1 00:00:01,080 --> 00:00:04,600 Speaker 1: Hello, folks, it's Chuck here on a Saturday Select episode. 2 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:08,800 Speaker 1: This is from April seven, two fift and this is 3 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 1: a very sexy podcast episode called Polyamory Colin when too 4 00:00:15,160 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 1: just won't do. I think you know where this is 5 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: headed right now. Welcome to Stuff you should know, a 6 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: production of My Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hey, and 7 00:00:31,840 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles w Chuck, 8 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: Bryan Jerry's over there, and this is stuff you should 9 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:42,760 Speaker 1: not Let's try how all of our wives and girlfriends 10 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 1: are in the next room. All right, how are you doing? Man? 11 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:48,480 Speaker 1: I'm good. I found this topic to be super interesting. 12 00:00:49,320 --> 00:00:52,879 Speaker 1: And um, I should say up front that our our 13 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:56,560 Speaker 1: joky nous that we always include in every podcast almost 14 00:00:57,440 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: um is not meant to be disrespectful to anyone who 15 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:05,280 Speaker 1: was in a polyamorous relationship. Yeah, and we're not here 16 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:08,399 Speaker 1: to like just kind of look at your relationship from 17 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:10,760 Speaker 1: the outside and poke at it and make fun of 18 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 1: it or light of it. If you're enjoying yourself and 19 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:17,960 Speaker 1: everybody's on board and no one's being hurt, then we 20 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:22,959 Speaker 1: always say to each his own, but um, from the outside, Uh, 21 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 1: polyamory might seem like a very strange arrangement. Well, I 22 00:01:27,560 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: think to most people it seems like swinging. That's right, 23 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 1: but it's not. No, it is not a lot of things. 24 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:37,959 Speaker 1: It's not cheating, right, it's not swinging, right, it's not Um, 25 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: it's not polygamy. It's not what was the other one? Well, 26 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:48,840 Speaker 1: it's not a lot of things. Um, it's not dentistry right. Uh, Well, 27 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:53,040 Speaker 1: the point is that we should it's not promiscuous nous. 28 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:57,920 Speaker 1: So what it is actually from? And I had no idea. 29 00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:00,560 Speaker 1: I think my conception of polyamory was that it was 30 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 1: basically kind of swinging and it was based on it 31 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:08,519 Speaker 1: was I got the the root couple thing, but um 32 00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:10,919 Speaker 1: that it was mostly like a swinging kind of thing. 33 00:02:11,400 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 1: But from research, like I realized I was pretty far off. 34 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 1: Polyamory is in a very odd way a form of monogamy, 35 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,720 Speaker 1: but that it includes more than two people in this 36 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 1: monogamous relationship, while not necessarily monogamous either though, so because 37 00:02:31,280 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: there can be arrangements where you're allowed to go out 38 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,960 Speaker 1: and do what you want, kickens with people. So I 39 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 1: ran across something that that's technically considered monogamish. As Dan 40 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 1: Savage coined it. That sounds like a very new word. 41 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:47,400 Speaker 1: It is new, yeah, I mean Dan Savage coined it. Yeah, 42 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:49,880 Speaker 1: but which means that I'm probably not gonna put too 43 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: much greedence. But in the from what I understand and this, 44 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:58,639 Speaker 1: I got this from a polyamory site called um more 45 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 1: than two more than two Great Side Franklin vow is 46 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 1: how I'm pronouncing his last name Vox. And I'm not 47 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 1: kidding when I say it's a great side. If you 48 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:11,959 Speaker 1: are interested in exploring polyamory, it's super thorough and very 49 00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 1: very helpful, I would think, yeah, just by going through it. 50 00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:17,280 Speaker 1: And the impression that I got from him, from his 51 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:20,120 Speaker 1: f a Q at least, is that it is a 52 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 1: It's like the people in a polyamorous relationship are committed 53 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:27,880 Speaker 1: to one another, and that like they're rather in in 54 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:31,200 Speaker 1: the same way that two people a couple come together 55 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 1: to form a monogamous relationship. If you if you take 56 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 1: that bubble and add another person or two other people 57 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:42,440 Speaker 1: or something like that, but there's still that bubble of monogamy, 58 00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: of commitment of affection. UM that that is more close 59 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 1: to the the the definition of polyamory. Now in real life, 60 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:55,840 Speaker 1: I'm sure it's different, um, and that there are different 61 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: aspects to it or whatever. But supposedly that's what I gathered. 62 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: But I think, uh, polyamorous couples say, why would you 63 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: even use a word like monogamy when it means that 64 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:12,840 Speaker 1: polly means more than one word. Yeah, I think that's 65 00:04:12,920 --> 00:04:19,640 Speaker 1: that's the trip. And so Dan Savage come on monogamoush Yeah. Yeah, UM, 66 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:22,880 Speaker 1: I knew more about this UM just because there was 67 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 1: a show I don't know if it was HBO, it's 68 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 1: probably Cinemax that UM followed some polyamorous relationships, and so 69 00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 1: I knew that it was not just hey it's swinging 70 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 1: or hey I just want an open relationship. It's you know, 71 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:44,680 Speaker 1: I'm gonna tryad I've got a man and there's a 72 00:04:44,720 --> 00:04:47,240 Speaker 1: woman and there's another woman. Or in another case it 73 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:50,919 Speaker 1: was two couples, they all lived together, they were all 74 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:55,120 Speaker 1: in a committed relationship with one another. UM. I mean, 75 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 1: we'll talk about there is no standard for a polyamorous relationship. 76 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 1: It can really be anything you want that works for you. 77 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 1: Sometimes it's bisexual, sometimes it's not. Sometimes um, the two Uh, 78 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:12,320 Speaker 1: it's really I mean, we could go over millions in 79 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:15,000 Speaker 1: areas you really could. I was starting to break them 80 00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 1: all down, but it's like, you really is. Whatever you 81 00:05:17,320 --> 00:05:21,599 Speaker 1: can work out between yourselves is polyamory. But the point 82 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:25,440 Speaker 1: is is ummm, to maybe put it on less fine 83 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:28,480 Speaker 1: of a point, but to get a little closer potentially 84 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 1: to a correct definition. Polyamory is not monogamy because there's 85 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 1: more than two people, and it's not cheating because all 86 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,919 Speaker 1: of the people involved are on the on the same 87 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 1: page about what they're doing, what what they're doing, what 88 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 1: their partners are doing, what everybody's doing. Everyone's aware and consenting, 89 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:50,440 Speaker 1: that's right. So it's between those two things. So this 90 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: is the opposite of the E s P podcast where 91 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 1: apparently we never even said what e SP stood for. Yeah, 92 00:05:57,720 --> 00:06:00,400 Speaker 1: a couple of people like, we're like, hey, catch what 93 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 1: ESP stands for? Can you tell us? And I'm like, well, 94 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: go listen again, and enough people said it that I 95 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 1: was like, oh, extrasensory perception, by the way, And then 96 00:06:11,040 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 1: we have just now defined polyamory for the last ten minutes, 97 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:16,360 Speaker 1: so I think we're covered. I think we finally landed 98 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:19,839 Speaker 1: on it. Though. Uh yeah, it's a very fascinating thing, 99 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: and um here's how it works. Well, Uh, I think 100 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:30,440 Speaker 1: the let's talk about why people are polyamorous. Right, So 101 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:34,280 Speaker 1: people who are polyamorous probably tend to think that monogamy 102 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:38,280 Speaker 1: is not for them. And if you're speaking from a 103 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:45,160 Speaker 1: like a evolutionary perspective, monogamy is kind of a puzzlement. Yes, 104 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: should we talk about that. Yeah, So monogamy looking through 105 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 1: the lens of natural selection doesn't make sense evolutionarily because 106 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:58,919 Speaker 1: it lowers a mail's ability to um, It lowers his 107 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 1: number of opportunity at ease to carry on his genetic 108 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 1: line and there for the species, right exactly. Yeah, And 109 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:10,440 Speaker 1: it was long thought by some that um it was 110 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:14,440 Speaker 1: monogamy came about so males could assist in the raising 111 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:18,160 Speaker 1: of the young. Um. But there are some new theories 112 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: now that UM make that seem a little less likely, 113 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 1: or actually a lot less likely. Um. And ironically, well 114 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: not ironically, but coincidentally they were both published. They were 115 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 1: both published around the same time, these two new theories, 116 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,080 Speaker 1: they came out at the and enough time to really 117 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:40,400 Speaker 1: kind of compete with one another. Yeah, because you know, 118 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:44,120 Speaker 1: when you look around the the animal kingdom, among non 119 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:49,160 Speaker 1: avian there are more birds that are supposedly cockroaches that 120 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 1: are monogamous. But if you if you rule out the 121 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 1: birds and the cockroaches, specifically, mammals too. Yeah, about five 122 00:07:55,600 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 1: percent of the four thousand mammal species, give or take UM, 123 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:04,560 Speaker 1: only about five are monogamous or mate for life. Right, 124 00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:09,160 Speaker 1: And so again, if you are strictly looking at it 125 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 1: from the selfish gene theory, like the whole point would 126 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:15,880 Speaker 1: be to run around and copulate with as many females 127 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 1: as you possibly can so that you can have more 128 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 1: and more chances of spreading your genetic line and then, 129 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:24,600 Speaker 1: like you said, hence carry on the species. So to 130 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 1: not do that, to just couple with one other person 131 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:32,079 Speaker 1: and and have maybe a few kids rather than thirty 132 00:08:32,120 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 1: with a bunch of different males and females. Right again, 133 00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: it doesn't really kind of make sense. So they've tried 134 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:40,720 Speaker 1: to explain this, and there are some theories, like you 135 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:45,319 Speaker 1: were saying, one of them is that UM, if you 136 00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:49,560 Speaker 1: are a rival male, one of the things you have 137 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:54,559 Speaker 1: to do to get with another female. I think that's 138 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:57,199 Speaker 1: what biologists call it getting with UM you have to 139 00:08:57,280 --> 00:09:01,239 Speaker 1: kill her offspring because while she's nursing, she can't ovulate, 140 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:05,560 Speaker 1: and therefore you can't reproduce with her, but kill her kids. 141 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 1: She's gonna stop nursing. She'll be sad. But then you 142 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:13,280 Speaker 1: guys can have your own offspring. If you are a 143 00:09:13,320 --> 00:09:18,480 Speaker 1: male that's staying behind after you reproduce with a female, 144 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 1: then you have the chance to defend your offspring from 145 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 1: being killed by arrival males. Explanation from monogamy yep, And 146 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: that was in the proceedings of the National Academy of 147 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 1: Sciences and UM. They found that out by studying behaviors 148 00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:36,480 Speaker 1: of two d and thirty primate species. Uh. And they 149 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:38,440 Speaker 1: felt so good about it that the guy who ran 150 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 1: the study said, this is it. We now finally know 151 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,240 Speaker 1: for sure. But that's not necessarily true because there's another 152 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: really great theory where they actually published in the journal 153 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:55,360 Speaker 1: Science and studied mammals, which is way more than the 154 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:59,439 Speaker 1: other study. H. D. H. Lucas and Tim kluten Brock 155 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:05,240 Speaker 1: of Cambridge University, and they said, Uh, it's really about 156 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:12,199 Speaker 1: low density and females. It's that simple, Like when there 157 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:15,560 Speaker 1: aren't many females, that's where monogamy happens, right when they're 158 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,679 Speaker 1: spread out, because they beat up on each other when 159 00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 1: they're in the same place. Females UM, so they have 160 00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:25,199 Speaker 1: to spread out geographically. Well, if you're a guy who's 161 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:27,920 Speaker 1: just running from female the female, the female, you don't 162 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 1: know what she's doing while you're not around, so you 163 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: don't know whether those kids are yours or not. So 164 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,400 Speaker 1: the best way to make sure that they're your kids 165 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:40,120 Speaker 1: is to hang around and be monogamous. That's right. So 166 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:45,800 Speaker 1: it's it's really similar to the other theory, the you're 167 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:48,640 Speaker 1: staying around to defend the kids, and this one it's 168 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:51,880 Speaker 1: a little less magnanimous. You're staying around to make sure 169 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 1: that the female doesn't run around on you. Right. But 170 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:57,800 Speaker 1: then I saw a third theory that also makes sense 171 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:03,120 Speaker 1: to UM, and that is the the idea of males 172 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: staying around to help raise kids was a strategy developed 173 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:11,640 Speaker 1: by lesser males in the primate kingdom. So like the 174 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 1: alpha male, the top guys, they're having no trouble, they 175 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: can go wherever they want, they're getting plenty of action, right, 176 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 1: But less nestman is like, hey, I can care for 177 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 1: the kids exactly, and that that's a strategy that caught 178 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: the attention of females who otherwise wouldn't have made it 179 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 1: with these guys. Because they're less nestment. And uh instead said, yeah, 180 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:34,719 Speaker 1: he's a dork. I can't stand his bow tie in 181 00:11:34,760 --> 00:11:38,240 Speaker 1: his shortsleeve shirt, but he does do a pretty good 182 00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 1: job with the kids. So I'm going to be monogamous 183 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:44,439 Speaker 1: with this guy. So three pretty good theories to explain monogamy. 184 00:11:44,760 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: None of them hold water for polyamorous No, and and 185 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:51,680 Speaker 1: everyone under the age of thirty five is now looking 186 00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 1: up who less neestment is? It was? That was a 187 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 1: great reference, man, Thanks, I just popped up um. Alright, 188 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 1: So the benefits, I believe, is what we were talking 189 00:12:02,040 --> 00:12:04,880 Speaker 1: about before we delved into the theory. And I've always 190 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:07,199 Speaker 1: said monogamy too is not a natural thing, and that 191 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:11,199 Speaker 1: the reward of staying with one person is partly because 192 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:14,240 Speaker 1: of that. You know, you, it's not a natural thing. 193 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,360 Speaker 1: You sacrifice something in some way by being with someone, 194 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 1: but the payoff is rich. That is wise words, Chuck. 195 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:24,120 Speaker 1: So we'll see if I end up married in twenty years, 196 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:28,040 Speaker 1: I'll confirm all this. Just kidding, of course, I will 197 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 1: be um. All right, So let's talk about the benefits. 198 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:36,320 Speaker 1: It is not just about um having sex with more 199 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 1: than one person. No, It's definitely part of it. It 200 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:42,240 Speaker 1: is part of it, UM, But it is also about 201 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:47,080 Speaker 1: um support in a greater you know, it takes a village, 202 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 1: they say, So if you have a larger village, then 203 00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 1: you're gonna have more support and care and love and 204 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:56,960 Speaker 1: emotional support. UM. All that stuff right, exactly. And it's 205 00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 1: not polyamorous relationship or group doesn't necessarily have sex with 206 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:08,719 Speaker 1: one another everybody. UM. Sex is a big component of it. 207 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 1: But you also have what are called poly effective relationships 208 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:16,440 Speaker 1: where like, let's say you have what you call it 209 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:20,440 Speaker 1: a triad. Is that a poly um? Yeah, right, but 210 00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 1: that's what polyamorous call it. UM. So let's say you 211 00:13:23,679 --> 00:13:26,960 Speaker 1: have a triad where neither of the of two women 212 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 1: and a guy, and neither of the women are bisexual, 213 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:34,160 Speaker 1: but they're still in a polyamorous relationship. They would be 214 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:37,640 Speaker 1: polly effective, like they have an emotional connection to one 215 00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 1: another like a couple would, but they're not sexually involved 216 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:45,160 Speaker 1: with one another. They're poly effective. That's another component of 217 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 1: a polyamorous relationship. So the whole thing is not just 218 00:13:48,320 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 1: satisfying your every sexual need with a bunch of different people. UM. 219 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:57,200 Speaker 1: It's also that I think they believe that you have 220 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:01,199 Speaker 1: a lot of different needs that one person can't necessarily 221 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:05,439 Speaker 1: satisfy beyond sex as well. It can be cultural interests, 222 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 1: it can be past times, it can be what have you. 223 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:13,000 Speaker 1: And so the idea behind polyamory is you find those 224 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 1: people in your life who combined make that single ideal person, yeah, 225 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:21,000 Speaker 1: rather than placing all that on one single person for 226 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 1: better for worse. Yeah. I looked at an example on 227 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 1: the what was it two for one, no two or 228 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 1: more more than more than two, more than two, more 229 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:35,080 Speaker 1: than more than two dot com? I looked at one. 230 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: They have a lot of just stories and examples of people, 231 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:41,320 Speaker 1: like real stories. And this one lady UM was married 232 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 1: to a guy who quite simply was not into a 233 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,760 Speaker 1: lot of the things she was into. Um, she was 234 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:50,600 Speaker 1: big into the theater, I think, in museums. Her husband 235 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:54,440 Speaker 1: didn't like that. Uh. They developed into a polyamorous relationship, 236 00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,000 Speaker 1: and she had another man that was really into that stuff, 237 00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:01,200 Speaker 1: an old high school boyfriend I think, and he uh 238 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 1: took up with another woman who had similar interest as him, 239 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:07,600 Speaker 1: and they all worked it out. And you know, people say, well, 240 00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:10,040 Speaker 1: why don't you just leave the husband then? Who you 241 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:11,480 Speaker 1: don't have these things in common within go with the 242 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 1: old high school boyfriend. That's a neat story. She was like, well, 243 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:17,120 Speaker 1: because he's really needy and my husband isn't and we 244 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:20,840 Speaker 1: have a lot of great stuff. Uh So it is literally, 245 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:24,840 Speaker 1: like you said, satisfying all my needs through multiple people, 246 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 1: because who can expect one person to be that soul 247 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 1: mate that gives you everything you need? And these suckers 248 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 1: who are in monogamous marriages are just uh, sacrificing certain 249 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:37,960 Speaker 1: parts of their life, like going to museums or whatever. 250 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:40,760 Speaker 1: If it was this lady, So everybody, we're about to 251 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 1: satisfy all of your needs with this commercial break. Hey 252 00:15:44,000 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 1: now all right and we're back. So chuck um. We 253 00:16:11,760 --> 00:16:17,000 Speaker 1: were talking about why people do polyamory, Right, do polyamory? 254 00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:22,960 Speaker 1: Let's talk about how polyamory actually works? Yeah, I mean 255 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:27,480 Speaker 1: anyone in a marriage that's you know, things get more 256 00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:30,240 Speaker 1: complicated as you get older. So I don't mean to 257 00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:32,880 Speaker 1: talk down to people in your twenties, but relationships get 258 00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 1: a little more complicated you get older and you get 259 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:37,240 Speaker 1: more responsibilities. So if you're married and you're in your 260 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:40,880 Speaker 1: thirties or forties or fifties, you know it is or 261 00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 1: any kind of committed relationship you know it's logistically tough sometimes, well, yeah, 262 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 1: because you're like, I want this, and this other person 263 00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 1: who you share half of your estate with says, no, 264 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:52,760 Speaker 1: I want this, or I want to do this, or 265 00:16:52,760 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 1: I want to do that, or I want a vacation here. 266 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,800 Speaker 1: They're exactly just in keeping up with schedules. It's all 267 00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 1: very complicated. It's all compromise. It's like there's one big, 268 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:05,639 Speaker 1: complicent compromise and you're compromising between two people's opinions. Imagine 269 00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:09,280 Speaker 1: just throwing in one extra opinion that differs from the 270 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 1: other two equal weight exactly. So that's basically what we're 271 00:17:15,160 --> 00:17:17,919 Speaker 1: getting at is, if you think your marriage is complicated, 272 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: polyamory can be even more complicated. And they admit that 273 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:25,280 Speaker 1: it can be more complicated, but they say that, uh. 274 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 1: And this is really what I gathered from reading that 275 00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:30,840 Speaker 1: site in a bunch of articles, is that two for one, 276 00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:34,160 Speaker 1: two for one. You want to meet a great communicator, 277 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 1: go talk to someone in a polyamorous relationship. Yeah, so 278 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 1: that's one of the chief requirements of polyamory. Gotta be 279 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 1: able to talk about all this stuff. I've seen it 280 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:48,760 Speaker 1: put as you have highly evolved communication skills. Yes, I 281 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 1: would not a good polyamory man like I wouldn't last 282 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:58,359 Speaker 1: two days. No, I stink. I stink at communicating. I 283 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 1: think I'm just doing line and it turns out, oh wait, 284 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:03,879 Speaker 1: I didn't say that, Chuck. Is this bothering you know? 285 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:07,480 Speaker 1: But it's really bothering. Well, that's another thing too. Not 286 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:09,639 Speaker 1: only do you have to be a great communicator and 287 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 1: get your point across and read other people and listen 288 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 1: to that kind of thing, but you also have to 289 00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:17,760 Speaker 1: be honest about your feelings. And one of the things 290 00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 1: that polyamorous face, just like anybody else's jealousy. We did 291 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 1: a pretty good episode on jealousy a while back, jealousy 292 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:31,440 Speaker 1: much yea yeah, with a question mark right, um, And 293 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:34,360 Speaker 1: so they deal with jealousy and and and they deal 294 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:37,520 Speaker 1: with it apparently ideally. Again, this is from more than 295 00:18:37,600 --> 00:18:41,640 Speaker 1: two dot com in a way where it would take 296 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 1: a pretty intelligent, calm person to approach the feelings of 297 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 1: jealousy like this, which is basically deconstructing it. So the 298 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 1: guy at more than two dot com I kind of 299 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:57,720 Speaker 1: gave a good example where he was saying, Um, you're 300 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:01,800 Speaker 1: in a polyamorous relationship and it bugs you when your 301 00:19:02,359 --> 00:19:07,800 Speaker 1: spouse kisses there are other spouse in front of you, right, 302 00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 1: and he says the correct thing to do basically here 303 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:15,439 Speaker 1: is to stop and say, okay, why does that make 304 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:18,719 Speaker 1: me jealous? And if you are honest with yourself, you'll say, well, 305 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 1: it makes me jealous because I worried that the other spouse. 306 00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 1: And by the way, in a polyamorous relationship, the plural 307 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:27,680 Speaker 1: of spouse is spice. Yes, so if you're married to 308 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:32,159 Speaker 1: two people, you have two spice um, which is kind 309 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 1: of funny. Sure you got a spicy I love life. Anyway, 310 00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:37,280 Speaker 1: when the other spouse, if if you're worried that your 311 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 1: spouse is kissing his other spouse, he's going to think 312 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:43,680 Speaker 1: that that spouse is a better kisser than you and think, well, 313 00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:48,120 Speaker 1: that spouses, if he's better kisser then you, he wants 314 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:50,240 Speaker 1: to be with him more than me. And if he 315 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:53,040 Speaker 1: wants to be with him more than me, then uh, 316 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:57,800 Speaker 1: he's gonna leave me. Is often rooted in your own insecurities. 317 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:00,440 Speaker 1: So what this guy was saying is, if you spell 318 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:02,240 Speaker 1: this out, you realize that there's a lot of hidden 319 00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:05,040 Speaker 1: assumptions and your jealous feelings, and that when you confront them, 320 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 1: you will probably discard a lot of them. If you 321 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 1: find that, no, this is correct, this person really would 322 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,600 Speaker 1: leave me because that person is a better kisser. Um, 323 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:17,440 Speaker 1: then you would ask yourself, do I want to be 324 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: with somebody who would leave me because somebody else is 325 00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:23,359 Speaker 1: a better kisser? Yeah? Um, So if you can approach 326 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: this kind of stuff in this manner, then maybe you'd 327 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:31,240 Speaker 1: be a decent polyamorous. Yeah. There's a lady named Terry Connelly, 328 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 1: a professor of psychology and women's studies at University of Michigan, 329 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 1: uh Go Wolverines, and she's she's one of the well, 330 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 1: not one of the only people. But there haven't been 331 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:44,800 Speaker 1: many studies on polyamory. Um. One reason is because it's 332 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:48,440 Speaker 1: underreported in a lot of cases because people, some people 333 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:51,200 Speaker 1: may not like to be uh really out front with it. 334 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:53,879 Speaker 1: And for good reason, Yeah, for very good reasons. But 335 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:56,639 Speaker 1: she did some studies and polls and things, and she 336 00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:00,720 Speaker 1: found that jealousy is, in fact, she said, much higher 337 00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:04,879 Speaker 1: end quote among monogamous pairs than non monogamous ones. And 338 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:07,560 Speaker 1: I think for the reasons you just said, um, she 339 00:21:07,640 --> 00:21:12,159 Speaker 1: also found Um, she interviewed sevent individuals. Polly, Um, I'm 340 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:16,320 Speaker 1: sorry monogamous individuals, hundred and fifty swingers, hundred and seventy 341 00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:20,000 Speaker 1: people in an open relationship, and three hundred polyamorous individuals, 342 00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:23,400 Speaker 1: and said that polyamorous tended to have equal or higher 343 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:28,480 Speaker 1: levels of sexual satisfaction. Uh, and people in open relationships 344 00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:32,159 Speaker 1: tended to have lower sexual satisfaction than their monogamous piers 345 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:35,399 Speaker 1: and polyamorous piers. So, and we should say open is 346 00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 1: not the same as polyamorous. Now again, in a polyamorous group, 347 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:42,400 Speaker 1: the people in the group form a closed hole. Yeah. 348 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:46,560 Speaker 1: In an open relationship, it's like there's two people who 349 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:49,960 Speaker 1: are connected, but they're also facing outward and the whole 350 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:54,080 Speaker 1: world's up for grabs, basically, right, in an open relationship, 351 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: you know, right, it's not so in polyamorous is not 352 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:01,120 Speaker 1: an open relationship, and open really ship is not polyamorous. 353 00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 1: But a polyamorous relationship could include swinging from what I understand. Yes, 354 00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:12,480 Speaker 1: And did you know that swinging apparently started among World 355 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 1: War Two Air Force pilots in your families? You knew that, yeah, 356 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 1: because you supposedly if your husband died in battle, it 357 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:23,639 Speaker 1: was just sort of understood that that woman would then 358 00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:27,240 Speaker 1: take up with another serviceman. Correct, I guess, but with 359 00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 1: another married serviceman or what. I don't know about that. Huh. Well, 360 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:34,400 Speaker 1: apparently it started out with like we called that wife 361 00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:36,879 Speaker 1: swapping in World War Two in the Air Force, like 362 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:40,680 Speaker 1: specifically the Air Force, not like oh, American servicemen like 363 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:44,119 Speaker 1: the Air Force. So I guess they know who it was. Um. 364 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:47,040 Speaker 1: I think I've told the story about the Atlanta Swingers 365 00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:48,959 Speaker 1: Club was very close to my phone number growing up, 366 00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:51,639 Speaker 1: and we used to I was a kid. I had 367 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,159 Speaker 1: no idea what it meant, of course, and I used 368 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 1: to answer the phone and people would be like the 369 00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 1: Atlanta Singers would just be like my mom would just 370 00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:02,720 Speaker 1: remember it was so like troublesome to her, and she 371 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 1: kept the whistle next to the phone and would blow 372 00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 1: a whistle into it. It's so funny to think about, yes, 373 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:15,000 Speaker 1: so man, very funny. I still remember that number two? 374 00:23:15,040 --> 00:23:21,200 Speaker 1: Do you remember your original phone number? Nine? Isn't that crazy? Um? 375 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,159 Speaker 1: I'm sorry for anyone who has those numbers today, or 376 00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:29,320 Speaker 1: to the Atlantic Swingers Club, which is still operational, I'm sure. Um. 377 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:31,920 Speaker 1: All right, another thing we need to talk about our 378 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 1: s t I s UM sexually transmitted infection. You would 379 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:41,480 Speaker 1: think that UM it would be higher in a polyamorous relationship, 380 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 1: and they don't have statistics that may or may not 381 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 1: be the case, but what they are adamant about is 382 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,760 Speaker 1: lots of testing and lots of access to those results 383 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:57,640 Speaker 1: and being super open about those results. UM apparently much 384 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:01,840 Speaker 1: more so than UM people in monogamous relationships like new 385 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 1: new relationships. They found that people in new monogamous relationships 386 00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 1: are often very shy about talking about their sexual history 387 00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:15,560 Speaker 1: and potential UM infections and things, whereas they're really upfront 388 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:17,920 Speaker 1: about it in polyamory. Yeah, and and they kind of 389 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:19,879 Speaker 1: have to be, and they kind of just make it 390 00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:23,359 Speaker 1: a normal, open thing. But that's part of that open, 391 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:27,480 Speaker 1: honest communication. That's that's kind of a hallmark of polyamory. 392 00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:32,120 Speaker 1: And even two, it has a practical application defending against 393 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 1: S T I S. Yeah, they did. There was one 394 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:38,359 Speaker 1: study in twelve in the Journal of Sexual Medicine that 395 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:44,760 Speaker 1: found that UM unfaithful like cheaters, not like uh, like 396 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 1: a cheater, you're in a monogamous relationship, in your cheating, 397 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:50,960 Speaker 1: they're much more likely to engage in risky sexual behavior 398 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,359 Speaker 1: and to keep it a secret than someone in a 399 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,119 Speaker 1: polyamorous relationship because you go off in your cheat and 400 00:24:57,160 --> 00:24:59,720 Speaker 1: you keep quiet and you do something super risky, you know, 401 00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:03,440 Speaker 1: hook up with someone randomly that you don't know, and 402 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:06,160 Speaker 1: that's just that's kind of like the opposite of polyamory 403 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:09,320 Speaker 1: from what it sounds like. Right. With polyamory, it's like, okay, 404 00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:13,159 Speaker 1: it's your it's time for your weekly STD test, right, 405 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,720 Speaker 1: I want to see the paper and we're not hooking 406 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:18,159 Speaker 1: up with some random person. There. If there are one 407 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,160 Speaker 1: thing that there's a lot of in a polyamorous relationship 408 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:24,440 Speaker 1: or rules, yeah, if you haven't picked up on that yet, Yeah, 409 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:27,159 Speaker 1: you gotta have the ground rules laid down. Um, how 410 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:30,359 Speaker 1: much time are you going to spend with this person 411 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: versus that person? Um? All the way down to rules 412 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,359 Speaker 1: in the bedroom. Um. It sounds a little gross, but 413 00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:40,280 Speaker 1: fluid swapping. Well, it's a big deal. So there's a thing. 414 00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:44,920 Speaker 1: One of the ways they protect against um STDs is uh, well, 415 00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,920 Speaker 1: let's talk about some of the arrangements. Okay, alright, because 416 00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:50,080 Speaker 1: I think we need to because these different rules that 417 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:53,160 Speaker 1: we're talking about here will apply differently to different types 418 00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:57,120 Speaker 1: of relationships. So obviously there's a triad. You can also 419 00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:59,560 Speaker 1: have a quad. I can imagine that you could go 420 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:03,439 Speaker 1: up to six eight. Whatever. The point is is um 421 00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:07,639 Speaker 1: when you have a group that are equal to one another, 422 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:11,360 Speaker 1: where everybody's equal to one another, that's one. That's one 423 00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:17,440 Speaker 1: form of the polyamorous relationship, right. There's another form that's hierarchical, 424 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:22,440 Speaker 1: which is based on a core couple that are Yeah, 425 00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 1: they would be the primary, and then say each of 426 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,800 Speaker 1: them has a significant other like a boyfriend or girlfriend. 427 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:33,040 Speaker 1: Those would be the secondaries. And then maybe they have 428 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: another person that they're they're close to, they see once 429 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 1: in a while, maybe they live out of town, something 430 00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:43,360 Speaker 1: like that. That would be potentially a tertiary um relationship, 431 00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:45,239 Speaker 1: right like you break the twister game out and they 432 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,720 Speaker 1: show up, right. So the the the the difference between 433 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:54,520 Speaker 1: the two is with the hierarchical relationship. With the hierarchical format, 434 00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:59,560 Speaker 1: the the person that your spouse, the core group, the 435 00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:02,080 Speaker 1: core couple of people. They're the ones who are gonna 436 00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:05,399 Speaker 1: get the most time, the most attention. They're gonna have 437 00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:09,240 Speaker 1: more power to say, vito the others veto is a 438 00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: big deal. Yeah, um in a and the other relationship 439 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:14,680 Speaker 1: that forms like a try it or a quad or 440 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,840 Speaker 1: six people or something like that where everybody is equally weighted. 441 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:22,520 Speaker 1: That's that that that you wouldn't have like a high 442 00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:25,760 Speaker 1: there's no hierarchical structure to that. Yeah, And it depends 443 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 1: on how you want to structure things. They're both completely 444 00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:33,240 Speaker 1: valid as polyamorous relationships. Um, it's just you know, up 445 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:35,960 Speaker 1: to you basically, And so you said the veto power 446 00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:38,040 Speaker 1: is a big deal. Yeah, I think it's always to 447 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,680 Speaker 1: be honored. Right. So if if um, somebody is is 448 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,600 Speaker 1: is meeting somebody new and wants to date them, they 449 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 1: basically have to go to the rest of the group 450 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 1: that they're committed to in this committed relationship with and 451 00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 1: say I got this person, I'd like to bring them 452 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 1: unto the group. I don't know this, but I can 453 00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:59,960 Speaker 1: imagine that is a huge thing, especially in a law 454 00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:06,200 Speaker 1: long established um polyamorous relationship, you know, like bringing a 455 00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:08,800 Speaker 1: new person in all bet that would be really big deal. 456 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,080 Speaker 1: I can imagine being that dude and showing up right, 457 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:14,600 Speaker 1: it's like the worst job interview of all time, especially 458 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:17,720 Speaker 1: if you don't know what's going on. Plus in the 459 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:23,399 Speaker 1: hierarchical structure, then I can imagine the veto power probably 460 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,840 Speaker 1: just rests with the two core people, maybe slightly in 461 00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:31,120 Speaker 1: the secondary people, probably not at all. In the tertiary people, 462 00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:34,359 Speaker 1: they're just there for twister. But with the um the 463 00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 1: s t I thing. Um, if you are what's called 464 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:42,480 Speaker 1: body fluid uh monogamous, Yeah, which I was kind of 465 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:45,040 Speaker 1: joking about that it sounds gross, it's really not at all. 466 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,960 Speaker 1: That's basically saying that we can have sex with each 467 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:51,120 Speaker 1: other without condoms. And I'm sorry I'm saying you and me. 468 00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,200 Speaker 1: I thought you were talking to somebody behind. But um, 469 00:28:56,080 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 1: maybe the secondary and I have to wear condoms and 470 00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:04,680 Speaker 1: we don't exchange those fluids so intimately and freely or um. 471 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: If you're in a group, like everybody in the group 472 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:11,120 Speaker 1: might be body fluid monogamous, but if they are agreed 473 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:12,960 Speaker 1: that they can go outside of the group, they would 474 00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:16,120 Speaker 1: not be. Or if it's a hierarchical structure, yeah, that 475 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 1: primary couple would just be body fluid monogamous and everybody 476 00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 1: else would be. Right, you'd have to wear economy or something. Yeah, 477 00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:24,600 Speaker 1: or it may not even involve sex. Maybe your your 478 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 1: secondaries or you go on dates with and you can um, 479 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:30,600 Speaker 1: you know, go to first and second base and that's 480 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:34,480 Speaker 1: where it ends. Like, it's really all about the people 481 00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:36,840 Speaker 1: in the relationship working out what works best for them. 482 00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 1: All right, So let's take a break here and talk 483 00:29:41,000 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 1: more about the polyamory right after this. Okay, Chuck, we're back. Um. 484 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:12,080 Speaker 1: It's one of the things that I found interesting about 485 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:16,440 Speaker 1: polyamory um was that they had to coin some terms 486 00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:20,360 Speaker 1: because they were really breaking new ground here and trying 487 00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 1: things with relationships whos two or more Spice is the 488 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,680 Speaker 1: plural of spouse um. And then there's a word called 489 00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:32,920 Speaker 1: compulsion that's very much associated with polyamory, and it is 490 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:37,240 Speaker 1: basically the mirror image of jealousy. Yeah, it's being super 491 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 1: happy that you're primary has found someone else that they 492 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:44,920 Speaker 1: really love and are satisfied with. Yeah, and not just 493 00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:48,720 Speaker 1: your primary, anybody your polyamorous relationship with. Yeah, that they've 494 00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:52,520 Speaker 1: found happiness with somebody else. You're happy for them because 495 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:56,360 Speaker 1: of that. So yeah, that's not a normal thing for 496 00:30:56,600 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: most people, especially people in traditional argamous relationships. So polyamorous 497 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,600 Speaker 1: people kind of, I guess, stumbled upon this thing and 498 00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:06,840 Speaker 1: had to come up with the name for it, and 499 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,400 Speaker 1: they call it compulsion. Yeah. And if you know, if 500 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:12,600 Speaker 1: you think to yourself as a monogamous person, Well, what 501 00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:14,480 Speaker 1: you know, this person goes off your wife all of 502 00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:18,000 Speaker 1: a sudden is sleeping with another man. What's to keep 503 00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: her from really falling in love with him to the 504 00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 1: extent that she no longer wants to be with you. 505 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 1: Of course that can happen, but that can happen in 506 00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:30,320 Speaker 1: your regular marriage as well. And if the only thing 507 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:35,720 Speaker 1: that's binding your marriage is that, um, you've got bigger 508 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:37,840 Speaker 1: problems in your marriage. If the only thing binding you 509 00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:41,800 Speaker 1: do that marriage is like the marital contract that you 510 00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:45,720 Speaker 1: feel like you have to stay you know, uh true too, 511 00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 1: you know, like in a regular marriage, you should want 512 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:51,160 Speaker 1: to be with your husband and your wife, like it 513 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:54,160 Speaker 1: doesn't matter what the piece of paper says. Um. I 514 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,520 Speaker 1: would guess, and again I don't know. I would guess 515 00:31:56,600 --> 00:32:02,240 Speaker 1: that polyamorousts have some sort of of structure or mechanism 516 00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 1: to deal with that, Like if, especially if there is 517 00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:10,320 Speaker 1: a if that happens where somebody starts out as a 518 00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 1: married couple, but then they include a third person and 519 00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:16,360 Speaker 1: become a triad. If one of them really starts to 520 00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:19,280 Speaker 1: fall for the other one, that that doesn't mean that 521 00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 1: the the initial couple is going to break up and 522 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,200 Speaker 1: that couple is going to split off. That's not polyamory 523 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:26,880 Speaker 1: and that's not how it works. So I wonder what 524 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,760 Speaker 1: kind of mechanism they have to deal with checks and balances. Yeah, 525 00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 1: there's got to be something they did do. There was 526 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,040 Speaker 1: one study in the Electronic Journal of Human Sexuality in 527 00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 1: two thousand five that said, um, polyamorous couples who had 528 00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:42,600 Speaker 1: been together more than ten years listed love and connection 529 00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 1: as the most important factors in their longevity, and monogamous 530 00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:51,000 Speaker 1: couples listed religion and family as the most important reasons. Uh. 531 00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:53,120 Speaker 1: And that's what I was sort of clumsily trying to say. 532 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:56,200 Speaker 1: The only thing keeping you together is the fact that 533 00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,680 Speaker 1: your husband or wife hasn't slept with someone else. Are 534 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:01,320 Speaker 1: your parents are going to be disappoint Yeah, it's I mean, 535 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 1: those aren't reasons to stay mary, you know. So, Um, 536 00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 1: we already touched on also the idea that if you 537 00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,840 Speaker 1: are in a polyamorous relationship, you you know, you might 538 00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,400 Speaker 1: not share a lot of interests with your primary, but 539 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,280 Speaker 1: you've got the ones that your primary is not interested 540 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 1: in you get to share with your secondary or your 541 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:23,000 Speaker 1: tertiary or whatever. Right, Um, so just having more people 542 00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:26,240 Speaker 1: to spend life with. That's another benefit of it. There's 543 00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 1: a lot of drawbacks to being in a polyamorous relationship 544 00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:33,720 Speaker 1: that I think any polyamorous would readily admit as well 545 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:38,959 Speaker 1: UM to be in in a quote fringe sexual sexuality, 546 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:43,160 Speaker 1: I think living your romantic and reproductive life. As we'll 547 00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:51,320 Speaker 1: talk about a minute, UM in complete contrast two societal 548 00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:55,640 Speaker 1: values is UM. It's gotta be tough. Yeah, And you know, 549 00:33:55,760 --> 00:34:01,280 Speaker 1: over the years acceptance of this is UM been zilch too. 550 00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 1: Better be saying now zilts to confusion to UM. These 551 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,560 Speaker 1: days a little more open minded about things. I did 552 00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:12,239 Speaker 1: see one pole here from I think it was in 553 00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:16,840 Speaker 1: April of this year actually, where they pulled about heterosexuals 554 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:18,920 Speaker 1: on how willing they would be on a scale of 555 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:23,640 Speaker 1: one to seven to commit non monogamous acts like adding 556 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:26,760 Speaker 1: a third party to the relationship, and depending on the scenario, 557 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,200 Speaker 1: sixteen percent of women and thirty one percent of men 558 00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:32,799 Speaker 1: chose four or higher on that scale, would ask if 559 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,279 Speaker 1: they'd be willing to pursue like try something like that 560 00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 1: out basically, so it's I don't know, lower did you 561 00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:45,920 Speaker 1: did you say before that? There was this two thousand 562 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:50,000 Speaker 1: two survey that found that UM, that predicted as much 563 00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:53,279 Speaker 1: as ten percent. Yeah, people, that's high compared to other 564 00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:57,520 Speaker 1: studies I've seen. I saw like the most maybe four percent. Yeah, 565 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 1: I can't imagine ten percent. There's just no UM because 566 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:03,960 Speaker 1: I mean I'm pretty hip, you know, I know what's 567 00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:07,239 Speaker 1: going on, and I would just be blown away if 568 00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:09,040 Speaker 1: it turned out that one in ten people were in 569 00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:12,279 Speaker 1: a polyamorous relationship and and just managed to keep it 570 00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:16,560 Speaker 1: secret that much. I agree. Secrecy is a big part 571 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:18,480 Speaker 1: of this. And that's not to say that shame is 572 00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:23,279 Speaker 1: a part of a polyamorous relationship, but secrecy is just 573 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:27,800 Speaker 1: out of necessity a UM a pretty big aspect of 574 00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:32,759 Speaker 1: polyamorous relationships, mainly because, like we said, it's in stark 575 00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:35,839 Speaker 1: contrast to social values, and if you've got a kid, 576 00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:39,759 Speaker 1: you're at risk of having your kid taken away. Yeah. Plus, 577 00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:42,280 Speaker 1: I mean you'd spend half your life explaining this to everybody, 578 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:44,840 Speaker 1: you know. Um, there was the one case and uh, 579 00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:48,040 Speaker 1: and I couldn't find up any follow up about this 580 00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:53,400 Speaker 1: young woman, but April what's your last name? Yeah, she 581 00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:55,880 Speaker 1: was on the MTV show in the late nineties and 582 00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,560 Speaker 1: had a child and had two men in her life. 583 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:04,040 Speaker 1: A triad and everyone was happy, the kid was healthy 584 00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 1: and happy, and everything was great, and the grandmother sued 585 00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:12,600 Speaker 1: for custody and one it because the court basically made 586 00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:16,520 Speaker 1: a moral judgment. So this is a depraved lifestyle. And 587 00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:19,080 Speaker 1: this was in spite of the fact that the court 588 00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:22,680 Speaker 1: sent its own shrinks to go evaluate the home and 589 00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:25,960 Speaker 1: the family and didn't find that the kids were any 590 00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:29,520 Speaker 1: in anything but a loving, supporting home and we're happy 591 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:32,400 Speaker 1: and healthy. Uh. Still it didn't matter because it was 592 00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:36,120 Speaker 1: she was living a depraved lifestyle. So she lost her kid. Um. 593 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 1: I can imagine that in almost any state in the Union, 594 00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:43,640 Speaker 1: you would be at great risk of losing your kid 595 00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:47,399 Speaker 1: if you came out as a polyamorous family. Probably it's 596 00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:49,560 Speaker 1: one thing I think as far as society goes to 597 00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:52,880 Speaker 1: be like, Okay, you guys, just go do your own thing. 598 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:56,799 Speaker 1: Whatever you floats your boat, that's fine, keep it out 599 00:36:56,840 --> 00:37:00,520 Speaker 1: of our faces, keep your your little polyamorous lifestyle quiet. 600 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:03,160 Speaker 1: But if it turns out that there's kids that are 601 00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:06,960 Speaker 1: being brought into that, like either they already existed or 602 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:11,320 Speaker 1: you're having kids with multiple partners in this polyamorous relationship, 603 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:15,399 Speaker 1: I think society's threshold for understanding and looking the other 604 00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:19,839 Speaker 1: way really reaches an end for better for worse. Right, Um, 605 00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:21,839 Speaker 1: so I think there is a real threat and there's 606 00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:25,279 Speaker 1: there's a real threat still in part because there's very 607 00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:30,080 Speaker 1: little scholarship on the impact that a polyamorous upbringing has 608 00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:35,200 Speaker 1: on children. No, no one knows polyamorous will say, look, dude, 609 00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:39,719 Speaker 1: you have no idea how much our child is loved. 610 00:37:40,160 --> 00:37:43,239 Speaker 1: My wife loves our kid. I love our kid. Our 611 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:45,839 Speaker 1: wife loves our kid. So not only does our kid 612 00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,520 Speaker 1: get to like be raised by two loving parents, our 613 00:37:48,600 --> 00:37:51,920 Speaker 1: kid gets to be raised by three loving parents equally. Um, 614 00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:55,120 Speaker 1: there's more of a division of labor. Uh, it's it's 615 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:59,080 Speaker 1: just the kids great. And on the other side you'll 616 00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:03,200 Speaker 1: find blog posts by people who are authorities on the 617 00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:06,520 Speaker 1: other side saying no, there's just no way because you're 618 00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,680 Speaker 1: you're at risk of a divorce. But it's a nontraditional divorce, 619 00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:12,280 Speaker 1: whereas under a normal divorce we have a social structure 620 00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:15,000 Speaker 1: to support kids who are going through that. With this, 621 00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:17,319 Speaker 1: it's like that doesn't make any sense, and the kid's 622 00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:19,640 Speaker 1: going to be have all sorts of issues. And then 623 00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:21,880 Speaker 1: if you don't tell your kid while you're raising them, 624 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:23,880 Speaker 1: when they get to college and figure out what was 625 00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:26,400 Speaker 1: going on, they're not going to trust you any longer. Like, 626 00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:29,480 Speaker 1: but none of this, almost none of it is based 627 00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:33,920 Speaker 1: on studies. It's all just moral judgments on one way 628 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,279 Speaker 1: or the other. Yeah, I think it's pretty funny. That's 629 00:38:36,719 --> 00:38:39,480 Speaker 1: I bet the same people that I don't think a 630 00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:42,920 Speaker 1: child should be raised by a single parent also probably 631 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:47,080 Speaker 1: think three or more. They're like, just two, not one, 632 00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:50,800 Speaker 1: not three or four? Five? Two is perfect? Uh So, 633 00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 1: who are polyamorous? Um? Elizabeth Chef as a sociologist who's 634 00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,080 Speaker 1: done a lot of interviewing, and she finds generally they 635 00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:03,160 Speaker 1: are in their thirty sporties and fifties, generally white and 636 00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 1: liberal and educated, many of them highly educated master's degrees 637 00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:12,799 Speaker 1: to the tune of like, compared to eight percent forty 638 00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:16,000 Speaker 1: percent master's degrees. Yeah, that's what I saw, compared to 639 00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:19,800 Speaker 1: eight percent in the general population. And she says, rarely 640 00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,120 Speaker 1: are they religious, but when they do, it's usually paganism 641 00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:26,400 Speaker 1: or unitarian universalism. Apparently there's a lot of overlap with 642 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:30,360 Speaker 1: the b D s M and cosplay communities. And here's 643 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,480 Speaker 1: another term, hunting the unicorn. Did you come across that, No, 644 00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 1: I didn't. I'm disappointed in myself. That is. Um. She 645 00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:40,320 Speaker 1: said that a lot of couples are introduced or interested 646 00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:47,359 Speaker 1: in polyamory by start looking for a woman bisexual when 647 00:39:47,520 --> 00:39:50,319 Speaker 1: to enter their relationship. So I want to try ad, 648 00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:53,080 Speaker 1: I want two women. The woman's like I would like 649 00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:55,600 Speaker 1: a woman as well, and so let's go out and 650 00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:59,919 Speaker 1: find that. That's that's called hunting the unicorn. What else? 651 00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: I got nothing else? I mean I did look up 652 00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:05,440 Speaker 1: a little bit of the history of this kind of thing, 653 00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:08,480 Speaker 1: and it's there was Have you ever heard of the 654 00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:13,520 Speaker 1: Oneida Commune? Yeah, I think we touched upon the communism. 655 00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:19,160 Speaker 1: Oh really, I think so? Well, they were. It sounds 656 00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:22,440 Speaker 1: like a cult, but um, it's super interesting because it 657 00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:25,920 Speaker 1: was in the eighteen forties in upstate New York and Oneida, 658 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:29,000 Speaker 1: New York where you usually don't in the eighteen forties 659 00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:33,360 Speaker 1: here about things like um, free sex and polyamory. But 660 00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,239 Speaker 1: that's exactly what was going on there. A lawyer named 661 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:41,360 Speaker 1: John Humphrey noise Uh basically started of Free Love Commune 662 00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:45,080 Speaker 1: in the eighteen forties in New York, and by some accounts, 663 00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:48,960 Speaker 1: it was a very um feminist group because women were 664 00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 1: encouraged to only have sex when they wanted to, which 665 00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:55,640 Speaker 1: you know, in the eighteen forties that wasn't the norm um. 666 00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:58,759 Speaker 1: But it was also, as it turned out, not so 667 00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:02,320 Speaker 1: great in many ways because because they had sex with teenagers, 668 00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:04,520 Speaker 1: and the more I read about it, at first it 669 00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:07,960 Speaker 1: sounded like this commune, and then ten minutes later I 670 00:41:08,040 --> 00:41:10,600 Speaker 1: was like, no, this was a cult and it had 671 00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:13,440 Speaker 1: religious undertones. And the weirdest thing out of all is 672 00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:17,160 Speaker 1: Oneita silverware that is still popular today. It was formed 673 00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:20,520 Speaker 1: from that commune. I remember hearing it as like some 674 00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:24,239 Speaker 1: sort of cautionary tailor whatever. Yeah, and there was only 675 00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:26,920 Speaker 1: like three hundred of them, but apparently they I think 676 00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:30,600 Speaker 1: it was all about having lots of kids to keep 677 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:35,200 Speaker 1: that commune going. That was the main reason. But they 678 00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:38,239 Speaker 1: did not encourage monogamy at all. They they shunned it. 679 00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,959 Speaker 1: If you were caught, like really rooting down with one person, 680 00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:43,400 Speaker 1: they were like, no, no, no, no, no no no, 681 00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:46,880 Speaker 1: you can't do that. Go off and have sex with 682 00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:50,760 Speaker 1: someone else, right now, get your priorities in order, basically, 683 00:41:51,120 --> 00:41:54,320 Speaker 1: get your head together. Yeah, I'm sure there's a documentary 684 00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,920 Speaker 1: on that clan that'll be interesting. Uh, if you want 685 00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:02,040 Speaker 1: to know more, about polyamory and other alternative lifestyles. You 686 00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:04,360 Speaker 1: can search those in the search bar at how stuff 687 00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:07,600 Speaker 1: works dot com. And uh, since I said search bar, 688 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:11,920 Speaker 1: it's time for a listener mail. Here's more on T. 689 00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:15,720 Speaker 1: Hey guys, listen to T and a massive te connoistur 690 00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:18,040 Speaker 1: for the last seven years. I was really impressed. I 691 00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:20,720 Speaker 1: expected to listen and pick out a bunch of little mistakes, 692 00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:23,879 Speaker 1: but I was pleasantly surprised. However, you guys did leave 693 00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:27,440 Speaker 1: out what I can't wait to sec them this one. No, 694 00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,400 Speaker 1: I don't think so, Aaron sounds like a nice dude. Um. 695 00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:33,160 Speaker 1: You left out one major category of T though, and 696 00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:37,160 Speaker 1: it spelled pu dash e r H. Pu air is 697 00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:39,520 Speaker 1: what I'm gonna say, he said. It's probably the most 698 00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:43,040 Speaker 1: unique T out of the six types tom to the 699 00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:46,520 Speaker 1: Union Province of China, is the only T to be fermented, 700 00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:50,759 Speaker 1: not oxidized. What this means is that pu air is 701 00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:54,520 Speaker 1: and I know that's wrong, is able to be aged 702 00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:58,279 Speaker 1: for years and years and taste better as ages, just 703 00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:01,160 Speaker 1: like wine. And some pure air on the market that's 704 00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:04,640 Speaker 1: several decades old goes for thousands of dollars per disc disc. 705 00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:08,839 Speaker 1: Yes disc traditionally puerre is stone pressed into a disc 706 00:43:08,920 --> 00:43:13,120 Speaker 1: form called a being cha and is sold um in 707 00:43:13,239 --> 00:43:16,760 Speaker 1: that disc form that it has a forced floor flavor 708 00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,160 Speaker 1: and has brooded about two five to two and ten 709 00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:24,120 Speaker 1: degrees fahrenheit. Yeah, it sounds good, um, he said. I 710 00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:26,600 Speaker 1: could go on and on, but that suggests great job 711 00:43:26,680 --> 00:43:28,279 Speaker 1: over all, guys, and now it's tough to fit at all. 712 00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:31,400 Speaker 1: One episode t could easily be its own college class 713 00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:34,680 Speaker 1: with all the cultural history behind it. Take care. And 714 00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:39,200 Speaker 1: that is from Aaron Krauss, whose developer at the Society 715 00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:42,640 Speaker 1: dot org. That is t h E s O c 716 00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:45,640 Speaker 1: I E t e A dot org. Thanks a lot, 717 00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:50,960 Speaker 1: Aaron and your cohorts at the Society. Sounds neat. Uh, 718 00:43:51,200 --> 00:43:56,000 Speaker 1: it sounds like the one needed call. Mm hmm yeah, 719 00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:58,560 Speaker 1: I like it. Okay, Uh. If you want to get 720 00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:01,520 Speaker 1: in touch with us, you can Let's see what can 721 00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:04,320 Speaker 1: you do? Chuck Tweet to us at s y s 722 00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:06,839 Speaker 1: K podcast. You can join us on Facebook dot com, 723 00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:08,960 Speaker 1: slash Stuff you Should Know. You can send us an 724 00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:11,440 Speaker 1: email to Stuff Podcast at how Stuff Works dot com, 725 00:44:11,760 --> 00:44:13,879 Speaker 1: and as always, join us at our home on the web. 726 00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:18,560 Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know dot com. Stuff you Should Know 727 00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:21,080 Speaker 1: is a production of iHeart Radio's How Stuff Works. For 728 00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:23,799 Speaker 1: more podcasts for my heart Radio, visit the iHeart radio app, 729 00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:26,520 Speaker 1: Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.