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Speaker 1: Also media, Welcome back to Behind the Bastards, a podcast

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Speaker 1: where Robert Evans is still waking up, still kind of hungover,

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Speaker 1: which I know I introduced like a third of our

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Speaker 1: episodes that way, and it might lead some of you

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Speaker 1: to wonder, does Robert have a problem, And the answer

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Speaker 1: to that question is no, I have a solution. Sophie.

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Speaker 1: How are you doing today?

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Speaker 2: I'm in pain, but my best friend's here, so that's

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Speaker 2: a win. And you my other best friend. I have two,

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Speaker 2: I have two.

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Speaker 1: It's okay. I know where I stand. I know where

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Speaker 1: I stand. Yeah, Sarah Marshall, Welcome to the show.

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Speaker 3: Hello Robert. A pyramid is the strongest shape, or well,

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Speaker 3: I guess a triangle, but a pyramid if you're in marketing.

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Speaker 3: I Sophie, I'm so happy to be here with you,

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Speaker 3: my legend, my queen, and Robert, you a guy who

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Speaker 3: is also here. I'm just kidding. Thank you so alike.

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Speaker 3: And I think of you every time I see a goat.

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Speaker 1: A goat, Okay, that's good because there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: those out there. You. You and Sophie were talking about

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Speaker 1: your beautiful friendship, and it made me think about the

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Speaker 1: differences between like deep male and deep female friendships, because

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Speaker 1: when I was thinking back to my stories with my

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Speaker 1: best friend, it's all the different times that Linny, either

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Speaker 1: I puked on Lenny or Lenny puked on me.

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Speaker 3: I have one, but only one. Yeah, well now I

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Speaker 3: have two. I have two anyway.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, that's good. That's a good number. That's a

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Speaker 1: good number.

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Speaker 3: St Yeah, it's a I mean, what do you what

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Speaker 3: do you think that you're kind of the stuff of

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Speaker 3: your intimacy with your male friends is about un.

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Speaker 1: You know, honestly, I think a big part of it's

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Speaker 1: just male or female friends is just that kind of

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Speaker 1: that kind of bone deep trust where you feel as

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Speaker 1: comfortable with another person as you do like feeling alone

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Speaker 1: on your your couch. I would say that's about the

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Speaker 1: highest level of intimacy in or out of a romantic

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Speaker 1: relationship that exists.

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Speaker 2: Just to say, Robert, I would love to puke on you.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Sophie. That's very sweet.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Coppen one day. You guys just keep putting in

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Speaker 3: your hours.

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Speaker 1: I've avoided puking on you for the same REUW I've had.

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Speaker 1: I think I've puked done more people than the average person.

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Speaker 1: The most at once was like nine.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, wow, the most at once.

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Speaker 1: I'm proud of that. It took some work. It took

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Speaker 1: some work in elevation.

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Speaker 3: I like to stay in and you know, watch the

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Speaker 3: Drew carry Show, so I don't get the opportunity as much.

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Speaker 3: It's a great shame.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, now that you think of it, I've

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Speaker 1: never puked on someone while watching the Drew Carrey Show,

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Speaker 1: so yeah, it may be a caustive effect.

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Speaker 2: Speaking of great shows, I would like Sarah to plug

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Speaker 2: her new show.

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Speaker 3: For our audience. I have a show to plug. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: and Sophie, you have been such a help to me

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Speaker 3: in my show advertising tour, going hither and on, ringing

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Speaker 3: Mike cow Bell telling people about my new show, which

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Speaker 3: is called The Devil. You know, it's from CBC Podcasts.

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Speaker 3: It features such iconic performances as our dear friend Jamie

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Speaker 3: Loftus performing the book. Michelle remembers, Oh my god, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: that's a win that just needed to happen, and now

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Speaker 3: it's happened. And it's also, you know, an attempt to

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Speaker 3: kind of tell the story of the Satanic Panic and

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Speaker 3: its initial spread in the eighties. It's sort of long

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Speaker 3: shadow in the nineties and how it came back in

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Speaker 3: a way that suggests it never went away in the

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Speaker 3: present day by talking to individual people whose lives were

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Speaker 3: dramatically affected and often you know, pretty much destroyed by it.

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Speaker 3: And but and yet it's also I think not that depressing.

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Speaker 3: I really want to mstis that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I've had an argument with a friend about like

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Speaker 1: whether or not like because his argument was that Kissinger's

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Speaker 1: Diplomacy was the book that you needed to read in

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Speaker 1: order to really understand like American statesmanship. And I was like, now,

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Speaker 1: it's Michelle Remembers. That's the book if you want to

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Speaker 1: understand how politics works in this country.

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Speaker 3: You know, you said Americans, suh, And I was like, psychopaths. Noah, okay, weird.

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Speaker 3: I thought, I think that, Yeah, I think that's true.

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Speaker 3: And it stands to reason that the book that explains

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Speaker 3: America is Canadian.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, this is the case. Often that's the case.

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Speaker 3: I would love to hear your thoughts on Michelle Remembers,

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Speaker 3: because it's a book that like defies description, you know.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's a it's a book that I think

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Speaker 1: says a lot about how irrationality can be foundational to

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Speaker 1: a lot of people's fundamental beliefs about how the world works,

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Speaker 1: like it's and it's also a book about how I mean,

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Speaker 1: the story of the book and how it became popular

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Speaker 1: and what happened like to it during its creation is

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Speaker 1: incredibly relevant for like foundationally how everything from like reality

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Speaker 1: TV to like modern politics works in this country. Like

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Speaker 1: it's the story of a fantasy overtaking reality in the

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Speaker 1: minds of tens of millions of Americans based on nothing

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Speaker 1: but like, I'd rather believe that there's that satanic pedophiles

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Speaker 1: run the country than anything else.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, And that's like one of the things we're

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Speaker 3: trying to get at, which is, you know, kind of

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Speaker 3: this enduringly fascinating thing of like why why did people

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Speaker 3: why did it feel less scary in a way to

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Speaker 3: believe in what was seemingly the scariest thing possible.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And there's you know, that's actually very relevant to

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Speaker 1: what we're talking about today. All of this both both

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Speaker 1: how irrationality and fantasy become like the undergirding aspects of

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Speaker 1: people's under standing about reality and how about these things

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Speaker 1: have come to completely dominate us politics and culture because

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Speaker 1: they primarily primarily because they dominate the thinking and the

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Speaker 1: rationality of the power elite in this country. And that's

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Speaker 1: why today you and I, Sarah are going to be

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Speaker 1: talking about Peter Teel's weird obsession with the Antichrist.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, Oh this is amazing, wow, because I

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Speaker 3: know that he's a handful and I feel like, probably

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Speaker 3: from Sophie that Yeah, I'm so excited. Is Peter Teel?

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Speaker 3: Is this the guy who took down Gawker all by himself?

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Speaker 1: He sure did this. Is funded well with Hulk Hogan.

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Speaker 1: Hope was a load bearing part of that.

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Speaker 3: He got Hulk Hogan to hulk out all over Gawker

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Speaker 3: and journalism and free speech. So that's nice.

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Speaker 1: So we've done a two parter on Peter about his

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Speaker 1: life and background. But this is the guy. He's the

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Speaker 1: co founder of PayPal. He actually is the guy who

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Speaker 1: kind of like orchestrated Elon Musk's ouster from the company

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Speaker 1: and they were at odds. Now they're friends again. It's

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Speaker 1: a beautiful story.

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Speaker 3: You know, I'd watch an HBO original movie about that.

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Speaker 3: I would be like a six out of ten, you know.

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Speaker 2: Storrying Jeremy Strong.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, oh, I was gonna say Jared Leto for both

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Speaker 1: of them, that he was the only man upsetting enough

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Speaker 1: to play both those guys.

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Speaker 3: It'll make test audiences puke yeah on each other.

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Speaker 1: Jesse Eisenberg. I realized the other day because I saw

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Speaker 1: him in that Kieran or Rory Colchin, which one of

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Speaker 1: the Coulkins was in the movie with him. Yeah, Kieren Colchin,

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Speaker 1: and he was good, And I was like, oh, I've

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Speaker 1: hated Jesse Eisenberg for years. I guess because he just

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Speaker 1: did a good job of playing Mark Zuckerberg. Like I

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Speaker 1: think I just hated him because he did a job well.

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Speaker 3: He really did, though, But the thing is he kind

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Speaker 3: of always plays guys who you're like, hmm, no, got

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Speaker 3: away from me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't seem safe, Like I'm watching my drink

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Speaker 1: around you, Jesse Eisenberg, which she did. He I don't

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Speaker 1: think real Jesse Eisenberg is air into.

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Speaker 3: That kind of big all of his characters. You're like, look,

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Speaker 3: it's not to be rude, but I'm going to be

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Speaker 3: a little rude. It's fine.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you upset me on some fundamental level. There's something

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Speaker 1: something wrong in the pit of your soul. Jesse Eisenberg

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Speaker 1: and I'm glad you've been able to turn that into

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Speaker 1: your careers.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're not welcome in my house or.

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Speaker 3: Wow.

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Speaker 1: Sorry, if you're listening to this podcast, Jesse.

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Speaker 3: Taking No Prisoners, this is you know, you have to

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Speaker 3: be provocative in today's political wins, and we're doing it.

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Speaker 1: You have to be ruthless to get into the mood

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Speaker 1: to talk about the things Peter Teel believes about the world.

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Speaker 1: Because despite being an aspiring, immortal CEO king and one

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Speaker 1: of the major patrons of the modern far right and

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Speaker 1: the guy who got JD. Vance's career started, you know,

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Speaker 1: he funded his campaign, he funded he's he's his mentor.

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Speaker 1: Despite all of that, Peter.

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Speaker 3: Being that guy's mentor, you're like, hey, buddy, you killed

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Speaker 3: the pope and your face still looks like a captures.

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Speaker 1: Meant Yeah, still doing good.

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Speaker 3: Funny you have an apple juice or an apple sauce?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I want you to sit down over here next

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Speaker 1: to me. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Despite sports reference, that was so beautiful.

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Speaker 3: Yeah well yeah, well that's kind of a classic MST

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Speaker 3: three K descriptor of like Robert Zadar type. I will

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Speaker 3: Robert all the baseball references I can Robert Zadar, who

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Speaker 3: was a No, kids.

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Speaker 1: Don't know Robert Zadar. You know, I'm glad Robert Zadar.

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Speaker 3: It's spelled Robert the apostrophe dar obviously.

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Speaker 1: And yes he had a condition, that's why his face

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Speaker 1: looked like that, and it's often fatal, but in his case,

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Speaker 1: he was like right in the sweet spot where it

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Speaker 1: just made him an incredibly in demand character actor during

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Speaker 1: the nineteen eighties.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, you play a lot of alien prison guards.

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Speaker 1: A lot of alien prison guards.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Anyway, Robert Zadar not much to do with Peter Teal,

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Speaker 1: But the other stuff we were talking about.

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Speaker 3: Does ived Heal.

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Speaker 1: I've got back and forth in my studies on Teal,

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Speaker 1: and I think in the biographical episodes we did about him,

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Speaker 1: I concluded he's one of the very few of these

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Speaker 1: guys who like scares me because of how intelligent and

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Speaker 1: disciplined and patient and competent he is, and the fact

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Speaker 1: that disciplined intelligence and patients with him are married to

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Speaker 1: like thirty billion dollars in net worth, right, which is

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Speaker 1: a dangerous mixture for a guy who thinks democracy should

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Speaker 1: come to an end and is actively working to further

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Speaker 1: that goal. This week, I think I have to make

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Speaker 1: me a cult book because I don't entirely agree with

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Speaker 1: that anymore.

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Speaker 3: Oh, I think that's exciting.

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Speaker 1: I may have overestimated his intelligence and cunning, which I don't.

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Speaker 1: He's still a dangerous man, right, I think he's out

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Speaker 1: of his mind, And I think he's out of his

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Speaker 1: mind in part because he's not as smart as certainly

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Speaker 1: he thinks he is, and not as smart as maybe

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Speaker 1: I thought he was. And you know, it's tough for

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Speaker 1: me to tell entirely what's going on here, but I've

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Speaker 1: become increasingly convinced that he's like unwell in a way

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Speaker 1: that's leading him, that's made him less functional as a person.

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Speaker 1: And I kind of think this Antichrist obsession is an

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Speaker 1: example of that, because this is it's very disordered thinking

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Speaker 1: that you see when you like listen to him try

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Speaker 1: to explain his beliefs, which I'm going to do to you.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to try to walk you through everything. He

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Speaker 1: recently did a four day lecture series laying out his

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Speaker 1: theories on the Antichrist. There's been articles about this. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you're like reasonably online, you might have seen something

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Speaker 1: about this, because the lectures weren't public, but they were

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Speaker 1: publicly advertised. The page for the registration for these lectures

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Speaker 1: is still up on some service called Luma that I

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Speaker 1: I'd never heard of before this, but it was at

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Speaker 1: the in the Embarcadero in San Francisco on September fifteenth,

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Speaker 1: was the first of these, and it was called the Antichrist,

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Speaker 1: a four part lecture series. And the picture of this

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Speaker 1: is just like Peter Teel from fifteen years ago, underneath

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Speaker 1: the logo of the group that supported this speech, the

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Speaker 1: Act seventeen Collective. It's weird how young Sophie can pull

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Speaker 1: up that and then like a modern day photo of

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Speaker 1: Peter Teel. It's just like for it. It's fitting, I

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Speaker 1: guess for a guy whose most public obsession is with

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Speaker 1: living forever. But yeah, so the event summary reads, you

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Speaker 1: are warmly invited to a series of four lectures by

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Speaker 1: Peter Teal addressing the topic of the Biblical Antichrist. Peter

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Speaker 1: is a technology entrepreneur and investor who has spent much

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Speaker 1: of his career writing and speaking about how his Christian

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Speaker 1: faith informs his understanding of the world. His remarks will

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Speaker 1: be anchored on science and technology and will comment on

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Speaker 1: the theology, history, literature, and politics of the Antichrist.

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Speaker 2: I have twenty twenty five Peter up on the screen

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Speaker 2: for you, Robert.

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Speaker 3: Say it last place in the Katie Lang tribute competition.

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Speaker 1: That's a fair comparison, Sarah.

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Speaker 3: And I love Katie Lang. That's not the point here. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: No, And I love Peter Teal, you know.

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Speaker 3: Oh, and I mean certainly the Lord loves him, but

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Speaker 3: maybe not anybody else.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I don't know about the Lord, but yeah, possibly possibly.

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Speaker 3: If Jesus, I would simply be looking at a lot

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Speaker 3: of people who talk about me a lot and being like,

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Speaker 3: I don't know you, Please stop implying that we're friends.

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Speaker 3: This is Yeah, I'm sending you a sease and desist.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's got to be like I'm sure you've experienced

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Speaker 1: the same thing, Like when you get like a degree

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Speaker 1: of fame. Every now and then you'll meet fans who

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Speaker 1: will like talk about something you did that meant something

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Speaker 1: to them, and the way they will explain it is like,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't sound familiar to me at all. That's what

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Speaker 1: you took out of that. That's not what I meant

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Speaker 1: in any way. Can I do I say that to you?

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Speaker 1: Do I say like, oh, no, that had nothing to

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Speaker 1: do with like you've read in something completely absent there,

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Speaker 1: or do you just like smiling?

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Speaker 3: People think I often or remember me saying something that

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Speaker 3: I feel like is smarter than I said because I

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Speaker 3: don't know it any longer. But then you're like, did

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Speaker 3: I know it at one time and then I said it? Yeah,

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Speaker 3: I forgot it? Or are they confusing me with some

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Speaker 3: other show they listened to that same day? Could be

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Speaker 3: that too. Sometimes it's very interesting.

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Speaker 1: I've seen it all happen where it's like, no, that

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Speaker 1: was a guest who said that, and you just like

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Speaker 1: transposed it to being me.

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Speaker 3: Thanks for giving me credit. Yeah, I was personally in

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Speaker 3: a Simpson's commentaries, And one of the things the writers

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Speaker 3: kind of consistently talk about is like, who wrote that?

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Speaker 3: Was that your joke? Was that my joke? I can't remember,

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Speaker 3: or like someone being like I love that choke in

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Speaker 3: that episode wrote and they're like, I didn't write that joke.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that's to do a thing. Yeah, yeah, this is

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Speaker 1: my favorite thing. You did well I didn't.

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Speaker 3: So you're like that I had I was near it

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Speaker 3: and I was around, so yeah, I was in the room.

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Speaker 1: I was in the room when that joke was made. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: I midwife to that joke. Yeah, I provided moral support

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Speaker 1: to the birth of that joke.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So this summary of Peter's lecture on the Antichrist goes

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Speaker 1: on to note that Peter's thinking about the anti beliefs

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Speaker 1: on this subject drop from the work of several prominent

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Speaker 1: theologians and philosophers. These include Renee Gerard, Jonathan Swift, and

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Speaker 1: former Bastard's Pod alumni Karl Schmidt. Now, if you haven't

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Speaker 1: listened to those episodes, I would recommend listening to the

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Speaker 1: Karl Schmidt episodes. The gist of it is Schmidt was

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Speaker 1: a right wing political philosopher, and when the Nazis came

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Speaker 1: to power, they basically called him up and said, hey,

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Speaker 1: you're writing the justif the education, the educated justification for

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Speaker 1: Nazism's good? Like that, We need you to come in

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Speaker 1: and do that right. Yeah, it's not great. And you know,

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Speaker 1: Schmidt was a perfect fit for this job because his

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Speaker 1: earlier work had been a huge influence on a lot

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Speaker 1: of prominent Nazis. So he helped influence the Nazis and

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Speaker 1: how they took power. A big thing he wrote about

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Speaker 1: was how to use effectively the creation of borders in

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Speaker 1: order to destroy liberal democracy. Basically his kind of in

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Speaker 1: a nutshell, it does works very well. And he's the

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Speaker 1: guy who the basic idea was that like anytime you

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Speaker 1: every society, no matter how like liberal and democracy, draws

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Speaker 1: a line between like who are members of the community

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Speaker 1: and who aren't, who is a citizen and who isn't,

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Speaker 1: and wherever you find that line, anytime there's a border,

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Speaker 1: that's the thing you can use to destroy that liberal

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Speaker 1: democracy because you figure out where that is and you

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Speaker 1: start pushing it inward and you start trying to define

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Speaker 1: other groups as not part of the community. Right, And

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Speaker 1: that's kind of the fundamental weak point that all liberal

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Speaker 1: democracies have. And it's you know, in a way, it's

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Speaker 1: kind of the the other side of the anarchist belief that,

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Speaker 1: like any border is implies the violence of its maintenance. Right,

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Speaker 1: the existence of a border fundamentally implies violence, because that's

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Speaker 1: the only way to maintain a border. And what Schmidt

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Speaker 1: was saying is the existence of a border is an

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Speaker 1: opportunity to carve groups of people out of the body

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Speaker 1: politic in order to gain authoritarian political power. Right, that's

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Speaker 1: Karl Schmidt, who Peter Thiel loves and sees as a

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Speaker 1: big influence.

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Speaker 3: Right, So he's not being subtle about any of this.

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Speaker 3: He's like, here are my top three influences.

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Speaker 1: One of them so much my buddies. Yeah, these are

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Speaker 1: all my faves. Well, and it's the other guy that

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Speaker 1: he listed there, Renee Gerrard, is a I mean, neither

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Speaker 1: of these guys are like exactly household names, but Girard

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Speaker 1: a big part of like his belief system was the

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Speaker 1: idea of like scapegoating, right, and how like scapegoating works

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Speaker 1: within you know, and like why communities pick scapegoats, and

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Speaker 1: like how the whole process works. And that's also like

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Speaker 1: a major influence on Peter Teel, like that which is

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Speaker 1: you know, not again, if you look at the kind

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Speaker 1: of politics, like the right wing politics that he's supported

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Speaker 1: during his lifetime, it makes sense that he finds these

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Speaker 1: kind of things influential. Like, So, Schmid's essential idea is

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Speaker 1: that like when once a human society like has reached

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Speaker 1: the level where most people's basic needs are satisfied, they're

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Speaker 1: still like unmet desires, but people don't know like entirely

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Speaker 1: what it is that they want that they don't have,

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Speaker 1: and so they engage in mimicry where they like look

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Speaker 1: at what their neighbors who are doing the best have

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Speaker 1: and they seek to they aspire to mimic the most

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Speaker 1: impressive people in their society. Right. And because people are

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Speaker 1: never really satisfied and this memetic rivalry never really leads,

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's never something that you can actually like

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Speaker 1: achieve or like get the things that these unfilled desires

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Speaker 1: can't really be met, and so people need like an

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Speaker 1: explanation for why it doesn't work, for why they're not happy,

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Speaker 1: and that tends to get channeled into a war of

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Speaker 1: all against one via what Gerard called a scapegoat mechanism.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: And so these are the two huge like Schmidt and

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Speaker 1: Gerard are the two huge pillars of Peter Teel's like

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Speaker 1: personal philosophy. And one of the things Gerard believed is

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Speaker 1: that Christianity kind of marks this turning point in human

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Speaker 1: consciousness because like the Crucifixion narrative is fundamentally Jesus being

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Speaker 1: murdered in an act of collective violence against escape goat, right,

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Speaker 1: and so like that's kind of this that Christianity leads

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Speaker 1: to this sort of epiphany by which human beings have

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Speaker 1: started to realize that, like the scapegoating rituals that we

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Speaker 1: engaged in are wrong and it's like a bad thing

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Speaker 1: to do. And yeah, that's that's kind of where Girard goes.

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Speaker 1: Peter Teel winds up taking this in some weird places,

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Speaker 1: right where basically Gerard's attitude was that you have to

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Speaker 1: reject scapegoating because like Christ's example is proof that it's

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Speaker 1: fundamentally evil and wrong. And Teal's kind of interpretation from

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Speaker 1: that is that you can't really avoid scapegoating, like that's

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Speaker 1: the inevitable path forward, and so it's kind of a

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Speaker 1: thing you have to it's a tool you have to

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Speaker 1: make use of. This like human need to scapegoat is

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Speaker 1: a thing that you can use to drive politics. Essentially

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Speaker 1: where Peter Teal takes this, guys, because Gerard was not advocated, right, Well,

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Speaker 1: we're all watching that happen, you know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's not to dairy queen, that's for sure.

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Speaker 2: No.

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Speaker 1: So these are Peter Teal's kind of favorite philosophers that

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Speaker 1: have inspired his takes on the anti Christ, And unfortunately

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Speaker 1: full audio of these talks is not available publicly. Seven

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Speaker 1: hours of so or so have been leaked to a

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Speaker 1: couple of different outlets. I don't have them tragically, but

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Speaker 1: we do have one attendee took word for word nearly

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Speaker 1: notes of the first lecture, which got him kicked out

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Speaker 1: of subsequent lectures. So we've got that, and we've got

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Speaker 1: articles that have summarized and quoted directly from teal in

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Speaker 1: these lectures. So I feel pretty confident that I can

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Speaker 1: explain what this motherfucker believes to the extent that it

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Speaker 1: will ever make sense. So before we get into that,

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Speaker 1: we should talk about the group that funded this lecture series,

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Speaker 1: which is the Acts seventeen Collective. You would have seen

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Speaker 1: that on the photo of Peter that we post a

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Speaker 1: little bit earlier if you're watching it. The name of

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Speaker 1: the Act seventeen Collective is based on chapter seventeen of

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Speaker 1: the Book of Acts. And you know the Bible, uh,

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Speaker 1: and this chapter of concerns.

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Speaker 3: You said Bible, You said Bible, Sarah, go's heard of it?

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Speaker 1: Heard of it? Heard of it?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you might. You might have caught this one.

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Speaker 1: And it's it's the New Testament, which, if you're not

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Speaker 1: into religion, it's the aliens to the Old Testament's alien.

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Speaker 3: Oh God, that's so true.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely. Obviously, Jesus is sort of a Ripley figure.

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Speaker 1: I think a lot of people have argued that over

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Speaker 1: the years he was clearly heavily inspired by Ripley.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, unless he's Yeah, there's a little bit of Newt

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Speaker 3: in there too, though.

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Speaker 1: There's a little bit of new Sure. Absolutely, I think

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Speaker 1: the Apostle Paul is Hicks. We could generally Biblical scholars

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Speaker 1: agree that that the Apostle Paul was inspired by corporal Hicks. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So it's a chapter. Yeah, there's a broad consensus. You

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Speaker 1: have to really read the original Aramaic that Aliens was

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Speaker 1: written in to get a lot of that. Yeah, James

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Speaker 1: Cameron writes exclusively in arame it's a real problem for

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Speaker 1: a lot of the collaborators. So Act seventeen that the

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Speaker 1: chapter that's in concerns Paul and some of his companions

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Speaker 1: on like a trip through Greece. They're not just in Greece,

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Speaker 1: or they're not just in Athens, but it's like they

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Speaker 1: spend a lot of time in Athens arguing about religion

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Speaker 1: with philosophers. Right, They're going to these different markets in

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Speaker 1: public places and synagogues and they're talking to like educated

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Speaker 1: scholars about religion to like argue that, hey, Christianity is

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Speaker 1: a thing. Basically I'm summer, right, I'm YadA YadA ying

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Speaker 1: this a lot. But like that it is like, have.

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Speaker 3: You thought about Christianity?

434
00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:54,159
Speaker 1: Yeah? Have you thought about Christianity in like a logical

435
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 1: and like like sense. Like he's trying to make the

436
00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:00,960
Speaker 1: intellectual this is like that's chapter is like Paul arguing

437
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:04,920
Speaker 1: and debating with a lot of intellectuals about his new religion. Right,

438
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:08,879
Speaker 1: It's like, which is relevant? Yes, it's like the shark

439
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:11,520
Speaker 1: tank part of the Bible. Yeah to sell.

440
00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:13,400
Speaker 3: Girl, you gotta hate girl?

441
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:18,919
Speaker 1: And I say, girl, whatever is that a shark tank joke? Sophie?

442
00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:19,919
Speaker 1: How am I supposed to get that?

443
00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:20,400
Speaker 2: Oh?

444
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:25,359
Speaker 3: It's the ladies who peaked in high school on MLM

445
00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:28,679
Speaker 3: Facebook ten years ago kind of a thing. Oh it

446
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:29,520
Speaker 3: is happening.

447
00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 1: But yeah, it is definitely that for Paul, where he's

448
00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,800
Speaker 1: like sliding into the DMS of a friend from high

449
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,600
Speaker 1: school who happens to be like a rabbi, being like, Hey,

450
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 1: I'm doing this new thing. You want to hear about it?

451
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:44,720
Speaker 1: Can I get you to show up? Like well, there

452
00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 1: will be free makeup. We'll get it, give you free

453
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:48,480
Speaker 1: make over. Talk about Jesus.

454
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:52,120
Speaker 3: There's going to be snacks. We're going to learn about leggings.

455
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,400
Speaker 3: Yeah right, also Jesus.

456
00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:57,240
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, Jesus wants you to sell these leggings. No,

457
00:24:57,400 --> 00:25:00,280
Speaker 1: that is exactly what's going on basically, And the Act

458
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:05,680
Speaker 1: seventeen Collective is inspired by this chapter dedicated specifically to

459
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:11,480
Speaker 1: spreading Christian doctrine to political and cultural elites in Silicon Valley, right,

460
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:13,960
Speaker 1: which is why that chapter makes sense, right, because Paul

461
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:17,040
Speaker 1: is kind of talking to these sort of intellectual elites.

462
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,879
Speaker 1: Act seventeen is like, we need to be proselytizing, not

463
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,600
Speaker 1: to the poor, not to the huddled masses, you know,

464
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 1: not to the people that like Jesus talk to you,

465
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:28,000
Speaker 1: but like the billionaires. We need to convert the billionaires.

466
00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:30,360
Speaker 3: So it's the opiate of the few, now.

467
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:32,080
Speaker 1: Right exactly.

468
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 3: I mean they are obsessed with not dying, so it

469
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:37,280
Speaker 3: does make sense that they would be like, yeah, yeah,

470
00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:39,480
Speaker 3: my immortal soul. Yeah that's the ticket.

471
00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, flipping the chair around backwards. You kids are just

472
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:44,520
Speaker 1: into eternal life, huh. I know a guy who offers

473
00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:50,640
Speaker 1: eternal life, you don't even have to take your son's blood, Peter, exactly, Well,

474
00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:53,840
Speaker 1: you do have to take his son's blood, the son,

475
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:55,880
Speaker 1: somebody's son's blood, that's right.

476
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:59,240
Speaker 3: Plus gross, you just have a cracker and some grape juice.

477
00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,400
Speaker 1: That's right. And if you want to be immortal, listeners,

478
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,359
Speaker 1: whatever sponsor of the podcast comes on next will ensure

479
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:17,080
Speaker 1: that you never die. Just you though, heard that, and

480
00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:20,840
Speaker 1: we're back. I hope you're enjoying your new immortality. You

481
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 1: know you're going to watch everyone that you love and

482
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:25,880
Speaker 1: care for die, everything that you care for end, eventually,

483
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 1: watch the stars themselves wink out. But you know, have

484
00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 1: fun with that.

485
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:31,439
Speaker 3: I didn't think it through you.

486
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:33,359
Speaker 1: People never do with immortality.

487
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:37,879
Speaker 3: Also, what about the scenario where if you're immortal and

488
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:40,680
Speaker 3: everyone else dies and then there aren't people to maintain

489
00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:45,879
Speaker 3: nuclear reactors and they all melt down, and then the

490
00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 3: globe is covered in nuclear fallout? What are you going

491
00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:50,479
Speaker 3: to do then, Dracula.

492
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 1: I feel like I could maintain a nuclear reactor.

493
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, the one in your area is going to be

494
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 3: so you're going to take care of the one in Washington,

495
00:26:57,520 --> 00:26:58,200
Speaker 3: so we'll be sure.

496
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that'll that'll be good. I mean,

497
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 1: all that nuclear waste from the Hanford site's going to

498
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 1: poison all of the waters, but that'll happen anyway. Good.

499
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:09,040
Speaker 3: I mean, where else are we going to get those

500
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 3: albino gators or whatever they have right there?

501
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:15,359
Speaker 1: Exactly? You know, I assume that in a couple of

502
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:18,680
Speaker 1: generations it'll be gator territory. The Pacific Northwest will warm

503
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:20,920
Speaker 1: up enough finally, then I could have a gator farm

504
00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:21,440
Speaker 1: in my yarm.

505
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 3: You were always meant to be gator territory.

506
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:30,440
Speaker 1: Really everywhere was everywhere was so yeah. The Act seventeen

507
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 1: collective dedicated to preaching to the most needy in our society,

508
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 1: which is tech billionaires.

509
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,200
Speaker 3: Yes, well the hearts i've heard.

510
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 1: Yes, the Egyptian since yes, yes, it's funny. What I

511
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:47,919
Speaker 1: think is funniest about this is like the Act seventeen

512
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: works perfectly as a name, like you're referencing a part

513
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,119
Speaker 1: of the Bible that's relevant to what the group does.

514
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,240
Speaker 1: But they needed to make it into a backronym anyway,

515
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,000
Speaker 1: which I don't understand because like, no, it already worked,

516
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 1: why would you make this an acronym? But they did,

517
00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:05,760
Speaker 1: and so they've decided that Acts also stands for acknowledging

518
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 1: Christ and technology and society. All right, all right, again unnecessary,

519
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:18,080
Speaker 1: but I hope you're happy I got Max, you know, sure,

520
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:23,679
Speaker 1: many Yeah. So the organization was founded by or At.

521
00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 1: He's co founded by Michelle Stevens. And she, I mean,

522
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:30,480
Speaker 1: she was some sort of entrepreneur. She was involved in

523
00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 1: tech to some extent and kind of did this after

524
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 1: she left a company. Her husband, Trey, was one of

525
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:41,520
Speaker 1: the first. Trey Stevens is one of the first Pallanteer

526
00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:45,520
Speaker 1: employees and now works for Peter's venture capital fund as

527
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 1: a partner. So this is a guy who was involved

528
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:53,320
Speaker 1: in Peter's military spying company and also his VC fund,

529
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 1: and it's his wife that founds the Acts seventeen collective.

530
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 1: And I found an interview with Michelle where she explains

531
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:00,800
Speaker 1: how the group came about, and so this is their

532
00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:04,120
Speaker 1: origin story, per Michelle. By the end of twenty twenty three,

533
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,920
Speaker 1: my company was winding down and my husband's fortieth birthday

534
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:09,920
Speaker 1: was that November. I wanted to celebrate big. We invited

535
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 1: over two hundred and twenty of his closest friends to

536
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: a three day birthday party in New Mexico called the Roast,

537
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 1: the Toast and the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost Day,

538
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 1: we thought we'd have a sort of remixed church service.

539
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,120
Speaker 1: Wouldn't it be funny if we tricked a bunch of

540
00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 1: people into going to church? We served caviar bumps, breakfast, pizza, mimosas,

541
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 1: and spiked coffee. Dj Canvas had come out with his

542
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 1: crew to play a Saturday night set, remixing all of

543
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:37,400
Speaker 1: our beloved movie themed songs into a trap beat. He

544
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,360
Speaker 1: also does this for Christian and worship music. He's got

545
00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:41,719
Speaker 1: the best dance moves.

546
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 3: No wonder nobody likes white people.

547
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,959
Speaker 1: Yeah, that made me cringe nearly to death. Sarah, I'm

548
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 1: gonna be honest.

549
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 3: It's also funny that they're like, isn't it fun and

550
00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 3: subversive to have caviar bumps and then go worship Christ?

551
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:02,520
Speaker 3: And it's like, no, because the whole problem in America

552
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:06,560
Speaker 3: arguably is that the prosperity gospel has taken over Christianity

553
00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 3: and it's no longer a moderating influence on capitalism.

554
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,760
Speaker 1: Right. Yeah, and that they also it's just.

555
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 3: Gross and silly to be doing that. It's gross, stop it.

556
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's just deeply upsetting and it's this, it's

557
00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 1: this fundamentally poisonous thing that stands against most of what

558
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:30,560
Speaker 1: the religion has has at least publicly stood for over

559
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:32,880
Speaker 1: the course of like the history of the faith. Like

560
00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:39,520
Speaker 1: it's it's fundamentally a theoretical interpretation of Christianity, I think, right, Like, if.

561
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:42,520
Speaker 3: You think the good parts of Christianity, which I feel

562
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 3: like most people would acknowledge that there are like at

563
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 3: least some good ideas in there. Like one of the

564
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:53,440
Speaker 3: main themes is like don't eat caviaar off each other's

565
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 3: hands while a huge percentage of the population is in

566
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:01,320
Speaker 3: dire poverty. That's it's one of the main.

567
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't have to like the religion to be like, Okay, well,

568
00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 1: the one time that like literally God beat people up,

569
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:14,480
Speaker 1: it was because they were money changing in the temple. Yeah,

570
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 1: probably shouldn't have money changes. That probably shouldn't. He might

571
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 1: not like money changers at all. Actually, it's so funny.

572
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:23,280
Speaker 1: It's like, which is just what Peter Thiel and his

573
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: friends do. That's what a venture capital fund is. They're

574
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 1: changing money.

575
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:29,880
Speaker 3: Huh. And also PayPal, where you literally just move money

576
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:33,440
Speaker 3: around for a fee. Yes, yeah, it's it is really

577
00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:36,840
Speaker 3: it's just it's fascinating, and it's like, what is it

578
00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:41,560
Speaker 3: like to become an enthusiastic about a belief system that

579
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 3: your actual beliefs are pretty much contrary too, you know,

580
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:47,360
Speaker 3: I'm curious about.

581
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:50,280
Speaker 1: That's that's the thing, and the answer is you have

582
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:54,479
Speaker 1: to like remake the belief system into something that is

583
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 1: not does not familiar to most people who actually like

584
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: are members of the faith. Like you have to create

585
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 1: your own Christianity, which is what Peter's done. That's effectively

586
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 1: what these Antichrist lectures are is him reinventing Christianity four billionaires.

587
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 3: So he's the Antichrist.

588
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 1: Just that is the twist at the end of this.

589
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 1: Before we get to that, though, you have to hear

590
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:25,040
Speaker 1: a little bit of DJ Canvas. I just I needed to.

591
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 1: I tried. I didn't have the courage, the raw heroism

592
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 1: to look at examples of his dance moves, so we're

593
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 1: gonna have to leave those to our imagination. But I

594
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,760
Speaker 1: did find his just Got Saved mixtape, and Sophie's gonna

595
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 1: play you like fifteen seconds of that, so let's hear it.

596
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 1: I am not so God.

597
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:47,920
Speaker 3: I am not so God.

598
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 1: I am not so good God.

599
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,960
Speaker 3: No, I am not so God.

600
00:32:56,040 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 1: I am not so Gota. I am not so God God.

601
00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 1: There you go. See, Okay, I wouldn't want to get

602
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 1: down to that with Peter Teal and a bunch of

603
00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:10,680
Speaker 1: venture capital guys.

604
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:14,000
Speaker 3: Thanks for that. The thing is like, if I met,

605
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 3: like some I don't know, a fifteen year old Bible

606
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:20,720
Speaker 3: campgoer who was like, I love this song, I would

607
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:22,800
Speaker 3: be like, that's nice, good for you.

608
00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 1: I don't care. Yeah.

609
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:28,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, But then it's like like so directly about this

610
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,959
Speaker 3: idea of like being rescued from being one of the

611
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 3: down trodden, and it's like you're the one who's treading

612
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:35,600
Speaker 3: on people.

613
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:38,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, everyone knows your name. You're one of the most

614
00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:42,320
Speaker 1: famous people in the world. Like you're all wealthy and powerful.

615
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:44,440
Speaker 3: You've got buildings with your name on it.

616
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:46,840
Speaker 1: I mean you have everything that you've ever wanted.

617
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, you don't mean God. You are God in society

618
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 3: as we have it set up, you know.

619
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:55,240
Speaker 1: Yeah. I also love that they're like this music is

620
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 1: just so bumping, it'll trick people into going to church.

621
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:01,080
Speaker 3: It's not going to see like should music at all.

622
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 3: It's like, yes, it's tricky.

623
00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:07,360
Speaker 1: I want you the audience to imagine you're at this

624
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:10,279
Speaker 1: birthday party. This guy is laying down what we what

625
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 1: will We'll call it a beat, right, and people are

626
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:17,000
Speaker 1: dancing as well as you'd expect a bunch of tech

627
00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 1: elites to dance. And then while this is all going on,

628
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:25,240
Speaker 1: Peter Teal gets up spontaneously and, in Michelle's words quote,

629
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:31,359
Speaker 1: gave a fifty five minute lecture on forgiveness and miracles. No.

630
00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:34,640
Speaker 3: God, it's like in succession when you're like, why do

631
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:38,120
Speaker 3: these people keep throwing parties? They're so bad and parties

632
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:39,680
Speaker 3: just stop having them?

633
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:41,280
Speaker 1: Is this even a party?

634
00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 3: Evil?

635
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 1: That's abuse to be that's like torture, Like the CIA

636
00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:48,840
Speaker 1: didn't do that shit back during the at the very least.

637
00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 3: It's it's that timeshare thing, you know, where you just

638
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 3: have to attend a short sales pitch.

639
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:57,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm imagining too, like the dawning realization like,

640
00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 1: oh wow, that Peter's talking. I thought we were all dancing. Okay,

641
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 1: he's probably just doing a little quick toast. No, no,

642
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:06,560
Speaker 1: not doing a toast.

643
00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:08,960
Speaker 3: I actually have to go to the bathroom.

644
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:12,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I need to get a drink, maybe do some

645
00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:17,560
Speaker 1: caviar bumps. I don't know. Michelle stated, we were blown away.

646
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:19,720
Speaker 1: A lot of people were looking like he had ten heads,

647
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:22,319
Speaker 1: like what are you talking about? And I'll believe that.

648
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:27,200
Speaker 1: I'll believe that being the response to this, so, she

649
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:29,760
Speaker 1: says the reaction was mixed. Some of her Christian friends

650
00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:32,919
Speaker 1: were angry that she'd put a non seminary trained guy

651
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:34,799
Speaker 1: up and had him give a sermon that like, this

652
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:37,840
Speaker 1: is heretical, he doesn't know what he's talking about. This

653
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 1: is certainly not Christianity that he's ranting about. It's kind

654
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 1: of weird that you did this to all of us.

655
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 1: But she said some other Christian friends of hers were like,

656
00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:50,000
Speaker 1: you just tricked over two hundred people into going to church,

657
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:53,920
Speaker 1: and that's good. We like it. We think that's great.

658
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,440
Speaker 1: And so this is the origin of the Act seventeen collective.

659
00:35:57,640 --> 00:35:59,960
Speaker 3: Right time a boring guy forces you to listen to

660
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 3: him for an hour, that is Kirk.

661
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,320
Speaker 1: That's church. Yes, this podcast has often been church.

662
00:36:07,560 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 3: Running into someone you kind of know, Kirk Church.

663
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 1: That's a kind of church. Getting an uber driver who

664
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 1: just immediately starts talking for the entire drive about like

665
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:22,160
Speaker 1: his weird philosophical beliefs. That's a kind of church. You know,

666
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 1: thank you Dale for informing me about the dangers of vaccines.

667
00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:29,240
Speaker 1: You know, I wouldn't have known without that, right.

668
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:33,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's a big one. God. The important thing

669
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:36,360
Speaker 3: is that Peter Tele has the freedom to express himself

670
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:39,800
Speaker 3: what God knows he hasn't had access to in society before.

671
00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, our culture has really cracked down on Peter

672
00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:48,560
Speaker 1: Tele's ability to express his beliefs to the world. And yeah.

673
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:51,680
Speaker 1: So the purpose of the ACT seventeen Collective is specifically

674
00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 1: to trick San Franciscans, who Michelle describes as one of

675
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:58,680
Speaker 1: the most unchurched cities in America, into going to church

676
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 1: and becoming Christians. Right, that's what this group exists to do.

677
00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:05,279
Speaker 3: They have Unitarianism, that's enough.

678
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 1: Right, Unitarians are nice and not bigots. That's kind of

679
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:11,800
Speaker 1: the whole point. And these people want to be assholes.

680
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:12,279
Speaker 3: Right.

681
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:17,520
Speaker 1: Oh see, Hey, that's key because one of the prop

682
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:20,480
Speaker 1: most prominent members of the ACTS seventeen Collective is Gary

683
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,920
Speaker 1: Tan who is the CEO of y Combinator, which is

684
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 1: a tech startup incubator. He's hosted several ACTS seventeen events

685
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 1: in his home, which is a former church, including one

686
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:34,280
Speaker 1: with former Intel CEO Pat Gelsinger about the holy shift

687
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:39,720
Speaker 1: across life, AI leadership and faith, and for an idea

688
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:41,520
Speaker 1: of some of the other things Gary Tan is into.

689
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:43,440
Speaker 1: I'm going to quote from a twenty twenty four article

690
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:45,879
Speaker 1: in The New Republic by Gildoran, which is writing about

691
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:49,560
Speaker 1: a Twitter rant that Tan went on January of twenty

692
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 1: twenty four. Posting on x formerly Twitter, Tan wished death

693
00:37:53,719 --> 00:37:56,880
Speaker 1: upon a majority of the San Francisco Board of Supervisors.

694
00:37:57,160 --> 00:38:01,080
Speaker 1: Fuck Chan, Peskin, Preston Walton, Melgar Row than sapphi Chan

695
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 1: as a label and motherfucking crew, wrote Tan, name checking

696
00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:08,520
Speaker 1: seven progressive supervisors and a hypercringy attempt to adapt Tupac

697
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:12,880
Speaker 1: Shakur's hit him up to his drunken rants, die slow motherfuckers.

698
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 1: For good measure, he posted a photo of his personal

699
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:18,920
Speaker 1: liquor cabinet. It's inscription, Gary Tan s f social media

700
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:23,959
Speaker 1: troll Twitter menace on his liquor cabinet. Man, Well, it's not.

701
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:26,879
Speaker 3: Like anyone in local office in San Francisco has ever

702
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:29,319
Speaker 3: been famously assassinated by a crazy guy.

703
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:39,800
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, that did really piss people. Yeah yeah, god yeah,

704
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:43,239
Speaker 1: a super godly, super godly. Now another godly thing Tan

705
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 1: did was fund the recall campaign against Progressive District Attorney Chesabuden.

706
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:51,640
Speaker 1: He also promised to wipe out supervisors who expressed worries

707
00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 1: about the safety of driverless taxis, telling them your days

708
00:38:55,520 --> 00:38:56,160
Speaker 1: are numbered.

709
00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 3: You know, if he used to threats all the time,

710
00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:01,840
Speaker 3: it doesn't mean anything.

711
00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:05,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, And it's very funny to be like, you

712
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:08,080
Speaker 1: think these are unsafe, I'll kill you. And then like

713
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: three months later, a Cruz taxi pins a pedestrian and

714
00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:14,280
Speaker 1: drags her across the payment, which leads to Cruz losing

715
00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:16,720
Speaker 1: its operating permit and receiving a one point five million

716
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:17,360
Speaker 1: dollar fine.

717
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, although where I'm sure they could afford.

718
00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:24,959
Speaker 1: I'm sure, but maybe they weren't super safe. Gary River cars.

719
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:28,320
Speaker 3: Don't you kill people? I kill people, That's.

720
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 1: Right, Jerry Tan does. Tan had delete his tweets threatening

721
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:36,040
Speaker 1: city supervisors, as you brought up due to the Harvey

722
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:37,960
Speaker 1: milk of it, all right, because a bunch of them

723
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:41,960
Speaker 1: received death threats after he threatened to Jesus killings. Because

724
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:44,440
Speaker 1: he has fans who are you know, assholes.

725
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,600
Speaker 3: Jesus is like, leave me out of this one.

726
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:52,040
Speaker 1: Right, Gary put out a statement directed by a crisis

727
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:54,720
Speaker 1: pr firm and said I am sorry for my words

728
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 1: and regret my poor decision. Tan is one of a

729
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 1: chunk of wealthy reactionary using their money to try to

730
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:03,719
Speaker 1: change progressive San Francisco into something of a haven for

731
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:06,640
Speaker 1: far right plutocrats. He's a big network state guide like

732
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:10,320
Speaker 1: Peter Teel. And you know the fact that the city's

733
00:40:10,360 --> 00:40:14,320
Speaker 1: already very friendly to these guys doesn't matter, because again,

734
00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 1: it's really the thing Girard picked up on, which is

735
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 1: that once people have everything they need, they're still unhappy.

736
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 1: And because that unhappiness fundamentally can't be dealt with in

737
00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:30,080
Speaker 1: the ways that they try to like the things that

738
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:32,600
Speaker 1: they think will make them happy, simply don't they just

739
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:34,799
Speaker 1: find someone to be angry at. They need a scapegoat.

740
00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:37,560
Speaker 1: You know, that's for Jerry Tan. It's the progressives in

741
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:40,400
Speaker 1: San Francisco. That's why Jerry's unhappy.

742
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 3: And what they don't realize is as a secret to

743
00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 3: happiness is small achievable goals in a sort of vague

744
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 3: general progression. So you know, you're like, I want to

745
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,359
Speaker 3: get better at baking. I want to make a bousch

746
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:56,280
Speaker 3: to Noel for Christmas. I'm going to spend three months

747
00:40:57,040 --> 00:41:00,880
Speaker 3: developing my bush de ol skills. But because they have

748
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:04,480
Speaker 3: no patience, they just want to destroy democracy because that

749
00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:08,920
Speaker 3: feels like it would be faster. I don't know, maybe

750
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:09,239
Speaker 3: it is.

751
00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:12,359
Speaker 1: Well, I think it's just because for these guys, there's

752
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:15,799
Speaker 1: so little that they can really say. There's nothing above them.

753
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 1: They have all of the money, there's no one who

754
00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 1: can tell them what to do. So the only thing

755
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:26,280
Speaker 1: theoretically above them is the state, and so is the government,

756
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:30,360
Speaker 1: and so they define and honestly, most of the government

757
00:41:30,640 --> 00:41:34,120
Speaker 1: is in their pocket. Is a general rule. Lawmakers are

758
00:41:34,120 --> 00:41:37,960
Speaker 1: not anti Silicon Valley billionaires, so instead they pick like

759
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:40,600
Speaker 1: the thing they can't control, which is the small number

760
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: of people who get elected like on progressive agendas trying

761
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 1: to fix problems. And those are the people who don't

762
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 1: like because those are the only people in politics who

763
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:53,319
Speaker 1: aren't going to pretend to respect you, to love you, right,

764
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:56,319
Speaker 1: because they're kind of fundamentally in opposition to guys like you,

765
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,319
Speaker 1: and so you have to that's who's responsible for all

766
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:02,319
Speaker 1: of the problems. That's who does everything wrong. Yeah, that's

767
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:03,600
Speaker 1: why I'm unhappy.

768
00:42:04,239 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 3: Because someone out there doesn't like me, or someone out

769
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:09,360
Speaker 3: there like marginally hardh respect me.

770
00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it's it's the reason why so many

771
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 1: famous people lost their minds as soon as they got

772
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 1: access to Twitter, right, is like being confronted with the

773
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:20,759
Speaker 1: fact that people dislike you and disrespect you, and that's

774
00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: just life. Maybe you could be a better person.

775
00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 3: But like you normally don't hear about it in detail,

776
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,400
Speaker 3: you know, and so having the ability to reach for

777
00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 3: that knowledge it is kind of this yeah, like a

778
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:36,080
Speaker 3: fascinating yeah, I don't know, experiment in terms of what

779
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:38,880
Speaker 3: would happen if people suddenly became telepathic, because in a

780
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 3: way people did, especially choys Carolodes.

781
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:44,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's the it's the same reason

782
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:47,319
Speaker 1: why like so many people high up in like our

783
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:50,200
Speaker 1: media class, like the folks who write for the like

784
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:53,920
Speaker 1: columns for the New York Times, consider quote unquote wokeism

785
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 1: and cancel culture a bigger problem than any of the

786
00:42:56,239 --> 00:42:58,879
Speaker 1: things that are actually going to kill them, because like

787
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:03,320
Speaker 1: it's this, No, people, I went to Harvard or Yale

788
00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:05,799
Speaker 1: or whatever, and my family name is this, and I

789
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:08,480
Speaker 1: have this fancy john and people are calling me an idiot.

790
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:11,880
Speaker 1: They that shouldn't be allowed. That's got to be illegal

791
00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:15,000
Speaker 1: that they're calling me a dip shit for my dipshit opinions, and.

792
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:17,240
Speaker 3: It's like they were calling you an idiot before. East

793
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 3: didn't know about it.

794
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:21,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, just yeah, you couldn't see it and people

795
00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:25,279
Speaker 1: weren't sharing it one hundred thousand times. Yeah.

796
00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:28,319
Speaker 3: Anyway, there are a bunch of very healthy people, these

797
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:31,399
Speaker 3: these billionaires, they're driving, they're doing great.

798
00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:34,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're doing great. And they have now formed Act

799
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:38,080
Speaker 1: seventeen because they want to establish a theocracy that makes

800
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:40,959
Speaker 1: it illegal to not like them or respect them. Yeah right,

801
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 1: that's the gist of the Act seventeen Collective in my opinion.

802
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:48,279
Speaker 1: And obviously, as I noted, they were inspired by a

803
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: rant Peter Teel gave at a birthday party about Christianity,

804
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:53,000
Speaker 1: and so it's only fitting that they would host a

805
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:57,360
Speaker 1: four part lecture series by him about the Antichrist. During

806
00:43:57,520 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 1: the first of these lectures, Michelle Stevens, the found under

807
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:04,120
Speaker 1: of the collective, introduced Peter on September fifteenth by calling

808
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:06,239
Speaker 1: him one of the great Christians of our time as

809
00:44:06,239 --> 00:44:10,960
Speaker 1: well as one of the great capitalists. Sony, sure, those

810
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 1: two things seem like they should go together. We're going

811
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:16,880
Speaker 1: to start with the most detailed information of God, which

812
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:21,000
Speaker 1: is the almost word for word notes on lecture one

813
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:25,440
Speaker 1: titled knowledge shall be increased Now. The attendee who published

814
00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:27,560
Speaker 1: his notes on this lecture was the head of protocol

815
00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:30,879
Speaker 1: research at a software company called Succinct, and his name

816
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 1: is hit Chi Kulkarney. And from what I can tell,

817
00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: Kulkarney is a fan of Teal. I don't think he

818
00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:40,280
Speaker 1: posted these notes as like a work of undercover reporting.

819
00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:42,799
Speaker 1: I think he was just super enthusiastic and kind of

820
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:46,320
Speaker 1: ignored that the event itself warned people not to share

821
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:49,120
Speaker 1: and spread what they heard inside, like folks weren't supposed

822
00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:50,320
Speaker 1: to record this and stuff.

823
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:53,239
Speaker 3: It was like, he's Chris Modest. It's so great, people

824
00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 3: are gonna.

825
00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:57,279
Speaker 1: To People need to read this. Kulkarney was banned from

826
00:44:57,320 --> 00:45:00,279
Speaker 1: listening to other lectures, but his notes are, as far

827
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 1: as I can tell from other reviews that include quotes

828
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:06,080
Speaker 1: from Peter Teal, pretty close to one to one. So

829
00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 1: Teal opens his lecture with a quote from the Book

830
00:45:09,040 --> 00:45:12,240
Speaker 1: of Daniel. But thou, oh Daniel, shut up the words

831
00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:14,640
Speaker 1: and seal the book. Even to the time of the end,

832
00:45:14,880 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 1: many shall run to and fro and knowledge shall be increased,

833
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:22,440
Speaker 1: and this is like talking about the end of days, right, you.

834
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:26,600
Speaker 3: Know, Daniel, shut up, shut up, Yeah.

835
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:30,560
Speaker 1: Shut up. Peter Teal interprets this as Daniel, who he

836
00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:34,840
Speaker 1: describes as a biblical historian, predicting that knowledge was would

837
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:39,480
Speaker 1: increase vastly towards the end of time and quote as

838
00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:42,960
Speaker 1: knowledge increased, apocalyptic fears would mount, leaving room for a

839
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:46,239
Speaker 1: tyrant to rise. Now, there's a lot that's wrong with

840
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:50,759
Speaker 1: these few sentences. Like, first, I don't really that's not

841
00:45:51,239 --> 00:45:58,200
Speaker 1: the only omen Yeah right, that's not really what Daniel's saying. That, like,

842
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:01,880
Speaker 1: the increase in knowledge will increase apocalyptic fears, which will

843
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:05,400
Speaker 1: let a tyrant. For that's not how the Antichrist comes

844
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:06,080
Speaker 1: to power.

845
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a lot to get from the word increase.

846
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:11,600
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, you're reading a lot in there.

847
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 3: And he's like, and that tyrant is me.

848
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you'll be surprised at who he thinks that

849
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:22,160
Speaker 1: tyrant is, Sarah. I'm excited for that reveal. That's that's

850
00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:23,360
Speaker 1: gonna be really fun.

851
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:25,960
Speaker 3: For you, Sandray.

852
00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:29,239
Speaker 1: No, it's weirder than that.

853
00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:33,239
Speaker 3: De fact Joe, First Lady of New York, Sandra Ley

854
00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:33,799
Speaker 3: just like.

855
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:38,399
Speaker 1: Nope, although he's probably she's probably on his list. I'll

856
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:40,880
Speaker 1: give you that. But yeah, okay, we'll get to that.

857
00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:43,480
Speaker 1: So the other thing that Peter says here that's really

858
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:47,520
Speaker 1: questionable is he describes Daniel as a historian, Like, in fact,

859
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:50,759
Speaker 1: he describes Daniel as the first historian. Right, it's like

860
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:53,400
Speaker 1: the first person to really think of history in a

861
00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:58,160
Speaker 1: modern way. Uh, that's very silly, and it's kind of

862
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:02,600
Speaker 1: worth noting. Biblical scholar debate ferociously whether or not Daniel

863
00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:05,799
Speaker 1: was writing reliable accounts of history, whether or not he

864
00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:07,960
Speaker 1: was effectively trying to write a history, right, Because there's

865
00:47:08,239 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 1: the two broad interpretations of like how the Book of

866
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:16,240
Speaker 1: Daniel was written. As one is the author Daniel had

867
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:19,080
Speaker 1: these experiences with he and his friends and chronicled them.

868
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:21,160
Speaker 1: Right that he's like writing an account of things that

869
00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:24,280
Speaker 1: he saw and did, and he's including in their genuine

870
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 1: prophecies that he made that were fulfilled in some cases

871
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:31,839
Speaker 1: centuries later. Right, that's the traditional interpretation of the Book

872
00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:36,600
Speaker 1: of Daniel. Right. Modern biblical historians have pointed out that

873
00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:40,400
Speaker 1: there's a lot of evidence that suggests that the author

874
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:42,640
Speaker 1: of the Book of Daniel was someone who would have

875
00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:48,480
Speaker 1: been alive centuries after the actual biblical Daniel, and that

876
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:52,319
Speaker 1: the Book of Daniel couldn't have been written contemporaneously. Right.

877
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:54,960
Speaker 1: In other words, like this is more of like a

878
00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:58,880
Speaker 1: work of historical fiction than historical fact. It's kind of

879
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:02,400
Speaker 1: like one of the argument the real Daniel is supposed

880
00:48:02,400 --> 00:48:04,480
Speaker 1: to have been a member of the Judean nobility who

881
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:07,360
Speaker 1: was taken to Babylon during the Babylonian captivity and became

882
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:11,400
Speaker 1: popular at Nebuchenezer's court. He eventually became a dream interpreter

883
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:14,120
Speaker 1: and a prophet, and again, up until like the nineteenth century,

884
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:17,440
Speaker 1: it was widely agreed that this historical guy wrote the

885
00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:20,040
Speaker 1: Book of Daniel and filled it with prophecies he had

886
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 1: at the time that were proven right later. Now there's

887
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 1: a good write up on the Biblical hermeneutic stack Exchange

888
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 1: with Citations, which summarizes the modern critical argument about Daniel. Quote.

889
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:33,520
Speaker 1: The Book of Daniel is replete with historical inaccuracies regarding

890
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,640
Speaker 1: the Babylonian and Persian periods, indicating it was written quite

891
00:48:36,719 --> 00:48:39,440
Speaker 1: some time after those eras. Between this point and the

892
00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:41,960
Speaker 1: independent nature of the court tales, the person of Daniel

893
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:45,600
Speaker 1: appears to be a literary fabrication, not a historical figure,

894
00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:48,520
Speaker 1: and hence not the author of the book. Davies, who

895
00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:51,200
Speaker 1: is a biblical scholar, suggests that this Daniel character may

896
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 1: not have been a well known figure in Jewish culture

897
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:56,080
Speaker 1: before the book was completed, and Collins is one scholar

898
00:48:56,120 --> 00:48:58,239
Speaker 1: to suggest the very name Daniel was chosen for the

899
00:48:58,280 --> 00:49:00,680
Speaker 1: anonymous Jewish sage of the folk life, or out of

900
00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:04,360
Speaker 1: the inspiration from the ancient sage Danel mentioned by Ezekiel

901
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 1: and ugartic texts. Right. So the likeliest and the thing

902
00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:13,280
Speaker 1: widely believed by biblical scholars today is that this because

903
00:49:13,320 --> 00:49:16,320
Speaker 1: of some very fundamental historical inaccuracies in the Book of Daniel.

904
00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 1: This was written later and Daniel was never meant to

905
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:21,120
Speaker 1: be a real person, Like the name was taken by

906
00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:21,920
Speaker 1: an ancient sage.

907
00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:25,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, the same way that Binikula wasn't actually written.

908
00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:28,560
Speaker 1: By a dog exactly exactly. Well, there's a lot of

909
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 1: scholarly debate about that. Well that's true, Yeah, but you know,

910
00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:33,040
Speaker 1: I'm a believer.

911
00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 3: It feels like it's to me kind of the marker

912
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:39,200
Speaker 3: of a good historian to understand that people in the

913
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 3: past also enjoyed using literary devices, you.

914
00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:46,920
Speaker 1: Know, yes, and that there's also this It's weird to

915
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:49,880
Speaker 1: me how despite how much some people who are religious

916
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 1: emphasize the importance of faith, there's this idea that like, well,

917
00:49:53,280 --> 00:49:55,400
Speaker 1: but no, if it's not literally Daniel that wrote this

918
00:49:55,440 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 1: about his literal life, then that would be saying that

919
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:02,160
Speaker 1: the Bible doesn't have value. And it's like, why not, Like.

920
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:06,319
Speaker 3: You know, sometimes it gets a little frilly. You know,

921
00:50:06,520 --> 00:50:11,239
Speaker 3: it's a work of literature. Let them have their literary devices.

922
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:14,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, it doesn't bother people with other kinds of literature

923
00:50:14,320 --> 00:50:17,320
Speaker 1: that it's not literally true that Aragorn's son of Rathorne

924
00:50:17,360 --> 00:50:21,120
Speaker 1: isn't a real historical figure. People have still changed their

925
00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:23,440
Speaker 1: lives as a result of those books, you know, right,

926
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:26,239
Speaker 1: But I don't know, maybe they just don't have that

927
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:29,319
Speaker 1: much faith. And I guess Peter doesn't, because again he

928
00:50:29,680 --> 00:50:32,480
Speaker 1: always describes Daniel as absolutely the guy who wrote the

929
00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:35,440
Speaker 1: Book of Daniel and as a historians a real historian.

930
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:37,600
Speaker 1: And you know he's real because he made predictions about

931
00:50:37,600 --> 00:50:40,239
Speaker 1: the future that happened, and again historians will say, well,

932
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:42,960
Speaker 1: because they happened before the person.

933
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:45,000
Speaker 3: That wrote the book in the future.

934
00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:49,520
Speaker 1: It's like if you could write a historical fiction about

935
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:51,560
Speaker 1: a guy who's a prophet and include a bunch of

936
00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:54,000
Speaker 1: shit about World War Two in your book set in

937
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 1: nineteen ten. That doesn't mean you prophesied World War Two.

938
00:50:57,320 --> 00:50:59,919
Speaker 1: You're just looking You're just writing fiction.

939
00:51:00,520 --> 00:51:03,040
Speaker 3: Wouldn't it be great if some guys saw that coming? Yeah,

940
00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:06,200
Speaker 3: I mean it's like, I don't know, and just any

941
00:51:06,280 --> 00:51:11,200
Speaker 3: kind of nostalgia media like that seventies show where they're like, oh, right, kids,

942
00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:13,840
Speaker 3: stop playing with the lawn darts. Isn't it funny?

943
00:51:13,880 --> 00:51:14,080
Speaker 1: Yeah?

944
00:51:14,120 --> 00:51:18,000
Speaker 3: We know now what that's about? How many time where

945
00:51:18,040 --> 00:51:18,640
Speaker 3: this is set?

946
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:21,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, this is That's exactly what's going on in

947
00:51:21,840 --> 00:51:24,960
Speaker 1: the Book of Daniel. And speaking of lawn darts, this

948
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:29,520
Speaker 1: podcast is sponsored entirely by lawn darts. Lawn darts. Aren't

949
00:51:29,560 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 1: there too many kids in the world?

950
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, the Love Canal didn't get enough of them.

951
00:51:36,440 --> 00:51:45,920
Speaker 1: That's right, we're back. We're thinking about all the things

952
00:51:45,960 --> 00:51:49,120
Speaker 1: that used to kill kids back before we decided to

953
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:53,359
Speaker 1: make the world safe. And yeah, now things are good.

954
00:51:53,400 --> 00:51:54,720
Speaker 1: It's a safe world for children.

955
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:58,560
Speaker 3: They're perfect now. Yeah, no complaints.

956
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:05,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why so many schools have metal detectors. Great stuff.

957
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:08,560
Speaker 1: So I don't have when it comes to the Biblical scholarship.

958
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:11,040
Speaker 1: Was the Book of Daniel written by I mean, I'm

959
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:14,520
Speaker 1: pretty convinced that it was written later, and Daniel is

960
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:19,200
Speaker 1: a historical fiction and amalgam of different people and whatnot.

961
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:24,040
Speaker 1: But you know, there's arguments scholars will make either way.

962
00:52:24,120 --> 00:52:26,440
Speaker 1: What's interesting to me is that Teal doesn't reference these

963
00:52:26,520 --> 00:52:30,560
Speaker 1: arguments at all. He doesn't even mention them, which it

964
00:52:30,640 --> 00:52:34,239
Speaker 1: could just mean that he has a strong Biblical literalism

965
00:52:34,360 --> 00:52:37,160
Speaker 1: stance and he disagrees with those takes, But the fact

966
00:52:37,160 --> 00:52:38,560
Speaker 1: that he doesn't mention them at all, I kind of

967
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:41,760
Speaker 1: wonder if he just doesn't know because he doesn't actually

968
00:52:41,840 --> 00:52:47,440
Speaker 1: like read curiously about stuff like this. I yeah, I

969
00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:50,000
Speaker 1: could believe that he doesn't really care about scholarship on

970
00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:52,440
Speaker 1: the Bible. He reads it and takes whatever is useful

971
00:52:52,480 --> 00:52:54,560
Speaker 1: to him out of it and has no interest in

972
00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:56,040
Speaker 1: what anyone else has said about it.

973
00:52:56,560 --> 00:52:59,120
Speaker 3: Well, and this feels like he's doing like his impression

974
00:52:59,120 --> 00:53:00,920
Speaker 3: of a smart person, And I feel like a lot

975
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:03,440
Speaker 3: of people's smart person impression is like I read the

976
00:53:03,440 --> 00:53:05,640
Speaker 3: Bible and I figured out what it's about without the

977
00:53:05,680 --> 00:53:09,239
Speaker 3: benefit of ever reading any one else's thoughts about it, ever,

978
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:13,080
Speaker 3: and it's like, that's not what intelligence is about. Intelligence

979
00:53:13,080 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 3: doesn't mean that you never listen to anyone else for

980
00:53:15,360 --> 00:53:16,280
Speaker 3: your whole life.

981
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:19,440
Speaker 1: No, no, Nor is it like, well, I assume this,

982
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:23,480
Speaker 1: the English translation of this has all of the context

983
00:53:23,480 --> 00:53:27,759
Speaker 1: that's useful in understanding it historically, right, right, there's no

984
00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 1: need to look back at the different ways that this

985
00:53:30,280 --> 00:53:33,839
Speaker 1: is different things have been interpreted, different translations, Like, there's

986
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:35,719
Speaker 1: no value in any of that. They got it right

987
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:38,000
Speaker 1: with the King James version. That's the official version. Now

988
00:53:38,040 --> 00:53:39,640
Speaker 1: God said, so this one.

989
00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:43,480
Speaker 3: I found in the hotel is going to take me home. Yeah,

990
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:46,480
Speaker 3: And I feel like what people maybe who I don't know,

991
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:50,000
Speaker 3: look down on scholarship as a pursuit, don't really realize

992
00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:53,840
Speaker 3: about it maybe and maybe disdain it because they understand

993
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:57,319
Speaker 3: this kind of collaborative quality to it is anything you

994
00:53:57,360 --> 00:53:59,879
Speaker 3: figure out in an academic setting or really like any

995
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:04,840
Speaker 3: you know, kind of real pursuit of learning and research

996
00:54:05,040 --> 00:54:07,520
Speaker 3: is you're standing on the shoulders of everyone else who's

997
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:09,360
Speaker 3: thought about it and worked on it in the past.

998
00:54:09,400 --> 00:54:12,440
Speaker 3: And there's and you have a you know, an awareness

999
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:16,360
Speaker 3: that you're only doing like an extra little millimeter of

1000
00:54:16,880 --> 00:54:18,319
Speaker 3: progressing an idea.

1001
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:21,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's also something a guy like Peter Teel

1002
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:24,960
Speaker 1: can't accept. Like the collaborative nature of like through which

1003
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:27,839
Speaker 1: actual knowledge is built is fundamentally that's why all these

1004
00:54:27,840 --> 00:54:30,279
Speaker 1: guys are so bullish on AI is. It's abhorrent to

1005
00:54:30,320 --> 00:54:34,080
Speaker 1: them that other people have thought thoughts that they haven't thought,

1006
00:54:34,600 --> 00:54:37,520
Speaker 1: or that they didn't think first, that they might not understand.

1007
00:54:38,120 --> 00:54:42,080
Speaker 1: You know, it's this A healthy person understands there's things

1008
00:54:42,120 --> 00:54:45,080
Speaker 1: that are beyond me. Even if I'm very smart, I'm

1009
00:54:45,120 --> 00:54:48,160
Speaker 1: not smart in every area, you know. I think I'm

1010
00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:52,520
Speaker 1: certain that like Stephen Hawking wouldn't have like gotten angry

1011
00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:56,120
Speaker 1: if somebody had tried to explain to him how like, oh, yeah,

1012
00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:58,160
Speaker 1: your fridge is broken, Steve, and this is what's wrong,

1013
00:54:58,200 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 1: because I doubt Stephen Hawking knew much about how we're

1014
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 1: refrigerators worked, right, And I'm sure he was humble enough

1015
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:03,680
Speaker 1: to be like, well, no, I need to get a

1016
00:55:03,680 --> 00:55:05,399
Speaker 1: repair guy, like this is.

1017
00:55:05,320 --> 00:55:08,120
Speaker 3: What happened on EastEnders for the past ten years.

1018
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:11,680
Speaker 1: Sure, or this is what this versus of the Bible,

1019
00:55:11,960 --> 00:55:14,319
Speaker 1: you know how it was translated a thousand years ago

1020
00:55:14,440 --> 00:55:18,520
Speaker 1: and so it might mean something different. I actually intelligent

1021
00:55:18,560 --> 00:55:20,880
Speaker 1: people have a degree of humility in terms of the

1022
00:55:20,920 --> 00:55:23,399
Speaker 1: things they don't know. And I think to a guy

1023
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:25,719
Speaker 1: like Peter Teele, the idea that like there might be

1024
00:55:25,719 --> 00:55:29,160
Speaker 1: anything important that he doesn't know is deeply offensive. And

1025
00:55:29,200 --> 00:55:31,880
Speaker 1: I think that's the Silicon Valley ideology in a nutshell,

1026
00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:34,360
Speaker 1: which is why, like, no, all that matters is what

1027
00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:37,200
Speaker 1: I know and what I can have this robot summarize,

1028
00:55:37,239 --> 00:55:39,680
Speaker 1: it can do everything else because other kinds of knowledge

1029
00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:42,080
Speaker 1: than the ones I have, and other kinds of skill

1030
00:55:42,520 --> 00:55:45,360
Speaker 1: aren't real knowledge or skill because I don't have them.

1031
00:55:45,680 --> 00:55:48,799
Speaker 1: That's my interpretation of Peter Teel. You know yours my Yeah,

1032
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:49,680
Speaker 1: where's my very.

1033
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:52,200
Speaker 3: Well, I guess like kind of toddler like anger at

1034
00:55:52,239 --> 00:55:54,799
Speaker 3: anything that elluse your grasp. So you have to kind

1035
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:56,960
Speaker 3: of shrek the world to fit your own worldview.

1036
00:55:57,719 --> 00:55:59,680
Speaker 1: And that's what he's doing with the Bible here, because

1037
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:02,600
Speaker 1: it's written to Peter that Daniel is a real prophet

1038
00:56:02,840 --> 00:56:06,879
Speaker 1: and a real historian, because he interprets Daniel twelve four,

1039
00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:10,279
Speaker 1: which I quoted earlier as a prophecy. Now this is

1040
00:56:10,320 --> 00:56:12,720
Speaker 1: the fact the idea that, like, oh, what he's saying

1041
00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:16,799
Speaker 1: is that knowledge increases, which leads to us expecting an apocalypse,

1042
00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:19,600
Speaker 1: and that creates room for a tyrant. That's not really

1043
00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:24,680
Speaker 1: how the Bible foresees the Antichrist rising, you know, but

1044
00:56:24,719 --> 00:56:28,920
Speaker 1: apocalyptic fears have been with us as long as civilization, right, Like,

1045
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:31,680
Speaker 1: it's it's not a thing that starts with Christendom, and

1046
00:56:31,719 --> 00:56:34,080
Speaker 1: it's not a thing that starts with Daniel, right. The

1047
00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:40,400
Speaker 1: Book of Daniel didn't invent apocalyptic beliefs. And it's one

1048
00:56:40,400 --> 00:56:42,840
Speaker 1: of those you'll sometimes hear it claim that prior to

1049
00:56:42,880 --> 00:56:45,440
Speaker 1: the year one thousand, Christendom was convulse that like the

1050
00:56:45,520 --> 00:56:47,680
Speaker 1: last millennium, there were a bunch of specific fears that

1051
00:56:47,719 --> 00:56:50,160
Speaker 1: the world was going to end then. And this is

1052
00:56:50,160 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 1: actually not really accurate. But it's not accurate because people

1053
00:56:54,440 --> 00:56:57,200
Speaker 1: didn't really agree what year it was on a wide

1054
00:56:57,239 --> 00:57:00,759
Speaker 1: scale back then, however, is Peter Steylefels wrote in a

1055
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:03,799
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety nine article for The New York Times, So

1056
00:57:03,840 --> 00:57:06,720
Speaker 1: were there religious terrorists and overwrought expectations of the final

1057
00:57:06,760 --> 00:57:09,600
Speaker 1: judgment in the year nine ninety nine, Absolutely, and also

1058
00:57:09,600 --> 00:57:12,080
Speaker 1: in the years eight ninety nine, eleven ninety nine, twelve

1059
00:57:12,160 --> 00:57:14,520
Speaker 1: ninety nine, you name it. One might as well turn

1060
00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:16,800
Speaker 1: the question around and ask how could it have been otherwise?

1061
00:57:16,920 --> 00:57:17,040
Speaker 2: Right?

1062
00:57:17,080 --> 00:57:19,480
Speaker 1: In other words, it wasn't so much that people were

1063
00:57:19,520 --> 00:57:22,840
Speaker 1: obsessed with the year one thousand, It's that they they

1064
00:57:22,840 --> 00:57:25,919
Speaker 1: have always People did not widely agree on what year

1065
00:57:25,960 --> 00:57:27,959
Speaker 1: it was at all times in the past, but people

1066
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:30,120
Speaker 1: have always expected the end of the world was around

1067
00:57:30,160 --> 00:57:32,120
Speaker 1: the corner, no matter what year they thought it was

1068
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:36,080
Speaker 1: going to happen. That's just natural human nature, right, it.

1069
00:57:36,040 --> 00:57:38,640
Speaker 3: Guess makes sense. Well, And also, I mean, you know,

1070
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:41,560
Speaker 3: not take this is just me kind of guessing, but

1071
00:57:41,600 --> 00:57:44,120
Speaker 3: I feel like if you look at human history, there

1072
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:47,520
Speaker 3: are plenty of civilizations that have ended right or that

1073
00:57:47,600 --> 00:57:50,040
Speaker 3: have come very close to it through you know, plague

1074
00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:53,880
Speaker 3: or being built next to a volcano or right massive

1075
00:57:53,920 --> 00:57:56,480
Speaker 3: floods or whatever else. And so it feels like this,

1076
00:57:56,480 --> 00:58:00,480
Speaker 3: this idea of destruction that will have been actually come

1077
00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:05,680
Speaker 3: for everyone. Sure is because something that you would develop

1078
00:58:05,720 --> 00:58:08,560
Speaker 3: as an idea based on what it feels like to

1079
00:58:08,840 --> 00:58:10,240
Speaker 3: exist as a human being.

1080
00:58:11,120 --> 00:58:14,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes complete sense. And like it is this

1081
00:58:15,240 --> 00:58:17,919
Speaker 1: like you can't how can you how could somebody live

1082
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:20,720
Speaker 1: through like the the Black Death and be in like

1083
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:23,200
Speaker 1: a city where seventy five percent of the population dies,

1084
00:58:23,280 --> 00:58:26,240
Speaker 1: like that is an apocalypse that you looked through, just

1085
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:28,440
Speaker 1: like I mean, fuck, if you lived in Berlin in

1086
00:58:28,520 --> 00:58:31,840
Speaker 1: nineteen forty five, you're living through an apocalypse or hiroshima,

1087
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:35,200
Speaker 1: you know, like that, that's an apocalypse. What else would

1088
00:58:35,240 --> 00:58:35,640
Speaker 1: you call it?

1089
00:58:35,720 --> 00:58:36,160
Speaker 2: We create?

1090
00:58:36,400 --> 00:58:38,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, humans create a lot of them or witness a

1091
00:58:38,520 --> 00:58:40,680
Speaker 3: lot of them. And I do feel like post pandemic.

1092
00:58:41,280 --> 00:58:43,080
Speaker 3: I have this feeling of like, all right, we can

1093
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:45,480
Speaker 3: have another of these. I don't know, like that's not

1094
00:58:45,560 --> 00:58:46,920
Speaker 3: sure precidented anymore.

1095
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:50,120
Speaker 1: So what's not honestly might be nice. We all got

1096
00:58:50,120 --> 00:58:53,360
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks off last time, you know, sure.

1097
00:58:53,240 --> 00:58:58,560
Speaker 3: We had before we descended into a lot worse more

1098
00:58:58,680 --> 00:59:01,439
Speaker 3: fascism for several we had a couple of weeks where

1099
00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:02,520
Speaker 3: things were really chilled.

1100
00:59:02,720 --> 00:59:05,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, really got to catch up on Netflix. Yeah, I've

1101
00:59:05,760 --> 00:59:11,680
Speaker 1: got to rewatch some good TV shows. Yeah. So in

1102
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:14,439
Speaker 1: that article, Steinfelds goes on to quote Bernard McGain, who's

1103
00:59:14,440 --> 00:59:16,840
Speaker 1: a scholar of medieval religion from the University of Chicago,

1104
00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:19,000
Speaker 1: who said medieval folk lived in a more or less

1105
00:59:19,040 --> 00:59:22,720
Speaker 1: constant state of apocalyptic expectation. And if that sounds kind

1106
00:59:22,760 --> 00:59:26,640
Speaker 1: of chillingly familiar to you, it's because we haven't changed. Really,

1107
00:59:26,920 --> 00:59:29,440
Speaker 1: We're the same as people back then, and we expect

1108
00:59:29,480 --> 00:59:31,880
Speaker 1: the world to end just like they did in some

1109
00:59:32,000 --> 00:59:33,480
Speaker 1: different ways. You know, r.

1110
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:36,800
Speaker 3: Tummy's hurt for different reasons and sometimes the same.

1111
00:59:37,560 --> 00:59:41,480
Speaker 1: So some of them the same. Yeah, And obviously there's

1112
00:59:41,480 --> 00:59:43,680
Speaker 1: different theories as to why do people always think the

1113
00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:46,520
Speaker 1: world is going to end? You know, you can That's

1114
00:59:46,880 --> 00:59:49,280
Speaker 1: a lot of ink has been spilled on that topic.

1115
00:59:50,080 --> 00:59:52,000
Speaker 1: But I think it boils down to two factors, and

1116
00:59:52,080 --> 00:59:54,920
Speaker 1: neither of which really involves an increase in knowledge like

1117
00:59:55,000 --> 00:59:57,720
Speaker 1: Peter is obsessed with. I think it. The two big

1118
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:00,720
Speaker 1: factors are, number one, the apocalypse makes for good entertainment.

1119
01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:03,600
Speaker 1: People are interested in the idea of the world ending.

1120
01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:07,120
Speaker 1: And number two, it's less scary to imagine the world

1121
01:00:07,200 --> 01:00:09,720
Speaker 1: ending than to imagine yourself dying in the world going on,

1122
01:00:09,880 --> 01:00:14,000
Speaker 1: which is what will happen, right to everybody, and especially

1123
01:00:14,000 --> 01:00:16,400
Speaker 1: for guy like Peter Teel Yeah, right.

1124
01:00:16,280 --> 01:00:20,240
Speaker 3: And right, and especially if you're you know, an egomaniac

1125
01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:22,959
Speaker 3: who no one is restraining any longer. You're like, look,

1126
01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:26,720
Speaker 3: everyone has to go out with me ultimately somehow.

1127
01:00:26,320 --> 01:00:30,520
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I am certain that he would prefer

1128
01:00:31,080 --> 01:00:35,240
Speaker 1: a nuclear holocaust to himself dying alone while the world continues, right,

1129
01:00:35,320 --> 01:00:37,200
Speaker 1: he would his last year's.

1130
01:00:36,920 --> 01:00:39,720
Speaker 3: Being a bunker the second one.

1131
01:00:39,720 --> 01:00:43,240
Speaker 1: God willing, you know. I just hope those bunkers ain't

1132
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:45,720
Speaker 1: deep enough or the security their security guides will take

1133
01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:48,680
Speaker 1: him out. I'm sure they haven't figured out the shot

1134
01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:52,240
Speaker 1: collars well enough. Now that's it, I will. I will acknowledge.

1135
01:00:52,240 --> 01:00:54,120
Speaker 1: One thing that Peter says that I agree with is

1136
01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:56,680
Speaker 1: that I think apocalyptic fears have in the past and

1137
01:00:56,720 --> 01:00:59,520
Speaker 1: do today provide space for a tyrant to rise, you know.

1138
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:02,880
Speaker 1: And one of the things that I think I don't

1139
01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:06,120
Speaker 1: think Peter realizes, but is clear to me studying his

1140
01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:10,400
Speaker 1: beliefs about the Antichrist, is that he justifies his yearning

1141
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:13,280
Speaker 1: for a tyrant his desire to end democracy and replace

1142
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 1: it with a dictatorship. He justifies that as the only

1143
01:01:17,640 --> 01:01:20,440
Speaker 1: way to stop the Antichrist and the end of the world,

1144
01:01:20,720 --> 01:01:24,040
Speaker 1: which is deeply anti Christian because Peter's whole idea he

1145
01:01:24,040 --> 01:01:25,920
Speaker 1: says he's a Christian. He says, I am a believer

1146
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:29,000
Speaker 1: that the Antichrist will come and bring about the end

1147
01:01:29,000 --> 01:01:31,880
Speaker 1: of days, but I also think it can be stopped,

1148
01:01:31,960 --> 01:01:36,120
Speaker 1: and that's a good thing, which is like not the religion,

1149
01:01:36,440 --> 01:01:40,680
Speaker 1: my dude, right, Like, you can't stop the Antichrist, isn't it.

1150
01:01:40,680 --> 01:01:42,320
Speaker 3: Don't you kind of have to just go through the

1151
01:01:42,360 --> 01:01:42,880
Speaker 3: whole thing.

1152
01:01:43,360 --> 01:01:47,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty important, right, it's like.

1153
01:01:47,720 --> 01:01:51,680
Speaker 3: The last you know, the final conflict of the movie. Yeah,

1154
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:52,880
Speaker 3: he has cut that scene out.

1155
01:01:53,280 --> 01:01:56,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's important for you to understands that Peter's

1156
01:01:56,280 --> 01:02:00,000
Speaker 1: belief is not the standard Christian apocalyptic belief that you

1157
01:02:00,160 --> 01:02:03,160
Speaker 1: heard even from like weirdo fundamentalists, you know, believe in

1158
01:02:03,200 --> 01:02:06,680
Speaker 1: the rapture. Peters is all of that, except but we

1159
01:02:06,720 --> 01:02:09,440
Speaker 1: can stop the bad stuff if we put the right

1160
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:10,360
Speaker 1: dictator in to day.

1161
01:02:10,440 --> 01:02:13,640
Speaker 3: It's actually amazing because he's made himself the main character

1162
01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:17,320
Speaker 3: of the Bible, which yeah, I can't think of another

1163
01:02:17,360 --> 01:02:19,760
Speaker 3: person who's managed to do that. They usually stick with

1164
01:02:19,800 --> 01:02:21,040
Speaker 3: the characters that are in there.

1165
01:02:21,240 --> 01:02:24,920
Speaker 1: Jesus, did you know, And yeah, like.

1166
01:02:24,960 --> 01:02:27,480
Speaker 3: You know and people, you know, we're very familiar with

1167
01:02:27,520 --> 01:02:30,400
Speaker 3: people using Jesus as a proxy for their own desires.

1168
01:02:30,480 --> 01:02:36,200
Speaker 3: But yeah, to actually write self insert Bible fan fiction.

1169
01:02:36,280 --> 01:02:37,880
Speaker 1: It's it's stunning.

1170
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:39,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is. It's stunning.

1171
01:02:40,640 --> 01:02:44,440
Speaker 1: It's really it's really some impressive stuff, and it's it's

1172
01:02:44,560 --> 01:02:48,720
Speaker 1: very funny. We're barely into Peter's like the first episode

1173
01:02:48,800 --> 01:02:51,240
Speaker 1: of Peter's speech, so I'm gonna I'm gonna read for

1174
01:02:51,280 --> 01:02:53,760
Speaker 1: you now. It started with him quoting that passage from

1175
01:02:53,760 --> 01:02:56,360
Speaker 1: the Book of Daniel. Here's the second paragraph of his speech.

1176
01:02:57,200 --> 01:03:00,680
Speaker 1: In late modernity, such worries of the apocalypse are in fashionable,

1177
01:03:00,720 --> 01:03:03,680
Speaker 1: and the Antichrist is a forgotten figure. And I'm sorry,

1178
01:03:03,680 --> 01:03:05,760
Speaker 1: I lied. We couldn't get through the whole paragraph because

1179
01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:07,960
Speaker 1: that first sentence, like what world are you living in?

1180
01:03:08,040 --> 01:03:08,240
Speaker 2: Man?

1181
01:03:08,520 --> 01:03:10,440
Speaker 1: The Antichrist is a forgotten figure?

1182
01:03:11,000 --> 01:03:11,080
Speaker 2: Like?

1183
01:03:11,120 --> 01:03:13,640
Speaker 3: Where have you heard of the Antichrist? Peter Taylor is

1184
01:03:13,640 --> 01:03:16,680
Speaker 3: probably growing up watching the Omens during Gregory I Pack,

1185
01:03:16,880 --> 01:03:18,160
Speaker 3: just like everyone else did.

1186
01:03:18,320 --> 01:03:21,760
Speaker 1: Have you talked to a person? Yeah? And this is

1187
01:03:22,200 --> 01:03:24,480
Speaker 1: a load bearing belief of his that churches don't talk

1188
01:03:24,520 --> 01:03:27,560
Speaker 1: about the apocalypse of the Antichrist anymore? What are you

1189
01:03:27,720 --> 01:03:34,680
Speaker 1: talking about? Are you? How do you think this? And

1190
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:38,280
Speaker 1: just to add some polling data here, in twenty thirteen,

1191
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:41,800
Speaker 1: the Public Policy Polling conducted a series of a survey

1192
01:03:41,840 --> 01:03:45,920
Speaker 1: on conspiratorial beliefs among American voters. Thirteen percent of respondence

1193
01:03:45,960 --> 01:03:49,840
Speaker 1: in twenty thirteen believed Barack Obama was the Antichrist. Another

1194
01:03:49,960 --> 01:03:53,720
Speaker 1: thirteen were unsure, and seventy three percent stated they didn't

1195
01:03:53,720 --> 01:03:56,600
Speaker 1: think Obama was the Antichrist, but all of them were

1196
01:03:56,640 --> 01:04:01,160
Speaker 1: aware of the concept of the antichrist pair. I mean,

1197
01:04:01,160 --> 01:04:05,240
Speaker 1: this isn't yeah, it's yeah, and it's.

1198
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:06,720
Speaker 3: It's Satan's kid, you know.

1199
01:04:06,800 --> 01:04:10,960
Speaker 1: It's really exactly, it's little Nikki, it's his, it's his.

1200
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:15,600
Speaker 1: You know. Look, if Satan is uh, Francis Ford Coppola,

1201
01:04:16,440 --> 01:04:19,960
Speaker 1: the Antichrist is Nicholas Cage, who also would be a

1202
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:21,440
Speaker 1: good pick to play the anti Christ.

1203
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:24,160
Speaker 3: I'm just saying, my god that that has to have

1204
01:04:24,200 --> 01:04:26,920
Speaker 3: happened in nineteen ninety four and we forgot about it.

1205
01:04:26,920 --> 01:04:29,760
Speaker 1: It better Yeah, yeah, it just skipped us by. I

1206
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:32,640
Speaker 1: watched him play a surfer recently. Not a great movie. Wow,

1207
01:04:33,640 --> 01:04:34,320
Speaker 1: not a great movie.

1208
01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:38,240
Speaker 3: Sorry, what I appreciate that. Nicholas Cage, well, I apparently

1209
01:04:38,320 --> 01:04:40,840
Speaker 3: can't say no. You know. They're just like, will you

1210
01:04:40,960 --> 01:04:43,840
Speaker 3: be in this really inappropriate role and he's like yes.

1211
01:04:44,560 --> 01:04:47,800
Speaker 1: He's also an Australian in that, and they just explained

1212
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:49,880
Speaker 1: it by being like, oh, we moved to America when

1213
01:04:50,120 --> 01:04:52,840
Speaker 1: California when I was young. It's like, I don't you

1214
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:54,720
Speaker 1: still don't really sound Australian to.

1215
01:04:54,800 --> 01:04:58,880
Speaker 3: Me, Nicholas Cage, all right, Mel Gibson, But.

1216
01:04:58,920 --> 01:05:02,240
Speaker 1: Also I will watch you do anything for roughly ninety minutes.

1217
01:05:02,280 --> 01:05:04,439
Speaker 1: So yeah, I guess I'm the fool here, and often

1218
01:05:04,480 --> 01:05:08,960
Speaker 1: an additional thirty Yeah, some many cases more than that.

1219
01:05:10,200 --> 01:05:12,800
Speaker 1: So I'm going to actually read another paragraph, Peter said,

1220
01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:14,840
Speaker 1: this time you'll get the whole paragraph. But it's just

1221
01:05:14,920 --> 01:05:19,280
Speaker 1: as insane, and so like, hold your questions till the end, Sarah,

1222
01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:22,480
Speaker 1: but I know you're going to immediately have them. Our

1223
01:05:22,600 --> 01:05:25,680
Speaker 1: universities tell us that fears of the apocalypse are irrational

1224
01:05:25,720 --> 01:05:27,919
Speaker 1: and that the world is simply getting better, And yet

1225
01:05:28,000 --> 01:05:30,760
Speaker 1: our news tells us otherwise. We are worried about existential

1226
01:05:30,800 --> 01:05:34,000
Speaker 1: risks from AI bioweapons and nuclear war. How can we

1227
01:05:34,080 --> 01:05:39,000
Speaker 1: understand our apocalyptic time? And like what universities are you?

1228
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:42,360
Speaker 1: You think college professors are telling all their kids the

1229
01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:45,000
Speaker 1: world is always getting better and that's what happened? Like

1230
01:05:45,640 --> 01:05:51,360
Speaker 1: who where? What are you basing this on? What college classes? Maybe?

1231
01:05:51,360 --> 01:05:53,720
Speaker 3: He write Candide, and he was like, so that's what

1232
01:05:53,760 --> 01:05:55,040
Speaker 3: they do in college.

1233
01:05:55,080 --> 01:05:57,280
Speaker 1: That's what professors must feel all the time.

1234
01:05:57,360 --> 01:06:00,479
Speaker 3: College. You spend four years with people saying everything is fine,

1235
01:06:00,520 --> 01:06:03,760
Speaker 3: don't worry about it, don't even think about it, It's great.

1236
01:06:04,920 --> 01:06:07,400
Speaker 1: That's what's so weird to me about this is that,

1237
01:06:07,480 --> 01:06:10,760
Speaker 1: like Peter hates universities in the standard right wing way,

1238
01:06:10,960 --> 01:06:13,320
Speaker 1: so I'm not surprised that he's critical of professors, But

1239
01:06:13,360 --> 01:06:16,880
Speaker 1: the standard right wing critique of professors in the university

1240
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:19,320
Speaker 1: isn't they think the world's getting better?

1241
01:06:19,840 --> 01:06:20,040
Speaker 3: Right?

1242
01:06:20,080 --> 01:06:22,640
Speaker 1: It's that like all of these leftist academics are telling

1243
01:06:22,640 --> 01:06:25,720
Speaker 1: everyone capitalism is fucked up and the climate change is

1244
01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:28,480
Speaker 1: kind of it's the opposite of that. That's such a

1245
01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:30,120
Speaker 1: weird thing for you to say.

1246
01:06:30,160 --> 01:06:33,320
Speaker 3: Being you, Peter, it feels like kind of classic like

1247
01:06:33,400 --> 01:06:36,640
Speaker 3: Freshmen comp writing, where you're like, yeah, I'm going to

1248
01:06:36,800 --> 01:06:41,080
Speaker 3: invent a problem that doesn't exist in order to justify

1249
01:06:41,600 --> 01:06:44,080
Speaker 3: the importance of my position. And it's like, all right,

1250
01:06:44,120 --> 01:06:47,400
Speaker 3: you just made that up, but whatever, Fine, keep going.

1251
01:06:48,080 --> 01:06:51,120
Speaker 1: And it's like like I get that you're you can

1252
01:06:51,440 --> 01:06:55,160
Speaker 1: you're creating strawman, but like you're creating conflicting strawman, Like

1253
01:06:55,200 --> 01:06:58,400
Speaker 1: your strawmen aren't internally consistent, which is kind of weird.

1254
01:06:58,680 --> 01:07:03,560
Speaker 1: Right Anyway, after this, Peter goes on to state that

1255
01:07:03,600 --> 01:07:06,440
Speaker 1: the apocalypse is not a fixed date on a calendar,

1256
01:07:06,960 --> 01:07:09,880
Speaker 1: and he briefly summarizes the hilarious history of people trying

1257
01:07:09,920 --> 01:07:13,080
Speaker 1: to predict the end of days. Then he writes, still,

1258
01:07:13,120 --> 01:07:15,560
Speaker 1: if the day and the hour remain hidden, perhaps we

1259
01:07:15,600 --> 01:07:19,439
Speaker 1: may at least suspect the century. Now, I would argue

1260
01:07:19,440 --> 01:07:21,440
Speaker 1: this is just as delusional as trying to predict the

1261
01:07:21,480 --> 01:07:23,400
Speaker 1: day of the apocalypse, but it is much smarter from

1262
01:07:23,400 --> 01:07:25,760
Speaker 1: a gambler's point of view. And Peter Tiel is a

1263
01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:29,200
Speaker 1: degenerate gambler, right, Like, you got a lot of space

1264
01:07:29,280 --> 01:07:30,960
Speaker 1: to be wrong if you're just like, oh, it'll happens

1265
01:07:31,000 --> 01:07:33,960
Speaker 1: sometime in the twenty first century, right Like, that is

1266
01:07:34,000 --> 01:07:35,280
Speaker 1: the smart play.

1267
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:42,000
Speaker 3: You'll be dead before people know you're totally wrong. Yeahsolutely Yeah. Now,

1268
01:07:42,080 --> 01:07:43,920
Speaker 3: next he tells his audience that if we are to

1269
01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:47,080
Speaker 3: take the Antichrist seriously, and again, for Peter, the Antichrist

1270
01:07:47,160 --> 01:07:49,760
Speaker 3: and the apocalypse are both synonyms, we have to ask

1271
01:07:49,960 --> 01:07:54,040
Speaker 3: four questions. These four questions are, what is the Antichrist's

1272
01:07:54,080 --> 01:07:57,440
Speaker 3: relationship to Armageddon, when will he arrive? What is his

1273
01:07:57,560 --> 01:08:02,720
Speaker 3: relationship to Christ? And who is the Antichrist now Peter's

1274
01:08:02,720 --> 01:08:05,360
Speaker 3: selective reading of scripture concludes that the Antichrist is the

1275
01:08:05,400 --> 01:08:09,160
Speaker 3: final antagonist before the revelation of Christ and Armageddon quote

1276
01:08:09,200 --> 01:08:11,880
Speaker 3: the beast of the Sea heading a world government. He

1277
01:08:11,960 --> 01:08:15,920
Speaker 3: will come after many forerunners and will deceive the faithful

1278
01:08:15,920 --> 01:08:19,839
Speaker 3: by appearing more Christian than Christ. Now, for that last question,

1279
01:08:20,160 --> 01:08:24,519
Speaker 3: who is the Antichrist? Peter notes that the Antichrist, depending

1280
01:08:24,520 --> 01:08:26,320
Speaker 3: on who you listen to, could be a single person,

1281
01:08:26,400 --> 01:08:29,080
Speaker 3: or a system or a type that repeats across history.

1282
01:08:29,320 --> 01:08:32,799
Speaker 3: Right and next he has a diggression where he claims

1283
01:08:32,800 --> 01:08:36,960
Speaker 3: that David from the Bible was the first real historian quote,

1284
01:08:36,960 --> 01:08:40,520
Speaker 3: because he foresaw a one time sequence of world empires,

1285
01:08:40,920 --> 01:08:46,280
Speaker 3: whereas classical historians like Thucydides saw only cycles. Quote, Athens

1286
01:08:46,400 --> 01:08:49,479
Speaker 3: versus Sparta, Germany versus Britain, and China versus America were

1287
01:08:49,479 --> 01:08:51,479
Speaker 3: one and the same. They were just steps in an

1288
01:08:51,520 --> 01:08:55,160
Speaker 3: eternal recurrence. And I know there's a lot that's wrong there.

1289
01:08:55,200 --> 01:08:56,840
Speaker 3: We'll get back to the antichrist stuff, but I have

1290
01:08:56,880 --> 01:09:00,360
Speaker 3: to correct Peter's talking about history, because this is not

1291
01:09:00,400 --> 01:09:04,120
Speaker 3: fair to Thucidides or to classical thought, and neither nothing

1292
01:09:04,160 --> 01:09:08,639
Speaker 3: he's saying here is like accurate historiography. Right, Classical thinkers

1293
01:09:08,680 --> 01:09:12,400
Speaker 3: did talk about the cyclical nature of history, like Thucidities

1294
01:09:12,560 --> 01:09:16,759
Speaker 3: talked about that, But he wasn't saying that like history

1295
01:09:16,920 --> 01:09:21,280
Speaker 3: is trapped in these like like cycles of like it's

1296
01:09:21,320 --> 01:09:23,560
Speaker 3: the same thing happening over and over again. He was

1297
01:09:23,600 --> 01:09:26,519
Speaker 3: making the same observation modern people do looking at history,

1298
01:09:26,720 --> 01:09:29,400
Speaker 3: which is that like, oh, people make the same mistakes

1299
01:09:29,439 --> 01:09:32,400
Speaker 3: a lot. Huh, Like there's a lot of similarities in

1300
01:09:32,520 --> 01:09:35,679
Speaker 3: history that rhyme because we keep fucking up in similar ways.

1301
01:09:36,000 --> 01:09:36,120
Speaker 2: Right.

1302
01:09:36,200 --> 01:09:39,120
Speaker 1: I'm gonna here's a quote from Thucydides himself, just to

1303
01:09:39,240 --> 01:09:42,280
Speaker 1: make that point. If my work is judged useful by

1304
01:09:42,280 --> 01:09:44,400
Speaker 1: any who shall wish to have a clear view both

1305
01:09:44,400 --> 01:09:46,960
Speaker 1: of the events which have happened and those which will someday,

1306
01:09:47,000 --> 01:09:49,600
Speaker 1: according to the human condition, happen again in such and

1307
01:09:49,680 --> 01:09:53,120
Speaker 1: such like ways, it will suffice for me. So Throcidides

1308
01:09:53,160 --> 01:09:55,920
Speaker 1: is saying, my work is a success if it leads

1309
01:09:55,920 --> 01:09:59,519
Speaker 1: people to understand the human condition and the patterns that

1310
01:09:59,560 --> 01:10:02,320
Speaker 1: we go through as people. Right, Like the patterns in

1311
01:10:02,400 --> 01:10:04,479
Speaker 1: history as a result of the human condition. That's a

1312
01:10:04,560 --> 01:10:07,639
Speaker 1: very like modern thing really in a lot of ways.

1313
01:10:07,680 --> 01:10:10,680
Speaker 1: And I think it's actually comports pretty well with modern historiography,

1314
01:10:10,960 --> 01:10:13,519
Speaker 1: which is like the exact same things don't repeat, but

1315
01:10:13,560 --> 01:10:17,800
Speaker 1: people make similar choices historically in similar situations, and that's

1316
01:10:17,800 --> 01:10:21,080
Speaker 1: why you study history. Like I actually think Thucydides is

1317
01:10:21,120 --> 01:10:25,120
Speaker 1: saying something timeless here, and Peter is saying that no, no, no,

1318
01:10:25,160 --> 01:10:27,960
Speaker 1: this guy is that this is a classical person who's

1319
01:10:27,960 --> 01:10:30,320
Speaker 1: trapped with like a very limited view of history of

1320
01:10:30,400 --> 01:10:34,000
Speaker 1: history that's fundamentally wrong because he doesn't believe history can progress,

1321
01:10:34,400 --> 01:10:36,559
Speaker 1: you know, which is not what Thucydides is saying. He's

1322
01:10:36,600 --> 01:10:38,000
Speaker 1: making a point about human nature.

1323
01:10:38,080 --> 01:10:41,439
Speaker 3: He's got to create another meaningless straw man in order

1324
01:10:41,439 --> 01:10:43,919
Speaker 3: to exactly theoretical point. Yeah.

1325
01:10:44,000 --> 01:10:47,240
Speaker 1: Yes, in part because Daniel has to be the first

1326
01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:48,639
Speaker 1: real historian, you.

1327
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:52,400
Speaker 3: Know, because historians predict things that haven't happened yet.

1328
01:10:52,640 --> 01:10:55,879
Speaker 1: Right, That's what big historian is.

1329
01:10:55,960 --> 01:10:56,320
Speaker 3: Robert.

1330
01:10:56,360 --> 01:11:00,360
Speaker 2: My question is, do we have any from the source.

1331
01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:03,400
Speaker 2: Do they say, like how the audience is reacting to

1332
01:11:03,479 --> 01:11:05,080
Speaker 2: this like fifty five minute thing.

1333
01:11:05,720 --> 01:11:08,479
Speaker 1: They seemed engrossed from the reports I've heard, like mostly

1334
01:11:08,560 --> 01:11:10,960
Speaker 1: interested people kept showing up. I don't know. I don't

1335
01:11:10,960 --> 01:11:12,680
Speaker 1: have the audio, so I can't hear like what the

1336
01:11:12,720 --> 01:11:15,479
Speaker 1: reaction was. Was there a lot of applause? Was it

1337
01:11:15,600 --> 01:11:18,120
Speaker 1: all people being polite to Peter because they work in

1338
01:11:18,120 --> 01:11:21,720
Speaker 1: his VC fund? These are the unknowns, you know? To me?

1339
01:11:21,960 --> 01:11:25,360
Speaker 1: So I can't answer that question accurately, Sophie, But it's

1340
01:11:25,400 --> 01:11:31,040
Speaker 1: a good question, so Peter claim his justification. His explanation

1341
01:11:31,040 --> 01:11:33,559
Speaker 1: for why Daniel was the first real historian is that

1342
01:11:33,640 --> 01:11:36,760
Speaker 1: Daniel was the first historian to realize that world empires

1343
01:11:36,960 --> 01:11:40,599
Speaker 1: would all fall in succession, leading ultimately to the end

1344
01:11:40,640 --> 01:11:45,080
Speaker 1: of the world and the coming of God's kingdom. Now, okay, Daniel,

1345
01:11:45,200 --> 01:11:48,280
Speaker 1: I mean he that he made a that's kind of

1346
01:11:48,280 --> 01:11:50,320
Speaker 1: what he predicted, but not in a way that's accurate

1347
01:11:50,360 --> 01:11:55,440
Speaker 1: to modern history, because this is critical, Sarah. Daniel prophesied

1348
01:11:56,000 --> 01:12:00,360
Speaker 1: four earthly kingdoms rising and falling in succession, and then

1349
01:12:00,680 --> 01:12:04,040
Speaker 1: after vose four kingdoms rise and fall will get the

1350
01:12:04,120 --> 01:12:06,720
Speaker 1: end of days in God's eternal kingdom. Right, and the

1351
01:12:06,760 --> 01:12:09,640
Speaker 1: first we know what the kingdoms were. The first was Babylon,

1352
01:12:09,920 --> 01:12:13,400
Speaker 1: which did indeed rise and fall, The second was Persia,

1353
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:17,000
Speaker 1: the third was Greece. Some of what Daniels wrote is

1354
01:12:17,040 --> 01:12:19,759
Speaker 1: often seen to him having predicted Alexander the great, although

1355
01:12:19,800 --> 01:12:25,120
Speaker 1: again it was written after Alexander's time, probably right, probably,

1356
01:12:25,479 --> 01:12:29,120
Speaker 1: and then the fourth kingdom that rosen fall was probably Rome, right,

1357
01:12:29,439 --> 01:12:32,840
Speaker 1: that that's what Daniel was prophesying. Now, if you're a

1358
01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:37,599
Speaker 1: history no talk, right, you might be saying at this point,

1359
01:12:37,840 --> 01:12:39,479
Speaker 1: I feel like there's been a lot of empires since

1360
01:12:39,520 --> 01:12:40,679
Speaker 1: the Roman Empire fell.

1361
01:12:41,040 --> 01:12:44,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like the Ottoman Empire springs to mind.

1362
01:12:45,040 --> 01:12:49,880
Speaker 1: Sure, that's a good empire. Yeah, the American.

1363
01:12:49,400 --> 01:12:51,800
Speaker 3: Empire you know, ye, falling as we speak.

1364
01:12:51,880 --> 01:12:55,360
Speaker 1: Obviously, the Canadian Empire the most powerful and evil of

1365
01:12:55,360 --> 01:12:55,800
Speaker 1: them all.

1366
01:12:56,080 --> 01:12:58,760
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, the seat of global Satanism, according to

1367
01:12:58,800 --> 01:13:00,120
Speaker 3: Michelle Remembers.

1368
01:13:00,400 --> 01:13:05,960
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, And anyway, Peter's stance seems to be that,

1369
01:13:06,040 --> 01:13:10,880
Speaker 1: like Daniel was right, but that and again Daniel is

1370
01:13:10,960 --> 01:13:13,640
Speaker 1: literally the guy who wrote the Book of Daniel and

1371
01:13:13,720 --> 01:13:17,840
Speaker 1: literally historian. But also the four Kingdoms thing was figurative, right,

1372
01:13:18,040 --> 01:13:21,000
Speaker 1: He wasn't literally talking about the actual historical empires. He

1373
01:13:21,040 --> 01:13:26,240
Speaker 1: was about right, yeah, yeah, which is the only way

1374
01:13:26,320 --> 01:13:29,280
Speaker 1: because like again, he missed a lot of history after

1375
01:13:29,320 --> 01:13:33,080
Speaker 1: the Roman Empire, in between that and the apocalypse, And

1376
01:13:33,120 --> 01:13:35,839
Speaker 1: as a result, I might suggest that like, well, Daniel

1377
01:13:35,960 --> 01:13:39,439
Speaker 1: clearly didn't foresee anything past the Roman Empire in terms

1378
01:13:39,479 --> 01:13:42,640
Speaker 1: of empires rising and falling. Maybe thucidides is way of

1379
01:13:42,680 --> 01:13:46,320
Speaker 1: looking at history, you know, seeing patterns of human behavior

1380
01:13:46,479 --> 01:13:50,120
Speaker 1: and seeing how they anticity influenced historic events, rather than

1381
01:13:50,160 --> 01:13:53,160
Speaker 1: trying to predict specific events. Maybe that's a more productive

1382
01:13:53,160 --> 01:13:55,000
Speaker 1: way to look at history. Maybe e Thucydides was a

1383
01:13:55,000 --> 01:13:56,240
Speaker 1: better historian than Daniel.

1384
01:13:56,439 --> 01:13:59,040
Speaker 3: Now the correct way to look at history is self

1385
01:13:59,080 --> 01:14:01,840
Speaker 3: insert fan fait. We've been over there, that's right, Yeah,

1386
01:14:01,880 --> 01:14:05,400
Speaker 3: that's right. Make yourself the most important character in history.

1387
01:14:05,439 --> 01:14:08,200
Speaker 3: Why bother studying anything if you can't be the main

1388
01:14:08,320 --> 01:14:09,200
Speaker 3: character of it?

1389
01:14:09,520 --> 01:14:12,720
Speaker 1: Right, I've always felt that way anyway, So thank you

1390
01:14:12,800 --> 01:14:17,439
Speaker 1: for like reinforcing my belief system here. Oh ye anyway.

1391
01:14:17,439 --> 01:14:20,320
Speaker 1: In his next paragraph, Peter continues to be dizzyingly wrong.

1392
01:14:20,720 --> 01:14:24,240
Speaker 1: From seventeen fifty to the early nineteen hundreds, technology accelerated

1393
01:14:24,280 --> 01:14:27,240
Speaker 1: at a pace that defies comprehension. In the twentieth century,

1394
01:14:27,280 --> 01:14:30,680
Speaker 1: lifespans doubled, we moved faster physically, Steam engines led to

1395
01:14:30,680 --> 01:14:34,280
Speaker 1: automobiles and jet airplanes, and the twenty first century technology

1396
01:14:34,360 --> 01:14:38,800
Speaker 1: only means information technology progress in all other fields has

1397
01:14:38,840 --> 01:14:42,280
Speaker 1: halted the question naturally arises, is the singularity in the

1398
01:14:42,320 --> 01:14:43,639
Speaker 1: past or in the future.

1399
01:14:44,560 --> 01:14:46,920
Speaker 3: Now, he doesn't know what singularity means.

1400
01:14:47,240 --> 01:14:49,800
Speaker 1: No, he doesn't, and he doesn't know. This is a

1401
01:14:49,960 --> 01:14:53,600
Speaker 1: very if all you care about is like the consumer

1402
01:14:54,080 --> 01:14:57,760
Speaker 1: tech industry, it's a I understand how your attitude could be.

1403
01:14:58,080 --> 01:15:02,320
Speaker 1: Nothing is progressing aside from it information technology. Smartphones aren't

1404
01:15:02,320 --> 01:15:05,600
Speaker 1: really improving anymore, Tablets are kind of laptops. All of

1405
01:15:05,640 --> 01:15:07,920
Speaker 1: these things that used to be wildly different every year

1406
01:15:08,280 --> 01:15:10,720
Speaker 1: are only kind of a little bit different now with

1407
01:15:10,800 --> 01:15:15,200
Speaker 1: every new innovation, progress has stopped. If you only look

1408
01:15:15,240 --> 01:15:18,479
Speaker 1: at technology and like gadgets a guy keeps in his

1409
01:15:18,560 --> 01:15:21,760
Speaker 1: living room or their pocket. I get how you might

1410
01:15:21,840 --> 01:15:24,280
Speaker 1: say that, And clearly that's how Peter Teal thinks about

1411
01:15:24,280 --> 01:15:27,240
Speaker 1: technology because he's a terminal narcissist. Right, you can only

1412
01:15:27,240 --> 01:15:28,960
Speaker 1: see progress through the lens of the parts of the

1413
01:15:28,960 --> 01:15:32,439
Speaker 1: tech industry he makes money on. But the idea that,

1414
01:15:32,560 --> 01:15:36,680
Speaker 1: like all other fields of scientific endeavor, have stalled in

1415
01:15:36,720 --> 01:15:39,919
Speaker 1: the last couple of decades is insane nonsense. And for example,

1416
01:15:40,360 --> 01:15:48,400
Speaker 1: mRNA vaccine technology advanced gractically in recent history. Right, that

1417
01:15:48,439 --> 01:15:50,400
Speaker 1: doesn't count to Peter for some reason.

1418
01:15:50,280 --> 01:15:53,479
Speaker 3: And like what does it matter if something advances, is

1419
01:15:53,479 --> 01:15:57,280
Speaker 3: if you can't make exponential profits off of it, who cares?

1420
01:15:57,520 --> 01:16:00,719
Speaker 1: Yep yep. And that's clearly what's going going on here.

1421
01:16:00,840 --> 01:16:03,080
Speaker 1: I don't even know, like should I, like I have,

1422
01:16:03,280 --> 01:16:05,679
Speaker 1: I had a rant in here about like car tech,

1423
01:16:05,840 --> 01:16:08,880
Speaker 1: like automobile safety technology, just just like a point of

1424
01:16:08,880 --> 01:16:12,360
Speaker 1: how wrong he is, because like it's matt like since

1425
01:16:12,760 --> 01:16:17,200
Speaker 1: the nineteen eighties, Like there's a little bit of debate

1426
01:16:17,240 --> 01:16:20,479
Speaker 1: about this, but like anti lock breaks became normal in

1427
01:16:20,520 --> 01:16:22,960
Speaker 1: the nineteen eighties, and kind of after that, you've started

1428
01:16:22,960 --> 01:16:25,599
Speaker 1: getting an increasing a variety of like what are called

1429
01:16:25,640 --> 01:16:29,960
Speaker 1: advanced driver assistance systems or ADAS. This includes everything from

1430
01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:34,080
Speaker 1: like collision warnings to automated emergency braking and electronic stability

1431
01:16:34,080 --> 01:16:36,840
Speaker 1: control lane assist, all that kinds of stuff. And like

1432
01:16:37,000 --> 01:16:41,040
Speaker 1: electronic stability control or e SC systems alone have been

1433
01:16:41,040 --> 01:16:45,320
Speaker 1: shown to reduce single vehicle fatal crash crash fatality chances

1434
01:16:45,400 --> 01:16:49,680
Speaker 1: by between like forty and fifty six percent. There's a

1435
01:16:49,720 --> 01:16:52,799
Speaker 1: twenty seventeen study by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety

1436
01:16:53,040 --> 01:16:57,080
Speaker 1: that shows that like some of these, like like rear

1437
01:16:57,160 --> 01:17:00,599
Speaker 1: braking systems have reduced rearing collisions by twenty seve seven percent.

1438
01:17:01,840 --> 01:17:05,400
Speaker 1: Like the data overall suggests that like automated emergency braking

1439
01:17:05,439 --> 01:17:08,280
Speaker 1: with combined with a warning reduces rearing crashes by between

1440
01:17:08,280 --> 01:17:11,679
Speaker 1: fifty and fifty six percent, and all together, newer cars

1441
01:17:12,040 --> 01:17:15,160
Speaker 1: have something like a fifty percent lower fatality risk in

1442
01:17:15,240 --> 01:17:18,000
Speaker 1: crashes than cars built in the late fifties. This is

1443
01:17:18,040 --> 01:17:20,240
Speaker 1: a staggering groove improvement, and a lot of it's occurred

1444
01:17:20,240 --> 01:17:22,439
Speaker 1: in the last like twenty years. Again during this period

1445
01:17:22,479 --> 01:17:25,080
Speaker 1: of time where Peter with Peter's like nothing's getting better, Well,

1446
01:17:25,120 --> 01:17:28,880
Speaker 1: a lot is. It's just not what you care about, Like, yeah,

1447
01:17:28,920 --> 01:17:31,040
Speaker 1: we have kind of reached the apex of what a

1448
01:17:31,080 --> 01:17:34,679
Speaker 1: screen can do. Probably, like you can't get out.

1449
01:17:35,080 --> 01:17:39,200
Speaker 3: That's fine, there's other things cancers to research, you know,

1450
01:17:39,320 --> 01:17:42,080
Speaker 3: we're making headway in other areas. It's fine.

1451
01:17:42,520 --> 01:17:45,040
Speaker 1: It's it's so weird to be like, well, TVs are

1452
01:17:45,080 --> 01:17:47,799
Speaker 1: as good as they're going to get. All the progress

1453
01:17:47,880 --> 01:17:50,600
Speaker 1: is halted now there's nothing else.

1454
01:17:50,400 --> 01:17:54,280
Speaker 3: So you might as well give up. I guess, Yeah,

1455
01:17:54,400 --> 01:17:56,800
Speaker 3: I'm ready for the apocalypse if my TV is not

1456
01:17:56,840 --> 01:17:59,880
Speaker 3: going to keep improving. Yeah, you can't make the image

1457
01:18:00,200 --> 01:18:01,000
Speaker 3: any smoother.

1458
01:18:01,800 --> 01:18:05,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's just really telling that. Like Peter's attentude

1459
01:18:05,800 --> 01:18:08,920
Speaker 1: is like only information technology is still advancing, and it's like, yeah,

1460
01:18:08,960 --> 01:18:11,479
Speaker 1: because that's the only technology you're looking at, right, you

1461
01:18:11,479 --> 01:18:13,920
Speaker 1: don't care about car safety, you don't care about any

1462
01:18:13,960 --> 01:18:14,839
Speaker 1: of these other fields.

1463
01:18:15,000 --> 01:18:17,519
Speaker 3: Well, if he's not paying attention to it, it doesn't exist.

1464
01:18:17,880 --> 01:18:19,920
Speaker 3: You know. It's like when a baby drops something.

1465
01:18:20,360 --> 01:18:22,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, and there's a there's a very funny at this

1466
01:18:22,720 --> 01:18:25,960
Speaker 1: point in his write up he made of Peter's speech,

1467
01:18:26,040 --> 01:18:28,479
Speaker 1: Cool Carney, the guy taking notes includes a graph and

1468
01:18:28,560 --> 01:18:31,880
Speaker 1: I I don't know, I think that Peter's presentation had

1469
01:18:31,920 --> 01:18:34,840
Speaker 1: a graph like this. I don't know that maybe, but

1470
01:18:34,880 --> 01:18:37,599
Speaker 1: it's it's so funny, Sarah, look at this beautiful thing.

1471
01:18:38,200 --> 01:18:40,799
Speaker 1: There's there's two graphs. One is labeled in the past

1472
01:18:40,920 --> 01:18:43,439
Speaker 1: and one is labeled in the future. And the one

1473
01:18:43,439 --> 01:18:46,160
Speaker 1: that says in the past shows the line basically going

1474
01:18:46,240 --> 01:18:50,439
Speaker 1: an S curve, but like it's going rapidly up knowledge

1475
01:18:50,960 --> 01:18:54,560
Speaker 1: on the X axis, time on the Y axis, or

1476
01:18:54,680 --> 01:18:58,719
Speaker 1: did I fuck up the axes? And then it's showing

1477
01:18:58,960 --> 01:19:01,800
Speaker 1: it's showing knowledge going up massively over time and then

1478
01:19:01,840 --> 01:19:05,040
Speaker 1: plateauing suddenly. And then the one labeled in the future

1479
01:19:05,400 --> 01:19:09,479
Speaker 1: shows knowledge at a steady rate until it shotguns up

1480
01:19:10,760 --> 01:19:13,919
Speaker 1: rapidly over time. I guess that's Peter predicting that knowledge.

1481
01:19:14,040 --> 01:19:15,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, can we see the right data for.

1482
01:19:15,840 --> 01:19:19,200
Speaker 1: These What is the data? What is knowledge based on?

1483
01:19:19,280 --> 01:19:22,760
Speaker 1: How are we defining knowledge in the future when now

1484
01:19:22,800 --> 01:19:23,240
Speaker 1: don't we know?

1485
01:19:23,360 --> 01:19:25,479
Speaker 3: Why do we have a chart of the future. It's

1486
01:19:25,520 --> 01:19:28,400
Speaker 3: because he's a try historian, like Daniel who wrote the

1487
01:19:28,400 --> 01:19:30,320
Speaker 3: Book of Daniel Duh.

1488
01:19:30,439 --> 01:19:33,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love I love fake graphs, and this is

1489
01:19:33,040 --> 01:19:35,720
Speaker 1: a beautiful fake graph to me, it's perfect. I don't

1490
01:19:35,720 --> 01:19:37,720
Speaker 1: even know what you're trying to argue, other than like

1491
01:19:38,200 --> 01:19:41,040
Speaker 1: AI will increase the rate of knowledge. Maybe it looks

1492
01:19:41,040 --> 01:19:43,080
Speaker 1: like that's kind of what he's trying to say, But

1493
01:19:43,200 --> 01:19:46,719
Speaker 1: he's arguing certainly that right now we're stuck, like science

1494
01:19:46,840 --> 01:19:49,439
Speaker 1: is stuck, you know, And this is like the core

1495
01:19:49,600 --> 01:19:52,320
Speaker 1: of everything Peter believes, and like why he is so

1496
01:19:52,400 --> 01:19:55,639
Speaker 1: supportive of radical political change is that he thinks it's

1497
01:19:55,680 --> 01:19:58,559
Speaker 1: death for the human race, that science is stuck. And

1498
01:19:59,160 --> 01:20:01,559
Speaker 1: as a spoiler, the antichrist is all of the anti

1499
01:20:01,640 --> 01:20:05,080
Speaker 1: science people who want to stop AI research, who want

1500
01:20:05,080 --> 01:20:08,439
Speaker 1: to stop oh drilling for fossil fuels, like who wanted

1501
01:20:08,560 --> 01:20:12,920
Speaker 1: like that that is his his doom loop. Right, Peter says, quote,

1502
01:20:12,920 --> 01:20:16,599
Speaker 1: we are running a red queen's race, working harder, running faster,

1503
01:20:16,760 --> 01:20:20,160
Speaker 1: yet standing still. Wages of stagnated health is plateauing, and

1504
01:20:20,200 --> 01:20:23,160
Speaker 1: optimism is fading. Nixon declared a war on cancer in

1505
01:20:23,200 --> 01:20:26,320
Speaker 1: nineteen seventy one, promising victory by the bisentennial in nineteen

1506
01:20:26,320 --> 01:20:29,160
Speaker 1: seventy six. No president today would dare to clear a

1507
01:20:29,160 --> 01:20:32,920
Speaker 1: war on Alzheimer's And like, I mean, yeah, man, because

1508
01:20:32,920 --> 01:20:35,719
Speaker 1: we didn't. We didn't beat cancer in nineteen seventy six.

1509
01:20:35,760 --> 01:20:38,519
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, Nixon was very brave. Hey, if he hadn't got,

1510
01:20:38,560 --> 01:20:42,800
Speaker 3: if he hadn't resigned, maybe he would have cured cancer.

1511
01:20:43,040 --> 01:20:45,840
Speaker 1: Sure, It's like, I don't know, man, Maybe the fact

1512
01:20:45,880 --> 01:20:47,720
Speaker 1: that this was it didn't work last time is why

1513
01:20:47,760 --> 01:20:50,160
Speaker 1: presidents don't say shit like that anymore, because it's like dumb,

1514
01:20:50,560 --> 01:20:53,200
Speaker 1: It's like, dully, yeah, it's a stupid thing to do.

1515
01:20:53,520 --> 01:20:55,639
Speaker 3: Grandiose and over the top thing to say.

1516
01:20:55,680 --> 01:20:56,600
Speaker 1: And I got that.

1517
01:20:56,680 --> 01:20:59,880
Speaker 3: It's personally disappointing to you that the presidents don't act

1518
01:21:00,080 --> 01:21:03,320
Speaker 3: more megalomania call. But but it is.

1519
01:21:03,240 --> 01:21:05,680
Speaker 1: Also the idea that like, oh wow, it's fun that

1520
01:21:05,720 --> 01:21:09,960
Speaker 1: he recognizes regular people their wages are standing still, like

1521
01:21:10,040 --> 01:21:13,519
Speaker 1: things like quality of life increases have plateaued, and things

1522
01:21:13,560 --> 01:21:16,439
Speaker 1: aren't getting better at the rate they used to. And

1523
01:21:16,520 --> 01:21:20,599
Speaker 1: yet my wealth as a billionaire has increased massively, while

1524
01:21:20,720 --> 01:21:24,479
Speaker 1: like regular wages are stagnant. Rich people like me, the

1525
01:21:24,520 --> 01:21:26,240
Speaker 1: top one percent of the top one percent, are getting

1526
01:21:26,280 --> 01:21:29,720
Speaker 1: a lot more. Hmm. Wonder if those are connected. I

1527
01:21:29,720 --> 01:21:32,160
Speaker 1: wonder if maybe all of the benefits that should be

1528
01:21:32,200 --> 01:21:35,320
Speaker 1: spread out throughout society in order to do things like

1529
01:21:35,400 --> 01:21:39,240
Speaker 1: increase life expectancy and increase average wealth and like ensure

1530
01:21:39,360 --> 01:21:41,840
Speaker 1: people are able to retire and all this stuff that

1531
01:21:42,720 --> 01:21:44,720
Speaker 1: translates to quality of life. I wonder if the fact

1532
01:21:44,720 --> 01:21:47,360
Speaker 1: that all that money is going to me has anything

1533
01:21:47,400 --> 01:21:52,920
Speaker 1: to do with this stagnation nah antichrist. Yeah. In his

1534
01:21:52,920 --> 01:21:54,760
Speaker 1: next paragraph, Peter gets to the core of why he's

1535
01:21:54,800 --> 01:21:58,280
Speaker 1: so angry at science and academia. Science once proud promised

1536
01:21:58,360 --> 01:22:01,320
Speaker 1: radical life extension. To day, the closest we come to

1537
01:22:01,400 --> 01:22:08,360
Speaker 1: mastery over death is legalized euthanasia. And I, yeah, no, Peter,

1538
01:22:08,760 --> 01:22:09,719
Speaker 1: that's not true.

1539
01:22:10,200 --> 01:22:14,360
Speaker 3: Like he just hasn't he. I don't think anyone has

1540
01:22:14,400 --> 01:22:15,559
Speaker 3: given him feedback on this.

1541
01:22:15,880 --> 01:22:20,519
Speaker 1: No, no, And it's like, yeah, this is very clearly

1542
01:22:20,560 --> 01:22:22,360
Speaker 1: a man without an editor for sure.

1543
01:22:22,640 --> 01:22:27,320
Speaker 2: Editor, he needs a producer, he needs us, a single

1544
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:29,360
Speaker 2: person to say no.

1545
01:22:29,920 --> 01:22:33,599
Speaker 1: I feel like science never promised radical life. You probably

1546
01:22:33,640 --> 01:22:36,920
Speaker 1: read like an article and like people were someone who

1547
01:22:37,040 --> 01:22:40,639
Speaker 1: wasn't a scientist talked about radical or a grifter talked

1548
01:22:40,640 --> 01:22:43,719
Speaker 1: about radical and you bought it because you're not that smart.

1549
01:22:43,920 --> 01:22:48,040
Speaker 1: Maybe that's who promised radical life. I think some conmen

1550
01:22:48,200 --> 01:22:51,760
Speaker 1: promised you radical life extension. And as you age and

1551
01:22:51,840 --> 01:22:54,240
Speaker 1: none of the nonsense you're doing really works the way

1552
01:22:54,280 --> 01:22:57,840
Speaker 1: it's supposed to, you realize you've been conned, and you're

1553
01:22:57,840 --> 01:23:01,639
Speaker 1: blaming science as opposed to the grifters that you listen

1554
01:23:01,720 --> 01:23:04,160
Speaker 1: to and gave a lot of money, And maybe that's

1555
01:23:04,200 --> 01:23:04,880
Speaker 1: what's going on.

1556
01:23:04,920 --> 01:23:07,760
Speaker 3: And blaming science for your magical thinking not working in

1557
01:23:07,800 --> 01:23:09,639
Speaker 3: those wall as it used to. Yeah.

1558
01:23:09,680 --> 01:23:11,800
Speaker 1: And also, just like the closest we come to mastery

1559
01:23:11,800 --> 01:23:16,360
Speaker 1: of a death is legalized euthanasia. Again, like fucking, the

1560
01:23:16,360 --> 01:23:22,240
Speaker 1: most recent vaccine technology leaps, and like life expectancies have

1561
01:23:22,360 --> 01:23:23,800
Speaker 1: increased in a lot of ways for a lot of

1562
01:23:23,800 --> 01:23:26,000
Speaker 1: specific illnesses, there are a lot of new medicines that

1563
01:23:26,000 --> 01:23:28,360
Speaker 1: didn't exist ten years ago twenty years ago, that exists

1564
01:23:28,439 --> 01:23:29,599
Speaker 1: that exists now, and like.

1565
01:23:31,360 --> 01:23:36,080
Speaker 3: Gene modification technology, yeah you know, yeah, like I really

1566
01:23:36,280 --> 01:23:38,080
Speaker 3: euthanasia is exciting, but come.

1567
01:23:37,920 --> 01:23:42,520
Speaker 1: On, Yeah, there's a ton of medical improvements and even breakthroughs,

1568
01:23:42,800 --> 01:23:45,160
Speaker 1: just none of them mean that you'll live forever, because

1569
01:23:45,200 --> 01:23:46,599
Speaker 1: that's not possible. Peter.

1570
01:23:47,160 --> 01:23:50,000
Speaker 3: But basically, he's like science is in the diction, we

1571
01:23:50,080 --> 01:23:53,519
Speaker 3: might as well all kill ourselves. But wait, there's more.

1572
01:23:53,960 --> 01:23:56,640
Speaker 1: But wait, there's more. It's like looking at it's like

1573
01:23:56,680 --> 01:23:58,679
Speaker 1: looking at like the aerospace field and being like, there's

1574
01:23:58,720 --> 01:24:01,280
Speaker 1: been no progress in the life thirty years because we

1575
01:24:01,320 --> 01:24:03,440
Speaker 1: haven't developed faster than light travel.

1576
01:24:03,400 --> 01:24:05,759
Speaker 3: Because I didn't see it on TV, so I assume

1577
01:24:05,760 --> 01:24:06,440
Speaker 3: it didn't.

1578
01:24:06,200 --> 01:24:09,760
Speaker 1: Happen, right, But like planes are a lot safer, like

1579
01:24:09,960 --> 01:24:12,760
Speaker 1: plane crashes are a lot rare, Like isn't that count

1580
01:24:12,760 --> 01:24:16,519
Speaker 1: as an improvement? No, fuck you, we don't have warp speed.

1581
01:24:16,680 --> 01:24:21,760
Speaker 1: I'm angry. Yeah. Anyway, we'll talk some more about Peter

1582
01:24:21,880 --> 01:24:24,320
Speaker 1: Teel and what he believes, and specifically we're going to

1583
01:24:24,360 --> 01:24:26,840
Speaker 1: talk about who he thinks the Antichrist might be in

1584
01:24:27,000 --> 01:24:29,720
Speaker 1: part two, but this is part one. It ran a

1585
01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:33,080
Speaker 1: little long, but thank you Sarah for indulging me.

1586
01:24:33,680 --> 01:24:36,439
Speaker 3: Thank you. This has been a horrifying journey.

1587
01:24:36,960 --> 01:24:40,240
Speaker 1: Yeah. How do you feel about Peter? You seem smart.

1588
01:24:41,000 --> 01:24:45,240
Speaker 3: I feel like he's a tiny little baby and I

1589
01:24:45,280 --> 01:24:50,280
Speaker 3: can't wait to see him become even tinier before my

1590
01:24:50,439 --> 01:24:51,599
Speaker 3: very eyes next time.

1591
01:24:52,280 --> 01:24:55,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, Robert, who is your anti Christ?

1592
01:24:56,040 --> 01:24:56,519
Speaker 3: Robert?

1593
01:24:56,920 --> 01:24:59,760
Speaker 1: Who do I think the Antichrist is? Honestly? Like Peter

1594
01:24:59,840 --> 01:25:03,200
Speaker 1: t He is not a bad pick if you're kind

1595
01:25:03,200 --> 01:25:04,920
Speaker 1: of going though with the more traditional view, Ali, it

1596
01:25:04,960 --> 01:25:08,840
Speaker 1: needs to be somebody who's like popular, who's like widely beloved,

1597
01:25:09,080 --> 01:25:11,240
Speaker 1: you know, by people who's able to like get a

1598
01:25:11,400 --> 01:25:17,760
Speaker 1: large following together. I feel like mister Beast. I feel

1599
01:25:17,760 --> 01:25:21,760
Speaker 1: like mister Beast's very probable Antichrist. Yeah, see it, there's

1600
01:25:21,800 --> 01:25:24,559
Speaker 1: nothing behind his eyes. We can all agree on that, right.

1601
01:25:25,040 --> 01:25:30,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, black eyes like a doll size.

1602
01:25:31,400 --> 01:25:34,720
Speaker 1: And I'm glad that you brought up Jaws, because I

1603
01:25:34,760 --> 01:25:37,439
Speaker 1: do think that the solution to mister Beast is the

1604
01:25:37,479 --> 01:25:39,479
Speaker 1: same as the solution to the shark and Jaws.

1605
01:25:40,360 --> 01:25:42,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, make him bite into an oxygen tank.

1606
01:25:43,479 --> 01:25:46,240
Speaker 1: Yeah. I'm in a crowdfund a shitty boat, like not

1607
01:25:46,320 --> 01:25:48,800
Speaker 1: a good boat, like a fucked up looking boat that

1608
01:25:48,800 --> 01:25:49,479
Speaker 1: I've been living on.

1609
01:25:49,560 --> 01:25:51,840
Speaker 3: It's named after the thing that almost ate you when

1610
01:25:51,840 --> 01:25:54,000
Speaker 3: you were young writer. Or no, it's called the or

1611
01:25:54,240 --> 01:25:56,599
Speaker 3: I guess it's samed after the only thing that can

1612
01:25:56,640 --> 01:25:58,720
Speaker 3: eat the thing that almost ate you when you were young.

1613
01:25:58,840 --> 01:26:03,200
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, yeah, so yeah, that's gonna be great anyway.

1614
01:26:03,240 --> 01:26:05,799
Speaker 1: If you haven't watched the original Jaws, go listen to Jaws.

1615
01:26:06,400 --> 01:26:10,599
Speaker 3: Plug your pluggable, Sarah, Yeah, go listen to the Devil.

1616
01:26:10,640 --> 01:26:10,840
Speaker 2: You know.

1617
01:26:10,920 --> 01:26:13,719
Speaker 3: It's out right now from CBC Podcasts. It's my new

1618
01:26:14,520 --> 01:26:17,320
Speaker 3: mini series about the Satanic panic and all of the

1619
01:26:17,600 --> 01:26:21,479
Speaker 3: truly wonderful people who got caught up in it. And

1620
01:26:21,760 --> 01:26:24,360
Speaker 3: I was so happy to get to talk to you

1621
01:26:24,400 --> 01:26:28,120
Speaker 3: today about something that scares me so much more than

1622
01:26:28,200 --> 01:26:31,599
Speaker 3: any depiction of the devil. And I cannot wait to resume.

1623
01:26:32,680 --> 01:26:36,320
Speaker 1: Yay, all right, everyone, Part one is done, Go away

1624
01:26:36,439 --> 01:26:36,960
Speaker 1: for a while.

1625
01:26:40,240 --> 01:26:42,960
Speaker 2: Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media.

1626
01:26:43,320 --> 01:26:46,600
Speaker 2: For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website Coolzonemedia

1627
01:26:46,760 --> 01:26:49,960
Speaker 2: dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1628
01:26:50,040 --> 01:26:53,200
Speaker 2: Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Behind the

1629
01:26:53,240 --> 01:26:57,320
Speaker 2: Bastards is now available on YouTube. New episodes every Wednesday

1630
01:26:57,400 --> 01:27:01,040
Speaker 2: and Friday. Subscribe to our channel, YouTube dot com slash

1631
01:27:01,240 --> 01:27:02,720
Speaker 2: at Behind the Bastards