1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,640 Speaker 1: Hey everyone, it's Sophia. Welcome back to work in progress. 2 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:20,239 Speaker 1: Today's guest is the inimitable Tony Goldwin, a phenomenal screen 3 00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:24,439 Speaker 1: and voice actor, Peabody Award winning director, and an incredible 4 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: philanthropic force for good in the world. Tony has played 5 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: iconic characters in films like The Last Samurai, to the 6 00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 1: Divergent Films, even to the voice of Tarzan and Disney's 7 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:38,440 Speaker 1: Animated Tarzan. But you might know him best from his 8 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:42,519 Speaker 1: shall we say spicy portrayal of President Fitzgerald Grant, the 9 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 1: third on Scandal. Tony is a born and raised Angelino 10 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:49,519 Speaker 1: and a child of Hollywood. The son of an actor 11 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:53,240 Speaker 1: mother and a producer father, he joined the family business 12 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:56,040 Speaker 1: and pursued a career in acting, eventually getting his breakout 13 00:00:56,080 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 1: moment as Carl Bruner, the antagonist of the nineties instant 14 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:02,680 Speaker 1: Class Ghost, one of my personal favorites, by the way. 15 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:05,479 Speaker 1: From there, he went on to perform myriad roles in TV, 16 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:08,960 Speaker 1: film and on the stage, including in one of my 17 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 1: favorite performances I was able to see on Broadway pre 18 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:17,760 Speaker 1: Pandemic Network, also starring Brian Cranston and Tatiana Muslani. Oh 19 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:21,959 Speaker 1: You guys, it was phenomenal. But those aren't the only 20 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 1: ways he's followed in his family's footsteps. Like his parents 21 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 1: and grandparents, Tony is also an avid philanthropist. He sits 22 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:32,600 Speaker 1: on the board of three separate charity organizations, and as 23 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: if that wasn't enough, he's also an ambassador for Stand 24 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 1: Up to Cancer, a nonprofit that is dedicating to funding 25 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: cancer research, treatment, and cure options. Today, we're going to 26 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:46,080 Speaker 1: find out more about his life, his career, his pursuit 27 00:01:46,120 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 1: of his own creativity, his advocacy, and more. Enjoy Well, Hi, Tony, 28 00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:08,919 Speaker 1: I'm so excited to have you today, Sophia. Yeah, thanks 29 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 1: for having me on. Thank you for being willing to 30 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 1: join me from your vacation. It's nice here and where 31 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:17,079 Speaker 1: we are it's quite kind of remote. And I was 32 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:18,680 Speaker 1: just saying, a walk on the beach with my daughter, 33 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,120 Speaker 1: and the seagulls are all hatching and they're all these 34 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 1: baby baby seagulls, you know, walking around. I took some 35 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:29,720 Speaker 1: pictures of them. Yeah, oh that's so neat. So it's interesting, 36 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 1: you know, you were just talking about things that you're 37 00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 1: doing with your daughter, and I always really like to 38 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 1: find out who the folks that sit across from me 39 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:43,120 Speaker 1: were when they were kids, because I think, you know, 40 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 1: I look at you and immediately think of all the 41 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 1: things I've seen you in and and I wonder, when 42 00:02:50,520 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 1: you're so well known as an adult, Um, were you 43 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:56,919 Speaker 1: similar to the Tony the world knows? You know? Were 44 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:02,960 Speaker 1: you this poised um until actual performer as a kid, 45 00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: or were you very different from from the man we 46 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:09,200 Speaker 1: know now as a child? Oh? God, no, Well I 47 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:13,799 Speaker 1: don't see myself. No, but I know i'd asking No, no, 48 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 1: not at all. I was not. I was sort of um, 49 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: it wasn't a thing when I was growing up. But 50 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,800 Speaker 1: I probably would have been diagnosed with a d h 51 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:24,679 Speaker 1: D you know, like a lot of creative people when 52 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 1: I was a kid. So I was unable to concentrate, 53 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 1: bouncing off the walls in school, kind of the class 54 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 1: clown as a little kid. Yeah, really unable, quite undisciplined 55 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: and unable to focus on anything. And honestly, until I 56 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 1: discovered acting, which was like in high school, and before that, 57 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 1: I didn't feel like I was good at anything specifically, 58 00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:53,160 Speaker 1: Like I was okay at sports, but I wasn't like 59 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 1: one of the best kids at sports. I enjoyed aspects 60 00:03:58,000 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: of school, but other things that it didn't grab my interest. 61 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 1: I just couldn't get it done, you know. And and 62 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:07,760 Speaker 1: then I don't know, like the first time I was 63 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 1: in a school play, I was able to like laser 64 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: have laser focus for an extended period of time, which 65 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,320 Speaker 1: was very free in a way, you know, But nobody's 66 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:20,160 Speaker 1: a kid I was. Yeah, I was kind of all 67 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:24,239 Speaker 1: over the place. Yeah, I when I was in fifth grade, 68 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 1: I used to get put what they called out of block. 69 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:29,359 Speaker 1: A lot. Our desks in the classroom were in this 70 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: sort of rectangular block and the teacher taught in the center. 71 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:36,479 Speaker 1: It was cool because the class was small, but for 72 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:38,919 Speaker 1: chatting with my friends and like you know, being like 73 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:40,559 Speaker 1: look at the bird and look what's outside the window, 74 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:43,479 Speaker 1: they were they constantly were taking my desk out of 75 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,160 Speaker 1: block and putting me against the wall to isolate me. 76 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 1: So that might be something a lot of us, uh, 77 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:52,560 Speaker 1: you know, circus performers have in common, I think. So, 78 00:04:52,640 --> 00:04:55,120 Speaker 1: I think it's pretty most people I know like that. 79 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 1: And yeah, I spent a lot of time in the 80 00:04:57,240 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 1: principal's office. What what was it that first inspired you 81 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: to get on stage? What made you sort of take 82 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 1: up that pastime as a kid. Yeah, honestly, it was 83 00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:13,160 Speaker 1: because my big brother did it. I mean, I think 84 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 1: I've always been attracted to performing. I think, like in 85 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:20,279 Speaker 1: I always liked, you know, in elementary school when we 86 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:24,279 Speaker 1: have singing, you know, like a chorus kind of thing. 87 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 1: I always loved doing that. Or and in my middle 88 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:30,360 Speaker 1: school there was a choir that actually was a parson. 89 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:33,400 Speaker 1: I enjoyed it. I don't know, I just never knew 90 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:35,040 Speaker 1: it was a thing. And then my older brother when 91 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:36,920 Speaker 1: I went to high school, we were at the same 92 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 1: school and news two years older than me, and I 93 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 1: kind of vitalized him, and he was kind of he 94 00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:44,880 Speaker 1: was always in the lead and all the school plays. 95 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:51,719 Speaker 1: So I just thought, well, I'll try that. And the 96 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: first yes, in ninth grade, I auditioned for the Fall 97 00:05:55,720 --> 00:06:02,320 Speaker 1: play and was immediately instantly it was like being shot, 98 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 1: you know, with a drug or something. I just ad 99 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:08,279 Speaker 1: I actually didn't get I didn't get the part, but 100 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 1: I remembered sitting reading with the drama teacher reading this 101 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:15,200 Speaker 1: play Inherent the wind film, you know, like someone older 102 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: than me got the part. But I was just like, 103 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 1: oh my god, I know how to do this. And 104 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:21,920 Speaker 1: it was it was it was sort of instantly addicted 105 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:23,919 Speaker 1: to it. Yeah, do you think there's something kind of 106 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:27,000 Speaker 1: inherent in your DNA about it? I mean you you 107 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 1: grew up the child of entertainers, the you know, the 108 00:06:30,080 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 1: grandchild of entertainers, you know, the Metro Goldwyn Meyer. Like, 109 00:06:36,400 --> 00:06:39,279 Speaker 1: do you think there's something was there just like something 110 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:42,599 Speaker 1: in the water or or was it something that you 111 00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 1: just got to witness from the inside and so perhaps 112 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:50,800 Speaker 1: it felt a little more possible. I guess so. Um 113 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:54,160 Speaker 1: my sort of I am from a total show biz family, 114 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:57,960 Speaker 1: but it sort of was divided between theater on my 115 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:02,480 Speaker 1: mother's side and the movies i'm father's side. And uh, 116 00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:05,800 Speaker 1: my grandfather that you referred to was one of the 117 00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:09,160 Speaker 1: pioneers of the movie business, Samuel Goldwyn who I mean 118 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 1: literally started in nineteen twelve or whatever it was, you know, 119 00:07:12,560 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 1: an actual legend, and he really he really wasn't in 120 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:20,640 Speaker 1: a very long career up he retired like right about 121 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 1: the time I was born. Um, and I kind of 122 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 1: because he was sort of so famous, I wanted nothing 123 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: to do with Hollywood. I grew up in l a 124 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 1: and thought, get me out of here. I just want 125 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 1: to do something different than all this show biz stuff, 126 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 1: so I didn't I wasn't drawn to it at all 127 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: as a kid. My mother's father was a very successful 128 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: Broadway playwright in the nineteen twenties and thirties who became 129 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:48,680 Speaker 1: a very successful screenwriter as well. Like a lot of 130 00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 1: of the you know, New York playwrights would come to 131 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:53,960 Speaker 1: Hollywood to make money, you know, during the depression and stuff, 132 00:07:53,960 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 1: and he was quite a successful Broadway play right, So 133 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: he wrote a lot of wonderful movies, and one of 134 00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:03,400 Speaker 1: the was Gone with the Wind, which he actually he 135 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:07,960 Speaker 1: died in a tragic accident in nine at the year 136 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 1: he won he won a posthumous oscar uh that years. 137 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:14,000 Speaker 1: So he was also in the movie business, and ironically 138 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: he worked he was under contract. His name was Sidney 139 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:20,480 Speaker 1: Howard and he was under contract to Sam Goldwyn. So 140 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 1: my both my grandfathers worked together and made some great 141 00:08:23,760 --> 00:08:26,240 Speaker 1: films together, and then their kids ended up marrying each 142 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 1: other years later. But anyway, so, but he was much 143 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: more a creature of the theater, and my mom had 144 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: been an actress as a young woman, so I was 145 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 1: kind of for me, the theater was what inspired and 146 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: drew me, like I started going to the theater with 147 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:41,920 Speaker 1: my parents when I was a little kid. I was 148 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 1: always just fascinated by it and drawn to it, and 149 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:47,200 Speaker 1: it was always very romantic to me. And when I 150 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:49,480 Speaker 1: first came to New York and went to a Broadway play, 151 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 1: I was my mind was blown. But I didn't actually 152 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:54,440 Speaker 1: make the connection like, oh, I don't want to do that, 153 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:58,200 Speaker 1: but I was. It was a magical space for me, 154 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: you know. And and I knew a lot of a 155 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 1: lot of my parents friends were theater actors. They weren't 156 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:05,000 Speaker 1: really I didn't never know movie stars growing up because 157 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:08,079 Speaker 1: they tried to keep us away from all that for 158 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: being a Hollywood kid. I literally never met one movie 159 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:13,720 Speaker 1: star as a kid, or never was on a movie set. 160 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:16,400 Speaker 1: They just kept it very They did not want us 161 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:18,840 Speaker 1: to be you know, that could be a treacherous world 162 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 1: for kids. So um. But in terms of their friends, 163 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:25,200 Speaker 1: a lot of them were actors who were kind of 164 00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 1: New York theater actors or you know, not movie stars, 165 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:33,800 Speaker 1: but so and not always was very romantic to me. Yeah. Yeah, 166 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 1: the sort of images that come up for me when 167 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 1: I listened to you tell the story or those you know, 168 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 1: amazing like nights walking through New York leaving the theater 169 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 1: and a you know, a late dinner in a bistro 170 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:49,120 Speaker 1: and lively conversation and everyone's kind of in the mix, 171 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 1: and it it feels creative and and really alive. And 172 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 1: how fun that you got exposed to all of that 173 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:00,760 Speaker 1: and and not tossed into being a business person when 174 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: you were still a kid. Yeah, I was. I'm grateful 175 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 1: to my parents, you know. So, like my parents were divorced, 176 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:08,199 Speaker 1: so my dad's world was very much he sort of 177 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: followed in his father's footsteps and was, you know, a 178 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 1: successful producer and and that was very much his job. 179 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:16,920 Speaker 1: But he didn't he just did not want his kid. 180 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: He you know, my dad grew up right in the 181 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 1: red hot center of the golden age of Hollywood, and 182 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: I think it almost you know, it was very rough 183 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:28,599 Speaker 1: on him. You know, every night their their house was 184 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 1: a place of business, and every night was at dinner 185 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:35,360 Speaker 1: party with movie stars. And you know that my grandfather's 186 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 1: business was the center of his life and my grandmother 187 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: was a big part of that, and um being a 188 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 1: Hollywood hostess and all. You know, it's just like their 189 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:48,200 Speaker 1: dinner table was a place of business. It was just 190 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:50,400 Speaker 1: the way it was. And so my dad as a kid, 191 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 1: you know, that was he was definitely I mean, they 192 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:58,960 Speaker 1: he loved his parents, but he was definitely in second position, 193 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,440 Speaker 1: and so he never wanted his kids to suffer the 194 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 1: pain that he suffered in that way. So, as far 195 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:07,120 Speaker 1: as I knew, my dad could have done anything, he 196 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 1: could have been a in any kind of business, and 197 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:12,439 Speaker 1: I wouldn't have known any differently. On the other hand, 198 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:15,920 Speaker 1: my mom's household was my mother was a painter and 199 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 1: her my stepfather, whom she married after my parents, was 200 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:22,079 Speaker 1: also a painter. So our house was like a bohemian 201 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:26,400 Speaker 1: like gathering place, you know. It was it was all 202 00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:31,599 Speaker 1: crazy artists and actors and musicians, and yeah, it was 203 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: just a very different vibe. And I love that, you know, 204 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:36,840 Speaker 1: So that I felt those were more of my people 205 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,439 Speaker 1: in a way. So that when I kind of discovered 206 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:42,320 Speaker 1: what you just mentioned in the New York theater community, 207 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 1: which is a real community which now I'm a part of, 208 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:47,440 Speaker 1: you know, that's sort of where I started out as 209 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: an actor, that felt more like when I started discovering that, 210 00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:55,040 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, these are my people, right, if 211 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:57,680 Speaker 1: that makes sense. What what kind of a painter with 212 00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:00,800 Speaker 1: your mom. She did a lot of uh, you know, 213 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:04,240 Speaker 1: abstract did a lot of watercolors, but they tended to 214 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:08,319 Speaker 1: be abstractions of sort of still life. My stepfather was 215 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 1: also a paint that's his painting behind us. You can 216 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 1: sort of see that's one of these that he did, 217 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 1: like back in the seventies. But then I have some 218 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,440 Speaker 1: of my mom's work in this house. But yeah, but 219 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 1: you know, we lost I lost both of them quite 220 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:26,440 Speaker 1: a while ago in the nineties. But but yeah, she's wonderful. 221 00:12:26,679 --> 00:12:29,960 Speaker 1: Her work was beautiful. That's so cool, how special to 222 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:33,240 Speaker 1: to have to be able to have that on the wall. 223 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:37,280 Speaker 1: And I I think about that, you know, when I 224 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:41,240 Speaker 1: look at photos of my grandparents who are no longer 225 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:44,560 Speaker 1: with us, and um, you know, I have old letters 226 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:46,680 Speaker 1: my granddad used to send to me, and I think 227 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:50,160 Speaker 1: about my dad was a photographer for his whole career, 228 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 1: and I think about how someday like it will be 229 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 1: his photographs that I have and I and I'll, you know, 230 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:58,280 Speaker 1: feel like he's still in the house. So I think 231 00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:03,040 Speaker 1: there's something really uh kind of sacred about being able 232 00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:07,959 Speaker 1: to create, to make art that you know, can stay 233 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:12,080 Speaker 1: with people. And when I get really in my feelings 234 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:15,440 Speaker 1: and sort of esoteric about what we do. I think 235 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 1: back to you know, before there was written language, and 236 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:21,640 Speaker 1: the way that humanity passed itself down was to you know, 237 00:13:21,720 --> 00:13:25,000 Speaker 1: perform these stories around fires, probably in caves, and I 238 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 1: can really get out there with it. But I think 239 00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 1: there's something so there's just something so incredible about, um, 240 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:37,760 Speaker 1: the legacy of storytelling and and I think, what a 241 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:42,000 Speaker 1: neat thing that, you know, talk about a movie script, 242 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:43,959 Speaker 1: like you know, your grandfather is working together and then 243 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:47,080 Speaker 1: eventually their kids got married. Like it's it feels so 244 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:49,440 Speaker 1: written in the stars for you that you would be 245 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:52,720 Speaker 1: here and and be doing all of this. Yeah, no, 246 00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:57,400 Speaker 1: it's it's true. And I think, um, I believe totally 247 00:13:57,640 --> 00:14:00,679 Speaker 1: what what you're saying. I mean like that art is 248 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:03,840 Speaker 1: a kind of is a communion. That's why people are 249 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:07,640 Speaker 1: drawn to it. It's not for me, It's not just yes, 250 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:10,080 Speaker 1: it's the stories. But I'm almost like, why are we so? 251 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:14,920 Speaker 1: Why are we so fascinated with storytelling? Why is it so? 252 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 1: What is that satisfy? And it's it's that touch point 253 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:24,560 Speaker 1: of human connection. It's just it's the same feeling as 254 00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:29,680 Speaker 1: a friendship or a lover or any communion with another person. 255 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 1: You know, when you feel that deep connection of where 256 00:14:34,040 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: you touch someone's soul or you really see into a 257 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:41,080 Speaker 1: person's inner life in a profound way, that is a 258 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:44,200 Speaker 1: transcendent experience in life, you know. I mean, that's that's 259 00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 1: where really like we touch God. I think that's where 260 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:49,360 Speaker 1: we that's where we're all trying to to be in 261 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:52,000 Speaker 1: touch with, you know, whether it's in through a church 262 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:56,000 Speaker 1: or whether it's through our relationships or you know, that's 263 00:14:56,040 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 1: that common thing. So I don't I feel like there's 264 00:14:57,880 --> 00:15:03,360 Speaker 1: something really primalence sacred about art and storytelling and whether 265 00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:06,040 Speaker 1: it's a painting which is someone expressing whatever was going 266 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:07,680 Speaker 1: on for them and they put it on a campus, 267 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 1: or a piece of music, or I mean when you 268 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:13,400 Speaker 1: have a friend who's you know, friends who are amazing musicians, 269 00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 1: and when I watch or listen to a friend of 270 00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:20,720 Speaker 1: mine played extraordinary music, I feel like I'm touching their 271 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:23,120 Speaker 1: soul and it's quite different than just hearing a beautiful 272 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:26,080 Speaker 1: piece of music anyway, which is also an amazing experience. 273 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 1: So yeah, I feel every day is so lucky to 274 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: do what we do, you know, to get to try 275 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:36,040 Speaker 1: and reach that to achieve that kind of transcendent experience, 276 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 1: which is hard, it is, but God, when you get it, 277 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:43,280 Speaker 1: when you've really just been in it. And I think 278 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:45,640 Speaker 1: about those experiences where I've been so deep in a 279 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:49,800 Speaker 1: moment with another performer and then it's over, and it's 280 00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:51,920 Speaker 1: almost like waking up out of a dream, like you've 281 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 1: been in some other place. And you're right it it 282 00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 1: does feel like transcendence. And and I think what's interesting 283 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:05,280 Speaker 1: is the thing we're touching is like unadulterated spirit, and 284 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: you're right. I think that can feel holy. I think 285 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:10,760 Speaker 1: that can feel magical. And it's not lost on me, 286 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:13,920 Speaker 1: but it is. I guess it's not been lost on 287 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:16,160 Speaker 1: me before, but it's really occurring to me in this moment. 288 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:18,360 Speaker 1: As I think about the questions I wanted to ask you, 289 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,880 Speaker 1: there's something about what a spiritual act it is to 290 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:25,960 Speaker 1: show up for other people. And I think that's something 291 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:29,360 Speaker 1: that really exists at the root of, you know, activism, 292 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:33,240 Speaker 1: and and often at the root of activism is storytelling. 293 00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:37,440 Speaker 1: Is is telling other people's stories, hearing other people's stories, 294 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 1: having empathy for other people's experiences, and how interesting that 295 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 1: those things kind of come around and meet in the middle, 296 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:49,120 Speaker 1: in the way you grew up in this generational legacy 297 00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:51,960 Speaker 1: of storytelling and and in a family with a long 298 00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:57,720 Speaker 1: history of activism and philanthropic action, and and do those 299 00:16:57,760 --> 00:16:59,960 Speaker 1: things kind of strike you as going hand in hand? 300 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:05,000 Speaker 1: Did they both inspire you as a kid? Um, the 301 00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:09,959 Speaker 1: activism part not so much. I mean, I knew I 302 00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 1: was aware and admired, you know, but I didn't. I 303 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:18,359 Speaker 1: don't think it was mature enough to be inspired by it, 304 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:21,960 Speaker 1: just to be honest, I was more into being a kid, 305 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 1: and I don't think I understood it. I mean, it's 306 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 1: appreciate it as an adult, yeah, I mean as a 307 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:33,840 Speaker 1: teenager book I I frankly, my kids were much more, 308 00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:36,800 Speaker 1: not so much in high school, being like as as 309 00:17:36,800 --> 00:17:40,480 Speaker 1: they approached young adulthood, both of them were like, really 310 00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:44,040 Speaker 1: felt this call to service and how do I, you know, 311 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:47,439 Speaker 1: get back? And it took me a little longer to 312 00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 1: discover that muscle. But I did watch my parents. Both 313 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:56,719 Speaker 1: my parents and my grandparents were very, very engaged on 314 00:17:56,720 --> 00:17:58,679 Speaker 1: that level. So I suppose that that was you know, 315 00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 1: they sort of said an example, and I knew I 316 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 1: was supposed to follow, but it took me. I think Honestly, 317 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:06,560 Speaker 1: he was a maturity issue when I started to realize 318 00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:11,640 Speaker 1: how central that is to a happy life and as 319 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:14,400 Speaker 1: you mentioned, how connected it is to the work that 320 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,400 Speaker 1: we do as storytellers. So what what did you grow 321 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: up witnessing, I guess or being exposed to. What were 322 00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 1: they passionate about. Well, my mom, who as I told her, 323 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 1: was was a painter. She um taught at a community center. 324 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 1: I grew up in l a And she taught art 325 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:36,959 Speaker 1: at a at a community center, and she like formed 326 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:40,680 Speaker 1: these deep relationships with the kids and their families, and 327 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:43,479 Speaker 1: you know, it was in a disadvantaged community, and she 328 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:46,840 Speaker 1: would have like the kids who she taught, I developed 329 00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:50,760 Speaker 1: really close relationship, became like my friends. And they would 330 00:18:50,760 --> 00:18:52,639 Speaker 1: come hang out at her house and she would have 331 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:54,720 Speaker 1: a you know, Christmas time. We would always have a 332 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 1: she'd have a Christmas party for all the kids and 333 00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:58,640 Speaker 1: the film they would come over and she'd make sure 334 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:02,119 Speaker 1: that some of these kids really were in tough circumstances, 335 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 1: and she made sure everybody got Christmas presents and you know, 336 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:07,240 Speaker 1: had a place. But they were sort of just always 337 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 1: around and so hers was on a very grassroots level, 338 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: and it became a big part of her life. And 339 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 1: you know, the thing about my mom that I really 340 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:20,359 Speaker 1: come to admire, she like she got in there. You know, 341 00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 1: it wasn't just writing a check or doing something, you know, 342 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:27,280 Speaker 1: doing volunteering or something. I mean, she did volunteer several 343 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:29,280 Speaker 1: hours a week to teach, but that that was only 344 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:33,199 Speaker 1: her jumping off points. She got in there. And on 345 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:36,280 Speaker 1: my father's side, it felt he also was very, very committed, 346 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:38,800 Speaker 1: but he um something that he was very involved in 347 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:42,800 Speaker 1: was the Most Picture of Television Fund. My grandfather was 348 00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:46,280 Speaker 1: one of the founders of it in one I guess, 349 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:48,320 Speaker 1: so you know, he was sort of drawn in to 350 00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:50,879 Speaker 1: follow the legacy of his parents and that was, you know, 351 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:53,240 Speaker 1: super important to him. Which for people who don't know 352 00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:55,879 Speaker 1: what that is, it's an organization that gives back to 353 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 1: people who work in the entertainment industry because our business 354 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 1: is a very secure one and you know, when you 355 00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:05,119 Speaker 1: fall on hard times, you know, it's a freelance business 356 00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:07,400 Speaker 1: and you can find yourself successful one year and then 357 00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 1: on your ass the next year, and you know, NPTF 358 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:14,560 Speaker 1: will pay your rent or provide social services or addiction 359 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 1: counseling or healthcare. And then there's this incredible, as you know, 360 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 1: I'm sure you know this an amazing retirement home and 361 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:24,359 Speaker 1: so anyway, so that that was a real passion of 362 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:27,920 Speaker 1: my father's as well. Yeah, well, and I wondered too, 363 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:32,440 Speaker 1: because they're the legacy of them both is so inspiring. 364 00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 1: I mean, you, you know, your dad was a producer. 365 00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:36,120 Speaker 1: I'm saying this to you like you don't know, I'm 366 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 1: really saying this to the audience at home. Your dad 367 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,960 Speaker 1: was a producer and also a World War Two veteran. 368 00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 1: And you know, in my like digging up all of 369 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:47,200 Speaker 1: my research, you know, I learned about your grandfather and 370 00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:51,119 Speaker 1: his being born in Poland to a Jewish family and 371 00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 1: your father fought in World War Two, and I I 372 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 1: just think about that kind of family history and really 373 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 1: the the I gues see of service and of of 374 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:04,639 Speaker 1: standing up for people, both of being and oppressed people, 375 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:08,600 Speaker 1: and of of coming to the aid of of one's neighbor. 376 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 1: And then you know, not to really bring it back 377 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:16,040 Speaker 1: around to performances, because I don't know how how you 378 00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:19,240 Speaker 1: feel about it personally, but then you played the president, 379 00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: you know, the the expert on policy, and I wonder 380 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:27,119 Speaker 1: does that real world legacy and also some of what 381 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:29,479 Speaker 1: I imagine you had to dive into to play that character. 382 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:33,920 Speaker 1: Does that make you really have to take a moment 383 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 1: with what we're witnessing in the world now, because you know, 384 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:41,359 Speaker 1: so many artists are asked to use their voices and 385 00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:44,000 Speaker 1: stand up for justice and for what's right, and you 386 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:50,000 Speaker 1: have personal ties to generations old extremism and its risks, 387 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 1: to the harm done to communities, and now we see 388 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:57,840 Speaker 1: versions of that all rising again, and and I imagine 389 00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 1: that that's a pretty interesting intersection for you to sit at, 390 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,080 Speaker 1: you know, as a man, as a performer, as a father, 391 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:06,679 Speaker 1: as as the descendant of these men. You know, what 392 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:10,480 Speaker 1: a what a moment. Yeah, it's interesting for me the 393 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:17,200 Speaker 1: way all my engagement with activism and is it involved 394 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:20,959 Speaker 1: on a more personal level as I've sort of gotten 395 00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:25,200 Speaker 1: into it over the past twenty or whatever years, I've 396 00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:29,480 Speaker 1: not then come to very much appreciate what my forebears did, 397 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 1: and I've I've sort of noticed it almost like I 398 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:34,639 Speaker 1: was unaware of it as a kid, as opposed to 399 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 1: it being like, oh, this is what I'm supposed to do. 400 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 1: I And one of the things that I just want 401 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: to say that I'm so impressed about you is from 402 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:48,760 Speaker 1: the moment you hit you know, got notoriety. You immediately 403 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:51,720 Speaker 1: put that to work in terms of activism. And I've 404 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:55,960 Speaker 1: been so impressed with with what you've been doing the 405 00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:59,840 Speaker 1: past ten or fifteen years. You know, it's like, um, Tony, 406 00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:03,920 Speaker 1: because we do have a platform, and you're always so 407 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,639 Speaker 1: intentional and I'm substantive about your approach to it, which 408 00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,720 Speaker 1: honestly was you know, for me, the way it evolved 409 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 1: in terms of my connection to any kind of services 410 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:17,199 Speaker 1: I found celebrity. When I first started to experience it, 411 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:23,320 Speaker 1: it made me really uncomfortable. It felt fraudulent somehow, And 412 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,119 Speaker 1: I really loved being an actor once I was allowed 413 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:28,080 Speaker 1: to act. You know, at first it's hard to break in, 414 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:32,119 Speaker 1: and then once you do the work itself was great. 415 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:35,280 Speaker 1: But it took me a few years to be in 416 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:39,680 Speaker 1: a you know, to get any notice really like where 417 00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,400 Speaker 1: you were quotqu famous or whatever. And when that started happening, 418 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:46,240 Speaker 1: I've been a sort of struggling actor and all of 419 00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 1: a sudden, everyone the lights were shining on me and 420 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: people were taking my picture and I was like, this 421 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:55,600 Speaker 1: is I didn't know what to do with it, and 422 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:59,360 Speaker 1: so it felt very, very shallow. To me. I understood 423 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:01,399 Speaker 1: that it was we were selling a product, and it 424 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,919 Speaker 1: was transactional and it was necessarily part of the business, 425 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,240 Speaker 1: but it just, I don't know. I thought it would 426 00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 1: be really cool, but it ended up not feeling that way. 427 00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:14,520 Speaker 1: So and then thought, wow. It took me like a 428 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,600 Speaker 1: couple more years to realize, oh no, but there's a 429 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:20,919 Speaker 1: there is power here, So how can I leverage this 430 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:25,000 Speaker 1: attention that I'm getting to actually do something that feels 431 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 1: substantive and meaningful to me and other people. Then I 432 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:32,360 Speaker 1: started searching for ways to give back or to use 433 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:35,199 Speaker 1: the platform that we've been given, and it did. It 434 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:37,080 Speaker 1: took me a while to find it because it's hard 435 00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:39,120 Speaker 1: to find something that's meaningful to you because you get asked, 436 00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 1: like you said, a lot, you know, we get asked 437 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,600 Speaker 1: to show up at things or to speak on behalf 438 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:47,600 Speaker 1: of things. But I quickly realized, you know, just this 439 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:50,159 Speaker 1: is before social media, so but it's the equivalent of 440 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 1: you know, posting on Instagram, you know, for a cause 441 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:56,399 Speaker 1: it felt very shallow, and so I thought, well, how 442 00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:59,480 Speaker 1: do you I really find things that mattered to me 443 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:03,040 Speaker 1: and then really roll up my sleeves and engage in 444 00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:06,560 Speaker 1: a meaningful way. And I started finding, after some splashing 445 00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:10,840 Speaker 1: around very organically, you know, a few organizations and causes 446 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 1: that I started to get really passionate about and in 447 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:17,080 Speaker 1: fact connected with my storytelling. One was Criminal Justice Reform, 448 00:25:17,119 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 1: which came out of a film that I was making 449 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,280 Speaker 1: as a director and producer. You know that I found 450 00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:27,040 Speaker 1: out about this organization called the Innocence Project, which pioneered 451 00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:32,160 Speaker 1: DNA testing for you know, freeing wrongfully convicted people. And 452 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:35,040 Speaker 1: they're now the forefront of criminal justice performance. An incredible 453 00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:37,880 Speaker 1: organization which I'm not deeply involved in, but that came 454 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:40,320 Speaker 1: out of storytelling. And then over the years other things 455 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: have added on in politics too, which I sort of 456 00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:46,880 Speaker 1: came to again organically just you know, I remembered when 457 00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:49,440 Speaker 1: I was you know what, I've been asked to help 458 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,480 Speaker 1: out with political campaigns. I'm like, okay, but I'll only 459 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: do it if I can actually help, if I can 460 00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 1: be of help and do it in a substantive way. 461 00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 1: I don't want to just I'm you know, happy to 462 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: say as a for you, but I'm not going to 463 00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,640 Speaker 1: be like showing up events to have my picture taken. 464 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:05,200 Speaker 1: If you want to use me, really use me, and 465 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,480 Speaker 1: then and then I've forgot I found out how thrilling 466 00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 1: and fascinating that world is, you know as well, so 467 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:16,280 Speaker 1: and then you feel like, well, yeah, at those moments, 468 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:18,400 Speaker 1: because our careers all go up and down, and at 469 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:21,480 Speaker 1: some moments where you know, the lights are all shining 470 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:24,399 Speaker 1: on us, and then the lights divert somebody else for 471 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 1: a while, and then they come back to you. And 472 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: so when you have those moments where you're hot, I 473 00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:31,399 Speaker 1: feel like it. It feels so much better now that 474 00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, having a hot moment. How can we 475 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:36,440 Speaker 1: put this to use? You know what I mean, not 476 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:38,679 Speaker 1: just in a career ist way, not I mean we 477 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:41,359 Speaker 1: all want to get our next job and capitalism, you know, 478 00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:43,359 Speaker 1: capitalism and our success and all that, and from a 479 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:45,520 Speaker 1: business point of view, but it really feels good to 480 00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:48,879 Speaker 1: do it, to do it, to use it, to actually 481 00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 1: have an impact on other people's lives. That is that's 482 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:53,840 Speaker 1: really cool, and I think it's so much in the 483 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,320 Speaker 1: spirit of what we do. You know, you mentioned the 484 00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,439 Speaker 1: Motion Picture and Television Fund that the whole nature of 485 00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:04,000 Speaker 1: being an actor is kind of like being in a circus. 486 00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:07,040 Speaker 1: You travel with this big band of people, you pick up, 487 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:09,199 Speaker 1: you move. You spend more time with them than you 488 00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:12,439 Speaker 1: spend with your own family. And it's it's like it 489 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 1: is kind of like being in a circus, for being 490 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:16,320 Speaker 1: in a summer camp. People think it's glamorous, and you know, 491 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:18,159 Speaker 1: you know, then they come to visit set and they're like, 492 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,760 Speaker 1: oh my god, this is horrible. You know, they they 493 00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 1: they're they're bored and forty minutes. But we love it. 494 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:28,280 Speaker 1: You know. We're like a little gang of weirdos. And 495 00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:33,359 Speaker 1: and I think that whether it's supporting our own um 496 00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:37,080 Speaker 1: really supporting our own you know, our unions are construction guys, 497 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:42,600 Speaker 1: the transpo teams, the camera people. We really love being 498 00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:48,240 Speaker 1: part of a team. And when you can take your celebrity, 499 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 1: which can feel very isolating, as you mentioned, it's like 500 00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:53,720 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, you're alone. You're like, where's all 501 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,560 Speaker 1: my people? They? You know, you you get this kind 502 00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:59,280 Speaker 1: of flashlight put in your face. It feels like an 503 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:03,960 Speaker 1: immense privilege to be able to grab that flashlight and 504 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:08,760 Speaker 1: shine it on someone or something else, a group that 505 00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:14,400 Speaker 1: could use the spotlight more than than we might. And 506 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:16,400 Speaker 1: you know, the I think the irony as I've as 507 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:18,600 Speaker 1: I've gotten older in this business as I realized, most 508 00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:20,800 Speaker 1: of us are very uncomfortable being in the spotlight. We 509 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:22,639 Speaker 1: just want to go to summer camp and make art 510 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,439 Speaker 1: with the other weirdos when the lights around us were like, 511 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:30,359 Speaker 1: this feels really really strange. So how do I do 512 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:35,919 Speaker 1: something better than what this feels like with all this attention? Exactly, 513 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 1: That's exactly how I feel and have always felt that way, 514 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:43,320 Speaker 1: and it feels it's it's I love the thing about 515 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:47,960 Speaker 1: the circus. I always use that that metaphor because that's 516 00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:50,640 Speaker 1: exactly what it feels like. I mean. Even my my 517 00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:54,000 Speaker 1: older daughter who's a writer and a you know, when 518 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:56,920 Speaker 1: she was like I guess she was in college or whatever, 519 00:28:56,960 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 1: and she she knew she wanted to be a writer 520 00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 1: in the in the business and stuff like that. And 521 00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,960 Speaker 1: so she was interning on a TV show and she 522 00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 1: had been during the school years. She had been working 523 00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 1: like in the writer's office, and they said, well, do 524 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 1: you want to go be a PM production of New 525 00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:12,960 Speaker 1: Stone Break? And she was like sure. So she came 526 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 1: to New York where the show shot. I can't you 527 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:18,520 Speaker 1: remember what show it was gone, but but it's shot 528 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,480 Speaker 1: in New York. And her first day of work, they 529 00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 1: said um okay, Uh meet ninth Avenue and fourteenth Street 530 00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:30,240 Speaker 1: at five o'clock, you know, and that's when you'll start 531 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: that your first day of work, and they'll you'll meet 532 00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 1: the sort of person who's the head p A and 533 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:36,239 Speaker 1: all that, and they'll they'll they'll put you work. So 534 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 1: she's a great So she called me up about five 535 00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 1: thirty the next morning and said, Dad, I'm just walking 536 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:47,440 Speaker 1: home from work. We just finished and they I said, 537 00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:50,200 Speaker 1: you started to five five in the afternoon. She said, yeah, 538 00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,120 Speaker 1: I got there and this person just handed me a 539 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 1: walkie talkie and told me to like stop people from 540 00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 1: walking down the block. And then I didn't see anybody 541 00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:02,880 Speaker 1: again for twelve hours. And I stayed all night long 542 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:04,800 Speaker 1: on the street corner while they were shooting like two 543 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,800 Speaker 1: blocks away. And then they came and collected wakie talking 544 00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:10,600 Speaker 1: told me to go home. I was like, and I 545 00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:13,720 Speaker 1: said to her, I said, welcome to the circus. She 546 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:16,040 Speaker 1: was like walking down the streets in Manhattan, you know, 547 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,240 Speaker 1: quoted to six in the morning, having spent stuff in 548 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 1: the street corner, and uh, it's so it's so funny, 549 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:23,800 Speaker 1: but it was like, that's what the circuses. And some 550 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: people go are you crazy that you would do that? 551 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:28,440 Speaker 1: And other people just go, I don't know. I love it. 552 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 1: I love it. It's super weird and I love it. Yeah. 553 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:36,120 Speaker 1: Oh man, that is so funny. And that's it. I mean, 554 00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:40,200 Speaker 1: that's just it. You just show up and you do 555 00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,720 Speaker 1: it all night and you come back again the next day. 556 00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:46,760 Speaker 1: Oh my god. I have to ask because I think, 557 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:50,600 Speaker 1: and this is just from a like a purem I'm 558 00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,920 Speaker 1: removing myself from like Pierre an interviewer, and I'm going 559 00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:56,800 Speaker 1: really into my you know, growing up in the movies 560 00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:59,560 Speaker 1: that made me want to be an actor fan moment 561 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:02,840 Speaker 1: when you say that there was a moment where all 562 00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:04,480 Speaker 1: of a sudden, there was a lot of attention and 563 00:31:04,520 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 1: you were like, what's happening are you? Are you referring 564 00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 1: to after Ghost premiered, M Yeah, yeah, Ghost was the 565 00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:14,800 Speaker 1: first thing. Up until Ghost, I was like, I was working, 566 00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 1: but I guess, I mean, I get when I look back, 567 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 1: I was doing pretty well, but to me it felt 568 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,480 Speaker 1: like I was just constantly unemployed in my first years 569 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,400 Speaker 1: and couldn't I just like I couldn't break in to 570 00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:28,960 Speaker 1: get any traction. And then all of a sudden, but 571 00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:31,960 Speaker 1: by a miracle, I got you know, this big part 572 00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:35,360 Speaker 1: in this movie, and but even then we still had 573 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,440 Speaker 1: no idea if it was anyone was gonna watch it. 574 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:42,760 Speaker 1: And then overnight it became this massive you get if 575 00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:45,040 Speaker 1: you get one of those in a career, you're so lucky, 576 00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:47,800 Speaker 1: and if you got a couple, you're like, you know, 577 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:51,840 Speaker 1: but that was it was like an out of body experience, 578 00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 1: that thing. I was just like, no one knew what 579 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:55,800 Speaker 1: it was, no one had any awareness of it, and 580 00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:58,240 Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, overnight it became this giant 581 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:02,320 Speaker 1: hit so one and then everyone was like, oh, you're 582 00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:05,720 Speaker 1: that dude. You know, it was very exciting because it 583 00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:08,680 Speaker 1: was really a thrilling time. I mean, what and what 584 00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:14,120 Speaker 1: a film? Just what a what a conversation, what a moment? 585 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:16,640 Speaker 1: Was it so surreal for all of you. I mean 586 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:21,880 Speaker 1: you Patrick Whoopy to me, I imagine none of you 587 00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:25,080 Speaker 1: had any idea what was coming, no, you know, and 588 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:28,120 Speaker 1: I was this sort of newbie of the group. I 589 00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:30,520 Speaker 1: don't know, I think when we were making it, look, 590 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:34,480 Speaker 1: I was just so every day I was pinching myself 591 00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:37,400 Speaker 1: because I could not believe that I was getting this 592 00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:41,400 Speaker 1: opportunity to do this. And I was like dude, if 593 00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:44,920 Speaker 1: no one sees this movie, I've had this experience like this. 594 00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:49,120 Speaker 1: It was. It was just amazing, and while we were 595 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:51,719 Speaker 1: doing it, I don't know, I guess one of those 596 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,520 Speaker 1: weird things. When I read this script, I thought, God, 597 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:58,960 Speaker 1: this could be really commercial. Just this this um sort 598 00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,360 Speaker 1: of pushes a lot of buttons. This film was one 599 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:02,800 Speaker 1: of those was one of those movies that, like I said, 600 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,280 Speaker 1: romantic and it's kind of scary and funny and had 601 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 1: all these different genres kind of blended into one. While 602 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,600 Speaker 1: we were making it, we felt like it was good, 603 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:16,200 Speaker 1: like we were. It was inspiring and fun and it 604 00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 1: seemed really like it could be good, but still would 605 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:22,719 Speaker 1: no no idea. You never know, as you know, And 606 00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:28,160 Speaker 1: then when I saw the finished film, I was like, wow, 607 00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 1: if this is not a hit, someone screwed up. You 608 00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:35,160 Speaker 1: know that. Then the marketing people did not do their job, 609 00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:38,600 Speaker 1: like this movie works and if this doesn't, who knows 610 00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:40,160 Speaker 1: it may know and may go see it. But I 611 00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:42,640 Speaker 1: just had a feel like if they do their job right, 612 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 1: this could this could really work. So I did feel 613 00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,400 Speaker 1: like he's just you never know. I mean, I've been 614 00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:50,720 Speaker 1: in so many things where that I thought were great 615 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:54,080 Speaker 1: and no one saw him. You know, I've had my 616 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:56,440 Speaker 1: heartbroken so many times of things that I was just 617 00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,720 Speaker 1: deeply passionate about that just never just never found an audience. 618 00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,160 Speaker 1: So so no, you just never know, you know. And 619 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:06,920 Speaker 1: like I said, I was a new kid. But you know, 620 00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:09,960 Speaker 1: Patrick kid had sort of a string of movies that 621 00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:13,640 Speaker 1: hadn't quite worked at that moment and whoopee too. You know, 622 00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:16,960 Speaker 1: she you know, it was a star for sure, but 623 00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,080 Speaker 1: she did a few that, you know, things that weren't 624 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,440 Speaker 1: didn't do so well at the box office right before that, 625 00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:25,399 Speaker 1: and you know, demy was still that was the thing 626 00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:27,319 Speaker 1: that made her star. So she'd been working for a 627 00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:29,840 Speaker 1: number of years and was kind of you know, everyone 628 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:31,560 Speaker 1: thought she was gonna have a big career, but she 629 00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:36,120 Speaker 1: hadn't kind of busted out yet, so no one, no 630 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 1: one knew I was free. Yeah, it was, It was, 631 00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:44,560 Speaker 1: It was. Yeah. I look back on it with gratitude 632 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 1: and a lot of funness. It was really an exciting 633 00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:49,919 Speaker 1: time and my wife one of the most exciting things. 634 00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 1: My wife, Jane was an incredible production designer, was the 635 00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:57,239 Speaker 1: production designer on that movie. Is that how You do? So? No, no, no, 636 00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:01,680 Speaker 1: we met God, we were already married. We met years before. 637 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,800 Speaker 1: Several years before we met, when I was still in college. 638 00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:07,840 Speaker 1: My very first professional job was working at a theater, 639 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:11,600 Speaker 1: a summer theater festival um called the Williamstown Theater Festival, 640 00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:14,960 Speaker 1: and Jane was like a young designer there. She was 641 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:18,360 Speaker 1: doing scenic design for for theater at that time. And 642 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:21,319 Speaker 1: then she's a few years older than me, so her 643 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 1: career kind of took off from there when I was 644 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:26,040 Speaker 1: still at finishing school and she became like a very 645 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:30,799 Speaker 1: hot production designer. And when I was really struggling as 646 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:32,600 Speaker 1: an actor, she was already doing all these big movies 647 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:36,080 Speaker 1: and everything. And the way I got that part in 648 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:39,760 Speaker 1: Ghost was Jane kept coming home. She was on the movie, 649 00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:41,760 Speaker 1: and she kept coming home going, you know, they haven't 650 00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 1: cast a villain, and there's this great part, and you 651 00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:47,040 Speaker 1: should bug your agents. And I literally couldn't get an audition. 652 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:48,719 Speaker 1: I kept calling my agents and they're like, Nope, they 653 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:51,440 Speaker 1: don't want to see you, and uh, I could and 654 00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:53,640 Speaker 1: only because James was on me every night. I was like, 655 00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:55,839 Speaker 1: y'ren they want to start, they want a big name, 656 00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:57,480 Speaker 1: They're not gonna. I can't even get in the door. 657 00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:01,120 Speaker 1: And I just Finally my agents assist and said, Tony, 658 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:03,160 Speaker 1: you should get seen for this. I'm gonna I'm gonna 659 00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:07,160 Speaker 1: get you an appointment, and he the assistant, got me 660 00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:09,879 Speaker 1: in the room and I end up getting me. Then, 661 00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:13,120 Speaker 1: you know, months later, after they tried to get a star, 662 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:14,759 Speaker 1: they couldn't get a star for the part, and then 663 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:19,000 Speaker 1: they like saw my audition tape and we're like, oh, 664 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 1: that guy's good, let's bring him back. And then they 665 00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,320 Speaker 1: couldn't live like that's Jane's husband. Oh my god. It 666 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:27,600 Speaker 1: was one of those weird kids met things. So that 667 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:30,040 Speaker 1: was the other really awesome thing about that is that 668 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:32,120 Speaker 1: we've got to do it together and she designed these 669 00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,719 Speaker 1: amazing sets and yeah, it was really that was It 670 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,960 Speaker 1: was a magical time. Oh that's so neat and Okay, 671 00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 1: So that that's this major sort of pivotal moment in 672 00:36:42,440 --> 00:36:46,400 Speaker 1: your career. What happens next? How do you decide what 673 00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:49,600 Speaker 1: to do next? When you've had a movie you know, 674 00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:53,120 Speaker 1: explode around the globe like that. I feel like I 675 00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:57,759 Speaker 1: would be paralyzed with decision fear. Yeah, that's pretty right. 676 00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:02,120 Speaker 1: I had no clue. I sort of had no idea 677 00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:07,120 Speaker 1: what to do. The mistake that I made was I 678 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:12,000 Speaker 1: sort of said to my agents, Okay, I've done that. 679 00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:15,000 Speaker 1: Here you go, We've got this. Don't tell me how 680 00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:18,319 Speaker 1: tell me what happens next? Like okay, I felt like 681 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,520 Speaker 1: I did all the work, I delivered this hot thing, 682 00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:25,799 Speaker 1: and now you guys go do your thing. And I 683 00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:30,400 Speaker 1: just assumed they were going to provide me with the plan. 684 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,120 Speaker 1: And that's not how it works, and I didn't. I 685 00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:37,120 Speaker 1: learned that the hard way, you know, so like they 686 00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:39,240 Speaker 1: just it doesn't work that way. You got to take 687 00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:43,319 Speaker 1: responsibility for your own career. One of the good things 688 00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:45,879 Speaker 1: I did was that same year, actually, you know, when 689 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:48,600 Speaker 1: I got the job, I was actually doing a play 690 00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:50,800 Speaker 1: at that same theater where I met Jane years before, 691 00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:55,040 Speaker 1: and this playing it up transferring to New York City, 692 00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:59,200 Speaker 1: and I decided at the moment ghost was kind of 693 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:00,920 Speaker 1: raging in the theater to do this play in New 694 00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:03,360 Speaker 1: York And people are like, why do you are you crazy? 695 00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:04,759 Speaker 1: You're gonna go to a play now You've got this 696 00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:06,200 Speaker 1: hot movie out there, and I was like, yeah, but 697 00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:08,480 Speaker 1: I'm there's no scripts coming by. Well, I don't know. 698 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:10,239 Speaker 1: I'm gonna I love this part and I'm gonna go 699 00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:12,120 Speaker 1: do it and and the planet. It being a real 700 00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:15,120 Speaker 1: success and a great thing artistically for me to do, 701 00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:18,279 Speaker 1: and that was all awesome. What it was called The 702 00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:22,400 Speaker 1: Some of Us. It was this beautiful Australian play about 703 00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:25,160 Speaker 1: a son and a father and the son is gay 704 00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:30,279 Speaker 1: and the father is completely accepting of his homosexuality. And 705 00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:33,680 Speaker 1: this was at a time when that was not the case. 706 00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:37,640 Speaker 1: And in those days Australia was even further behind than 707 00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:39,719 Speaker 1: the States, but it was still, you know, like in 708 00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:43,240 Speaker 1: the eighties and early nineties. Man, it was very different 709 00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:45,879 Speaker 1: than it is nowadays. But it was this beautiful story 710 00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:48,640 Speaker 1: where the father and the son share a house together 711 00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:53,839 Speaker 1: and both men are unable to find love in their 712 00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:57,000 Speaker 1: life because people are so freaked out that they have 713 00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:01,400 Speaker 1: such an accepting relationship. So the men that my character 714 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:05,920 Speaker 1: brings into the home are flip. They can't handle the 715 00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:09,840 Speaker 1: fact that my dad is so embracing my sexuality and 716 00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:13,040 Speaker 1: so okay with it, and they run away. And the 717 00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:17,000 Speaker 1: women that he gets involved with because my mother is dead, 718 00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:20,879 Speaker 1: are completely unable to accept that he has a home 719 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:25,440 Speaker 1: sexual son, and so these two men live. It's this beautiful, 720 00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:28,880 Speaker 1: heartbreaking play about, you know, the love between a son 721 00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:31,720 Speaker 1: and a father, and at a time when the AIDS 722 00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:36,960 Speaker 1: epidemic was raging in New York and only you know, 723 00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:39,719 Speaker 1: a year or two before the President of the United 724 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,440 Speaker 1: States had only uttered the word AIDS, and it was 725 00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:45,520 Speaker 1: just tremendous stigma, and you know, we so we did 726 00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:48,560 Speaker 1: display it. We did it at a theater in Greenwich Village, 727 00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:50,560 Speaker 1: which was, you know, the red hot center of the 728 00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:53,440 Speaker 1: gay community. And it was a it was an important 729 00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:56,320 Speaker 1: piece of work. It really really was in a beautiful 730 00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,000 Speaker 1: play and very meaningful. You know, It's one of the 731 00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:02,439 Speaker 1: roles of my career. I really cherished I hadn't done. 732 00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:04,520 Speaker 1: But anyway, but back to your your question. But then 733 00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:07,080 Speaker 1: the movies I ended up doing not very we're not 734 00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:09,000 Speaker 1: very good. Like I did a couple that didn't work, 735 00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:11,279 Speaker 1: and I wasn't sure, like do I just take a 736 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:13,399 Speaker 1: job because someone's offering me a job. It was hard 737 00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:15,160 Speaker 1: for me to say no to a job because I 738 00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:17,440 Speaker 1: wasn't used to saying no. So you can offer all 739 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:19,239 Speaker 1: these things that are not maybe so good, maybe you 740 00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:22,920 Speaker 1: shouldn't take them, but even then, you know, we're like, okay, 741 00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:26,000 Speaker 1: if you want to do it, really really yeah, So 742 00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:29,200 Speaker 1: I just kind of was like, oh, Okay, I'll do it. 743 00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:31,719 Speaker 1: I just didn't have a sense. So then for me, 744 00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:34,759 Speaker 1: you know, doing that for a few years and then 745 00:40:35,040 --> 00:40:37,840 Speaker 1: having had the experience of being like super red hot 746 00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:40,360 Speaker 1: and then after a few movies don't work, I'm suddenly 747 00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:43,080 Speaker 1: not so hot and it's hard to get you know. 748 00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:45,120 Speaker 1: I was working, thank god, unable to support my family, 749 00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:47,600 Speaker 1: but not getting those great parts, and I was like 750 00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:52,360 Speaker 1: what So that's really when I turned to directing and producing, 751 00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:54,560 Speaker 1: because I thought, oh, that's how I'll take control of 752 00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:58,560 Speaker 1: my career. And that was great. That was my solution. 753 00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:02,120 Speaker 1: It gave me more a sense of self determination. Yeah, 754 00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:06,080 Speaker 1: it's just always fascinating to me that actors will be 755 00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:09,399 Speaker 1: punished if their movies don't turn out great when we're 756 00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:12,520 Speaker 1: the ones in the least control of the movie, Like 757 00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:14,279 Speaker 1: we show up and we do the thing, and then 758 00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:18,160 Speaker 1: all the footage goes away to someone else. We don't 759 00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:21,040 Speaker 1: make the decisions you know, in the editing room, or 760 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:24,879 Speaker 1: or about the sound or the soundtracks or and it's 761 00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:28,320 Speaker 1: it's it is. It's very it's very funny to um 762 00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:32,120 Speaker 1: face a thing that you don't control, and I think 763 00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:36,120 Speaker 1: about having the same anxiety, you know, because you don't 764 00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,080 Speaker 1: know what will work. You don't know what to say 765 00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:40,600 Speaker 1: yes and no to. At least for me in my 766 00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:43,080 Speaker 1: early career, My god, I was like, I can't tell 767 00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:46,520 Speaker 1: the difference on the page. Like sometimes sure you read 768 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,239 Speaker 1: I don't know Steven Soderberg movie, like, yeah, obviously it's 769 00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:51,960 Speaker 1: going to be good. But with these movies where you 770 00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:55,719 Speaker 1: don't know who anybody is, and I'm like, I like 771 00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:57,719 Speaker 1: the story or I like this character, I have no 772 00:41:57,800 --> 00:41:59,359 Speaker 1: idea if this is going to be a good or bad. 773 00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:02,680 Speaker 1: And I was on a TV show that went on 774 00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:04,840 Speaker 1: for so long that I was just so desperate to 775 00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:08,760 Speaker 1: go do something else, to like try on someone else 776 00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:11,520 Speaker 1: that Yeah, there were the rightest movies I did that 777 00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:15,440 Speaker 1: were terrible, but I had a really good time, you know, 778 00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:20,520 Speaker 1: out adventuring with new people and and in new places. 779 00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:23,960 Speaker 1: So it's like you gotta chalk it up to experience. 780 00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:28,319 Speaker 1: That's that's that's so true, and that at the end 781 00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:30,600 Speaker 1: of the day, you know, I came to a kind 782 00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:37,759 Speaker 1: of this idea of trying to game the business. Um, 783 00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:40,839 Speaker 1: I have always found to be a fools. I think 784 00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:43,399 Speaker 1: there was maybe some people who just have a real 785 00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:50,440 Speaker 1: nose for what's commercial or their particular brand, I guess 786 00:42:50,520 --> 00:42:55,080 Speaker 1: is the term people use now. But you know, there 787 00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 1: are there are certain performers and stars who have a 788 00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:03,640 Speaker 1: real vision about himself in the marketplace, and I really 789 00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:06,719 Speaker 1: admire those people. I do not have that. I've never 790 00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:09,080 Speaker 1: I don't have that muscle. I don't understand it. I'm 791 00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:10,839 Speaker 1: unable to do it, you know. So for me when 792 00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:15,360 Speaker 1: I came to personally was in terms of as an actor. 793 00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:19,600 Speaker 1: I have like three criteria that I evaluate a job with. 794 00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:22,399 Speaker 1: None of them are is this going to be good 795 00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:24,040 Speaker 1: for my career? Is this going to be a hit? 796 00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:27,319 Speaker 1: The three things for me are who am I working with? 797 00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:31,040 Speaker 1: Are the people that that inspire me? Or I'm excited 798 00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:34,799 Speaker 1: to work with? Is the role something that I feel 799 00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:37,160 Speaker 1: like I can do something with, Like can I really 800 00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,600 Speaker 1: whether it's big or small, can I really is there 801 00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:43,439 Speaker 1: a real stub kind of do something special with this role? 802 00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:45,640 Speaker 1: And then the third thing is how much money am 803 00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:47,719 Speaker 1: I going to make? And for me, I've sort of 804 00:43:47,719 --> 00:43:49,239 Speaker 1: come to this from me. If it if it satisfies 805 00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:52,840 Speaker 1: two of the three criteria, I'll take the job. You know. 806 00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,200 Speaker 1: If it's if it's a really interesting role with great people, 807 00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:58,759 Speaker 1: I'll do it for free. If it's amazing money with 808 00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:01,719 Speaker 1: people I die I work with, the scripts may not's 809 00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:04,919 Speaker 1: so great, I'll be like, great, that'll be a really 810 00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:06,560 Speaker 1: cool experience, you know what I mean. And then if 811 00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:08,759 Speaker 1: it's a great role for good money and I don't 812 00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:10,840 Speaker 1: know who I'm working with, I'll do that so and 813 00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:13,279 Speaker 1: I found that to be pretty good. And it's all 814 00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:17,280 Speaker 1: about what, you know, my personal connection in a sense, 815 00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:19,440 Speaker 1: and what my personal experience is going to be on it, 816 00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:23,120 Speaker 1: thinking is this gonna be a success. When I look 817 00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:24,920 Speaker 1: back on all the movies that I've done, and I've 818 00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:29,279 Speaker 1: done dozens of thems, now, I could no more have 819 00:44:29,360 --> 00:44:32,960 Speaker 1: predicted which ones we're gonna work. And I've been in 820 00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:36,360 Speaker 1: some big hit movies I had would have no idea 821 00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:38,879 Speaker 1: which ones. And then ones that I just am so 822 00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:42,319 Speaker 1: proud of that you know, you would say what, I've 823 00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:43,719 Speaker 1: never heard of it, you know, and then you can 824 00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:45,960 Speaker 1: go and you said yes. And but I made a 825 00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:48,319 Speaker 1: decisions early on where I thought, oh, well, this is 826 00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:51,000 Speaker 1: what I'm supposed to be doing. Man, every one of 827 00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:55,480 Speaker 1: them was just a disaster for me looking back now, 828 00:44:55,560 --> 00:45:00,279 Speaker 1: whether it's a business decision or signing onto a film, 829 00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:03,920 Speaker 1: any time I've had to be talked into something. I 830 00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:06,040 Speaker 1: look back and go, I was right. I shouldn't have 831 00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:09,719 Speaker 1: done that, even in my personal life. Honestly, as I 832 00:45:09,800 --> 00:45:11,440 Speaker 1: say that, I'm like, no, anytime I've had to be 833 00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:15,120 Speaker 1: talked into something, it's been a mistake. But you you know, 834 00:45:15,200 --> 00:45:18,800 Speaker 1: you live and you learn. I'm curious about that idea 835 00:45:18,880 --> 00:45:22,120 Speaker 1: that you know, you mentioned getting into this about how 836 00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:26,799 Speaker 1: you decided to sort of rest some control because as performers, 837 00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:30,120 Speaker 1: we again we often have the least of it. And 838 00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:32,040 Speaker 1: you said that there was a point where you started 839 00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:36,040 Speaker 1: producing and directing, and it was a film you produced 840 00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:39,000 Speaker 1: that led you to a criminal justice reform. And so 841 00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:42,680 Speaker 1: I guess this question is twofold, which is how how 842 00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:46,080 Speaker 1: did you begin producing and directing? And then and then 843 00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:49,640 Speaker 1: how did you find that kind of a lens for 844 00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:54,520 Speaker 1: projects as you got farther down that road? Okay, So, 845 00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:57,360 Speaker 1: so what happened for me was about a year or 846 00:45:57,360 --> 00:46:01,880 Speaker 1: two after Ghost, when I started to feel like it 847 00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:04,520 Speaker 1: was slipping away from me. To be honest with you, 848 00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:07,520 Speaker 1: you know, like the next movie I did didn't do well, 849 00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:10,759 Speaker 1: and and then not suddenly I was like, wait, but 850 00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:13,360 Speaker 1: why I'm not So I started to get very frustrated. 851 00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:15,359 Speaker 1: And I did a couple of jobs where I had 852 00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:17,799 Speaker 1: that feeling of like, well that wasn't very good, and 853 00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:22,000 Speaker 1: I just felt no sense of self determination whatsoever. And 854 00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:26,200 Speaker 1: you know, my agent, who had been super you know, 855 00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:30,080 Speaker 1: I thought was my best friend, was suddenly not returning 856 00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:33,160 Speaker 1: my phone calls so much, you know, And it was 857 00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:35,520 Speaker 1: all that stuff where you're like, oh, we're best friends, 858 00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:38,160 Speaker 1: now we're like family, and then a year or two later, 859 00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:40,160 Speaker 1: when you're not making so much money, it was like, 860 00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,080 Speaker 1: why did it take him three days to call me back? 861 00:46:43,239 --> 00:46:45,640 Speaker 1: You know kind of thing. I started to go, this 862 00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:47,840 Speaker 1: is not I said, Okay, So I said, when I 863 00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:50,360 Speaker 1: get into my forties, I don't want to be feeling 864 00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:52,200 Speaker 1: this way. I don't this I'm not gonna be able 865 00:46:52,239 --> 00:46:55,640 Speaker 1: to survive. This is just too crazy. So I thought, 866 00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:58,160 Speaker 1: this is gonna mean I wanted more self determined. So 867 00:46:58,200 --> 00:47:01,560 Speaker 1: with the way I started approaching it was I didn't 868 00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:04,160 Speaker 1: really have any interest in directing. I had no idea 869 00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:06,319 Speaker 1: that I want to be a director. I had never 870 00:47:06,640 --> 00:47:09,520 Speaker 1: I'd never thought about it. It seemed an impossible job 871 00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:12,319 Speaker 1: that I had no skills for. So I thought, well, 872 00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:14,600 Speaker 1: at some point one of my movies will work and 873 00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:16,560 Speaker 1: I'll be in a position of leverage again, and I 874 00:47:16,600 --> 00:47:18,239 Speaker 1: want to know at that point, I want to have 875 00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:21,680 Speaker 1: a script or a role that I want to do, 876 00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:23,839 Speaker 1: so the next time I'm in a hit, I can 877 00:47:23,880 --> 00:47:27,479 Speaker 1: say not to my agents, find me a great job. 878 00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:29,880 Speaker 1: I can say, here's what I want to do. Let's 879 00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:32,319 Speaker 1: use my leverage to get this done. So that was 880 00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:35,120 Speaker 1: the thought going in so and then I started reading 881 00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:38,719 Speaker 1: a hundred scripts looking for roles that I would be 882 00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:41,560 Speaker 1: right for that I could then develop the thing and 883 00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:44,400 Speaker 1: be a producer on That was my thought. So I 884 00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:47,920 Speaker 1: read a bunch of scripts, maybe like a hundred scripts, 885 00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:50,879 Speaker 1: and Sea send me all the scripts that they couldn't sell. 886 00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:53,040 Speaker 1: So most of them were not very good, but I 887 00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:56,200 Speaker 1: did find a few that were really quite interesting. And 888 00:47:56,239 --> 00:47:58,840 Speaker 1: there was one in particular that I absolutely fell in 889 00:47:58,840 --> 00:48:02,120 Speaker 1: love with. And I said, there wasn't really a part 890 00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:04,160 Speaker 1: that I felt right for in it, but the writing 891 00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:05,640 Speaker 1: just blew my mind, and I said, I have to 892 00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:08,439 Speaker 1: meet this writer. So I met the writer and I said, 893 00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:10,279 Speaker 1: what else do you have? And she said, well, I 894 00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:14,560 Speaker 1: don't really have anything else at the moment um, but 895 00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:16,320 Speaker 1: I'm working on stuff, you know, and she was a 896 00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:19,440 Speaker 1: struggling writer and uh, this script had won a lot 897 00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:22,400 Speaker 1: of awards for her, but it hadn't gotten made. And 898 00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:24,520 Speaker 1: I said, well, I think I think it needs work. 899 00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:26,480 Speaker 1: I think this is what I would do to it 900 00:48:26,520 --> 00:48:29,240 Speaker 1: in terms of developing it, and I think these characters 901 00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:31,239 Speaker 1: could be better. And you know, we talked about the 902 00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:33,640 Speaker 1: script and she said, you know, I love your ideas 903 00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:35,839 Speaker 1: about my script. Would you produce it with me, even 904 00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:37,320 Speaker 1: if you're not sure you want to act in it? Like, 905 00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:40,000 Speaker 1: would you help me get it off the ground. And 906 00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:43,400 Speaker 1: I was like, okay. So we entered it in this 907 00:48:43,480 --> 00:48:45,640 Speaker 1: relationship and I said, what do you want? And I 908 00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:47,760 Speaker 1: paid her a little bit of money to option the script, 909 00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:50,040 Speaker 1: very little, and I said, I'll pay your rent. When 910 00:48:50,080 --> 00:48:53,800 Speaker 1: you can't afford your rent, I'll pay your rent, so literally, 911 00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:56,319 Speaker 1: like you had a seven dollar a month rent. And 912 00:48:56,400 --> 00:48:58,319 Speaker 1: when she was hard up, she'd go, Tony, can you 913 00:48:58,320 --> 00:48:59,719 Speaker 1: pay my rent? This man that I'd send her a 914 00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:01,319 Speaker 1: check and pay her rent. And that's kind of how 915 00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:03,319 Speaker 1: we kept working on the script for a few years 916 00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:07,080 Speaker 1: and the script got to be really good. And initially 917 00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:09,600 Speaker 1: I had approached a director who I admired, who liked 918 00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:11,239 Speaker 1: the script a lot, and I said, you know, will 919 00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:12,960 Speaker 1: you help us? And he was also a writer, so 920 00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:14,960 Speaker 1: we worked with him for about a year and then 921 00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:18,680 Speaker 1: he lost interest and sort of disappeared on us, and 922 00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:21,239 Speaker 1: the script got to be quite good, and I was 923 00:49:21,320 --> 00:49:25,200 Speaker 1: deeply invested in it and had a sense. I remember 924 00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:27,000 Speaker 1: my father saying to me, you know, you have a 925 00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:30,200 Speaker 1: really good sense of story. I think you should consider 926 00:49:30,239 --> 00:49:33,240 Speaker 1: directing yourself, like I think you're more than just an actor. 927 00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:35,360 Speaker 1: And I was like, no, no no, no, I'm gonna be 928 00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:36,760 Speaker 1: an actor. I don't tell me I'm not an actor, 929 00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:41,200 Speaker 1: typical sort of defensive with my father. But I started 930 00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:43,520 Speaker 1: thinking about, well, maybe in one day I would like 931 00:49:43,560 --> 00:49:46,680 Speaker 1: to do that. So but anyway, I had this wonderful 932 00:49:46,719 --> 00:49:49,759 Speaker 1: script and I started trying to find another director for it, 933 00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:52,600 Speaker 1: and I was meeting these directors. In every meeting I had, 934 00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:54,799 Speaker 1: I was like, they're going to screw it up. Like 935 00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:57,040 Speaker 1: I can't. I've worked too hard on this thing for 936 00:49:57,120 --> 00:49:58,800 Speaker 1: We've been working for a couple of years on the script. 937 00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:00,719 Speaker 1: I can't give it of what if I give it 938 00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:02,640 Speaker 1: to somebody and they mess it up? And it was 939 00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:05,440 Speaker 1: the kind of material that could easily be done badly 940 00:50:05,520 --> 00:50:08,080 Speaker 1: there were lots of sort of cliche traps in it, 941 00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:11,959 Speaker 1: and it was set in the Summer of nine, which 942 00:50:12,120 --> 00:50:14,719 Speaker 1: often is an era that's done very badly, and and 943 00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:18,000 Speaker 1: I just was like scared that someone's gonna screw it up. 944 00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:23,600 Speaker 1: And one day I just thought, oh, I need to 945 00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:28,359 Speaker 1: do this myself. I need to step up and say 946 00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:31,839 Speaker 1: I'm going to direct this myself. And I've been thinking, well, 947 00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:34,120 Speaker 1: maybe I should direct a little short film or do something, 948 00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:36,600 Speaker 1: put my toe in the water. And one day I 949 00:50:36,719 --> 00:50:39,719 Speaker 1: just be like, Nope, I'm gonna do this as like 950 00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:45,239 Speaker 1: a personal challenge. And I've called the writer and her 951 00:50:45,280 --> 00:50:47,719 Speaker 1: name is Pamela, and I said, PAMs, are you sitting down. 952 00:50:48,719 --> 00:50:50,440 Speaker 1: I know we've been telling you a lot of the directors, 953 00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:52,920 Speaker 1: but I think I want to direct this myself. But 954 00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:54,799 Speaker 1: I don't want to do it if you don't support that. 955 00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:57,080 Speaker 1: And I thought she'd get upset with me, and she 956 00:50:57,200 --> 00:51:00,480 Speaker 1: was like, that's a great idea. So I'd decided to 957 00:51:00,520 --> 00:51:04,919 Speaker 1: do it myself. And then I don't know, it's weird 958 00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:08,080 Speaker 1: because I had some profile as an actor. People then 959 00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:10,920 Speaker 1: were like, oh, that makes sense, and you know, my 960 00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:14,400 Speaker 1: agents were like, oh, that's a great idea. Okay, and 961 00:51:15,280 --> 00:51:18,640 Speaker 1: out of the blue. This is how life works like 962 00:51:18,680 --> 00:51:20,719 Speaker 1: this is another thing dropped in my lap. After three 963 00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:24,560 Speaker 1: years of work out of the Blue, so I had 964 00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:27,319 Speaker 1: her do another rewrite for me as the director, and 965 00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:29,479 Speaker 1: I started gaining my confidence about what I was gonna 966 00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:32,560 Speaker 1: do with the movie. I get a call from an 967 00:51:32,600 --> 00:51:38,239 Speaker 1: agency a saying, Tony this script. It was called The 968 00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:40,279 Speaker 1: Blouseman at the time. The movie ended up being called 969 00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:42,040 Speaker 1: A Walk on the Moon, but it was original time 970 00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:44,080 Speaker 1: was The Blustman. He said, you you control the rights 971 00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:47,279 Speaker 1: to The Blouse Man, right, I said yeah. He said, 972 00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:49,520 Speaker 1: and you want to direct it, right? I said, yeah, 973 00:51:49,560 --> 00:51:52,880 Speaker 1: I do. And he said, well, Dustin Hoffman wants to 974 00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:59,240 Speaker 1: read the script. I said what he said, Well, Dustin Hoffman, Um, 975 00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:01,799 Speaker 1: I had not shown the script to anybody. He said 976 00:52:01,880 --> 00:52:06,000 Speaker 1: he was having lunch with a director who had read 977 00:52:06,080 --> 00:52:07,640 Speaker 1: that script back in the day when I was I 978 00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:09,560 Speaker 1: told you had won some awards and went around town 979 00:52:09,560 --> 00:52:12,040 Speaker 1: to no one bought it. He always had remembered the script. 980 00:52:12,040 --> 00:52:13,719 Speaker 1: And Dustin was having lunch with this guy and the 981 00:52:13,719 --> 00:52:15,640 Speaker 1: guy said, oh, there's the script. I always wondered what 982 00:52:15,680 --> 00:52:18,960 Speaker 1: happened with it? And Dustin wants to read it because 983 00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:21,880 Speaker 1: his production company has just put together a deal to 984 00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:26,840 Speaker 1: produce independent movies. And I was like, this is crazy. 985 00:52:27,040 --> 00:52:29,040 Speaker 1: So I didn't have never met Dustin. I was like, 986 00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:31,200 Speaker 1: is it Can I send him the script? I was like, well, 987 00:52:31,640 --> 00:52:32,960 Speaker 1: I don't have a copy of but I have to 988 00:52:32,960 --> 00:52:36,239 Speaker 1: print it off my computer else. So I sent him. 989 00:52:36,239 --> 00:52:38,279 Speaker 1: I was on my way back from a film festivals 990 00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:42,160 Speaker 1: and so I send him the script to Dustin's office 991 00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:45,719 Speaker 1: and about two days later, I get a phone call 992 00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:49,239 Speaker 1: and there's this character who's Dustin's kind of head story guy, 993 00:52:49,320 --> 00:52:52,640 Speaker 1: this old playwright named Murray shis Galla. Mary was like this. 994 00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:54,320 Speaker 1: He was like it must have been in his seventies 995 00:52:54,320 --> 00:52:57,239 Speaker 1: at the time. He was this old, like New York guy. 996 00:52:57,239 --> 00:53:01,279 Speaker 1: And he's like, hello, as Mary's from Punch Productions, which 997 00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:03,560 Speaker 1: was Dustin's company. I read your script. I think it's 998 00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:05,319 Speaker 1: very good. We'd like to make a deal with you. 999 00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:07,759 Speaker 1: And I said, well, I was driving in my car 1000 00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:10,360 Speaker 1: and I almost crashed the car. He said, would you 1001 00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:13,560 Speaker 1: come see me in my apartment? And so I'm like, yes, sir. 1002 00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:17,480 Speaker 1: So he going up to Murray's apartment and he sits 1003 00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:21,279 Speaker 1: me down and he's like, so, um, you want to 1004 00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:23,920 Speaker 1: direct this movie, right, And I was thinking he was 1005 00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:25,680 Speaker 1: gonna say, we can't let you do it, and I 1006 00:53:25,719 --> 00:53:28,280 Speaker 1: was like yes. He said, good, that's a great idea. 1007 00:53:28,360 --> 00:53:31,040 Speaker 1: Dustin loves actor directors. That's a fantastic idea. I was 1008 00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:33,040 Speaker 1: like okay. He said how much money do you want 1009 00:53:33,040 --> 00:53:35,360 Speaker 1: to make it for? And I had been struggling to 1010 00:53:35,360 --> 00:53:38,560 Speaker 1: get the budget under two million dollars and I couldn't. 1011 00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:40,320 Speaker 1: I was trying to say well, and I was about 1012 00:53:40,320 --> 00:53:42,279 Speaker 1: to say well, I've been trying to get it under 1013 00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:43,880 Speaker 1: two million, and he said, do you think you can 1014 00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:48,000 Speaker 1: do it for six million dollars? And I said, uh, yeah, 1015 00:53:48,320 --> 00:53:53,960 Speaker 1: you probably could do. So basically that was like October 1016 00:53:54,920 --> 00:53:59,520 Speaker 1: and by December we were casting, and by May we 1017 00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,880 Speaker 1: were in production directing what turned out being an eight 1018 00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:07,400 Speaker 1: million dollar independent feature. And it was like it just 1019 00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:10,479 Speaker 1: like all came to life. So it was a weird, 1020 00:54:10,520 --> 00:54:13,040 Speaker 1: that weird thing that I'm sure you've experienced, where like 1021 00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:16,719 Speaker 1: you kind of set your intention towards something that's impossible 1022 00:54:17,280 --> 00:54:19,400 Speaker 1: and you just kind of grind away at it and 1023 00:54:19,440 --> 00:54:22,560 Speaker 1: it seems like you're nowhere and it's never gonna happen, 1024 00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:27,080 Speaker 1: and then like light a lightning bolt strikes and suddenly 1025 00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:30,720 Speaker 1: something finds its moment and and then that that movie 1026 00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:33,719 Speaker 1: ended up you know, it was this joyous experience and 1027 00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:37,560 Speaker 1: it ended up getting into this sundance and like it 1028 00:54:37,640 --> 00:54:39,160 Speaker 1: got a lot of heat on it. And then that 1029 00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:41,440 Speaker 1: sort of gave me the beginnings of a you know, 1030 00:54:41,480 --> 00:54:45,200 Speaker 1: a directing career, and it got sold, you know, bought 1031 00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:47,279 Speaker 1: by Mirror Max, and it was like, you know, it 1032 00:54:47,320 --> 00:54:51,400 Speaker 1: was it ended up being a good thing. So and 1033 00:54:51,400 --> 00:54:53,359 Speaker 1: and also I fell in love with directing. I had 1034 00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:55,719 Speaker 1: no idea I would have any interest in the job, 1035 00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:57,279 Speaker 1: and as soon as I started doing it, I was like, 1036 00:54:57,320 --> 00:55:00,200 Speaker 1: oh my god, this is the best job ever. So 1037 00:55:00,800 --> 00:55:04,600 Speaker 1: I just love that. And it's funny because, you know, 1038 00:55:04,680 --> 00:55:06,919 Speaker 1: you said, it's like something fell into my lap after 1039 00:55:07,080 --> 00:55:11,240 Speaker 1: three years of work, and everyone always from the outside 1040 00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:14,719 Speaker 1: thinks it's an overnight success, but there's these years and 1041 00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:17,839 Speaker 1: years to your point that you're just grinding away, and 1042 00:55:18,280 --> 00:55:21,720 Speaker 1: your story is just reminding me. There have been times where, 1043 00:55:22,320 --> 00:55:26,040 Speaker 1: to use your three year example, I'm like, did I 1044 00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:28,800 Speaker 1: give up on something at two years and ten months? 1045 00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:31,120 Speaker 1: Like was it just going to take two more months? 1046 00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:36,359 Speaker 1: And I don't know. I think it's so great for 1047 00:55:36,400 --> 00:55:40,239 Speaker 1: folks at home listening to hear you talk about what 1048 00:55:40,280 --> 00:55:43,080 Speaker 1: the work really takes, because it's such a good reminder 1049 00:55:43,120 --> 00:55:46,880 Speaker 1: to keep going and that just because dreams might have 1050 00:55:46,920 --> 00:55:48,960 Speaker 1: a long lead time doesn't mean they won't come true. 1051 00:55:49,360 --> 00:55:52,320 Speaker 1: So it's so it's so cool, it's so try to 1052 00:55:52,360 --> 00:55:54,520 Speaker 1: say this. I mean, like I said to my kids 1053 00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:58,160 Speaker 1: all the time, and any artists that I you know, 1054 00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:03,600 Speaker 1: if you're listening to the right voices inside of you again, 1055 00:56:04,040 --> 00:56:06,279 Speaker 1: like you said, not the voices that are convincing, which 1056 00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:08,880 Speaker 1: you should do what you're supposed to do, what you 1057 00:56:08,920 --> 00:56:12,280 Speaker 1: think you want to do to to make a million 1058 00:56:12,320 --> 00:56:14,960 Speaker 1: dollars or whatever. You know, it's like that's another another thing. 1059 00:56:15,000 --> 00:56:17,160 Speaker 1: But you know, if you have a creative soul and 1060 00:56:17,200 --> 00:56:20,640 Speaker 1: you want to do something, you know, creative or anything, 1061 00:56:20,680 --> 00:56:23,239 Speaker 1: if you have a passion to do something. I've said 1062 00:56:23,239 --> 00:56:25,480 Speaker 1: this a lot in sort of like talking to younger people. 1063 00:56:25,520 --> 00:56:28,400 Speaker 1: But the best advice I ever got in my life 1064 00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:30,799 Speaker 1: with my brother in law was a jazz musician, a 1065 00:56:30,880 --> 00:56:34,319 Speaker 1: very very successful jazz musician. And when I was in 1066 00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:36,799 Speaker 1: college and desperate to be an actor and really had 1067 00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:39,000 Speaker 1: decided this is what I wanted to do with my life, 1068 00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:40,920 Speaker 1: but I have no idea if I had any talent. 1069 00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:44,279 Speaker 1: I was having lunch with him one day and I 1070 00:56:44,320 --> 00:56:46,000 Speaker 1: was like, oh, man, I just don't know, and he's 1071 00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:48,839 Speaker 1: a tony. When I was your age, I was like 1072 00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:51,480 Speaker 1: a kid from Indiana and I came to New York 1073 00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:55,240 Speaker 1: City dreaming to be a jazz musician with no idea. 1074 00:56:55,360 --> 00:56:59,400 Speaker 1: And he said, I knew that if I committed a 1075 00:56:59,520 --> 00:57:04,440 Speaker 1: hundred sent to the passion that is driving me, either 1076 00:57:04,880 --> 00:57:06,719 Speaker 1: it will work out the way I dream it will, 1077 00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:09,960 Speaker 1: or it will lead me to something else that I 1078 00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:13,360 Speaker 1: don't even know about. He said, But I won't wake 1079 00:57:13,560 --> 00:57:18,360 Speaker 1: up twenty years from now wishing I had tried. But 1080 00:57:18,440 --> 00:57:21,720 Speaker 1: I didn't because I was too scared. He said, So 1081 00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:26,959 Speaker 1: if you commit, that's the that is the solution, because 1082 00:57:26,960 --> 00:57:28,920 Speaker 1: it will lead you somewhere you don't even know about. 1083 00:57:29,280 --> 00:57:31,840 Speaker 1: And that I added to me was the thing that 1084 00:57:31,960 --> 00:57:34,840 Speaker 1: I have lee I've fallen back on so many times 1085 00:57:34,840 --> 00:57:36,840 Speaker 1: in my life where I'm like, I have no idea 1086 00:57:37,320 --> 00:57:39,600 Speaker 1: if this is gonna work at all. But I made 1087 00:57:39,600 --> 00:57:44,760 Speaker 1: a commitment, so I'm gonna commit, And oh god, I 1088 00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:48,240 Speaker 1: mean I could. The six years before that, I was 1089 00:57:48,280 --> 00:57:51,920 Speaker 1: an actor before I got ghost. I literally, I mean 1090 00:57:52,080 --> 00:57:54,160 Speaker 1: I remember there were days and I was weeping in 1091 00:57:54,240 --> 00:57:57,080 Speaker 1: my living room, going, this is never going to work out, 1092 00:57:57,520 --> 00:58:00,160 Speaker 1: Like no one is interested, or you get rejected for 1093 00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:03,080 Speaker 1: the five thousandth time, or people tell you have no 1094 00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:05,280 Speaker 1: talent or that you're it's just you should just give 1095 00:58:05,280 --> 00:58:07,760 Speaker 1: it up. And and literally the only thing that kept 1096 00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:10,760 Speaker 1: me going was going I made a commitment to do this, 1097 00:58:10,840 --> 00:58:13,880 Speaker 1: so I'm gonna do it until I see a path elsewhere. 1098 00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:16,320 Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden, out of the blue, 1099 00:58:16,440 --> 00:58:20,080 Speaker 1: some miracle happens, you know, in the in the direction 1100 00:58:20,120 --> 00:58:22,960 Speaker 1: that movie was like that, or so many things, you know. 1101 00:58:23,160 --> 00:58:25,920 Speaker 1: I found it on projects where even scripts that I've 1102 00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:28,440 Speaker 1: been developing the movie. I mentioned to you that I 1103 00:58:28,480 --> 00:58:32,960 Speaker 1: was about this innocence project case that the movie towe 1104 00:58:33,000 --> 00:58:36,040 Speaker 1: me eight years to get going. It was on and 1105 00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:38,960 Speaker 1: off again for eight years, and I just kept at 1106 00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:40,520 Speaker 1: it because it was a true story, and I had 1107 00:58:40,520 --> 00:58:43,120 Speaker 1: made a commitment to the woman whose life it was about, 1108 00:58:43,920 --> 00:58:45,880 Speaker 1: and I said, I'm going to tell your story. I 1109 00:58:46,240 --> 00:58:47,840 Speaker 1: you have my commitment that we're going to do this. 1110 00:58:48,160 --> 00:58:51,200 Speaker 1: And then when the circumstances were right, it happened, and 1111 00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:53,120 Speaker 1: we made the film and I was like, wow, man, 1112 00:58:53,240 --> 00:58:55,400 Speaker 1: I could easily have just walked away from this because 1113 00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:58,439 Speaker 1: it would have been easier, but I would have missed 1114 00:58:58,440 --> 00:59:02,800 Speaker 1: out on this extraordinary experience, you know, creative and very 1115 00:59:02,800 --> 00:59:06,480 Speaker 1: fulfilling thing. Well, and what a thing to give the 1116 00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:11,800 Speaker 1: kind of platform that art can give. Two, this truth 1117 00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:15,720 Speaker 1: of wrongful incarceration, this thing that happens in our country 1118 00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:18,880 Speaker 1: all the time that we want to ignore. And I 1119 00:59:19,240 --> 00:59:23,919 Speaker 1: imagine in your subject, in the woman whose story you told, 1120 00:59:23,920 --> 00:59:26,160 Speaker 1: I imagine you made a friend for life. Oh, no 1121 00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:28,280 Speaker 1: question about it. Yeah, I mean this story that film 1122 00:59:28,320 --> 00:59:32,120 Speaker 1: was called Conviction. Hillary Swain and Sam Rockwell ended up 1123 00:59:32,600 --> 00:59:34,960 Speaker 1: being a brilliant actress who are in a And then 1124 00:59:36,040 --> 00:59:38,120 Speaker 1: this was a story about a woman named Benny and 1125 00:59:38,160 --> 00:59:41,840 Speaker 1: Waters who whose brother was convicted of murder and they 1126 00:59:41,840 --> 00:59:44,880 Speaker 1: had been you know, poor kids, growing up uneducated. She 1127 00:59:44,960 --> 00:59:47,360 Speaker 1: never got out of tenth grade, and Kenny was in 1128 00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:49,920 Speaker 1: and out of jail his whole life, really, but he 1129 00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:52,520 Speaker 1: got convicted of this murder that he didn't commence. She 1130 00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:55,720 Speaker 1: was the only person who believed he was innocence. Everyone 1131 00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:58,280 Speaker 1: else was like, he's all those you know, he's We 1132 00:59:58,360 --> 00:59:59,920 Speaker 1: knew he was gonna end up in jail when the 1133 01:00:00,120 --> 01:00:03,440 Speaker 1: days and so he went away for murder with life 1134 01:00:03,800 --> 01:00:07,520 Speaker 1: in prison with no chance of parole, and Betty Anne 1135 01:00:07,520 --> 01:00:09,880 Speaker 1: refused to admit that he was guilt. And what she 1136 01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:11,400 Speaker 1: ended up doing was she said, I'm going to get 1137 01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:12,840 Speaker 1: you out of here. And she went back to school. 1138 01:00:13,320 --> 01:00:15,440 Speaker 1: She got her g e d. She went to college, 1139 01:00:15,480 --> 01:00:20,000 Speaker 1: she went to law school, became an attorney just with 1140 01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:21,960 Speaker 1: the sole objective of getting her brother for any way 1141 01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:24,479 Speaker 1: to get her brother out, had no interest in practicing law. 1142 01:00:24,760 --> 01:00:27,440 Speaker 1: It took eighteen and a half years and she finally, 1143 01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:29,959 Speaker 1: with the help of the Innocence Project, who she wrote 1144 01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:32,920 Speaker 1: when she was in law school, she found some DNA 1145 01:00:33,240 --> 01:00:36,880 Speaker 1: evidence in a basement of courthouse in Boston and got 1146 01:00:36,920 --> 01:00:38,840 Speaker 1: her brother elexnor at it after eighteen and a half 1147 01:00:38,920 --> 01:00:42,040 Speaker 1: years in prison. Yes, it was an amazing story and 1148 01:00:42,080 --> 01:00:44,919 Speaker 1: she is one of my dear friends. You know. Yeah. Wow. 1149 01:00:45,800 --> 01:00:49,080 Speaker 1: So do you think that that kind of storytelling the 1150 01:00:49,120 --> 01:00:54,520 Speaker 1: potential to expose injustice and your your platform, coupled with 1151 01:00:54,600 --> 01:00:57,680 Speaker 1: you know, your family history. Do you see that when 1152 01:00:58,200 --> 01:00:59,960 Speaker 1: you know when you look at and I want to 1153 01:01:00,040 --> 01:01:03,680 Speaker 1: your daughters, you know, co creating the political playlist and 1154 01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:07,560 Speaker 1: educating all of us about what's you know, what's happening 1155 01:01:07,560 --> 01:01:09,960 Speaker 1: with so many elected officials. Do you go like, yeah, 1156 01:01:09,960 --> 01:01:14,919 Speaker 1: that's my kid, that makes sense? Oh wow? Um? Sort 1157 01:01:14,960 --> 01:01:18,360 Speaker 1: of the the inverse of that is what I feel. Honestly, 1158 01:01:18,600 --> 01:01:23,120 Speaker 1: I feel, um proud that that's my I'm sort of 1159 01:01:23,160 --> 01:01:25,560 Speaker 1: impressed and amazed. I'm like, I wish I was like 1160 01:01:25,600 --> 01:01:29,919 Speaker 1: that her age. You know. Um, there are certain moments 1161 01:01:29,960 --> 01:01:33,360 Speaker 1: where I'm like, oh no, I'm really glad I did 1162 01:01:33,440 --> 01:01:36,400 Speaker 1: this as a parent because I know that inspired, like, 1163 01:01:36,440 --> 01:01:39,320 Speaker 1: for example, with Anna with Political Playlist, which is this 1164 01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:43,640 Speaker 1: platform that they've launched six months ago to educate people 1165 01:01:43,800 --> 01:01:46,439 Speaker 1: about young leaders in Congress under forty five years old 1166 01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:50,080 Speaker 1: and really to engage young vote millennial voters. But anybody 1167 01:01:50,160 --> 01:01:53,760 Speaker 1: you know, it's this awesome platform at you can Political 1168 01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:57,720 Speaker 1: Playlist dot com people who are interested. But yeah, it's 1169 01:01:57,720 --> 01:02:00,120 Speaker 1: cool and the way the answer gets into politics. As 1170 01:02:00,160 --> 01:02:02,080 Speaker 1: my wife Jane and I are always been real political 1171 01:02:02,120 --> 01:02:07,000 Speaker 1: and but in two thousand eight she turned eighteen, and um, 1172 01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:10,880 Speaker 1: I was going to the Democratic convention where Obama was 1173 01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:15,840 Speaker 1: the nominee, you know, and you were you there and 1174 01:02:16,040 --> 01:02:22,400 Speaker 1: I think I saw you in I saw you Yeah, yeah, 1175 01:02:22,440 --> 01:02:25,440 Speaker 1: I think I saw you at an inauguration, but I 1176 01:02:25,480 --> 01:02:28,920 Speaker 1: know I saw you in Philly and yeah, but anyway, yeah, 1177 01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:30,760 Speaker 1: but but so in a way, we went to Denver, 1178 01:02:30,920 --> 01:02:34,200 Speaker 1: which was an extraordinary thing, and I saw her at 1179 01:02:34,200 --> 01:02:38,280 Speaker 1: eighteen was the first time voting, being like very inspired 1180 01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:41,400 Speaker 1: about politics. So in that way I did feel like, 1181 01:02:41,440 --> 01:02:46,400 Speaker 1: oh yeah, great. And the family legacy thing, it's a 1182 01:02:46,520 --> 01:02:50,520 Speaker 1: very gratifying thing to see both Anna and my younger 1183 01:02:50,600 --> 01:02:54,440 Speaker 1: daughter tests, you know, really joining those service oriented aspects 1184 01:02:54,440 --> 01:02:59,160 Speaker 1: of our family instinct um. But it wasn't preordained. I 1185 01:02:59,200 --> 01:03:02,040 Speaker 1: wasn't like, oh, yeah, of course they did that. It's 1186 01:03:02,040 --> 01:03:04,520 Speaker 1: more like, wow, look they're doing it, and isn't it 1187 01:03:04,560 --> 01:03:07,840 Speaker 1: wonderful to be a part of something that's multi generational. 1188 01:03:08,400 --> 01:03:11,160 Speaker 1: In the same way that I feel very grateful that 1189 01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:16,560 Speaker 1: I have found a way to kind of engage in 1190 01:03:16,600 --> 01:03:21,120 Speaker 1: my own way, and that then that is thereby therefore 1191 01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:25,240 Speaker 1: connected to what my parents and grandparents did, do you 1192 01:03:25,240 --> 01:03:26,800 Speaker 1: know what I mean? As opposed to just kind of 1193 01:03:27,560 --> 01:03:29,760 Speaker 1: joining what they did, I had to figure my own 1194 01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:32,320 Speaker 1: way into it. But so being put in the same way, 1195 01:03:32,400 --> 01:03:34,520 Speaker 1: like show business, like you have to make your own 1196 01:03:34,560 --> 01:03:37,160 Speaker 1: way in this business. I don't know how you could 1197 01:03:37,200 --> 01:03:39,280 Speaker 1: be an like, I don't know how my dad couldn't 1198 01:03:39,280 --> 01:03:41,000 Speaker 1: give me a job, you know, I had to figure 1199 01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:43,720 Speaker 1: out how to forge my own way. But once I 1200 01:03:43,800 --> 01:03:46,760 Speaker 1: was able to do that, what a blessing to be 1201 01:03:46,840 --> 01:03:49,320 Speaker 1: a part of a legacy, you know that. To me, 1202 01:03:49,360 --> 01:03:54,360 Speaker 1: I feel so lucky and privileged to have that. I 1203 01:03:54,640 --> 01:03:58,400 Speaker 1: love that and you do. It's another I think common 1204 01:03:58,440 --> 01:04:01,920 Speaker 1: misconception that you're somebody's kid. It's easy for you, and 1205 01:04:01,960 --> 01:04:04,400 Speaker 1: I think in a way, you have to work harder 1206 01:04:04,440 --> 01:04:07,840 Speaker 1: to prove yourself, you know, because because everyone thinks maybe 1207 01:04:07,840 --> 01:04:09,680 Speaker 1: you're in the room because you're so and so's kid, 1208 01:04:10,440 --> 01:04:14,200 Speaker 1: And it's neat to see when you love something, you 1209 01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:16,320 Speaker 1: know how you'll fight for it, how you'll work for it. 1210 01:04:16,400 --> 01:04:19,560 Speaker 1: And like you said, you spent years just like sobbing 1211 01:04:19,560 --> 01:04:22,640 Speaker 1: in your apartment wondering if it's going to happen, And 1212 01:04:22,720 --> 01:04:26,480 Speaker 1: here you are with this incredible filmography. And I mean, god, 1213 01:04:26,520 --> 01:04:29,280 Speaker 1: even what you guys did was scandal. You like rocked. 1214 01:04:30,520 --> 01:04:34,600 Speaker 1: You rocked the world with that show. You you know, 1215 01:04:34,680 --> 01:04:38,760 Speaker 1: you you challenged all of these ideas and I don't know, 1216 01:04:39,080 --> 01:04:41,960 Speaker 1: I just think it's it's so exciting to see all 1217 01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:45,160 Speaker 1: the things that you know, you've you've done and made 1218 01:04:45,240 --> 01:04:47,400 Speaker 1: and and even what's coming up. I mean you have 1219 01:04:47,480 --> 01:04:51,280 Speaker 1: two huge new projects coming out. You you did um 1220 01:04:51,280 --> 01:04:54,520 Speaker 1: this new Nott Geo thing, the Hot Zone Anthrax all 1221 01:04:54,560 --> 01:04:58,720 Speaker 1: about what happened you know, post nine eleven, and and 1222 01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:02,280 Speaker 1: you're doing King Richard for Wonder Brothers. I mean, can 1223 01:05:02,320 --> 01:05:06,160 Speaker 1: you tell us about these what what can we expect? Yeah? 1224 01:05:06,240 --> 01:05:09,240 Speaker 1: And maybe why why you chose these these projects? Yeah, 1225 01:05:09,240 --> 01:05:12,840 Speaker 1: they're both really really great projects. King Richard is the 1226 01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:16,040 Speaker 1: story to check all the boxes on the list. Yea, yeah, yeah, 1227 01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:18,680 Speaker 1: King King Richard. Yes, they definitely check all the boxes 1228 01:05:18,680 --> 01:05:23,000 Speaker 1: on the list. Uh. King Richard is the story of 1229 01:05:23,280 --> 01:05:26,240 Speaker 1: Venus and Serena Williams in primary of the story of 1230 01:05:26,280 --> 01:05:30,040 Speaker 1: their father, Richard Williams, who was their their coach and 1231 01:05:30,440 --> 01:05:34,800 Speaker 1: will place will Smith place Richard, and it's about them 1232 01:05:34,800 --> 01:05:36,760 Speaker 1: when they were little girls, how they got into tennis 1233 01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:39,960 Speaker 1: and became champions, and um, it was all this vision 1234 01:05:40,440 --> 01:05:44,000 Speaker 1: that Richard Williams had. He literally, for those who don't know, 1235 01:05:44,760 --> 01:05:46,880 Speaker 1: had never picked up a tennis racket in his life. 1236 01:05:47,960 --> 01:05:51,520 Speaker 1: He saw a tennis match on television before his girls 1237 01:05:51,520 --> 01:05:55,640 Speaker 1: were born, and he was raising his three step daughters 1238 01:05:56,280 --> 01:05:59,560 Speaker 1: by his wife, and uh, he was watching this match. 1239 01:06:00,080 --> 01:06:03,840 Speaker 1: He said that's he saw this this woman tennis player 1240 01:06:04,000 --> 01:06:07,200 Speaker 1: get a check for for a tennis tournament. And he 1241 01:06:07,280 --> 01:06:10,760 Speaker 1: was like, that's a good way to make money. And 1242 01:06:10,800 --> 01:06:14,400 Speaker 1: he wrote something like an eight page manifesto this plan. 1243 01:06:15,120 --> 01:06:16,840 Speaker 1: They were gonna have two girls and they were gonna 1244 01:06:16,840 --> 01:06:19,040 Speaker 1: become the number one, number two champions in the world. 1245 01:06:19,440 --> 01:06:21,400 Speaker 1: And he told his wife and she was like, you're crazy, 1246 01:06:21,440 --> 01:06:23,880 Speaker 1: but let's have two more kids. They had these two girls, 1247 01:06:24,000 --> 01:06:26,480 Speaker 1: Venus and Serena, and at four years old, he started 1248 01:06:26,720 --> 01:06:29,560 Speaker 1: he taught himself to play tennis, and then he started 1249 01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:33,640 Speaker 1: teaching them to play, and he coached them, you know, 1250 01:06:33,760 --> 01:06:35,480 Speaker 1: for as long as he could before they really needed 1251 01:06:35,520 --> 01:06:38,880 Speaker 1: professional intervention and and he made this dream come true. 1252 01:06:38,880 --> 01:06:40,760 Speaker 1: And so I played this guy, Paul Cohen, who was 1253 01:06:40,800 --> 01:06:44,560 Speaker 1: their first professional coach, who he kind of cold called. 1254 01:06:44,680 --> 01:06:48,200 Speaker 1: I was Paul was mcnrose coach, and he cold called 1255 01:06:48,200 --> 01:06:49,960 Speaker 1: this guy and said, you need to see my kids play, 1256 01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:53,240 Speaker 1: and brought them to him, and Paul Cohen, you know, 1257 01:06:53,920 --> 01:06:57,160 Speaker 1: took him on. And then anyway, it's really the odyssey 1258 01:06:57,200 --> 01:07:00,280 Speaker 1: of of of the family and how they they So 1259 01:07:00,520 --> 01:07:03,960 Speaker 1: it's it's a really great script and UM, it was 1260 01:07:04,000 --> 01:07:06,800 Speaker 1: a really fun project to do. And then and yeah, 1261 01:07:06,840 --> 01:07:12,240 Speaker 1: that'll be out I think like November December of this year. 1262 01:07:12,280 --> 01:07:15,720 Speaker 1: And then The Hot Zone Anthrax is the second season 1263 01:07:15,760 --> 01:07:18,520 Speaker 1: of this series that nat GEO did, this limited series. Um. 1264 01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:20,640 Speaker 1: Last year the Hot Zone was about the Bolo crisis, 1265 01:07:20,720 --> 01:07:23,600 Speaker 1: Julianna Marguillis did it. And this year, as you mentioned, 1266 01:07:23,600 --> 01:07:27,360 Speaker 1: it's about the anthrax attacks after eleven and it's a 1267 01:07:27,400 --> 01:07:31,600 Speaker 1: six part series exploring that crime and the murder, investigating 1268 01:07:31,600 --> 01:07:34,480 Speaker 1: the investigation. Five people were killed and it was a 1269 01:07:34,600 --> 01:07:38,520 Speaker 1: terrible time and it was something I didn't remember when 1270 01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:42,680 Speaker 1: it happened. But I played this scientist named Bruce Ivans 1271 01:07:42,720 --> 01:07:45,920 Speaker 1: who was the lead anthrax researcher for the U. S. 1272 01:07:45,960 --> 01:07:50,080 Speaker 1: Batto Defense for the military, and he struggled with mental 1273 01:07:50,160 --> 01:07:53,240 Speaker 1: illness and ended up becoming central in this investigation and 1274 01:07:54,080 --> 01:07:58,680 Speaker 1: as a fascinating, complicated character and someone I knew nothing about. 1275 01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:01,960 Speaker 1: So yes, he's her of followed Groucer's story and then 1276 01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:05,640 Speaker 1: Daniel take Him, wonderful actor plays the FBI and who 1277 01:08:05,680 --> 01:08:08,640 Speaker 1: was the lead investigator and the sort of you followed 1278 01:08:08,640 --> 01:08:12,240 Speaker 1: these two men's on parallel tracks. And ultimately their stories converge, 1279 01:08:12,760 --> 01:08:15,320 Speaker 1: so that that's a really it's a fascinating project which 1280 01:08:15,320 --> 01:08:19,200 Speaker 1: we just finished son yet so all I can think 1281 01:08:19,200 --> 01:08:22,160 Speaker 1: about it, I just I love a research project. Is 1282 01:08:22,640 --> 01:08:26,960 Speaker 1: the I would imagine the very different types of prep 1283 01:08:27,040 --> 01:08:29,000 Speaker 1: you had to do for these projects, one of which 1284 01:08:29,040 --> 01:08:30,960 Speaker 1: I'm I'm wondering, you know, did you just get to 1285 01:08:31,000 --> 01:08:34,719 Speaker 1: take tennis lessons for for a while to get ready 1286 01:08:34,760 --> 01:08:38,559 Speaker 1: for King Richard? Did you have to just pound the court? Wow? 1287 01:08:39,120 --> 01:08:41,639 Speaker 1: That feels fun, though, to learn a skill like that 1288 01:08:41,800 --> 01:08:45,040 Speaker 1: for a job, I think feels really so great. I mean, 1289 01:08:45,120 --> 01:08:46,760 Speaker 1: like I played tennis as a kid, but I'm not 1290 01:08:46,800 --> 01:08:49,120 Speaker 1: I'm not a good tennis player, and it dropped it 1291 01:08:49,280 --> 01:08:52,880 Speaker 1: like I just hadn't been playing for twenty years really, 1292 01:08:52,920 --> 01:08:55,240 Speaker 1: And so then you get this thing, and I thought, 1293 01:08:55,240 --> 01:08:56,760 Speaker 1: I want to I don't want to have to rely 1294 01:08:56,760 --> 01:08:59,280 Speaker 1: on stunt double to look like I know what I'm doing. Obviously, 1295 01:08:59,560 --> 01:09:01,439 Speaker 1: to some two at it would have to. But so 1296 01:09:01,479 --> 01:09:03,679 Speaker 1: I immediately is when I got the job, for whatever 1297 01:09:03,720 --> 01:09:05,599 Speaker 1: a month or two that I knew before I went 1298 01:09:05,680 --> 01:09:09,320 Speaker 1: to do it, I just played tennis every day and 1299 01:09:09,800 --> 01:09:11,880 Speaker 1: went to tennis coach is going to be? How would 1300 01:09:11,880 --> 01:09:15,040 Speaker 1: a coach play tennis like not, because that's what I 1301 01:09:15,080 --> 01:09:18,120 Speaker 1: had to do. So that was just super fun and interesting. 1302 01:09:18,200 --> 01:09:21,800 Speaker 1: You want as an actor, I think, as you know, well, 1303 01:09:22,280 --> 01:09:24,200 Speaker 1: you don't necessarily need to be a great tennis player. 1304 01:09:24,240 --> 01:09:26,519 Speaker 1: You need to feel like you know what you're doing, 1305 01:09:26,880 --> 01:09:30,360 Speaker 1: so physically you need to be very very relaxed and 1306 01:09:30,479 --> 01:09:34,880 Speaker 1: able to hit balls and be physically very much at 1307 01:09:34,920 --> 01:09:37,559 Speaker 1: ease like someone who plays hundreds of hours of tennis 1308 01:09:37,640 --> 01:09:41,479 Speaker 1: every week, you know. So that was super exciting. And 1309 01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:44,479 Speaker 1: then I, you know, both kids, I was playing a 1310 01:09:44,560 --> 01:09:48,360 Speaker 1: real real people, so that's also when always an interesting challenge. 1311 01:09:48,360 --> 01:09:51,840 Speaker 1: And so I cold called this man, this wonderful man, 1312 01:09:51,880 --> 01:09:54,080 Speaker 1: Paul Colin, who I was playing, who was not involved 1313 01:09:54,120 --> 01:09:55,840 Speaker 1: with the production, but I found his email address and 1314 01:09:55,880 --> 01:09:57,840 Speaker 1: I just wrote him and I was like, would you 1315 01:09:57,960 --> 01:09:59,719 Speaker 1: have for talking to me? So we had some really 1316 01:09:59,720 --> 01:10:04,479 Speaker 1: fast in any conversations and which I wasn't able to 1317 01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:06,960 Speaker 1: do on the second one. Bruce is no what he 1318 01:10:07,320 --> 01:10:10,320 Speaker 1: actually died, so I was able to just read a 1319 01:10:10,320 --> 01:10:13,800 Speaker 1: lot about him. But yeah, playing the research aspect, I 1320 01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:16,920 Speaker 1: just to find this such a fun rabbit hole to 1321 01:10:16,960 --> 01:10:20,240 Speaker 1: go down with every project. Yeah, did you find for 1322 01:10:20,520 --> 01:10:23,960 Speaker 1: Hot Zone? Were you really diving deep into you know, 1323 01:10:24,080 --> 01:10:28,599 Speaker 1: researching chemistry or or biological weaponry like hat Where where 1324 01:10:28,600 --> 01:10:32,000 Speaker 1: do you have to go to play someone like that? Yeah? 1325 01:10:32,080 --> 01:10:35,519 Speaker 1: For me, that part it really depends, you know, because 1326 01:10:35,560 --> 01:10:40,040 Speaker 1: I with acting, you can also get hamstrung by research. 1327 01:10:40,920 --> 01:10:42,640 Speaker 1: You know, when I was a younger actor, I was 1328 01:10:42,840 --> 01:10:45,200 Speaker 1: so fascinated with research. But I do so much research 1329 01:10:45,560 --> 01:10:47,600 Speaker 1: that it would be so in my head about what 1330 01:10:47,840 --> 01:10:51,000 Speaker 1: really happened or what it really was that I wasn't 1331 01:10:51,040 --> 01:10:54,680 Speaker 1: you know. So what I try and do personally is 1332 01:10:54,720 --> 01:10:59,800 Speaker 1: I'll do enough research again where I feel comfortable, like 1333 01:10:59,840 --> 01:11:02,800 Speaker 1: I feel like I know what I'm talking about, but 1334 01:11:03,560 --> 01:11:07,040 Speaker 1: not enslaved by it. So in the case of the 1335 01:11:07,080 --> 01:11:12,840 Speaker 1: hot Zone, I did research in the science the microbiology 1336 01:11:12,880 --> 01:11:15,479 Speaker 1: of what I was doing enough so that anything that 1337 01:11:15,520 --> 01:11:18,360 Speaker 1: I was talking about in the scenes, I knew what 1338 01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:20,280 Speaker 1: I was talking about, and anything I had to do 1339 01:11:20,360 --> 01:11:24,040 Speaker 1: physically in terms of behavior that I really understood what 1340 01:11:24,040 --> 01:11:28,360 Speaker 1: I was doing. I did not get go down the 1341 01:11:28,439 --> 01:11:30,840 Speaker 1: rabbit hole of becoming a microbiology I knew that that 1342 01:11:30,920 --> 01:11:34,920 Speaker 1: was impossible and be it was unnecessary. Where I did 1343 01:11:35,040 --> 01:11:38,880 Speaker 1: need to do a tremendous amount of work was on 1344 01:11:40,080 --> 01:11:44,720 Speaker 1: the specific mental illness that my character was struggling with. 1345 01:11:45,800 --> 01:11:49,759 Speaker 1: That I spent a lot of time reading about talking 1346 01:11:49,760 --> 01:11:53,800 Speaker 1: to people about trying to get inside of someone who 1347 01:11:53,840 --> 01:11:58,519 Speaker 1: was struggling in the way that that Bruce was. That 1348 01:11:58,520 --> 01:12:00,559 Speaker 1: that ended up being much more, you know, which was 1349 01:12:00,600 --> 01:12:04,640 Speaker 1: not that connected to microbiology, had to do with his 1350 01:12:04,720 --> 01:12:09,559 Speaker 1: childhood and childhood trauma and um, you know, different different 1351 01:12:09,560 --> 01:12:14,320 Speaker 1: issues that he struck and there was there was the 1352 01:12:14,520 --> 01:12:18,520 Speaker 1: gold of a biography that had been written about him, 1353 01:12:18,520 --> 01:12:23,040 Speaker 1: which is always amazing resource when you have something like that. Yeah, 1354 01:12:23,080 --> 01:12:27,120 Speaker 1: that's so cool. Again, it just makes me think about 1355 01:12:27,160 --> 01:12:32,120 Speaker 1: the truth that storytelling is a vehicle for empathy and 1356 01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:34,840 Speaker 1: you know, you get to study the specifics of a 1357 01:12:34,920 --> 01:12:37,240 Speaker 1: person and what they do, but to figure out what 1358 01:12:37,320 --> 01:12:41,679 Speaker 1: makes them tick or what makes them suffer. It. It's 1359 01:12:41,760 --> 01:12:45,840 Speaker 1: really I just think it's so special. Yeah. The thing 1360 01:12:45,880 --> 01:12:48,479 Speaker 1: the magic of it for me as an actor always is, 1361 01:12:48,600 --> 01:12:51,120 Speaker 1: you know, every time I play a part, I always 1362 01:12:51,120 --> 01:12:53,800 Speaker 1: feel fraud at first. I'm like, I'm not right for this, 1363 01:12:53,880 --> 01:12:55,880 Speaker 1: Like what what they want me? Like, I don't know, 1364 01:12:56,160 --> 01:12:58,240 Speaker 1: this guy is so different than me. What you know, 1365 01:12:58,720 --> 01:13:02,320 Speaker 1: And the more you borrow into it, hopefully by the 1366 01:13:02,360 --> 01:13:05,200 Speaker 1: time you get to actually doing it, you feel like, well, 1367 01:13:05,240 --> 01:13:08,200 Speaker 1: this is just me, this is just another version of me. 1368 01:13:08,360 --> 01:13:11,080 Speaker 1: I I completely relate to this person, and I'm just 1369 01:13:11,120 --> 01:13:16,200 Speaker 1: kind of doing myself in this situation, you know, And 1370 01:13:16,320 --> 01:13:18,880 Speaker 1: uh that you know, I'm not I'm not putting on 1371 01:13:18,960 --> 01:13:24,040 Speaker 1: a character or playing at something that's far away from me. 1372 01:13:24,840 --> 01:13:26,880 Speaker 1: If you do the work to get there or where 1373 01:13:26,920 --> 01:13:29,519 Speaker 1: you feel that, that's like, we never we never get 1374 01:13:29,560 --> 01:13:31,000 Speaker 1: to the place we want to be it. We always 1375 01:13:31,000 --> 01:13:34,000 Speaker 1: feel that we're falling short, which you have to learn 1376 01:13:34,040 --> 01:13:36,080 Speaker 1: how to just roll with that as well and go, well, 1377 01:13:36,200 --> 01:13:38,559 Speaker 1: I gave it my best shot. But you know, if 1378 01:13:38,600 --> 01:13:42,000 Speaker 1: you do feel that intimacy and empathy with a character. 1379 01:13:42,560 --> 01:13:44,800 Speaker 1: I was reading something a profile I think it was 1380 01:13:44,840 --> 01:13:47,080 Speaker 1: in the New York Times of some wonderful actor actress 1381 01:13:47,640 --> 01:13:49,840 Speaker 1: who was saying that playing a character, you have to 1382 01:13:49,840 --> 01:13:52,120 Speaker 1: fall in love with your character. That it's it's like 1383 01:13:52,200 --> 01:13:54,240 Speaker 1: falling in love and you and that's what it is. 1384 01:13:54,600 --> 01:13:56,640 Speaker 1: And I was like, Oh, that's so great. That you 1385 01:13:56,680 --> 01:13:59,840 Speaker 1: have to get whatever, the character of a villain or whatever, 1386 01:13:59,880 --> 01:14:01,439 Speaker 1: you have to get to a point of intimacy where 1387 01:14:01,439 --> 01:14:04,120 Speaker 1: you've fallen in love with the person that you're playing. 1388 01:14:04,120 --> 01:14:07,040 Speaker 1: And then you really find that connection. And that gets 1389 01:14:07,080 --> 01:14:08,360 Speaker 1: back to the things we were first talking about it, 1390 01:14:08,360 --> 01:14:11,639 Speaker 1: but that sort of transcendent connection with another person, another 1391 01:14:11,720 --> 01:14:15,679 Speaker 1: human being. You know that you are trying to bring 1392 01:14:15,720 --> 01:14:18,040 Speaker 1: someone to life, someone like as if they're a real, 1393 01:14:18,240 --> 01:14:21,760 Speaker 1: living human being. You know, when you're connecting with them 1394 01:14:22,040 --> 01:14:26,599 Speaker 1: in the way that you would with any intimate person 1395 01:14:28,080 --> 01:14:29,920 Speaker 1: in your life. You know, and then you have the 1396 01:14:29,960 --> 01:14:35,200 Speaker 1: honor of telling that person's story. Mm hmm. Yeah, it 1397 01:14:35,320 --> 01:14:39,719 Speaker 1: is an honor. And maybe that's why we never really 1398 01:14:39,760 --> 01:14:42,120 Speaker 1: feel like we get there. I mean, or maybe it's 1399 01:14:42,160 --> 01:14:44,000 Speaker 1: because if you ever got to the end of your destination, 1400 01:14:44,040 --> 01:14:48,519 Speaker 1: you'd be dead. But I feel like I feel like 1401 01:14:48,560 --> 01:14:51,320 Speaker 1: it's the work. I feel like it's the constant desire 1402 01:14:51,400 --> 01:14:54,800 Speaker 1: to learn another thing or you know, turn another stone over. 1403 01:14:55,880 --> 01:15:02,040 Speaker 1: It feels it just feels endlessly citing to me. Yeah, 1404 01:15:02,080 --> 01:15:04,000 Speaker 1: And I don't know about you, but I often feel 1405 01:15:04,040 --> 01:15:07,639 Speaker 1: like in any given project, there are just a few 1406 01:15:07,800 --> 01:15:11,840 Speaker 1: moments or a few times when I'm like, oh my god, 1407 01:15:12,479 --> 01:15:17,200 Speaker 1: that we found flow like that was whether you know, 1408 01:15:17,360 --> 01:15:21,479 Speaker 1: like that I walked away really feeling like I went somewhere, 1409 01:15:21,600 --> 01:15:25,200 Speaker 1: you know, or even if you touch it a few 1410 01:15:25,240 --> 01:15:27,439 Speaker 1: times in a in the scene, or I have a 1411 01:15:27,439 --> 01:15:31,000 Speaker 1: couple of moments where you're like that that was I 1412 01:15:31,120 --> 01:15:35,479 Speaker 1: was that was fully connected, work fully and it's never 1413 01:15:35,640 --> 01:15:38,200 Speaker 1: at the time. You know, if you can create the 1414 01:15:38,200 --> 01:15:42,960 Speaker 1: illusion for the audience that they have that experience at 1415 01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:47,519 Speaker 1: the time, that's that's the job. But it doesn't mean 1416 01:15:47,560 --> 01:15:52,240 Speaker 1: you're gonna you know, we're just trying to touch to 1417 01:15:52,240 --> 01:15:54,760 Speaker 1: touch it, you know, and maybe there are geniuses who 1418 01:15:54,840 --> 01:15:57,519 Speaker 1: can sort of step in and be that, but I've 1419 01:15:57,520 --> 01:16:00,720 Speaker 1: not met one. I must say, the actors that I've 1420 01:16:00,880 --> 01:16:04,920 Speaker 1: met and worked with who I believe our geniuses to 1421 01:16:05,000 --> 01:16:07,759 Speaker 1: hear them say they're like, no, I've never got there, 1422 01:16:07,880 --> 01:16:09,840 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, the great who I've met, 1423 01:16:10,280 --> 01:16:12,519 Speaker 1: I've never heard one of them say yeah, man, I'm 1424 01:16:12,560 --> 01:16:16,799 Speaker 1: just always connected. I'm always so yeah. Well, it's a chase. 1425 01:16:17,200 --> 01:16:20,520 Speaker 1: It's a constant chase, and and it's it's the occasional 1426 01:16:21,320 --> 01:16:24,040 Speaker 1: moment where we touch it that keeps us coming back 1427 01:16:24,080 --> 01:16:28,680 Speaker 1: looking for more. I think that's it. But it um, 1428 01:16:28,840 --> 01:16:31,439 Speaker 1: You're right when I hear people who I think are 1429 01:16:31,479 --> 01:16:34,960 Speaker 1: just so incredible talk about how much work it is, 1430 01:16:35,760 --> 01:16:38,720 Speaker 1: or you know, when I've heard actors who I really 1431 01:16:38,720 --> 01:16:40,680 Speaker 1: look up to say, Oh, I'm always convinced when I 1432 01:16:40,720 --> 01:16:42,160 Speaker 1: start a job that this is going to be the 1433 01:16:42,200 --> 01:16:43,880 Speaker 1: one where everyone figures out I don't know how to 1434 01:16:43,920 --> 01:16:46,160 Speaker 1: act at all, and I'm going to get fired. I'm like, oh, 1435 01:16:46,240 --> 01:16:50,519 Speaker 1: you feel that so okay? Well, I mean, I guess 1436 01:16:50,520 --> 01:16:51,960 Speaker 1: if a person with a bunch of oscars at home 1437 01:16:52,120 --> 01:16:54,160 Speaker 1: feels that way, and then I should probably accept it. 1438 01:16:54,160 --> 01:16:57,960 Speaker 1: I'm always going to feel that way too, totally completely. 1439 01:16:58,720 --> 01:17:01,280 Speaker 1: It's very important to make friends with that feeling, Like 1440 01:17:01,320 --> 01:17:03,800 Speaker 1: I just have developed a sense of humor about it, like, yeah, 1441 01:17:04,200 --> 01:17:06,360 Speaker 1: this is probably going to be a disaster and I'm 1442 01:17:06,560 --> 01:17:08,920 Speaker 1: going to fail. So all I know to do is 1443 01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:13,120 Speaker 1: roll up my sleeves and put one foot in front 1444 01:17:13,120 --> 01:17:16,479 Speaker 1: of the other and see what happens. You know, because 1445 01:17:16,479 --> 01:17:19,759 Speaker 1: you can actually burn a lot of energy and destroy 1446 01:17:19,800 --> 01:17:24,040 Speaker 1: a lot of creative energy by indulging that anxiety, you 1447 01:17:24,120 --> 01:17:25,920 Speaker 1: know what I mean, Like people get in their own 1448 01:17:25,920 --> 01:17:27,559 Speaker 1: way so much because they're like, oh my god, what 1449 01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:29,639 Speaker 1: if this doesn't work out? Or what if what if 1450 01:17:29,640 --> 01:17:31,600 Speaker 1: I among my good or what if people don't like me? 1451 01:17:31,640 --> 01:17:33,800 Speaker 1: Or what if I don't get what I'm in any 1452 01:17:33,840 --> 01:17:36,080 Speaker 1: department of life? You know what I mean when you're like, 1453 01:17:36,520 --> 01:17:39,559 Speaker 1: our fears get the better of us, and we worry, 1454 01:17:39,920 --> 01:17:41,920 Speaker 1: oh my god, what if what if it doesn't go right? 1455 01:17:42,040 --> 01:17:45,479 Speaker 1: Or what if I don't prevail? Or And that's just 1456 01:17:45,520 --> 01:17:49,559 Speaker 1: a waste of time and energy and life and life force. 1457 01:17:50,040 --> 01:17:53,800 Speaker 1: So it's like, well, just go dive into the experience 1458 01:17:53,840 --> 01:17:56,920 Speaker 1: and you know your best shot is it? Like commit, 1459 01:17:57,080 --> 01:18:00,439 Speaker 1: just go for it, and who knows whether it's a 1460 01:18:00,479 --> 01:18:05,960 Speaker 1: relationship or a project or you know, yeah, how have 1461 01:18:06,000 --> 01:18:10,320 Speaker 1: you learned to do that though? To free yourself of 1462 01:18:10,479 --> 01:18:14,040 Speaker 1: that or or to make friends with that feeling? Yeah, 1463 01:18:14,120 --> 01:18:17,800 Speaker 1: combination of experience since psychotherapy, I would say in my 1464 01:18:18,200 --> 01:18:22,280 Speaker 1: early thirties, I started to really dislike my work. I 1465 01:18:22,360 --> 01:18:27,400 Speaker 1: was extremely self critical, and I would finish a day 1466 01:18:27,400 --> 01:18:29,400 Speaker 1: on set, or I'd finished a scene, or I'd be 1467 01:18:29,400 --> 01:18:32,559 Speaker 1: in a play and I've come into my addressing my performance, 1468 01:18:32,680 --> 01:18:35,160 Speaker 1: and I would like evaluate my work and like what 1469 01:18:35,240 --> 01:18:36,720 Speaker 1: did I do right? What did I do wrong? And 1470 01:18:37,040 --> 01:18:38,840 Speaker 1: not it's not good enough and it's got to be better. 1471 01:18:38,880 --> 01:18:41,400 Speaker 1: And I really was in my own way, and I 1472 01:18:41,439 --> 01:18:44,040 Speaker 1: started to think my work was getting mediocre, Like I 1473 01:18:44,080 --> 01:18:45,720 Speaker 1: didn't like it. I was a little tight, and I 1474 01:18:45,720 --> 01:18:48,880 Speaker 1: didn't there was a lack of joy and fun and 1475 01:18:48,920 --> 01:18:51,760 Speaker 1: play in it. So I went to a therapist. I 1476 01:18:51,760 --> 01:18:54,679 Speaker 1: was like, I'm I'm in troublesome. I'm I'm doing something 1477 01:18:54,680 --> 01:18:58,040 Speaker 1: wrong and I'm not. It's not I got to figure 1478 01:18:58,040 --> 01:19:02,960 Speaker 1: this out, and I literally learned skills like exercises where 1479 01:19:02,960 --> 01:19:06,559 Speaker 1: I could there were like little meditations to reorganize my 1480 01:19:06,680 --> 01:19:10,880 Speaker 1: brain where I stopped doing that, where I was like failures, 1481 01:19:10,960 --> 01:19:13,000 Speaker 1: good failures. Okay, if I'm gonna fall in my face, 1482 01:19:13,040 --> 01:19:15,519 Speaker 1: I'll fall on my face and that's not a bad 1483 01:19:15,640 --> 01:19:20,880 Speaker 1: thing that that's not like it's counterintuitive, but it's fine. 1484 01:19:21,080 --> 01:19:24,559 Speaker 1: Like and to do something and throw down and then 1485 01:19:24,680 --> 01:19:26,400 Speaker 1: be able to walk away and go it is what 1486 01:19:26,479 --> 01:19:28,519 Speaker 1: it was, was what it was like as opposed to 1487 01:19:28,560 --> 01:19:30,280 Speaker 1: that thing, and like what was it good? Was it bad? Way? 1488 01:19:30,720 --> 01:19:34,840 Speaker 1: You know? And the sort of self flagellation that we 1489 01:19:34,880 --> 01:19:37,320 Speaker 1: saw often do an I think actors particularly do because 1490 01:19:37,640 --> 01:19:39,960 Speaker 1: we're so exposed, you know, like whether it after an 1491 01:19:39,960 --> 01:19:42,560 Speaker 1: audition or after a performance. You know, you're like, what 1492 01:19:42,840 --> 01:19:45,160 Speaker 1: what how did that go? You know? I just publicly 1493 01:19:45,200 --> 01:19:50,240 Speaker 1: humiliated myself maybe, And so I developed skills to do that, 1494 01:19:50,400 --> 01:19:52,920 Speaker 1: and then as I got better at that, I started 1495 01:19:52,960 --> 01:19:55,439 Speaker 1: to realize how empowering that was, and I was able 1496 01:19:55,479 --> 01:19:58,200 Speaker 1: to develop a sense of humor about myself and be 1497 01:19:58,439 --> 01:20:03,880 Speaker 1: fine with like, well maybe that wasn't so good, okay, 1498 01:20:04,120 --> 01:20:06,599 Speaker 1: and then be less attached to when it does go well, 1499 01:20:07,240 --> 01:20:09,320 Speaker 1: not be like your ego doesn't get on them, like, 1500 01:20:09,360 --> 01:20:12,240 Speaker 1: oh it was great, you know that was that was 1501 01:20:12,280 --> 01:20:15,400 Speaker 1: a great performance. You know now, I'm like, Okay, that 1502 01:20:15,439 --> 01:20:17,760 Speaker 1: one worked out pretty well. That was like that. I 1503 01:20:17,840 --> 01:20:19,960 Speaker 1: was able to then go, I like that way that worked, 1504 01:20:19,960 --> 01:20:23,000 Speaker 1: that was good, and something else go, oh that didn't 1505 01:20:23,680 --> 01:20:25,400 Speaker 1: that That wasn't at all what I thought I was 1506 01:20:25,439 --> 01:20:26,679 Speaker 1: supposed to, you know what I mean? And you sort 1507 01:20:26,720 --> 01:20:32,120 Speaker 1: of then over time that becomes your default and you 1508 01:20:32,200 --> 01:20:35,679 Speaker 1: realize that that is um your best shot at success 1509 01:20:35,720 --> 01:20:40,240 Speaker 1: actually is by just I can't determine outcomes. All I 1510 01:20:40,240 --> 01:20:43,280 Speaker 1: can control was my process, And frankly, the process is 1511 01:20:43,320 --> 01:20:46,680 Speaker 1: what actually really interests me most. That's what I like 1512 01:20:46,840 --> 01:20:48,600 Speaker 1: about it. So why don't I just pay attention to 1513 01:20:48,720 --> 01:20:51,680 Speaker 1: that and pay a lot of attention to that? So 1514 01:20:51,760 --> 01:20:56,360 Speaker 1: then when those negative voices come crowding in, I'm like, Okay, 1515 01:20:56,400 --> 01:20:59,320 Speaker 1: you're always there, but you're wasting my time, So shut 1516 01:20:59,400 --> 01:21:01,800 Speaker 1: the hell up. You know what I mean that you 1517 01:21:01,920 --> 01:21:05,000 Speaker 1: just not that those voices go away, but you start 1518 01:21:05,040 --> 01:21:09,360 Speaker 1: to give them less credence and go shut up, you know, 1519 01:21:09,439 --> 01:21:12,120 Speaker 1: go meditate or something, and then get back to work. 1520 01:21:12,160 --> 01:21:16,759 Speaker 1: Because anytime I'm giving that attention is attention I'm taking 1521 01:21:16,800 --> 01:21:19,800 Speaker 1: away from actually what I want to do, which is 1522 01:21:20,560 --> 01:21:27,600 Speaker 1: create something good. Mm hmmm mm hmm. That's beautiful. And 1523 01:21:27,680 --> 01:21:30,559 Speaker 1: I think the key I'm really learning right now that 1524 01:21:30,600 --> 01:21:34,040 Speaker 1: I think the key to dealing with those feelings is 1525 01:21:34,080 --> 01:21:36,240 Speaker 1: a bit of a sense of humor is learning to 1526 01:21:36,320 --> 01:21:40,000 Speaker 1: laugh at them, because otherwise, at least for me, if 1527 01:21:40,000 --> 01:21:42,280 Speaker 1: I'm not laughing at them, I'm taking them seriously and 1528 01:21:42,360 --> 01:21:45,880 Speaker 1: that's really a waste of my time. The sense of 1529 01:21:45,960 --> 01:21:50,240 Speaker 1: humor is sense humor about everything in life. But yeah, 1530 01:21:50,439 --> 01:21:52,760 Speaker 1: with our work and with ourselves. To be able to 1531 01:21:53,000 --> 01:21:55,720 Speaker 1: say that's their key to humility for me, you know, 1532 01:21:55,800 --> 01:21:59,880 Speaker 1: being able to like laugh at yourself or your situation 1533 01:22:00,080 --> 01:22:04,000 Speaker 1: or your demons or whatever it is. It just lightens everything. 1534 01:22:04,479 --> 01:22:08,320 Speaker 1: And without it, man, it just gets I gets to 1535 01:22:08,360 --> 01:22:13,640 Speaker 1: be a heavy experience. Truly, laughter really is medicine. I'm like, 1536 01:22:13,680 --> 01:22:15,719 Speaker 1: it's a cliche, but it's a cliche because it's true. 1537 01:22:15,920 --> 01:22:20,080 Speaker 1: Apparently they all are, so Tony, I have one last 1538 01:22:20,120 --> 01:22:22,360 Speaker 1: question for you, and I'm curious because you just have 1539 01:22:22,479 --> 01:22:26,160 Speaker 1: so much you know that you do and clearly care about. 1540 01:22:27,120 --> 01:22:31,320 Speaker 1: And it could be you know, professional film, television, theater, 1541 01:22:31,439 --> 01:22:34,160 Speaker 1: it could be personal, it could be you know, political 1542 01:22:34,280 --> 01:22:38,559 Speaker 1: with activism. What would you say when you think about 1543 01:22:38,600 --> 01:22:41,599 Speaker 1: the notion of being a work in progress? What feels 1544 01:22:41,600 --> 01:22:43,479 Speaker 1: like a work in progress in your life? Right now? 1545 01:22:44,000 --> 01:22:47,000 Speaker 1: My whole life feels like a work in progress, honestly, 1546 01:22:47,840 --> 01:22:53,559 Speaker 1: so I I'm finding at my age too, I'm viewing 1547 01:22:53,680 --> 01:22:58,400 Speaker 1: both my creative process as a work in progress, my parenting, 1548 01:22:58,520 --> 01:23:03,280 Speaker 1: my marriage of out thirty four years um my kind 1549 01:23:03,280 --> 01:23:09,040 Speaker 1: of viewed holistically. And so I'm now going, okay, I'm 1550 01:23:09,080 --> 01:23:14,760 Speaker 1: resisting the habitual impulse to try and say this is 1551 01:23:14,760 --> 01:23:16,559 Speaker 1: how it's gonna, this is how it's supposed to go, 1552 01:23:17,120 --> 01:23:20,519 Speaker 1: Like you know, we saw up and go what's my plan? Like, 1553 01:23:20,600 --> 01:23:22,080 Speaker 1: what's my plan? Okay? So what do I want to 1554 01:23:22,080 --> 01:23:24,240 Speaker 1: do next time? I What am I gonna? And I'm 1555 01:23:24,240 --> 01:23:26,280 Speaker 1: not saying there's anything wrong with having a plan, that 1556 01:23:26,280 --> 01:23:30,800 Speaker 1: that's that's good and often very useful, But I also 1557 01:23:30,880 --> 01:23:33,800 Speaker 1: can be toxic in the sense of trying to get 1558 01:23:33,880 --> 01:23:37,800 Speaker 1: what we talk about were controlling outcomes and because so 1559 01:23:37,880 --> 01:23:42,439 Speaker 1: many things like you mentioned scandal or something happening fell 1560 01:23:42,560 --> 01:23:46,920 Speaker 1: in my lap at fifty years old, Like I literally 1561 01:23:46,920 --> 01:23:49,360 Speaker 1: got a phone call from Sean dear Rocks going feel 1562 01:23:49,360 --> 01:23:52,599 Speaker 1: like planning President. I was like, what you know that 1563 01:23:52,600 --> 01:23:56,000 Speaker 1: that was something I could never have created, the success 1564 01:23:56,040 --> 01:23:58,519 Speaker 1: of it, the cultural phenomenon of it. That was just 1565 01:23:58,600 --> 01:24:02,120 Speaker 1: a gift that its life just dumped in my lap. 1566 01:24:02,240 --> 01:24:05,200 Speaker 1: And you know, so I've sort of had so many 1567 01:24:05,240 --> 01:24:08,120 Speaker 1: things like that that I am trying now to look 1568 01:24:08,160 --> 01:24:11,000 Speaker 1: at my life very much like what is what is 1569 01:24:11,120 --> 01:24:15,639 Speaker 1: actually happening, what's going on in the present, to be 1570 01:24:15,880 --> 01:24:20,040 Speaker 1: played with, to be um worked with in terms of 1571 01:24:20,040 --> 01:24:22,919 Speaker 1: work in progress, like what is the work that's actually progressing, 1572 01:24:22,960 --> 01:24:26,639 Speaker 1: what's actually what's actually happening, as opposed to being like, Okay, 1573 01:24:27,040 --> 01:24:28,639 Speaker 1: that job is over, I don't know what my next 1574 01:24:28,640 --> 01:24:30,680 Speaker 1: project is, so what you know, what's my client? What 1575 01:24:30,680 --> 01:24:31,960 Speaker 1: am I? What do I want? What am I gonna 1576 01:24:32,200 --> 01:24:34,960 Speaker 1: tell my agents? Or what script am I going to direct? Now? 1577 01:24:35,000 --> 01:24:37,160 Speaker 1: Like how am I going to? Is that all just 1578 01:24:37,280 --> 01:24:41,639 Speaker 1: exhausted to me now? So I'm really putting my attention 1579 01:24:41,880 --> 01:24:48,080 Speaker 1: more on trying to be observing and respond to all 1580 01:24:48,080 --> 01:24:51,880 Speaker 1: the little sparks that are constantly all around us that 1581 01:24:51,960 --> 01:24:57,080 Speaker 1: we just don't see. Does that make sense? Yes, absolutely, 1582 01:24:57,120 --> 01:24:58,680 Speaker 1: because we get swing our own head about like what 1583 01:24:58,760 --> 01:25:00,960 Speaker 1: I think it's supposed to happen is us, and you 1584 01:25:01,080 --> 01:25:04,800 Speaker 1: miss all the ship that's actually happening. So that's sort 1585 01:25:04,840 --> 01:25:07,880 Speaker 1: of the jag that I'm out at the moment. I 1586 01:25:07,960 --> 01:25:13,120 Speaker 1: love it, which is just another word for unemployment. No, 1587 01:25:13,479 --> 01:25:16,880 Speaker 1: but I think it's so important because you're right, Sometimes 1588 01:25:17,000 --> 01:25:20,719 Speaker 1: our job is slow, and sometimes it's it's so fast 1589 01:25:20,760 --> 01:25:22,960 Speaker 1: it's hard to keep up with. And and if you're 1590 01:25:23,000 --> 01:25:25,599 Speaker 1: always looking at what's coming next, you know, weeks go 1591 01:25:25,680 --> 01:25:27,280 Speaker 1: by and you realize you have no idea what you 1592 01:25:27,280 --> 01:25:29,880 Speaker 1: did because you weren't paying attention. Yeah, you know. I 1593 01:25:29,880 --> 01:25:32,800 Speaker 1: had this beautiful experience this year. My younger daughter, Tess, 1594 01:25:32,840 --> 01:25:35,360 Speaker 1: who's an actress, who was just she just got to 1595 01:25:35,439 --> 01:25:38,720 Speaker 1: grad school and during COVID she was home for a 1596 01:25:38,720 --> 01:25:41,680 Speaker 1: while because her program get suspended and she was in 1597 01:25:41,680 --> 01:25:43,160 Speaker 1: school in London, and she came home and she was 1598 01:25:43,200 --> 01:25:46,599 Speaker 1: like that we should make a film together. I was like, Okay, 1599 01:25:46,720 --> 01:25:49,000 Speaker 1: how do how do how do we let me do that, 1600 01:25:49,760 --> 01:25:53,840 Speaker 1: like just during COVID, like what. And I said, well, 1601 01:25:53,880 --> 01:25:56,000 Speaker 1: why don't you write why don't you write one like 1602 01:25:56,120 --> 01:25:58,400 Speaker 1: and we'll figure it out. And so she was back 1603 01:25:58,439 --> 01:26:01,160 Speaker 1: in London or school resumed, and and she wrote the 1604 01:26:01,200 --> 01:26:02,640 Speaker 1: script and sent it to me and I was like, 1605 01:26:02,800 --> 01:26:05,680 Speaker 1: this is really good. And we sort of kicked it 1606 01:26:05,680 --> 01:26:07,960 Speaker 1: back and forth, and then when she came home in 1607 01:26:08,000 --> 01:26:11,200 Speaker 1: the wintertime, she said, I was about to go off 1608 01:26:11,240 --> 01:26:14,400 Speaker 1: to Toronto to do the hot zone that I just 1609 01:26:14,439 --> 01:26:16,600 Speaker 1: told you about. And she was like, we need to 1610 01:26:16,600 --> 01:26:18,479 Speaker 1: do this before you leave because it needs to be 1611 01:26:18,479 --> 01:26:20,080 Speaker 1: shot in the winter, and this is where we're gonna 1612 01:26:20,120 --> 01:26:21,960 Speaker 1: do it. And I was like okay, And the two 1613 01:26:21,960 --> 01:26:25,040 Speaker 1: of us we got a crew together and we knew 1614 01:26:25,080 --> 01:26:27,200 Speaker 1: where we wanted to do it, and in a month 1615 01:26:27,280 --> 01:26:31,080 Speaker 1: we're going to put together this short film with it 1616 01:26:31,200 --> 01:26:33,880 Speaker 1: and found these young filmmakers, this incredibly young d P 1617 01:26:34,120 --> 01:26:37,040 Speaker 1: and all these We got this crew of eight people 1618 01:26:37,080 --> 01:26:41,200 Speaker 1: together and we figured it out and shot this beautiful 1619 01:26:41,240 --> 01:26:43,960 Speaker 1: little film and then edited it together while she was 1620 01:26:44,080 --> 01:26:46,640 Speaker 1: you know, I was in Toronto and anyway, it was 1621 01:26:46,720 --> 01:26:50,720 Speaker 1: just like, uh, seizing an opportunity because we were in 1622 01:26:50,760 --> 01:26:54,280 Speaker 1: the COVID situation. I wanted to do something creative, and 1623 01:26:54,880 --> 01:27:00,240 Speaker 1: this very magical creative experience, artistic experience happened, and we 1624 01:27:00,960 --> 01:27:03,680 Speaker 1: collaborating with one's own kid, which we had not collaborated 1625 01:27:03,720 --> 01:27:07,200 Speaker 1: really together before. It was it was just this thrilling 1626 01:27:07,280 --> 01:27:11,200 Speaker 1: thing and we made this beautiful little film and yeah, 1627 01:27:11,800 --> 01:27:13,840 Speaker 1: whereas you know, those are the kinds of things you 1628 01:27:13,840 --> 01:27:15,800 Speaker 1: can miss if you're like, well, no, that's not part 1629 01:27:15,840 --> 01:27:17,960 Speaker 1: of the plan, that's not on the schedule, whatever it is, 1630 01:27:18,240 --> 01:27:21,040 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Mm hmm. I love that. 1631 01:27:21,479 --> 01:27:24,920 Speaker 1: It's amazing what you find, you know, on the other 1632 01:27:24,960 --> 01:27:28,879 Speaker 1: side of your plans. Totally. I'm so excited for everything 1633 01:27:28,920 --> 01:27:31,320 Speaker 1: that's ahead. I know I would love to see the short. 1634 01:27:31,360 --> 01:27:33,760 Speaker 1: I'm very excited about this too. Yeah, show it to 1635 01:27:33,800 --> 01:27:37,160 Speaker 1: you for sure. And I just I'm so grateful for 1636 01:27:37,200 --> 01:27:40,479 Speaker 1: you taking the time. Well, thank you. So fun talking 1637 01:27:40,520 --> 01:27:49,480 Speaker 1: to Sophia