1 00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:06,360 Speaker 1: In the evening of September one, nineteen ninety eight, a 2 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:09,799 Speaker 1: fight broke out in East Cleveland, Ohio between two large 3 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: groups of young men. Many were injured, including twenty year 4 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:18,080 Speaker 1: old Ricardo Gray, who had been struck in the head 5 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:22,760 Speaker 1: with a pipe. When police finally arrived, they also discovered 6 00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:27,920 Speaker 1: that a young man named James Russell had been fatally shot. Eventually, 7 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 1: a narrative developed that Ricardo Gray had returned after the 8 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: fight to exact revenge, leading to a sentence of twenty 9 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:36,560 Speaker 1: three to life. 10 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:38,839 Speaker 2: But this is wrongful conviction. 11 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 1: Wrongful conviction has always given voice to innocent people in prison, 12 00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 1: and now we're expanding that voice to you. Call us 13 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 1: at eight three three two o seven four six sixty 14 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: six and tell us how these stories make you feel 15 00:00:57,880 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 1: and what you've done to help the cause, even if 16 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: it's something as simple as telling a friend or sharing 17 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:06,480 Speaker 1: on social media, and you might just hear yourself in 18 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,920 Speaker 1: a future episode. Call us A three three two o 19 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 1: seven four six sixty six. 20 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 3: Hello, this is a free call from Carl, an inmate 21 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 3: at the North Central Correctional Institution. To accept this free call, 22 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:33,480 Speaker 3: press zero to refuse this free call, hang up or 23 00:01:33,520 --> 00:01:36,040 Speaker 3: press one. Thank you for using GTL. 24 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: Welcome back to wrongful Conviction and calling in today from 25 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:43,720 Speaker 1: an Ohio maximum security facility, we have Ricardo Gray on 26 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:47,320 Speaker 1: the line to share his story, another wrongful conviction out 27 00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:50,560 Speaker 1: of Cuyahoga County, where it appears the only evidence against 28 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 1: him was fabricated witness testimony. So we hope to see 29 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 1: his release really soon. 30 00:01:56,520 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 2: Ricardo. 31 00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 1: I'm sorry you're here because of everything you've gone through 32 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: and are going through. 33 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 2: But thank you for joining us here today. 34 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 4: I appreciate you myself. 35 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:09,880 Speaker 1: And joining him. The person who's trying to bring about 36 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 1: justice in this case, Kim Krawl, Kim, thank you for taking. 37 00:02:14,320 --> 00:02:14,920 Speaker 2: Up this fight. 38 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 5: Yeah, thanks for doing what you do now. 39 00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 1: Cleveland, Ohio, of course, is one of the absolute hotbeds 40 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:26,359 Speaker 1: of wrongful convictions in this country. But before we get 41 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: into how Ricardo's case is emblematic of that ongoing tragedy, 42 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:34,519 Speaker 1: we want to know a bit about your life before 43 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: all of this madness took place. 44 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:40,640 Speaker 4: I grew up in Cleveland, Ohio with my mom and 45 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:43,560 Speaker 4: my dad. I got an older sister. We're staying on 46 00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 4: Barlett one hundred and forty third and Barlet. My mother 47 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 4: and father they had their own house down there. I 48 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 4: had a sweet grandmom. I think that's where I get 49 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:54,360 Speaker 4: all my kind from Kai. Her clothes off your back 50 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:59,679 Speaker 4: is if you needed it. Yeah. My father got incarcerating 51 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 4: when I'm I was like fourteen for like seven years. 52 00:03:04,520 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 4: You know, that's when I really needed him in my life. 53 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,680 Speaker 4: And then my cousin had got killed two in the 54 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 4: same year my father went to jail. He was older, 55 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 4: you know, I looked up to him like a brother. 56 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 4: His name was y'all real Gray. He went to Kent 57 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:21,560 Speaker 4: State University too. I didn't graduate from high school. I 58 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:23,200 Speaker 4: dropped out of school when I was in like the 59 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:25,639 Speaker 4: eleventh grade. I was in the streets for real. I 60 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:27,639 Speaker 4: ain't gonna lie. I was in the streets. I had 61 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 4: had a family to take care of. My mama needed me, 62 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:34,040 Speaker 4: my baby, mama and my daughter. I mean I had 63 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 4: to take care of them. 64 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 1: And not only did Riccardo Field responsible for his mother, 65 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:40,200 Speaker 1: but he had also started his own family with his girlfriend, 66 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 1: Denika James. 67 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, we just had one daughter together, Carriel. You know, 68 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:48,200 Speaker 4: we got together high school. We was together for about 69 00:03:48,240 --> 00:03:52,400 Speaker 4: five years. We stayed in Warreneville Heights, So I wasn't 70 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 4: really in the neighborhood no more for real, messing with 71 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:57,880 Speaker 4: the guys seemed like once I got my life together, 72 00:03:57,960 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 4: they was mad at me for real. 73 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 1: Now. Warrensville Heights was about five miles away from Lacarda's 74 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:07,120 Speaker 1: old neighborhood along Bartonell Avenue around East one hundred and 75 00:04:07,160 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 1: forty third Street, and his friends there had a contentious 76 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: relationship with the guys up on Kinsman Road, about a 77 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 1: half a mile away. 78 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:16,920 Speaker 4: We right up the street from each other. We always 79 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 4: ended up getting to it with each other about something 80 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 4: about nothing for real, but if they make it something. 81 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,719 Speaker 4: We either playing basketball with each other, football. You know. 82 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:29,799 Speaker 4: It was just a neighborhood thing, just boys being boys. 83 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 4: Growing up, everybody wanted to be hard for real, that's all. 84 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:34,840 Speaker 4: I wanted to have a name for they self. 85 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,040 Speaker 1: With his new responsibilities, Ricardo had been keeping to himself, 86 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 1: raising his daughter, who was not even two years old 87 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: yet when the crime in question occurred back on September one, 88 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty eight. 89 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:48,920 Speaker 4: I just happened to come into a neighborhood one day. 90 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 4: You know, they was having a little cookout in the neighborhood, 91 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:53,520 Speaker 4: so I just wanted to show the guys. It was 92 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 4: still love. So it's probably about eight thirty. Somebody come 93 00:04:57,080 --> 00:04:58,920 Speaker 4: back there and the cookout and say, he just got 94 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 4: jumped one of my guys, Mike, it just jumped by 95 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:04,479 Speaker 4: one of the Kingsman. God, it ain't that far from 96 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 4: where we was at. It's right up the street. It 97 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:09,599 Speaker 4: had to be about ten or fifteen of us. So 98 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 4: we'll go up there on one hundred and forty thirty 99 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:16,760 Speaker 4: Kinsman Today neighborhood. It had to be about twenty or 100 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 4: thirty of them. 101 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:22,040 Speaker 6: So the police report says, at approximately twenty one hundred hours, 102 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:25,160 Speaker 6: a group of approximately sixty mails began to congregate at 103 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 6: the parking lot at the corner of East one forty 104 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 6: thirty Kinsmen. Trouble had been brewing between a group of 105 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 6: juveniles from Bartlett Avenue and the group from Kinsmen. A 106 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 6: fight started and for approximately one half hour, he heard 107 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:36,919 Speaker 6: random shots and bottles breaking. 108 00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 4: You wanted to fight? I got hit with a pole 109 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:42,160 Speaker 4: on the right side of my face. Dude knocked me out. 110 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:45,320 Speaker 4: I don't even know who would me. That's the crazy part. Well, 111 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:47,720 Speaker 4: my God told me, man, once you sail down, I'll 112 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 4: picked you up and dragged you to Marquise Dugley car 113 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:53,840 Speaker 4: and drove me to the hospital. At the hospital, I 114 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,680 Speaker 4: made a police report, so I really ain't really know 115 00:05:56,760 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 4: what really happened until I came back and my friends 116 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:01,479 Speaker 4: told me what happened at the lift. 117 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 2: You know. 118 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 4: They told me that God Benny got the shooting and 119 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 4: everybody ran. 120 00:06:06,920 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 1: A guy named Benny, whose last name didn't surface until 121 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: many years later, was alleged to have fired into the crowd. 122 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:17,640 Speaker 1: Everyone scattered away, and a young man named James D. 123 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:22,479 Speaker 1: Russell was dead. Detective Cipo and Kovac arrived after his 124 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:25,880 Speaker 1: body had been transported, and they began to get the statements. 125 00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:30,280 Speaker 6: We have a statement from Edward McDowell, Edward Harris, Gary Blanchard, 126 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:35,039 Speaker 6: and from deneen Joy Smith. Edward Harris reported being outside 127 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 6: when the shooting started, but not observing anyone who was 128 00:06:37,920 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 6: doing the shooting. 129 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 5: He was just told by neighbors to go in the house. 130 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 6: Edward McDowell says he was involved in a fight with 131 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:47,280 Speaker 6: the males from Bartlett Avenue when he heard gunshots. At 132 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 6: this time, the fight broke up and everybody ran. He 133 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:52,480 Speaker 6: didn't see who was doing the shooting. Gary Blanchard says 134 00:06:52,839 --> 00:06:54,599 Speaker 6: he went out on his front porch with a blow, 135 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 6: interviewed female he lives with, and saw the victim lying 136 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,599 Speaker 6: face down in the bushes on the side of his residence. 137 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:01,919 Speaker 6: Left the poetry and went down to the victim and 138 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:04,320 Speaker 6: turned him over and noticed he was bleeding and foaming 139 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:05,920 Speaker 6: at the mouth. He then told his wife to call 140 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 6: nine one one. Almost immediately police began to arrive. He 141 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:10,800 Speaker 6: stated he recognized the male from the area, but did 142 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:12,840 Speaker 6: not know his name. He described as a shooter as 143 00:07:12,880 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 6: having an afro haircut and wearing a white T shirt 144 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 6: and blue jeans. He saw this male running toward Kinsmen, 145 00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 6: and that last piece of information was never disclosed. 146 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 4: So I couldn't never question Blanchard about the guy he's seeing. 147 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:30,240 Speaker 4: He identified the same guy at my witnesses identified at 148 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:33,840 Speaker 4: my trial, dude with a short afro haircut, blue jeans 149 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 4: with a white T shirt on. He said he was 150 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 4: the shooter he's seen he run towards Kensmen. But see, 151 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:42,520 Speaker 4: they never went to the Barlett group and questioned them 152 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:45,560 Speaker 4: about what happened. And I didn't know Benny's full name. 153 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:47,680 Speaker 4: Did none of my guys know Benny fool name, And 154 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 4: they were scared to talk to the police because you know, 155 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:52,240 Speaker 4: snitching people retaliate for that, you know. 156 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:56,040 Speaker 1: So while the Kinsman guys who were initially interviewed omitted 157 00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:58,720 Speaker 1: the shooter's name, they were at least in agreement with 158 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 1: the Bartlet guys that the fight had ended when shots 159 00:08:01,240 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: were fired. Only two young men said otherwise, Anthony Mixon 160 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:08,120 Speaker 1: and Arthur Jackson, who were interviewed the following day by 161 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: a new lead detective on the case. 162 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 4: Death, Detective Beaman. He the one that got the statements 163 00:08:12,800 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 4: from Nixon and Jackson, but see Detective Cepo and his partner. 164 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 4: They was the first ones to the crime scene, but 165 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 4: in the next day they started to change. The statements changed, so. 166 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 1: It appears the statements gathered by Sipo and Kovak were 167 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 1: ignored and may have been hidden, and Beamon focused on 168 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 1: the statements from Mixing and Jackson, who claimed that the 169 00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:38,080 Speaker 1: shooting happened long after the fight, conveniently, when all the 170 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:41,520 Speaker 1: other witnesses were gone and Ricardo Gray had been released 171 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 1: from the hospital. 172 00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 4: They said, I did and came back on a bike 173 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 4: and shot down the street and instruct the victim. 174 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:53,040 Speaker 6: Arthur Jackson says he was walking northbound from Kinsman in 175 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 6: company with his friend Mike, last name unknown, and the victim. 176 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 6: He then observed a mail he knows by the name 177 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:00,880 Speaker 6: of Ricardo Gray riding a mountain bike on his and 178 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 6: began shooting at them. He says, as he, Mike and 179 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:05,640 Speaker 6: the victim ran, they separated. The victim ran on the 180 00:09:05,720 --> 00:09:07,440 Speaker 6: right side of the street and Mike on the left. 181 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:09,880 Speaker 6: He reports hearing bullets buzzing by his head while running. 182 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:13,920 Speaker 1: Anthony Mixon claimed that he saw Ricardo ride passed him 183 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:16,559 Speaker 1: on a bike, pull out a nine millimeter and fire 184 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:18,640 Speaker 1: fourteen rounds of the guys from Kinsman. 185 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:21,160 Speaker 6: And what we now know is that the shooter was 186 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:26,440 Speaker 6: from the group that was with both Mixon and Arthur Jackson. 187 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:29,559 Speaker 6: And so one, they have an interest in protecting kind 188 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 6: of their own boy. But two, they had their own 189 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:37,600 Speaker 6: legal issues. They had issues with parole and probation, and 190 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 6: they were subject to pressure and threats by police. 191 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:44,480 Speaker 4: Next to you know, I hear it's a warm out 192 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 4: for my risk, my family telling me just wait, don't 193 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 4: turn myself in. So you know, I'm listening to my family. 194 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 4: We get a lawyer ail me to Johnson and when 195 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 4: the crazy party is I asked my lawyer at the time. 196 00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:59,160 Speaker 4: Was there a warrm for my risk? She said, no, 197 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,079 Speaker 4: I diin't know wrong, So you know, I went on living. 198 00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:05,319 Speaker 4: They came and got me in November. I was at 199 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:09,080 Speaker 4: my baby mother house, their mama house, and they came 200 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:11,960 Speaker 4: in there. They kicked the goe in and everything, came 201 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:13,120 Speaker 4: in there and got me. 202 00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:26,960 Speaker 2: You're listening to Wrong for Conviction. You can listen to 203 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:27,400 Speaker 2: this and. 204 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:30,080 Speaker 1: All the Lava for Good podcasts one week early and 205 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 1: ed free by subscribing to Lava for Good Plus on 206 00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:34,760 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts. 207 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:44,160 Speaker 4: I'm in the county jail trying to put my defense 208 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:48,200 Speaker 4: together and everything. I gave him three witnesses names that 209 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 4: was there. But I had a speedy try. They tried 210 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:54,760 Speaker 4: me within ninety days, and that wasn't enough time for 211 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 4: my lawyer to really investigate my case for real. 212 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:01,160 Speaker 6: It's very hard, especially from neighborhoods like this, to get 213 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:04,880 Speaker 6: people to come to testify on your behalf. It's very 214 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:09,520 Speaker 6: difficult to get anyone to come forward in situations like 215 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:12,120 Speaker 6: this because the police of the ability to put pressure 216 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:15,080 Speaker 6: on everybody. Everybody was there for a fight. Everybody is 217 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 6: susceptible to like threats of charges police intimidation, and so 218 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:22,319 Speaker 6: he has three witnesses who come forward who are consistent 219 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,560 Speaker 6: he was hit with a poll He was rendered unconscious. 220 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:27,319 Speaker 5: And he had to be treated at the hospital. 221 00:11:27,800 --> 00:11:30,559 Speaker 4: You know, when you get assaulted the hospital, they automatically 222 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:33,600 Speaker 4: call the police and they come make a report. So 223 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:37,560 Speaker 4: the police report spells my first name wrong, put Richard 224 00:11:37,880 --> 00:11:40,920 Speaker 4: instead of Ricardo. They used that against me and said 225 00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:43,720 Speaker 4: I was trying to falsify my name. And you know 226 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:47,319 Speaker 4: I got the same address, It got my last name. 227 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:49,600 Speaker 4: He just didn't know how to spell my damn name. 228 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:51,920 Speaker 4: That's what it all boiled down to. They put it 229 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 4: on me. Look, he's gave the wrong name. His named Ricardo. 230 00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 4: He gave him the name Richard with the same address 231 00:11:58,160 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 4: and everything. Come on. 232 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:03,560 Speaker 1: Now, regardless of the effort to discredit this alibi evidence, 233 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:06,320 Speaker 1: it didn't matter. They had changed the timeline of the 234 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:09,440 Speaker 1: shooting to have occurred long after the fight, rendering this 235 00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 1: alibi mood. 236 00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:13,040 Speaker 4: See, they knew I could prove I was hit with 237 00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:15,520 Speaker 4: a pole during the fight, so it couldn't have been me. 238 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 4: See when I couldn't prove that the victim was shot 239 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:20,959 Speaker 4: during the fight and shots was fired doing to fight 240 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:23,720 Speaker 4: I couldn't dispute what they were saying at my trial 241 00:12:23,840 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 4: that I came back. 242 00:12:25,160 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 5: Yeah. 243 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 6: Anthony Mixon testified that Ricardo Gray road passed him on 244 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:31,200 Speaker 6: a bike and pulled out a weapon that appeared to 245 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 6: be a nine milimeter and then watched him fire approximately 246 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:38,880 Speaker 6: fourteen rounds. Arthur Jackson also testified that Ricardo Gray shot 247 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:41,560 Speaker 6: at him and his friends that Gray rode toward them 248 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 6: on the bike. Those are really the only two fact 249 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 6: witnesses from. 250 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 4: The state see the original investigative report, and two other 251 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:51,920 Speaker 4: witnesses indicate that the shots was fired during to fight 252 00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:54,679 Speaker 4: and everybody ran, so that's why they had to with 253 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 4: told that evidence. 254 00:12:56,480 --> 00:12:59,640 Speaker 1: It appears that the original police reports from Kovac and 255 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:03,120 Speaker 1: c Bote, with the statements confirming the defense timeline of 256 00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:07,079 Speaker 1: the shooting, were either hidden from the defense or Ricardo's 257 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:10,440 Speaker 1: attorney neglected to use them to impeach Mixon and Jackson 258 00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 1: or raise Gary Blanche's original statement. 259 00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:16,520 Speaker 6: When he got on the stand, Gary Blanchard testified that 260 00:13:16,679 --> 00:13:18,679 Speaker 6: when he heard the shots, I was outside when the 261 00:13:18,760 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 6: first ones. That's when I went into the house. While 262 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:23,600 Speaker 6: you were in your house, you heard more shots fired. Yes, 263 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:26,839 Speaker 6: did you ever see the person who was firing the shots. No, 264 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:28,880 Speaker 6: I was in my house with a door closed. 265 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:31,560 Speaker 1: But that's not what he told police on the night 266 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 1: of the shooting. 267 00:13:32,559 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 6: And that's why it would have been crucially important to 268 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:36,199 Speaker 6: have this statement that he made to police saying he 269 00:13:36,280 --> 00:13:39,080 Speaker 6: saw someone running, describe what they looked like, and believed 270 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:39,839 Speaker 6: them to be the shooter. 271 00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:44,480 Speaker 1: However, Ricardo's alibi witnesses also testified about the alternate timeline 272 00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:45,760 Speaker 1: and suspect Benny. 273 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:50,959 Speaker 4: My three witnesses, London Heeljanmes Thomas and Sharon Williams that 274 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 4: was there. They witnessed Benny do it, but they didn't 275 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:58,080 Speaker 4: know was last name. So you know, the prosecutor told 276 00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:01,280 Speaker 4: the jury they made this name up. This guy doesn't 277 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:02,000 Speaker 4: even exist. 278 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:07,040 Speaker 1: According to the prosecutor, Benny didn't even exist, and Ricardo's 279 00:14:07,080 --> 00:14:10,319 Speaker 1: witnesses were his friends, the kind of testimony that is 280 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:15,920 Speaker 1: routinely discredited for proximity to the defendant, while Mixing and 281 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 1: Jackson's testimony went unchallenged. 282 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:21,960 Speaker 4: We're so crazy. Once Offor Jason testified at my trial, 283 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 4: they took me back to the county jail and I 284 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 4: remember one of the sheriffs said, I knew he was lying, 285 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:29,080 Speaker 4: But I. 286 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:33,040 Speaker 1: Guess the jury didn't pick up on what was so 287 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: obvious to that sheriff. On February eighteenth, nineteen ninety nine, 288 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: Ricardo was convicted and Judge Nancy McDonald sentenced him to 289 00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:43,640 Speaker 1: five years for assault, three years for the weapons charge, 290 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 1: and fifteen to life for murder, to run consecutively, adding 291 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:49,920 Speaker 1: up to a total of twenty three years to life. 292 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 4: If I'd have had all these facts I got now, 293 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:54,880 Speaker 4: it ain't no way they would either had a trial 294 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:58,160 Speaker 4: against me. You know, didn't nobody look me in I 295 00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 4: they just found me kuilty. Shit broke my soul. 296 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:02,760 Speaker 2: That tore me up. 297 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 4: For a minute, you have one minute remaining here, right, 298 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:11,480 Speaker 4: I'm still in this damn place, man. But I got 299 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 4: all the facts to prove what the hell going on, 300 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:29,800 Speaker 4: and I'm still in here. They sent me strike to Lucasville, 301 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:34,160 Speaker 4: twenty years old. Man, with all these killers and racists. 302 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:36,920 Speaker 4: That's all they was doing was racist dudes down there. Man, 303 00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:39,960 Speaker 4: I did have to do five years down there before 304 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 4: I could go to a close camp. I'm locked down 305 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 4: twenty three hours a day. I was mentally fucked up 306 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 4: off that shit. Man. My father died of cancer, like 307 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 4: five years after he got out of jail. But my 308 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 4: father hadn't been through the system, so he know how 309 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:57,800 Speaker 4: everything he's going. So I didn't really have nobody helping 310 00:15:57,840 --> 00:16:00,080 Speaker 4: me on my case no more. Once he died, I 311 00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:02,360 Speaker 4: had to contend on my sister and my Mamay, and 312 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 4: they had lives to live their damn So so while 313 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:07,200 Speaker 4: I was sitting here fighting in my case, you know, 314 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:09,920 Speaker 4: I taught myself how to read and write, for I 315 00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:13,960 Speaker 4: got my ged, taught myself out to hook up cases, 316 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 4: and taught myself out of tight. I don't know how 317 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 4: to file a whole brief and everything. 318 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:22,240 Speaker 1: While Ricardo did have a pellet counsel, it never hurts 319 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 1: to learn the law and advocate for yourself, and he 320 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 1: got his first break just a few years after his conviction. 321 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:32,120 Speaker 4: I had an investigator, Fine Jackson, and he voted as 322 00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:32,720 Speaker 4: the David. 323 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 6: He says three years ago, when I testified for the 324 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 6: state against Riccardo Gray for the state, my testimony was 325 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 6: not completely true. I did not see Ricardo with a gun, 326 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:42,920 Speaker 6: nor did I see him shooting a gun at any 327 00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 6: time during the fight. And when the shooting started, I 328 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 6: began to run like everyone else did. I talked to 329 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 6: the police at night, and I told them I would 330 00:16:49,160 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 6: come down to talk to them about the case. Before 331 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,520 Speaker 6: I talked to the police, some of the Kinsman boys 332 00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:55,800 Speaker 6: told me to say Ricardo was a shooter. I did 333 00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:57,440 Speaker 6: because they made me feel like they would do something 334 00:16:57,480 --> 00:16:59,360 Speaker 6: to me if I did not say Ricardo was a shooter. 335 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:01,840 Speaker 5: Arthur Jackson Senior made this statement of. 336 00:17:01,880 --> 00:17:04,480 Speaker 6: My own free will dated May of two thousand and 337 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 6: two with the investigator. 338 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 4: Gave it to my attorney at the time. My attorney 339 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 4: was Paul Massino, and then Massino he went to go 340 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 4: talk to Mix and personally hisself because Anthony Mix and 341 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:20,440 Speaker 4: the stake. Whenness he was in jail for murdering his girlfriend, 342 00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:21,600 Speaker 4: he comes. 343 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:24,080 Speaker 6: Forward to say, my name is Anthony Mixon. At Ricardo 344 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:26,680 Speaker 6: Grey's trial, I testified that Ricardo Gray was on a 345 00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 6: bike shooting a gun. This testimony is not correct. The 346 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:33,119 Speaker 6: person shooting the gun was Benny, a dark skinned, skinny 347 00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 6: black man with an afro haircut. He has wide eyes 348 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:39,720 Speaker 6: and a real small head. I was pressured by the 349 00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:42,600 Speaker 6: detectives to say that Ricardo Gray was there. I was 350 00:17:42,760 --> 00:17:46,159 Speaker 6: on parole and they told me that if I didn't 351 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:48,639 Speaker 6: say it, was Ricardo Gray, I would go back to prison. 352 00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:52,359 Speaker 6: Arthur Jackson was about ten houses or more away and 353 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:55,200 Speaker 6: could not see who was shooting or who was shot. 354 00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:59,320 Speaker 6: I have tried to tell my story, but nobody would listen. 355 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:03,640 Speaker 6: This is true, Anthony Mixon, August fourteenth, two thousand and two. 356 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 4: So then I have both of them. And then Masino 357 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:11,400 Speaker 4: filed a motion for a new trial under newly discover evidence. 358 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:14,879 Speaker 4: They stalled me out for about three years. That was 359 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 4: in two thousand and six. Man they came up with 360 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 4: some bogus ruling saying that this was the same evidence 361 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:22,840 Speaker 4: I used a trial. 362 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:25,760 Speaker 1: Even though the defenses danced at trial was that Mixing 363 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:29,080 Speaker 1: and Jackson were lying. Ricardo most definitely did not have 364 00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:33,240 Speaker 1: Mixing and Jackson's recantations a trial, and critically their testimony 365 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:35,080 Speaker 1: was the only evidence against him. 366 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:38,119 Speaker 6: So Nanthy McDonald had a very long career as a 367 00:18:38,160 --> 00:18:41,680 Speaker 6: sitting judge. She was known, I think wildly by the 368 00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:45,560 Speaker 6: defense community as being someone who had a pensiont for injustice. 369 00:18:46,119 --> 00:18:48,119 Speaker 6: But we know just in the last few years there 370 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,440 Speaker 6: have been many wrongful convictions that have come out of 371 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:55,360 Speaker 6: her courtroom. Now, of course, when juries and prosecutors are involved, 372 00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:59,320 Speaker 6: you can't shoulder the entire responsibility of wrongful convictions on 373 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:01,240 Speaker 6: a judge. But when we look at the number of 374 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:04,440 Speaker 6: years it's taken these folks to prove their innocence, that 375 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,240 Speaker 6: can be directly attributed to her, because she has denied 376 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:11,199 Speaker 6: every single filing in front of her, no matter how 377 00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:15,000 Speaker 6: compelling like Ricardo's those filings are. We know that we're 378 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,880 Speaker 6: all Sailor's cases out of her courtroom, Isaiah Andrews, who 379 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:22,080 Speaker 6: spent one of the longest periods of wrongful incarceration in 380 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:25,120 Speaker 6: the history of the United States. We have other cases 381 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:30,320 Speaker 6: just like Ricardo's that represent very serious, very obvious innocence 382 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 6: claims that have just been denied and denied for decades, 383 00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:35,760 Speaker 6: and it's because they were constantly put back in front 384 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 6: of the same judge, Nancy McDonald. 385 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:40,640 Speaker 1: You know, one would think that just one judge couldn't 386 00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:42,399 Speaker 1: and shouldn't have that much power. 387 00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:44,399 Speaker 2: There are other courts to appeal to. 388 00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:47,920 Speaker 6: Every effort you make to reopen your case based on 389 00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 6: new evidence, whether it's newly discovered because a witness just 390 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:54,800 Speaker 6: came forward, or because the state withheld it, or because 391 00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 6: of ineffective assistance of counsel of your trial council. 392 00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:00,440 Speaker 5: All of those are raised in the trial court. 393 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 6: I bet if you were to go through her entire 394 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:07,080 Speaker 6: decades long term on the bench, she didn't grant a 395 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:09,240 Speaker 6: single one. She didn't even grant a hearing on one. 396 00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:12,160 Speaker 6: I mean, we had cases where like the shooter came 397 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:13,119 Speaker 6: forward and she was. 398 00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: Like, man, now, all of a sudden, he's not credible anymore. 399 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 6: Yeah, he's not credible now. But then you get more 400 00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 6: evidence of his credibility and she's like, Eh, that's not new. 401 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:22,200 Speaker 6: You've been saying you're innocent for years, so that's no 402 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:26,000 Speaker 6: longer a new theory of your case, Like it's wild. 403 00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:28,480 Speaker 6: And so while there are a lot of factors that 404 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:33,000 Speaker 6: lead to wrongful convictions, the police, juries lowering their standard 405 00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:37,960 Speaker 6: of beyond reasonable doubt, judges and of course prosecutors overzealz 406 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:40,879 Speaker 6: prosecutors who care more about winning than justice, and lazy 407 00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:43,760 Speaker 6: defense attorneys. All of those things contribute to wrongful convictions. 408 00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:48,359 Speaker 6: But the one thing that maintains wrongful convictions are trial 409 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:51,760 Speaker 6: judges who don't give meaningful consideration to these claims, because 410 00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:53,760 Speaker 6: then when it goes to the Court of appeals, they 411 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 6: give deference to the trial court the trial. Judge sat 412 00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:58,640 Speaker 6: on the trial. They're the ones looking at this now, 413 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 6: we're going to give difference their decision. We don't sit 414 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 6: in judgment of their decision unless it's arbitrary or absurd, 415 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:07,119 Speaker 6: which is a very high standard. And when you have 416 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:08,680 Speaker 6: someone like her who's been on the bench in a 417 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:12,680 Speaker 6: political climate for decades, they're not calling her arbitrary and absurd. 418 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:15,920 Speaker 6: They're affirming every single one of her crappy decisions. And 419 00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:18,359 Speaker 6: we know they're crappy because so many of these men 420 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:22,960 Speaker 6: have now been exonerated, and we can literally attribute hundreds 421 00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:26,320 Speaker 6: and hundreds of years of wrongful conviction to her unwillingness 422 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:28,240 Speaker 6: to consider these claims from her bench. 423 00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:30,879 Speaker 1: Even though finding new evidence appeared to be feudal with 424 00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:33,480 Speaker 1: Judge McDonald. Ricardo caught another break. 425 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,840 Speaker 4: I found Denny last name. That's when my god Quincy, 426 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 4: but I called him Q. I was in Lucas Wheel waiting. 427 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:45,000 Speaker 4: Quincy told me he was in Toledo with Benny and 428 00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:48,200 Speaker 4: his last name is Karen Ben. He told Q that 429 00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:51,560 Speaker 4: I was in jail for some he did. That's how 430 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,000 Speaker 4: I got his full name. At the time, my lawyer 431 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:56,719 Speaker 4: was Brett Burner, so I got my I told him 432 00:21:56,720 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 4: my appel attorney felt the mixing again and Mixing identify 433 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:04,040 Speaker 4: by Benny Kerr as a shooter. I file another emotion 434 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 4: for a new trial. They deny it, talking about my lawyer. 435 00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 4: Ain't give a time frame and when I discovered the 436 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 4: new evidence, so they shot that down. 437 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 1: Another break in the case came from a four year 438 00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:19,480 Speaker 1: request along the way, someone on his legal team did 439 00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:22,919 Speaker 1: a Freedom of Information Act request but did not realize 440 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 1: what they had discovered until moving on from the case 441 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:28,040 Speaker 1: and returning Ricardo's files. 442 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:31,119 Speaker 4: So then when they send me my paperwork, I go 443 00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:35,480 Speaker 4: through all my file dam I see the original investigator 444 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:41,439 Speaker 4: reporting here, Gary Blanchard police report and Edward McDowell police report. 445 00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:43,720 Speaker 4: I'm like, man, I'm looking at it, like man, this 446 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,200 Speaker 4: all the stuff to prove Ryan commit this crime. I 447 00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:49,639 Speaker 4: never got this stuff in my trial, So bam I 448 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:52,480 Speaker 4: end up filing the motion myself. That had to be 449 00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:54,600 Speaker 4: Like in twenty fourteen. 450 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:58,399 Speaker 1: These police reports undermined Mixing and Jackson and the state's 451 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:02,240 Speaker 1: timeline of the shooting while validating Ricardo's alibi if the 452 00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:04,760 Speaker 1: shooting ended the fight like these witnesses in the alibi, 453 00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:08,120 Speaker 1: witness has said then Ricardo's police report from the hospital 454 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 1: was checkmate. 455 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,120 Speaker 2: This appears to be a major Brady. 456 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:15,400 Speaker 6: Violation, So it's important to know some of the context 457 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 6: of what was going in Ohio in terms of the 458 00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 6: way criminal trials were handled at that time. We didn't 459 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,399 Speaker 6: have open discovery, so there's no way of knowing what 460 00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:27,600 Speaker 6: actually was and was not shared with defense other than 461 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:30,439 Speaker 6: presuming that if a defense attorney had the information, they 462 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:33,159 Speaker 6: would have used it. Now, when Ricardo goes on to 463 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 6: file all these things, he's saying, we obviously didn't have it, 464 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 6: because he would have used it if we had it. 465 00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 6: But the court says that without some affirmative proof that 466 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:45,199 Speaker 6: it was not turned over, he cannot meet his burden. Now, 467 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,960 Speaker 6: there is law in Ohio which contradicts those holdings, but 468 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,000 Speaker 6: there are holdings that support that perspective also, and so 469 00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:53,560 Speaker 6: what the state is arguing is that you can't prove 470 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:55,480 Speaker 6: that it wasn't turned over because all we used to 471 00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:58,040 Speaker 6: do back then is the defense attorney would meet with 472 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:01,040 Speaker 6: the prosecutor. The prosecutor would have have the police reports, 473 00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:03,520 Speaker 6: not share them or show them, but summarize what was 474 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:05,440 Speaker 6: said in them. And so there's no way to prove 475 00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:07,160 Speaker 6: or disprove what might have been said in some back 476 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:10,399 Speaker 6: room handing these things back and forth. It's a system 477 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 6: that disfavors the truth because how do you prove the 478 00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:16,159 Speaker 6: absence of an occurrence. 479 00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,800 Speaker 1: Well, if it wasn't Brady, then it's sure as hell 480 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:24,200 Speaker 1: was an effective assistance of counsel. Nevertheless, Ricardo caught another 481 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,639 Speaker 1: break in twenty twenty when another witness came forward, Derek James, 482 00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:30,119 Speaker 1: who said that he told police about ben Kerr in 483 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:32,000 Speaker 1: the night of the shooting. But what good was any 484 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 1: of it if it had to pass to Judge McDonald first. 485 00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 6: This is awful, but for years we were just waiting 486 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:40,359 Speaker 6: for her to leave the bench, which we knew she 487 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,400 Speaker 6: would not do on her own. It took an act 488 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 6: of God to save our clients from her ongoing reign 489 00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 6: of injustice. She died a few years ago, which the 490 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 6: result is finally clients whose wrongful convictions arose out of 491 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:56,879 Speaker 6: her courtroom can get fair consideration. 492 00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:01,560 Speaker 1: Unfortunately, Riccardo did not benefit. She passed in twenty twenty one, 493 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,159 Speaker 1: after he had already used up to Derek James affid 494 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 1: David So to recap all the evidence that this judge 495 00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,920 Speaker 1: denied him on the initial interviews with McDowell and Blanchard, 496 00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,879 Speaker 1: discrediting the state's timeline of the crime, the description of 497 00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:17,800 Speaker 1: Benny Kern, all of which corroborated his alibi defense. Multiple 498 00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,360 Speaker 1: people identified Benny Kern along the way, not to mention 499 00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 1: recantations from the only material witnesses in this case. 500 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:26,680 Speaker 6: And so all of those things together not only entirely 501 00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:30,359 Speaker 6: undermind the states claim, but present a meaningful case for 502 00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:33,440 Speaker 6: who the actual wrong doer is. And really he should 503 00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:35,520 Speaker 6: have had a hearing in two thousand and two when 504 00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 6: these initial affidavids came forward, but his judge denied him. 505 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 6: The Court of Appeals just constantly affirms what the trial 506 00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 6: judge does and the fact that he remains in prison. 507 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 6: So when this case came to me, it's exactly where 508 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:49,439 Speaker 6: it is right now. All of this has been filed, 509 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:53,520 Speaker 6: and here we are, twenty one years later from those affidavids, 510 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:57,160 Speaker 6: with an insurmountable amount of evidence supporting his innocence. 511 00:25:57,440 --> 00:25:59,560 Speaker 5: And really, if I'm being honest, no. 512 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,800 Speaker 6: Proceed door to get into court for meaningful consideration. And 513 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,000 Speaker 6: so here we are thinking artfully and creatively about how 514 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 6: do we get that door open so that we can 515 00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:10,720 Speaker 6: do the right thing for this innocent person. We have 516 00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:12,760 Speaker 6: done it before this office, and we will do it again. 517 00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:14,120 Speaker 6: We will find a way to get this man back 518 00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:17,080 Speaker 6: in court because that's what justice requires, but we are 519 00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:23,479 Speaker 6: up against a substantial mountain of procedural hurdles and procedural default. 520 00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:26,560 Speaker 1: To help facilitate that, we're going to link Kim's instagram 521 00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:29,639 Speaker 1: in the episode description. If anyone listening has information about 522 00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 1: this case, it could be the key to getting them 523 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: back into court without Judge McDonald, So please reach out 524 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:37,879 Speaker 1: to her and help bring Ricardo home. We're also going 525 00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:40,240 Speaker 1: to be linking a petition to help raise awareness about 526 00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:44,000 Speaker 1: this horrible injustice, so please take a moment and join 527 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:47,200 Speaker 1: us sign it. And with that, now we're going to 528 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:48,840 Speaker 1: go to my favorite part of the show, we called 529 00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 1: closing arguments, and it's where I thank you again for 530 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: being here. Now I'm going to turn my microphone off 531 00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:59,560 Speaker 1: and kick back in my chair and just listen to 532 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,080 Speaker 1: anything else you have to share with me in our 533 00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,720 Speaker 1: amazing audience. So, Kim, when don't we start with you 534 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 1: and then Ricardo, do you take us off into the sunset. 535 00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:10,120 Speaker 5: At the end of the day. 536 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:12,360 Speaker 6: What we're looking for is to give Ricardo a chance 537 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:15,240 Speaker 6: at a fair trial due process. We have no doubt 538 00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:18,200 Speaker 6: he would be acquitted when presented with that opportunity, But 539 00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 6: he hasn't even had the chance to have his fair trial, 540 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:21,800 Speaker 6: his fair day. 541 00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:22,280 Speaker 5: In court yet. 542 00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:25,440 Speaker 6: So I think Ricardo Gray's case is one of the 543 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 6: most obvious claims of innocence we've ever seen. There was 544 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:32,480 Speaker 6: very little evidence to support a conviction to begin with, 545 00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 6: and all of it, every ounce of it, has been overturned. 546 00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:37,480 Speaker 6: But the problem with his case is that it really 547 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:40,600 Speaker 6: highlights the failures of the criminal justice system to correct 548 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:44,240 Speaker 6: itself in every incident, and so is one of those 549 00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:47,439 Speaker 6: examples of where the criminal justice system has the tools 550 00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:50,600 Speaker 6: to convict, but not the tools to overturn conviction. And 551 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 6: so not only is this an opportunity to look meaningfully 552 00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:57,280 Speaker 6: at his case, but at the rules of procedural default 553 00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:00,480 Speaker 6: that keep people innocent, people like Ricardo Gray prison for 554 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:04,560 Speaker 6: ten twenty thirty years before having a chance to even 555 00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,720 Speaker 6: have a hearing, to have their day in court, or 556 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 6: to present their claims in a way that the merits 557 00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:13,120 Speaker 6: of their claims are considered. And so, you know, when 558 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,520 Speaker 6: listening to stories like this, It's important that we not 559 00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:19,919 Speaker 6: only consider how we can help Ricardo Gray, but how 560 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 6: we can expect more of the system and demand that judges, 561 00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 6: that people we elect to be in positions to make 562 00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:30,920 Speaker 6: these choices give consideration or be held accountable, and that 563 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,120 Speaker 6: when you get that jury summons, that you don't think, oh, 564 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 6: I don't want to be a jur but you think, 565 00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 6: this is my chance to hold the government accountable to 566 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:41,920 Speaker 6: its very high standard and to participate in preventing wrongful 567 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 6: and convictions. Because that is the most minimal way we 568 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 6: all get to participate and to change the system. 569 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 5: And it would have. 570 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:51,280 Speaker 6: Made all the difference, a lifetime of difference to Ricardo 571 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 6: Gray if he had a jury who held the state 572 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:55,160 Speaker 6: to that very high standard to begin with. 573 00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:57,479 Speaker 4: I'm ready to go on, man. 574 00:28:57,520 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 2: I'm tired. 575 00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 4: I'm sickly tired, but so strong. 576 00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 1: Man. 577 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:05,000 Speaker 4: I need help, man, it's killing me. I'm trying not 578 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,880 Speaker 4: to start crying with around all these dudes in here. Man, 579 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:11,920 Speaker 4: I can't show no sign of weakness in here. I'm 580 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:16,560 Speaker 4: here with lyons. Oh yeah, I just need some help, man, 581 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,640 Speaker 4: to show what the hell really going on here? Man. 582 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,240 Speaker 4: I got all the facts, I just need help man 583 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:24,080 Speaker 4: to get me the hell out of here. Man. I 584 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:25,240 Speaker 4: need to get hold of my daughter. 585 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:25,400 Speaker 1: Man. 586 00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:27,800 Speaker 4: I don't missed twenty years of my daughter life. Man. 587 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,240 Speaker 4: I wasn't able to raise my daughter. Man. That's what 588 00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 4: fuck with me the most. 589 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:31,680 Speaker 2: Man. 590 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 4: I ain't been able to I ain't been there with 591 00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:36,720 Speaker 4: my family. I was really just miss raising my daughter. Man. 592 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:38,959 Speaker 4: That was the key part of everything. We've been through 593 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 4: a lot, through this whole thing. Man, It's just time 594 00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 4: to go. Man, twenty six years, it's just out of control. 595 00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,680 Speaker 4: They wrong, and they know they're wrong, and they willing 596 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 4: to keep me in here until I put it on 597 00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 4: the wall of what's really going on. If I don't 598 00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 4: put it on the wall what's going on, they not 599 00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:57,440 Speaker 4: gonna do nothing. 600 00:29:57,520 --> 00:29:57,680 Speaker 2: Man. 601 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,000 Speaker 4: So I need help, you know. Appreciate you good day, 602 00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:01,960 Speaker 4: man for real. 603 00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction. You can listen 604 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 1: to this and all the Lava for Good podcasts one 605 00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:17,320 Speaker 1: week early by subscribing to Lava for Good Plus on 606 00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:20,560 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts. I want to thank our production team, Connor 607 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 1: Hall and Kathleen Fink, as well as my fellow executive 608 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 1: producers Jeff Kempler, Kevin Wartis, and Jeff Clyburn. The music 609 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,960 Speaker 1: in this production was supplied by three time OSCAR nominated 610 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:33,000 Speaker 1: composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to follow us across all 611 00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:36,680 Speaker 1: social media platforms at Lava for Good and at Wrongful Conviction. 612 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 1: You can also follow me on Instagram at it's Jason Vlahm. 613 00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:43,160 Speaker 1: Wrongful Conviction is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts 614 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 1: and association with Signal Company Number one