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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlieb. You're listening to All

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Speaker 1: Ball Talk. A lot of college basketball upcoming. Bobby Reagan

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Speaker 1: will join us from bar Stool Sports, and an incredible,

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Speaker 1: incredible coach, Randy Bennett, head coach of St. Mary's. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna ask him, has he ever paid a player? They

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Speaker 1: were on n C a probation where he actually was

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Speaker 1: suspended for a couple of games as a head coach.

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Speaker 1: We last him, has he ever been to plaid a player?

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Speaker 1: I'll ask him, plus how they got into Australia and

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Speaker 1: how he turned around a two win program to a

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Speaker 1: juggernaut in Moraga, California. By the way, make sure you

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Speaker 1: listen to The Doug Gotlin Show daily three Eastern time,

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Speaker 1: twelve to three Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, Fox Sports

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Speaker 1: Radio dot Com, the I Heart Radio app. Give you

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Speaker 1: some quick thoughts on the NBA as the NBA season

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Speaker 1: has tipped off already. Unlike anybody else, we talked about

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Speaker 1: Lebron James. You can listen to that podcast should be

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Speaker 1: in your queue if you're already listening to the All

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Speaker 1: Ball podcast. I watched last night. Uh and this has

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Speaker 1: been recorded on a Wednesday. We dropped on a Thursday,

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Speaker 1: so I watched the Sixers first game. I'm not surprised

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Speaker 1: that the Celtics were that much better than the Sixers,

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Speaker 1: and the Celtics are going to get better because Gordon

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Speaker 1: Hayward look rusty and Frankly Kyrie look rusty. But I

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Speaker 1: was interested to see the Mark hell Folds thing. If

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Speaker 1: you know anything about my career, you're like, that guy

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Speaker 1: couldn't shoot. If you watched me shoot a basketball, you're like,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't make any sense. The mental side to shooting

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Speaker 1: is like the mental side to pitching, the Ricky and

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Speaker 1: Keel thing. And I'll tell you I think the Sixers

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Speaker 1: have handled this all wrong. I think he should have

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Speaker 1: played in summer league so he had game action. As

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Speaker 1: he's working through whatever sort of therapy he needs, he

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Speaker 1: didn't want to look at a jump shot. It still

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Speaker 1: has a bit of a hitch and it's really really

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Speaker 1: hard to fix on the fly, and unless it gets fixed,

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Speaker 1: it's going to kill his career because he's just his

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Speaker 1: game is not built. Like Rondo has never been able

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Speaker 1: to shoot and has slowly gotten better. But Rondo knows

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Speaker 1: how to play without a jump shot. There's an art

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Speaker 1: to it. Even t J McConnell, who's their backup point guard.

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Speaker 1: Like t J, almost never shoots an open deep three. Instead,

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Speaker 1: he gets to his mid range, gets to his spots

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Speaker 1: where he can make shots. But basically he plays without looking.

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Speaker 1: But he's played a substantial chunk of his career without

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Speaker 1: looking to be a score mark. Cal Fulton's entire game

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Speaker 1: was built around being a scoring guard. If you take

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Speaker 1: away the jump shot, it makes you want to dimensional

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Speaker 1: and he's not really comfortable doing it. By my estimation,

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Speaker 1: the best way to break that is um I played

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Speaker 1: for a guy named Mass Track who's currently it's just

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Speaker 1: a coach with in the NBA Believe with the Wizards,

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Speaker 1: and Mas was my coach and Phoenix and the A

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Speaker 1: B A and he did what my dad did, but

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Speaker 1: he coached me some when we went on tour teams,

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Speaker 1: which is, if you're open, you turn down an open

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Speaker 1: jump shot, and you force something bad, you come out

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Speaker 1: of the game. It's the opposite of how you handle

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Speaker 1: guys that shoot too much right where you take them

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Speaker 1: out when they take a bad shot. When you don't

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Speaker 1: take an open rhythm jump shot. How you come how'd

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Speaker 1: you come because you have to eliminate the fear of

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Speaker 1: missing or the fear of ramification for missing. And I

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Speaker 1: felt like, for me, that's the way to do it,

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Speaker 1: but you gotta do it in game. Actual. Alight, more

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Speaker 1: to come on the NBA, but let's get you to

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Speaker 1: the college game and to the FBI investigation and FBI

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Speaker 1: court testimony that's come out recently. Let's talk about the trial,

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Speaker 1: which has been kind of off discussed on Twitter and

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Speaker 1: several writers have written about it as well as kind

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Speaker 1: of what your appetite get ready for what's gonna be

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Speaker 1: another weird college basketball season. UM, I'll we'll discuss why

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Speaker 1: it's weird and also why it's interesting. Bobby Reagan joins us.

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Speaker 1: He writes for Barstool you fallm on Twitter at Barstool Riggs.

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Speaker 1: That's at Barstool Riggs. R. E. A. G. S. And Bobby,

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Speaker 1: I saw you wrote a piece on this, I think

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Speaker 1: earlier today and at the day of this record, this

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Speaker 1: All Ball podcast, it's on a Wednesday. UM, what's your

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Speaker 1: reaction to the latest on this? Uh? On this trial

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Speaker 1: which now all of a sudden, names like Zion Williamson

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Speaker 1: and schools like Kansas are kind of getting thrown into

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Speaker 1: the fray. Yeah, I think out of I think out

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Speaker 1: of all the programs that have been implicated in this

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Speaker 1: whole thing, can'tus looks the worst with the trial, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean, it started with gas and Ola saying, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, self and the staff didn't know. That was

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Speaker 1: his first day on the stand, I believe, And then

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Speaker 1: there's text messages that kind of contradict that you have

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Speaker 1: the rumor. I guess you want to call it a rumor.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if I didn't hear the whole um conversation,

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Speaker 1: because uh, the judges allowed in evidence that town said

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Speaker 1: self assistant said that they were willing to or whatever

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Speaker 1: for Zion Kansas. Just right now, I think, out of

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Speaker 1: everything looks the worst, which I wouldn't have believed I

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Speaker 1: get heading into it, what's you know, everything that happened

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Speaker 1: all and the other school bosted there um, but Kansas, man,

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Speaker 1: I don't know that. It just doesn't sound doesn't sound

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Speaker 1: like it's the fest thing going for him. I want

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Speaker 1: to get I want to circle back to Kansas in

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Speaker 1: a second. But your piece also dealt with the fact

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Speaker 1: that Mike Sachowski said, we've never lost We've never lost

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Speaker 1: a recruit to somebody, you know, because somebody bought him

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Speaker 1: somebody because somebody's cheating and he really is. Basically, he

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Speaker 1: and Roy Williams like, I had no idea this stuff

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Speaker 1: was going on. I had no idea this And and

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Speaker 1: then you know, part of the Kansas thing is where

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Speaker 1: Zion Williamson's name gets brought up and what he desired

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Speaker 1: and the obvious Well, look, if Kansas was willing to

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Speaker 1: pay up to and do whatever to get him and

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Speaker 1: he ends up going to Duke, well, that doesn't that

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Speaker 1: make the assumption that want to do whatever to get him. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: especially the fact that those those stories kind of broke

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Speaker 1: what four hours apart from each other or so, doesn't

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Speaker 1: look the best. I just didn't look the way. And

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Speaker 1: Roy Williams, I think you tweeted out this morning that hey,

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Speaker 1: you can say that we're clean and you didn't realize

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Speaker 1: the I guess depths of what everything was going on is.

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Speaker 1: But don't pretend like it's not happening. I think everybody,

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Speaker 1: especially when you're Shootski and Williamson, you've been around for

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Speaker 1: what a combined seventy years or so in college basketball,

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Speaker 1: it's the idea that the idea that Duke has never

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Speaker 1: lost a player because somebody's bottom. That's laughable. The idea

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Speaker 1: that like, look, you got Marvin Bagley and your team,

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Speaker 1: and maybe you didn't know all the details of it,

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Speaker 1: but everybody knows his dad was legally being paid by Nike,

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Speaker 1: so they found kind of their own legal loophole, and

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Speaker 1: not every one of your guys found a legal loophole.

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Speaker 1: And even if you said even you came out and said, hey, look,

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Speaker 1: we know this is going on, and our way of

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Speaker 1: our way of handling it is like we think the

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Speaker 1: ultimate payment is you play for Duke, and it pays you,

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Speaker 1: you know, six sevenfold after you get done playing. Like

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Speaker 1: even if you said that, but to act like you

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Speaker 1: had no idea and this has no effect in your

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Speaker 1: program like now not now now, it's hard to take

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Speaker 1: anything you say seriously. It just came off disingenuous for

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Speaker 1: roy Um. It just didn't sound like they almost sounded entitled,

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Speaker 1: like this would never happen here because we don't need

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Speaker 1: it though, but it's like, well, you know what's still

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Speaker 1: going on, Like like you said, at least say like hey,

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Speaker 1: we don't we well we feel we don't need to,

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Speaker 1: you know, go to the extremes that other programs are

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Speaker 1: because you have the alliance, the Duke, the duke background,

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Speaker 1: it helps if you don't make it in the pros.

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Speaker 1: Something like that would at least make it sound more

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Speaker 1: believable or real. I just I wasn't impressed with I'll

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Speaker 1: say this that there's some plausible deniability with Bill's self

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Speaker 1: because apparently one conversation with Snola as inaudible, and who

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Speaker 1: knows that there's actual figures discussed, But there's nothing. There's

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Speaker 1: nothing in there that I've seen that says anything about money.

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Speaker 1: It's more about the old get getting it done term right,

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Speaker 1: which we all we all think we know what it means,

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Speaker 1: but we don't know we know and it's not what

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Speaker 1: you it's not what you know, it's what you can prove. Um.

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Speaker 1: But I am interested in in like self just inducted

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Speaker 1: into the Basketball Hall of Fame. They've won I believe,

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Speaker 1: seventy million consecutive Big Twelve titles and and and he's

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Speaker 1: always and he's a close friend of mine, and he's

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Speaker 1: always you know, told me, hey, um, you know there

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Speaker 1: are years in which your down years you try and

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Speaker 1: win twenty five games, and there's you know, once every

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Speaker 1: three or four years you've got a legit shot to

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Speaker 1: win it. This feels like a year in which they

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Speaker 1: have a legit shot to win it. What do you

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Speaker 1: think happens in Kansas? I mean, the first thing is

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Speaker 1: they can't play Sylvio Desusa, right, based on everything that's

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Speaker 1: said with with he just seems like the one that

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Speaker 1: you can't play if they were if they were careful

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Speaker 1: with Billy Preston last year. I don't know how they

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Speaker 1: can play Sylvia the studs of this year when we've

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Speaker 1: already seen the n T double A stripped Louisville of

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Speaker 1: a title. You know that could be the possible precedent

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Speaker 1: set for school like Kansas, who is a favorite to

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Speaker 1: win the title this year. I think that's the first

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Speaker 1: step is you can't play Sylvia the SUSA. Well, what

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Speaker 1: about self and what about his staff? I don't know,

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Speaker 1: Like I'm completely dumb founded by this because there isn't

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Speaker 1: a precedent in terms of a guy like Self, where

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Speaker 1: like you mentioned, there's there's plausible deniability. What if they

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Speaker 1: can prove itself? Now? I think you have to let

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Speaker 1: him coach this year wait for the end double A

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Speaker 1: to make a role. I think that's the way I

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Speaker 1: would go if I was in charge of of Kansas's

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Speaker 1: athletic department. Oh, no question. You have a new athletic

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Speaker 1: director and he's more powerful than it. And um, this

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Speaker 1: is one of those Uh, others will take others will

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Speaker 1: take the bullet for Bill self. But it does expose

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Speaker 1: some things. I guess the last question, I do I

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Speaker 1: want to diet the season? Bobby Reagan joining us from

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Speaker 1: Barstool Sports, he covers college basketball, does an outstanding job.

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Speaker 1: Fom on Twitter readers work as well. Um, is do

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Speaker 1: you think the NC like I've had high powered college

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Speaker 1: coaches tell me like, look, I think we are looking

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Speaker 1: to see how much it would clean it up. But

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Speaker 1: now you start mentioning names like Kansas and Duke and

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Speaker 1: l s U and um, there will be other big names.

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Speaker 1: How much do they really want to do? They want

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Speaker 1: to purge themselves of these big name coaches? Willy n

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Speaker 1: C actually do anything about so many of these kids,

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Speaker 1: so many of these stories. How do you think it

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Speaker 1: ultimately ends? I think there's gonna be a medium. Like

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Speaker 1: you said, the double A. Let's be honest, there they're

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Speaker 1: in the there in the business model, right like they

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Speaker 1: they're around for a reason. They've been around for a reason.

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Speaker 1: It's still a business to a degree. You have to

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Speaker 1: protect your assets, and your assets are like you mentioned

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Speaker 1: Kansas Duke along with some other schools that haven't been

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Speaker 1: implicated yet. But we don't know, you know, maybe we

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Speaker 1: didn't think Duke was gonna be implicated at the beginning

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Speaker 1: to this, and look where they are now. Um So,

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Speaker 1: I think you see them punish through smaller schools, the

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Speaker 1: ones that are obvious. Um and to the lesser and

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Speaker 1: to the higher degree, you'll see sanctions against against coaches,

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Speaker 1: show clauses and things of that effect. But I think

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Speaker 1: they're going to be very cautious with how they attack

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Speaker 1: the Kansas and Dukes of the world. Um I think

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Speaker 1: they need concrete evidence to go after them, and either

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Speaker 1: you know, they cave a season, they cave a player,

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Speaker 1: you know, sanction a coach, whatever it might be. I

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Speaker 1: think it's gonna fall somewhere in mind with that. Just

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Speaker 1: because we don't know what the NT double A does,

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Speaker 1: We don't know what what's going to be released to

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Speaker 1: the NT double A. They still have to do their

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Speaker 1: portion of the investigation. Despite the new rule that they

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Speaker 1: can use what's said in court and everything like that

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Speaker 1: to hand down sanctions, they still need to find out

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Speaker 1: the whole context of everything and and what coaches knew, what,

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Speaker 1: what players accepted what. So I think it's gonna be

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Speaker 1: a long process even after all the court systems done,

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Speaker 1: and I think it's going to be somewhere in the medium.

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Speaker 1: But we're not going to see a complete purge, but

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Speaker 1: there there are going to be teens and programs that

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Speaker 1: we know in power conferences. All right, let's let's get

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Speaker 1: let's get to this year. Um on paper, on paper, Kansas, Duke, Kentucky,

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Speaker 1: Gonzaga look like their heads and tails above above others. Right. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: Arizona's in rebuild mode. I think U c l a

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Speaker 1: somewhere between. You know, they didn't get everybody that they

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Speaker 1: wanted back Um and they did lose Um Holiday, who

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Speaker 1: was their best player from last year and did everything.

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Speaker 1: But overall, talent wise, you know, Villanova Villa Villanova is

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Speaker 1: gonna be very talented, but they're gonna have a completely

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Speaker 1: new starting lineup and try and carry over that culture

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Speaker 1: that's allowed them to win two titles in three years.

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Speaker 1: Xavier looks like a bit of a rebuild even though

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Speaker 1: they're two best players. You know, two of their best

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Speaker 1: players are returned earning. Um, give me your sense of

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Speaker 1: of somebody else outside of that big four that you

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Speaker 1: feel like we could legitimately see content for a national title.

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Speaker 1: I think everyone is glossing over Virginia. They were I

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Speaker 1: think the clear second best team in the country last

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Speaker 1: year and they returned as I kind of correlated to

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Speaker 1: this is my kind of my comparison is they remind

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Speaker 1: me of the way people thought about Villanova heading into

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Speaker 1: the sixty year or because because they kept losing in

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Speaker 1: the second round, kept losing the second round before straight

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Speaker 1: year that you lose the key guard Darren Hilliard for Villanova,

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Speaker 1: Devon Hall for Virginia. That was kind of like, okay,

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Speaker 1: well this is why they were able to do this.

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Speaker 1: But then you know, DeAndre Hunder is kind of that

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Speaker 1: Josh Hart, the NBA player that people expect to breakout

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Speaker 1: yere Um. You have the return guards with with Guy

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Speaker 1: and Jerome. I think people are just glossing over Virginia

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Speaker 1: because the lasting images I'm losing the UNBC. This is

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Speaker 1: a team that lost one name in the a c

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Speaker 1: C last year and it was in overtime. Um, I

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Speaker 1: think they are absolutely the same mold as that Villanova

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Speaker 1: team that won the title, where they were forgotten about

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Speaker 1: kind of, you know, on the back end of the

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Speaker 1: top ten in the preseason, but everyone kind of said, well,

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Speaker 1: they're gonna win the Big East. They win thirty games,

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Speaker 1: but losing around thirty. You know, I think Virginia's up

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Speaker 1: there with with the rest of them in terms of

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Speaker 1: teams that you should be considering the national titles. That's

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Speaker 1: it's a great point. I actually had a long discussion

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Speaker 1: with Tony Benny. He told me to come on my

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Speaker 1: pod here some time before the season, in which he

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Speaker 1: said he for the first time ever, he like, they

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Speaker 1: knew they could be beaten by a team that went small,

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Speaker 1: and then of course you lose Hunter and that gets

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Speaker 1: even more exposed when you gotta play two bigs instead

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Speaker 1: of playing But he said, look, look, I'm we're going

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Speaker 1: to evaluate ways in which we can evolve, still be

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Speaker 1: us and evolve. I think that that happened with Jay

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Speaker 1: right as well. You know, they didn't play, they changed

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Speaker 1: how they played. In addition to the fact that they

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Speaker 1: had veteran players, and they had guys that the entire

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Speaker 1: year there, their focus was we're not going out in

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Speaker 1: the second round. And if you remember that year, they

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Speaker 1: dominated I think Iowa in around two they just blew

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Speaker 1: their doors off and and the rest was and And

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Speaker 1: though they won a national championship on a buzzer shot,

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Speaker 1: we also forget that they beat Oklahoma worse than anyone

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Speaker 1: has ever been beaten in the Final four. Like all

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Speaker 1: of that energy kind of finally came to be in

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Speaker 1: the in the in the n c A term that's

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Speaker 1: that's as they'd be a good Miami team pretty easily

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Speaker 1: too in the Sweet six team. Yeah, that's a it's

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Speaker 1: a it's a it's a great point. Um, Okay, give

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Speaker 1: me one player that you're like, I can't wait to

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Speaker 1: tell people about who they don't know about yet. It

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Speaker 1: seems obvious, but it's the correct answer. Treymont Waters like

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Speaker 1: doing do enough people know him from LSU, who was

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Speaker 1: the originally one to Georgetown, who played high school basketball

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Speaker 1: in Connecticut when I was up there. No, I don't think.

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Speaker 1: I don't think people know Trey Waters. I would say

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Speaker 1: I think it's the first team All America. I think

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Speaker 1: he's that good. He's the lazy comparison is kind of

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Speaker 1: he can do what Trey Young did with obviously the

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Speaker 1: last bodum of shots. I think he's the one who

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Speaker 1: if you're looking for a power Conference team that couldn't

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Speaker 1: surprise some people, I think it's him. Um. I think

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Speaker 1: I really like to tell the Shoe team. I think

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Speaker 1: Errymont Waters, like I said, I think he is actually

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Speaker 1: Player of the Year and first Team All America. And

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Speaker 1: then of course, and then of course Will Waite is

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Speaker 1: one of the guys that got on tape talking talking,

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Speaker 1: So we'll Wade roommate Will Will Will We'll wait Will

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Speaker 1: Will Wade remain as head coach. It is L s U.

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Speaker 1: And people kind of chuckle like, really, this is like,

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Speaker 1: of all the time to get L. S U. This

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Speaker 1: is when you get L s U. Not when they

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Speaker 1: have Shock and Chris Jackson who became a d and

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Speaker 1: any of the other litany of of players or d

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Speaker 1: John or the Yeah or the John Brady era when

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Speaker 1: they had Stroma Swift and others. But yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: when she got a guy in type, it's a fascinating

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Speaker 1: Bobby great stuff. I'm a fan of your work. Can't

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Speaker 1: wait to have you back on the pod, and thanks

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Speaker 1: for joining us on the All Ball Podcast. Appreciate it. Talk.

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Speaker 1: Let's go from the discussion about this scandal in college

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Speaker 1: basketball and getting ready for the season with a guy

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Speaker 1: who he's been UM in this business as a player

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Speaker 1: and coach, Holy crap, for almost forty years. Oh my god,

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Speaker 1: I had no idea who was as old. UM. I mean,

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Speaker 1: he's always kind of looked old, but now he actually

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Speaker 1: is old. He's the head coach of St. Mary's, the

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Speaker 1: only place he's ever been head coach. And what's crazy

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Speaker 1: about it is they won two games the year before

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Speaker 1: he got there. His first year, they won nine. Since then,

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Speaker 1: they had one five season to seventeen win seasons and

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Speaker 1: that and um and a nineteen win season after. Outside

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Speaker 1: of that, it's been all twenty plus win seasons. Matter

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Speaker 1: of fact, most of them plus win seasons. He's three

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Speaker 1: two and one sixty two at tiny St. Mary's in Moraga, California.

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Speaker 1: He's Randy Bennett. He joins us here on the All

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Speaker 1: Ball Podcast. UM. I want to get to your current

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Speaker 1: job and how you had turned this thing into kind

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Speaker 1: of like a juggernaut in northern California. But let's start.

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Speaker 1: You grew up. Your dad, was he always a junior

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Speaker 1: college coach? Uh? No, he was. He worked his way up.

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Speaker 1: He worked his way He started out j V High

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Speaker 1: school and then went to high school and then we

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Speaker 1: went from high school to uh Virginia College assistant for

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Speaker 1: a few years, and then became the head coach at

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Speaker 1: Mace Community College in Arizona years. But you guys were

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Speaker 1: always in you always lived in Mesa kind of growing

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Speaker 1: up because you went to high school and and a

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Speaker 1: junior college in Mesa. Right right now. I was born

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Speaker 1: and raised in the rest of my rest of my

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Speaker 1: family was born in Indiana, but and my dad played

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Speaker 1: out there. So anyhow, he moved out and by the

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Speaker 1: time I you know anything, I can remember, he was

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Speaker 1: he was a high school of varsity coach and then

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Speaker 1: he went to Mason did that for a long time.

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Speaker 1: That's then he actually retired, and then he came back

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Speaker 1: and coached high school for just for fun. He was

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Speaker 1: retired and then when the state championship school called Gilbert.

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Speaker 1: But he he's been there the whole time. He's been

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Speaker 1: in the Phoenix area since. Uh yeah, since I was

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Speaker 1: born so what was it like playing What was it

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Speaker 1: like playing for your dad and j your coach. You know,

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Speaker 1: when you're when you're going through it, you just you're

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Speaker 1: just going through. And now when I looked back at it,

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Speaker 1: it was it was I'm sure it was a little

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Speaker 1: tricky for him. For me my first year, I you know,

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Speaker 1: I was like eight or ninth man, so there weren't

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Speaker 1: there wasn't a lot of It was tough for me

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Speaker 1: because I wasn't used to not playing. And uh, anyhow,

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Speaker 1: it was good. It was really good for me as

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Speaker 1: a coach because now I understand, I understand what guys

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Speaker 1: that are eight or ninth or tenth man are going through.

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Speaker 1: And so it helped me. But the my sophomore year,

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Speaker 1: woo woo good like our JC teams are really good.

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Speaker 1: And uh, my sophomore year played that was there was

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Speaker 1: probably more pressure on him then. I didn't really feel

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Speaker 1: it though, Like I didn't feel as good teammates. I

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Speaker 1: didn't feel like there was any animosity towards me being

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Speaker 1: in there. And yeah, I think my dad went over

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Speaker 1: you know, made sure he was careful not to blame

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Speaker 1: if I didn't deserve to. And so anyhow, at least

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Speaker 1: that's my opinion. I don't what those other guys thought.

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Speaker 1: And that was good overall. It was good. Ah, I'm

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Speaker 1: glad I did. When when you when you coach your

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Speaker 1: sons and AU, how? How? What? What do you like?

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's gotta tellways, always gotta be because I've

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Speaker 1: heard you coach coaching and AU and um, which is

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Speaker 1: really really cool. Right, it's gotta be great for the

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Speaker 1: other kids, like, wow, Randy Bennett is coaching our team.

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Speaker 1: How are you as a as a coach towards your kid?

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Speaker 1: I would say I am definitely, definitely hard in the

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Speaker 1: first sir, I'm harder on them than I am on

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Speaker 1: the other kids. And uh so it's tricky and I

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Speaker 1: gotta you gotta be. It's hard. There were some interesting

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Speaker 1: car rides home after games, like oh, I just want

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Speaker 1: to I still want to. I wanted to play right,

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Speaker 1: play hard to be. Usually it would be like an

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Speaker 1: attitude type deal or just how they reacted to something.

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Speaker 1: But I think it was. I think it was good

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Speaker 1: for them, but I think it's hard hard for them too.

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Speaker 1: So as a dad, as a dad doing that, you

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Speaker 1: you learn that you're there days. They can only see

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Speaker 1: as their dad. They can't separate it dad and coach,

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Speaker 1: and you you kind of can as a dad, but

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Speaker 1: they can't. So they get tired of here and dad

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Speaker 1: a little bit. And I've running across a lot of

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Speaker 1: dads who tried coaching their kids and they get the

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Speaker 1: same point. The kids kind of to no, no listen.

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Speaker 1: I just I do twice a week. I haven't. We

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Speaker 1: have a big clinic that we do, and my son

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Speaker 1: he likes to He's one of the younger kids there,

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Speaker 1: but he likes to be a demonstrator and and I

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Speaker 1: had to kick him out of practice the other day

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Speaker 1: because he wasn't listen to me. He's just having fun,

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Speaker 1: and you know, it's kind of being a jerk, and uh,

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Speaker 1: if why are you getting so mad at me? You know,

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Speaker 1: I was like, because you had to be you gotta

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Speaker 1: be one and a half times everybody else, and I

428
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,640
Speaker 1: gotta be on you more because if you act this way,

429
00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:31,480
Speaker 1: how do you think everybody else is gonna act? I

430
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:34,239
Speaker 1: just I'm fascinated by Randy Bennett joining joining me here

431
00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,240
Speaker 1: in the All Ball podcast. All right, so you go

432
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:38,960
Speaker 1: to UC San Diego and play this is back U

433
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:41,720
Speaker 1: C S d U c S D is D three

434
00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:43,800
Speaker 1: back then, right before they moved up to D two.

435
00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:49,360
Speaker 1: Who's your coach? My coach was Tom Marcel and uh,

436
00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: we're actually in AI at the time, and and then

437
00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,280
Speaker 1: they went D three later after the later and then

438
00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:59,000
Speaker 1: now and they went D two and now they're they're

439
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,280
Speaker 1: going to do one and the years. So it was

440
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:05,000
Speaker 1: a great experience for me. Great great school academically. But

441
00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:08,640
Speaker 1: some of my best friends and to this day are

442
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:10,640
Speaker 1: guys I played with there, So we had we had

443
00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:14,280
Speaker 1: great experience. Wouldn't trade it for anything. Now he's a

444
00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:16,920
Speaker 1: former player, wasn't he when he's he's like a if

445
00:23:16,920 --> 00:23:19,480
Speaker 1: I if I remember correctly, like was he a was

446
00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:23,199
Speaker 1: he a player in his own rights at the same time, Marshall, No, Huh,

447
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:25,880
Speaker 1: Tom was when I went there, the head coaches John

448
00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 1: Black and I had to read shirt transferred in there

449
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:33,320
Speaker 1: and he uh, he left that year. But John Black

450
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:36,439
Speaker 1: was a good NBA pro player, so he was around.

451
00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,800
Speaker 1: But then Tom was his assistant, and uh, he probably

452
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 1: played a little high school, but that's about it. What

453
00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,520
Speaker 1: was he like as a coach, He was just learning.

454
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:48,359
Speaker 1: He was he'd never been a head coach before and

455
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:53,320
Speaker 1: so he got he took over that job, and it

456
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:56,960
Speaker 1: was all that stuff as a as a coach for

457
00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:01,480
Speaker 1: me now and when I became a head coach was

458
00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 1: helpful to me as far as all right, this is

459
00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:11,000
Speaker 1: you learned from your experiences right where you played, right,

460
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 1: That's why. That's why. That's why I asked, and that

461
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:18,320
Speaker 1: was that was one of those deals. Is this guy's

462
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,399
Speaker 1: his first job and he's trying to learn and he

463
00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:24,320
Speaker 1: inherited this team and anyhow, so he was he was learning,

464
00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:28,200
Speaker 1: and uh he did. He was a great guy. We

465
00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 1: had great experiences. We could you know, looking back on it,

466
00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:35,400
Speaker 1: and we probably could have done some things players leadership

467
00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:38,119
Speaker 1: wise and done a better job. Okay, So then you

468
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 1: go and work for Hank Egan. Um. And when your

469
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:47,600
Speaker 1: first job was at us D under Hank Egan Winner. Yes, um,

470
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:51,320
Speaker 1: So take me through how you went from a junior

471
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:53,679
Speaker 1: college player playing for your dad, then playing in a

472
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:56,479
Speaker 1: ball you see San Diego, to getting your How did

473
00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:59,439
Speaker 1: you get that job? Well, I still had a year

474
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:03,239
Speaker 1: of school left, and so how many years you were

475
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:06,480
Speaker 1: in junior college? For two years? You red shirted one

476
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,879
Speaker 1: year at at you see San Diego. You played at

477
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:11,560
Speaker 1: least one of the year. How many years to take

478
00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:16,159
Speaker 1: you to finish? Like I said, I still had another

479
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 1: year to finish after I've done playing. So the went

480
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: over to University of San Diego, which was I really did.

481
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:28,240
Speaker 1: Hank had recruited me a little bit of the Air Force,

482
00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,360
Speaker 1: so I knew him, and uh I went over there

483
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 1: to volunteered like a volunteer system back then, for for

484
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:43,240
Speaker 1: that year and it was it was eye opening for me.

485
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: Hank was a great offensive coach, great great coach and

486
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:53,040
Speaker 1: uh so I spent a year working with him, and

487
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,280
Speaker 1: then then I went to Idaho his grad assistant with

488
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:58,520
Speaker 1: Tim Floyd when he first that was his first head

489
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:02,879
Speaker 1: coaching job. That was that was a great staff. I

490
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 1: learned that you just learned so much early on in

491
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:09,520
Speaker 1: your career what Hanker did. And then went with Tim

492
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 1: and our staff there was Kermit Davis, Larry Stacy, and

493
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 1: Tim Floyd. But back then you don't know who they are,

494
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:19,840
Speaker 1: like you're just you're just all scrapping and trying to

495
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:23,359
Speaker 1: hustle to get as good as you can and shoot.

496
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:25,640
Speaker 1: I mean Kerman was twenty six, he didn't know yet.

497
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 1: Larry was maybe thirty and uh and Tim that was

498
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: the thirty two as his first job, so we were

499
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 1: all trying to figure it out. But I learned so

500
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:42,520
Speaker 1: much in those first three years between Hank and uh, Tim,

501
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,160
Speaker 1: Larry and Kerman up there. So it was those were

502
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:49,480
Speaker 1: great years At that time. I didn't realize how valuable

503
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 1: they were gonna be to me down down the road.

504
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:56,560
Speaker 1: And uh So, I can't tell you how many times

505
00:26:56,600 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 1: I go back to those early years when I'm trying

506
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: to figure out things in Bathtobast, especially when I got

507
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,720
Speaker 1: my first head coaching job at St. Mary's eighteen years ago.

508
00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 1: Um okay, So, which there's a couple of questions to

509
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,400
Speaker 1: come from it. One, how do you make ends meet?

510
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 1: Like how do you afford how do you afford to

511
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:18,719
Speaker 1: be a grad to be a volunteer assistant in San Diego?

512
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:22,119
Speaker 1: How do you afford to be a grad assistant at Idaho? Like?

513
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 1: How are you? How where are you living? How are

514
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 1: you paying your bills? What was it like? So that's

515
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 1: the deal. And in this profession, which is kind of crazy,

516
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:34,680
Speaker 1: in college coaching, you kind of have to work your

517
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:37,720
Speaker 1: way up to a volunteer year and do a grad

518
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:41,360
Speaker 1: assistant year whatever you have to do to get in

519
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,440
Speaker 1: it is. It's crazy because you're talking about guys who

520
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 1: can be pretty successful in a lot of other trades,

521
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,879
Speaker 1: and they're willing to go and make no money or

522
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,679
Speaker 1: even come out of pocket to get in his career

523
00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:57,360
Speaker 1: with no guarantees that down the road is gonna make

524
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:01,520
Speaker 1: a payoff back. But anyhow, that's I was just living

525
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 1: life and I wanted to coach and love basket. So

526
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 1: when I was a San Diego was just paying paying

527
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:08,840
Speaker 1: for everything. I had to do it out for school,

528
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 1: so there's no real option and U wasn't making money.

529
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 1: So where'd you live? I had to pay school? And

530
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,160
Speaker 1: then when I went to Idaho where it is basically

531
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:22,159
Speaker 1: a scholarship, so they paid for But did you like

532
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:30,359
Speaker 1: living the dorms? Did you get an apartment on campus? Okay,

533
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 1: in the dorm and was there ever a thought? I mean,

534
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:37,159
Speaker 1: I guess your dad was a coach because some you know,

535
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 1: we had we had to run Canada. Of course, your

536
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:42,840
Speaker 1: former assistant and he volunteered for you when he started.

537
00:28:42,920 --> 00:28:45,160
Speaker 1: He's straight at Swarthmore. Right, you can go make six

538
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:49,160
Speaker 1: figures on on on Wall Street and financial district if

539
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:51,840
Speaker 1: he wants um I just wonder if there was ever

540
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 1: any any pressure to like, hey, maybe you should just

541
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 1: go and make not especially finished up, but I know

542
00:28:56,760 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 1: you got a master's degree. Should you go and actually

543
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:03,760
Speaker 1: make some money? And said easing this basketball drink? You know,

544
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 1: it was never even a thought to me, And uh,

545
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 1: I just I knew. I knew what I loved doing

546
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 1: and the next step when you're done playing for me

547
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:17,480
Speaker 1: was I was coaching, and that's what I want to do.

548
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:21,520
Speaker 1: So but my dad knew enough to tell me, hey,

549
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 1: if you want to coach Division one, then you need

550
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,239
Speaker 1: to get in Division one. Don't go high school or

551
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 1: junior college and then try and get back in later.

552
00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,600
Speaker 1: Hard to do so he he. I didn't know anything.

553
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 1: I was just this was my next step was as

554
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 1: far as all right, I'm done with college, what am

555
00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 1: I gonna do? And I knew for a long time

556
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 1: that I went to coach, and uh so that's what

557
00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 1: I did, and and uh you really, I really was.

558
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 1: I was pretty naive to it. I hadn't been around

559
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:54,160
Speaker 1: Division one and in Arizona there was I just wasn't.

560
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 1: I wasn't hip to how it all worked, and it

561
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 1: probably wasn't tell I was dirty where I think got

562
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 1: all right, this is this is what you gotta do

563
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 1: if you're gonna move up. Randy Bennett join us. Okay,

564
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: So give me one thing, one thing from Hank Egan

565
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:16,640
Speaker 1: that you still do or use or implore upon your

566
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 1: kids today. Ah, there's a lot of them, but I

567
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:24,680
Speaker 1: would I would say footwork when you offensive, when you

568
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:26,640
Speaker 1: catch the ball. He's really good. I thought he's a

569
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 1: really good offensive coach. And he some on the fundamentals,

570
00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 1: just as far as cash turn to face, bringing up

571
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:37,479
Speaker 1: your right foot if you're right hand, or stuff like that.

572
00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 1: People go back and forth on it. To this David,

573
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 1: it's I think you had it right and it's what

574
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 1: we teach, and I think it really has a lot

575
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 1: to do with how you shoot the ball, and we

576
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:50,280
Speaker 1: shoot the ball pretty well, and I think it Yeah,

577
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 1: it goes back to that. But he was He was

578
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:56,520
Speaker 1: Hanks biggest deal to me. And if you ask me,

579
00:30:56,560 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 1: one guy coach with the college that had the big

580
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 1: gust effect on my coaching would be hanged for sure,

581
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 1: because I end up spending uh seven years with him.

582
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:11,600
Speaker 1: But his integrity was second and none like he just

583
00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 1: he thought guys should act right and high character and

584
00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: even his coaching he was tough, like he's tough on kids.

585
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 1: He's he was demanding on his coach coaches. And I

586
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 1: was lucky to work for him. And I was really

587
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:30,640
Speaker 1: lucky to work for him early on in my career,

588
00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: and it helped me a lot as far as just

589
00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 1: see he got it and he really got it on

590
00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 1: integrity and high character and and being being Trudy two

591
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 1: yourself acting right and uh yeah, all right, those those

592
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 1: impressions stuck. What about what about Tim Floyd? It was

593
00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:56,520
Speaker 1: his first head coaching job. Of course he went on

594
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 1: to what Louisiana attack and then obviously I would staying

595
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 1: he played against them, were they were great? Um, and

596
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:04,720
Speaker 1: then he had a couple stops in the NBA as

597
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: well as as USC. One thing that you took from

598
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: your time with timployed a couple of things. I think

599
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:14,560
Speaker 1: anybody knows Tim. He really knew the profession. He'd be

600
00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:19,720
Speaker 1: an assistant for Don Haskins for uh maybe eleven ten

601
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: years somewhere in there, and he was pretty much doing

602
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:26,959
Speaker 1: all the recruiting UTAP at that time, and so he

603
00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 1: knew the profession inside and out. I thought he was

604
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:33,800
Speaker 1: really shrewd. To this day, if I have a question

605
00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:37,040
Speaker 1: on something like that in the profession, every once in a

606
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:38,960
Speaker 1: a while, I'll shoot him call and see what he

607
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:43,000
Speaker 1: thinks on that. Um, Now, he really he really understood that.

608
00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 1: So I thought he was good there and then he

609
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 1: was he was a relentless worker and just he obviously

610
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 1: was a good recruiter, but he was He was a

611
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:53,440
Speaker 1: good coach for that age at that time. I mean,

612
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:55,800
Speaker 1: he's been around Haskins, so he knew what he knew

613
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:57,160
Speaker 1: what he was doing. All right. Then you worked for

614
00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 1: Lorenzo Romar at pep and A at St. Louis one

615
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:07,960
Speaker 1: thing from row that you still use, I would say, uh,

616
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:11,040
Speaker 1: just how good he was is with people. If I

617
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 1: picked one thing that I thought Lorenzo was, he he's

618
00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 1: he's really talented guy and a great human being as well.

619
00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:20,760
Speaker 1: But I thought he was just really good with people,

620
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:25,760
Speaker 1: with the players and coaches. He just made you feel

621
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: good when you're around. He's in a tractor, but just

622
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:33,680
Speaker 1: really good with people. So, um, in two thousand one St.

623
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 1: Mary's who they had been good. Uh, you know, Ernie

624
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,680
Speaker 1: had him going and they went to the n C

625
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:41,719
Speaker 1: a term he leaves and C. Dominguez. You know, they

626
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:44,080
Speaker 1: win two games, he ends up getting fired. How did

627
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:45,479
Speaker 1: you get the St. Mary's job? How did that come

628
00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:47,640
Speaker 1: to be? You're at what St. Louis at the time,

629
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: and you guys had St. Louis pretty well rolling? How

630
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 1: did you get the same Mary's job? Uh? So, yeah

631
00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:59,200
Speaker 1: it was boys, I said Selby to minus Dave Dave

632
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,760
Speaker 1: Bowinkle my well four years after Ernie did and they

633
00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 1: live they had some that's a bad break. So the

634
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: starting with Brad Millard had the foot problem, right, So

635
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:14,920
Speaker 1: anyhow did how did I get the job? I was

636
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:17,840
Speaker 1: lucky and that's the bottom line there was. It was

637
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 1: really down. They weren't paying a lot um and yeah

638
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 1: I was whatever. Somehow did you did you interview? Did

639
00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 1: you interview in person? Yeah? I mean what like how

640
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 1: did you go back? I think like we have you know, like, look,

641
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 1: there's lots of basketball coaches listen to this pod. You're like,

642
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: how did you get it? All? Right? So you're at

643
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 1: you're at St. Louis. What do you remember about how

644
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:45,040
Speaker 1: you're like St. Mary's just coming open, Dave Bowinkle lose

645
00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:46,960
Speaker 1: his job. You knew the league because your time at

646
00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:49,600
Speaker 1: San Diego and at Pepperdine, right, you know, the West

647
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:51,360
Speaker 1: Coast because that's where you that's where you grew up,

648
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 1: and that's where you grew up in terms of recruiting.

649
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 1: But how did you go about, you know, get in

650
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 1: front of somebody and where did where did you conduct

651
00:34:57,480 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 1: your interview and what was your pitch? How did you

652
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:03,120
Speaker 1: do it? So I was at a point in my

653
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,200
Speaker 1: career and I was at St. Louis and really was

654
00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:07,799
Speaker 1: a West Coast guy. Lorenzo took the job of St.

655
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:11,799
Speaker 1: Louis as a Pepperdine and kind of, you know, I

656
00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:14,759
Speaker 1: was in San Diego and they brought in a guy,

657
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:17,560
Speaker 1: they brought in Brad Holland. And then I was when

658
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 1: I was hoping, you know, I thought I had a

659
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,440
Speaker 1: chance to get that job. And then the same thing

660
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:26,359
Speaker 1: having at Pepperdine and they brought him Van Breda CoV

661
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:30,520
Speaker 1: And so that's what I was talking about earlier. Like

662
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:32,840
Speaker 1: I didn't really figure out how it all worked. I

663
00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:36,239
Speaker 1: was like thirty, and I kind of got not that

664
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 1: I deserved the jobs and they take very good candidates,

665
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:42,399
Speaker 1: but it kind of reality hit me, all right, wait

666
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,440
Speaker 1: a minute, these jobs are hard to get. I have

667
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 1: to figure out how you do this, because I don't

668
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 1: want to change professions and I don't want to be

669
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:51,480
Speaker 1: assist all my life. But I had gotten a point

670
00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:54,680
Speaker 1: and moved out to St. Louis with Lorenzo. He took

671
00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:57,400
Speaker 1: that job. I didn't really want to go. I just

672
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:02,279
Speaker 1: had no connection with the Midwest. Like I said, born

673
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 1: and raised in the West, had done to college out there.

674
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:09,400
Speaker 1: All my contacts were out there, and so I was ready.

675
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:12,399
Speaker 1: I was ready to co tak a j C job.

676
00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 1: I was right at that point, and I thought I

677
00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:19,000
Speaker 1: could get one in Arizona and this St. Marriag's job open.

678
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 1: And I'd been in the league a number of years, um,

679
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:28,799
Speaker 1: probably fourteen years before that was San Diego and Pepperdine

680
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:34,000
Speaker 1: actually in twelve years UM, So I had experienced that

681
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:36,400
Speaker 1: and I knew the school, but I really didn't know.

682
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:39,120
Speaker 1: I didn't really know the same marriage job very well.

683
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:44,839
Speaker 1: It came open, I threw my name in there. Rick

684
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 1: Majeri's called for me, helped me get in there as

685
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:50,920
Speaker 1: far as at least get they knew who I was.

686
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 1: And then, um, I think because I was of St. Louis,

687
00:36:56,640 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 1: were in Conference USA at that time. The guy that

688
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:04,400
Speaker 1: athletic director Carl Clapp at the time at St. Mary's

689
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:09,640
Speaker 1: thought that that was pretty big deal conference USA Cincinnati

690
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:11,960
Speaker 1: was number one in the country I think the year

691
00:37:12,040 --> 00:37:15,160
Speaker 1: before with Kenyan Martin all them, so it was perceived as, hey,

692
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 1: this is a this is an assistant from a bigger conference,

693
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:26,279
Speaker 1: and they I met. What happened? I met Uh. I

694
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:30,880
Speaker 1: met with him at the final four in Minneapolis in

695
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:35,200
Speaker 1: the in the right by the swim pool and an

696
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:39,120
Speaker 1: indoor swim pool, people running buying their swimsuits. I was like,

697
00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 1: this is kind of crazy. I didn't think this is

698
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:45,600
Speaker 1: what the interview is gonna be like, but I guess it. Yeah,

699
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:48,440
Speaker 1: went well, and then they brought me out to campus

700
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:50,200
Speaker 1: and I think I was the last guy they brought in,

701
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 1: and I really I didn't. I didn't think I was

702
00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:57,960
Speaker 1: getting a job at that time. I was like, well,

703
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,879
Speaker 1: whatever happens, happens. I think it helped me actually, because

704
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:05,160
Speaker 1: I wasn't nervous at all for the interview. If it

705
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:07,879
Speaker 1: didn't happen, I was probably making more money at St.

706
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:12,120
Speaker 1: Louis's assistant whatever. So I came in there and I

707
00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:14,600
Speaker 1: think the fact that I've been at University of San

708
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 1: Diego and Pepperdine in the league, and I knew the league.

709
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:21,440
Speaker 1: I think that probably helped me a little bit as

710
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,600
Speaker 1: far as on an interview answering questions. What I thought

711
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 1: as far as what should happen at school like is

712
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 1: it was very much like the University of San Diego

713
00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:32,960
Speaker 1: when I was there, and so I had familiarity with

714
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 1: with that. With it, I felt like it was pretty

715
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:40,640
Speaker 1: much the same job. And uh so it went well

716
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:44,440
Speaker 1: and then uh sitting down there one of the pumps tournaments,

717
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 1: uh like that next weekend, actually two days after I

718
00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:51,719
Speaker 1: finished my interview, and they called me and said, hey,

719
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:54,160
Speaker 1: we take this job. There's some other things that happened

720
00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 1: in between there, but pretty much that was it. And

721
00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,000
Speaker 1: I was like, guys, this really happened. And so I

722
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 1: was lucky. And uh I tell people that all the

723
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:05,360
Speaker 1: time that I had to get lucky, and uh, I

724
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:08,800
Speaker 1: think most guys get these jobs, they get a break,

725
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 1: and unfortunately I got one. And in the rest of

726
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:15,000
Speaker 1: his history, all right, so you get the job, and

727
00:39:15,200 --> 00:39:18,480
Speaker 1: now you realize I'm going from St. Louis where you

728
00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:19,800
Speaker 1: guys are going to the the n c A tourmament I

729
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:21,759
Speaker 1: think he had Larry Hughes as well to a to

730
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 1: a two win team in the league that at the

731
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:28,680
Speaker 1: time was dominated by Pepperdine and and going Zaga. What

732
00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:33,640
Speaker 1: was the program like when you took it over. There

733
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:35,680
Speaker 1: wasn't a lot of confidence in the players. That was

734
00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:39,239
Speaker 1: the biggest thing that I noticed right away. They I

735
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:42,560
Speaker 1: think it happens, you get they had won two games,

736
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:46,480
Speaker 1: EREI four and uh yeah, the confidence there being no

737
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:53,200
Speaker 1: just from losing and I I had. I've been around

738
00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:57,279
Speaker 1: that a time or two when we took over programs,

739
00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:02,000
Speaker 1: like when we took over. Uh, when I first went

740
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 1: to San Diego, they're coming off of down here, and

741
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:06,160
Speaker 1: when I first went to Pepper and they're coming off

742
00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 1: down here. So that was the major issue. We actually

743
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 1: had some There was actually some players there when I

744
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:17,879
Speaker 1: got there. The two leading scorers from that team said

745
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:24,799
Speaker 1: they were going to transfer, and I was like, I

746
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 1: think we'll be all right with that either way. I

747
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:32,000
Speaker 1: just wanted guys who want to be with us at St. Mary's,

748
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:35,680
Speaker 1: and I gave everybody fresh start. I didn't run anybody off,

749
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:37,680
Speaker 1: and I just told him, I said, I'm not even

750
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 1: watch belm from you from last year. We're just gonna

751
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 1: start over and see what we can do. And we

752
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 1: did and they were great. We had some some guys

753
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:51,880
Speaker 1: that really bought in. To this day when I you know,

754
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:54,319
Speaker 1: a lot of good memories being at St. Mary's now,

755
00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:57,760
Speaker 1: but to this day, that first year it was really cool,

756
00:40:58,040 --> 00:40:59,880
Speaker 1: like just to try and we had to get them

757
00:40:59,920 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 1: to believe. They had to believe. And how do you

758
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:04,640
Speaker 1: do that themselves? How do you do that? I think

759
00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:06,960
Speaker 1: it starts with work, and you just gotta work. You

760
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:09,600
Speaker 1: gotta know you paid the price, and if you work,

761
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 1: you'll start seeing results. And then when you see results,

762
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:17,400
Speaker 1: I think you're it's a cycle. I think you go

763
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:19,880
Speaker 1: back and you work harder and then you see some

764
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:23,799
Speaker 1: more results. So and then eventually they start thinking, hey,

765
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: I'm not bad, I can make these plays. We we

766
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:31,759
Speaker 1: played in some games. Our first game when I was

767
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,919
Speaker 1: of St. Mary's, we played a good UC Irvine team.

768
00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:38,120
Speaker 1: They had won twenty five games a year before, and

769
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:41,280
Speaker 1: we were we were like up six in the last

770
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 1: five or six minutes and we just we just it

771
00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 1: was crazy to me how we just had a melt

772
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:51,560
Speaker 1: down and there was a straight confidence issue. They had

773
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:54,920
Speaker 1: not been in that position in a long time, and

774
00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:59,879
Speaker 1: I think they had twenty one losses in a row

775
00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:04,880
Speaker 1: standing from the year before, so they just they got nervous,

776
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:06,400
Speaker 1: meaning in that spot. So we had a lot of

777
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:11,560
Speaker 1: issues like that that just psychologically you have to teach them.

778
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:12,800
Speaker 1: You got to teach them how to win to like

779
00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:15,280
Speaker 1: teaching a team. First you gotta teach and believe themselves

780
00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:17,200
Speaker 1: and you get to sell other stuff and then like

781
00:42:17,239 --> 00:42:19,879
Speaker 1: the final step is like teaching them how to win.

782
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:21,359
Speaker 1: One you have to believe you're gonna win. But then

783
00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:24,759
Speaker 1: there's a physical like these are things that we have

784
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 1: to do, and then you almost have to then you

785
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 1: have to like do it, and then you kind of

786
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 1: believe in it even more right, it's kind of the

787
00:42:31,520 --> 00:42:33,759
Speaker 1: same process by which you believe in them you have

788
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,000
Speaker 1: to do in terms of as a team executing and

789
00:42:36,040 --> 00:42:42,319
Speaker 1: winning games very fair and all those little steps you

790
00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 1: forget they exist if you haven't dealt with them, Like

791
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:50,279
Speaker 1: I hadn't dealt with that for a while, and I

792
00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:54,040
Speaker 1: didn't realize how fragile guys could be. So those it

793
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:57,240
Speaker 1: was different than things we had to be work on, man,

794
00:42:57,880 --> 00:43:00,239
Speaker 1: are totally different than the things we have to work

795
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:02,560
Speaker 1: on now. Now we have to work on. Hey, you're

796
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: getta deal. You're gonna have expectations all the time, and

797
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 1: people are gonna have your your name circled before they

798
00:43:10,719 --> 00:43:15,040
Speaker 1: play you each year. So it's totally different. But it

799
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 1: was great. I mean, they they got those kids were

800
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:21,680
Speaker 1: they're good. They had to fight through some tough stuff

801
00:43:21,719 --> 00:43:27,000
Speaker 1: and then and we started getting some We had some

802
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:30,880
Speaker 1: talent then, but we had had to get older and

803
00:43:30,960 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 1: more confident and better leadership and all that stuff. If

804
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:37,840
Speaker 1: I was a better coach that first year, we probably

805
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:40,879
Speaker 1: could have won won nine. We probably could have won

806
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:46,640
Speaker 1: thirteen or fourteen, and uh so, but has that happened.

807
00:43:47,320 --> 00:43:50,040
Speaker 1: We were able to get better players and more of them.

808
00:43:50,080 --> 00:43:51,920
Speaker 1: And Daniel Kicker was the first. Was it was the

809
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:56,600
Speaker 1: first big offsee right, Yes, he was the first. He

810
00:43:56,680 --> 00:44:00,000
Speaker 1: was our first All league guy that we recruited. Okay,

811
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,440
Speaker 1: s good. So you you how did you come? Do

812
00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:06,400
Speaker 1: you remember how you got Daniel Kicker? I totally remember

813
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:11,239
Speaker 1: how we got Daniel Kicker? Okay, go. We took my

814
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 1: first year there. We took Adam cape Porn in August,

815
00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:17,200
Speaker 1: late August, he was like four days late for school.

816
00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:21,759
Speaker 1: Is that late? And uh we had two scholarships at

817
00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:24,279
Speaker 1: the time, I just I hadn't even seen him play.

818
00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:29,200
Speaker 1: Can you hadn't seen I hadn't seen him. I saw

819
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,000
Speaker 1: him a little on video, but we we just needed

820
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:34,440
Speaker 1: some cards. It was hard to get guys at that point.

821
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 1: And Uh, this kid want to come over. He's looking

822
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:41,880
Speaker 1: at Division two school and that's the Pacecook. It was

823
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:47,239
Speaker 1: like first conversations. I say, you don't know me. I

824
00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:49,360
Speaker 1: don't know you. You don't know much about this place,

825
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:53,279
Speaker 1: but we could use you. I think I think we'll

826
00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 1: get good in time. I love to have you. You

827
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:59,400
Speaker 1: want to do this? And he said sure, and that

828
00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:01,359
Speaker 1: was that and he was honest. We had to. I mean,

829
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:04,120
Speaker 1: we had a hustle to get his beasts everything straight,

830
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:05,920
Speaker 1: get him in school. But he's a really good student.

831
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:11,799
Speaker 1: Anyhow he came. He was great as as far as Yeah,

832
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 1: he's way better on thought he'd be. And uh, and

833
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:16,560
Speaker 1: he told us about Kicker. He said, I think I

834
00:45:16,600 --> 00:45:18,960
Speaker 1: think I got a teammate that could maybe help us,

835
00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 1: And that was Kicking And so that's how we found

836
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 1: out about it. We recruited him. He liked Adam being

837
00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:31,480
Speaker 1: in our school helped, and then he liked our He

838
00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:34,239
Speaker 1: liked her, he liked St. Mary's, he liked their situation.

839
00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:36,719
Speaker 1: Now he's gonna play a lot right away. But he

840
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:42,120
Speaker 1: was really humble and he was it was okay with

841
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:47,560
Speaker 1: not He didn't really like the recruitment. He didn't like

842
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:51,480
Speaker 1: being stroked. That wasn't what his deal was. So he

843
00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:55,200
Speaker 1: uh kind of I think I think the assistant from

844
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:57,600
Speaker 1: Oregon at the time, I told him, hey, this it

845
00:45:57,719 --> 00:46:01,160
Speaker 1: was the worst passible decision ever, and it was probably

846
00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:04,319
Speaker 1: I mean, knowing what he knew, he was probably right.

847
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:07,319
Speaker 1: But it turned out it turned out to be a

848
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 1: great decision for him because he end up be an

849
00:46:09,080 --> 00:46:11,120
Speaker 1: all time winking score at St. Mary's. But it's just

850
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:14,840
Speaker 1: it's funny how those things work out. And uh, and

851
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:17,279
Speaker 1: that was kicking when I look back, Kicker was a

852
00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:20,840
Speaker 1: was the big piece and us turning this thing. And

853
00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:22,919
Speaker 1: then of course you had Patty Mills. I remember when

854
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:26,680
Speaker 1: I came and spoke at your kickoff banquet when Delhi

855
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:30,160
Speaker 1: was a freshman, and You're like, hey, that's my next

856
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:34,319
Speaker 1: great player, and I was like, really like he he

857
00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:37,399
Speaker 1: looked like, uh, he kind of looked like Team Wolf.

858
00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:39,160
Speaker 1: He had so much hair, right, like he had just

859
00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 1: kind of like like leg hair and he was kind

860
00:46:41,040 --> 00:46:43,440
Speaker 1: of thick legged, and I was like, I don't know,

861
00:46:43,520 --> 00:46:45,520
Speaker 1: and he kind of funky looking shot like yeah, you

862
00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:47,239
Speaker 1: just gotta trust me. You just gotta watch him play

863
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:50,479
Speaker 1: for a while. And I was like, I don't, I don't.

864
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:52,799
Speaker 1: I don't know. What's it like to coach all those

865
00:46:52,840 --> 00:46:57,000
Speaker 1: because my again this is more outsider and any aussee

866
00:46:57,040 --> 00:46:59,440
Speaker 1: that I've played with or dealt with, they all seem

867
00:46:59,520 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 1: like they just kind of got it figured out right,

868
00:47:02,200 --> 00:47:05,040
Speaker 1: Like they just they play super hard. They're a little

869
00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 1: bit they're like physical to the point of like are

870
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:09,680
Speaker 1: they being dirty or they just they don't mind it

871
00:47:09,719 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 1: being physical. They're like right on that edge, you know.

872
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: And then after the game, it couldn't be better. Dudes,

873
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:18,360
Speaker 1: they all like to drink beer, it seems like, and

874
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:20,319
Speaker 1: and have a good time. Is that you've coached a

875
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:23,520
Speaker 1: lot of Australians. I know that I'm making assumptions about

876
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:25,680
Speaker 1: a bunch of kids I don't know about. But how

877
00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:27,759
Speaker 1: accurate did I name? Did I did I nail the

878
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:32,399
Speaker 1: skid of report? Pretty accurate? I would say the one

879
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:38,000
Speaker 1: common denominating most of them are tough, not all. They're

880
00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 1: not all physically tough like that. But some of them are.

881
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:44,319
Speaker 1: They're just like everybody else. But the one common denominator

882
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,160
Speaker 1: is they are great teammates like that is that is

883
00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:50,200
Speaker 1: part of their culture, that's part of Australia. Is they

884
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:53,879
Speaker 1: are not They either are not into the it's all

885
00:47:53,880 --> 00:47:56,320
Speaker 1: about me deal or they're not even comfortable with like,

886
00:47:56,920 --> 00:47:59,160
Speaker 1: hey you're the man. Like we told Delli, hey you're

887
00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:01,880
Speaker 1: the next great there he would not be comfortable with

888
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:05,960
Speaker 1: that with that conversation. He would change that conversation a second.

889
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:11,200
Speaker 1: And there Patty too. They're and those guys they are

890
00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:15,680
Speaker 1: great ones and uh but to a man, their their

891
00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:20,840
Speaker 1: team spirit, being about the team, enjoying being part of

892
00:48:20,840 --> 00:48:24,080
Speaker 1: a team. Those things are that's the one thing that

893
00:48:24,200 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 1: every one of those us drying kids has in common. Um.

894
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 1: And they they are they've been eight we've had eighteen

895
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:36,719
Speaker 1: of them, nineteen now they they're all great guys. Like

896
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 1: we have no issues with those guys and there they

897
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:44,560
Speaker 1: really they turn this thing into Our programs obviously got

898
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:48,359
Speaker 1: it a big They're a big part of it as

899
00:48:48,360 --> 00:48:52,160
Speaker 1: far as just the culture of our program and even

900
00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:54,759
Speaker 1: our school in our community. So it's been a it's

901
00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:56,880
Speaker 1: been a cool story. Once again, I mean it was

902
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:00,279
Speaker 1: kind of it's kind of a fluke deal and then

903
00:49:01,719 --> 00:49:04,520
Speaker 1: good things happened. So we when we doubled down, went

904
00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:07,719
Speaker 1: back down there and rosa more in once Patty came.

905
00:49:08,640 --> 00:49:11,920
Speaker 1: It really because he was kind of the poster child

906
00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:14,400
Speaker 1: for the youth basketball over there at that time. He

907
00:49:14,480 --> 00:49:19,200
Speaker 1: played in the Nike Hoops Summit and so he everybody

908
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:21,120
Speaker 1: knew he was good when he when he decided to

909
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:26,680
Speaker 1: come here, which it was crazy that worked out the

910
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:29,120
Speaker 1: way he did. He really got under recruited. But anyhow,

911
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:31,359
Speaker 1: when he came, he should take him super early, wasn't

912
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:33,440
Speaker 1: He didn't? Didn't They play on a tour? I remember,

913
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:35,719
Speaker 1: and tell me if I'm wrong. I remember a I

914
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:38,000
Speaker 1: s the Australian Institute of Sport. Remember them coming on

915
00:49:38,040 --> 00:49:40,359
Speaker 1: a tour and playing and you going and seeing him

916
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:42,319
Speaker 1: and him committing to you early. Is that? Am I

917
00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:47,759
Speaker 1: misremembering and I remembering a different player? Uh? They did

918
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:49,840
Speaker 1: come on a tour and they came up to our school.

919
00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 1: So we met him early. We had gone on a

920
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 1: tour over there and had seen him seeing their young

921
00:49:56,040 --> 00:49:59,879
Speaker 1: guys when we played on the tour. But he fun,

922
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:03,040
Speaker 1: he's trying me. Like when he came on his visit,

923
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:05,839
Speaker 1: he had two visits. He took two visits and uh,

924
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:11,880
Speaker 1: they're gonna be Utah and St. Mary's and so he

925
00:50:11,960 --> 00:50:14,840
Speaker 1: had a buddy over the name Steve Way at Utah

926
00:50:15,040 --> 00:50:18,440
Speaker 1: and so he's gonna so he had interest there obviously

927
00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:21,759
Speaker 1: had some guys here that we're from Australia. But when

928
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 1: he arrived at Utah, he uh, when he got off

929
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:29,640
Speaker 1: the plane, their coach at that time and said, hey,

930
00:50:29,680 --> 00:50:32,200
Speaker 1: we just took a commitment from another kid this weekend.

931
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:34,560
Speaker 1: I think Patty came on Monday and they took the commitment.

932
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:37,440
Speaker 1: A kid came in and committed on Sunday. So anyhow,

933
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:41,399
Speaker 1: so I get a guy Patty Is. They said, hey,

934
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:43,160
Speaker 1: we can send you to St. Mary's right now, or

935
00:50:43,239 --> 00:50:48,160
Speaker 1: you can just hang out with with your buddy here

936
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:50,960
Speaker 1: for two days up to you, but we don't have

937
00:50:50,960 --> 00:50:53,759
Speaker 1: a scholarships for you. He was he was the best.

938
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:55,719
Speaker 1: Said now I'll just hang out here for a couple

939
00:50:55,760 --> 00:50:57,919
Speaker 1: of days of visit my boy. And so he did

940
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:00,239
Speaker 1: that and he came in on our visit and we're

941
00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:05,680
Speaker 1: pretty much only school there was that it visited them.

942
00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:08,480
Speaker 1: I got my own I got my own I got

943
00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:12,680
Speaker 1: my own Utah stories that you might like. Okay, So, uh,

944
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:16,680
Speaker 1: I leave Notre Dame and I went to Golden West College.

945
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:19,000
Speaker 1: Tom McClusky, in my old high school coach my first year,

946
00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:22,759
Speaker 1: was a coach of Golden West, and so I'm like,

947
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:27,320
Speaker 1: I'm like practice all American, and I helped him like assist.

948
00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:29,200
Speaker 1: I was like an assistant to him and during the games,

949
00:51:29,960 --> 00:51:32,680
Speaker 1: and it was it was an awesome experience. And you know,

950
00:51:32,719 --> 00:51:35,400
Speaker 1: I I worked out with Marv Rnovich. I got my

951
00:51:35,480 --> 00:51:39,080
Speaker 1: a A degree. Anyway, so Rick Majeria starts recruiting me

952
00:51:39,160 --> 00:51:43,759
Speaker 1: because Andre Miller was a prop forty eight and at

953
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:47,960
Speaker 1: the time, I think he was a junior, and so

954
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:50,000
Speaker 1: I was going to play with him for one year

955
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:53,000
Speaker 1: and then I would have two years without Andre. And

956
00:51:53,080 --> 00:51:57,920
Speaker 1: so Rick Majerra's first he comes to Golden West gym

957
00:51:57,960 --> 00:52:01,279
Speaker 1: and I practiced against the the j C team and

958
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:04,920
Speaker 1: then afterwards, like he and Jeff Judkins, they like, uh,

959
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:06,560
Speaker 1: you only want to stay and shoot a little bit.

960
00:52:06,600 --> 00:52:09,480
Speaker 1: I was like yeah, so literally, and Donnie Daniels walks in.

961
00:52:09,560 --> 00:52:12,440
Speaker 1: So there's three assistant coaches and me, and they locked

962
00:52:12,440 --> 00:52:13,879
Speaker 1: the doors to the gym and they worked me out

963
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: for like an hour and a half, right, because this

964
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:17,960
Speaker 1: whole thing was like I don't know if you can shoot,

965
00:52:18,320 --> 00:52:20,160
Speaker 1: you know, And so he worked me out and he's like,

966
00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:23,200
Speaker 1: oh you can, you can play, and so he basically

967
00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:25,160
Speaker 1: offered me a scholarship. And they're playing U C Irvine

968
00:52:25,160 --> 00:52:28,400
Speaker 1: like the next day. So I go to watch. This

969
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:30,600
Speaker 1: is Keith Van Horne and Andre Miller and they practice

970
00:52:30,640 --> 00:52:33,960
Speaker 1: at U C I and it was an unbelievable practice

971
00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:37,960
Speaker 1: and I never here's like, here's the indelible moment even

972
00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:40,560
Speaker 1: watching them practice. Two things I remember about Jared's practice.

973
00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:44,120
Speaker 1: One was he would he would yell at him and

974
00:52:44,160 --> 00:52:48,400
Speaker 1: blast him, well good van Horne, what the funk are

975
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:51,720
Speaker 1: you doing? Go to two lines? And they would whoever

976
00:52:51,719 --> 00:52:53,719
Speaker 1: he would yell out would run over to the baseline.

977
00:52:54,080 --> 00:52:57,839
Speaker 1: He's not looking. They touched the baseline. They sprint down

978
00:52:57,880 --> 00:52:59,799
Speaker 1: and back with two lines. It's sprint down and back

979
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:01,879
Speaker 1: and then hop back in the drill. Like he wasn't

980
00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:05,280
Speaker 1: It wasn't like everybody lines up. He just like two lines,

981
00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:08,280
Speaker 1: three lines, four whatever, and they with they were like

982
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:10,360
Speaker 1: pro like robots, and they were splitting their ass off

983
00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:12,520
Speaker 1: because it was like, damn he if he turns around,

984
00:53:12,560 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 1: I'm not doing it. I'm gonna run all day. The

985
00:53:14,600 --> 00:53:18,000
Speaker 1: second thing was he had like five walk ons and

986
00:53:18,040 --> 00:53:19,800
Speaker 1: I thought walk ons couldn't travel, And I don't know

987
00:53:19,840 --> 00:53:21,799
Speaker 1: how he did it, but he had five walk ons

988
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:24,840
Speaker 1: over the scout team and the guys that were in

989
00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:28,160
Speaker 1: the rotation would sit in chairs and they had their

990
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:31,520
Speaker 1: notebooks opened up. They'd watched the scantn report and the

991
00:53:31,560 --> 00:53:33,719
Speaker 1: walk ons or whatever the assistant coach or whoever is

992
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:36,160
Speaker 1: doing it would run through stuff. Then they'd come guard it.

993
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:38,080
Speaker 1: Then they go back and sit down like it was.

994
00:53:38,520 --> 00:53:40,400
Speaker 1: It was like a work of art watching his practice.

995
00:53:40,960 --> 00:53:44,560
Speaker 1: Then we went to spoons, and spoons is like before this,

996
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:46,360
Speaker 1: I don't know if they still have spoons like chilis

997
00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:53,120
Speaker 1: and okay, okay. So we're sitting there eating and he's

998
00:53:53,160 --> 00:53:55,359
Speaker 1: like trying to be on a diet and I got

999
00:53:55,360 --> 00:53:59,080
Speaker 1: like a burger and fries and way while we're talking basketball,

1000
00:53:59,080 --> 00:54:01,040
Speaker 1: and you know, like you've you I'm sure you sat

1001
00:54:01,040 --> 00:54:04,600
Speaker 1: down with Rickman Jarison. It's just the most incredible, insightful

1002
00:54:04,640 --> 00:54:07,000
Speaker 1: basketball conversation. Mean, while he's eating all of my fries,

1003
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:08,279
Speaker 1: while he's telling me he's on a diet and he's

1004
00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:10,760
Speaker 1: eating a salad and he's asking me about my burger,

1005
00:54:11,120 --> 00:54:12,719
Speaker 1: how it looks pretty good. So then he orders like

1006
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:15,040
Speaker 1: the same burger in the same price I have, wife's

1007
00:54:15,080 --> 00:54:18,960
Speaker 1: the whole thing out. So uh, they come back to

1008
00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:22,640
Speaker 1: town to play Fullerton. Like two weeks later. He comes

1009
00:54:22,680 --> 00:54:24,960
Speaker 1: to my house for an in home visit and my

1010
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:27,800
Speaker 1: mom makes this huge kind of spread and he's like, listen,

1011
00:54:28,560 --> 00:54:31,080
Speaker 1: you know tomorrow they're gonna pass a rule where Prop

1012
00:54:31,160 --> 00:54:34,239
Speaker 1: forty eight can, if they graduate on time, can get

1013
00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:37,680
Speaker 1: that year back. So look, you're His vision was I

1014
00:54:37,680 --> 00:54:39,759
Speaker 1: would play me and Andrea played together for a year,

1015
00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 1: and then Andrea would would go to go to the pros.

1016
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:44,839
Speaker 1: And in this particular case, he basically told me like

1017
00:54:44,880 --> 00:54:47,160
Speaker 1: the very next day, which it did happen, Prop forty

1018
00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:48,600
Speaker 1: eights could get their earback. So I would have had

1019
00:54:48,600 --> 00:54:50,920
Speaker 1: to play two years with Andrea and only had the

1020
00:54:50,920 --> 00:54:53,279
Speaker 1: team to myself for a year. And I wasn't really

1021
00:54:53,640 --> 00:54:55,719
Speaker 1: I just didn't think that was a great situation for me.

1022
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:58,240
Speaker 1: You like, I I'm not really a two guard anyway.

1023
00:54:58,600 --> 00:55:02,160
Speaker 1: Andrea neither Andrea Norman could shoot, and that wasn't anyway

1024
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:04,279
Speaker 1: he stayed and had had a great dinner. We had

1025
00:55:04,280 --> 00:55:06,200
Speaker 1: a great visit, even though he knew like it wasn't

1026
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:08,319
Speaker 1: really a scholarship offer because it wasn't something I was

1027
00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:11,080
Speaker 1: gonna take. That's my own kind of Utah, thought I

1028
00:55:11,160 --> 00:55:13,239
Speaker 1: might go there and all of a sudden it didn't happen.

1029
00:55:14,120 --> 00:55:17,799
Speaker 1: That that is such a story. Yeah, he had great,

1030
00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:20,720
Speaker 1: he had he killed, killed, crushed my mom's fried chicken,

1031
00:55:20,840 --> 00:55:25,040
Speaker 1: just just crushed. Um. Okay, so of the things they

1032
00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:28,400
Speaker 1: turn on the charm too, Oh yeah, oh, no, no question.

1033
00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:30,720
Speaker 1: Although he's the one who told my dad his team

1034
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:33,279
Speaker 1: coach him hard and then he could just turn on

1035
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:39,799
Speaker 1: the charms. One best coaches I've ever no, no, no question. Um.

1036
00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:42,080
Speaker 1: And obviously there's some there's some other stories which are

1037
00:55:42,080 --> 00:55:45,200
Speaker 1: amazing which we made. Not we we might not tell.

1038
00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:46,960
Speaker 1: We might tell. We gets a podcast we could tell,

1039
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:52,040
Speaker 1: but um, yeah it was. It was pretty pretty interesting stuff. Okay,

1040
00:55:52,080 --> 00:55:56,239
Speaker 1: so you you but you've only won three tournament games,

1041
00:55:56,239 --> 00:55:58,720
Speaker 1: and I say only remember like it's not like St. Mary's,

1042
00:55:58,760 --> 00:56:02,400
Speaker 1: but you've had all these incredible dominant seasons. You're competing

1043
00:56:02,440 --> 00:56:05,120
Speaker 1: with Gonzaga, who has now reached a national championship. Game,

1044
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:08,680
Speaker 1: and you know lost lost by a bucket. Obviously, the

1045
00:56:08,800 --> 00:56:11,879
Speaker 1: Villanova game is probably your like your signature upset win.

1046
00:56:13,080 --> 00:56:16,360
Speaker 1: How can you get like what? What's missing from allowing

1047
00:56:16,360 --> 00:56:20,239
Speaker 1: you guys to do what a Butler of ECU more

1048
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:24,359
Speaker 1: maybe more Butler and Gonzaga and some of these other

1049
00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:27,640
Speaker 1: programs that have been kind of mid majors and they've

1050
00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 1: been able to compete um deeper into March than you've

1051
00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:36,440
Speaker 1: been able to compete. I think the biggest deal I

1052
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:42,480
Speaker 1: think I think even won four tournament game if you're counting, okay,

1053
00:56:41,840 --> 00:56:44,799
Speaker 1: so I think they took one off. I think they

1054
00:56:44,840 --> 00:56:48,040
Speaker 1: took one off. Did they take one off? No? No, no, no, no,

1055
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:54,400
Speaker 1: not so bad. Well, see won four tournament games. But

1056
00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:57,000
Speaker 1: the bottom line is, I think you have the hardest

1057
00:56:57,040 --> 00:56:59,520
Speaker 1: thing is to get in the tournament. If you get

1058
00:56:59,560 --> 00:57:04,560
Speaker 1: in the turn you can how long think it's it's

1059
00:57:04,600 --> 00:57:07,279
Speaker 1: not easy, But it's harder to getting the tournament is

1060
00:57:07,320 --> 00:57:10,600
Speaker 1: to win a game. And uh, the last two times

1061
00:57:10,600 --> 00:57:13,239
Speaker 1: we've been there, we won our first game and then

1062
00:57:13,239 --> 00:57:17,280
Speaker 1: we lost Arizona one time and lost to Memphis the

1063
00:57:17,320 --> 00:57:20,440
Speaker 1: next or the other time. How you guys get you

1064
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:23,280
Speaker 1: also get bad draws too, because you never. You never

1065
00:57:23,360 --> 00:57:25,439
Speaker 1: You're like where Gonzaga used to be, where you never

1066
00:57:25,440 --> 00:57:30,200
Speaker 1: get a good seed. No, but hey, there's unless you're

1067
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:32,600
Speaker 1: a one or a two seeds, you're gonna you're gonna

1068
00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:35,120
Speaker 1: get a bad draw. There's there's no dogs in there.

1069
00:57:35,120 --> 00:57:38,760
Speaker 1: It's all pretty even. And that's why I say the

1070
00:57:38,760 --> 00:57:40,320
Speaker 1: hardest thing is getting in. If you can get in,

1071
00:57:40,440 --> 00:57:42,120
Speaker 1: you can. You got a chance to win. You got

1072
00:57:42,160 --> 00:57:44,480
Speaker 1: a pretty good chance to win if you're if you

1073
00:57:44,520 --> 00:57:45,840
Speaker 1: get in there and you play well, you have to

1074
00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:48,960
Speaker 1: play well. But it's uh so I think it's that

1075
00:57:49,080 --> 00:57:51,640
Speaker 1: it's just you gotta get and once you win one

1076
00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:54,880
Speaker 1: and it's gonna get it's gonna get tougher the next game.

1077
00:57:54,920 --> 00:58:00,640
Speaker 1: So there are yeah, I tell our guys getting in

1078
00:58:00,720 --> 00:58:03,200
Speaker 1: state tournament, there's there's no bumps. So you're gonna be

1079
00:58:03,240 --> 00:58:06,360
Speaker 1: playing against somebody good and you're gonna have to you

1080
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:09,840
Speaker 1: have to play it a r B game to advance.

1081
00:58:10,160 --> 00:58:15,240
Speaker 1: And uh that's where it's that. So I think, yeah,

1082
00:58:15,560 --> 00:58:18,640
Speaker 1: last year we're geting enough to to win to win

1083
00:58:18,920 --> 00:58:23,800
Speaker 1: a game two and the instate tournament. But you you

1084
00:58:23,880 --> 00:58:27,640
Speaker 1: just have to play well, and uh, I think we

1085
00:58:28,040 --> 00:58:32,280
Speaker 1: could probably. I think being in it and winning games.

1086
00:58:33,040 --> 00:58:36,800
Speaker 1: It gives you. You got to do that. Having that

1087
00:58:36,880 --> 00:58:39,800
Speaker 1: kind of experience you you need that it helps you

1088
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:43,160
Speaker 1: in the next time you're in the tournament. So if

1089
00:58:43,200 --> 00:58:47,360
Speaker 1: you can get a string of back to back and

1090
00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:49,480
Speaker 1: see like Delhi went three out of four years, if

1091
00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:51,800
Speaker 1: you get something like that, it helps you Because you

1092
00:58:52,920 --> 00:58:55,840
Speaker 1: insa term, it's a totally different deal. And uh, you

1093
00:58:55,960 --> 00:59:00,000
Speaker 1: just gotta be used to used to the whole format

1094
00:59:00,040 --> 00:59:02,280
Speaker 1: at and all the interviews and all the hype that

1095
00:59:02,320 --> 00:59:04,800
Speaker 1: goes with it and all that stuff is helps it

1096
00:59:05,040 --> 00:59:07,000
Speaker 1: like anything else that helps if you have experience. So

1097
00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:09,840
Speaker 1: I think getting in is the key. And then then

1098
00:59:09,920 --> 00:59:12,280
Speaker 1: after that you just you have to be big enough.

1099
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:15,800
Speaker 1: You can't I don't need you can play small and

1100
00:59:15,880 --> 00:59:18,040
Speaker 1: have success and that yet you have. Don't think you don't.

1101
00:59:18,080 --> 00:59:20,480
Speaker 1: You don't think you have some dudes? Yeah, yeah, I

1102
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:22,640
Speaker 1: mean you look, you've had dudes. I mean, we haven't

1103
00:59:22,640 --> 00:59:26,560
Speaker 1: talked about making McConnell. H Omar was Omar Omar you

1104
00:59:26,680 --> 00:59:30,640
Speaker 1: made into a dude, right, Omar san Um. Obviously you

1105
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:33,880
Speaker 1: had Patty. We've talked about you know, Kick Hurt and

1106
00:59:33,960 --> 00:59:36,280
Speaker 1: Cape Horn and all those others. Like you've had some

1107
00:59:36,320 --> 00:59:40,080
Speaker 1: really good players. Okay, what's the closest you've ever come

1108
00:59:40,120 --> 00:59:43,240
Speaker 1: to leaving? Well, I haven't really come close to leaving,

1109
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:49,040
Speaker 1: but uh, when you when you opened it last time,

1110
00:59:49,040 --> 00:59:52,800
Speaker 1: I think, I think, yeah, I think when Mary took it,

1111
00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:57,000
Speaker 1: you know, I was. I was intrigued on that one.

1112
00:59:57,480 --> 01:00:01,200
Speaker 1: And uh so that if I have to pick the closest,

1113
01:00:01,200 --> 01:00:06,200
Speaker 1: that would be the closest. What keeps you there? I'm happy?

1114
01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:09,360
Speaker 1: But but so many other guys would be like, but yeah,

1115
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:11,400
Speaker 1: but yeah, but you could be like two or three

1116
01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:15,680
Speaker 1: million dollars happy at somewhere else. Um, how do you

1117
01:00:15,720 --> 01:00:17,400
Speaker 1: how do you balance that? Like, look, you make still

1118
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:19,480
Speaker 1: make a healthy living, and you live in a great place,

1119
01:00:19,520 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 1: an expensive area. You get a long time ago, But

1120
01:00:22,920 --> 01:00:25,320
Speaker 1: how do you balance out the idea that you could

1121
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:34,919
Speaker 1: just kill it financially with with happiness? Yeah, he picked

1122
01:00:34,920 --> 01:00:38,919
Speaker 1: them on the spot. You're not gonna I pretty much

1123
01:00:38,920 --> 01:00:43,200
Speaker 1: know all the pieces and people that are in the

1124
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:47,760
Speaker 1: right places at St. Mary's, So I'm not ever worried

1125
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:50,760
Speaker 1: about those types of things. And I think, you know,

1126
01:00:50,840 --> 01:00:52,520
Speaker 1: you go to another school and you take two or

1127
01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:55,680
Speaker 1: three million, you're gonna you're gonna have to deal with

1128
01:00:55,720 --> 01:01:00,640
Speaker 1: that and so there's no guarantee. I think there's no

1129
01:01:00,720 --> 01:01:02,720
Speaker 1: guarantee that it's going to be as good a deal

1130
01:01:02,800 --> 01:01:05,840
Speaker 1: as you as I have the same areas, it's probably

1131
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:09,840
Speaker 1: unlikely that it is. If you maybe really had a

1132
01:01:09,880 --> 01:01:12,320
Speaker 1: great relationship with an A D or something and they

1133
01:01:12,360 --> 01:01:15,680
Speaker 1: had a lot of trust there, then maybe it could be.

1134
01:01:15,720 --> 01:01:19,640
Speaker 1: But as I've been here that the money thing at

1135
01:01:19,680 --> 01:01:21,920
Speaker 1: this point, it doesn't really matter that much to me,

1136
01:01:22,200 --> 01:01:28,000
Speaker 1: And yeah, it wouldn't be nice, but I should if

1137
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:31,400
Speaker 1: I do things right, I should have enough money that

1138
01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 1: I should be a really good for my career. So

1139
01:01:35,000 --> 01:01:38,680
Speaker 1: it's not as big a deal in that way, and

1140
01:01:38,800 --> 01:01:42,280
Speaker 1: money wise, it's more a big deal in that, Hey,

1141
01:01:42,320 --> 01:01:48,040
Speaker 1: ally we have a program here and there's there's some

1142
01:01:48,320 --> 01:01:51,400
Speaker 1: more fun things that you're trying to do. You're trying

1143
01:01:51,400 --> 01:01:56,080
Speaker 1: to build a your program to last long. You have

1144
01:01:56,280 --> 01:02:01,320
Speaker 1: your guys coming back, now they're maybe a guy in

1145
01:02:01,360 --> 01:02:04,760
Speaker 1: the coaching staff. They they come back with their kids,

1146
01:02:04,840 --> 01:02:07,720
Speaker 1: and you get to see that, you get to see

1147
01:02:07,760 --> 01:02:10,600
Speaker 1: that they're proud of this. This is their family, this

1148
01:02:10,640 --> 01:02:14,560
Speaker 1: is this was their coach. That stuff it's hard to

1149
01:02:14,600 --> 01:02:16,800
Speaker 1: put a price on it. It's pretty cool. And then

1150
01:02:17,280 --> 01:02:19,280
Speaker 1: everybody doesn't get to have that. You have to be

1151
01:02:19,280 --> 01:02:22,120
Speaker 1: at a program long time to have that. And I

1152
01:02:22,160 --> 01:02:25,440
Speaker 1: actually really enjoy that. And uh, it's not when I

1153
01:02:25,480 --> 01:02:28,400
Speaker 1: took the job, it wasn't like I had some master

1154
01:02:28,480 --> 01:02:31,400
Speaker 1: planing else stay at St. Mary's. I was hoping. I

1155
01:02:31,480 --> 01:02:34,000
Speaker 1: was hoping we could win a couple of games. So

1156
01:02:34,520 --> 01:02:37,560
Speaker 1: you just kind of that's just kind of. As I've

1157
01:02:37,600 --> 01:02:40,720
Speaker 1: been here longer, I've figured out, Hey, there's some real

1158
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:44,000
Speaker 1: rewards to staying in the same place. You have to hear,

1159
01:02:44,040 --> 01:02:46,520
Speaker 1: it's a great place to live. I really believe in

1160
01:02:46,520 --> 01:02:49,200
Speaker 1: what the school is about. They've treated me really well,

1161
01:02:50,240 --> 01:02:54,040
Speaker 1: and uh, I have all these players there are great

1162
01:02:54,080 --> 01:02:59,640
Speaker 1: guys and turned into great fathers, husbands, people and the community.

1163
01:02:59,680 --> 01:03:02,560
Speaker 1: So it's uh, I really enjoyed that. I really enjoy

1164
01:03:02,680 --> 01:03:07,760
Speaker 1: that aspect of Um, Kyle's at San Francisco and um,

1165
01:03:07,800 --> 01:03:10,160
Speaker 1: you know, now you're back competing with Roe at at

1166
01:03:10,160 --> 01:03:14,120
Speaker 1: pepper Dye. He had Lamont before at USD. What's it like,

1167
01:03:14,680 --> 01:03:16,920
Speaker 1: what's it like to coach against a friend, because because

1168
01:03:16,960 --> 01:03:19,560
Speaker 1: one of the things about you is if somebody sees

1169
01:03:19,600 --> 01:03:21,760
Speaker 1: you or hears you speaking, like, well, that's nice, but

1170
01:03:21,880 --> 01:03:26,000
Speaker 1: you are a a fierce, ridiculous competitor Kyle the exact

1171
01:03:26,080 --> 01:03:27,640
Speaker 1: same way. The Mont is the same way. Like you

1172
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:30,320
Speaker 1: guys could go from being nice guys a lot like

1173
01:03:30,360 --> 01:03:32,640
Speaker 1: the Australians right, Like you guys are gonna hang out,

1174
01:03:32,680 --> 01:03:35,400
Speaker 1: but when when we're playing to win, playing a win? Now,

1175
01:03:35,840 --> 01:03:38,680
Speaker 1: what's it like to coach against guys who um, I

1176
01:03:38,720 --> 01:03:41,120
Speaker 1: don't know if you're gonna play U U C riverside,

1177
01:03:41,120 --> 01:03:43,560
Speaker 1: but like DPS to coach there now, right, what's it

1178
01:03:43,600 --> 01:03:45,959
Speaker 1: like to compete against somebody who's a close to your friend?

1179
01:03:47,080 --> 01:03:49,240
Speaker 1: You know, if it we're up to me, I wouldn't

1180
01:03:49,240 --> 01:03:52,560
Speaker 1: do it. Like, there's nothing I can do about Kyle

1181
01:03:52,640 --> 01:03:55,280
Speaker 1: being in the League of Lamont being the league he

1182
01:03:55,400 --> 01:03:57,919
Speaker 1: was in the league, and uh, Lorenzo League. I don't

1183
01:03:57,920 --> 01:04:01,320
Speaker 1: I don't like it at all. You're right, you have

1184
01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:04,120
Speaker 1: to compete, so you're gonna have to play the game

1185
01:04:04,200 --> 01:04:07,600
Speaker 1: and you turn all that off and you're gonna compete,

1186
01:04:07,840 --> 01:04:11,760
Speaker 1: and uh, but it just it affects. It's not as

1187
01:04:11,760 --> 01:04:14,800
Speaker 1: fun because you can't, Like, I can't share stuff with

1188
01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:18,000
Speaker 1: Kyle that I used to ask him about his team.

1189
01:04:18,040 --> 01:04:20,320
Speaker 1: He'd asked about my team. You just don't do that anymore.

1190
01:04:21,280 --> 01:04:24,640
Speaker 1: So it creates a when you're in the same league

1191
01:04:24,640 --> 01:04:28,720
Speaker 1: and you're competing twice a year, it just puts a

1192
01:04:28,720 --> 01:04:33,680
Speaker 1: little strain on the openness of that friendship. And so

1193
01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:38,520
Speaker 1: that's why I won't play VP at UC Riverside and

1194
01:04:38,560 --> 01:04:42,600
Speaker 1: won't play Iron Hawaii and Rick Roy at cal Baptist

1195
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:46,400
Speaker 1: if I can avoid it. I never we never played

1196
01:04:46,480 --> 01:04:49,600
Speaker 1: Lorenzo Washington, So that's kind of my rule as I

1197
01:04:49,640 --> 01:04:52,920
Speaker 1: don't want I want to play my guys. They're my assistants.

1198
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:56,560
Speaker 1: Are I worked with us at Lorenzo's assistant So it's

1199
01:04:56,560 --> 01:05:00,000
Speaker 1: not h I don't like it. But when you get

1200
01:05:00,160 --> 01:05:03,240
Speaker 1: get yeah, Rick's a really good coach, They're gonna be

1201
01:05:03,240 --> 01:05:07,640
Speaker 1: good at cal Baptist, zero zero doubts about that at all. Um,

1202
01:05:08,560 --> 01:05:10,440
Speaker 1: you guys got dinged by the n c A for

1203
01:05:11,080 --> 01:05:14,240
Speaker 1: a kid who never played for you, for an assistant

1204
01:05:14,240 --> 01:05:17,280
Speaker 1: that wasn't on on the staff. And now you hear

1205
01:05:17,920 --> 01:05:20,720
Speaker 1: I mean, like anybody else, you read about the college

1206
01:05:20,760 --> 01:05:26,640
Speaker 1: basketball scandal and text messages about major money either being

1207
01:05:26,720 --> 01:05:31,160
Speaker 1: offered and potentially being doled out, Like what's what's what's

1208
01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:34,480
Speaker 1: the discussion inside your coach's office about what's going on?

1209
01:05:34,520 --> 01:05:42,000
Speaker 1: In college who, Well, there's a there's two sides of

1210
01:05:42,040 --> 01:05:46,480
Speaker 1: this thing. The one is that having gone through uh

1211
01:05:47,040 --> 01:05:50,440
Speaker 1: a n C A situation like we did and then

1212
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:53,520
Speaker 1: I thought it was garbage, but having the stress that's

1213
01:05:53,520 --> 01:05:57,040
Speaker 1: on that it's just I mean, it's tough. It was tough,

1214
01:05:57,080 --> 01:05:59,640
Speaker 1: So I don't I don't wish that on anybody. And

1215
01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:04,080
Speaker 1: there are you know, you can you can be a

1216
01:06:04,080 --> 01:06:07,360
Speaker 1: pretty good guy and we're running a very clean program

1217
01:06:07,400 --> 01:06:12,520
Speaker 1: and and sometimes get hit on this. So, uh then

1218
01:06:12,560 --> 01:06:17,160
Speaker 1: the other part of it is, yeah, I think I

1219
01:06:17,160 --> 01:06:19,840
Speaker 1: don't think the FBI has this this thing that wrong,

1220
01:06:20,400 --> 01:06:23,240
Speaker 1: like I think they're probably there. Some of the stuff

1221
01:06:23,240 --> 01:06:26,120
Speaker 1: that's coming out. I think a lot of guys in

1222
01:06:26,160 --> 01:06:31,520
Speaker 1: college basketball would say, no, it doesn't shock me. Maybe

1223
01:06:31,600 --> 01:06:34,760
Speaker 1: the amount, but the fact that it's going on. It

1224
01:06:34,880 --> 01:06:40,080
Speaker 1: didn't didn't. I don't think it's that prevalent. But I

1225
01:06:40,120 --> 01:06:43,200
Speaker 1: think most of us knew, Hey, some of that stuff existed,

1226
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:46,600
Speaker 1: and uh so that part of it and when people

1227
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:52,360
Speaker 1: act like it's not going on still, well, you just

1228
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:54,200
Speaker 1: want it right like you want it right. You don't

1229
01:06:54,200 --> 01:06:55,600
Speaker 1: feel like, you don't want to feel like some people

1230
01:06:55,600 --> 01:06:58,320
Speaker 1: are getting the edge on you because they're doing it,

1231
01:06:58,960 --> 01:07:00,640
Speaker 1: you know, the way you're not suposed be doing it.

1232
01:07:00,720 --> 01:07:06,280
Speaker 1: So it's uh um, I'm not holy now on it.

1233
01:07:06,480 --> 01:07:09,640
Speaker 1: And I don't think most guys are like understand, but

1234
01:07:09,680 --> 01:07:13,520
Speaker 1: there's certain things that they they just don't they don't

1235
01:07:13,560 --> 01:07:16,439
Speaker 1: taste right on this one. And uh so you don't

1236
01:07:16,480 --> 01:07:19,720
Speaker 1: wish it for him, but you're not. There's a lot

1237
01:07:19,720 --> 01:07:22,960
Speaker 1: of us in coaching right now that we can't deal

1238
01:07:23,080 --> 01:07:26,440
Speaker 1: with this or just just gonna go away. And I

1239
01:07:26,520 --> 01:07:31,560
Speaker 1: don't think everybody wants to just to go away. There's

1240
01:07:31,600 --> 01:07:37,880
Speaker 1: a hard question. So here's how do you guys ever

1241
01:07:37,920 --> 01:07:43,840
Speaker 1: paid a player? No? No, I mean I've never never

1242
01:07:44,200 --> 01:07:47,720
Speaker 1: come close to you as a kid ever asked for money. No,

1243
01:07:48,960 --> 01:07:55,400
Speaker 1: never once. No. Now, there's and guys before that we

1244
01:07:55,680 --> 01:07:58,600
Speaker 1: think got hooked up. I don't know if we could

1245
01:07:58,600 --> 01:08:01,760
Speaker 1: prove it or not, but got hooked up from you

1246
01:08:01,800 --> 01:08:03,360
Speaker 1: don't want to say that because it's kind of a

1247
01:08:03,600 --> 01:08:06,760
Speaker 1: cop out excuse deal. So you can't just say, oh Jesus,

1248
01:08:07,160 --> 01:08:08,960
Speaker 1: they're getting them because they cheated a lot of times.

1249
01:08:09,000 --> 01:08:12,600
Speaker 1: They're getting them. Most times they get him because they

1250
01:08:14,080 --> 01:08:16,479
Speaker 1: they had a better pitch, they had a better the

1251
01:08:16,680 --> 01:08:20,200
Speaker 1: situation was better, They outworked you so, and yeah, I

1252
01:08:21,080 --> 01:08:25,120
Speaker 1: never go there on that, but yeah, to me, it's

1253
01:08:25,160 --> 01:08:27,439
Speaker 1: it's it's a very simple like have you ever paid

1254
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:30,640
Speaker 1: a kid? Have you ever changed his grades? Right? You know,

1255
01:08:30,920 --> 01:08:33,120
Speaker 1: as long as you haven't done those two things. I don't.

1256
01:08:33,720 --> 01:08:35,559
Speaker 1: I don't even like the idea that you have these

1257
01:08:35,640 --> 01:08:38,920
Speaker 1: recruiting windows opening and closing, like guys recruiter, let him

1258
01:08:38,960 --> 01:08:41,040
Speaker 1: go recruit Like I know, it's kind of ridiculous my

1259
01:08:41,120 --> 01:08:42,680
Speaker 1: dad back in the day, who would be gone for

1260
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:46,439
Speaker 1: months on end. But I think now you can wear

1261
01:08:46,520 --> 01:08:48,400
Speaker 1: kids out to where to actually turn them off if

1262
01:08:48,439 --> 01:08:50,960
Speaker 1: you recruit him too much, if you're texting them too much,

1263
01:08:51,000 --> 01:08:52,680
Speaker 1: if you're calling them too much, you're hanging around in

1264
01:08:52,800 --> 01:08:54,519
Speaker 1: too much, Like it gets a little bit creepy to

1265
01:08:55,080 --> 01:08:57,880
Speaker 1: some kids. But I just I kind of think those

1266
01:08:57,880 --> 01:09:02,200
Speaker 1: are the two questions, right and um and I kind

1267
01:09:02,200 --> 01:09:05,559
Speaker 1: of think we got we we go, we go from there. Um.

1268
01:09:05,880 --> 01:09:08,240
Speaker 1: But but but the but the the idea that this

1269
01:09:08,400 --> 01:09:11,320
Speaker 1: does go on, what would you say the percentage of

1270
01:09:12,560 --> 01:09:19,120
Speaker 1: percentage of times this goes on? I don't know. I'm

1271
01:09:19,160 --> 01:09:21,240
Speaker 1: probably wrong guy to ask. I don't know. I think

1272
01:09:21,320 --> 01:09:29,720
Speaker 1: it's it. There's probably some outliers on this, But I

1273
01:09:29,800 --> 01:09:32,920
Speaker 1: think the ones that goes on with are the ones

1274
01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:38,320
Speaker 1: that are gonna be NBA guys. There's gonna be lottery picks.

1275
01:09:38,360 --> 01:09:41,800
Speaker 1: I think that's These guys are worth a lot of

1276
01:09:41,840 --> 01:09:45,000
Speaker 1: money to some people that could be agents. They're worth

1277
01:09:45,040 --> 01:09:46,960
Speaker 1: a lot of money to an agent if they sign them,

1278
01:09:47,080 --> 01:09:51,320
Speaker 1: like we're talking about guys nowadays, if they're the future

1279
01:09:51,439 --> 01:09:54,000
Speaker 1: Lebron James or Kevin Drowner that they're they're worth five

1280
01:09:54,400 --> 01:09:59,200
Speaker 1: million dollars. So, uh, as an agent, you're gonna you

1281
01:09:59,280 --> 01:10:01,800
Speaker 1: can do what you know. Do you know what you

1282
01:10:02,200 --> 01:10:04,560
Speaker 1: have to do? I guess too. To sign one of

1283
01:10:04,560 --> 01:10:06,960
Speaker 1: those guys, we didn't. We didn't make a lot of

1284
01:10:07,000 --> 01:10:10,360
Speaker 1: money off him, and so are so there's other people

1285
01:10:10,479 --> 01:10:13,720
Speaker 1: that can make money along the way as well. And

1286
01:10:14,840 --> 01:10:18,120
Speaker 1: ten thou dollars to a guy, you know, ten tho

1287
01:10:18,360 --> 01:10:21,519
Speaker 1: dollars to get a guy that's gonna make five is nothing,

1288
01:10:21,880 --> 01:10:24,280
Speaker 1: And so I get that. I totally understand that. And

1289
01:10:24,760 --> 01:10:28,200
Speaker 1: some of it is if you're an agent. I don't

1290
01:10:28,240 --> 01:10:30,439
Speaker 1: I don't know what's I don't. I don't. I'm not

1291
01:10:30,560 --> 01:10:35,480
Speaker 1: sure why that's not smart. I don't know the legalities

1292
01:10:35,520 --> 01:10:37,720
Speaker 1: of it, but you would do what you have to

1293
01:10:37,800 --> 01:10:42,400
Speaker 1: do to get in tight with a runner or whatever

1294
01:10:42,560 --> 01:10:44,800
Speaker 1: relative or whatever that can help influence that guy to

1295
01:10:44,880 --> 01:10:47,639
Speaker 1: come your way when he when he goes pro. And yes,

1296
01:10:47,720 --> 01:10:52,040
Speaker 1: they're probably working that angle before he's a pro. So, um,

1297
01:10:53,400 --> 01:10:56,160
Speaker 1: I get it. These guys are worth a lot of

1298
01:10:56,200 --> 01:11:00,479
Speaker 1: money now and that's that has changed, I will change recently,

1299
01:11:00,520 --> 01:11:03,680
Speaker 1: I'd say in the last ten or fifteen years. The

1300
01:11:03,840 --> 01:11:07,040
Speaker 1: numbers are just shot up, so they got I think

1301
01:11:07,080 --> 01:11:10,600
Speaker 1: what we all want is want to sing fixed, and

1302
01:11:10,680 --> 01:11:14,840
Speaker 1: they're gonna have there's some things in the system and

1303
01:11:15,280 --> 01:11:19,280
Speaker 1: they need to I don't have the answer, is my answer,

1304
01:11:19,400 --> 01:11:22,240
Speaker 1: but I think we all would like it to get fixed,

1305
01:11:22,280 --> 01:11:25,880
Speaker 1: because it's not really can I keep dealing with a

1306
01:11:26,120 --> 01:11:30,559
Speaker 1: very elite group of kids that people nowhe are gonna

1307
01:11:30,560 --> 01:11:32,080
Speaker 1: be worth a lot of money, so they're gonna do

1308
01:11:32,200 --> 01:11:34,240
Speaker 1: what about whatever they have to do. And I'm not

1309
01:11:34,360 --> 01:11:37,120
Speaker 1: just talking about I'm not necessarily talking about coaches. I'm

1310
01:11:37,120 --> 01:11:39,840
Speaker 1: talking about the other people in between, whether the shoot

1311
01:11:39,880 --> 01:11:45,599
Speaker 1: companies or agents or whoever. Well. Also, I don't think

1312
01:11:45,680 --> 01:11:48,200
Speaker 1: you like it's one of those It's like it's like lawyers, right,

1313
01:11:48,320 --> 01:11:50,599
Speaker 1: somebody walks in and says, what do you do for living.

1314
01:11:50,640 --> 01:11:53,560
Speaker 1: I'm a lawyer, like you know, because there are unsavory

1315
01:11:53,680 --> 01:11:55,639
Speaker 1: lawyers who're like, oh lawyer, Like what wait is saying?

1316
01:11:55,640 --> 01:11:59,360
Speaker 1: I'm at you know, a public defender or like there

1317
01:11:59,400 --> 01:12:02,160
Speaker 1: there's there's plenty of lawyers who do a very good

1318
01:12:02,240 --> 01:12:05,559
Speaker 1: job for their clients, by their clients, you know. Um,

1319
01:12:06,600 --> 01:12:08,200
Speaker 1: it's the same thing with the basketball. It's like if

1320
01:12:08,200 --> 01:12:10,720
Speaker 1: you said you're a college basketball coach, I think there

1321
01:12:10,760 --> 01:12:12,960
Speaker 1: are some that would perceive you us those guys are

1322
01:12:13,000 --> 01:12:17,840
Speaker 1: just basically used car salesman because of perception more than reality. Right,

1323
01:12:18,120 --> 01:12:21,200
Speaker 1: Like the reality is your kids come, they have a

1324
01:12:21,240 --> 01:12:23,960
Speaker 1: good time. They usually play an n ci A tournament

1325
01:12:24,320 --> 01:12:26,759
Speaker 1: or playing an I t They play in these epic

1326
01:12:26,840 --> 01:12:30,200
Speaker 1: battles with b y u and and Gonzagen on national television.

1327
01:12:30,479 --> 01:12:32,800
Speaker 1: They get a degree, they make friends for life, and

1328
01:12:32,920 --> 01:12:35,160
Speaker 1: many of them go and play a little bit professionally

1329
01:12:35,200 --> 01:12:37,600
Speaker 1: and then go on their merry way or maybe they

1330
01:12:37,720 --> 01:12:39,680
Speaker 1: come back and help you coach. Like that's the reality

1331
01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:42,439
Speaker 1: of it. But the perception of it is basketball coach

1332
01:12:42,439 --> 01:12:44,639
Speaker 1: is a bunch of used car salesman, right. But that's

1333
01:12:44,640 --> 01:12:47,400
Speaker 1: not and and that's the part that I think coaches

1334
01:12:47,479 --> 01:12:53,240
Speaker 1: want to fix most because they know that that thatent

1335
01:12:53,400 --> 01:12:55,400
Speaker 1: of guys are better off because they got a chance

1336
01:12:55,439 --> 01:12:57,479
Speaker 1: to play ball in college. They met their wife there,

1337
01:12:57,520 --> 01:12:59,639
Speaker 1: they met their best friends there, and and they gave

1338
01:12:59,720 --> 01:13:01,280
Speaker 1: them it was a chance to have a life after

1339
01:13:01,400 --> 01:13:08,000
Speaker 1: college because of it. Even higher. Yeah, but yes, I agree.

1340
01:13:08,360 --> 01:13:13,040
Speaker 1: I'd say it's probably above a couple a couple of things. Um,

1341
01:13:13,840 --> 01:13:18,519
Speaker 1: give me one coach who you really like, a really

1342
01:13:18,640 --> 01:13:22,200
Speaker 1: respect watch his tapes or whatever, learn from and they

1343
01:13:22,280 --> 01:13:24,880
Speaker 1: have no idea, like it's not somebody you've reached out,

1344
01:13:24,920 --> 01:13:28,600
Speaker 1: you just like I have a certain coaching crush on

1345
01:13:29,439 --> 01:13:36,519
Speaker 1: this guy. Uh. Well, one program I have a lot

1346
01:13:36,520 --> 01:13:38,880
Speaker 1: of respect for is but he I think he kind

1347
01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:41,280
Speaker 1: of knows is Sean Miller. I think does they do

1348
01:13:41,360 --> 01:13:46,240
Speaker 1: a great job coaching? And I think I'm always, uh,

1349
01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:48,439
Speaker 1: let me get a chance to watch which test day

1350
01:13:48,479 --> 01:13:50,960
Speaker 1: they'll watch them? They play so hard and defends so hard.

1351
01:13:51,400 --> 01:13:57,240
Speaker 1: So there's two. I think Tony Bennett in Virginia, A

1352
01:13:57,360 --> 01:14:01,839
Speaker 1: lot of respect there for way he's way he coaches

1353
01:14:02,000 --> 01:14:05,439
Speaker 1: and how good they are again defensively and they're good.

1354
01:14:05,560 --> 01:14:08,560
Speaker 1: I mean, they're just so consistent. But those will be

1355
01:14:08,720 --> 01:14:13,040
Speaker 1: three that, like I told my assistance. Hey, get some

1356
01:14:13,160 --> 01:14:14,840
Speaker 1: film on these guys. I want to watch a little

1357
01:14:14,840 --> 01:14:17,280
Speaker 1: bit of them in the off season. Your team is

1358
01:14:17,760 --> 01:14:20,559
Speaker 1: young this year. This is this a new group. There's

1359
01:14:20,560 --> 01:14:22,479
Speaker 1: a lot of youth there. Whereas in the past, you

1360
01:14:22,560 --> 01:14:25,479
Speaker 1: guys have been able to, you know, to draw on

1361
01:14:25,640 --> 01:14:28,880
Speaker 1: so much experience. How hard is that, especially in the

1362
01:14:29,000 --> 01:14:31,800
Speaker 1: league where you have a team like Gonzaga that most

1363
01:14:31,840 --> 01:14:36,639
Speaker 1: people think have a chance to win it all. Yeah,

1364
01:14:36,720 --> 01:14:41,360
Speaker 1: it's a it's challenging. It's a it's a fun challenge,

1365
01:14:41,400 --> 01:14:44,840
Speaker 1: but it's it'll be challenging, especially I think our non

1366
01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:50,720
Speaker 1: conference schedules pretty tough this year, and uh so with

1367
01:14:50,920 --> 01:14:54,400
Speaker 1: a young team early on, I think we'll get it together,

1368
01:14:54,600 --> 01:14:57,800
Speaker 1: but it's we'll probably have some growing pains along the

1369
01:14:57,840 --> 01:15:01,200
Speaker 1: way somewhere. But I I would like our personnelity. I

1370
01:15:01,200 --> 01:15:03,640
Speaker 1: think we have good players. I just think we're we

1371
01:15:03,760 --> 01:15:06,559
Speaker 1: have so many guys. We have eight guys eight out

1372
01:15:06,600 --> 01:15:11,080
Speaker 1: of our thirteen scholarship guys are are guys that have

1373
01:15:11,280 --> 01:15:15,479
Speaker 1: an uh didn't play last year for so there's so

1374
01:15:15,640 --> 01:15:20,040
Speaker 1: many new pieces. You guys have to play new roles

1375
01:15:20,080 --> 01:15:23,240
Speaker 1: and I don't really know a way that to rush that.

1376
01:15:23,320 --> 01:15:26,000
Speaker 1: It just takes you, and you have to you have

1377
01:15:26,080 --> 01:15:28,160
Speaker 1: to have enough practices and you have to have enough

1378
01:15:29,240 --> 01:15:32,439
Speaker 1: games under your belt where they can get confident playing

1379
01:15:32,439 --> 01:15:35,240
Speaker 1: the playing their new roles and and grow into them.

1380
01:15:35,280 --> 01:15:39,720
Speaker 1: But like Jordan Ford has to turn into are best

1381
01:15:39,800 --> 01:15:46,280
Speaker 1: score best player and uh, last year he's probably third

1382
01:15:46,360 --> 01:15:48,519
Speaker 1: or fourth, so that he's got to make a big jump.

1383
01:15:50,160 --> 01:15:52,439
Speaker 1: We have to do that with about nine guys. How

1384
01:15:52,479 --> 01:15:53,960
Speaker 1: do you do that? How do you make how do

1385
01:15:54,040 --> 01:15:56,800
Speaker 1: you make Jordan's like you? Because one of the things

1386
01:15:56,800 --> 01:15:59,000
Speaker 1: that Eddie Sutton would do, what is we play the

1387
01:15:59,120 --> 01:16:02,280
Speaker 1: UTC and Antonio US of the world and we'd get

1388
01:16:02,360 --> 01:16:04,280
Speaker 1: to the second half, we'd be up twenty five and

1389
01:16:04,360 --> 01:16:07,439
Speaker 1: we were still running plays for Adrian Peterson or Destin

1390
01:16:07,520 --> 01:16:10,679
Speaker 1: Mason because he wanted he wanted it known throughout our team.

1391
01:16:10,720 --> 01:16:12,679
Speaker 1: We need a bucket with these are the two guys

1392
01:16:12,840 --> 01:16:15,839
Speaker 1: and those guys to understand he had the utmost confidence

1393
01:16:15,880 --> 01:16:18,439
Speaker 1: in him. How do you do you allow it to

1394
01:16:18,479 --> 01:16:22,560
Speaker 1: happen organically? Like, how do you how do you do that? No?

1395
01:16:22,760 --> 01:16:27,040
Speaker 1: I do only I guess it happens a little bit organically,

1396
01:16:27,160 --> 01:16:30,080
Speaker 1: but you kind of have to set it up where

1397
01:16:30,120 --> 01:16:31,400
Speaker 1: it can happen that way. I think one of the

1398
01:16:31,400 --> 01:16:32,519
Speaker 1: first things you have to do is you got to

1399
01:16:32,560 --> 01:16:36,160
Speaker 1: figure out your eight or nine are and if you're

1400
01:16:36,800 --> 01:16:39,559
Speaker 1: at least for me, if you're jumping around all over

1401
01:16:39,640 --> 01:16:41,519
Speaker 1: on that, and then you're not gonna be able to

1402
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:44,280
Speaker 1: get a group of eight or nine to play together

1403
01:16:44,800 --> 01:16:47,760
Speaker 1: to understand that roles. And then once you have that,

1404
01:16:48,720 --> 01:16:51,200
Speaker 1: then you can start working on the guys after that.

1405
01:16:51,320 --> 01:16:56,320
Speaker 1: But for me right now, that's our biggest challenge. Whereas

1406
01:16:56,439 --> 01:16:58,800
Speaker 1: a team like we had last year, and I have

1407
01:16:58,880 --> 01:17:01,400
Speaker 1: to worry about that, Oh had these guys. This is

1408
01:17:01,640 --> 01:17:04,000
Speaker 1: pretty much the third year in a row we had

1409
01:17:04,080 --> 01:17:07,040
Speaker 1: them and they're playing the same roles, and so I

1410
01:17:07,160 --> 01:17:10,120
Speaker 1: knew we would. I knew we'd be good, and uh,

1411
01:17:12,280 --> 01:17:15,559
Speaker 1: this year it's different and and I think so we don't.

1412
01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:18,160
Speaker 1: We don't have a lot of teams on our non

1413
01:17:18,280 --> 01:17:22,040
Speaker 1: conference schedule where I can you have a lot of

1414
01:17:23,760 --> 01:17:25,880
Speaker 1: a lot of leeway there on whether it went or not.

1415
01:17:26,080 --> 01:17:29,600
Speaker 1: So that's the better get good first and then and

1416
01:17:29,680 --> 01:17:32,519
Speaker 1: then try developing those other guys you've got. You've got

1417
01:17:32,560 --> 01:17:35,919
Speaker 1: a couple of transfers. Uh Malik fits obviously from San Francisco,

1418
01:17:36,000 --> 01:17:39,760
Speaker 1: but Aaron Menzies, he's what he's seven threes, he's still

1419
01:17:39,800 --> 01:17:42,280
Speaker 1: to sixties. You lean him up like I've never seen

1420
01:17:42,400 --> 01:17:45,439
Speaker 1: him play, but it it feels like he's a block

1421
01:17:45,479 --> 01:17:48,080
Speaker 1: out the sun sort of big guy. And you've had

1422
01:17:48,200 --> 01:17:49,559
Speaker 1: you've had some big guys with a lot of your

1423
01:17:49,600 --> 01:17:53,040
Speaker 1: big guys have been really skilled facing up what's mensies

1424
01:17:53,080 --> 01:17:58,680
Speaker 1: like menzies is? Uh, he's a good athlete, he's uh.

1425
01:17:58,840 --> 01:18:01,040
Speaker 1: They at one point he was a three pound guy.

1426
01:18:01,080 --> 01:18:05,040
Speaker 1: But he's to sixty five now and he's in he's

1427
01:18:05,080 --> 01:18:07,240
Speaker 1: in good safe. He's a good athlete. So he is

1428
01:18:09,200 --> 01:18:12,360
Speaker 1: he is not a face up guys, straight low post

1429
01:18:12,439 --> 01:18:15,519
Speaker 1: guy and uh, he's pretty good. He was eleven and

1430
01:18:15,600 --> 01:18:20,800
Speaker 1: eight last year. W wish we had more time with him,

1431
01:18:20,840 --> 01:18:23,920
Speaker 1: but he's doing well, so we have to h he'll

1432
01:18:23,920 --> 01:18:26,519
Speaker 1: be more like he'll be more like an Omar type guy.

1433
01:18:27,400 --> 01:18:29,439
Speaker 1: All right, started out, start out, heavy up. Now said

1434
01:18:29,600 --> 01:18:33,240
Speaker 1: Omar is like super thin Um. I don't know, maybe

1435
01:18:33,439 --> 01:18:35,479
Speaker 1: right we we thinned him up. He got down to

1436
01:18:37,320 --> 01:18:43,280
Speaker 1: when he was a senior. Is Omar your your greatest

1437
01:18:43,479 --> 01:18:46,519
Speaker 1: Like if you like, hey, this is this is our program?

1438
01:18:46,800 --> 01:18:49,240
Speaker 1: Is it Omar? Is it? Give me one who's the

1439
01:18:49,320 --> 01:18:52,400
Speaker 1: guy who obviously you have a couple of guys playing

1440
01:18:52,400 --> 01:18:56,120
Speaker 1: in the NBA, but is your signature in terms of

1441
01:18:56,240 --> 01:19:00,240
Speaker 1: player development, person to personal development sort of guy from

1442
01:19:00,520 --> 01:19:03,639
Speaker 1: what you brought into campus to what you end up producing.

1443
01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:07,639
Speaker 1: There's a few of them, but uh and Omar would

1444
01:19:07,680 --> 01:19:09,960
Speaker 1: be one of those. Like, there's four or five of

1445
01:19:10,000 --> 01:19:13,559
Speaker 1: them that jump out to me where they weren't They

1446
01:19:13,640 --> 01:19:17,040
Speaker 1: weren't great players when we took him and in Uh,

1447
01:19:17,600 --> 01:19:21,480
Speaker 1: they just kept developed and kept working. He's one. Lndale

1448
01:19:21,640 --> 01:19:27,000
Speaker 1: is way up there. He and Omar like, those are

1449
01:19:27,000 --> 01:19:30,479
Speaker 1: the two bigs that really came a long way in Uh,

1450
01:19:30,840 --> 01:19:33,200
Speaker 1: Like Blondale didn't. He played five minutes of game for

1451
01:19:33,320 --> 01:19:35,560
Speaker 1: us as oppression. Maybe maybe that was me, maybe that

1452
01:19:35,760 --> 01:19:38,760
Speaker 1: was the problem, but anyhow, he just kept getting better.

1453
01:19:39,560 --> 01:19:43,559
Speaker 1: Delavado is he's one herd percent one of those guys.

1454
01:19:43,640 --> 01:19:46,800
Speaker 1: He just kept getting better. And McConnell was too. Those

1455
01:19:46,960 --> 01:19:49,599
Speaker 1: those are four. There are others, but those are four

1456
01:19:49,720 --> 01:19:51,960
Speaker 1: that ended up being really good players, like players of

1457
01:19:52,000 --> 01:19:56,840
Speaker 1: the year type players. Um yeah, Patty, we only had

1458
01:19:56,880 --> 01:19:58,880
Speaker 1: two years and one of the years he broke his

1459
01:19:58,960 --> 01:20:02,000
Speaker 1: hand for half to so anyhow, those those are the

1460
01:20:02,040 --> 01:20:07,200
Speaker 1: guys that that uh, well, okay, talked recruiting to us,

1461
01:20:07,240 --> 01:20:09,200
Speaker 1: and we talked about player development. Those are the guys.

1462
01:20:10,080 --> 01:20:15,320
Speaker 1: A slide comes up on the I'm the projector of Hey,

1463
01:20:15,439 --> 01:20:18,080
Speaker 1: this is what these guys do as freshman sophtoware junior

1464
01:20:18,160 --> 01:20:21,240
Speaker 1: seeing and they can see the transformation. That's pretty amazing.

1465
01:20:21,280 --> 01:20:23,200
Speaker 1: And Mickey's a guy you talked about being lucky. Mickey's

1466
01:20:23,200 --> 01:20:26,200
Speaker 1: a guy New Mexico makes a coaching change so he

1467
01:20:26,600 --> 01:20:29,320
Speaker 1: d commits. You end up getting him. And look what

1468
01:20:29,360 --> 01:20:32,040
Speaker 1: an incredible career he had and has had. You know,

1469
01:20:32,160 --> 01:20:34,320
Speaker 1: since it's it's uh, some of its luck, some of

1470
01:20:34,400 --> 01:20:37,000
Speaker 1: its skill relationships, and I think the respect that you

1471
01:20:37,080 --> 01:20:39,280
Speaker 1: guys have garnered to where now all of a sudden,

1472
01:20:39,400 --> 01:20:42,160
Speaker 1: same area's as a household name. Hey man, I know

1473
01:20:42,280 --> 01:20:44,240
Speaker 1: this has been probably longer than you thought you would

1474
01:20:44,479 --> 01:20:46,600
Speaker 1: thought you would have to be on the phone to

1475
01:20:46,920 --> 01:20:51,559
Speaker 1: to do the pod. But I appreciate the way. We'll

1476
01:20:51,720 --> 01:20:53,960
Speaker 1: then we'll we'll do it again. We'll do and and

1477
01:20:54,160 --> 01:20:56,400
Speaker 1: at some point we'll do is after your season is over.

1478
01:20:56,760 --> 01:20:58,400
Speaker 1: Then I'll have you we'll do some what you see

1479
01:20:58,400 --> 01:21:01,640
Speaker 1: in terms of watching NBA, because I think so oftentimes

1480
01:21:02,360 --> 01:21:04,720
Speaker 1: just you know, basketball is basketball, and I love hearing

1481
01:21:04,760 --> 01:21:07,880
Speaker 1: basketball coaches talk about what they're seeing with the NBA,

1482
01:21:07,920 --> 01:21:10,000
Speaker 1: because I know you watched watch the playoffs, especially after

1483
01:21:10,080 --> 01:21:12,120
Speaker 1: your season is done. Thanks for joining us. We'll talk

1484
01:21:12,120 --> 01:21:15,080
Speaker 1: to you soon, Doug. Thanks for having me take care

1485
01:21:15,120 --> 01:21:19,560
Speaker 1: of my Thanks to Bobby Reagan and Randy Bennett. What

1486
01:21:20,080 --> 01:21:23,719
Speaker 1: incredible insight in building a college basketball program and getting

1487
01:21:23,720 --> 01:21:26,920
Speaker 1: ready for the college basketball season. I'll leave you with

1488
01:21:27,040 --> 01:21:29,479
Speaker 1: this from the NBA as we get ready for the season.

1489
01:21:30,800 --> 01:21:36,559
Speaker 1: I would encourage all brothers, sisters, mothers, cousins, uncle's friends.

1490
01:21:37,360 --> 01:21:41,559
Speaker 1: Don't tweet, don't message on i G. Don't post things

1491
01:21:41,640 --> 01:21:47,080
Speaker 1: about somebody else's life because it becomes controversial and though

1492
01:21:47,120 --> 01:21:50,160
Speaker 1: it comes back to you. It's like Kevin Durance brother

1493
01:21:50,320 --> 01:21:52,840
Speaker 1: put on his Instagram page eighty one more to go

1494
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:57,840
Speaker 1: until we until we add of here. And and maybe

1495
01:21:57,920 --> 01:22:00,200
Speaker 1: that's the case. Maybe Kad does want to get out there.

1496
01:22:01,000 --> 01:22:02,960
Speaker 1: Maybe he feels like, no matter what I do, it's

1497
01:22:03,160 --> 01:22:05,680
Speaker 1: it's always Steph's team. Maybe he wants to go to

1498
01:22:05,680 --> 01:22:07,360
Speaker 1: New York, can be the guy who can save the

1499
01:22:07,400 --> 01:22:10,720
Speaker 1: New York Knicks. Nick's have cast base for him. My

1500
01:22:10,880 --> 01:22:13,439
Speaker 1: guest is prezingis barely plays it at all. This year

1501
01:22:13,920 --> 01:22:16,080
Speaker 1: and they try and keep loading up as I love

1502
01:22:16,200 --> 01:22:19,519
Speaker 1: Kevin Knox. I think he's terrific, but I don't see

1503
01:22:19,560 --> 01:22:21,880
Speaker 1: how it helps it. You know, this is the everybody

1504
01:22:21,960 --> 01:22:24,519
Speaker 1: wants the reality show. Everybody wants their name in the paper.

1505
01:22:24,880 --> 01:22:28,280
Speaker 1: And now we're talking about Kevin Durant's brother, who is

1506
01:22:28,880 --> 01:22:32,360
Speaker 1: merely a distraction. Even if he has the story right,

1507
01:22:32,760 --> 01:22:35,320
Speaker 1: it's not your story to tell. And that's the mistake

1508
01:22:35,400 --> 01:22:37,800
Speaker 1: in the I G message. Look, well, we'll break down

1509
01:22:37,920 --> 01:22:41,400
Speaker 1: some of the rookies. The Kevin Knox is the the

1510
01:22:41,520 --> 01:22:44,800
Speaker 1: Trey Young's of the world. I would expect Luke Luca

1511
01:22:44,880 --> 01:22:47,759
Speaker 1: don Check to have an incredible season with the Dallas

1512
01:22:47,840 --> 01:22:50,760
Speaker 1: Mavericks because he's been playing against the higher level of competition,

1513
01:22:51,360 --> 01:22:54,559
Speaker 1: and he's older, he's bigger, and no he's not as

1514
01:22:54,600 --> 01:22:56,479
Speaker 1: athletic as some of the other guys, but he's very

1515
01:22:56,560 --> 01:22:58,479
Speaker 1: he's very refined, and I think he's playing with a

1516
01:22:58,520 --> 01:23:01,000
Speaker 1: pretty good team. I don't know statistically how to look,

1517
01:23:01,040 --> 01:23:03,360
Speaker 1: but remember stats don't matter. If you're they're empty status

1518
01:23:03,400 --> 01:23:05,559
Speaker 1: you're play on a losing team, well like a try

1519
01:23:05,600 --> 01:23:08,479
Speaker 1: Young is gonna play. But I do think those are

1520
01:23:08,520 --> 01:23:12,240
Speaker 1: two of the leaders. UM coming in in terms of

1521
01:23:12,400 --> 01:23:16,800
Speaker 1: trying to win Rookie of the Year, and we'll break

1522
01:23:16,880 --> 01:23:19,800
Speaker 1: down their opening games will give you a sense of

1523
01:23:19,920 --> 01:23:22,719
Speaker 1: what we think. I've told people that I think Janice,

1524
01:23:24,280 --> 01:23:26,400
Speaker 1: Janice and k D are the two guys that are

1525
01:23:26,439 --> 01:23:29,040
Speaker 1: most likely to compete for an m v P. K

1526
01:23:29,200 --> 01:23:30,680
Speaker 1: D has a lot to try and prove, and so

1527
01:23:30,800 --> 01:23:33,680
Speaker 1: does Janice. Those are the two guys I would keep

1528
01:23:33,680 --> 01:23:36,080
Speaker 1: an eye on. I think Toronto is a team, excuse me.

1529
01:23:36,160 --> 01:23:38,400
Speaker 1: I think Portland's a team that will come back down

1530
01:23:38,439 --> 01:23:41,840
Speaker 1: to earth because they played way above their level. And

1531
01:23:41,920 --> 01:23:43,800
Speaker 1: I'm not sure the Golden State Warriors got better. I

1532
01:23:43,880 --> 01:23:46,320
Speaker 1: think they got different because they're not gonna have their

1533
01:23:46,360 --> 01:23:49,200
Speaker 1: full a lotment of players until DeMarcus Cousins is healthy.

1534
01:23:49,680 --> 01:23:52,320
Speaker 1: I don't love their bench as his even though to

1535
01:23:52,360 --> 01:23:55,400
Speaker 1: push one of the starters to the bench, and if

1536
01:23:55,439 --> 01:23:57,679
Speaker 1: he's a starter, is he okay? If they play small

1537
01:23:57,720 --> 01:23:59,640
Speaker 1: at the end of the games, if they play with them,

1538
01:23:59,680 --> 01:24:01,400
Speaker 1: they have to play big defensively, which is not how

1539
01:24:01,439 --> 01:24:03,479
Speaker 1: they usually played. Make sure you listen to my show

1540
01:24:03,560 --> 01:24:05,839
Speaker 1: daily three to six Eastern time, twelve or three Pacific

1541
01:24:06,680 --> 01:24:10,559
Speaker 1: wherever you listen to Fox Sports Radio. I'm Doug gott leaving,

1542
01:24:10,640 --> 01:24:11,479
Speaker 1: this has been all ball