I think I'm doing this when I'm thirty, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm quitting the business. And I get in trouble the band.
Speaker 2: The band leader would say, you have an attitude today,
Speaker 2: and I'd be thinking, because I just I'm going to
Speaker 2: be something one day. You know, I'm going to get
Speaker 2: out of here, so I forget where your question, Well, no,
Speaker 2: my question is that I do What was the next
Speaker 2: thing like that, is that that's do you're doing exactly
Speaker 2: what it's asking, like that idea that you're going to auditions,
Speaker 2: What were you auditioning for?
Speaker 1: Like what was well important to you at that?
Speaker 2: Yeah. So when I was a little girl, my parents
Speaker 2: took me and I grew up in Long Island, they
Speaker 2: take me into the city to see Broadway shows. I
Speaker 2: wanted to be on Broadway. Then when I started doing
Speaker 2: all these weddings and seeing all these kinds of music,
Speaker 2: I started writing my own music, and my taste evolved
Speaker 2: with the kind of music that I wanted to sing,
Speaker 2: and so then I wanted my own record deal and
Speaker 2: wanted to make albums, and so I would now also
Speaker 2: put rock bands together, and I'd go play at CBGB's
Speaker 2: and at the Bitter End in the village, and so
Speaker 2: that started to be the thing that I wanted. And
Speaker 2: then I finally, at finally, at twenty five, I got
Speaker 2: the original cast of Rent, which was the big rock
Speaker 2: musical of the time, but it was theater, but it
Speaker 2: was rock. And so that started me on this sort
Speaker 2: of path of kind of straddling both worlds always, which
Speaker 2: back then in the nineties it was not it was
Speaker 2: frowned upon to try to go from theater to legitimate
Speaker 2: rock pop kind of career. Now everyone can do everything,
Speaker 2: but back then you didn't. If you're a movie star,
Speaker 2: you didn't do TV. And if you were a theater person,
Speaker 2: you weren't going to be people wouldn't believe you as
Speaker 2: a as a rock star. But here I was kind
Speaker 2: of in both, and so I did that dance for
Speaker 2: a long time. And now you get to the point
Speaker 2: where you've done so many different things and so many
Speaker 2: I put out so many kinds of albums and that
Speaker 2: I can get on stage and I don't care that
Speaker 2: I'm one particular style because now my body of work
Speaker 2: is who I am. But it's taken me all that
Speaker 2: time to feel like I have a story and identity,
Speaker 2: because back then it was like, look, who are you?
Speaker 2: What kind of singer are you? What are you going
Speaker 2: to be? What do you represent? And I said, well,
Speaker 2: I can do and I can do motown, and I
Speaker 2: can do Madonna and when you use it and rock
Speaker 2: and roll, and so my versatility was my curse.
Speaker 1: Wow, and what were you doing by age thirty? Because
Speaker 1: you said, when I get to if I'm doing this
Speaker 1: by thirty, I'm going to quit what were you actually doing.
Speaker 2: When I was in a workshop of Wicked. Okay, so
Speaker 2: I was hired to develop Wicked, which was a five
Speaker 2: year process, and ever after every workshop of that, I
Speaker 2: always thought they were going to replace me with someone
Speaker 2: more famous or something, and so I always thought I
Speaker 2: was going to get fired. So the fact that I
Speaker 2: actually got to the Gershwin Theater when I was I
Speaker 2: don't know, thirty two, I was like, who, you know?
Speaker 2: You always think you're going to get fired in this business.
Speaker 1: So when they bring you into develop and part of
Speaker 1: my ignorance, yes, so they're bringing you into develops and
Speaker 1: what is that? What does that actually mean? Does that
Speaker 1: mean you might make it into the show or you're
Speaker 1: in the behind the scenes.
Speaker 2: They say they're looking for their amuses, you know, and
Speaker 2: so they'd like to find the people that they are
Speaker 2: writing for, because the composers are writing and for your voice,
Speaker 2: and which is like the greatest honor that was Rent
Speaker 2: was like that as well, and most of the things
Speaker 2: I do because their original musicals they go through these
Speaker 2: long developmental processes, which I love. I love standing on
Speaker 2: a piano and an incredibly talented composer like Steven Schwartz
Speaker 2: or Tom kitt or Jonathan Larson, and they say, figure
Speaker 2: out where my voice sits and how they want to
Speaker 2: write something so that I can soar, you know, and
Speaker 2: the character can soar. Sometimes that guests confused, but or
Speaker 2: it's one and the same.
Speaker 1: I guess.
Speaker 2: But I love that process so much. And what it
Speaker 2: is is you go in a room, usually in like
Speaker 2: a regular rehearsal room, and sometimes they only have the
Speaker 2: first act. Sometimes they have the whole thing, but then
Speaker 2: they so you do like a little reading of it
Speaker 2: for a bunch of people, investors, and then everyone gives notes.
Speaker 2: And then six months later they've scrapped a bunch of things.
Speaker 2: Maybe they took a song out of Act two and
Speaker 2: put it in F one, and now that offsets the
Speaker 2: whole balance. And then and this part sucks, but this
Speaker 2: part's really working, you know, and they keep having to
Speaker 2: and you just go with the flow. And I find
Speaker 2: it fascinating that whole process.
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, it's interesting hearing about it as a fan
Speaker 1: of Broadway. I always have been in the West End
Speaker 1: in London where I grew up, and then Broadway here.
Speaker 1: It's interesting knowing how it works because I think you
Speaker 1: take for granted that some of these things, the amount
Speaker 1: of time they take in development before we even see them.
Speaker 2: It's funny. I did Wicket at the West End for
Speaker 2: six months a year and a half after I left
Speaker 2: it here in New York. I always wanted to open
Speaker 2: a show on the West End. To me, that was
Speaker 2: the most prestigious thing to do, and I had one
Speaker 2: of the greatest times of my life. I had two
Speaker 2: Australians starring with me, who taught me how to party
Speaker 2: and do hos a week, which I think I only
Speaker 2: learned that because they like to take credit for that,
Speaker 2: but I also think it's because I had already wanted Tony.
Speaker 2: I knew I wasn't going to get fired. I knew
Speaker 2: how to pace myself hos a week. The pressure was
Speaker 2: off me and so I could go to the pub after.
Speaker 2: But you know, when when you're in the beginnings of
Speaker 2: a show, you're just you know, you're you're a monk, yes,
Speaker 2: and you don't do anything and you go home and
Speaker 2: you watch movies and you don't drink alcohol and you
Speaker 2: know so, and that can be kind of lonely.
Speaker 1: Yeah, those schedules seem just insane. I was with a
Speaker 1: friend recently, they're piloting a show in San Diego at
Speaker 1: the Old Globe Theater to try and take it into Broadway,
Speaker 1: and so I was watching her and she was telling
Speaker 1: me about her schedule, and then we just I just
Speaker 1: went and saw the music Man this Sunday and like
Speaker 1: watching you do that, and I was it was just
Speaker 1: it's fascinating to me to think just what a tough
Speaker 1: schedule that is. It's exhaust yeah, it's And how do
Speaker 1: you like? What were your coping mechanisms the first time round?
Speaker 1: Like not when you'd won the tourny.
Speaker 2: First time with friends? I I lost my boy well,
Speaker 2: I started I was abusing my voice. I didn't I would.
Speaker 2: I took boys lesson in my whole life, but I
Speaker 2: stop going to my teacher at one point, and I
Speaker 2: just had never even though I was singing all those
Speaker 2: gigs at the weddings, I had never done eight shows
Speaker 2: a week, and so I had to look go back
Speaker 2: to a teacher and address all the different problem spots
Speaker 2: in the show for myself. And then I ended up
Speaker 2: being stronger than ever and then it's never happened to
Speaker 2: me again. But back then, you know, the I don't know,
Speaker 2: if you're familiar with Jonathan Larson, who wrote he was
Speaker 2: a composer of I don't, but I know. He passed
Speaker 2: away early on in our process, and it was a
Speaker 2: very emotional time for all of us, and we all
Speaker 2: felt so committed to never missing a show because we
Speaker 2: just felt like our mission was to show up and
Speaker 2: communicate his message, you know. So for six months, not
Speaker 2: one of us missed a show. I was actually the
Speaker 2: first one because the doctor ordered me to have voice
Speaker 2: for us, and I've never had a cast do that ever.
Speaker 2: I realized that was very rare that people wouldn't miss
Speaker 2: a show for six months. That's so that was a
Speaker 2: commitment and that set a precedent. I think for me,
Speaker 2: it's also because you know, have an ego and I
Speaker 2: don't want my understandy to go on all the time.
Speaker 2: But but yeah, and the more people coming to see
Speaker 2: a show with your name on the marquee, the more
Speaker 2: pressure you feel to be there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, definitely, that's.
Speaker 2: A lot of pressure. But I learned, you learn to
Speaker 2: pace yourself and you learn. What I like to say
Speaker 2: is I have an A, B, and a C show.
Speaker 2: So the A show is the one that has lots
Speaker 2: of acrobatic vocals and what I want to sing if
Speaker 2: I could all the time. The B and the C
Speaker 2: are melodies that are maybe not as hard, but people
Speaker 2: don't even notice itogize, and so it's a psychological thing
Speaker 2: for me that I don't feel like I'm failing if
Speaker 2: I don't get the A show. I just say I
Speaker 2: have a cold to go out there and do a
Speaker 2: really great B show today, and then I and then
Speaker 2: the pressure's off and I end up having a great show.
Speaker 2: So there's a lot of it's mental, you know, and just.
Speaker 1: That's a great technique. I love that. I don't think
Speaker 1: I've ever heard anyone say that before, because I think
Speaker 1: people think that you only have two choices. You're off. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're on or off, and that's actually not true. I
Speaker 1: love the ABC grading for anything in life because I
Speaker 1: don't think we're ever at our a game every single day.
Speaker 1: It's not possible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And how many times do you realize you think
Speaker 2: you had the worst show, interview, whatever, and then someone
Speaker 2: comes and they had no idea what you're talking all
Speaker 2: that dialogue in your head, that's sabotaging.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I went to public speaking drama schools since I
Speaker 1: was eleven years old, and so I've been in public
Speaker 1: speaking is now the majority of my life, and so
Speaker 1: there is I know exactly when I think I messed
Speaker 1: the lineup or didn't quite get that message across right,
Speaker 1: and I'll be over analyzing it. I used to do
Speaker 1: a lot more earlier days, but then you realize no
Speaker 1: one even noticed any percentage of that. But I love
Speaker 1: your ABC grading.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wish I could do that with life.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I think it's a good tool for life.
Speaker 1: I'm hoping that.
Speaker 2: Mom, I'm not going to get it all right, you
Speaker 2: know today, and my son's gonna be angry with me.
Speaker 2: But that's okay. But I'm really hard on myself about
Speaker 2: that stuff. I'm hard on myself in general. I'd like
Speaker 2: to so give myself a break.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, how did you How do you think
Speaker 1: you were able to give yourself a break on stage?
Speaker 1: Because that's obviously in one sense. I mean, I'm sure
Speaker 1: and I'd love to hear this as from a mother's perspective,
Speaker 1: but and I don't want to assume either way. But
Speaker 1: I'm guessing you may say that actually being a mother
Speaker 1: to one child is actually more pressure than performing in
Speaker 1: front of thousands of people.
Speaker 2: And when I became a mother, I found perspective. Obviously,
Speaker 2: I became less self absorbed. I realized that my son
Speaker 2: has a fever tonight. I want to snuggle with him,
Speaker 2: take care of him. I don't want to worry that.
Speaker 2: I don't care if I get sick. Yeah, I got
Speaker 2: a big show tomorrow. What happens if I get throat
Speaker 2: or something, Well, it's too bad. I'm not going to
Speaker 2: sleep in the other room. That's just not going to
Speaker 2: be I just have to be with them. So then
Speaker 2: I'd wake up the next day, didn't get a lot
Speaker 2: of sleep worrying about my kid. I'm on stage. What
Speaker 2: can I do? I'm doing the best I can. I'd
Speaker 2: have the best shows, yeah, you know, because I just,
Speaker 2: you know, lower the expectations of myself and for myself.
Speaker 2: And that's really it changed my life in a lot
Speaker 2: of ways. When you have something that you care about
Speaker 2: way more.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so what do you think it's going to take?
Speaker 1: I love what you said there, and I think everyone
Speaker 1: can relate to that. I think anyone is listening right now.
Speaker 1: If you're a mother, you definitely feel if you're not
Speaker 1: a mother, you'll feel it like the idea of I
Speaker 1: just need to be a bit easier on myself, Like
Speaker 1: I think most people are very self critical, h most
Speaker 1: people who even come across as confident or even arrogant
Speaker 1: or often insecure and dealing with something internally.
Speaker 2: So I'm not an expert and no, not an expert.
Speaker 1: I'm just intrigued as to how you think you get
Speaker 1: to like what well.
Speaker 2: And I also I'm not a shamed to say my
Speaker 2: public assisians probably don't say that, but I take you know, prozac,
Speaker 2: and I have help, and I yeah, because there are
Speaker 2: some days where I just I'm you know, people expect
Speaker 2: me to let it go and I can't, you know.
Speaker 2: So I'm doing the best that I can. But being
Speaker 2: in the moment, being present, you know, it's just the
Speaker 2: hardest thing to do. It's like what we aspire to
Speaker 2: do as artists, actors, singers to you know. It's it's
Speaker 2: so weird because the greatest moments I have when I'm
Speaker 2: performing are usually moments I can't even remember because they
Speaker 2: I transcend it in some way, you know, but trying.
Speaker 2: But that's not being present then, you know, and that
Speaker 2: you know, you can meditate, you can do all these things,
Speaker 2: but it's trying to achieve just one moment where I
Speaker 2: felt like I'm here in my body, understanding this without
Speaker 2: judging myself, without criticized. And so I don't I don't
Speaker 2: have the answers. I just I give myself things to
Speaker 2: try to stay in the moment, you know, whether it's
Speaker 2: very clinical, just think about the lyrics, think about breathing,
Speaker 2: think about getting Walker to school tomorrow, or focusing on
Speaker 2: the person in front of me and trying to change
Speaker 2: them in the scene or the song. You know. But
Speaker 2: sometimes it's just it's really hard. I can't get out
Speaker 2: of there. In other days I can.
Speaker 1: Yeah, But I think that ABC grading is you've already
Speaker 1: You've already come up with the perfect But it's what
Speaker 1: you said. It's like, that's that is the way we
Speaker 1: all need to think. How you started thinking about the stage,
Speaker 1: you think about our life network. I think it's a
Speaker 1: great it's a great method.
Speaker 2: And I also have an incredible husband who was an actor.
Speaker 2: His life changed and he became he's a clinical director
Speaker 2: of uh An impatient facility in California has two houses recovery,
Speaker 2: alcohol and drug recovery and also mental illness and so
Speaker 2: he thinks I'm just like a piece of cake all
Speaker 2: the time, which is really nice to come home and
Speaker 2: think He's like, what that mood is fine, that's nothing,
Speaker 2: you know. So that's given me some perspective too. He
Speaker 2: just thinks all my neuroses is like normal and he
Speaker 2: can handle he can handle it. I'm not too much.
Speaker 2: I'm not too much for him.
Speaker 1: That's beautiful. That's a really special Yeah. That's amazing. Yeah, yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I mean yeah, that's that's a beautiful thing to have
Speaker 1: in your life. Yeah, And I think it's I think
Speaker 1: that's true for pretty much. I often think with relationships
Speaker 1: and with my wife, I I if I sat there,
Speaker 1: I could easily reel off reasons why I think she's
Speaker 1: annoying or frustrating or whatever. Maybe, like that's easy. I
Speaker 1: think anyone could do that if they've been longer long
Speaker 1: enough with someone. But if I stop to think about
Speaker 1: the things that are special about her and unique about her,
Speaker 1: and the thing that she does that no one else
Speaker 1: could do, all of a sudden, it's like all those
Speaker 1: other things seem so insignificant and irrelevant, And I think
Speaker 1: it's so easy to amplify those small, irrelevant.
Speaker 2: And my life is too short. I'm gonna get he's
Speaker 2: gonna I mean, he gets on my nerves so much
Speaker 2: when we travel because I'm traveling all the time. I
Speaker 2: know how to wear my I don't wear shoes with laces.
Speaker 2: I get through the security, I know how to do it.
Speaker 2: If something changes, I can go get another flight. I'm
Speaker 2: moving and grooving. He walks too slow. He doesn't have
Speaker 2: that aggressive traveling attitude. And I'm like, oh, and then
Speaker 2: I realize, why am I you know, he's sweet? Why
Speaker 2: is this getting on my nerves that life's too short? Yeah,
Speaker 2: he's when it comes down to it, he's an incredible
Speaker 2: father and my son, and he's there for me whenever
Speaker 2: I need him, and he really sees me, sees my soul,
Speaker 2: and so so those little things are so silly.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, And I feel like we all pair up
Speaker 1: with someone who's exactly the other way. Like I'm probably
Speaker 1: more like you in that sense as you describe that,
Speaker 1: just like you know, I'm like, I want to get
Speaker 1: to the airport three hours early and figure everything out,
Speaker 1: and like I don't like rushing. I don't like being late.
Speaker 1: And my wife's like, you know, just like she's having
Speaker 1: to run to the the what do you call it,
Speaker 1: the terminal? Like run to the yeah, the gate, sorry,
Speaker 1: the gate, Yeah, run to the gate. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: I don't want to live like this, And she loves
Speaker 1: the pressure and whatever it may be. So, but I
Speaker 1: feel like we always pair up with people like that.
Speaker 1: But with your dreams earlier you said that, she's like,
Speaker 1: you know, dreams for the future. Like, what are the
Speaker 1: dreams now, Like, how have your dream shifted? You changed,
Speaker 1: or what's left? You said elusive? Some of the dreams
Speaker 1: are still elusive. You said that's the word.
Speaker 2: Well, now talking to you, they seem so trivial. Well, professionally,
Speaker 2: there's things. I want to be a better performer, a
Speaker 2: better artist. I want to work with people that I've
Speaker 2: always looked up to. I want to work with some
Speaker 2: more people like that that teach me stuff. I want
Speaker 2: to create more original music. But my son is mixed.
Speaker 2: He's uh, he identifies as black, and I see him
Speaker 2: as a black thirteen year old boy, little man. That's
Speaker 2: kind of where a lot of my focus is, I
Speaker 2: think lately, is I don't want my whiteness to be
Speaker 2: something that I know people say, you're the mom he's
Speaker 2: going to love you, but he's super smart and intuitive,
Speaker 2: and there's going to be things that I can't understand
Speaker 2: for him because I'm not in his skin. And I
Speaker 2: find myself preoccupied with that a lot, like how can
Speaker 2: I be so close to him, be the one that
Speaker 2: he can come to for everything? If I can't totally
Speaker 2: understand all that because I just haven't lived it, How
Speaker 2: can I educate myself? How can I be better in
Speaker 2: that way? And as he's getting older, he's becoming more
Speaker 2: and more aware of the society that he lives in
Speaker 2: and the chaotic world he lives in, the violence, the racism,
Speaker 2: and I just want to be someone he can come to,
Speaker 2: you know. So I'm probably overthinking a lot of that,
Speaker 2: but that's a lot where my energy goes to, just
Speaker 2: how can I really be better in that way for him?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, I mean I think my parents felt that
Speaker 1: way when I was a kid, for different reasons completely,
Speaker 1: but I was mine was probably not as smart or
Speaker 1: as intuitive as your son sounds, but I was highly
Speaker 1: rebellious and I was getting involved in all the wrong
Speaker 1: places and circles, and my parents didn't raise me that way,
Speaker 1: and they, you know, they did only thing everything right
Speaker 1: and they were loving.
Speaker 2: And why were you pushing back?
Speaker 1: I think I was. I think I've always been like
Speaker 1: a thrill seeker, Like I've always deeply wanted a purpose.
Speaker 1: I didn't know that word at that at thirteen, Like
Speaker 1: I just thought thrill meant excitement, and almost like doing
Speaker 1: well in school and getting good grades like didn't feel
Speaker 1: like enough. I was like, that can't be the goal
Speaker 1: of life, to do well at school, Like, that can't
Speaker 1: be it.
Speaker 2: You got to live.
Speaker 1: There has to be yeah, like what does it mean
Speaker 1: to live? Right? What does it mean? And And I
Speaker 1: feel like it's really interesting because that age at least,
Speaker 1: and whenever I'm working with someone or whenever I hear
Speaker 1: about that, I always feel like that's the age when
Speaker 1: kids kind of like start going off in their own journeys,
Speaker 1: in their own directions. And one thing that my dad
Speaker 1: did that I think was a game changer because I
Speaker 1: realized that at that point, no matter what my parents said,
Speaker 1: I wasn't going to listen to it, no matter what
Speaker 1: they said. And I think a lot of parent of
Speaker 1: your job, Yeah, yeah, and yeah, exactly right. And I
Speaker 1: think every child, everyone who's been a child, everyone has
Speaker 1: that experience of yeah, I didn't listen to my parents
Speaker 1: when I was thirteen, and then I think every parent
Speaker 1: has that experience of my kids don't listen to me
Speaker 1: from like thirteen to twenty one maybe, and then my
Speaker 1: dad started giving me books of people's lives, of people
Speaker 1: that he thought I'd be inspired by based on my ambitions,
Speaker 1: my rebellion. But at that time it started to be
Speaker 1: people like Malcolm Max and Martin Luther King, and then
Speaker 1: later on I read Einstein, and then I was also
Speaker 1: reading people like that that I was interested in as
Speaker 1: a fifteen year old kid, like David Beckham and so
Speaker 1: I was into soccer or doing the Johnson because he
Speaker 1: was in WWE, and so I was reading Malcolm X
Speaker 1: on one side and David Beckham on the other. But
Speaker 1: it was really fascinating to me because it was almost
Speaker 1: like those people could talk to me at that time
Speaker 1: in a way that my parents never could, because they
Speaker 1: had lived experiences or things that for some reason, you know,
Speaker 1: connected with me and resonated with me in a way
Speaker 1: that even if my parents said the same things, it
Speaker 1: would never have connected. And I wonder, hence you writing
Speaker 1: a children's book, which is where my direction's going. It's like,
Speaker 1: I'm fascinated by who the voice is your son needs
Speaker 1: to hear right now at this time in his life.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I it's no.
Speaker 1: I don't think it ever is your parents, not because
Speaker 1: our parents are wrong. Like there's that famous quote. I
Speaker 1: don't know who said it, but it's the day you
Speaker 1: realize your parents were right. Your kids are telling you
Speaker 1: that you're wrong exactly, and you know, it's one of
Speaker 1: those moments like now I'm so grateful to my parents
Speaker 1: and I can see everything. I'm thirty five and I'm like, okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: I value everything my parents did and they tried their best.
Speaker 1: But in those times, I find like finding the voices
Speaker 1: of other people that feel like your voice to you,
Speaker 1: that he could hear it from someone else feels like,
Speaker 1: you know, it feels like I'm wondering this children's book.
Speaker 1: Was that a way of communicating to like, what was
Speaker 1: the Yeah, what was the purpose behind it?
Speaker 2: I want him to hear that message. My son's pretty confident.
Speaker 2: So I think the book comes from my interaction with
Speaker 2: so many young people through all the projects that I've
Speaker 2: been a part of, and these multi generational projects, you know,
Speaker 2: of really seeing lots of young people inhibit themselves on
Speaker 2: scorn their unique qualities, and I relate to that because
Speaker 2: that's how I was. My son's pretty sure of himself.
Speaker 2: So hopefully that's good. I mean, because I think we
Speaker 2: all as parents project, you know, all the stuff that
Speaker 2: I need to work on and myself. When you have
Speaker 2: a kid that comes like glaring back at you, you know,
Speaker 2: he's okay with the spotlight, you know. So I don't
Speaker 2: know if this book is necessarily written for him to
Speaker 2: help him, because he teaches me. I you know, I am,
Speaker 2: he said, he said, Mom, when I get my braces
Speaker 2: off and I and I go through puberty, this is
Speaker 2: going to be no stocking. He means that with the
Speaker 2: girls everything. So it's like I just need to take
Speaker 2: a lesson from my son, you know. So I think
Speaker 2: the book comes from I wrote it with my sister,
Speaker 2: first of all, who I'm very close to, Kara, and
Speaker 2: and she's a teacher, an elementary school teacher, a writer,
Speaker 2: and also specialize in literacy at school. So I wanted
Speaker 2: to write it with her because she's a pro, and
Speaker 2: she understood me better than anyone else in the world
Speaker 2: understands me. She's the closest person to me. She's younger,
Speaker 2: but she's the wiser, she's the older soul. And it
Speaker 2: was the two of us writing lists together because we
Speaker 2: experienced it as sisters. I was always loud and singing
Speaker 2: and taking up all this space, and she was always
Speaker 2: am I supposed to know what I want to do
Speaker 2: at the age of seven, you know, I don't know
Speaker 2: what I want to do. And so we've been really
Speaker 2: exploring all of those that's so old issues, I think.
Speaker 2: So that's more for those kids that are just a
Speaker 2: little bit hesitant to kind of allow people to see them,
Speaker 2: you know, and allow themselves to be vulnerable and take
Speaker 2: a risk.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's fascinating. Yeah. I have a younger sister
Speaker 1: and we became we're still extremely close. She's like my
Speaker 1: best friend. She knows everything about me, and I know
Speaker 1: everything about her, and she's I almost treat it like
Speaker 1: a little child. She's only five years younger than me.
Speaker 1: To me, that's I remember holding her when I was
Speaker 1: five years old and she was this tiny, little bay.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's one of those, like, you know, very special memories
Speaker 1: of kind of seeing her grow up and feeling old
Speaker 1: even though I was old. But it's interesting, like I
Speaker 1: think with siblings, it's it's fascinating to hear that that
Speaker 1: difference also of being okay with one being loud and
Speaker 1: one being silent, and noticing how neither of those strengths
Speaker 1: or weaknesses. Although I think it's often imprinted that someone
Speaker 1: is loud is more confident and.
Speaker 2: Is more right, and that's totally a contradiction, at least
Speaker 2: in me. I mean, if you saw me at home,
Speaker 2: I'm actually kind of quiet, and people that meet me,
Speaker 2: they say, oh, you're actually really soft spoken, and so
Speaker 2: the big the girl with the big voice and singing
Speaker 2: to the rafters is definitely part of me. But I
Speaker 2: think we all have these different sides. And then my sister,
Speaker 2: who is very soft spoken. She's the one that when
Speaker 2: I went to watch her teach, she was a TA
Speaker 2: back in Boulder at See You, and she didn't know
Speaker 2: what she wanted to do. And I was like some
Speaker 2: neuroscience classes and she was a TA and I sat
Speaker 2: in the back and watched her and she was unbelievable,
Speaker 2: so charismatic, so on her voice, so engaging. The students
Speaker 2: loved her, and I said, this is your thing, Like
Speaker 2: you got to teach, you know, so our voice emerges
Speaker 2: in many different ways, and I think it's a little
Speaker 2: bit a misconception that someone like me, who knows how
Speaker 2: to produce loud sounds and hit the back row, is
Speaker 2: necessarily comfortable in her own voice in my own life,
Speaker 2: because especially given that mantle to always sing, let it
Speaker 2: go to kids or defy gravity, it's like, oh, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm not always that example. I mean, I have those
Speaker 2: days where I can't get out of bed myself and
Speaker 2: I have to find my voice as well. And it's
Speaker 2: so I hate for people to think that there's this
Speaker 2: perception of me that I'm fearless because I'm not.
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, And it sounds like this book is
Speaker 1: also of finding your voice, because yeah, you're playing so
Speaker 1: many other voices.
Speaker 2: Yes, well yeah, I mean it's it's autobiographical and a
Speaker 2: too Little Mouse, too little mice away, But I love
Speaker 2: that you chose a mouse to really yeah, because the
Speaker 2: mouse feels is so small. But when she sings, she's
Speaker 2: the joy and the sound of her voice. When she
Speaker 2: decides to share it with the class instead of just
Speaker 2: keeping it to herself at home, she ends up becoming
Speaker 2: a huge, huge, huge mouth and now everybody can see
Speaker 2: her and hear her, and that invites a lot of scrutiny,
Speaker 2: a lot of accolades, but a lot of different things,
Speaker 2: you know, And that's I think that's what happens with
Speaker 2: all of us when we allow ourselves to be seen.
Speaker 1: I'm always finding I'm always intrigued by people who play
Speaker 1: lots of voices. And as you said, like, I think
Speaker 1: everyone's always searching for their voice in life because they
Speaker 1: forget that their early voice was so informed by their parents,
Speaker 1: and then their later voice was so informed by friends,
Speaker 1: and then our voice is just always a mix of
Speaker 1: other people's noise. And then I wonder for you, do
Speaker 1: you ever feel like you've rubbed off on the voices
Speaker 1: of your characters? Your characters' voices rub off on you,
Speaker 1: Like I'm always fascinated by people who play people for
Speaker 1: a living, Like how that.
Speaker 2: That's what I was saying before checking the egg. How
Speaker 2: much am I bringing to something that then the writers
Speaker 2: are inspired by what I'm bringing? And how much is
Speaker 2: the part sort of finding me?
Speaker 1: Which characters do you think? Which characters do you think
Speaker 1: rubbed off the most on you? In a.
Speaker 2: Each one was like a gift at the time, you know,
Speaker 2: like the Rent stuff was really it was a celebration
Speaker 2: that character was unafraid, sexy, money, just an excuse for
Speaker 2: me to really be all those things. And then when
Speaker 2: Wicked came along, I was definitely more insecure and needing
Speaker 2: to sort of allow myself to not be afraid of
Speaker 2: my own anger and my larger than life qualities, you know,
Speaker 2: So that one was really art imitating life. You know,
Speaker 2: so different things.
Speaker 1: I don't know, that's a beautiful Yeah, No, there's there's wonderful.
Speaker 1: It's just so's it's just so much. Yeah, it's so
Speaker 1: much more when you're playing someone deeply, it's so much
Speaker 1: more deeper than just a character right.
Speaker 2: Now, and then you live with that how many shows
Speaker 2: a year?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's well, that's even more than a movie, right,
Speaker 1: Like even more than a TV show a movie. It's
Speaker 1: like this character is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I've had two instances now with Rent the movie.
Speaker 2: We did it ten years after we left. I left
Speaker 2: the show and then had this sequel to Enchanted, Disenchanted
Speaker 2: coming out now, and that's fifteen years later. And it's
Speaker 2: kind of fun to revisit a character years later because
Speaker 2: it's just you see how like life is informed you're
Speaker 2: who you are and how you approach the character. Now
Speaker 2: it's really I find it really fascinating to go back
Speaker 2: and see that if I threw caution to the wind
Speaker 2: a lot. I didn't have as much process when I
Speaker 2: was younger, just kind of like was raw and in
Speaker 2: the moment and spontaneous and in the moment. But the
Speaker 2: older I've been getting, the less in the moment I
Speaker 2: am because the more you're aware of how far you
Speaker 2: can fall, you know, and you get in your head.
Speaker 1: So I don't know, Yeah, what's something that you feel
Speaker 1: you used to value that you don't value anymore, Something
Speaker 1: that was important to you that's become less and less important.
Speaker 2: Hmm. I was going to say being liked, but having
Speaker 2: people care about what people think, But I think I
Speaker 2: still care about what people think.
Speaker 1: Yeah, when I was asked, I was asked this question,
Speaker 1: and that's where I started to involve in my interviews.
Speaker 1: And it was probably one of the only questions that
Speaker 1: made me stop and think, like you had to, you know,
Speaker 1: most questions you're just talking. And then my answer to
Speaker 1: it in the moment, without thinking about it, in like
Speaker 1: seven seconds of thinking about it was being understood. I
Speaker 1: think I realized that ninety nine percent of the world
Speaker 1: would never be able to understand anyone fully. I don't
Speaker 1: think it's actually possible. And I think the pressure we
Speaker 1: put on ourselves to try to understand someone fully rushes
Speaker 1: the process of understanding them half And so like that
Speaker 1: feeling of oh, I understand you, Like even we just
Speaker 1: want to be able to say that, and we want
Speaker 1: to be able to say that so quickly.
Speaker 2: I'm saying about my son, Yeah, I will never yeah,
Speaker 2: be able to be all those things to him exactly. Yeah,
Speaker 2: live in a white woman's body and my background and
Speaker 2: where I've come from, and just because he came from
Speaker 2: my womb, I think the carte blanche to understand his emotion,
Speaker 2: you know. So that's very frustrating, Yeah, and I need
Speaker 2: to just accept that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and accepting it just Yeah. I think for me,
Speaker 1: it was like I realized that even if someone does
Speaker 1: understand you, they won't understand you in the way you
Speaker 1: want them to understand you, right, even in wanting to
Speaker 1: be understood, like you're talking about trying to understand someone else,
Speaker 1: but even I think all of us crave to be understood.
Speaker 1: When we say.
Speaker 2: Something we're really seeing, like someone really gets me exactly.
Speaker 1: And I found even the people that really get you
Speaker 1: don't really they don't they get me.
Speaker 2: They do.
Speaker 1: My closest friends really get me. But even then, there's
Speaker 1: a part of you that only you get and no
Speaker 1: one will ever know. And that's and being at peace
Speaker 1: with that has been very good for me. If you
Speaker 1: could create one law that everyone in the world had
Speaker 1: to follow, what would it be.
Speaker 2: It would just be to mind your own business, stop
Speaker 2: worrying about what other people are doing, and live your
Speaker 2: own life.
Speaker 1: That's a great one. I love that it didn't Mazelle. Everyone,
Speaker 1: if you have been listening or watching, thank you so
Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Make sure you share what you learned,
Speaker 1: what you took away, any reflections, any questions that you've
Speaker 1: had tig us both on Instagram, on TikTok, on Twitter,
Speaker 1: all the platforms that you know that we're on right now.
Speaker 1: And of course, the book loud Mouse is available. We're
Speaker 1: going to put the link in the show notes so
Speaker 1: you can order it as well. You can read along.
Speaker 1: I know I'm going to be ordering a ton of
Speaker 1: copies for my nieces and nephews.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and there's a refrain in it, so there's a
Speaker 2: song I wrote that I love that that goes along
Speaker 2: with that, and you don't have to sing it.
Speaker 1: Like I definitely will not sing it.
Speaker 2: Just start.
Speaker 1: I never don't see it, but I'll be ordering them,
Speaker 1: ordering the book for my nieces and nephews to share
Speaker 1: it with them as well. I know that it's probably
Speaker 1: one of my favorite things to do is to sit
Speaker 1: down and read it to your child. And I don't
Speaker 1: have two kids on my own yet, but when I
Speaker 1: do it with nieces and nephews or you know, my godsaid,
Speaker 1: it's like one of the most fun, fun bonding experiences.
Speaker 1: I look forward to that. Yeah, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 1: If you love this episode, you'll enjoy my conversation with
Speaker 1: Megan Trainer on breaking generational trauma and how to be
Speaker 1: confident from the inside out.
Speaker 2: My therapist told me stand in the mirror naked for
Speaker 2: five minutes. It was already tough for me to love
Speaker 2: my body. But after the C section scarf with all
Speaker 2: the stretch marks, now I'm looking at myself like I've
Speaker 2: been hacked. But day three, when I did it, I
Speaker 2: was like, you know what her thighs are cute,