1 00:00:03,960 --> 00:00:09,440 Speaker 1: Welcome the prognosis. I'm Laura Carlson. It's day one sixty 2 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 1: eight since coronavirus was declared a global pandemic. Today's main story. 3 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: An f DA official made a high profile misstatement about 4 00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:25,160 Speaker 1: the efficacy of a COVID treatment this weekend, even after 5 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:29,520 Speaker 1: he backtracked. The episode has led many to wonder how 6 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:36,360 Speaker 1: independent the agency really is. But first, here's what happened 7 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:50,640 Speaker 1: in virus news today. Italy has ruled out imposing a 8 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:56,920 Speaker 1: new nationwide lockdown despite an increase in coronavirus cases. Today, 9 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 1: the country recorded its highest number of new cases in 10 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:06,640 Speaker 1: three and a half months, but the virus and associated 11 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:12,520 Speaker 1: lockdowns have sent Italy into its worst recession in living memory. 12 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: Italy's Health Minister Roberto Speranza told Bloomberg News that the 13 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:21,480 Speaker 1: rise in contagion has been limited, with very low impact 14 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:24,960 Speaker 1: on hospitals. He also said the average age of people 15 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 1: who have tested positive in the last week is thirty 16 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:33,320 Speaker 1: and most have mild symptoms or none at all. Authorities 17 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:37,640 Speaker 1: in Berlin have banned demonstrations that were planned to protest 18 00:01:37,840 --> 00:01:42,959 Speaker 1: COVID related restrictions. Thousands of protesters have clashed with police 19 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 1: in recent weeks, many of them openly ignore hygiene and 20 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:51,800 Speaker 1: distancing rules. The city's interior minister said that the ban 21 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:55,720 Speaker 1: is meant not to limit freedom of assembly, but to 22 00:01:55,800 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 1: protect citizens from infection. Separately, the German government is extending 23 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 1: its coronavirus travel warning for countries outside Europe until September. Finally, 24 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:14,959 Speaker 1: drug company Moderna presented early data that provides the first 25 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:19,639 Speaker 1: evidence that its COVID nineteen vaccine stimulates the immune systems 26 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:23,960 Speaker 1: of older people. In a phase one trial, the vaccine 27 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:30,080 Speaker 1: produced quote consistently high levels of neutralizing antibodies and older adults. 28 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 1: According to a statement, antibody levels produced in people older 29 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 1: than fifty five were comparable to those seen in younger adults. 30 00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 1: The findings are important because those over the age of 31 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: fifty five often don't respond as well to vaccines as 32 00:02:48,680 --> 00:03:00,800 Speaker 1: younger adults. And now for today's main story. This weekend, 33 00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:05,120 Speaker 1: Stephen Hahn, the Commissioner of the US Food and Drug Administration, 34 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 1: attracted criticism when he substantially overstated the benefits of an 35 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: experimental COVID nineteen therapy at a press conference with President Trump. 36 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 1: Hans said that a treatment using blood plasma from recovered 37 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: patients could save thirty five of every one hundred people 38 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 1: who would have died. Those high profile remarks were incorrect, 39 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 1: and they were repeated by others in the Trump administration. 40 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: Late on Monday, Doctor Han clarified some of what the 41 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 1: data on blood plasma actually show, but the episode has 42 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:46,960 Speaker 1: raised questions about how the agency will review a vaccine, 43 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 1: as well as its overall scientific independence. Senior editor for 44 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 1: Healthcare Drew Armstrong spoke to Dr Han about the agency's 45 00:03:56,880 --> 00:04:02,880 Speaker 1: role in an increasingly politicized federal virus response. I talked 46 00:04:02,880 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 1: to Drew about what his reporting has found. Earlier this week, 47 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 1: FDA Commissioner Stephen Hahn admitted to overstating the benefits of 48 00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:25,039 Speaker 1: convalescent plasma and treating COVID nineteen. What exactly was incorrect 49 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 1: about his remarks. The important thing to know is exactly 50 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:33,440 Speaker 1: what he said at the start and what he said 51 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 1: at this press conference with President Trump over the weekend, 52 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:41,159 Speaker 1: was that so plasma is the liquid portion of the 53 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 1: blood um. That liquid portion contains the natural immunity that 54 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:48,800 Speaker 1: someone develops in response to an infection, in this case 55 00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:52,640 Speaker 1: COVID nineteen. You can take that and infuse it into 56 00:04:52,839 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: current patients and hopefully it takes those infection fighting antibodies 57 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:00,080 Speaker 1: and gives them to the new patient and helps and 58 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:03,480 Speaker 1: fight off the infection. So around the world this has 59 00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 1: been used by physicians outside of clinical trials. It's always 60 00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:11,360 Speaker 1: been thought of as a promising but unproven therapy for 61 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 1: COVID nineteen and they've been trying to find out does 62 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:18,600 Speaker 1: it work and if it works, how effective is it. 63 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:23,360 Speaker 1: So one of the things that Commissioner Han presented over 64 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 1: the weekend at the press conference with President Trump was 65 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:29,720 Speaker 1: a comment that was really really important about how good 66 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:31,919 Speaker 1: is this thing? And he said, the data continue to 67 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:35,400 Speaker 1: pan out a hundred people who are sick with COVID 68 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty five would have been saved because of the 69 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:42,160 Speaker 1: administration of about plasma. That's a pretty dramatic result. That 70 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:44,600 Speaker 1: would be one of the most effective treatments we have 71 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 1: for this disease. Unfortunately, it's not accurate and it's not 72 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:52,159 Speaker 1: what the data show that FDA have. What the data 73 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:57,040 Speaker 1: actually show is that the effect of this of the 74 00:05:57,160 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 1: highest dose of this blood plasma mu is thirty five 75 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:05,599 Speaker 1: more effective. It reduces mortality by thirty compared to the 76 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 1: lowest dose. But we don't have the data to compare 77 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 1: it to how it works against the standard of care 78 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 1: of placebo. And that's the gold standard of evidence that 79 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 1: the f d A really looks at and that physicians 80 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,640 Speaker 1: and patients really want to know when they're assessing does 81 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: something actually work? And that's just something we don't know yet. 82 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:28,520 Speaker 1: But that Commissioner Hound was really, really, really misleading in 83 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 1: making that statement in the press conference with President Trump. 84 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:35,720 Speaker 1: In terms of how this might damage public perception and 85 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:39,600 Speaker 1: trust of the f d A, particularly during a pandemic. 86 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:44,240 Speaker 1: What are some of the concerns there. I think there 87 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:48,520 Speaker 1: are really serious concerns because while these concepts of what 88 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 1: we call relative risk versus absolute risk are kind of 89 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:55,480 Speaker 1: technical and maybe a lot of late people don't necessarily 90 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 1: think about this every day, it's unbelievably important and it's 91 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 1: incredibly just fundamental if you're a drug researcher or a 92 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:07,360 Speaker 1: medical researcher. And Steve Hahn over at the fd I mean, 93 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: he's written two hundred and twenty different academic papers, he 94 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: has read thousands. I'm sure he's been in cancer research 95 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 1: for decades. I mean, this is pretty basic stuff if 96 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 1: you're in the scientific world, and so it's a pretty 97 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 1: big screw up, and that's the reason why it's damaging 98 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 1: to the credibility of the f d A, you know. 99 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 1: And it also comes at a point when the FDA 100 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:32,120 Speaker 1: was kind of up there during a political event, you know, 101 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 1: the administration's um was there with President Trump and his 102 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: re election really hinges on a successful response to this virus, 103 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 1: and the FDA got dragged into that overstated something that 104 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 1: wasn't true and about his higher profile setting, as you 105 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: can imagine, and then had to walk it back. That 106 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: is really really not a great place for an agency 107 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: that prides itself on rock solid science and credibility to 108 00:07:57,440 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 1: be in Americans, no matter what they're political affiliation, have 109 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,560 Speaker 1: to be able to trust that they have good information 110 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 1: about the medicine, therapy, medical devices they take. You do 111 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 1: not want to be in a country where half the 112 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: country doubts whether drug works because of who's in office. 113 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 1: And let's talk more broadly or generally about the f 114 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 1: d A in terms of how it does actually function, 115 00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: specifically with regard to its independence from political affiliations or 116 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:33,559 Speaker 1: or who is in office. Yeah, I think the f 117 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 1: d A has always had a little bit of a 118 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:41,000 Speaker 1: benefit by being a public health agency and been perhaps 119 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:45,200 Speaker 1: less susceptible to some of the political pressures that have 120 00:08:45,360 --> 00:08:48,840 Speaker 1: we've seen placed on and you know, other parts of government, 121 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 1: particularly during this administration. That said, I want to be clear, 122 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: it's certainly not exempt, and it can get hauled in 123 00:08:56,320 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: front of Congress, criticized by lawmakers, and so it is 124 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 1: not immune. But one of the Commissioner's real jobs is 125 00:09:03,360 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 1: to protect the scientific and professional staff of the agency 126 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 1: from that so that they can do their jobs. They 127 00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 1: are both a leader and a buffer at the agency. 128 00:09:15,559 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 1: And so, turning to the context of the pandemic and 129 00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 1: the concern that politics might actually enter into the f 130 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:30,559 Speaker 1: d a's reaction or treatments or even vaccines for COVID nineteen, 131 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:35,320 Speaker 1: I think the worry always is that you have a 132 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:40,200 Speaker 1: vaccine or a drug or a therapy that is approved 133 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:45,040 Speaker 1: or allowed out under some kind of emergency program where 134 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:48,240 Speaker 1: the evidence to support it just asn't there, either because 135 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: of a effectiveness problem or because of an even more 136 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:55,319 Speaker 1: worryingly a safety problem. One of the things that Commissioner 137 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:58,600 Speaker 1: hantst in our our lengthy interview this week was that 138 00:09:58,800 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 1: he is aware of that. Sure he said that it 139 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:05,680 Speaker 1: has been uh challenging. He's he's aware that other people 140 00:10:05,679 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 1: in the FDA aware of and that he sees one 141 00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 1: of his major jobs to reinforce to the folks at 142 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 1: the agency that they need to ignore that and and 143 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:17,600 Speaker 1: do their jobs. He is also very cognizant of the 144 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:20,959 Speaker 1: unique situation that we're in um with the pandemic in 145 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 1: the sense that this is urgent, and wants people to 146 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:27,040 Speaker 1: be able to move quickly, but to move quickly in 147 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 1: the right way. What kinds of pressure and the Trump 148 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 1: administration put on the f d A to say, speed 149 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 1: up the approval process for a COVID nineteen vaccine, Well, 150 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 1: they can put as much pressure on the f d 151 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:45,120 Speaker 1: A as the f d A allows them to squeeze. 152 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 1: It really is up to the f d A. You know, 153 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:50,960 Speaker 1: the it's a matter of you know, does Commissioner Han 154 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 1: want to keep his job? Can he take the heat? 155 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,120 Speaker 1: You know? There have been a number of reports out 156 00:10:56,160 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 1: there of people in the White House being highly critical 157 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 1: of the agency. Axios I believe had a report that 158 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: White House Advisor Peter Navarro told some FDA officials that 159 00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:09,960 Speaker 1: you're all deep state and you need to get on 160 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,960 Speaker 1: Trump time. Trump himself put out a tweet over the 161 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 1: weekend that he had heard some members of the FDA 162 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:20,520 Speaker 1: were deep staters attempting to slow down work on a 163 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:24,080 Speaker 1: vaccine or a drug in order to impede his re election. 164 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 1: UM Commissioner han Um he very definitively said, Um, I'll 165 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 1: quote from his interview. You said, what I can tell 166 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 1: you is that I feel very strongly that the seventeen 167 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:35,320 Speaker 1: thousand plus fd employees are true professionals, and none of 168 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:37,320 Speaker 1: them wants to delay getting medical products into the hands 169 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:40,000 Speaker 1: of Americans, and all emphasises, I mean, there is no 170 00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:43,720 Speaker 1: evidence whatsoever, Um that the f d A is slowing 171 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:46,680 Speaker 1: down work on this. I think everybody in the country 172 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:50,160 Speaker 1: realizes this is a public health crisis, and the sooner 173 00:11:50,240 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 1: there is an effective vaccine UM and additional therapy for 174 00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 1: this disease, the better. And certainly we know from the 175 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 1: Trump administration that they have their eye on election day 176 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:06,720 Speaker 1: and there is significant pressure there to have a vaccine 177 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:11,840 Speaker 1: either approved or even available by that point. And perhaps 178 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:16,560 Speaker 1: that has led to this question of pressures on the 179 00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 1: f d A and whether or not the FDA needs 180 00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:22,439 Speaker 1: to be even more independent. I was wondering if you 181 00:12:22,520 --> 00:12:24,480 Speaker 1: might be able to go into that of what can 182 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 1: there be done to ensure this continued independence. I think 183 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:32,800 Speaker 1: a huge amount of the independence of any agency is 184 00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:35,440 Speaker 1: going to be defined by its leader. You know, there 185 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:39,079 Speaker 1: are federal agencies and parts of the federal government that 186 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:41,400 Speaker 1: have more independence. You know, the Federal Reserve is kind 187 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 1: of a classic example. But it's really up to the commissioner. 188 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:49,439 Speaker 1: Is the reality and being able to be a strong 189 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:52,080 Speaker 1: leader who can stand up for the science while being 190 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:57,640 Speaker 1: cognizant of the real world scenario that they're living in 191 00:12:58,080 --> 00:13:00,640 Speaker 1: is probably at this point in time, I'm the most 192 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,600 Speaker 1: important thing. I asked Commissioner Han, you know, did he 193 00:13:03,640 --> 00:13:06,480 Speaker 1: think that the FDA should be an independent agency instead 194 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,760 Speaker 1: of being a part of the Health and Human Services Department? Um, 195 00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 1: you know, like the Federal Reserve. And you know, he 196 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 1: said he hadn't really thought about it, but that it 197 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:18,640 Speaker 1: was worth consideration, um for exactly the reasons we're discussing. 198 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:21,160 Speaker 1: But he really he backed off on that quite a 199 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 1: bit and said he didn't really want to rush into 200 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:25,839 Speaker 1: giving an opinion about it. Uh, it appeared to be 201 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:28,679 Speaker 1: at least a little bit appealing in that moment. What 202 00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:33,120 Speaker 1: are perhaps the dangers um of this potential political pressure 203 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:37,240 Speaker 1: on speeding up getting a vaccine out before perhaps it's ready. 204 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: When you're the head of an agency, the reality is 205 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:44,760 Speaker 1: that you don't have all that many options if an 206 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: administration really does want to pressure your overrule a decision 207 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 1: that you make. There was a report by Ruters that 208 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:55,199 Speaker 1: Peter Marks, who is the leader of the group inside 209 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:58,240 Speaker 1: the FDA that reviews vaccines. The writers reported the HULD 210 00:13:58,240 --> 00:14:02,439 Speaker 1: resign if the agency rubber stamp something. Essentially, our administration 211 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:06,120 Speaker 1: forced the FDA to rubber stamp something. And I asked 212 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,640 Speaker 1: Commissioner Hot about that, and his response was, you know, 213 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 1: I'll quote here he said, Peter did not say that 214 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:14,400 Speaker 1: to me, but it wouldn't surprise me that this is accurate. 215 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:16,760 Speaker 1: And I asked him the same question. What would he 216 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:19,120 Speaker 1: do if he was being asked rubber stamp a vaccine? 217 00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:21,880 Speaker 1: And I'll quote again from his answer, it wouldn't be 218 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,320 Speaker 1: okay for me, and I would not participate in any 219 00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:27,160 Speaker 1: decision that was made on anything other than the science. 220 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:30,280 Speaker 1: So you know, that is kind of the nuclear option 221 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 1: for an FDA commissioner is to resign or publicly protest 222 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 1: about a decision where you're either being overruled or forced 223 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 1: to do something that you don't believe is correct. Hopefully 224 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 1: we won't be in a situation like that. That was 225 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,880 Speaker 1: Drew Armstrong and that's it for our show today. For 226 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 1: coverage of the outbreak from one bureaus around the world, 227 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 1: visit Bloomberg dot com slash Coronavirus and if you like 228 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:05,680 Speaker 1: the show, please leave us a review and a rating 229 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:09,520 Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. It's the best way to 230 00:15:09,560 --> 00:15:14,680 Speaker 1: help more listeners find our global reporting. The Prognosis Daily 231 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:19,720 Speaker 1: edition is produced by topor foreheads Jordan Gospoure, Magnus Hendrickson 232 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 1: and me Laura Carlson. Today's main story was reported by 233 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 1: Drew Armstrong. Original music by Leo Sidrin. Our editors are 234 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:34,840 Speaker 1: Francesca Levi and Rick Shine. Francesca Levi is Bloomberg's head 235 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:37,200 Speaker 1: of podcasts. Thanks for listening.