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Speaker 1: Steve Schmid with the warning, and I'm thrilled today to

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Speaker 1: be joined by the former US Acting Secretary of Labor

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Speaker 1: and the former California Secretary of Labor, Julie Sue. We're

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Speaker 1: going to talk about what's going on in the country

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Speaker 1: and what job was more fun the California job were

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Speaker 1: the DC job.

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Speaker 2: Well, it turns out there were a lot of similarities

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Speaker 2: between them. I think partly because California is a big

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Speaker 2: state and so you know, a lot of the enforcement,

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Speaker 2: the you know, the investments to make sure that we're

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Speaker 2: creating good jobs. The unemployment Insurance benefit system also into

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Speaker 2: the same thing, so it was different. But I did

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Speaker 2: think that it was really important to serve on the

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Speaker 2: federal level to try to make sure that working people

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Speaker 2: across the country felt some of that sense of security

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Speaker 2: that we wanted for everybody.

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Speaker 1: When you look at the economy right right now and

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Speaker 1: you are talking to people in your life who are

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Speaker 1: not former government officials, you know, who are not economists,

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Speaker 1: and I imagine, uh, people must approach you like they

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Speaker 1: might a doctor or a dentist, you know, kind of

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Speaker 1: like my two thirds right, Like Atualie, what's what's going

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Speaker 1: on in the economy. What do you what do you

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Speaker 1: what do you? What do you say to them? Right now?

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Speaker 2: Well, the truth is the right now. What a lot

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Speaker 2: of people say to me is what the hell is

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Speaker 2: going on? Like, why are the things that are happening happening? Right?

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Speaker 2: Even if things were not you know, ideal, things were

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Speaker 2: not perfect, people were struggling before the fact that this

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Speaker 2: president has taken the baton that you know, he was

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Speaker 2: handed from President Biden and just spiked it is infuriating

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Speaker 2: to people. You know, it's mystifying, right, it's you know,

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Speaker 2: it feels like this president if he was trying to

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Speaker 2: drive the economy off the cliff and trying to head

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Speaker 2: us down the road to procession, this is exactly the

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Speaker 2: playbook that he would use. And so people are you know, like, like,

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Speaker 2: you know, why did he cancel this project that had

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Speaker 2: created you know, a couple thousand jobs. Why is he

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Speaker 2: withdrawing investments in communities that were that you know, where

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Speaker 2: factories were going to open and right we were going

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Speaker 2: to reshore manufacturing jobs. Why is he engaging in a

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Speaker 2: utterly chaotic and un you know, unpredictable teriff regime that

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Speaker 2: is putting small businesses in a state of not knowing

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Speaker 2: what comes next, right, large businesses in a state of

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Speaker 2: you know, I don't know what I'm going to be

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Speaker 2: able to be able to do next month. Why is

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Speaker 2: he engaging in completely unfettered uh, you know, immigration, so

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Speaker 2: called immigration enforcement, it's not really just immigration, because he's

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Speaker 2: rounding up all kinds, you know, all kinds of people,

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Speaker 2: mostly based on race. Why is he doing that? And

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Speaker 2: so I think I don't have good answers those questions either,

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Speaker 2: to be honest, But that is the That's what people

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Speaker 2: in my life are saying to me, and I think

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Speaker 2: that they're both mystified and infuriated at a president. Why

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Speaker 2: is he trying to eliminate data that would tell us

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Speaker 2: how the economy is doing just because it makes him

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Speaker 2: look bad? You know, those are the kinds of things

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Speaker 2: people are saying, and I think those are those are

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Speaker 2: fair questions.

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Speaker 1: Why do you think that those people focus on the

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Speaker 1: mode of the why as opposed to the outcome. So

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Speaker 1: I'm not necessarily in in this, you know, in the

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Speaker 1: in the in the context of this analogy, I'm not

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Speaker 1: really a journey person, right, I'm a I'm an outcome person.

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Speaker 3: And it's.

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Speaker 1: You know, if someone jumps off the roof, I suppose

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Speaker 1: it's natural, right if you're a witness to it, why

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Speaker 1: they jump off the roof. But is the reaction why

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Speaker 1: they jumped off the roof or is it that, my god,

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Speaker 1: this person just jumped off the roof. And you know,

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Speaker 1: because I tend to view this through the prism right

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Speaker 1: now of what I observe is happening, and what's happening

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Speaker 1: is an irrational actor has vandalized the US economy, which

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Speaker 1: and I'm not an economist, I'm a I'm a political

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Speaker 1: consultant for a lot of my lot of my career

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Speaker 1: in a in a in a television commentator. But you know,

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Speaker 1: I wanna I want to take people that are with

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Speaker 1: us inside the the uh, inside the rooms a little bit.

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Speaker 1: If there was functional and honest government about what would

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Speaker 1: be the conversation between us if I was in a

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Speaker 1: White House with you and I was trying to understand

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Speaker 1: the state of the economy so I could explain it

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Speaker 1: right in an accurate and honest, honest way. And if

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Speaker 1: I read all of the stories and I and I dismissed,

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Speaker 1: I say, really not interested in why he's doing it,

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Speaker 1: just he's doing it. And is it accurate to say

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Speaker 1: that the economy is seizing that it's almost in a

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Speaker 1: in a state of a of a cardiac event if

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Speaker 1: you were to, if you were to analogize it in

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Speaker 1: that space. Is that is that's what's happening to the

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Speaker 1: economy right now.

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Speaker 2: I mean, if you look at all of them measures

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Speaker 2: of economic well being that that are that have been used,

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Speaker 2: you know, how many jobs are being created? Uh, what

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Speaker 2: is the unemployment rate? You know GDP consumer confidence? On

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Speaker 2: all of these measures, Donald Trump is failing. And I

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Speaker 2: say that as somebody who I think, Steve like you

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Speaker 2: were suggesting. I'm somebody who both assumes good motives and

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Speaker 2: wants the people in power to succeed, because that's how

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Speaker 2: life gets better for people, Right, That's how life gets

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Speaker 2: better for working people, for for families, and for communities.

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Speaker 2: But by every measure under this administration, things are going

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Speaker 2: really really poorly for working people, including the you know,

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Speaker 2: promise to bring down prices on day one, right, there's

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Speaker 2: been no positive motion in that direction. And I think

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Speaker 2: the reason why people get to motives is that wise

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Speaker 2: it's sort of unfathomable what is going on, Like what

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Speaker 2: it doesn't make sense. Now, the Donald Trump most recently

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Speaker 2: fired the person who was in charge of the agency,

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Speaker 2: the peer of labor statistics that gives us this data.

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Speaker 2: And the other thing to remember is, unfortunately, when he

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Speaker 2: left office the first time, he was the first president

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Speaker 2: in modern times to leave office with fewer jobs than

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Speaker 2: he came in with. So there's a track record that

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Speaker 2: I think people are legitimately concerned about. And instead of

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Speaker 2: trying to figure out what should be done differently this time, right,

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Speaker 2: how do you actually create an economy that works for

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Speaker 2: working people? How do you actually expand the number of

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Speaker 2: jobs opportunities available? It feels like what's happened is this

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Speaker 2: administration has doubled down on the things that didn't work

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Speaker 2: the first time around and now wants to try to

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Speaker 2: cover it up. So I think these are more the

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Speaker 2: motives are more like alarm bells than anything else, and

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Speaker 2: what we're living, the outcomes are really damaging. And then

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Speaker 2: you know, honestly, if I was inside the White House right,

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Speaker 2: which you know, I worked for the administration before, for

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Speaker 2: the Biden administration, if we got numbers that didn't reflect

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Speaker 2: outcomes that we wanted, Let's say, you know, We wanted

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Speaker 2: wages to increase, We wanted prices to come down. We wanted,

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Speaker 2: you know, communities that have been devastated by decisions in

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Speaker 2: the past, including trade policies that did not benefit workers,

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Speaker 2: We wanted to reverse that. If we got numbers that

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Speaker 2: showed that that wasn't working, we would stop and say, Okay,

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Speaker 2: what are we doing wrong?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 2: What do we need to do differently? What how? What's

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Speaker 2: the answer here? And part of the what's the answer

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Speaker 2: is what led to the mass of federal investments under

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Speaker 2: the Biden administration in infrastructure, in clean energy, in manufacturing? Right,

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Speaker 2: How does the federal government play a positive role in

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Speaker 2: expanding opportunity? This administration does not seem in the least

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Speaker 2: bit interested in that kind of thoughtful, careful visionary governance. Right,

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Speaker 2: What are we doing wrong? Because it's all about, you know,

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Speaker 2: how do we make stuff look good for us, regardless

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Speaker 2: of what it means for people. And that also just

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Speaker 2: feels it just it's it's frustrating and it's wrong.

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Speaker 1: I want to ask you some questions about California and

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Speaker 1: what's going on inside the agricultural labor markets across the

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Speaker 1: country and the degree to which we will see more

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Speaker 1: and more food riding on the vines, no workforce to

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Speaker 1: harvest it. There are some reports that you read, UH,

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Speaker 1: there is a paucity of images that validate those reports.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about the San Joaquin Valley, not uh of Mars,

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Speaker 1: but of California. So it should be easy for people

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Speaker 1: that evidence it with with photographs. But you know, for

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Speaker 1: everyone who's joining us, I mean, I'll just I'll just

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Speaker 1: I'll bore you for a for a minute or two

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Speaker 1: with a little bit of California geography and history. The

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Speaker 1: the Golden Gate is the name of the bridge, but

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Speaker 1: the Golden Gate UH does not refer to the bridge.

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Speaker 1: It refers to that opening UH from the Pacific oceaning

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Speaker 1: into the interior of California that separates Marine and San

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Speaker 1: Francisco from one another. And that that opening is the

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Speaker 1: only opening uh that was penetrable uh into the area

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Speaker 1: against hundreds of miles of coastal mountains on either side.

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Speaker 3: And so.

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Speaker 1: When people came to California and they sailed into what

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Speaker 1: is now San Francisco Bay, and they sail up into

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Speaker 1: this riverine estuary system that is connected to the Sacramento

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Speaker 1: and American Rivers, coming out of the Sierra Nevada Mountains.

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Speaker 1: What it creates is one of the great breadbaskets, if

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Speaker 1: not the greatest, in the world. And so many Americans

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Speaker 1: don't have any comprehension of the immensity of agriculture in

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Speaker 1: the state of California, the importance of California agriculture to

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Speaker 1: the whole of America, and the wealth that the country

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Speaker 1: produces from agriculture being shipped to markets all around the

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Speaker 1: world from American ports. And one of the great advantages

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Speaker 1: of the country is the ability of farmers to be

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Speaker 1: able to get their products to market by one of

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Speaker 1: America's great competitive advantages, which is our river systems that

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Speaker 1: connect the ports on golfs and can go all over

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Speaker 1: the world. But none of that works if you can't

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Speaker 1: get the strawberry off of the vine. Because the workforce

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Speaker 1: has been criminalized and is terrorized and is facing the

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Speaker 1: massed agents and abuse in a facility that I feel

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Speaker 1: absolutely comfortable precisely referring to what it is, which is

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Speaker 1: a concentration camp. But what what is happening in the

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Speaker 1: agricultural market in California.

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Speaker 2: Well, so thank you for that, Steve, because what you're

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Speaker 2: reminding me of is there is a reason why farm

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Speaker 2: owners have been one of the strongest advocates for comprehensive

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Speaker 2: immigration reform for decades now, right recognizing that their workforce

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Speaker 2: is vital to sustaining this really important industry and that

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Speaker 2: it is still people, people's hands, people's bodies who go

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Speaker 2: out into fields and pick the crops, pick the strawberries,

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Speaker 2: pick the blueberries, pick the you know, pick pick the lettuce,

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Speaker 2: pick the nuts, pick the tomatoes, the things that we

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Speaker 2: rely on to feed our families on the kitchen tables.

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Speaker 2: And under this administration, those workers have been completely criminalized.

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Speaker 2: And that is both in relation to these raids where

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Speaker 2: this administration has, on the one hand, tried to say

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Speaker 2: that their pro worker, on the other, used workplaces as

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Speaker 2: the site of enforcement. And in workplaces, the enforcement is indiscriminate.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 2: They come into workplaces masked, armed weapons drawn and terrorized

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Speaker 2: the workers who have shown up to work and are

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Speaker 2: tried to do their work. And in fact, there's a

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Speaker 2: farm work in California who died during a raid and

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Speaker 2: others who get rounded up, and you know, many of

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Speaker 2: them get released because they shouldn't have been rounded up

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Speaker 2: in the first place, and the Trump administration, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: wants to think that you know that that it's it's

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Speaker 2: okay right, that that that somehow they're they're they're justified

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Speaker 2: in this kind of growth abuse of their power, were

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Speaker 2: to terrorize working people. But the other part about it

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Speaker 2: is they've also weakened rules that protect those workers. So

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Speaker 2: we put in place a rule that would have done

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Speaker 2: things like make sure that when farm workers are transported

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Speaker 2: on the fields, that the transportation is safe, that when

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Speaker 2: farm workers live on employer provided housing, that they're allowed

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Speaker 2: to invite guests in simple sort of basic human things

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Speaker 2: that this administration is also has eliminated. And so I

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Speaker 2: think what's happening now is that working people, including farm workers,

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Speaker 2: are feeling like it's too dangerous to go to work,

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Speaker 2: and many of them are still doing it because that

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Speaker 2: is what they do. I see some of the comments

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Speaker 2: are from people who know it right, They're from the

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Speaker 2: Central Valley, they know it. So these people come to

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Speaker 2: work because it's important, there's honor in it for them.

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Speaker 2: They have to support their families. This is what they do,

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Speaker 2: and yet they're doing it under daily threats to their

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Speaker 2: livelihoods and their lives, and uh, you know, at one

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Speaker 2: point Donald Trump said, well, this is actually you know,

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Speaker 2: it's again, it's like not careful governance. It's like this,

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Speaker 2: you know, I don't know, chaotic, you know whatever. The

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Speaker 2: whoever lay last offended him is who he who he

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Speaker 2: goes after. He decided well maybe it's not so good

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Speaker 2: to go after farm workers and said that he would

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Speaker 2: put a pause on it. We have not seen that happen,

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Speaker 2: and so you know, it's it's it's I think I

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Speaker 2: think we're well, we'll continue to see the harms of that,

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Speaker 2: not just to those workers, but to an entire industry

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Speaker 2: that has really helped build up our economic strength and

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Speaker 2: put food on our tables.

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Speaker 1: And just from a total perspective of abjecting difference, just

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Speaker 1: let's look at the world through the self interests and

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Speaker 1: selfish eyes of a maga chieftain. If you have a

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Speaker 1: mom who lives on a fixed income, right, and you're

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Speaker 1: some sector chief directing the masked man, what you've achieved

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Speaker 1: is a lot of rotting food on the crops.

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Speaker 3: Is that is that accurate to say? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yes, And that will drive prices up, It increase food inflation.

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Speaker 3: That will hurt working people the most.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's terribly costly to farmers also because,

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Speaker 2: as you're suggesting, right, those crops need to be picked

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Speaker 2: when they need to be picked. Right. This is not

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Speaker 2: a this is not a you know, we can wait

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Speaker 2: two to three weeks until Donald Trump figures out whether

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Speaker 2: his enforcement regime is hurting or helping. These things have

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Speaker 2: to happen when when when When things when when crops

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Speaker 2: are ripe, and and and the fact that they cannot

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Speaker 2: or the fact that the lack of predictability, of ability

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Speaker 2: to you know, maintain a workforce to to to do

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Speaker 2: the work again, it's it is. It is incredibly irresponsible

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Speaker 2: for an administration to to do this. And I mean

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Speaker 2: the other issue I think, Steve, is that when the

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Speaker 2: government comes for workers and makes the work site a

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Speaker 2: dangerous place, it's harmful not just to those particular workers

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Speaker 2: who are targeted, but it does create the sense of, uh,

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Speaker 2: you know, like you know, workers are no longer safe

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Speaker 2: going to work, and that's bad not just for the

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Speaker 2: agriculture industry, but for so many industries that have long

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Speaker 2: relied on on immigrant workers to get the job done.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about two aspects of immigration The

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Speaker 1: second of the two things I want to I want

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Speaker 1: to talk about is the use of labor from private

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Speaker 1: prisons least to some corporate address, and I wanna I

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Speaker 1: want to explore that space. But before we get there,

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about illegal immigration. And this is

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Speaker 1: an issue that as someone who's been involved in politics

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Speaker 1: and in campaign politics that I've been involved in for

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Speaker 1: a long time, and I always worked for people that

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Speaker 1: had a consistent position, and that position was that there

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Speaker 1: was a number that was in the millions of people

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Speaker 1: who were in the country illegally, but were in the

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Speaker 1: country illegally as a matter of semantics, and they existed

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Speaker 1: in the country because the labor market demanded that they

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Speaker 1: exist in the country, and it was tolerated, it was seen,

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Speaker 1: and it was known. And the parameters of that debate,

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Speaker 1: the compromise point. If you if you have to sit

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Speaker 1: in a room with other human beings, right and you

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Speaker 1: you walk in and people from all over the country,

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Speaker 1: it requires, I think, the ability to have a rational

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Speaker 1: conversation with with people of good faith. And you know,

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Speaker 1: I worked for George W. Bush, I worked for John McCain,

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Speaker 1: and I'm going to try to explain as best I

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Speaker 1: can with the basics of that. With that position was,

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Speaker 1: which was that every country has to have a border,

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Speaker 1: and particularly after nine to eleven, every country has to

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Speaker 1: know who's in the country, right and that includes everybody,

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Speaker 1: and so everybody has to have a status. And so

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Speaker 1: the issue here is that the people who cut the

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Speaker 1: line but have lived lawful lives are in the end

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Speaker 1: going to pay a fine, going to receive a credential

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Speaker 1: that regularizes them, that gives them a legal status that

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Speaker 1: would place them in the back of a line that

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Speaker 1: at the first opportunity, maybe in about twenty seven years,

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Speaker 1: they'd be eligible to apply for US citizenship, and that

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Speaker 1: they would not have a green card eligibility for upwards

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Speaker 1: of twenty years. And there was in side of the

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Speaker 1: contours of that debate two stupid positions. The first stupid

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Speaker 1: position was will deport all the people? And the second

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Speaker 1: stupid position was, well, there really shouldn't be a border

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Speaker 1: at all. And I think about this through the prism

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Speaker 1: of watching the ball volley back. Increasingly over the last

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Speaker 1: twenty years of this issue between the extremists and the

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Speaker 1: performance artists right and advocates of the two stupid positions,

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Speaker 1: and between those two stupid positions. If you force a

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Speaker 1: political choice right watching over twenty years time, and you

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Speaker 1: wi evaporate the possibility of common sense. The choice that

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Speaker 1: people will make between everybody in or everybody out is

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Speaker 1: everybody out. And it's incredible to me that people in

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Speaker 1: Washington don't understand that the Asian American voter who's an

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Speaker 1: American citizen, the Hispanic American voter who's an American citizen,

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Speaker 1: the Black voter who's an American citizen doesn't line up

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Speaker 1: with the rest of the American citizens, whether they be

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Speaker 1: of Italian or Irish or German or whatever is said Japanese, Korean,

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Speaker 1: Chinese to say between those alternatives everybody out.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 1: The answer to this, right looking ahead four or five

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Speaker 1: years is you cannot have in a society tolerance for

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Speaker 1: eleven million people in the country illegally and impose that

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Speaker 1: hypocrisy on the country as a whole without part of

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Speaker 1: those people going wild eyed, which is what has happened.

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Speaker 1: And so we're going to have to have a policy

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Speaker 1: in this country that requires some deafness that basically says

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Speaker 1: everyone who's in the country has to have illegal steps

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Speaker 1: and the approach of these fools not to mention the

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Speaker 1: inhumanity and the human rights abuses and all of those

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Speaker 1: things that resulted in higher prices, food rotting on the crops,

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Speaker 1: the moral abominations. All of this stuff requires that we

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Speaker 1: break the chains on the stupidity that has imprisoned us

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Speaker 1: in this debate and solves a problem.

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Speaker 3: So what does that look like to you?

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Speaker 1: Right? Five years from now, when the fever is broken,

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Speaker 1: these people are disgraced, they're voted out of office. There's

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Speaker 1: investigations into the criminal conduct of the kidnappings, the ice officers,

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Speaker 1: Congressional hearings, likely indictments from the International Criminal Court, decisions

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Speaker 1: that will have to be made, including the right of

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Speaker 1: the next president to make them by executive order that

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Speaker 1: transfer custody of an indicted American to the International Criminal

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Speaker 1: Court for abuses of citizens of other nations should they

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Speaker 1: be indicted by the head or in other countries. Right,

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Speaker 1: but what what well that's going on? How do we

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Speaker 1: bring this to an end that says, listen, all right,

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Speaker 1: we need a labor force that will go out there

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Speaker 1: and pick the crops. And I don't think the college

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Speaker 1: educated millennials are going to be into the gig despite

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Speaker 1: the mass unemployment about to come from the AI technology

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Speaker 1: that we're at the very edge of now seeing the

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Speaker 1: great disruption.

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Speaker 2: Yeah right, well so, Steve, And until that happens what

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Speaker 2: you're saying, you know, a few years down the line,

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Speaker 2: when people take a clear eye look at just how

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Speaker 2: illegal this current administration is in terms of its you know,

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Speaker 2: uh enforcement regime. Until that happens, people are suffering, right.

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Speaker 2: People are being ripped apart from their families, children are

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Speaker 2: being deported or you know, being uh they're going to

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Speaker 2: be deported with no representation in the dead of night.

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Speaker 2: And and people are also being arrested following the law, right,

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Speaker 2: They're being arrested when they go to the Immigration and

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Speaker 2: Customs to report in like they're supposed to. So none

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Speaker 2: of this is about law enforcement. It's really about about

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Speaker 2: what you're saying, kind of maintaining a political football for

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Speaker 2: someone's political perceived advantage. And if you recall, right, Steve,

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Speaker 2: before the election, at some point there was an immigration deal.

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Speaker 2: This is I'm channeling your frustration too about why is

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Speaker 2: this something that hasn't been solved. It's not because it's impossible,

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Speaker 2: it's because it's been made political by people who see

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Speaker 2: the immigration issue as something that benefits them politically. So

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump before the election made a phone call to

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Speaker 2: the Speaker of the House to say, do not agree

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Speaker 2: to this deal that has already been negotiated by Republicans

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Speaker 2: and Democrats because the immigration issue will help win an election.

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Speaker 2: And it turns out that that was something that Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump was right about, right his let's vilify entire communities

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Speaker 2: of people in order to rile up a base so

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Speaker 2: that they're not paying attention to the fact that he

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Speaker 2: has no plan or strategy to actually govern and make

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Speaker 2: lives better. He was right about that, and so that's

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Speaker 2: the situation we find ourselves in now. And again, the

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Speaker 2: truth is that one reason why people in desperate straits

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Speaker 2: have continued across continents and oceans to come to the

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Speaker 2: United States was this chance at a better life, was

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Speaker 2: this chance at a job. And that has been true

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Speaker 2: for a very very long time in this country. And

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Speaker 2: what's also true is that employers are hiring those workers.

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Speaker 2: And I think one thing that we should say explicitly

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Speaker 2: right is that if you believe in the Donald Trump regime,

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Speaker 2: which is that those workers are the ones who should

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Speaker 2: be rounded up criminalized and made the scapegoat. Then you're

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Speaker 2: all so exacerbating any hope you have of protecting workers

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Speaker 2: work workers as workers, meaning that you make workers vulnerable,

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Speaker 2: you make them more open, you know, to any kind

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Speaker 2: of exploitation. Right, if you have a bad employer who

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Speaker 2: hired them because they recognize that it's easier to exploit them.

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Speaker 2: Now that's easier, and essentially you take the floor out

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Speaker 2: from underworking people because now you have it entire basically

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Speaker 2: underclass that's allowed to work under terrible conditions because the

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Speaker 2: Trumpe administration has said, all right, like all holds barred,

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Speaker 2: whatever you want to do to them, you're gonna do

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Speaker 2: them because that's what we're doing anyway. So they're gonna work,

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Speaker 2: they're gonna keep on working, but working further underground. And

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Speaker 2: for other workers, that's also bad, right, because when you

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Speaker 2: create an underclass that can be underpaid and exploited, that

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Speaker 2: has no health and safety protections and other things, that

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Speaker 2: decreases the ability of all workers to protect themselves and

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Speaker 2: their rights. So this is a fundamental you know, anti immigrant, uh,

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Speaker 2: you know, the anti immigrant mentality or platform of this

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Speaker 2: administration is also really deeply anti worker all right, So.

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Speaker 1: Let's let's put a pen in that, right, because I

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Speaker 1: think that that's an important thing for everybody to grasp

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Speaker 1: that as an outcome of of what the Secretary just said,

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Speaker 1: there will be a cohort of human beings, none of

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Speaker 1: whom will be ethnically European or Caucasian, who will live

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Speaker 1: in a state of endentured servitude and ability.

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Speaker 3: Where they are.

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Speaker 1: Unable to address with any agency abuses against that. That is,

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Speaker 1: that is what we are saying, that there is a

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Speaker 1: cohort of human beings who will find themselves in a position,

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Speaker 1: uh where they effectively are made voiceless, invisible, and yoked

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Speaker 1: to the plow, having no ability to call a cop,

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Speaker 1: talk to a lawyer, to have somebody visit them on

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Speaker 1: the property which is private. Okay, when everybody want everybody

435
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:17,480
Speaker 1: to think about the implications of that.

436
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:19,280
Speaker 3: Okay.

437
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:28,080
Speaker 1: Second second thing, so big moment in America a few

438
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:34,600
Speaker 1: months ago when I look at people, uh, you know,

439
00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:39,440
Speaker 1: would have conversations with them. You know, it's you know,

440
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: it's when you when you have someone on who's thirty five,

441
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 1: who was born in nineteen ninety two or whatever, you know,

442
00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 1: and they you know, they had a different experience in life,

443
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 1: you know, and I look at the people that I'm

444
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:55,040
Speaker 1: in the same age bracket with, and I and what

445
00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 1: what I what I think is one of the aside

446
00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 1: from the from the weather, the big chance changes.

447
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 3: In life is causality.

448
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 1: Right, is that the notion right are supposed to dissociation

449
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:18,440
Speaker 1: between Well, when that happened, right, it made it likely

450
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:23,120
Speaker 1: that these next three things would occur. And following those

451
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:28,680
Speaker 1: three things, the next five and so here we are today, right,

452
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:38,959
Speaker 1: And so the sentcom whatever it is, concentration camp prison

453
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:47,720
Speaker 1: in Ol Salvador. The US government engaged in an economic

454
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 1: transaction that said, we will pay you X to take

455
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:06,840
Speaker 1: these people human beings and house them in the words

456
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 1: of our government, or chain them, shave their heads, imprison

457
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 1: them in this place. And that's the deal, great deal

458
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:26,320
Speaker 1: because the cost is much less than in the United States.

459
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:27,840
Speaker 3: And L.

460
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:32,520
Speaker 1: Salvador says, what a great business this is for the dictator.

461
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:42,360
Speaker 3: And so we sell the human beings to L.

462
00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:46,279
Speaker 1: Salvador. Where they're where they're where they're put in the

463
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 1: concentration camp.

464
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:49,279
Speaker 3: Is that is that?

465
00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 1: Is that how you understand the policy? Any rhetoric that's objectionable,

466
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:58,120
Speaker 1: any extremist. Have I exaggerated that at all?

467
00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,640
Speaker 2: Nope, That's exactly what it was. And you you're you know,

468
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 2: there's a specific example right of a Kilmar Abrego Garcia,

469
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 2: who kind of brings together the themes we've been talking

470
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:10,799
Speaker 2: about today, which is that you know, in addition to

471
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 2: everything you said, which is what happened to him, union

472
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:21,839
Speaker 2: members and union leaders came out to call for his

473
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:26,440
Speaker 2: return because they recognize that when you create a criminalized

474
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:29,920
Speaker 2: underclass of workers who have no rights whatsoever, it tears

475
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 2: away hard won rights for native born uh Caucasian union

476
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 2: workers too. Because yeah, go ahead, this.

477
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:43,160
Speaker 1: Is a fork in the road here, right, and so

478
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 1: we have to we have to appreciate something, right, I

479
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: think every everybody who's on who who will watch later? Right,

480
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:56,160
Speaker 1: So every everything we're talking about so far, you know,

481
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,080
Speaker 1: we've we've we've been on for a while now and

482
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: we've not said the word Democratic party or or leader.

483
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:08,680
Speaker 1: And it's not necessary because we're having an American conversation,

484
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 1: right that no matter where you sit right on a

485
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:17,360
Speaker 1: on a range of policy issues, right, there is there

486
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:21,040
Speaker 1: is there is nobody you know, in my view, who

487
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:25,560
Speaker 1: should be in disagreement right with with anything we said. Right,

488
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:31,640
Speaker 1: So we have the first black leader of the of

489
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 1: the House Democrats.

490
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:35,400
Speaker 3: And when.

491
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 1: Democrats like Chris van Holland go to El Salvador in

492
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:53,360
Speaker 1: demand to see their constituent who has uh US citizen children,

493
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:04,680
Speaker 1: the man who has been sent there as part of

494
00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:12,360
Speaker 1: an economic transaction, Souldel Salvador.

495
00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:15,800
Speaker 2: Sent there erroneously, remember the meditation. Admitted that part.

496
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:22,680
Speaker 1: Too, But Leader Leader, Leader Jefferies says, don't talk about that.

497
00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:26,799
Speaker 3: And so what I would.

498
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:30,240
Speaker 1: Say to that is right, there's a there's an inherent

499
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:36,160
Speaker 1: question is why why did the Union army fight Lee

500
00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 1: at Gettysburg and and and the answer to that question

501
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: is is because Robert E. Lee invaded Pennsylvania and that's

502
00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:49,400
Speaker 1: where the Confederate army was. And so if the government

503
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:56,239
Speaker 1: sells a human being Cal Salvador, the position of the

504
00:37:56,320 --> 00:38:00,719
Speaker 1: Democratic leader in the Congress can't be we shouldn't talk

505
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 1: about it because my pollster says, there's better issues for us.

506
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:08,360
Speaker 3: Do you agree with that?

507
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:16,360
Speaker 2: I definitely agree that we there is a principle of

508
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:22,840
Speaker 2: humanity that exists above and apart from any kind of

509
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:29,160
Speaker 2: political calculation, and and and that what's happening now in

510
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,359
Speaker 2: this country is bringing a lot of people together who

511
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 2: might not have been you know, in conversation or you know,

512
00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:41,720
Speaker 2: shoulder to shoulder on issues because of that that that belief,

513
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:42,600
Speaker 2: I do agree with that.

514
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 1: Okay, I want to talk about what I described earlier

515
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:52,640
Speaker 1: is the second is the second is the second issue,

516
00:38:52,800 --> 00:39:00,359
Speaker 1: and this is about now private prisons. And I don't

517
00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:07,720
Speaker 1: think I think that people who share our position should

518
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:14,280
Speaker 1: not engage in any rhetorical excess here because the exaggerations

519
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 1: don't help at all, and I don't think there's a

520
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:22,160
Speaker 1: need to exaggerate the grotesque area. And so I want

521
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:30,359
Speaker 1: to walk through this with you, to check myself right,

522
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:33,799
Speaker 1: and to go through this with a with an expert,

523
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:38,600
Speaker 1: one of the foremost acting secretary of labor, of labor

524
00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:48,800
Speaker 1: right in America in this moment about this, about this issue.

525
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:54,759
Speaker 1: So prison labor is not a novel concept in America.

526
00:39:55,400 --> 00:40:01,719
Speaker 1: So in Mississippi and Alabama, chain gan prison labor would

527
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:06,560
Speaker 1: be rented, leased out. So none of this is none

528
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:09,319
Speaker 1: of this is novel. There is a tradition and a

529
00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:13,720
Speaker 1: lot of southern governor's mansions that you had convicts working

530
00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:18,200
Speaker 1: in the governor's mansion as part of the part of

531
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:24,120
Speaker 1: the domestic staff. And and so we know that about history,

532
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:30,560
Speaker 1: we know that that practice doesn't exist anymore. But now

533
00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:34,719
Speaker 1: we see the rise of a multi billion dollar industry,

534
00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:39,320
Speaker 1: and in these companies, many of them are publicly traded,

535
00:40:40,239 --> 00:40:44,040
Speaker 1: some of them are owned by private equity, and and

536
00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:48,239
Speaker 1: and there's no small number of states, uh where the

537
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:54,400
Speaker 1: teacher's pension funds and the retirement pension funds, cal stirs,

538
00:40:54,520 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 1: calpurs perhaps are invested in funds that haven't echinonomic interest

539
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:05,239
Speaker 1: in these private prisons. And so I think as a

540
00:41:05,239 --> 00:41:10,360
Speaker 1: matter of policy, there should be no government ownership of

541
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:14,359
Speaker 1: businesses that are involved in the trading and ownership at

542
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:18,439
Speaker 1: some level of people. And we're gonna get into that.

543
00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 1: And there should not be the existence of a private prison.

544
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:25,520
Speaker 3: They're right for abuse.

545
00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:28,319
Speaker 1: This is a cost if you wish to build a

546
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:34,919
Speaker 1: prison that society must pay for and that the taxpayer

547
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:40,560
Speaker 1: must fund, and they must comport with human rights and

548
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 1: human values. So what we know right now is we

549
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:50,040
Speaker 1: have massed agents, no badges, snatching people, kidnapping them off

550
00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 1: the streets, disappearing them. Mika Brazinski used the word disappear

551
00:41:56,640 --> 00:42:01,200
Speaker 1: when confronting Tom Homan and a precise and effective interview.

552
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:06,000
Speaker 1: And disappear is the right word. It's the precise word,

553
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 1: disappearing these people, and they wind up some of them

554
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 1: in Al Salvador, some of them in Uganda, and some

555
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 1: of them wind up in these private prison detention facilities.

556
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:23,879
Speaker 1: We know that there are reports of people drinking out

557
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:30,960
Speaker 1: of toilets, that people are sleeping on concrete floors, and

558
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:38,840
Speaker 1: all manner of abuses. So what Trump has said in

559
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:46,400
Speaker 1: a number of different instances is that recognizing that he

560
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:53,000
Speaker 1: has created through the Stephen Miller terror campaign and acute

561
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:59,760
Speaker 1: labor shortage, right, And sitting in the White House behind

562
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 1: the Maga wall, where the conversation between Brooke Rawllins, the

563
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:09,280
Speaker 1: Secretary of Agriculture, who is a vessel for the powerful

564
00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:15,040
Speaker 1: corporate interests right that are the stamp on her jersey,

565
00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:21,399
Speaker 1: looks at the Rhinehart Hydrich of the administration right, who

566
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 1: wants his roundups, who's crashing the economy?

567
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:27,560
Speaker 3: Right?

568
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:31,279
Speaker 1: And the argument is crazy, Steven hates these people so much,

569
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:38,880
Speaker 1: mister President, that he's crashing the economy. Right, But we

570
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 1: need these people to pick the crops. And so what

571
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:46,720
Speaker 1: Trump has said, well, if the people have been rounded

572
00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 1: up and they have been put in the camps. The

573
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 1: company can take those people and do a deal an

574
00:43:55,239 --> 00:44:08,279
Speaker 1: economic transaction, yeah, between the prison and agricultural interest involving

575
00:44:08,360 --> 00:44:20,880
Speaker 1: that human capital. And and maybe the government gets a

576
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:29,800
Speaker 1: kind of it too, right, Maybe the MAGA sector chief

577
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 1: gets his piece of the pie because of the evisceration

578
00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:40,319
Speaker 1: of the US Attorney's offices and the evisceration of the

579
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 1: ethics laws. And maybe a foreign corporation can lease the

580
00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:54,840
Speaker 1: labor because the Foreign for a Practices Act has also

581
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:56,080
Speaker 1: been eviscerated.

582
00:44:58,080 --> 00:44:58,640
Speaker 3: Is there.

583
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:14,760
Speaker 1: Your knowledge any transactions where detainees have been turned into laborers,

584
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:21,600
Speaker 1: a contractual arrangements between private prisons, and any economic interest

585
00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:27,280
Speaker 1: was soever anywhere in America since Trump has been president.

586
00:45:28,680 --> 00:45:31,759
Speaker 2: So I don't have any inside information anymore than you

587
00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:34,120
Speaker 2: would Steve about that. But I think what you've laid

588
00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:38,920
Speaker 2: out that danger is very real, and it's related to

589
00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 2: what we were saying earlier about if you create any

590
00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:47,359
Speaker 2: again a cohort of an underclass of people who have

591
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 2: no rights at all, who can be bought and sold

592
00:45:51,239 --> 00:45:55,160
Speaker 2: as human chattel, I mean it's and you've denied them

593
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:59,120
Speaker 2: any other protections, right, they don't have freedom, they don't

594
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:01,640
Speaker 2: have mobility, they don't have choice, they don't have a

595
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:05,640
Speaker 2: voice in anything. That is the danger. And just to

596
00:46:05,719 --> 00:46:11,440
Speaker 2: build on what you said, it's not only so deeply inhumane,

597
00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:18,479
Speaker 2: it is also it exists in part because people who

598
00:46:18,520 --> 00:46:22,360
Speaker 2: need labor aren't willing to pay for it, right, aren't

599
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:27,000
Speaker 2: willing to hire working people and give them a real

600
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:32,279
Speaker 2: shot at a good life. And that is fundamentally right

601
00:46:32,320 --> 00:46:34,319
Speaker 2: part of the you know, part part of part of

602
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 2: the the the bargain, the idea of America is that

603
00:46:38,920 --> 00:46:42,839
Speaker 2: you work hard, you do a job, and you get

604
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:45,360
Speaker 2: to build a good life out of it. And this

605
00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:49,719
Speaker 2: this sort of this administration's approach to allowing you know,

606
00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:54,800
Speaker 2: classes of people, whether it's uh, you know, immigrant workers,

607
00:46:55,320 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 2: round faces, imprisoned, uh you know, works to serve that

608
00:47:02,280 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 2: as an alternative to actually paying people, uh to do

609
00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 2: real jobs that would allow them to build a life.

610
00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:14,399
Speaker 2: Is it is repulsive. It's it's really gross the other

611
00:47:14,560 --> 00:47:17,200
Speaker 2: things that I think, and allowing people to profit from it.

612
00:47:17,280 --> 00:47:17,400
Speaker 3: Right.

613
00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:19,399
Speaker 2: You also raised this point which I also think needs

614
00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:24,000
Speaker 2: to be called out, that public goods are being privatized

615
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:28,600
Speaker 2: at a rapid rate in this administration and there are

616
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 2: many many dangers to that, including those that you said,

617
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 2: and including just the growth like sort of accumulation of

618
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:41,000
Speaker 2: wealth among a few private actors. That's that's that's another problem.

619
00:47:41,200 --> 00:47:42,920
Speaker 2: But the other thing that I just wanted to also

620
00:47:43,080 --> 00:47:46,320
Speaker 2: pick out is so if you wanted to solve these issues,

621
00:47:46,360 --> 00:47:49,919
Speaker 2: you could bring together smart people on you know, both

622
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:51,960
Speaker 2: sides of the aisle to try to figure out how

623
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:55,120
Speaker 2: we ensure that we don't slide into this this space

624
00:47:55,160 --> 00:47:58,839
Speaker 2: where we lose all our humanity. Private actors who who

625
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:01,840
Speaker 2: who stand to gain get to do that with no check,

626
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:04,640
Speaker 2: and it hurts and it hurts all of us. That

627
00:48:04,760 --> 00:48:06,160
Speaker 2: hurts all of us. Part is the one I want

628
00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:09,160
Speaker 2: to say, because you know, you talked about a labor shortage.

629
00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:11,360
Speaker 2: For a long time, there has been a labor shortage

630
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:13,799
Speaker 2: in this country, meaning there are more jobs than there

631
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:17,480
Speaker 2: are workers, right and so in many ways that is

632
00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:20,320
Speaker 2: a that's helped create more people coming into the labor

633
00:48:20,360 --> 00:48:22,239
Speaker 2: for us, people wanting to work and be able to

634
00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:25,080
Speaker 2: find work, people again being able to build a good

635
00:48:25,080 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 2: life where they go do a good job, they get

636
00:48:27,160 --> 00:48:29,040
Speaker 2: paid fairly, they come home the end of the day,

637
00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:32,839
Speaker 2: and they can afford you know, to build a life

638
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:35,120
Speaker 2: and afford to retire with dignity. That is no longer

639
00:48:35,120 --> 00:48:38,120
Speaker 2: the case for the first time in a very long time,

640
00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:40,120
Speaker 2: since basically the height of the pandemic, and I think

641
00:48:40,280 --> 00:48:43,439
Speaker 2: maybe April twenty twenty one, there are now more job

642
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:46,160
Speaker 2: seekers than there are jobs. So not only are all

643
00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 2: these terrible things that you just talked about happening, the

644
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:53,040
Speaker 2: administration is using the exact wrong solution, right, which is

645
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:55,200
Speaker 2: that if you're worried about a labor shortage, the re

646
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:58,440
Speaker 2: solution is not to create fewer jobs, right. The solution

647
00:48:58,560 --> 00:49:01,000
Speaker 2: is not to tank the account of me and make

648
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:04,879
Speaker 2: sure that now fewer and fewer people get an opportunity.

649
00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:05,160
Speaker 3: Right.

650
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:07,880
Speaker 2: I think that there's a vision for this country that is,

651
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:12,839
Speaker 2: the bigger you make the pie, the more people can

652
00:49:12,880 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 2: get slices, and the bigger everyone slices can be instead

653
00:49:16,200 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 2: of what this administration has done, which is taken the

654
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:22,239
Speaker 2: bulk of the pie and given it to a few

655
00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:25,920
Speaker 2: private actors, a few billionaires. Keep you know, the entire

656
00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:29,560
Speaker 2: tax cut bill for them was about giving them a

657
00:49:29,600 --> 00:49:32,280
Speaker 2: bigger piece of the pie and taking a very small

658
00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:35,400
Speaker 2: sliver and handing out to a few people and saying, look,

659
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:37,759
Speaker 2: you guys got to figure out how to make this

660
00:49:38,080 --> 00:49:41,040
Speaker 2: work for you and just be glad that you're not

661
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 2: one of these other people who are getting none of

662
00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:44,960
Speaker 2: it at all. I think that is we deserve so

663
00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:49,000
Speaker 2: much better than that. That is not the policy, that

664
00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:52,200
Speaker 2: that that that that that that you know, that's not

665
00:49:52,239 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 2: the America that I was born into, the America that

666
00:49:55,120 --> 00:49:57,080
Speaker 2: that that we can build the America that you know,

667
00:49:57,560 --> 00:49:59,800
Speaker 2: for better or for worse. People have been in office

668
00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:02,920
Speaker 2: and try to try to make this pie bigger and

669
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:06,440
Speaker 2: not always succeeded. But this one seems really help bent

670
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:09,400
Speaker 2: on making sure that that small sliver is all the

671
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:12,600
Speaker 2: majority of people get. And it's just that I think

672
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:15,439
Speaker 2: that's outrageous and everything that you've highlighted is a part

673
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:17,080
Speaker 2: of that broader agenda.

674
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:20,040
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna make an assumption about you and

675
00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:23,520
Speaker 1: I and I and I. You hate to do that,

676
00:50:23,560 --> 00:50:28,480
Speaker 1: but I imagine earlier in your career you have labor experience,

677
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:30,400
Speaker 1: working inside labor union.

678
00:50:31,560 --> 00:50:34,320
Speaker 2: I have worked alongside labor unions for very long right.

679
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:37,440
Speaker 1: For very for for for a very long time, and

680
00:50:37,920 --> 00:50:44,160
Speaker 1: so I have this observation about something that's happening in

681
00:50:44,200 --> 00:50:51,879
Speaker 1: the country. And it is through seeing Mark Zuckerberg at

682
00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:58,160
Speaker 1: the White House in the dialogue with Donald where you

683
00:50:58,200 --> 00:51:01,839
Speaker 1: know he says, say, one hundred billion, which is an

684
00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 1: absurdist number. Uh, that's going to be invested into the

685
00:51:06,520 --> 00:51:07,760
Speaker 1: deer leader's.

686
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:09,400
Speaker 3: Domain.

687
00:51:10,239 --> 00:51:15,480
Speaker 1: And it's a it's a nonsense number. It was it

688
00:51:15,560 --> 00:51:21,839
Speaker 1: was publicly publicly recorded. And so when you think about

689
00:51:21,920 --> 00:51:29,040
Speaker 1: labor and management over over my career, I have represented

690
00:51:29,320 --> 00:51:37,600
Speaker 1: a private sector labor union or two, but overwhelmingly I

691
00:51:37,719 --> 00:51:44,000
Speaker 1: have represented management in labor negotiations right from the management

692
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:47,320
Speaker 1: side of the studios and the you know many years

693
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:52,759
Speaker 1: ago the writer strike, not the last one. But if

694
00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:56,960
Speaker 1: you are on the management side, right and you are

695
00:51:57,480 --> 00:52:04,840
Speaker 1: representing GM against the ua W right, your your fiduciary

696
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:12,680
Speaker 1: responsibility is to the shareholder, and the labor union's fiduciary

697
00:52:12,800 --> 00:52:18,480
Speaker 1: responsibility is to the member of the labor union.

698
00:52:19,280 --> 00:52:22,520
Speaker 3: And there's inherent join.

699
00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:26,440
Speaker 1: Us and conflict because a lot of the members of

700
00:52:26,520 --> 00:52:30,720
Speaker 1: the labor union or shareholders and the company and and

701
00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:34,080
Speaker 1: and vice versa. But you know, the most the most

702
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:37,120
Speaker 1: common piece of advice you know that I would give

703
00:52:37,200 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 1: CEOs as they would get ready to be in a

704
00:52:40,280 --> 00:52:45,240
Speaker 1: labor dispute was that, Well, listen, you know, I think

705
00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:49,680
Speaker 1: the most important thing to understand is that if you're

706
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:54,040
Speaker 1: going to cave, and you will cave early, it's a

707
00:52:54,160 --> 00:53:00,680
Speaker 1: it's a lot less painful, right. And but but as

708
00:53:00,719 --> 00:53:05,239
Speaker 1: you as you sit there, you know who's representing him?

709
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:14,520
Speaker 3: In a world where it's the government that drives.

710
00:53:17,239 --> 00:53:22,400
Speaker 1: The decisions of a company, not the shareholder interest, but

711
00:53:22,520 --> 00:53:27,960
Speaker 1: the ego of one man, how does a labor representative

712
00:53:28,120 --> 00:53:36,319
Speaker 1: set across from a management representative against the corporation in

713
00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:41,400
Speaker 1: America when it seems the shareholder is no longer in

714
00:53:41,520 --> 00:53:46,480
Speaker 1: charge of the destiny of a corporation. The destiny of

715
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:50,640
Speaker 1: a corporation is a function of pleasing Donald Trump's eca.

716
00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:55,400
Speaker 1: So how does how does somebody who has the fiduciary

717
00:53:56,400 --> 00:53:59,920
Speaker 1: for the for the labor union member think about that?

718
00:54:00,560 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 3: Yeah?

719
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:04,200
Speaker 2: Right, I mean just and to like take that one

720
00:54:04,239 --> 00:54:08,080
Speaker 2: step further. This is a president that when it comes

721
00:54:08,120 --> 00:54:11,759
Speaker 2: to his own employees, the federal workforce has horn up

722
00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:17,480
Speaker 2: union contracts completely. So there's not he's not even negotiating, right,

723
00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:20,279
Speaker 2: He's basically up turned over the table and said I'm

724
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:23,160
Speaker 2: not coming to it. So I think that this is

725
00:54:23,200 --> 00:54:27,000
Speaker 2: a dangerous time for for labor unions and for what

726
00:54:27,080 --> 00:54:32,360
Speaker 2: you're describing, which is, how do you develop good labor

727
00:54:32,440 --> 00:54:36,719
Speaker 2: management relations for the benefit of the the the enterprise right,

728
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:39,440
Speaker 2: for the benefit of the of the good jobs that

729
00:54:39,480 --> 00:54:42,680
Speaker 2: workers want, and of the business that needs to succeed

730
00:54:42,719 --> 00:54:45,600
Speaker 2: in order for those good jobs to continue. I think

731
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:50,000
Speaker 2: this is like a wild wild West, given this administration's

732
00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:53,480
Speaker 2: complete disregard for union rights in a way that we

733
00:54:53,600 --> 00:54:57,799
Speaker 2: have not seen in really ever. I don't think there's

734
00:54:57,800 --> 00:55:00,640
Speaker 2: ever been a moment where a president United State ripped

735
00:55:00,680 --> 00:55:02,759
Speaker 2: up the contracts of over four hundred thousand people in

736
00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:05,800
Speaker 2: a single day. But I will say this so as

737
00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:09,400
Speaker 2: the acting Labor Secretary, I came to the bargaining table

738
00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:12,760
Speaker 2: many times on behalf of President Biden with a goal

739
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:17,600
Speaker 2: of helping the parties achieve good results. And you know

740
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:20,960
Speaker 2: this president made. President Biden made no secret of him

741
00:55:21,040 --> 00:55:24,600
Speaker 2: wanting to be a pro worker, pro union president, and

742
00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:28,120
Speaker 2: I was all for that. And what I believe is

743
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:31,480
Speaker 2: that when the parties come to the table in good faith,

744
00:55:31,520 --> 00:55:34,280
Speaker 2: when they negotiate and grapple with hard things, they're definitely

745
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:36,239
Speaker 2: not going to agree on everything when they first come

746
00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:40,280
Speaker 2: But when they recognize that there is a goal beyond

747
00:55:41,160 --> 00:55:45,759
Speaker 2: just shareholder returns that is good for everybody, that you

748
00:55:45,880 --> 00:55:51,040
Speaker 2: can have really, really good outcomes that provide for record

749
00:55:51,280 --> 00:55:54,280
Speaker 2: improvements in the lives of workers and helped to sustain

750
00:55:54,320 --> 00:55:58,120
Speaker 2: the long term wellbeing of a company and of an industry.

751
00:55:58,239 --> 00:56:00,680
Speaker 2: And we saw that, you know, when I was in office,

752
00:56:00,760 --> 00:56:04,440
Speaker 2: we had auto workers, as you mentioned, to airline flight attendants,

753
00:56:04,480 --> 00:56:08,279
Speaker 2: to healthcare workers and hospitality workers, to delivery drivers. I

754
00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:14,319
Speaker 2: mean in multiple industries where machinists who build planes, manufacturers

755
00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:19,200
Speaker 2: who build buses really do well. And I think that

756
00:56:19,200 --> 00:56:23,520
Speaker 2: that is fundamentally a vision of the economy that is

757
00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:26,640
Speaker 2: so important that that there's enough in this country to

758
00:56:26,719 --> 00:56:31,319
Speaker 2: go around. There's enough for working people to also get

759
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:33,480
Speaker 2: some not just you know we talk about, oh, make

760
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:36,120
Speaker 2: sure that you know they get they get the minimum.

761
00:56:36,239 --> 00:56:38,080
Speaker 2: The great thing of a union contract is you get

762
00:56:38,120 --> 00:56:40,160
Speaker 2: much more than the minimum. Right, you get things that

763
00:56:40,200 --> 00:56:44,399
Speaker 2: are not required by law, health benefits, a pension, paid holidays.

764
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:47,799
Speaker 2: There's things that working people we would hope, right, we

765
00:56:47,880 --> 00:56:49,919
Speaker 2: want for our own lives that I want to see

766
00:56:49,920 --> 00:56:53,719
Speaker 2: for everybody who works in this country. That happens when

767
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:57,960
Speaker 2: there's a good union contract and I got to participate

768
00:56:57,960 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 2: in getting some of those. I'm really proud of that,

769
00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:03,520
Speaker 2: and it's really hard to see a lot of that

770
00:57:03,640 --> 00:57:07,799
Speaker 2: foundation being ripped away in an administration that professes to

771
00:57:07,840 --> 00:57:11,040
Speaker 2: be pro worker professor to Bill sab unions and everybody

772
00:57:11,160 --> 00:57:16,040
Speaker 2: still turn is doing things. Yeah, that was right to

773
00:57:16,120 --> 00:57:18,320
Speaker 2: crush unions and to make it harder for working people

774
00:57:18,400 --> 00:57:18,920
Speaker 2: just to get.

775
00:57:18,760 --> 00:57:23,480
Speaker 3: By Upton Sinclair to find.

776
00:57:24,760 --> 00:57:33,120
Speaker 1: Fascism as capitalism plus murder, and this is a fascist

777
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:37,760
Speaker 1: administration in its early days. One of the things that

778
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:45,000
Speaker 1: I said about Trump in twenty twenty four was that

779
00:57:45,160 --> 00:57:49,400
Speaker 1: if he wins the electure, everything that he will be

780
00:57:49,560 --> 00:57:58,040
Speaker 1: remembered for is ahead, not behind, everything that he did

781
00:57:58,720 --> 00:58:05,840
Speaker 1: to debate the societ from two thousand and fifteen forward.

782
00:58:07,120 --> 00:58:13,160
Speaker 1: Just a short preface for what's coming. And here we are,

783
00:58:14,320 --> 00:58:18,480
Speaker 1: and we are in this extraordinary moment, and I just

784
00:58:18,520 --> 00:58:25,920
Speaker 1: wanted to ask you two last things really quick. Do

785
00:58:26,000 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 1: you have you been following the story of the enforcement

786
00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:34,440
Speaker 1: actions by ICE at the Hyundai plant.

787
00:58:35,880 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm reading about it just like you are. But yeah,

788
00:58:38,120 --> 00:58:39,200
Speaker 2: I've read about it.

789
00:58:39,880 --> 00:58:42,680
Speaker 3: So what is the.

790
00:58:44,360 --> 00:58:53,120
Speaker 1: What would happen inside the White House between various government agencies,

791
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:59,400
Speaker 1: Secretary of Labor, Secretary of Commerce, Secretary of State. When

792
00:58:59,640 --> 00:59:05,640
Speaker 1: if I understand that that story, the government almost certainly

793
00:59:07,120 --> 00:59:14,200
Speaker 1: would have been everyone who's working there has some pre

794
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:23,800
Speaker 1: approval status to be working there until some arbitrary decision

795
00:59:24,040 --> 00:59:28,000
Speaker 1: is made that revoked and we send in, we send in.

796
00:59:27,960 --> 00:59:30,920
Speaker 3: The mass, guys. But inside government.

797
00:59:33,120 --> 00:59:37,800
Speaker 1: The role of Hyundai, in the power of Hyundai in

798
00:59:38,560 --> 00:59:46,680
Speaker 1: South Korean society, what is going on like behind the scenes,

799
00:59:46,800 --> 00:59:51,040
Speaker 1: is they is they all are fighting with each other.

800
00:59:51,360 --> 00:59:53,240
Speaker 1: And one of the most important things for everyone to

801
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:58,840
Speaker 1: understand is all these people a Dvance and Rubio and Hagsath,

802
00:59:58,960 --> 01:00:01,960
Speaker 1: they all hate each other. None of these people are friends,

803
01:00:02,040 --> 01:00:06,840
Speaker 1: right Morton Borman and Goebbels and Heidrick and Himmler, they

804
01:00:06,880 --> 01:00:10,560
Speaker 1: all hated each other. Right they were Yes, they were Nazis.

805
01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:12,080
Speaker 1: Yes they were on the same team.

806
01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:12,480
Speaker 3: Right.

807
01:00:12,560 --> 01:00:15,280
Speaker 1: Some of them wanted to die with the furor some

808
01:00:15,320 --> 01:00:18,200
Speaker 1: of them poison their children to die with the furor

809
01:00:19,160 --> 01:00:23,120
Speaker 1: some of them, like Borman uh Uh, tried to escape,

810
01:00:23,240 --> 01:00:26,080
Speaker 1: like Himmler tried to escape.

811
01:00:26,520 --> 01:00:28,280
Speaker 3: But but they all hated each other.

812
01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:33,320
Speaker 1: And in any autocratic system, right, the only way to

813
01:00:33,440 --> 01:00:36,520
Speaker 1: advance is to knife the person in front of you

814
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:38,280
Speaker 1: to get closer.

815
01:00:37,880 --> 01:00:39,320
Speaker 3: To your leader, right.

816
01:00:39,440 --> 01:00:43,640
Speaker 1: So so so that's the culture, right, these these people

817
01:00:43,680 --> 01:00:46,880
Speaker 1: hate each other's gouts. So inside the government when this

818
01:00:47,000 --> 01:00:50,520
Speaker 1: goes down, right, and and they got to go explain

819
01:00:50,600 --> 01:00:53,120
Speaker 1: it to Trump. Just take us inside the dynamic of

820
01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:55,840
Speaker 1: what would have gone down when the when the president

821
01:00:55,880 --> 01:00:59,040
Speaker 1: of South Korea was like the Ice just attacked the

822
01:00:59,120 --> 01:00:59,840
Speaker 1: Hyundai plan.

823
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:05,480
Speaker 2: So let me be very clear, Steve, I can't imagine

824
01:01:05,520 --> 01:01:08,360
Speaker 2: what goes down in this particular White House. And and

825
01:01:08,440 --> 01:01:10,280
Speaker 2: so well, let me take one step back to say this,

826
01:01:10,520 --> 01:01:13,280
Speaker 2: So on Hindi and on the the companies that are

827
01:01:13,360 --> 01:01:18,800
Speaker 2: now opening UH facilities and investing and bringing billions of

828
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:22,240
Speaker 2: dollars to the United States, that is all happening because

829
01:01:22,680 --> 01:01:25,480
Speaker 2: President Biden had investing in America agenda. I don't say

830
01:01:25,520 --> 01:01:27,680
Speaker 2: that to be political about it. I say that because

831
01:01:28,040 --> 01:01:30,520
Speaker 2: that is the fact that the amount of investments that

832
01:01:30,560 --> 01:01:33,360
Speaker 2: were being made and the interactions that we had with

833
01:01:33,560 --> 01:01:39,320
Speaker 2: companies to help build our manufacturing base was a very

834
01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:41,480
Speaker 2: very high priority. And the fact that you know, Donald

835
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:44,240
Speaker 2: Trump is now taking a lot of those investments and

836
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 2: putting his name on them, right is I mean, you

837
01:01:46,560 --> 01:01:50,240
Speaker 2: know again, I in normal times, we would want the

838
01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:52,560
Speaker 2: president to succeed. And if he had just kept the

839
01:01:52,560 --> 01:01:55,560
Speaker 2: baton and kept on going with those investments, I think

840
01:01:55,600 --> 01:01:56,920
Speaker 2: we'd been in a let me let.

841
01:01:56,760 --> 01:01:59,240
Speaker 1: Me jump let me jump in here, because this is

842
01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:03,280
Speaker 1: an important point to say, and I just think it's

843
01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:07,560
Speaker 1: and I just want to assert it for history, for

844
01:02:07,640 --> 01:02:09,920
Speaker 1: the satisfaction of saying this.

845
01:02:11,600 --> 01:02:13,520
Speaker 3: The investments that you speak of.

846
01:02:15,120 --> 01:02:22,040
Speaker 1: Are real, and the investments that Trump speaks of, as

847
01:02:22,080 --> 01:02:30,280
Speaker 1: in the conversation with Mark Zuckerberg are figments of his imagination. Right,

848
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:34,600
Speaker 1: he could be talking about crackers or cookies or animal

849
01:02:34,680 --> 01:02:41,000
Speaker 1: crackers or whatever, right, but none of that is real. Right,

850
01:02:41,040 --> 01:02:44,480
Speaker 1: whether he calls it six hundred billion or two hundred

851
01:02:44,560 --> 01:02:47,880
Speaker 1: billion or three hundred billion. Qatar has given us a trillion,

852
01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:51,760
Speaker 1: and the Saudi's five hundred billion, and the left handed

853
01:02:51,840 --> 01:02:54,560
Speaker 1: green guy has giving us this and that and that.

854
01:02:55,560 --> 01:03:04,680
Speaker 1: It's all nonsense, nonsense, right, So right, right, this is

855
01:03:04,920 --> 01:03:07,760
Speaker 1: this is this is this is this is like I

856
01:03:07,800 --> 01:03:12,240
Speaker 1: just will say, as we as we as we talk

857
01:03:12,320 --> 01:03:16,120
Speaker 1: about this and as we go forward, it's nonsense.

858
01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:19,840
Speaker 2: Right, right, So there's real, right, there's there's real investments,

859
01:03:20,000 --> 01:03:23,200
Speaker 2: and there's nonsense. There's real policies to help workers, and

860
01:03:23,200 --> 01:03:25,200
Speaker 2: there's nonsense. There's real things to help grow the economy,

861
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:28,360
Speaker 2: and there's nonsense. But on your other question about how

862
01:03:28,400 --> 01:03:34,120
Speaker 2: would this have worked, you know, the things that need

863
01:03:34,160 --> 01:03:37,360
Speaker 2: to be done in this country to actually make life

864
01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:40,120
Speaker 2: better for people who are struggling are are massive there.

865
01:03:40,160 --> 01:03:43,960
Speaker 2: They're big challenges, and working together as a team was

866
01:03:44,000 --> 01:03:47,560
Speaker 2: really important for that, which is what you would hope

867
01:03:47,600 --> 01:03:51,320
Speaker 2: would happen. Right in any administration, you will know about

868
01:03:51,320 --> 01:03:54,880
Speaker 2: ones that you were familiar with, and so the secretaries

869
01:03:54,920 --> 01:04:00,960
Speaker 2: of Labor, Transportation, Energy, Agriculture, like all, we're all a

870
01:04:01,040 --> 01:04:04,480
Speaker 2: team to try to achieve the outcomes of building a

871
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:08,640
Speaker 2: stronger economy, building a country that works for all Americans.

872
01:04:08,640 --> 01:04:14,040
Speaker 2: In this administration, if you just watch that last cabinet

873
01:04:14,080 --> 01:04:17,920
Speaker 2: meeting that they had, everyone is spending all their time

874
01:04:18,520 --> 01:04:21,840
Speaker 2: trying to say the most complimentary thing to the dear leader.

875
01:04:22,680 --> 01:04:25,160
Speaker 2: I didn't hear a single thing about what was good

876
01:04:25,160 --> 01:04:29,240
Speaker 2: for the American people, and so I imagine, again, I don't know.

877
01:04:29,280 --> 01:04:32,920
Speaker 2: I don't have any insight into what happened at the

878
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:36,640
Speaker 2: Hindai facility than what I'm reading about it too, But

879
01:04:36,760 --> 01:04:40,160
Speaker 2: I will say that there is now obviously a big

880
01:04:40,200 --> 01:04:46,040
Speaker 2: problem of an enforcement action that was taken again like

881
01:04:46,120 --> 01:04:49,479
Speaker 2: so many others, right sweeping into a workplace where people

882
01:04:49,480 --> 01:04:54,280
Speaker 2: are actually working, armed, masked and rounding people up without

883
01:04:54,320 --> 01:04:57,240
Speaker 2: a care in the world about whether they've done anything

884
01:04:57,560 --> 01:05:01,320
Speaker 2: to warrant it, without any particular you know, like they're

885
01:05:01,400 --> 01:05:04,280
Speaker 2: you know, maybe maybe this person should be round up,

886
01:05:04,320 --> 01:05:07,080
Speaker 2: but but but these people should not. Nothing like that.

887
01:05:07,080 --> 01:05:12,240
Speaker 2: There's no no plan, no strategy. It's just a sheer

888
01:05:12,800 --> 01:05:16,480
Speaker 2: display of growth power, and and they take them at

889
01:05:16,520 --> 01:05:19,960
Speaker 2: Now they've done that to a company that was willing

890
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:22,480
Speaker 2: to make investments, who now feels like, is the US

891
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:26,320
Speaker 2: actually a place I want to make investments to our

892
01:05:26,360 --> 01:05:30,000
Speaker 2: partners right right, you know, like like you know, no no,

893
01:05:30,680 --> 01:05:36,720
Speaker 2: with no notice, just pure disruption. You know, a fellow,

894
01:05:36,840 --> 01:05:39,440
Speaker 2: you know, a government that has been an ally of

895
01:05:39,480 --> 01:05:41,480
Speaker 2: ours now having to figure out you know, I think

896
01:05:41,520 --> 01:05:44,240
Speaker 2: I need to charter a plane to bring my countrymen

897
01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:46,720
Speaker 2: home safely because I don't want them to end up

898
01:05:46,720 --> 01:05:51,480
Speaker 2: at Seacott. So you know, there's all these things about

899
01:05:51,480 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 2: this that are so deeply problematic and without any kind

900
01:05:55,520 --> 01:05:57,840
Speaker 2: of I think, you know, coordination or notice. Because on

901
01:05:57,880 --> 01:06:00,080
Speaker 2: the one hand, the administration is touting these investment and

902
01:06:00,240 --> 01:06:03,400
Speaker 2: on the other hand, they are pushing them, you know,

903
01:06:03,880 --> 01:06:06,640
Speaker 2: out as fast as they can. And I just think

904
01:06:06,640 --> 01:06:11,680
Speaker 2: this is again another example of the pure incompetence. Uh

905
01:06:11,760 --> 01:06:15,840
Speaker 2: and and and uh and there was too many. But

906
01:06:15,920 --> 01:06:17,880
Speaker 2: you know, you use fascism, so I'm gonna use it right,

907
01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:24,160
Speaker 2: an approach to governing that is wholly about increasing their

908
01:06:24,160 --> 01:06:29,120
Speaker 2: own power and control over people without delivering anything good

909
01:06:29,200 --> 01:06:30,440
Speaker 2: for anybody.

910
01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:34,960
Speaker 1: I we're over time on the hour, but I but

911
01:06:35,000 --> 01:06:37,240
Speaker 1: I love talking to you, and I have one last

912
01:06:37,320 --> 01:06:39,320
Speaker 1: I have one last question for you that I think

913
01:06:39,360 --> 01:06:43,200
Speaker 1: people be interested in. We shared, we share an experience,

914
01:06:43,240 --> 01:06:44,840
Speaker 1: and I want to I want to share at least

915
01:06:44,840 --> 01:06:50,280
Speaker 1: this therapy for me, something that drives me crazy. Banana

916
01:06:50,400 --> 01:06:59,280
Speaker 1: ram is crazy. And I have never had the ambition

917
01:06:59,680 --> 01:07:03,120
Speaker 1: really after many many many years, right like a goo

918
01:07:03,320 --> 01:07:04,600
Speaker 1: having left Washington, d C.

919
01:07:04,760 --> 01:07:06,440
Speaker 3: To live in Washington, d C. Again.

920
01:07:08,240 --> 01:07:10,360
Speaker 1: You know it's been it was twenty years ago that

921
01:07:10,400 --> 01:07:12,600
Speaker 1: I left d C. I'm a I'm a I'm a

922
01:07:12,640 --> 01:07:15,440
Speaker 1: West Coaster. But but I want to be a special

923
01:07:15,480 --> 01:07:22,080
Speaker 1: government employee in the next Democratic administration. And I have

924
01:07:22,440 --> 01:07:27,160
Speaker 1: I have some specific things that I would like to

925
01:07:27,200 --> 01:07:33,200
Speaker 1: be in charge of and I want to I want

926
01:07:33,200 --> 01:07:40,000
Speaker 1: to be in charge of UH presidential portraiture placement. I'm

927
01:07:40,080 --> 01:07:45,160
Speaker 1: the eighteen acres of the White House. I want to

928
01:07:45,240 --> 01:07:49,160
Speaker 1: be in charge of scraping all that tacky gold pimp

929
01:07:49,240 --> 01:07:53,320
Speaker 1: shit off of the walls, right, I wanna. I want

930
01:07:53,360 --> 01:07:58,160
Speaker 1: to do it right, and and and film it right.

931
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:01,240
Speaker 1: Is the paint job and all that go. And I

932
01:08:01,280 --> 01:08:03,760
Speaker 1: think you stay there about one hundred days, and so

933
01:08:04,960 --> 01:08:10,720
Speaker 1: the cherry blossoms go, you know, usually blooming in March.

934
01:08:10,960 --> 01:08:15,000
Speaker 1: And I want to crack open the Predator patio with

935
01:08:15,160 --> 01:08:16,120
Speaker 1: the jackhammer.

936
01:08:16,280 --> 01:08:20,639
Speaker 3: I wanna, I want to do it. I wanna, I wanna.

937
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:23,960
Speaker 1: I want to have somebody get me the golden spike

938
01:08:24,640 --> 01:08:28,759
Speaker 1: out of the Smithsonian and you know that was used on.

939
01:08:28,640 --> 01:08:32,519
Speaker 3: The railroad, right, and you know.

940
01:08:32,600 --> 01:08:36,200
Speaker 1: We'll get We'll get some Chinese immigrant who got abused

941
01:08:36,200 --> 01:08:40,120
Speaker 1: by ice to to to drive the drive the spike

942
01:08:40,200 --> 01:08:43,240
Speaker 1: in the Predator patio and smash the ship out of it.

943
01:08:44,040 --> 01:08:48,080
Speaker 1: And and and I want and I want the Rose

944
01:08:48,200 --> 01:08:52,559
Speaker 1: Guardian restored right by you.

945
01:08:52,520 --> 01:08:53,439
Speaker 3: Know what I want?

946
01:08:53,600 --> 01:08:57,759
Speaker 1: I want, I would say, get me the guy that

947
01:08:57,760 --> 01:09:01,599
Speaker 1: that is Prince Charles head Gardener, want him over here right,

948
01:09:01,680 --> 01:09:06,800
Speaker 1: fly him over here, on on from High Grove Gardens, right,

949
01:09:06,920 --> 01:09:10,519
Speaker 1: get them over here. We're making them an American right away.

950
01:09:11,400 --> 01:09:16,519
Speaker 1: And I want the rose Garden restored, right down to the.

951
01:09:16,560 --> 01:09:18,320
Speaker 3: Last to the last rose.

952
01:09:18,600 --> 01:09:24,480
Speaker 1: And this, this drives me crazier than anything, the desecration

953
01:09:25,280 --> 01:09:28,920
Speaker 1: of the White House, the People's House, the the the

954
01:09:29,160 --> 01:09:30,519
Speaker 1: tackiness of this.

955
01:09:30,400 --> 01:09:35,640
Speaker 3: Guy, his appalling lack of taste. And so you have had.

956
01:09:35,439 --> 01:09:39,200
Speaker 1: The experience of being in the Oval Office, being in

957
01:09:39,280 --> 01:09:43,799
Speaker 1: the being in the White House. You know, the less

958
01:09:43,920 --> 01:09:50,120
Speaker 1: is more aesthetic, you know, I you know, it's like

959
01:09:50,280 --> 01:09:54,280
Speaker 1: Caligula on LSD in the in the thing. So when

960
01:09:54,320 --> 01:09:56,639
Speaker 1: you think about when you see the pictures of that

961
01:09:56,760 --> 01:10:01,320
Speaker 1: patio right in the in the yellow bread, every person

962
01:10:01,520 --> 01:10:05,479
Speaker 1: Democrat reprobably is ever walked into that building's taken and

963
01:10:05,640 --> 01:10:09,559
Speaker 1: oath try to do the right thing right. Every person

964
01:10:09,600 --> 01:10:13,160
Speaker 1: I think has had the exact same reaction, right of

965
01:10:13,200 --> 01:10:16,800
Speaker 1: seeing the desecrated space when you see it, right, like,

966
01:10:16,840 --> 01:10:17,280
Speaker 1: what is it?

967
01:10:17,360 --> 01:10:20,120
Speaker 3: What? Like? What like? Like? What how do you feel

968
01:10:20,120 --> 01:10:20,519
Speaker 3: about that?

969
01:10:20,960 --> 01:10:27,360
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, no, I mean I I am I'm deeply troubled,

970
01:10:28,120 --> 01:10:32,160
Speaker 2: not just by the uh uh you know those I

971
01:10:32,160 --> 01:10:34,080
Speaker 2: don't even know. I don't know why I'm trying to

972
01:10:34,120 --> 01:10:36,799
Speaker 2: use euphemisms, but I will use the destruction of the space.

973
01:10:38,840 --> 01:10:42,479
Speaker 2: I'm equally troubled by who now gets to use that

974
01:10:42,560 --> 01:10:47,640
Speaker 2: space right who's in it? And the night before the

975
01:10:47,720 --> 01:10:51,880
Speaker 2: last Job's report came out that confirmed that what Donald

976
01:10:51,880 --> 01:10:55,400
Speaker 2: Trump is doing to the economy is devastating to working people,

977
01:10:55,400 --> 01:11:00,599
Speaker 2: it's devastating to communities, it's it's it's you know, by remeasure,

978
01:11:00,800 --> 01:11:04,800
Speaker 2: things are going off a cliff. The night before that,

979
01:11:05,280 --> 01:11:09,400
Speaker 2: he invited in that conversation that you heard Mark Zuckerberg,

980
01:11:11,280 --> 01:11:16,720
Speaker 2: Jeff Bezos, you know, the CEOs of of of companies

981
01:11:17,280 --> 01:11:20,559
Speaker 2: that are now being sent a clear message that you

982
01:11:20,680 --> 01:11:26,639
Speaker 2: have no accountability to anybody, but what can bring you

983
01:11:26,720 --> 01:11:29,680
Speaker 2: the most profit. And I'm going to back that up.

984
01:11:29,760 --> 01:11:33,960
Speaker 2: I Donald Trump will back that up with policy, with

985
01:11:34,200 --> 01:11:37,160
Speaker 2: tax breaks, with taking the reins off of any kind

986
01:11:37,200 --> 01:11:40,759
Speaker 2: of enforcement, with getting rid of any agencies that would

987
01:11:41,760 --> 01:11:44,759
Speaker 2: fight the kind of corporate monopolies that are so bad

988
01:11:44,840 --> 01:11:48,000
Speaker 2: for everyday people. And I'm going to invite you in

989
01:11:48,040 --> 01:11:51,040
Speaker 2: to the White House so you get free rein That's

990
01:11:51,080 --> 01:11:54,760
Speaker 2: the message that's being sent to them and to the

991
01:11:54,760 --> 01:11:59,479
Speaker 2: American people, and it is it's it's it's horrifying, and

992
01:11:59,520 --> 01:12:01,800
Speaker 2: it is deeply un American. And I'm just gonna tell you,

993
01:12:01,960 --> 01:12:05,360
Speaker 2: I'll head back east with you to DC to help

994
01:12:05,600 --> 01:12:08,800
Speaker 2: restore museums, to make sure that they have the full

995
01:12:08,840 --> 01:12:12,200
Speaker 2: story about America, to reclaim our open spaces that they're

996
01:12:12,240 --> 01:12:15,599
Speaker 2: not being you know, policed in a way that is

997
01:12:15,880 --> 01:12:20,240
Speaker 2: just about, you know, terrorizing everyday Americans. I sign me

998
01:12:20,320 --> 01:12:22,479
Speaker 2: up for that job. I will, I will join you.

999
01:12:24,080 --> 01:12:31,400
Speaker 1: It is an incredible, incredible moment in these United States.

1000
01:12:31,960 --> 01:12:36,200
Speaker 1: That is that is for sure. That is for sure,

1001
01:12:38,280 --> 01:12:40,680
Speaker 1: I do think. And let me leave it on a

1002
01:12:40,720 --> 01:12:41,880
Speaker 1: positive note here.

1003
01:12:43,400 --> 01:12:45,360
Speaker 3: We will, we will.

1004
01:12:45,120 --> 01:12:48,800
Speaker 1: Make it through. But let me ask you one last question.

1005
01:12:49,920 --> 01:12:52,280
Speaker 1: I love I love talking to you on this thing.

1006
01:12:52,400 --> 01:12:58,719
Speaker 1: And I was if you were if you went into

1007
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:04,639
Speaker 1: a coma on February first, and you and you whoop

1008
01:13:05,200 --> 01:13:08,600
Speaker 1: and he woke up to that, and I had to

1009
01:13:08,640 --> 01:13:13,880
Speaker 1: go in and brief you, right, you know about like

1010
01:13:14,000 --> 01:13:17,680
Speaker 1: everything that went on, right, I'd be like, well, I

1011
01:13:17,720 --> 01:13:25,960
Speaker 1: could do it. I could do it chronologically right, or

1012
01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:29,880
Speaker 1: we could get right into the we could get into

1013
01:13:29,920 --> 01:13:31,000
Speaker 1: the essence of it.

1014
01:13:31,080 --> 01:13:34,160
Speaker 3: But like I would, I would.

1015
01:13:36,240 --> 01:13:43,360
Speaker 1: Qatar, which was just attacked by Israel, because that's where

1016
01:13:43,439 --> 01:13:50,200
Speaker 1: Harmas is, right, or the people that gave him the plane,

1017
01:13:50,240 --> 01:13:53,360
Speaker 1: they gave Trump a giants M forty seven, And I

1018
01:13:53,400 --> 01:13:55,640
Speaker 1: think that's what I would tell you first.

1019
01:13:55,880 --> 01:13:57,840
Speaker 3: I would be like, I'd be like, the.

1020
01:13:57,840 --> 01:14:07,519
Speaker 1: Qataris gifted Trump his very own flying Katari palace. And

1021
01:14:07,560 --> 01:14:14,000
Speaker 1: by the way, Israel has attacked Qatar, because that's where

1022
01:14:14,040 --> 01:14:18,920
Speaker 1: Ramas is now. Poland just shot down a bunch of

1023
01:14:19,000 --> 01:14:23,639
Speaker 1: Russian drones and the Venezuela and F sixteen's are flying

1024
01:14:23,720 --> 01:14:31,559
Speaker 1: over our growing invasion fleet in the Southern Caribbean. And

1025
01:14:31,640 --> 01:14:34,880
Speaker 1: Steve Wikoff gave a very touching address at the last

1026
01:14:35,000 --> 01:14:38,599
Speaker 1: year leader Cabinet meeting demanding Trump at the Nobel price.

1027
01:14:40,200 --> 01:14:41,280
Speaker 3: That's where i'd start.

1028
01:14:41,920 --> 01:14:44,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, But like when you when you think about

1029
01:14:44,720 --> 01:14:52,400
Speaker 1: like the craziness of that, right that the Israelis are

1030
01:14:52,439 --> 01:15:00,280
Speaker 1: attacking Qatar gave Trump the plane, how do you think

1031
01:15:00,400 --> 01:15:08,760
Speaker 1: and shift through the waterfall of craziness and maintain optimism?

1032
01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:12,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, it's it's a it's a good question. And

1033
01:15:12,479 --> 01:15:15,599
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say that some days it's hard. Sometimes it's hard,

1034
01:15:15,680 --> 01:15:18,880
Speaker 2: you know. I I love that we can have this

1035
01:15:18,960 --> 01:15:23,200
Speaker 2: conversation and laugh about some of it because it's absurd, right,

1036
01:15:23,280 --> 01:15:27,280
Speaker 2: Like I would you know, think that if I woke

1037
01:15:27,360 --> 01:15:29,240
Speaker 2: up with that com and you told me that, I

1038
01:15:29,280 --> 01:15:33,000
Speaker 2: would say, and how many wars has he claimed to

1039
01:15:33,040 --> 01:15:33,599
Speaker 2: have stopped?

1040
01:15:33,720 --> 01:15:33,840
Speaker 1: Right?

1041
01:15:33,920 --> 01:15:34,000
Speaker 3: Like?

1042
01:15:34,080 --> 01:15:36,200
Speaker 2: You know, we know, we know who he is.

1043
01:15:36,400 --> 01:15:40,000
Speaker 1: Right, we know fifty or fifty seven, seventeen or eighteen

1044
01:15:40,120 --> 01:15:41,560
Speaker 1: or nineteen stopped.

1045
01:15:41,240 --> 01:15:45,840
Speaker 2: All the right exactly all right, we know who he is.

1046
01:15:46,120 --> 01:15:52,800
Speaker 2: I think one of the things that is most despicable

1047
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:55,960
Speaker 2: is the number of people who have jumped on board

1048
01:15:56,439 --> 01:16:02,880
Speaker 2: to help him, you know, lie sheet steal his way

1049
01:16:03,120 --> 01:16:07,360
Speaker 2: to to his goals. The number of people who've helped

1050
01:16:07,400 --> 01:16:12,600
Speaker 2: him to cover up and right like you know, I

1051
01:16:12,640 --> 01:16:18,160
Speaker 2: mean to enable him. And I find that to be

1052
01:16:18,320 --> 01:16:20,439
Speaker 2: one of the one of the things that that troubles

1053
01:16:20,479 --> 01:16:26,559
Speaker 2: me the most. But I also think that he did

1054
01:16:26,600 --> 01:16:31,920
Speaker 2: not expect the force of the pushback that he's been

1055
01:16:31,920 --> 01:16:36,560
Speaker 2: getting from all over. He didn't. I think he overestimates

1056
01:16:36,600 --> 01:16:42,080
Speaker 2: himself on the regular and underestimates anybody who who disagrees

1057
01:16:42,120 --> 01:16:45,360
Speaker 2: with or would resist what he does. And that gives

1058
01:16:45,439 --> 01:16:48,000
Speaker 2: me hope. And we've seen it in big ways, right,

1059
01:16:48,240 --> 01:16:51,879
Speaker 2: you know, court victories. Although I do believe those are temporary,

1060
01:16:51,920 --> 01:16:55,519
Speaker 2: given what the Supreme Court has been doing and saying

1061
01:16:55,520 --> 01:16:57,960
Speaker 2: to also enable him. But there have been victories, and

1062
01:16:58,040 --> 01:17:01,360
Speaker 2: there have been people who have stood up and spoken

1063
01:17:01,439 --> 01:17:04,519
Speaker 2: out and who are continuing to do that in ways

1064
01:17:04,560 --> 01:17:08,160
Speaker 2: that I do believe are stronger than anything that he

1065
01:17:08,200 --> 01:17:11,400
Speaker 2: would do with the with the ways that he's abusing

1066
01:17:11,479 --> 01:17:13,960
Speaker 2: any power that he has. So that gives me hope,

1067
01:17:14,240 --> 01:17:17,880
Speaker 2: and I think we absolutely cannot give in to the

1068
01:17:18,280 --> 01:17:22,320
Speaker 2: chaos and the sense of being overwhelmed. Right, It's important

1069
01:17:22,560 --> 01:17:25,440
Speaker 2: to recognize that each of these things are not inevitable.

1070
01:17:25,520 --> 01:17:27,679
Speaker 2: They're not you know, we say going off a cliff

1071
01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:30,160
Speaker 2: as because that makes it. See, you know, he's pushing

1072
01:17:30,200 --> 01:17:33,240
Speaker 2: us to that point, but there's many many ways to

1073
01:17:33,240 --> 01:17:35,439
Speaker 2: stop it before we get there, and I think all

1074
01:17:35,479 --> 01:17:38,120
Speaker 2: of us has power to do that. Speaking up about

1075
01:17:38,160 --> 01:17:41,200
Speaker 2: it matters, coming together matters. I believe that marching in

1076
01:17:41,240 --> 01:17:43,320
Speaker 2: the street matters. I believe that, you know, showing that

1077
01:17:44,000 --> 01:17:45,920
Speaker 2: we are not going to go quietly, that he's not

1078
01:17:46,400 --> 01:17:49,200
Speaker 2: he is not all powerful, is really really important, and

1079
01:17:49,240 --> 01:17:51,640
Speaker 2: there's things that everybody can do about that, And it

1080
01:17:52,479 --> 01:17:54,880
Speaker 2: gives me great hope to watch people it just let's

1081
01:17:54,880 --> 01:17:56,840
Speaker 2: talk about the federal employees for a moment, right, people

1082
01:17:56,840 --> 01:17:59,559
Speaker 2: I worked with, people I was privileged to lead in

1083
01:17:59,560 --> 01:18:01,160
Speaker 2: an age of see that was working really hard to

1084
01:18:01,200 --> 01:18:06,040
Speaker 2: deliver on its mission. People there who have been completely

1085
01:18:06,080 --> 01:18:08,679
Speaker 2: you know, many have been pushed out entirely. But many

1086
01:18:08,760 --> 01:18:13,120
Speaker 2: of them are working under the most impossible circumstances. They're

1087
01:18:13,160 --> 01:18:17,240
Speaker 2: being criticized and vilified on a daily basis, but they

1088
01:18:17,280 --> 01:18:21,120
Speaker 2: are finding courage and the ability to speak out and

1089
01:18:21,200 --> 01:18:24,000
Speaker 2: to do in ways that I don't think they ever

1090
01:18:24,080 --> 01:18:27,120
Speaker 2: imagined they would have to use. So recently, employees of

1091
01:18:27,120 --> 01:18:29,559
Speaker 2: the Bureau of Labor Statistics that puts out this data

1092
01:18:29,600 --> 01:18:33,880
Speaker 2: that Donald Trump is now trying to completely control, put

1093
01:18:33,880 --> 01:18:36,840
Speaker 2: out a statement and its last sentence was something like,

1094
01:18:37,040 --> 01:18:39,440
Speaker 2: you know, we are going to do our jobs with integrity,

1095
01:18:39,800 --> 01:18:42,400
Speaker 2: and the moment we are told we cannot, people will

1096
01:18:42,400 --> 01:18:43,040
Speaker 2: know about it.

1097
01:18:43,520 --> 01:18:43,680
Speaker 3: Right.

1098
01:18:43,840 --> 01:18:46,439
Speaker 2: That is the kind of courage and the kind of

1099
01:18:46,680 --> 01:18:50,320
Speaker 2: you know, standing up to this UH, to this UH,

1100
01:18:50,439 --> 01:18:55,280
Speaker 2: to this cruelty and insanity that that I'm seeing everywhere.

1101
01:18:55,400 --> 01:18:57,519
Speaker 2: Turn And I think that, you know, that gives me

1102
01:18:57,560 --> 01:18:59,360
Speaker 2: hope and makes me realize that, you know, I got

1103
01:18:59,360 --> 01:19:00,680
Speaker 2: to keep on doing it that I can do.

1104
01:19:01,240 --> 01:19:05,080
Speaker 1: I want to I want to just close, if I

1105
01:19:05,080 --> 01:19:08,920
Speaker 1: if I could, I appreciate we have some regulars on

1106
01:19:09,080 --> 01:19:13,280
Speaker 1: and if they've heard these stories before, they can they

1107
01:19:13,320 --> 01:19:17,680
Speaker 1: can leave early. But of course everybody is free to

1108
01:19:18,000 --> 01:19:23,240
Speaker 1: leave whenever. But I did see in the comments as

1109
01:19:24,080 --> 01:19:27,479
Speaker 1: as I'm reading through them, and and thank you for

1110
01:19:27,560 --> 01:19:32,360
Speaker 1: everybody who who participates in in that way. In the

1111
01:19:32,560 --> 01:19:39,559
Speaker 1: in the conversation and talked about a mini Ikeman and

1112
01:19:39,720 --> 01:19:44,200
Speaker 1: the term uh is little ikeman, and that would have

1113
01:19:44,320 --> 01:19:51,880
Speaker 1: been a popular uh definition right of a fascist in

1114
01:19:51,400 --> 01:19:59,000
Speaker 1: the in the nineteen sixties. And the man who interrogated

1115
01:19:59,840 --> 01:20:06,120
Speaker 1: uh add Off Iikman was a German Jew named Avner

1116
01:20:06,280 --> 01:20:13,080
Speaker 1: Less who became an Israeli police captain and manipulated the

1117
01:20:13,200 --> 01:20:16,320
Speaker 1: truth a bit to make sure that he would be

1118
01:20:16,360 --> 01:20:20,080
Speaker 1: the one in the interrogation room with Aikman did not

1119
01:20:20,280 --> 01:20:27,280
Speaker 1: disclose that his family was murdered in the Holocaust and

1120
01:20:28,120 --> 01:20:31,040
Speaker 1: managed to get in the room and he interrogated Iikman

1121
01:20:31,200 --> 01:20:36,679
Speaker 1: for two hundred and seventy five hours, and he talked

1122
01:20:36,720 --> 01:20:41,559
Speaker 1: about the experience twenty years after Aikman swung from the

1123
01:20:41,680 --> 01:20:47,640
Speaker 1: rope in Jerusalem, and he said that when he was

1124
01:20:47,840 --> 01:20:52,520
Speaker 1: asked the question did you have a takeaway from the experience.

1125
01:20:54,160 --> 01:20:59,360
Speaker 1: His was that he gave him his faith in democracy,

1126
01:21:00,040 --> 01:21:08,120
Speaker 1: because democracies are what keep you safe. And he's set

1127
01:21:08,120 --> 01:21:14,120
Speaker 1: in a dictatorship of the left or the right. Little

1128
01:21:14,200 --> 01:21:18,639
Speaker 1: Ikeman's turned deadly. And what he specifically said was this,

1129
01:21:19,560 --> 01:21:25,840
Speaker 1: there are add off Ikeman's everywhere. We are surrounded by them.

1130
01:21:25,920 --> 01:21:30,560
Speaker 1: You're safe from them in a democracy, but when that falls,

1131
01:21:30,920 --> 01:21:34,840
Speaker 1: they turned deadly in an instant. And the second story

1132
01:21:34,840 --> 01:21:37,080
Speaker 1: I want to share with everyone and you on the

1133
01:21:37,560 --> 01:21:42,360
Speaker 1: optimism front is something a story that my friend Bishop

1134
01:21:42,400 --> 01:21:49,439
Speaker 1: William Barber told me about that the Save America movement

1135
01:21:49,560 --> 01:21:52,160
Speaker 1: that he is part of, that I am part of.

1136
01:21:52,760 --> 01:21:58,080
Speaker 1: We are advertising geo fencing, communicating directly to ICE, we

1137
01:21:58,160 --> 01:22:03,320
Speaker 1: will lead the counter propaganda campaign against their obscene recruiting,

1138
01:22:03,840 --> 01:22:07,360
Speaker 1: and we are communicating directly to the guards at the

1139
01:22:08,080 --> 01:22:11,720
Speaker 1: concentration camps at the private prisons, saying that there are

1140
01:22:11,840 --> 01:22:16,759
Speaker 1: no safe spaces, there are no hidden corners. Every abuse

1141
01:22:16,800 --> 01:22:19,400
Speaker 1: will be known, you will be held to account for them.

1142
01:22:20,600 --> 01:22:24,679
Speaker 1: History makes makes that clear. Will be deploying the first

1143
01:22:24,800 --> 01:22:28,599
Speaker 1: of the Liberty vans at the end of this month,

1144
01:22:28,680 --> 01:22:33,040
Speaker 1: and they will be outfitted with chaplains with lawyers, with veterans,

1145
01:22:33,280 --> 01:22:38,080
Speaker 1: and with full on camera and sound crews to film

1146
01:22:38,280 --> 01:22:42,280
Speaker 1: and to document and share with the American people, with

1147
01:22:42,360 --> 01:22:46,679
Speaker 1: the communities what's happening. We will use the First Amendment

1148
01:22:46,920 --> 01:22:53,639
Speaker 1: as our shield and our sword at the front edge

1149
01:22:53,840 --> 01:22:59,880
Speaker 1: of a non violent opposition movement that rejects these indecency

1150
01:23:00,320 --> 01:23:05,640
Speaker 1: and these obscenities. And so when you think about what

1151
01:23:05,800 --> 01:23:13,400
Speaker 1: has happened, the drama that has arisen, the terribleness that's descended,

1152
01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:17,280
Speaker 1: I think it's time that everybody appreciate that we have

1153
01:23:17,400 --> 01:23:21,520
Speaker 1: to meet it head on, that we didn't get here overnight,

1154
01:23:22,240 --> 01:23:26,280
Speaker 1: and that we have to have gratitude that if in

1155
01:23:26,400 --> 01:23:29,920
Speaker 1: Thomas Paine's words, that there be trouble, that it be

1156
01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:33,320
Speaker 1: in our time, so that not being our children's, and

1157
01:23:33,360 --> 01:23:36,679
Speaker 1: we should all have gratitude that we get to live

1158
01:23:36,720 --> 01:23:40,920
Speaker 1: in in interesting and interesting days. So at any rate,

1159
01:23:41,880 --> 01:23:47,800
Speaker 1: one of the greatest of all of us was Frederick Douglas.

1160
01:23:47,840 --> 01:23:49,280
Speaker 3: And there have only.

1161
01:23:49,080 --> 01:23:54,080
Speaker 1: Ever been seven hundred million of us, which means there's

1162
01:23:54,120 --> 01:23:56,840
Speaker 1: about half of us who have ever been or alive

1163
01:23:57,080 --> 01:24:05,479
Speaker 1: right now. And so the person who was the most

1164
01:24:05,840 --> 01:24:11,000
Speaker 1: important voice of justice in the United States in the

1165
01:24:11,120 --> 01:24:16,480
Speaker 1: nineteenth century for the cause of emancipation was Frederick Douglass.

1166
01:24:17,840 --> 01:24:20,840
Speaker 1: And we look at a Frederick Douglass, and we look

1167
01:24:20,880 --> 01:24:23,360
Speaker 1: at a Martin Luther King, or we look at a

1168
01:24:23,400 --> 01:24:28,320
Speaker 1: Franklin Roosevelt, or we look at leaders at decisive moments

1169
01:24:28,360 --> 01:24:33,519
Speaker 1: and history in Abraham Lincoln, a Harriet Tubman, and we

1170
01:24:33,800 --> 01:24:41,000
Speaker 1: tend to dehumanize them by taking from them their doubt.

1171
01:24:42,400 --> 01:24:48,640
Speaker 1: And it's that humanity and doubt and their grit and

1172
01:24:48,760 --> 01:25:00,720
Speaker 1: toughness and perseverance that is the element till part of

1173
01:25:00,760 --> 01:25:07,639
Speaker 1: their greatness. And so after the dread Scott decision, which

1174
01:25:07,680 --> 01:25:16,520
Speaker 1: obliterated the humanity of anyone with black skin, the lowest

1175
01:25:16,600 --> 01:25:21,799
Speaker 1: of the lowest moments in the four hundred years of

1176
01:25:22,640 --> 01:25:29,080
Speaker 1: slavery on the North American continent, the dread Scott decision,

1177
01:25:30,200 --> 01:25:37,840
Speaker 1: and Frederick Douglas is in despair and his friends. Sojourner

1178
01:25:38,000 --> 01:25:46,080
Speaker 1: Truth sees this, and Sojourner Truth has a question for

1179
01:25:46,200 --> 01:25:51,880
Speaker 1: her friend that she makes him meet his standards. And

1180
01:25:51,960 --> 01:25:57,919
Speaker 1: Frederick Douglas is a very religious man, and she simply

1181
01:25:58,000 --> 01:26:08,000
Speaker 1: asked him, Frederick is God dead. And Frederick Douglas recognizes

1182
01:26:08,160 --> 01:26:13,400
Speaker 1: instantly that he has been called out, and judges himself

1183
01:26:13,479 --> 01:26:21,000
Speaker 1: guilty of apostasy because he's put his faith in a

1184
01:26:21,080 --> 01:26:29,720
Speaker 1: supreme court, he's put his faith in an institution of

1185
01:26:29,880 --> 01:26:36,320
Speaker 1: men that can be corrupted. And he prepares an address.

1186
01:26:36,400 --> 01:26:40,400
Speaker 1: He doesn't have sub stack, he doesn't have Twitter, so

1187
01:26:40,760 --> 01:26:46,400
Speaker 1: he immediately sets about preparing to go out and to

1188
01:26:46,439 --> 01:26:50,679
Speaker 1: speak on this. And in the first part of Frederick

1189
01:26:50,760 --> 01:26:58,600
Speaker 1: Douglas's speech, he condemns the evil of the dread Scott decision,

1190
01:27:00,280 --> 01:27:05,800
Speaker 1: and we must condemn the evil of the Kavanaugh pinon

1191
01:27:07,360 --> 01:27:14,000
Speaker 1: that establishes a society where the immigrant or the American

1192
01:27:14,120 --> 01:27:18,120
Speaker 1: with brown skin, where the traveler in a free country

1193
01:27:18,200 --> 01:27:26,919
Speaker 1: is demanded papers. Please must condemn that. And Frederick Douglass

1194
01:27:26,960 --> 01:27:31,000
Speaker 1: condemned the dread Scott decision. But then he said, but

1195
01:27:31,160 --> 01:27:34,280
Speaker 1: what if, what if.

1196
01:27:35,880 --> 01:27:36,799
Speaker 3: In a way that.

1197
01:27:36,720 --> 01:27:43,040
Speaker 1: We can't see, we can't comprehend, that that decision is

1198
01:27:43,080 --> 01:27:51,200
Speaker 1: a chain, a link in a necessitous chain of events

1199
01:27:51,920 --> 01:27:58,080
Speaker 1: that is being authored as we speak, beyond our ability

1200
01:27:58,120 --> 01:28:02,280
Speaker 1: to see, beyond the horizon that will bring about the

1201
01:28:02,439 --> 01:28:06,360
Speaker 1: end in the fall of this whole rotten institution in

1202
01:28:06,400 --> 01:28:11,160
Speaker 1: its entirety. And it was gone within eight years time.

1203
01:28:13,200 --> 01:28:18,439
Speaker 1: And so there has never been a serene period. We

1204
01:28:18,520 --> 01:28:23,400
Speaker 1: certainly don't live in one, and I hope everybody who

1205
01:28:23,479 --> 01:28:28,160
Speaker 1: is with us today can appreciate being a good American

1206
01:28:29,439 --> 01:28:34,559
Speaker 1: does not mean believing in the dogma of a political party.

1207
01:28:35,080 --> 01:28:37,879
Speaker 1: It means believing in a faith of freedom and liberty

1208
01:28:37,920 --> 01:28:40,880
Speaker 1: and in the Constitution of the United States. And this

1209
01:28:41,000 --> 01:28:45,200
Speaker 1: is a season where your patriotism has called for. Thank you, everybody,

1210
01:28:45,200 --> 01:28:46,639
Speaker 1: Madam Secretary, thank.

1211
01:28:46,479 --> 01:28:48,040
Speaker 2: You, Thank you so much.

1212
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:52,240
Speaker 1: Steve, I'm Steve Schmidt. This is the warning. I invite

1213
01:28:52,280 --> 01:28:55,719
Speaker 1: you to join this community, where I promise to be honest,

1214
01:28:56,000 --> 01:28:59,519
Speaker 1: blunt and direct about what is happening in this country.

1215
01:29:00,000 --> 01:29:04,160
Speaker 1: America is in crisis. Follow and subscribe to this channel

1216
01:29:04,280 --> 01:29:05,280
Speaker 1: and on substack.

1217
01:29:05,520 --> 01:29:05,880
Speaker 3: Thank you.