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Speaker 1: Hey, this Sanny and Samantha, and welcome stuff.

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Speaker 2: I never told you protection to buy Heart Radio, and

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Speaker 2: welcome to another edition of Happy Hour. I have to

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Speaker 2: admit I'm a little thrown because my days are just

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Speaker 2: so off and so but anyway, we're recording this on

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Speaker 2: a day. I'm just confused. But anyway, if you are

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Speaker 2: drinking or whatever you're choosing to do, please do so responsibly.

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Speaker 2: These are just times to wind down. Samantha, are you

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Speaker 2: sitting on anything? Are you doing it responsibly?

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Speaker 3: I'm being responsible with some bubbly water because I'm already sleepy.

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Speaker 3: I can't stop yawning. I just I'm like, I'm not

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Speaker 3: sure what's happening. Maybe it's at the mid afternoon, you

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Speaker 3: know moment where everything feels like it's crashing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we are recording later than we normally record, that

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Speaker 2: is true.

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Speaker 3: But yes, I'm keeping responsible with some water. Get myself

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Speaker 3: hydrated like a hydrated queen.

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Speaker 2: Nice, thank you, I've got my red wine. Yes, I'm

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Speaker 2: very excited about it. All right, So this is going

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Speaker 2: to be a quick update episode. I think on just

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Speaker 2: me being ace because if you're listening to this chronologically,

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Speaker 2: you haven't heard the episode yet. But we did a

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Speaker 2: wonderful interview with Alison Raskin, who has written a lot

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Speaker 2: of books about mental health and romance and relationships and

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Speaker 2: has a romantic comedy book coming out and has just

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Speaker 2: done a lot. She's done a lot in that space,

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Speaker 2: and I have to say, when I was preparing for

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Speaker 2: that interview, I got very nervous because I realized I

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Speaker 2: still get nervous, like if it will come up like

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Speaker 2: people don't believe I'm asexual, or they don't believe it's

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Speaker 2: a thing, or if I'll doubt everything I know about myself.

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Speaker 2: Because I've said I feel really comfortable in that identity

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Speaker 2: now people who know me have accepted it generally, and

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Speaker 2: the people who don't I don't really care about. And

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Speaker 2: that's a whole other thing. But I just want to

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Speaker 2: say she was in her books. She even had a

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Speaker 2: whole section that was like, no, I can't speak to

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Speaker 2: this experience, that's not what this is about, but it

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Speaker 2: acknowledging it existed, and it was just really relieving. But

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Speaker 2: because I was so relieved, I was shocked at how

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Speaker 2: nervous I was that I would get to some point

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Speaker 2: in the book and I would be like oh no,

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Speaker 2: which can be a you know, we do vet everybody

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Speaker 2: who comes on here, but sometimes you can't know completely

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Speaker 2: for sure. Just again to say she was fabulous and

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Speaker 2: I should I wish I had put at the top

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Speaker 2: that she recognized that, or just some kind of acknowledgement

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Speaker 2: that she recognized that. But it made me stop and think, wow,

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Speaker 2: I'm still very insecure in some ways about it. And

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Speaker 2: it was also fascinating that I read her two of

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Speaker 2: her books before we did the interview, and they are

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Speaker 2: all about all the facets of romantic relationships. There's some

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Speaker 2: stuff about you know, platonic relationships or business relationships as well.

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Speaker 2: But it was both validating and kind of like shocking

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Speaker 2: how much I was like, Wow, this is not my

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Speaker 2: experience at all. This is not what I was experiencing

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Speaker 2: at all.

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Speaker 1: And so it made me feel like, Okay, yes you were.

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Speaker 2: This old time and she's very clear, and it like

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Speaker 2: she's very clear. Not everybody experiences romance the same way.

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Speaker 2: That's kind of the whole thing, but just in the

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Speaker 2: general vibe, I was like, Nope, that was not what

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Speaker 2: I was feeling. That's not what I was going for me.

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Speaker 2: And it, like I said, it did kind of made

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Speaker 2: me feel it made me feel a little validated because

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Speaker 2: it's like, Okay, yes, that was not me. It also

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Speaker 2: made me feel a little guilty because I I think

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Speaker 2: I assumed in some instances that I understood why people

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Speaker 2: were reacting the way they were, and I don't think

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Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 1: I don't think I did at all. And I thought

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Speaker 1: that I knew that.

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Speaker 2: But it was really it was really eye opening to

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Speaker 2: me to read it and be like, Okay, so in

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Speaker 2: this past relationship, I was perhaps really misinterpreting this whole thing,

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Speaker 2: and not just on a relationship level, but on I

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Speaker 2: don't even understand that level. Almost I was having all

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Speaker 2: these like I say in the episode, I cried. I

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Speaker 2: felt I felt both seen and like I should. I

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Speaker 2: wish I had seen other people in my life because

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Speaker 2: I didn't. That's just not how I That's just not

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Speaker 2: how I.

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Speaker 1: Experienced the world, and I wanted to.

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Speaker 2: That was the other thing that made me kind of

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Speaker 2: sad when I read it is that I wanted to

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Speaker 2: so badly, and I remember in high school just trying

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Speaker 2: so hard, and I've kind of made myself very sexual

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Speaker 2: at one point because I felt so asexual that I

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Speaker 2: was like, I'm gonna going overboard so no one will

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Speaker 2: question me. But I just didn't feel it, and I

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Speaker 2: was trying really hard to and so it was a

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Speaker 2: strange experience reading it where I just.

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Speaker 3: Was.

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Speaker 2: It was eye opening, but it was also a reminder

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Speaker 2: of how isolated I felt in some ways, of like

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Speaker 2: trying to fit in in some ways. And we had

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Speaker 2: the interview went long, which you will hear, and there

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Speaker 2: was a question I had that said, if we have time,

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Speaker 2: I would love to talk about this, and hopefully we

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Speaker 2: can have Alison back and we can talk about it.

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Speaker 2: But she had a whole thing in there about just

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Speaker 2: that really illustrated to me kind of some differences about

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Speaker 2: breakups and the need to be in a relationship are

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Speaker 2: the very much wanting to be in a relationship versus me,

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Speaker 2: And it was just so different, And it was very

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Speaker 2: because she was saying like she's felt guilt for basically

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Speaker 2: being shamed her wanting to be in a relationship as

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Speaker 2: if she's not an independent woman, and I was like,

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Speaker 2: I've felt the exact opposite shame of I'm not in

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Speaker 2: one and don't want to be in one, and it's

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Speaker 2: sort of a damned if you do, damned if you don't.

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Speaker 2: So I would love to have that conversation with her.

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Speaker 2: But it was just it was really it made me

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Speaker 2: think about a lot of stuff, and like I said,

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Speaker 2: I feel very confident in it now, but it was.

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Speaker 1: I was so nervous.

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Speaker 2: That it would come up and be like that's not

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Speaker 2: a real identity, or there's something wrong with you. You

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Speaker 2: need to go get something checked out, or and none

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Speaker 2: of that happened. It was all me. It was all

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Speaker 2: me doing this to be one hundred percent clear, but

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Speaker 2: I don't know. It was just it was I still

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Speaker 2: am going, still learning, still trying to go through this.

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Speaker 3: I think it's interesting when it comes to trying to

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Speaker 3: figure out what the norm is. And again we talk

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Speaker 3: about tropes and expectations as adults or growing to be

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Speaker 3: an adult, and our ideals as teenagers too becoming that adults,

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Speaker 3: and we really have to navigate what that means to us.

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Speaker 3: Because I did not get into dating and relationships until

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Speaker 3: I was in my late twenties, and I didn't have

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Speaker 3: much of relationships until I was in my thirties mid thirties,

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Speaker 3: and that was all things in part to online dating,

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Speaker 3: because for me to meet people. Was really hard. I

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Speaker 3: don't know why, it just was for me. And then

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Speaker 3: like my current relationship was because we lived near each

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Speaker 3: other and it just happened that way. We built a

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Speaker 3: relationship that way. But like I was with you in

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Speaker 3: that same manner of like, I'm not normal. Why am

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Speaker 3: I not dating? Why am I not seeing tons of people?

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Speaker 3: I've never been in a deep, committed along relationship college,

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Speaker 3: never dated people at all, somewhat religious background as well,

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Speaker 3: but like it also made me feel stunted, and I

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Speaker 3: was like, this is all my attachment issues and trauma

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Speaker 3: and all these things. And then growing older than like

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Speaker 3: watching everybody who was going through some good relationships put

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Speaker 3: a lot more bad relationships that I was like, oh

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Speaker 3: I'm good, and people like so many people going through

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Speaker 3: divorces and I'm like, eh, I'm even better now, I'm good.

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Speaker 3: And then having children and having a really messy divorce

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Speaker 3: and not that children are a problem because I love children.

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Speaker 3: I should really think they're so sweet and cute, and

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Speaker 3: I love hanging out with really like cute children. I

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Speaker 3: raise some for a while, you know, But like at

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Speaker 3: this point I'm like, yeah, no, that was not this

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Speaker 3: is not for me. This has never been for me,

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Speaker 3: and I've gotten old enough that I don't care enough

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Speaker 3: about other people's opinions of that. But and also the

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Speaker 3: people in my life have seen the bad versions of that,

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Speaker 3: if that makes sense, Like they've watched, like, you know,

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Speaker 3: their children going through divorce or they've gone through horrible

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Speaker 3: divorces or really messy stuff, and they're like, yeah, no,

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Speaker 3: don't do it. If you don't want to, if that's

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Speaker 3: not something absolutely that you want, don't do it. And

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Speaker 3: it's kind of one of those like, in hindsight, I'm

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Speaker 3: feel grateful that I didn't have to go do that,

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Speaker 3: But definitely, during those times, I felt as if I

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Speaker 3: was so abnormal and so weird and that unlovable. I

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Speaker 3: thought I was unlovable and that feels like such a

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Speaker 3: curse in these things, you know, and then growing into

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Speaker 3: oh no, that was okay, I'm actually okay, not having

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Speaker 3: experienced all of that until I was older and felt

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Speaker 3: a little more secure about myself.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And I mean that's one of the things

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Speaker 2: we talk about in this upcoming episode, is that realization

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Speaker 2: of I'm okay, but I still want x y Z,

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Speaker 2: or maybe I don't want X y and Z and

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Speaker 2: this is something that I have long thought, But that

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Speaker 2: whole idea of finding the relationship it's going to fix you, right,

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Speaker 2: I just don't think that's a hellal thing. I think

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Speaker 2: that's I think it's fair to say relationship, a good relationship,

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Speaker 2: you're going to help each other or whoever is involved.

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Speaker 2: But I don't think you should be looking for this

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Speaker 2: will fix me right personally.

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Speaker 3: Okay, that's kind of what I've come to discover being

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Speaker 3: in this long term relationship that I've been in. It's enjoyable.

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Speaker 3: I enjoy his company, and we had to wade through

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Speaker 3: some really tough conversations. We don't necessarily fight a lot.

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Speaker 3: We don't do like the dramatic up and downs, which

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Speaker 3: I'm really grateful for because I am a non confrontational person.

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Speaker 3: I have discovered this very non confrontational until I blow up,

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Speaker 3: and then I blow up like it just is one

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Speaker 3: of those and I'm like, I don't like those moments.

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Speaker 3: I don't want those moments. And you see all these

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Speaker 3: relationships where they talk about if there's not passion and fighting,

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Speaker 3: and I'm like, oh, yeah, I don't think you understand

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Speaker 3: what that is compared to like how exhausting that can

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Speaker 3: be and how emotionally draining that can be for most people,

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Speaker 3: and that a lot of the times finding friendship and comfort,

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Speaker 3: but also finding the boundaries of like he's not my

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Speaker 3: whole world. I can live without him. I know that

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Speaker 3: I can, like I've done it. But at the same time,

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Speaker 3: he makes it better or the partner makes it better.

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Speaker 3: That's the difference, you know what I mean. Like, yeah,

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Speaker 3: and the fact that we don't drive each other crazy.

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Speaker 3: Every now and again, we have moments with each other.

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Speaker 3: I know he can complain about me and I can

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Speaker 3: complain about him. But then in the end it's kind

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Speaker 3: of like also funny, like if I couldn't laugh at

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Speaker 3: my own stuff and his stuff, then I think that's

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Speaker 3: where we have a problem. But again, like we're still

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Speaker 3: as much as we're together, we're still very separate. Like

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Speaker 3: we have separate so many separate things that I feel

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Speaker 3: like works for us. It's kind of like that conversation

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Speaker 3: about people who sleep in different bedrooms and everybody's like,

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Speaker 3: oh my god, there is no norm. Like I think

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Speaker 3: when you start breaking that, you start finding yourself and

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Speaker 3: finding out that it doesn't like maybe you were meant

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Speaker 3: to be in a relationship. It's wonderful, but it's not

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Speaker 3: your typical You might sleep in separate bedrooms and it

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Speaker 3: works wonderfully because you have your own space that you need.

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Speaker 3: Like for a lot of people, they need that, and

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Speaker 3: it's a beautiful thing. For some people they don't need that,

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Speaker 3: and that's also a beautiful thing. Some people need weddings

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Speaker 3: or want weddings and marriages and the togetherness what's wonderful,

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Speaker 3: you know. Like I think one of the things about

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Speaker 3: that interview we had was like we had very three

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Speaker 3: different distinct people in this moment. Like she knew she

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Speaker 3: wanted to be married, and I think that's amazing and

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Speaker 3: I love that, but like she also had to work

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Speaker 3: through what that meant for her and her identity and

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Speaker 3: realizing that shouldn't be her whole identity. Like she loves

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Speaker 3: it as a part of who she is in her life,

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Speaker 3: but it's not what makes her. For me, that's not

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Speaker 3: my part of my identity. But I do enjoy my relationship,

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Speaker 3: and this is wonderful, and I don't know how, Like

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Speaker 3: I hope a less forever that would be wonderful, Forever

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Speaker 3: mine forever as and like until I die. But if

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Speaker 3: it doesn't, I'll.

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Speaker 1: Be okay, He'll be okay, you know, like.

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Speaker 3: He'll be painful and all those things and any other relationships,

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Speaker 3: and I feel like there's no regret in our relationship.

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Speaker 3: Where we're at is wonderful, you know. And for her,

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Speaker 3: that's like when she talked about, yeah it's spoiler alert,

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Speaker 3: some rough patches and her previous relationships, you know, And

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Speaker 3: then that's for you too. It's like a lot of

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Speaker 3: things that you took you a minute to figure out. Oh,

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Speaker 3: but I don't need I don't need this, and if

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Speaker 3: I did, it wouldn't look like this, And that's wonderful

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Speaker 3: because then that's when you were like, huh, this feels easier.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: You know. The interesting thing too, was nothing is a monolith.

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Speaker 2: There are plenty of asexual people who have relationships who

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Speaker 2: are married. So this is very much my personal experience,

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Speaker 2: I want to say, and I'm not even like.

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Speaker 1: Writing that out for now.

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Speaker 2: It looks unlikely right now, but I'm not even like,

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Speaker 2: you know, saying it's not a possibility. But I did

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Speaker 2: have a conversation with somebody who is friends with someone

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Speaker 2: else who's a sexual, and she was kind of asking

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Speaker 2: me these questions that it was. It was a little

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Speaker 2: funny because it was like, I'm not the authority on

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Speaker 2: what a sexual looks like, but it what she was

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Speaker 2: telling was so different. Like this this person she was describing,

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Speaker 2: I'm like, Oh, that is not my experience at all.

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Speaker 2: So it's that's fascinating too, like the fact that there

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Speaker 2: are all these ways these things can manifest. And of

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Speaker 2: course for me, I'm like, if that's how she is,

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Speaker 2: that's how she is, Like I don't know her. Some

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Speaker 2: it's just it's hard when you want to find the camaraderie,

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Speaker 2: but you also don't want to exclude people like I

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Speaker 2: don't want to make anybody feel like, oh, that's not

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Speaker 2: what it is sexuality is, because that's wrong. That's wrong,

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Speaker 2: it's completely wrong. But that also brings me to another

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Speaker 2: point that I think I'll talk about more in depth later,

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Speaker 2: but even at like Pride events, I get nervous that

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Speaker 2: I'll get dismissed or people be like, Oh that's not

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Speaker 2: that's not what this is, and that's not what it

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Speaker 2: should be.

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Speaker 1: That's not how it should be.

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Speaker 3: And I mean, this is why it's a spectrum, like

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Speaker 3: everything's very much your self related. Your own past, your

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Speaker 3: own reactions. You're like, you're what you're comfortable with, and

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Speaker 3: that's the way it should be. And I think the

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Speaker 3: problem for years has been that it's been argue that

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Speaker 3: this is the way it's supposed to be and it's

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Speaker 3: no rigidity, and like even like people who terse like

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Speaker 3: that's that same level of conversation that that's on there

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Speaker 3: that they're like, no, I as a lesbian will not

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Speaker 3: allow yeah, a trans woman to come in here, like

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Speaker 3: or I as a straight woman, or I as a

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Speaker 3: woman in general, like this in just like forgetting what

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Speaker 3: this is and how why these movements were important to

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Speaker 3: begin with, why feminism was important to begin with. It

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Speaker 3: wasn't just it is for voting. It is for the

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Speaker 3: basic human rights, but basic human rights meaning you become

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Speaker 3: who you truly are.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's just a yeah, it's something I'm still

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Speaker 2: still thinking about and working through, and I know a

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Speaker 2: lot of us are. I don't even think that's necessarily

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Speaker 2: relegated to when it comes to relationships, at least to

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Speaker 2: these people. But also I want to be clear, I

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Speaker 2: I feel like a lot of the things I'm talking

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Speaker 2: about people before me have experienced forever, So I acknowledge

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Speaker 2: that it's It was just really interesting to read this

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Speaker 2: book and be like, Okay, wow, this.

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Speaker 1: Is not lining up with the hell.

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Speaker 3: When it comes to identity and trying to figure like

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Speaker 3: trying to fit in, it does feel really difficult when

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Speaker 3: it's like, HM's what is it?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Oh, and then you start you start asking a lot

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Speaker 3: of questions. But again, come in but the mature part

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Speaker 3: is realizing, Oh, but that's different experiences and we may

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Speaker 3: come to a similar connclusion, but we had different paths

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Speaker 3: and that's what makes this so wonderful in that we

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Speaker 3: are human.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm really glad I read it. I'm I'm really happy.

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Speaker 2: I feel like I understand some things a little bit better.

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Speaker 2: I won't delay in texting back as much. Oh oh no,

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Speaker 2: I'm only said my kidding.

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Speaker 1: There was just a there was a thing in there

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Speaker 1: about it. I'm really bad about it. So, oh my god.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I'm I'm glad that I know this other

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Speaker 2: experience that is not mine better because I thought I

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Speaker 2: did because you see it all the time in media.

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Speaker 2: But of course media gets it wrong very often or

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Speaker 2: has a fun take on it, which is fine, but

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Speaker 2: if you start to take that as reality.

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Speaker 3: Right, And that's the problem, especially because when you see

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Speaker 3: that in like not necessarily books, but like when we

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Speaker 3: see it in like TV's as such, is also from

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Speaker 3: a perspective of someone who probably doesn't I've never experienced

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Speaker 3: it either, and has assumptions.

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Speaker 2: Yes, exactly, and then we take on those assumptions, and

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Speaker 2: then they become what we think, this is how this

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Speaker 2: thing should look like. But yeah, it was. Sometimes it's

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Speaker 2: a really nice part of this job. Sometimes it's a

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Speaker 2: painful part of this job. But to know that your

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Speaker 2: mind can still be I'm still absorbing information and I'm

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Speaker 2: still like, okay, let me think about this. That okay,

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Speaker 2: that's a new thing for me, right. So yes, thank

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Speaker 2: you listeners, Thank you Samantha for Jordan being on this

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Speaker 2: the word salad about my thoughts after reading this book.

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Speaker 2: But I had a lot of thoughts about it. And

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Speaker 2: you will hear the episode with Alison soon unless you

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Speaker 2: listen to this out of order and you might have

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Speaker 2: already heard it.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. It could be either. It could be either, but.

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Speaker 2: Yes, in the meantime, if you have any thoughts about this,

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Speaker 2: if you would like to contact us, you can you

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Speaker 2: can email us at Hello at Stuffwenever Told You dot com.

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Speaker 2: You can also find us on Blue Sky at bombs

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Speaker 2: Up podcast, or on Instagram and TikTok at stuff We

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Speaker 2: Never Told You. We're also on YouTube. We have a

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Speaker 2: tea public store, and we have a book you can

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Speaker 2: get wherever you get your books. Thanks as always too,

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Speaker 2: our super produced Christine are Exective, Christin Maya and our

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Speaker 2: contributor to Joey. Thank you and thanks to you for

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Speaker 2: listening Stuff Will Never Told You Books of iHeart Radio.

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Speaker 2: For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can check

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Speaker 2: out Yeah Art Radio, app, Apple Podcasts, or where you

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Speaker 2: listen to your favorite shows