Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Civic Cipher. I'm your host,
Speaker 1: ramses Jah.
Speaker 2: So his name is ramses Jah. My name is Quentin
Speaker 2: Ward Quinn with an oh, but everybody calls me Q
Speaker 2: because that's just way easier to say.
Speaker 1: You gotta teachhim, man, you gotta you gotta teach them.
Speaker 1: That's what we're here to teach. You can look it up.
Speaker 2: The manual, Well Webster Good News Today.
Speaker 3: Year.
Speaker 2: Listen to me. We made it a year.
Speaker 3: Year.
Speaker 2: That don't sound that's significant to everybody else as it is.
Speaker 2: That's but we've been in these streets, we've been outside,
Speaker 2: and we we we real pro us in real anti
Speaker 2: the bs, and that's dangerous in today's climate. So I'm
Speaker 2: glad we made it to a year.
Speaker 1: Man.
Speaker 2: Happy birthday.
Speaker 1: Happy birthday to us to us here on Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1: And before we go any further, I gotta say thank
Speaker 1: you to everybody that's ordered us. Of course our day ones,
Speaker 1: but even if you're just getting onto the show today.
Speaker 3: We appreciate you because we know why you're here.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's an anniversary and what we're gonna do
Speaker 1: is talk about some of the good things that have
Speaker 1: happened in.
Speaker 2: The past year, we're switching to yours.
Speaker 1: Yeah, normally the show is like real heavy with a
Speaker 1: lot of you know, just heavy stuff.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: It's obviously we have a lot of traumas that we
Speaker 1: have to deal with, past traumas, generational traumas, and of
Speaker 1: course present day traumas as black people that we share with,
Speaker 1: you know, our other marginalized brothers and sisters. But after
Speaker 1: a year of trying to have conversations on the radio
Speaker 1: about the state of things, I thought it would be
Speaker 1: special and and swirl and que of course, thought it
Speaker 1: would be special that we share some of the positive
Speaker 1: things that have happened. And so let's start off where
Speaker 1: we normally start off. But let's discuss some ebony. Excellent,
Speaker 1: and I know you got some special queue.
Speaker 2: So I'm gonna read this because I wanted to be accurate.
Speaker 2: But before I start reading, shout out to the Cab County.
Speaker 2: That's actually where I am right now, for those that
Speaker 2: don't know, I am down in the at l A
Speaker 2: N T A g A. That's where I stay and
Speaker 2: in the Cab County in a city called Stone Crest, Georgia.
Speaker 2: They are developing the new Black Wall Street market I
Speaker 2: just read that. I knew I was going to read it.
Speaker 2: We prepped for the show, and I still got goosebumps
Speaker 2: when I read it this time, especially in it because man,
Speaker 2: that's incredible, and I want to read this quote. We
Speaker 2: know right now was the time to begin moving forward
Speaker 2: on mister Allen's vision to create a new Black Wall Street,
Speaker 2: not only market, but an international village that has numbers
Speaker 2: of young African American businesses that are growing and being developed.
Speaker 2: New Black Wall Street Market spokesperson Matthew Hampton said, So,
Speaker 2: we are in the middle of doing a multi year
Speaker 2: billion dollar development in the city of Stonecrest right down
Speaker 2: here in Decab County, Georgia. For those of you that
Speaker 2: are familiar with Black Wall Street in Tosa, Oklahoma and
Speaker 2: the very very tragic happenings down there, this is the
Speaker 2: type of thing you should get excited about. And the
Speaker 2: fact that it's happening here, I think is ideal. It's
Speaker 2: happening in a place where the black agenda is very
Speaker 2: very out, very very forward, very very loud. It's not covert,
Speaker 2: it's very overt. People are very very proud and very
Speaker 2: very in this area. It's very very concentrated. So this
Speaker 2: is the perfect place for something like that to start
Speaker 2: and develop. And you know, we might need to do
Speaker 2: some excite for activities down here, just to shine some
Speaker 2: light on what they got going rams.
Speaker 1: Listen, Well, that's Abny excellence if I ever heard it.
Speaker 1: Shout out to Leicester Alan, Leicester, Leicester Allan. I'm not
Speaker 1: sure how to pronounce his name, but he is black.
Speaker 1: He's definitely an elder statesman, but he is black. And
Speaker 1: so the Black Wall Street, at least from appearances, appears
Speaker 1: to be in good hands and guided by someone who
Speaker 1: has a vested interest in the success of it. And
Speaker 1: so we're really excited about that. So that's our Ebny
Speaker 1: excellence on our birthday as a radio show. While I
Speaker 1: got the time too, Before we move on to the
Speaker 1: next topic, I want to make sure that I give
Speaker 1: a shout out to all the programmers around the country
Speaker 1: who have believed in this show. You know, some of
Speaker 1: you are listening to our voices on hip hop stations,
Speaker 1: some of you're listening to our voices on talk radio
Speaker 1: stations or whatever stations it is, even alternative stations. And
Speaker 1: you know, we're two young black men having long form
Speaker 1: conversations about what it means to have a black life
Speaker 1: in this country and the things that we have to endure.
Speaker 1: And we do our best to share this space with
Speaker 1: our brothers and sisters who were born with a strike
Speaker 1: against them, be they LGBTQ, Asian, Hispanic, Native, so forth,
Speaker 1: so on. But this is obviously a decidedly black space
Speaker 1: and for us to have had a year being able
Speaker 1: to have these long form conversations as a result of
Speaker 1: the decisions of the programmers behind the radio stations that
Speaker 1: you're listening to our voices on, we just want to
Speaker 1: make sure that we say thank you to those people
Speaker 1: who made those decisions to put us in position to
Speaker 1: be able to empower the communities that you live in.
Speaker 1: And you know, as you mentioned, he's in Atlanta, I'm
Speaker 1: in Phoenix at the moment. And the show obviously has
Speaker 1: grown since our first since our first episode, you know,
Speaker 1: and now we're on both coasts. We're all in the
Speaker 1: middle and certainly very excited about the year to come.
Speaker 1: With that said, onward and upward, let's talk about some
Speaker 1: more positive things that have happened in the past year.
Speaker 1: I think the most notable for black people, specifically, you know,
Speaker 1: if twenty twenty had to have a name associated with
Speaker 1: it given by black people, there's a number of names
Speaker 1: we could choose from, not the least of which is
Speaker 1: Kobe Bryant. You know, we had to revisit, you know,
Speaker 1: stuff with Nipsey. We had a lot of things that
Speaker 1: we had to process in twenty twenty. But George Floyd,
Speaker 1: I believe, will be top of that mountain right and
Speaker 1: everyone took to the streets demanding justice. And as we
Speaker 1: learn time and again as black people, there is no justice.
Speaker 1: There's no way to make sense of a senseless death,
Speaker 1: especially an agonizing like a horrible death where someone is
Speaker 1: crushed to death over the course of nearly nine minutes
Speaker 1: and it's on video with people telling the officer to stop.
Speaker 1: We all had to watch that. We all had to
Speaker 1: imagine our brothers, We all had to imagine our sons.
Speaker 1: We all had to imagine our cousins and relatives and
Speaker 1: friends and people that we love. We all as humans,
Speaker 1: not just as black people, but humans. Because I'm sure
Speaker 1: if you're listening to this show, if you can hear
Speaker 1: my voice, if you can hear a Q's voice, you
Speaker 1: know someone that you can imagine in the place of
Speaker 1: George Floyd, regardless of what they did in the past,
Speaker 1: regardless of where they're going, they don't deserve to be
Speaker 1: crushed out in the middle of the street like that.
Speaker 1: Everyone deserves a chance to say their peace, at least
Speaker 1: according to the laws in this country. You should be
Speaker 1: able to appear in court in front of a judge
Speaker 1: and say your peace, and then the judge is the
Speaker 1: person that we've appointed to decide your guilt or end incense,
Speaker 1: and you know, whatever punishment, if any, should be handed down.
Speaker 1: You should not be crushed to death on the street.
Speaker 1: You should not be shot in the back. You should
Speaker 1: not be shot period before you've had your day in court,
Speaker 1: unless you present a real viable threat to someone. And
Speaker 1: even then there are ways of dealing with it as
Speaker 1: we see time and again when the suspect or the
Speaker 1: alleged you know, gunman or whatever is a non black person.
Speaker 1: With that said, a little bit of positivity that we
Speaker 1: got and this was kind of connected to last year,
Speaker 1: but you know, in our year that we've been on
Speaker 1: the air, we've been able to have an episode where
Speaker 1: we talked about the Derek Chavin verdict and Derek Chauvin,
Speaker 1: of course, is the officer responsible for take the life
Speaker 1: of George Floyd. He was sentenced to twenty two and
Speaker 1: a half years, and that was something now we all.
Speaker 1: The reason why I want to say is because there's
Speaker 1: a lot of people that will listening to my voice,
Speaker 1: A lot of black people, of course, will listen to
Speaker 1: this and think that wasn't justice. You know, he deserved more.
Speaker 1: He took a life. You know, if he had been
Speaker 1: black and killed a white person, then this would be
Speaker 1: very different. He'd have been life in prison, sixty years,
Speaker 1: death penalty, whatever, right. And I understand that. I'm not
Speaker 1: trying to take that away from it. I recognize that
Speaker 1: the world is not fair. But I also remember what
Speaker 1: it felt like going into that trial, all of us
Speaker 1: thinking this man is going to walk because he's a
Speaker 1: police officer, because that's what happens. I remember people planning
Speaker 1: to protest, people planning to riot. That were I don't
Speaker 1: know any people that were planning to rite. Let me
Speaker 1: say this, right, but people were worried that people we're
Speaker 1: planning to riot if the verdict wasn't a guilty verdict.
Speaker 1: And I remember that time, and while this verdict isn't
Speaker 1: what some people wanted. It does document and it firmly
Speaker 1: entrenches in the timeline of this country that the powers
Speaker 1: that be decided that this action was wrong, which doesn't
Speaker 1: often happen. In most cases, there was not even charges
Speaker 1: brought for it. So the guilty verdict says that the
Speaker 1: powers that be says, yes, this is in fact wrong.
Speaker 1: And the punishment, while it might not have been what
Speaker 1: some of us wanted, as extreme and is harsh, you know,
Speaker 1: and I tend to agree with that, it could have
Speaker 1: been a much more fairer punishment. He took a life
Speaker 1: that should cost a life, you know, so a life sentence.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't believe in the death penalty, but
Speaker 1: that's a personal thing. I can see that side of
Speaker 1: the argument. But this twenty two and a half years
Speaker 1: does something significant, and it's that not only do the
Speaker 1: powers that beat the judges the country has to come
Speaker 1: to terms with the fact that this was wrong, but
Speaker 1: also that this officer would be punished, and even if
Speaker 1: he's not punished the way we wanted, what it does
Speaker 1: is it sends a message to other police officers and
Speaker 1: you know, precincts and you know, whatever, everyone who was
Speaker 1: thinking that, you know, this guy was black and he
Speaker 1: was trying to pass a twenty dollars bill that was fake,
Speaker 1: and he was a criminal four years prior, and blah
Speaker 1: blah blah, and he didn't he shouldn't be a hero.
Speaker 1: All those people had had to swallow those words, because
Speaker 1: in that moment, it wasn't about George Floyd as much
Speaker 1: as it was about did this man, Derek Shehlman do
Speaker 1: the right thing or the wrong thing? And if he
Speaker 1: did the wrong thing, will he be punished for it?
Speaker 1: And the answer, as we now know, is that he
Speaker 1: A did the wrong thing and b was punished for it. Again,
Speaker 1: don't blow me up on social media. I recognize that
Speaker 1: that punishment might not have been as severe as one
Speaker 1: as some people wanted, but he was punished for it.
Speaker 1: And the ripple effect of that, I believe is a
Speaker 1: net positive for the plight of black and brown people
Speaker 1: in this country, people who have often been the victims
Speaker 1: of police brutality, the victims of systemic oppression and white supremacy,
Speaker 1: and have never even had a chance at justice. You
Speaker 1: just have to take what these people do to you
Speaker 1: and eat it. And that's the story going all the
Speaker 1: way back to the beginning of this country. If you
Speaker 1: were born with a little bit more melanin than our
Speaker 1: Caucasian brothers and sisters, and so I call that a positive.
Speaker 1: And on our one year anniversary, if I'm looking back
Speaker 1: and I'm seeing the positive things that have happened in
Speaker 1: the year since we've been on the air, I definitely
Speaker 1: count that among them. Now, I might be alone because
Speaker 1: I haven't got your thoughts on it yet, Q, but
Speaker 1: I would love to hear what you think.
Speaker 2: So as you said, of course, there are of course
Speaker 2: a harsher sentence. But like you said, man, going into this,
Speaker 2: I think a lot of us expected for there to
Speaker 2: be nothing. In most cases, as Ramses has echoed, as
Speaker 2: we've talked about many times on this show, charges are
Speaker 2: not even brought against people in these situations. So him
Speaker 2: having to go to trial, being found guilty and there
Speaker 2: being some sort of accountability is a massive step forward.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: Of course, we would have felt there were more just
Speaker 2: and more fair punishments, but there are cases where something
Speaker 2: is better than nothing, and twenty two years is not nothing. Right,
Speaker 2: We've seen someone going to a person's house and murder
Speaker 2: them and get a I think less than ten years.
Speaker 2: So this case being as loud and as publicly scrutinized
Speaker 2: as it was definitely helped us get at least some
Speaker 2: semblance of justice. And you know, the idea of celebrating
Speaker 2: a person going to prison might seem kind of wrong,
Speaker 2: except our history in this country has shown, you know,
Speaker 2: as an entire movement started on the basis of Black
Speaker 2: lives matter, right, the idea that we just deserve to
Speaker 2: exist and shouldn't be snuffed out without consequence is proof
Speaker 2: positive that we've been shown the contrary by this country
Speaker 2: for a very long time. So there was kind of
Speaker 2: a clinching of the fist, celebratory feel of him first
Speaker 2: being found guilty and there at least being some significant sentence. Right,
Speaker 2: twenty two years is not nothing. It's not life, and
Speaker 2: it's not fifty or sixty years, but it's not nothing.
Speaker 2: And most of the significant parts of this man's life
Speaker 2: will be spent in prison, even if it's not the
Speaker 2: rest of his life. It's our one year anniversary, so
Speaker 2: I'm trying to keep it as positive as possible.
Speaker 1: That's what I was gonna say. I appreciate that you
Speaker 1: normally you don't even be in this direction, man, good
Speaker 1: for you.
Speaker 2: I'm trying my best, man. You know, there's, of course,
Speaker 2: there are spaces in my brain where it's like, okay,
Speaker 2: just like Barack Obama became the two term president, so
Speaker 2: America had to get us back with what happened next.
Speaker 2: We all know what happened next. He's like, Okay, you
Speaker 2: guys got that. Now, this is how we really feel.
Speaker 2: The me too movement started years ago, and a lot
Speaker 2: of despicable people had to be held accountable for their actions.
Speaker 2: But here come legislation all over the country with the
Speaker 2: most strict and insane anti abortion laws that we've ever
Speaker 2: heard of. So like, yeah, y'all got that, but here
Speaker 2: we come with ours. So the powers that be always
Speaker 2: find a way to kind of remind us who's in charge.
Speaker 2: So I'm not going to go full me and find
Speaker 2: some negative to talk about. But I'm always reserved because
Speaker 2: you know, as I remind us, far too often, I
Speaker 2: have not been allowed to be in the space of
Speaker 2: hope and optimism. As my brother.
Speaker 1: Ramses, well, one more thing, you know, based on the
Speaker 1: browning of America, based on the census that we've recently done,
Speaker 1: my assumption is that the population will continue to reflect
Speaker 1: a more liberal philosophy and of voting, and you know,
Speaker 1: this won't be a majority white country forever, and hopefully
Speaker 1: we will learn how to be better brothers and sisters
Speaker 1: once that happens, you know what I mean. And so
Speaker 1: that's something that I'm optimistic about, is just the population shift,
Speaker 1: if nothing else. Long term, the shift in population should
Speaker 1: bring about a shift in ideas and ideals. And so
Speaker 1: I want to make sure I say that now another
Speaker 1: thing that I think was positive, now that I'm saying
Speaker 1: these things out loud, they are kind of sad stories,
Speaker 1: but they have endings that weren't sad as sad, and
Speaker 1: so that's really the right way I should say it,
Speaker 1: because this is certainly not a positive story. This is
Speaker 1: one time when I actually cried. Maybe I am a crier,
Speaker 1: but this next name, I saw the video of he
Speaker 1: was a kid. I saw the video of him, I
Speaker 1: saw the light in his eyes, I saw his smile,
Speaker 1: and then I read the story about what happened to him,
Speaker 1: and then I read the transcript as he said the
Speaker 1: last words that he'd ever say, and it was heartbreaking.
Speaker 1: You know, I have a little brother who's kind of
Speaker 1: a quiet guy. If you look at him, he might
Speaker 1: look scary to you. You know, he keeps to himself.
Speaker 1: He does just how he is. He's that way. He's
Speaker 1: quiet with me. I love him with my whole heart.
Speaker 1: He loves me, but we don't talk a lot, but
Speaker 1: he enjoys being in my presence. I'm his big brother,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So some people loved it differently,
Speaker 1: and I could see some similarities when I saw this.
Speaker 1: This young man, his name is Elijah McClain. This sounds sad,
Speaker 1: but it has a not as sad ending, and I
Speaker 1: really wanted to make sure that I talked about this
Speaker 1: on our one year anniversary. So I want to read
Speaker 1: this for those who are not as familiar with Elijah
Speaker 1: as they are with George Floyd.
Speaker 4: So.
Speaker 1: He was born February twenty fifth, nineteen ninety six, and
Speaker 1: his last day was August thirtieth, twenty nineteen. He made
Speaker 1: it twenty three years. He was a massage therapist from Aurora, Colorado,
Speaker 1: and he died six days after a violent police accounter
Speaker 1: on August twenty fourth, twenty nineteen. Three Aurora police officers
Speaker 1: confronted McLain after responding to a call by an Aurora
Speaker 1: Citizen about an unarmed person wearing a ski mask that
Speaker 1: looked quote sketchy end quote. The three police officers who
Speaker 1: were involved in the incident, Nathan Woodyard. Why am I
Speaker 1: reading these people's names. I'm gonna just skip that. They said
Speaker 1: that there was a struggle with McClain and McLain was
Speaker 1: forcibly held to the ground with his hands cut behind
Speaker 1: his back, after which paramedics there's and then named a
Speaker 1: couple of paramedics here. I don't think that their names
Speaker 1: deserve to be mentioned. They had ministered some sort of
Speaker 1: sedative to McLain while he was on the ground. He
Speaker 1: went into I believe it's cardiac arrests, and then three
Speaker 1: days after arriving at the hospital, he was declared brain dead.
Speaker 1: He was removed from life support on August thirtieth. His
Speaker 1: autopsy was inconclusive and the cause of death was listed
Speaker 1: as undetermined by the coroner. The police officers met with
Speaker 1: the coroner before the announcement that the cause of death
Speaker 1: could not be determined, and police investigators were also in
Speaker 1: present during the autopsy. Now, I want to stop there
Speaker 1: before I say this next part. The transcript that you
Speaker 1: can read from this interaction, because you know it's recorded,
Speaker 1: they have the police cameras or whatever. He's saying. He's
Speaker 1: saying to the officers, calmly saying, I'm different. I remember
Speaker 1: him saying that I'm just different. You know, there's nothing
Speaker 1: to be worried about. He's saying like we're we're friends,
Speaker 1: or we're like I love you, or something like that.
Speaker 1: He was saying to the officers. There was no struggle,
Speaker 1: no adversarial tone in his in the language he was using, right,
Speaker 1: And if you see the videos of him, you'll you
Speaker 1: can see immediately that, oh, this is definitely that this type,
Speaker 1: that's the type of person that he is or was,
Speaker 1: because he's not alive anymore. He didn't get to finish
Speaker 1: growing up. And in Colorado it's cold, you know, and
Speaker 1: I believe he had a condition, some sort of medical condition.
Speaker 1: Might have been anemia, sickle cell or something. I don't
Speaker 1: hold me to it, but you know, this is a
Speaker 1: while back when this happened, when I read about all this.
Speaker 1: But he had the face mask on and the ski
Speaker 1: mask on to keep warm, and of course you know
Speaker 1: that can look very threatening to whoever this Aurora citizen is.
Speaker 1: And if the Aurora citizen alerts the police. Then the
Speaker 1: police move under the assumption that the person is quote sketchy,
Speaker 1: and then they govern themselves accordingly. And you could make
Speaker 1: a case that officers' jobs are difficult and they have
Speaker 1: to go in, you know, under the assumption that there's
Speaker 1: a bad guy out there, because if they don't, then
Speaker 1: they could be in. You know, you can make that case.
Speaker 1: But once you read the transcripts, once the officers are
Speaker 1: interacting with him, and once you see that they are
Speaker 1: overreacting very much to this person who was just walking
Speaker 1: down the street and then ultimately he lost his life
Speaker 1: because of their actions, and those are the paramedics, then
Speaker 1: this next line, this next bar becomes again not good news.
Speaker 1: It's not a happy ending, but it is an ending
Speaker 1: that is not as sad as the ones we're accustomed to,
Speaker 1: So allow me to continue. In September twenty twenty one,
Speaker 1: the three police officers and two paramedics were charged through
Speaker 1: a Colorado grand jury and they were also they were
Speaker 1: charged with the death of Elijah McLain. Long story short,
Speaker 1: So for charges to even be brought to these people
Speaker 1: is almost unheard of when the victim is black and
Speaker 1: you know, there's this narrative that exists in this country.
Speaker 1: I don't know, oh how fair it is. I'm not
Speaker 1: saying it's unfair, but that the narrative is that our
Speaker 1: first responders are heroes. And when I think of heroes,
Speaker 1: I think of like Superman. You know, I'm not knocking anybody,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, But I think of those
Speaker 1: types of people, and they don't get paid. Superman never
Speaker 1: got paid to save anyone's life, you know. But if
Speaker 1: you get paid to do something before, you're a hero.
Speaker 1: It's a job. If you do something heroic while in
Speaker 1: that job, then maybe we can have that conversation. I'm
Speaker 1: actually willing to have that conversation with you if you
Speaker 1: go above and beyond that call of duty. But I
Speaker 1: think the term hero really can serve to elevate a
Speaker 1: person from doing their job to like an almost godlike status.
Speaker 1: And I don't know if it's deserved all the time.
Speaker 1: I don't know that it's fair all the time. Obviously,
Speaker 1: there's instance is like the one we're talking about, where
Speaker 1: people lose their lives, and of course we talk all
Speaker 1: the time about how police who are often considered first responders.
Speaker 1: You know, there's a tremendous amount of loss of life
Speaker 1: when it comes to policing. It's not to say that
Speaker 1: people don't save lives too, you know, but when we
Speaker 1: automatically start off with this hero narrative and we don't
Speaker 1: look at it like it's a job where some people
Speaker 1: can be good at it and some people can be
Speaker 1: bad at it, and you know, people rush to defend that,
Speaker 1: you know, in the same way that you defend troops
Speaker 1: and you defend everything else, which I'm not saying is wrong. Obviously,
Speaker 1: these people are very important, the roles they play society
Speaker 1: is very important. But it's almost like people are impervious
Speaker 1: to having human shortcomings, which is very unfair when it
Speaker 1: comes time to hold folks accountable for their actions. I
Speaker 1: think I'll leave it right there and now hold my
Speaker 1: mic back.
Speaker 4: You're like that.
Speaker 1: Striking waters from headquarters behind him. And if you're just
Speaker 1: tuning in the civic cipher, I'm your host, rams is joh.
Speaker 2: Sometimes my mom calls me Q dirty, and that's a
Speaker 2: whole nother conversation that we'll have another day.
Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, Well, if you just tune it in and
Speaker 1: stick around, we are having our one year anniversary show,
Speaker 1: and we chose to discuss some of the more positive
Speaker 1: things that have happened over the year that we've been
Speaker 1: on the air, and coming up in the show, we
Speaker 1: will be talking about perhaps the biggest donor of the year,
Speaker 1: Fiscal Donor. In our Become a Better Ally segment, we
Speaker 1: do want to talk about some other things that have happened,
Speaker 1: some past things and some present things going on, and
Speaker 1: of course we're checking with DJ Swolf with that way
Speaker 1: Black History fact. But for now, let's go ahead and
Speaker 1: discuss our Becoming a Better Ally highlight. This time we're
Speaker 1: talking about a woman named Mackenzie Scott. For those of you,
Speaker 1: I know her, Yeah, yeah, I didn't know her until
Speaker 1: all this stuff happened, but she was got the she
Speaker 1: got it all. It ain't matter, but yeah, she ended
Speaker 1: up divorcing Jeff Bezos. She ended up with billions of
Speaker 1: dollars and she and other billionaires there are some other billionaires,
Speaker 1: but has committed to giving away the majority of her wealth.
Speaker 1: The thing that interests me and us around here is
Speaker 1: that her donating nearly seven billion dollars since her split,
Speaker 1: She's given away nearly one point seven billion to historically
Speaker 1: black colleges and universities and women's in LGBTQ equity organizations.
Speaker 1: So if those aren't marginalized individuals or people born with
Speaker 1: a strike against them, I don't know what is one
Speaker 1: point seven billion dollars to institutions of higher education or
Speaker 1: institutions dedicated to fortifying and preserving the lives, cultures, legacies
Speaker 1: of black individuals, brown individuals, gay individuals, and so forth.
Speaker 1: And you know, there's been this big call for reparations
Speaker 1: since forever. And you know, if that never comes about
Speaker 1: legally on paper, like where you are donating to a
Speaker 1: cause or you're taxed for it and then the government
Speaker 1: pays it out to folks who've been harmed by the
Speaker 1: government's actions past, you can pay your reparations on your
Speaker 1: own in the same way that Mackenzie Scott does. You
Speaker 1: can just give money to black organizations and support them,
Speaker 1: and in doing that you will become a better ally.
Speaker 1: Money never hurts, And as long as you make sure
Speaker 1: you know who you're donating your money to and you
Speaker 1: really believe in the cause, Karmicalley believe that'll get you
Speaker 1: in line with the universe and where you want to
Speaker 1: be ultimately. So so yeah, something keep in mind, big
Speaker 1: shout out to Mackenzie Scott though we didn't get a
Speaker 1: chance to talk about her before, so we're doing it now.
Speaker 3: It's a good year, big shout out.
Speaker 2: Indeed, now.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about the big one, the big thing that
Speaker 1: has happened since we've been on the air. Well, the
Speaker 1: other big thing. The name. There used to be a
Speaker 1: name that we heard. Shoot, I would say every day,
Speaker 1: but it was really more like two or three times
Speaker 1: a day. And every time.
Speaker 2: We have that same.
Speaker 1: I'll let you say it. Or maybe maybe this world can.
Speaker 2: Say do we have to say that?
Speaker 1: Well, how about we strongly imply it. I think people
Speaker 1: will be able to be able to catch up. So anyway,
Speaker 1: if you'll remember, back in twenty twenty, there was a
Speaker 1: name that we would all wake up and see on
Speaker 1: our phones, this name, and we would see what he
Speaker 1: did that day, how he made this country look horrible,
Speaker 1: how he emboldened the worst ideals that this country has
Speaker 1: ever had, how he doubled down on things like you know,
Speaker 1: the Confederate Confederate flag and and just and the emboldened part,
Speaker 1: that's the part that really got to me above anything else.
Speaker 1: You know, people I saw more swastika written in bathroom
Speaker 1: stalls since twenty sixteen then I've ever seen in the
Speaker 1: sum total of my whole life. You know, the group
Speaker 1: that felt like he was their guy, the group that
Speaker 1: had harbored some sentiments, and perhaps in twenty thirteen, twenty fifteen,
Speaker 1: they felt like, Okay, I'm part of the minority. This
Speaker 1: is a you know, I might feel this way, but
Speaker 1: you know the world is moving in this direction. So
Speaker 1: I got to keep it to myself. Once this guy
Speaker 1: got elected, everybody was like, oh no, I'll bets are
Speaker 1: off we out here now. And then you know, people
Speaker 1: started doing stuff, being violent, you know whatever, and this
Speaker 1: guy would have these rallies and he would just he
Speaker 1: had no tact. He was exceptionally rude. He was a bully,
Speaker 1: he was a bigot, everything everything you can imagine. And
Speaker 1: then he lied and lied and lied, and then just
Speaker 1: fumbled his way through an entire presidency. And we all
Speaker 1: woke up to that. Every day. We're traumatized by it.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't know many black people who were
Speaker 1: fans of his. I don't know any who were fans
Speaker 1: of his. I don't know many who were like just like, hey,
Speaker 1: he's our guy. So that's just what we're riding with.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't know any like black Trumpers, like
Speaker 1: go Trump. You know, there's some people who are just Republican. Man.
Speaker 2: I didn't think we were going to say it.
Speaker 1: Oh dang, I'm sorry, I almost made it. But anyway,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm trying to say. Anyway, so we
Speaker 1: made it through that time, and then there came the end,
Speaker 1: and there was all of this hearsay about what was
Speaker 1: going to happen and who was going to run. Is
Speaker 1: it going to be Bernie Sanders, is it going to
Speaker 1: be you know, Joe Biden or whatever? And then you know,
Speaker 1: we know how the story went. Biden and Kamala Harris.
Speaker 1: You know, they ran an excellent campaign on the nomination
Speaker 1: and won the election. And then you know, January sixth
Speaker 1: happened and a lot of the I don't know how
Speaker 1: to call his fanatics without saying his name again, but
Speaker 1: his fanatics stormed the Capitol and we're watching this happen.
Speaker 1: It seems like something that would happen on a movie.
Speaker 1: We're watching it happen on the actual news, and it's scary.
Speaker 1: And then there's the loss of life and then you
Speaker 1: get to really see this ugly side of it. You know,
Speaker 1: no one did that when when this guy won over
Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton. No one was like, hey, you know what,
Speaker 1: We're not going to take this. You know, that's whatever.
Speaker 1: But these people, they really really felt like, this is
Speaker 1: our country and we're losing it to folks south of
Speaker 1: the border. This is our country, and we're losing it
Speaker 1: to people from these s whole countries. This is our country,
Speaker 1: and we were living in fear because of you know,
Speaker 1: our cold, our coal mining jobs are going away to China,
Speaker 1: you know, like all kinds of weird stuff like that. Man,
Speaker 1: these people are and that, and they had their guy
Speaker 1: and they were willing to fight for him and die
Speaker 1: for them. And that's exactly what happened. And you know,
Speaker 1: in hindsight, it's easier to feel bad. At the time,
Speaker 1: I really didn't, but it's really easy to feel bad
Speaker 1: for people who have experienced a great deal of hopelessness.
Speaker 1: Hear me out, I see your face cue hear me out.
Speaker 1: In hindsight, it's easy to feel it's it's easier to
Speaker 1: feel bad when you are born with this seeming like superpower,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Maybe it doesn't appear that
Speaker 1: way to you, you know, in your early stages of
Speaker 1: your life. But you're born, and you have white skin, yes,
Speaker 1: And everyone on TV looks like you, and everyone on
Speaker 1: the billboards and the panteene pro v commercials and everyone
Speaker 1: looks just like you. And this is the world was
Speaker 1: shaped in your image, you know. And you're curious, why
Speaker 1: do people want to change the world so much? You know,
Speaker 1: why are these people always complaining? You know, because the
Speaker 1: world suits you so well, it's hard to see why
Speaker 1: anybody would have a problem with it. You know, it's
Speaker 1: hard to come out of your own come off your
Speaker 1: own porch to see what's really going on in the streets. Right,
Speaker 1: but you know, I'm a human and I recognize some
Speaker 1: human things that happen.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 1: You get comfortable, You get secure in your own little world,
Speaker 1: and your frame of reference tells you all the truths
Speaker 1: that you need to be true, and then everything is good,
Speaker 1: and then beyond that, everything else belongs to Like it
Speaker 1: doesn't exist in your world. I mean it exists, you're
Speaker 1: aware of it, but it doesn't affect you one way
Speaker 1: or the other, so you're not too concerned about it. Well,
Speaker 1: you get older, and then you realize what American dream.
Speaker 1: I was supposed to be a movie star. I was
Speaker 1: supposed to be rich and famous. I was supposed to
Speaker 1: be this and that and the other. You know, why
Speaker 1: are these people complaining, you know, just because they are
Speaker 1: Michael Jordan is black, you know, and he's rich. Or
Speaker 1: look at this guy and or Morgan Freu, whatever name
Speaker 1: they want to pick, he did. Okay. Meanwhile, I'm here
Speaker 1: and I'm white, and I can't get a break. This
Speaker 1: was supposed to happen for me. I was sold something
Speaker 1: that didn't happen, and this can't This presidential candidate guy
Speaker 1: was able to find that gap in between who they
Speaker 1: were and who they were supposed to be quote unquote
Speaker 1: and give them a reason that they didn't make it. Oh,
Speaker 1: well because the jobs are gone, oh because this happened.
Speaker 1: Or because these people are coming and taking over the country.
Speaker 1: Oh because your tax dollars are going to waste. Oh
Speaker 1: because people are on welfare, oh this, oh that or
Speaker 1: the other. You know, and these people because they were
Speaker 1: so disillusioned and disappointed in the outcomes of their lives
Speaker 1: and their station in life. You know, of course it
Speaker 1: can be their own fault. It can't be their own problem.
Speaker 1: It has to be someone else, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: Everything should be like the Disney movies I saw when
Speaker 1: I was a kid. They were vulnerable for that message
Speaker 1: from that man and that Those are the same people
Speaker 1: that went to the capitol. Those are the same people
Speaker 1: that want to hang on to this the Confederate flag
Speaker 1: of a country that existed for like six months or something,
Speaker 1: or it's a couple of years. I want to say,
Speaker 1: you know, maybe six years, I don't know, whatever it was.
Speaker 1: It wasn't It was very brief. And then that country
Speaker 1: actually lost and they wave that flag around and it's
Speaker 1: the losing flag. May as well be a white flag.
Speaker 1: It's crazy, but it's all that they have, you know.
Speaker 1: It's it's their legacy, it's their heritage, it's their culture,
Speaker 1: if you will. And it's sad. It's when you start
Speaker 1: to take a step back and look at it, it's
Speaker 1: like it's really sad. And then you start to see
Speaker 1: how everyone else is a threat to them. You start
Speaker 1: to understand it's not fair. But I get it. How
Speaker 1: Black people can be a threat, how Hispanic people can
Speaker 1: be a threat, how Asian people can be a threat.
Speaker 1: You know what I mean, because this world you've been
Speaker 1: taught was created for you to succeed, and if you
Speaker 1: don't succeed, it can't be your own fault. It can't
Speaker 1: be the fault of these rich people. It can't be
Speaker 1: the fault of capitalism, it can't be the fault of
Speaker 1: anything that you can't see. But if I do point
Speaker 1: someone out to you and they look a little different
Speaker 1: from you, it can be their fault. And it's such
Speaker 1: an easy self for a lot of people. And it's
Speaker 1: not because these folks are white. It could happen to anyone,
Speaker 1: but it just so happens to be the case that
Speaker 1: they're white. And so it's from that vantage point that
Speaker 1: I look at it and I say, it's easier to
Speaker 1: feel bad now looking back on it in hindsight, you know,
Speaker 1: these people aren't They are angry, but above that, they're desperate,
Speaker 1: you know, for something, something to blame, something to make
Speaker 1: their lives make sense. And you start to feel bad,
Speaker 1: and at least for me, I begin to become more compassion.
Speaker 1: I recognize education changes a lot of things, and some
Speaker 1: people do not wish to be educated. But you know,
Speaker 1: some people, other people besides me, maybe they can have
Speaker 1: conversations with these people who need to blame their lives
Speaker 1: on some cause. And if I'm talking on this show
Speaker 1: to the middleman people you know whose aunts and uncles
Speaker 1: they'll see at Christmas, and they can have conversations over
Speaker 1: Thanksgiving dinner and say, hey, listen, man, just so you know,
Speaker 1: you know, people that come across the border aren't here
Speaker 1: to take your jobs. You know, they're not going to
Speaker 1: them Coming into this country is not going to change
Speaker 1: your lifestyle one bit. You know, I feel like we're
Speaker 1: doing something positive in the past year. And so this
Speaker 1: man's name what I accidentally said, but I won't say again,
Speaker 1: not being in office anymore, not galvanizing those people, our
Speaker 1: white brothers and sisters who maybe are feeling like life
Speaker 1: hasn't the American dream hasn't been what they expected it
Speaker 1: to be, you know, maybe a little disappointed with the
Speaker 1: outcomes in their stories. The fact that he's not in
Speaker 1: office anymore, turning them against us, I say, that's a win.
Speaker 1: And you know it's up to people like us to
Speaker 1: continue to have conversations with our Caucasian brothers and sisters
Speaker 1: and be brothers and sisters to them when we're able
Speaker 1: to be strong. You know, Black people were known for
Speaker 1: being strong, you know, so if we can be strong again,
Speaker 1: then I believe it's our duty to be strong again
Speaker 1: because no matter what, we have to be brothers and
Speaker 1: sisters here. So I'm not knocking anybody. I know, it's
Speaker 1: a very black and white show that you know we
Speaker 1: have here. I would never do that, you know. But
Speaker 1: you know, there's there's a little bit of tough love
Speaker 1: that goes into these conversations, and then there's a little
Speaker 1: bit of like more gentle, compassionate, you know, sugar coated
Speaker 1: love that goes into it as well, because I think
Speaker 1: that takes both sides to to get us where we
Speaker 1: need to be. So anyway, I call that a positive
Speaker 1: with that guy not being in office. And of course,
Speaker 1: Kamala Harris, that's a good look for women, that's a
Speaker 1: good look for Asian people, it's a good look for
Speaker 1: Black people, and it's a great look for the AKA.
Speaker 1: Shout out to doctor Westernberg, shout out to Janelle. Would
Speaker 1: your thoughts cue anything?
Speaker 2: I don't have a whole lot. There is absolutely a
Speaker 2: segment of the population that fits the exact description that
Speaker 2: you just gave. There is also a segment of the
Speaker 2: population that saw a racist bigot playing a racist bigot
Speaker 2: on TV and said, Oh, that guy's like me. Let's
Speaker 2: run it boom. It was not as complex, it was
Speaker 2: not as deep, it was not as it was not
Speaker 2: as much mental and emotional manipulation. They just saw themselves
Speaker 2: in him. Even if they didn't see themselves as racist bigots,
Speaker 2: they did see themselves in him. And that's why a
Speaker 2: lot of people push back so hard when you say
Speaker 2: something bad about him, because they don't see themselves that way.
Speaker 2: I'm not a racist, I'm not a bigot. I feel
Speaker 2: the same way, so he can't be. No, you all are.
Speaker 2: And the most divisive period of my lifetime was his presidency.
Speaker 2: And that's having grown up in Detroit, Michigan, with the
Speaker 2: mother that was born and raised in Making, Georgia, and
Speaker 2: those being the places I spent most of my life,
Speaker 2: growing up in a country where racism has always existed.
Speaker 2: The worst of it for me was when he was
Speaker 2: the president and in bolden was a word that you used,
Speaker 2: not just in Bolden, but encouraged outward overt racism and
Speaker 2: using things to intentionally divide us because it was in
Speaker 2: his own personal best interest. I think he might have
Speaker 2: even doubled down on things that he didn't feel as
Speaker 2: strongly about as he said out loud, because he knew
Speaker 2: that there were people in this country that supported him,
Speaker 2: that did so he played to it. On top of
Speaker 2: being a despicable person, he played to the most despicable
Speaker 2: things in other people as a way to springboard his
Speaker 2: own agenda forward. He manipulated, lied to and made a
Speaker 2: mockery of our government, and made a fool of a
Speaker 2: lot of our citizens in front of them, and they
Speaker 2: still supported them, lied to them, cheated them, took advantage
Speaker 2: of them, stole from them, and even when they learned
Speaker 2: of these things, they dug their heels in so far
Speaker 2: and so deep and supported him for so long. So
Speaker 2: it was a zealot like base he developed, and it
Speaker 2: was super discouraging man. It was part of what has
Speaker 2: stoked my more pessimistic fire on this show is the
Speaker 2: men that you're talking about, because I saw him bring
Speaker 2: out the worst and people that I know, people that
Speaker 2: I care about, people that thoroughly disappointed me and really
Speaker 2: really surprised and caught me off guard with their support
Speaker 2: of his beliefs and with their justifications of his actions.
Speaker 2: So you know, it's a time that I can't wait
Speaker 2: to be history. It still feels too present sometimes, and
Speaker 2: some of the things that we deal with, like what's
Speaker 2: going on over in Afghanistan, are still very much a
Speaker 2: part of his legacy. So good riddance, and hopefully I
Speaker 2: can be as hopeful and optimistic as my brother Rams
Speaker 2: is with regard to where we can go from here.
Speaker 1: Well, I like that very eloquently stated by the way
Speaker 1: it's you know, on this show, we've never been the
Speaker 1: type of people that has been like, haha, we want
Speaker 1: you lost, you know whatever. And I think that if
Speaker 1: we were to be that way, no one would be
Speaker 1: able to hold it against us, just because of what
Speaker 1: we've been through. But you know, we've always tried at
Speaker 1: least to have a little bit more poise and you know,
Speaker 1: be a little bit more you know, take the high road,
Speaker 1: you know when it comes to that. And I think
Speaker 1: that your thoughts kind of reflect that that attitude, So
Speaker 1: I'm appreciative of that. Another thing, and this one is
Speaker 1: a little bit more recent, that I think is positive
Speaker 1: that has happened in the.
Speaker 3: Past year, is.
Speaker 1: Uh, do you remember so we didn't get to talk
Speaker 1: about this on the show. But do you remember that
Speaker 1: there was a video that came out a couple of
Speaker 1: weeks ago. I want to say maybe Swirl sent it
Speaker 1: to us. Did that come from I don't know what
Speaker 1: you're talking about yet. Okay, Well, anyway, it was a video,
Speaker 1: it came out. I'll describe it the U. The video
Speaker 1: was a woman, black woman walking her dog. It was
Speaker 1: night and you know, I didn't really get too much
Speaker 1: it's just a video, but she was walking her dog
Speaker 1: and an officer ran upon her and yelled at her
Speaker 1: and assaulted her and then grabbed her and did all
Speaker 1: this stuff with her and ultimately let her go. And
Speaker 1: it was a very aggressive encounter from the officer, needlessly
Speaker 1: aggressive because a woman obviously wasn't doing anything. She was
Speaker 1: walking her dog. And you know, from the video there's
Speaker 1: no audio, you can't really, you know, hear what's happened.
Speaker 1: And of course, on our end, we've learned as journalists
Speaker 1: not to really jump to any conclusions save the obvious conclusion,
Speaker 1: which is, well, that doesn't seem like it's necessary. This
Speaker 1: huge man attacking this woman who's walking her dog. You know,
Speaker 1: there's no weapons, nothing, this woman poses a no threat,
Speaker 1: if she was trespassing, or if there was anything going
Speaker 1: on that was you know, you know whatever, you can
Speaker 1: just talk to this woman. But you know, when we
Speaker 1: see it happen, we're like, oh my god, this is
Speaker 1: completely unnecessary. Unfortunately, the woman wasn't you know, she wasn't
Speaker 1: killed or anything crazy like that, but you could see
Speaker 1: the aggressive sort of type of behavior coming from the officer. Now,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't know how to point you to the direction
Speaker 1: of that video. I guess if you wanted to see
Speaker 1: it yourself, you could google black woman walking dog attacked
Speaker 1: by officer. Maybe it'll come up and you'll be.
Speaker 3: Able to see it.
Speaker 1: The video takes place, it looks like it's nighttime, and
Speaker 1: you can see for yourself exactly what happened. Well, under
Speaker 1: normal circumstances, we would expect to see a video like that.
Speaker 1: You know, in our group chat, we share stories like
Speaker 1: that all the time in order to prepare for the
Speaker 1: show every week. We would expect to see a video
Speaker 1: like that and say, well, this is just another incident
Speaker 1: of what is happening, and we could talk about it,
Speaker 1: or we could not. Maybe it contributes something meaningful to
Speaker 1: the narrative or maybe it doesn't, but we're already aware
Speaker 1: that these type of things happen. They have happened since
Speaker 1: long before we were born, and unfortunately, our belief around
Speaker 1: here is that they will continue to happen for some time.
Speaker 1: And you know, that's just kind of what we're dealing with.
Speaker 1: But the reason that we're talking about this one today
Speaker 1: and the reason why, again it's not necessarily positive outcome,
Speaker 1: but it's not as negative, and you know, on our
Speaker 1: birthday it felt meaningful to have some not as negative things.
Speaker 1: The officer involved is now facing twenty four or rather,
Speaker 1: he has faced twenty four misconduct allegations since joining the
Speaker 1: force in nineteen ninety eight. Three were sustained, resulting in discipline,
Speaker 1: and the most serious incident involved in off duty incident
Speaker 1: in Tennessee, which the officer was suspended for twenty days
Speaker 1: and arrested on aggravated assault charges after pointing a gun
Speaker 1: at a victim and subjecting them to verbal abuse. So
Speaker 1: the reason that we're talking about this is because the
Speaker 1: calls to action against this officer have resulted in disciplinary action,
Speaker 1: which is now not so unheard of. You know, now
Speaker 1: that we've talked about Derek Shelvin and the Elijah McLain
Speaker 1: case and so forth. You know, it is possible for
Speaker 1: you to act out of pocket and get himmed up. Now,
Speaker 1: obviously this story tells us that you can do it,
Speaker 1: you know, twenty four times and get away with it
Speaker 1: and still be a police officer. But that twenty fifth one,
Speaker 1: you know, it'll catch up to you, which in the
Speaker 1: past hasn't always been true when it comes to police
Speaker 1: and certainly the way that police interact with black and
Speaker 1: brown bodies, and so that I believe is progress. That
Speaker 1: is something that we can look back on our year
Speaker 1: being on the radio and say, the world is slightly
Speaker 1: better than the one that we started in and hopefully
Speaker 1: we're contributing something meaningful to that growth, and we will
Speaker 1: be able to continue to do so with the help
Speaker 1: of our listeners and with the help of these programmers,
Speaker 1: and just you know, with our own fortitude toward that end.
Speaker 3: And so.
Speaker 1: With that said, I think it's time to check in with.
Speaker 3: DJ Swirl for that Way Black History Fact.
Speaker 4: And his Way Black History Flat in Fact Highlights. David Ruggles,
Speaker 4: aka the Soul of the Underground Railroad. David Ruggles was
Speaker 4: an African American abolitionist in New York who resisted slavery
Speaker 4: by his participation in a Committee of Vigilance in the
Speaker 4: underground Railroad to help fugitive slaves reach free states. He
Speaker 4: was a printer in New York City during the eighteen
Speaker 4: thirties who also wrote numerous articles and was quote the
Speaker 4: prototype for black activist journalists of his time end quote.
Speaker 4: He claimed to have led more than six hundred fugitive
Speaker 4: slaves of freedom in the North, including Frederick Douglass, who
Speaker 4: became a friend and fellow activist. Ruggles opened the first
Speaker 4: African American bookstore in eighteen thirty four and was secretary
Speaker 4: of the New York Committee of Vigilance, a radical biracial
Speaker 4: organization to aid future of slaves, opposed slavery and informed
Speaker 4: enslave workers in New York about their rights in the state.
Speaker 4: In October eighteen thirty eight, Ruggles assisted Frederick Douglass on
Speaker 4: his journey to freedom and reunited Douglas with his fiancee,
Speaker 4: Anna Murray. Ruggles was especially active against kidnapping bounty hunters,
Speaker 4: also known as blackbirds, who made a living by capturing
Speaker 4: free black people in the North and illegally selling them
Speaker 4: into slavery, as was done to Solomon Northrop in eighteen
Speaker 4: forty one, whose story was portrayed in the movie Twelve
Speaker 4: Years a Slave. With the Vigilance Committee, Ruggles fought for
Speaker 4: fugitive slaves to have the right to jury trials and
Speaker 4: helped arrange legal assistance for them. His activism earned him
Speaker 4: many enemies. Ruggles was physically assaulted and his bookshop was
Speaker 4: destroyed through arson. He quickly reopened his library and bookshop.
Speaker 4: There were also two known attempts to kidnap him and
Speaker 4: sell him into slavery in the South. His enemies even
Speaker 4: included fellow abolitionists who disagreed with his tactics. Ruggles ultimately
Speaker 4: paid a steep price for his actimism, exhaust sing himself
Speaker 4: and burning way out, burning out, way too soon. He
Speaker 4: died blind and ill at thirty nine, never acquiring much
Speaker 4: fame or fortune, and that comes from both Wikipedia and
Speaker 4: USA today.
Speaker 1: Ruggles I'm assuming was black. Yes, okay, anythank you, because
Speaker 1: I'll go.
Speaker 2: I'm sad that I've never heard his name before.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 2: I'm sad that his fire was put out at such
Speaker 2: a young age. I'm already older than he was when
Speaker 2: he passed. Away being down here in Atlanta being reminded
Speaker 2: that I'm already older than doctor Martin Luther King was
Speaker 2: when his fire was put out. The things that they
Speaker 2: were able to accomplish, the impact that they had on
Speaker 2: the world forever at such young ages, it's really, really,
Speaker 2: really powerful when you sit back and think about it.
Speaker 2: I'm going to try to figure out a way to
Speaker 2: say this man's name more, to bring him up more,
Speaker 2: because again I never heard his story before right now,
Speaker 2: and man, that was hard to listen to. Inspiring, like
Speaker 2: I said, all the things he did before even reaching
Speaker 2: the age that I am now, but difficult because you know,
Speaker 2: I wish that his life had not come to an
Speaker 2: end alone and blind.
Speaker 1: I got something. Well, one thing that I do definitely
Speaker 1: want to talk about is I think I always had
Speaker 1: an idea, you know, for a long time that there
Speaker 1: might be people who would capture free black folks in
Speaker 1: the country and and then kidnap them and sell them
Speaker 1: into slavery in the South, you know, capture them in
Speaker 1: free states where they're just going about their business, throw
Speaker 1: them in the back of a wagon, I guess horse
Speaker 1: wagon or whatever, and shoot them to you know, bucksnort Tennessee,
Speaker 1: which is a real place, by the way, and then
Speaker 1: sell them to someone down there and then that's it.
Speaker 1: And it wasn't until recently when I realized that that
Speaker 1: actually happened, you know, in the in the levels of
Speaker 1: the the trauma endured by by people in this country,
Speaker 1: you know, in our in our first years, you know,
Speaker 1: as I don't want to call us citizens, but as inhabitants,
Speaker 1: residents if you will, of this land. And then to
Speaker 1: be reminded of again in hearing the story just now
Speaker 1: where you know that that was an actual practice. It
Speaker 1: just I just I cringe at that. I cringe at
Speaker 1: the idea of it. You know, like the traumas that
Speaker 1: we feel like we're experiencing now, the fears that we
Speaker 1: feel like, you know, whenever we see the patrol cars
Speaker 1: or whatever. You know, those fears are centuries old. You know,
Speaker 1: they're just looking for somebody to snatch up and get
Speaker 1: into the system or make a profit off of. You know,
Speaker 1: the pro the prison industrial complex being privatized means that
Speaker 1: there's money to be made there, and you know it's
Speaker 1: the money flows differently these days, but still, the the
Speaker 1: fear of walking down the street, you know, in your
Speaker 1: black skin is very much the same. So the officer
Speaker 1: or the whatever might not make any money in the
Speaker 1: same way that these kidnappers did. But I just think
Speaker 1: that's interesting to kind of hear that story. But just
Speaker 1: like you said, you know, this is somebody that I've
Speaker 1: never heard of before. And this is part of the
Speaker 1: reason why I'm like so happy to have these way
Speaker 1: black history facts, because you know, if we just keep
Speaker 1: talking about the history that we know, you know, there's
Speaker 1: something to be said about that, because obviously we need
Speaker 1: to celebrate it. It gives us, you know, a guide
Speaker 1: post of where we've been, what other what our ancestors
Speaker 1: have endured, and our forefathers, and where we are and
Speaker 1: the liberties we enjoy now. And then I think it
Speaker 1: also helps compel us to keep moving forward so that,
Speaker 1: you know, generations that come after us will have an
Speaker 1: even better world and even more equal world to live
Speaker 1: in and grow up in and to have their children in.
Speaker 1: But you know, I love when we get to talk
Speaker 1: about things that we didn't know about. And I'm one
Speaker 1: of those people that knows a lot of stuff about
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff, you know what I mean. I
Speaker 1: just I just grew up that way. My dad made
Speaker 1: sure that I had to learn it, you know, doctor
Speaker 1: Westenberg made sure that it was my nose was always
Speaker 1: in a book. And so a lot of this stuff
Speaker 1: I'm familiar with, but that's one of them that I
Speaker 1: was not made aware of until today. And so, you know,
Speaker 1: like you said, I'm really grateful to have stories like that,
Speaker 1: and I think that also, you know, sometimes it it
Speaker 1: pushes me to try to learn more, you know, to
Speaker 1: know more about what I don't know. And so, like
Speaker 1: you said, I'm really grateful for that. But I think
Speaker 1: that that is probably where we're going to wrap it up.
Speaker 1: So once again, thank you for tuning in all this
Speaker 1: past year to Civic Cipher. I'm your host, ramses joh My.
Speaker 2: Name is quintun Ward, but you can call me Q.
Speaker 1: Yes Indeed, show produced by DJ Swirl and be sure
Speaker 1: to lock in with us for another year. Y'all. Hit
Speaker 1: the website Civiccipher dot com to submit any questions, any
Speaker 1: topics for future shows. If you want to make a
Speaker 1: donation and help the show continue to grow, you can
Speaker 1: also do have a Civiccipher dot com. Also, be sure
Speaker 1: to follow all of our social media. It's all at
Speaker 1: Civic Cipher and don't forget you can download this in
Speaker 1: any previous episode of the show. And with that said,
Speaker 1: we will see y'all next week.
Speaker 2: Until then, peace up a towndown a