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Speaker 1: responsible gaming resources. All right, good hour tonight with John Middlecoff,
Speaker 1: former NFL scout for the Philadelphia Eagles, will be joining
Speaker 1: me in about ten minutes. Talk obviously about the Bills
Speaker 1: discouraging loss to Philadelphia or Philadelphia's basically game plan week
Speaker 1: after week to be outplayed for large stretches of games
Speaker 1: and then come back to win. We'll talk about that
Speaker 1: some Jim Harbaugh, Michigan football, some college football, the big
Speaker 1: playoff picture overall. What Russell Wilson and Sean Payton now
Speaker 1: they are a playoff team and the hottest team in
Speaker 1: the AFC, the Denver Broncos. What do the Seahawks do
Speaker 1: with Geno Smith? It's obviously now he has regressed to
Speaker 1: the mean, as they say, So a lot of things
Speaker 1: to talk about. I want to start with the Chargers
Speaker 1: losing to the Ravens. So I went back during the
Speaker 1: game because it just felt like it was going to
Speaker 1: be a close ending. It ended up being a Ravens
Speaker 1: win by double digits. But if you go back to
Speaker 1: last year, the LA Chargers have lost eight games by
Speaker 1: three or less, and they've lost their last seven in fact,
Speaker 1: by three or less. So I've said it's not man
Speaker 1: overboard with head coach Brandon Staley. It's not as though
Speaker 1: they're not competitive. But just think about this. Right now,
Speaker 1: the Los Angeles Chargers have the same number of wins
Speaker 1: as the New York Giants in a quarterback league when
Speaker 1: they are now on Tommy DeVito, their third quarterback. Now,
Speaker 1: I know a lot of you people just love to say,
Speaker 1: well Justin Herbert, you know he is overrated. Let's say
Speaker 1: he is at six five two forty, super mobile. You
Speaker 1: saw his run up to the left sideline tonight, big
Speaker 1: fast kid, huge power arm. Would you not take him?
Speaker 1: Over all? But about seven guys in the league. I mean,
Speaker 1: if you watched Desmond Ritter or are you watching what's
Speaker 1: happening in these games? Are are you watching Zach Wilson
Speaker 1: or Tim Boyle Is? Backup? You know, are you watching
Speaker 1: Will Levis? You take Justin Herbert over all, but about
Speaker 1: six guys. But you know what's interesting right now in
Speaker 1: the AFC playoff picture, only Tennessee, the Jets, New England,
Speaker 1: all really bad at quarterback, are below the Chargers. If
Speaker 1: you want something to change in any business, you have
Speaker 1: to make changes. So again, I'm not a guy that
Speaker 1: calls for the firing of a head coach, but once again,
Speaker 1: end of a game, they really got a break because
Speaker 1: John Harbaugh, the Ravens should have gone for it on
Speaker 1: that fourth and short instead of trying to go up
Speaker 1: by six. You're better off getting a first down, forcing
Speaker 1: the Chargers and you will all their timeouts and any
Speaker 1: of the game that they got a break. John Harbaugh
Speaker 1: made a rare clock management mistake. They really did make
Speaker 1: a mistake. That's and I think Baltimore's as well run
Speaker 1: as any organization in football. He may have been thinking,
Speaker 1: nobody's gonna score touchdowns against our defense, but that's generally
Speaker 1: they should have gone for fourth and short, picked it up,
Speaker 1: forced the Chargers to burn all their timeouts. Be that
Speaker 1: as it may. They went on to win anyway. But
Speaker 1: I think the Chargers are at a point now where
Speaker 1: and maybe this was last year, but their brand is
Speaker 1: like mismanagement. Their brand is blowing wins, their brand is underachieving.
Speaker 1: That is a lousy brand to have, and it's a
Speaker 1: really bad brand. In Los Angeles, which we've talked about before,
Speaker 1: is a very distracted sports market. The beach, the weather,
Speaker 1: the mountains, proximity to Vegas, Scottsdale. Lots to do here,
Speaker 1: the Dodgers, the Lakers, the Clippers. You got soccer, you
Speaker 1: got hockey, you got major college basketball now USC and UCLA.
Speaker 1: There's stuff to do. There's a lot of things to
Speaker 1: do here. And if you don't win, people move on.
Speaker 1: There's another NFL team sharing your building, and right now
Speaker 1: that team, the Rams, has a better record than you,
Speaker 1: and they're in a rebuild year. So I think in
Speaker 1: a very distracted market, the Chargers are getting to a
Speaker 1: point now where their brand is just futility. And I
Speaker 1: know inside the building, and this is the downside to
Speaker 1: having an owner the Spanos family, where their kids work
Speaker 1: in the building, is that everybody, you know, it's like
Speaker 1: any family business. Everybody kind of walks on eggshells, knows
Speaker 1: what to really say in crisis. But they have a
Speaker 1: major crisis on their hands. The brand, which has never
Speaker 1: been a powerful brand to begin with. They were playing
Speaker 1: in a soccer stadium a couple of years ago. The
Speaker 1: town they were in a few years ago, San Diego.
Speaker 1: Now many of those fans resent the Chargers. So it's
Speaker 1: not a very good brand to begin with. But in
Speaker 1: Los Angeles it's getting lost. It's just it's not must see.
Speaker 1: In fact, you know tonight, Lamar Jackson's as big a
Speaker 1: draw as the Chargers are. So at some point if
Speaker 1: market share and you know, a local viability matter, it's
Speaker 1: just becoming a bad brand. A really talented quarterback, a
Speaker 1: handful of talented players, now it would help if they
Speaker 1: had a deep threat. They drafted Quinton Johnston out of TCU.
Speaker 1: He's been very slow to develop. It just it looks
Speaker 1: like a bit of a miss. He doesn't look kind
Speaker 1: of buttoned up when he's out there. There's very littly
Speaker 1: can do. He's not on the field regularly, so they
Speaker 1: drafted him to replace eventually Mike Williams, a deep threat
Speaker 1: who just can't stay healthy. Williams got hurt again and
Speaker 1: Quinton Johnston's not ready to play. That has absolutely hurt
Speaker 1: this offense. Yet you know, they go on a lot
Speaker 1: of these long drives because it's the only way they
Speaker 1: can score Keenan Allen, Justin Herbert, Austin Eckler, and you
Speaker 1: know you're hoping for six yard gains from Gerald Everett,
Speaker 1: you know, and underneath stuff. So it's not nearly as
Speaker 1: viable as it could be if Mike Williams was healthy.
Speaker 1: And because Quintin Johnston has not been a hit as
Speaker 1: a first round wide receiver pick, there's some limitations to
Speaker 1: begin with. But I think you have to make a
Speaker 1: move at some point with a head coach. If you
Speaker 1: want results to change, you have to make changes. Feels
Speaker 1: very simple to me. And now a segment we called
Speaker 1: making it look easy. Matt Stafford made it look easy.
Speaker 1: Four touchdown passes against the Arizona Cardinals, some of the
Speaker 1: best play calling of the year by Sean McVay. Just
Speaker 1: like Matt Stafford made it look easy, so does Morgan
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Speaker 1: make it look easy. The Rams right now, believe it
Speaker 1: or not, are in a dog fight for a wild
Speaker 1: card spot in the NFC. And so this this was
Speaker 1: a team Vegas had their over under at about five.
Speaker 1: And I had said in the off season I had
Speaker 1: to talk myself out of putting them in the playoffs
Speaker 1: because I said, if you have a really smart offensive
Speaker 1: coach and a really talented quarterback and at least one
Speaker 1: big time weapon Sean McVay, Matt Stafford coover Cup. You know,
Speaker 1: they had a couple offensive linemen I liked and could
Speaker 1: tie to end Tyler Higbe. You had a couple of
Speaker 1: touchdowns today against Arizona. I'm like that, that's a team
Speaker 1: battling for the playoffs. But because they had so many
Speaker 1: young players defensively, you know, my takeaway was they probably
Speaker 1: won't they won't stop people. Well, Raheem Morris has been
Speaker 1: a great defensive coordinator for them. But it's really the
Speaker 1: Rams kind of ironically have become the opposite of the Chargers.
Speaker 1: Where the Chargers are constantly underachieving, the Rams are the opposite.
Speaker 1: I mean, if you really look at what this year
Speaker 1: was outside of Aaron Donald, it is a bunch of kids.
Speaker 1: There is no money on the defensive side at all,
Speaker 1: and they're playing very well now. They were physically controlled
Speaker 1: by the Philadelphia Eagles, a stacked, often veteran roster. Outside
Speaker 1: of that, they have been in every game this year
Speaker 1: and have beaten teams swept Seattle, and it's just coaching
Speaker 1: mcveaon's Pete Carroll. Stafford's better than Geno Smith. But the Rams,
Speaker 1: I mean, even if you go back to their Super
Speaker 1: Bowl year, it took Matt Stafford. You know, they were
Speaker 1: struggling a couple of blowout losses. You know that they
Speaker 1: had cam Akers, who they liked but didn't love. He
Speaker 1: had a bit of a fumble problem. They almost blew
Speaker 1: that game in Tampa because of cam Aker fun. You know,
Speaker 1: it was a team that had Jalen Ramsey and Aaron Donald,
Speaker 1: but Jalen Ramsey would bite and get burned over the
Speaker 1: top a lot that was a team that was trying
Speaker 1: to kind of figure and find its way, and they
Speaker 1: eventually did for a Super Bowl. But I mean, I
Speaker 1: would say for a majority of the year, we did
Speaker 1: not look at that Rams team as a super Bowl team.
Speaker 1: They had some ugly, ugly losses and they just kind
Speaker 1: of find ways to win. With Sean McVay. Now he
Speaker 1: struggles in the regular season against Kyle Shanahan of the
Speaker 1: forty nine ers. They just don't match up particularly well
Speaker 1: with them. But outside of that matchup, I'm watching the
Speaker 1: Rams this year. The play calling, Now, Arizona's not a
Speaker 1: great team. Nobody thinks they are. The play calling today though,
Speaker 1: I mean, Cooper Cup is not one hundred percent. If
Speaker 1: you watch the game today, he is his first catch
Speaker 1: of the game, he's limping. They got Williams backed Kyron
Speaker 1: Williams are very nice running back, very shifty, very clever,
Speaker 1: and that gives them kind of a one to two
Speaker 1: punch at running back and wide receiver. But this is
Speaker 1: a team that I would argue doesn't have a single
Speaker 1: great player in their prime. Aaron Donald's not, Cooper Cupp
Speaker 1: is not, Matt Stafford's not. Rob Havenstein is a good
Speaker 1: good right tackle, but he's not in his prime. They
Speaker 1: don't have a single great player in their prime. Now
Speaker 1: go to the Philadelphia Eagles. In contrast, Jalen Hurts, great
Speaker 1: player in his prime. AJ Brown great receiver in his prime,
Speaker 1: Davonte Smith excellent player in his prime. Their left tackle
Speaker 1: young player PFF top graded left tackle in his prime.
Speaker 1: That's just on the offensive side. So Philadelphia is stacked
Speaker 1: and will probably win the Super Bowl. If you go
Speaker 1: to the forty nine Ers. Fred Warner I thinks in
Speaker 1: his prime, late prime, but you know Bosa in his prime,
Speaker 1: Debo in his prime, Brandon Ayyuk just moving into his prime.
Speaker 1: Brams don't have one. So this is a team. There
Speaker 1: are certain teams in this league that are being one
Speaker 1: buffalo another that kind of find ways to lose. You know.
Speaker 1: The Rams being a viable playoff team with this roster
Speaker 1: is I mean they've been moving offensive line pieces around,
Speaker 1: going to get running backs off the street needed. Pooka Nakua,
Speaker 1: the fifth round wide receiver early when Cooper cup was
Speaker 1: out to produce offense on the perimeter to two at
Speaker 1: Well was a bus seemingly at wide receiver. He's now
Speaker 1: semi viable big play receiver. They are just coaching and
Speaker 1: drafting and development, and I mean in the same building.
Speaker 1: You've got a team that finds ways to lose and
Speaker 1: a team that finds ways to win. There's no way
Speaker 1: the Rams should be a more viable playoff team this
Speaker 1: year than the Chargers. Again, Chargers justin Herbert in his prime.
Speaker 1: They're left tackle Slater in his prime. It was a
Speaker 1: great players Derwin James in his prime, Bosa in his prime.
Speaker 1: You know several high players Rams don't have won. They
Speaker 1: have good players, no great players though, in the middle,
Speaker 1: in the meat of their career. All right. John Middlecoff,
Speaker 1: former NFL scout on the Three and Out podcast for
Speaker 1: the volume Let's start. Philadelphia plays about as poorly as
Speaker 1: they can possibly play. This is the team you used
Speaker 1: to scout for. They have made sort of an art
Speaker 1: form out of sluggish wins. It's probably why I think
Speaker 1: I give them. I'd make them the favorite to win
Speaker 1: the Super Bowl this year. I thought they were so.
Speaker 1: In fact, it was my DraftKings bet of the week.
Speaker 1: I thought Buffalo and four and a half was a
Speaker 1: great bet. Did you have your doubts in this one?
Speaker 1: Because it was so sloppy.
Speaker 2: Early well, I mean felt like a lock Buffalo win
Speaker 2: when it was twenty four to fourteen and they were
Speaker 2: in complete control, and then it went touch down Josh
Speaker 2: Allen interception touchdown, and then they got the lead. And
Speaker 2: then he went, well, this is the Philadelphia team we've
Speaker 2: seen all year, because I don't think there's any player
Speaker 2: in the NFL who has looked as poorly in their
Speaker 2: parts of games and then turn the switch and look
Speaker 2: like an MVP again. And maybe it's you know, Romo.
Speaker 2: They talked about that. Whatever it is, the deep thigh
Speaker 2: Brews or the injury that he's dealing with, it's not
Speaker 2: something that you know, you just you got a pain tolerance.
Speaker 2: Maybe as the game goes on he gets a little looser, Yeah,
Speaker 2: because early on in games, there is no elite player
Speaker 2: who plays as crappy in the first half as Jalen.
Speaker 2: You look up at his stats early on in the
Speaker 2: first half, he barely had over he had under forty
Speaker 2: yards passing. Yeah, and then all of a sudden, you
Speaker 2: look at the end of the game, you're like, I
Speaker 2: thought the guy was awesome. You know, it's he's been
Speaker 2: a he's been a crazy roller coaster ride and it
Speaker 2: goes back. You know, Josh Allen can't play much better.
Speaker 2: I mean John Elway meets Cam Newton today. But yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, the Bills just find ways to lose games
Speaker 2: this year.
Speaker 1: I mean they had ten first half penalties. I counted
Speaker 1: two drop Yeah, I mean I think, you know, and
Speaker 1: I'll get into this later when you watch, like I
Speaker 1: watch what Sean Payton's doing in Denver, and they just
Speaker 1: don't make many mistakes. I don't think they're gifted. I
Speaker 1: think they have some really good players. Buffalo. I mean
Speaker 1: I've compared them to Mike Tyson, like they don't. You know,
Speaker 1: Tyson at the end didn't have a jab, you know,
Speaker 1: left himself wide open, but he had this vicious power
Speaker 1: and so he you know, he swung from the heels.
Speaker 1: It was a little bit like Tiger coming out of
Speaker 1: his shoes as a golfer. It just made up if
Speaker 1: the irons were off. And I look at Buffalo and
Speaker 1: I think, listen, you're not gonna there's not gonna be
Speaker 1: a game this year that Philadelphia probably won't play that
Speaker 1: poorly for a half. They I mean, they may say
Speaker 1: there can be sluggish, and to me, if Buffalo can't
Speaker 1: win this game. I mean, right now, John Denver is
Speaker 1: the hottest team in the league. Buffalo's if if, if
Speaker 1: the Chargers win tonight, does Buffalo feel like a playoff
Speaker 1: team to you?
Speaker 2: They don't, because they can't win the games that they
Speaker 2: have to win. And tonight was a great example of
Speaker 2: their quarterback can't play any better. Their quarterback really this year,
Speaker 2: besides some of the primetime games, has been good. You know, statistically,
Speaker 2: he's top five in every metric. Some would argue he's
Speaker 2: been a top two or three quarterback. But today's a
Speaker 2: great example. Their defense let him down. To me, the
Speaker 2: final drive that led to the sixty yard field goal
Speaker 2: and then the final drive that led to the touchdown
Speaker 2: in overtime. I don't understand why you completely just let
Speaker 2: them get easy completions when all game long you have
Speaker 2: been playing normal defense. Yeah, they beat it, they beat it.
Speaker 2: It's a rainstorm, that field is slippery. Okay, if they
Speaker 2: make hit some miraculous play, you tip your hat. But
Speaker 2: to just play, you know whatever, eight ten, twelve yards
Speaker 2: off and give them completion after completion after completion. With
Speaker 2: this offense, they're too potent once they get close you
Speaker 2: saw on the final touchdown with Jalen Hurts. At any
Speaker 2: moment he can run it. And obviously they just got
Speaker 2: in field goal range. And honestly, if it wasn't for
Speaker 2: a Hall of Fame center making a couple shitty weird
Speaker 2: plays the pre snap that cost him couple of yards,
Speaker 2: they would have had a fifty yard field goal drove
Speaker 2: the field pretty easily. So yeah, I do not think
Speaker 2: Buffalo is a playoff team. I'm with you, Denver is
Speaker 2: playing much better on defense. And there's a belief. I
Speaker 2: don't see how you lose this game. If you're Buffalo
Speaker 2: and have any belief, you know that's I think this.
Speaker 2: You start looking around, you go what what else can
Speaker 2: we do?
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's also and I've beat on this now for
Speaker 1: two years, but there's two quarterbacks in this league that
Speaker 1: we feel are being let down by their coaching staff.
Speaker 1: Buffalo and the Chargers defensive head coaches, defensive cultures. And
Speaker 1: in both they have one great receiver, capable backs, good
Speaker 1: enough o lines, nice pass rushers, but we just feel
Speaker 1: like they're uneven and the quarterback does all he can do.
Speaker 1: And I'll go back to saying and I'll get into
Speaker 1: this in a bit. I mean what Sean McVay is
Speaker 1: doing with this rickety rebuilt old or too young roster,
Speaker 1: with the rams he's manufacturing points. I never feel like
Speaker 1: the Chargers, despite killing more the Chargers or the Bill's
Speaker 1: manufacture stuff. It's just Herbert, go make throws, Keenan Allen,
Speaker 1: go make catches. Josh Allen, be great and listen. There's
Speaker 1: no you know again, if you're gonna lose to anybody
Speaker 1: at Philadelphia, late is about as good a loss as
Speaker 1: the NFL has. But I also think that there is
Speaker 1: something to be said about. You know, Buffalo's not Green Bay.
Speaker 1: You have an owner and free agents would go there.
Speaker 1: But John, let's be honest about this. I think you
Speaker 1: have about four more years of Josh Allen in his
Speaker 1: prime because he takes too many shots, and then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden it's like it's not the same and
Speaker 1: his contract's going to get bigger. I just kind of
Speaker 1: feel like they've blown it. I feel like I don't
Speaker 1: feel like Herbert's blown it yet because they could get
Speaker 1: the right coach. I don't think Buffalo's ever gonna move off.
Speaker 2: Sean McDermott, well, to me, if they were to do it,
Speaker 2: and were to get a better coach and upgrade, which
Speaker 2: is going to be difficult, they would have a chance
Speaker 2: because the way that guy when he is on like
Speaker 2: he was today, you're watching and you go, Mahomes has
Speaker 2: a better career resume and has more accomplishments. But like
Speaker 2: that version of Josh Allen, there's nothing quite like that, right,
Speaker 2: I mean, that's like peak John Elway meets Cam Newton.
Speaker 2: Like you said, how long can you play like that?
Speaker 2: You can't really hit the quarterback as much anymore. But
Speaker 2: he did have the one play when Reddick got him
Speaker 2: early in the game, he got slammed like it was
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty five. Yeah, I just wonder the NFL football
Speaker 2: is a team game ultimately, even if you have pon.
Speaker 2: There's a reason Peyton Manny didn't win as much as
Speaker 2: Tom Brady. His teams were never as good. Yeah, And
Speaker 2: I remember hearing stories when I was in the NFL
Speaker 2: that Tom Condon would get on the phone with Bill
Speaker 2: Pollian and Bill's like, we're not going to be able
Speaker 2: to buy any players, and Tom would say more more.
Speaker 2: And Peyton was always paid a premium and their teams
Speaker 2: always had major flaws and listen, Tom Brady looks like
Speaker 2: he's doing pretty well financially right now. Took a little
Speaker 2: bit less and his teams were much more stacked, and
Speaker 2: that was a huge difference. And honestly, it wasn't until
Speaker 2: the end when Peyton got to Denver that he probably
Speaker 2: played on the most complete teams. But he was older.
Speaker 2: Can you imagine him in his peak in younger days,
Speaker 2: it would have a John Elway.
Speaker 1: Made Elway made him take a bit of a pay cut.
Speaker 1: Remember he and Lway had a little bit of a
Speaker 1: clash because John wanted Peyton to take less.
Speaker 2: I just don't think you can play in the NFL
Speaker 2: like a basketball team where you're like Yanna Steph just
Speaker 2: carry us. That's not the way it really works over
Speaker 2: the course of a season, especially when you run into
Speaker 2: good teams, and let's face it, when you shoot yourself
Speaker 2: in the foot like the Bills did early in the season.
Speaker 2: There's too much to make up for now. The AFC,
Speaker 2: because of the injuries, is still not great, but it's
Speaker 2: hard to have much. I do think there's an emotional
Speaker 2: toll that losing in football takes on you, right It's
Speaker 2: it's one thing if you lose a game, Like if
Speaker 2: the Eagles would have lost this game, they could easily
Speaker 2: just shake it off. I think the Bills are at
Speaker 2: the point where that might just be the crushing blow
Speaker 2: for their season.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I don't want to be too punitive on
Speaker 1: Buffalo because if Gabe Davis turns the other way, they
Speaker 1: win the game. I mean, this whole world. You can
Speaker 1: go to Ohio, State, Michigan, you can go to Washington,
Speaker 1: Washing and in state. These games are decided on inches,
Speaker 1: not feet. One play here and there. So I thought Buffalo,
Speaker 1: but it did feel like it's it's an accumulation of
Speaker 1: games blown and opportunities not seized. And I think that's
Speaker 1: going to be the season for Buffalo.
Speaker 2: Well, I think in Romo mentioned this for the first
Speaker 2: time this year, they've had a little bit more consistent
Speaker 2: running game. Cook is you know the best running back
Speaker 2: they've had. Well, if they would have had that a
Speaker 2: couple look at the Eagles at any moment, they can
Speaker 2: just hand it to a guy that they're GM traded
Speaker 2: like twenty seventy five fifth round pick for, and they
Speaker 2: can control the ball on the ground right because the
Speaker 2: quarterback also runs. Yet the Bills finally can run the ball.
Speaker 2: And it's two years too late because if you would
Speaker 2: have put a running game on that team a couple
Speaker 2: of years ago, maybe they're not playing at Kansas City
Speaker 2: in the second round of that game is in Buffalo,
Speaker 2: and they're the number one seed. But like you said that,
Speaker 2: there's a window because of the way finances work in
Speaker 2: the NFL, these contracts are not just equal year to year,
Speaker 2: right look at Deshaun Watson. This year's twenty million on
Speaker 2: the cap, next year it's sixty three. Like these swings
Speaker 2: dramatically impact your team. So's it sucks if you're a
Speaker 2: Bills fan because they've been a franchise that was so
Speaker 2: terrible for so long and they get this franchise quarterback
Speaker 2: and now it feels like their finest moment was the
Speaker 2: blown thirteen second game to the Kansay Chiefs.
Speaker 1: And Philadelphia can certainly win anywhere. They could win at Datlas,
Speaker 1: they could win at Detroit, they could win at San Francisco.
Speaker 1: But these wins matter if you want to be the
Speaker 1: number one seed. Also, it's a team that has some
Speaker 1: age up front. Philadelphia could certainly use a week off.
Speaker 1: Jalen Hurtz is you know, like Travis Kelcey, Jalen Hurts,
Speaker 1: Jason kelce these guys. I don't think they're ever at
Speaker 1: even ninety percent at this point. So I think Philadelphia
Speaker 1: is a team that could use a week off. So
Speaker 1: this win is not just another w It goes a
Speaker 1: long way in the NFC home field advantage race.
Speaker 2: Well, if they would have lost this game with the
Speaker 2: forty nine ers coming in with a lot of momentum,
Speaker 2: the extra couple days because they played on Thanksgiving, I
Speaker 2: would look at the NFC a lot different. Honestly, the
Speaker 2: Eagles this game on Sunday does like they won the
Speaker 2: Chiefs game, they won the Bills game, they can lose
Speaker 2: the Niner game whatever. I think the Niners played a
Speaker 2: Bill or me the Ravens. It's not like the Niners
Speaker 2: are just gonna cruise undefeated even if they beat the Eagles.
Speaker 2: So this game, honestly, with Detroit LEAC and Oil probably borderlines,
Speaker 2: solidifies their spot as the number one seed, which is huge.
Speaker 2: We saw it last year the Niners had to go
Speaker 2: to Philadelphia's. This is not Levi Stadium. I mean it
Speaker 2: was rainy, it was cold. Yeah, not a soul in
Speaker 2: that stadium left it. The area embraces the ugliness, and
Speaker 2: it's just they're now built to play like that too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Philadelphia could rest starters in the final week, and
Speaker 1: if they got to the Super Bowl, gets two weeks
Speaker 1: for the Super Bowls. So in it really feels like
Speaker 1: a magical year for Philadelphia if you just keep winning
Speaker 1: games like this. There's a reason they do it. They're
Speaker 1: so situationally excellent. But it also one of the things
Speaker 1: you worry about with Philadelphia is, oh hurts is Jayalen healthy?
Speaker 1: They could rest starters absolutely in week seventeen as Detroit
Speaker 1: as you said, leak's oil. San Francisco's also got some
Speaker 1: really tough games to the stretch and also Super Bowl.
Speaker 1: So like even in a even in like a cosmic way,
Speaker 1: what they if you could, if you could literally take
Speaker 1: a want and go, okay, give Philadelphia a couple of
Speaker 1: weeks to get rest and healthy, because I think San
Speaker 1: Francisco has the best roster. But listen, if you told
Speaker 1: me San Francisco Philadelphia today and it's in Philadelphia, I
Speaker 1: think it's one of the great games we've seen in
Speaker 1: recent years. But I'd have to lean Philly.
Speaker 2: I really would you know, I saw your take last
Speaker 2: week about Jalen's composure in the way he acts in
Speaker 2: front of a press conference and how impressive he is.
Speaker 2: Doesn't that carry over to the way he plays? Yeah, good, bad,
Speaker 2: or indifferent? I mean, he scores the game when he
Speaker 2: touched down, he acts so different than when he's got
Speaker 2: twenty yards in a first half. Meanwhile, his coach jumping
Speaker 2: up and down, acting like an idiot. Jalen's the opposite.
Speaker 2: I mean, let's face it, Sirianni's get a little over
Speaker 2: the top for my liking, but Jalen is actually much
Speaker 2: more coach like in his mannerisms and the way he
Speaker 2: conducts himself as a player. You never they score touchdowns, unfazed,
Speaker 2: not celebrate. If you're an Eagle fan, to have that
Speaker 2: Carson Wentz situation and to pivot to this guy, it's
Speaker 2: just it's an all time football Havn't throwing you a
Speaker 2: bone move because that's a pretty special player.
Speaker 1: We could talk about a variety of things. I do
Speaker 1: want to talk about Sean Payton and what he's done
Speaker 1: for Russell Wilson. They are now the hottest team in
Speaker 1: the NFL, and I mean, we all know coaching matters.
Speaker 1: Nobody disputes that, but I'm watching them today. They have
Speaker 1: really figured out Russell Wilson. He can throw for one
Speaker 1: hundred and thirty five yards. He had eight rushes. You
Speaker 1: could tell very early in the game Sean's like Russ,
Speaker 1: there's going to be real limitations on throwing the ball
Speaker 1: down the field. I need you to run. The game
Speaker 1: plan was clearly run the football screen it mitigate their
Speaker 1: pass rush. With Cleveland a lot of screens, Russ, anytime
Speaker 1: you can run. They were trying to keep the Cleveland
Speaker 1: defense as passive as they could on screens, and Russell
Speaker 1: running slowed him down a little bit. But as I
Speaker 1: watched that game, I think this is it's Listen. We
Speaker 1: always knew that Sean Payton had a winning record with Bridgewater,
Speaker 1: Taysom Hill, Drew Brees. I don't know if he did
Speaker 1: with Jamis Winston, but it was close. So he's won
Speaker 1: with different, stylistically different guys. But Russell Wilson is absolutely
Speaker 1: and I know this to be true, he's a difficult
Speaker 1: quarterback for Sean Payton. His style isn't Sean's. This isn't
Speaker 1: what Shawn would hand pick right, and so it's just different.
Speaker 1: I watched that game today and I'm like, it is
Speaker 1: amazing when a quarterback plays to his straints, how good
Speaker 1: Suddenly Denver's roster looks Simmons the safety, Sir Tan DJ
Speaker 1: Jones in the middle, by the way, Mims can be
Speaker 1: wildly explosive. Courtland Sutton's always been talented. They'll get Dulsitch
Speaker 1: back at tight end, but they're tied end. Made a
Speaker 1: great Cats today. Williams and p Ryan are really wrong,
Speaker 1: very similar style backs, both can catch o line. I
Speaker 1: thought today that a pretty good job of protecting Russ.
Speaker 1: Suddenly the quarterback play. You look around and you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: you know what, Denver's pretty good. How good are they?
Speaker 1: Do you think? Well?
Speaker 2: I mean, I think Russ these last couple of weeks
Speaker 2: is carrying himself a little old school moving around. I mean,
Speaker 2: he had some runs today. You're like, wow, where has
Speaker 2: that been? You know when everyone was being critical last
Speaker 2: year and early in this season. To me, he's dramatically better.
Speaker 2: But I think what Shawn's really proven is being a
Speaker 2: head coach is more than just being a play caller. Right.
Speaker 2: We saw it with Nathaniel Hackett, who's proven not to
Speaker 2: be a very good play caller, either overwhelmed by everything else.
Speaker 2: Early on in the season, everybody and their mother are saying,
Speaker 2: you advanced joke, seventy points, you gotta fire him. He
Speaker 2: was able to just kind of ride out the storm
Speaker 2: locker room lawyer, some older guys with big money probably
Speaker 2: doing who knows what to his younger players. Frank Clark,
Speaker 2: Randy Gregory, get out of my locker room when you
Speaker 2: watch him to day, Cleveland easily has been not just
Speaker 2: the best defense in the NFL, but the most physical
Speaker 2: defense in the NFL. I thought Denver was every bit
Speaker 2: as physical flying around with rushing people. So he has
Speaker 2: maintained a level of improving Russell and getting Russell to
Speaker 2: just go more like he was in his younger days
Speaker 2: in Seattle, and the defense which again Colin, they scored
Speaker 2: twenty points in the game and still lost by fifty,
Speaker 2: Like that could be a firefule defense on its own,
Speaker 2: but he's stuck with him. You watch Vance Joseph right
Speaker 2: now these last couple weeks. Their defense is playing really good,
Speaker 2: so that you know the Raiders are just they're just okay.
Speaker 2: The Chargers you can never trust. Obviously, the Chiefs are
Speaker 2: gonna be fine. But you look at the AFC. I mean,
Speaker 2: I do not trust Pittsburgh at all. I mean, at
Speaker 2: one point in time in the game, I thought, is
Speaker 2: this Mike Tomlins last year? Like this is this all
Speaker 2: she wrote for him? You know, he just fires a coordinator.
Speaker 2: They're down early to Jake Browning. Jake Browning's beating them.
Speaker 2: Now they ended up coming back and their offense looked
Speaker 2: a little bit better, but no one cares how many
Speaker 2: yards you get when you score sixteen points. Right at
Speaker 2: the point of that, you gotta score some points, which
Speaker 2: you cannot trust them to do.
Speaker 1: So.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I would say, beside a couple of
Speaker 2: teams in the AFC, which would obviously be the Chiefs
Speaker 2: and the Ravens, I don't think you can try. I mean,
Speaker 2: look at the Browns today, right that they are supposed
Speaker 2: to be and they have been, even with the random
Speaker 2: quarterback play, easily one of the best teams in the AFC.
Speaker 2: Denver kicked their ass today. That was not that was
Speaker 2: not a tight game, and that was not Eagles Bills
Speaker 2: going back and forth. That was we are better than
Speaker 2: you shoving you around.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they're also they're pretty lucky. Again, they get
Speaker 1: the tight end back, so they're pretty lucky right now
Speaker 1: with their their health, you know. And you start looking
Speaker 1: at the AFC, is you know Kansas City, you'll be
Speaker 1: ready to play. Baltimore hasn't had playoffs success. We think
Speaker 1: they're excellent. It thins out pretty quick. Neither one of
Speaker 1: us trust the Jags in a big spot or Houston.
Speaker 1: So you start looking at the AFC. We look at
Speaker 1: this Power Conference and I'm like Denver's style of play.
Speaker 1: John defense is young and fast, They're running the all.
Speaker 1: It's a screen run game, so that's kind of bulletproof
Speaker 1: against bad weather. And I look at them and I think, oh,
Speaker 1: I could see them going to Baltimore. I could absolutely
Speaker 1: see them going. I take Kansas City out of it,
Speaker 1: but I mean Miami. If Miami and Denver played today,
Speaker 1: I could see that getting being a completely ugly you know.
Speaker 1: First of all, the past best.
Speaker 2: Pass rusher just Torre's Achilles, James Phillips.
Speaker 1: So to me, I look at Denver and it's not
Speaker 1: crazy if you look at the momentum. If they remain
Speaker 1: healthy outside of going to Kansas City or maybe Baltimore,
Speaker 1: they can play with anybody.
Speaker 2: I will say this about Kansas City and listen, you know,
Speaker 2: it's like Kurr and Curry, like you never feel bad
Speaker 2: about betting on those guys in a big game. It
Speaker 2: doesn't mean they're always gonna win it, though. And I
Speaker 2: would say this about Travis Kelcey. I was I was
Speaker 2: talking to someone about this a couple of days ago.
Speaker 2: He's kind of looked old this year. Oh yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: and part of it he had knee injury right before
Speaker 2: the season started, he said, ankle injuries. He just kind
Speaker 2: of looks old. And this is the NFL where you
Speaker 2: don't always see it coming. I mean, he's one of
Speaker 2: the greatest players of all time. He's one of my
Speaker 2: favorite players to watch, but he's looked his age a
Speaker 2: little bit and he's no longer and their receivers are young.
Speaker 2: There was a report today they've had to do some
Speaker 2: extra filmwork about some adjustments. That's a work in progress.
Speaker 2: Maybe it's just like Belichick and Brady didn't win the
Speaker 2: Super Bowl every year. Remember the Jets got him one year.
Speaker 2: They got taken down every once in a while. And
Speaker 2: maybe just this even watching today against the Raiders, who
Speaker 2: I don't think are very good. Was a pretty tight
Speaker 2: game for a while. Now the Chiefs are ultimately better.
Speaker 2: They got a better coach and obviously a better quarterback.
Speaker 2: But you watch him, you go, I don't know, because
Speaker 2: if Travis is no longer an A plus player and
Speaker 2: let's say he's a BB minus player, well the rest
Speaker 2: around there. They're so dependent on their defense, which is good, yes,
Speaker 2: but you know, you go against Lamar, you go against
Speaker 2: that like the game could get weird and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden you just lose a nineteen to seventeen playoff game.
Speaker 2: And that's what I think they've opened themselves up to
Speaker 2: for the first time. To me, Travis flying to Taylor
Speaker 2: and being it has nothing to do with that is
Speaker 2: simply I just he's a thirty four year old guy
Speaker 2: with a lot of miles on his body. He's starting
Speaker 2: to get banged up, and he's his game very predicated
Speaker 2: on athleticism, right to eat, movement, speed, explosiveness, and it
Speaker 2: just feels like a step flow this year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and continuing on with the Chiefs and the Raiders,
Speaker 1: you're talking about an interim coach, an immobile backup quarterback. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that game was fourteen fourteen, and I until about
Speaker 1: seven minutes left, until that big Rashi Rice touchdown. I
Speaker 1: was like, or that big play by him. I forgot
Speaker 1: if it was a touchdown, but it was.
Speaker 2: Like, yeah, it was a touchdown. He kind of back.
Speaker 1: Okay, And my takeaway was it was a real game.
Speaker 1: And here's the thing about those players. So Watson's not
Speaker 1: a great athlete. Rashi Rice is a great athlete, but
Speaker 1: he's inexperienced. Tony's more of a gadget player who I
Speaker 1: don't trust. He's got very regrettable hands. So and sky
Speaker 1: Moore is just a guy. So you start looking around.
Speaker 1: They don't have a really they don't have a number one.
Speaker 1: I think Rice to me feels like he'd be are
Speaker 1: really really explosive too, with like one talent more of
Speaker 1: a two. And a lot of this, a lot of
Speaker 1: this stuff is that these guys come out of college
Speaker 1: John they're not always like Josh Allen. They're not always
Speaker 1: particularly well coached. They don't have the route tree down.
Speaker 1: They just need time, I mean tight ends. Historically struggle
Speaker 1: in year one were some receivers, you know, the great
Speaker 1: ones like Jamar Justin Jefferson can make an impact in
Speaker 1: most cases, though, it's because the quarterback's really good, right,
Speaker 1: it helps to have Burrow or even a veteran like
Speaker 1: Kirk Cousins. But I just look at Kansas City and
Speaker 1: I said this last week. They've moved into the second
Speaker 1: phase of the dynasty. The first phase is Mahomes is cheap.
Speaker 1: They can play down twenty one up twenty one. It's
Speaker 1: they look faster, smarter, and they have a ton of weapons.
Speaker 1: Phase two, they've entered Travis Kelcey. Their best player is wobbling.
Speaker 1: They've had to move off players because of Mahomes now
Speaker 1: as expensive. Their defense is the best it's been. So
Speaker 1: they're now carried kind of by their defense. And so
Speaker 1: it's like Phase two for the Patriots was no super Bowls.
Speaker 1: Now they got to them, they were closed. But Phase
Speaker 1: one was Tom was a game manager becoming a big
Speaker 1: time player defense. Phase two was the Randy Moss Welker,
Speaker 1: which was explosive, almost offensive lad and then Phase three
Speaker 1: was Tom Edelman Gronk. He got his favorite weapons ever,
Speaker 1: excellent o line play, and it was a combination of
Speaker 1: they could be explosive, but they weren't as explosive as Moss. Right,
Speaker 1: and I think with Kansas City, they're just not as explosive.
Speaker 1: They can't play down twenty one nothing to teams. So
Speaker 1: that's why, By the way, that's why if you've noticed John,
Speaker 1: they don't experiment as much. They're pretty good on script
Speaker 1: early now because I think they know, you know, I
Speaker 1: think initially with Patrick, you you could roll the dice.
Speaker 1: I think they come in scripted. They need a lead.
Speaker 2: Well they I thought last year was going to be
Speaker 2: their transitional year. It turns out they won the Super Bowl. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but it turns out this year is and I think
Speaker 2: this offseason, like I think it's gonna be very difficult
Speaker 2: for them to win the Super Bowl. Doesn't mean they
Speaker 2: can't because their head coach is an all timer and
Speaker 2: their quarterbacks an all timer. And if your defense is good,
Speaker 2: you can stay in games. And Andy's willing to run it.
Speaker 2: Why he doesn't have a choice. I mean, pa Jaco's
Speaker 2: easily a second best offensive player. You could argue if
Speaker 2: Kelsey's not elite anymore, he's every bit as good as him,
Speaker 2: at least impactful to the offense. So I think big picture,
Speaker 2: in the offense, they're gonna dress tight end in the offseason.
Speaker 2: Andy historically is always big game hunted. You know, he
Speaker 2: traded for tell Owens once upon a time. He always
Speaker 2: drafts skill guys high. I think tight ends and wide
Speaker 2: receivers are. You're gonna be a huge point emphasis for
Speaker 2: them this offseason because this quarterback's not going anywhere. And
Speaker 2: the difference with Tom Right, they did get him Randy
Speaker 2: in his prime, but for the most part he dealt
Speaker 2: with underneath wide receivers. Loved it that way. Mahomes is
Speaker 2: a deep ball thrower, Like if you're gonna make if
Speaker 2: Diggs isn't on the team next year with Josh Allen,
Speaker 2: you're gonna want a player that can get down the
Speaker 2: field because that is a massive strength and he's willing
Speaker 2: to do it. So I would expect them to be
Speaker 2: pretty aggressive this offseason for getting more speed. But it's
Speaker 2: it's going to be difficult the way, you know, just
Speaker 2: they're white. You can only do so much. I don't
Speaker 2: care how great a coach Andy is to have these
Speaker 2: guys make plays like when Rice made that player I got.
Speaker 2: I haven't seen a Chief do this in a while.
Speaker 1: All Right, I want to talk Jim Harbaugh in a second, John,
Speaker 1: but I do want to go back to because of
Speaker 1: my you know, from the Northwest, and you're a Niners guy,
Speaker 1: so we know San Francisco's really good, and you touched
Speaker 1: on it with Seattle. But Seattle's in a very interesting spot.
Speaker 1: I so Chicago's going to get the number one pick
Speaker 1: via Carolina and they're going to take Kaylea Williams, and
Speaker 1: so everybody is gonna Arizona's not going to keep that number.
Speaker 1: I mean they may and take Harrison. I could see
Speaker 1: them keeping Marvin Harrison because he's so good, but I
Speaker 1: could also see them getting a boatload of picks and
Speaker 1: going and getting other receivers. I'm not sure which way
Speaker 1: they'll go. Harrison so gifted, so Randy Moss they probably do.
Speaker 1: And so the third team there could be a bidding
Speaker 1: war for that. It's New England, whatever it is. New
Speaker 1: England's going to draft a quarterback. But Seattle is one
Speaker 1: of those teams. They don't have a lot of holes
Speaker 1: on this roster. I could see if I ran the Seahawks.
Speaker 1: I thought watching Geno Smith, who's you know, regressed to
Speaker 1: the mean. He is what he is. He was. He
Speaker 1: bombed people, forget how badly he bombed in New York.
Speaker 1: He was awful, like like not maybe not Zach Wilson bad,
Speaker 1: but he was awful. And so eventually, you know, people
Speaker 1: get a year of film on him. You know, you
Speaker 1: can see some of his teammates barking. People are getting frustrated.
Speaker 1: Seattle has enough depth at running back, at wide receiver,
Speaker 1: I even think at corner. I wonder if Seattle just
Speaker 1: says we're going all in, all in on getting up
Speaker 1: there and getting that quarterback, maybe bow Knicks, or if
Speaker 1: New England took a bone Nicks over Drake May. Because
Speaker 1: Seattle is one of those teams that's very hard to do,
Speaker 1: bring a rookie quarterback in and give up massive draft
Speaker 1: capital and players. But if Seattle said, we'll give you
Speaker 1: a you know, we'll give you a DK Metcalf. We
Speaker 1: got these two young receivers, we'll go draft another. It's
Speaker 1: a good receiver draft. We'll give you DK Metcalf. We'll
Speaker 1: give you to the number ones. I think it makes
Speaker 1: Seattle's got They've drafted so well John for two straight years.
Speaker 1: They've hit about eight home runs. I wonder if Seattle
Speaker 1: just says we can give up some draft picks here.
Speaker 2: I've been getting texts for years and it's been reported,
Speaker 2: you know, back with the Josh Allen stuff. But over
Speaker 2: the last couple of years, John Schneider has been scouting
Speaker 2: these guys heavily. I mean all the top quarterbacks he
Speaker 2: sees live, which is not normal for general managers. And
Speaker 2: I think last year they went into the season thinking
Speaker 2: we're gonna take one of these guys and what happens,
Speaker 2: you know, career year throwse thirty touchdowns. It was awesome,
Speaker 2: and they had a spot at what did they draft
Speaker 2: last year? Because of the trade they were at number five,
Speaker 2: They easily could have got to three and taken Anthony Richardson,
Speaker 2: who would have kind of been their version of Josh
Speaker 2: Allen from years before. Remember I pissed Russell Wilson off
Speaker 2: when they were thinking about sniffing around trying to get
Speaker 2: up and get him, and they didn't do it, And
Speaker 2: I think they're not gonna make that mistake again. And
Speaker 2: I'm with you. You remember to beat Trough. Once upon a
Speaker 2: Time got from the twenties to get Julio Jones at six. Andy,
Speaker 2: Once upon a time came from the mid twenties, get
Speaker 2: up I think ten or twelve whatever, Mahomes was, I
Speaker 2: think they're gonna have to do that because they are.
Speaker 2: The Niners are much better than them. But one major
Speaker 2: difference is bruck Perty's better than Geno Smith. Yes, right,
Speaker 2: so it's like you can't forever with Russell Wilson for
Speaker 2: whatever reason. Back to Harbaugh through Kyle, they kind of
Speaker 2: owned the Niners. They beat the Niners all the time. Well,
Speaker 2: the Niners are now, including the playoffs, four to ozho
Speaker 2: in the last year and a half, and it's most
Speaker 2: of those games have not felt that close. They've had
Speaker 2: moments in the game, but over the totality the sixty minutes,
Speaker 2: the Niners have separated themselves and they're kicking Geno Smith's ass.
Speaker 2: And I think that was a big reason why why
Speaker 2: the Rams kind of soured on golf is when you're
Speaker 2: not a super mobile guy and don't have a super
Speaker 2: high ceiling, the Niners hass rush can just a golfew
Speaker 2: and Stafford helped the you know, obviously the Rams in
Speaker 2: that NFC Championship game. Gino has not been able to
Speaker 2: overcome that and honestly hasn't looked very good against them
Speaker 2: at all. Beside a moment a drive here and a
Speaker 2: drive there, but the game and ultimately, if you're them,
Speaker 2: you know you're a couple of players away, probably from
Speaker 2: being a super Bowl contender, but you have no chance
Speaker 2: to beat the forty nine ers to win the division,
Speaker 2: who are probably gonna run the table again and win
Speaker 2: the division by several games because of that player. So
Speaker 2: historically they've been one of the most would you say
Speaker 2: them Andy Reid, Howie Roseman more aggressive organizations? Haven't all
Speaker 2: worked Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin. Why the hell wouldn't they
Speaker 2: do that for a quarterback? So I'm with you. They have,
Speaker 2: you know, a DK Metcalf, maybe one of their corners,
Speaker 2: not the rookie, but they got a guy that they
Speaker 2: could throw in there to also intrigue with maybe two
Speaker 2: to one to just throw hail Mary, because without that position,
Speaker 2: you could have two dk Metcalfs and Gino Smith. You're
Speaker 2: probably getting bounced in the first round no matter of one.
Speaker 1: Yea, if you bring a rookie quarterback in, I don't
Speaker 1: want to do what Carolina did and have no receivers
Speaker 1: for Bryce Young. So what if you no chance? If
Speaker 1: you could draft somebody and get a DK Metcalf comes
Speaker 1: in as you're one. If you've got other sort of
Speaker 1: pedestrian wide receivers, that's ideal to me, Tom Tellsco told
Speaker 1: me this. He goes, you don't want too many draft picks,
Speaker 1: you don't want to be too young. So he goes, Ideally,
Speaker 1: when you give up a lot, you'd like to get
Speaker 1: a veteran player, a productive player. Draft picks even in
Speaker 1: the first round thirty percent miss. So I think Seattle
Speaker 1: could give a team, you know, one of those teams
Speaker 1: in the top five or six, and just say here,
Speaker 1: we'll give you a star receiver. We'll give you our
Speaker 1: number two corner. We draft very well, we develop well,
Speaker 1: Pete always has, and we'll give you two ones that
Speaker 1: to me would be much more enticing than a million
Speaker 1: draft picks.
Speaker 2: I'm a huge believer, and part of it is just
Speaker 2: the people that are coming out now in the draft
Speaker 2: are no longer look like Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, and
Speaker 2: Tom Brady. Mobility is such a huge element in today's game.
Speaker 2: You saw it on full display with Josh Allen and
Speaker 2: Jalen Hurst. Today when you watch Brock Purdy, I don't
Speaker 2: think we give him enough credit for just the mobility
Speaker 2: to keep plays alive. Yes, and you know when you
Speaker 2: look at the other teams Seattle Detroit that aren't Dak
Speaker 2: Prescott can move, Jalen Hurts can move, Brock Purty can move.
Speaker 2: I'm not talking. You know, Jalen runs more than Dak
Speaker 2: in Brock. Those guys extend the play outside the tackle
Speaker 2: and usually you can't cover forever. You know, the receivers.
Speaker 2: These guys practice so many of these kind of you know,
Speaker 2: scramble drills. You hit them, it feels like more than
Speaker 2: half the time on a big play, and if you
Speaker 2: don't hit them, you get a lot of pass interferences.
Speaker 2: So to me the mobility, And look at this draft class, right,
Speaker 2: Bo Nicks, Drake May, all these guys who moved McCarthy
Speaker 2: were to come, Kayleb Williams athlete Penix would be the
Speaker 2: one guy who's more of a throwback, and he's he
Speaker 2: throws such a beautiful ball. But it's just hard to
Speaker 2: draft a guy who's not a great movement guy in
Speaker 2: today's day and age. Isn't it all right?
Speaker 1: So I want to go back to a game on Thanksgiving,
Speaker 1: which there's there's two stories on the Packers game and
Speaker 1: the Lions game. First of all, it's the second game
Speaker 1: in a row where Jordan Love had real life, and
Speaker 1: I think he's a player Baker Mayfield's like this. Baker
Speaker 1: relies a great deal on confidence, and when Baker loses it,
Speaker 1: he's not the same quarterback Jordan Love clearly in the
Speaker 1: last two weeks. Now, I could argue it's the coaching
Speaker 1: and the secondary of the Chargers and the bad secondary
Speaker 1: for the Lions. It's a big part of that. But
Speaker 1: be that as it may. Green Bay has drafted very
Speaker 1: good young receiver tight end talent excellent from Musgrave, Watson, Dobbs.
Speaker 1: There's some really nice players here. So let's start with
Speaker 1: the Packers and then we'll pivot to the Lions. I
Speaker 1: said this with Kenny Pickett. I feel like I've just
Speaker 1: I see what he is and I don't think you
Speaker 1: can win big. Do you have a different opinion of
Speaker 1: Jordan Love today, John as a former scout.
Speaker 2: Yeah, listen. I mean, when you're a young player, you
Speaker 2: can only react to what you see, and early on
Speaker 2: he was terrible, But looking back, you go, he hadn't
Speaker 2: really played football. The difference though, is he was not
Speaker 2: a rookie, right, He had been in the league a
Speaker 2: little longer, so I think your expectations a little higher,
Speaker 2: especially what you're used to seeing at that those colors
Speaker 2: on a quarterback on that franchise, and he looked anemic.
Speaker 2: But these last two weeks, obviously, let's even throw the
Speaker 2: Charger game away short week on the road Thanksgiving. That's
Speaker 2: you're a long way into the season. Your body's probably
Speaker 2: a little tired. Those first couple drives Collin Kenny Pickett,
Speaker 2: and let's you throw Mac Jones. Who's worse than Kenny Pickett.
Speaker 2: They don't have the physical characteristics of this guy, Like
Speaker 2: this guy does have a big power arm, moves really well. Yeah,
Speaker 2: these I tend to like because I come from the
Speaker 2: Andy Reid school of the more physically gifted guys and
Speaker 2: try to figure it out. But those guys miss just
Speaker 2: as much as the low, you know, ceiling high floor guys.
Speaker 2: But at least one a guy kind of hits like
Speaker 2: Jordan Love has been lately. You go, God, they might
Speaker 2: have God, they might be alive. What if they're actually
Speaker 2: kind of good? Because offensively they have a lot of
Speaker 2: speed outside right, a lot of speed. An offensive head
Speaker 2: coach who's literally calling the so he can impact the
Speaker 2: guy like ultimately Mike Tomlin or Belichick like they Oh,
Speaker 2: they could yell at the quarterback, they could motivate the quarterback,
Speaker 2: but they can't impact the play calling on a play
Speaker 2: to play basis. The head coach is in full control
Speaker 2: there him and Jordan. It's why you see if you
Speaker 2: watch a Packer game when it was going bad, now
Speaker 2: that's watching going good. Those guys spend a lot of
Speaker 2: time together. So yeah, I'm much more bullish on it,
Speaker 2: because how could you not be if you just watched
Speaker 2: the last two weeks, whether you thought he was bad,
Speaker 2: which I did, you go that guy looks like a
Speaker 2: really good quarterback. Now can he maintain it into December?
Speaker 2: Time will tell he gets a long break. He should
Speaker 2: be more arrested this this upcoming week, but there's no
Speaker 2: disputing he has been. He kicked their ass. Now that
Speaker 2: they are not playing very well at all, that secondary
Speaker 2: is a major problem. It's hard. I have to drop
Speaker 2: them above the other three teams, obviously the Niners, Dallas
Speaker 2: and Philly, because they that secondary like they will get
Speaker 2: beat by any of those three teams pretty easily. If
Speaker 2: that's the way they're gonna play, but this is the NFL.
Speaker 2: Man Thursday night or Thursday morning in Detroit, it's a huge, huge,
Speaker 2: when's the last time a home game we went in
Speaker 2: for Detroit thinking oh, they were a huge favor in
Speaker 2: that game, and they got worked. The final score was
Speaker 2: not as close as what we witnessed.
Speaker 1: Well, And the other thing about Jordan Love is, you know,
Speaker 1: initially I still think he's sort of an erratic thrower.
Speaker 1: He tends to be like a streaky shooter in the NBA.
Speaker 1: He's a little streaky, like he'll have And sometimes I
Speaker 1: think the more athletic guys mahomes this is certainly true. Lamar,
Speaker 1: it's true, Josh Allen, it's true. They can go off
Speaker 1: into the weeds they like mechanically when you're so gifted,
Speaker 1: like Brady had to be efficient with his mechanics. Like
Speaker 1: guys know who can be and who isn't. And so
Speaker 1: sometimes when I watch Jordan he's a little loose, And
Speaker 1: I think because he got away with it in high
Speaker 1: school college, probably gets away with it at practice, and
Speaker 1: you can see in games sometimes he just gets away
Speaker 1: with it. But I will say this, when you watch
Speaker 1: a lot of these quarterbacks that don't work. One of
Speaker 1: the things that just jumps out to you is they're
Speaker 1: just not gifted. There's not a lot of secret sauce there.
Speaker 1: Matt job Right, Yeah, Jordan Love moves really well. I
Speaker 1: don't think he has a huge arm, but it's a
Speaker 1: good arm. But he moves easy. It's it's just very
Speaker 1: easy for him to drift outside and head up field.
Speaker 1: And it's like you know that that also John buys
Speaker 1: you for about two years, buys you time at the
Speaker 1: line of scrimmage, is running for first downs.
Speaker 2: Well, even if they don't make the playoffs this year,
Speaker 2: and I probably I wouldn't put one thousand dollars on
Speaker 2: him right now to make the playoffs, but if he
Speaker 2: has two more of those over the next six or
Speaker 2: even two and a half, three games like that splits it.
Speaker 2: He's going to be their quarterback next year. And obviously
Speaker 2: they would win games, they would take themselves out of
Speaker 2: drafting the guys high. So I think he's already kind
Speaker 2: of borderline done that where he just could help them
Speaker 2: take a deep breath, keep loading up the team. On
Speaker 2: the flip side, One thing I wrote down on Thursday night,
Speaker 2: like Gino was really impressive, and the more we've got
Speaker 2: to know him as a starting quarterback, he's an easy
Speaker 2: guy to root for, how he conducts himself, just the
Speaker 2: way he's just handled the ups and downs of his career.
Speaker 2: He's just not good enough. And to me, ultimately, you know,
Speaker 2: at least with Jordan, I don't know if he is either,
Speaker 2: but he's young. There's a lot to work with. He's
Speaker 2: not making up. He's gea Now. Gino makes a lot
Speaker 2: of money. So the Seattle it's been impressive how they've
Speaker 2: pivoted away from Russ and they've kept maintained well. Now
Speaker 2: they played the Cowboys on Thursday night. I don't know
Speaker 2: about you. I don't like him in that game. You know,
Speaker 2: all of a sudden, they're kind of leaking oil and
Speaker 2: you go, it's not They got talent everywhere. Now, they've
Speaker 2: done a good job of drafting. They already had some
Speaker 2: players when he showed up. But he's kind of their problem.
Speaker 2: And they're gonna win enough games where it's eight or nine,
Speaker 2: maybe they're the seventh seed. How are they going to
Speaker 2: get a quarterback draft? Hope to draft a guy in
Speaker 2: like the second round and keep their fingers crossed.
Speaker 1: So let's go back to Green Bay Detroit, because with
Speaker 1: Detroit I always felt like you become your coach. And
Speaker 1: so Dan Campbell is big, and he's relentless, and he's emotional,
Speaker 1: and I think that's great, but emotion doesn't equal wins.
Speaker 1: And I think the first couple of years with Dan,
Speaker 1: we were all blown away by his ability. The team
Speaker 1: played hard. I mean they were flawed, but they played
Speaker 1: really hard. And I still think they play really hard.
Speaker 1: But we've seen a couple of moments. That Baltimore game
Speaker 1: was embarrassing. This game was embarrassing. Where there is I
Speaker 1: mean you start looking around at the coaches that have rings,
Speaker 1: the Belichicks and Andy Reives, the Sean mcvays, there is
Speaker 1: an intellectual level Sean Payton's that you start getting upstairs
Speaker 1: to the highest levels of these games, and they're all situational,
Speaker 1: and I just wonder, is Dan more emotion driven? There's
Speaker 1: nothing wrong with it. Pete Carroll can do some of that,
Speaker 1: but Pete's legendary for his meetings and situational football. This franchise,
Speaker 1: to me right now, Detroit feels like have they emotionally peaked?
Speaker 1: Do they have a second gear? Well?
Speaker 2: I think there's two parts to the NFL. College is
Speaker 2: a lot about motivation once you have really good players.
Speaker 2: It's why once Urban got to Jacksonville, it was like,
Speaker 2: none of that stuff matters. It's about the scheme, because
Speaker 2: the NFL is a scheme game Monday through Friday, a
Speaker 2: game plan. You know, Motivation when you're really a bad team,
Speaker 2: like what he took over matters. So when he got
Speaker 2: to Detroit, they needed some confidence. They needed a guy
Speaker 2: out in front willing to take it.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 2: These last couple of weeks, you have enormous holes in
Speaker 2: your secondary and the secondary. The schematics in the secondary
Speaker 2: are probably the most complex most you know, most people
Speaker 2: aren't very good at it. Even in the NFL. Well,
Speaker 2: he can't impact it at all. There's nothing he can do.
Speaker 2: So as a head coach, he can motivate, he can
Speaker 2: stay on these guys. Mike Tomlin the same thing with
Speaker 2: his quarterback. He can't do anything. So it's like the motivation.
Speaker 2: You have to change your coverages, whatever that may be.
Speaker 2: It's always been a point of differentiation when Bill and
Speaker 2: Tom work together, as like Bill could impact schematically every position,
Speaker 2: every unit. Well, Dan, now they're going through a little adversity.
Speaker 2: They're good enough that they're gonna end up winning some
Speaker 2: you know, more than enough games to win the division
Speaker 2: and host a playoff game. But like, do you feel
Speaker 2: as good now about them in the first round of
Speaker 2: the playoffs? Definitely not in the second round if they
Speaker 2: got to go on the road to let's say San Francisco.
Speaker 2: And to me, it gets back to I'm a Dan
Speaker 2: Campbell guy because I do think the people that believe
Speaker 2: in you matters to me. And Bill Parcells and Seohn
Speaker 2: Payton were his two biggest proponents. But he does have
Speaker 2: a flaw. Like most offense, like Andy Reid, doesn't know
Speaker 2: that much about defense in terms of relative do I
Speaker 2: think what the average person's gonna think? Why he needs
Speaker 2: a strong defensive coordinator. When you give them spags, when
Speaker 2: you give him Jim Johnson, he's kicking a lot of ass,
Speaker 2: taking a lot of names. Well now they because of personnel,
Speaker 2: some injuries. I don't really know what Dan can do
Speaker 2: right because his specialty like, okay, motivate the D line,
Speaker 2: but the secondary is more about pure scheme. You know,
Speaker 2: it's all my mind versus your mind, putting our guys
Speaker 2: in position, and that's gonna be a fatal flaw for
Speaker 2: them just moving forward because he doesn't have a pitch there.
Speaker 1: All right, So I want to talk some harball. I
Speaker 1: want to go in on harball. So let's do some
Speaker 1: Michigan Ohio State. So the three best teams, in my opinion,
Speaker 1: in the country. And I don't think there's a great
Speaker 1: deal separating him Georgia, Oregon, Michigan. I could argue, I
Speaker 1: think I would take Ohio State over Alabama and Texas,
Speaker 1: but it's inches, not feet. I just I think Ohio
Speaker 1: State's a really good team. I thought they played really,
Speaker 1: really well. They just couldn't make stops and so but
Speaker 1: here's my takeaway is that everybody wants to play that
Speaker 1: four team Michigan, Georgia, and Oregon. They don't want to
Speaker 1: play each other first, Like, right, you want to play
Speaker 1: that four team. And so my guess is Texas. If
Speaker 1: they went out, Texas is your four because they beat
Speaker 1: Alabama and Alabama and should be. I would take Ohio
Speaker 1: State to beat them, but Ohio State lost late Texas.
Speaker 2: Florida State. I see I.
Speaker 1: Disqualifying for not having a quarterback. And I think it's
Speaker 1: the weakest conference and I know people get upset, but
Speaker 1: it's almost like remember years ago in the NCAA tournament
Speaker 1: when Cincinnati Kenyan Martin broke his leg before the tournament,
Speaker 1: and it's like, well, you're not a number one seed
Speaker 1: anymore because he was like one of the players of
Speaker 1: the year. You're not the same team, So backup quarterbacks
Speaker 1: not I don't think going to compete against Georgia, Oregon, Michigan,
Speaker 1: and you can say whatever you want about that, but
Speaker 1: that's just the reality of it. I mean, the odds
Speaker 1: will change now. So if Florida State gets in you
Speaker 1: and I know that's who all those teams want to
Speaker 1: play first. They want to play Florida State first. But
Speaker 1: I was thinking about this, if it's if you're thinking
Speaker 1: about Oregon, or let's just say it's Georgia and Michigan
Speaker 1: and they both went out. Could I not make the
Speaker 1: argument that Michigan's ability so that it's the duality of life,
Speaker 1: your weakness becomes your strength. Michigan's ability to win two
Speaker 1: huge road games without their coach on the sideline actually
Speaker 1: would make me say I think Michigan's number one that
Speaker 1: in a weird way, it would get them the number
Speaker 1: one set over Georgia. Is that crazy?
Speaker 2: No, that was a really impressive win yesterday because Ohio State,
Speaker 2: to me, one knock on Ryan Days always kind of
Speaker 2: have this chip Kelly little soft right, a lot offense, defensively,
Speaker 2: dramatically better. That was a very very impressive loss. I
Speaker 2: mean his last two losses Georgia and Michigan. Obviously the
Speaker 2: Michigan game was a more physical game in terms of
Speaker 2: lower scoring. We're just I have a little more respect
Speaker 2: for Ryan Day than some of these people saying running
Speaker 2: out of town. He's they run a high level program, clearly,
Speaker 2: but for Michigan to play like at multiple times in
Speaker 2: that game when it was tied, a lot of teams
Speaker 2: without their coach and their leader would have crumbled, especially
Speaker 2: their quarterback had come into the game not playing well.
Speaker 2: That there was a togetherness of the group. Now, they
Speaker 2: obviously have a lot of guys that easily could have
Speaker 2: gone to the NFL. It's a very unique team. But
Speaker 2: that was as now they were at home. But to
Speaker 2: win that game, I have a hard time. Georgia is
Speaker 2: clearly not as good that They're just not. You can't
Speaker 2: lose the caliber of NFL players for back to back
Speaker 2: years and be as good this year doesn't mean they
Speaker 2: haven't recruited the highest level and they're not gonna win
Speaker 2: more national championships. Nick Saban did win national championship every year.
Speaker 2: He skipped some years. And to me, Oregon, it's pretty
Speaker 2: crazy that Washington can't remember the last time they lost
Speaker 2: a game Colin definitely in the regular season. It's been
Speaker 2: a while. By the time that game kicks off, what
Speaker 2: are they going to be a ten point underdog?
Speaker 1: Oh? No, Oregon is at nine and a half point favorite.
Speaker 1: So I made this argument. I think Oregon's the best
Speaker 1: team I've seen so of the three quarterbacks Carson Beck,
Speaker 1: JJ McCarthy and Bone Nicks. Bon Nicks right now is
Speaker 1: the best of the three because of the system. Their
Speaker 1: offensive line is fantastic, They're big everywhere, They've got weapons.
Speaker 1: I think they're as well coached team. They don't fumble,
Speaker 1: they don't have penalties today. I don't know what Vegas
Speaker 1: would say. I think Oregon's the best football team. I've
Speaker 1: seen him live twice. I've watched them on TV an
Speaker 1: uther two to three times. I think Oregon's the best
Speaker 1: team I've seen, better than Michigan.
Speaker 2: I'll say this, JJ played a lot better against Ohio
Speaker 2: State than he had the previous couple weeks, just in
Speaker 2: terms of some enormous third and fourth down plays, made
Speaker 2: some plays with his legs, made some great passes into
Speaker 2: tight windows like that version. He probably he's gonna have
Speaker 2: to be better than that to win a national championship.
Speaker 2: But was closer to the guy that I think through
Speaker 2: the early half of the season when they were playing
Speaker 2: you know, the School of the Blind and who knows
Speaker 2: who people were talking about him as a first round pick.
Speaker 2: He showed flashes again and clearly outplayed the Ohio State quarterback.
Speaker 2: To me, Oregon has just been consistently the best team
Speaker 2: start to finish that they have had no hiccups because
Speaker 2: even their loss, he went God, they were incredible. It
Speaker 2: was just a fourth down play the easily could have.
Speaker 2: I think are we underestimating Washington a little bit though,
Speaker 2: because defensively they've been a lot better the last couple
Speaker 2: of weeks. Offensively, they're so predicated on the pass that
Speaker 2: scares you a little bit that the balance isn't always there.
Speaker 2: But I do wonder because I think everyone and their
Speaker 2: mother's gonna pick Oregon and Hammer him ten to eleven
Speaker 2: point as a favorite. Could the game be a little club.
Speaker 2: There're gonna be a lot of Washington fans there this game.
Speaker 2: I think it was sold out like three weeks ago,
Speaker 2: so this yeah, it's gonna be a bananas.
Speaker 1: I'm going to the game.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: I think what Washington does is they have an ability
Speaker 1: to have a bad half trail anybody Michigan, Texas, Oregon,
Speaker 1: Georgia by twenty one and never be out of it.
Speaker 1: Because a Dunze is a great receiver, he'll be a
Speaker 1: first round guy. They have two other NFL receivers probably
Speaker 1: second third round guys, so they have an effective tight end.
Speaker 1: They get good pass protection. Now, Penis I thought was
Speaker 1: really off, but again Northwest cold, it's not. You know,
Speaker 1: he played at Corvallis in a rainstorm and then you know,
Speaker 1: on a short time he comes back in a huge
Speaker 1: By the way, all these underdogs Auburn against Alabama, you know,
Speaker 1: Ohio State was an underdog to Michigan. Listen, the underdog
Speaker 1: Alhos has an advantage Emotionally, you're just banging the drum
Speaker 1: all week. Nobody believes in US. So Washington State cam
Speaker 1: Ward played a great couple of great throws. Washington has
Speaker 1: the ability to be outplayed and win. I thought they
Speaker 1: were outplayed by Oregon and they just won because I
Speaker 1: mean they listen. In the NFL outside of the Jet
Speaker 1: nobody has two elite corners well in college, forget about it.
Speaker 1: And so if you have three NFL receivers john, they're
Speaker 1: just they just have matchup. Even Oregon was was blanketing
Speaker 1: them and the guys made catches. So I think Washington
Speaker 1: has the ability and this is not all college. Good
Speaker 1: teams have this. They can play poorly and win because
Speaker 1: of their passing offense.
Speaker 2: I do think back to Florida State and listen, I
Speaker 2: follow the program closely. I know they're GM well, they've
Speaker 2: put together, they have an NFL roster. Their backup quarterback
Speaker 2: also got knocked out, so the third stringer came in
Speaker 2: by the end of the game. I do think, because
Speaker 2: next year's going to the twelve team, if the four
Speaker 2: team playoff was just gonna be let's just say a minimum,
Speaker 2: another decade going, it would be hard for them to do,
Speaker 2: you know, because then it would set the precedent of
Speaker 2: leading leaving un you know, undefeated power five team out.
Speaker 2: I do wonder if the twelve team next year, it's
Speaker 2: easier for them just to go listen, your third string
Speaker 2: quarterbacks in, you're no longer the same team, because I
Speaker 2: think that would be pretty controversial, right because a lot
Speaker 2: of people are saying, well, what if Alabama, who easily
Speaker 2: could have lost, I mean, took great throw by mill Row,
Speaker 2: but they did not deserve to win that game. Obviously
Speaker 2: it's gonna be difficult for them to beat Georgia. But
Speaker 2: what if they do, then everyone's going to beat does
Speaker 2: Alabama and Georgia? Then you know all the SEC haters
Speaker 2: get involved. Well, Texas beat Alabama. Now you can say
Speaker 2: that's Week three, but still, what's the point of the game.
Speaker 2: They played the game they beat him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if Georgia loses to Bama, and I don't, I
Speaker 1: think it's it's Georgia wins because I think Carson Beck's
Speaker 1: the best quarterback they've had in this run, then I
Speaker 1: would not have an SEC team in. And by the way,
Speaker 1: Georgia loses late Alabama lost at home. I've always looked
Speaker 1: at how do you lose like Oregon losing on a
Speaker 1: last second field goal on the road in which they
Speaker 1: outplayed a team arguably that's a great loss early in
Speaker 1: the season. Yeah, Alabama losing at home is not a
Speaker 1: good loss.
Speaker 2: No, it's kills.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they got pushed around. So it does matter when
Speaker 1: you lose how you lose. Like I think, if Ohio
Speaker 1: State had lost to Michigan four weeks ago, I could
Speaker 1: make an argument I think they're better than Tech in Bama.
Speaker 1: I would. I would have no problem putting Ohio State
Speaker 1: in as long as they didn't have to play Michigan
Speaker 1: again if they met Michigan in the National because we
Speaker 1: years ago, LSU and Bama met again in the National Championship,
Speaker 1: and so I think it's a disadvantage for Michigan. Michigan
Speaker 1: would fight against it. It's not good for them. But
Speaker 1: I just things change. The reality is Florida States now
Speaker 1: on a backup to a backup in a week conference.
Speaker 1: I don't buy it.
Speaker 2: One story I always find funny is when a guy
Speaker 2: you know, kind of gets in some hot water in
Speaker 2: college with the NCAA or you know, weird stuff going on,
Speaker 2: and people go, would the NFL still be interested in him?
Speaker 2: Like when Pete Carroll left, It's like the NFL does
Speaker 2: not care one iota about the marine with a phone
Speaker 2: at Iowa, Nebraska. They they don't haven't thought more than
Speaker 2: ten seconds about it, Just like when Pete Carroll had
Speaker 2: who knows what do and what they didn't. It didn't
Speaker 2: cross their mind for once that Chip Kelly was in
Speaker 2: trouble left no one cares. Harbass value to me is
Speaker 2: higher than ever. I would say it was down a
Speaker 2: couple of years ago. He's definitely got it back because
Speaker 2: they're running an NFL program. Honestly, Ryan Day really impressed
Speaker 2: me was that that wasn't impressive outing by Ohio State
Speaker 2: because they had got the knock, and I know he
Speaker 2: freaked out at Lou Holtz earlier in the season. They
Speaker 2: were soft, like I don't think it was, you know,
Speaker 2: uncalled for by people questioning their toughness. And they're much
Speaker 2: tougher program. I mean, they're right there with Michigan. Now.
Speaker 2: Can you lose to a rival when you have the
Speaker 2: highest payroll for a coaching staff, when their head coach
Speaker 2: is at home in his shorts eating a hot dog.
Speaker 2: That's a tough. It's one thing to lose a hardbass
Speaker 2: straight up right. I think it's hard to lose to
Speaker 2: the O line coach who's thirty seven years old. These
Speaker 2: Ohio State, these people pay so much money. It was
Speaker 2: kind of another take I have is listen, I understand
Speaker 2: for Casey Wasstererman is a very successful individual and for
Speaker 2: whatever reason, loves Chip Kelly. But they had the opportunity
Speaker 2: they're going to the Big ten now to get rid
Speaker 2: of him and hire Jonathan Smith, who I think every
Speaker 2: Power five AD and every Power five head coach would
Speaker 2: say Jonathan Smith in twenty twenty three is a much
Speaker 2: better coach than Chip Kelly.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 2: Michigan State, who they're gonna start playing and is in
Speaker 2: the con gets that guy, which I don't blame Jonathan Smith.
Speaker 2: Oregon State and Washington State did everything right over the
Speaker 2: last decade and they got screwed the economics of the sport, whatever.
Speaker 2: But he had to leave even though but they upgraded
Speaker 2: the coach. I mean, to me, that's a that's a
Speaker 2: solid addition by Michigan State and to me, Ucla he got.
Speaker 2: I watched a decent amount of that game before I
Speaker 2: went to sleep. Cal kicked his ass, and let's face it,
Speaker 2: Cal plays a lot like a Big ten team, you know, physicality,
Speaker 2: what he handles Lincoln Well what's Lincoln more of a
Speaker 2: spread big twelve team. I don't know. I think that
Speaker 2: Chip Kelly's lost three or four some bad losses.
Speaker 1: Colin all right, John Middlecoff three and out at the volume,
Speaker 1: great senior as always, John, appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Happy thanks Giving, Collins's soon the volume.
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