Speaker 1: Hey, everyone, welcome to another episode of the Market Disruptors Show. Today,
Speaker 1: I am joined by Max Porterfield. He is the president, CEO,
Speaker 1: and the director of calin X Minds. Um. He is
Speaker 1: maybe what a lot of people would call a disruptor
Speaker 1: in the mining space, which is awesome because of course
Speaker 1: we're talking about disrupting markets on this show. Um. So, Max,
Speaker 1: I've been I've been really excited to talk to you.
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us today. Yeah, thanks so much for
Speaker 1: having me. I'm really excited to be here. Yeah. So,
Speaker 1: you know, I've been following what your company has been
Speaker 1: doing for quite a while. We've talked about it in
Speaker 1: the past on this show. I'll get to that a
Speaker 1: little bit later. So I'm kind of familiar with you,
Speaker 1: but for those who really aren't familiar with you, just
Speaker 1: give us a little bit on your background and what
Speaker 1: you're doing. Yeah. So I'm originally from Texas. I got
Speaker 1: my undergraduate Texas Tech University, Border Raged, Texas out of
Speaker 1: West Exist originally and um again, starting my career in
Speaker 1: the natural resource space with a comic a US Global Investors.
Speaker 1: Spent nearly six years there and that's a fuch boutique
Speaker 1: investment firm. That specializes as in natural resources investing the
Speaker 1: run a mutual fund portfolio there really known across the
Speaker 1: world for their their expertise with that, and so that
Speaker 1: was a tremendous amount of education really on what does
Speaker 1: an institutional investor look at when looking at to make
Speaker 1: investments into the mining space in particular, which is what
Speaker 1: my next move was. So then I moved to Canada.
Speaker 1: In I did some investor relations there's some two notable
Speaker 1: companies for a couple of years to really understand the
Speaker 1: capital markets, and then went all in, so to speak,
Speaker 1: and taking over klin X and refocusing the company to
Speaker 1: these exploration within these prolific mining camps in Canada to
Speaker 1: make the next discoveries to really continue those long lived
Speaker 1: histories within those communities. Yeah, so that's cool. Worked with
Speaker 1: at US Global Investors. I had Frank Holmes on the
Speaker 1: show UM a few months back. He was he was great.
Speaker 1: I I learned a lot from him until he was awesome.
Speaker 1: So that's cool. That's a good person to mentor under,
Speaker 1: I would imagine. Yeah, so you went to uh you
Speaker 1: went to Canada in two thousand and twelve UM and
Speaker 1: started working in the capital markets. UM. I guess specifically
Speaker 1: trying to like maybe raise money for mining companies, but
Speaker 1: that probably wasn't the best time, right, That was kind
Speaker 1: of like at the peak before we went into a
Speaker 1: long bear market. Yeah, I know, I'm my whole career,
Speaker 1: I in a lot of ways has been in a
Speaker 1: bear market. I mean I came out of a university
Speaker 1: in two thousands and six, joined US Global and it
Speaker 1: was a nice you know right up watching the assets
Speaker 1: grow and really the last secular bull market for commodities.
Speaker 1: But then that will popp ur the financial crisis and
Speaker 1: and really it's been a tough time through throughout that past,
Speaker 1: you know, over a decade at this point. But I
Speaker 1: think we are re entering a new secular bull market
Speaker 1: for the commodities space. And really always said to myself
Speaker 1: that you want to ride the wave when the wave comes,
Speaker 1: and yeah, certainly that's what we're doing. You're with calin
Speaker 1: x and hitting these discoveries when the winds really behind
Speaker 1: our sales in a lot of ways. So you know,
Speaker 1: these cycles they come, and when they come, they come
Speaker 1: really big. And we're in the middle a very big
Speaker 1: cycle coming force in the basic process metal space. In
Speaker 1: my opinion, Yeah, I love. I love what you said.
Speaker 1: So I'm in I'm in California. I'm a surfer. So
Speaker 1: I always talk about like investing like a surfer. Right,
Speaker 1: I can see a storm brewing from far away, I
Speaker 1: contract that the storm's coming, and then I wait and
Speaker 1: I just ride that wave. Um. And so that's kind
Speaker 1: of what you're talking about. So it's kind of always
Speaker 1: work with my analogy. But the other thing I like
Speaker 1: about what you said is, you know you've kind of
Speaker 1: been through these bear markets and so um. I love
Speaker 1: the quote that a smooth seas never made a skilled sailor. Right,
Speaker 1: you have to go through these tough times and you've
Speaker 1: made it, so you're definitely prepared for that. But talking
Speaker 1: about this wave coming or you said the wind at
Speaker 1: our back, Um, what do you see being the catalyst
Speaker 1: with the gold price? I mean, obviously we were in
Speaker 1: this gold you know, bull market recently, but now we've
Speaker 1: seen this weakness in the price and some people maybe
Speaker 1: are starting to doubt that. But you think we have
Speaker 1: this bull market head, talk to me about that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: most certainly. I think we're in the early stages of
Speaker 1: a secular bull market for the real assets out there.
Speaker 1: And that's just do basically, you know, simply to the
Speaker 1: what's going on and the government spending. The amount of
Speaker 1: printing of dollars is unprecedented. The last time you've seen
Speaker 1: anything like this was during the financial crisis, and that
Speaker 1: was probably three trillion dollars of the FED and that
Speaker 1: took a gold move from six dollars announced north announce
Speaker 1: at that time, right, and that was you know what
Speaker 1: I got to experience the end of that in terms
Speaker 1: of the last rodeo for a very very short period
Speaker 1: of time. And you know, this is the situation now
Speaker 1: with the COVID. Whether you agree with the reaction or not,
Speaker 1: I'll leave that up to other people's debate a different conversation.
Speaker 1: But the amount of money printing is just next level.
Speaker 1: You're looking probably three times that in terms of money printing.
Speaker 1: In the magnitude that's going to have on real sets,
Speaker 1: it's gonna be tremendous. And you know, ideally placed you know,
Speaker 1: owning real estate, goal precious medals, based medals art I
Speaker 1: think is it's gonna have a big run to Yeah.
Speaker 1: Is again, you know, you just can't print that kind
Speaker 1: of currency and think nothing's gonna happen. Just like you
Speaker 1: or anybody out there can't run a big credit card
Speaker 1: debt and think that's not gonna be ramifications to that.
Speaker 1: And anytime you have a negative real interest rate environment,
Speaker 1: you're gonna see the precious medals ride and perform very
Speaker 1: very well during those periods of time. And that's, you know,
Speaker 1: certainly what we have today. And I don't see that
Speaker 1: changing that for the foreseeable future. And you know, the
Speaker 1: Fed's reiterated that too, So it's not like I'm coming up. Oh,
Speaker 1: they've they've they've they've given us a lot of words
Speaker 1: like infinity. Yeah, they're not even thinking about thinking about
Speaker 1: changing Uh now they've projected out you know, five years,
Speaker 1: so yeah, definitely, they've they've told us that. And it's
Speaker 1: interesting what you said. The three trillion dollars and two
Speaker 1: thousand and eight drove it from you know whatever, six
Speaker 1: eight to two thousand, just that same move, what could
Speaker 1: push us up a four or five thousand, But as
Speaker 1: you've just said, they've actually done three times that amount,
Speaker 1: So yeah, that could be conservative, we don't know. But
Speaker 1: but there's other drivers as well. So I think we're
Speaker 1: almost seeing this kind of perfect storm. Um, I know
Speaker 1: a lot of people think it maybe just depends on
Speaker 1: a strong or a week dollar, which has kind of
Speaker 1: been been that historically. But I think you've probably seen
Speaker 1: it move up against either or strong or a week
Speaker 1: would you say that's correct? Yeah, yeah, you will see that.
Speaker 1: And I think what's also overlooked is gonna supply side
Speaker 1: of things. I mean everyone thinks that you look at
Speaker 1: a price and the price is just set by you know,
Speaker 1: stronger demand, but you know, stronger demand met with stronger
Speaker 1: supply coming online will net out, you know, really a
Speaker 1: flat move in any kind of commodity. So you're seeing
Speaker 1: this new demand come on both on investment demand in
Speaker 1: different types of consumption, certainly on the gold side, but
Speaker 1: then on the supply side. These discoveries are becoming very,
Speaker 1: very difficult to make. You look at how many multimillionaiuts
Speaker 1: gold discoveries are made, and it's becoming more and more rare.
Speaker 1: So a lot of that is going to be supply
Speaker 1: side driven as well. When you have increasing demand but
Speaker 1: you don't have supply that can meet you meet up
Speaker 1: and keep over with that demand, that's when you have
Speaker 1: big moves and price action and not online medals seeing
Speaker 1: happening in gold. You saw that happen in silver, and
Speaker 1: more recently, I think, you know, again, silver can continue
Speaker 1: to have a big run with it. I mean the
Speaker 1: move that silver had this year, you haven't seen a
Speaker 1: moving silver like that since the nineteen eighties. Um So, again,
Speaker 1: it's a supply side story in a lot of ways
Speaker 1: as well, because while you had that big movement and
Speaker 1: it's been a tough period, you've also had lack of
Speaker 1: investment into exploration across the board base meals in particular,
Speaker 1: because you know, seventy of all exploration dollars raised, believe
Speaker 1: it or not, go to gold. Um So again, Uh,
Speaker 1: you know, I do see a bright future and it's
Speaker 1: gonna be both supply and demand oriented. Yeah. Well, I
Speaker 1: love that you say that because, um I always, you know,
Speaker 1: try to break things down very simply, and you know,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of complex ways to look at the markets,
Speaker 1: but at the end of the day, really it all
Speaker 1: boils down to supply and demand, and so, um you
Speaker 1: have increasing demand for a bunch of different reasons. But
Speaker 1: then the simple sides, you can see the supply side
Speaker 1: going down as you're seeing, and so that leads to
Speaker 1: that that price increasing. Um. You know you talked about
Speaker 1: you know, the FED printing all this money, and when
Speaker 1: they print the money, fake money values are dropping and
Speaker 1: it seems like that's gonna naturally push people into real
Speaker 1: things like possibly commodities, which is the space you're in.
Speaker 1: I mean, do you see that that migration of people
Speaker 1: wanted to leave fake money into like real assets like commodities. Yes,
Speaker 1: for sure, you know it's you're seeing a new wave
Speaker 1: of an investor coming into the commodity space. And you
Speaker 1: can always tell that's the telltale sign. Um. You know.
Speaker 1: I like to think of money and when in terms
Speaker 1: of that flows as the water, you know, you can
Speaker 1: like that as the waves and a knowedge. But when
Speaker 1: you have asset flows into a sector, a small sector
Speaker 1: like the mining businesses, you know, all ships are gonna
Speaker 1: rise in the rising tide, and you've certainly seen that.
Speaker 1: But I think again you don't have anywhere near which
Speaker 1: you saw into doesn't six yet and the market really
Speaker 1: has it's truly caught on another big thing you know
Speaker 1: that's been changed in the market, which I think is
Speaker 1: very very healthy. Do this pandemic and when have you?
Speaker 1: Is the advent of the day trader or the personal investor,
Speaker 1: and that was something I thought. It was a loss
Speaker 1: so which I really I give a lot of credit
Speaker 1: to you know, outfits like yourselves that educate investors out
Speaker 1: there about the markets and what have you. But it
Speaker 1: was the one big concern I saw overall in the
Speaker 1: markets in general is you know, investors stopped taking responsibility
Speaker 1: for their own futures. You go to a financial advisor, broker,
Speaker 1: get stuck into a mutual fund that's supposed to be
Speaker 1: you know, slated for you, and then you kind of
Speaker 1: walked away. And that whole uh commanditization, I would say,
Speaker 1: of the financial industry that actually heard it, because it
Speaker 1: took away people's connect them to their own money and
Speaker 1: this adamant of robin Hood and the monials coming in
Speaker 1: and you know, sports being shut down and people moving
Speaker 1: to the markets. I think while it's building some you know,
Speaker 1: unique price action some of these stocks, of these momentum
Speaker 1: that's drawn into them, it's gonna be longer term, very
Speaker 1: very healthy for the capital markets. And something that I
Speaker 1: like to see. Uh you know, one of the unfortunate
Speaker 1: things I think being you know anno cap stock or
Speaker 1: microcap stock today is that those investors don't aren't able
Speaker 1: to readily access us a certain trading platforms. And you know,
Speaker 1: we'll get to fix that in the future. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: as we get them hire more market cap, will be
Speaker 1: able to uplist and what have you. And uh, you
Speaker 1: know see where it carries out from there. Yeah, that
Speaker 1: that has been amazing phenomenon of of the rise of
Speaker 1: the robin Hood trader, as you say, and and a
Speaker 1: very welcome one. I mean, I'm trying to encourage people
Speaker 1: to take control of their financial future and so uh,
Speaker 1: we're definitely seeing that happen, which is cool. Um. Now,
Speaker 1: as far as the mining goes, I know you're you know,
Speaker 1: you operate across multiple front commodities gold, coppers, beeing, silver, etcetera. Um,
Speaker 1: but talk to me about how the mining um is
Speaker 1: set up. So we have this move where people are
Speaker 1: going to be demanding you know, more commodities, whether that's
Speaker 1: gold or silver or copper. Um, we have a supply
Speaker 1: side that's down and so we're expecting these big moves up.
Speaker 1: But how does that work for a mining company? So
Speaker 1: it's easy I see, you know, gold jumps up a
Speaker 1: hundred bucks or silver jumps up you know, three or
Speaker 1: four bucks, But how how do you look at moves
Speaker 1: in the physical and then kind of compare that to
Speaker 1: a mining company and the share price. Yeah, so it
Speaker 1: really depends on stage of the mining company. So there's
Speaker 1: three different stages in the mining business. You have the
Speaker 1: explorers that Calnex fits in, and that's kind of really
Speaker 1: gonna be heavily based upon making discoveries which will create
Speaker 1: a lot of value for your shoulders, and that's where
Speaker 1: you can make the biggest wins in the businesses through exploration.
Speaker 1: But also it's very hard to make a discovery, so
Speaker 1: that carries obviously the biggest risks. And in the kind
Speaker 1: of the our, you make a discovery and you start
Speaker 1: going through the engineering phase that's called the development page
Speaker 1: for the developers, and then the final group is gonna
Speaker 1: be the producers. So when you ever, ever you see
Speaker 1: a you know, price action movement in a short period
Speaker 1: of time like you mentioned, that's gonna obviously immediately impact
Speaker 1: the producers because those are the companies that are immediately
Speaker 1: generating revenues. And so again you have rising metal prices,
Speaker 1: you have increasing revenues, and then your margins should expand
Speaker 1: because your profit margins. All that's being equally going to
Speaker 1: say the same you fixed costs. So those are the
Speaker 1: three different sectors. Now, once you have a move in
Speaker 1: underlying moving the metal, and then the market realize that
Speaker 1: that's that's gonna be a stabilized price going forward, and
Speaker 1: there's confidence that this isn't like a you know, a
Speaker 1: fluke move up and then you know, shorter term move
Speaker 1: up and then gonna come back down type of situation.
Speaker 1: That's when you're gonna see the developers and then even
Speaker 1: more so the explorers follows suit and actually outperform the producers.
Speaker 1: So again that's kind of how the sector is broken
Speaker 1: up in terms of those three different subsectors and how
Speaker 1: the underlying commodity prices can have an impact on them
Speaker 1: depending on where you are in the cycle. Okay, and
Speaker 1: so you have like the producers are the ones that
Speaker 1: are actually producing the gold hence the name producers putting
Speaker 1: that gold to market. Um, but they they constantly need
Speaker 1: to be refilled, so they're kind of like draining their
Speaker 1: reserves of gold, and so they're leaning on the developers
Speaker 1: and the explorers to then keep bringing them uh fresh gold.
Speaker 1: So it looks like the market is really um kind
Speaker 1: of set up for like M and A, you know,
Speaker 1: mergers and absolutely all the way up. So that is
Speaker 1: that kind of the typical play. That's absolutely so you know,
Speaker 1: calin x per Se has a potential um to go
Speaker 1: into production. But more realistically, what you'd see as a
Speaker 1: producer mid tier major come out and I want to
Speaker 1: acquire that asset say then again to kind of go
Speaker 1: into their pipeline and production. Typically when you make a
Speaker 1: discovery from you know, discovery hole to producing seven years
Speaker 1: for copper and it's really no different for a lot
Speaker 1: of these other minds, and you can compress that timeline.
Speaker 1: You know, there's obviously permanent environmental studies that need to
Speaker 1: be done and what have you, but that's typically how
Speaker 1: it goes. And so the only way these these mid
Speaker 1: tiers really kind of replenish their future cash flows is
Speaker 1: buying these development stage assets and taking into production because
Speaker 1: again there's a lot of expertise and skill sets. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's one thing to find a mind, then there's amount
Speaker 1: of engineering and then actually going in and producing uh
Speaker 1: is you know, it's a lot of work and it's
Speaker 1: broken down in those subsectors and it's not you know,
Speaker 1: in terms of explorations, it's like a biotech stock. You know,
Speaker 1: you come up with your exploration thesis, which be simply
Speaker 1: like someone's trying to come up with those cure for
Speaker 1: cancer or concoction or what have you. And then you
Speaker 1: go and you test that hypothesis and we test our
Speaker 1: HYPOTHESI students our business by doing geophysical tests that will
Speaker 1: you know, further build up what that hypothesis is, and
Speaker 1: build our exploration model on different data sets. And then
Speaker 1: ultimately we've drill test it, which is the most sense
Speaker 1: of part of the business is drilling. Uh. And then
Speaker 1: once we drill it, that's really the truth machine they
Speaker 1: call it in the business, to see what you hid,
Speaker 1: is your hypothesis correct or incorrect, or what you need
Speaker 1: to do to continue vectoring to make that discovery no
Speaker 1: difference than a biotech cycle will have when a drug
Speaker 1: goes through celinical trials to see what are those results
Speaker 1: for those trials. Our trials happened to be the droll.
Speaker 1: But you can't create wealth in any other business as
Speaker 1: quickly as you can through a discovery. And then you know,
Speaker 1: that's really what we're focused on set out to do, uh,
Speaker 1: you know with caln X. Yeah. So as an investor
Speaker 1: looking to invest into the market, I mean, I I
Speaker 1: love the mining sector. That's why I've been talking about
Speaker 1: a lot lately. I mean, I see this massive need
Speaker 1: for gold, this demand as you say, and you know,
Speaker 1: the miners give us that asymmetric return. But as so
Speaker 1: as an investor looking into the space, um with that
Speaker 1: sustained gold price being up, like you said, the miners
Speaker 1: have um leverage to that, right, So they have so
Speaker 1: much gold or silver copper in the ground, so when
Speaker 1: the ice moves up, they have multiples on that UM.
Speaker 1: And I think that's why we get those big moves.
Speaker 1: I know in our portfolio we've we have several that
Speaker 1: have gone up a d percent. I think I talked
Speaker 1: about calin X on a video back in July, and
Speaker 1: it's up about I think sixty five percent just since
Speaker 1: I mentioned it in that video back in July. It
Speaker 1: was much higher. It's a little bit down um. And
Speaker 1: is that because of the reserves that you have in
Speaker 1: the ground is why it's really moved up? Or was
Speaker 1: it more? Uh? What was the driver for that? So
Speaker 1: it's twofold. Obviously we we had we have existing resources
Speaker 1: in the ground in the portfolio and you know, coming
Speaker 1: out of the negative sentiment, and that's really when I
Speaker 1: picked market bottoms on anything, whether it be an individual
Speaker 1: commodity or their overall capital markets. It's really when this
Speaker 1: peak fear, and there was certainly peaked fear in March,
Speaker 1: and so coming out of that and cerainly's gonna help us.
Speaker 1: But with that, we're also coming out of this you know,
Speaker 1: downturn so to speak, with key discoveries across our portfolio.
Speaker 1: And so we did hit two silver discoveries that are
Speaker 1: near surface with potential be a minimal to an open
Speaker 1: pit operation which has one third mining costs of an
Speaker 1: underground um again very widely space in New Brunswick near
Speaker 1: an International Creek property which also hosts a zinc lead deposit.
Speaker 1: And then in tantem to that we were vectoring in
Speaker 1: UH to a big target in Flint Fond, which is
Speaker 1: a community that's been in production for almost a hundred
Speaker 1: years and thirty two minds in County. That's an area
Speaker 1: that is due to have their flagship MIND shutdown in
Speaker 1: Q two two UH and we just made a significant
Speaker 1: discovery there UH and that discovery is going to be copper, gold, silver,
Speaker 1: and zinc rich which is in high grade, which is
Speaker 1: what Flint fond is known for a very very critical
Speaker 1: time for that community. And so right now again we're
Speaker 1: going to continue drilling there. We're gonna be following up
Speaker 1: also to the silver discoveries. But that was what drove
Speaker 1: that move. And as as just like I was mentioned
Speaker 1: in terms of a biotech stock, as we go forward
Speaker 1: and continue to drill and step out from that extra
Speaker 1: discovery hole and show the size of the deposit, then
Speaker 1: people can start really seeing, hey, the potential of what
Speaker 1: the discovery is. The rainbow discovery Manitoba, uh, and then
Speaker 1: the two silver discoveries in New Brunswick you know have
Speaker 1: and you know, and that's when you get a huge
Speaker 1: move in terms of equity valuation. And an explorer like ourselves,
Speaker 1: particularly callin X, has such a type capital structure with
Speaker 1: just eleven million shares out and some very very strong supporters,
Speaker 1: you know, within that scheerbase. So if I'm gonna summarize that,
Speaker 1: and then basically, you know, being being the the explorer
Speaker 1: is kind of the riskiest part because you don't know
Speaker 1: if you're gonna discover, but you're the greatest upside. So,
Speaker 1: just like most things of risk and reward, as you
Speaker 1: get further along, the price goes up. So you made
Speaker 1: a couple of big discoveries which brought the share price up,
Speaker 1: which now you're less risky, but if people jump in,
Speaker 1: now there's less upside. So as you get further along,
Speaker 1: back to your biotech example, as you get further along
Speaker 1: clinical trial, as you're closer closer, closer, the price moves up, up, up,
Speaker 1: and people can jump in. There's less risk, but there's
Speaker 1: less reward. Kind of a thing, right, and so it
Speaker 1: actually it's very unique right now with caln X coln X.
Speaker 1: When we were you know, as you mentioned, we traded
Speaker 1: to four dollars to share, but that's actually before we
Speaker 1: hit the discovery hole in Flint, Flont. We were just
Speaker 1: merely announcing we started that discovery hole in Flinn fund
Speaker 1: And in fact, now with you know calns trading roughly
Speaker 1: two dollars and fifty cents two thousand and sixty cents Canadian,
Speaker 1: you're able to buy the stock, if you're able to
Speaker 1: buy into these prices today at a cheaper price than
Speaker 1: before we actually physically hit on the discovery which is
Speaker 1: why you saw myself and in our team. You know,
Speaker 1: we we obviously can only purchase after we have a
Speaker 1: news go public um and you know we have significant
Speaker 1: blackouts during drilling. But you know, I was a purchaser
Speaker 1: of the stock and end of my own position about
Speaker 1: three dollars because I really did see us having a
Speaker 1: big move off of that base. And and you know,
Speaker 1: in my own own way, it's it also worked out
Speaker 1: better for me. I had to buy some stock a
Speaker 1: bit cheaper. But now is a very unique situation where
Speaker 1: you can buy a stock and actually a much higher
Speaker 1: evaluation before you confirmed and actually derisked it significantly. And
Speaker 1: now between now and our step out from that discovery hole,
Speaker 1: as I think, a tremendous opportunity to look at the
Speaker 1: stock uh and again because you know, when once you
Speaker 1: go out to confirm the discovery, which is something that
Speaker 1: we didn't you know, we've we've had a big hole
Speaker 1: in Flint Fund before in the company, in before we
Speaker 1: had any of the assets in Eastern Canada, we we
Speaker 1: had a discovery UH and you know the company went
Speaker 1: to nearly sixty million dollar valuation on that one discovery hole.
Speaker 1: So this time we've hit the discovery hole. We had
Speaker 1: the target going into that, which we didn't have in ten,
Speaker 1: with a much tighter capital structure because we restructure the
Speaker 1: company last year leading into this, you know, new wave
Speaker 1: coming and um, the market hasn't really believed that we're
Speaker 1: gonna it's been confirmed yet because we've hit a hole
Speaker 1: there before but haven't be able to confirm it. But
Speaker 1: this is a much different scenario. And I'm really really
Speaker 1: excited about the drilling campaign and that's underway there and
Speaker 1: that could be a big, big catalyst for us in
Speaker 1: the next month as we step out to confirm that
Speaker 1: discovery and in in Manitoba. Yeah, I love what you
Speaker 1: said there about how how you're buying your You hold
Speaker 1: a lot of the stock and you even were buying
Speaker 1: more more stock at that price. You know. One thing
Speaker 1: that I talked about is as investors and we're looking
Speaker 1: at the market, UM, I always like to look at
Speaker 1: the team because you know that takes a lot of
Speaker 1: the workout right, And one of the things that I
Speaker 1: look for in the team is like do they have
Speaker 1: skin in the game? You know, are they are they investing?
Speaker 1: Are they buying into their own company? Um? Can you
Speaker 1: tell us roughly you know what the kind of insider
Speaker 1: participation is with the company. Yeah, again, I own just
Speaker 1: under five percent of the company myself. My family collectively
Speaker 1: has been a big supporter in my career and their
Speaker 1: own roughly twelve percent across the board with you know,
Speaker 1: my family to extended families. So we're really happy to
Speaker 1: have that support. In terms of reformer chairman Mike Maslawski,
Speaker 1: remember the Canadian Mining Hall of Fame, Ban's just under
Speaker 1: five percent of the shares outstanding as well. Uh And
Speaker 1: so you know, forms of management, we do have a
Speaker 1: big stake in the company, and you know our board
Speaker 1: also has has positions. Our technical team have all been
Speaker 1: buyers in the stock more recently, but they're not filers
Speaker 1: per se, so that's not a but again, we all
Speaker 1: believe in what we're doing, and you know, I plan
Speaker 1: on creating a lot of wealth for myself and obviously
Speaker 1: my family that's been supporting me and my endeavors personally,
Speaker 1: and more importantly, we want to create long term job
Speaker 1: creation within these communities. That need is discovery and I
Speaker 1: think that truly in life is a rescue for success,
Speaker 1: much like yourself, Mark, I mean your professions to educate
Speaker 1: people to make people happy and you know, help their
Speaker 1: with their financial decisions. And the more people that you mark,
Speaker 1: you help them more successful. Marks point to be financially
Speaker 1: as well as probably how he feels about himself. And
Speaker 1: one of the things that drives myself is saving fun.
Speaker 1: Fun was one saving you know, the very high unemployment
Speaker 1: where you see in the bathrooms district and new runs
Speaker 1: like well Over pre pandemic. And you know, when I
Speaker 1: achieve those goals and our team achieves those goals of
Speaker 1: helping people, you know, our shoulders are gonna be rewarded
Speaker 1: and the we're big shareholders of that. Yeah, I h
Speaker 1: I love the fact that you have five percent, But
Speaker 1: I'm even more impressed that you got your family in
Speaker 1: a twelve percent. Because if you're gonna bring your Jewish guilt,
Speaker 1: who knows if you bring your friends and family and
Speaker 1: you better be doing good. I let deliver. I'll tell
Speaker 1: you that. You know, there's no question because the first
Speaker 1: people are gonna call you when something goes wrong, as
Speaker 1: your friends and family. It's easy to let yourself down, right,
Speaker 1: but man, and we let your friends and family down,
Speaker 1: That's that's a tough one. No, Well, I'm not. First
Speaker 1: of all, I won't let myself down. I mean, I
Speaker 1: you know, when the kind of the company got the
Speaker 1: baby got thrown out with the bathwater. You know, I
Speaker 1: when the zink price came down and we were known
Speaker 1: for calling the bottom of the zinc cycle in in
Speaker 1: ten making those acquisitions because there's a zinc component to
Speaker 1: those those acquisitions in Eastern Canada. Um. But when when
Speaker 1: I saw the company go down to three and Apple
Speaker 1: into our evaluation, I really said to myself, Hey, what
Speaker 1: am I doing with my own career and what why
Speaker 1: am I doing this? And again I stated why I'm
Speaker 1: doing this. We're doing this to make discoveries to help
Speaker 1: these communities. And uh and I said, you know, if
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna put my money where
Speaker 1: my mouth is and and put pretty much everything I had,
Speaker 1: you know, my age that I could into caln X
Speaker 1: and look forward to being rewarded with our shoulder basis
Speaker 1: we have success. But before now you talk about callin X,
Speaker 1: you know, copper, gold, zinc, silver. I mean, when I
Speaker 1: talked about it back in July, I think I was
Speaker 1: just talking about the silver, which I guess is those
Speaker 1: deposits that you made. Um, are you just like a
Speaker 1: general miner or are you really specializing in one. If
Speaker 1: I was looking at the company, what I considered a
Speaker 1: silver miner, a copper miner, a gold miner, or I
Speaker 1: just look at all of that, Well, yeah, that's what
Speaker 1: you know. A lot often times in the industry, everybody
Speaker 1: wants to pure play. They want to get exposure for
Speaker 1: this and then and quite frankly, I mean if you
Speaker 1: were to buy Apple, I don't think you're buying Apple
Speaker 1: just because they have iPhone. Uh. And a lot of
Speaker 1: people look at one key driver to drive something in
Speaker 1: their investment thesis. And that's fine if you're only looking
Speaker 1: for a leveraged play. But the reality is is where
Speaker 1: a v MS explorer. V MS stands for volcano genic
Speaker 1: massive sulfide deposits, and these deposits why I like them
Speaker 1: is because bloom or Bus, when a v MS mind
Speaker 1: goes into production, more likely than that it's going to
Speaker 1: stay in production. And that was a tribute to Flint Funds.
Speaker 1: You know, a hundred year almost track record, um. And
Speaker 1: that's because of the polymetallic nature of the deposits. So
Speaker 1: oftentimes when you're marketed a zinc story or a silver story.
Speaker 1: You know, it's particularly in silver. If you ever market
Speaker 1: a silver story, you should really go look at the
Speaker 1: by products from either zinc, lead or copper because a
Speaker 1: majority of the world silver production really truly comes from
Speaker 1: their copper dominant discovery or deposit or a zinc lead deposit. Uh.
Speaker 1: So again we're we look after these VMS deposits because
Speaker 1: they're high grade. They're polymetallic with a spread between base
Speaker 1: and precious metals. Uh. And again some of them be
Speaker 1: higher grades in various minerals and as supposed to others.
Speaker 1: For example, if you look at Nash Creek deposit itself,
Speaker 1: that's a zinc lead mindali minilization. But adjacent to that,
Speaker 1: over that very long strike extent, we hit the silver
Speaker 1: discoveries and a majority of that has discovered a silver
Speaker 1: which is tremendously rare to find, you know, silver dominant
Speaker 1: near surface and open pittable grades. And then moving over
Speaker 1: to Flinn Flon. Flynn Flon is known for the high
Speaker 1: grade copper gold uh the flint media Flint Flon area
Speaker 1: at the Triple Seven mine. But then you also have
Speaker 1: the zinc silver lead as byproducts so to speak for that.
Speaker 1: Um So, again, our discovery in the Manitoba as it
Speaker 1: stands today is is very copper rich, but also as
Speaker 1: significant precious metals components as well as that the zinc there.
Speaker 1: So you know, I don't like to say that we're
Speaker 1: one one metal company. I think you know, we're an
Speaker 1: exploration company that has a purpose and let's to discover
Speaker 1: a big economic deposits in proximity infrastructure, particularly where there's
Speaker 1: an immediate need for discoveries, because that really accelerates your
Speaker 1: ability to fast tracks your discovery. Yeah. Now I talk
Speaker 1: a lot about gold and silver on this channel, mostly
Speaker 1: because you know, the money falling apart in the need
Speaker 1: for like kind of back that real town money. But
Speaker 1: like we already already talked about, that's also going to
Speaker 1: push people back. Just two real assets commodities. UM I
Speaker 1: don't really talk a lot about copper. And since I
Speaker 1: have you on, maybe you can tell us maybe what
Speaker 1: you see as far as the cycle and copper. What
Speaker 1: are the drivers, like what are we expecting with copper?
Speaker 1: You know, I think copper and zinc are both in
Speaker 1: the you know, tight supply side markets and that's due
Speaker 1: to a really tough decade in terms of base metal exploration.
Speaker 1: When I took over klin X, it was actually a
Speaker 1: focus on graphite exploration in northern Manitoba. And so what
Speaker 1: are we doing here, Yeah, we gotta go look for
Speaker 1: these these base metals b MS deposits in flint Fall
Speaker 1: and beyond um and and again. Copper overall as a
Speaker 1: as a commodity though is is one of the most
Speaker 1: consumed metals in the world. It's often refer to his
Speaker 1: doctor Copper because when you can really look at copper
Speaker 1: as a bell weather to the global economy, if you
Speaker 1: want to see how the global economy is, you go
Speaker 1: look at copper because coppers are pretty much and every
Speaker 1: thing that you're using daily life between the electricity that's
Speaker 1: turning your lights on. So when you get in your
Speaker 1: car to drive to work. You know, everything in terms
Speaker 1: of the world is base metals is the building blocks
Speaker 1: of the global economy in a lot of ways. So
Speaker 1: in terms of copper, right now, you've got in a
Speaker 1: tight supply, but you've got steady demand growth, particularly out
Speaker 1: of China. Uh and you know, as you see the
Speaker 1: world continue to come out of this, you know, want
Speaker 1: to call it a recession that we're already probably in
Speaker 1: pre pandemic. But as we come out of that with
Speaker 1: all the stimulus going on, I do see the base
Speaker 1: medals performing very very well in tandem with the precious
Speaker 1: metal space. And I do think the government policy is
Speaker 1: going to be a key driver of that. And I
Speaker 1: don't mean for the money printing standpoint. Well, they're really
Speaker 1: really good at printing money. I hope that they're really
Speaker 1: really good at spending that money in a much better
Speaker 1: way than they have in the past. And I think
Speaker 1: that the way that needs to be done is to
Speaker 1: infrastructure spending. If you look at infrastructure spending is a
Speaker 1: key driver for job creation. Right you look at there's
Speaker 1: a great depression. How did the FDR get us of
Speaker 1: the Great Depression? I don't know, speaking in from an
Speaker 1: American standpoint, now, is infrastructure spending? You know, the interstate
Speaker 1: build out in the nineteen fifties, the build out of
Speaker 1: the national parks, all this type of stuff, you know,
Speaker 1: creates jobs. And it seem it's called the cous net
Speaker 1: cycle where we see job creation for twenty years. And
Speaker 1: if you look in terms of what China has done, um,
Speaker 1: China has used infrastructure spending to really facilitate the growth
Speaker 1: for the economy in terms of really the urbanization of
Speaker 1: their economy and their population, and then connecting their urban
Speaker 1: centers to the rural centers through their rail lines. They're
Speaker 1: Telegoni communication networks there, their highways, their ports, they're in airports.
Speaker 1: All that is tremendous base and precious medals and UH consumption.
Speaker 1: And if you look in terms of their one wealth'm sorry,
Speaker 1: one Belt, one road plan, you're talking an infrasture actual
Speaker 1: plan that's never been seen before in terms of its scale,
Speaker 1: connecting China and rebuilding their old silk Road so to speak,
Speaker 1: as they moved to the west. And in the United States,
Speaker 1: I know it's being a talking point, but I travel
Speaker 1: prior pandemic, I traveled the world quite frequently, and then
Speaker 1: one of the things I can assure you of as
Speaker 1: the infrastructure the United States needs to be updated as well,
Speaker 1: particularly in Eastern Canada, I think there's a total lack
Speaker 1: of infrastructure investments, you know, like in the profits of
Speaker 1: Quebec in particular, in that infrastructure spending is going to
Speaker 1: create jobs, that's gonna be I think something that bipartisan
Speaker 1: groups can agree upon uh and and again it's gonna
Speaker 1: see be something that everybody can look at and go,
Speaker 1: you know what, I see my tax sellars go to
Speaker 1: work and I can appreciate where it's going, as opposed
Speaker 1: to many of us that look at what's going on
Speaker 1: and think that the dollars are being flushed on the
Speaker 1: toilet right after their printed. And again, that's gonna be big,
Speaker 1: big for the base metal space. Yeah, yeah, I agree,
Speaker 1: And I've talked about that quite a bit that I
Speaker 1: believe that there is big infrastructure spending coming um in
Speaker 1: in my portfolio. I've actually been positioned for some of that,
Speaker 1: and we're starting to see some really good moves there.
Speaker 1: UM And I think regardless speaking in the US, I
Speaker 1: mean you did talk about the world in Canada and China,
Speaker 1: et cetera. But specifically in the US, regardless of who wins,
Speaker 1: we're gonna have that, and specifically if the UM if
Speaker 1: the Democrat Party wins, I mean they're trying to push
Speaker 1: this Green New Deal or the Biden Deal or whatever,
Speaker 1: and they're talking, you know, thirty to ninety trillion dollars
Speaker 1: of spending you have the that'd be real problem. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's gonna be a real problem as far as uh
Speaker 1: as far as what that's gonna do to the economy,
Speaker 1: but as far as the demand for base metals, right,
Speaker 1: So I know, I know, I mean, I'm just looking
Speaker 1: at the it's a very very big problem. I would
Speaker 1: be very very great for my life. But I'd say,
Speaker 1: you know, that amount of jeck going out there is
Speaker 1: is something that you know I would never want to
Speaker 1: see for my future generations. But that's exactly why you
Speaker 1: are where you are. And I'm even talking about putting
Speaker 1: this on a video because this is coming whether you
Speaker 1: like it or not, and everybody's going to be in
Speaker 1: jet the over this. And if you don't as an
Speaker 1: individual person, as you said the Robin had Trader taking
Speaker 1: responsibly for the future, if you don't make these moves,
Speaker 1: you're gonna be in the side that gets left behind
Speaker 1: and gets damaged by this. But if you position yourself right,
Speaker 1: so the economy gets wrecked but copper goes up, maybe
Speaker 1: I should be in copper and I can offset that loss. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know. I honestly, I've told some of my friends
Speaker 1: you know, I always plan on doing well for myself
Speaker 1: and and just really matter what I put my mind
Speaker 1: to you, I've always had that, and then I'm dying
Speaker 1: belief and wavering belief that we're gonna make these discoveries
Speaker 1: as well, um, putting a lot of ways COVID is gonna,
Speaker 1: you know, create the well threefold what I could have
Speaker 1: ever dreamt of because of the you know again what
Speaker 1: this is all set into place. You know, making a
Speaker 1: discovery is one thing, and then making multiple discoveries is
Speaker 1: a completely other thing, which I'm super excited about. To
Speaker 1: make these discoveries with the fore side of restructuring the company, tightening,
Speaker 1: the tightening that capital's structure up last year and really
Speaker 1: to put us in a position to catch that wave
Speaker 1: um with these discoveries, and then layering on what's going
Speaker 1: on in terms of globally monetary policy and fiscal policy.
Speaker 1: You know, that's what's gonna, you know, make the wave
Speaker 1: really swell in this scry um. It's the tsunami of money. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, to protect yourself, you're absolutely right, by your
Speaker 1: real assets is the way to go. And I'm obviously
Speaker 1: a heavily lever to that. Yeah, yeah, definitely, And so
Speaker 1: that's what I continue to pound the table on. And uh,
Speaker 1: you know, it is unfortunate that the majority of people
Speaker 1: are not going to do well in this money transfer,
Speaker 1: but the few people that get it right are going
Speaker 1: to do extremely well. I think you said three times
Speaker 1: extremely well. So um, that's why I continue to encourage
Speaker 1: people to do that. One other thing that I want
Speaker 1: to talk about because you have a background in it.
Speaker 1: I know you're not currently engaged in it, but talking
Speaker 1: about you know, potentially as Green New Deal or the
Speaker 1: Biden Deal whatever. And there's this massive push to renewable
Speaker 1: energy and so you know a lot of solar and
Speaker 1: wind and stuff like that, which probably also helped base
Speaker 1: medals UM. But there's talk and I did a video
Speaker 1: on this recently where really, you know, maybe wind solar
Speaker 1: isn't the best option, maybe we should take a look
Speaker 1: at um at nuclear and so a lot of people
Speaker 1: are thinking that uranium could be a good mining play,
Speaker 1: and I talked about mine in the lots. I could
Speaker 1: ask this question a lot, and I know you have
Speaker 1: a background in uranium. So what do you see happening
Speaker 1: in the world in regards to that? Uh, Well, in
Speaker 1: terms of uranium, I think uranium is gonna do okay,
Speaker 1: just given the back that again, my the thesis we've
Speaker 1: been talking about for the next greeps half hour really
Speaker 1: all ships rising, rising tide, and so I think uranium
Speaker 1: will do okay to that end. Um. But you know,
Speaker 1: I came to Canada on the pretense of uranium. I'm
Speaker 1: a big admirer of the country of Japan. I've been
Speaker 1: to Japan probably once a year over the past five years,
Speaker 1: and I'm really quite frankly, if I could go anywhere
Speaker 1: right now, would probably be back to Japan. But the
Speaker 1: first time I actually went there, and the reason why
Speaker 1: I went there was I really wanted to get a
Speaker 1: pulse in terms of one of the Japanese perspectives on
Speaker 1: nuclear reactors, you know. And the one thing about Japanese,
Speaker 1: if anybody's been there, is that Japanese overall have a
Speaker 1: great sense of pride um and that's one thing you
Speaker 1: can never take away from Japan there. The amount of
Speaker 1: pride that country has is something that's very, very unique
Speaker 1: that you don't see anywhere else. I in a lot
Speaker 1: of places, I should say, and you know, just mentioning
Speaker 1: Fukushima nuclear reaction to anybody that came across um that
Speaker 1: you could see was a big, big, ego hit right.
Speaker 1: It was something that they didn't like to speak about
Speaker 1: because of you know, obviously what it did to the country, UM,
Speaker 1: not just from the act accident perspective, but the global
Speaker 1: perspective of of howevere looks at Japan UM. And they
Speaker 1: had a tremendous amount of reactors come on offline because
Speaker 1: of that. And that's when immediately knew that the kind
Speaker 1: of mindset that the reactors were gonna come back online,
Speaker 1: I kind of strong order was was unlikely. UM. And
Speaker 1: so that's when I kind of personally turned a more
Speaker 1: negative outlook on on uranium. But on the again the
Speaker 1: supply side, I we always talk about demand and everybody
Speaker 1: wants to talk about, you know, the solution that uranium
Speaker 1: should have and should have on the baseload power. And
Speaker 1: I am a proponent for your for nuclear power. By
Speaker 1: the way, I do think the disaster that occurred in
Speaker 1: Fukushima was extremely unique and it went back down to
Speaker 1: a design flaw. Basically, your backup generators were located below
Speaker 1: sea level. Probably don't need that to happen, and it
Speaker 1: was all old technology and yeah, it's just a design
Speaker 1: flaw really and and that needs to be addressed, but
Speaker 1: you can't get baseload of power as cheap as you
Speaker 1: can everywhere else. But with that being said, what also
Speaker 1: is very unique about the power is the cost of
Speaker 1: fuel is very very inexpensive relative you're operating costs for
Speaker 1: the fuel relative to all other costs being equal for
Speaker 1: nuclear power. So I do think the nuclear plowers should
Speaker 1: have a place, but it's fighting overall public perceptions. Obviously,
Speaker 1: more of a trouble with nuclear power UM going forward
Speaker 1: in the fact that there's a lot of low cost
Speaker 1: production for uranium globally, particularly at the Kazakhstan where you're
Speaker 1: producing uranium eight a pound and the Russians. Basically, if
Speaker 1: you buy a new reactor from UM, it's cause ATA
Speaker 1: prompt uh. You know, they'll guarantee you fuel for your
Speaker 1: reactor for a decade, you know. And really it's like, hey,
Speaker 1: we're gonna give a spare tire if you buy our car,
Speaker 1: you know. So you know again, and if you look
Speaker 1: in terms of the discoveries out of the Athabasque region
Speaker 1: of Canada, there's some monster high grade discoveries, uh. And
Speaker 1: as US go online, you know you're gonna have enough
Speaker 1: uranium to feed in this whole notion about domestically source uranium. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think, you know, Americans can be rest assured that
Speaker 1: you can look north to Canada to get that feed
Speaker 1: in the future, while the Chinese have bought a lot
Speaker 1: of that. Um you know there there's more discoveries been
Speaker 1: made up there and that's just take on uranium. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So um it sounds like uh if I've summarize your
Speaker 1: view and and it seems like it does kind of
Speaker 1: line up with what I've been seeing, is that the
Speaker 1: demand side is still on its way down. I know
Speaker 1: in California we've shut down two of three reactors, the
Speaker 1: third one schedule to be shut down. As you said,
Speaker 1: Japan's pulling them down. Germany has been pulling them down,
Speaker 1: so we're kind of seeing them going down and probably
Speaker 1: haven't hit the bottom and definitely not going back up yet.
Speaker 1: So on the demand side is going down, and then
Speaker 1: you're talking about the supply side. We have an overabundance
Speaker 1: of supply and it's pretty cheap, so there's a ton
Speaker 1: of uranium out there. So that was another thing. So
Speaker 1: in terms of the the demand, I'd say demand is
Speaker 1: probably flat because you do have a lot of reactors
Speaker 1: being coming online in China. Uh, that's been a big
Speaker 1: thing is the reactors that they've built. The quality of
Speaker 1: those reactors that was that I can't speak to, but
Speaker 1: those are supposed to be coming on a lot. You're
Speaker 1: gonna be like kind of a situation where you you'd
Speaker 1: have a flat demand type situation. And then for a
Speaker 1: long time, there's been the down blending of the highly
Speaker 1: enriched uranium that seems to be never really ending. It
Speaker 1: was a twenty year deal that was supposed to end
Speaker 1: a couple of years ago. We're basically as part of
Speaker 1: the Non Proliferation Treaty or one of the treaties that
Speaker 1: you'd see the Russians down blend they're highly enriched uranium
Speaker 1: that was used for their warheads and there were thousands
Speaker 1: of them during the Cold War into a lowly lower
Speaker 1: enrichment of uranium that can go as a fuel source
Speaker 1: for reactors, and then that was sold to the United States.
Speaker 1: The down blended uranium for a number of decades. It
Speaker 1: is supposed to end, it didn't need just got rechanged
Speaker 1: and reject around. Uh. And you know, the last lobbying
Speaker 1: effort was trying to u get all this uranium source
Speaker 1: at the United States, which is quick really just not
Speaker 1: going to happen. So yeah, yeah, I would agree in general,
Speaker 1: but there is some demand growth out of China, but
Speaker 1: it's not going to be a you know, big move
Speaker 1: or demand growth like you see in electric cars for example.
Speaker 1: But there's a big missnomer in my opinion when people
Speaker 1: look at electric car and say, hey, look how clean
Speaker 1: it is, because they don't understand the whole business cycle
Speaker 1: in terms of how do you get to get in
Speaker 1: the car, and there's you know, a lot of energy
Speaker 1: intensity that goes into these, um, these green deals and
Speaker 1: these green technologies because it just doesn't happen by magic,
Speaker 1: you know, out of the thin air, right, and a
Speaker 1: lot of it um And I recently just did a
Speaker 1: video on this, I think last week UM talking about
Speaker 1: you know, the booming in electric vehicles and really what
Speaker 1: that means for every car needs a battery, and every
Speaker 1: battery needs minerals to go into it, right, right, A
Speaker 1: lot of copper, A lot of copper. So again right,
Speaker 1: so with uranium we see uh, too much supply and
Speaker 1: not enough demand. But with copper and gold we see
Speaker 1: too much demand and not enough supply, which is what
Speaker 1: we want to see as investors. So um yeah, with that,
Speaker 1: we'll we'll wrap it up and and I appreciate you
Speaker 1: doing that, taking the time to explain that klin X
Speaker 1: minds again copper, gold, zinc and silver um now again.
Speaker 1: I talked about it back in July. I think I
Speaker 1: think it's up six since then, but I'll go ahead
Speaker 1: and link to it down below in the description as well.
Speaker 1: Is there anywhere else people should go to follow up
Speaker 1: with you or or follow you or follow the company? Yeah,
Speaker 1: are on our website. The easiest is calin x dot
Speaker 1: c a uh and there you can get our corporate
Speaker 1: presentation or contact information. I'd always like to interact with
Speaker 1: different shielders and investors out there. I'm not too busy
Speaker 1: on the Twitter or anything like that. I'm really solely
Speaker 1: focused on making these discoveries. And and that's about it. Good,
Speaker 1: all right, Well, without we're gonna gohea and sign it out.
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for joining us today, Max, Thank you
Speaker 1: very much for having me. I've had a great time