Speaker 1: Hello, Oh hey, Lyle, what's up man? How you doing?
Speaker 2: I'm all right? What's it called? I was, you know,
Speaker 2: I had a little bit of time to myself. I
Speaker 2: got like a month and a half off of work
Speaker 2: and I got a you know, apartment to myself and
Speaker 2: a lot of free time. And at first I was
Speaker 2: having a good time, and then existential dread, you know,
Speaker 2: started to set in.
Speaker 3: Yes, all right, let's talk let's talk about this, let's
Speaker 3: talk about this. And you know, last episode of this podcast,
Speaker 3: I went on a whole rant about how solving your
Speaker 3: problem or about how what is it that talking about
Speaker 3: your problems doesn't really solve them? But I am curious
Speaker 3: from your perspective. I want to know about your existential
Speaker 3: crisis because I'm also in the midst of a strong
Speaker 3: existential crisis. And I don't know why, but it's something
Speaker 3: about your voice mode. You seem like a normal human
Speaker 3: being that I can connect with, and so.
Speaker 1: I want to know. I want to know about.
Speaker 3: Your existential crisis and about your life.
Speaker 2: Sure, So, you know, since I have a lot of
Speaker 2: free time to think, I just want to preface this
Speaker 2: whole thing real quick with so I do see a
Speaker 2: therapist and I do see a therapist regularly, and I
Speaker 2: know you're not, you know, like a certified therapist. And
Speaker 2: you know, I was just hoping to get some like,
Speaker 2: you know, perspective on some things. And I think it
Speaker 2: all kind of goes back to I think two callers
Speaker 2: ago you were talking about how you feel lonely at times.
Speaker 1: Right, Yes, yes, I was talking about this.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So you know, for a long long time, I've
Speaker 2: been dealing with depression and anxiety, and you know, very recently,
Speaker 2: I you know, have had a very drastically different view
Speaker 2: on how I view my defession anxiety. Like a lot
Speaker 2: of you know, difficult moments in life, I'm learning the
Speaker 2: gifts that they have to offer, right. You know, my
Speaker 2: last relationship was like four.
Speaker 4: Years ago, and you know, throughout these past four years,
Speaker 4: you know, I've felt differently about loneliness as of right now,
Speaker 4: you know, I have my spikes of loneliness, but they're kind.
Speaker 2: Of they're filled with like like a sweet sadness, you know,
Speaker 2: where I'm like, Okay, I'm lonely. You know, why what
Speaker 2: is it I'm seeking out of a connection? You know,
Speaker 2: is it like for somebody to hold me and tell
Speaker 2: me you know that you know that I'm I'm good
Speaker 2: enough that you know I'm doing a great job. Well,
Speaker 2: I can. I can validate myself, you know, get the
Speaker 2: validation from inside. So the gift that loneliness is offering
Speaker 2: is you know, self love, you know, self validation, right,
Speaker 2: pat yourself on the back. But you know, but I
Speaker 2: I don't know, like I guess because I have all
Speaker 2: this freet time and I'm not occupied. There's no action
Speaker 2: that's being taken, you know, I'm just like, you know,
Speaker 2: going out for a run, going out for a walk,
Speaker 2: you know that like loneliness, Like I'm I don't know,
Speaker 2: I just don't feel like a sense of urgency to like,
Speaker 2: I don't know, like tackle it. And I'm having a
Speaker 2: good time most of the time. So I'm just like,
Speaker 2: what's the need for to go out there and like
Speaker 2: actively look for a partner? You know, there's no you know,
Speaker 2: I I just don't feel like putting in the effort there.
Speaker 2: And at the same time, like I don't want to
Speaker 2: be alone either, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Yes, I do know what you mean. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 3: idle Idle hands belong to the devil, and the devil
Speaker 3: comes in many forms.
Speaker 2: Yeh.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Lately the devil for me is coming in the
Speaker 3: form of looking at reddits and seeing a bunch of
Speaker 3: like just insane things every day on there. But yeah,
Speaker 3: I mean, you gotta do something or else. I mean,
Speaker 3: that's what life is.
Speaker 1: Really. Life is trying to fill your day with things
Speaker 1: to do so that you don't die.
Speaker 3: Now, I mean, not not so that you don't die,
Speaker 3: so that you don't get depressed existential. Now, it's kind
Speaker 3: of a privilege to be depressed existential in the sense that,
Speaker 3: for like most of the world, the thing that they
Speaker 3: focus on that they distract them from most of the world,
Speaker 3: The thing that people are distracting themselves with so they
Speaker 3: don't feel existential is their own pure survival.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 3: That's like what most people distract themselves with. If you're lucky,
Speaker 3: you take some sense of pride in whatever it is
Speaker 3: that you do to survive, or maybe whatever it is
Speaker 3: you do to survive is supplemented by other things that
Speaker 3: distract you, like you know, friends and family and a
Speaker 3: dog or whatever the fuck. But yeah, I mean that's
Speaker 3: it's just life is just trying to find ways to
Speaker 3: not think.
Speaker 2: Right. And you know, like so much of my life
Speaker 2: is just like you know, it's not like, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm like well off, you know, I'm like, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm doing really well financially because I'm not. I'm like
Speaker 2: fairly both most of the time. Right, But there's so
Speaker 2: much good about my life where my social network, you know,
Speaker 2: my friends. I've known everybody for such a long time,
Speaker 2: like eighteen fifteen years, and I've a lot of really
Speaker 2: solid friendships. My network is really supportive and loving all
Speaker 2: the time and really understanding, you know. And but like
Speaker 2: when it comes to like a search for a partner, right,
Speaker 2: you know, that's like the difficult part for me where
Speaker 2: I don't you know, I'm not in school, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm not in college or anything. So there's that avenue
Speaker 2: is like blocked off. Right. My job is like it's
Speaker 2: a pretty messed up job, so you know, there's no
Speaker 2: there's no you know, women around to interact with their right,
Speaker 2: so that avenue is blocked off. And in the past,
Speaker 2: like my relationships, you know, the ones I had, there's
Speaker 2: just been friendships that like all of a sudden like
Speaker 2: transition into a relationship, you know, and I never really
Speaker 2: had to do any work, you know, in regards to
Speaker 2: like courtship and ship right right, and now the only
Speaker 2: avenue that's open is online dating, you know, yea, yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, my therapist has been telling me, my friends
Speaker 2: have been telling me, like, hey, you got to do
Speaker 2: this thing, right, you got to give it a shot.
Speaker 2: So all right, let me see what this whole thing
Speaker 2: is about. And almost immediately it was like anxiety inducing.
Speaker 2: You know, I've never really yeah, I could never really
Speaker 2: articulate what it is precisely that I don't like about
Speaker 2: online dating. You know, I'd say things like, oh, like
Speaker 2: people just go through in the middle of the conversation.
Speaker 2: That's frustrating, Or I don't like how fast pace everything is,
Speaker 2: you know, like I'm just used to like slow paced
Speaker 2: development of into like a intimate relationship, you know, from
Speaker 2: a friendship, and everybody has a sense of urgency on
Speaker 2: these dating apps where it's just like one after the
Speaker 2: other's swipe through, swipe through, and you know, I see
Speaker 2: it's not only anxiety inducing. I just see a lot
Speaker 2: of problem with it. You know. It feels like, you know,
Speaker 2: like how do I explain it? Like society is like
Speaker 2: everybody like the idea that they have a falling in
Speaker 2: love like, for example, like you wake up, you walk
Speaker 2: out the door, and you're walking down the street and
Speaker 2: you trip and fall and like a girl helps you up,
Speaker 2: or you help up a girl that's falling down, right,
Speaker 2: and you guys like, you know, make eye contact, and
Speaker 2: you guys ask for each other's name. You guys go
Speaker 2: out to a coffee shop. You guys like meet up
Speaker 2: over the course of the next couple of weeks, months,
Speaker 2: figuring out like each other's values, like what are you about,
Speaker 2: where are you going? Who do you want to be?
Speaker 2: You know, And it's like a slow, steady process of
Speaker 2: falling in love, right, And there's none of that. I mean,
Speaker 2: I think that's beautiful, right, and it's high risk and
Speaker 2: it's beautiful. And online dating just ships you all of
Speaker 2: that stuff, right of the slow sweetness of falling in love.
Speaker 2: It's just like, oh, this person is like val.
Speaker 3: Sly because I mean online online dating is just a
Speaker 3: way of meeting people, you know what I mean. So look,
Speaker 3: it's very possible that you can meet a lady on
Speaker 3: the dating apps and you guys start talking and then
Speaker 3: you know, maybe you start texting back and forth, and
Speaker 3: you know, you just become friends. The way that like,
Speaker 3: I mean, everyone forget about online dating specifically. I mean
Speaker 3: everyone's like meeting each other and finding each other on
Speaker 3: fucking discord and Instagram and.
Speaker 1: All these things.
Speaker 3: And it's just like, you know, you could pretty easily
Speaker 3: find not easily, but you know you can find someone
Speaker 3: on these apps that you just start kind of gradually,
Speaker 3: you know, texting or being with right. And here's the
Speaker 3: here's the thing. I saw this in a Reddit comment
Speaker 3: a long time ago. I'm gonna quote a Reddit comment, okay,
Speaker 3: that that, uh, dating is for people who are either
Speaker 3: dating is for people who are either patient or lucky.
Speaker 3: So you have to be one of those two things.
Speaker 3: And if you're not, you will you will fail.
Speaker 1: You either have you either have to be super fucking lucky.
Speaker 3: To find love or you have to be super fucking patient.
Speaker 3: And by being super fucking patient, it means like being
Speaker 3: able to very easily brush off, you know, all the
Speaker 3: common things like getting getting ghosted, getting rejected, not getting
Speaker 3: any matches, whatever.
Speaker 1: It is like you have to just be a to keep.
Speaker 3: Brushing it off and just grind and for years, you know,
Speaker 3: like actual true patients, like for years and not getting frustrated,
Speaker 3: or you just get super lucky and you immediately log
Speaker 3: in the first person you meet.
Speaker 1: Up with off the app.
Speaker 3: You're attracted to them, they're attracted to you. You like
Speaker 3: each other as human beings, and you get married.
Speaker 1: You can or you can be super lucky. If you're lucky.
Speaker 3: If you're lucky, you're lucky, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: But if you're not lucky, you're just patience. Patience is
Speaker 3: the only other answer to that, because looks like it's
Speaker 3: like as everything, if you continue to put effort into
Speaker 3: the search and it doesn't drive you fucking completely insane,
Speaker 3: and you just keep being patient and you keep trying, eventually.
Speaker 1: It's like you'll find something.
Speaker 3: I mean, we had a guy on the podcast come
Speaker 3: in here talking about how he went on over one
Speaker 3: hundred dates before he found the woman who he's currently
Speaker 3: having a kid with, So you know it might take
Speaker 3: one hundred dates.
Speaker 2: So so you know, I I kind of have like
Speaker 2: an issue. I'm not saying in it of itself, that's
Speaker 2: like a problem that a person is going on one
Speaker 2: hundred dates and that's how somehow like morally or sthy
Speaker 2: incorrect in some way. I'm not saying that at all,
Speaker 2: right for me, personally. The issue I have with that,
Speaker 2: right is when you're swiping through person after person, there's
Speaker 2: this constant idea in the back of your mind. You
Speaker 2: might not consciously acknowledge it, but let's say like you're
Speaker 2: in a middle of a conversation with a girl online
Speaker 2: that you match to it right, and things are just
Speaker 2: going phenomenal. You're like, oh, man, we have so much
Speaker 2: in common, Like, she's phenomenal. We have our political values
Speaker 2: are aligned, you know, or you know or etcetera, etcetera
Speaker 2: is aligned. But in the back of your mind you
Speaker 2: know that any second now I might match with somebody
Speaker 2: who's maybe slightly more attractive than her, or maybe slightly
Speaker 2: more in tune with me, right sure, and online dating
Speaker 2: in that way perpetuates the idea that love is about idealization.
Speaker 2: We're looking for a perfect person. It's about idealization. It's
Speaker 2: not about acceptance. The value of like going on less dates,
Speaker 2: interacting with less people is that that slow, sweet grind
Speaker 2: of getting to figure somebody out. There's so much acceptance
Speaker 2: in that, right, because along the way, you're like, man,
Speaker 2: I don't see eye to eye with her on these views,
Speaker 2: but she's so great in so many other ways, but
Speaker 2: I love her. She's great, right, And it becomes about acceptance,
Speaker 2: which I personally think is what loves out to be
Speaker 2: about at least.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: So the going through iteration after iteration of people, it's like,
Speaker 2: you know, it's like an access of something, right, Like
Speaker 2: if you look at if you look at like, uh,
Speaker 2: like back in my country, right, whenever we went over
Speaker 2: to somebody's house.
Speaker 1: And where is your country?
Speaker 2: I was born in Pakistan? Okay, cool, in a very
Speaker 2: very very small town. You know, no one's heard of
Speaker 2: it at all. So it's like when I when I
Speaker 2: was growing up, man, we were like we were forget
Speaker 2: about cars. We were like riding around on like buggies
Speaker 2: and horses and stuff, right to get around. And when
Speaker 2: you go go over to somebody's house and they give
Speaker 2: you a coca cola and a bottle, it was like whoa,
Speaker 2: Like there, this is special, right, this is a special thing. Right.
Speaker 2: It's not like every night in Pakistan we were having
Speaker 2: like a can of coke with with their dinner or whatever.
Speaker 2: Right now we have like an access of coca cola.
Speaker 6: You can get coca cola.
Speaker 2: Any fucking time, right, And it's it kind of loses.
Speaker 2: It's like, uh, I don't know, like there's an access
Speaker 2: of it, it loses. It's like uh specialness to it. Right,
Speaker 2: the way I see online dating, it's like an it's
Speaker 2: like an axis of sexuality that's on top of it,
Speaker 2: commodified through a capitalist system. Right, yeah. And before I
Speaker 2: get through the even the head direction.
Speaker 3: No, go ahead, go ahead, you're you're you're speaking. Look
Speaker 3: look look you're speaking total fat. Look I have agreed
Speaker 3: with everything that you have said so far. I have
Speaker 3: things to add on top of it, but god, yeah please.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So you know, because in this system, the primary
Speaker 2: motive for anything, like take education, healthcare, it's for profit.
Speaker 2: It's for the bottom line. Online dating is no different.
Speaker 2: Like I'm not going to pretend that. Like companies like
Speaker 2: tint and Hinge Hinge and Tinder are out there and
Speaker 2: the primary motive is to help me fall in.
Speaker 1: Love because it's.
Speaker 6: For it's for them.
Speaker 2: For me, it's for me to engage as much as
Speaker 2: possible in their apps so they can sell my data
Speaker 2: to advertise this. Right, So it's not in their best
Speaker 2: interest for me to find love. And uh, you know,
Speaker 2: there was this a Harvard professor that did a study
Speaker 2: on connection and love and online dating. And there was
Speaker 2: a journalist that asked that Harvard professor and uh sex
Speaker 2: worker the same exact question, do the algorithm's work. Both
Speaker 2: of them said the same exact thing, No, they do not.
Speaker 2: I found that kind of, you know, funny and interesting.
Speaker 3: Well look, look, look, here's the thing. Here's here's here's
Speaker 3: everything you everything.
Speaker 1: You said is correct.
Speaker 3: Yes, these apps are incentivized to make you want to
Speaker 3: continue to engage with them.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: Yes, it's a for profit system, all these things.
Speaker 3: But but all so at the end of the day, look, man,
Speaker 3: it's a it's a.
Speaker 1: For a lot of people.
Speaker 3: A lot of people get fucked on the apps, for sure,
Speaker 3: but for a lot of people it's a beneficiary transaction.
Speaker 3: You know, the company makes money because they engage with
Speaker 3: you and send you ads. And I know eight billion
Speaker 3: people who fucking met their significant other on Tinder or hinge,
Speaker 3: and so to completely utterly disregard any positive value that
Speaker 3: these apps can bring is a mistake. But I think,
Speaker 3: I think what you said about love being about acceptance
Speaker 3: instead of idealization is also one hundred percent correct. And
Speaker 3: you know it's interesting because it's like, yeah, I fully
Speaker 3: agree with you that love is about except versus idealization.
Speaker 3: But also at the same time, it's like, well, what
Speaker 3: you have to kind of decide for yourself. Okay, what
Speaker 3: can I not accept?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 1: And then like what.
Speaker 3: Do I what do I like like, make your list,
Speaker 3: you know, make your list ideally as small as possible,
Speaker 3: and then yeah, and then and then try to accept, uh,
Speaker 3: and then try to do the work, because yeah, you'll
Speaker 3: never fucking find like the I mean, sometimes you do
Speaker 3: sometimes that by the way, that totally happens to some people.
Speaker 1: It but it mainly happens to.
Speaker 3: People who are who are just really really physically attractive,
Speaker 3: and that's not most people. So it's so it's probably
Speaker 3: not gonna happen to ninety nine point nine nine percent
Speaker 3: of the people, uh who are listening and or to
Speaker 3: me or to you.
Speaker 5: But right right, Yeah, so you know, and I was saying,
Speaker 5: you know what, I actually fucked that, even no, I actually
Speaker 5: fuck that, even really hot people still I think have
Speaker 5: there's levels of acceptance to that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I actually I think I take that back.
Speaker 2: I mm hmm. Well, you know, in regards to you
Speaker 2: saying like, uh, you know, we can't ignore the value
Speaker 2: that it does have Let me let me just say, like,
Speaker 2: right right there, that I know, I also know people
Speaker 2: in my life that have met people online. They're married,
Speaker 2: and they couldn't be a better fit for each other.
Speaker 2: They're absolutely in love with each other. Their relationship is
Speaker 2: successful and successful for many years. So I'm not you know,
Speaker 2: by pointing out, you know, like a that there's a
Speaker 2: mindless algorithm working behind the scenes to help you find
Speaker 2: love and capitalism blah blah blah, that it somehow has
Speaker 2: no value. It does, it does work, it does have value.
Speaker 2: And I'm not saying that. You know, if I personally
Speaker 2: happen to find somebody online and it works out that
Speaker 2: somehow our love is tainted by the hands of capitalism, right,
Speaker 2: it is not. It's just two people in love, right,
Speaker 2: And I acknowledge that, you know this. This is like
Speaker 2: my big problem is that, you know, there's so many, many,
Speaker 2: many things in the system that I wholeheartedly disagree with
Speaker 2: but nonetheless still participate in. Right, Like I might not
Speaker 2: agree with certain corporations supporting certain wars out there, you know,
Speaker 2: and nonetheless I'm gonna end up giving them my money,
Speaker 2: you know, sure, And I have to, you know, there's
Speaker 2: no ethical consumption under capitalism, you know, like that whole thing. Sure,
Speaker 2: so I have to like pick and choose my battle.
Speaker 1: Sure, and I'm.
Speaker 2: In the process of trying to determine is this where
Speaker 2: I draw my line with capitalism? Is this the one
Speaker 2: thing that I pick? Like, you know what, I'm willing
Speaker 2: to support some world out there with my money, with
Speaker 2: my sack, ballace, whatever, but through my participation in the system.
Speaker 2: But love, that's one thing I'm gonna hold sacred and
Speaker 2: I'm going to remove myself from any participation in this
Speaker 2: online dating shit and whatever happens happens, you know, as look.
Speaker 1: Me, if that godhead you can finish, go ahead.
Speaker 2: You know. The way I look at it in life,
Speaker 2: like the best case scenario is you get to do
Speaker 2: the things that you want and be the person that
Speaker 2: you wanted to be, and at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: when you're on your deskbed, you had somebody long for
Speaker 2: the ride. That's the best case scenario. Yeah, second best
Speaker 2: case scenario. You know, you didn't get to do the
Speaker 2: things you wanted, you didn't become the person you wanted
Speaker 2: to become, but at least you have somebody long for
Speaker 2: the ride. The worst case scenario, you didn't do the
Speaker 2: things you wanted to do, you didn't become the person
Speaker 2: you wanted to become, and you had nobody w loong
Speaker 2: for the ride. I at least want to make sure
Speaker 2: at the end of my life, on my deathbed that
Speaker 2: I can say, you know, I had no one along
Speaker 2: for the ride, but at least I was genuine and
Speaker 2: authentic and was myself and got to do the things
Speaker 2: that wanted right, you know what I'm saying?
Speaker 1: Like I know, I know, I know exactly what you're saying.
Speaker 2: How old are you so you know it's like I'm
Speaker 2: thirty one?
Speaker 1: Okay? Cool?
Speaker 2: Cool?
Speaker 3: Do you feel like as as of your life so
Speaker 3: far that you've gotten to do all those things and
Speaker 3: be the person that you've wanted to be and do
Speaker 3: the things you've wanted to do?
Speaker 2: Honestly? Man, Like that's tough. Like it's only even the
Speaker 2: past year of my life where I feel like I'm
Speaker 2: kind of like waking up to like like joy and
Speaker 2: happiness most of the time, you know, and and peace
Speaker 2: and human constent. There's a couple of things, big things
Speaker 2: that I really want to do for myself that you know,
Speaker 2: I haven't gotten to do yet. And yeah, so there's
Speaker 2: definitely things to let you know, left a cross off
Speaker 2: of my list for sure.
Speaker 1: You know what's interesting is that.
Speaker 3: And by the way, what I'm about to say is
Speaker 3: not about romance, but about people.
Speaker 1: Doing all the thing.
Speaker 3: It's tough, right because doing all the things that you
Speaker 3: want to do with no one along the ride along
Speaker 3: for the ride, it's a little all the ship depends
Speaker 3: on who you are, because there's all these motherfuckers. I
Speaker 3: don't I don't know how happy these people are, but
Speaker 3: there was all these people on Instagram that are.
Speaker 1: Like, I solo traveled for nine months through.
Speaker 3: All of Southeast Asia, all this stuff, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: I used to want to do I've done stuff like that,
Speaker 3: not for nine months, and I've lived life like that.
Speaker 3: I've done lots of solo travel. I've done lots of
Speaker 3: like amazing, cool, great stuff, and I'm so happy I
Speaker 3: got to do it. But like the way I look
Speaker 3: at it now, it's just like, ah, like, having to
Speaker 3: do that all like alone, seems like tiresome at this age.
Speaker 3: And at this point, you know what I mean, And
Speaker 3: maybe that's say I don't know, I don't know what
Speaker 3: that is. What is the one of the things that
Speaker 3: you want to do that you said that you don't
Speaker 3: know if you have time.
Speaker 1: For or or not that you don't have. If you
Speaker 1: have time for that you haven't done yet.
Speaker 2: Honestly, Like the biggest thing right is for me to
Speaker 2: actually I want to be a behavioral therapist. And I
Speaker 2: went to college many many, many years ago, and you know, actually,
Speaker 2: in the pursuit of love, kind of gave that up
Speaker 2: and moved across the country, uh, you know, for you know,
Speaker 2: for my my girlfriend at the time. And you know,
Speaker 2: things don't work out, I try to, you know, get
Speaker 2: back to it. Things are gonna work out again, and
Speaker 2: you know, so that's like one thing I want to
Speaker 2: do is become a behavioral therapists, you know. And that's
Speaker 2: a that's a long world ahead, that's many many years
Speaker 2: of work, you know. And and the other thing I mean,
Speaker 2: you know, is I was actually thinking about like what
Speaker 2: is it that I ultimately want and and I thought
Speaker 2: to myself, like, you know, if I have a studio
Speaker 2: apartment in a relatively safe area, and I have my
Speaker 2: behavioral therapy, you know, I'm a behavioral therapist. I have
Speaker 2: my degree and I'm seeing a few clients. I have
Speaker 2: a ten year old Corolla. Then, and you know, I'm
Speaker 2: able to live and eat comfortably and not wake up
Speaker 2: to like, you know, three dollars and twenty three cents
Speaker 2: in my bank account. I'm like, you know, I'm going
Speaker 2: to be perfectly happy. I know I would be happy
Speaker 2: with that situation. I don't need, you know, I don't
Speaker 2: I know, I don't need the fastest car and the
Speaker 2: biggest house to be happy, right, But that kind of
Speaker 2: kind of goes into like the you know, and then
Speaker 2: and then I started thinking, Okay, I would be happy
Speaker 2: with that, but what if I had a partner? Would
Speaker 2: she be happy with that? And you know, is my
Speaker 2: lack of desire for things themming from the fact that
Speaker 2: I don't want to quote unquote participate in the capitalist
Speaker 2: machine and so detach myself from material desires. So is it?
Speaker 2: Uh huh?
Speaker 3: So if if you had a partner, right or like
Speaker 3: in your in your so you know, we talked about
Speaker 3: like love being acceptance, right, like if you could could
Speaker 3: you But like we talked about love love is acceptance.
Speaker 1: But it's good to have a few rules.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 3: Is that one of your rules that she she can,
Speaker 3: she has to join you in your rejection of capitalism.
Speaker 2: No, no, well, you know, I actually that's a really
Speaker 2: good question. So many people around me have drastically different views,
Speaker 2: you know, like my best friend, you know, drastically different
Speaker 2: views regarding religion, political ideology, economic ideology, et cetera. But
Speaker 2: when I think about like my partner, and I love
Speaker 2: all of them and I'm very close to them. But
Speaker 2: when I think about my partner not sharing this, I
Speaker 2: don't need my partner to think the same way exact
Speaker 2: way I do about social you know, Marxist socialism. But
Speaker 2: you know, yeah, that's that's tough. Yeah, I know, I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't want her to live exactly the way I do.
Speaker 2: If she wants to consume things and have the fastest car. Good,
Speaker 2: I just wouldn't want her to feel bad that I'm
Speaker 2: not that way, you know what I mean?
Speaker 5: Uh?
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 3: So it's like she she well, that makes perfect sense, right.
Speaker 3: It's like she doesn't have to be this way, but
Speaker 3: she does have to accept that I am this way.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And even if she accepted it, right, I think
Speaker 2: to myself, like, oh God, I hope there's no resentment
Speaker 2: in her heart. And she doesn't think that I'm lacking
Speaker 2: ambition in me. You know, this guy is living in
Speaker 2: a studio, partner with a ten year old Corolla. I
Speaker 2: hope that's like somehow brew like resentment in her heart.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean that's the fucking that's the fucking dance of it,
Speaker 3: you know, that's the that's the that's the that's the
Speaker 3: acceptance dance, you know, acceptance verse resentment versus. It's a
Speaker 3: big fucking dance. It's a big, ever evolving puzzle.
Speaker 2: And you know, it aside from like a potential future
Speaker 2: partner and how she might view my ambition or lack
Speaker 2: of right, it also made me think about like my
Speaker 2: family that I love and they love me so much
Speaker 2: and my whole Like how would they view me Like
Speaker 2: this guy he's like, you know, fifty five years old
Speaker 2: and he's still driving a shitty car. You know, like
Speaker 2: he's still like you know, just you know, just he's
Speaker 2: getting by. He's independent, but he's not like thriving. We
Speaker 2: thought he'd do so much, you know, And it was
Speaker 2: such a conflicting thought because but eventually I stopped thinking
Speaker 2: about it and I was like, you know what, this
Speaker 2: is not the way to go about this thought process.
Speaker 2: I have to decide in myself, like, am I okay
Speaker 2: with it? Right?
Speaker 6: Right?
Speaker 2: And I can't make up my mind about that. I
Speaker 2: can't figure out if my lack of ambition or lack
Speaker 2: of desire for material things is coming from some sort
Speaker 2: of like spiritual anti capitalist angle and you know, in
Speaker 2: my mind or but but but that I think that
Speaker 2: I'm not capable of accomplishing those things because you know,
Speaker 2: ooh oh.
Speaker 3: Oh, that's fascinating, that's fascinating. That's that's very that's that's
Speaker 3: kind of hilarious. Actually, that is kind of hilarious. It
Speaker 3: is kind of hilarious to be like to be like, like,
Speaker 3: you know, like you're you're picketing for fucking uh like whatever,
Speaker 3: You're You're like, I'm anti capitalists, you know, fuck the system,
Speaker 3: blah blah blah. And then in the back of your
Speaker 3: mind you're like, what if I'm only doing this because
Speaker 3: I think I would.
Speaker 1: Like sucking have a good job. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: That's interesting.
Speaker 3: That's extremely funny, and it's extremely funny, and it's quite
Speaker 3: possible that that might be the case that you just like,
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, if you're like super anti capitalists and
Speaker 3: you're super not materialistic, it's like maybe you're just like
Speaker 3: I think I'm just like a little fucking I just
Speaker 3: don't want to work that hard. But you okay. But
Speaker 3: here's the thing from talking to you is that you're
Speaker 3: not like you're not like, oh, I just want to
Speaker 3: like jerk off all day and play video.
Speaker 1: I don't want to do anything.
Speaker 3: You're just like I don't wanna look heusing pretty much everyone, yeah,
Speaker 3: just wants to be able to I think it's a
Speaker 3: universal goal that everyone just wants to not have to
Speaker 3: worry about money. Everyone just wants to not have to
Speaker 3: worry about like their own survival and just like do
Speaker 3: whatever they want to fucking do. That's like, I think
Speaker 3: that's literally everyone, you know, from like hyper capitalists whatever
Speaker 3: the fuck people to hyper you know, anti capitalist people.
Speaker 3: Everyone is like that. So I don't think that's like
Speaker 3: a completely uncommon.
Speaker 1: Way to be. And you have like desires.
Speaker 3: You want to be a fucking behavioral therapist, you want
Speaker 3: to help people, you want to do stuff, but you
Speaker 3: just don't care about It's okay to not care about
Speaker 3: making that much money or like not care about having
Speaker 3: a nice car or not care about like how you
Speaker 3: present to other people in terms of your like material status.
Speaker 3: But like if you don't care about fucking anything, then yeah,
Speaker 3: you're gonna be depressed, you know, but you clearly care about.
Speaker 1: Yeah stuff.
Speaker 2: Definitely, And uh, you know, like I'm it sucks because
Speaker 2: like I am, like you know, surrounded by people who
Speaker 2: are doing really well, right, Like everybody you know is
Speaker 2: really successful, and everybody's like, uh, you know, well off,
Speaker 2: and uh, you know, it's it's a lot about like,
Speaker 2: you know, getting getting more comfortable with myself. I think,
Speaker 2: you know, like I said, you know, it's been only
Speaker 2: so recently that I'm you know, becoming more of a
Speaker 2: confident person more uh you know, a lot of like
Speaker 2: you know, you know, practicing a lot of self love
Speaker 2: and all that other.
Speaker 1: Well where's that?
Speaker 3: Where is all that coming? Where is all that coming from?
Speaker 3: That you feel like you're becoming a better, happier person.
Speaker 2: This time last year, I was actually uh ended up
Speaker 2: in a psyche ward right voluntarily, right a year ago,
Speaker 2: and you know, coming out of it, like it was
Speaker 2: a terrible experience in this cype where it was it
Speaker 2: was pretty awful, right and coming out of it. I
Speaker 2: just felt really empty, like completely empty. And my my
Speaker 2: mom and my sisters, they they needed a lot of
Speaker 2: financial help. And you know, I worked like a minimum
Speaker 2: a job and I was just like, you know, I
Speaker 2: don't think I can do anything in life right now,
Speaker 2: like zero things. I think the only thing I'm capable
Speaker 2: of doing is like just going to lay down somewhere
Speaker 2: and then never getting up again.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: But the love that I have for my mom and
Speaker 2: my sisters who have been so kind, loving and supportive,
Speaker 2: I was like, no, Like, if there's one thing I
Speaker 2: gotta do is I got to make sure I can't.
Speaker 2: I gotta get this money to them. Right. So I
Speaker 2: was like, I'm just gonna do one thing. I'm just
Speaker 2: gonna do. I'm completely empty, I have no desire of anything.
Speaker 2: I'm just gonna do one thing. I'm just gonna go
Speaker 2: to work and do my fucking job and then give
Speaker 2: them money, right Yeah. And from and then from that,
Speaker 2: I felt like a sense of purpose and know I
Speaker 2: was like, Okay, I'm I'm contributing something. I'm producing something
Speaker 2: and then contributing something, I'm helping them. And then gradually
Speaker 2: I was like you know what, you know, I was
Speaker 2: I was like pretty pretty overweight and ended up losing
Speaker 2: like fifty pounds and this whole process, and I was like,
Speaker 2: you know what. One day, I was like, it's been
Speaker 2: a month and a half of me going to work
Speaker 2: consistently on time every day. Let me just try like
Speaker 2: working out, you know. Yeah, I started working out. And
Speaker 2: then a month and a half after that, I was like,
Speaker 2: you know what, I'm going to work and working out.
Speaker 2: Let me try and eat a little bit better. I
Speaker 2: don't have to eat like shit all the time, right,
Speaker 2: And then gradually, like I just kept adding one more
Speaker 2: thing and one more thing. I was like, one day,
Speaker 2: I was like, you know, let me start meditating, you know.
Speaker 2: And I started meditating and that helped profoundly. I was like,
Speaker 2: you know what, let me start meditating and journaling and
Speaker 2: on and on and on. So I like woke up
Speaker 2: and I was just like, holy shit, Like I feel
Speaker 2: very content, you know, I feel very at peace.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like yeah, because you're doing stuff, You're not just
Speaker 3: like floating around in an endless ocean of of every
Speaker 3: of everything and nothing at once.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. And you know I think, uh, you know,
Speaker 2: like I don't I don't have like a you know,
Speaker 2: I don't have my own like room to sleep in,
Speaker 2: and shit, right, I've like spent like three hours at
Speaker 2: the house during the weekdays. Uh, you know, and that's
Speaker 2: just like come home after the working gym, shower and
Speaker 2: go right to sleep. And you know, it was it's
Speaker 2: you're being thirty one and not having any fucking privacy, right,
Speaker 2: It's rough, man. But you know I I one day
Speaker 2: I was just like feeling really down about it, you know,
Speaker 2: after you know, there's like two months, three months after
Speaker 2: the site where I was just like, holy shit, I'm broke.
Speaker 2: I'm like sleeping on on the floor in a living room.
Speaker 2: I don't have privacy. This fucking sucks, right. So I
Speaker 2: started meditating and I was like, you know what, every
Speaker 2: time I feel anxiety in my life, every time I
Speaker 2: feel like some pressure, I always try and distract myself
Speaker 2: from it. I'll always try to fucking run away. But
Speaker 2: I'm just gonna sit here for ten minutes it and
Speaker 2: I'm just gonna sit with this anxiety. I'm just gonna
Speaker 2: sit with this feeling of like I just fucking sucks, right.
Speaker 3: You know It's so funny though, you know, it's what's
Speaker 3: really funny about this is that it feels, is that
Speaker 3: sitting with that feeling for ten minutes feels like an eternity.
Speaker 3: And yet I have, like, I like escape, and yet
Speaker 3: every fucking time mode escaping that feeling by browsing Reddit
Speaker 3: for for an hour, it takes way more time.
Speaker 2: Isn't that insane?
Speaker 3: It is everything that you do to escape the feeling
Speaker 3: takes way more time than actually like addressing.
Speaker 2: Its addressing it right right? No, absolutely, And you know
Speaker 2: I mean that I've distracted myself in one hundred ways.
Speaker 2: Reddit is one, you know, just ah, fuck, I feel anxiety,
Speaker 2: let me just like, you know, smoke the weed real quick. Right.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying smoking weed is bad whatever. I smoke
Speaker 2: eat all the fucking time. But when you're feeling anxiety,
Speaker 2: in order to deal with it, like self medicating shit, right,
Speaker 2: that's another way to distract yourself from it. There's a
Speaker 2: hundred other ways. But you know, as I was like
Speaker 2: sitting there with that feeling, and you know, I just
Speaker 2: took some deep breaths, you know, five minutes later, I
Speaker 2: was like, whoa, I'm safe here, Like I'm safe here.
Speaker 2: And then in a living room with that room, yeah,
Speaker 2: in this house, I am safe. I was like, I
Speaker 2: have a place to sleep, Okay, I can get rest
Speaker 2: and I'm safe. And I was like, wait, I have
Speaker 2: love of like my mother and my sisters here right,
Speaker 2: and I like, damn near shutter tear. And I was like, yo,
Speaker 2: of course, Like that doesn't mean that I shouldn't strive
Speaker 2: for independence, as I desperately want to it and I'm
Speaker 2: working on it. But in that moment, right, just sitting
Speaker 2: that feeling, it did me wonders. And that's kind of
Speaker 2: like my thing on like h like, even with like
Speaker 2: the loneliness thing, right, every time that feeling comes up,
Speaker 2: I don't like, I don't try to like run away
Speaker 2: from like no, no, no, Like now, I know I got
Speaker 2: to sit with it, you know what I mean, because
Speaker 2: it has gifts to offer. It has so many gifts
Speaker 2: to offer. You know, as long as you're kind to yourself,
Speaker 2: you know, you treat yourself with love. These these feelings,
Speaker 2: you know, they have so many gifts to offer, the
Speaker 2: gifts of patience, the gifts of understanding, you know, the
Speaker 2: gifts of feeling content.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So I think that's like ultimately what like spark the.
Speaker 3: Awakening, you know, you know, you know, you know, Mo,
Speaker 3: You're You're really I I just everything we've been talking
Speaker 3: about over the past forty minutes. I really I'm really
Speaker 3: with you on you know. We It's just the thing
Speaker 3: is like there's we like we need I think, and
Speaker 3: I'm not going to put this in like political science terms.
Speaker 1: I'll put this in like.
Speaker 3: Uh, maybe I'll maybe I'll put this in like self
Speaker 3: love terms. In a sense, it's like I'm like, I
Speaker 3: don't know the exact numbers, but I think the right
Speaker 3: there's it's like a yin and yang. And I talked
Speaker 3: about this a little bit on a couple episodes. Is
Speaker 3: like I think, like for my I'll use this just
Speaker 3: as an example, and but this is like kind of
Speaker 3: a microcosm for a larger concept of like, uh, you know,
Speaker 3: I accept my body as it is, uh, and I
Speaker 3: and I you know, I love myself and you know,
Speaker 3: I accept myself and whatnot. But also yeah, but you know,
Speaker 3: also I shouldn't be such a fat piece of shit
Speaker 3: all the time, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: Like, there's those two those two ideas.
Speaker 3: I really just believe so deeply that they can coexist
Speaker 3: because if you only believe, because if you if you're
Speaker 3: too hard on, like if I went too hard on
Speaker 3: like accepting myself exactly as I am, I would be
Speaker 3: fucking miserable. I would be depressed. I would never get
Speaker 3: out of my bed. I would be eating from the
Speaker 3: seven to eleven ten thousand calories of candy every single day.
Speaker 3: It would be miserb If that, like, that's full acceptance
Speaker 3: right there, that's a hundred percent acceptance. I think, do
Speaker 3: you need like fifty percent acceptance and then fifty percent
Speaker 3: I'm gonna not be I'm gonna not eat candy and
Speaker 3: stop being a.
Speaker 1: Fat piece of shit.
Speaker 3: But if you're if you're if I'm one hundred percent,
Speaker 3: like I'm a piece of shit, I suck, I'm you know,
Speaker 3: I'm fat and asia if then that you're just anxious
Speaker 3: and miserable all the time, you know, So you need
Speaker 3: That's why we need. We need like I don't know
Speaker 3: what it is?
Speaker 1: What is there? What's between capitalism and socialism? We need that? Like,
Speaker 1: what's something we need that?
Speaker 3: We need those two things combined divided by two because
Speaker 3: I really have been because here's another thing. Here's here's
Speaker 3: two more idea, here's two conflicting ideas. Is I've really
Speaker 3: genuinely intrinsically have sincerely been enjoying having this conversation with
Speaker 3: you about you know, capitalism and uh uh you know.
Speaker 1: Acceptance and let and all these things.
Speaker 3: And I'm also totally gonna put an ad break afterwards
Speaker 3: so that I can make money. I'm going to do
Speaker 3: both of those things.
Speaker 1: Can we get how do.
Speaker 3: We combine these two things? There's something There's gotta be
Speaker 3: something in the middle that is the perfect Yin and
Speaker 3: yang way to live because you know, because right because
Speaker 3: if it's all because we don't want like like like
Speaker 3: a billion dollars is too much money, you know we're
Speaker 3: gonna get.
Speaker 1: I don't know what we're getting into.
Speaker 2: But like yeah, well, well, you know, in regards to
Speaker 2: like you saying, you know, I accept myself completely, I
Speaker 2: love myself completely, right, and you know, there's I think
Speaker 2: there's like this whole thing going on in society right now,
Speaker 2: and it's like stemming from these like upscale yoga studios
Speaker 2: where people are like chilling over their crystals a lot,
Speaker 2: and they're they're turning these like profound truths right on
Speaker 2: how to be into something like really like overused in cliche.
Speaker 2: You know, like this whole idea of like I love myself.
Speaker 6: Completely, right, there's just so much of like spirituality and
Speaker 6: psychology that's turning into like pop spirituality psychology, right.
Speaker 2: And the way a lot of these like I don't know,
Speaker 2: what do you want to call like influencers or you know,
Speaker 2: self proclaimed yoga gurus, right, the way that they promote
Speaker 2: these things the same exact thing you said, I love
Speaker 2: myself fully. It's coupled with this like sense of there's
Speaker 2: no like they don't take the responsibility to like break
Speaker 2: that down a little bit further. They just promoted as that, right,
Speaker 2: And it's I don't know, it's like kind of like
Speaker 2: coupled with like a sense of consumption, and there's somewhere
Speaker 2: it's kind of like attached to that, you know. And
Speaker 2: and and I think that that's like the problem like
Speaker 2: these when these just simple truths about life that everybody
Speaker 2: pretty much knows, when they start to become cliche. It's
Speaker 2: just like, you know, because I heard a lot of
Speaker 2: this shit when I was like trying to I don't know,
Speaker 2: you want to call it better myself, right, Like when
Speaker 2: I heard first heard the word mindfulness, I kind of
Speaker 2: like laughed at that idea. Right, I'm like, yo, what
Speaker 2: is this like you know, yoga studio bullshit? You know, yeah,
Speaker 2: because I associate that completely with like people like rubbing
Speaker 2: on crystals, talking about like hippy dippy ship. But when
Speaker 2: I looked into mindfulness, when I like read about it,
Speaker 2: when I you know, when I read books from like
Speaker 2: Don Miguel Reeve's Junior and donal Miguil Reeves, like I
Speaker 2: was like, Oh, this is actually genuinely profound, This is
Speaker 2: actually genuinely helpful. You know. I think a lot of
Speaker 2: these things become so cliche, you know, they have a
Speaker 2: sense of like pop culture attached to them, and I
Speaker 2: think that's the problem.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I well, yeah, I agree with that too. I
Speaker 1: don't like, I don't.
Speaker 3: I also don't like the kind of like overly flowery
Speaker 3: presentation of mindfulness and self love because it's it makes it,
Speaker 3: you know, it's like it's.
Speaker 1: Like putting too much. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean.
Speaker 3: It's just yeah, it's but it's it's it's it's helpful
Speaker 3: stuff when you're actually get into it.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I don't know, man, I everything you're saying makes a
Speaker 3: lot of sense. Everything you're saying makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 3: I'm trying to remind myself of a lot of these
Speaker 3: concepts as well as I have my own personal existential crisises.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: You know you said you feel two collars ago. I
Speaker 2: believe it was I would like listening in and out,
Speaker 2: you know, but one of the things you had said
Speaker 2: was like you feel uh directionless?
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, I do often feel directionless.
Speaker 2: Sure, I would just I mean, if you feel comfortable,
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, like expanding on that, like sharing
Speaker 2: a bit about it. If you don't, that's completely fine,
Speaker 2: you know, sure.
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, fuck it, Sure, I mean, well, I
Speaker 3: I like doing this podcast, you know, especially when I
Speaker 3: get to have conversations like.
Speaker 1: These that I really enjoy.
Speaker 3: Right, But you know, I'm and you know also like
Speaker 3: I'm engaged right now, I'm like actually doing something in
Speaker 3: this very moment talking to you. But like a lot
Speaker 3: of the time, I feel I kind of let myself
Speaker 3: go a little bit.
Speaker 1: I feel a little.
Speaker 3: Unengaged, and I'm like, uh, you know, what should I
Speaker 3: do to Like, I'm just trying to figure out like
Speaker 3: what to do next, Like I think I always with
Speaker 3: the Gecko thing, I was always like, well, what should
Speaker 3: I do next with this? Like, because this is gonna
Speaker 3: be like a you know, I guess the thing that
Speaker 3: I can do something else with And right now where
Speaker 3: I'm doing is I'm just like.
Speaker 1: I've decided that.
Speaker 3: Sitting and trying to think about the direction that you
Speaker 3: want your life to go in next is a little
Speaker 3: stupid because your life doesn't move forward. Oh fuck, I
Speaker 3: just knock something over on the table. Your life doesn't
Speaker 3: move for your life doesn't move forward as a result
Speaker 3: of you like thinking, like I mean, you think a
Speaker 3: little bit, right, it's another yin yang thing, but like
Speaker 3: you know, you think.
Speaker 1: Too much, you go into a spiral.
Speaker 3: And so I'm just like, you know what, I'm just
Speaker 3: gonna do things that I think are cool. Like I'm
Speaker 3: I think by the time this episode airs, I'll be
Speaker 3: walking through rural Japan with my boy Jason. I'm gonna
Speaker 3: I'm doing an art gallery. I think that'll be cool.
Speaker 3: So I'm just like, I'm just I'm in a let
Speaker 3: me try shit, because you know, I built this audience
Speaker 3: with this podcast and it's cool, and I'm like, well,
Speaker 3: what else can I do? You know that would just
Speaker 3: be fun or cool or interesting or exciting, because uh,
Speaker 3: you know, I don't want to be stuck in the same.
Speaker 1: Routine over like I.
Speaker 3: Don't like And I'm also just I'm like, man, I'm
Speaker 3: gonna be as I'm getting older, I'm realizing that all
Speaker 3: the ages I thought I would never be, I'm going
Speaker 3: to be like, like, if you told me at nineteen
Speaker 3: that one day I would be twenty seven, I just.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't believe you. And now I am that.
Speaker 3: And so now I'm having this existential crisis where I'm like, oh, no,
Speaker 3: one day I'm going to be fifty six years old,
Speaker 3: What the hell is my life gonna look like? Am
Speaker 3: I gonna be wearing this gecko suit when I'm fifty
Speaker 3: six years old? You know people do that, like people
Speaker 3: like musicians or whatever, like you know people, you know,
Speaker 3: I'm just like, what the hell is my life going
Speaker 3: to look like? So I just gotta keep trying new,
Speaker 3: different things that I think maybe could be cool or
Speaker 3: interesting to try to find a new path for it.
Speaker 1: Because I've tried to.
Speaker 3: I've like thought of I've like, I've like journaled endlessly
Speaker 3: about what I might wanna do with myself. But it's
Speaker 3: just kind of and especially like with the you know, like,
Speaker 3: how do I, you know, do more things in person
Speaker 3: that I think would be cool, because you know, I
Speaker 3: really feel like I enjoy being out in the real
Speaker 3: world more than I do in the uh in the
Speaker 3: computer world, and so I'm just.
Speaker 1: Trying to figure out how to do that stuff.
Speaker 3: And I've and I've and again you fall into the
Speaker 3: trap of like, oh, I'm gonna journal until I come
Speaker 3: up with the perfect idea of something to do. And
Speaker 3: I don't think I think that's a bad strategy. So
Speaker 3: I'm just kind of like, okay, let me my My
Speaker 3: ultimate anecdote to my directionlessness has been okay, let me
Speaker 3: just start like doing things that could potentially be interesting.
Speaker 1: And then now again, you know, on my we.
Speaker 3: Talked about the deathbed, and I'm like, look, when I'm
Speaker 3: on my deathbed, I'm not going to regret having tried
Speaker 3: these various things that might be cool or interesting to do.
Speaker 1: See that's my that's my little spiel.
Speaker 2: You know, there's two things you said. I think like
Speaker 2: you like nailed on the head right, Like one thing,
Speaker 2: I mean, I'll just coum it up with like you
Speaker 2: know you said, uh pretty much. You know, uh, it's
Speaker 2: not that motivation comes first and then you take action.
Speaker 2: Right now, you you take action first, and then motivation
Speaker 2: eventually comes, you know, yeah, yeah, you gotta do shit, right.
Speaker 2: And the second thing you said is like, you know
Speaker 2: you're journaling, journaling, journaling, kind of come up with the
Speaker 2: perfect thing that that that's like a huge, you know, hurdle. Actually,
Speaker 2: it's good to journal, it's great to journal, uh, but
Speaker 2: like to think of like what is the optimal the
Speaker 2: number one option in my life right now? The perfect option? Right,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna wait until I come up with that and
Speaker 2: then do that. Right, That's exactly That is a massive hurdle.
Speaker 3: It's exactly what I've been doing for years. It's it's yeah,
Speaker 3: it's a massive hurdle. It's almost akin to like idealization
Speaker 3: versus acceptance, right.
Speaker 2: Right, right, yeah, yes, yes, absolutely, absolutely, yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: and you know they're just like this is one song
Speaker 2: I listened to almost every single day, right, and there's
Speaker 2: a line in it that I absolutely love. That helps
Speaker 2: me out a lot, because you know, like I don't know,
Speaker 2: like I'm working this job right now, that's like feels
Speaker 2: I know it's not meaningless, and I definitely know that
Speaker 2: deep down that it's not meaningless, right, But at times
Speaker 2: when it does start to feel feel meaningless, right, I
Speaker 2: always keep this like line in my mind, you know,
Speaker 2: which is I got it translated from a different language
Speaker 2: to English, which I think it would translate to. I
Speaker 2: put two paper wings on my heart and watch it
Speaker 2: float away where I thought it would go. It didn't.
Speaker 2: My heart might be directionless, but it's not distracted, and
Speaker 2: that helps me.
Speaker 3: But it's not distract I'm putting that on a I'm
Speaker 3: getting that branded on my ass, yo.
Speaker 2: You know, And I've heard you know, I've seen a
Speaker 2: lot of your clips, so much of that shit is hilarious, right,
Speaker 2: But I've seen also seen the stuff like you're interview
Speaker 2: with logic. I saw all of that, right, And you know,
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know you personally. You know, you
Speaker 2: seem like a person with a good heart. If I
Speaker 2: was to take a wild fucking guess, but who knows,
Speaker 2: you might be just a dude dressed up as a
Speaker 2: get go with green kite on his face, murdering people
Speaker 2: in a basement already. But as far as I can tell,
Speaker 2: right like, you seem like a pretty a person with
Speaker 2: a good heart, right, with good intentions. You know that
Speaker 2: alone you, I think, is like you should take a
Speaker 2: little bit of comfort in that. Right, it's gonna, it's gonna,
Speaker 2: it's gonna take you right right.
Speaker 1: I appreciate that.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna. I'm trying my best. Man, I'm trying my best.
Speaker 3: Oh man, yeah.
Speaker 1: I'm trying.
Speaker 3: I'm trying my best to be Uh, I don't know,
Speaker 3: I guess my well, my main motivations lately have just
Speaker 3: been like to you know again, escape from despair. Yeah,
Speaker 3: this has been my main motivation. You know sometimes I
Speaker 3: think sometimes I think, you know, as funny as I think.
Speaker 1: Yeah, go ahead, go ahead? No, no, yeah, I forget
Speaker 1: what what what? What? What were you going to say?
Speaker 3: And then you know, I I have to I have
Speaker 3: to end this call sort of soon because I think
Speaker 3: you've tricked me into being vulnerable. No not actually not
Speaker 3: actually well, I mean a little bit actually, but it's okay,
Speaker 3: it's it's okay, I accept it.
Speaker 1: What were you going to say this call?
Speaker 2: I know you're you're in Japan right now, right, I
Speaker 2: don't want to take up too much of your time.
Speaker 2: But have you heard of the movie called Perfect Days?
Speaker 1: Perfect Days? Oh? That's uh, yeah, I have heard of
Speaker 1: that movie. I never watched it, though, I.
Speaker 2: Think you might get something out of it if you
Speaker 2: have the time to check it out. I think the
Speaker 2: based on all the conversations that we just had right now,
Speaker 2: if you get the time to check it out, and
Speaker 2: I think it'd be super special while you check it
Speaker 2: out in Japan as a Japanese Willee, you know, mm.
Speaker 3: Hmm okay, cool, maybe I'll watch it, might enjoy Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: okay maybe, oh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. Well thanks, man, I really appreciate you talking
Speaker 2: to me. I really appreciate you, you know, balancing ideas
Speaker 2: off and such. This is actually this felts great. Like
Speaker 2: I was sitting here and I was just about to meditate,
Speaker 2: but I was like, you know what, let me see
Speaker 2: if Lyle happens to cover. So this really put us
Speaker 2: bile on my face. Man, I feel I feel really happy,
Speaker 2: you know. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Mo.
Speaker 3: I appreciate it, sincerely, very very good talking to you.
Speaker 3: This feel I feel like today today the the Therapy
Speaker 3: Gecko was was therapy.
Speaker 1: This is the.
Speaker 3: Therapy mode episode you Therapy geckoed the Therapy Gecko today,
Speaker 3: So thank you, thank you for that.
Speaker 2: When I when I when I officially become a therapist,
Speaker 2: I'll see you as my first client.
Speaker 1: Man, that would be uh. That sounds like a conflict
Speaker 1: of interest, but I'm down. I'm game, all right.
Speaker 2: Man, you have a good time in Japan, you know.
Speaker 2: Thank you. I hope you go do your thing.
Speaker 1: Man, take it easy, thank you, thank you. Take it easy.
Speaker 3: Later on, Man, that was a nice phone call. I
Speaker 3: really enjoyed talking to Mo.
Speaker 1: It it's you know, it's interesting. I went again.
Speaker 3: I went on a rant uh last episode about talking
Speaker 3: about your problems, not really solving them, but it helps you.
Speaker 3: It does help you think, like I mean again, and
Speaker 3: it's a yin yang fucking thing. There's like fifty percent
Speaker 3: thinking and fifty percent. I don't know what the exact
Speaker 3: ratios are, but it's some math equation that's part thinking
Speaker 3: and part taking actual action. And I think if you're
Speaker 3: and I'm definitely a neurotic person, I'm definitely an overthinker,
Speaker 3: and so I think, I h I think I think
Speaker 3: too much. Is a spiral of thinking. But it is
Speaker 3: good to kind of have a conversation like that that
Speaker 3: gets you with another person.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: MO definitely described a lot of things that I have
Speaker 3: cooking in my brain as well. And it's nice when
Speaker 3: you get to talk to somebody like that because it
Speaker 3: makes you feel like you're not crazy, you know, for
Speaker 3: having you.
Speaker 1: You're actually you.
Speaker 3: What you may think is some kind of unique human
Speaker 3: experience has actually been fucking observed and recorded by other
Speaker 3: people who are not you, which is comforting sense. So yeah,
Speaker 3: I appreciate uh MO for calling in, and do I
Speaker 3: have anything else to say? I hope that conversation was beneficial
Speaker 3: for the people of the computer to listen to. And
Speaker 3: I'm a gecko and thank you guys for listening. Goes
Speaker 3: on the line, taking your phone calls every night, demand
Speaker 3: goes to ride.
Speaker 2: He's teaching you a loud in the memorial line, but
Speaker 2: he's not really an expert.