1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,320 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,840 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to Casual Friday. 3 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 1: I'm Holly Fry. I'm Tracy V. Wilson. One of the 4 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,279 Speaker 1: things we talked about this week was the history of Bondsai. Yeah, 5 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:24,120 Speaker 1: it has been on your list for so long it um. 6 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: I will also confess to you that um, as part 7 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:31,200 Speaker 1: of doing this episode, you know you get maybe you don't, 8 00:00:31,400 --> 00:00:33,720 Speaker 1: you know how I get obsessed with some of the 9 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 1: stuff we briess. I may have reached out to of 10 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 1: bond psai um Nursery so I can get some of 11 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:45,560 Speaker 1: my own to start, just a couple. I'm not gonna 12 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:47,960 Speaker 1: be too foolish. I have that bad problem where I 13 00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 1: get interested in something and then I ordered twenty two 14 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: of that thing because I'm overenthusiastic. And then I'm like, oh, 15 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 1: this is more than I can handle. I didn't this time. Yeah, 16 00:00:57,880 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 1: just too bad too. Yeah, I gotta come up with 17 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:06,360 Speaker 1: good names for him. Yeah. I will keep you posted 18 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 1: on their uh their success. I fear I have a 19 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:13,679 Speaker 1: mixed thumb when it comes to gardening in general. Right, 20 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 1: Like I can grow a rose like nobody's business. I 21 00:01:16,600 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 1: don't know why. It's really just blind luck uh and 22 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 1: I do pretty well with hardy hybiscus, but there are 23 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 1: other plants that just are like goodbye and I can't 24 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 1: save them, and it breaks my heart. So hopefully my 25 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 1: bonds I will survive. Um. I discovered while doing this 26 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: episode also like one of the greatest coping mechanisms I 27 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 1: could ever ever envision, which is to go on YouTube 28 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:45,240 Speaker 1: and watch long videos of people clipping their bonds eye 29 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:51,520 Speaker 1: um or like if you see a bondsay master, who 30 00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 1: will talk through like how they're caring for that. It's 31 00:01:55,280 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 1: so soothing. It's the best. I'm not a person that's 32 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:03,400 Speaker 1: great at met it paian Um, I'm not great at 33 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: being still I'm not so for me, this is kind 34 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:09,040 Speaker 1: of like a good bridge to that kind of mental 35 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:11,720 Speaker 1: state where I'm just like, I suddenly find myself just 36 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:17,160 Speaker 1: completely enraptured quietly watching these videos for long periods of time. 37 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: That's cool. I quite enjoyed it. I feel like I 38 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 1: should also mention the other thing that comes to my 39 00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 1: mind every time the subject of Bond's eye comes up, 40 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 1: which is not a good representation of it. There used 41 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 1: to be an animated series called Home Movies, which was 42 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,720 Speaker 1: by Lauren Bouchard and UH it starred Brendan Small. Lauren Buchard, 43 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 1: in case you don't know, is the creator of Bob's 44 00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: Burgers as well and now Central Park, UM, which are 45 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: also shows that I love. And there was a character 46 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: on Home Movies called Coach McGirk that was voiced by 47 00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:54,240 Speaker 1: John Benjamin and he was like this kind of big 48 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: train wreck of a soccer coach the Selementary School. But 49 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 1: in one episode, with absolutely no context, one of the 50 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:06,519 Speaker 1: kids goes to his house and it's a very rudimentary 51 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:11,600 Speaker 1: animation style and he's just sitting there with a bunch 52 00:03:11,639 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 1: of bonds eye trees, cultivating them and it's so out 53 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: of character and so completely random for that character to 54 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 1: be doing, and they never explained it. I just loved it. Um. 55 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,360 Speaker 1: There was another popular culture thing that came up in 56 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 1: a lot of the discussions that I read both online 57 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:37,200 Speaker 1: and in books about how Bonds I became popularized in 58 00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: uh in American pop culture. Can you guess what it is? 59 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 1: The Karate Kid. Yes, this is where I confess that 60 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:51,559 Speaker 1: I have never seen any of those movies. Yeah, I 61 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 1: have definitely seen the first one, UM and I I 62 00:03:56,160 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: don't know if I've seen other ones, but I can 63 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 1: visualize a scene of taking care of bonsai, and that 64 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 1: like Karate Kid one, I was just known as the 65 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 1: Karate Kid when it originally came out. There was no 66 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 1: one after it. Obviously. Yes, there were actually a lot 67 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:20,719 Speaker 1: of bonsai apparently those movies, but I having never seen them, 68 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 1: even though I am in exactly the right age range 69 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 1: to have watched them when they came out. I think 70 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:29,440 Speaker 1: that was probably one of those many instances where I 71 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:32,920 Speaker 1: was too um it was too cool for popular culture, 72 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 1: its mainstream for me. I'm gonna go do you know, 73 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 1: start trying to read in Parsterida, which I never really 74 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 1: got very good at. I'm gonna go watch and alue, 75 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,479 Speaker 1: you guys watched Karate Kids. So pretentious on my part, 76 00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:52,080 Speaker 1: so pretentious, rivaling me for some pretentiousness, but most of 77 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:55,719 Speaker 1: my pretentiousness was like post college. Oh no, I got 78 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 1: that stuff out of the way early, and then I 79 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 1: got to my just free to be stage earlier than 80 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:05,159 Speaker 1: most people. Yeah. Uh yeah, but it's interesting. I have 81 00:05:05,279 --> 00:05:11,919 Speaker 1: always loved the concept of bonsai, but admittedly, uh through 82 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:17,919 Speaker 1: that very very uninformed sort of pop culture angle on it. 83 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 1: So as I have gotten older and have done more 84 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:24,120 Speaker 1: reading on plant life and gardening in general and started 85 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 1: to really appreciate just how much effort goes into the 86 00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 1: design and creation of these pieces. Um, I realized, one 87 00:05:32,040 --> 00:05:34,880 Speaker 1: it's amazing, and two it's something I probably would never 88 00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:39,919 Speaker 1: have the focus to achieve. Yeah. Yeah, how that potato 89 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:44,039 Speaker 1: bonds I come out? Yeah, like you, I have mixed 90 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:49,160 Speaker 1: results trying to grow plants of any sort. Um, So 91 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 1: I've never tried anything with with bonds eye specifically, not 92 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:57,400 Speaker 1: even the potato thing, which even as a child, I 93 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:02,920 Speaker 1: was like, I think this misses the point. Yeah. I 94 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 1: feel like my mom, who similarly had sort of a 95 00:06:08,120 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 1: flighty attention span and would get obsessed with things for 96 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:14,080 Speaker 1: about twelve minutes at a time. I feel like she 97 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:19,680 Speaker 1: purchased one of those like really fakey bonsai from like 98 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 1: a craft store at one point that had like a 99 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 1: lot of things glued into it, and I'm not even 100 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:27,920 Speaker 1: sure if it was alive or not. I think probably 101 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:33,120 Speaker 1: a lot of kids in the US have a similar 102 00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 1: experience in terms of their exposure if they're in our 103 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,479 Speaker 1: age range to bonsai in like the seventies and eighties. 104 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: R One of the things we talked about this week 105 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 1: was Abraham Flexner and the Flextioner Report. Yeah. Yeah, I 106 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:49,800 Speaker 1: was glad when you brought this up, because when you did, 107 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:53,719 Speaker 1: I had just listened to the saw Bones episode UM 108 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 1: that I'd like mentioned in in the podcast, which mentions 109 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:02,440 Speaker 1: that efforts to reform our medical education generally lead to 110 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:06,159 Speaker 1: schools for black students being closed. That, like I said 111 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:08,280 Speaker 1: in the episode, like that episode is really worth listening 112 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: to for a different angle on the same topics. Yeah, 113 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 1: it's um. As I said in the episode, it's I 114 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 1: have such a complicated relationship with this material because I 115 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 1: want to support the idea of educational reform. And certainly 116 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:29,840 Speaker 1: there were a lot of really really not high minded 117 00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 1: medical schools opening in the US that basically were like 118 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:36,080 Speaker 1: can you write a check, please come in uh, And 119 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 1: those obviously needed to not be operating or not operating 120 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:43,400 Speaker 1: the way they were. But this did create such a 121 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: long term ripple effect, uh for the black community that 122 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 1: it's really really um, sort of difficult to still think 123 00:07:56,680 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: like that was a great thing. Um. It's in interesting 124 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 1: to think about how much power that one report had 125 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: that like half of the medical schools in the country 126 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:10,000 Speaker 1: had closed within ten years of its publication. Yeah. Um, 127 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 1: that is a lot of a lot of power for 128 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: someone who was not from the medical community to have wielded. Yeah. 129 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:19,120 Speaker 1: That's one of the things that was mentioned in the 130 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:21,960 Speaker 1: episode was that because he had an outsider his perspective, 131 00:08:22,080 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 1: he was able to look at everything without a lot 132 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 1: of preconceptions. Um. And it's like, there's there's truth to that, 133 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:32,160 Speaker 1: but that also means that he didn't have experience. Yeah, 134 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:37,160 Speaker 1: he didn't have contexts. Yeah. Um, it's like it's a 135 00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:41,679 Speaker 1: fair point that that medical schools needed to be reformed 136 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 1: and that there wasn't a lot of standardization and stuff 137 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 1: like that, but like like not really comprehending that the 138 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:52,679 Speaker 1: bar was being set that most schools wouldn't be able 139 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,600 Speaker 1: to reach. Yeah, it was definitely a part of it, 140 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:58,440 Speaker 1: and that disproportionately the school is not able to reach 141 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:01,200 Speaker 1: that bar. We're going to be the only schools that 142 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:04,400 Speaker 1: were really open to black doctors. Yeah, And it's one 143 00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:08,319 Speaker 1: of those things that, um, you know, when you think 144 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 1: about the long term ramifications on the health of black 145 00:09:14,120 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 1: people in the United States, like this literally was part 146 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 1: of a problem that already existed but only got worse, 147 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:26,400 Speaker 1: where there was not trust in the medical system, and 148 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 1: as a consequence, there have been a lot of people 149 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 1: that do not see a doctor when they need one, 150 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:38,440 Speaker 1: Like there is a just general downgrading of health for 151 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 1: that entire black community that happens as a consequence of 152 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:47,319 Speaker 1: this one report coming out. Um that literally today is 153 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: still a problem that we're dealing with. This isn't even 154 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 1: though it is history. It is history that is still 155 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: impacting people, whether they realize it or not, um, which 156 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:00,120 Speaker 1: is what makes it so troubling and why the we 157 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 1: need to be very mindful of looking at moments like 158 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:06,319 Speaker 1: this and recognizing like the cause and effect where we're 159 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:09,080 Speaker 1: still in the effect part of something even though we 160 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:13,160 Speaker 1: may consider it settled history. Yeah, for sure, It's still 161 00:10:13,200 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 1: just kind of baffles me that he thought that, like 162 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: any any black person that wanted a medical education could 163 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:23,720 Speaker 1: go to one of two schools, Like he didn't really 164 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:26,360 Speaker 1: think that. I mean, he we mentioned it a little bit, 165 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 1: like he recognized that this was a limitter, but to him, 166 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:32,960 Speaker 1: the tradeoff was that it would just be better to 167 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:37,720 Speaker 1: not have black doctors from those other schools then it 168 00:10:37,760 --> 00:10:41,559 Speaker 1: would be to have black doctors. You know what, I mean, like, 169 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,560 Speaker 1: to have poorly educated black doctors, in his opinion, was 170 00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 1: going to be a much worse problem than having no 171 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:51,959 Speaker 1: black doctors, which is a weird way to look at it. Um, 172 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:54,560 Speaker 1: just like you can't have any help because it's not 173 00:10:54,760 --> 00:11:00,640 Speaker 1: excellent help. Again, Ideally, sure, you want everyone who is 174 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:04,240 Speaker 1: looking after people's health to have been excellently educated. But 175 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 1: to say no, no resources are good enough, so you 176 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:10,840 Speaker 1: don't get any resources is a really really big problem. Yeah, 177 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:14,000 Speaker 1: it's it's the perfect being the enemy of the good. 178 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:18,400 Speaker 1: And yes, and he seemed to think that the bolstering 179 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:22,480 Speaker 1: of Howard and Maherry would have some sort of ripple 180 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:25,920 Speaker 1: effect where black education in the medical field would just 181 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:31,120 Speaker 1: get better everywhere, and that subsequent openings of universities would 182 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:33,720 Speaker 1: be at that level. And it's like you're presuming an 183 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:38,680 Speaker 1: awful lot on how this is going to work going forward. Um. Yeah, again, 184 00:11:39,679 --> 00:11:42,440 Speaker 1: all the blind spots of Abraham Flexner are a big, 185 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:50,079 Speaker 1: big problem. Stuff you missed in History Class is a 186 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:53,320 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from I 187 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:56,599 Speaker 1: Heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 188 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:58,760 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.