WEBVTT - The Next Steps Are On Us

0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:02.720
<v Speaker 1>Lava for Good and Stand Together Music Present The War

0:00:02.759 --> 0:00:06.160
<v Speaker 1>on Drugs Podcast Season two. This season, we're diving deeper

0:00:06.200 --> 0:00:09.320
<v Speaker 1>into the real stories behind the War on Drugs, its impact,

0:00:09.480 --> 0:00:12.119
<v Speaker 1>its failures, and the people offering a better path forward.

0:00:13.000 --> 0:00:17.799
<v Speaker 2>Hey that me and Greg, our guests and sponsors may

0:00:18.239 --> 0:00:20.680
<v Speaker 2>sound smart, We may even make some good points, but

0:00:20.720 --> 0:00:22.640
<v Speaker 2>at the end of the day, we're not medical professional.

0:00:23.160 --> 0:00:23.600
<v Speaker 3>Okay.

0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:27.160
<v Speaker 2>Please don't get your medical advice from a podcast. Anything

0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:31.120
<v Speaker 2>we say on here does not constitute official medical advice. Relax,

0:00:31.640 --> 0:00:35.880
<v Speaker 2>consult your doctor before you start any new treatment plans.

0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:40.320
<v Speaker 4>Got it, Clayton, it's book report time.

0:00:40.640 --> 0:00:40.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:00:41.040 --> 0:00:44.479
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, we at the end, man, Yeah, this group project,

0:00:44.880 --> 0:00:45.800
<v Speaker 2>we pulled it together.

0:00:45.920 --> 0:00:46.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:00:46.520 --> 0:00:49.000
<v Speaker 5>It was an amazing season and a lot of traveling

0:00:49.080 --> 0:00:51.560
<v Speaker 5>and meeting people where they were. Yeah, that was kind

0:00:51.560 --> 0:00:53.240
<v Speaker 5>of the of the season.

0:00:53.000 --> 0:00:55.560
<v Speaker 2>Right, yeah, man, way to bring that around. Yeah, we

0:00:55.680 --> 0:00:57.200
<v Speaker 2>met people definitely where they were.

0:00:57.280 --> 0:00:59.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. I don't think nobody met us halfway.

0:00:59.520 --> 0:01:02.720
<v Speaker 2>Now we met We might have met each other halfway

0:01:02.840 --> 0:01:04.119
<v Speaker 2>when we were going.

0:01:03.960 --> 0:01:07.160
<v Speaker 5>Like yeah, yeah, what was some of the your favorite

0:01:07.200 --> 0:01:09.800
<v Speaker 5>moments lessons something that you took away?

0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:11.320
<v Speaker 3>Oh, man, I think.

0:01:12.800 --> 0:01:15.640
<v Speaker 2>Some of the lessons that I definitely took away is

0:01:15.760 --> 0:01:20.280
<v Speaker 2>the cannabis industry in the weed business, right being two

0:01:20.360 --> 0:01:23.839
<v Speaker 2>separate things that operate off each other.

0:01:23.959 --> 0:01:26.920
<v Speaker 5>You know, the you know, regular market, the legal market

0:01:27.000 --> 0:01:31.039
<v Speaker 5>versus the black and the gray market, where because of

0:01:31.319 --> 0:01:34.640
<v Speaker 5>prohibition still because our federal government still schedules this as

0:01:34.640 --> 0:01:37.640
<v Speaker 5>a Schedule one drug, you know, you still have that

0:01:37.800 --> 0:01:42.839
<v Speaker 5>proliferation because you know, local laws and state laws cap

0:01:43.080 --> 0:01:45.880
<v Speaker 5>this market and make it a second class industry. You

0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:49.520
<v Speaker 5>allow for people that were you know, selling illegally you know,

0:01:49.640 --> 0:01:52.040
<v Speaker 5>quote unquote you know, through the laws and system to

0:01:52.080 --> 0:01:54.280
<v Speaker 5>continue to happen. The thing that you are trying to prevent,

0:01:54.400 --> 0:01:57.120
<v Speaker 5>you are allowing to thrive because of these things. And

0:01:57.280 --> 0:01:59.440
<v Speaker 5>it's just something we saw every single time, and every

0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:02.800
<v Speaker 5>single one of our conversations was that part where it

0:02:02.880 --> 0:02:05.520
<v Speaker 5>was like, if it was only this, you could only

0:02:05.560 --> 0:02:07.480
<v Speaker 5>just put some money in a bank, if you can

0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:12.800
<v Speaker 5>only just like say like hey, and all the great

0:02:12.800 --> 0:02:15.600
<v Speaker 5>stuff that we have seen with legalization, the fact that

0:02:15.639 --> 0:02:18.320
<v Speaker 5>you can literally go into places and actually get t

0:02:18.480 --> 0:02:20.639
<v Speaker 5>I mean, so many people have access to it that

0:02:20.760 --> 0:02:22.760
<v Speaker 5>just did not before, and that's.

0:02:22.639 --> 0:02:23.359
<v Speaker 4>An amazing thing.

0:02:23.400 --> 0:02:27.200
<v Speaker 5>But we're still seeing so much of the same stuff

0:02:27.240 --> 0:02:31.240
<v Speaker 5>happened because of prohibition. Like we've said, like you know,

0:02:31.360 --> 0:02:34.560
<v Speaker 5>the fact that it is a second class industry, the

0:02:34.639 --> 0:02:35.560
<v Speaker 5>fact that you know.

0:02:36.360 --> 0:02:37.400
<v Speaker 4>It's a cash business.

0:02:37.440 --> 0:02:39.440
<v Speaker 5>So now people have to treat it in a different

0:02:39.480 --> 0:02:42.360
<v Speaker 5>way and it makes them more susceptible to being you know,

0:02:43.200 --> 0:02:45.880
<v Speaker 5>crimer and actually getting you know, it's all these things

0:02:45.880 --> 0:02:48.400
<v Speaker 5>that are happening, and we just need to kind of

0:02:48.440 --> 0:02:51.000
<v Speaker 5>look at that where hey, we haven't crossed the finish

0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:51.880
<v Speaker 5>line just yet.

0:02:52.160 --> 0:02:53.600
<v Speaker 3>It's still a lot of work to be done.

0:02:53.680 --> 0:02:56.400
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, And just kind of another takeaway I had from

0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:58.840
<v Speaker 5>the season, you know, kind of getting more on the

0:02:59.440 --> 0:03:02.840
<v Speaker 5>treatment and the things that we're seeing with psilocybin, and

0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:04.880
<v Speaker 5>you know, we talked a little bit about it last

0:03:04.960 --> 0:03:07.160
<v Speaker 5>you know season with you know, from the medical side,

0:03:07.160 --> 0:03:09.680
<v Speaker 5>from with on with Maps and you know, if if

0:03:09.720 --> 0:03:11.640
<v Speaker 5>you really want to look at some of the great

0:03:11.680 --> 0:03:14.799
<v Speaker 5>work that's going on with psilocybin research, with md m

0:03:14.840 --> 0:03:18.880
<v Speaker 5>A research just treating you know, addiction and PTSD and

0:03:18.919 --> 0:03:20.960
<v Speaker 5>all this stuff, go to Maps and see what they're doing.

0:03:21.800 --> 0:03:24.520
<v Speaker 5>We're seeing great progress there, but again, you know, the

0:03:24.600 --> 0:03:27.400
<v Speaker 5>FDA denies them from being you know, a treatment after

0:03:27.440 --> 0:03:29.600
<v Speaker 5>even seeing you know, the results that we've seen of.

0:03:29.880 --> 0:03:37.400
<v Speaker 2>Seeing people not having PTSD or AMIA requirements, not having

0:03:38.040 --> 0:03:39.760
<v Speaker 2>to deal with depression.

0:03:39.360 --> 0:03:41.880
<v Speaker 4>And it's it's it's pretty remarkable.

0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:43.760
<v Speaker 5>So we're seeing that one step forward kind of two

0:03:43.800 --> 0:03:46.800
<v Speaker 5>steps back, but they are taking we are taking steps

0:03:46.800 --> 0:03:49.520
<v Speaker 5>in the fact that we had such a diverse array

0:03:49.640 --> 0:03:53.680
<v Speaker 5>of people come on and talk about their own all.

0:03:53.800 --> 0:03:58.880
<v Speaker 2>Walks yeah, of life, all different backgrounds, all different stories,

0:03:58.960 --> 0:03:59.960
<v Speaker 2>all different.

0:03:59.640 --> 0:04:03.760
<v Speaker 5>Paths, right exactly, all different paths, and you could genuinely

0:04:03.920 --> 0:04:07.960
<v Speaker 5>hear their excitement and enthusiasm because these are people that

0:04:08.120 --> 0:04:11.240
<v Speaker 5>went through struggles and they almost want it. It's like

0:04:11.280 --> 0:04:14.160
<v Speaker 5>someone that's like, you know, got baptized just wants to scream.

0:04:14.320 --> 0:04:16.560
<v Speaker 5>You know, it's like singing from the mountaintop that like, hey,

0:04:16.800 --> 0:04:19.680
<v Speaker 5>other people that are hurting like me, like this could

0:04:19.720 --> 0:04:22.400
<v Speaker 5>be a solution. And you can hear like the excitement

0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:25.719
<v Speaker 5>and then also the the sadness from you know, someone

0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:27.840
<v Speaker 5>like Brent who's thinking of other people that didn't get

0:04:27.839 --> 0:04:30.320
<v Speaker 5>the chance to maybe do things, or you know, it's

0:04:30.360 --> 0:04:33.039
<v Speaker 5>just all these It was just a really kind of rollercoaster.

0:04:33.200 --> 0:04:33.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:04:33.440 --> 0:04:34.799
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, it was kind of a trip.

0:04:35.000 --> 0:04:36.760
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it was definitely a trip. Yeah.

0:04:36.839 --> 0:04:43.880
<v Speaker 2>In one also, Liz Karamus talking about CBD rain, yeah,

0:04:43.960 --> 0:04:48.280
<v Speaker 2>and the inflammation being able to be decreased by some

0:04:48.360 --> 0:04:51.200
<v Speaker 2>of these things, and yeah, man, all of that was interesting.

0:04:51.480 --> 0:04:53.479
<v Speaker 5>You know, military people don't like to go out on

0:04:53.480 --> 0:04:55.840
<v Speaker 5>a limb that often and kind of shout things. But

0:04:56.720 --> 0:04:59.080
<v Speaker 5>the people that are leading this a lot are you know,

0:04:59.480 --> 0:05:01.760
<v Speaker 5>not only former but active military members.

0:05:01.760 --> 0:05:03.080
<v Speaker 4>When they reel, they can speak up.

0:05:03.080 --> 0:05:04.560
<v Speaker 5>You know, Liz said it it's going to have to

0:05:04.560 --> 0:05:07.440
<v Speaker 5>come from the officers and the officer class to kind

0:05:07.440 --> 0:05:09.920
<v Speaker 5>of build that up. And I think it's something that's

0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:12.919
<v Speaker 5>gonna need to occur, Like you can't deny some of

0:05:12.920 --> 0:05:15.520
<v Speaker 5>these results at some point. And I just hope in

0:05:15.560 --> 0:05:17.960
<v Speaker 5>the next you know, year, so there is some movement

0:05:18.000 --> 0:05:19.520
<v Speaker 5>in you know a little bit at the federal level

0:05:19.520 --> 0:05:21.280
<v Speaker 5>to allow for the VA to do a little bit

0:05:21.320 --> 0:05:24.920
<v Speaker 5>more testing, a little bit more research, a little bit

0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:27.680
<v Speaker 5>more conversations that still hasn't passed.

0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:27.880
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:05:28.120 --> 0:05:30.000
<v Speaker 4>It's these types of things, so.

0:05:29.520 --> 0:05:33.239
<v Speaker 5>Solely but surely hopefully the research will kind of catch

0:05:33.320 --> 0:05:36.240
<v Speaker 5>up to our institutions. It takes a while sometimes, you know,

0:05:36.640 --> 0:05:38.960
<v Speaker 5>they're like the you know, setting their ways cross the

0:05:39.000 --> 0:05:39.440
<v Speaker 5>old man.

0:05:41.400 --> 0:05:45.400
<v Speaker 2>And then also, you know, is a lot of undoing.

0:05:45.560 --> 0:05:48.320
<v Speaker 2>It's a lot of unlearning that people have to do

0:05:48.760 --> 0:05:51.200
<v Speaker 2>because that's caused by the War on drug Yeah, they

0:05:51.240 --> 0:05:54.280
<v Speaker 2>painted it in there's light and it's hard to you know,

0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:56.200
<v Speaker 2>get get people to see it in another way.

0:05:56.360 --> 0:05:59.719
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and understanding that, you know, the skeptics aren't just

0:06:00.240 --> 0:06:02.160
<v Speaker 5>folks that are just saying this because they don't like

0:06:02.240 --> 0:06:04.080
<v Speaker 5>drugs or saying it's you know, it's people that dealt

0:06:04.120 --> 0:06:06.360
<v Speaker 5>with addiction. You know, with doctor Brent Smith who said,

0:06:06.440 --> 0:06:09.559
<v Speaker 5>you know, hey, it feels weird to me, like coming

0:06:09.560 --> 0:06:11.920
<v Speaker 5>from a place of addiction to think that this can

0:06:11.960 --> 0:06:14.599
<v Speaker 5>be helpful in that way when it's so And I

0:06:14.640 --> 0:06:16.800
<v Speaker 5>get that, and you know, but he still said, you know,

0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:18.840
<v Speaker 5>I'm open to these things. And I think that's again

0:06:18.920 --> 0:06:20.920
<v Speaker 5>we just have to be honest and open. That's another

0:06:20.960 --> 0:06:23.839
<v Speaker 5>thread line through this, just let's be honest about both

0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:26.039
<v Speaker 5>sides of everything. And I'm you know, that was a

0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:29.359
<v Speaker 5>big takeaway for me as well. With the therapeutists on

0:06:29.360 --> 0:06:31.320
<v Speaker 5>psychedelics and things like that. Again, it's kind of this

0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:33.480
<v Speaker 5>dominant that has to topple at the at the top,

0:06:33.560 --> 0:06:36.120
<v Speaker 5>at the tippy top too, at the federal government to

0:06:36.200 --> 0:06:39.279
<v Speaker 5>kind of let this go where we have these restrictions

0:06:39.360 --> 0:06:41.560
<v Speaker 5>like in the tax code that now like people can't

0:06:41.600 --> 0:06:44.200
<v Speaker 5>do you know, banking the way that they they're able to,

0:06:44.440 --> 0:06:47.839
<v Speaker 5>and you know, to allow for cannabis industry to thrive,

0:06:47.920 --> 0:06:51.200
<v Speaker 5>and you know, to have like research being stymied and

0:06:51.200 --> 0:06:54.960
<v Speaker 5>not allow for you know, psilocybin or MDMA to be

0:06:55.080 --> 0:06:57.719
<v Speaker 5>used as treatment you get into like you know, it

0:06:57.760 --> 0:07:00.360
<v Speaker 5>just takes all these big haunches. Then that's when insurance come.

0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:02.520
<v Speaker 5>You know, think about that, and we talked about that

0:07:02.600 --> 0:07:04.679
<v Speaker 5>so much with like veterans they can get how much

0:07:05.120 --> 0:07:08.600
<v Speaker 5>antidepressants and opi it's off of there, but they're not

0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:10.880
<v Speaker 5>able to get this because it can't be insured right now.

0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:14.200
<v Speaker 5>And so it's all these little things that hopefully will

0:07:14.240 --> 0:07:16.120
<v Speaker 5>start to slide away. And that's that's my hope for

0:07:16.160 --> 0:07:19.640
<v Speaker 5>the next year and five years. And yeah, we'll probably

0:07:19.680 --> 0:07:20.520
<v Speaker 5>be on season.

0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:21.920
<v Speaker 4>Thirty five drugs.

0:07:22.040 --> 0:07:24.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but I think we'll be closer because I know

0:07:24.840 --> 0:07:27.920
<v Speaker 2>we often talk about it's one step forward, two steps back.

0:07:28.160 --> 0:07:29.360
<v Speaker 3>What would you give this year?

0:07:29.360 --> 0:07:32.200
<v Speaker 2>Would you give it a step forward or would you

0:07:32.240 --> 0:07:33.000
<v Speaker 2>give it two back?

0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:37.600
<v Speaker 5>I'd say it was I'll do a boxing analogy where

0:07:37.600 --> 0:07:39.120
<v Speaker 5>I think it's one of those early rounds in a

0:07:39.120 --> 0:07:42.960
<v Speaker 5>big match, and both everyone's kind of feeling each other. Okay,

0:07:43.600 --> 0:07:45.160
<v Speaker 5>presidential election going.

0:07:44.960 --> 0:07:47.160
<v Speaker 3>On, only so much you can do there.

0:07:47.240 --> 0:07:49.600
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, when things get on the ballot with the presidential election,

0:07:49.680 --> 0:07:52.520
<v Speaker 5>it warps who's kind of voting, who's not, how much

0:07:52.560 --> 0:07:53.440
<v Speaker 5>attention those.

0:07:53.280 --> 0:07:55.880
<v Speaker 4>Issues get there, Just keep voting, right.

0:07:55.920 --> 0:07:58.360
<v Speaker 5>It just wasn't like a lot of stuff going on,

0:07:58.520 --> 0:08:00.640
<v Speaker 5>and that kind of happens in transition. But I do

0:08:00.680 --> 0:08:04.080
<v Speaker 5>think that fact that both parties have signaled at the

0:08:04.120 --> 0:08:05.880
<v Speaker 5>top of their level. You know, President Trump came out

0:08:05.920 --> 0:08:07.720
<v Speaker 5>and said he was going to vote for Amendment three

0:08:07.760 --> 0:08:10.840
<v Speaker 5>in Florida, which was, you know, going to legalize cannabis there,

0:08:11.400 --> 0:08:13.760
<v Speaker 5>and you know him and you know Vice President Vance

0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:15.360
<v Speaker 5>have both set you know, it kind of comes from

0:08:15.400 --> 0:08:18.119
<v Speaker 5>a place of we're throwing people in prison for something

0:08:18.160 --> 0:08:21.560
<v Speaker 5>that other people can profit from and this piecemeal thing

0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:23.000
<v Speaker 5>where you can go in one place another. I mean,

0:08:23.000 --> 0:08:25.480
<v Speaker 5>those are the things that he's saying, and it's a

0:08:25.560 --> 0:08:28.240
<v Speaker 5>kind of a noe duh, like it just doesn't make sense.

0:08:28.280 --> 0:08:31.080
<v Speaker 5>And so, you know, whatever you think of either side,

0:08:31.120 --> 0:08:33.440
<v Speaker 5>we're not trying to get publically here. It's just it's

0:08:33.760 --> 0:08:36.520
<v Speaker 5>very promising to hear that it's just never been that way.

0:08:36.559 --> 0:08:38.600
<v Speaker 5>And I think, you know, once you have a tipping

0:08:38.640 --> 0:08:40.720
<v Speaker 5>point a lot of this stuff, it can it can

0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:41.960
<v Speaker 5>start to tumble pretty quick.

0:08:42.559 --> 0:08:46.360
<v Speaker 2>Party's looking at it in a similar fashion, not maybe

0:08:46.400 --> 0:08:52.000
<v Speaker 2>the exact same view, but yeah, realizing and trying to

0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:53.560
<v Speaker 2>correct the course that we're going.

0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:53.880
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

0:08:53.920 --> 0:08:54.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:08:54.720 --> 0:08:56.960
<v Speaker 5>And the other thing to remember is like, not all

0:08:57.000 --> 0:09:00.480
<v Speaker 5>progress is always good progress, like we've seen, like you

0:09:00.559 --> 0:09:03.040
<v Speaker 5>have to have these things set up, you have to

0:09:03.080 --> 0:09:06.559
<v Speaker 5>be mindful of what all these causes and consequences can have,

0:09:06.640 --> 0:09:09.760
<v Speaker 5>and so the job's not done. Don't turn a blind

0:09:09.760 --> 0:09:13.440
<v Speaker 5>eye once you vote, like, understand what's happening in your community,

0:09:13.440 --> 0:09:16.040
<v Speaker 5>what's going on, how are these licenses getting divvied out.

0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:19.680
<v Speaker 4>All this type of stuff. There's just a lot lot.

0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:20.560
<v Speaker 3>Lots of the handle.

0:09:28.679 --> 0:09:30.679
<v Speaker 2>Okay, man, you know I got to come to you

0:09:31.000 --> 0:09:34.960
<v Speaker 2>for the call to action? Was the play? Was the plan?

0:09:35.880 --> 0:09:38.040
<v Speaker 2>If we're in a huddle, what do people need to do?

0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:40.360
<v Speaker 3>Man? While you've got them listening.

0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:42.320
<v Speaker 5>I think you know, sometimes we're just like, you know,

0:09:42.520 --> 0:09:45.000
<v Speaker 5>call your local congressmen, and that's all well and good,

0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:47.720
<v Speaker 5>but there are like I think, particularly with this issue,

0:09:48.080 --> 0:09:51.679
<v Speaker 5>you know, if things don't feel like overwhelming on other things,

0:09:51.720 --> 0:09:53.520
<v Speaker 5>because there obviously is policy stuff and you should and

0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:55.320
<v Speaker 5>you should be educated on this, and a lot of

0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:58.560
<v Speaker 5>stuff happens local, So your council meetings and all these

0:09:58.640 --> 0:10:01.120
<v Speaker 5>those are things that really matter a lot as well,

0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:03.040
<v Speaker 5>and so you should be mindful of what we need

0:10:03.080 --> 0:10:05.080
<v Speaker 5>to do at the federal level. Demand these things, but

0:10:05.120 --> 0:10:07.880
<v Speaker 5>really be honest and what's going on in your community

0:10:07.880 --> 0:10:11.280
<v Speaker 5>and how that's operating. But even getting closer to it,

0:10:11.440 --> 0:10:15.040
<v Speaker 5>like if you know your friend or family struggling with

0:10:15.120 --> 0:10:18.040
<v Speaker 5>something or suffering, you know, talk to them about you know,

0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:20.600
<v Speaker 5>some of this or share these experiences. Maybe it's like, hey,

0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:24.080
<v Speaker 5>I know you like Shine Down, I know you like Brothers,

0:10:24.200 --> 0:10:26.080
<v Speaker 5>I know you like Benny the Butch. Like listen to

0:10:26.120 --> 0:10:28.520
<v Speaker 5>what they're saying or like something like that maybe this

0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:31.440
<v Speaker 5>will help or some other information to give them, Like

0:10:31.480 --> 0:10:34.319
<v Speaker 5>you can actually really mean a lot to like your

0:10:34.360 --> 0:10:37.720
<v Speaker 5>small area and maybe you're influential on some folks around

0:10:37.760 --> 0:10:40.160
<v Speaker 5>you that could look up to you and saying like oh, hey,

0:10:40.240 --> 0:10:42.719
<v Speaker 5>this person's being you know, open and honest about their

0:10:42.760 --> 0:10:45.559
<v Speaker 5>experiences or what they heard. It's it can really mean

0:10:45.600 --> 0:10:47.480
<v Speaker 5>a lot. Like we saw that like it may have

0:10:47.559 --> 0:10:50.920
<v Speaker 5>saved you know, John Osborne's friend's life, having that conversation.

0:10:50.960 --> 0:10:51.920
<v Speaker 4>It done costs anything.

0:10:52.000 --> 0:10:54.839
<v Speaker 5>So that's you know, it's always like these are the laws,

0:10:54.840 --> 0:10:56.480
<v Speaker 5>these are the things, we've talked about them all year,

0:10:56.520 --> 0:10:59.559
<v Speaker 5>but like that could have a profound impact just kind

0:10:59.559 --> 0:11:01.560
<v Speaker 5>of having the discussions. And I know I am and

0:11:01.600 --> 0:11:04.040
<v Speaker 5>I've been even with people that's a little uncomfortable, you know,

0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:05.640
<v Speaker 5>with the old man, and.

0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:08.160
<v Speaker 4>Uh yeah, that can always be cop.

0:11:07.960 --> 0:11:11.439
<v Speaker 2>And yeah, yeah, yeah, And I think a lot of

0:11:11.480 --> 0:11:13.760
<v Speaker 2>times people throw their hands up like what can I do?

0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:17.440
<v Speaker 2>What can be done? And I think that's a very

0:11:17.640 --> 0:11:22.120
<v Speaker 2>actionable thing. It really done is the people you're around,

0:11:22.240 --> 0:11:25.960
<v Speaker 2>listening to them, offering them the resources that works for

0:11:26.040 --> 0:11:28.040
<v Speaker 2>you are what you found out there that may be

0:11:28.080 --> 0:11:32.200
<v Speaker 2>able to provide them insight. Not saying it's gonna be relief,

0:11:32.280 --> 0:11:35.280
<v Speaker 2>not saying it's gonna be the answer, not gonna say

0:11:35.280 --> 0:11:38.800
<v Speaker 2>that it's gonna work, but looking at stuff a different way,

0:11:39.400 --> 0:11:43.640
<v Speaker 2>hearing it from somebody who's respected, hearing it from somebody

0:11:43.640 --> 0:11:48.600
<v Speaker 2>who's in a field where they experience the very thing

0:11:48.679 --> 0:11:51.240
<v Speaker 2>that you're going through. That all can help. Man, So

0:11:51.720 --> 0:11:53.480
<v Speaker 2>be the change you know that you want to.

0:11:53.440 --> 0:11:54.520
<v Speaker 3>See and just.

0:11:56.080 --> 0:11:58.160
<v Speaker 2>When it does, like I said before, when it doesn't

0:11:58.160 --> 0:12:01.720
<v Speaker 2>cost nothing that yeah, you know what I'm saying, do

0:12:01.800 --> 0:12:04.520
<v Speaker 2>that if this person, if listening to this person is

0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:08.000
<v Speaker 2>going to be beneficial to them, if you got the time, why.

0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:08.760
<v Speaker 3>Would you not do that?

0:12:08.800 --> 0:12:09.280
<v Speaker 4>Exactly?

0:12:09.480 --> 0:12:12.720
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, you know these really are They're not even like

0:12:12.760 --> 0:12:16.719
<v Speaker 5>criminal justice issues. This is about like people's health. These

0:12:16.720 --> 0:12:22.880
<v Speaker 5>are like the issues that people pain, pain, health, mental health. Yeah,

0:12:23.080 --> 0:12:25.360
<v Speaker 5>just dealing with trauma and suffering. I mean, these are

0:12:25.360 --> 0:12:28.000
<v Speaker 5>the things that we talk about all day, every day,

0:12:28.040 --> 0:12:30.959
<v Speaker 5>and all we're saying is these are potential paths to

0:12:32.120 --> 0:12:34.640
<v Speaker 5>help with these types of things to have a better

0:12:34.679 --> 0:12:37.240
<v Speaker 5>health and overall well being. Because at the end of

0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:39.560
<v Speaker 5>the day, what we're doing right now, I don't think

0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:43.000
<v Speaker 5>anyone can say this is working. So let's just like

0:12:43.080 --> 0:12:45.280
<v Speaker 5>take a step back, cause I feel like a lot

0:12:45.280 --> 0:12:48.040
<v Speaker 5>of the time, the fighting the war on drugs, you're

0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:51.080
<v Speaker 5>on the defense of quite a bit, and so it

0:12:51.160 --> 0:12:54.600
<v Speaker 5>is kind of like flipping around, what are we defending.

0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:58.280
<v Speaker 5>More people are homeless and suffering from substance abuse disorders,

0:12:58.679 --> 0:13:01.000
<v Speaker 5>then more than ever, we're more people are dying from

0:13:01.000 --> 0:13:03.720
<v Speaker 5>overdose than ever. Drugs are cheaper, and stronger than ever.

0:13:03.800 --> 0:13:06.640
<v Speaker 5>What are you defending right now? At the very least,

0:13:06.640 --> 0:13:09.040
<v Speaker 5>can we have conversations about some of these other things

0:13:09.080 --> 0:13:12.280
<v Speaker 5>that are going on. Suicide race for veterans are skyrocketing,

0:13:12.400 --> 0:13:13.560
<v Speaker 5>Like can we have a conversation?

0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:13.760
<v Speaker 2>Right?

0:13:13.880 --> 0:13:14.640
<v Speaker 4>That's all we're saying.

0:13:14.800 --> 0:13:18.160
<v Speaker 2>Don't talk about what's convenient to your point, Yes, be

0:13:18.400 --> 0:13:23.040
<v Speaker 2>honest and talk about these things in their totality exactly.

0:13:23.200 --> 0:13:25.960
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, it's about giving those options and not making it

0:13:26.080 --> 0:13:30.760
<v Speaker 5>some risky proposition to am I being a criminal or

0:13:30.800 --> 0:13:32.920
<v Speaker 5>being something weird or trying to help myself?

0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:34.560
<v Speaker 4>I think a lot of people struggle with that.

0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:37.240
<v Speaker 2>One of the things that I think we really hammered

0:13:37.280 --> 0:13:40.840
<v Speaker 2>home on this season was the best people to talk

0:13:40.880 --> 0:13:43.839
<v Speaker 2>about these situations are the people that's closest to us, right,

0:13:43.960 --> 0:13:47.880
<v Speaker 2>And I mean we've got countless examples of that this season.

0:13:47.960 --> 0:13:48.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:13:48.280 --> 0:13:50.160
<v Speaker 4>John Osborne, Yeah, exactly.

0:13:50.000 --> 0:13:53.520
<v Speaker 2>Stopping his friend from a planned suicide, just saying, hey, man,

0:13:54.080 --> 0:13:54.840
<v Speaker 2>maybe try this.

0:13:55.000 --> 0:13:55.400
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:59.880
<v Speaker 2>Brent Smith, his manager, stepping in at a time where

0:14:00.120 --> 0:14:03.240
<v Speaker 2>you know, he could have been a sleazy manager, but

0:14:03.360 --> 0:14:05.680
<v Speaker 2>he saw something and was like, no, let's do this,

0:14:05.760 --> 0:14:08.800
<v Speaker 2>Let's handle this the right way. And so it's a

0:14:08.920 --> 0:14:12.360
<v Speaker 2>concerted effort. It's a community effort. You have to be

0:14:12.440 --> 0:14:15.760
<v Speaker 2>there for your people, and your people have to be

0:14:15.800 --> 0:14:18.120
<v Speaker 2>there for you. And that's the only way I think

0:14:18.360 --> 0:14:20.520
<v Speaker 2>this works. I think that's how we're supposed to live

0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:25.040
<v Speaker 2>as a society. I agree, that's how we maximize living

0:14:25.840 --> 0:14:27.320
<v Speaker 2>in this crazy world we live in.

0:14:27.720 --> 0:14:29.880
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and if you want to be active on the

0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:32.040
<v Speaker 5>policy side and really get informed, I mean, the biggest

0:14:32.080 --> 0:14:35.560
<v Speaker 5>dominoes are still at the federal level, and until they

0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:38.680
<v Speaker 5>speak on this and kind of allow for you know,

0:14:38.880 --> 0:14:41.800
<v Speaker 5>this enterprise to continue and to understand it's going to

0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:44.280
<v Speaker 5>continue to be this way, and so descheduling up there,

0:14:44.320 --> 0:14:47.320
<v Speaker 5>allowing for banks to be allowed to you know, work

0:14:47.360 --> 0:14:50.160
<v Speaker 5>with the industry and doing all these things, that's what

0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:52.920
<v Speaker 5>it's going to take. Until then, you're always going to

0:14:53.000 --> 0:14:56.360
<v Speaker 5>have that maybe we're about to do something elide because

0:14:56.440 --> 0:14:59.600
<v Speaker 5>technically you are know what your representative's thoughts are, like

0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:02.200
<v Speaker 5>email them, call them, like they do respond and like

0:15:02.240 --> 0:15:04.720
<v Speaker 5>I've worked in offices when a lot of people ask

0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:07.000
<v Speaker 5>about something, they have to say so you yeah, and

0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:10.360
<v Speaker 5>so it really does matter, and that's what it's going

0:15:10.400 --> 0:15:12.640
<v Speaker 5>to take to really kind of see all these things,

0:15:12.720 --> 0:15:14.360
<v Speaker 5>you know, come to fruition. And so there's a lot

0:15:14.360 --> 0:15:16.400
<v Speaker 5>of work still at the local and state, but if

0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:18.520
<v Speaker 5>you get that one tipping point to start to come down,

0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:21.600
<v Speaker 5>it'd be incredibly impactful and we would see a lot

0:15:21.680 --> 0:15:24.360
<v Speaker 5>of positive benefits and a lot of the complications that

0:15:24.400 --> 0:15:27.000
<v Speaker 5>we see with this kind of piecemeal system. Kind of

0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:29.360
<v Speaker 5>go away and share those stories.

0:15:29.520 --> 0:15:30.680
<v Speaker 3>Use this podcast.

0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:33.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, use your personal experience if you got it, But

0:15:33.720 --> 0:15:36.320
<v Speaker 2>if you don't, you got a resource right here with.

0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:38.680
<v Speaker 5>Us, because stories matter, and it brings a face to

0:15:38.720 --> 0:15:41.080
<v Speaker 5>it when you're just kind of saying, you know, hey,

0:15:41.120 --> 0:15:43.800
<v Speaker 5>these are the statistics and all these things.

0:15:44.080 --> 0:15:46.600
<v Speaker 4>You know, it makes it real. It really does.

0:15:46.760 --> 0:15:51.520
<v Speaker 2>Sometimes the language we use it just dehumanizes people and

0:15:51.560 --> 0:15:54.800
<v Speaker 2>it quantifies them. It makes them a thing and not

0:15:54.840 --> 0:15:59.480
<v Speaker 2>a person, and it's hard to separate the person from

0:15:59.600 --> 0:15:59.960
<v Speaker 2>a person.

0:16:00.400 --> 0:16:01.160
<v Speaker 4>Story agreed.

0:16:02.000 --> 0:16:05.880
<v Speaker 2>Anybody that's skeptical or not sure where it's going. If

0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:07.920
<v Speaker 2>you didn't if you can't look at some of these

0:16:07.960 --> 0:16:14.840
<v Speaker 2>studies with psilocybin and what they're doing with PTSD and veterans,

0:16:14.880 --> 0:16:19.640
<v Speaker 2>if you can't look at lizit story about the brain

0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:24.440
<v Speaker 2>decreasing inflammation, if you can't listen to John Osborne talk

0:16:24.440 --> 0:16:28.280
<v Speaker 2>about the neuroplasticity and if I think that's the biggest

0:16:28.360 --> 0:16:33.880
<v Speaker 2>takeaway is these things are working for some people. You know,

0:16:34.480 --> 0:16:39.520
<v Speaker 2>these things are beneficial to some people. So what knowledge

0:16:39.560 --> 0:16:43.480
<v Speaker 2>do you have that's making you push back against the

0:16:43.520 --> 0:16:44.680
<v Speaker 2>information that's out there.

0:16:44.800 --> 0:16:46.880
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, just be a little bit more understanding of other

0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:49.400
<v Speaker 5>people's stories and how that they came to it, and

0:16:49.960 --> 0:16:52.760
<v Speaker 5>not think that it's some excuse just to get high.

0:16:52.800 --> 0:16:55.360
<v Speaker 5>It's actually medicine is actually trying to help other people.

0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:57.440
<v Speaker 5>So even if you're not going to go down a

0:16:57.440 --> 0:16:59.160
<v Speaker 5>path of this or even look at it, just be

0:16:59.640 --> 0:17:03.240
<v Speaker 5>more ethetic and understanding of other people's you know, successes

0:17:03.360 --> 0:17:05.399
<v Speaker 5>or benefits that they've had from some things that we

0:17:05.480 --> 0:17:06.000
<v Speaker 5>talked about.

0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:08.359
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, we talked to a lot of skeptics that kind.

0:17:08.200 --> 0:17:10.960
<v Speaker 5>Of when yeah and experiment and did something else or

0:17:11.240 --> 0:17:12.920
<v Speaker 5>have been more open about it. And I think that's

0:17:13.119 --> 0:17:15.760
<v Speaker 5>really important to show that you.

0:17:15.800 --> 0:17:18.919
<v Speaker 2>Got to be hoping, Hey, this has been great. Yeah,

0:17:19.160 --> 0:17:23.480
<v Speaker 2>great season. I hope you all, you know, benefited from this.

0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:27.680
<v Speaker 2>I hope these stories, you know, allow you to make

0:17:27.720 --> 0:17:30.320
<v Speaker 2>an impact on the people that you care about, the

0:17:30.359 --> 0:17:31.159
<v Speaker 2>people around you.

0:17:31.960 --> 0:17:35.080
<v Speaker 5>We appreciated season two. Thank you all again for listening.

0:17:35.359 --> 0:17:36.399
<v Speaker 5>I'm Greg Laude.

0:17:36.240 --> 0:17:38.520
<v Speaker 2>And I'm Clayton English and this has been The War

0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:41.240
<v Speaker 2>on Drugs podcast Season two, Take.

0:17:41.119 --> 0:17:44.320
<v Speaker 1>Care the War on Drugs is a production of Lava

0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:47.800
<v Speaker 1>for Good and Stand Together Music and association with Signal

0:17:47.840 --> 0:17:51.680
<v Speaker 1>Company Number one. Stand Together Music unites musicians and their

0:17:51.720 --> 0:17:55.000
<v Speaker 1>teams with proven change makers to co create solutions to

0:17:55.080 --> 0:17:57.680
<v Speaker 1>some of the most pressing issues in our country, including

0:17:57.720 --> 0:18:03.280
<v Speaker 1>criminal justice, reform, addiction, recover mental health, education, free speech,

0:18:03.600 --> 0:18:07.000
<v Speaker 1>and ending the War on drugs. Learn more at Standogether

0:18:07.160 --> 0:18:10.520
<v Speaker 1>Music dot org. Be sure to follow Lava for Good

0:18:10.560 --> 0:18:14.919
<v Speaker 1>on Instagram, Facebook and threads at Lava for Good. You

0:18:14.920 --> 0:18:18.760
<v Speaker 1>can follow Clayton English on Instagram, n X at Clayton English,

0:18:18.800 --> 0:18:21.399
<v Speaker 1>and you can follow Greig Laude on Instagram and on

0:18:21.680 --> 0:18:26.440
<v Speaker 1>X at Greg Latt. Executive producers Jason Flamm, Jeff Kempler,

0:18:26.760 --> 0:18:31.400
<v Speaker 1>Kevin Wartis, and Collette Wintraub. Senior producers Kelsey Stenecker, Zak

0:18:31.480 --> 0:18:35.200
<v Speaker 1>Huffman and Nick Stump. Post production by ten ten, Audio

0:18:35.640 --> 0:18:39.280
<v Speaker 1>talent booking by Dan Resnik res Entertainment Head of Marketing

0:18:39.320 --> 0:18:44.879
<v Speaker 1>and Operations, Jeff Cleiburn, Social Media Director, Ismadi Gudarama, Social

0:18:44.920 --> 0:18:48.520
<v Speaker 1>media manager Sarah Gibbons and art director Andrew Nelson.