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Speaker 1: On the cast. The questions asked if movies have women

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Speaker 1: and um are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands

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Speaker 1: or do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef in best

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Speaker 1: start changing it with the Betel Cast. Jamie, can I

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Speaker 1: have a simple favor to ask of you? Oh? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: for sure? Oh yeah, for sure? Yeah, okay, for sure,

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Speaker 1: for sure. Sorry, that's why, Anna Kendrick, Oh for sure.

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Speaker 1: It's really good. Will you help me record an episode

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Speaker 1: of the Becktel Cast so the Yeah, it's totally fine.

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Speaker 1: I'm happy to do it. And it's actually I'm going

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Speaker 1: to actually tweet about it right now. That's totally fine,

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Speaker 1: and I would I would be thrilled. Do you want

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Speaker 1: to be friends? I haven't had an alcoholic beverage in years. Great,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much, because we need to do that

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Speaker 1: so that our listeners will be distracted when I commit murder.

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Speaker 1: Oh for sure. Do you want to take karaoke? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I guess I had sex with my brother there. What

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Speaker 1: a fun movie we're talking about today. I think that

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Speaker 1: that intro about as well as it could. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: I don't even know if I was like unintentionally doing

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Speaker 1: a Blake Lively impression. But I feel like I kind

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Speaker 1: of nailed it regardless. Oh yeah, I could like sense

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Speaker 1: your elegant coat across the zoom call her outfits, her

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Speaker 1: outfits in this movie. Good Lord, soul, good truly. Well.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bechtel Cast. My name is Jamie Loftus.

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Speaker 1: My name is Caitlin Darante and this is our show.

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Speaker 1: What if my name is actually Hope or Faith? Which one?

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Speaker 1: I don't know? Charity's many Charity, there's yeah, this root

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Speaker 1: might be Claudia Secret. I could, yeah, there was. At

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Speaker 1: some point, I'm like, this is we gotta pare it down.

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Speaker 1: I'm getting confused. But this is our show where we

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Speaker 1: examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens, using the Bechtel

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Speaker 1: Test as a jumping off point, which is a media

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Speaker 1: metric created by queer cartoonist Alison Bechtel. There are many

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Speaker 1: variations of the test. The one that we are using

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Speaker 1: is the test requires that two people of a marginalized

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Speaker 1: gender must have names and speak to each other about

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Speaker 1: something other than a man for a two line exchange

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Speaker 1: of dialogue, ideally more than that, and hopefully that exchange

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Speaker 1: is narratively meaningful. Today we're not going to have many problems. No, no,

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Speaker 1: we're not. No need to get into the weeds. Which

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Speaker 1: is interesting because we are on a as we're just

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Speaker 1: discussing off Mike, we're on a bit of a noir

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Speaker 1: kick right now. And the first noir we covered, uh,

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Speaker 1: we had a lot of trouble, uh finding two women

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Speaker 1: at all and getting it in the same room. You know,

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Speaker 1: So you know what a difference almost eighty years may Yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: So today's movie is a simple favor, and we have

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Speaker 1: a magnificent guest joining us to discuss. She is a

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Speaker 1: writer and culture critic. It's Kate Young. Welcome, thanks for

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Speaker 1: having me. I'm so excited. We're so excited to have

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Speaker 1: It's been a long time coming. We're thrilled to have you,

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Speaker 1: and we're really excited you brought us this movie. It's

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Speaker 1: been a long time request. Since it came out, people

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Speaker 1: have been yammering on about how we need to cover

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Speaker 1: this movie. Sorry Kayle to hate star listeners. I mean

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Speaker 1: I understand why, Like this is the movie that turned

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Speaker 1: me around, like lively, Like I think the first time

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Speaker 1: I watched it, I think I watched like a bootleg

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Speaker 1: on my laptop, and I was like, this is incredible,

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Speaker 1: and I've seen it like five million times since then. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so you're I was just we're just about to ask

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Speaker 1: about your relationship with the movie. You're a fan. It's

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Speaker 1: funnily now. It came out the same yeah, that I

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Speaker 1: started listening to this podcast, and I was going to

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Speaker 1: the New York Film Festival for the first time, and

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Speaker 1: I was staying with a cousin in I think, like

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Speaker 1: harl M and I wasn't doing anything except like going

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Speaker 1: to screenings and like watching TV on my laptop. I

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Speaker 1: mean that was like the same year that like the

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Speaker 1: first season of You was on Lifetime and no one

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Speaker 1: was watching I'm cooler than everyone, but um it had

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Speaker 1: come out, and I was just like, I don't really

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Speaker 1: want to like figure out like a movie theem I like,

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Speaker 1: you know secret and know all the bootleg sites. So

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Speaker 1: I found a video and I watched it because I've

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Speaker 1: been hearing such great things about it, and I was like,

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Speaker 1: there's no way, like the Life is not a particularly

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Speaker 1: strong actress, there's no way this movie is good. And

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Speaker 1: I watched it and I was like, this is the

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Speaker 1: best thing I've ever seen in my life. Clearly like

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Speaker 1: someone on her team has like figured out what her

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Speaker 1: sweet spot is and like put her exactly in it,

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Speaker 1: like they know how to find her, like just that

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Speaker 1: specific kind of like b movie plot that is going

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Speaker 1: to play to her strengths. Like it's been a long

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Speaker 1: standing like pet peeve of my ye that like she

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Speaker 1: was a breakout star of Gossip Girl because rude, but this,

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Speaker 1: I feel like this is the first thing that she's done.

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Speaker 1: It's like kind of justified it. Like I really really

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Speaker 1: love this movie. She is on the star. She completely

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Speaker 1: makes it worth it. Like I don't think that anyone

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Speaker 1: else could have done it the same way that she did.

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Speaker 1: I totally agree. I was. I guess. I guess I

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Speaker 1: never really thought about I I didn't watch Gossip Girls

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Speaker 1: it was coming out, um, which I don't know if

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Speaker 1: I regret that or not, because I started to watch

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Speaker 1: it for the first time over the summer and I

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Speaker 1: was like, um, okay, interesting, interesting. I got to the

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Speaker 1: Hillary Duff season and then I had to stop. That's gnarly. Now.

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Speaker 1: That was a very specific moment in time. You had

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Speaker 1: to be seventeen to appreciate it. Got Hillary Duff in

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Speaker 1: like fourteen Infinity scrves at once. I was like, this

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Speaker 1: is a lot. I need to I need to slow.

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Speaker 1: We're just we're just having three since with Vanessa. Well,

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Speaker 1: I gotta watch this show. I guess it's pretty I mean,

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Speaker 1: if you want to see everything happened, then this is

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Speaker 1: the show to see it happen on. UM. But I

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Speaker 1: I always associate her with Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants.

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Speaker 1: Oh right, that is the one other thing I've seen

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Speaker 1: her in. I think that that was like maybe her

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Speaker 1: first thing, or like close to her first thing. I

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Speaker 1: think so. Yeah, So I I always had pleasant associations

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Speaker 1: with her because I was a pants head. I don't

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Speaker 1: know what they're on that fandom. I was twelve. I

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Speaker 1: liked it. Jamie, had you seen this movie before? What's

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Speaker 1: your relationship with it? I had? I saw it, um.

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Speaker 1: I didn't see it in theaters. I think I saw

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Speaker 1: it maybe the year after it came out. Someone sat

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Speaker 1: me down and maybe watch it, and I really really

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Speaker 1: enjoyed it, um, which I was kind of surprised that

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Speaker 1: I enjoyed it because I wasn't a particularly big fan

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Speaker 1: of Blake Lively or Anna Kendrick. I think just because

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Speaker 1: I am theater kid resistant to some degree and so

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Speaker 1: but but like you're saying, Kate, this movie actually turned

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Speaker 1: me around pretty significantly on both of them, be because

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Speaker 1: and and also I mean, I'm always thrilled to see

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Speaker 1: Henry Golding and so that was a treat. And then

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Speaker 1: there's also like so many fun comics in this movie too,

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Speaker 1: like a part in Intrelo is in it, Patty Harrison

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Speaker 1: is in it. Like there's a fun supporting cast too.

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Speaker 1: I liked this movie, and I was really especially after

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Speaker 1: we had just done uh like classic noar. I was

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Speaker 1: excited to go into like a very smart and funny

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Speaker 1: modern noir. And I mean that's start to talk. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think I mostly just have like questions about this movie,

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Speaker 1: but I'm excited to talk about it with y'all. Caitlin

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Speaker 1: went your history with this movie. I had not seen it. Oh.

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Speaker 1: I remember all the buzz around it when it came out,

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Speaker 1: and I had every intention of seeing it, but I

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Speaker 1: just like never got around to it, and it kept

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Speaker 1: slipping further and further down my list, and then I

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Speaker 1: just never saw it. But I like, I'm glad that

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Speaker 1: we're doing this episode to like have given me the

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Speaker 1: excuse to have seen it because it was a very

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Speaker 1: interesting and challenging watch for me. I don't know what

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Speaker 1: to make of this movie, and I'm going to need

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Speaker 1: both of your help. I have a lot of thoughts

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Speaker 1: about it. Yeah, I am very I don't know. It

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Speaker 1: was just I'm not really sure what the intention of

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Speaker 1: the movie is because it seems like it's asking the

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Speaker 1: audience to empathize with Anna kendricks character by the end.

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Speaker 1: But I'm like, but I don't, so, so what's what? Yeah? No,

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Speaker 1: I uh. I also resent being asked to relate with

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Speaker 1: Anna Kendrick. I was. I was thinking about this today

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Speaker 1: because I was eating a tuna sandwich in public, and

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Speaker 1: I'm like, Ana Kendrick wouldn't do this, and I'm supposed

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Speaker 1: to relate. I'm supposed to relate. I can I just

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Speaker 1: have theater kid prejudice. It's fine. I like that she

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Speaker 1: brings it's been because I didn't get that at all. Like,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I don't dislike her by the end of

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Speaker 1: the movie, but I like she's not person that I

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Speaker 1: gravitated towards. And I did not get the sense that

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Speaker 1: the movie wants us to be on her side or

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Speaker 1: to like her the best at all. That wasn't. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but like certain narrative and cinematic choices that are made

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Speaker 1: makes me think that the movie is sort of asking

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Speaker 1: that of you. But maybe maybe not, Maybe I'm just

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Speaker 1: like misinterpreting. I don't, I don't know, but yeah, I'm

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Speaker 1: excited to talk about that further. Yeah, I guess I

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Speaker 1: wasn't really sure. I guess you would assume that you're

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Speaker 1: trying to connect with Anna Kendrick harder than Lively. But

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Speaker 1: even so, like that didn't take me out of it.

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Speaker 1: I was just like, these women are all over the place.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, um well let's should we get into it? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: let's get into it. I will attempt to recap this

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Speaker 1: very complicated movie. So we open on Stephanie. That's Ana

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Speaker 1: Kendrick recording her vlog, which is directed at mom's. It

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Speaker 1: might even be called like him M god, I love

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Speaker 1: I do like the vlogger commentary. I feel like, especially

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Speaker 1: like I'm sure it will seem dated very soon and

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Speaker 1: already a little bit. I'm like, oh, this old interface interesting.

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Speaker 1: But Anna Kendrick is the perfect I mean, you could

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Speaker 1: so see easily see her like pivoting to lifestyle content,

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Speaker 1: and she's like one flop away from a lifestyle content

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Speaker 1: career at any given moment anyways, And I say that

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Speaker 1: with love, but like she she's got it, She's got

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Speaker 1: the cadence. So I love that her name and like

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Speaker 1: her character's name is literally Stephanie's mother is, which is

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Speaker 1: like her whole deal. I did appreciate that. So in

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Speaker 1: her vlog she mentions the disappearance of her best friend Emily,

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Speaker 1: who has at this point been missing for five days.

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Speaker 1: Then we flash back to Stephanie and Emily played by

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Speaker 1: Black Lively, meeting for the first time. Their sons go

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Speaker 1: to school together. Stephanie is a stay at home mom.

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Speaker 1: Her whole thing is that she's this like super mom.

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Speaker 1: Her flog is all about like recipes and how to

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Speaker 1: make all these like cool. It's lively. It's mommy blogging, lifestyle, clicky,

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Speaker 1: crafty food. And I think, Okay, I don't know if

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Speaker 1: you have any knowledge on this, because I have occasionally

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Speaker 1: gone down the mom mommy's vlogging from home hole, but

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Speaker 1: I feel like this movie was maybe a little early,

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Speaker 1: like in a good way early to mommy blogs pivoting

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Speaker 1: to true crime, which is definitely benefiting. I feel like,

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Speaker 1: especially in Lockdown, so many people pivoted to true crime.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, just because I'm not a true crime person,

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Speaker 1: so I'm not super tapped into like what those people

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Speaker 1: are doing. I know, as is your rights, I know.

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Speaker 1: I'm just like, I'm like, just give me like podcasts

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Speaker 1: about movies, like I don't want to hear about murdered woman.

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Speaker 1: That's not fun. Same. I went through like a two

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Speaker 1: week phase in Lockdown. I went I mean everyone went

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Speaker 1: through five two week phases in locked Down, but where

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Speaker 1: I someone Someone came into my algorithm and then I

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Speaker 1: just let her hang around for a while. Her name

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Speaker 1: was Stephanie, and she was doing this these really long

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Speaker 1: vlogs called like Coffee and true Crime, and it was like,

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Speaker 1: oh and and they videos have millions of views. She

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Speaker 1: was basically doing Ana Kendrick cosplay goodness. So Stephanie is

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Speaker 1: this super mom. Her son's name is Miles. She's also

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Speaker 1: kind of like a goody two shoes, which is in

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Speaker 1: stark contrast to Emily. She has a very high power,

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Speaker 1: high stress job. She's very elegant and high class, but

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Speaker 1: she's also very crass and abrasive. Her son's name is Nikki.

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Speaker 1: Their sons want to have a play date, so Emily

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Speaker 1: reluctantly invites Stephanie and Miles over to her amazing fancy house.

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Speaker 1: They all live in Connecticut in one of the suburbs

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Speaker 1: of New York City. Ever heard of it? And then,

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Speaker 1: like the other parents, including one played by a friend

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Speaker 1: of the cast, a partner, Matla, they comment on how

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Speaker 1: Stephanie and Emily like have nothing in common. They're like,

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Speaker 1: what are they even going to talk about? But Emily

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Speaker 1: and Stephanie get to know each other. Emily mentions her

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Speaker 1: husband Sean, who is a writer who wrote a book

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Speaker 1: like ten years ago. Who is Henry Golding? Yes, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he shows up its own point and it's Henry Golding.

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Speaker 1: He's in Um, He's in Paul Fige's movie after this, right,

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Speaker 1: the Christmas movie Last Christmas. Yes, but I don't think

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Speaker 1: that's a Paul Fige movie. Maybe Paul fig just produced

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Speaker 1: it or something. That was one of the worst movies

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Speaker 1: I've ever seen in my entire life. By the way, No,

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Speaker 1: he did direct Last Christmas. He did. He did, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I was feeling out. No, he he did the

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Speaker 1: end it also, and that movie also has a very

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Speaker 1: chaotic series of claussmists that happened very very close to

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Speaker 1: other It's just less satisfying in that one. But Henry

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Speaker 1: Golding us in a row, Paul Fie, it's a whole genre. Incredible.

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Speaker 1: It's it's Leo DiCaprio being submerged in water in his

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Speaker 1: clothes all over again. Remember that. Yeah, Oh my god,

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Speaker 1: what an exciting day for us when we were I

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Speaker 1: think I was like in a cabin in the middle

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Speaker 1: of the woods and we were just screaming at each

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Speaker 1: other over a poor Internet connection. Like it's all coming together.

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Speaker 1: What a normal time. Okay, So we meet Sean. He

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Speaker 1: is a writer. He wrote a book like ten years

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Speaker 1: ago that Stephanie has read and really liked. We learned

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Speaker 1: that Stephanie's husband and brother died in a car accident,

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Speaker 1: so she's a single mom now. Then one day Emily

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Speaker 1: asks Stephanie if she can pick up her son Nicki

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Speaker 1: and look after him until Emily gets home from work,

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Speaker 1: and then she does. They hang out again. They drink

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Speaker 1: Martini use they're loose, and they tell each other some secrets.

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Speaker 1: Stephanie reveals that after her father passed away, when she

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Speaker 1: was eighteen years old, she met her half brother that

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Speaker 1: she never knew that she had, and then she reveals

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Speaker 1: that she had sex with him. See this is where

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Speaker 1: I do connect with Anna kendricks character, and not in

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Speaker 1: the way but car to clarify that the years where

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Speaker 1: I felt like representation mattered. No, I okay, very with you,

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Speaker 1: but the whole like the dynamic and it's like, obviously

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Speaker 1: very exaggerated because it's a noir and Anna Kendricks in

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Speaker 1: the scene, so it's inherent I'm being so mean to her,

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Speaker 1: but um, but the whole idea of like making a

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Speaker 1: new friend who's a woman and being really swept up

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Speaker 1: and like taken into a friendship and like immediately oversharing

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Speaker 1: to an absurd degree and then having that be a

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Speaker 1: problem later. I had this problem before it revised me

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Speaker 1: of like getting drunk in the park with a new

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Speaker 1: friend and then being like, do you want to know

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Speaker 1: the worst thing that's ever happened to me? And they're like, yes,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I love intense friendships, but they're scary. Yes,

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Speaker 1: that aspect of her character is relatable. Yeah, I like it.

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Speaker 1: Others not so much. But when Emily, you mean When

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Speaker 1: Emily learns this, she's like, oh my god, you brother fucker,

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Speaker 1: which she says a million times throughout the movie, and

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Speaker 1: she seems to revel in this juicy gossip. Yeah. Not

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Speaker 1: long after this, Emily asks Stephanie to do her another

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Speaker 1: simple favor. She needs Stephanie to pick Nikki up from

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Speaker 1: school again until Emily gets home, except Emily never comes

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Speaker 1: home that night. Stephanie calls Emily's office and learns that

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Speaker 1: Emily is in Miami for a few days. Sean is

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Speaker 1: meanwhile overseas, but he comes back a couple of days later.

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Speaker 1: He picks up Nikki, but there's still no word from Emily,

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Speaker 1: so they decide to call the police, who start investigating

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Speaker 1: Emily being missing. Stephanie also goes to Emily's office to

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Speaker 1: do some digging. She finds an unflattering photo of Emily,

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Speaker 1: which she then posts around town as a missing person's flyer,

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Speaker 1: which is not me which to be fed to her.

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Speaker 1: It's because she doesn't have any other photos of her

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Speaker 1: because Emily is very secretive about the fact that she

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Speaker 1: is in hiding, which we don't know yet, but like

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Speaker 1: won't let her take her photo exactly. Yes, is that

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Speaker 1: a smart thing to do is like have someone in

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Speaker 1: your life that's like, if I ever go missing, please

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Speaker 1: use this picture. Yeah, I'm going to email all my

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Speaker 1: friends be like I approved this image of me. I

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Speaker 1: startally have very bad I mean, it seems suspicious to do.

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Speaker 1: It seems like you're about to disappear yourself. But I

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Speaker 1: do think that there. I don't know. I think I

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Speaker 1: just historically no one is ever picking a picture of

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Speaker 1: me that I want them to. Yeah, I mean on

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Speaker 1: the upside, well, I guess on the downside, if you're missing,

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Speaker 1: you're probably dead, so you won't care. That's true love

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Speaker 1: wringing my hands in the afterlife, being like, um, no,

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Speaker 1: wonder they didn't find me. I'm much cute in that

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Speaker 1: I did set my cousin to take over my Facebook

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Speaker 1: account if I die. So, oh wait, is that something

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Speaker 1: you can do? Yeah? Interesting. Yeah, it's like they like

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Speaker 1: they get access to it and they can memorialize it

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Speaker 1: and like confirm that your dad and like get over

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Speaker 1: your pathwords and let all your ship if you need

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Speaker 1: them to. Huh. Yeah, that's we're in the future, aren't we. Fun?

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Speaker 1: Morbid talk on the cast today. So much for not

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Speaker 1: liking dead women anyway. Okay, so they've posted the flow fire.

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Speaker 1: They find out that Emily rented a Kia from an

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Speaker 1: airport that the police are trying to track, and then

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Speaker 1: a fan of Stephanie's vlog thinks she spotted Emily in Michigan,

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Speaker 1: so they have kind of like a lead now. Also,

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Speaker 1: by the way, with Emily gone, Stephanie and Sean have

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Speaker 1: started to connect a bit more. They're getting closer, such

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Speaker 1: as like Stephanie is like coming over and like cooking

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Speaker 1: dinner for Sean and the kids. She makes a lot

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Speaker 1: of very weird choices. Yeah, she really takes a turn.

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Speaker 1: Then Emily's body is found in a lake in Michigan,

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Speaker 1: apparently she had drowned, and Stephanie and Sean mourn the

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Speaker 1: loss of Emily, and then immediately after that they have

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Speaker 1: sex with each other. We all grieve differently, you know.

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Speaker 1: I was like I was gonna say, I was like,

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Speaker 1: there's no one the wrong way to grieve, And if

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Speaker 1: you're grieving involves having sex with Henry Golding, you could

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Speaker 1: do work. You've unlocked a new level of grieving. Um.

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Speaker 1: One day, not long after this, Detective Somerville shows up

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Speaker 1: and informs Stephanie that Emily had heroin in her system

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Speaker 1: when she died, and that Sean took out a four

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Speaker 1: million dollar life insurance policy on Emily before she disappeared,

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Speaker 1: So all of this seems very suspicious, and also the

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Speaker 1: audience is kind of wondering at this point if Stephanie

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Speaker 1: had something to do with Emily's disappearance, because she's acting

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Speaker 1: a bit erratic, But either way, Stephanie starts to do

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Speaker 1: some more digging and she and Sean keep getting closer.

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Speaker 1: He asks her to move in with him. They tell

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Speaker 1: each other that they love each other. But then one day,

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Speaker 1: Nikki mentions that he saw his mom, that she had

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Speaker 1: come around to the playground at school, and there seemed

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Speaker 1: to be other hints that maybe Emily isn't actually dead

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Speaker 1: after all, including what appears to be Emily blackmailing Stephanie

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Speaker 1: with the information that Stephanie had sex with her brother

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Speaker 1: and that's why you don't get too drunk on the

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Speaker 1: first friend date. And then Emily still being alive is

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Speaker 1: confirmed when she calls Stephanie on the phone. Emily knows

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Speaker 1: that Stephanie Sean have like been having sex and that

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Speaker 1: they're in a relationship. So now Stephanie is suspecting that

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Speaker 1: Emily and Sean are working together to try to funck

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Speaker 1: over Stephanie somehow. This is also around the time that

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Speaker 1: we get a flashback where Stephanie and Emily kiss. Then

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Speaker 1: we learn of a relationship, a former relation ship that

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Speaker 1: Stephanie had with a woman named Diana Highland played by

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Speaker 1: Linda Cardellini, who had painted a number of nude portraits

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Speaker 1: of Emily, except when Stephanie goes to her to like

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Speaker 1: get some information, Diana is like, her name isn't Emily,

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Speaker 1: her name is Claudia, and they had kind of a

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Speaker 1: weird relationship where Emily had taken a lot of money

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Speaker 1: from Diana. And then also there is this like summer

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Speaker 1: camp sweatshirt that is a clue that Emily might be

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Speaker 1: from Michigan. So then Stephanie goes to Michigan to this

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Speaker 1: summer camp, which leads to Emily's parents house. We meet

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Speaker 1: Emily's mom, who was played by Jean Smart. Also around

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Speaker 1: this time, Stephanie learns that Emily had a twin sister

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Speaker 1: and that their real names are Hope and Faith. So

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Speaker 1: Emily reappears and links up with Sean and he's all like,

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Speaker 1: what the hell? I always find it. I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: fun to watch, but I'm like the fact that Stephanie

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Speaker 1: continues to vlog through this experience of like it feels

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Speaker 1: like we're leaving a lot of evidence like on I mean,

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Speaker 1: not that people don't do that on on their vlogs.

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Speaker 1: They do constantly, but it's it's just like she's really

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Speaker 1: she's really laying it on thick end the vlogs I liked.

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Speaker 1: I mean that is like one of the I feel

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Speaker 1: like stronger cool like themes through this movie that modernizes

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Speaker 1: it is that like Stephanie is genuinely like getting something

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Speaker 1: out of this trauma that is basically unrelated to her.

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Speaker 1: She's like building like like we've seen unfortunately, like a

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Speaker 1: lot of creators build themselves up based on the trauma

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Speaker 1: of others. And it's like to some extent, I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's also it is also happening to her, um, but

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Speaker 1: it's just like, oh, yeah, this is actually something that

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Speaker 1: happens in the world. Yeah, she's like a exploiting her

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Speaker 1: friend's disappearance to get more followers. She's leaning in, she's

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Speaker 1: going for it. Well, I mean they're best friends. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they only met like three times, but they're best friends.

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Speaker 1: How I was trying to figure out what the how

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Speaker 1: many times have they hung out before Emily disappears, because

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Speaker 1: it seems like it might have been like four or

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Speaker 1: five times. I think so because I think like the

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Speaker 1: first time is I think when she tells her about

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Speaker 1: the brother bucking and she meets Henry Golding. Um, there's

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Speaker 1: the flashback scene. I don't know, those are two different times. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: those are two different times, So that's at least twice.

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Speaker 1: The great Fard scene is after she disappears, so that

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Speaker 1: doesn't count. And there's the one where they kiss, so

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Speaker 1: and I think that's a separate time, so that's at

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Speaker 1: least three times. It's at least three times, and that

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Speaker 1: might be it. Yeah, but Stephanie keeps being like we're

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Speaker 1: best friends, and I'm not sure how much of that

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Speaker 1: is like Stephanie not having much of awareness. I think

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Speaker 1: it's a word. Its like in the end when they

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Speaker 1: pull this like big Gabbit, Stephanie says something to the

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Speaker 1: fact of like you're not just saying that, but like

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Speaker 1: you we really are best friends because I thought it

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Speaker 1: was just me And then like goes yes, of course,

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Speaker 1: Like I you know, I was feeling into and then

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Speaker 1: she shoots are So it's like, I think that that

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Speaker 1: was really fun for me, just because it's like in

424
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:28,360
Speaker 1: the same way that you guys are, like, she's doing

425
00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:30,800
Speaker 1: a lot. I feel like that isn't like a feeling

426
00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 1: that a lot of people have. That's very common to

427
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:35,680
Speaker 1: female friendships, where it's like am I coming on to strong?

428
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:37,360
Speaker 1: Do I like them enough? Do they like me enough?

429
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 1: Like is this reciprocated? And like how to kind of

430
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:45,800
Speaker 1: navigate that, especially given the like queer overtones for the

431
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:49,719
Speaker 1: whole thing. It's really fun. Yeah, it is. Yeah, Okay,

432
00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 1: So Emily reappears. She meets up with Sean and a restaurant.

433
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:59,440
Speaker 1: He's all like, what the hell during this little hat? Yeah,

434
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,960
Speaker 1: she's like very incognito. She's wearing sunglasses. Why was I

435
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: so in love with her when she was wearing that hat?

436
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 1: I was like, she's been so mean and she's wearing

437
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 1: a hat. I love it. Sean is like, what the hell?

438
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 1: I thought you were dead? And she's like, well, I

439
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:17,960
Speaker 1: faked my death to collect the four million dollars. Keep up, John,

440
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: but Stephanie keeps meddling in this whole situation and tells

441
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:28,439
Speaker 1: the insurance people that maybe the body they found is

442
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:34,399
Speaker 1: Emily's twin sister, that she's discovered that she had um.

443
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:38,680
Speaker 1: So then suddenly Stephanie and Emily meet up at Emily's

444
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:44,080
Speaker 1: grave site, but wearing good outfits yet again. But I'm like,

445
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,679
Speaker 1: how did they? I want to know what happened to

446
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:52,720
Speaker 1: like arrange this meet up? But anyway, there, oh was it?

447
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:55,480
Speaker 1: Did she say like, I'm going to the grave. So

448
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 1: she was like, I think there's the one where she

449
00:26:57,640 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 1: was like, I'm going to go toast in your memory

450
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 1: or something like that. Okay, yeah, right, got it? Yeah,

451
00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:05,479
Speaker 1: because the flox slowly just become like it's she's cloud chasing,

452
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:12,359
Speaker 1: but she's also like, yeah, just talking the lively. Yeah. Okay.

453
00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 1: So we find out that Hope, which is Emily's real name,

454
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:19,720
Speaker 1: and her twin sister, Faith, had burned down part of

455
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,639
Speaker 1: their parents house and had killed their father when they

456
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:26,440
Speaker 1: were teenagers because their father was abusive, and then after

457
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,160
Speaker 1: that they flee in part ways and they don't see

458
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 1: each other for years and years, the two sisters until

459
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 1: recently when they meet up. But Emily's sister is an addict.

460
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:43,640
Speaker 1: She needs money. She's trying to blackmail Emily, so Emily

461
00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:47,639
Speaker 1: drowned her in the lake. Uh, and that's whose body

462
00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:51,000
Speaker 1: they find. But Emily tells Stephanie that the drowning was

463
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:55,240
Speaker 1: a suicide and that Sean was in on this plan

464
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:58,040
Speaker 1: from the beginning and that they were just using Stephanie

465
00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:01,720
Speaker 1: to like take care of their song on until they

466
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:05,439
Speaker 1: were able to just like the insurance What a what

467
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:07,679
Speaker 1: a long what a what a long con? What a

468
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 1: risky long con to be like, oh, we just needed

469
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,000
Speaker 1: to exploit your labor, which is like there's that bit

470
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 1: in the middle where Andreronald's like, it's like, oh, you're

471
00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: you took on the nanny position and she's like, no,

472
00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:20,119
Speaker 1: we're friends. And then when she leaves, she goes she

473
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:25,440
Speaker 1: doesn't know she's freaking for free, right. I love that

474
00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:29,159
Speaker 1: I forgot he was in this movie. Okay, so Emily

475
00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:32,600
Speaker 1: reveals all this stuff to Stephanie. But because Stephanie has

476
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:37,680
Speaker 1: like meddled in the whole insurance collecting thing, now everyone's

477
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 1: kind of like at an impass where they like don't

478
00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: no one really knows what to do. So then Stephanie

479
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: goes to Sean and Emily's house, Stephanie fake shoots Sean

480
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,760
Speaker 1: and and so doing tries to trick Emily into confessing

481
00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:56,720
Speaker 1: to the murder of her sister, but Emily won't be

482
00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 1: so easily duped, and she actually shoots her husband Sean.

483
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,280
Speaker 1: But it turns out that Stephanie was secretly live streaming

484
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 1: the whole thing on her vlog, her tiny nanny Cam

485
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:12,880
Speaker 1: ty nanny Cam. Her vlog has gotten We've seen it

486
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:17,080
Speaker 1: like growing popularity throughout the movie, and so everyone was

487
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 1: watching Emily shoot her husband. So she gets arrested. Then

488
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 1: we get some text at the end that says that

489
00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:34,000
Speaker 1: Stephanie's vlog was purchased by like a huge like publishing. Yeah,

490
00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:37,720
Speaker 1: and she also takes on cold cases, so now she's

491
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,800
Speaker 1: like a private eye kind of thing. Sean and his

492
00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:47,120
Speaker 1: son Nikki are doing fine, and Sean moved to California

493
00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:49,719
Speaker 1: and is now the head of the lit department at

494
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 1: UC Berkeley wrote a second book, yeah, which is so funny.

495
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 1: And then Emily is serving a twenty year prison sentence

496
00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 1: and has adjusted to prison life very well. And that

497
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 1: is the end of the movie. So let's take a

498
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 1: quick break and we'll come back to discuss and we're

499
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:24,720
Speaker 1: back where shall we start here? Where we want to start?

500
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 1: When we should just pick something out of a hat.

501
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 1: At this point, there's something to do. There's truly we've

502
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 1: we've we've got some ship to talk about. Um. I mean,

503
00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:35,120
Speaker 1: I feel like we should just like start with the

504
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: costumes because I feel like that's such such a big draw. Um.

505
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously the main focus in terms of like

506
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,480
Speaker 1: the visually striking costumes are with Emily and like Lively,

507
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:48,120
Speaker 1: and it was definitely a big draw to me. I

508
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:54,719
Speaker 1: think that was part of what drew me into that

509
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 1: character specifically, and part of why I don't think we're

510
00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 1: supposed to like Stephanie that much, because I feel like

511
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 1: it's it's like the same issue that I had with

512
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:04,640
Speaker 1: like what is it Mrs American Hulu or whatever that

513
00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:07,040
Speaker 1: came last year, Like you don't give me like a

514
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:09,239
Speaker 1: super offend diva and like great costumes and then tell

515
00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:15,000
Speaker 1: me to root against her. Doesn't work that way, right, um? So,

516
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 1: So I love I loved all of the suits and

517
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,560
Speaker 1: like how stylish they are and like the way that

518
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:22,080
Speaker 1: they were able to kind of construct these like really

519
00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 1: feminine lines with like traditionally male attire. But I also

520
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:30,440
Speaker 1: really liked how they were able to kind of contrast

521
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 1: that with these this like two sections of her life

522
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 1: because she's in these suits when she's like dealing with Emily,

523
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 1: and that's kind of not with Emily with Stephanie, and

524
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:40,480
Speaker 1: that's part of my Stephanie is like so enamored with

525
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 1: her and think she's so cool that wants to be

526
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 1: her best friend, because like, obviously so do I. But

527
00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 1: but like she's not dressed like that when she finally

528
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:50,320
Speaker 1: meets up with this sister before she kills her, or

529
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 1: like when she meets up with the husband to tell

530
00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: him that she's still alive, or even at the very

531
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:57,360
Speaker 1: end when they're doing this big gambit, Like there's such

532
00:31:57,360 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 1: a huge contrast between the suits she wears in the

533
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 1: beginning of the film and like this like fifties housewive

534
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 1: get up that she has on when she's turned up

535
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 1: and told them that her husband tried to murder her.

536
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 1: Because she's essentially doing like white woman in Peril cosplay

537
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:15,160
Speaker 1: like very effectively, and like the knowledge that she has

538
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:19,680
Speaker 1: of like how to kind of I'm not sure that

539
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:23,320
Speaker 1: manipulate is the right way, but to like situate herself

540
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:28,400
Speaker 1: in relation to other people, Like she is nearly always overdressed,

541
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:32,200
Speaker 1: like in every scene, and it still doesn't feel like

542
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:35,479
Speaker 1: out of place. And I know, for me, like what

543
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 1: I thought was really fun is that I think it's

544
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 1: the first time that Stephanie comes over where the boys

545
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 1: are there. She's making her and meet Martini, and she

546
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 1: starts undressing and like pulling the pieces of the suit apart,

547
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:47,160
Speaker 1: and you realize that it's not at all actually it's

548
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 1: just pieces put together to look like a suit, and

549
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,680
Speaker 1: so it's like a metaphor for her whole life. It's

550
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 1: like this big, fancy, beautiful thing, but it's really just

551
00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,360
Speaker 1: like a trick meant to confuse you. And I really

552
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,720
Speaker 1: enjoy that aspect of it a lot, because I felt

553
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 1: like she has so much like swagger, and I feel

554
00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 1: like I don't know how to expand I keep trying

555
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 1: to tell people, like like I I have decided for

556
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 1: myself that like eye contact is gay, but there's not

557
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 1: actually a ton of it in this movie. But she

558
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 1: does have like a very she does have like a

559
00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: very masculine sagger, which I find very attractive, and that's

560
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:25,560
Speaker 1: like aided by the costuming um and the walking stick

561
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 1: that she uses for some reason later in the film,

562
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 1: which she apparently stole from Paul Feek, like on the

563
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:34,680
Speaker 1: day of the shoot. Yeah, it's his. I think she's

564
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:36,760
Speaker 1: doing some interview and she was like, I just decided

565
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 1: I wanted it. I asked him for it and he

566
00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:41,280
Speaker 1: told me fine. And I really love that I And

567
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,240
Speaker 1: I like that it's like something that she's very aware

568
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:45,760
Speaker 1: of because I think once we get through the plot

569
00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 1: and we deal with like the Linda Carline character and everything, like,

570
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:50,000
Speaker 1: it becomes very clear that she's a person who's like

571
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:52,800
Speaker 1: reinvented herself a lot, and like this is just the

572
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 1: latest iteration of that this is the persona that suits

573
00:33:56,440 --> 00:34:01,080
Speaker 1: her current life. Yeah, I totally agree. And that's like

574
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:05,320
Speaker 1: better put than I ever could have done with costume analysis,

575
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 1: So thank you. And I also, I mean, I also

576
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,720
Speaker 1: felt like a lot of I mean Blake Livelis costumes

577
00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 1: specifically because I feel like they're really given Anna Kendrick

578
00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: the full target very intentionally, um for the entire movie

579
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:20,839
Speaker 1: until the very end. But I I like, I feel

580
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 1: like Blake Lively's wardrobe also reminds you that this is

581
00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:27,359
Speaker 1: a noir movie all the time, because her outfits are

582
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:30,960
Speaker 1: definitely like referencing the forties and fifties. I mean, especially

583
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:33,799
Speaker 1: in that last scene when she's like, you know, being

584
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: the devil and wearing a house like a Donna Reed dress,

585
00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:40,399
Speaker 1: and like, I just I don't know, I think I'm

586
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:42,080
Speaker 1: just like in the noir zone right now. But I

587
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:46,280
Speaker 1: really appreciated how that, like the references to the genres

588
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:50,239
Speaker 1: origins were made even through the costuming, which was kind

589
00:34:50,239 --> 00:34:53,840
Speaker 1: of cool. And that actually that brought me to I'm

590
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,279
Speaker 1: wondering if I'm missing anything, but there did seem to

591
00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 1: be and maybe it's still happening and I just don't

592
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:03,319
Speaker 1: realize it. But there were three noir movies with with

593
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:07,440
Speaker 1: these kind of fem fatale characters modernized. They came up

594
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 1: within five years of each other that just had all

595
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 1: these similarities, and I don't know if it's anything, but

596
00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:13,680
Speaker 1: I was just like, this is so bizarre where this

597
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 1: movie came out in Uh, there was a lot made

598
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: of like, oh, this belongs to the like urra of

599
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:23,000
Speaker 1: Gone Girl and Girl on the Train, and then this

600
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:26,960
Speaker 1: is like the comedy flavor of that kind of modern

601
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:30,600
Speaker 1: film Fatale in a simple favor and there's Um and

602
00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:33,400
Speaker 1: I like a simple favor and gone Girl. I didn't

603
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:36,279
Speaker 1: like the Girl on the Train. That's my business. But

604
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 1: there is like a lot of similarities even in the

605
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 1: production of those movies, where I feel like part of

606
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,320
Speaker 1: what makes them different is that they're all adapted from

607
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: books by women, they're adapted into screenplays by women, and

608
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:56,400
Speaker 1: they're all directed by kind of like legacy mail directors UM,

609
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:58,600
Speaker 1: which I don't I don't know. It feels like an

610
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,439
Speaker 1: interesting kind of like half depth um in the way

611
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:03,399
Speaker 1: that we talked about a lot of the time where

612
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:04,920
Speaker 1: I was really happy to see that all three of

613
00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:09,000
Speaker 1: these movies were written by kind of like seasoned female screenwriters.

614
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:11,359
Speaker 1: And also I was like, oh, but they all were

615
00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:14,480
Speaker 1: directed by a very famous men, which I guess is

616
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:17,799
Speaker 1: the only way you can get a movie made stuff right,

617
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 1: because I mean, we talked about on the recent Double

618
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 1: Indemnity episode about how, despite some efforts to reclaim the

619
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:34,880
Speaker 1: fatal character, ultimately that archetype was men think women are scary,

620
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:39,160
Speaker 1: whereas these like you know, neo noir, way more recent

621
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:44,280
Speaker 1: you know, crime thrillers are especially the ones that you cited, Jamie,

622
00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 1: are stories that are crafted by women. So they're taking

623
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: some tropes of the genre that feel familiar but subverting

624
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 1: them or updating them. Yeah, like less mental gymnastics too

625
00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:00,359
Speaker 1: to get there, but um right, which makes for far

626
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:07,120
Speaker 1: more interesting and nuanced characters, especially the women in the movie.

627
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:13,960
Speaker 1: I like. Okay, So for Stephanie and Emily, I mean,

628
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 1: there's so much to talk about regarding their friendship. There's

629
00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:21,839
Speaker 1: so much to talk about regarding them. Is just like individuals.

630
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:25,839
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't even know where should should

631
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:28,840
Speaker 1: We just like start with Stephanie and then we'll just

632
00:37:29,440 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 1: go from there. I don't like trying to figure out

633
00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:34,239
Speaker 1: what the order or what like the order of operation

634
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 1: is here? Right? Yeah, so Stephanie, um thoughts, I like

635
00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:47,280
Speaker 1: know what Okay, let let me just pose this question

636
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 1: to start. Did Stephanie kill her dad? And did Stephanie

637
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 1: kill her brother and her husband? That is what I

638
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:59,840
Speaker 1: was thinking for a large chunk of the movie. She

639
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:03,479
Speaker 1: did not kill her dad or her brother or her husband. Okay,

640
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:08,920
Speaker 1: I was like, wait a second, Yes, her dad died

641
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:13,600
Speaker 1: and he either had a previous son or a secret

642
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:16,279
Speaker 1: son bat part son clip. But she has a half

643
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 1: brother who showed up to the funeral or the wake

644
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 1: or the whatever, and then she slept with him and

645
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:26,919
Speaker 1: her son is very probably her brother's yes, and her

646
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:30,319
Speaker 1: husband was like, you guys were too close. It's kind

647
00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 1: of a weird. And then he was mad about it

648
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:35,320
Speaker 1: and was like, let's go handle this like men. And

649
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 1: then they go too car accident, died. Yeah. I thought

650
00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 1: that was just the traumatic backstory for her. I'm pretty

651
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:43,680
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure, right, did they miss something? I don't

652
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:47,000
Speaker 1: think she killed she didn't know. Yeah, she didn't kill them.

653
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:50,839
Speaker 1: They just died doing men things. That's a wild theory, though,

654
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:55,439
Speaker 1: I that's my theory. I think that Stephanie is not

655
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:58,080
Speaker 1: as innocent as she seems. And maybe I was just

656
00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 1: thinking this because he just sucking her. She's she was

657
00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 1: sucking her brother famously. She was, yeah, and they kept

658
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:08,920
Speaker 1: showing you and she's loving it. Oh my gosh. There's

659
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 1: a chunk of the movie where you aren't sure how

660
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:17,040
Speaker 1: culpable or not Stephanie is, because there's a little bit

661
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 1: where you're kind of it's kind of vague, it's open

662
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:22,360
Speaker 1: to interpretation. You're wondering, like, wait a minute, did she

663
00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 1: have something to do with the disappearance of her supposed

664
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:30,960
Speaker 1: best friend that pretty quickly seems to fizzle out as

665
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:33,759
Speaker 1: more information comes out. But I think maybe it was

666
00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 1: just like during that chunk of time where I was like, Wow,

667
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 1: she seems really guilty. Does this mean she also killed

668
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:41,000
Speaker 1: all of these family members? And then I just kind

669
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 1: of like ran with it. But okay, so so I

670
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:49,840
Speaker 1: guess Stephanie isn't a murderer. Um, yeah, give her time.

671
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:53,840
Speaker 1: I mean I I liked a lot of the commentary

672
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:57,760
Speaker 1: that was being done through Stephanie's character where I feel

673
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:01,560
Speaker 1: like sometimes it's like she definitely is a type that

674
00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 1: I feel like most people who have met a you know,

675
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 1: a white millennial mom will recognize, which is like she

676
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:13,120
Speaker 1: is a lot. She's doing the most. There is like

677
00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:15,400
Speaker 1: she's not coming from a bad place, but it is

678
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:19,920
Speaker 1: from a very like vibrating insecurity. She is extremely online,

679
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:24,440
Speaker 1: but it's very curated and very fake. But also on

680
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:26,560
Speaker 1: top of that, like I feel like sometimes you'll see

681
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:29,919
Speaker 1: that archetype presented and then kind of just be like, yeah,

682
00:40:29,960 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 1: let's make fun of this person. She fucking sucks, and

683
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 1: this movie doesn't do that. This movie gives her background.

684
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:37,640
Speaker 1: It also says like, yeah, she is this it almost

685
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:40,440
Speaker 1: reminds me of oh God, not me quoting a Beau

686
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:45,080
Speaker 1: Burnham song Jesus Christ, but like the like she's a

687
00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 1: very very like. She's a whatever quote unquote basic woman

688
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:52,280
Speaker 1: who has trauma and has like a backstory and has

689
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:55,480
Speaker 1: um more to her than meets the eye on this

690
00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:59,880
Speaker 1: punishingly boring vlog that she has. And I liked that

691
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,799
Speaker 1: story choice where it seems like the writing in this

692
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 1: movie it doesn't let her off the hook for um

693
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:10,719
Speaker 1: a lot of the I mean, and and ultimately especially

694
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 1: at the end where I was a little unclear and like,

695
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:16,080
Speaker 1: and I guess it's just like open interpretation, but how

696
00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 1: the movie wants you to feel about her, Like sinister

697
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:22,600
Speaker 1: true crime blog getting bought out by Conde Nast, I'm like,

698
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:25,759
Speaker 1: I don't feel like that's really a win for for

699
00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 1: the culture. But but as a girl boss capitalist, you know,

700
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:33,840
Speaker 1: really thrilled for her that she gets to exploit people's

701
00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:37,799
Speaker 1: death on YouTube every single day. But um, I don't know.

702
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:39,600
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like the movie doesn't let her

703
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:43,560
Speaker 1: off the hook but also gives her an appropriate depth.

704
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:47,760
Speaker 1: So I liked she has written. I didn't like her particularly,

705
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:49,920
Speaker 1: but I but I don't know, like you were saying earlier, Kase,

706
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:52,000
Speaker 1: I don't know how much we're supposed to really like

707
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:56,120
Speaker 1: like her, but I was interested. Yeah. I think the

708
00:41:56,160 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 1: thing with Stephanie is that she is like aggressively normy,

709
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:03,319
Speaker 1: but it read to me like it was very much

710
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:06,719
Speaker 1: like a front to cover the brother fucking, which I

711
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:10,560
Speaker 1: think is part of why, like Emily is so delighted

712
00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:12,560
Speaker 1: when she admits that, because she's like, I thought you

713
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 1: were this like super boring housewife, and you're way more

714
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:19,120
Speaker 1: interesting than that. And it's like a thing that she's

715
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:22,840
Speaker 1: ashamed of, obviously, but it's also something that she feels

716
00:42:22,840 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 1: like it's maybe more true to she actually is, and

717
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 1: so she has to do this like very aggressive performance

718
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:35,160
Speaker 1: of like normativity to hide that side of herself. And

719
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:37,560
Speaker 1: I think that the thing that connects her and Emily

720
00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:39,239
Speaker 1: is that she kind of sees that, like Emily is

721
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:41,760
Speaker 1: very like cards on the table, like I'm in debt,

722
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:46,240
Speaker 1: hate my husband. Isn't that fun? And she like enjoys

723
00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:49,359
Speaker 1: how much that puts people off, because like we don't

724
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 1: generally just air our laundry out like that, um, And

725
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:56,120
Speaker 1: I think for her, like getting getting Stephanie to kind

726
00:42:56,120 --> 00:43:00,000
Speaker 1: of return the favor almost is like delightful to her

727
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:02,600
Speaker 1: because she didn't think that there was anything there. Yeah.

728
00:43:02,760 --> 00:43:07,120
Speaker 1: I found the way the two main characters and like

729
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 1: how they were written and how they were characterized to

730
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:15,360
Speaker 1: be interesting. And I mean the layers that keep getting

731
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:19,640
Speaker 1: healed back, the information you keep learning about each one

732
00:43:19,719 --> 00:43:25,800
Speaker 1: because Stephanie, Yeah, you learn this thing that she committed

733
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 1: an act of incest at least once, maybe most. It

734
00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:32,319
Speaker 1: might be suggested that it's like an ongoing scene. It's

735
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:38,279
Speaker 1: only half incest. It's I was also. I mean that's

736
00:43:38,320 --> 00:43:41,520
Speaker 1: like a gutsy move to involve an incest plotline in

737
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:45,440
Speaker 1: like a Paul Feig movie. Right, it's because I feel

738
00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:49,040
Speaker 1: like it never really registers. Is like as potentially gross

739
00:43:49,080 --> 00:43:52,359
Speaker 1: as it actually is. It feels like the movie kind

740
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,319
Speaker 1: of down plays it. I mean because the brother I

741
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:58,120
Speaker 1: don't think has any lines except maybe like one right

742
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:00,680
Speaker 1: before he dies. Right, maybe he doesn't know. I think

743
00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:03,919
Speaker 1: he might just signal to her like it's all good. Yeah,

744
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:06,120
Speaker 1: I guess you don't really get to know him, not

745
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 1: even at all. It's like a nonentity, Yeah I do.

746
00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 1: I mean it's like and and obviously that's a very

747
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:13,400
Speaker 1: very serious issue that this movie isn't equipped to handle.

748
00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:16,680
Speaker 1: But I wasn't like particularly upset with how It's like, well, yeah,

749
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:18,160
Speaker 1: if you're going to include that in this movie, you

750
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:21,719
Speaker 1: gotta like skirt around it, like we don't have in

751
00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:26,879
Speaker 1: a movie like this to tackle an issue of that magnitude. Yeah,

752
00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:29,719
Speaker 1: I feel like it puts it in in in a

753
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:34,439
Speaker 1: way where Emily's reaction is appropriate, where it's like, not,

754
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:37,279
Speaker 1: oh my god, that's incest, but oh my god, you're

755
00:44:37,320 --> 00:44:40,879
Speaker 1: so dirty. That's really fun, right right, because that's how

756
00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:44,400
Speaker 1: she would see it, Yeah, which is bizarre. It is,

757
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:48,560
Speaker 1: I mean, it's definitely bizarre. I'm also like, if if

758
00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 1: there were viewers who were like that was fucked up,

759
00:44:51,719 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 1: I totally understand why they would feel that way. Also,

760
00:44:56,200 --> 00:44:59,319
Speaker 1: apparently that is like even and again, this is not

761
00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:01,719
Speaker 1: a podcast we would where we would ever read read

762
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:04,640
Speaker 1: a book. We can say it for half a decade.

763
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 1: But apparently in the book that is far more of

764
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:13,719
Speaker 1: an element in the book, and it was actively and

765
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:17,239
Speaker 1: intentionally scaled back for this adaptation, which I think I

766
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:22,080
Speaker 1: wonder why. Yeah, Like that's I think a smart move

767
00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 1: if they absolutely had to include that plot point I

768
00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:27,879
Speaker 1: feel like they handled it about as gracefully as you could,

769
00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:30,640
Speaker 1: but there's no graceful way to handle an incest plot line,

770
00:45:30,719 --> 00:45:37,040
Speaker 1: so right, I'm just like, what function does this serve exactly?

771
00:45:37,239 --> 00:45:41,200
Speaker 1: Besides like giving I guess it gives Emily leverage to

772
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:45,200
Speaker 1: blackmail Stephanie when she needs to. And then it also

773
00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:49,919
Speaker 1: just like cluse the audience in two Stephanie not being

774
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:54,640
Speaker 1: nearly as innocent as she wants people to believe she is,

775
00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:56,759
Speaker 1: like this persona that she puts on. I mean, there

776
00:45:56,760 --> 00:46:03,280
Speaker 1: couldn't be a more extreme example of right right, So yeah,

777
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:07,120
Speaker 1: I find that all very fascinating in a way that

778
00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:10,880
Speaker 1: like a lot of movies wouldn't dare tackle something like that,

779
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:16,040
Speaker 1: just isolating Stephanie alone, Like she's such a challenging character

780
00:46:16,680 --> 00:46:19,960
Speaker 1: to analyze for sure. I mean I feel like it

781
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:22,840
Speaker 1: definitely is a case of like you can, but should you?

782
00:46:23,040 --> 00:46:25,640
Speaker 1: And the answer in this case is I don't know.

783
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:29,680
Speaker 1: I don't know, but I am always um, whatever this

784
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 1: is I guess my second and third time seeing this movie,

785
00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:35,520
Speaker 1: but every single time you're like, oh, right, that is

786
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:40,080
Speaker 1: also like an Ana Kendric character, Like it's just so wild.

787
00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:42,279
Speaker 1: I feel like I can't. Maybe my brain has a

788
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:44,600
Speaker 1: hundred percent process that they made that choice. I've had

789
00:46:44,600 --> 00:46:48,000
Speaker 1: plenty of time to process it. But it's so fun too,

790
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:49,759
Speaker 1: because I feel like in this movie, she's like Ana

791
00:46:49,840 --> 00:46:52,800
Speaker 1: Kendrick is slaying exactly to type, like she's the exact

792
00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 1: this is the exact character that you think that she

793
00:46:54,719 --> 00:46:56,200
Speaker 1: would be in real life if you were just making

794
00:46:56,200 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: it up, Like it's so aggressively like the it's a

795
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:03,400
Speaker 1: kod energy like you were saying before, like it doesn't

796
00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:05,560
Speaker 1: there's nothing new, Like I feel like all of the

797
00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 1: while ship that happens in the movie with her, it

798
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:10,640
Speaker 1: stops feeling wild because you're like, oh, yeah, of course

799
00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:14,000
Speaker 1: she would do that. And so I guess if you

800
00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:16,960
Speaker 1: said that precedent, you're like, oh, well, what could do

801
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:20,640
Speaker 1: anything at any time. It's like, yeah, I wonder if

802
00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:24,360
Speaker 1: her character is canonically the character she played in the

803
00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:29,239
Speaker 1: Twilight saga, because she was around so many like like

804
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:32,600
Speaker 1: this weird vampire family of like kind of brothers and

805
00:47:32,640 --> 00:47:37,280
Speaker 1: sisters dating each other. So she's just like this is normal, right, true,

806
00:47:37,800 --> 00:47:40,680
Speaker 1: she's carrying it over from her Twilight experience. She's like, Oh,

807
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:43,920
Speaker 1: I've been around this dynamic and um, you live long

808
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 1: enough anyway, it's right, okay, okay. But then even after

809
00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:54,319
Speaker 1: you learn that information about her back story, more and

810
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,800
Speaker 1: more layers keep being peeled back of, like her showing

811
00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 1: her true colors or like what she's capable of, and

812
00:48:01,719 --> 00:48:06,439
Speaker 1: you know, because she's very mettlesome, she's very sneaky. There's

813
00:48:06,440 --> 00:48:11,160
Speaker 1: that scene where she talks back to Emily's boss and

814
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:15,200
Speaker 1: like calls him like a bargain basement tom fordered and

815
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:19,800
Speaker 1: like tacky and says all these really bitchy things and

816
00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:22,399
Speaker 1: which is a very funny, but we're like, oh my god,

817
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:24,600
Speaker 1: I didn't you know, we didn't know she was capable

818
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:28,800
Speaker 1: of that. But she like firecracker, like one after the next,

819
00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:34,879
Speaker 1: and you wonder like channeling Emily there too, which again

820
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:38,400
Speaker 1: is just like the the intense friendship element of this

821
00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 1: movie is so like friendship. And then some like elements

822
00:48:42,040 --> 00:48:44,719
Speaker 1: of this movie are so appealing to me because you're like, oh,

823
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:47,480
Speaker 1: like like when you're in a new intense friendship, you're like, yeah,

824
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:48,920
Speaker 1: I want to be this person. I would like, let

825
00:48:48,920 --> 00:48:51,680
Speaker 1: me see if I can like single white female them

826
00:48:51,680 --> 00:48:56,480
Speaker 1: in this moment, you know that classic gay impulse of

827
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:59,279
Speaker 1: like do I want to be with her or to

828
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:03,200
Speaker 1: be her, to conceive her into my being. And I

829
00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:05,520
Speaker 1: feel like that kindaic is like fully on display and

830
00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 1: as well, right, and I love it. Which I'm also

831
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:16,640
Speaker 1: curious about your thoughts on that aspect of their relationships,

832
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:20,440
Speaker 1: specifically because there's that scene we get the flashback towards

833
00:49:20,520 --> 00:49:23,080
Speaker 1: the end of the you know, it's like quite a

834
00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 1: ways into the movie where they kiss, and it's after

835
00:49:28,040 --> 00:49:32,479
Speaker 1: Stephanie has revealed that she feels responsible for the death

836
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:35,880
Speaker 1: of both her husband and her brother. You know, she's crying,

837
00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 1: and that leads to this kiss between her and Emily

838
00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:45,239
Speaker 1: and then they both kind of like brush it off,

839
00:49:45,440 --> 00:49:49,000
Speaker 1: is like, oh, I'm embarrassed, and then Emily's like, oh,

840
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:51,879
Speaker 1: no big deal and just another Tuesday for me. And

841
00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 1: I thought that was like setting up a different ending

842
00:49:55,560 --> 00:50:00,320
Speaker 1: for the movie that they would actually like join forces

843
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:05,200
Speaker 1: and interesting exploit maybe like Sean and like because they

844
00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:07,840
Speaker 1: do kind of like try to send him off to jail,

845
00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:11,319
Speaker 1: but then but then the where that's under consideration, but

846
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:16,080
Speaker 1: it lasts about thirty seconds. It's confusing. Yeah, it's because

847
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:19,319
Speaker 1: I feel like the movie it's it's very gay and

848
00:50:19,360 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 1: its sensibility but it's also like aggressively heterosexual in a

849
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:26,000
Speaker 1: lot of ways, and it's kind of hard, Like I

850
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 1: feel like they do look ad job of balancing those

851
00:50:28,040 --> 00:50:31,279
Speaker 1: two things, because in my mind this is a gay film,

852
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:35,600
Speaker 1: but it's not actually all that gay, no, like if

853
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:39,919
Speaker 1: you really think about it, and like everyone's endings are

854
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:44,880
Speaker 1: very normally and heterosexual. Although to be fair, I'm not

855
00:50:44,920 --> 00:50:47,960
Speaker 1: sure if they say that Stephane is dating someone from

856
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:50,680
Speaker 1: the city or a guy from the city, so if

857
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 1: it's just somebody that it could be a lady, you

858
00:50:52,640 --> 00:50:55,920
Speaker 1: don't know. But I think in general, like it definitely

859
00:50:55,960 --> 00:51:04,560
Speaker 1: frames these relationships, is like transactional romantic heterosexual relationships. And

860
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:08,839
Speaker 1: that moment between Emily and Stephanie, I'm honestly not even

861
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:12,240
Speaker 1: sure what to make of it, except for the fact

862
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:14,680
Speaker 1: that because like Emily at least we know is like

863
00:51:15,080 --> 00:51:17,840
Speaker 1: at least by curious because she has its previous relationship

864
00:51:17,840 --> 00:51:20,399
Speaker 1: with Linda Carle name, Yeah, I think that she I mean,

865
00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:22,759
Speaker 1: And then she also mentions that, like she had a

866
00:51:22,800 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 1: relationship with the with the female ta at some point

867
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:30,719
Speaker 1: I think bisexual, So there you go. So for me,

868
00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 1: and it makes sense that she is kind of like

869
00:51:33,160 --> 00:51:35,239
Speaker 1: because I think a lot of what Emily is doing

870
00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:37,600
Speaker 1: too is like all of her relationships are about like

871
00:51:37,800 --> 00:51:39,759
Speaker 1: power and the exchange of power, even if they're not

872
00:51:40,120 --> 00:51:43,240
Speaker 1: actually sexual. And so I think for in that moment,

873
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:47,200
Speaker 1: it's very much like I don't do like hugs and

874
00:51:47,640 --> 00:51:51,040
Speaker 1: comfort and whatever, but I can't do sex, and sex

875
00:51:51,160 --> 00:51:54,520
Speaker 1: is power. So it's the same thing. Well that got

876
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:59,719
Speaker 1: me wondering. I think her sexuality is not super clear

877
00:51:59,760 --> 00:52:01,560
Speaker 1: because as even though it suggested that she had a

878
00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:04,279
Speaker 1: romantic relate or at least like a sexual relationship with

879
00:52:04,680 --> 00:52:10,719
Speaker 1: Linda Cardelini's character, I interpreted that as Emily basically just

880
00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:17,520
Speaker 1: like exploiting that situation for money, because Linda Cardelini is like, yeah,

881
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:20,440
Speaker 1: I paid her way through college and then and it

882
00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:22,680
Speaker 1: seemed like a very one sided relationship where she was

883
00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 1: like I was like she was the best sex I

884
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:26,680
Speaker 1: ever had, and like she was my muse and I

885
00:52:26,760 --> 00:52:29,600
Speaker 1: painted her and it was great and da dada. But

886
00:52:29,680 --> 00:52:34,359
Speaker 1: then Emily just like bailed and abandoned her. And but

887
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:37,520
Speaker 1: then it's like Emily does that to men as well,

888
00:52:37,560 --> 00:52:40,840
Speaker 1: Like it seems like she's an equal opportunity like bailor

889
00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:44,239
Speaker 1: just a chaos bisexual it's awesome. Yeah, Like, I don't

890
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:46,960
Speaker 1: think that that precludes her from being bisexual, if that

891
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:54,480
Speaker 1: she's a shitty girlfriend, A stronger case I wanted to

892
00:52:54,520 --> 00:52:57,640
Speaker 1: bring up there. There was a fun piece I read

893
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:01,520
Speaker 1: about this movie on a website called into more dot

894
00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:05,000
Speaker 1: com called but how Gay is a simple favor. It

895
00:53:05,040 --> 00:53:08,280
Speaker 1: was a fun and useful tool written by a writer

896
00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:10,840
Speaker 1: named Kevin O'Keeffe, and he references a trope that I

897
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:13,720
Speaker 1: don't know if we've ever addressed on this show before.

898
00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:16,640
Speaker 1: He does not make the argument that Emily. He's kind

899
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:19,000
Speaker 1: of ambiguous of whether he thinks Emily falls into this trope.

900
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:20,840
Speaker 1: But it's just one that we haven't talked about that

901
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:25,319
Speaker 1: I feel like is often pulled into a FM fatale character. Um,

902
00:53:25,360 --> 00:53:28,399
Speaker 1: which is the depraved bisexual trope. Have we talked about

903
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:33,280
Speaker 1: this before? Kay? I don't think so. The depraved bisexual trope? Okay,

904
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:36,720
Speaker 1: let's get into it. Um, I thinking whales are turning?

905
00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:39,600
Speaker 1: This was new to me also, I might be into

906
00:53:39,640 --> 00:53:42,200
Speaker 1: it right. And then once you hear the characters that

907
00:53:42,239 --> 00:53:44,200
Speaker 1: are referenced, I'm like, okay, I understand what is being

908
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:46,239
Speaker 1: referenced here. It was first brought up by a writer

909
00:53:46,360 --> 00:53:50,480
Speaker 1: named Devin Price in the Year of the Simple favor

910
00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 1: Um that we can link in the description. I was

911
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:56,120
Speaker 1: just curious on both of your thoughts on this, So,

912
00:53:56,239 --> 00:53:59,960
Speaker 1: quoting from Devin Price's piece, quote, A depraved by sexual

913
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:02,000
Speaker 1: is a character, usually in a work of fiction, whose

914
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:05,880
Speaker 1: bisexuality is used as an indicator that they are untrustworthy, perverse,

915
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:09,920
Speaker 1: and morally corrupt. They are often depicted as impulsive, even unstable,

916
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:13,279
Speaker 1: or mentally ill. Deprave bisexuals are not merely attracted to

917
00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:17,000
Speaker 1: some women and some men. They are salacious and undiscriminated,

918
00:54:17,120 --> 00:54:20,880
Speaker 1: perhaps willing to fuck anything that moves. Their sexuality and

919
00:54:20,920 --> 00:54:24,000
Speaker 1: the narrative is the source of distraction and corruption. They

920
00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:27,479
Speaker 1: are often depicted as having explosive emotions and a deep

921
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:31,200
Speaker 1: streak of hedonism and other animalistic urges because they cannot

922
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:34,040
Speaker 1: quote unquote decide on a gender to be attracted to.

923
00:54:34,360 --> 00:54:36,960
Speaker 1: As the logic goes, they also cannot say no to

924
00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:41,160
Speaker 1: anything sexual or pleasurable. And he kind of proceeds to

925
00:54:41,160 --> 00:54:44,600
Speaker 1: break this down character by character. He references shared Stone

926
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:49,080
Speaker 1: in Basic Instinct. He references Poison Ivy in Batman, the

927
00:54:49,120 --> 00:54:51,680
Speaker 1: animated series. I don't know, I just it was not

928
00:54:51,800 --> 00:54:55,760
Speaker 1: a trope I had come across before. And the writer

929
00:54:55,840 --> 00:54:58,319
Speaker 1: Kevin O'Keefe is not making an argument that Emily is

930
00:54:59,160 --> 00:55:01,279
Speaker 1: depraved by sex, because I think that there is like

931
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:03,799
Speaker 1: more to her than that, But it was just not

932
00:55:03,880 --> 00:55:07,360
Speaker 1: something that I had encountered before. I mean, it's describing

933
00:55:07,360 --> 00:55:09,880
Speaker 1: a trope. I feel like depraved as a strong word,

934
00:55:10,320 --> 00:55:13,160
Speaker 1: but I would argue yes, only because I feel like

935
00:55:13,239 --> 00:55:17,959
Speaker 1: the I am familiar with the idea that like bisexual

936
00:55:18,040 --> 00:55:20,680
Speaker 1: means you can't choose and you'll do anything with anyone,

937
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:25,560
Speaker 1: and like I don't agree obviously, but I was on

938
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:27,840
Speaker 1: I was on the Quite Quad podcast a couple of

939
00:55:27,840 --> 00:55:32,359
Speaker 1: weeks back, and we talked about the movie UM Side

940
00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:38,439
Speaker 1: Effects with Rooney Mara and Katherine Zada Jones, and they

941
00:55:38,680 --> 00:55:41,719
Speaker 1: are also bisexual. It's great UM, And one thing I

942
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:43,680
Speaker 1: talked about on that show is this idea that like

943
00:55:44,400 --> 00:55:47,319
Speaker 1: it's not like great representation of core people for them

944
00:55:47,320 --> 00:55:49,760
Speaker 1: to be like villains doing like bad things, but also

945
00:55:49,800 --> 00:55:53,920
Speaker 1: like that's the most fun, Like I'm always on the

946
00:55:53,960 --> 00:55:57,760
Speaker 1: side of the bisexual doing chaotic things, Like I'm always

947
00:55:57,800 --> 00:55:59,520
Speaker 1: on their side. I'm always going to choose them, like

948
00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:01,439
Speaker 1: I don't or if you murdered your husband, Like maybe

949
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:04,759
Speaker 1: he deserved it. That's not my problem, like I and

950
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:08,399
Speaker 1: so like I'm leaning towards like, yes, she falls into

951
00:56:08,440 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 1: that trope. I just don't mind because like I just

952
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:14,400
Speaker 1: feel like crevalents are always more fun, Like there's a reason,

953
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:16,600
Speaker 1: like so many of them have been reclaimed over the years,

954
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:19,800
Speaker 1: Like especially when you put those characters and other characters

955
00:56:19,840 --> 00:56:23,080
Speaker 1: are either explicitly quit or coded quite in the context

956
00:56:23,120 --> 00:56:26,359
Speaker 1: of like the persecution that they face in the world.

957
00:56:26,360 --> 00:56:29,120
Speaker 1: It's like, why wouldn't they go a little hog wild

958
00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:30,960
Speaker 1: and like do someings where it shipped to people like

959
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:34,319
Speaker 1: they deserved to the world's miserable right, And that's like

960
00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:37,279
Speaker 1: all of the characters that this trope are attributed to

961
00:56:37,320 --> 00:56:41,680
Speaker 1: our beloved character exactly. So it's like it is, it

962
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:44,120
Speaker 1: is complicated, but I did I just had never. Um,

963
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:48,160
Speaker 1: I guess i'd never like read the agency of like

964
00:56:48,239 --> 00:56:53,400
Speaker 1: conflating bisexuality with I mean, because the chaanic bisexual walks

965
00:56:53,440 --> 00:56:57,760
Speaker 1: among us, the chaotic everyone walks among us. Um. But

966
00:56:57,760 --> 00:57:01,719
Speaker 1: but in like in fiction, um, inflating that and the

967
00:57:01,800 --> 00:57:06,640
Speaker 1: stereotypes that you know incorrects marginalizing stereotypes associated with bisexual

968
00:57:06,680 --> 00:57:10,560
Speaker 1: people and how that translates to their to their chaos.

969
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:13,160
Speaker 1: It was like, oh, this is new to me, and

970
00:57:13,280 --> 00:57:16,360
Speaker 1: it does seem like Emily falls into this trope to

971
00:57:16,440 --> 00:57:21,680
Speaker 1: some degree. But I also really like that character, So yeah,

972
00:57:21,960 --> 00:57:24,280
Speaker 1: you know, I feel like it's a little cuspy because

973
00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:27,160
Speaker 1: like she is bisexual and she is chaotic. But I

974
00:57:27,200 --> 00:57:34,360
Speaker 1: also feel like the movie in general, it's not that sexual.

975
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:36,760
Speaker 1: Like all of the sex, I feel like it's implied,

976
00:57:36,760 --> 00:57:38,560
Speaker 1: other than the one sex scene of a brother, but

977
00:57:38,880 --> 00:57:42,120
Speaker 1: other than that, like it's it's very much like an implication,

978
00:57:42,240 --> 00:57:44,720
Speaker 1: like you're supposed to feel that the characters are sexy

979
00:57:45,280 --> 00:57:49,160
Speaker 1: as opposed to that they are having sex necessarily, and

980
00:57:49,280 --> 00:57:53,000
Speaker 1: so I I don't get that like that there's a

981
00:57:53,040 --> 00:57:58,480
Speaker 1: direct connection between her desire for or engaging in sex

982
00:57:58,800 --> 00:58:02,560
Speaker 1: as directly related to the crimes she does, Like she

983
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:05,280
Speaker 1: kills her dad because he's abusive, and then she like

984
00:58:05,760 --> 00:58:08,200
Speaker 1: does a gone girl on herself because they're deeply in

985
00:58:08,240 --> 00:58:10,720
Speaker 1: debt any money, Like she didn't None of that stuff

986
00:58:10,760 --> 00:58:13,200
Speaker 1: is like because I'm trying to trap a man or

987
00:58:13,400 --> 00:58:16,360
Speaker 1: trap a woman for that matter, Like they're all like

988
00:58:16,440 --> 00:58:21,200
Speaker 1: practical consideration her like fem fatale motivation is all based

989
00:58:21,280 --> 00:58:25,080
Speaker 1: in like class issues and money problems. It isn't like,

990
00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:27,960
Speaker 1: you know whatever, we just did the double Indemnity episode

991
00:58:28,000 --> 00:58:29,520
Speaker 1: of like I don't like my husband, I'd like for

992
00:58:29,600 --> 00:58:31,760
Speaker 1: him to disappear, which is like, I don't hate that

993
00:58:31,800 --> 00:58:34,720
Speaker 1: motivation either, But this is like a very like same

994
00:58:35,040 --> 00:58:37,480
Speaker 1: practical motivation at the end of the day, which I

995
00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:39,880
Speaker 1: thought was kind of cool that this movie doesn't really

996
00:58:39,920 --> 00:58:42,080
Speaker 1: like whack you over the head with it, but they

997
00:58:42,120 --> 00:58:46,040
Speaker 1: do like address class to some extent at the beginning,

998
00:58:46,160 --> 00:58:49,919
Speaker 1: with Stephanie, you know, being the I mean like she's

999
00:58:50,000 --> 00:58:53,760
Speaker 1: they're a middle class target family, like they're okay, but

1000
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:56,280
Speaker 1: she's talking about, you know, how she has to live

1001
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,280
Speaker 1: off of her her dead husband's life insurance, and how

1002
00:58:59,360 --> 00:59:01,560
Speaker 1: there's a lot of budgeting, a lot of money stress

1003
00:59:01,560 --> 00:59:05,600
Speaker 1: associated with maintaining her son's quality of life. And then

1004
00:59:05,640 --> 00:59:08,480
Speaker 1: you learn about all the Lively debt and just I

1005
00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:12,000
Speaker 1: don't know, it's it's always cool to hear money talked about,

1006
00:59:12,040 --> 00:59:16,439
Speaker 1: kind of frankly in a movie, especially like a genre movie. Wait,

1007
00:59:16,520 --> 00:59:22,320
Speaker 1: going back to sex really quickly, which is the best

1008
00:59:22,560 --> 00:59:27,840
Speaker 1: transitioned little sentence I've ever said, Um, come to think

1009
00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:32,760
Speaker 1: of it, the sexually charged moments in the movie that

1010
00:59:32,840 --> 00:59:37,480
Speaker 1: you see, like, for example, when when Emily is having

1011
00:59:37,520 --> 00:59:40,680
Speaker 1: sex or implied to want sex from her husband because

1012
00:59:40,680 --> 00:59:43,560
Speaker 1: there's a scene in the airplane after she revealed that

1013
00:59:43,600 --> 00:59:48,560
Speaker 1: she stole his mother's ring Chaos, and then he's like,

1014
00:59:48,560 --> 00:59:50,400
Speaker 1: what the fund did you? Like? It was a horrible

1015
00:59:50,400 --> 00:59:52,360
Speaker 1: thing for you to do, and she's like, ha ha,

1016
00:59:52,520 --> 00:59:54,439
Speaker 1: shut up. Also come into the bathroom and have sex

1017
00:59:54,440 --> 00:59:57,000
Speaker 1: with me. So she's like almost using sex is like

1018
00:59:57,560 --> 01:00:01,880
Speaker 1: a distraction because she does it again after she like

1019
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:05,960
Speaker 1: reappears and is like, surprise, husband, I'm not dead after all,

1020
01:00:06,440 --> 01:00:08,960
Speaker 1: and she like pretends to shoot him with like a

1021
01:00:09,000 --> 01:00:11,560
Speaker 1: gun that isn't loaded, and then she's like t he

1022
01:00:11,640 --> 01:00:14,280
Speaker 1: he I'll be in the bathroom, coming in twenty seconds

1023
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:16,480
Speaker 1: if you want to have sex with me. Um. I

1024
01:00:16,520 --> 01:00:19,160
Speaker 1: honestly was like rooting for her in that moment. I

1025
01:00:19,200 --> 01:00:22,200
Speaker 1: was like, what give me the confidence to do that?

1026
01:00:22,240 --> 01:00:25,120
Speaker 1: For one minute? Because how could you not? I know,

1027
01:00:25,280 --> 01:00:27,760
Speaker 1: like you do want to like in those moments, I'm like,

1028
01:00:27,840 --> 01:00:30,160
Speaker 1: I wanna I want to be her in that moment.

1029
01:00:30,200 --> 01:00:32,120
Speaker 1: I want to be the person that steals a ring.

1030
01:00:32,160 --> 01:00:34,160
Speaker 1: And then it's like, don't worry just have sex when

1031
01:00:34,200 --> 01:00:37,880
Speaker 1: you'll forget all about it, you know. But well, compare

1032
01:00:37,960 --> 01:00:42,480
Speaker 1: those moments where she's like clearly using sex as like

1033
01:00:42,520 --> 01:00:46,560
Speaker 1: a manipulation tactic. Compare that to the kiss that she

1034
01:00:46,720 --> 01:00:50,480
Speaker 1: shares with Stephanie, which feels, at least it felt to

1035
01:00:50,520 --> 01:00:55,120
Speaker 1: me like it was way more authentic and tender. You

1036
01:00:55,160 --> 01:00:59,720
Speaker 1: could make the argument that it's also manipulative on sure

1037
01:01:00,000 --> 01:01:03,560
Speaker 1: Emily's part, maybe also Stephanie's part. Hard to say, because

1038
01:01:03,600 --> 01:01:07,480
Speaker 1: both of these characters are very complicated and sneaky, and

1039
01:01:07,520 --> 01:01:10,280
Speaker 1: they're both like different degrees of fatale, which is kind

1040
01:01:10,280 --> 01:01:12,800
Speaker 1: of fun to have, like right, right, Yeah, there's like

1041
01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:14,680
Speaker 1: opposites of each other in a lot of ways. I

1042
01:01:14,680 --> 01:01:17,000
Speaker 1: feel like, so maybe I'm going back on what I

1043
01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:22,480
Speaker 1: like because I wasn't sure the authenticity to Emily's bisexuality,

1044
01:01:22,480 --> 01:01:26,280
Speaker 1: but now I'm like, wait, maybe she is perhaps even

1045
01:01:26,360 --> 01:01:30,640
Speaker 1: more attracted to women because of that scene versus again,

1046
01:01:30,680 --> 01:01:33,240
Speaker 1: like when we see her having sex with her husband,

1047
01:01:33,280 --> 01:01:35,840
Speaker 1: it's always like to trick him or like distract him.

1048
01:01:36,320 --> 01:01:38,400
Speaker 1: I mean, I can't speak to her kinsey scale, but

1049
01:01:38,440 --> 01:01:42,280
Speaker 1: I do think she's definitely fIF actual Yeah, I think right,

1050
01:01:43,280 --> 01:01:45,160
Speaker 1: But I agree, I think that that I think that

1051
01:01:45,280 --> 01:01:47,760
Speaker 1: that moment that she has a Stephanie is since I

1052
01:01:47,800 --> 01:01:50,680
Speaker 1: mean when I was watching it again for to prep

1053
01:01:50,680 --> 01:01:52,360
Speaker 1: for this podcast, one of the things that I noticed

1054
01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:54,480
Speaker 1: is that one because it is a lot longer than

1055
01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:57,400
Speaker 1: like just a moment, and too, they both like move

1056
01:01:57,480 --> 01:02:00,680
Speaker 1: their hands up to each other's heads to engage further,

1057
01:02:00,720 --> 01:02:03,800
Speaker 1: and it's Stephanie that pulls away, like they're both into it.

1058
01:02:03,880 --> 01:02:06,120
Speaker 1: And I think that that's part of the fun of

1059
01:02:06,120 --> 01:02:09,680
Speaker 1: the movie, is that in another scenario, if like Emily

1060
01:02:09,720 --> 01:02:12,520
Speaker 1: hadn't pulled this off or tried to pull the scam like,

1061
01:02:13,240 --> 01:02:15,640
Speaker 1: they probably would have been very close. I think that

1062
01:02:15,680 --> 01:02:18,200
Speaker 1: they each saw each something in the other that like

1063
01:02:18,280 --> 01:02:21,680
Speaker 1: spoke to the side of them they weren't comfortable showing

1064
01:02:21,920 --> 01:02:25,160
Speaker 1: the rest of the world. And in that moment, now

1065
01:02:25,160 --> 01:02:27,520
Speaker 1: that they kind of like had each other's secrets, it

1066
01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:31,360
Speaker 1: was it allowed them to have this closeness that wasn't

1067
01:02:31,400 --> 01:02:35,080
Speaker 1: available to them before. Like sure Stephanie was sucking her brother,

1068
01:02:35,200 --> 01:02:38,200
Speaker 1: but like she also talked about the fact that after

1069
01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:40,480
Speaker 1: they had died, like she hadn't slept with anyone, she

1070
01:02:40,560 --> 01:02:44,000
Speaker 1: hadn't been dating, she was too intimidated to go into

1071
01:02:44,000 --> 01:02:47,680
Speaker 1: the city or something like she she's alone and she

1072
01:02:48,040 --> 01:02:50,919
Speaker 1: is finally opening up about this like presumably like very

1073
01:02:50,960 --> 01:02:53,440
Speaker 1: shameful thing in her past to this woman that she

1074
01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:58,439
Speaker 1: just met, and that kind of like forced intimacy I think,

1075
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:01,120
Speaker 1: like really did bond them. And I think the that

1076
01:03:01,160 --> 01:03:04,840
Speaker 1: Emily would not have come after Stephanie if Stephanie had

1077
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:08,760
Speaker 1: just stopped meddling, right right. But then I also am like,

1078
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:12,120
Speaker 1: but maybe Emily, like I don't know. I ultimately it's

1079
01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:15,240
Speaker 1: like I I you can't really Emily, is It's really

1080
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:18,440
Speaker 1: hard to know who if Emily has a genuine feeling

1081
01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:22,040
Speaker 1: for really anybody except for her, like that's really the

1082
01:03:22,040 --> 01:03:24,520
Speaker 1: only person that you can guarantee, Like she really loved

1083
01:03:24,720 --> 01:03:28,240
Speaker 1: her son and would not kill him, but anyone else,

1084
01:03:28,400 --> 01:03:30,760
Speaker 1: like she could kill anyone else in her life except

1085
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:36,080
Speaker 1: for her son, who loves to say fuck her son

1086
01:03:36,080 --> 01:03:40,560
Speaker 1: says every scene very cute kid um, I forget where

1087
01:03:40,560 --> 01:03:43,640
Speaker 1: this is going. Oh oh that line from Stephanie that

1088
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:48,120
Speaker 1: like broke my heart, and I feel like justifies, not justifies,

1089
01:03:48,160 --> 01:03:52,080
Speaker 1: I guess contextualizes a lot of her behavior and why

1090
01:03:52,200 --> 01:03:55,520
Speaker 1: she goes so like has I think, you know, a

1091
01:03:55,680 --> 01:03:58,280
Speaker 1: very outsized reaction to the things that are happening to

1092
01:03:58,320 --> 01:04:01,520
Speaker 1: her sometimes where it's just like sometimes with Stephanie, you're like,

1093
01:04:01,640 --> 01:04:04,280
Speaker 1: just do nothing, Just go home, you know, like what

1094
01:04:04,720 --> 01:04:06,920
Speaker 1: just go home. But she says that thing where she

1095
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:10,120
Speaker 1: says like, I think loneliness probably kills more people than cancer,

1096
01:04:10,280 --> 01:04:14,040
Speaker 1: and you're like, oh my god, Like she her motivation

1097
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:18,680
Speaker 1: is to some extent to have an honest connection with someone,

1098
01:04:18,720 --> 01:04:21,400
Speaker 1: and so it's like when she feels that she has

1099
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:25,000
Speaker 1: that with Emily and then is betrayed, and then feels

1100
01:04:25,000 --> 01:04:27,040
Speaker 1: like she has that with Sean, which is like, well,

1101
01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:28,720
Speaker 1: what did you think was going to happen? And then

1102
01:04:28,840 --> 01:04:32,120
Speaker 1: is betrayed, It's like, of course that's going to like

1103
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:34,880
Speaker 1: spin her way the funk out because her like core

1104
01:04:34,960 --> 01:04:38,400
Speaker 1: motivation is to make a meaningful connection with someone that

1105
01:04:38,520 --> 01:04:43,000
Speaker 1: she can trust and is clearly not dealing with her

1106
01:04:43,040 --> 01:04:47,680
Speaker 1: grief in a meaningful way and has been through so

1107
01:04:47,800 --> 01:04:51,160
Speaker 1: much and I don't know, I mean, like, I don't know,

1108
01:04:51,360 --> 01:04:53,800
Speaker 1: Stephanie is such a weird character, but that that line

1109
01:04:54,640 --> 01:04:56,880
Speaker 1: really got me good. I was like, God, she's just

1110
01:04:57,000 --> 01:05:00,760
Speaker 1: she's just really unhappy. She's really really unhapp be And

1111
01:05:00,800 --> 01:05:03,160
Speaker 1: so at the end when she starts a like True

1112
01:05:03,200 --> 01:05:06,600
Speaker 1: Crime Empire. I'm like, mm hmm, but has she grieved

1113
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:10,400
Speaker 1: likes she you know, I hope that she's like got

1114
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:13,200
Speaker 1: a good therapist now that she's got that Conde Nast money,

1115
01:05:13,240 --> 01:05:16,800
Speaker 1: because she could be headed down a dark road. It's

1116
01:05:16,840 --> 01:05:18,800
Speaker 1: wunny to say that about connection, though, because I think

1117
01:05:18,840 --> 01:05:21,520
Speaker 1: that that is something that she's getting from the True

1118
01:05:21,520 --> 01:05:24,880
Speaker 1: Crime Empire, because like, especially now that we've like the

1119
01:05:24,920 --> 01:05:28,600
Speaker 1: way that it kind of has metastasized online, like through TikTok.

1120
01:05:28,640 --> 01:05:31,919
Speaker 1: Now especially like people aren't just being like, oh, isn't

1121
01:05:31,920 --> 01:05:33,960
Speaker 1: that like an interesting story, Like did you hear about it?

1122
01:05:33,960 --> 01:05:36,040
Speaker 1: It's like, now like we are the slopes. We will

1123
01:05:36,040 --> 01:05:38,560
Speaker 1: solve it. Even though these are people like that you've

1124
01:05:38,600 --> 01:05:40,800
Speaker 1: never met. You don't you're not involved in the case.

1125
01:05:40,800 --> 01:05:44,160
Speaker 1: You're like finally in states away. But I think people

1126
01:05:44,880 --> 01:05:50,320
Speaker 1: feel not just connected, but like this like very not

1127
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:53,000
Speaker 1: good impulse to like get involved in stories in a

1128
01:05:53,040 --> 01:05:55,840
Speaker 1: certain way. And I think that you're right that she's

1129
01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:57,880
Speaker 1: like ahead of that in the sense that that's exactly

1130
01:05:57,880 --> 01:06:00,000
Speaker 1: what she does in this film. Like there was multiple

1131
01:06:00,040 --> 01:06:03,240
Speaker 1: pool times in this movie where she could have simply said,

1132
01:06:03,280 --> 01:06:05,200
Speaker 1: like this is kind of weird, I think I'm gonna

1133
01:06:05,240 --> 01:06:07,760
Speaker 1: like bounce, and she just doesn't because she has to

1134
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:10,680
Speaker 1: have answers. She has to go sleeping, Like she dips

1135
01:06:10,720 --> 01:06:13,360
Speaker 1: her kids off with like who whomever the fuck and

1136
01:06:13,480 --> 01:06:18,800
Speaker 1: like parts off to go like investigated some camp, like

1137
01:06:18,920 --> 01:06:22,040
Speaker 1: no one should get you there, Yeah, no one sent you.

1138
01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:24,600
Speaker 1: But she's like spending the money that she can't afford

1139
01:06:24,640 --> 01:06:27,160
Speaker 1: really because her husband's insurance money is running out to

1140
01:06:27,280 --> 01:06:29,560
Speaker 1: like rent cars and go across the country to like

1141
01:06:29,760 --> 01:06:33,080
Speaker 1: figure out what's happening, like sneaking into her parents house

1142
01:06:33,600 --> 01:06:35,520
Speaker 1: to figure out what happened to her and her sister.

1143
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:38,720
Speaker 1: I know she's sneaking into Jeane Smart's house. Yes, it

1144
01:06:38,720 --> 01:06:40,800
Speaker 1: doesn't have anything to do with her, Yeah it is.

1145
01:06:40,880 --> 01:06:43,120
Speaker 1: I mean it is fucked. And I feel like something

1146
01:06:43,160 --> 01:06:46,600
Speaker 1: that they're also engaging with. And maybe someone mentioned this earlier,

1147
01:06:47,160 --> 01:06:51,440
Speaker 1: is she's like majorly capitalizing on as is you know,

1148
01:06:51,880 --> 01:06:53,800
Speaker 1: Gone Girl and I think Girl on the Train, I

1149
01:06:53,840 --> 01:06:57,120
Speaker 1: don't really remember that movie very well, but like capitalizing

1150
01:06:57,200 --> 01:07:01,680
Speaker 1: on missing white woman's syndrome and get people very involved

1151
01:07:01,760 --> 01:07:05,240
Speaker 1: with this like traditionally beautiful missing white lady and like

1152
01:07:05,480 --> 01:07:08,520
Speaker 1: capitalizing on it and building an audience based on it,

1153
01:07:08,680 --> 01:07:12,000
Speaker 1: and I don't like it's I wish I kind of

1154
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:14,920
Speaker 1: wish that the movie said that a little more explicitly.

1155
01:07:15,360 --> 01:07:19,240
Speaker 1: But I mean that's like definitely what is happening. I

1156
01:07:19,240 --> 01:07:21,960
Speaker 1: don't know. Yeah, Stephanie is very complicated, Like ultimately I'm

1157
01:07:21,960 --> 01:07:25,320
Speaker 1: not rooting for her, but like, what a wounded what

1158
01:07:25,400 --> 01:07:29,200
Speaker 1: a wounded soul? My god, But she should have just

1159
01:07:29,240 --> 01:07:32,800
Speaker 1: gone home at some point. Yeah. I like the like

1160
01:07:32,960 --> 01:07:35,120
Speaker 1: Gone Girl comparison, just specause. I mean I feel like

1161
01:07:35,160 --> 01:07:38,520
Speaker 1: that's kind of like the epitome of that genre or

1162
01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:40,720
Speaker 1: like that little mini genre that was happening at that time.

1163
01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:44,920
Speaker 1: But it like, to me, Stephanie is I think her

1164
01:07:45,000 --> 01:07:48,440
Speaker 1: name is Casey Wilson and Gone Girl the next door neighborhoods.

1165
01:07:48,680 --> 01:07:51,560
Speaker 1: We were best friends. I know what happened to her.

1166
01:07:51,800 --> 01:07:54,320
Speaker 1: Her husband killed her. You have to listen to me,

1167
01:07:54,520 --> 01:07:57,920
Speaker 1: like steps that character, except that this movie is from

1168
01:07:57,920 --> 01:08:00,400
Speaker 1: her perspective, and so it's like two who ends of

1169
01:08:00,480 --> 01:08:04,320
Speaker 1: the same the same story, but we're getting the like

1170
01:08:04,800 --> 01:08:07,560
Speaker 1: meddlesome neighbor who's sucking it up instead of the one

1171
01:08:07,600 --> 01:08:11,400
Speaker 1: who's trying to scan the money. And I think that's

1172
01:08:11,400 --> 01:08:15,720
Speaker 1: really fun just because in both situations like they're they're

1173
01:08:15,720 --> 01:08:18,400
Speaker 1: both white women and they're both people. Like I think

1174
01:08:18,720 --> 01:08:20,400
Speaker 1: it's some of something that like Sara Marshalls has a

1175
01:08:20,439 --> 01:08:23,000
Speaker 1: lot and you're wrong about that, like the justice system

1176
01:08:23,080 --> 01:08:27,840
Speaker 1: is like constructed to protect her, or like white women

1177
01:08:27,880 --> 01:08:32,080
Speaker 1: in general ostensibly even though it really isn't. But and

1178
01:08:32,160 --> 01:08:35,400
Speaker 1: so like in the same way that that Emily is

1179
01:08:35,840 --> 01:08:41,240
Speaker 1: leveraging her white womanhood to kind of build this story

1180
01:08:41,360 --> 01:08:44,799
Speaker 1: that she is in danger and that someone has harmed

1181
01:08:44,800 --> 01:08:49,280
Speaker 1: her and and to to to mobilize people to to

1182
01:08:49,360 --> 01:08:53,439
Speaker 1: save her, Stephanie's doing the same thing. It's just from

1183
01:08:53,439 --> 01:08:56,280
Speaker 1: a different part of the story. Like it's not just

1184
01:08:56,360 --> 01:08:58,360
Speaker 1: that she is looking for her friend and her friend

1185
01:08:58,439 --> 01:09:00,559
Speaker 1: is the white person, because I don't think that that

1186
01:09:00,560 --> 01:09:04,080
Speaker 1: it's Stephanie was not a white woman that her blog

1187
01:09:04,080 --> 01:09:06,680
Speaker 1: would blow up in the same way. I think that

1188
01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:09,640
Speaker 1: it's because she is also a white woman who is

1189
01:09:09,880 --> 01:09:14,120
Speaker 1: domestic and serene and you know, lovely and feminine that

1190
01:09:14,360 --> 01:09:19,080
Speaker 1: vaguely religious. Yes, Yeah, there's even a part where like

1191
01:09:19,120 --> 01:09:22,639
Speaker 1: Linda Cardalini is like, oh, I could paint you you

1192
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:26,080
Speaker 1: you seem so pure like a saint, and you know

1193
01:09:26,200 --> 01:09:31,439
Speaker 1: she's like talking about her perceived innocence that like, clearly

1194
01:09:31,479 --> 01:09:34,360
Speaker 1: people are latching onto because by the end of the movie,

1195
01:09:34,520 --> 01:09:38,120
Speaker 1: her blog, her vlog has over a million subscribers, precisely,

1196
01:09:38,160 --> 01:09:40,120
Speaker 1: and because all of these people who are watching these blogs,

1197
01:09:40,120 --> 01:09:42,120
Speaker 1: like they don't know Emily, They've probably never seen a

1198
01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:43,920
Speaker 1: photo of her except for that one raggedy one that

1199
01:09:43,960 --> 01:09:45,920
Speaker 1: she pulled out from Cotton Knows where, Like they don't

1200
01:09:45,960 --> 01:09:48,200
Speaker 1: know this person, they only know her there. She is

1201
01:09:48,200 --> 01:09:50,400
Speaker 1: the one that they're connecting, right, And it's precisely for

1202
01:09:50,439 --> 01:09:52,559
Speaker 1: those same reasons. I didn't even think that, like, yeah,

1203
01:09:52,560 --> 01:09:54,320
Speaker 1: you don't even have a picture of Emily, so you

1204
01:09:54,360 --> 01:09:58,400
Speaker 1: have to fully rely on Stephanie's own like persona in

1205
01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:01,240
Speaker 1: order to buy in too. And she is like she's

1206
01:10:01,240 --> 01:10:04,479
Speaker 1: fully playing a character in those videos, like I mean

1207
01:10:04,960 --> 01:10:07,040
Speaker 1: the way that any of us do to some extent,

1208
01:10:07,120 --> 01:10:09,920
Speaker 1: but like she's really she's I mean, she's really going

1209
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:13,559
Speaker 1: for it. It's it's so And I did think it

1210
01:10:13,600 --> 01:10:16,759
Speaker 1: was like an interesting detail that her audience becomes engaged

1211
01:10:16,840 --> 01:10:19,200
Speaker 1: enough that that is what takes her to Michigan in

1212
01:10:19,240 --> 01:10:21,880
Speaker 1: the first place, because that is also something we see

1213
01:10:21,920 --> 01:10:24,200
Speaker 1: all the time, is like the online detective is getting

1214
01:10:24,240 --> 01:10:26,320
Speaker 1: way too involved, and then you're like this seems dark,

1215
01:10:26,360 --> 01:10:28,320
Speaker 1: this is sucked up, and then they solve something and

1216
01:10:28,320 --> 01:10:32,400
Speaker 1: you're like, oh my god, what No, you're breaking my brain. Um,

1217
01:10:33,560 --> 01:10:35,439
Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, it's I just that's how I

1218
01:10:35,439 --> 01:10:39,080
Speaker 1: feel about Brittany. Yeah, you're just like I mean, And

1219
01:10:39,080 --> 01:10:42,200
Speaker 1: there was in the Gabby Petito case as well recently

1220
01:10:42,200 --> 01:10:47,439
Speaker 1: where it was like TikTok made a breakthrough and you're like, guys, stop,

1221
01:10:47,479 --> 01:10:50,960
Speaker 1: you're confusing me. Like, I think it is inherently like

1222
01:10:51,240 --> 01:10:53,400
Speaker 1: it comes from a good place, but but there's there's

1223
01:10:53,439 --> 01:10:58,040
Speaker 1: some darkness there and it's I don't know what's confusing, right, Yeah,

1224
01:10:58,040 --> 01:10:59,600
Speaker 1: it's like, I mean, I know we had there was

1225
01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:01,639
Speaker 1: that like a week when everyone was like para social

1226
01:11:01,680 --> 01:11:04,360
Speaker 1: relationships and they were whining about it. But like, I

1227
01:11:04,360 --> 01:11:08,479
Speaker 1: think in some way, like this true crime thing is

1228
01:11:08,600 --> 01:11:10,880
Speaker 1: an extension of that, because it's not just like, oh,

1229
01:11:10,920 --> 01:11:12,960
Speaker 1: there's a there's a mystery and we're going to solve it,

1230
01:11:13,000 --> 01:11:15,080
Speaker 1: even though we're like some rounded personal on TikTok, it's like,

1231
01:11:15,520 --> 01:11:16,960
Speaker 1: there's a mystery and we're going to solve it, and

1232
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:19,719
Speaker 1: we're going to ascribe motives to the players in the story.

1233
01:11:19,760 --> 01:11:21,559
Speaker 1: That we do not know and do not have information

1234
01:11:21,600 --> 01:11:25,200
Speaker 1: about based on what are very likely to be like

1235
01:11:25,640 --> 01:11:30,519
Speaker 1: raised in class assumptions about people to fit what is

1236
01:11:30,600 --> 01:11:32,920
Speaker 1: likely to be a very set true crime frame. Like

1237
01:11:32,960 --> 01:11:35,400
Speaker 1: I think they even say, like in the film, in

1238
01:11:35,439 --> 01:11:37,280
Speaker 1: the movie, there's a video she does, or she's like,

1239
01:11:37,280 --> 01:11:38,680
Speaker 1: oh no, I know you guys think that it's like

1240
01:11:38,720 --> 01:11:41,120
Speaker 1: always the husband, but it's not. He's very nice, like

1241
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:43,800
Speaker 1: we're best friends. And it's like, yeah, but that's because

1242
01:11:43,840 --> 01:11:46,160
Speaker 1: it usually is the husband, but it obviously wasn't. It

1243
01:11:46,240 --> 01:11:48,920
Speaker 1: wasn't in this case. But if we were going strictly

1244
01:11:48,960 --> 01:11:51,799
Speaker 1: on like what is the framework of a true crime story,

1245
01:11:52,320 --> 01:11:54,679
Speaker 1: it would be him because it's always the intimate butt now.

1246
01:11:55,720 --> 01:11:58,240
Speaker 1: And I think that like when we are dealing with

1247
01:11:58,360 --> 01:12:01,439
Speaker 1: real life stories, it's like we are not good at

1248
01:12:01,479 --> 01:12:05,519
Speaker 1: separating like the general likelihood based on statistics and like

1249
01:12:05,600 --> 01:12:08,960
Speaker 1: the specific information. And like I I personally like didn't

1250
01:12:08,960 --> 01:12:11,840
Speaker 1: follow the Gappytito case because I was like, I'm uncomfortable

1251
01:12:11,920 --> 01:12:14,080
Speaker 1: with like how much speculation is happening based on our

1252
01:12:14,120 --> 01:12:17,160
Speaker 1: little information, But like you can't you can't say that,

1253
01:12:17,200 --> 01:12:19,800
Speaker 1: you can't be like, sure, this guy seems sketch, but

1254
01:12:19,800 --> 01:12:22,080
Speaker 1: that's not proof of anything, because then you all of

1255
01:12:22,120 --> 01:12:24,640
Speaker 1: a sudden, you're like and you know you're you're on

1256
01:12:24,680 --> 01:12:26,040
Speaker 1: the side of a murder, and it's like, I don't

1257
01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:28,080
Speaker 1: know that he murdered anyone. I don't know anything about

1258
01:12:28,080 --> 01:12:31,640
Speaker 1: this case. It's yeah, it's it's extremely extremely complicated, and

1259
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:34,400
Speaker 1: just because it is like maybe statistically likely, doesn't mean

1260
01:12:34,400 --> 01:12:37,679
Speaker 1: that you should automatically default to ruining someone's life over

1261
01:12:37,720 --> 01:12:40,880
Speaker 1: it before you have enough information. And I mean it's

1262
01:12:41,280 --> 01:12:43,040
Speaker 1: I mean, we don't have to talk anymore about Gabby

1263
01:12:43,080 --> 01:12:45,880
Speaker 1: Petito case in particular, but it's it is like we

1264
01:12:45,920 --> 01:12:50,040
Speaker 1: haven't figured it out. That's for funing sure, um and

1265
01:12:50,080 --> 01:12:53,360
Speaker 1: it is like it makes me uncomfortable to um engage

1266
01:12:53,400 --> 01:12:55,680
Speaker 1: in it because of what you're saying. Case. It's like

1267
01:12:55,720 --> 01:12:58,439
Speaker 1: because people are making Yeah, it's real people and the

1268
01:12:58,479 --> 01:13:01,280
Speaker 1: internet at large and people at large are always going

1269
01:13:01,320 --> 01:13:05,960
Speaker 1: to default to very race and class based assumptions about

1270
01:13:06,000 --> 01:13:11,240
Speaker 1: people that can truly like destroy someone's life. And also

1271
01:13:11,320 --> 01:13:13,240
Speaker 1: a lot of women are killed by their intimate partners.

1272
01:13:13,280 --> 01:13:15,640
Speaker 1: It's just like so complicated, and this movie makes it

1273
01:13:16,000 --> 01:13:24,240
Speaker 1: funy Uh, let's take another quick break and then we

1274
01:13:24,280 --> 01:13:33,760
Speaker 1: will come right back and we're back. Can we talk

1275
01:13:33,800 --> 01:13:38,640
Speaker 1: about Henry Golden's character, because he was also very complicated

1276
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:42,160
Speaker 1: of a character in terms of like he's met. Yeah,

1277
01:13:42,200 --> 01:13:45,559
Speaker 1: there's like suggestions that he's maybe having an affair. We

1278
01:13:45,640 --> 01:13:50,320
Speaker 1: see him more or less gas lighting Stephanie when she's

1279
01:13:50,400 --> 01:13:54,559
Speaker 1: like it seems like maybe Emily is alive, and he's like,

1280
01:13:54,920 --> 01:13:58,679
Speaker 1: let me just call the psychology department because you seem

1281
01:13:58,720 --> 01:14:02,439
Speaker 1: cuckoo bananas. Um. You know, there's these different things. But

1282
01:14:02,439 --> 01:14:07,120
Speaker 1: then also he does really seem to love his wife

1283
01:14:07,160 --> 01:14:10,800
Speaker 1: and like want the best for her. But he's also

1284
01:14:11,560 --> 01:14:15,240
Speaker 1: to me, he feels like an unreliable narrator who's not

1285
01:14:15,280 --> 01:14:19,360
Speaker 1: the narrator. I guess just he's an unreliable character because

1286
01:14:20,000 --> 01:14:22,280
Speaker 1: I'm like, how much does he know? How much is

1287
01:14:22,320 --> 01:14:26,599
Speaker 1: he involved in this scheme? Like whose side is he on?

1288
01:14:26,760 --> 01:14:28,760
Speaker 1: Is he on anybody's side? There's like a lot of

1289
01:14:28,800 --> 01:14:34,000
Speaker 1: But I almost wish we understood better what his situation was,

1290
01:14:34,040 --> 01:14:38,320
Speaker 1: because I just left with a bunch of questions about him.

1291
01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:41,280
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, I feel like he's hard

1292
01:14:41,320 --> 01:14:42,920
Speaker 1: to read, and like, now that I've seen it a

1293
01:14:42,960 --> 01:14:44,880
Speaker 1: couple of times, it's more obvious to me that he

1294
01:14:45,120 --> 01:14:48,680
Speaker 1: isn't involved in genuinely doesn't know anything, but if you're

1295
01:14:48,680 --> 01:14:50,400
Speaker 1: watching it for the first time, like, it's very easy

1296
01:14:50,439 --> 01:14:52,200
Speaker 1: to think that he's in on it and gaslighting her.

1297
01:14:52,240 --> 01:14:54,599
Speaker 1: Because the thing that the one thing that I will

1298
01:14:54,600 --> 01:14:55,960
Speaker 1: say in defense of him is that I don't think

1299
01:14:55,960 --> 01:15:00,000
Speaker 1: that he was gaslighting Stephanie only because he genuinely believe

1300
01:15:00,040 --> 01:15:03,920
Speaker 1: his wife was dead and so he was wrong, but

1301
01:15:04,000 --> 01:15:08,640
Speaker 1: he wasn't trying to trick her. It wasn't intentionally Okay, yeah, yeah,

1302
01:15:08,880 --> 01:15:10,920
Speaker 1: So that that's the one thing I was in defense

1303
01:15:10,920 --> 01:15:13,760
Speaker 1: of him. On the other hand, I think that it

1304
01:15:13,920 --> 01:15:17,200
Speaker 1: is very suspicious, and I think the movie plays on

1305
01:15:17,240 --> 01:15:20,200
Speaker 1: that that he is just really real happy about moving on,

1306
01:15:20,439 --> 01:15:22,559
Speaker 1: Like it does not take him two seconds. He's like

1307
01:15:22,640 --> 01:15:25,120
Speaker 1: less moving like I want to be with you. You're

1308
01:15:25,160 --> 01:15:26,519
Speaker 1: the person that makes me the one the man that

1309
01:15:26,560 --> 01:15:28,000
Speaker 1: I want to be And I'm like, girl, like your

1310
01:15:28,200 --> 01:15:32,600
Speaker 1: your wife just died. Slow down for two seconds. Like

1311
01:15:32,640 --> 01:15:35,280
Speaker 1: he is very sketched. And also feel like that's not

1312
01:15:35,400 --> 01:15:39,640
Speaker 1: very considerate of her either of like yeah, and like

1313
01:15:40,200 --> 01:15:43,800
Speaker 1: on the one hand, it's like men do that they're

1314
01:15:43,880 --> 01:15:47,439
Speaker 1: very bad at being alone, but on the other she's

1315
01:15:47,520 --> 01:15:51,920
Speaker 1: literally her best friend maybe chill for two seconds, because like,

1316
01:15:52,040 --> 01:15:54,000
Speaker 1: I don't know what the timeline is on this movie,

1317
01:15:54,040 --> 01:15:57,720
Speaker 1: but it does seem very fast. It does. Yeah, And

1318
01:15:57,760 --> 01:16:00,519
Speaker 1: again that's what makes it all the wilder than it's like, Oh,

1319
01:16:00,560 --> 01:16:03,559
Speaker 1: it does seem like Stephanie is sharing all of these

1320
01:16:03,600 --> 01:16:08,320
Speaker 1: details with her vlog audience that really like, if I whatever,

1321
01:16:08,479 --> 01:16:11,760
Speaker 1: we're all there. But if I were like moving in

1322
01:16:11,840 --> 01:16:14,920
Speaker 1: with my quote unquote best friend who I've only met

1323
01:16:14,960 --> 01:16:18,240
Speaker 1: five times, by the way, but it was really intense

1324
01:16:18,360 --> 01:16:22,439
Speaker 1: five five hangouts. Um, but like, if you're moving into

1325
01:16:22,520 --> 01:16:25,280
Speaker 1: I would not tell anybody. I would not tell anyone

1326
01:16:25,760 --> 01:16:28,519
Speaker 1: much less because anyone who wanted to know, because at

1327
01:16:28,520 --> 01:16:32,160
Speaker 1: one point she does her vlog from Emily and Shawn's

1328
01:16:32,280 --> 01:16:35,000
Speaker 1: kitchen and anyone who's like paying attention and be like

1329
01:16:35,400 --> 01:16:41,000
Speaker 1: whose kitchen are you in? Like why? But yeah, that

1330
01:16:41,360 --> 01:16:44,760
Speaker 1: they both needed to just simmer down a bit. But um,

1331
01:16:46,160 --> 01:16:49,040
Speaker 1: but then it also is like, again I don't want to,

1332
01:16:49,439 --> 01:16:54,240
Speaker 1: but it's like Stephanie is so motivated by being deeply

1333
01:16:54,400 --> 01:16:57,519
Speaker 1: lonely that I feel like it's also like Sean and

1334
01:16:57,600 --> 01:16:59,519
Speaker 1: it's I couldn't tell. I was like, does Sean know

1335
01:16:59,600 --> 01:17:02,040
Speaker 1: her well enough to know that he's kind of like

1336
01:17:02,800 --> 01:17:06,080
Speaker 1: triggering something in her by pushing this relationship for it

1337
01:17:06,160 --> 01:17:07,920
Speaker 1: so quickly, it doesn't seem like he does know enough.

1338
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:10,160
Speaker 1: I feel like he just doesn't know enough information about anyone.

1339
01:17:10,280 --> 01:17:12,960
Speaker 1: He doesn't. I feel like he doesn't he doesn't know

1340
01:17:12,960 --> 01:17:16,200
Speaker 1: where any better than Emily did. She just took care

1341
01:17:16,240 --> 01:17:18,840
Speaker 1: of his kid a couple of times. Like that's it's

1342
01:17:18,880 --> 01:17:21,720
Speaker 1: like they don't know each other and they have that, Yeah,

1343
01:17:21,760 --> 01:17:23,720
Speaker 1: they have that like one hot moment and then they

1344
01:17:23,720 --> 01:17:25,960
Speaker 1: sleep together and like that's great, but that's when enough

1345
01:17:26,000 --> 01:17:28,000
Speaker 1: to up end your life and move your kid out

1346
01:17:28,000 --> 01:17:32,120
Speaker 1: of his house. And I understand her motivation because you're right,

1347
01:17:32,120 --> 01:17:34,400
Speaker 1: like she's lonely, but that doesn't explain to his behavior.

1348
01:17:35,040 --> 01:17:38,200
Speaker 1: I feel like he just moves so fast. And I

1349
01:17:38,280 --> 01:17:41,080
Speaker 1: think that the movie does like use that as a

1350
01:17:41,120 --> 01:17:43,880
Speaker 1: way to kind of like raise suspicion about him and

1351
01:17:43,880 --> 01:17:48,240
Speaker 1: like kind of you know, um misdirect the audience. But

1352
01:17:48,800 --> 01:17:52,479
Speaker 1: he's so like like even even when Emily finally comes

1353
01:17:52,520 --> 01:17:56,680
Speaker 1: back and reveals herself to him, and then when the

1354
01:17:56,720 --> 01:17:59,759
Speaker 1: detectives find out about it after she comes back on purpose,

1355
01:18:00,600 --> 01:18:02,200
Speaker 1: he asked him like, well, so you knew that she

1356
01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:04,679
Speaker 1: was alive and you didn't like say anything, And I'm like, yeah,

1357
01:18:04,720 --> 01:18:09,000
Speaker 1: that's suspicious. Why didn't you say anything? Like I don't write.

1358
01:18:08,560 --> 01:18:13,080
Speaker 1: Why would you not mention that, especially given that he

1359
01:18:13,160 --> 01:18:16,559
Speaker 1: spent the last couple of weeks of like of Stephanie

1360
01:18:16,640 --> 01:18:18,920
Speaker 1: being like she's alive, I promise she's alive and him

1361
01:18:18,960 --> 01:18:21,400
Speaker 1: being like, no, she's definitely dead. You now know that

1362
01:18:21,439 --> 01:18:24,599
Speaker 1: she was right, So why wouldn't you say anything? Right?

1363
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:27,200
Speaker 1: Which is like my first feeling in particular, I was like, oh,

1364
01:18:27,240 --> 01:18:30,680
Speaker 1: this guy is like guilty as fuck, Like why I

1365
01:18:30,720 --> 01:18:35,200
Speaker 1: still don't quite get Sean eludes me. He eludes me,

1366
01:18:35,360 --> 01:18:38,200
Speaker 1: and every time thing I think that he's just very

1367
01:18:38,320 --> 01:18:43,479
Speaker 1: very silly. What a goofy guy. They're like, yeah, like

1368
01:18:44,080 --> 01:18:46,280
Speaker 1: I do think it's fun, Like he is kind of

1369
01:18:46,360 --> 01:18:48,599
Speaker 1: the element that he's kind of this like one hit

1370
01:18:48,640 --> 01:18:51,400
Speaker 1: wonder kind of guy, where like he wrote a book

1371
01:18:51,439 --> 01:18:54,280
Speaker 1: what presumably in his early twenties and now he's like

1372
01:18:54,520 --> 01:18:57,920
Speaker 1: in his mid thirties, Like I'm really getting around to it,

1373
01:18:58,240 --> 01:19:01,120
Speaker 1: you know any second now? Is Oh I know that

1374
01:19:01,160 --> 01:19:06,120
Speaker 1: guy that I am that guy? I feel like sometimes

1375
01:19:06,120 --> 01:19:10,639
Speaker 1: you are that guy. Um, well, let's talk a little

1376
01:19:10,640 --> 01:19:15,280
Speaker 1: bit about Emily and her um, her background because there

1377
01:19:15,320 --> 01:19:18,599
Speaker 1: because there's in the back half of this movie, Holy

1378
01:19:18,600 --> 01:19:22,280
Speaker 1: sh it, there's a lot that comes up. Yeah, so

1379
01:19:22,320 --> 01:19:25,280
Speaker 1: there's a bunch of twists and turns as it pertains

1380
01:19:25,280 --> 01:19:27,000
Speaker 1: to Emily. I think one of the first things we

1381
01:19:27,600 --> 01:19:31,280
Speaker 1: learn about Emily that is never like explicitly stated. It

1382
01:19:31,360 --> 01:19:35,000
Speaker 1: is explicitly stated about her twin but not her, is

1383
01:19:35,040 --> 01:19:39,360
Speaker 1: that she has substance abuse issues. She is constantly drunk

1384
01:19:39,400 --> 01:19:41,799
Speaker 1: during the day. It's clearly had an effect on her marriage.

1385
01:19:41,960 --> 01:19:43,920
Speaker 1: She seems to be aware of this. She also seems

1386
01:19:43,920 --> 01:19:46,040
Speaker 1: to be aware that it's had an effect on her parenting.

1387
01:19:46,760 --> 01:19:48,680
Speaker 1: But it also, like I thought it was interesting the

1388
01:19:48,680 --> 01:19:51,600
Speaker 1: way that's presented, because it is reference constantly that it

1389
01:19:51,720 --> 01:19:56,479
Speaker 1: is like a detriment to her family um, But in

1390
01:19:56,520 --> 01:19:58,920
Speaker 1: the same way, it's also presented as like part of

1391
01:19:58,920 --> 01:20:02,640
Speaker 1: what makes her a cool from fatal character, which I

1392
01:20:02,680 --> 01:20:04,840
Speaker 1: just think is I guess I don't really know, Like

1393
01:20:04,920 --> 01:20:07,639
Speaker 1: many things in this movie, I don't know which which

1394
01:20:07,640 --> 01:20:09,760
Speaker 1: way to really fall on how I feel about that.

1395
01:20:09,840 --> 01:20:12,400
Speaker 1: I do think it's interesting that both sides of that

1396
01:20:12,439 --> 01:20:15,600
Speaker 1: coin are presented to the viewer of like, yeah, you know,

1397
01:20:15,720 --> 01:20:19,840
Speaker 1: she's drinking a handle of vodka a day, but doesn't

1398
01:20:19,880 --> 01:20:24,000
Speaker 1: she look good doing it? And you're like, well, yes,

1399
01:20:24,200 --> 01:20:27,160
Speaker 1: but also her like I mean that moment like after

1400
01:20:27,240 --> 01:20:31,040
Speaker 1: she quote unquote dies but doesn't where Sean like has

1401
01:20:31,080 --> 01:20:33,920
Speaker 1: a moment where he's angry about it and he's like, oh,

1402
01:20:34,000 --> 01:20:36,639
Speaker 1: you miss your mom, like that lady who got drunk

1403
01:20:36,640 --> 01:20:38,160
Speaker 1: in the middle of the day all the time, And

1404
01:20:38,160 --> 01:20:41,000
Speaker 1: you're like, yikes. This is like this family is like

1405
01:20:41,840 --> 01:20:45,280
Speaker 1: was truly affected, but it's not really. It's it's weird

1406
01:20:45,280 --> 01:20:49,960
Speaker 1: because it's presented as a genuine substance abuse issue with

1407
01:20:50,120 --> 01:20:53,360
Speaker 1: her mother and her twin sister who also had issues

1408
01:20:53,400 --> 01:20:57,920
Speaker 1: with abusing drugs, um and drug addiction. But when it

1409
01:20:57,960 --> 01:21:01,519
Speaker 1: comes to Emily, it's cool. Question Mark, that was one

1410
01:21:01,560 --> 01:21:05,080
Speaker 1: thing that was like one thing. I was like, I agree, Actually,

1411
01:21:05,600 --> 01:21:08,040
Speaker 1: it's because it wasn't until you just said that I

1412
01:21:08,080 --> 01:21:09,920
Speaker 1: was like, oh, yeah, she was like fully an alcoholic,

1413
01:21:10,320 --> 01:21:12,479
Speaker 1: Like it just dawned on me. Which is not a

1414
01:21:12,560 --> 01:21:15,479
Speaker 1: judgment statement, but it's like it seems to be inherent

1415
01:21:15,520 --> 01:21:20,160
Speaker 1: to that character. Yeah. I wonder if this is commentary

1416
01:21:20,320 --> 01:21:23,840
Speaker 1: or not. Let me know what you think, but I

1417
01:21:23,880 --> 01:21:27,240
Speaker 1: wonder if it's like a because of the class component.

1418
01:21:28,000 --> 01:21:32,600
Speaker 1: People perceive substance abuse differently depending on your class. It

1419
01:21:32,640 --> 01:21:35,840
Speaker 1: reminds me of a joke from Rock. Well, that's yeah,

1420
01:21:35,840 --> 01:21:37,519
Speaker 1: that's for sure true. So I don't know if the

1421
01:21:37,520 --> 01:21:40,720
Speaker 1: way it's being presented in this movie is commentary on

1422
01:21:40,760 --> 01:21:43,799
Speaker 1: that or not, if it's just sort of like leaning

1423
01:21:43,800 --> 01:21:47,120
Speaker 1: into that without really commenting on it. But it reminds

1424
01:21:47,120 --> 01:21:48,680
Speaker 1: me of this joke in thirty Rock, and I'm going

1425
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:50,519
Speaker 1: to butcher it because I don't remember it exactly, but

1426
01:21:50,560 --> 01:21:55,080
Speaker 1: it's something like Alec Baldwin is like, oh, it's just

1427
01:21:55,160 --> 01:21:59,160
Speaker 1: like being business drunk and it's like legal to drive

1428
01:21:59,240 --> 01:22:03,160
Speaker 1: when you're The implication being if you're wealthy enough, you

1429
01:22:03,200 --> 01:22:07,400
Speaker 1: can be drunk and drive or do whatever and you

1430
01:22:07,479 --> 01:22:12,320
Speaker 1: won't face any repercussions because of your like elevated privilege

1431
01:22:12,320 --> 01:22:15,800
Speaker 1: in class and stuff like that. So because Emily has

1432
01:22:15,840 --> 01:22:19,000
Speaker 1: this like high powered job and she's drinking fancy martinis

1433
01:22:19,000 --> 01:22:22,000
Speaker 1: and like doing them in a very fancy way, it's

1434
01:22:22,080 --> 01:22:25,479
Speaker 1: like not as easy to perceive her as you know,

1435
01:22:25,560 --> 01:22:30,559
Speaker 1: someone who's struggling with substance abuse issues, versus her twin sister,

1436
01:22:31,040 --> 01:22:34,360
Speaker 1: who has clearly been like down on her luck for

1437
01:22:34,400 --> 01:22:39,320
Speaker 1: several years and is uh, you know, financially struggling, and

1438
01:22:39,880 --> 01:22:43,439
Speaker 1: her substance abuse is much more apparent because of that.

1439
01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:45,960
Speaker 1: So I don't know. Yeah, I don't know what the

1440
01:22:46,000 --> 01:22:48,920
Speaker 1: movie is like saying about it, if anything. And Jeane

1441
01:22:48,960 --> 01:22:53,400
Speaker 1: Smarts character as well, who we see drinking and who

1442
01:22:53,560 --> 01:22:56,400
Speaker 1: we're told explicitly on screen like, oh, she shouldn't be drinking.

1443
01:22:56,439 --> 01:22:58,439
Speaker 1: So I did think it was interesting that they went

1444
01:22:59,080 --> 01:23:02,599
Speaker 1: and this again at like, this is not a universal truth,

1445
01:23:02,640 --> 01:23:06,479
Speaker 1: but it is certainly something that happens of you know,

1446
01:23:06,520 --> 01:23:09,559
Speaker 1: substance abuse being a hereditary issue, and so I thought

1447
01:23:09,600 --> 01:23:11,599
Speaker 1: it was interesting that you saw that her mother is

1448
01:23:11,640 --> 01:23:16,160
Speaker 1: clearly struggling with something similar. But again it's just like

1449
01:23:16,680 --> 01:23:19,200
Speaker 1: to what end, It doesn't really play out in Emily's

1450
01:23:19,280 --> 01:23:21,200
Speaker 1: character at all. You're sort of you sort of assumed

1451
01:23:21,200 --> 01:23:22,920
Speaker 1: that if she didn't go to prison, she would continue

1452
01:23:22,960 --> 01:23:29,160
Speaker 1: day drinking indefinitely and it would always be really sexy. Yeah,

1453
01:23:29,280 --> 01:23:32,360
Speaker 1: I think for me, I think Jane smot is the

1454
01:23:32,400 --> 01:23:34,080
Speaker 1: reason why I would say that, I don't think that

1455
01:23:34,080 --> 01:23:37,040
Speaker 1: it's meant to be class commentary only because for me,

1456
01:23:37,479 --> 01:23:39,800
Speaker 1: what made it obvious that the sister and the mom

1457
01:23:39,800 --> 01:23:43,080
Speaker 1: are struggling substance versus Emily is that Emily is always

1458
01:23:43,080 --> 01:23:47,160
Speaker 1: in control of her faculties. Like when we meet Faith,

1459
01:23:47,680 --> 01:23:50,920
Speaker 1: she looks strung out, she looks like she's been using

1460
01:23:51,000 --> 01:23:54,559
Speaker 1: drugs um, she's emaciated, her hair as a mess, and

1461
01:23:54,880 --> 01:23:58,280
Speaker 1: similar to Jane Spot's character the mom she is, you know,

1462
01:23:58,320 --> 01:23:59,960
Speaker 1: she's like in a dizzie she's lying around the how

1463
01:24:00,120 --> 01:24:03,519
Speaker 1: was like she she looks like she is under the influence,

1464
01:24:03,560 --> 01:24:07,360
Speaker 1: as opposed to Emily, who's just like sexily doing sexy

1465
01:24:07,400 --> 01:24:10,160
Speaker 1: things with a Martinique pass. And it makes me think

1466
01:24:10,840 --> 01:24:15,160
Speaker 1: of Olivia Pope from Scandal, who like also drunk exorbitant

1467
01:24:15,240 --> 01:24:20,479
Speaker 1: amount the time, but like the functioning alcoholic of all time, right,

1468
01:24:20,600 --> 01:24:22,679
Speaker 1: and she but like she's always in control, like that's

1469
01:24:22,720 --> 01:24:26,160
Speaker 1: that's her thing. And so that was another show where

1470
01:24:26,320 --> 01:24:29,479
Speaker 1: it didn't occur to me that like she literally only

1471
01:24:29,880 --> 01:24:32,520
Speaker 1: eats popcorn and drinks wine like she is an alcoholic.

1472
01:24:33,120 --> 01:24:35,559
Speaker 1: But it doesn't like it doesn't like register because she's

1473
01:24:35,600 --> 01:24:39,960
Speaker 1: she's always in control. She's never having um, you know,

1474
01:24:40,080 --> 01:24:43,760
Speaker 1: like accidents or getting black out drunk or throwing up

1475
01:24:43,800 --> 01:24:47,120
Speaker 1: everywhere or missing meetings like the one time that she

1476
01:24:47,200 --> 01:24:49,240
Speaker 1: ever spilled wine on her white couches because she was

1477
01:24:49,320 --> 01:24:56,640
Speaker 1: kidnapped by the deep state, like it like so you

1478
01:24:56,760 --> 01:24:59,120
Speaker 1: never like because of that. I think that it's the

1479
01:24:59,240 --> 01:25:02,759
Speaker 1: it's the the depiction of those characters as like fully

1480
01:25:02,760 --> 01:25:05,240
Speaker 1: in control of their faculties that makes the difference in

1481
01:25:05,280 --> 01:25:07,320
Speaker 1: whether or not you perceived them as having a substance

1482
01:25:07,320 --> 01:25:10,679
Speaker 1: to this problem, because like Black Live is tall, Carrie

1483
01:25:10,680 --> 01:25:13,840
Speaker 1: Washington is like smaller but like not a very tall person.

1484
01:25:13,920 --> 01:25:17,680
Speaker 1: Like the volumes of alcohol that she was allegedly consuming

1485
01:25:18,280 --> 01:25:22,559
Speaker 1: should have her flat on her back, right, yes, yes,

1486
01:25:22,840 --> 01:25:25,080
Speaker 1: And it's I mean I think that that is like

1487
01:25:25,080 --> 01:25:28,320
Speaker 1: like whatever fictional signaling that that play. I mean, at

1488
01:25:28,360 --> 01:25:30,280
Speaker 1: least in the case of Scandal, I mean, it for

1489
01:25:30,360 --> 01:25:32,840
Speaker 1: sure just plays into like this is the trope rich

1490
01:25:32,880 --> 01:25:36,960
Speaker 1: people can drink forever and still be the greatest people

1491
01:25:37,000 --> 01:25:39,320
Speaker 1: in the world. And I don't know the Scandal, I'm like,

1492
01:25:39,400 --> 01:25:42,280
Speaker 1: you know what, find whatever, I'm gonna keep watching it.

1493
01:25:42,320 --> 01:25:44,000
Speaker 1: I'm gonna keep watching it before I go to bed.

1494
01:25:44,120 --> 01:25:47,880
Speaker 1: So it's above reproach. But but yeah, I mean, in

1495
01:25:47,880 --> 01:25:50,880
Speaker 1: this case, it's just I with Scandal, it makes more

1496
01:25:51,439 --> 01:25:54,519
Speaker 1: sense to me because it's not like there are a

1497
01:25:54,600 --> 01:25:58,639
Speaker 1: lot of clear foils to that logic. Like it's just like, oh,

1498
01:25:58,680 --> 01:26:01,439
Speaker 1: this is Olivia Pope. This is like the in this

1499
01:26:01,560 --> 01:26:04,320
Speaker 1: world you can drink wine all day and still be

1500
01:26:04,439 --> 01:26:07,479
Speaker 1: the most high functioning, amazing person on the planet. And

1501
01:26:07,479 --> 01:26:10,800
Speaker 1: that is just true here where we are. But in

1502
01:26:10,840 --> 01:26:13,800
Speaker 1: this movie it's like both things are true. You can

1503
01:26:14,120 --> 01:26:16,160
Speaker 1: like I don't know again, I just like I just

1504
01:26:16,200 --> 01:26:19,400
Speaker 1: thought it was interesting when they went, and it wasn't

1505
01:26:19,439 --> 01:26:21,120
Speaker 1: until like they went as far as to show you

1506
01:26:21,160 --> 01:26:24,920
Speaker 1: that her mother also seems to be an alcoholic maybe

1507
01:26:24,920 --> 01:26:29,919
Speaker 1: and recovering alcoholic TOSM extent. It's just and and and

1508
01:26:30,080 --> 01:26:32,760
Speaker 1: she says over and over that it's like she's a

1509
01:26:32,800 --> 01:26:36,200
Speaker 1: bad mother. And that's another thing about Emily's character that

1510
01:26:36,280 --> 01:26:41,080
Speaker 1: I mean Emily, like that scene where she looks so beautiful,

1511
01:26:41,280 --> 01:26:45,120
Speaker 1: like but she shows up, like the scene where Anna

1512
01:26:45,280 --> 01:26:48,439
Speaker 1: Kendrick takes her picture and she says all these like

1513
01:26:48,520 --> 01:26:53,000
Speaker 1: casually like brutal things about herself in a very casual

1514
01:26:53,040 --> 01:26:54,960
Speaker 1: way where she's just like the best thing I can

1515
01:26:55,000 --> 01:26:57,200
Speaker 1: do for my son is to blow my brains out,

1516
01:26:57,240 --> 01:27:00,000
Speaker 1: and like, don't denigrate your good parenting to make up

1517
01:27:00,040 --> 01:27:02,320
Speaker 1: for my shitty parenting, Like she's saying like I'm a

1518
01:27:02,360 --> 01:27:07,120
Speaker 1: bad parent, like saying like really really gnarly stuff. So

1519
01:27:07,160 --> 01:27:09,640
Speaker 1: it's like she knows, I don't know. I don't know.

1520
01:27:09,720 --> 01:27:11,600
Speaker 1: It's just weird. I like it. I like it, but

1521
01:27:11,640 --> 01:27:14,720
Speaker 1: it's weird. Yeah, I think because at that point in

1522
01:27:14,760 --> 01:27:18,040
Speaker 1: the movie we don't know any of the backstory, and

1523
01:27:18,080 --> 01:27:20,679
Speaker 1: I think it's supposed to be part of her charm

1524
01:27:20,760 --> 01:27:23,160
Speaker 1: that she's like, no, parenting is hard, like I'm bad

1525
01:27:23,200 --> 01:27:26,599
Speaker 1: at it, and like it's supposed to be like I'm

1526
01:27:26,640 --> 01:27:28,679
Speaker 1: telling the truth things that like no one wants to say,

1527
01:27:28,720 --> 01:27:31,519
Speaker 1: as opposed to like no, I'm actually a neglectful person

1528
01:27:31,560 --> 01:27:35,200
Speaker 1: to my child and we don't know that until later.

1529
01:27:35,240 --> 01:27:37,360
Speaker 1: Because even even Stephanie's like no, I think you're a

1530
01:27:37,360 --> 01:27:41,120
Speaker 1: great mom. But that's also part of just like social graces, right,

1531
01:27:41,160 --> 01:27:43,360
Speaker 1: Like you don't someone says something shitty about themselves, You

1532
01:27:43,400 --> 01:27:48,920
Speaker 1: don't it's not true. Yeah, yeah, I agree with you. O. Yeah,

1533
01:27:48,960 --> 01:27:56,000
Speaker 1: I guess you are really late. So so I'm not.

1534
01:27:56,080 --> 01:27:58,360
Speaker 1: I feel like I think you're right that like she

1535
01:27:58,600 --> 01:28:01,240
Speaker 1: does know, But I think that's that's also part of

1536
01:28:01,280 --> 01:28:04,479
Speaker 1: like the fun that Emily has, like saying the true

1537
01:28:04,520 --> 01:28:08,000
Speaker 1: things out loud, and like making people squirm the first

1538
01:28:08,040 --> 01:28:11,120
Speaker 1: few lines of dialogue out of her mouth, and then

1539
01:28:11,160 --> 01:28:14,000
Speaker 1: like a couple of scenes beyond that, she's saying, like

1540
01:28:14,720 --> 01:28:17,519
Speaker 1: I was laughing. She's like, I can't have a play

1541
01:28:17,640 --> 01:28:20,080
Speaker 1: date with you, boring mom, mommy lady, I have a

1542
01:28:20,080 --> 01:28:24,200
Speaker 1: play date with the symphony of antidepressants. And then her

1543
01:28:24,200 --> 01:28:27,000
Speaker 1: son's like, you never let me do anything fun, and

1544
01:28:27,120 --> 01:28:30,240
Speaker 1: Emily's like, that's not true. I let you rip my

1545
01:28:30,479 --> 01:28:32,840
Speaker 1: labia when I pushed you out of my body. You know,

1546
01:28:32,920 --> 01:28:36,440
Speaker 1: like all this stuff, You're just like, wow, I deliciously

1547
01:28:36,520 --> 01:28:39,439
Speaker 1: grass my best friend or be my wife, doesn't matter.

1548
01:28:39,840 --> 01:28:42,559
Speaker 1: She should she should be the writer in this family,

1549
01:28:42,680 --> 01:28:47,800
Speaker 1: not Sean. Right, that is always fun when a writer

1550
01:28:47,920 --> 01:28:50,200
Speaker 1: has like a way more interesting partner. And I'm like, well,

1551
01:28:50,280 --> 01:28:51,960
Speaker 1: I guess I know where you're getting all this ship from.

1552
01:28:52,040 --> 01:28:54,559
Speaker 1: That you just have a factory of material with you.

1553
01:28:55,040 --> 01:28:58,720
Speaker 1: Emily's everybody's muse. She is, She's some people just walk

1554
01:28:58,760 --> 01:29:01,000
Speaker 1: in the light like that, And I guess that that

1555
01:29:01,160 --> 01:29:04,519
Speaker 1: that also does like that also ties into her whole

1556
01:29:04,600 --> 01:29:10,040
Speaker 1: like stop apologizing her annoyance with which is like, alright,

1557
01:29:10,080 --> 01:29:12,960
Speaker 1: it's weird. When we're recording this, it already does feel

1558
01:29:12,960 --> 01:29:16,520
Speaker 1: like a very eighteen thing to like girls stop apologizing.

1559
01:29:16,600 --> 01:29:18,639
Speaker 1: But but in the in the world of this movie,

1560
01:29:20,120 --> 01:29:22,439
Speaker 1: I think it works, and the way that Emily presents it,

1561
01:29:22,520 --> 01:29:24,439
Speaker 1: and then the way that Stephanie takes it to such

1562
01:29:24,439 --> 01:29:27,599
Speaker 1: an extreme that at the end she puts her best

1563
01:29:27,600 --> 01:29:29,679
Speaker 1: friend in jail, and it's like, oh, I'm not sorry,

1564
01:29:30,200 --> 01:29:32,360
Speaker 1: Like I thought that. There is like a good amount

1565
01:29:32,360 --> 01:29:36,240
Speaker 1: of commentary there on like, yes, women, like women are

1566
01:29:36,400 --> 01:29:39,880
Speaker 1: socially conditioned to apologize a lot, but but sometimes, you know,

1567
01:29:39,920 --> 01:29:41,960
Speaker 1: sometimes you do something sucked up you have to apologize.

1568
01:29:43,040 --> 01:29:47,160
Speaker 1: Because Emily says to Stephanie, don't apologize, it's a fucked

1569
01:29:47,200 --> 01:29:50,559
Speaker 1: up female habit. You don't need to be sorry for

1570
01:29:50,600 --> 01:29:53,080
Speaker 1: anything ever, And it's like, well that's not that part,

1571
01:29:53,120 --> 01:29:58,160
Speaker 1: isn't true, Like sometimes you like probably should apologize, right

1572
01:29:58,640 --> 01:30:04,719
Speaker 1: and not if you're a chaotic by sexual No. Oh man,

1573
01:30:04,880 --> 01:30:07,760
Speaker 1: this whole conversation is making me like the movie even more.

1574
01:30:08,080 --> 01:30:13,479
Speaker 1: Um uh, what else we got? What else we got?

1575
01:30:13,600 --> 01:30:17,759
Speaker 1: I find it interesting And maybe this comment isn't even

1576
01:30:17,960 --> 01:30:22,360
Speaker 1: totally fair. But this is a movie about female friendship

1577
01:30:22,640 --> 01:30:26,040
Speaker 1: more or less. But it's basically a movie where if

1578
01:30:26,400 --> 01:30:31,960
Speaker 1: two women try to be friends. Look what happens, but

1579
01:30:32,120 --> 01:30:34,960
Speaker 1: cautionary tale, which wouldn't be that big of a deal.

1580
01:30:35,080 --> 01:30:37,840
Speaker 1: But there are so many movies like this that hinge

1581
01:30:37,880 --> 01:30:42,320
Speaker 1: on a narrative of like two women meeting and then

1582
01:30:42,439 --> 01:30:44,880
Speaker 1: ending up hating each other or ending up like trying

1583
01:30:44,880 --> 01:30:48,599
Speaker 1: to screw each other over. Usually those stories are written

1584
01:30:48,600 --> 01:30:55,520
Speaker 1: by men, because men don't understand um things. But yeah,

1585
01:30:55,640 --> 01:30:57,519
Speaker 1: but I guess that's why it doesn't bother me as

1586
01:30:57,640 --> 01:31:02,240
Speaker 1: much here, because I understand why they don't. Like I mean,

1587
01:31:02,280 --> 01:31:04,120
Speaker 1: that's really all I mean. And I do think that

1588
01:31:04,160 --> 01:31:07,080
Speaker 1: there should be more move you know, media in general,

1589
01:31:07,080 --> 01:31:10,080
Speaker 1: where it's just like women being friends and connecting with

1590
01:31:10,120 --> 01:31:13,200
Speaker 1: each other. I just record something about Little Women where

1591
01:31:13,200 --> 01:31:17,280
Speaker 1: you're just like, oh, yeah, like watching women meaningfully connect

1592
01:31:17,320 --> 01:31:20,599
Speaker 1: with each other and occasionally how conflict is like, oh,

1593
01:31:20,640 --> 01:31:23,559
Speaker 1: it is such a really corner of the world to

1594
01:31:23,680 --> 01:31:27,000
Speaker 1: live in. But I do feel like in the case

1595
01:31:27,080 --> 01:31:28,960
Speaker 1: of this movie, I don't know all I want, like,

1596
01:31:29,040 --> 01:31:31,200
Speaker 1: if there are women in conflict, amazing. I just want

1597
01:31:31,240 --> 01:31:33,920
Speaker 1: to be able to wrap my head around why, like

1598
01:31:34,080 --> 01:31:36,559
Speaker 1: and sometimes with the men, with with the way that

1599
01:31:36,640 --> 01:31:39,200
Speaker 1: men right conflict between women, It just don't you're like

1600
01:31:39,240 --> 01:31:43,440
Speaker 1: this doesn't you don't understand, like that's that's very underdeveloped

1601
01:31:43,520 --> 01:31:45,800
Speaker 1: or like dissonant. But in this case, yeah, I don't

1602
01:31:45,840 --> 01:31:48,280
Speaker 1: feel like they're in conflict so much. Is that that

1603
01:31:48,320 --> 01:31:52,800
Speaker 1: they're at cross purposes. Like it's less that Stephanie is

1604
01:31:52,840 --> 01:31:56,479
Speaker 1: like against Emily or vice versa. It's more that, like

1605
01:31:57,200 --> 01:31:59,880
Speaker 1: one is trying to achieve something specific, the other is

1606
01:32:00,000 --> 01:32:02,400
Speaker 1: also trying to achieve something specific, and they both can't

1607
01:32:02,439 --> 01:32:05,040
Speaker 1: achieve the same thing or achieve their thing if the

1608
01:32:05,040 --> 01:32:07,639
Speaker 1: other person wins. So it's not that they're against each other.

1609
01:32:07,640 --> 01:32:11,160
Speaker 1: It's that they're trying to accomplish their goals, and their

1610
01:32:11,200 --> 01:32:14,840
Speaker 1: goals are contradictory. Right, that's it. That that's a perfect

1611
01:32:14,840 --> 01:32:16,360
Speaker 1: way to put it. I don't know, Yeah, it it

1612
01:32:16,360 --> 01:32:19,400
Speaker 1: didn't ping for me in this movie in particular, but

1613
01:32:19,439 --> 01:32:21,960
Speaker 1: I do. I mean, that's still obviously like a thing

1614
01:32:22,000 --> 01:32:27,240
Speaker 1: that still happens too frequently. Sure, yeah, yeah, does anyone

1615
01:32:27,280 --> 01:32:31,000
Speaker 1: have any other thoughts? I feel like we've just scratched

1616
01:32:31,040 --> 01:32:35,040
Speaker 1: the surface of this. I definitely just mentioned I noticed that.

1617
01:32:35,080 --> 01:32:37,439
Speaker 1: I mean, there is a fair amount of diversity in

1618
01:32:37,479 --> 01:32:41,760
Speaker 1: this cast, but it I mean, obviously, is this like

1619
01:32:42,040 --> 01:32:46,000
Speaker 1: you know, Battle of wits between these two white ladies,

1620
01:32:46,120 --> 01:32:49,160
Speaker 1: and they're like the queer characters and people of color,

1621
01:32:49,200 --> 01:32:52,200
Speaker 1: with the exception of Henry Golding, are kept on the

1622
01:32:52,280 --> 01:32:56,000
Speaker 1: comedic margins of the movie. There's like, there's so many

1623
01:32:56,040 --> 01:32:58,840
Speaker 1: good players that it's like I wish that, you know,

1624
01:32:58,880 --> 01:33:02,640
Speaker 1: like a part of nancial Or's there and use a

1625
01:33:02,720 --> 01:33:04,840
Speaker 1: mar I mean, Andrew Rails does get to hit Black

1626
01:33:04,880 --> 01:33:06,760
Speaker 1: Lively with a car so and then he gets out

1627
01:33:06,760 --> 01:33:12,680
Speaker 1: and he says, America's hybrids silent but deadly. And I'm like, like,

1628
01:33:13,240 --> 01:33:15,240
Speaker 1: I love any time that their ad screen. I just

1629
01:33:15,280 --> 01:33:17,080
Speaker 1: always have like, okay, give a word to do that,

1630
01:33:17,360 --> 01:33:19,280
Speaker 1: you know, but you know, you get you get to

1631
01:33:19,280 --> 01:33:21,679
Speaker 1: see them smoking a bong, you get to see Andrew

1632
01:33:21,680 --> 01:33:24,479
Speaker 1: Reynolds hit like Lively with a pre as you know,

1633
01:33:24,560 --> 01:33:26,360
Speaker 1: you do get some stuff. But yeah, I just felt

1634
01:33:26,360 --> 01:33:29,200
Speaker 1: like that was worth mentioning. Sure, I would like to

1635
01:33:29,280 --> 01:33:34,280
Speaker 1: mention that instead of a close trying on montage, there

1636
01:33:34,439 --> 01:33:40,439
Speaker 1: is a getting rid of clothes montage. Wow. But then

1637
01:33:40,439 --> 01:33:44,439
Speaker 1: that also confused me because we see that montage where

1638
01:33:44,760 --> 01:33:47,840
Speaker 1: Stephanie is getting she has moved into Emily's house, she

1639
01:33:47,920 --> 01:33:50,559
Speaker 1: clears out her closet, but then like she comes in

1640
01:33:50,880 --> 01:33:53,080
Speaker 1: whatever the next day or something like that, and all

1641
01:33:53,120 --> 01:33:56,080
Speaker 1: of Emily's stuff is back where it was. Is that

1642
01:33:56,160 --> 01:33:58,880
Speaker 1: to suggest that Emily like snuck in during the night

1643
01:33:59,000 --> 01:34:01,360
Speaker 1: and like put all of her clothes and shoes back.

1644
01:34:01,439 --> 01:34:04,160
Speaker 1: I hope, So, I think so right. I didn't even

1645
01:34:04,240 --> 01:34:06,880
Speaker 1: get that it was a different day because I was like,

1646
01:34:06,920 --> 01:34:09,000
Speaker 1: how did you do that? That bast that's weird. Yeah,

1647
01:34:09,000 --> 01:34:12,840
Speaker 1: I thought it was in this space went downstairs, I know,

1648
01:34:12,880 --> 01:34:14,960
Speaker 1: And I'm like, was this like a dream sequence? Like

1649
01:34:15,000 --> 01:34:17,880
Speaker 1: I was so confused by the whole thing. But anyway,

1650
01:34:17,920 --> 01:34:20,120
Speaker 1: we do see a getting rid of clothes montage, and

1651
01:34:20,120 --> 01:34:23,120
Speaker 1: I was like, I think that that's different. That's kind

1652
01:34:23,120 --> 01:34:26,160
Speaker 1: of funny too, because I I because we just had

1653
01:34:26,200 --> 01:34:29,120
Speaker 1: this like huge fem fay talel tropes discussion and how

1654
01:34:29,120 --> 01:34:32,400
Speaker 1: they're like sometimes perceived as being like kind of witchy

1655
01:34:32,680 --> 01:34:35,280
Speaker 1: characters that have magic. I think I just bought into

1656
01:34:35,320 --> 01:34:37,439
Speaker 1: that trope in that moment. I'm like, yeah, like Lively

1657
01:34:37,479 --> 01:34:41,400
Speaker 1: scrambled upstairs and put everything out there, of course you did. Yeah,

1658
01:34:41,040 --> 01:34:45,559
Speaker 1: that's her sense to me. Wow, Wow, I got femay

1659
01:34:45,600 --> 01:34:50,320
Speaker 1: tale pilled in that moment. Wow. Yeah, does anyone have

1660
01:34:50,320 --> 01:34:52,920
Speaker 1: anything else they want to talk about. I don't know.

1661
01:34:53,320 --> 01:34:57,360
Speaker 1: We talked about a lot. I don't know. I'm satisfied.

1662
01:34:57,760 --> 01:35:02,280
Speaker 1: I'm satisfied as well. And the movie, I mean, gang,

1663
01:35:02,360 --> 01:35:06,040
Speaker 1: does this movie pass the Bechtel test? Yes, yeah, yeah,

1664
01:35:07,040 --> 01:35:10,799
Speaker 1: super does. I would say more often than not. Maybe

1665
01:35:10,960 --> 01:35:14,120
Speaker 1: possibly kind of a rare example of a movie. Yeah

1666
01:35:14,160 --> 01:35:18,320
Speaker 1: that more conversations pass than don't. I mean, I haven't

1667
01:35:18,400 --> 01:35:21,360
Speaker 1: done the math the heart math on that, so don't

1668
01:35:21,439 --> 01:35:23,800
Speaker 1: quote me on it. This is not a math podcast.

1669
01:35:23,840 --> 01:35:27,000
Speaker 1: Is math podcast is not a book podcast, So relax.

1670
01:35:28,720 --> 01:35:34,599
Speaker 1: But it's just the girls circling up. And now I'm

1671
01:35:34,680 --> 01:35:38,680
Speaker 1: I'm I'm bisexual. I don't do math, but you do

1672
01:35:38,840 --> 01:35:44,080
Speaker 1: understand chaos theory because of how chaotic bisexuals are. It's

1673
01:35:44,120 --> 01:35:47,200
Speaker 1: just in me. Yeah, you are a scientist, you just

1674
01:35:47,240 --> 01:35:51,040
Speaker 1: don't do math. Um. Yes, definitely does pass the Becktel test.

1675
01:35:51,080 --> 01:35:54,480
Speaker 1: As far as our nipple scale zero to five nipples

1676
01:35:54,520 --> 01:35:58,639
Speaker 1: based on examining the movie through an intersectional feminist lens,

1677
01:35:59,479 --> 01:36:03,120
Speaker 1: Oh wow, I simply I simply don't know about a

1678
01:36:03,200 --> 01:36:07,800
Speaker 1: simple favor. I guess I would give this, like, I mean,

1679
01:36:07,960 --> 01:36:13,600
Speaker 1: it's rare. The movie where two women are the main

1680
01:36:13,800 --> 01:36:19,880
Speaker 1: players is like such a complicated and challenging and interesting

1681
01:36:20,080 --> 01:36:25,280
Speaker 1: movie that generates such an interesting discussion that alone makes

1682
01:36:25,320 --> 01:36:27,479
Speaker 1: me want to give it like three and a half

1683
01:36:27,560 --> 01:36:31,840
Speaker 1: or four nipples, maybe because even though I still don't

1684
01:36:31,920 --> 01:36:34,240
Speaker 1: quite know what to make of it, I do kind

1685
01:36:34,240 --> 01:36:37,439
Speaker 1: of part of me wanted the movie to end differently,

1686
01:36:37,640 --> 01:36:42,040
Speaker 1: where like the two women realize, wow, we actually are

1687
01:36:42,120 --> 01:36:46,920
Speaker 1: best friends, and um, we would stand a better chance

1688
01:36:47,120 --> 01:36:50,200
Speaker 1: if we just like team up and get rid of

1689
01:36:50,240 --> 01:36:55,719
Speaker 1: this goofball husband guy who will just apparently have sex

1690
01:36:55,760 --> 01:37:00,960
Speaker 1: with any woman nearby. Uh So let's screw him over

1691
01:37:01,360 --> 01:37:05,200
Speaker 1: and then team up and whatever, just like collect that

1692
01:37:05,240 --> 01:37:08,879
Speaker 1: four million dollars and have a ball and keep kissing

1693
01:37:08,880 --> 01:37:12,839
Speaker 1: each other. Um. That might have been like too silly

1694
01:37:12,880 --> 01:37:16,519
Speaker 1: and like to like girl power of an ending, but

1695
01:37:16,560 --> 01:37:21,360
Speaker 1: that is kind of what I was hoping for. Um,

1696
01:37:21,400 --> 01:37:25,439
Speaker 1: the heart wants what the heart wants. I know. Even so,

1697
01:37:25,880 --> 01:37:31,720
Speaker 1: it was a challenging, interesting movie. I appreciate a lot

1698
01:37:31,760 --> 01:37:34,400
Speaker 1: of what it was doing, as far as like commentary

1699
01:37:34,520 --> 01:37:38,160
Speaker 1: on like you know, middle class, upper middle class white

1700
01:37:38,320 --> 01:37:41,960
Speaker 1: lady being a girl boss, like because I mean, we

1701
01:37:42,000 --> 01:37:47,040
Speaker 1: don't really see Stephanie have any Karen moments, but she

1702
01:37:47,360 --> 01:37:52,240
Speaker 1: strikes me as like such a Karen. I feel like

1703
01:37:52,320 --> 01:37:55,080
Speaker 1: talking to the Boss was the Karen of it. That's true,

1704
01:37:55,120 --> 01:37:58,320
Speaker 1: It's true, Yeah, discount or was it low Rent tom Ford?

1705
01:37:58,560 --> 01:38:03,439
Speaker 1: That was? That was her? So yeah, I don't know

1706
01:38:03,479 --> 01:38:06,360
Speaker 1: the commentary on that. That's that's all interesting to me.

1707
01:38:08,200 --> 01:38:10,519
Speaker 1: I wish there were more movies just that celebrate female

1708
01:38:10,520 --> 01:38:14,919
Speaker 1: friendship and um don't suggest that they're kind of doomed.

1709
01:38:15,200 --> 01:38:19,000
Speaker 1: But you know, even so, this is a fun movie.

1710
01:38:19,040 --> 01:38:21,720
Speaker 1: I'll give it three and a half nipples. I'll give

1711
01:38:22,400 --> 01:38:26,200
Speaker 1: one to Henry Golding, not his character, but just him

1712
01:38:26,240 --> 01:38:29,639
Speaker 1: as an actor because I love him. I'll give one

1713
01:38:29,680 --> 01:38:33,680
Speaker 1: to a partner on Charla. I will give one to

1714
01:38:34,720 --> 01:38:38,880
Speaker 1: the prius that runs over Blake Live Lad. I'll give

1715
01:38:39,600 --> 01:38:44,160
Speaker 1: my half nipple to um. I think there are the

1716
01:38:44,320 --> 01:38:47,280
Speaker 1: two little boys were playing with teenage mutant Ninja Turtle

1717
01:38:47,360 --> 01:38:50,280
Speaker 1: toys at some point. Hell yeah, so I'll give my

1718
01:38:50,320 --> 01:38:56,400
Speaker 1: half nipple to Turtle Toys. Does it Ninja Turtles? Because

1719
01:38:56,439 --> 01:38:58,559
Speaker 1: I'm like, when are we going to cover a Ninja

1720
01:38:58,600 --> 01:39:02,000
Speaker 1: Turtles movie? You've never asked, we should do it. I

1721
01:39:02,080 --> 01:39:04,280
Speaker 1: will Secret of the Use Baby. There's a new one

1722
01:39:04,360 --> 01:39:07,320
Speaker 1: coming out next year. I think that's our time to

1723
01:39:07,320 --> 01:39:12,040
Speaker 1: shine anyway, So those are that's my nipple distribution. Okay,

1724
01:39:12,200 --> 01:39:14,880
Speaker 1: I'm tempted to go for here. I mean, and maybe

1725
01:39:14,880 --> 01:39:17,599
Speaker 1: it's just because I had such a delightful time, but

1726
01:39:17,960 --> 01:39:19,800
Speaker 1: and I think it also because I think I am

1727
01:39:19,880 --> 01:39:23,600
Speaker 1: going to go for partially because we and maybe I

1728
01:39:23,600 --> 01:39:26,479
Speaker 1: wouldn't have if we hadn't just covered a different noir.

1729
01:39:26,640 --> 01:39:30,759
Speaker 1: And it was really interesting to see how whatever seventy

1730
01:39:30,760 --> 01:39:33,520
Speaker 1: plus years of the genre kind of built and evolved

1731
01:39:33,920 --> 01:39:37,479
Speaker 1: the way that umm fatales can be presented and the

1732
01:39:37,520 --> 01:39:40,760
Speaker 1: amount of depth that they can have, and even like

1733
01:39:40,880 --> 01:39:44,439
Speaker 1: comparing this movie to the nineteen forties more that we covered,

1734
01:39:44,560 --> 01:39:50,559
Speaker 1: like how just replacing a motivation being inherently connected to

1735
01:39:50,600 --> 01:39:54,040
Speaker 1: a man and changing it to like this very complicated,

1736
01:39:54,160 --> 01:39:57,680
Speaker 1: fucked up relationship with the women in her life, like

1737
01:39:58,080 --> 01:40:00,720
Speaker 1: on the whole if reviewing Emily as the protagonist, she

1738
01:40:00,760 --> 01:40:03,120
Speaker 1: has a fox up relationship with Stephanie, she has a

1739
01:40:03,160 --> 01:40:05,920
Speaker 1: really complicated relationship with her sister. She has a really

1740
01:40:05,920 --> 01:40:09,080
Speaker 1: complicated relationship with her mom, and that seems to be

1741
01:40:09,160 --> 01:40:12,679
Speaker 1: more what drives her to behave the way she does

1742
01:40:12,840 --> 01:40:15,840
Speaker 1: versus her relationship with men. But she's still very much

1743
01:40:16,360 --> 01:40:18,800
Speaker 1: a fem fatale, which I just I don't know. I

1744
01:40:18,800 --> 01:40:20,519
Speaker 1: think it's really interesting. And then I also think that

1745
01:40:20,560 --> 01:40:25,400
Speaker 1: the modern you know, the kind of mommy vlogger criticism

1746
01:40:25,439 --> 01:40:28,680
Speaker 1: while also giving her depth that you can kind of

1747
01:40:29,640 --> 01:40:35,360
Speaker 1: like or dislike, was really strong. I at the end

1748
01:40:35,400 --> 01:40:38,519
Speaker 1: of the day, this is still a movie that hinges

1749
01:40:38,720 --> 01:40:43,719
Speaker 1: on the lives of two white women who have access

1750
01:40:43,760 --> 01:40:46,280
Speaker 1: to everything they need. They're not um you know, I

1751
01:40:46,280 --> 01:40:48,880
Speaker 1: think it's good that they discuss money and that they

1752
01:40:48,880 --> 01:40:51,240
Speaker 1: are having I don't think it's good that they're having money,

1753
01:40:51,280 --> 01:40:54,880
Speaker 1: but you know what I mean. But ultimately, like this

1754
01:40:54,920 --> 01:40:56,720
Speaker 1: is a kind of movie that's like it's subverting some

1755
01:40:56,800 --> 01:41:01,599
Speaker 1: things and then others it's sort of no, but it's

1756
01:41:01,640 --> 01:41:09,160
Speaker 1: a but I like it. We contain multitudes, We contain multitudes,

1757
01:41:09,200 --> 01:41:11,519
Speaker 1: and I do. And again it's this is a kind

1758
01:41:11,560 --> 01:41:15,360
Speaker 1: of like, very very specific subgenre that I hope continues

1759
01:41:15,439 --> 01:41:17,720
Speaker 1: to develop, maybe not like right away, but down the line,

1760
01:41:17,720 --> 01:41:19,280
Speaker 1: I would like to see more movies like this, and

1761
01:41:19,640 --> 01:41:24,040
Speaker 1: maybe you know, start women of color, maybe a little

1762
01:41:24,080 --> 01:41:27,720
Speaker 1: bit less of the completely depraved bisexual trope. Perhaps a

1763
01:41:27,760 --> 01:41:31,519
Speaker 1: woman could direct question Mark. I mean, let's really shoot

1764
01:41:31,520 --> 01:41:33,880
Speaker 1: for the stars here, but I do. I mean in

1765
01:41:33,960 --> 01:41:36,200
Speaker 1: terms of like a half step in progress. I think

1766
01:41:36,200 --> 01:41:38,360
Speaker 1: it's cool that you know, all three of these movies

1767
01:41:38,400 --> 01:41:40,880
Speaker 1: that we were kind of referencing throughout this episode, we're

1768
01:41:40,920 --> 01:41:44,040
Speaker 1: based on stories by women and were adapted by women,

1769
01:41:44,120 --> 01:41:47,120
Speaker 1: which you certainly weren't getting earlier in the genre. And

1770
01:41:47,160 --> 01:41:50,960
Speaker 1: it seems to show, Um, I like this movie. Uh.

1771
01:41:51,000 --> 01:41:53,360
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe I'm taking an l by giving it four nipples,

1772
01:41:53,360 --> 01:41:54,960
Speaker 1: but I'm going to go for it. I'm going to

1773
01:41:55,040 --> 01:42:01,120
Speaker 1: give one to Blake and give one Blake's twin. Oh no, sorry,

1774
01:42:01,120 --> 01:42:04,880
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give three to the triplets. Uh, and then

1775
01:42:04,880 --> 01:42:09,479
Speaker 1: I'll give I'll give my last one to a partner.

1776
01:42:09,880 --> 01:42:14,960
Speaker 1: And That's what I'm gonna do. Kate, So I love

1777
01:42:15,000 --> 01:42:17,880
Speaker 1: this movie because I've already said I mean, like I

1778
01:42:17,920 --> 01:42:19,759
Speaker 1: think I mentioned it before we got on the mix,

1779
01:42:19,800 --> 01:42:21,679
Speaker 1: but I have the poster for this film like framed

1780
01:42:21,680 --> 01:42:24,639
Speaker 1: and up in my apartment. But I love this movie.

1781
01:42:25,080 --> 01:42:28,400
Speaker 1: It forced me to stop calling like Lively Plantation Barbie,

1782
01:42:29,160 --> 01:42:35,120
Speaker 1: and I just I feel like it's one of those

1783
01:42:35,160 --> 01:42:39,800
Speaker 1: like media prophecies that has like enough of like a

1784
01:42:39,880 --> 01:42:43,320
Speaker 1: queer sensibility that it's like it's almost like gaydar, Like

1785
01:42:43,400 --> 01:42:46,120
Speaker 1: the movie is like signaling to you in ways that

1786
01:42:46,160 --> 01:42:49,439
Speaker 1: are not necessarily apparent, but are obviously if you know

1787
01:42:49,479 --> 01:42:51,840
Speaker 1: what you're looking for. And I love stuff like that.

1788
01:42:51,960 --> 01:42:56,080
Speaker 1: And I had known long before now that, like I

1789
01:42:56,120 --> 01:42:58,360
Speaker 1: always like the character that's like a little bit gy,

1790
01:42:58,479 --> 01:43:00,519
Speaker 1: like Blair was my favorite on Gossip Girl, Like I

1791
01:43:01,080 --> 01:43:03,640
Speaker 1: love the mean character. I love the character who is

1792
01:43:03,760 --> 01:43:07,120
Speaker 1: like quick with a sharp bird, And I just feel

1793
01:43:07,160 --> 01:43:08,880
Speaker 1: like I got so much of that out of this

1794
01:43:08,920 --> 01:43:11,120
Speaker 1: film that I really enjoyed. Plus, I love a mystery.

1795
01:43:11,160 --> 01:43:12,920
Speaker 1: I love a good twist. There's it's so rare that

1796
01:43:13,000 --> 01:43:16,760
Speaker 1: like a movie surprises me anymore, even if I really

1797
01:43:16,840 --> 01:43:18,439
Speaker 1: enjoy them, And like, this is one of the few

1798
01:43:18,439 --> 01:43:21,080
Speaker 1: in the last couple of years that I didn't know

1799
01:43:21,120 --> 01:43:23,160
Speaker 1: what was going to happen next, and I really enjoyed

1800
01:43:23,160 --> 01:43:26,840
Speaker 1: that ride. So asked for my nipples, I'm gonna just

1801
01:43:26,840 --> 01:43:32,320
Speaker 1: slightly differently. I'm going to dock a nipple for Emily

1802
01:43:32,400 --> 01:43:34,559
Speaker 1: not winning in the end, because I think that the

1803
01:43:34,600 --> 01:43:38,840
Speaker 1: crivalent should always win, And I'm gonna dock a half

1804
01:43:39,000 --> 01:43:47,639
Speaker 1: nipple for the black cop trope because I hate that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1805
01:43:47,760 --> 01:43:49,679
Speaker 1: And then as for my other three and a half.

1806
01:43:49,760 --> 01:43:53,000
Speaker 1: I'm going to give one to Emily Suits. I'm going

1807
01:43:53,040 --> 01:43:58,639
Speaker 1: to give another one to Paul Figs Walking Kane, I'm

1808
01:43:58,680 --> 01:44:05,439
Speaker 1: gonna give one to the cousin kid Nikki because kids

1809
01:44:05,439 --> 01:44:08,840
Speaker 1: swearing as alway hilarious. And my other half in the boat,

1810
01:44:08,840 --> 01:44:15,680
Speaker 1: I will give to Blake Lively's line reading of brotherfucker Yeah,

1811
01:44:15,800 --> 01:44:21,719
Speaker 1: which one I like? Maybe has a catch phrase it's fun.

1812
01:44:22,880 --> 01:44:26,360
Speaker 1: They should have been on the poster. But okay, thank

1813
01:44:26,360 --> 01:44:28,080
Speaker 1: you so much for being here. Oh my god, what

1814
01:44:28,160 --> 01:44:32,559
Speaker 1: a treat me so fun. Thanks for doing us the favor,

1815
01:44:32,800 --> 01:44:36,000
Speaker 1: the simple favors of being a guest on the show.

1816
01:44:37,040 --> 01:44:39,240
Speaker 1: And now we're going to disappear for a long time

1817
01:44:39,439 --> 01:44:42,320
Speaker 1: and always not to chat to murder you for a

1818
01:44:42,320 --> 01:44:46,480
Speaker 1: million dollars. Thank you so much. Look, I would understand.

1819
01:44:46,640 --> 01:44:51,080
Speaker 1: Just please use the correct photo when I'm killed. That's

1820
01:44:51,080 --> 01:44:54,320
Speaker 1: all I have. Yeah, will email you the photos that

1821
01:44:54,360 --> 01:45:00,639
Speaker 1: we approve of. Yeah, where can people follow you on

1822
01:45:00,760 --> 01:45:03,800
Speaker 1: social media? Check out your writing, check out anything that

1823
01:45:03,840 --> 01:45:08,840
Speaker 1: you'd like to plug. Sure, um, you can find me

1824
01:45:09,080 --> 01:45:12,600
Speaker 1: on various social media platforms at batty ma'amselle. Let's be

1825
01:45:12,640 --> 01:45:14,599
Speaker 1: a t C Y M E m Z E double

1826
01:45:14,680 --> 01:45:16,840
Speaker 1: l E. If you can't find me, I'm not there.

1827
01:45:17,479 --> 01:45:22,439
Speaker 1: UM and my website which is Kate dash Young dot

1828
01:45:22,520 --> 01:45:29,040
Speaker 1: com and more frequently UM. I published a weekly newsletter

1829
01:45:29,560 --> 01:45:32,599
Speaker 1: with my friend Zusha called thirty flirty and Fine. It's

1830
01:45:32,640 --> 01:45:34,840
Speaker 1: on sub stack and film. Oh my god, what did

1831
01:45:34,840 --> 01:45:37,280
Speaker 1: I say that wrong? Thirty flirty and film that sub

1832
01:45:37,360 --> 01:45:41,599
Speaker 1: stack um. And every week we published two film reviews

1833
01:45:41,720 --> 01:45:45,120
Speaker 1: that we write in thirty minutes or less, probably more,

1834
01:45:45,200 --> 01:45:47,040
Speaker 1: But we don't tell you because it's ours and we

1835
01:45:47,080 --> 01:45:50,519
Speaker 1: can make whatever rules you want. You're full of secrets. Yeah,

1836
01:45:50,800 --> 01:45:55,479
Speaker 1: we're just lying. Um. But but that's really fun. And

1837
01:45:55,560 --> 01:46:00,920
Speaker 1: our our last issue was, uh, the reviewed Benedetta, which

1838
01:46:00,920 --> 01:46:05,200
Speaker 1: just came out. That's a lesbian none movie. It's super fun, um,

1839
01:46:05,240 --> 01:46:08,320
Speaker 1: and so she covered UM. I forget what it's called

1840
01:46:08,640 --> 01:46:13,200
Speaker 1: the non documentary. Oh my god, I forget what it's

1841
01:46:13,200 --> 01:46:16,679
Speaker 1: about that. They're like kick ass nuns. I'm not sure,

1842
01:46:16,720 --> 01:46:18,439
Speaker 1: but it's like they're like kick ass nuns who like

1843
01:46:18,800 --> 01:46:21,679
Speaker 1: protest and ship and I'm like, yeah, more Catholic nuns

1844
01:46:21,680 --> 01:46:23,640
Speaker 1: need to say fuck you to the pope. But it's

1845
01:46:23,680 --> 01:46:25,880
Speaker 1: really fun. We have a lot of fun doing it. UM.

1846
01:46:25,920 --> 01:46:28,280
Speaker 1: I like to pretend like it's not stressful because I

1847
01:46:28,400 --> 01:46:33,960
Speaker 1: enjoy making work for myself relatable content. You can follow

1848
01:46:34,120 --> 01:46:39,240
Speaker 1: us on Twitter and Instagram at bechtel Cast. You can

1849
01:46:39,720 --> 01:46:45,040
Speaker 1: check out our Matreon that's at patreon dot com slash

1850
01:46:45,080 --> 01:46:48,759
Speaker 1: spectel cast. It gets you two bonus episodes every month,

1851
01:46:49,160 --> 01:46:52,040
Speaker 1: plus the whole back catalog of bonus episodes and it's

1852
01:46:52,120 --> 01:46:56,360
Speaker 1: five dollars per month. Wow. You can also fulfill all

1853
01:46:56,439 --> 01:47:01,879
Speaker 1: your merchandizing needs at t public dot com slash factel cast.

1854
01:47:02,520 --> 01:47:06,519
Speaker 1: And with that, um, do you want to jump in

1855
01:47:06,560 --> 01:47:10,439
Speaker 1: the lake? Nothing, nothing weird going on. Just let's let's

1856
01:47:10,479 --> 01:47:14,160
Speaker 1: go for a swim. You know this sounds like a

1857
01:47:14,280 --> 01:47:17,120
Speaker 1: plan to me. Okay, only if I got a fancy

1858
01:47:17,160 --> 01:47:22,960
Speaker 1: time in ring there. Okay, it's a deal. Bye bye

1859
01:47:22,439 --> 01:47:23,240
Speaker 1: bye