WEBVTT - CES 2026: Part Ten (Epilogue) 0:00:01.760 --> 0:00:02.880 A Zone Media. 0:00:04.720 --> 0:00:09.160 Welcome to the Better Offline after party epilogue from CS. 0:00:09.600 --> 0:00:13.480 It is like eleven am on the Saturday. We are 0:00:13.560 --> 0:00:17.120 I actually slip pretty well weirdly, but we're all. This 0:00:17.200 --> 0:00:18.560 is the thing we do at the end of the 0:00:18.600 --> 0:00:22.840 show where the remaining people join us. We relax and 0:00:22.880 --> 0:00:27.040 we have to my right, mister Philip Broughton. Hello, this 0:00:27.080 --> 0:00:30.400 is our bartender for the week. Phil, You've been so 0:00:30.560 --> 0:00:33.120 I want to give Phil immense credit for what he's 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:35.440 been doing all week. So the way this works, we 0:00:35.479 --> 0:00:37.920 have the We've got the main suite, which is where 0:00:37.920 --> 0:00:39.560 people come and they come sit down. It's got the 0:00:40.000 --> 0:00:42.480 big daddy bedroom where I sleep, where I just kind 0:00:42.479 --> 0:00:44.800 of like sleep or like talk to myself. 0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:46.560 Roll around the lot, I roll around on the floor. 0:00:47.840 --> 0:00:49.599 But then in the main room we have the bar 0:00:49.720 --> 0:00:52.480 that Phil is set up and during the recordings, Phil 0:00:52.520 --> 0:00:55.000 will come in and ferry and usually a diet coke 0:00:55.120 --> 0:00:58.440 or a little thing of stool just close to mens cow. 0:00:59.040 --> 0:01:01.320 Jesus crist my voice just broke down, I'm of course, 0:01:01.280 --> 0:01:03.760 said Zi Tromp. By the way, the host of Better Offline, 0:01:04.040 --> 0:01:07.200 and Phil has been bringing me drinks all week and 0:01:07.200 --> 0:01:10.400 bringing everyone drinks, just kind of ferrying around the recording. 0:01:10.400 --> 0:01:12.000 You wouldn't know what to hear it, but he's been 0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:13.080 an incredible bartender. 0:01:13.160 --> 0:01:15.520 I finally learned how to not walk into things after 0:01:15.600 --> 0:01:16.040 last year. 0:01:16.160 --> 0:01:19.640 You were pretty good. You give yourself more credit to 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:23.919 our left. Of course is mister Corey, doctor, activist, author, journalist. Hello, 0:01:24.600 --> 0:01:28.040 and of course mister Edward and Grayso Junior, Hello, my friends, 0:01:28.600 --> 0:01:34.039 my man, another year another day. Ye yeah, oh yeah, 0:01:34.040 --> 0:01:36.319 I should really have my book written by next year. No, 0:01:36.480 --> 0:01:40.039 it's we were just talking about games and relaxing after it, 0:01:40.120 --> 0:01:43.000 because you'd think after a week long podcast we'd go 0:01:43.080 --> 0:01:45.920 completely ape shit crazy, by which I mean I think 0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:49.800 all of us were in bed by eleven oh yeah, 0:01:51.240 --> 0:01:53.639 Junior and I got to go out to scheming twelve 0:01:53.640 --> 0:01:53.960 oh one. 0:01:54.000 --> 0:01:56.800 Am is the plan. We're gonna We're gonna go really crazy. 0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:00.280 I've got I feel like I gave me a just 0:02:00.320 --> 0:02:03.840 together people from different walks of life to party with 0:02:03.880 --> 0:02:04.360 you tonight. 0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:08.000 I did see there's Avengers Doomsday. 0:02:07.400 --> 0:02:11.200 Now they're doing three hour, forty five minute one and 0:02:11.240 --> 0:02:13.640 they got they got the X Men in it and 0:02:13.639 --> 0:02:15.440 the real just ty jangling. 0:02:15.600 --> 0:02:17.760 Yeah, it's either gonna be okay or horrible. 0:02:17.840 --> 0:02:20.440 Yeah, it's going to be amazing in the sense that, 0:02:20.520 --> 0:02:24.200 like Patrick Stewart, if Patrick Stewart does just does X 0:02:24.240 --> 0:02:27.400 Men ship, I'm fine. But yeah, this is this is 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:30.520 what happens at the end of CESR. Brains are reduced 0:02:30.560 --> 0:02:31.680 to a fine simmer. 0:02:32.040 --> 0:02:35.240 You're gonna do a courtesy sniff on me for Doomsday, 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:35.600 aren't you. 0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:39.639 I'm going to if I managed to watch that fucking movie, 0:02:39.919 --> 0:02:41.000 I will actually. 0:02:41.520 --> 0:02:44.840 Courtesy sniff at me for the Avatar three Way fire 0:02:44.880 --> 0:02:47.440 and ass right now, I've not seen any of the Avatar. 0:02:48.760 --> 0:02:51.120 Let's got a Pandora if it was. 0:02:51.320 --> 0:02:52.520 Literally watch it. 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:53.399 It's got a Pandora. 0:02:53.480 --> 0:02:55.520 But no, the history of the suite is such that 0:02:56.200 --> 0:02:59.320 Phil has been so when we first do This Week 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:02.959 Phil fifteen, twenty fifteen, we would have it. It was from 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:05.000 a PR firm. We'd all sit around, we'd have the 0:03:05.040 --> 0:03:08.720 journalists without drinks. But died in twenty twenty because of 0:03:08.880 --> 0:03:12.359 actually not because of the pandemic, just because we were 0:03:12.560 --> 0:03:14.680 I think it was like there was something weird that 0:03:14.840 --> 0:03:17.040 cees and then then COVID happened. 0:03:17.120 --> 0:03:20.480 We people were already scared of COVID at. 0:03:20.440 --> 0:03:23.600 C well, people were just sick, like people were ambient. 0:03:23.680 --> 0:03:24.360 I was sick. 0:03:24.560 --> 0:03:27.519 I was getting a lot of questions about is this okay? 0:03:27.600 --> 0:03:30.520 And I went well. 0:03:30.280 --> 0:03:30.440 Well. 0:03:30.600 --> 0:03:33.239 The other part of the worry is parts of China 0:03:33.320 --> 0:03:36.520 had already locked down at that point on January, so 0:03:36.560 --> 0:03:39.600 there were missing parts of the show which were starting 0:03:39.640 --> 0:03:42.640 people to worry about are we okay here? 0:03:42.680 --> 0:03:45.800 I was also just like I got I a knock 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:49.160 on wood. I have done pretty well not getting sick 0:03:49.200 --> 0:03:52.360 at CES, largely because the first few days when the 0:03:52.400 --> 0:03:55.680 show's the most crowded, I'm massed up immediately just to 0:03:55.960 --> 0:03:58.680 just I have my big I put my Bain mask 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:02.120 on and yeah, that that was a weird one. But 0:04:02.160 --> 0:04:03.920 we brought it back last year for the first time. 0:04:03.960 --> 0:04:06.000 It was good. I think this is the best one. Yeah, 0:04:06.160 --> 0:04:06.520 m hmm. 0:04:06.800 --> 0:04:10.680 And we were already scheming for twenty twenty seven. We've 0:04:11.200 --> 0:04:12.880 We've got Vice president JD. 0:04:12.960 --> 0:04:18.000 Vansner. I'm good and good. Do you even say please? 0:04:18.560 --> 0:04:19.400 Do you even say please? 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:20.560 No? 0:04:20.839 --> 0:04:23.800 I it's this year. The lesson I've learned is that 0:04:24.480 --> 0:04:26.520 I could use a slug. I could use help. I 0:04:26.520 --> 0:04:28.400 could use them not to say I didn't have it. 0:04:28.480 --> 0:04:31.320 I could use like an organizing document person. 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:33.560 So I have physics degrees, but I can't keep up 0:04:33.640 --> 0:04:35.120 that is what you need to do for a show. 0:04:35.320 --> 0:04:38.320 Also, neither could I. I was kind of putting it 0:04:38.360 --> 0:04:41.440 together as you went. But Corey, yes, this is your 0:04:41.440 --> 0:04:43.360 first CS in what twenty. 0:04:43.839 --> 0:04:46.160 Twenty, so it's two thousand and three, so twenty three 0:04:46.240 --> 0:04:47.920 years held Discordia. 0:04:48.240 --> 0:04:51.560 I'm really very grateful you came out here because it 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:54.159 was I know that we laughed about the Amazon the 0:04:54.160 --> 0:04:56.800 Amazon thing where you like asked the simplest questions they 0:04:56.800 --> 0:04:57.240 freaked out. 0:04:57.320 --> 0:04:58.520 But it was quite nice. 0:04:58.279 --> 0:05:01.480 Watching you bring me in front of stuff that I 0:05:01.600 --> 0:05:04.560 otherwise wouldn't have got excited about, like the fulln animeter 0:05:04.839 --> 0:05:05.680 microscope and. 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:10.159 Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love I love the the stuff 0:05:10.160 --> 0:05:13.120 that's kind of makery. And and then the other end 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:15.479 of that, which is I think we were talking about 0:05:15.520 --> 0:05:20.599 this yesterday, the hall where you know, Chinese designers have 0:05:20.680 --> 0:05:23.320 taken a standard board that is for a point and 0:05:23.320 --> 0:05:26.039 shoot camera and come up with seventy five form factors 0:05:26.040 --> 0:05:28.360 for it, and like seventy three of them are garbage 0:05:28.360 --> 0:05:30.800 and two of them are just really pretty. They looked 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:33.000 like something you know, you'd have gotten out of a 0:05:33.200 --> 0:05:36.239 mid century designer or something. You know, it's very striking. 0:05:36.440 --> 0:05:38.200 If you saw it in moment, you go, well, yeah, 0:05:38.200 --> 0:05:39.360 I get why. That's a classic. 0:05:39.480 --> 0:05:44.200 Yeah yeah, I and I kind of you stopped at 0:05:44.240 --> 0:05:46.479 one point in a wall of plugs as well. 0:05:46.640 --> 0:05:49.360 Yeah, that was no, it was that warmed my heart. 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:50.599 That's my friend, Matt. 0:05:50.920 --> 0:05:50.960 No. 0:05:51.080 --> 0:05:52.200 It was just like a wall. 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:54.080 Of like data set level plugs with the ones that 0:05:54.080 --> 0:05:56.120 you'd usually put in the back of the computer. 0:05:56.440 --> 0:05:56.680 Yeah. 0:05:56.880 --> 0:06:00.479 Yeah, yeah, I think that that's the the unseen magic 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:03.080 of CS is the well, we can complain about a 0:06:03.080 --> 0:06:05.000 lot of things, there are still little companies doing with 0:06:05.120 --> 0:06:06.120 little shit the side. 0:06:06.320 --> 0:06:07.560 Well, this is like what I was saying about the 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:12.560 British charger adapter, the collapsible charger yah yesterday. Is that 0:06:13.160 --> 0:06:15.719 the stuff that you interact with every day that has 0:06:15.760 --> 0:06:18.479 like moving parts that you have to plug and unplug, 0:06:18.920 --> 0:06:21.919 that you know, like so much of your quality of 0:06:21.960 --> 0:06:27.479 life is in that stuff. And you know, there's a 0:06:27.520 --> 0:06:29.560 really remarkable pair of books. There's a book called The 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:32.520 Design of Everyday Things by Don Norman that's a design classic, 0:06:33.040 --> 0:06:35.200 and it's this very austere book. 0:06:35.560 --> 0:06:37.159 Norman's a designer, and it's very. 0:06:37.160 --> 0:06:42.839 Steer book, a Steer book aimed at designers, saying stop 0:06:43.360 --> 0:06:49.719 sacrificing functionality for aesthetics, and everyone read it and this 0:06:49.839 --> 0:06:53.680 completely was it was It's impossible to overstate how important 0:06:53.720 --> 0:06:55.920 this was in how people think about design. And like, 0:06:55.960 --> 0:06:58.479 twenty five years later you wrote another book called Emotional Design, 0:06:58.480 --> 0:06:59.120 where he's like, I. 0:06:59.120 --> 0:06:59.880 Was totally wrong. 0:07:01.240 --> 0:07:04.040 Nearly everything that you use in a high tech society 0:07:04.080 --> 0:07:07.239 is nearly always broken, and the role of the user 0:07:07.320 --> 0:07:10.600 is actually the troubleshooter. And to be a troubleshooter is 0:07:10.640 --> 0:07:13.800 to be expansive. And to be expansive you can't be 0:07:13.880 --> 0:07:16.520 frustrated and angry. When you're frustrated and angry, you tunnel 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.440 down and you just keep like clicking the button over 0:07:19.480 --> 0:07:21.040 and over again and hoping it starts working. 0:07:21.400 --> 0:07:23.920 Just when you say a troubleshooter, exactly do you mame? 0:07:24.280 --> 0:07:27.120 Well, think about your average day right where you you 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:28.760 you know, plug in your computer and you try to 0:07:28.760 --> 0:07:31.200 do a thing that you've done before, and it just 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:35.000 doesn't work the way it's supposed to work. You know, 0:07:35.120 --> 0:07:38.000 the app doesn't load correctly, the little charge light doesn't 0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:41.400 come on. Yeah, the plug doesn't work. The latch doesn't work, 0:07:41.560 --> 0:07:45.360 something closes, something's broken, the app closes that you get 0:07:45.360 --> 0:07:48.920 a weird cryptic timeout bug, you know, all kinds of thing. 0:07:49.840 --> 0:07:52.239 I'm the last Tumbler user on Earth. But Tumblr changed 0:07:52.280 --> 0:07:55.240 their HTML editor a few years ago, about a year ago, 0:07:55.680 --> 0:07:57.640 and I only just figured out that the reason I 0:07:57.720 --> 0:07:59.800 can't type in it unless I flip it to HTML 0:07:59.840 --> 0:08:03.120 MO to write raw HTML is that the first character 0:08:03.200 --> 0:08:06.320 you enter into it has to have style data. It 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:08.600 has to be like bold or italic, or have a 0:08:08.640 --> 0:08:10.840 font size associated with it. So you have to copy 0:08:10.880 --> 0:08:13.280 it out of an app that has style data, paste 0:08:13.320 --> 0:08:15.960 it in and then and I don't know why, right, 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:19.760 but like now I can reliably type in the Tumblr compositor. 0:08:20.040 --> 0:08:22.880 And that's a troubleshooting thing. Yeah, And we all do 0:08:22.920 --> 0:08:25.280 this all day long with everything we use. And it's 0:08:25.280 --> 0:08:29.400 not just gnarly Linux shit. It's like my LG not 0:08:29.640 --> 0:08:32.360 electric stovetop, my induction stovetop. 0:08:32.080 --> 0:08:35.400 Exactly like the beginning of my book Why Everything Stopped Working, 0:08:35.400 --> 0:08:37.599 coming out next year. It's I think I count to 0:08:37.600 --> 0:08:39.800 one hundred and thirty one within the space of a 0:08:39.880 --> 0:08:42.960 day of just shit that went wrong. Aha, Things like 0:08:43.160 --> 0:08:46.360 I went on Reddit to try and look at someone, 0:08:46.679 --> 0:08:49.240 but when I went to click it, the entire things 0:08:49.240 --> 0:08:52.360 stopped responding to touch sure, or the many, the many 0:08:52.440 --> 0:08:56.320 times that just my email just decides to reset itself 0:08:56.400 --> 0:08:59.160 or Google Calendars lock me out of sorry, not just 0:08:59.160 --> 0:09:01.840 gone like, yeah, I might look in again. And the 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:04.280 funniest one, by the way, I don't know any has 0:09:04.320 --> 0:09:07.520 this happened to you? Have you logged into Google Calendar 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:10.040 as in like and it said log in place, you 0:09:10.040 --> 0:09:12.160 look in and then you go to it and it 0:09:12.200 --> 0:09:13.000 looks you out again. 0:09:13.160 --> 0:09:16.760 Yes, I had contysfunction instantly. Well, you don't use Google. 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:18.680 I know, I use g kel because I have to 0:09:18.679 --> 0:09:21.760 share a calendar with a bunch of heterogeny environments. But 0:09:22.080 --> 0:09:24.680 the point being that everyone's a troubleshooter all the time. Yeah, 0:09:24.720 --> 0:09:26.959 And if you're angry and frustrated and you're just like, 0:09:27.240 --> 0:09:31.080 you know you've got the incipient aneurysm throbbing in your temple. Yeah, 0:09:31.120 --> 0:09:33.120 and you know your fists are clenched and you're you've 0:09:33.160 --> 0:09:36.199 got the you know, black halo contracting around your vision. 0:09:36.559 --> 0:09:38.440 You can't fix stuff, Yeah, you need to be able 0:09:38.440 --> 0:09:40.800 to kind of step back, Like, have you ever been 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:42.400 trying to cook something with a couple of friends. 0:09:42.440 --> 0:09:44.679 Do you cook? Yes? Yes, So you're cooking. 0:09:44.440 --> 0:09:47.600 Something with say a friend, and it's not quite gelling, 0:09:47.840 --> 0:09:50.560 you know, maybe literally it's not gelling. Something's not right, 0:09:50.679 --> 0:09:52.840 and you just like if you're kind of bopping around 0:09:52.840 --> 0:09:54.720 the kitchen there's good music, you go taste this, What 0:09:54.760 --> 0:09:55.240 does it need? 0:09:55.480 --> 0:09:57.880 Oh? Yeah, I know, maybe try a little salt. Yeah, right. 0:09:58.440 --> 0:10:00.880 But like if you're in a pan and you've got 0:10:01.120 --> 0:10:04.200 ten people traveling what have you, You're trying to cook and 0:10:04.200 --> 0:10:07.920 you're like, how do I get this to work? You're frustrated, 0:10:07.920 --> 0:10:10.400 you're angry, it's hard to think creatively. So his point 0:10:10.520 --> 0:10:14.480 is that beautiful things make you happy, and when you're happy, 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:17.360 you're a better troubleshooter. And so for things to work well, 0:10:17.400 --> 0:10:18.520 they have to be beautiful. 0:10:18.960 --> 0:10:22.720 I love that because I lit my eyes immediately as 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:25.320 you said that. Drill to the road Coster pro too. 0:10:25.679 --> 0:10:28.160 And I will definitely say there is a level of 0:10:28.200 --> 0:10:30.839 like you look at it, you go, damn, I'll make 0:10:30.960 --> 0:10:33.160 production me, mister broadcast. 0:10:33.200 --> 0:10:35.280 And it sounds silly, but yeah, it does kind of 0:10:35.320 --> 0:10:35.920 make you. 0:10:35.920 --> 0:10:38.400 You kind of feel that you feel like a professional, 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:40.600 you feel like and so when shit's going well, you 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:42.000 kind of look at it and go, no, But I'm 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:44.559 a professional. I'm doing cool shit, and I know it 0:10:44.720 --> 0:10:49.680 sounds silly, but every quote Calm mcgloughlin and twin Peaks, 0:10:49.880 --> 0:10:52.320 every day give yourself a little present, which sometimes means 0:10:52.360 --> 0:10:54.280 setting things up to make yourself feel a little bit. 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:59.000 I love things that are quietly functional in my daily life, 0:10:59.000 --> 0:11:01.400 so I travel a lot. So I found a cable 0:11:01.440 --> 0:11:04.920 bag that I keep on my cables in and it 0:11:04.960 --> 0:11:07.360 sits flat when you open it instead of tipping over. 0:11:07.880 --> 0:11:10.240 And I get you can just leave it on a 0:11:10.280 --> 0:11:13.520 table and it just sits open. Lovely, Holy moly, is 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:14.200 that very nice? 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:16.480 And obviously like a bag that sits flat is not 0:11:16.760 --> 0:11:19.160 an innovation, right, It's like it's a thing that's existed 0:11:19.200 --> 0:11:21.960 for someone made it into a cable bag that reminds 0:11:22.000 --> 0:11:22.600 me so good. 0:11:22.760 --> 0:11:25.079 That reminds me of another one exactly like that, which 0:11:25.120 --> 0:11:27.040 is a company called Packed Pakt. 0:11:27.840 --> 0:11:28.400 I love them. 0:11:28.640 --> 0:11:31.160 They have a slightly dodgy design in this bag, but 0:11:31.200 --> 0:11:34.120 still it's a one that's slide It's a regular bag 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:37.360 that slips over your your suitcase, which, by the way, 0:11:37.400 --> 0:11:38.880 is the worst part of it because if you pack 0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:40.360 it too much, it's little hard to get on there. 0:11:40.400 --> 0:11:44.199 But the killer instinct thing is it opens from the top, 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:47.120 not the side, so when you're when you're sliding it 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:50.600 under a you're on a Southwest flight like a Burbank 0:11:50.640 --> 0:11:52.960 flight for example, and you need to get in there 0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:55.680 instead of having to like get a backpack and looking 0:11:55.720 --> 0:11:58.439 from the top the whole thing, the whole thing flips 0:11:58.520 --> 0:12:01.480 open so you can delve into it and easily close. Again, 0:12:01.720 --> 0:12:06.720 this sounds very minor, sure, this is the ability to 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:08.800 just take a gander in there and PLoP it back 0:12:08.840 --> 0:12:10.679 in is immense. 0:12:10.559 --> 0:12:12.760 And it kind of explains like this is the this 0:12:12.840 --> 0:12:15.840 is the non pathological version of everyday carry right. You 0:12:15.840 --> 0:12:18.560 find a thing that you love that works perfectly well. 0:12:18.760 --> 0:12:21.960 You you know, like I, I'm the kind of person 0:12:22.000 --> 0:12:23.839 who's on the road like one hundred and hundred and 0:12:23.880 --> 0:12:26.520 fifty days a year, and I have a fully set 0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:30.120 up travel package, you know, with the duplicates of everything 0:12:30.120 --> 0:12:33.080 I need to travel with and whatever, and when you 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:35.959 when you dial it all in perfectly, and the bag 0:12:36.080 --> 0:12:38.760 is great and the accessories are great, and the way 0:12:38.760 --> 0:12:41.600 it's organized is great, and you always you know, you 0:12:41.679 --> 0:12:44.160 get somewhere and something's broken and you can fix it again. 0:12:44.200 --> 0:12:46.520 I love I have a set of titanium chopsticks that 0:12:46.559 --> 0:12:48.840 break down, and a number of times I've been able 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:51.760 to like eat food in a hotel room without having 0:12:51.760 --> 0:12:53.200 to use the shitty plastic fork. 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:55.760 Oh that's bloody good. I should get some I should 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:56.840 get some cutlery that. 0:12:58.200 --> 0:13:02.560 Yeah, this, yeah, this is the thing like it in 0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:06.440 a somewhat like grim ces for not useful things, I 0:13:06.480 --> 0:13:08.400 feel like I would. I would love a trade show 0:13:08.440 --> 0:13:11.400 where it was just like useful shit. It's like a 0:13:11.440 --> 0:13:14.000 bag that's great for this kind of traveler. If you 0:13:14.000 --> 0:13:16.480 want to make the useful Shit convention, invite me. I'd 0:13:16.520 --> 0:13:19.280 love to cover it because I would love it. They 0:13:19.320 --> 0:13:21.319 need to start thinking that way with this show. I'd 0:13:21.360 --> 0:13:24.559 love like battery Isle, I'd love it. I'd love Batteryville. 0:13:24.920 --> 0:13:26.480 That would be a problem with the fire Marshal. 0:13:28.840 --> 0:13:30.880 You would have to yes, yeah, you space map on 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:31.679 a plasma. Note. 0:13:31.760 --> 0:13:33.880 I have not had to call the fire marcial this year. 0:13:33.960 --> 0:13:36.720 You haven't had to call them in years. You didn't 0:13:36.720 --> 0:13:37.520 call them last year. 0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:39.960 I didn't call them last year either, and for the 0:13:39.960 --> 0:13:42.640 previous four years I didn't because we weren't here. 0:13:42.920 --> 0:13:43.959 Yes, yes, every year. 0:13:44.160 --> 0:13:47.520 Yeah, yeah, there was that prolonged period where it's like, hey, Phil, 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:50.959 we found a completely functional laser on that and you're 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:53.000 like which kind and they were like, well. 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:56.240 MRI, the MRI in the middle of the electronics show 0:13:56.360 --> 0:13:57.040 the worst. 0:13:57.240 --> 0:13:59.319 I think, that's how the fuck did they even get 0:13:59.320 --> 0:13:59.640 that in. 0:13:59.679 --> 0:14:01.640 Because I never told anyone and then rolled it onto 0:14:01.679 --> 0:14:02.800 the floor in good time. 0:14:02.880 --> 0:14:05.120 Yeah, the perfect crime. 0:14:05.880 --> 0:14:09.600 You know, unlicensed medical use on random passers bybe and 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:12.040 destroying of adjacent electronics. 0:14:12.040 --> 0:14:15.080 And it's a long tradition, right, the World's Fairy used 0:14:15.120 --> 0:14:17.240 to be able to go and have your feet fluoroscoped, 0:14:17.280 --> 0:14:18.520 and the shoe sales. 0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:20.800 You didn't have to wear the World's Fair. 0:14:20.840 --> 0:14:23.040 We just went to your local market. Quick question, what's 0:14:23.080 --> 0:14:25.800 a florist scoop? It's an X ray, so you used. 0:14:25.920 --> 0:14:28.160 So it used to be very common to sell shoes 0:14:28.200 --> 0:14:29.960 by putting your feet in a pair of shoes and 0:14:29.960 --> 0:14:31.880 then putting your foot in an X ray. 0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:33.520 And then you can say, look how good your kid's 0:14:33.560 --> 0:14:34.480 foot fits in there. 0:14:34.520 --> 0:14:37.320 Not for a brief exposure, right, you leave it running 0:14:37.400 --> 0:14:41.000 like a radiographically guided injection. You would leave it running 0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:44.720 for ten twenty seconds and the shoe fitting sales person 0:14:44.880 --> 0:14:49.080 or longer. Yeah, would be just like continuously bombarded it. 0:14:49.240 --> 0:14:52.640 Right watching x ray TV, Phil as an expert in 0:14:52.680 --> 0:14:56.400 this kind of thing, How bad was that and why so? 0:14:56.440 --> 0:14:59.000 It was a remarkable amount of dose to the foot, 0:14:59.320 --> 0:15:03.000 primarily of children, so you don't really want to drop 0:15:03.040 --> 0:15:07.760 dose on kids. But the worst and most exposed were 0:15:07.800 --> 0:15:10.320 the workers in the shoe store who are continually doing it. 0:15:10.640 --> 0:15:13.520 And also, more to the point, the way they had 0:15:13.520 --> 0:15:16.600 built it is the X ray generator shut through your 0:15:16.680 --> 0:15:21.760 foot to the developing screen towards the lens for your face, 0:15:23.120 --> 0:15:26.360 so that you could see how good your shoes were instantly. 0:15:26.920 --> 0:15:30.880 We still use fluoroscopes. They are medical and they are 0:15:31.080 --> 0:15:34.920 the majority of the dose that doctors and nurses take. 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:38.040 Getting radiographically guided injection. 0:15:38.480 --> 0:15:42.280 They it's so they don't stab you or put the 0:15:42.400 --> 0:15:43.800 drugs where it shouldn't go. 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:47.040 They are good into your face at joint or whatever 0:15:47.400 --> 0:15:49.360 that has a person with a lot of medical things. 0:15:49.400 --> 0:15:51.720 I've had a lot of radiographically guided procedures. 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:55.120 They're useful, but you don't want to use them for 0:15:55.320 --> 0:15:56.440 bullshit like shoes. 0:15:56.560 --> 0:16:00.720 Yeah, Yeah, that's that is some classic human that they 0:16:00.720 --> 0:16:03.600 were just like, we're going to fit shoes on his X. 0:16:03.720 --> 0:16:05.080 Right. If it's hard. 0:16:05.440 --> 0:16:09.400 You can still find them in remote stores in Appalachia, 0:16:09.760 --> 0:16:11.320 but if you want to see one in person, there 0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:14.520 was one on display at the Bradbury Museum that they 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:18.680 have now equipped with digital cameras to simulate the effect 0:16:19.240 --> 0:16:21.920 of what the floral unit for shoes used to be. 0:16:22.080 --> 0:16:28.160 Like Jesus, it's one of those they seriously did this. Yeah, yeah, 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:28.560 they really. 0:16:28.600 --> 0:16:31.440 I'm not surprised anymore when I hit anything like that. 0:16:31.480 --> 0:16:35.160 I'm I'm honestly, I'm shocked. They haven't had a ghost 0:16:35.160 --> 0:16:38.200 gun problem here. I'm shocked. Okay, think about it. 0:16:38.160 --> 0:16:40.960 With the dad came to the floor in a prior year. Yep, 0:16:41.200 --> 0:16:45.720 what really three D printing of firearms with oh. 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:49.520 The three D printing. It also came to his name 0:16:49.560 --> 0:16:54.760 got busted for Yeah, oh god what it's a deep 0:16:54.920 --> 0:16:56.080 dark industry. 0:16:57.240 --> 0:17:00.640 Yeah, you've got you've got the horrifying billionairess who were 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:03.360 just talking about the fourteen words, and then you've got 0:17:03.440 --> 0:17:04.600 the macers. 0:17:04.760 --> 0:17:06.560 Printing them on their three D gun. 0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:07.080 Yeah. 0:17:07.119 --> 0:17:08.679 I mean, this was a guy who heard the phrase 0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:10.640 hard cases make bad law, and he was like, I've 0:17:10.640 --> 0:17:12.679 got a hard case. I'll make it because we were 0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:15.239 trying to figure out like our STL files, you know. 0:17:15.280 --> 0:17:17.639 So there's this principle in law that we established in 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:20.080 nineteen ninety two when we sued the NSA for civilian 0:17:20.119 --> 0:17:22.320 access to crypto, which is that code is a form 0:17:22.359 --> 0:17:24.960 of expressive speech covered by the First Amendment right, and 0:17:25.040 --> 0:17:28.640 so prior restraint on the publication of code is unconstitutional. 0:17:28.720 --> 0:17:30.920 It was narrowed in another case about the magazine twenty 0:17:30.960 --> 0:17:35.119 six hundred, but it's still a bedrock principle code of speech. 0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:37.600 And then it's like, well, our STL file speech, I 0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:41.359 mean their code right, and ideally what you'd want to 0:17:41.359 --> 0:17:44.119 have it about is something that has some nexus with 0:17:45.400 --> 0:17:49.840 privacy or political activity, like protected activity. And this guy 0:17:49.920 --> 0:17:53.080 was like, no, I'm going to just start with guns 0:17:53.680 --> 0:17:56.880 because I think Second Amend went weirdos will have my back, 0:17:56.880 --> 0:18:00.520 which is probably true, but also like the court is 0:18:00.560 --> 0:18:04.240 gonna go okay, but like, if we rule in favor 0:18:04.280 --> 0:18:07.600 of this, you got you're making guns at home? Uh 0:18:07.880 --> 0:18:11.120 that I feel like that's a I the judge feel 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:13.800 a little uncomfortable about it. So he was really he 0:18:13.920 --> 0:18:17.480 was like, let's roll the dice on the entire idea 0:18:17.520 --> 0:18:21.000 that code's speech on my folk theory about guns and 0:18:21.080 --> 0:18:24.840 whether Second Amendment weirdos will be able to sway the court. Ah, 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:27.280 and it sort of all fell apart because he had 0:18:27.280 --> 0:18:28.040 sex with a minor. 0:18:28.520 --> 0:18:32.359 Right, Yeah, that's the There was. 0:18:32.359 --> 0:18:36.119 A previous terrifying trip to Vegas where sit on the 0:18:36.160 --> 0:18:38.760 floors of the floor of Caesars. We were playing craps. 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:41.200 You had wandered off to bed, and I ran into 0:18:41.280 --> 0:18:45.280 a former student from one of my classes who was 0:18:45.320 --> 0:18:47.359 so excited to see it was a hit Phil and 0:18:47.400 --> 0:18:51.400 he was deck to the nines, heavy gold rings, clearly 0:18:51.480 --> 0:18:53.479 doing way better than I've seen it when he'd been 0:18:53.520 --> 0:18:54.280 laid off from. 0:18:54.200 --> 0:18:58.679 NU me and you're doing what is numi? 0:18:58.920 --> 0:19:04.080 Uh the it's now the Tesla plant in Fremont. Formerly 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:07.840 it was a cooperative between GM and Toyota that gave 0:19:07.920 --> 0:19:12.320 birth to Saturn, Right, but it folded and now it's 0:19:12.440 --> 0:19:15.400 Tesla and Elon bought it and that became their first factory. 0:19:15.640 --> 0:19:17.600 But I saw that student who had been working in 0:19:17.720 --> 0:19:21.800 all of the support machine shops that ring knew me 0:19:23.119 --> 0:19:25.960 bad economics, but he was looked like he was doing good. 0:19:26.800 --> 0:19:29.280 Linked out from green Land, and I asked, how you doing. 0:19:29.720 --> 0:19:32.439 He said, you have no idea how great it is 0:19:32.480 --> 0:19:35.359 to be able to just print lowers and uppers left 0:19:35.440 --> 0:19:36.119 right center. 0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:37.880 So he was a gun. 0:19:37.920 --> 0:19:40.240 He reached out into his pocket and said here, I 0:19:40.240 --> 0:19:42.359 got a fresh one, and just handed me a lower 0:19:43.080 --> 0:19:46.640 No thanks, and on the floor of the casino, the state. 0:19:46.600 --> 0:19:50.080 Uninitiated and through my very low gun knowledge, the loa 0:19:50.280 --> 0:19:52.719 is the part that actually makes a gun a gun, right, Like, 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:55.960 that's that's the part that that is the actual thing 0:19:56.000 --> 0:19:58.439 that you require to make a gun shoot boom boom. 0:19:58.480 --> 0:20:02.960 And it absolutely serial numbers. And it was which he handed. 0:20:02.680 --> 0:20:05.520 Me a fo you were required to put a serial 0:20:05.600 --> 0:20:08.800 number on a loa. Yeah, I'm saying this because I 0:20:08.840 --> 0:20:11.119 know sometimes I get the occasional email saying hey, you 0:20:11.200 --> 0:20:14.080 keep posting things out. The one thing, the one rule 0:20:14.160 --> 0:20:17.520 Sophie and Robert gave me was to be like, yeah, 0:20:17.520 --> 0:20:18.160 what's that mean? 0:20:18.440 --> 0:20:20.520 Say what this means? Say what this means? 0:20:20.720 --> 0:20:23.560 Because of wis no one knows anything, including me, But 0:20:23.640 --> 0:20:24.800 that's fucking insane. 0:20:24.880 --> 0:20:35.240 This person was just Vegas baby. 0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:39.840 So as a Canadian, I have a piece of gun 0:20:39.920 --> 0:20:43.040 lore for everyone. And I learned from John McDonald or 0:20:43.080 --> 0:20:46.680 Jim McDonald rather is a science fiction writer ex military 0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:50.240 writes military science fiction very well regarded, and he said, 0:20:50.320 --> 0:20:52.159 when you write science fiction with a gun in it, 0:20:52.280 --> 0:20:54.320 or any fiction with a gun in it, someone out 0:20:54.320 --> 0:20:56.439 there who really cares about guns will find something that 0:20:56.480 --> 0:20:59.080 you said that was wrong and they'll make fun of you. 0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:01.720 If you to avoid this, you just need to know 0:21:01.840 --> 0:21:06.680 one word modified And if you say he opened fire 0:21:06.760 --> 0:21:10.480 with his modified whatever walter p PK, no matter what 0:21:10.560 --> 0:21:13.439 it is, you then make the gun do The person 0:21:13.480 --> 0:21:17.800 out there who's a you know, amosexual musket fucker is 0:21:17.840 --> 0:21:23.199 going to be is going to be so interested in 0:21:23.280 --> 0:21:26.920 figuring out what modification you thought of to make this gun? 0:21:26.960 --> 0:21:30.040 Do this, And the weirder it is, the cleverer they'll 0:21:30.080 --> 0:21:33.480 think you are going like, I figured out the cool 0:21:33.480 --> 0:21:34.239 thing you thought of? 0:21:34.359 --> 0:21:37.919 Am I right? It's kind of like this is a 0:21:38.000 --> 0:21:39.119 very specific reference. 0:21:39.119 --> 0:21:42.280 There's a show called Reapa where Ray Wise from Twin 0:21:42.320 --> 0:21:44.600 Peaks was the devil and it's kind of like how 0:21:45.280 --> 0:21:47.199 they play a game of coin flip I think it is, 0:21:47.480 --> 0:21:51.320 and they use a reflection on the on the tabletop 0:21:51.440 --> 0:21:53.600 to distract the devil because the devil is distracted by 0:21:53.640 --> 0:21:55.800 his own reflection. You need a key jingle for the 0:21:55.880 --> 0:22:01.240 musket fuckers, the homosexual musket fuckers. That's that's a good one, 0:22:01.240 --> 0:22:02.280 but also that's so far. 0:22:02.600 --> 0:22:04.840 I know. I mean with my work. 0:22:04.840 --> 0:22:07.119 When I'm doing my AI stuff, my favorite thing is 0:22:07.160 --> 0:22:10.080 like someone will take one of my shorter pieces so 0:22:10.119 --> 0:22:13.679 they're like twenty nine thousand ones, and we'll say like, 0:22:14.320 --> 0:22:16.840 this guy doesn't know shit, and they will find one 0:22:16.920 --> 0:22:19.679 fucking line and they'll be like, look on that, and 0:22:19.720 --> 0:22:22.879 it will be the weirdest, smallest thing. And I'll always 0:22:22.920 --> 0:22:25.520 be like, so, can you be specific about what this changes? 0:22:25.880 --> 0:22:28.680 They block me. They block me every time. And actually 0:22:28.680 --> 0:22:31.040 there was a so there is a beer. This is 0:22:31.080 --> 0:22:31.840 a random side. 0:22:31.840 --> 0:22:34.240 But this make rough lines, LARPers or sickos. 0:22:34.520 --> 0:22:36.400 Well, no, this is I got sent very fun one. 0:22:36.480 --> 0:22:40.520 So there's this guy on Twitter, real horrible website Buco 0:22:40.640 --> 0:22:43.920 capital bloke who is like a weirdly popular guy, and 0:22:43.960 --> 0:22:46.840 he deleted this tweet, but an egleo i'd reader caught it. 0:22:46.920 --> 0:22:49.399 He said, conflict it because if the AI trade blows up, 0:22:49.440 --> 0:22:51.880 then take Kim's head explodes, which would be very funny. 0:22:52.000 --> 0:22:54.000 But then exitual will be right and that would not 0:22:54.080 --> 0:22:58.199 be funny at all. And I just to be just 0:22:58.240 --> 0:23:01.439 to be clear, this would be the funniest situation because 0:23:01.600 --> 0:23:03.680 that guy deleted it and thinks I didn't get it. 0:23:03.800 --> 0:23:06.440 Sadly, I got the screen show it's going to be 0:23:06.480 --> 0:23:08.159 a great it's going to be a great year for 0:23:08.200 --> 0:23:08.840 stuff like that. 0:23:08.840 --> 0:23:11.280 I don't know about the rest of the world, but yeah, 0:23:11.359 --> 0:23:15.239 this actually Corey back to the ghost gun stuff, what 0:23:15.440 --> 0:23:17.960 happened with all that because I don't remember, yeah, I 0:23:18.000 --> 0:23:21.400 mean it just that, yeah, I mean a specific guy, 0:23:21.480 --> 0:23:22.040 but I mean. 0:23:22.040 --> 0:23:25.280 I don't remember what happened to Defense Distributed. I don't. 0:23:26.320 --> 0:23:28.760 Yeah, I don't think we've had a case that was 0:23:28.800 --> 0:23:33.960 litigated to final judgment about the legality of shape files. 0:23:34.000 --> 0:23:37.119 I mean the legality of the gun itself is pretty established, right, 0:23:37.400 --> 0:23:39.600 but that's good shape files and and look, I just 0:23:39.760 --> 0:23:43.000 I do think that making geometry illegal is dumb. Yes, 0:23:44.040 --> 0:23:46.240 you know, as a like a person who would throw 0:23:46.240 --> 0:23:48.560 all the guns into the sea or whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah, right, 0:23:48.560 --> 0:23:50.760 I still think making geometry illegal is dumb. 0:23:50.760 --> 0:23:54.560 And also yeah, at that point you can't build things, Yeah, 0:23:54.600 --> 0:23:56.160 you can't three D print at all. 0:23:56.480 --> 0:23:59.440 And also impractical, right, because like what are you actually 0:23:59.480 --> 0:24:01.679 going to do because there are so many ways to 0:24:02.000 --> 0:24:06.240 express a file that will be that shape because STLs 0:24:06.320 --> 0:24:10.480 can express logic, right, I think it'd be parametric. So 0:24:10.560 --> 0:24:12.920 you can, like, for example, you can have a shape 0:24:12.960 --> 0:24:16.199 file for a key, like a door key, and there 0:24:16.240 --> 0:24:20.000 are variables you can set in the shape file for 0:24:20.080 --> 0:24:21.720 where you want the teeth and how deep they're going 0:24:21.800 --> 0:24:25.680 to go. So it's it's a it is a programmable 0:24:25.800 --> 0:24:31.560 piece of descriptive code. And so there are like an 0:24:31.600 --> 0:24:35.240 infinitude of ways you could write a program in the 0:24:35.320 --> 0:24:39.680 STL description language that would that would emit the illegal geometry. 0:24:39.880 --> 0:24:43.159 So how do you police the illegal geometry? 0:24:43.280 --> 0:24:44.280 You know? 0:24:44.280 --> 0:24:46.800 It just it just feels like if it's it's one 0:24:46.800 --> 0:24:48.840 thing to make a law that says something is illegal, 0:24:48.920 --> 0:24:50.640 it's another thing to make a law. And even if 0:24:50.640 --> 0:24:52.399 that thing is bad and you want to extinguish it, 0:24:52.440 --> 0:24:54.840 but if you have no way to administer that law, 0:24:55.520 --> 0:24:58.000 you are setting yourself up either for heartbreak or for 0:24:58.080 --> 0:24:59.879 something really bad where you just run around and you 0:25:00.080 --> 0:25:02.640 ques everyone having broken the law, because no one can 0:25:02.640 --> 0:25:04.399 ever tell who's broken the law and who hasn't. Like, 0:25:04.680 --> 0:25:11.680 administerability is the single most important factor in policy design because. 0:25:11.320 --> 0:25:14.080 And just administability means being able to do can you 0:25:14.080 --> 0:25:17.320 administer it? Can you figure out whether someone's violated it? Right? 0:25:17.359 --> 0:25:19.399 So to bring this to the internet, are there a 0:25:19.480 --> 0:25:21.160 lot of people who are very angry and I think 0:25:21.200 --> 0:25:23.720 rightfully so about harassment and hate speech on the platform. 0:25:24.280 --> 0:25:26.520 But a hate speech regime is very hard to police 0:25:26.560 --> 0:25:29.159 because you have a common definition of hate speech. You 0:25:29.200 --> 0:25:32.240 have to evaluate whether a given piece of speech rises 0:25:32.240 --> 0:25:35.000 to the definition. You have to make a technical determination 0:25:35.040 --> 0:25:38.159 about whether the firm took reasonable technical steps to address 0:25:38.200 --> 0:25:41.480 the hate speech. And you know, this is an offense 0:25:41.520 --> 0:25:43.879 that occurs on the platform one hundred times a minute, 0:25:44.160 --> 0:25:46.480 but it's a question that takes five years to adjudicate. 0:25:47.000 --> 0:25:49.200 So this it's just not a good You know, there 0:25:49.200 --> 0:25:53.320 are other fact intensive regimes in law, like like probate law, right, 0:25:53.560 --> 0:25:56.159 but it's fine because the average person dies one or 0:25:56.240 --> 0:25:58.920 fewer times, and so the fact that it takes a 0:25:59.000 --> 0:26:01.160 minute to figure out what to do when they die 0:26:01.520 --> 0:26:02.320 not a big deal. 0:26:03.040 --> 0:26:06.240 But I'm build different. You never say, but I'm going 0:26:06.320 --> 0:26:07.320 to die three times. 0:26:07.400 --> 0:26:09.639 But you know, you could imagine another regime where like 0:26:09.680 --> 0:26:11.960 if you I don't know, if you're a maskeet on user, 0:26:11.960 --> 0:26:15.200 but in no so in mastet on, there's this feature. 0:26:15.240 --> 0:26:18.760 It's a beautiful piece of design where if you want 0:26:18.800 --> 0:26:20.680 to go from one masted on server to another, because 0:26:20.720 --> 0:26:22.440 you can access mast it on from a lot of 0:26:22.480 --> 0:26:25.120 different services run by lots of different people, you click 0:26:25.160 --> 0:26:27.400 a link and it exports all of your data about 0:26:27.400 --> 0:26:29.480 who you were following and who is following you, and 0:26:29.520 --> 0:26:31.240 then you click another link on the news server and 0:26:31.359 --> 0:26:33.520 it imports it and then just all that stuff moves over. 0:26:33.920 --> 0:26:37.400 So we could say to Elon Musk, like, yeah, we're 0:26:37.400 --> 0:26:38.960 still going to have some standards for a hate speech 0:26:39.000 --> 0:26:40.719 and whatever, or we're going to worry about whether your 0:26:41.000 --> 0:26:45.560 your chatbot is shitting out child pornography. But at the 0:26:45.560 --> 0:26:47.119 same time, what we're going to do is create is 0:26:47.200 --> 0:26:50.160 create a mandate that you give people the data they 0:26:50.200 --> 0:26:52.200 need that if they leave Twitter and go to another server, 0:26:52.320 --> 0:26:54.080 they can still talk to the people they left behind 0:26:54.119 --> 0:26:56.520 on Twitter. Because that way, if you don't like the 0:26:56.560 --> 0:26:58.720 way you're being treated on Twitter, you can leave one 0:26:58.840 --> 0:27:01.880 second later. And then this is very easy to administer 0:27:01.960 --> 0:27:05.159 because say you know you're running the server and I 0:27:05.280 --> 0:27:09.239 leave the server and I don't get my file from you. 0:27:09.600 --> 0:27:12.240 I go to the regulator, and the regulator comes to 0:27:12.280 --> 0:27:14.400 you and says, look, I know you told me that 0:27:14.480 --> 0:27:16.600 you gave Corey his file. He says, you didn't give 0:27:16.600 --> 0:27:18.760 it to him. I don't care who's right who's wrong. 0:27:18.840 --> 0:27:20.520 Give it to me and I'll give it to him right, 0:27:20.560 --> 0:27:22.439 And then you just resolve the whole question. So you 0:27:22.480 --> 0:27:24.960 could have like one person administering this policy for a 0:27:24.960 --> 0:27:27.720 billion users, and then they could all just leave the 0:27:27.720 --> 0:27:30.240 platforms where they're being abused without having to pay a 0:27:30.320 --> 0:27:33.359 high switching cost. By exiting a community that means something 0:27:33.359 --> 0:27:37.639 to them, customers or audience members or family members or 0:27:37.760 --> 0:27:39.560 people are the same way disease as them that they're 0:27:39.600 --> 0:27:42.000 in a support group with, they could continue to talk 0:27:42.040 --> 0:27:42.679 with those people. 0:27:42.800 --> 0:27:43.119 Yeah. 0:27:43.160 --> 0:27:49.000 So this is a very administrable remedy. It's much more streamlined. 0:27:49.040 --> 0:27:52.320 It actually solves a great deal of the problem. It's 0:27:52.359 --> 0:27:55.040 not as good as eliminating hate speech. But I don't 0:27:55.080 --> 0:27:56.200 think you can. 0:27:56.400 --> 0:27:58.840 I just I feel like with some of these platforms, 0:27:58.880 --> 0:28:01.639 I'm not talking about Blue Scyt, but the original the 0:28:01.680 --> 0:28:06.400 original Twitter problems of like slurs, for example, and it's 0:28:06.440 --> 0:28:09.440 like you can't unilaterally ban them. Sure, other than the 0:28:09.520 --> 0:28:11.480 fact you could kind of lean that way, I feel 0:28:11.520 --> 0:28:13.119 like you could be like you will have to have 0:28:13.160 --> 0:28:14.840 a little more nuanced than that. You will have to 0:28:15.119 --> 0:28:17.680 but I feel like starting from there and working back, 0:28:17.720 --> 0:28:19.920 I'm sure you'll push back on this is just they 0:28:20.000 --> 0:28:22.119 usually go the other way. It's like, well, let people do, 0:28:22.240 --> 0:28:24.960 everything will work out later. I just feel like it's 0:28:25.000 --> 0:28:27.879 just a half fss attitude. I run the better offline 0:28:27.880 --> 0:28:30.880 reddit with a dread hand. Yeah in the sense, but 0:28:31.040 --> 0:28:34.480 I think the beautiful but the smaller communities you could 0:28:34.480 --> 0:28:34.679 do that. 0:28:34.720 --> 0:28:36.480 With a large social network you can't. 0:28:36.520 --> 0:28:38.880 And you understand the context, right, like the understanding the 0:28:38.880 --> 0:28:41.959 difference between and then I called him this slur and 0:28:42.000 --> 0:28:45.000 made him really sad. Ha ha ha, and uh then 0:28:45.040 --> 0:28:48.000 I got called the slur and I was sad, please 0:28:48.040 --> 0:28:51.160 come and give me comfort. Requires a lot of context knowledge, 0:28:51.560 --> 0:28:55.120 and you know, oftentimes the people using the slurs are 0:28:55.320 --> 0:28:58.520 like that's their hobby and they're really good at, you know, 0:28:58.600 --> 0:29:01.840 working the ref and so it's much more common that 0:29:02.280 --> 0:29:03.960 they're figuring out how to use the slur in a 0:29:03.960 --> 0:29:06.120 way that doesn't get them kicked off and getting the 0:29:06.120 --> 0:29:08.760 people they're using the slur agains kicked off for complaining 0:29:08.800 --> 0:29:09.160 about it. 0:29:09.240 --> 0:29:11.920 Yeah, and the classic one being like reporting people for 0:29:12.120 --> 0:29:15.120 death threats, but it's it's friends being like I'm gonna 0:29:15.160 --> 0:29:18.720 kill you man. That's not the classic. Like, I don't 0:29:18.720 --> 0:29:21.720 know how social networks still fall for this shit, but 0:29:21.800 --> 0:29:24.760 it's like they will be the the people doing lighthearted 0:29:24.760 --> 0:29:26.760 stuff that get banned, and then the people with the 0:29:26.760 --> 0:29:31.440 fourteen words and saying eighty eight gets get to keep around. 0:29:31.760 --> 0:29:33.520 I'm boasted, I really. 0:29:33.880 --> 0:29:37.320 I am excited to see though, how the world reacts 0:29:37.360 --> 0:29:41.200 to Twitter becoming the c SAM generator, because if kiss 0:29:41.200 --> 0:29:44.320 Starmer fucking bans X, that'd be the funniest thing I've 0:29:44.360 --> 0:29:46.400 seen in my fucking He won't do it. 0:29:46.600 --> 0:29:48.000 It doesn't have a spine. 0:29:48.280 --> 0:29:50.840 Have you been seeing this came up on my V 0:29:51.960 --> 0:29:55.520 today that the right and the left in the UK 0:29:55.720 --> 0:29:59.040 having dueling protests about who hates Kiers Starmer more. 0:29:59.240 --> 0:30:01.720 Oh? Yeah, that that is you know. 0:30:01.680 --> 0:30:05.120 What, that's the most That's the most British thing I've 0:30:05.200 --> 0:30:05.880 ever heard. 0:30:06.520 --> 0:30:08.200 We although we don't agree about. 0:30:08.160 --> 0:30:11.560 His humor is called we know we hate Kis Starmer 0:30:11.640 --> 0:30:13.640 more than you, So British. 0:30:13.840 --> 0:30:16.600 That's the most British thing I've ever heard in my life. 0:30:16.640 --> 0:30:20.160 But no, and then someone's gonna have a protest saying 0:30:20.160 --> 0:30:21.920 that we shouldn't have a protest about. 0:30:21.720 --> 0:30:24.760 Anything that we need, like at least four more protests. 0:30:24.760 --> 0:30:27.480 It's the fucking bit for the People's Front of Judea 0:30:27.640 --> 0:30:31.640 from Life of Brian. I love that, I don't love 0:30:31.720 --> 0:30:34.560 kiss Darma. Not gonna lie doesn't seem to it. I 0:30:34.600 --> 0:30:38.600 didn't know that we could get a conservative, labor conservative, 0:30:39.000 --> 0:30:41.080 just the guy who's like, no one's happy. 0:30:41.200 --> 0:30:42.720 He doesn't really have policies. 0:30:42.960 --> 0:30:46.080 Yes, it's again lowest approval ratings of any prime minister 0:30:46.280 --> 0:30:49.800 since measurement began. He has a lower approval rating than 0:30:49.880 --> 0:30:52.880 Boris Johnson during the pandemic, after it was discovered that 0:30:52.920 --> 0:30:55.440 he was having parties while everyone else was lockdown nine. 0:30:55.480 --> 0:30:57.360 He did it for funerals. 0:30:57.440 --> 0:31:00.600 We found the least popular, and Rachel Reeves is even 0:31:00.680 --> 0:31:01.440 less popular than his. 0:31:02.280 --> 0:31:04.680 What about there's a May. 0:31:05.560 --> 0:31:08.680 Less popular than Theresa May, less popular than Liz Trust. 0:31:08.800 --> 0:31:11.840 Yeah, it was just about Oh my fucking goun Now 0:31:11.880 --> 0:31:13.720 I'm gonna say I hate the Lettus thing. 0:31:13.960 --> 0:31:16.280 I hate the Lettus thing so much. It's the most. 0:31:16.000 --> 0:31:20.960 Boring, corny, wanky sh quirk youngus bullshit from the UK. 0:31:21.200 --> 0:31:23.400 We're a country where we used to have when spitting 0:31:23.440 --> 0:31:25.280 image used to have teeth and it wasn't just like 0:31:25.360 --> 0:31:28.920 Boop and Bow doing home Homer Like that's actually that 0:31:28.960 --> 0:31:31.320 really bothered me. I heard of a spitting image thing 0:31:31.360 --> 0:31:33.480 the other day, which is this puppet show in England 0:31:33.960 --> 0:31:36.200 where they do like political stuff, and all it is 0:31:36.240 --> 0:31:38.000 now is just like outright homophobia. 0:31:38.120 --> 0:31:41.800 It's just like what is Trump? Was good? Who have true? 0:31:41.880 --> 0:31:45.000 Did mere fucking laymark pieces as ship? 0:31:45.040 --> 0:31:47.400 We're a long way from the Land of Confusion video. 0:31:47.560 --> 0:31:51.520 Yeah, and god but it's I can't believe kissed is 0:31:51.560 --> 0:31:55.080 that unpopular though? But actually the only thing that labor 0:31:55.200 --> 0:31:58.160 does reliably is produced people that are less popular than 0:31:58.400 --> 0:32:01.880 the conservative because it's just like, well the Conservatives, we'll 0:32:01.920 --> 0:32:05.520 give a live in and they're like, right, historic fumble, 0:32:05.760 --> 0:32:09.240 historic football every fucking when you watch like Gordon Brown 0:32:09.280 --> 0:32:11.360 and you're like, god, I miss him, you know things. 0:32:12.240 --> 0:32:18.360 My boy Corbyn win in Oh yeah. 0:32:16.200 --> 0:32:20.720 He is also screwing up very badly. What's interesting, you know? Yeah, 0:32:21.000 --> 0:32:21.960 all what the fuck is? 0:32:22.400 --> 0:32:22.440 What? 0:32:22.720 --> 0:32:24.960 You know? The Greens are circling. 0:32:25.080 --> 0:32:28.200 So after World War Two there was a there was 0:32:28.200 --> 0:32:30.800 a reboot of British politics. The Liberal Party collapsed, so 0:32:30.800 --> 0:32:33.160 a party that had been around forever, the Whigs, just 0:32:33.200 --> 0:32:38.040 ceased to exist. Labor came into existence. That was happening 0:32:38.080 --> 0:32:40.840 to the Conservatives as of the last election, and the 0:32:40.920 --> 0:32:43.680 Reform Party we're about to basically scoop up all the 0:32:43.720 --> 0:32:46.360 Conservative voters who didn't like the way that the party 0:32:46.400 --> 0:32:48.440 was being run. But it looks like it's also happening 0:32:48.520 --> 0:32:51.719 to Labor. Yeah, and there is there are two potential 0:32:51.720 --> 0:32:53.760 places where the left is going to go. The Greens 0:32:53.760 --> 0:32:55.480 have not been great historically. They've had a lot of 0:32:55.520 --> 0:32:58.800 bad policies. They were into homeopathy for a while whatever. 0:32:59.200 --> 0:33:02.080 But they have got a terrific new leader, Zak Polanski, 0:33:02.120 --> 0:33:08.640 who is basically young, charismatic Corbin interesting, and Corbin himself is. 0:33:08.600 --> 0:33:10.680 Not charismatic Crown and. 0:33:12.320 --> 0:33:16.200 Just very bad at organizing, and Polanski's an organizer. I'm 0:33:16.320 --> 0:33:18.400 very bullish on the British Greens. 0:33:18.800 --> 0:33:22.520 That'd be nice. I mean, we did lose Scott Galloway. Sorry, 0:33:22.560 --> 0:33:25.120 we've got they sent Scott Galloway there. I mean like 0:33:25.280 --> 0:33:27.760 they sent Scott Galloway to England. I thought or maybe 0:33:27.760 --> 0:33:30.200 he moved from England to Florida. I can't remember which 0:33:30.240 --> 0:33:33.240 direction they sent that piece to Florida. Yeah, that's okay. 0:33:33.280 --> 0:33:36.320 By the way, just want to just a completely blunt statement, 0:33:36.600 --> 0:33:41.800 if you move from England to Florida, they should put 0:33:41.840 --> 0:33:42.360 you on the list. 0:33:42.400 --> 0:33:43.080 I know what you are. 0:33:43.320 --> 0:33:46.920 Yeah, as a Floridian, we have a very long tradition 0:33:47.000 --> 0:33:49.600 of accepting the garbage of the world and making it 0:33:49.680 --> 0:33:50.080 our own. 0:33:50.200 --> 0:33:53.520 It's like the Staten Island to Florida thing, except it's 0:33:53.560 --> 0:33:56.960 not just because you're old and hate everyone. It's because 0:33:57.000 --> 0:33:59.920 you're horny and a new way they haven't quite identified. 0:34:00.120 --> 0:34:02.680 Yeah, but you're welcome. Check that out. 0:34:02.800 --> 0:34:06.760 Yeah, the male loneliness crisis is solved in Palm Beach, Florida, 0:34:06.880 --> 0:34:07.280 isn't it. 0:34:07.480 --> 0:34:09.200 No, it's Ebor City, is it. 0:34:09.239 --> 0:34:09.680 What's that? 0:34:10.560 --> 0:34:13.200 Because even Tampa and has a place they need to 0:34:13.239 --> 0:34:14.000 make mistakes. 0:34:14.920 --> 0:34:16.600 I thought that that was just Tampa. 0:34:16.760 --> 0:34:20.040 Now even Tampa has the place to go to go 0:34:20.680 --> 0:34:23.360 make life errors. Yeah, and that is Ebor City. 0:34:23.719 --> 0:34:24.000 God. 0:34:24.680 --> 0:34:27.719 Yeah, I'm And as we look into this year, I 0:34:27.800 --> 0:34:33.000 gotta admit I realized things are quite bad and things 0:34:33.000 --> 0:34:35.920 are going to get a lot more chaotic. But I 0:34:35.920 --> 0:34:38.399 think the chaos is necessary. Coming out of this week. 0:34:39.600 --> 0:34:42.480 All I can feel in my gut is like destruction 0:34:42.680 --> 0:34:46.560 from this show. Not literally, but this feels like a 0:34:46.719 --> 0:34:49.600 reckoning of Like, Corey, you'll have some good historical knowledge 0:34:49.760 --> 0:34:53.280 of like twenty years of hubris in the tech industry, 0:34:53.320 --> 0:34:55.920 of moving away from we made a thing that people 0:34:55.920 --> 0:34:58.799 could use towards Actually, random question, Corey, you ever read 0:34:59.280 --> 0:35:02.560 the case for the Startup by Ben Horwitz? It was 0:35:02.600 --> 0:35:04.880 a PC roade actually before software is eating the world, 0:35:05.840 --> 0:35:10.120 Horrowitz even it was basically saying the worst thing hell 0:35:11.280 --> 0:35:13.319 was having a startup that was not the leader in 0:35:13.320 --> 0:35:13.680 the market. 0:35:13.800 --> 0:35:16.600 I know this. I've not read the paper, but I've 0:35:16.600 --> 0:35:17.360 heard it described. 0:35:17.400 --> 0:35:21.120 It's just it's a it's a guy one of the 0:35:21.160 --> 0:35:25.160 Horowitz of Andres and Horowitz early on twenty ten, I think, 0:35:25.600 --> 0:35:28.160 and I think ever since then, we have been leading 0:35:28.160 --> 0:35:32.160 to this point where you chase out the companies that 0:35:32.320 --> 0:35:34.600 are like, Okay, we'll build something cool and we'll compete 0:35:34.640 --> 0:35:37.680 in a market, and you'll chase them out in favor 0:35:37.719 --> 0:35:40.319 of companies like we will win the market, even if 0:35:40.360 --> 0:35:43.439 it means changing the market materially, even if it means 0:35:43.560 --> 0:35:47.440 using means such as and to monopolistic tendencies, or just 0:35:48.480 --> 0:35:50.799 race to the bottom, or using funding to chase people 0:35:50.840 --> 0:35:54.120 out uber to your point ed, and I think what 0:35:54.160 --> 0:35:56.719 we're seeing this CEES is what happens when you just 0:35:56.840 --> 0:36:00.399 chase growth. Because the thing about all these companies is, yeah, 0:36:00.440 --> 0:36:02.400 you can judge them, and you should judge them, and 0:36:02.440 --> 0:36:04.520 they fucking suck. And I think all of these LLM 0:36:04.600 --> 0:36:07.960 rappers deserve gone the trash along with their founders. But 0:36:08.080 --> 0:36:11.279 at the same time, it's like scorpion the frog. It's 0:36:11.440 --> 0:36:16.040 when you incentivize bringing things to a show that do 0:36:16.120 --> 0:36:19.040 not exist, when you give them awards, when you write 0:36:19.080 --> 0:36:21.560 them up and act like they're real year after year, 0:36:21.680 --> 0:36:25.439 regardless of whether the fucking thing actually exists. Of course 0:36:25.480 --> 0:36:27.439 you're going to get a CES predominantly made of things 0:36:27.440 --> 0:36:30.640 that don't and that things that exist only to get 0:36:30.640 --> 0:36:33.360 invested in from the normally people who came here like 0:36:33.440 --> 0:36:36.440 Chloe Redgcliff to the extremely technical people like Corey. It's 0:36:36.480 --> 0:36:39.080 the same thing of like, this is just a company 0:36:39.080 --> 0:36:40.759 that's here to jingle the keys in front of the 0:36:40.760 --> 0:36:44.240 investors or the not even the buyers, just investors invest 0:36:44.280 --> 0:36:46.680 in me or in front of the press. And I 0:36:46.719 --> 0:36:49.520 think in this next year, we're going to see what 0:36:49.600 --> 0:36:52.160 happens when you do that everywhere, and we're going to 0:36:52.160 --> 0:36:55.319 see the collapse of these AI startups that never had 0:36:55.360 --> 0:36:57.279 a point and we're never built for anything other than 0:36:57.320 --> 0:36:59.840 selling to someone else or dumping onto the public markets. 0:37:00.080 --> 0:37:02.640 Except none of them can chase that, all the smart 0:37:02.640 --> 0:37:06.560 people in favor of people you can't count. 0:37:06.960 --> 0:37:09.200 So I think if you want to identify something over 0:37:09.239 --> 0:37:13.960 twenty years that's monotonically increased, it's the way that it 0:37:14.040 --> 0:37:19.080 comments are able to block new market entry. So you know, historically, 0:37:19.080 --> 0:37:21.359 if you're going to make something new, you would make 0:37:21.400 --> 0:37:23.480 it work with the thing that already existed. You know, 0:37:24.040 --> 0:37:26.840 canonical example, like when we opened up AT and T 0:37:27.120 --> 0:37:30.840 after the breakup in nineteen eighty two, the modem just 0:37:30.920 --> 0:37:33.960 plugged into their shit, right. You didn't need to make 0:37:34.000 --> 0:37:37.120 a phone network, You just needed to make a modem, right, 0:37:37.160 --> 0:37:40.760 and that everything exploded and that happened, right. It's sometimes 0:37:40.760 --> 0:37:44.600 called permissionless innovation. Sometimes it's called disruption. Both of those 0:37:44.680 --> 0:37:47.200 terms have got into bad odor. But you know this 0:37:47.360 --> 0:37:52.839 idea that you don't create a market denovo, you raid 0:37:53.040 --> 0:37:59.120 the high margin lines of sclerotic you know, legacy companies 0:37:59.120 --> 0:38:02.400 that are dominating the market. And you you, you know, 0:38:02.440 --> 0:38:04.239 this is what Jeff Bezos said to the publishers when 0:38:04.239 --> 0:38:07.160 he launched Amazon. Infamously, he went to a boardroom full 0:38:07.160 --> 0:38:10.560 of publishers and he said, your margin is my opportunity, right, 0:38:10.600 --> 0:38:14.239 so you take those high margins, you make them your opportunity. 0:38:14.280 --> 0:38:16.400 And so when AT and T gets broken up and 0:38:16.440 --> 0:38:18.279 they lose the ability to control what you plug into 0:38:18.280 --> 0:38:20.800 the phone jack, we see modems, we see an explosion 0:38:20.800 --> 0:38:22.960 of answering machines PBX. It's just all this stuff that 0:38:23.080 --> 0:38:26.960 is just like built layered on top of the existing stuff. 0:38:27.000 --> 0:38:29.480 But you can't do that anymore, you know. In Facebook launch, 0:38:29.560 --> 0:38:31.640 they had this problem that everyone who could have used 0:38:31.640 --> 0:38:35.000 Facebook had a MySpace account, and so he gave you know, 0:38:35.120 --> 0:38:37.440 Zuck gave everyone who had a MySpace account a bot 0:38:37.840 --> 0:38:40.279 that you fed your MySpace credentials to and it would 0:38:40.320 --> 0:38:42.759 go to MySpace several times a day and impersonate you, 0:38:43.160 --> 0:38:45.160 scrape everything waiting for you and put it into your 0:38:45.160 --> 0:38:47.200 Facebook feed. It then you could reply to it, right, 0:38:47.440 --> 0:38:50.480 so you didn't have to choose between your friends and 0:38:50.840 --> 0:38:54.440 superior service. Facebook's initial pitch was We're like Myspaceboar were 0:38:54.480 --> 0:38:56.160 not run by an evil billionaire and we never spy 0:38:56.239 --> 0:38:56.560 on you. 0:38:56.719 --> 0:38:57.239 Thank god. 0:38:57.480 --> 0:39:00.480 Yeah, uh and thank god. And so you could have this. 0:39:00.600 --> 0:39:02.560 You could eat your cake and have a two. And 0:39:02.680 --> 0:39:05.000 you know, you do this to Facebook, they will nuke 0:39:05.040 --> 0:39:08.120 you till you glow. It's not technically challenging, and it's 0:39:08.120 --> 0:39:09.759 not hard to think of cool things to do, so 0:39:09.880 --> 0:39:12.719 you know. Twenty twenty four, there was a startup from 0:39:12.760 --> 0:39:17.359 two teenagers called og app say almost the same thing. 0:39:17.400 --> 0:39:20.480 You gave it your Insta credentials. It logged in as you, 0:39:20.760 --> 0:39:23.440 It grabbed everything Insta had waiting for you. It discarded 0:39:23.440 --> 0:39:26.000 all the suggestions, all the ads, all the recommendations, all 0:39:26.000 --> 0:39:28.480 the boosted content, and all the clickbait, and showed you 0:39:28.560 --> 0:39:32.960 things from people you followed from in reverse chronological order. 0:39:33.120 --> 0:39:36.040 Right and oh the Facebook I want Yeah, And that 0:39:36.200 --> 0:39:39.080 day it hit the top ten of both app markets 0:39:39.400 --> 0:39:41.560 and that night met us at a takedown notice to 0:39:41.600 --> 0:39:42.920 Apple and Google and they removed it. 0:39:43.560 --> 0:39:48.440 Nice, and that's that's they won't remove x though. Sure no, 0:39:48.520 --> 0:39:49.000 but that's no. 0:39:49.080 --> 0:39:52.319 But there's honor among thieves exactly, yeah, yeah, no, No, 0:39:52.360 --> 0:39:56.040 these guys are not really competitors they all sat behind 0:39:56.080 --> 0:39:56.760 Donald Trump. 0:39:56.600 --> 0:40:00.200 On the dayas But that's the thing though, the egregious 0:40:00.320 --> 0:40:03.279 of that is large language models, hear me out. So 0:40:03.360 --> 0:40:05.200 none of these companies can be run on cash flow 0:40:06.120 --> 0:40:09.399 doing the bit. But you can't compete with open AI. 0:40:09.440 --> 0:40:12.160 You can't compete with Anthropic. You can't because the train 0:40:12.239 --> 0:40:16.880 these models requires that at best, millions and millions and 0:40:16.920 --> 0:40:20.359 millions and millions of dollars and access to infrastructure at 0:40:20.360 --> 0:40:22.120 a scale. What I mean, if you want to compete 0:40:22.120 --> 0:40:25.239 with them, you need hundreds of millions of dollars, and 0:40:25.320 --> 0:40:27.840 you need the talent a big capital mote, well the 0:40:27.840 --> 0:40:30.440 capital mote, but also the talent mode sure, and the 0:40:30.680 --> 0:40:31.399 RSU mode. 0:40:31.400 --> 0:40:34.120 They can just offer stock. So it's impossible to enter there. 0:40:34.160 --> 0:40:37.200 But even as an AI startup, you can't compete with 0:40:37.320 --> 0:40:38.640 the venture capital industry. 0:40:38.680 --> 0:40:41.280 There is no scrappy AI startup. 0:40:41.400 --> 0:40:43.719 Sure you can say, oh, well we've got you know, 0:40:43.800 --> 0:40:46.360 we scrape by with how much hundreds of thousands of dollars. 0:40:46.360 --> 0:40:47.000 I think you're right. 0:40:47.040 --> 0:40:49.640 I think AI has got formal characteristics that make it 0:40:49.680 --> 0:40:53.640 attractive to VC, and one of them is that it 0:40:53.760 --> 0:40:56.040 looks like it tends towards a winner. Take all market, 0:40:56.040 --> 0:40:58.320 which is the thing VC's very obviously loved. This is, 0:40:58.680 --> 0:41:01.080 you know, zero to one, all of those all the 0:41:01.239 --> 0:41:02.160 VC nonsense. 0:41:02.480 --> 0:41:02.759 I think. 0:41:02.800 --> 0:41:05.640 The other one is that the jobs that they think 0:41:05.680 --> 0:41:10.200 AI will take our capital p professional jobs in the 0:41:10.200 --> 0:41:12.919 sense that a professional is someone, yeah, a professional, someone 0:41:12.920 --> 0:41:16.239 who's bound to a code of ethics that not only 0:41:16.280 --> 0:41:18.480 permits them but requires them to tell their boss to 0:41:18.520 --> 0:41:20.359 fuck off if their boss asks them to do something 0:41:20.400 --> 0:41:22.840 that's not moral. And so you have this whole class 0:41:22.840 --> 0:41:27.680 of people teachers, nurses, rad techs, you know whatever, who 0:41:27.719 --> 0:41:30.560 are like obliged to say fuck off to their bosses. 0:41:31.120 --> 0:41:34.600 And no wonder they're having such an easy time selling 0:41:34.640 --> 0:41:39.000 this otherwise vaporous technology because bosses have been furiously fantasizing 0:41:39.320 --> 0:41:41.719 about firing everyone who's allowed to tell them to fuck 0:41:41.760 --> 0:41:45.640 off since the idea of a profession emerged. And so, 0:41:45.719 --> 0:41:47.759 you know, you have all these different formal characteristics. The 0:41:47.800 --> 0:41:50.680 winner take all dynamic, we fire all the people who 0:41:50.719 --> 0:41:52.640 get to tell us to fuck off dynamic, you know, 0:41:52.680 --> 0:41:54.800 like it's very exciting. 0:41:54.560 --> 0:41:57.799 And the fight to maintain the codes of ethics. It 0:41:57.880 --> 0:42:03.680 also often t ching students that this is why I 0:42:03.800 --> 0:42:06.520 demand this of them, and why they should demand it 0:42:07.280 --> 0:42:11.920 for themselves may often be the first time they've ever 0:42:12.320 --> 0:42:15.719 heard for the concept of a code of ethics, which 0:42:15.760 --> 0:42:19.759 is depressing, but also it warms my heart for I 0:42:19.800 --> 0:42:22.239 get to be the person who teaches you to care 0:42:22.320 --> 0:42:23.080 about yourself. 0:42:23.320 --> 0:42:25.960 The thing is, though, I also think there's something quite simple, 0:42:26.000 --> 0:42:28.919 which is all of that's true, and none of these 0:42:28.960 --> 0:42:31.320 people know what their people actually do, like the people 0:42:31.320 --> 0:42:34.080 they want to the people they want to fire, they 0:42:34.120 --> 0:42:36.600 truly do not understand what it is they do. Like 0:42:36.640 --> 0:42:39.400 I'm going to choose like a random public business inside 0:42:40.440 --> 0:42:42.879 all of the layoffs they did there, and it's like, oh, 0:42:42.880 --> 0:42:43.920 well replace them with AI. 0:42:44.360 --> 0:42:48.000 Well we won't. That didn't work. 0:42:48.080 --> 0:42:51.480 But you know we're going to say we're AI first. 0:42:51.840 --> 0:42:56.480 What does that mean? Well, I can't really stop asking 0:42:56.520 --> 0:43:10.560 so many fucking questions you ask everyone around here talking 0:43:10.560 --> 0:43:13.840 about worker replacement and that This is the thing that 0:43:13.880 --> 0:43:16.200 actually drives me the craziest all the time. It's the 0:43:16.200 --> 0:43:19.440 people like, yeah, work a replacement, worker replacement, Have you 0:43:19.560 --> 0:43:21.799 fucking used one of them? They don't work. They just 0:43:21.840 --> 0:43:25.000 don't work. They don't work. Occasion, I'll see someone on 0:43:25.000 --> 0:43:28.280 Twitter be like my my wife who's a special doctor 0:43:28.280 --> 0:43:32.560 at the most genius Hospital New York City. She put 0:43:32.600 --> 0:43:34.400 in a thing and it came up with a differential 0:43:34.440 --> 0:43:36.839 diagnosis that usually and it's just fuck off, you fucking 0:43:36.920 --> 0:43:40.680 lying second shit. Ah, And it's but everyone I've been 0:43:40.680 --> 0:43:44.000 talking to this week outside of this room, of course, 0:43:44.400 --> 0:43:46.640 who talks about worker replacements like yeah, and you know, 0:43:46.800 --> 0:43:52.080 of course right now it's replacing workers where well, I 0:43:52.120 --> 0:43:54.399 think coders are you need to. 0:43:54.320 --> 0:43:57.239 Differentiate between the AI can do your job and an 0:43:57.280 --> 0:44:00.160 a salesman can convince your bastard fiery replace that's that 0:44:00.280 --> 0:44:02.480 can't do your That's the point, that's exactly it. 0:44:02.480 --> 0:44:05.920 It's like they say, it's almost like they find actually 0:44:05.920 --> 0:44:09.080 know that's it. They finally created an economy where you've 0:44:09.120 --> 0:44:12.799 come out like efficacy or like what a thing does 0:44:12.880 --> 0:44:15.319 to just like finally we create a thing for salespeople 0:44:15.320 --> 0:44:16.280 to sell to CEOs. 0:44:16.600 --> 0:44:18.680 No one knows what's going on with. 0:44:18.680 --> 0:44:22.000 The actual product, whether it works, whether it's good or bad, 0:44:22.520 --> 0:44:24.480 just like the vibes baby. 0:44:24.800 --> 0:44:29.160 But then also there are bosses who could give less 0:44:29.160 --> 0:44:31.239 of a fuck about whether it works or not. They 0:44:31.280 --> 0:44:33.680 know that what their headcount reduction for the year house 0:44:33.719 --> 0:44:35.560 to be. Yeah, and they're just gonna be like, well, hey, 0:44:35.800 --> 0:44:39.120 you know what, I yeah, I can do this. You 0:44:39.160 --> 0:44:41.799 know Microsoft, for example, aren't they They're like rumored to 0:44:42.200 --> 0:44:44.520 be doing a massive layoffs again, and then they keep 0:44:44.520 --> 0:44:45.680 doing layoffs every single year. 0:44:45.719 --> 0:44:49.040 Why they do them? They just fucking the well. 0:44:49.080 --> 0:44:52.440 Actually, Microsoft I think has genuine brain madness though, because 0:44:52.480 --> 0:44:54.680 I talk to people that I have a ton of mine. 0:44:54.760 --> 0:44:56.840 If your work for Microsoft always reach out? Is it 0:44:56.840 --> 0:44:57.839 a better off lining dot com? 0:44:57.920 --> 0:44:58.200 Is it fro? 0:44:58.200 --> 0:45:01.080 I'm not seventy six in the signal. It's funny every 0:45:01.120 --> 0:45:03.239 time I hear from them. I never hear from anyone 0:45:03.280 --> 0:45:06.040 who's like, I fucking love this. AI is actually huge. 0:45:06.280 --> 0:45:10.040 It's always people being like my product manager, who does 0:45:10.080 --> 0:45:11.880 not appear to do any work, has told me that 0:45:12.080 --> 0:45:15.759 AI and Copilot must be used, and it's just it's 0:45:15.800 --> 0:45:18.360 people again, senior people too, being like, I don't know 0:45:18.400 --> 0:45:20.799 what the fuck is going on with Jay Perig's other 0:45:20.880 --> 0:45:23.879 at Microsoft. Real Loser Guy went from a company called 0:45:24.160 --> 0:45:26.759 move Works, which was famous for buying thirty thousand dollars 0:45:26.800 --> 0:45:28.640 worth of Lululemon gift cards to give to people to 0:45:28.640 --> 0:45:31.920 buy their software, went to Meta, then went to Microsoft 0:45:31.960 --> 0:45:34.800 to run Ai. It's just like there are these business 0:45:34.880 --> 0:45:38.799 idiots who bounce around and just go AI, baby, we're here, 0:45:38.840 --> 0:45:42.239 it's time, And then the sales team goes out tries 0:45:42.280 --> 0:45:44.279 to sell it, and they're like, yeah, it turns out 0:45:44.320 --> 0:45:47.440 that people want something that works, that actually does the job, 0:45:47.480 --> 0:45:49.960 and you keep saying it's digital labor, but that it 0:45:50.040 --> 0:45:52.960 don't don't do that at all. And it gets back 0:45:53.000 --> 0:45:54.759 to the point I was making. It's like, we're at 0:45:54.760 --> 0:45:57.440 the natural end point when you start removing the product 0:45:57.480 --> 0:45:58.160 from the sale. 0:45:58.400 --> 0:45:58.680 Sure. 0:45:59.239 --> 0:46:00.759 I have a bit of a little Lemon trivia for 0:46:01.480 --> 0:46:03.360 the guy who found a little lemon giant piece of 0:46:03.360 --> 0:46:06.239 shit Iron ran worshiping libertarian edge Lord. 0:46:06.360 --> 0:46:06.560 Yep. 0:46:06.640 --> 0:46:08.960 The reason he called it Lululemon. He thought it would 0:46:08.960 --> 0:46:11.640 be fun to hear Japanese tourists in Vancouver try and 0:46:11.680 --> 0:46:14.200 say lemon, so he picked a word with as many 0:46:14.360 --> 0:46:15.480 l's in it as possible. 0:46:15.840 --> 0:46:18.200 I fucking hate that so much. 0:46:18.200 --> 0:46:21.120 He also had no fact checks policy for quite some time. 0:46:21.160 --> 0:46:23.879 It's like, no, we don't do plus sizes, no fact 0:46:23.960 --> 0:46:27.400 checks policy. What is this platform of the newsletter? 0:46:29.160 --> 0:46:29.759 Checks? 0:46:29.760 --> 0:46:31.240 Not fact checks? Fat checks? 0:46:31.280 --> 0:46:36.120 Oh my bad, Yes, I really misheard that one. It's 0:46:36.200 --> 0:46:39.160 usually usually the other way around. I'll say something in 0:46:39.200 --> 0:46:41.320 an America, Sorry Canadian won't understand. 0:46:41.320 --> 0:46:42.600 Do you like to go to the Pond Store? 0:46:43.040 --> 0:46:46.439 No, we're not talking about Bawn Stars. I would. 0:46:46.600 --> 0:46:49.600 I'm serious if I could get Chum Lee from that 0:46:49.719 --> 0:46:51.000 show on this. 0:46:51.560 --> 0:46:53.200 Prison is he in jail? 0:46:54.080 --> 0:46:56.840 You may have had a teensy bit of a cum problem. 0:46:57.400 --> 0:47:00.719 I mean, I hate to say it, but look at him. 0:47:01.080 --> 0:47:08.280 Then listen to every tour and look, yeah, yeah Jimmy, no, no, no, no, no, 0:47:08.280 --> 0:47:11.759 none of that. Yeah, It's gonna be an interesting year 0:47:11.840 --> 0:47:14.239 because I just think it's a reckoning of every like 0:47:14.320 --> 0:47:17.720 the twenty years of dumb fuck decisions, the Iraq War, 0:47:18.480 --> 0:47:21.879 the DHS, and then the venture capital era. I think 0:47:21.920 --> 0:47:23.719 the venture capital era is coming to an end. I'm 0:47:23.760 --> 0:47:26.279 not saying VC will go away, but I don't think 0:47:26.320 --> 0:47:27.680 people add a six things. 0:47:27.719 --> 0:47:30.360 He just raised their biggest fun and they get their return. 0:47:30.440 --> 0:47:33.240 They're gonna make the tech industry multiples larger. 0:47:33.360 --> 0:47:36.360 The funniest thing I saw though, was someone posting about, Wow, 0:47:36.840 --> 0:47:39.640 look how great Andrew says. Look at these vintages and 0:47:39.680 --> 0:47:43.359 they stop at twenty seventeen. I'm just like, ah, yeah, 0:47:43.440 --> 0:47:45.960 look how good this is and as we was, we 0:47:46.040 --> 0:47:47.400 all know the time stopped. 0:47:47.600 --> 0:47:49.520 Listen. I believe in cone Hen. I think he can 0:47:49.560 --> 0:47:52.440 do anything he sets that point to. It's the thing like, 0:47:53.320 --> 0:47:54.560 even he can be wrong. 0:47:54.800 --> 0:47:57.000 And the whole thing, the whole reason that vcs like 0:47:57.080 --> 0:47:59.759 that have done well is not because of them being geniuses, 0:47:59.880 --> 0:48:03.280 is because when the really obvious things that will obviously sell, 0:48:03.520 --> 0:48:06.640 they just go to them first. They just go and 0:48:06.960 --> 0:48:09.760 or at a later round or Yeah, they will always 0:48:09.800 --> 0:48:11.800 know that they can get in there and that company 0:48:11.880 --> 0:48:12.319 will help. 0:48:12.680 --> 0:48:14.239 That's a big thing of theirs is that you know, 0:48:14.320 --> 0:48:15.880 if you fuck up and you don't get in on 0:48:15.920 --> 0:48:17.799 the winner, then get in on the winner on the 0:48:17.840 --> 0:48:19.359 next round and crowd everyone out. 0:48:19.560 --> 0:48:19.759 Yeah. 0:48:20.000 --> 0:48:23.840 And the thing is, though venture capitals running out of money, 0:48:24.120 --> 0:48:27.080 fifteen billion dollars go to Andresen Horowitz. 0:48:27.160 --> 0:48:28.839 That's going to drain it from all the other people 0:48:28.880 --> 0:48:31.160 that need it. The thing is is why the fuck 0:48:31.160 --> 0:48:33.839 they're going to sell these stops to Aquaman? Like what's 0:48:33.840 --> 0:48:34.279 going on? 0:48:34.400 --> 0:48:36.560 See, I think there's so much money to be made 0:48:36.560 --> 0:48:38.040 out there if we can. 0:48:37.960 --> 0:48:40.480 Unlock the silos. 0:48:40.560 --> 0:48:42.680 Right, So, like just think about some of those fast 0:48:42.719 --> 0:48:45.680 adopted technologies in the history of the world like the VCR, right, 0:48:45.719 --> 0:48:49.080 people love home recording. We don't have VCRs anymore because 0:48:49.120 --> 0:48:51.400 it's illegal to break DRM. So it's still legal to 0:48:51.440 --> 0:48:54.200 record shows. It's just every show that arrives in your house, 0:48:54.200 --> 0:48:56.719 either rise by streaming, cable or satellite. They're all encrypted. 0:48:56.880 --> 0:48:58.560 It's against the law of break the encryption. Because of 0:48:58.560 --> 0:49:01.880 the DMCA, the recording is legal, the breaking the encryption 0:49:01.920 --> 0:49:02.919 to do the recording isn't. 0:49:04.280 --> 0:49:06.319 Who who would not like? 0:49:06.719 --> 0:49:08.960 I think you could sell every person in America a 0:49:09.000 --> 0:49:12.600 PVR for streaming, Well, just like recording. 0:49:12.480 --> 0:49:13.880 Recording the stuff you watch. 0:49:15.000 --> 0:49:17.560 So you know everyone's like, oh, I hate streaming because 0:49:17.600 --> 0:49:20.200 they take away the shows I love. You should just 0:49:20.320 --> 0:49:22.640 record them. You should just record them the way you 0:49:22.640 --> 0:49:24.800 did off your television. It is legal and exactly the 0:49:24.840 --> 0:49:25.920 same way it was legal. 0:49:25.719 --> 0:49:26.719 To record it off your TV. 0:49:26.840 --> 0:49:28.920 Seeing this company called play On I worked with like 0:49:29.000 --> 0:49:31.680 fifteen years ago, so it's okay, likes I just I 0:49:31.719 --> 0:49:34.280 can say that does that they seem to exist? 0:49:34.280 --> 0:49:36.440 Were they using the analog outputs? I got no idea. 0:49:37.400 --> 0:49:40.080 You're now seeing downsampling on the There's a thing called 0:49:40.120 --> 0:49:43.320 selectable output control that we fought really hard in cable 0:49:43.360 --> 0:49:47.840 card and lost on where they downsample the analog outputs 0:49:48.200 --> 0:49:50.359 and so the analog outputs are just garbage. So what 0:49:50.440 --> 0:49:52.320 you record off of it is like a postage stamp. 0:49:53.200 --> 0:49:56.440 And so you know, that was like there were the 0:49:56.640 --> 0:49:58.120 Elgado did this for a long time. There were a 0:49:58.120 --> 0:50:01.480 bunch of companies that had that had analog stuff. There's 0:50:01.520 --> 0:50:04.000 actually a name for what they wanted to do about this. 0:50:04.040 --> 0:50:07.520 They called it plugging the analog hole, which is like 0:50:07.560 --> 0:50:12.000 the people who ride themselves and their ability to communicate 0:50:12.000 --> 0:50:14.280 with the public. Coming up with we will now plug 0:50:14.360 --> 0:50:18.279 everyone's analog holes was just a moment. 0:50:18.040 --> 0:50:19.759 Of just incredible ice. 0:50:20.120 --> 0:50:23.640 Yeah, And I wrote something about it that got translated 0:50:23.640 --> 0:50:28.320 into German. I learned my most useful German UH phrase, 0:50:28.360 --> 0:50:30.440 which is plugging the analog hole in German, which is 0:50:30.520 --> 0:50:34.120 dust analogy lostoffen. And so now if I ever need, 0:50:34.200 --> 0:50:36.880 I can order tap water, I can ask if there 0:50:36.880 --> 0:50:38.960 are any hotel rooms, and I can tell you I 0:50:38.960 --> 0:50:40.520 want to plug your analog hole in German. 0:50:40.560 --> 0:50:44.080 That's which is a very common German conversation. 0:50:44.120 --> 0:50:44.959 Clubs all the time. 0:50:45.840 --> 0:50:47.080 I just think. 0:50:51.360 --> 0:50:57.319 That, oh my god, we're gonna and I just think 0:50:57.480 --> 0:51:00.560 entering this year I'm just I'm excited for because I 0:51:00.600 --> 0:51:01.600 live in cash. 0:51:01.719 --> 0:51:05.240 But it's I will say, every day I keep seeing 0:51:05.320 --> 0:51:10.080 people increasingly more frantic about this market and about VC. 0:51:10.600 --> 0:51:14.040 And also we can't sell any AI companies. No one's 0:51:14.080 --> 0:51:17.880 buying them. They have to do these weird like deals 0:51:17.880 --> 0:51:20.080 where it's like, yeah, we're not hiring you, we're signing 0:51:20.400 --> 0:51:22.319 a license and we're not going to pay all the 0:51:22.360 --> 0:51:24.560 people off. We're going to play the top brass off 0:51:24.560 --> 0:51:26.320 who will then join our company the IP. 0:51:26.800 --> 0:51:28.680 Yeah, we're going to license it. We don't really care, 0:51:28.760 --> 0:51:31.640 We're just getting the talent. Yeah, it's just acquhirer. Yes. 0:51:31.880 --> 0:51:34.040 The thing is aquahias traditionally. 0:51:34.120 --> 0:51:36.120 I don't know, I'm old enough to remember back in 0:51:36.160 --> 0:51:38.960 like twenty thirteen when an aquhi was you losing? 0:51:40.000 --> 0:51:43.200 Yeah, it was like when we sort of I mean, 0:51:43.239 --> 0:51:46.279 there were a lot of startups that were effectively just 0:51:46.400 --> 0:51:49.440 like there were a lot of vcs who said, really 0:51:49.440 --> 0:51:51.400 what I am as a headhunter? And I go out 0:51:51.440 --> 0:51:53.200 and I get a bunch of promising people, maybe people 0:51:53.239 --> 0:51:55.520 who are already working a big tech I give them 0:51:55.520 --> 0:51:58.160 some money to build what amounts to a postgraduate project, 0:51:58.560 --> 0:52:01.319 and then they get high. You're back at either their 0:52:01.320 --> 0:52:03.920 former employer or a new employer, and they get a 0:52:04.000 --> 0:52:06.839 hiring bonus in the form of their stock being bought 0:52:06.840 --> 0:52:08.520 by the company. I get a finder's fee in the 0:52:08.560 --> 0:52:10.440 forum of my stock being bought by the company. Was 0:52:10.520 --> 0:52:12.400 just the shittiest way to run an executive recruiting. 0:52:12.520 --> 0:52:14.400 The thing is, the company gets the patent. 0:52:14.640 --> 0:52:17.240 But the thing is, though, that's not even happening anymore 0:52:17.280 --> 0:52:19.560 because there are no patents. Yeah no, what you can't 0:52:19.600 --> 0:52:23.399 patent prompt engineering. You can't patent the fuck it because 0:52:23.400 --> 0:52:24.120 that's all it is. 0:52:24.320 --> 0:52:25.080 I haven't looked into it. 0:52:25.080 --> 0:52:28.000 So the USPTO is not issuing a ton of it's 0:52:28.040 --> 0:52:29.960 a shitty AI patents. 0:52:30.120 --> 0:52:34.400 Also, they damaged deeply the USPTO with doge. 0:52:34.680 --> 0:52:35.520 Oh that's funny. 0:52:35.560 --> 0:52:39.200 And it's also just I don't think you can patent Yeah, 0:52:39.200 --> 0:52:40.920 I mean maybe you can try, but I haven't seen 0:52:40.960 --> 0:52:42.560 people patenting prompts. 0:52:42.719 --> 0:52:46.440 Well, the USPTO has historically been very bad about granting 0:52:46.640 --> 0:52:50.040 bullshitty patents. You know, we fought and killed a patent 0:52:50.840 --> 0:52:54.400 that effectively would have allowed one company to control all podcasting. 0:52:54.520 --> 0:52:57.439 So like, the reason this podcast is on the air 0:52:58.400 --> 0:53:02.440 is that we we we killed this patent. The trumpetman 0:53:02.560 --> 0:53:04.840 is now moving to make it harder to get patent 0:53:04.880 --> 0:53:08.040 re examination. So if a bullshit patent issues, it's harder 0:53:08.080 --> 0:53:10.000 to challenge the patent. So I think we're going to 0:53:10.040 --> 0:53:12.919 see a lot more garbagee patterns, more patent trolling. There's 0:53:12.960 --> 0:53:15.200 a town in East Texas, yeah, where they have a 0:53:15.239 --> 0:53:19.360 made judge and all of the all the patent cases 0:53:19.400 --> 0:53:22.000 go there to die. There's like seven hundred companies that 0:53:22.040 --> 0:53:24.279 are headquartered in like one dusty building and it's just 0:53:24.320 --> 0:53:27.480 a bunch of mailboxes with you know, brass keys. And 0:53:27.520 --> 0:53:30.840 then all the big companies that get sued by patent 0:53:30.840 --> 0:53:35.319 trolls try to sweeten the jury by putting money into 0:53:35.360 --> 0:53:38.080 public work. So Samsung built them a year round outdoor 0:53:38.120 --> 0:53:42.239 ice skating rink in I think it's West Texas. In 0:53:42.320 --> 0:53:44.280 like it's one hundred and fifteen degrees in the summer 0:53:44.480 --> 0:53:46.399 and they have a year round outdoor ice skating rink 0:53:46.400 --> 0:53:47.279 that Samsung pays for. 0:53:47.400 --> 0:53:50.560 This is like a capitalist libertarian paradise. 0:53:50.680 --> 0:53:53.840 This is just like what if actually, like this is 0:53:53.880 --> 0:53:56.480 the world that the libertarians think that they could build. 0:53:56.520 --> 0:53:57.960 But you'll never beat Samsung. 0:53:58.560 --> 0:54:01.480 Samsung. Samsung will fuck thank you what big time? All right, 0:54:01.719 --> 0:54:03.759 I think we're gonna wrap this up. It has been 0:54:03.840 --> 0:54:08.120 such a wonderful show. It's been fun, great enjoyed having 0:54:08.160 --> 0:54:10.799 all of you here. Thank you Cory for making the 0:54:10.920 --> 0:54:11.520 trip out. 0:54:11.680 --> 0:54:16.120 Thanks Ed, Thanks Phil, thank you, thank you, Thank you Mattasowski, 0:54:16.160 --> 0:54:20.440 our incredible producer, mister Longuso Junior, Thank you for joining 0:54:20.480 --> 0:54:23.360 me once more. Thank you for having me. Mister Philip Broughton, 0:54:23.440 --> 0:54:24.520 Thank you so much. 0:54:24.760 --> 0:54:25.359 I do my thing. 0:54:25.800 --> 0:54:28.120 Thank you for bartending, and thank you for everyone who 0:54:28.200 --> 0:54:30.719 came through these doors. And thank you to the incredible 0:54:30.760 --> 0:54:34.040 listeners have stuck with us on an incredible show. We 0:54:34.120 --> 0:54:37.799 have done incredibly well. It's a great show. We will 0:54:37.840 --> 0:54:41.080 be back next week with mister Stephen Burke of Gamers. 0:54:41.120 --> 0:54:42.719 Next is going to have a post yes show with 0:54:42.800 --> 0:54:45.840 him said not in personal beil, but it will be remote. 0:54:45.920 --> 0:54:47.080 I can speak flawlessly. 0:54:47.400 --> 0:54:51.040 Please subscribe to my newsletter and of course, in dedication 0:54:51.120 --> 0:54:53.600 to Sean Paul Adams, we will have a link to 0:54:53.680 --> 0:54:57.520 the Pediatric Epilepsy Research Consortium. Remember that for the first 0:54:57.560 --> 0:55:01.120 time in the show notes. Thanks thank you all, it's 0:55:01.160 --> 0:55:02.040 beat incredible. 0:55:02.400 --> 0:55:15.000 Later, thank you for listening to Better Offline The editor 0:55:15.040 --> 0:55:17.880 and composer of the Better Offline theme song is Matasowski. 0:55:18.239 --> 0:55:20.080 You can check out more of his music and audio 0:55:20.080 --> 0:55:23.920 projects at Matasowski dot com, M A T T O 0:55:24.160 --> 0:55:28.280 S O W s ki dot com. You can email 0:55:28.320 --> 0:55:30.759 me at easy at Better offline dot com or visit 0:55:30.800 --> 0:55:33.120 Better Offline dot com to find more podcast links and 0:55:33.160 --> 0:55:36.279 of course, my newsletter. I also really recommend you go 0:55:36.320 --> 0:55:38.960 to chat dot Where's youreaed dot at to visit the discord, 0:55:39.200 --> 0:55:41.520 and go to our slash Better Offline to check out 0:55:41.520 --> 0:55:42.080 our reddit. 0:55:42.840 --> 0:55:44.200 Thank you so much for listening. 0:55:45.040 --> 0:55:47.719 Better Offline is a production of cool Zone Media. For 0:55:47.840 --> 0:55:51.040 more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool Zonemedia 0:55:51.080 --> 0:55:53.919 dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 0:55:53.960 --> 0:56:17.720 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.