Speaker 1: Welcome to good Game with Sarah Spain where we're not
Speaker 1: calling soccer superstar Lynn Williams, Lynn Biandolo. What we went
Speaker 1: over this no new names, We're not going to know
Speaker 1: them and we're not going to use them for like
Speaker 1: at least a year too. Many of you soccer girl
Speaker 1: who's got hitched this offseason? How are we supposed to
Speaker 1: keep up? Can't do it? Won't do it. Also, honestly,
Speaker 1: fuck the patriarchy, keep your own names. It's Friday, January
Speaker 1: twenty fourth, and on today's show, we'll be talking Tampa
Speaker 1: Bay and how WNBA free agency might be affected by
Speaker 1: all the unrivaled players hanging down in Florida. Plus the
Speaker 1: latest in a wild college hoops season, transfer fees explained,
Speaker 1: and some new research that's no surprise to us, but
Speaker 1: that doesn't make it any less infuriating. It's all coming
Speaker 1: up right after this Happy Friday slices. Here's what you
Speaker 1: need to know today in hockey news. Huge congrats to
Speaker 1: Northeastern University, winners of the forty sixth Women's bean Pot.
Speaker 1: The Huskies down to Boston University for nothing in front
Speaker 1: of thirteen two hundred and seventy nine people at TD Garden.
Speaker 1: That's good for the fifth biggest turnout in D one
Speaker 1: women's college hockey history. Freshman goalie Lisa Jansen was named MVP,
Speaker 1: registering thirty saves in the championship game. The victory marks
Speaker 1: Northeastern's third straight bean Pot title and the twentieth in
Speaker 1: school history. In the on ice postgame interview, Husky's grad
Speaker 1: student defender Lily Jovitch took center stage and shared her
Speaker 1: thoughts with nesson on what we can learn from the
Speaker 1: bean Pot Take a listen. I think it's funny and
Speaker 1: when you add a little bit of money to a
Speaker 1: sport and you give some girls attention what they can
Speaker 1: do with it. I think everyone should take a page
Speaker 1: out of our book.
Speaker 2: And really put some more time and effort into women's everything.
Speaker 1: Yes, Lily, Yes. In college hoops, there's a critical top
Speaker 1: five clash between number five LSU and number two South
Speaker 1: Carolina tonight at Colonial Life Arena, a battle of the
Speaker 1: last two NCAA champs and two of the coaches with
Speaker 1: the most green in the game. That game tips off
Speaker 1: at five pm Eastern. We'll have more on the matchup
Speaker 1: and the fit off between Don Staley and Kim Mulkey
Speaker 1: later in the show. In Pro Hoops, Unrivaled got a
Speaker 1: double header tonight action tipping off at seven to fifteen
Speaker 1: pm Eastern with my Phantom BC facing mist BC. Still
Speaker 1: looking for our first stub. Come on Ghost Gang. Then
Speaker 1: it's a battle of two and OHO teams, the Laces
Speaker 1: BC playing Vinyl BC at eight to fifteen pm Eastern
Speaker 1: or whenever that first game ends. You can catch those
Speaker 1: matchups live on TNT and streaming on Max. There are
Speaker 1: two other Unrivaled games on Saturday as well, so check
Speaker 1: the schedule link in our show notes. Elsewhere in Pro
Speaker 1: Hoops WNBA, Star Sawtu Sobly has inked a deal with
Speaker 1: Adidas after four years with Jordan brand Shall now rep
Speaker 1: the Three Stripes alongside players like Eliah Boston, Chelsea Gray
Speaker 1: and Cheneyan neck Ogoom Mackay some more WNBA. The Atlanta
Speaker 1: Dreams sold out all their season tickets for the second
Speaker 1: season in a row four months before the start of
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty five season. They've also sold out four
Speaker 1: home games so far, two matchups with the Chicago Sky
Speaker 1: and one apiece with the Fever and Aces. If you're
Speaker 1: hoping to catch a game A limited number of single
Speaker 1: game tickets for the rest of the twenty twenty five
Speaker 1: Dream Season will go on sale in February. We'll link
Speaker 1: to where you can get yours in our show notes
Speaker 1: to Tennis. The Australian Open final is set. Top ranked
Speaker 1: Arena Sablenka and world number nineteen Madison Keys will play
Speaker 1: for the title on Saturday. If Keys wins, this would
Speaker 1: be her first title at a Grand Slam tournament. If
Speaker 1: you're wondering, The Australian Open is called a Grand Slam
Speaker 1: because it's one of the four major tennis events every
Speaker 1: calendar year. Meanwhile, Sabalank is chasing her third straight Australian
Speaker 1: Open title. The last time these two met in a
Speaker 1: Grand Slam was twenty twenty three in the US Open semifinal.
Speaker 1: Sabalanka won that match in three sets. We've got pro
Speaker 1: vibes happening tonight too. Love Madison plays Love Omaha at
Speaker 1: eight pm Eastern. That one will stream live on ESPN
Speaker 1: Plus and over in the PVF the Omaha Supernova's take
Speaker 1: on the Columbus Fury at seven pm Eastern, streaming on YouTube.
Speaker 1: That'll be followed by the India IG Night against the
Speaker 1: San Diego Mojo at ten fifteen Eastern on Volleyball World TV.
Speaker 1: Lots more pro vibes happening over the weekend, so we'll
Speaker 1: link to the love and PVF schedules in our show
Speaker 1: notes to Lacrosse aka the Lax to our Vibes. On Thursday,
Speaker 1: the Women's Lacrosse League rebranded as the Mabeline Women's Lacross
Speaker 1: League after the cosmetics company stepped in as a title sponsor.
Speaker 1: The league also announced its inaugural rosters for its upcoming
Speaker 1: Championship Series debut in February. We'll link to those in
Speaker 1: the show notes. Beyond that, we still don't really know
Speaker 1: what's happening with the wl sorry, the Mabeling Women's Lacrosse
Speaker 1: League beyond that single one week tournament just yet. So
Speaker 1: in Mabeling parlance, maybe it'll be a full time lacrosse league.
Speaker 1: Maybe we still don't have any information. So I want
Speaker 1: to take a quick second to talk about the big
Speaker 1: Naomi Germa to Chelsea News. So as of this taping,
Speaker 1: it's still not official, and Germa did report to the
Speaker 1: NWSL's first day of preseason training as expected, but it
Speaker 1: really feels like only a matter of time before the
Speaker 1: eyes are dotted and the teaser crossed and Germa ships
Speaker 1: off to jolly old England, which brings us to a
Speaker 1: really great question from a slice about Gurma's historic transfer fee.
Speaker 1: So Kaylee wrote, quote, just wondering if you could explain
Speaker 1: what the transfer fee means for Nami Germa. Is that
Speaker 1: to get her out of her contract with San Diego?
Speaker 1: Does it have anything to do with how much she'll
Speaker 1: get paid? Just figured more people like me might not
Speaker 1: know what all that means. Love the podcast so much.
Speaker 1: End quote. Great questions, Kaylee, and you got it right. Basically,
Speaker 1: the transfer fee is a negotiation between two clubs, so
Speaker 1: money paid by Team A to get the rights to
Speaker 1: a player currently under contract with team B. It's completely
Speaker 1: separate from the salary that the player is going to
Speaker 1: get from their new team, which is a different negotiation
Speaker 1: between club and player. In fact, the two clubs might
Speaker 1: come to an agreement on the transfer fee and the
Speaker 1: player could still refuse to sign with the new team,
Speaker 1: in which case they'd stay put on their current team
Speaker 1: and finish out their deal. The FIFA Women's Football Transfer
Speaker 1: window this is the period of time when clubs can
Speaker 1: buy or sell or loan out players. There's two of them.
Speaker 1: One of them is right now in January and one
Speaker 1: is in the summer. So Naomi Germa is under contract
Speaker 1: with the San Diego Wave through the end of twenty
Speaker 1: twenty six. Else wants her now, so since she's not
Speaker 1: a free agent, Chelsea are willing to pay the Wave
Speaker 1: one point one million dollars to take her rights aka
Speaker 1: have her play for their team starting now, instead of
Speaker 1: waiting for her to become a free agent and sign
Speaker 1: with them. Then, Chelsea's undefeated midway through the Women's Super
Speaker 1: League season out in England which runs September to May,
Speaker 1: and they lost star Canadian back Kadisha Buchanan to an
Speaker 1: ACL jury last November, so they'd really like to shore
Speaker 1: up their defense with Germa, and they'd like to do
Speaker 1: it now. Per sources, Gurma's pursuing the move as well,
Speaker 1: so they're aligned and wanting to make it work now.
Speaker 1: In the past, things would have been more complicated because
Speaker 1: the NWSL basically tried to live in a bubble where
Speaker 1: they operated separately and differently from how FIFA and World
Speaker 1: Football operated in the old draft system. The NWSL allowed
Speaker 1: teams to acquire and hold on to rights to players
Speaker 1: without their consent, like a lot of other American sports.
Speaker 1: But the new NWSLCBA basically makes the NWSL rules more
Speaker 1: aligned with FIFA and World Football. So an NWSL team
Speaker 1: can only hold player rights pursuant to a con so
Speaker 1: both a team and a player have to agree they
Speaker 1: want to be together. So now when a team in
Speaker 1: another league, say Chelsea, wants to do a deal with
Speaker 1: the team in the AMWSL, in this case the Wave
Speaker 1: both are operating with the same rules, same transfer window,
Speaker 1: all that jazz. Now you're seeing transfer fees happen a
Speaker 1: lot more than before in women's football. Previously there just
Speaker 1: wasn't as much money at play, and contracts, at least
Speaker 1: in European women's football were typically shorter than on the
Speaker 1: men's side, so they were like a year or eighteen months,
Speaker 1: and it made more sense to wait out a player's
Speaker 1: contract and go after them at free agency. But in
Speaker 1: recent years, as contracts have gotten longer, valuations have gone up,
Speaker 1: investments have poured in attendance, viewership records all those getting broken,
Speaker 1: more and more transfer fees have been paid. In fact,
Speaker 1: eight of the top nine richest transfer fees in women's
Speaker 1: soccer all happened last year, and make that nine of
Speaker 1: the richest ten in the last thirteen months once Kermis
Speaker 1: deal is done. Now something to think about as transfer
Speaker 1: fees become more common, especially in light of some related
Speaker 1: negotiations currently going on in the MLS, the men's professional
Speaker 1: soccer league in the US, think about what their players
Speaker 1: should get a percentage of that transfer fee. It's their
Speaker 1: value driving up that dollar amount, so shouldn't they see
Speaker 1: a part of it, especially when I look at contracts
Speaker 1: for players. So if Chelsea thinks Nailmi is worth one
Speaker 1: point one million dollars plus whatever salary they pay her,
Speaker 1: they clearly value her way more than the dollar amount
Speaker 1: that she's going to see. So remember on the show,
Speaker 1: we've talked about the pyramid of value in women's sports,
Speaker 1: like it feels like male athletes are top of the pyramid.
Speaker 1: They're recognized as the product and the most valuable thing
Speaker 1: in the sport, while women are in the middle of
Speaker 1: the pyramid or sometimes near the bottom. Consider that pyramid
Speaker 1: when thinking about how much money clubs are willing to
Speaker 1: send each other in transfer fees while not paying that
Speaker 1: amount in salaries. To the players. This will be interesting
Speaker 1: to watch as the NWSL moves forward with this new
Speaker 1: CBA and as money continues to pour in into women's
Speaker 1: football across the world. Thank you for the question, Kaylee.
Speaker 1: I actually learned a lot researching that too. We're going
Speaker 1: to take a quick break. When we come back, Big
Speaker 1: Citrist is talking a whole lot of hoops. Don't go anywhere,
Speaker 1: Welcome back slices. Big Citrus ready to convene to talk
Speaker 1: a whole lot of hoops, and we want to start
Speaker 1: with WNBA free agency. Now, this is none of our
Speaker 1: jobs or wheelhouses, and in fact, we'll probably be having
Speaker 1: someone whose job it is to understand itself on the
Speaker 1: show to talk more about the biggest moves in WNBA
Speaker 1: free agency and how all of it works. But in
Speaker 1: the meantime, Mish is our expert on this, the closest
Speaker 1: thing we've got to it. So Mish, can you kind
Speaker 1: of tell us, like what's happening and what does it
Speaker 1: mean to be in this WNBA free agency period?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: I am learning all this stuff, but as I understand it,
Speaker 3: there are a few categories of players in free agency.
Speaker 3: So first up, there is reserve players and the people
Speaker 3: who are eligible for this, or any player with three
Speaker 3: years of service or fewer and whose prior team extended
Speaker 3: them a reserved qualifying offer between very recently January eleventh
Speaker 3: and the twentieth. So basically what this means is that
Speaker 3: that player's prior team as sole negotiating rights to that player,
Speaker 3: and if their team didn't offer them a contract, they
Speaker 3: just become an unrestricted free agent on February first, so
Speaker 3: that's coming up. An example of a player with this
Speaker 3: designation would be the New York Liberties Marien Johannes, who
Speaker 3: a lot of people are high on, but she's currently
Speaker 3: a reserve player for.
Speaker 1: Them, meaning that the Liberty are the only people can
Speaker 1: extend her an offer because they did extend that reserve
Speaker 1: qualifying offer from the eleventh to the twentieth exactly. So
Speaker 1: now they'll negotiate with each other and she'll be on
Speaker 1: the Liberty and they'll agree to some deal. Yep, okay.
Speaker 1: So that's only players with three years of service or
Speaker 1: fewer though, so those are sort of newer players to
Speaker 1: the league. What's a restricted free agent?
Speaker 3: So this is any player with four years of service
Speaker 3: whose contract has expired and who receives a qualifying offer
Speaker 3: from their previous team. So basically, that player's previous team
Speaker 3: has the right to match any contract offer that they
Speaker 3: get from another team, which sometimes people call it the
Speaker 3: first refusal. So in that scenario, if the restricted free
Speaker 3: agent were to sign an offer with another team, then
Speaker 3: their prior team gets four days from when they're notified
Speaker 3: to determine whether or not they're going to match that
Speaker 3: offer to try to keep that player. If they do
Speaker 3: decide to match, then that player is going to stay
Speaker 3: with their previous team, pretty simple. But if they don't,
Speaker 3: then that player will be under contract with the new
Speaker 3: team who's extended that offer.
Speaker 1: Example.
Speaker 3: Dj A Carrington, we all love her, Noah lover, She's
Speaker 3: currently a restricted free agent because she got a qualifying
Speaker 3: offer from the Connecticut Sun during that window.
Speaker 1: Okay, so the point of a restricted free agent is
Speaker 1: basically like, maybe the team had a four year deal
Speaker 1: plus an option, meaning they're on the team for four years,
Speaker 1: and then in the option year they have more rights
Speaker 1: to the player, but not all the rights, Like, there's
Speaker 1: still an opportunity for the player to leave for somewhere
Speaker 1: that will pay them more and wants the more, but
Speaker 1: the team that's had them on a contract has the
Speaker 1: first chance to try to keep them exactly. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: so it's like they're kind of a free agent, but
Speaker 1: the team they're currently playing for has a little bit
Speaker 1: of Say, yep, then there's unrestricted free agent. What's that?
Speaker 3: These are players with five or more years of service
Speaker 3: they're getting up there, getting old, or players with fewer
Speaker 3: than five years of service who don't receive qualifying offers
Speaker 3: during the window that they can receive those. So basically,
Speaker 3: this means that a player is free to sign with
Speaker 3: any team, no hindrance, as long as they haven't been
Speaker 3: designated a core player by their prior team.
Speaker 1: It's getting complicated, mes, Yeah, okay, so real quick, just
Speaker 1: to clarify everyone we've talked about before, this has gotten
Speaker 1: some sort of offer from the team they were on
Speaker 1: during this January eleventh to twentieth window, correct, And the
Speaker 1: unrestricted people have gotten no such offer from anyone. Correct,
Speaker 1: But tell us about this core player thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so, folks who are eligible for this, this is
Speaker 3: where it's like, all right, we're getting in the leeds.
Speaker 3: But I understand it to be any unrestricted or restricted
Speaker 3: free agent excluding so not including players who've already played
Speaker 3: on a core designation for two or more seasons. So
Speaker 3: when a player is cored, it basically means that the
Speaker 3: team that they were cored by becomes the only team
Speaker 3: that that player can sign or negotiate a contract with
Speaker 3: during free agency. But that doesn't mean that a move
Speaker 3: to another team can't be figured out. It has to
Speaker 3: be something that both parties want and then they'll work
Speaker 3: together to make that happen. So, for example, Dallas Wings
Speaker 3: forward Satusaboli just told everybody that she played her last
Speaker 3: game in the Dallas Wings uniform, but she and the
Speaker 3: Wings are now working together to find her a new
Speaker 3: team and find the best deal for the franchise.
Speaker 1: And the thing about core players is it's kind of
Speaker 1: like a franchise tag if you've ever heard of that
Speaker 1: in other sports. You can't just give them to everyone.
Speaker 1: You get one or per season. So you get to
Speaker 1: pick one player and that's a fully guaranteed one year
Speaker 1: deal worth the supermax, and if you're unrestricted or restricted,
Speaker 1: you could be eligible for it, but it's just a
Speaker 1: one year deal on the maximum base salary, and then
Speaker 1: that team cannot core anybody else. YEP, that's right. Okay,
Speaker 1: So it's a good deal because you're making the most
Speaker 1: money possible, but it's hard if you want to go
Speaker 1: somewhere else because you don't really have any choice.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 3: Well, so that's why I bring up Satu, because if
Speaker 3: you have a good relationship with your front office, like
Speaker 3: you can work with.
Speaker 1: Them, you're a really terrible one real though, because if
Speaker 1: it's really bad, they're like fine, like we're it's not
Speaker 1: gonna work to keep you because you're not gonna want
Speaker 1: to be here and it's gonna be pretty miserable, like
Speaker 1: sort of what's going on with Jimmy Butler in the MNBA,
Speaker 1: Like it's so bad that at this point they're just
Speaker 1: extending various suspensions to keep them from playing because the
Speaker 1: vibes are terrible. So, yeah, Satu is working on it
Speaker 1: in a positive way, but potentially also it could be
Speaker 1: so bad that you're like, your core, help me get
Speaker 1: out of here, and then it's kind of a benefit
Speaker 1: to both sides if they know it's going to be
Speaker 1: a really miserable existence. Okay, I think I get this.
Speaker 1: So Satu, soably, for instance, is a core, but since
Speaker 1: she wants to leave, she and the Wings will try
Speaker 1: to work to send her somewhere else. Meanwhile, you look
Speaker 1: at someone like Kennedy Carter of the Sky. She's an
Speaker 1: unrestricted free agent. She's never been cored. The Sky did
Speaker 1: not give her a qualifying offer to come back to
Speaker 1: the team she's been on before the deadline, So she
Speaker 1: is a freeze bird. Yep, anywhere she wants to go
Speaker 1: if they want her back. Bird. Yes, she's like a bird.
Speaker 1: I was going to sing it, but she's like a
Speaker 1: bird fly away. Come. But as we mentioned, Kennedy needs
Speaker 1: to find a team that wants her and that she
Speaker 1: will be on and be a positive member of society
Speaker 1: on while also being a tremendous basketball player, which has
Speaker 1: been somewhat of the problem. Okay, Alex, I'm sure your
Speaker 1: brain is working one thousand miles an hour. What is
Speaker 1: it doing right now when you're thinking about all of
Speaker 1: these different types of players.
Speaker 5: Frest thing I did, as means she were going through
Speaker 5: all of that, was I pulled up her hoopstats to
Speaker 5: see what Caitlin Clark's contract looks like down the road.
Speaker 5: Because rookies totally different world where you know, they typically
Speaker 5: get signed anywhere from a one year to a three
Speaker 5: year contract. I was curious, at what point for Caitlin
Speaker 5: will she become a player that has the ability to
Speaker 5: negotiate with other teams. Now, it's also very much complicated
Speaker 5: by the fact that WNBA players just decided to opt
Speaker 5: out of their current CBA and so the rules that
Speaker 5: will go into effect next year likely will be different,
Speaker 5: probably than what Caitlin's contract currently says.
Speaker 1: But yeah, that's where my mind initially went to your
Speaker 1: point about the new CBA. I'll be interested to see
Speaker 1: what it looks like because back in the day, one
Speaker 1: of the biggest complaints from WNBA players is you would
Speaker 1: get drafted, so then you would have X number of
Speaker 1: years to play for whatever team drafted you, so you
Speaker 1: had no say. Then if you got cord then you
Speaker 1: had more and I think back in the day it
Speaker 1: might have even been more years than one. I'm not posit,
Speaker 1: but I just remember, particularly Elena Deladon had a valid
Speaker 1: complaint that she had no say over the first seven
Speaker 1: years of her career. And depending on how long your
Speaker 1: career is, to wait that long before you get to
Speaker 1: decide where you want to live, who you want to
Speaker 1: play with, who you want to play for whether you
Speaker 1: have a shot at a title. All of that, particularly
Speaker 1: even just five or six years ago, when the haves
Speaker 1: and have nots was much more pronounced like you're on
Speaker 1: a perennial loser that doesn't invest and has bad facilities,
Speaker 1: and you're stuck there for your entire career, straight up
Speaker 1: horrible time. Yeah, and so they're definitely making a lot
Speaker 1: of changes so that players have more ability to move around,
Speaker 1: and we've seen that obviously some of the biggest names
Speaker 1: like Brianna Stewart taking into titles in Seattle and being like,
Speaker 1: all right, let me bring some fun to New York.
Speaker 1: Before there was not nearly as much movement in the league.
Speaker 1: Some people don't like that. It's nice to see a
Speaker 1: player wear one uniform their entire career, but if you're
Speaker 1: somewhere that isn't getting the right players and putting in
Speaker 1: the money and giving your players a good experience, the
Speaker 1: idea that you'd be stuck there for a whole career
Speaker 1: or almost all of it, that sucks NICs.
Speaker 5: I think it's especially interesting when you see what the
Speaker 5: NWSL did and making essentially every player an unrestricted free
Speaker 5: agent at the end of their contract. Also getting rid
Speaker 5: of the draft. But the NWSL has now set the
Speaker 5: bar when it comes to player free agency and player rights.
Speaker 5: When it comes to that specific issue, I think the
Speaker 5: WNBA is different because the season is so much shorter
Speaker 5: that what we see as WNBA players don't necessarily live
Speaker 5: in market. They have more flexibility to establish their life
Speaker 5: somewhere else and then kind of fly into market for
Speaker 5: that four five month window, depending on how long the
Speaker 5: season is. But it makes me curious is that something
Speaker 5: that WNBA players are talking about as the CBA negotiations
Speaker 5: continue to say, Hey, if the NWSL is doing this,
Speaker 5: why can't we.
Speaker 1: Two fascinating things that you made me think of, Alex.
Speaker 1: Number one is not only in women's sports, but in
Speaker 1: American sports. The NWSL is now one of the few
Speaker 1: places that's like, good draft, We're going to let you
Speaker 1: go where you want to go. This is all about
Speaker 1: player rights, which is very European and global. You know,
Speaker 1: we don't want the Europeans colonizing our players, like we said,
Speaker 1: but we are sort of into the rules that they
Speaker 1: have that give players a lot more rights. Secondarily to
Speaker 1: what you said though about you know, players picking where
Speaker 1: they want to live and maybe living in market for
Speaker 1: some sports and not in others. One thing that has
Speaker 1: historically been a part of women's sports has been trying
Speaker 1: to give players what they want, understanding that the leagues
Speaker 1: that they're in don't pay enough to hold them hostage,
Speaker 1: and that in men's sports, like you're going to millions
Speaker 1: of dollars, suck it up, go live and fill in
Speaker 1: the place that I won't say aloud, because then people
Speaker 1: who listen there will be sad meantime, in women's sports,
Speaker 1: especially if somebody's husband or wife or family was somewhere,
Speaker 1: they would work really hard to get them to where
Speaker 1: they want to be. As money goes up, as investment
Speaker 1: goes up, as the demand to be professionalized and treated
Speaker 1: and respected like other professional athletes in our country, it'll
Speaker 1: be interesting to see if there's a reticence to some
Speaker 1: of those demands that come along with that, because if
Speaker 1: players get used to their interests and their personal lives
Speaker 1: being prioritized and they want to cling to that while
Speaker 1: also getting the fruits of being a high funded endeavor,
Speaker 1: there might be some conflict.
Speaker 3: Definitely tricky, and that brings to mind a couple who's
Speaker 3: no longer a couple in the NWSL who played for
Speaker 3: the Orlando Pride, ally Krueger and Ashlyn Harris. I remember
Speaker 3: when they left Washington Spirit and went to the Pride.
Speaker 1: It was like a packaged deal kind of situation that
Speaker 1: happens a lot.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, and so if that's gone away, mm hmm.
Speaker 1: Had We had a lot of habs, as I call them,
Speaker 1: husbands and boyfriends on the Red Stars, and the fear
Speaker 1: was always like, does Julie Ertz want to go where
Speaker 1: Zach Ertz is? Does Kleeah Watt want to go closer
Speaker 1: to where jj Watt plays? Does Mallory Swanson need to
Speaker 1: be where Dansby swantson?
Speaker 4: Is?
Speaker 1: Like it's a fun thing to have all the habs
Speaker 1: and try to get them to show up to games
Speaker 1: and watch. It's a little bit scary when you're worried
Speaker 1: that they might leave anyway. Those are all interesting things
Speaker 1: to think about. Also interesting to think about as this
Speaker 1: free agency in the WNBA is happening for the first
Speaker 1: time ever. Most of the best players in the league
Speaker 1: are all hanging out together in Miami, or, as I
Speaker 1: called it on a previous show, Tampa Bay. It's not
Speaker 1: actually Tampa Bay, but I called it Tampa bay because
Speaker 1: for those not familiar, tampering is when you go chasing
Speaker 1: after someone on another team that is technically under the
Speaker 1: rights of someone else. So in say the WNBA before
Speaker 1: the free agency period is open. In theory, you can't
Speaker 1: be calling up players if you're the president of one
Speaker 1: team and saying wouldn't you rather play for us? You
Speaker 1: have to wait for the window to open and then
Speaker 1: the negotiations. And there are some rules to this, but Alex,
Speaker 1: you did the research. None of them are actually publicly
Speaker 1: available right on WNBA tampering.
Speaker 5: Yeah, as far as I can find, and I searched
Speaker 5: a lot of keywords Tampa persuading.
Speaker 1: Decided Alex read the whole damn CBA looking for this.
Speaker 5: I really did you know how much I love a
Speaker 5: good PDF and a control f function, And I couldn't
Speaker 5: find the exact rule, And that surprised me because we
Speaker 5: do know that the WNBA has previously fine teams for
Speaker 5: tampering violations. There was a pretty funny one a couple
Speaker 5: of years ago when the Seattle Storm got fined for
Speaker 5: tampering for tweeting about Sue Byrd returning to the city.
Speaker 5: Even though everyone and their mama knew that Suta ways
Speaker 5: returning to Seattle. They did not wait for the deadline
Speaker 5: to actually announce it.
Speaker 1: You got to do what every other league does, where
Speaker 1: you leak it to a reporter and then they post it,
Speaker 1: and then everyone goes so much for tampering because it
Speaker 1: comes out before the window ends. But everyone knows that's
Speaker 1: how it works. You just can't do it if you're
Speaker 1: the team.
Speaker 5: Itself, exactly exactly. If you're the social media manager, you
Speaker 5: better be real, real careful here. And so we know
Speaker 5: that the WNBA has these rules. I'm pretty sure the
Speaker 5: players have to be made aware of them based on
Speaker 5: things that players have previous said, But we're not totally
Speaker 5: sure where that line is of what is considered persuading
Speaker 5: somebody or just having a nice conversation and telling them
Speaker 5: how good life is in New York.
Speaker 1: Let's say I'm gonna do some research on this. I'm
Speaker 1: going to reach out to my contacts and see if
Speaker 1: somebody can provide us in black and white what the
Speaker 1: actual tampering rules are. But for the purposes of this discussion,
Speaker 1: all you need to know is that tampering exists. You
Speaker 1: can get in trouble. If you're any member of an organization, coach, player,
Speaker 1: executive owner, if you're trying to talk to a player
Speaker 1: on another team and lure them into joining your team,
Speaker 1: I don't know me if they've got the saunas bugged
Speaker 1: and the cold baths miked up, and you could tell
Speaker 1: which people are talking to the right people and who's
Speaker 1: crossing the lines and who's doing it right. All I
Speaker 1: know is that it's a wild experiment to have essentially
Speaker 1: thirty six of the best players in one place right
Speaker 1: when all of this is going down.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's chaotic, But at the same time, I think
Speaker 3: this is something that could save a lot of people,
Speaker 3: a lot of time and a lot of energy, a
Speaker 3: whole lot of money. Because think about how many stories,
Speaker 3: not just in the WNBA, but in other professional leagues
Speaker 3: we've heard about, Oh, yeah, we're gonna put so and
Speaker 3: so and so and so together, and we're gonna have
Speaker 3: the best team in the league, and so and so
Speaker 3: and so and so end up not liking each other
Speaker 3: at all.
Speaker 1: Their personalities don't mesh.
Speaker 3: And these are things that when you're just calling up
Speaker 3: people or you're not actually spending extended periods of time
Speaker 3: with people you can't really tell how you vibe and
Speaker 3: then not to mention unrivaled is giving players on opposite
Speaker 3: in different teams the opportunity to learn how they train,
Speaker 3: learn how you lead and practice, learn what your communication
Speaker 3: style is, like all these very integral, kind of intangible
Speaker 3: things that matter to players who want to be teammates
Speaker 3: and excel at.
Speaker 1: An elite level in the WNBA. So who knows such
Speaker 1: a smart point? Like, it's like a trial run, m
Speaker 1: it's like a little four you're actually committing. And to
Speaker 1: your point, like, not only do we sometimes put players
Speaker 1: together and it turns out to hate each other, we
Speaker 1: often have the reverse where we're like, oh, we can't
Speaker 1: believe that trade happened their enemy is and then they
Speaker 1: show up and they're the besties and we're like, well,
Speaker 1: we read that one wrong. It turned out you know,
Speaker 1: they're a fit when they're on the same team. Alex,
Speaker 1: what do you make of this, particularly in the sense
Speaker 1: of players being able to actually be honest with each
Speaker 1: other about how their experience is at the team that
Speaker 1: they're on.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm super curious about what those kind of behind
Speaker 5: the scenes conversations look like. And I'm also super curious.
Speaker 5: I don't know, you're in the locker room and your
Speaker 5: teammate's phone buzzes and you see b Hammon appear on
Speaker 5: the screen. It's like, Ooh, what's going on over there.
Speaker 5: So I think the fact that they're all in the
Speaker 5: same place while these conversations go down is pretty interesting.
Speaker 5: But I also think it's fascinating because WNBA players have historically,
Speaker 5: especially compared to other athletes and women's sports, have had
Speaker 5: salary transparency where they know, because of databases that exist,
Speaker 5: how much anyone on any given team is making per year.
Speaker 5: And I think that's a really important thing. You know,
Speaker 5: in jobs that include people of all genders, one of
Speaker 5: the things that is known to help close the wage
Speaker 5: gap is having salary transparency, because if you know that
Speaker 5: your coworker who does have as much work as you
Speaker 5: is making twenty thousand dollars more a year, you are
Speaker 5: way more likely to go to your boss and demand
Speaker 5: a promotion. And so I think when we see it
Speaker 5: in the WNBA, you can kind of pull up your stats,
Speaker 5: or your agent could do it on your behalf and say, hey,
Speaker 5: look at how much I contributed this year. I deserve
Speaker 5: this much money, and so I'm also curious, like how
Speaker 5: much players are helping.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 5: I think the friends that I have in my own
Speaker 5: professional life who say, hey, you're worth Moore, and so
Speaker 5: I think when you're able to be in an environment
Speaker 5: with the best players in the world, I'm curious what
Speaker 5: those kind of behind the scenes conversations sound like and
Speaker 5: look like.
Speaker 1: I finally just got a chance to watch the Off Season,
Speaker 1: which is the reality show that Midge Purse executive produced
Speaker 1: and put together, and it ran on Twitter slash x.
Speaker 1: You can go watch it. It's really enjoyable. It was
Speaker 1: really fun to get to know a lot of the players.
Speaker 1: But low Labanta is on their complain most of the show,
Speaker 1: and I think she very wisely used it as like
Speaker 1: a propaganda arm for her to complain about how she's
Speaker 1: been underpaid her entire career, particularly because at the time,
Speaker 1: the highest played player in NWSL history, Maria Sanchez, was
Speaker 1: also there and she walked in right after that deal
Speaker 1: talking about buying a house for herself, and Lowe's like, damn,
Speaker 1: and my salary sucks. But while she's at the dinner table,
Speaker 1: they're asking her like, who's your agent, and she's like,
Speaker 1: I don't have an agent. I've been raw dogging it
Speaker 1: the full time, which is debrais that she actually used.
Speaker 1: And then at the end of the show there's those
Speaker 1: little codas about how everyone's doing it. It's like low
Speaker 1: got an agent and she's getting paid and it's like, yeah, duh.
Speaker 1: It's like everybody there was like what are you doing?
Speaker 1: Like get you deserve more? And I feel like that's
Speaker 1: one thousand percent what's happening here. You mentioned Sachiusabli so
Speaker 1: Sue Bird on a Touch More Suebirds podcast with Meghan
Speaker 1: Rapino basically said she could not imagine the kind of
Speaker 1: chats that were going down at Unrivaled and Megan was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'd be buying Sato some coffee, Like you know, everybody's
Speaker 1: going after the most highly sought after people. After Satu
Speaker 1: said she didn't want to be with the Wings anymore.
Speaker 1: You know, she's looking to go somewhere else, and Satu
Speaker 1: told Front Office Sports, it's true, you're able to talk
Speaker 1: to other players directly and you could figure out what
Speaker 1: do they have, what type of resources, how important is
Speaker 1: their team to the owners. If you have an owner
Speaker 1: of a team that doesn't prioritize the women's team. They're
Speaker 1: going to talk about it, and that's a place where
Speaker 1: I would less likely like to go. And I've received
Speaker 1: a couple of coffees. I'm allowed, I'm allowed. End quote.
Speaker 1: I don't know if she is allowed because we don't
Speaker 1: have the actual tampering rule. You can't share no beans, right.
Speaker 1: Is it like the NCAA where it's like you can
Speaker 1: have a bagel, but you got that cream cheese on it,
Speaker 1: and now you're in violation. Like either way, it's pretty
Speaker 1: fascinating to think about what's going down and which of
Speaker 1: these conversations might result in players even if it's not
Speaker 1: right now, Maybe it's a year later when their contract
Speaker 1: is up and they are a free agent. Maybe it's
Speaker 1: that slow build toward a super team. Sup Bird said.
Speaker 1: Usually these conversations would happen during Team USA camps. That
Speaker 1: was one of the only time that a lot of
Speaker 1: these great players would get together and think about the
Speaker 1: relationships that you form and how fun would it be
Speaker 1: for Stooja to be doing this, you know, during the
Speaker 1: regular season too, like that kind of thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's interesting. All I'm saying is SA too low.
Speaker 3: If you want to come on the show and tell
Speaker 3: us all about our experiences in the journey.
Speaker 1: Come on down. We would love to have you. So
Speaker 1: you want them to Satu in particular, incriminate herself. Name
Speaker 1: all the people who have bought the coffees. Get them
Speaker 1: all fine for tampering.
Speaker 3: No, just use us, use us as a vessel to
Speaker 3: make your desires known.
Speaker 1: Before mentioned propaganda arm could be us. We can be
Speaker 1: propaganda pinky. That's us. Oh my god. Yeah. Fascinating, very
Speaker 1: very fascinating. And to the point we've made the opposite
Speaker 1: might be true to you. Get down there, You're so
Speaker 1: excited to play with someone you love their game from afar,
Speaker 1: and then you're like, absolutely not. Actually you're a term right.
Speaker 1: It's like when people move in together and then the
Speaker 1: lake up comes pretty quick after and they're like, no, no,
Speaker 1: you just never was familiar with your game and I
Speaker 1: do not want a part of it. Yeah, okay, speaking
Speaker 1: of hoops, we got one last thing I wanted to
Speaker 1: touch on in meiche particular. I want to get your
Speaker 1: take on this. We've got a huge matchup tonight, Number
Speaker 1: five LSU taken on number two South Carolina. The last
Speaker 1: three NCAA titles have been won by one of these
Speaker 1: two teams. We've got the two big dogs in the
Speaker 1: coaching game. Obviously there's Gino and there's others, But like
Speaker 1: Kim Malkey was getting the biggest bag, they have Kim
Speaker 1: Malkey look alike contests at the games. Her fit is
Speaker 1: always something to talk about. It's a great way and
Speaker 1: then thank you. And then there's Don Staley, who just
Speaker 1: recently passed Kim Malky with the biggest bag, also a
Speaker 1: fit to talk about for entirely different reasons. And this
Speaker 1: is like one of those games you've got circled on
Speaker 1: calendar at the beginning of the season, and it has
Speaker 1: only gotten more interesting as we've gotten closer to it.
Speaker 1: So what's the big thing that you're looking for?
Speaker 3: I mean, I think this is probably going to be
Speaker 3: the game of the year, Like I'm just gonna put
Speaker 3: it out there. I do think it's the game of
Speaker 3: the year. The thing I'm most looking forward to, though,
Speaker 3: is this matchup between LSU senior Anissa Morro and South
Speaker 3: Carolina freshman Joyce Edwards, who's currently leading them and scoring.
Speaker 3: Anissa Morrow is like a double double machine and Joyce
Speaker 3: is just one of those players. You think three years
Speaker 3: from now, she's going to be terrifying. I wouldn't even
Speaker 3: want to suit up against her if I was still
Speaker 3: in college, Like she's musty TV. If people like physicality
Speaker 3: in the post, you're welcome. This is gonna give you
Speaker 3: everything you need. And then the other kind of personnel
Speaker 3: battle I'm looking at is LSU's you know, Flaje Johnson
Speaker 3: and Mikayela Williams versus South Carolina's Raven Johnson and Malesia
Speaker 3: full Wiley. That is going to be straight up highlight
Speaker 3: reel and one mixtape type shit. Like my heart rate
Speaker 3: is going up just thinking about it right now. But
Speaker 3: both teams also have like X factors up and down
Speaker 3: the roster, so you really just don't know who's going
Speaker 3: to explode, who's going to have a big game.
Speaker 1: But those are the two personnel matchups that I've got
Speaker 1: my eye. Yeah, and you have to imagine that when
Speaker 1: you've got someone on the other side that you know
Speaker 1: is putting up those highlight reel moves, you might be
Speaker 1: a little bit more interested in making sure you put
Speaker 1: up one of your own in this game. You're not
Speaker 1: letting the sc top tens well, the other squad. We
Speaker 1: going bar for bar. We're going to play for play,
Speaker 1: just like that. And I also think, to state the obvious,
Speaker 1: there are a lot of folks who love Kim Molke.
Speaker 1: I would say most folks agree. She's a tremendous basketball coach.
Speaker 1: She has been able to get a lot out of players.
Speaker 1: She turned around this LSU program when she arrived. And
Speaker 1: there's also a lot of folks that aren't a fan
Speaker 1: of a variety of things that she has done and
Speaker 1: said in the past. Correct held up against Don Staley.
Speaker 1: Mm hmmm, who I almost never hear a bad word
Speaker 1: about You find me someone saying a bad word about
Speaker 1: Don Staley. I would like to talk to them out
Speaker 1: of curiosity. Maybe they have a good reason to, but
Speaker 1: you don't hear it. She stands for so much. The
Speaker 1: players love her, the game loves her. It is such
Speaker 1: a distinct I almost said black and white.
Speaker 4: I mean such a distinct difference that it almost feels
Speaker 4: like rooting for a side beyond basketball, which is hard
Speaker 4: because there are LSU players that I really love their game.
Speaker 1: I'm friends with Lage. She's awesome. She was a real
Speaker 1: fun hang in France. I want her to succeed. But man,
Speaker 1: I really struggle to see good things happening for gim.
Speaker 3: And it's tough for things to be like framed that
Speaker 3: way too, because it's it's not unique, right like this
Speaker 3: is we've talked about Gino as much as we talk
Speaker 3: about about the players on Yukon's roster. We've taught like
Speaker 3: that's just kind of how it goes.
Speaker 1: But what do you mean by that?
Speaker 3: I mean I wish that I want our coaches in
Speaker 3: the college ranks to have personalities, to be people that
Speaker 3: bring casual fans or fans from the schools in, but
Speaker 3: I don't want them to overshadow the players who are
Speaker 3: on the team, basically the same thing that you're saying, Like,
Speaker 3: I wish there was a way too.
Speaker 1: It's hard to separate.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I wish there was a way to separate it
Speaker 3: out because those LSU players, they're not the ones who
Speaker 3: said all that shit about Brinick, Like that's not on them.
Speaker 3: So it's just tough. But yeah, I can't wait to
Speaker 3: see what they show up to the arena in I
Speaker 3: know Kim, I can't.
Speaker 2: I can't think of who tweeted it, but when she
Speaker 2: had the basketball basket, outfit on somebody tweeted and quoted
Speaker 2: a picture of her and was like, anybody who runs
Speaker 2: into Kim today is getting called.
Speaker 1: For basket interference. Yep, And I thought I was gonna
Speaker 1: pass laughing at that. But we are definitely putting a
Speaker 1: link to that particular outfit in the show notes. If
Speaker 1: you search Kim Malkey's name, you're going to get a
Speaker 1: lot of images that come back that explain a lot
Speaker 1: of things about what we're talking about with Kim Malki's fits.
Speaker 1: But the basketball one, I don't know. It was in
Speaker 1: a universe of its own for a variety of reasons.
Speaker 1: I want you to know. And I don't know if
Speaker 1: by the time this comes around, I'll still feel so compelled.
Speaker 1: But I saved in my Google calendar at the beginning
Speaker 1: of October Halloween slash Kim Malky question mark to potentially
Speaker 1: dress as a basketball hoop because that outfit was so
Speaker 1: offensive to me in every possible way. WHOA, Alex, what
Speaker 1: are you watching for this one? Man?
Speaker 5: Well, I want to go back to one thing that
Speaker 5: you are just talking about when it comes to the
Speaker 5: juxtaposition of Kim Milk and Don Staley, and I will
Speaker 5: never not think about how they both handled Britney Griner
Speaker 5: being detained in Russia so differently, the context here being,
Speaker 5: of course, that Malki was Griner's coach when she was
Speaker 5: at Baylor and said absolutely nothing, and don Staley going
Speaker 5: out of her way time and time again to make
Speaker 5: sure that Britney Griner was front and center when they
Speaker 5: needed her name to be, you know, in.
Speaker 1: Heaven once they decided it should be.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And so I can never not think about that
Speaker 5: with the juxtaposition of them, Sarah. I also want to
Speaker 5: go back to something that you said that you know,
Speaker 5: everyone agrees that she's a great basketball coach, and I agree,
Speaker 5: but I think that the word college basketball coach needs
Speaker 5: to be put in there somewhere in the sense that
Speaker 5: I think one thing that we have seen time and
Speaker 5: time again is that Don Staley knows how to prepare
Speaker 5: her players for what comes after college in a way
Speaker 5: that I don't think we've seen quite as much from
Speaker 5: Kim Malki. Are there exceptions to that?
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
Speaker 5: You have an Angel Reese, who, you know, until she
Speaker 5: got injured this year, was making a name for herself
Speaker 5: potentially as a Rookie of the Year candidate. So I
Speaker 5: just think that that's something I've heard though, is that
Speaker 5: she's great when you're in college, but beyond that, it's
Speaker 5: not always a coaching philosophy that translates to the pro game.
Speaker 1: Right, And I should say x's and o's because again,
Speaker 1: I don't know when I say coach if that means
Speaker 1: everything that comes with being a coach, because I bet
Speaker 1: you Brittany and others might disagree with the experience that
Speaker 1: they had, but it has been interesting to talk to
Speaker 1: some LSU players about the loyalty that they have to Kim.
Speaker 1: How many players do come out of that program and feel,
Speaker 1: you know, they revere her and they and they love
Speaker 1: the experience that they had. So it's all very personal. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we'll leave it at that.
Speaker 3: While we're on the topic of coaches, I think it's
Speaker 3: really important that this matchup is coming right on the
Speaker 3: heels of We Back Pat Week, so folks who don't know,
Speaker 3: We Backpat is an initiative to amplify the work of
Speaker 3: the Pat Some Foundation, which is helping to fight against Alzheimer's,
Speaker 3: and every year at We Backpat Week, I'm reminded that
Speaker 3: Pat would probably have so much to say about this
Speaker 3: specific era of basketball, like on so many levels, specifically
Speaker 3: about Kim and Dawn and what they've done with their
Speaker 3: respective per I mean, we're talking about two teams that
Speaker 3: are undefeated at SEC play a conference that's got seven
Speaker 3: teams in the top twenty five. I just want to
Speaker 3: shine some light and say wow to the SEC as
Speaker 3: a whole. But these two teams that are at the
Speaker 3: top of the standings. I cannot wait for this game
Speaker 3: to tip off.
Speaker 1: Like we said, number five Olus through number two South Carolina.
Speaker 1: That's five pm Eastern tonight and you can watch it
Speaker 1: on ESPN. This game was moved, remember because of the weather,
Speaker 1: but you can still catch it on ESPN. Okay, we
Speaker 1: got to take a quick break. When we come back.
Speaker 1: Research shows that the save women's sports crowd is actually
Speaker 1: more interested in keeping women down. We'll get into it next.
Speaker 1: Welcome back, everybody. It's time for another what the fact
Speaker 1: and here it is a new study published in Sociology
Speaker 1: of Sport put data behind what lots of us have
Speaker 1: known for a long time. The people who aim to
Speaker 1: want to quote save women's sports by excluding transfolks usually
Speaker 1: have a negative perception of female athletes and are not
Speaker 1: otherwise interested at all in advancing women's sports. I can
Speaker 1: hear you all out there right now, duh, But we
Speaker 1: actually have a study for this now. So the authors
Speaker 1: of the study took data from twenty eighteen and found
Speaker 1: that US adults who are opposed to transgender athletes are
Speaker 1: also more likely to have beliefs about how women should look,
Speaker 1: more likely to hold homophobic views, and more likely to
Speaker 1: have a negative perception of women's sports in general. We'll
Speaker 1: link to the full study so you can read it.
Speaker 1: You will again not be surprised by the results, but
Speaker 1: that will make them no less infuriating. And here's another fact.
Speaker 1: Elf Beauty's recent report shows that gender diverse boards lead
Speaker 1: to positive business results.
Speaker 5: S and P.
Speaker 1: Five hundred companies with above average gender diversity on their
Speaker 1: boards saw a fifteen percent boost in return on equity
Speaker 1: and a fifty percent drop in earning's risk over a year.
Speaker 1: You could read the full report at elfbeauty dot com
Speaker 1: slash not So White Paper. We love that you're listening,
Speaker 1: but we want to get you in the game every
Speaker 1: so here's our good game play of the day. We're
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Speaker 1: somehow read our minds and before yesterday's show even hit
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Speaker 1: follow their lead. It's easy watch a planetary parade rating
Speaker 1: four to six set of six planets brightly aligned. Review. Okay,
Speaker 1: so have you heard about this January planetary parade where
Speaker 1: six planets will all be in line? So cool? It's
Speaker 1: also always the case every single night without getting two
Speaker 1: into the weeds. Basically, the planets always appear in a
Speaker 1: line because they orbit the Sun in more or less
Speaker 1: a flat plane, so that line that we see is
Speaker 1: just a two dimensional representation of the three dimensional plane
Speaker 1: of our Solar system. But the reason that things are
Speaker 1: actually extra cool this January is because four planets will
Speaker 1: be visible to the naked eye and two very faintly
Speaker 1: in what astronomers and stargazers are calling a planet parade.
Speaker 1: When the parades form a straight line and look like
Speaker 1: they're sort of marching across the night sky, so most
Speaker 1: folks will be able to look up and see Venus, Saturn, Jupiter,
Speaker 1: and Mars super bright, and then Uranus and Neptune more
Speaker 1: faintly were with a telescope, So all month after dark,
Speaker 1: look for Venus and Saturn in the southwest for the
Speaker 1: first couple hours of darkness, while Jupiter shines brightly high
Speaker 1: overhead and Mars is rising in the East. You're probably
Speaker 1: gonna need a telescope to see your RAINUS and Neptune.
Speaker 1: Now it's your turn, rate and review. Thanks for listening,
Speaker 1: See you next week. Good game Northeastern Hockey, Good game
Speaker 1: Atlanta Dream Fans. Few complicated free agency rules that I
Speaker 1: don't want to spend my time learning. Just to sign
Speaker 1: the players to teams and let them pick where they
Speaker 1: want to go, and then I'm going to watch the
Speaker 1: basketball part. Good Game with Sarah Spain is an iHeart
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