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Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature feature production of iHeartRadio. I'm your host

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Speaker 1: of Many Parasites, Katie Golden. I studied psychology and evolutionary biology,

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Speaker 1: and today on the show we have a special episode

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Speaker 1: because I get to talk to someone from a zoo. Now,

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Speaker 1: this happens to be a human being, so we will

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Speaker 1: be able to have a nice conversation. There's some really

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Speaker 1: exciting news coming out from the Philadelphia Zoo and I

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Speaker 1: am very pleased to have with me today Lauren Augustine,

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Speaker 1: who is the director of Herpetology at the Philadelphia Zoo. Lauren,

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Speaker 1: welcome to the show.

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Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me. I'm very excited

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Speaker 2: to talk to you guys today.

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Speaker 1: I am. I'm super excited about this news. I don't

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Speaker 1: know if my listeners have heard it. But first, Lauren,

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Speaker 1: tell us just a little bit about yourself. What's your

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Speaker 1: role at the zoo and what kinds of animals do

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Speaker 1: you work with?

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Speaker 3: From the director of her photology, her patology is a

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Speaker 3: study of the creepy crawley so reptiles and amphibians, of course,

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Speaker 3: and so my job is to oversee the collection here

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Speaker 3: at the zoo, their animal care, the staff that take

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Speaker 3: care of them, and then are conservation programs that are

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Speaker 3: linked to those very special species.

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Speaker 1: I think this is something that's key when it comes

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Speaker 1: to zoos because there's so like as a visitor, you

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Speaker 1: get to see the animals and maybe you get to

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Speaker 1: see some of the presentations that happen at the zoo,

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Speaker 1: but there's a lot of stuff that's happening behind the scenes,

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Speaker 1: especially when it comes to conservation. So in addition to

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Speaker 1: actually taking care of the individuals at the zoo, taking

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Speaker 1: care of their health, their diet, there's also larger conservation efforts.

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Speaker 1: So you may have a species of animals that is

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Speaker 1: not doing so well in the wild. I imagine this

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Speaker 1: is pretty common in herpetology, especially with amphibians, and so

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Speaker 1: you also have a lot of efforts to actually help

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Speaker 1: animals that are out in the wild or preserve species

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Speaker 1: that are endangered.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, we do that in a lot of different ways.

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Speaker 3: We're really fortunate in her petology we get a large

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Speaker 3: diversity of species and so they come with a lot

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Speaker 3: of different needs. Sometimes we can meet those needs for

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Speaker 3: the species at our institution or through the collaboration with

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Speaker 3: other institutions, but a lot of times we are looking

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Speaker 3: at managing those conservation efforts in the field with collaborators

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Speaker 3: or directly through leading research projects, and so we get

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Speaker 3: a lot of different avenues to contribute to species conservation

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Speaker 3: through a modern zoo that takes a conservation first approach.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fantastic. So let's get right into the exciting

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Speaker 1: news you have. Mommy, the Galapagis tortoise has an announcement

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Speaker 1: to make. Lauren will be the one to transmit that announcement.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we're very excited.

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Speaker 3: Mommy's been at the zoo since nineteen thirty two and recently, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: we are proud to announce that she is a mommy.

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Speaker 3: Mommy has sixteen babies that hatched earlier this year from

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Speaker 3: two different clutches or groups of eggs that she laid

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Speaker 3: last winter.

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Speaker 1: That's incredible. How old is mommy?

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Speaker 3: So we estimate mommies around ninety seven years old, but

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Speaker 3: we don't know. She came right in nineteen thirty two,

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Speaker 3: so she's been at the zoo a very long time.

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Speaker 2: Ninety two years.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so she's at least ninety two years old,

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Speaker 1: if not, who knows a decade old?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, undready. Yeah, but is this a.

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Speaker 1: So, is this a miracle Galapago's tortoise or is this

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Speaker 1: something that Galapagos tortoises can do in the wild give

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Speaker 1: birth at such an old age.

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Speaker 3: This is something they can do in the wild, give

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Speaker 3: birth to such an old age. What's so amazing about

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Speaker 3: Mommy's story is that this is her first time. So

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Speaker 3: the fact that she hasn't reproduced until this age is

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Speaker 3: what's so incredible, and that it went so successfully really

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Speaker 3: is a testament to the long term care of that animal.

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Speaker 3: Right She's been in our in our care for over

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Speaker 3: ninety years, and so it's just a really great story

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Speaker 3: for Philadelphia.

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Speaker 1: That's fantastic. And I would assume this isn't the first

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Speaker 1: time that you guys have tried having her breed. It's

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Speaker 1: just this is the first time she's actually produced a

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Speaker 1: clutch of eggs.

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Speaker 3: So with Mommy, the interesting story for Galopagos tortuses in

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Speaker 3: general is that in the early nineties we did some

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Speaker 3: genetics work to identify the different species from different islands,

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Speaker 3: and so when we found out that Mommy was a

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Speaker 3: Western Santa Cruz Galopagos tortoise, we went through the process

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Speaker 3: working with our association to bring in a mail for her.

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Speaker 3: So we wanted to make sure we are breeding and

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Speaker 3: maintain that genetic lineage for that island species. And so

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Speaker 3: we had to get a Braso here who came from

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Speaker 3: the Riverbank Zoo to pair with her because he is

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Speaker 3: also a western Santa Cruise Island Galopagos tortoise. And so

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Speaker 3: that is the process of working collaboratively to maintain those

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Speaker 3: those really important genetics.

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Speaker 1: Right, because you can't you can't just take sort of

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Speaker 1: there's a bunch of different populations of Galapagos tortoises, and

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Speaker 1: so if you got a different Galapagos tortoise, they might

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Speaker 1: be able to set successfully mate, but then you don't

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Speaker 1: have that same wild lineage that you're looking to preserve, right, correct,

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Speaker 1: So that is so exciting. So how often do Galapagos

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Speaker 1: tortoises mate like, both in the wild and also in captivity.

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Speaker 3: So here at the zoo, because we are in a

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Speaker 3: temperate climate, right, it gets colder in the winter, we

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Speaker 3: have to bring the tortoises in. So every winter we

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Speaker 3: actually separate the male of braso from the females just

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Speaker 3: because of space and for a lot of other reasons.

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Speaker 3: So every spring we reintroduce them together, and so there

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Speaker 3: is breeding every year, the same thing in the wild.

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Speaker 3: As they come across each other in the wild and

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Speaker 3: through territories during breeding season, they will breed, so it's.

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Speaker 2: An annual event.

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Speaker 3: And then mommy laid actually three clutches of eggs her

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Speaker 3: first year that she produced eggs for us since meeting

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Speaker 3: a braso, and so they will lay eggs every year also,

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Speaker 3: So she did lay three clutches her first year, and

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Speaker 3: then two clutches this past year that resulted in these

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Speaker 3: sixteen babies.

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Speaker 1: It's because from my understanding of Galapago's tortoises is that

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Speaker 1: they it is tricky to get them to actually produce offspring,

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Speaker 1: particularly in captivity. Is it that the because it sounds

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Speaker 1: like the mating itself happens with some frequency, but actually

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Speaker 1: producing a clutch of eggs that are successful seems more rare.

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Speaker 3: There are so many factors that go into the successful

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Speaker 3: reproduction of a species in human care, and especially with

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Speaker 3: reptiles and amphibians. So sorry, I'm going to call out

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Speaker 3: that my tax are the best all the time, but

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Speaker 3: we have so many things that influence the success of

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Speaker 3: that reproduction, and it's not just one thing, so they're

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Speaker 3: all playing off of each other and it can be

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Speaker 3: very complex. So we have to consider the lifespan of

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Speaker 3: the individual, their age at the time of reduction, and

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Speaker 3: then their care, the UV light that they've been provided,

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Speaker 3: their nutritional status, their health status in general. All of

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Speaker 3: this plays into success. Also their stress levels, right, so

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Speaker 3: if they can't if they are nutritionally deficient in some way,

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Speaker 3: their eggs might not be fit to hatch. If they're not,

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Speaker 3: if they're overly stressed, they might hold onto those eggs

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Speaker 3: and and affect the hatch rate by not laying them

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Speaker 3: right away, or even the developmental rates. So there's so

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Speaker 3: many facets to this, which is why this is so impressive,

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Speaker 3: because it shows that Mommy's care over the decades has

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Speaker 3: been very good, that her stress levels are likely pretty low.

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Speaker 3: I mean, all animals encounter stress, right, but we have

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Speaker 3: this beautiful outdoor yard. We were able to give her

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Speaker 3: in a braso the ability to interact should they choose,

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Speaker 3: but her the ability to get away from those interactions

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Speaker 3: if she wants to.

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Speaker 1: Appropriates every important important in every relationship.

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Speaker 2: Yes, exactly, choice alone time. Choice. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So just the fact that she has appropriate nesting sites

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Speaker 3: that she likes them as well. You know, we as

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Speaker 3: humans can say, oh, this is great nesting for a

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Speaker 3: Galapagos tortoise, but she might not agree. So knowing that

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Speaker 3: we were able to provide her with those things that

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Speaker 3: resulted in the success yeats, it's definitely a complicated process.

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Speaker 3: And then of course the incubation of the eggs is

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Speaker 3: just adds on to it. And now the rearing of

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Speaker 3: the offspring. I mean nothing about this is simple.

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Speaker 1: So how do Galapagos tortoises in the wild incubate their eggs?

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Speaker 1: And is there a difference between the wild because of

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Speaker 1: course you're not on that Galapagos islands, so you can't

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Speaker 1: completely recreate those conditions. So then how do you do

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Speaker 1: it at the zooke compared to wild incubation?

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Speaker 3: Great question. And so these guys are whole nesters. So

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Speaker 3: they'll dig a hole and they'll deposit a clutch of

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Speaker 3: eggs or a group of eggs into the hole and

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Speaker 3: then they'll bury it back up and then they're done.

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Speaker 3: The eggs will incubate in the ground in the wild.

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Speaker 3: At a zoological institution, in general, we will dig up

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Speaker 3: the eggs and artificially incubate them. So one of the

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Speaker 3: major reasons we do that for galopagos tortoises is that

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Speaker 3: they have temperature sex determination, and so the temperature that

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Speaker 3: the eggs are incubated will determine the sex of the offspring.

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Speaker 3: So this is a really important part of their biology

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Speaker 3: that helps us as population managers. Now I can control

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Speaker 3: the number of males and the number of females I'm

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Speaker 3: putting into the population, which is an amazing asset when

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Speaker 3: you have a smaller population in a zoological institutions. And

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Speaker 3: so we do retrieve those eggs, but it also gives

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Speaker 3: us the opportunity to track their development and see where

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Speaker 3: and if we have challenges, what the problem or the cause.

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Speaker 2: Of those challenges might be for next time.

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Speaker 3: So we do need to track very carefully the environment

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Speaker 3: that we give these eggs. So temperature and humidity are

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Speaker 3: two key factors that we monitor very closely when incubating eggs.

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Speaker 3: But then we're able to track through the four month incubation.

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Speaker 3: It was a very long incubation the development of these eggs.

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Speaker 3: You know, try to troubleshoot any challenges and then wait

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Speaker 3: for these babies to emerge what was in a very

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Speaker 3: exciting moment.

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Speaker 1: So when like little baby birds are born, they will

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Speaker 1: kind of knock their way out of the egg with

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Speaker 1: their little they got a little ridge on their beak

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Speaker 1: and egg tooth. How hard is it for these little

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Speaker 1: baby Globuka's tortoises to get out?

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Speaker 2: They also have an egg tooth.

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Speaker 3: So reptiles have an egg tooth, yep, and they use

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Speaker 3: that to break through their eggshell. Yeah, and these tortoises,

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Speaker 3: they'll we call it pipping the first moment that they

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Speaker 3: break through the egg shell and then that's a yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's so cute. And then they did just stay in

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Speaker 3: the egg for a couple almost a week before they

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Speaker 3: fully emerge and hatch.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really cute.

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Speaker 1: It's a lot of work. I don't blame them, So

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Speaker 1: you know, you gotta take a breather after you're hacking

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Speaker 1: your way out of an egg. This is something that

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Speaker 1: I have talked about on the show a little bit,

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Speaker 1: which is the as I get a question a lot

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Speaker 1: from especially women, which is like it seems really silly

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Speaker 1: as placental mammals that we carry pregnancies and it's a

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Speaker 1: huge headache, and I very much sympathize with this, So

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Speaker 1: then why don't we as humans just lay eggs like

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Speaker 1: so many other animals do? And I think it's a

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Speaker 1: really interesting thing you bring up with the things like

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Speaker 1: changes in temperature and humidity, how much the environment impacts

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Speaker 1: the eggs. So one kind of cool thing that plus

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Speaker 1: intal animals did was that we create like a kind

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Speaker 1: of miniature environment for our offspring, which we can control.

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Speaker 1: As warm blooded animals, we control the temperature just like

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Speaker 1: you kind of do with incubating these eggs. I just

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Speaker 1: find that kind of this is kind of a cool

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Speaker 1: example of why there is a bit of a trade

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Speaker 1: off the eggs. Yes, they can usually have more offspring

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Speaker 1: at once. Maybe Galapaco's tortoises don't have as many offspring

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Speaker 1: at one time, but there are plenty of egg laying

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Speaker 1: animals that have so many offsering all at once. But

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Speaker 1: you can't control that environment as well, and so if

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Speaker 1: you have if you're a species of animal that likes

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Speaker 1: to invest a lot into one offspring, laying an egg

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Speaker 1: usually doesn't make as much sense or comes with more

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Speaker 1: risks when you're versus having the baby born live. So

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Speaker 1: that's just kind of a cool kind of application of

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Speaker 1: some evolutionary biology ideas. But in terms of the rarity

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Speaker 1: of Galapagos tortoises, why is it so difficult to breed

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Speaker 1: them and why are they relatively rare in the wild

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Speaker 1: as well.

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Speaker 3: Glapa ghost tortoises are critically endangered species, and they're island species,

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Speaker 3: and so it's really important to remember when you're an

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Speaker 3: island species that your populations are innately at a higher

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Speaker 3: level of threat because anything, a storm could come and

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Speaker 3: wipe out your population. The biggest threats usually to these

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Speaker 3: island species are human human impacts such as you know,

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Speaker 3: habitat degradation, but also invasive species. And so because they

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Speaker 3: have such a limited range and they're naturally smaller populations,

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Speaker 3: they are at a high risk of extinction, and so

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Speaker 3: that's why they are critically endangered. They are challenging to breed,

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Speaker 3: I think in the United States because we have to

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Speaker 3: move them around and they are very large animals, and

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Speaker 3: we have to get the right animals together in the

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Speaker 3: right conditions. You know, reptiles are very seasonally driven their reproduction,

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Speaker 3: and so being able to provide them the right habitats,

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Speaker 3: the right social dynamics, and the right, care is not

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Speaker 3: always very simple, so and moving you know, Brazos almost

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Speaker 3: four hundred pounds, moving him to Philadelphia was not an

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Speaker 3: easy feat. So that was probably the hardest part of

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Speaker 3: breeding these guys, to be honest. But they are a

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Speaker 3: very long lived species, which gives us a long opportunity

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Speaker 3: for each individual to get their genetics represented. So that

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Speaker 3: is one of the fortunate parts of the Galopagos toward

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Speaker 3: us and their biology.

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Speaker 1: That is the that is so interesting to me. How

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Speaker 1: I mean, I think we kind of as humans, we

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Speaker 1: tend to think about things in terms of our own lives, right,

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Speaker 1: so where we go through menopause and we know are

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Speaker 1: no longer fertile when we're seniors, so then to see

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Speaker 1: an animal like this, it just seems so strange to us.

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Speaker 1: But there's not necessarily our perspective, right of us going

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Speaker 1: through like having a long live span, but then having

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Speaker 1: a long chunk of our live span where we're not

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Speaker 1: fertilely reproductive is not necessarily the main blueprint for a

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Speaker 1: lot of animals. A lot of animals have really short

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Speaker 1: life spans and they're fertile for most of that lifespan.

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Speaker 1: The kind of the species that we do see in

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Speaker 1: the wild that have long life spans like we do,

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Speaker 1: and a long chunk of that lifespan where we're not

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Speaker 1: usually is another social species. So you know, for instance, elephants, Right,

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Speaker 1: so you have a lot of matriarchs there that may

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Speaker 1: no longer be producing offspring, but they're helping out the

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Speaker 1: youngsters who don't know what they're doing. So it's so

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Speaker 1: the fact that this tortoise is able to it has

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Speaker 1: such a long lifespan, but it also remains fertile. It's

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Speaker 1: not that it is weird. It's that we have a

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Speaker 1: specific kind of interesting biological clock which is not shared

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Speaker 1: by all animals on earth, particularly not necessarily by reptiles.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, what's really fascinating. They've done some research on crocodiles

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Speaker 3: and what helps the longevity of their fertility is that

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Speaker 3: they can shut their systems down, so we won't see

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Speaker 3: the same hormone spikes seasonally in a singly housed female

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Speaker 3: crocodile that we will see in a crocodile that's set

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Speaker 3: up with a male and that is reproducing. They can

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Speaker 3: shut their systems down, which can make them last longer. Right,

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Speaker 3: So for example, well, mommy didn't lay eggs for twenty years, right,

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Speaker 3: she didn't go through the process her being paired up

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Speaker 3: with a braso. The social interactions that is what started

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Speaker 3: her cycling again and got her laying eggs and moving forward.

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Speaker 3: So I think that's a really interesting part of it,

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Speaker 3: like an ectotherms biology, that these animals can kind of

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Speaker 3: turn it off and turn it on, which helps it

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Speaker 3: be a little bit of a longer lifespan.

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Speaker 1: That is amazing. I mean, it's and it's something that

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Speaker 1: is coming from like a social cueue, which is so

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Speaker 1: interesting where you can have these hormones kind of like

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Speaker 1: activated because she sees a male, not because she's there's

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Speaker 1: something in the water or her diet has changed necessarily,

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Speaker 1: although diet changes can also affect fertility for sure. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I another reason to be jealous of reptile

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Speaker 1: is that the control they have over their production. But

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Speaker 1: you do you see that in other species. You see

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Speaker 1: that actually in case gurus have some control over their

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Speaker 1: reproduction that you know. Sometimes it's like, you know, I'm

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Speaker 1: just not feeling so I'm going to freeze the development

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Speaker 1: of this embryo until I feel like things are cool

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Speaker 1: for me to have a baby, which is, you know,

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Speaker 1: if only, if only, we could be like that. But

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Speaker 1: that's that's so interesting. So that sounds like, given that

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Speaker 1: they are so their reproductive cycle, it's not like human

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Speaker 1: women where you know, during our reproductive years, unless we

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Speaker 1: use medical intervention, medication, we just have to have our

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Speaker 1: periods no matter what. They have some that they're able

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Speaker 1: to shut that off. So that seems like that could

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Speaker 1: be another potential challenge thought at a zoo because they

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Speaker 1: if they're not sensing, if they're not you know, getting

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Speaker 1: sort of the cues that this is a good time

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Speaker 1: to be reproductively active, they may not be reproductively active.

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Speaker 1: Are are there kind of ways like are there challenges

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Speaker 1: to actually like kind of convince her that, like, hey,

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Speaker 1: now's a good time to mate or to be reproductively active.

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Speaker 3: I actually think this is a totally fascinating part of

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Speaker 3: our jobs is that we really don't know a lot

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Speaker 3: about the social behavior of reptiles, and we're learning a

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Speaker 3: lot thanks to zoological institutions, and so some of the

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Speaker 3: research I've been doing on turtle breeding in general suggests

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Speaker 3: that the over attention of a male, so the males

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Speaker 3: don't just go breathe with the female one time, right.

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Speaker 3: They are very insistent and often there's a huge ritual

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Speaker 3: of nudging and mounting and circling that takes place as

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Speaker 3: courtship prior to copulation. And then this constant attention from

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Speaker 3: the males is anecdotally linked in some species to the

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Speaker 3: reproductive output of a female, so not just sparking the

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Speaker 3: female to cycle, but actually the outcome of those eggs.

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Speaker 3: And so that's a really interesting part of our jobs

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Speaker 3: because a lot of people would see that also as stressful.

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Speaker 2: Right, this male is hounding this female. In the wild,

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Speaker 2: he would come through.

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Speaker 3: Her territory, breathe with her and then move on. But

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Speaker 3: in a zoo, maybe she's his only potential mate. They're

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Speaker 3: sharing a habitat and a territory, and so he's constantly

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Speaker 3: breeding and reproducing with her, and so there's that stress aspect,

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Speaker 3: but also the aspect of that Potentially that's what is

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Speaker 3: going to lead to success. And so I think one

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Speaker 3: of the things that we're very fortunate about here in

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Speaker 3: Philly is that we have this large outdoor yard. We

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Speaker 3: have two go up and goos females as well as

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Speaker 3: two aldabra females. In with a braso so that he

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Speaker 3: can share his attention. When we did the first introductions,

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Speaker 3: we did observe them and do a behavioral ethogram, So

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Speaker 3: we had staff watching and observing a braso where was

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Speaker 3: he spending his time because we were very concerned of

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Speaker 3: mommy and mommy getting stressed out at her older age,

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Speaker 3: and Abraso did selectively choose to spend most of his

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Speaker 3: time breeding with mommy, but he did spread out the

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Speaker 3: love and we didn't see a lot of signs of

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Speaker 3: stress or indicators that we would want to separate those animals.

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Speaker 3: And so a lot of like really interesting social behavior

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Speaker 3: stuff that we really are just now on the cusp

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Speaker 3: of learning and reptiles is really fascinating.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that seems to be quite like that's the

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Speaker 1: over many many years, like hundreds of years of having zoos,

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Speaker 1: that seems to be one of the major shifts in

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Speaker 1: terms of modern zoos, which is understanding that the behaviors

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Speaker 1: of animals in captivity. You can't just copy and paste

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Speaker 1: animals from the wild, put them in captivity and then

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Speaker 1: have their behaviors all be the same. Like a lot

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Speaker 1: of misunderstandings about animal behavior comes from studying animals in

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Speaker 1: captivity because it's so much easier to study animals in captivity,

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Speaker 1: and it's I'm completely for researching animals in captivity because

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Speaker 1: it's a great opportunity for conservation and understanding animal behavior.

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Speaker 1: But what the mistakes that we used to make were

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Speaker 1: assuming that you know, you can have like a pack

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Speaker 1: animal or a migratory animal, or or or you know,

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Speaker 1: a tortoise with a really long lifespan and a large

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Speaker 1: area and then see the exact same behaviors in the

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Speaker 1: zoo that you would see in the wild. So I

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Speaker 1: think it is I think it's really important to know that,

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Speaker 1: like you know, today, like in zoo's I think there's

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Speaker 1: a lot more awareness of like, all right, we even

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Speaker 1: if we can't completely recreate the Galapagos Island within the zoo,

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Speaker 1: having the awareness of, like, okay, what are these sorts

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Speaker 1: of stressors that these animals might feel, particularly with social animals,

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Speaker 1: where you know, might you might see aggression in social

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Speaker 1: animals that are usually a lot more chill in the

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Speaker 1: wild when they don't have time alone from each other.

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Speaker 1: And so it's from my perspective, it seems like we've

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Speaker 1: gone from maybe misunder standing these things many many years

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Speaker 1: ago to now caretakers and researchers in zoos being really

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Speaker 1: aware of, Okay, we need to create an environment that

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Speaker 1: is not stressful for this animal and then to understand

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Speaker 1: why there might be conflicts among species in zoos. And

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Speaker 1: I think because I think when people think about reptiles,

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Speaker 1: they don't think of them as being particularly social, right,

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Speaker 1: Like they see a crocodile, it's like, well, it's just

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Speaker 1: sitting there, it's not talking to anyone, it's not groomed,

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Speaker 1: they're not grooming each other, so they don't seem particular Like,

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Speaker 1: I think it's easier to understand this concept when it

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Speaker 1: comes to maybe primates or something, right because you see

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Speaker 1: their social behaviors that are much more like our own.

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Speaker 1: But would you say, like in the herpetology department, like,

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Speaker 1: are there a lot of considerations made in terms of

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Speaker 1: the social lives of these animals.

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Speaker 3: So I think one of the things I've loved seeing

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Speaker 3: as I've worked through my career and moved institutions, is

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Speaker 3: that one we're not just offering more naturalistic habitats and

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Speaker 3: trying to elicit more natural behaviors, but we're also using

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Speaker 3: non natural.

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Speaker 2: Things to get the same output. Right, it doesn't really

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Speaker 2: matter how I.

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Speaker 3: Get the natural behavior as long as I'm listening it

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Speaker 3: because it's something that's healthy for the animal. And so

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Speaker 3: that's where enrichment and training are coming in to our care.

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Speaker 3: And I think the biggest thing for reptile keepers and

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Speaker 3: fimmin keepers is to first say, we don't actually know

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Speaker 3: and they communicate in very different ways in us. So,

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Speaker 3: like you said, it's very easy for me to look

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Speaker 3: at a primate and recognize play behavior or social behaviors,

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Speaker 3: but not so easy on a snake that's very old,

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Speaker 3: factory or using pheromones for a lot of it's communication.

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Speaker 2: I can't possibly evaluate that right.

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Speaker 3: So all I can do is use my observations and

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Speaker 3: develop metrics for evaluation that help us learn more and

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Speaker 3: collect data and then collaborate with other institutions that might

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Speaker 3: be seeing something similar or have maybe another a larger

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Speaker 3: sample size on that species. So I think it's one

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Speaker 3: of the most exciting parts of our job is that

435
00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 3: we're able to fill gaps in data on these species

436
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:08,760
Speaker 3: that otherwise would be unattainable.

437
00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:14,880
Speaker 1: Are there other endangered species that you are breeding at

438
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,119
Speaker 1: the Zoo, either within the Herpetology department or even outside

439
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:22,800
Speaker 1: of the Herpetology department. Is this sort of is mommy

440
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 1: really especialness is like kind of a unique event or

441
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:29,399
Speaker 1: do you have this breeding of endangered species happening in

442
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:31,240
Speaker 1: other areas of the zoo.

443
00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:31,880
Speaker 2: Yeah.

444
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:34,119
Speaker 3: No, we breed a lot of endangered species here at

445
00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:37,879
Speaker 3: the Philadelphia Zoo. In the Reptile department specifically, we have

446
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 3: a lot of different we call them species survival plans.

447
00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:44,040
Speaker 3: They're the way we collaborate in North America in the

448
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:47,639
Speaker 3: Association of Zoos and Aquaria to move animals around, like

449
00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 3: we moved to Braso here to have ideal genetic genetic pairings.

450
00:24:52,040 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 2: And so we have Vietnamese.

451
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,359
Speaker 3: Box turtles that we're working on breeding. We recently hashed

452
00:24:56,359 --> 00:25:01,199
Speaker 3: a dwarf crocodile. We have Chinese crocodile lizards. We have

453
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,240
Speaker 3: a lot of different species, a lot of different critically

454
00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 3: endangered species.

455
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:07,359
Speaker 2: That we're working on breeding here at the Zoo.

456
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:10,920
Speaker 3: To develop these genetically sustainable populations, but are then available

457
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:15,679
Speaker 3: for education for research, and then of course we collaborate

458
00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 3: in the field with a lot of them as well,

459
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:19,959
Speaker 3: and so they can be representatives for their species here

460
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,720
Speaker 3: at the zoo. We had an orangutan born a few

461
00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 3: years ago. Yeah, so we do. We work with a

462
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:28,120
Speaker 3: lot of different endangered species here and sometimes our role

463
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:31,160
Speaker 3: is just to house them until they're old enough to breed,

464
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:33,320
Speaker 3: and then we work with the Species Survival Plan to

465
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 3: move animals around and sometimes our job is to pair

466
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 3: them up and breed them. So it just depends on

467
00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 3: the species and the populations need at the time.

468
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,920
Speaker 1: For instance, for the baby Galapagos tortoises, are these going

469
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:47,240
Speaker 1: to are they all going to remain in your care?

470
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:51,800
Speaker 1: Are they going to go to other institutions? My sense

471
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:57,359
Speaker 1: is that it's usually conservation, where you have breeding programs.

472
00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 1: For releasing into the wild is usually quite different because

473
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 1: the problem is if you have a species that you

474
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,919
Speaker 1: have at zoo that you're raising, is that it's not

475
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: going to know necessarily how to survive. So you don't

476
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,720
Speaker 1: want to just send tortoise out there it's like, all right,

477
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 1: good luck, and then it might not thrive.

478
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:19,800
Speaker 2: So what.

479
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: Happens to these baby endangered animals after they're born.

480
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,640
Speaker 3: That's such a good question because we're actually fortunate reptiles

481
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:32,119
Speaker 3: and amphibians that we can have a direct release right

482
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:34,640
Speaker 3: As you mentioned, egg laying species generally have a lot

483
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,640
Speaker 3: of offspring, and so we use a technique called headstarting,

484
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 3: where we can rear the juvenile animal in captivity until

485
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:44,520
Speaker 3: it's a certain size and then release it. It has

486
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:48,680
Speaker 3: a much higher chance of success in the wild because obviously,

487
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,560
Speaker 3: for instance, tabpoles have a high rate of predation and

488
00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:53,680
Speaker 3: mortality in the wild.

489
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:54,840
Speaker 2: That's why there are so many.

490
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:57,919
Speaker 3: It makes sure some animals make it to adulthood and

491
00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 3: can contribute to the population. By head starting animals, we

492
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,959
Speaker 3: can give them that kickstart in the wild and guarantee

493
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:07,920
Speaker 3: more animals make it, or not guarantee, but increase the

494
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:10,879
Speaker 3: chances that more animals will make it to adulthood and

495
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:13,919
Speaker 3: then become reproductive parts of the wild population.

496
00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:15,720
Speaker 2: However, that does.

497
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:18,120
Speaker 3: Not mean that every animal that we're breeding in zoological

498
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 3: institutions is going back into the wild. There's a high

499
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:24,560
Speaker 3: risk of transferring diseases and a lot of other problems

500
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 3: that we don't necessarily want to perpetuate in the wild

501
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 3: without proper testing and quarantining procedures. So most of our

502
00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 3: populations are for sustainability within the zoological field. That allow

503
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 3: us to maintain those genetics if needed, and then also

504
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 3: to research these populations. And so these tortoises will not

505
00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:44,679
Speaker 3: go back to the wild. They will be part of

506
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 3: our North American population of western Santa Cruz Galapagos tortoises,

507
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:50,919
Speaker 3: which was forty four individuals and now is sixty so

508
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 3: really nice big kick yeah, in the population, and we

509
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,000
Speaker 3: will not keep them all. They will have to be

510
00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,639
Speaker 3: moved out in place to these get very large and

511
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,639
Speaker 3: live a every long time, so we will move them

512
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 3: out into the aza population at other zoos within North America.

513
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:09,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's and I think it is something

514
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 1: that is important for people to learn about, which is

515
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:20,360
Speaker 1: that zoos. Natural history museums there's a lot of stuff there,

516
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:26,080
Speaker 1: both living specimens and you know, not living specimens where

517
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:31,040
Speaker 1: it is preserving a lot of information so we can

518
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 1: look at DNA from an animal as this huge library

519
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:41,560
Speaker 1: of information. And you know, obviously with natural history museums

520
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:44,840
Speaker 1: the specimens are almost always not living animals, but you

521
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 1: still have like outside of the like display area which

522
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:51,840
Speaker 1: is for education and is amazing, I love it, but

523
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 1: inside sort of the archives, you have a ton of

524
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 1: stuff that is there for research, and also just to

525
00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 1: preserve things that you may not know what to do

526
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 1: with yet. Right, Like one of my favorite examples is

527
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:07,680
Speaker 1: a lot of museums have ear wax from whales, and

528
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 1: they didn't they didn't know what to do with these,

529
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:13,280
Speaker 1: Like they're these like hard chunks, they're almost like they're

530
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:17,360
Speaker 1: kind of like fossils, but it's just hardened ear wax

531
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:19,960
Speaker 1: from whales, And they had no idea what to do

532
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 1: with them for like hundreds of years, but they kept it,

533
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 1: and then finally some researchers realized we can actually like

534
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 1: cut into this and look at it and use it

535
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:34,960
Speaker 1: to understand better whales seasonal diets and migratory patterns. So

536
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 1: I imagine this is something that happens in zoos as well.

537
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 1: Like you are, you have the front facing part of

538
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 1: the zoo, which is educating people, letting people see into

539
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:50,360
Speaker 1: a world that otherwise they would not have access to,

540
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:55,720
Speaker 1: uh and kind of you know, allowing people to explore

541
00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 1: the their love of animals, which I think is wonderful.

542
00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 1: But then you also have just a massive amount of

543
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 1: information that is either being researched or there in case

544
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:11,040
Speaker 1: we lose some of these animals, so that we still

545
00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: have at least some of the record of these animals

546
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 1: in living specimens. So can you talk a little bit

547
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:24,640
Speaker 1: about that, like the kind of maybe unseen side of

548
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:26,400
Speaker 1: conservation at the zoo.

549
00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, So we do have a zoological information system

550
00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:34,320
Speaker 3: where we collect vast amounts of data. So while you

551
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 3: come to Philadelphia Zoo and you only see two Glopagos

552
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 3: tortoises or now you know, nineteen, are nineteen or contributing

553
00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 3: data to the overall forty.

554
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 2: Four that we have housed currently.

555
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:50,800
Speaker 3: But then just think about the number of Glophagos tortses

556
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 3: that we've had in human care in North America in

557
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 3: our history. And so every day the animal caretakers are

558
00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 3: collecting data, they're collecting important information on each individual here

559
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 3: at the zoo, and then these individuals and they become

560
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 3: part of a population and that amasses a large amount

561
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:12,240
Speaker 3: of data. And so this provides a repository right for

562
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 3: future research and for current research. We never know what

563
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 3: questions we're going to ask or what needs we're going

564
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 3: to have in the future, and what conservation issues might

565
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 3: come up and where that data might be super valuable,

566
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 3: and so often we're fielding research requests as as zoo

567
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 3: professionals from universities where there's a professor or a student

568
00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 3: doing their master's research and they would like us to

569
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:37,160
Speaker 3: share data with them, or they would like to come

570
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 3: observe our animals for one of their research questions. So

571
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 3: being able to provide that opportunity is huge.

572
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 1: This is a question that just occurred to me. So

573
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:48,720
Speaker 1: I don't want to put too much pressure on you,

574
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 1: but what, like, are there any really funny kind of

575
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:57,680
Speaker 1: ways of data collection? Because I've heard stories of the

576
00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:02,720
Speaker 1: very creative ways people have to, say, do fecal samples

577
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 1: at zoos or try to figure out, like, hey, whose

578
00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:10,600
Speaker 1: poop is this, and then using glitter or dye that's

579
00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:14,440
Speaker 1: safe in order to identify whose poop is this? So

580
00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:17,240
Speaker 1: is there are there any like really funny ways either

581
00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:20,520
Speaker 1: in general at the Philadelphia Zoo or within the herpetology

582
00:32:20,560 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: department where you guys have had to do really weird

583
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:25,240
Speaker 1: things in the name of research.

584
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:26,680
Speaker 2: Well, you named mine.

585
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 3: I mean for me, I did a fecal hormone study

586
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 3: with crocodilians at a different institution, but I had to

587
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 3: figure out how to get them to be markers in

588
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 3: their fecal samples.

589
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,560
Speaker 2: So that I knew whose species were each and one

590
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 2: way was dye. So and you don't want to use like.

591
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 3: A red dye, right because they will come out looking like,

592
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 3: you know, oh my god, what's proud animal.

593
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, so one.

594
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 3: Animal got blue dye and had very green poop, and

595
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 3: another animal got glitter. And that was hilarious because when

596
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,160
Speaker 3: I was feeding this crocodile one day, it kind of

597
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 3: went up to grab the rat that had glitter in it,

598
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 3: and it hit the rat and it just exploded like

599
00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:08,520
Speaker 3: a glitter bomb all over the exhibits. So that was

600
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:11,800
Speaker 3: a really fun day for me when I was like,

601
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:15,440
Speaker 3: oh my goodness, you didn't see that happening.

602
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,040
Speaker 1: And glitter gets everywhere, so everywhere probably still there to

603
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:24,000
Speaker 1: this day. Yeah, that's I love that. I mean, you

604
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 1: have to you have to get creative because it's not

605
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:29,760
Speaker 1: like you can't interview these animals.

606
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:30,080
Speaker 2: You can't.

607
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,360
Speaker 1: They don't use toilets, you can't have them come. Well,

608
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,520
Speaker 1: you can do labs on them, but if you're just

609
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 1: trying to let them live their lives and then collect

610
00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 1: their collect biological specimens from them, sometimes you got to

611
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: feed them a glitter rat. That's amazing. So Yeah, any

612
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: other conservation news, any other zoo babies or weird and

613
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 1: wild stuff happening.

614
00:33:57,240 --> 00:33:59,240
Speaker 3: No, I think the biggest news here is that we're

615
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 3: getting ready to you know, we've broke ground and we're

616
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 3: working on our new Bear Country exhibit and so the

617
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,760
Speaker 3: opening of that is going to just be phenomenal next year.

618
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 3: And we recently opened the Flamingo walkthrough, so that has

619
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 3: been a really exciting guest opportunity where you can walk

620
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:16,160
Speaker 3: in with some of our some of our flamingos.

621
00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:17,440
Speaker 2: Is a nice new habitat.

622
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:21,480
Speaker 3: So just you know, constantly progressing, moving forward, working with

623
00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,560
Speaker 3: a lot of endangered species here and doing our best

624
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,319
Speaker 3: to really push the needle for conservation and animal care.

625
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,279
Speaker 1: That's fantastic. And how are all the How are all

626
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 1: of Mommy's babies doing now? Are they all all good?

627
00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:34,480
Speaker 2: Yes, there's doing awesome.

628
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 3: We're really happy we have an exhibit inside the Reptility

629
00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:39,879
Speaker 3: Amphibian House. But in this nice weather, we've been able

630
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:42,400
Speaker 3: to get a group of them outside as well. So

631
00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:45,440
Speaker 3: getting them out in natural, full spectrum lighting is just

632
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:48,280
Speaker 3: really beneficial to their health. So we're getting them outside

633
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 3: and they're they're growing like weeds.

634
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:52,319
Speaker 2: I'll tell you that they're they're adorable.

635
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 1: How okay, just one more like these? How small do

636
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 1: they start off? And then like because they got to

637
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:02,480
Speaker 1: get to be around four hundred pounds eventually.

638
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:05,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, so they hatched around but you know, anywhere between

639
00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:08,480
Speaker 3: sixty and eighty grams, so like roughly the size of

640
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 3: a tennis.

641
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:10,440
Speaker 2: Ball right fit in the palm of your hand.

642
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:13,720
Speaker 3: And I mean they are going on five months, six months,

643
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:15,760
Speaker 3: the oldest ones now, and they've doubled in size.

644
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:23,239
Speaker 1: Wow, amazing. Yeah, yeah, I mean that's that's fantastic. Hopefully

645
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,960
Speaker 1: they will be big and cumbersome real soon. Yeah.

646
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:27,279
Speaker 2: Yeah.

647
00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:29,799
Speaker 3: It's one of the actually the really difficult parts is

648
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:32,480
Speaker 3: making sure they don't grow too fast because they are,

649
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:35,880
Speaker 3: you know, grazers. They're constantly ready to eat, and so

650
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,800
Speaker 3: one of the things we learned early on wearing giant

651
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 3: tortoises is that we don't want them to grow too

652
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:43,160
Speaker 3: fast because they'll end up with shell issues and arthritis.

653
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:44,200
Speaker 1: And that's so interesting.

654
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:44,600
Speaker 2: Yeah.

655
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:47,200
Speaker 3: So it's actually a huge job raising these babies. Like

656
00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:50,719
Speaker 3: we're weighing and measuring them every month. Our nutritionist is

657
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 3: amazing and she's really tracking their diet intake and what

658
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:56,560
Speaker 3: they don't eat, so we know when do we increase

659
00:35:56,600 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 3: the food availability to them. It's a really interesting process

660
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:05,200
Speaker 3: that is teaching us a lot about controlling our offerings

661
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:08,239
Speaker 3: to these animals. Because they are hungry and they are ready.

662
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 1: To eat, they will eat. Uh yeah, I I sympathize

663
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:14,600
Speaker 1: with that if I have a dog. I have a

664
00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 1: dog who would eat, who would eat herself sick if

665
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 1: I if I lit her so I can't. But she

666
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:23,799
Speaker 1: thinks I'm a monster for it, and that's just that's

667
00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:28,279
Speaker 1: just how it's gotta be. But I can baby Galapago's

668
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 1: tortoise give you puppy dog eyes when they're not getting

669
00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 1: enough food or they do. They just kind of look

670
00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:33,840
Speaker 1: eh whatever.

671
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:37,879
Speaker 3: They're just like air biting around like the staff are,

672
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 3: like they're hungry.

673
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:45,239
Speaker 1: That is that is adorable. Uh Well, before we go,

674
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,760
Speaker 1: we're gonna play a little game called the mister Animal

675
00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 1: sound game. Guess who's squawking? Last week, the mystery animal

676
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:57,359
Speaker 1: sound hint was this. You can find this animal in

677
00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 1: Kara Jaimo's book about sea creatures called Leaving the Ocean

678
00:37:04,239 --> 00:37:08,799
Speaker 1: was a mistake. We talked to Karl last week, so

679
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:11,120
Speaker 1: another part of the clue if you have not read

680
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:13,359
Speaker 1: the book is that it's not a bird and it's

681
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 1: not a superhero sidekick. This one is really really tricky

682
00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 1: if you haven't read the book. So I apologize. I'm

683
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:36,000
Speaker 1: I'm immediately giving you hard node for this. All right, Lauren,

684
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:39,920
Speaker 1: do you have any gifts? Oh my gosh, this is

685
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,879
Speaker 1: such a I would I wouldn't get this one. I'm

686
00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 1: just gonna I'm gonna come out with that. It's it's

687
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:47,120
Speaker 1: very very tricky.

688
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:50,480
Speaker 2: Leaning towards a marine mammal, but yeah, I don't know.

689
00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 2: I'm thinking like a.

690
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 1: It does kind of sound.

691
00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:59,799
Speaker 2: Like a he was eating a clam there, and that's

692
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:00,600
Speaker 2: where I went with that.

693
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:04,120
Speaker 1: It sounds it sounds like a happy sound, like a

694
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:07,880
Speaker 1: sea otter. But it's really fascinating because this is actually

695
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:13,680
Speaker 1: a fish. This is this is the sea robin. Congratulations

696
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 1: to Emily m Alaura W and Craig K for guessing correctly.

697
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 1: It is a fish that is able to make this

698
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 1: kind of like weird groaning, gurgling sound that you can

699
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 1: only hear as people. We can only hear it on lands.

700
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:32,920
Speaker 1: So this particular fish is very unhappy to be on land,

701
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:35,800
Speaker 1: so it is complaining, But yeah, fish do not normally

702
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,600
Speaker 1: make a ton of vocalizations. It was a big deal

703
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 1: a few years ago and we were able to actually

704
00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:46,600
Speaker 1: get some recording devices near coral reefs and found out

705
00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:49,960
Speaker 1: that there's a lot more sounds than one would expect

706
00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:53,359
Speaker 1: that are being made by the fish and by the

707
00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:56,200
Speaker 1: invertebrates that are living in the coral reefs. But yeah,

708
00:38:56,360 --> 00:39:01,920
Speaker 1: sound communication, except for with cetaceans whales, it's not usually

709
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:05,080
Speaker 1: going on with a lot of sea life. So it's

710
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:09,640
Speaker 1: really interesting when we find a fish, something that is

711
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:11,840
Speaker 1: not a mammal in the ocean who can make a

712
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 1: sound like why can't.

713
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:14,000
Speaker 2: Make this sound?

714
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 1: What are they doing down there? Onto this week's mystery

715
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,520
Speaker 1: animal sound. The hint is this, you may find these

716
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,800
Speaker 1: colorful animals at zoos, but they're not always in an exhibit.

717
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:31,280
Speaker 1: All right, Lauren, do you have any guesses?

718
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 3: Well, from your hint, I want to say, but I

719
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:38,000
Speaker 3: feel like when I've heard they sounded.

720
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:40,239
Speaker 2: More like cats than that did.

721
00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:45,319
Speaker 1: Well, you're absolutely correct, Will I will be bleeping out

722
00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:48,600
Speaker 1: your answer, but the listeners will know that you got

723
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:52,359
Speaker 1: it correctly. I have personal experience with one of these

724
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:55,360
Speaker 1: that showed up in my yard when I was a kid,

725
00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:58,760
Speaker 1: and so pretty, so amazing. These are all more hints

726
00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:00,560
Speaker 1: for you guys to have figured out. But like, it's

727
00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:03,760
Speaker 1: a beautiful animal and then it just makes the most

728
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:09,000
Speaker 1: god awful noise and shrieks at you. It's very intimidating.

729
00:40:10,360 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 1: And I have seen these at a lot of zoos,

730
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 1: and they're often just chilling out walking around. They're at

731
00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 1: the I know for sure they're at the San Diego Zoo,

732
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 1: and usually you can just see them kind of like

733
00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:29,880
Speaker 1: hanging out with the visitors. And I've never quite understood

734
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:32,799
Speaker 1: what they're doing there. I do, I'm pretty sure they're

735
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:37,919
Speaker 1: there purposefully, but yeah, they seem to just enjoy hanging out.

736
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:41,080
Speaker 1: So if you guys think you know the answer to

737
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,680
Speaker 1: this week's mister Animal sound game, you can write to

738
00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:48,760
Speaker 1: me at Creature feature Pod at gmail dot com. Lauren,

739
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:51,440
Speaker 1: thank you so much for coming on today. Where can

740
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:55,279
Speaker 1: people find more information about Mommy, about the babies, about

741
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:56,320
Speaker 1: the Philadelphia Zoo?

742
00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 3: Yep, well it's all over the news Mommy and her Baby,

743
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 3: but you can definitely find out moreation on our website

744
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:05,200
Speaker 3: and then obviously please come to the zoo if you're

745
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:08,400
Speaker 3: in the Philadelphia area such a wonderful place. The reptile

746
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,640
Speaker 3: house is open and the babies can be seen inside

747
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 3: and outside seasonally, and Mommy and abraso out in the

748
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:16,640
Speaker 3: yard as well when temperatures are ideal.

749
00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:21,439
Speaker 1: Amazing. That sounds so fun. I would love to see

750
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:24,440
Speaker 1: those babies if I was in the area. Maybe someday,

751
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 1: maybe when they're grown, I'll be able to see them.

752
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:30,920
Speaker 1: And thank you guys so much for listening. If you're

753
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:33,280
Speaker 1: enjoying the show and you leave a rating or review,

754
00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:36,799
Speaker 1: it's greatly appreciated. That does help me a lot. I

755
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 1: read all the reviews and I appreciate the feedback. And

756
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:42,560
Speaker 1: thanks to the space Cussocks for their super awesome song.

757
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 1: Ex Alumina Creature features a production of iHeartRadio. For more

758
00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:49,399
Speaker 1: podcasts like the one you just heard, visit the iHeartRadio app,

759
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:51,480
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts or he guess what why of you listen

760
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:54,080
Speaker 1: to your favorite shows. I'm not your mother. I can't

761
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 1: tell you what to do, but if I was your mother,

762
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 1: I'd probably dig a hole, leave you in there and

763
00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:02,680
Speaker 1: bury you again and just hope for the best. See

764
00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:07,759
Speaker 1: you next Wednesday. H