1 00:00:05,559 --> 00:00:07,960 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Emily, and this is you're listening to 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: stuff Mom never told you. So. July is Minority Mental 3 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:25,360 Speaker 1: Health Awareness Month. UM, a month that I think is 4 00:00:25,400 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: really important. I actually didn't know that this was a 5 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:32,120 Speaker 1: thing that was marked and it's important. UM. So today's 6 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: episodes all about a topic that I feel very personally 7 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:38,560 Speaker 1: connected to as a woman of color. UM, Black black 8 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:42,159 Speaker 1: folks and mental health. UM. Most people maybe don't know this. 9 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 1: Mental health and black communities can be a bit of 10 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:47,280 Speaker 1: a taboo topic. So today we're gonna be talking about 11 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:49,960 Speaker 1: some of the reasons around why that is, UM, some 12 00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 1: of the historical research and data around black communities and 13 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 1: mental health, and some resources and ways that folks are 14 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 1: are trying to make things better. Awesome, And if you 15 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: are coming to this episode as someone who is in 16 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 1: need of a little bit of mental health support UM, 17 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:08,880 Speaker 1: or you've been sort of reticent to explore your options, 18 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:11,399 Speaker 1: this is a really important one to pay attention to, 19 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 1: because we're going to make sure that you leave today's 20 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:17,800 Speaker 1: episode not only hopefully feeling as much freedom as possible 21 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,800 Speaker 1: around being able to pursue the kind of support you 22 00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:25,399 Speaker 1: might need, but also just having some tactical practical resources 23 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:28,080 Speaker 1: for you to get you know, get hurt and and 24 00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:30,080 Speaker 1: and take care of yourself. This is part of that 25 00:01:30,160 --> 00:01:35,280 Speaker 1: whole hashtag self care thing that I'm all about. It's 26 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:39,240 Speaker 1: you know it definitely you just roll drags. It definitely 27 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 1: warrants a little bit of that. I wish they could 28 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:45,039 Speaker 1: see this, But no, I agree. I mean, I think 29 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 1: self care is important. I think it's gotten. I think 30 00:01:47,440 --> 00:01:50,840 Speaker 1: we've gotten a little like not everything, not everything is 31 00:01:50,840 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 1: self care, right, Maybe manny's and petties aren't the full 32 00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 1: extent of how women should be taking care of themselves, 33 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: I say, as someone who got a manny petty within 34 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 1: the last twenty four hours. But um, this is this 35 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:04,040 Speaker 1: is what real self care is about. I think when 36 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: we simplify it down to something superficial, um, then it's 37 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 1: totally warranting of those eye rolls. But this is I mean, 38 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 1: sometimes self care is not glamorous at all, and I 39 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:17,639 Speaker 1: would put this in that category as super important even 40 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 1: if it's not sexy. Yeah, I'm so glad you said that, 41 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 1: because that's exactly how I feel about this issue. Um. 42 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:26,840 Speaker 1: For me, self care around mental health looks like talking 43 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:29,680 Speaker 1: about it, being honest about it. Being open about it, um, 44 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:32,520 Speaker 1: seeking professional help if you need it, seeking medication if 45 00:02:32,520 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 1: you need it, making lifestyle changes if you need it. 46 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:38,000 Speaker 1: And that's not always as glam as a many petty, 47 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 1: but it's also really important. UM. And so I think 48 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:42,639 Speaker 1: one of the ways that I think makes in the 49 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:44,840 Speaker 1: most sense to sort of start this conversation is really 50 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 1: just sort of level setting with where we're at. And 51 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: one thing that people should really know is that black 52 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:53,960 Speaker 1: black folks and mental health has been kind of an 53 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: authority topic because it's so taboo. And so I think 54 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:01,320 Speaker 1: that talking about mental health challenges can be taboo and 55 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:04,800 Speaker 1: stigmatized for all people, regardless of race, but with with 56 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:07,760 Speaker 1: black folks, we don't talk about it, right. I grew 57 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:10,280 Speaker 1: up with this adage. You know, black folks don't go 58 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 1: to therapy, We go to church. And so that's I've 59 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 1: heard that many, many times. And so it's just interesting 60 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: how Um, it's a struggle, I think for anyone to 61 00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 1: talk about mental health issues, but it's a particular struggle 62 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,480 Speaker 1: for communities of color, particularly black communities. There's something very 63 00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 1: white about this idea of having a therapist on speed dial. 64 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:33,520 Speaker 1: I'm thinking, like Lena Dunham, esque and what does that show? Uh, 65 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:37,760 Speaker 1: not curb your enthusiasm, but with all the super wealthy, 66 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 1: funny family members who god, hold on that Fraser. No, 67 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:49,880 Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's perfect. I was thinking. I associated, yes, 68 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:52,320 Speaker 1: that's a perfect example that you know what the show 69 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:55,520 Speaker 1: I'm thinking of is Arrested Development. That's a good one, right, 70 00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 1: So it's funny, but I almost think of like that 71 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,960 Speaker 1: older woman, that matriarch of the families her, yeah, holding 72 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 1: her martini glass. You can tell I'm not, like, I've 73 00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 1: never really been super into that show, but she's the 74 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 1: kind of woman I think of when I think of, Oh, 75 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:09,880 Speaker 1: I have my therapist on Speed. Well, if you watched 76 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:12,680 Speaker 1: that show, you would know that Dr Fuku is actually 77 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 1: a therapist on that show. Oh my god, really, Tobias, 78 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:18,720 Speaker 1: So that the character on the show that is a therapist. Um, 79 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: and he's one of those kind of like just like 80 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:23,680 Speaker 1: what you were saying, sort of granola e hippie to 81 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:28,040 Speaker 1: be very white. They're so I completely see how therapy 82 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:30,480 Speaker 1: has sort of been whitewashed in this way that when 83 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:32,919 Speaker 1: you think of therapy you think of folks like Phraser 84 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:37,200 Speaker 1: or Tobias Fuka from the rest of development like a 85 00:04:37,240 --> 00:04:41,760 Speaker 1: real um a real almost like a caricature of what 86 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:44,479 Speaker 1: therapy looks like. Right, it's very white, it's very wealthy, 87 00:04:44,720 --> 00:04:46,840 Speaker 1: those two So when you layer on racing class here, 88 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:49,600 Speaker 1: it's no wonder to me that there's such stigma around 89 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 1: therapy for folks in the black community especially, And that's 90 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:55,640 Speaker 1: one of the things that that folks black folks who 91 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:58,000 Speaker 1: do go to therapy, one of the challenges that a 92 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 1: lot of them have reported is at when you know, 93 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: when you're if you're if if the mental health um 94 00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:06,839 Speaker 1: industry is at the right, Yeah, the mental health industry 95 00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 1: is very white. Black women can feel and people of 96 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: people of color in general can feel a bit isolated 97 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 1: because your therapist might not, you know, be able to 98 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:20,760 Speaker 1: really truly grapple with or understand the issue that you're 99 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 1: talking about. So if you're talking about some heavy thing 100 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 1: related to culture or raise or being an immigrant or 101 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:30,279 Speaker 1: something like that, your your super white therapist might not 102 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: always exactly, um, now, exactly what you're going through, right, 103 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 1: And that ability to empathize is so critically important. I 104 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:40,599 Speaker 1: think some therapists might push back on that and say, listen, 105 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:43,640 Speaker 1: I don't need to be my client heal to help 106 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,400 Speaker 1: my client tell. But at the same time, representation matters 107 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 1: period full stop. So being having options as a individual 108 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:53,720 Speaker 1: and in seeking out therapists who look like you, who 109 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 1: feel like you, who can understand and empathize with you 110 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 1: from a cultural perspective, I'm sure that can lower the 111 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:01,800 Speaker 1: barrier f entry, you know what I mean, make it 112 00:06:01,839 --> 00:06:05,719 Speaker 1: more comfortable and relatable to pursue support that you know 113 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 1: is going to be there and be able to truly 114 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:10,480 Speaker 1: understand where you're coming from. Yes, that's so funny because 115 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:14,920 Speaker 1: my personal therapist shout out to Shelley. I doubt she's listening. 116 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 1: But when I found her, I specifically found her online 117 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 1: and she I was looking at her credentials of where 118 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:22,599 Speaker 1: she went to school, and I saw that she got 119 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 1: her degree from Howard University here in d C. And 120 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:28,400 Speaker 1: so I thought, oh, this is a black woman. I 121 00:06:28,440 --> 00:06:31,240 Speaker 1: was so confident. I was like, this is this therapist 122 00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:34,279 Speaker 1: is a black woman. I get there, she's very very 123 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 1: not a black woman, but she's amazing. So exactly, I 124 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 1: don't I don't want to say that only a therapist, 125 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 1: only a black woman therapist and understand my black woman issues. 126 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 1: But I definitely thought that going in, and then when 127 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 1: I got there, I was like, Oh, you're not a 128 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 1: black woman. Wow, that's funny to hear, like prejudicial assumptions 129 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 1: on both ends of inspectrum there. But that warns a 130 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:58,920 Speaker 1: further conversation on historically black colleges and university. I wonder 131 00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:03,200 Speaker 1: if someone will do a podcast about them, so again, 132 00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 1: I think, you know, just to sort of level set 133 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 1: on where the Black community is of mental health and 134 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 1: sort of the history of it. So one of the reasons, 135 00:07:10,320 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 1: in addition to the things that we were just talking about, 136 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: one of the reasons why there are so many taboos 137 00:07:13,960 --> 00:07:19,040 Speaker 1: and black communities might stem from slavery. According to any magazine, historically, 138 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 1: African Americans have normalized our own suffering. During slavery, mental 139 00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:26,720 Speaker 1: illness often resulted in more inhumane lifestyles, including frequent beatings 140 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: and abuse, which forced many slaves to hide their issues. 141 00:07:29,520 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 1: Over time, strength became equated with survival and weakness, including 142 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:35,920 Speaker 1: mental illness, meant you might not survive. And I know 143 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 1: that in in my family and in my communities, I've 144 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 1: seen I've seen this. I know exactly what it looks like. 145 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: People feeling the need to sort of do it all 146 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:48,559 Speaker 1: with a brave face and never never let them see slat. 147 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 1: And so if you're really having an issue, feeling like 148 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:54,360 Speaker 1: there is a strength in not talking about it, there 149 00:07:54,400 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 1: is a strength and not speaking up about it. And 150 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 1: I can see how historically that maybe could have been 151 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:01,880 Speaker 1: a strength and I kind of way to cope. But 152 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:04,240 Speaker 1: now I don't feel like it's doing us any favors. Right. 153 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:08,000 Speaker 1: That's so fascinating to bring up, Bridget, because I actually 154 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 1: recently stumbled across new research, not terribly new, but this 155 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 1: the study actually came out showing that there is the 156 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 1: potential for trauma to be internalized and imprinted on d 157 00:08:21,880 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 1: n A and potentially passed on to future generations. So 158 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:31,000 Speaker 1: I mean, you're really talking very literally about institutional and 159 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 1: historical and systemic oppression being in some ways a very 160 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:38,320 Speaker 1: sad birth right or so passed on from one generation 161 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:41,600 Speaker 1: to the next. In this particular study, uh, they were 162 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:45,560 Speaker 1: examining the DNA of Holocaust survivors and their their family 163 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:49,200 Speaker 1: lineage and what they found this They found this sort 164 00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 1: of pattern implying that children of individuals who experienced profound 165 00:08:54,240 --> 00:08:57,440 Speaker 1: stress in life maybe more likely to develop stress or 166 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:03,040 Speaker 1: anxiety disorders. Themselves. The pattern known as epigenetic change because 167 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 1: it affects the chemical marker for the gene rather than 168 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: the gene itself, suggests that profound stress in the older 169 00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:13,360 Speaker 1: generation translated into an adaptation that passed on to the 170 00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:17,000 Speaker 1: next generation. That insane. I mean, I have no trouble 171 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:20,440 Speaker 1: believing that. I mean, I I feel like anecdotally, I 172 00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:23,800 Speaker 1: have seen that. I see that play out. Um, I've 173 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 1: seen that play out, I feel like, and it doesn't 174 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:30,400 Speaker 1: surprise me. Sure, And so talk about profound stress, talk 175 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 1: about continual oppression. You know, of course there's going to 176 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:38,000 Speaker 1: be profound stress there, whether we're talking about institutions that 177 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 1: have had as long a legacy as slavery in the 178 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:46,240 Speaker 1: United States, or internment camps for Japanese Americans or something 179 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:50,920 Speaker 1: like the Holocaust. Right, of course, these things are passed down, um, 180 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: because of how significant they are. And I wonder if 181 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:56,520 Speaker 1: that also could be translated into the cycle of poverty 182 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,559 Speaker 1: and just how not genetic, but just how s y, 183 00:10:00,720 --> 00:10:03,440 Speaker 1: systemic and continuous that can be. Yeah, I mean, this 184 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:07,200 Speaker 1: is a whole other episode. But issues of inequality and 185 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:11,679 Speaker 1: issues issues of that nature are so systemic, they're so 186 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 1: widespread and So when people say things and this is 187 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:20,000 Speaker 1: a terrible thing to say, but when people say things like, um, oh, 188 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 1: black people haven't there hasn't been slavery in America for 189 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:26,439 Speaker 1: YadA YadA years getting together. People don't understand the way 190 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:29,600 Speaker 1: that these legacies of oppression get passed out and are really, 191 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:33,679 Speaker 1: according to the study, can really be like in our bones. Um, 192 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:36,040 Speaker 1: and it's it's it's fascinating, but it's very sad. And 193 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:38,720 Speaker 1: I think that's one of the reasons why I feel 194 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:42,360 Speaker 1: like there is really a mental health crisis and black communities. Um, 195 00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:44,560 Speaker 1: it's really a problem that that they're such a stigma 196 00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:47,640 Speaker 1: and that folks aren't really talking about it. Um. Black 197 00:10:47,679 --> 00:10:50,400 Speaker 1: Americans are more likely than their white counterparts to experience 198 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:52,439 Speaker 1: mental health issues. In fact, according to the Health and 199 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:56,320 Speaker 1: Human Sciences Office of Minority Health, black Black Americans are 200 00:10:56,360 --> 00:10:59,199 Speaker 1: twenty percent more likely to experience serious mental health problems 201 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:02,960 Speaker 1: than the general pop relation. And so we're struggling, but 202 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 1: we're also struggling in silence. Um, we're much less likely 203 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:09,760 Speaker 1: to seek help. UM. Young adult African Americans, especially those 204 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: with higher levels of education, are less likely to seek 205 00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:14,680 Speaker 1: mental health services and their white counterparts, According to a 206 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 1: study by the American Psychological Association, I would have thought that, 207 00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 1: like this was a generational trend in which young people 208 00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:26,720 Speaker 1: were starting to seek out help more openly. You would think, Yeah, 209 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:29,200 Speaker 1: you would think that, And I'm I'm curious as to 210 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:32,880 Speaker 1: why that might be. Um, I think that as a 211 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:35,880 Speaker 1: as a young black American who you know has a 212 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:40,480 Speaker 1: college degree. I think it. I just I don't I 213 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:43,080 Speaker 1: don't know what the explanation. I mean, its financial because 214 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:45,920 Speaker 1: my twenties, my budget was kind of a hot mass personally. 215 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 1: Maybe I wonder if it's financial or just that the 216 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:52,679 Speaker 1: idea of navigating how you go about getting services can 217 00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 1: be overwhelming, and it's one of those things. And I 218 00:11:55,160 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 1: can imagine if there's already a stigma, if you already 219 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: feel weird about it, challenging yourself to get the help 220 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:05,960 Speaker 1: and doing so logistically, like finding a doctor, getting the 221 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: insurance information together, all of that might be overwhelming to 222 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:11,560 Speaker 1: the point where it's, you know, you might think just 223 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 1: forget it. Hashtag adult ing. I'm like, just starting to 224 00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:18,160 Speaker 1: get on board with adulting is rough. It is rough. 225 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:20,559 Speaker 1: If we have this definitely falls into that category. And 226 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, you mean my mom's not going 227 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 1: to force me to make a dentist appointment in my 228 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:27,720 Speaker 1: life anymore. My my dad's not going to schedule that 229 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:31,840 Speaker 1: check up for me. Like, yeah, I would not if 230 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:33,679 Speaker 1: it wasn't for my mom. Shout out to my mom 231 00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:35,640 Speaker 1: front of the show, I would never go to the dentist. 232 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: So something else that I found really troubling is that 233 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 1: as bad as it is in black communities, surprised, it's 234 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:43,079 Speaker 1: even worse for black women. And we're going to get 235 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:45,320 Speaker 1: into a little bit about why that is after this 236 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 1: quick break and we're back and we were just talking 237 00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 1: about black communities and mental health again. This is a 238 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:02,280 Speaker 1: topic that is near and dear to my heart. Um 239 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:06,920 Speaker 1: I um, I'm someone. I mean, therapy changed my life. 240 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:12,000 Speaker 1: I spent a lot of time growing up feeling unhappy 241 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:14,360 Speaker 1: and out of place and anxious and sort of stressed 242 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:16,719 Speaker 1: out and you know a lot of the ways that 243 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:20,240 Speaker 1: teenagers feel, but feeling that that in a really existential way. 244 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 1: And it wasn't until going to therapy and learning how 245 00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 1: to talk about my behavior and my issues and understand 246 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:30,760 Speaker 1: them that has been a tremendous help in my life. 247 00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 1: I don't know where I would be if I hadn't 248 00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:34,320 Speaker 1: gone to therapy, and it was hard. It was it 249 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:37,680 Speaker 1: is hard because we I grew up thinking or hearing 250 00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:41,080 Speaker 1: that therapy is something that like white girls did. Black 251 00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:43,480 Speaker 1: girls don't go to therapy, Black girls don't have these issues. 252 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 1: I grew up internalizing that, thinking that was true. And 253 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:48,640 Speaker 1: so if I was sad, if I was depressed, I 254 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:51,880 Speaker 1: was having a hard time. I grew up thinking this 255 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,320 Speaker 1: was some it was something wrong with me. I must 256 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 1: not be a strong Black woman if I feel like 257 00:13:56,800 --> 00:13:58,320 Speaker 1: I need help on an issue, or if I even 258 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 1: talk about needing help on on that issue. Yeah, And 259 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:04,480 Speaker 1: there's evidence, new evidence that just came out saying that 260 00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 1: the world would agree with that really unhealthy double standard 261 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:11,079 Speaker 1: that we hold little black girls too, even starting as 262 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 1: early as age five. This new research that just came 263 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:18,160 Speaker 1: out found that people like teachers and doctors and adults 264 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 1: are more likely to see little black girls as more mature, 265 00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:25,400 Speaker 1: more able to handle stuff, less in need of maybe 266 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:28,080 Speaker 1: benevolent sort of support, right less in need of care, 267 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,840 Speaker 1: and that I found extraordinarily problematic and troubling. According to 268 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 1: the study which came out from the Georgetown School of 269 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:38,760 Speaker 1: Laws Center on Poverty and inequality. They found that black 270 00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:43,440 Speaker 1: girls may face unconscious bias while still in kindergarten. Black 271 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 1: girls are perceived as less innocent than white girls at 272 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:49,960 Speaker 1: five years old, So it's not exactly related to therapy, 273 00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 1: but I wonder if that same bias of seeing little 274 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 1: black girls as less innocent, in need of our help 275 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 1: or support, or more mature and able to handle it 276 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:01,160 Speaker 1: translates over to that suck it culture, like deal with it, 277 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:03,840 Speaker 1: get your stuff together, lock it up, you should need support. 278 00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:06,360 Speaker 1: I mean, that's been my that was my entire experience 279 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,840 Speaker 1: growing up. I grew up feeling that inside, feeling that 280 00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:14,960 Speaker 1: if I, you know, expressed that I needed help or 281 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,120 Speaker 1: that I was struggling or having a hard time, that 282 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:19,680 Speaker 1: that wasn't okay, and that it was clear to me 283 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 1: that that was okay for other types of girls and 284 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 1: it wasn't okay for me. That was the message that 285 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:27,320 Speaker 1: I carried inside on a lot of levels, not just 286 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:29,680 Speaker 1: in terms of getting therapy and getting mental help, get 287 00:15:29,680 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 1: getting mental health help and things like that, but in 288 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:34,160 Speaker 1: a lot of ways, I think I internalized the message 289 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 1: that society is set up to protect white womanhood and 290 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: I'm not I am not part of the you know, 291 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 1: I'm not part of that, Like I am not deserving 292 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:47,360 Speaker 1: of that same level of protection. Society is not set 293 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 1: up to ensure that I am protected and supported in 294 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 1: the way that I think. It's easy to look at 295 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 1: our society and see how, you know, how it's not 296 00:15:57,240 --> 00:15:59,440 Speaker 1: set up for black women, and I think that we 297 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 1: have to We're going to cover that in an episode 298 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 1: or something related to that on intersectionality. I think this 299 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:06,480 Speaker 1: is one of the reasons why it's so important that 300 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 1: women who live at the intersection of race and gender 301 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 1: discrimination don't get erased from the equation. And clearly this 302 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:16,600 Speaker 1: is happening already. I I also have heard from many 303 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:19,360 Speaker 1: of the women of color, and specifically black women that 304 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: I've worked with through my work at Boss Up this 305 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:25,920 Speaker 1: mantra of you have to be twice as good to 306 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:29,280 Speaker 1: go half as far, And there's some underlying truth to that, 307 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:32,240 Speaker 1: because life is not fair. The world is not fair. 308 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:34,400 Speaker 1: But when I hear a mantra like that, told me 309 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 1: over and over again, like congratulations, you're a tough black woman, 310 00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:40,720 Speaker 1: You've got to be twice as good to compete with 311 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:43,600 Speaker 1: a white nude for the same job. And when I 312 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:45,960 Speaker 1: hear that I can imagine how that kind of a 313 00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:49,520 Speaker 1: message could be internalized in a way to think, you know, 314 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:52,240 Speaker 1: I need to suck it up, I need to like 315 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,360 Speaker 1: just deal with it. I need to be to work 316 00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:56,880 Speaker 1: twice as hard to get half as far, and that 317 00:16:57,280 --> 00:17:00,320 Speaker 1: I don't know, I think that can lead to really 318 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:04,239 Speaker 1: dangerous UH scenarios and the lack of seeking help when 319 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:06,200 Speaker 1: you need to because it's seen as a failure. Yeah. 320 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:08,200 Speaker 1: I mean, I just we just had an interview and 321 00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 1: Glamour magazine, UM, basically all about this. Um. I probably 322 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: the hardest time I ever had in my life was 323 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,679 Speaker 1: when I was working for a major news company at 324 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:21,159 Speaker 1: a twenty four hour cable news company, and that's exactly 325 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:25,520 Speaker 1: what I felt. I felt I had internalized this idea that, um, 326 00:17:25,560 --> 00:17:29,160 Speaker 1: you know, I am the representative of my race and gender. 327 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,400 Speaker 1: And we did an episode around this. And in work 328 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:35,199 Speaker 1: fales where you can often feel if you mess up 329 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 1: as a woman, then your boss is going to say, oh, 330 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:39,320 Speaker 1: all women mess up in this way, and that you're 331 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:42,960 Speaker 1: really become representative of of the group that you represent 332 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:45,040 Speaker 1: or of the group that you're a part of. And 333 00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 1: when I was working there, I felt if I raised 334 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:52,080 Speaker 1: the alarm about anything. It could be things that were 335 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:53,880 Speaker 1: some of the things that I went through there were 336 00:17:53,960 --> 00:17:58,760 Speaker 1: legitimately all unfair labor practices, and rather than you know, 337 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 1: speaking up about it, I just thought, Oh, if I 338 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:04,439 Speaker 1: make noise about this, I'm gonna get pegged as you know, 339 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:07,720 Speaker 1: the complaining black woman, and I'm gonna make it. I'm 340 00:18:07,720 --> 00:18:09,840 Speaker 1: gonna make it harder for another black woman who comes 341 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 1: behind me to be in the same place. And I 342 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 1: have this really intense wait on. I felt like I 343 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: had a really intense weight on my shoulders and I 344 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:23,040 Speaker 1: had to be perfect and in all the ways, and 345 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:25,040 Speaker 1: if I wasn't, then I was messing it up for 346 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:26,760 Speaker 1: someone else, or there would be less I would be 347 00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: the last black woman in that office, right, And I 348 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: couldn't handle that. It was almost like you were a 349 00:18:31,040 --> 00:18:35,640 Speaker 1: martyr for your group, that your minority group of which 350 00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:40,560 Speaker 1: you're representing, which really becomes exaggerated for women in male 351 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 1: dominated or white dominated fields. Which is it safe to 352 00:18:43,560 --> 00:18:46,920 Speaker 1: assume that's what You're absolutely safe. So you've got to 353 00:18:46,960 --> 00:18:49,879 Speaker 1: read this Glamour piece by Jessica Militari, who interviewed with 354 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 1: us about burnout for Glamour, and they're they're Glamour online piece, 355 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,640 Speaker 1: I should say, and in it you'll see just how 356 00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:02,520 Speaker 1: dramatic burnout is for women, especially when you layer on race, 357 00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:06,919 Speaker 1: um and class in addition to identity, not identity, but 358 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:09,919 Speaker 1: to in addition to gender identity. So what happened at 359 00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 1: that cable news that let you want to tease a 360 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:14,840 Speaker 1: little bit about the story, Yeah, it was. It's one 361 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:17,960 Speaker 1: of the saddest it would mean. Actually no, it wasn't said. 362 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:19,640 Speaker 1: It was a wake up call and in a kind 363 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:22,040 Speaker 1: of way, so it kind of was sad at the time, 364 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:25,800 Speaker 1: but helpful in another way. Um I on the day 365 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:29,360 Speaker 1: before my thirtieth birthday, I collapsed in an elevator. UM 366 00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 1: I had had a cold, I had been uplight the 367 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:36,359 Speaker 1: night before. It was a really busy news cycle, A 368 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:38,959 Speaker 1: lot was going on. Um I was going to get 369 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,800 Speaker 1: coffee and the next I woke up. Next thing I know, 370 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,479 Speaker 1: I was in the in the infirmary and the nurses 371 00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:48,640 Speaker 1: there were you know, they said, oh, you're dehydrated, you 372 00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:52,000 Speaker 1: are exhausted. You need to take care of yourself. And 373 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:54,200 Speaker 1: this is the saddest thing. Whenever I tell this story, 374 00:19:54,280 --> 00:19:58,120 Speaker 1: people are like, wow, that is bleak. Um. They the 375 00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:01,160 Speaker 1: nurse was. She said, it's a someone we can call, someone, 376 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:03,000 Speaker 1: we can call all to come get you, take you home. 377 00:20:03,359 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 1: And I thought about it, and I said, literally, everyone 378 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:07,600 Speaker 1: I know in New York City is in this building. 379 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: I don't know a single person who's not in this 380 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: office right now. There was no one to call, you know, 381 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,439 Speaker 1: no one. No. I have worked so hard that I 382 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:19,560 Speaker 1: have made zero friends or not in this office. And 383 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:22,120 Speaker 1: it was a week up call. I really became clear 384 00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:24,760 Speaker 1: to me that I had to make some life changes. 385 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:27,960 Speaker 1: And it became clear to me that for probably for 386 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:29,680 Speaker 1: a mix of the reasons we were just talking about 387 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:33,359 Speaker 1: that I am someone who internalizes the need to do 388 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 1: it all and they need to do it perfectly and 389 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:37,560 Speaker 1: they need to be twice as good, and that I 390 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:40,040 Speaker 1: will put I will take that to a really unhealthy 391 00:20:40,080 --> 00:20:42,520 Speaker 1: and dangerous place. All out. I mean, you are in 392 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 1: such good company, unfortunately, because this is what I've made 393 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:49,919 Speaker 1: my life's work about, really is burnout and people. We 394 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:52,440 Speaker 1: could talk about burnout for a whole other episode. Oh wait, 395 00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:54,760 Speaker 1: we did with Chris, I did with Kristen and Caroline 396 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: last year is a good check it out. The episodes 397 00:20:56,560 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 1: called Boss Up and as it turns out burnout is 398 00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: not just oh I'm so tired, it's a clinically diagnosable 399 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:05,959 Speaker 1: mental health disorder. So that totally falls within the confines 400 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:08,439 Speaker 1: of what we're talking about here. And I'm so glad 401 00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:12,200 Speaker 1: that things have changed significantly due to your hard work 402 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 1: and assertiveness and willingness to set healthy boundaries. But I 403 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:19,120 Speaker 1: think honestly that so many women I talked to, especially 404 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:22,840 Speaker 1: women of color, have had shockingly similar experiences on that 405 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: it doesn't surprise me at all. I was talking to 406 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 1: a friend earlier and I mentioned, um, I think we 407 00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:33,240 Speaker 1: were talking about me trying to get something done on 408 00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 1: a project and I said, gee, you know, I'm not 409 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:37,400 Speaker 1: a very assertive person and I really sort of never 410 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:40,199 Speaker 1: have been, and he was. He said, of course you're not. 411 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:42,760 Speaker 1: I don't feel like black women are allowed to be 412 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,159 Speaker 1: assorted people if that they are, so when you need 413 00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:48,200 Speaker 1: to speak up about something, it's possible that black women 414 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:50,919 Speaker 1: just don't really get that space. And I have completely 415 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:53,159 Speaker 1: internalized that. I think I'm part of me. Wonder this 416 00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:56,320 Speaker 1: is the whole other. It's like a therapy session. I 417 00:21:56,359 --> 00:22:01,560 Speaker 1: don't where is Daphanie taking calls? Well, you really knew 418 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:06,159 Speaker 1: your Fraser, it's here. You really knew your Frasier. I 419 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:09,240 Speaker 1: really I grew up watching Frasier, which is the whitest 420 00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:12,720 Speaker 1: thing I've ever said out loud. It was like a 421 00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:16,959 Speaker 1: ten year old watching Fraser. Get the jokes? No, okay, 422 00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:19,600 Speaker 1: but I somehow stayed glued to them. I don't know. 423 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:22,199 Speaker 1: I guess my parents must have. I think you know what. 424 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:25,280 Speaker 1: I came on right before the Simpsons. That's what's really happening. 425 00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 1: Were Simpsons family? A man? We should do an episode 426 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:32,359 Speaker 1: on Lisa since definitely, yes, we should stay tuned writing 427 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:37,399 Speaker 1: down right now? What were we talking about? Oh, Frasier. No, 428 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 1: they're all like, get to the point, lady, stop talking 429 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:46,720 Speaker 1: about Fraser. Um. And probably women are young enough listening, 430 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 1: who are like, Who's Fraser? That makes me sad we 431 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,120 Speaker 1: are old and that we got okay? Um? So wait. 432 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:55,679 Speaker 1: I wanted to add one thing to this, which is 433 00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 1: back when we were I don't know when this game 434 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: out previously. God, we've recorded a lot of episodes, y'all. 435 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,000 Speaker 1: I think we were talking about this on work fails 436 00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 1: or when I've at some point mentioned burnout. I recently 437 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:10,080 Speaker 1: learned that a ton of the stress research that has 438 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:14,560 Speaker 1: ever been done empirically is done on almost all male 439 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:17,439 Speaker 1: Oh you know what, it was our first episode on 440 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:20,960 Speaker 1: the psychological benefits of female friendships. There's a ton of 441 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 1: stress research out there, but most of the stress studies 442 00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:26,280 Speaker 1: that have been done in the university setting, have you 443 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:28,240 Speaker 1: even been done with men and women in equal numbers 444 00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:33,120 Speaker 1: or just all men? And similarly, black women are not 445 00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 1: specifically studied as a group. So when we talk about 446 00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 1: minority mental health, when we talk about black women in particular, 447 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: that that are sort of erased because of a lack 448 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 1: of intersectionality in the research world. Um, this is a 449 00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:53,440 Speaker 1: real problem when it comes to empirical studies. Josephin Breedfeld 450 00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,000 Speaker 1: has said little is known about black women and mental 451 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,880 Speaker 1: health as these individuals have been largely absent from research, 452 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,600 Speaker 1: and she is the research manager at the Mental Health 453 00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:05,679 Speaker 1: Foundation Foundation. She goes on to say, the majority of 454 00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: research has looked at ethnic minorities as a whole, which 455 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:12,440 Speaker 1: is like, come on, people, like every ethnic It's like 456 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,399 Speaker 1: saying every Spanish speaking country is so the same, and 457 00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 1: all Latin people are like excuse me no. Um, So 458 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:21,879 Speaker 1: they've been looked at as a whole rather than providing 459 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,440 Speaker 1: a focus on the challenges faced by black women. Yeah, 460 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,439 Speaker 1: that is, I mean, it's it's upsetting, but it's not 461 00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:32,440 Speaker 1: necessarily shocking, because that's so true of even um physical 462 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 1: medical research, where you know, we don't study the you know, 463 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:40,159 Speaker 1: bodies of women specifically, and even with women that or 464 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:43,199 Speaker 1: we're we're more likely to study groups of men and 465 00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:46,800 Speaker 1: then give women medical advice that's geared towards men and 466 00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:48,639 Speaker 1: not specifically women. And that's a problem with things like 467 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:52,960 Speaker 1: heart disease, where women's bodies operate differently and to be studied, 468 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:55,880 Speaker 1: you know, in their own way and you know kind 469 00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 1: of way. It's not surprising, but it's certainly not helping 470 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: the situation when it comes to black women in mental 471 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:04,160 Speaker 1: health totally and kind of along those lines, they've actually 472 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,399 Speaker 1: done studies that show that doctors are so doctors are 473 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,879 Speaker 1: less lucky to take the symptoms of women seriously in general, 474 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:12,680 Speaker 1: but it's even worse for black women. A study out 475 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:15,840 Speaker 1: of uv a UM University of Virginia has proven that 476 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:18,320 Speaker 1: there's a racial bias and on medical providers assess black 477 00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:22,200 Speaker 1: patients and complaints of pain, guaranteeing that medical providers consistently 478 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,679 Speaker 1: undertreat black patients and ignore their symptoms. Um. Yeah, and 479 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,439 Speaker 1: so this study is about physical symptoms, but I can 480 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 1: only imagine how that also translates to translates to mental 481 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:35,679 Speaker 1: or emotional issues that folks are reporting. No wonder, women 482 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:38,679 Speaker 1: are less likely to tell their doctors if they completely 483 00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: like if doctors aren't taking them seriously or they're not 484 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 1: they're getting gaslighted. Um gas lit Yeah, I don't know 485 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:50,920 Speaker 1: the side side note. Um, I'm sure we'll hear about 486 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,879 Speaker 1: it on Twitter. Let us know, y'all. Um, Like, no 487 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,800 Speaker 1: wonder if if women are not getting that space, as 488 00:25:57,840 --> 00:25:59,400 Speaker 1: you said earlier, I think that's a really great way 489 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:01,920 Speaker 1: to say a black women in particular, they're not given 490 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:05,400 Speaker 1: that opportunity to be taken seriously when doing a very 491 00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:08,960 Speaker 1: brave thing like asking for mental health support. There're no 492 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 1: wonder there's this philosophy or this mentality that as a 493 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:13,720 Speaker 1: black woman, you have to do it all, you have 494 00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:18,119 Speaker 1: to be everything to everyone. According to this recent article 495 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: in Ebony magazine titled Depression and the Black Superwoman's Syndrome 496 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 1: by Josie Pickens, she writes that quote, masking up as 497 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,159 Speaker 1: superwoman is killing us. Whether we need that death as 498 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,919 Speaker 1: a result of suicide or the stresses that lead to 499 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:38,240 Speaker 1: heart disease and other serious life threatening illnesses. She goes 500 00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 1: on to say that and to really point out and 501 00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:44,800 Speaker 1: a really great example here, which is that black women 502 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,960 Speaker 1: between the ages of forty five and fifty five are 503 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:53,359 Speaker 1: quote biologically seven point five years older than white women 504 00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:58,680 Speaker 1: of the same age. So there's this weird dichotomy between 505 00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:02,600 Speaker 1: doctors not take king black women's issues as seriously women 506 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,800 Speaker 1: in that demographic than being less likely to report it 507 00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:07,679 Speaker 1: or get help or ask for the support that they 508 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,480 Speaker 1: need because why bother because they're getting met with this resistance. 509 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 1: And then this this other philosophy which I hear on 510 00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:17,359 Speaker 1: reality TV often. You know, black don't crack, so like 511 00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:22,119 Speaker 1: we look younger. I don't need botox like white ladies do. 512 00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:23,880 Speaker 1: What your botox is a white lady thing. We should 513 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:25,639 Speaker 1: do an episode. Oh my god, I had not even that, 514 00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:28,240 Speaker 1: had not even occurred to me that that would be related. 515 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:30,960 Speaker 1: But it's true. First of all, my mom is she 516 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,399 Speaker 1: looks like a teenager. You look at my mom and think, oh, 517 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,240 Speaker 1: what are you thirty? And she's in her sixties. It's true, 518 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:40,920 Speaker 1: like black bodies it's it's so toxic because I feel like, 519 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:47,600 Speaker 1: because we look younger, we present different different some things 520 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:51,680 Speaker 1: could be going on internally, but it's harder to take 521 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,520 Speaker 1: it seriously if you don't if the inside doesn't actually 522 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:56,440 Speaker 1: outside in a kind of way that I phrase that weird, 523 00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:58,280 Speaker 1: but you know what I mean, totally know what you mean. 524 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 1: Fist bump. Yes, and even here from um from this 525 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,480 Speaker 1: sort of quote comes from a Lotty Joiner post on 526 00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 1: the Route dot com that medically speaking, black women's bodies 527 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,840 Speaker 1: are older in some ways than white women's bodies on average. 528 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:18,159 Speaker 1: I'm assuming it's got to be on average. Uh, then 529 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:20,919 Speaker 1: there are hidden symptoms that were missing, and so it's 530 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:24,640 Speaker 1: just it sounds like a total erasure of a space 531 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:28,639 Speaker 1: or a representation of black women's seeking mental health for 532 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:31,200 Speaker 1: it and getting it. And that's honestly why it was 533 00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 1: so important to me just personally to do this episode. 534 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,280 Speaker 1: But also I think that word you use, erasure, is 535 00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:39,960 Speaker 1: exactly it. You know. I so the fact that black 536 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,840 Speaker 1: folks are dealing with more mental health issues in their 537 00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:46,800 Speaker 1: white counterparts, clearly it's an issue for us, Yet we 538 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,320 Speaker 1: are completely erased on the conversation. I did not I 539 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,280 Speaker 1: mean I remember reading an article. This was probably fifteen 540 00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:54,640 Speaker 1: years ago. I was in high school, so this was 541 00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,040 Speaker 1: really going back. But it was in Bitch magazine. It 542 00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: was my you know, how Bitch was like an early 543 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 1: can we can you say that it's the name of publication? 544 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:05,840 Speaker 1: Yeah for sure? Okay, well b Word magazine. If I 545 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:07,800 Speaker 1: can't say it, sorry, that's the thing. Well, you're fifteen 546 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,080 Speaker 1: years old reading and I was attracted to that magazine 547 00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 1: because I was like, oh swear word. Um. But yeah, 548 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,840 Speaker 1: reading an article about how black how mental health is 549 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 1: dealt with in pop culture around whiteness, and so just 550 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 1: like we were saying before, you know, they did episodes 551 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 1: where Carrie and Sex and the City goes to therapy 552 00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:27,960 Speaker 1: where she meets that guy and they sleep together and 553 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 1: blah blah blah. Um. If you remember that, yeah, I 554 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:33,880 Speaker 1: remember Sex and the City plotlines pretty well. Um. But 555 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:36,920 Speaker 1: in this article they were talking about how another show 556 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:40,000 Speaker 1: at the time that was very similar Girlfriends, which was like, 557 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:45,520 Speaker 1: you know one of my favorite humans, yes, yes, yeah, 558 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,719 Speaker 1: friend of the show sort of she might not know 559 00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 1: to get her on the show, Tracy call Us. But yeah, 560 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 1: basically they said that you would never have an episode 561 00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:58,200 Speaker 1: where you know that it's dealt with in a in 562 00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:02,080 Speaker 1: a loving or normalized way on shows that deal with 563 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:04,280 Speaker 1: with with black folks, right like, that was not a 564 00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:07,440 Speaker 1: thing that was happening. And I grew up watching women 565 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:11,840 Speaker 1: like Carrie Bradshaw or you know, other other white characters 566 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 1: talked to therapists. Really are watching the movie Harry at 567 00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: the Spy and she goes to a child psychologist, and 568 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,000 Speaker 1: I remember just thinking how how odd like you would 569 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:23,680 Speaker 1: never see and you're the daughter of a medical, daughter 570 00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:27,280 Speaker 1: of a doctor, and even then that was completely sort 571 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:30,479 Speaker 1: of foreign to me. And so I think that the 572 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:32,920 Speaker 1: fact that black folks and black women in particular are 573 00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:36,320 Speaker 1: kind of a race from how we think about therapy 574 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,440 Speaker 1: and mental health issues in America when we are the 575 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:40,800 Speaker 1: ones who we're dealing with it in a in a 576 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 1: deeper way, is baffling. And this seriously tragic irony is 577 00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:49,240 Speaker 1: what it is. But I also I am optimistic by 578 00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 1: I am optimized by you know what I'm going I'm encouraged, 579 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:57,520 Speaker 1: that's the word. I'm encouraged by pop cultures change on 580 00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 1: that front. Definitely, should we take a break before we 581 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 1: dive into that at a sick of break all right. 582 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,160 Speaker 1: When we come back, we'll talk about how things are 583 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 1: changing on that front for the better. But we'll be 584 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:16,160 Speaker 1: right back after a quick word from our sponsors, and 585 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:19,600 Speaker 1: we're back. And the good news is that, especially in 586 00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 1: the relatively recent history, pop culture, especially black people in 587 00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:29,680 Speaker 1: pop culture, in the media landscape, whether they're musical artists 588 00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:33,360 Speaker 1: or behind you know, television shows are really starting to 589 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:37,360 Speaker 1: take seriously, um, how to address these issues in the 590 00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:39,920 Speaker 1: public light, whether it's in a fictional character, like through 591 00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 1: a fictional character's plotline, or in a public way, in 592 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 1: a really brave way. So um, yeah, I've been really 593 00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:49,280 Speaker 1: thrilled to see, um, the way that artists have been 594 00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,600 Speaker 1: taking the lead and having these conversations in black communities. Um. 595 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 1: If anyone watched one of my favorite shows on HBO, 596 00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:59,680 Speaker 1: Insecure Ray she's amazing. Um, but one of the characters spoiler, 597 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,360 Speaker 1: so if you haven't seen it, also pick up her books. 598 00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:05,800 Speaker 1: Oh it's so good. It's so good, Black Girl, It's 599 00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:11,400 Speaker 1: so good. That's the story of my life. It is 600 00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:14,760 Speaker 1: story of my life to it's actually it's like it's 601 00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 1: as an r A was watching me growing up and 602 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 1: wrote a book about it. Honestly, Um, but yeah. On 603 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:23,480 Speaker 1: one of the plot lines of the show Insecure and 604 00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:25,520 Speaker 1: Against Boiler, a Lord of Kis's seen it is that 605 00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:28,280 Speaker 1: her best friend Molly is going through a lot of 606 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,239 Speaker 1: issues with dating and with um work and having all 607 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:35,480 Speaker 1: these kind of she's really struggling, and she walks out 608 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:37,719 Speaker 1: on the street one day and she bumps into a 609 00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:40,120 Speaker 1: friend from college who used to be sort of um 610 00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:42,360 Speaker 1: what you might think of this, like ratchet um, And 611 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 1: she's like, oh my god, you look so good lest 612 00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:45,960 Speaker 1: time I sell you. You were like dancing on a 613 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:49,560 Speaker 1: bar doing shots, And her friend very earnestly says, yeah, 614 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:51,160 Speaker 1: I was a mess back then, but now I'm in 615 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,520 Speaker 1: therapy and things are going great and I'm so happy, 616 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:59,000 Speaker 1: and Molly, you kind of realizes. At first, Molly thinks, therapy, 617 00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:00,960 Speaker 1: you know, has that same actually I would have had 618 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 1: before I got into therapy, which is therapy, you know, what, 619 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 1: are you quote crazy? And then while talking to her friend, 620 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:10,960 Speaker 1: she realizes this might be something that I could benefit from. 621 00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:14,280 Speaker 1: So having showing a character go through that trajectory of 622 00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:18,880 Speaker 1: having a problem and then realizing that therapy is an 623 00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:21,160 Speaker 1: option and then weighing it, like weighing that as an 624 00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:25,160 Speaker 1: option for her. I thought Liz was huge, was transformative, powerful, Yeah, 625 00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:28,640 Speaker 1: and when I I can almost relate to that in 626 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:32,320 Speaker 1: my own experience because I don't know if anyone else 627 00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:34,640 Speaker 1: listening has ever gone through this, But I actually started 628 00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:37,880 Speaker 1: to talk to mental health professionals in order to get 629 00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:41,880 Speaker 1: my boyfriend the support he needed, or to pursue therapy 630 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:44,760 Speaker 1: for my family member who needed it. You know, I 631 00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:49,720 Speaker 1: initially went to you know, be an agent of connection 632 00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,280 Speaker 1: for other people's therapy and ended up in therapy myself 633 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:55,800 Speaker 1: that way. And I had not thought of myself as 634 00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:58,840 Speaker 1: being someone who would benefit from it, and that was 635 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:01,960 Speaker 1: so incorrect and my life completely transformed when I actually 636 00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,640 Speaker 1: did seek out support for my own self. So I 637 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:07,760 Speaker 1: think women are very good kind of like negotiation, very 638 00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,680 Speaker 1: good at negotiating on behalf of others. Um. And it's 639 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:14,719 Speaker 1: harder sometimes for us to feel safe and uh be 640 00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:18,280 Speaker 1: well received when received when pursuing support for ourselves. Totally 641 00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:21,200 Speaker 1: so so important to see that as an option and yeah, 642 00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:23,440 Speaker 1: and and to see it as an option not just 643 00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:25,279 Speaker 1: for friends or for family that you're trying to get 644 00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: support for, but for yourself should you need it. Um. 645 00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:30,200 Speaker 1: I also just if you got jay Z's newest album, 646 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:32,920 Speaker 1: which is great. You should definitely listen to it. It's amazing. 647 00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:35,840 Speaker 1: But um four or forty four, he actually it's so 648 00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:40,120 Speaker 1: not only is an album all about um being critical 649 00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 1: and looking at your own behavior and your own actions 650 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:44,160 Speaker 1: and your own intentions and and thinking about it in 651 00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 1: a in a with the lens of being aware of 652 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:49,560 Speaker 1: self aware, which just kind of a new thing I 653 00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:52,279 Speaker 1: think in hip hop, especially for jay Z. UM. But 654 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:55,920 Speaker 1: he actually explicitly mentions seeing a therapist and so m 655 00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 1: on his one song, he writes, mama had four kids, 656 00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:00,399 Speaker 1: but she's a lesbian, had to pretend in so long 657 00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:02,600 Speaker 1: that she's a thespian, had to hide in the closet, 658 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:05,600 Speaker 1: so she medicates society shames the pain. It was too 659 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:08,160 Speaker 1: much to take. My therapist said I relapsed. I said, 660 00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:11,640 Speaker 1: perhaps I've already and slipped into European whips. Um. And so, 661 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:16,560 Speaker 1: going on that, his mom comes out as gay, which 662 00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:20,879 Speaker 1: is huge UM. And then too he explicitly talks about 663 00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:23,319 Speaker 1: seeing a therapist. And for me, I mean when I 664 00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:26,520 Speaker 1: heard that line, I thought, yes, jay Z, thank you 665 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,160 Speaker 1: like getting it. Getting a therapist if you need one, 666 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:31,359 Speaker 1: should be cool talking about your issues. And being self 667 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:35,000 Speaker 1: critical and looking at your behavior with an eye towards intentionality. 668 00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:37,400 Speaker 1: We should make that cool, like that should be a 669 00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:41,520 Speaker 1: thing that we make, that we talk about and make normal. 670 00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 1: I completely agree. I couldn't have said it better myself. Yeah, 671 00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:46,799 Speaker 1: And that's again why why it was so sad to 672 00:35:46,880 --> 00:35:50,399 Speaker 1: see um kid Cutty. I think last year UM wrote 673 00:35:50,400 --> 00:35:54,200 Speaker 1: a very open, uh open and like moving post about 674 00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:56,600 Speaker 1: getting help from mental health issues and addiction issues and 675 00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 1: checking himself into a center. And I was and I 676 00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,320 Speaker 1: thought that was great. After that happened, UM, the hashtag 677 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:06,640 Speaker 1: you good Man sparked a conversation on Twitter around black 678 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,000 Speaker 1: men and mental health. UM. So that was great. But 679 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,960 Speaker 1: then I was so sad to see Drake, another rapper 680 00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:15,760 Speaker 1: who I I like, dissed him forward He added a 681 00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: line to a song making fun of Kid Cutty for that, 682 00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:20,640 Speaker 1: and I thought that was I mean, I think what 683 00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:26,200 Speaker 1: we're seeing is is important and transformative, and it makes 684 00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:29,239 Speaker 1: me sad that folks would try to crap on that. 685 00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 1: I said, you stayed xanixed up and perked up in 686 00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:37,120 Speaker 1: his album like dissing Kid Cutty, which I get it wrapped, 687 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:42,200 Speaker 1: Like hip hop can sometimes be, you know, not antagonistic, 688 00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:45,759 Speaker 1: but they can put people against one another. But come on, man, 689 00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:49,919 Speaker 1: that was low and yeah and he he When people 690 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:51,040 Speaker 1: called him out for it, he was like, I'm not 691 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:53,600 Speaker 1: a poppy walk back at all. I'm sorry, I don't 692 00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:55,879 Speaker 1: really like drink them. Well, that actually did make me 693 00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,560 Speaker 1: I never really liked Yeah, that made me not like 694 00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:01,359 Speaker 1: him too like him, but I didn't. I liked him 695 00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,560 Speaker 1: less after that, although I do think his uh proud 696 00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:08,400 Speaker 1: judaism is very interesting in a cool way, like minority 697 00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:10,480 Speaker 1: like black Jews, Like we could do an episode on 698 00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 1: being a Puerto Rican, do you know, I think there's 699 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:14,000 Speaker 1: a whole thing. Then when I was growing up, they 700 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:17,080 Speaker 1: didn't know there are black Jews. I think that's I 701 00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:19,719 Speaker 1: think that an element of visibility from Drake is a 702 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,080 Speaker 1: good Do you like him or do you know what? 703 00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 1: Not like him? Yeah? Him, I want to like him, 704 00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:27,239 Speaker 1: but I don't. I don't like his music. I feel 705 00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:29,480 Speaker 1: you um and yeah. I think when you look at 706 00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:32,800 Speaker 1: these artists, I think of it as I mean mental 707 00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:36,640 Speaker 1: health issues in black communities. To me, it's we've seen 708 00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,279 Speaker 1: it be so entwined with things like policing. And then 709 00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:41,840 Speaker 1: I think the same way that black artists can no 710 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:44,160 Speaker 1: longer afford to stay silent when it comes to things 711 00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:46,719 Speaker 1: like Black Lives Matter and police shootings. I see that 712 00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:48,680 Speaker 1: as a similar thing. And we actually know from the 713 00:37:48,760 --> 00:37:52,440 Speaker 1: research that black mental health and policing are linked, actually 714 00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:57,279 Speaker 1: done research from the fact that UM, black Americans can 715 00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:00,160 Speaker 1: experience a form of post traumatic stress disorder from UM 716 00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:03,279 Speaker 1: seeing you know, police shootings all day long on a loop. 717 00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:05,520 Speaker 1: I have certainly felt that, And so I think it's 718 00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:08,319 Speaker 1: one of those things where artists can lead the way 719 00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:10,800 Speaker 1: in sort of sort of having those conversations. And we 720 00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:15,920 Speaker 1: know that so often, UM police can get called to 721 00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:19,520 Speaker 1: handle UM what are actually mental health christ crisises and 722 00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:24,040 Speaker 1: the crises Christ, how do you floor less crisis? You 723 00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:26,680 Speaker 1: get it? Um? And so yeah, they've actually been some 724 00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:30,600 Speaker 1: really recent cases of black women who dial nine one 725 00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:34,000 Speaker 1: one who are having mental health issues and then they 726 00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,080 Speaker 1: like a psychotic episode, and then when the cops get there, 727 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:40,279 Speaker 1: they are shot and killed, and which is disgusting and 728 00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:44,840 Speaker 1: deplorable and completely maddening and infuriating. UM, I don't know 729 00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:47,360 Speaker 1: where to go after this. Well, it's deplorable, I get it. 730 00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:49,400 Speaker 1: I mean, I think I think it's it's like a 731 00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:51,960 Speaker 1: legitimate statement. I don't know where to go after that either. 732 00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:54,319 Speaker 1: I think here's the important thing is that we are 733 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,560 Speaker 1: seeing raised awareness around this. We are not seeing political 734 00:38:57,640 --> 00:38:59,560 Speaker 1: movement around this, which is there needs to be so 735 00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,200 Speaker 1: shout out for those who are supporting mental health reform 736 00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,960 Speaker 1: because that needs to happen in this country obviously. UM. 737 00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:12,040 Speaker 1: Also the fact that this is hashtag Minority Mental Awareness 738 00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:15,880 Speaker 1: Month is a great first step. UM. And you know, 739 00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:18,960 Speaker 1: black women in particular are raising more awareness around mental health. 740 00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:23,960 Speaker 1: There's an art exhibition called Unmasked Woman which is exploring 741 00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:26,200 Speaker 1: the current state of black mental health or young women 742 00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:29,320 Speaker 1: in the UK, which is awesome. And there's another exhibit 743 00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:32,320 Speaker 1: in New York City UM that really finds Black women 744 00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 1: using art to raise awareness and have conversations around health, 745 00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:40,880 Speaker 1: black women in health in general, but also mental health. UM. 746 00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:43,359 Speaker 1: There was a really sad situation where forty nine year 747 00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:46,319 Speaker 1: old woman in Brooklyn died in a hospital waiting room 748 00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:48,720 Speaker 1: after she'd been waiting twenty four hours to see a doctor. 749 00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:51,360 Speaker 1: She fell out of her chair and died on the 750 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:55,239 Speaker 1: floor after blood cloths moved from her legs to her lungs. UM. 751 00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:58,800 Speaker 1: So that's pretty terrifying and sad and awful Um. But 752 00:39:58,880 --> 00:40:01,680 Speaker 1: then eight years later, New York based artists sim only 753 00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:05,640 Speaker 1: paid homage that woman Um in her exhibition at the 754 00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,799 Speaker 1: at the New York City's New Museum called The Waiting Room. 755 00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:12,839 Speaker 1: And so this really was a way of using art 756 00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:16,239 Speaker 1: to raise awareness around black women and mental health, Black 757 00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:19,120 Speaker 1: women and health. In addition to being like a visual 758 00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:22,799 Speaker 1: art exhibition, it also part of the exhibit is Um 759 00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:27,120 Speaker 1: offers training and workshops around self care, mental health issues 760 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:30,000 Speaker 1: and all of that for folks so they know what's up. 761 00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 1: And so it just seems like a really cool way 762 00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:36,479 Speaker 1: of turning this tragedy that we were just talking about 763 00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:39,840 Speaker 1: it like black women having their their pain and symptoms ignored, 764 00:40:40,239 --> 00:40:42,440 Speaker 1: and using that to bring awareness so that people know 765 00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,319 Speaker 1: that this is an issue. And I feel like half 766 00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:49,759 Speaker 1: of the problem is making sure that those folks who 767 00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:51,719 Speaker 1: are in a position of power and decision making, whether 768 00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:56,000 Speaker 1: you're a doctor, a psychologist, a psychotherapist, or a police officer, 769 00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,400 Speaker 1: know how to read people's symptoms and not bring and 770 00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:03,320 Speaker 1: sort of combat some of the unconscious bias that everybody 771 00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:06,960 Speaker 1: brings to the table that can quickly make us assume, oh, 772 00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:10,200 Speaker 1: this is a dangerous, crazy person instead of this is 773 00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:14,000 Speaker 1: a person who needs my help and protect those folks 774 00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:19,040 Speaker 1: and and uh and treat them fairly and appropriately. So 775 00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:20,920 Speaker 1: I think, you know, we could talk all day about like, oh, 776 00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:23,320 Speaker 1: black women need to seek out more help. Yes, but 777 00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:26,960 Speaker 1: when they seek out help, professionals need to be like 778 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:30,839 Speaker 1: fair and just in how they treat Absolutely. I don't 779 00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,200 Speaker 1: actually think this is an issue that can be solved 780 00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:35,160 Speaker 1: with you know, if you're a black woman, go see 781 00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:37,160 Speaker 1: a shrink. I think this is an issue that needs 782 00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,680 Speaker 1: systemic cultural change around how we think about, talk about, 783 00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:44,160 Speaker 1: and deal with, um, the mental health of people of color. 784 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,880 Speaker 1: And and that being said, there are there are resources 785 00:41:48,000 --> 00:41:50,640 Speaker 1: to available for those of you who are listening, who 786 00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:52,799 Speaker 1: are thinking that you might be struggling a little bit 787 00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:55,680 Speaker 1: right now. If you've been putting yourself last on the 788 00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:57,880 Speaker 1: to do list every single day, when you know that 789 00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:01,040 Speaker 1: you've been meaning to reach out to a medical professional, 790 00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:03,440 Speaker 1: make today the day you do that, you know, make 791 00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:07,120 Speaker 1: today the day you you make today the day you 792 00:42:07,160 --> 00:42:09,000 Speaker 1: pick up the phone, or you find what kind of 793 00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 1: coverage your insurance provides. I know it can be a 794 00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,319 Speaker 1: pain in the ass, but call them up and get 795 00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:16,759 Speaker 1: the support you need, whether it's you know, seeking out 796 00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:20,880 Speaker 1: a therapist or other kinds of professional help because you 797 00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:24,320 Speaker 1: are worthy of your time. You are worthy of that effort. 798 00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,120 Speaker 1: And just as much as you would obviously do that 799 00:42:27,239 --> 00:42:29,200 Speaker 1: for your best friend or your sister, or your mother 800 00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:31,279 Speaker 1: or your daughter, pick up the phone and make that 801 00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,560 Speaker 1: happen for yourself right now. If this sounds like something 802 00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:37,040 Speaker 1: that you've been in need of. Yeah, and so just 803 00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:39,759 Speaker 1: for if if you're a black woman or a person 804 00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:43,319 Speaker 1: of color out there who wants resources specifically around black 805 00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:45,920 Speaker 1: folks and mental health. UM. A couple of good resources 806 00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:48,920 Speaker 1: we found UM. One is Ourselves as Black. Their admission 807 00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:51,520 Speaker 1: is to empower the Black community by promoting mental health UM. 808 00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:53,959 Speaker 1: And something that I found really helpful about their site 809 00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:57,560 Speaker 1: is that they actually include a state by state provider directory. 810 00:42:57,800 --> 00:42:59,000 Speaker 1: And so if you're like me and you want to 811 00:42:59,040 --> 00:43:03,000 Speaker 1: find a black amist, although shout out to my there, 812 00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:04,640 Speaker 1: she's not black and she's great, and you need to 813 00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:08,200 Speaker 1: make assumptions based on there, they're like, wait, where degrees from? 814 00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:10,480 Speaker 1: It's like, what does she put in her and her 815 00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:13,000 Speaker 1: chicken recipe? You're like, how does she make the hay 816 00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:17,040 Speaker 1: to sell it? Uh? Yeah, you don't want to have 817 00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:20,000 Speaker 1: to get into that. Totally fine. They're there for you. 818 00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,239 Speaker 1: Um so it's the website is ourselves black dot com 819 00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:25,800 Speaker 1: and then you can go online and find their provider directory. 820 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:28,279 Speaker 1: Another good one is Black Mental Health Alliance, which is 821 00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:31,360 Speaker 1: Black Black mental Health dot com. And again they just 822 00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:33,680 Speaker 1: provide a lot of state by state resources of health. 823 00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:36,480 Speaker 1: Folks can get help if you want specified help to 824 00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:41,319 Speaker 1: to go along with you know, your identity. I love it. Well, 825 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:45,080 Speaker 1: thank you for all of what you brought to this episode. 826 00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:48,120 Speaker 1: This is this is This is a topic that I mean, honestly, 827 00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:50,480 Speaker 1: it's a topic that I care a lot about and 828 00:43:51,080 --> 00:43:54,759 Speaker 1: I just want if one person listening feels empowered to 829 00:43:54,880 --> 00:43:57,279 Speaker 1: have this conversation, even if it's what's with a friend, 830 00:43:57,360 --> 00:43:59,400 Speaker 1: even if it's not you know, even if it's just 831 00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:02,320 Speaker 1: saying I'm having a tough time giving your giving like 832 00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:05,160 Speaker 1: this is your perdition, you permission to to do that. 833 00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:08,560 Speaker 1: Have that conversation. Yeah, I love it. Wilson and deal listeners, 834 00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:10,799 Speaker 1: we want to hear from you. We want to hear 835 00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,480 Speaker 1: if you have sought out support in the past, what 836 00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:16,040 Speaker 1: did that feel like for you? How did how doctors 837 00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:19,279 Speaker 1: responded to your requests for some support on mental health. 838 00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:22,040 Speaker 1: Have you been seeing a therapist? Has that made a 839 00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:24,800 Speaker 1: difference in your life as it has dramatically for Repridgeon 840 00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:27,440 Speaker 1: and I make sure you send us a tweet at 841 00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:31,800 Speaker 1: mom Stuff Podcast, and we are always sharing stuff and 842 00:44:32,040 --> 00:44:34,560 Speaker 1: chatting along with you in the comments section on our Instagram. 843 00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:37,120 Speaker 1: Handle that stuff and I've Never told you, or shoot 844 00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:40,280 Speaker 1: us an email at mom Stuff at how stuff works 845 00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:40,759 Speaker 1: dot com.