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Speaker 1: LinkedIn News.

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Speaker 2: Although I totally understand and I support the idea of

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Speaker 2: longevity at a company because you can kind of tell

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Speaker 2: this long term story.

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Speaker 1: And I agree.

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Speaker 2: I also think that what makes me sometimes a really

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Speaker 2: strong candidate is when they've seen, oh, jam has worked

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Speaker 2: at this company, this company, this company, versatile, she's versatile.

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Speaker 1: Let me think about it.

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Speaker 2: Why would you not want to hire someone who's worked

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Speaker 2: for all your competitors. I mean, I'm not talking trade secrets,

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Speaker 2: but I mean, like, if you already know that this

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Speaker 2: person has unique skills that they've been able to bring

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Speaker 2: and thrive in at your competitor, why would they.

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Speaker 1: Not do the same thing for you?

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Speaker 3: From LinkedIn News and I heard podcasts, this is Let's

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Speaker 3: Talk offline, a show about what it takes to thrive

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Speaker 3: in the early years of your career without sacrificing your values,

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Speaker 3: sanity or asleep.

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Speaker 1: I'm Gianna Predenti.

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Speaker 2: And I'm Jama Jackson Gadson. So you've worked hard to

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Speaker 2: land that first job. I mean, you sent in all

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Speaker 2: those job applications, you did all those informational interviews, You've

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Speaker 2: put in the work, and now you're at a job

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Speaker 2: where you feel pretty comfortable I mean, honestly, it feels good.

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Speaker 1: A few years in, though, you start to think, hmm,

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Speaker 1: should I stay at this company or's it time to

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Speaker 1: move on?

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Speaker 3: In other words, should you climb lie up that corporate

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Speaker 3: ladder or job up? It can be a tough decision,

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Speaker 3: especially when you've really grown to love your first job.

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Speaker 3: So if you're thinking about making a change, we're going

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Speaker 3: to help you figure out what those next career moves

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Speaker 3: might look like for you.

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Speaker 1: Today. Let's chat. Let's do it.

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Speaker 4: So.

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Speaker 3: A lot of my friends have changed jobs or at

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Speaker 3: least considered it in the three years since we graduated,

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Speaker 3: and I feel like at one point, every time I

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Speaker 3: was going on LinkedIn, it was another person I knew

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Speaker 3: from school announcing a job update, and I was like,

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Speaker 3: should I be looking for jobs?

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Speaker 1: Like?

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Speaker 3: You know, it really got me thinking like should I

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Speaker 3: be considering moving on too? Or is it okay to

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Speaker 3: want to grow my career at LinkedIn? And these are

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Speaker 3: the questions that keep me up at night. You know,

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Speaker 3: I really could see myself staying at this company for

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Speaker 3: a while because I feel like there's so many internal

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Speaker 3: opportunities that I've like yet to even explore. So that's

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Speaker 3: where I'm at but let's take a look at the

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Speaker 3: larger job movement trends we've been seeing. For gen z ers,

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Speaker 3: the trend has been to job hop. So if you

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Speaker 3: guys are on career TikTok aka career talk, you've probably

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Speaker 3: heard about the benefits of switching jobs every one to

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Speaker 3: two years, and research shows that frequent movement really does

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Speaker 3: boost pay in the long run. I feel like you've

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Speaker 3: talked about this in your own job hopping journey, and

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Speaker 3: in the past decade or so, job hopping that trend

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Speaker 3: has really become popular in the job market. And that's

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Speaker 3: when people you know, hop quite literally from job to

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Speaker 3: job in a short period of time. And it's been

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Speaker 3: particularly popular among gen z and millennial workers. The reason

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Speaker 3: why is because one, it allows you to diversify your

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Speaker 3: experience and also just figure out what you want to do.

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Speaker 3: Like a lot of people change jobs early on because

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Speaker 3: they're like, ooh, this is not it and I want

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Speaker 3: to find something different. And because so many people, not

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Speaker 3: even just gen z rs, have been changing jobs so

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Speaker 3: frequently over the past you know, few years, over the pandemic,

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Speaker 3: job hopping isn't frowned upon like it once was. Like

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Speaker 3: it used to really raise red flags to hiring managers,

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Speaker 3: but now not so much. But I think in general,

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Speaker 3: the guidance is still to stay in a job for

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Speaker 3: at least two years, and then at that three to

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Speaker 3: four year mark is when you kind of get the

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Speaker 3: itch and when you need to start thinking about your

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Speaker 3: future at the company. And that's where I'm at. You know,

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Speaker 3: I'm three years in, so I'm like, hmm. But in

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Speaker 3: the past few years, the job market has been slowing

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Speaker 3: down and there's been a lot of economic uncertainty, so

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Speaker 3: now more workers are staying put because you know, it's

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Speaker 3: harder to find a job these days. But I think

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Speaker 3: the decision whether to you know, stick at your company

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Speaker 3: or find your next play, as we say here at LinkedIn,

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Speaker 3: is still really relevant. So in just a bit, we're

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Speaker 3: bringing on creative exec and content creator Tim Cusano, who

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Speaker 3: you guys definitely know on TikTok and if you don't,

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Speaker 3: check out his videos. But he has stayed at every

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Speaker 3: company in his career for five plus years, so he's

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Speaker 3: going to come on and share a bit about his experience.

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Speaker 3: But before he does, Tom, your career has not been linear.

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Speaker 1: Girl, She's curvy, she's windy. My hips don't know.

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Speaker 3: And you've had multiple jobs and worked at a bunch

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Speaker 3: of different companies throughout your career in the past decade alone,

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Speaker 3: So what's your experience been like with job switching?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean you know, this is what I will say.

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Speaker 2: First of all, I think it behooves fancy word, behooves,

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Speaker 2: particularly early career professionals to job because like you said earlier,

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Speaker 2: you don't know what you don't know, and when you

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Speaker 2: are going from maybe a company to another, or even

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Speaker 2: changing industries or markets, that is how you start asking

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Speaker 2: yourself the question what do I like? What do I

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Speaker 2: want out of an employer? What do I want out

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Speaker 2: of a career?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 2: Because a lot of times you're thinking about what is

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Speaker 2: the job right in front of me? But how is

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Speaker 2: that building into the portfolio of your life? And so

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Speaker 2: I am so thankful particularly that when I was in

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Speaker 2: my twenties I just hopped. Now I hopped methodically. I

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Speaker 2: didn't just leave a job, but that I was mindful.

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Speaker 2: I wasn't always the year, but I was mindful. I

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Speaker 2: always tried to think of, you know, what was the

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Speaker 2: next opportunity did I max out in my job? Had

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Speaker 2: I max out in the roles and responsibilities or was

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Speaker 2: I just being very underpaid and not acknowledged for the work.

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Speaker 2: And if I felt like I could go out and

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Speaker 2: find something else that was going to hit whatever I

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Speaker 2: needed at that time, whether it was more money, more responsibilities,

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Speaker 2: better work life balance, I was going to go all

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Speaker 2: in on it. I am so thankful that I did,

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Speaker 2: because I think job hopping or job switching has a

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Speaker 2: lot of benefits. I mean, first of all, you have

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Speaker 2: the possible wage increases. I've talked about this before. There

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Speaker 2: was a series of like five or six years where

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Speaker 2: I literally almost doubled my salary every time I took

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Speaker 2: on a new job. Yeah, because you need to get

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Speaker 2: in there, you need to learn what you need to learn.

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Speaker 2: You need to build that portfolio. And if you can

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Speaker 2: show you the next person that you have the skill sets,

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Speaker 2: why not go for the maximum. Another thing are title bumps.

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Speaker 2: Now this is I think a little bit more dependent

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Speaker 2: on your industry or your market. I have definitely worked

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Speaker 2: at some places where two people of two different seniorities

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Speaker 2: are both internally revered the same because even the person

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Speaker 2: on a lower seniority level still carries the roles and

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Speaker 2: the responsibilities of someone more senior. That's totally fine if

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Speaker 2: that's your jam. But I look at it that if

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Speaker 2: I'm doing the work of someone who's two four pay

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Speaker 2: bands that hire the me baby, where's the pay banding?

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Speaker 2: Is the band in my pocket? It's not bandit, it's

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Speaker 2: that it's actually very discombobulating. So depending where you're at,

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Speaker 2: you could actually negotiate your title. Like this is something

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Speaker 2: that a lot of people, I think don't think about

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Speaker 2: when you're getting that initial job offer, that your title

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Speaker 2: can also sometimes be negotiated. And I think that this

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Speaker 2: is a really important distinction because if you are on

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Speaker 2: the road map to become I don't know, one day,

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Speaker 2: you know you want to be a CMO Chief marketing officer,

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Speaker 2: Let's say you want to make sure that resume reflects

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Speaker 2: the right job titles that are going to help you

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Speaker 2: get there.

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Speaker 1: So titles do matter.

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Speaker 2: For certain industries. So that's another thing that I think

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Speaker 2: job switching can do. Another thing is you get the

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Speaker 2: opportunity to grow in a new work environment. This is

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Speaker 2: super important, I think, particularly if you come from like

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Speaker 2: a toxic work atmosphere, which, by.

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Speaker 1: The way, seamless plug.

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Speaker 2: We already have an episode all around that, which if

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Speaker 2: you skipped that episode to listen to this one, baby

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Speaker 2: go back.

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Speaker 1: But seriously, like, sometimes.

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Speaker 2: Some people just need a new change of environment, Like

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Speaker 2: just the idea of being in a new position, a

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Speaker 2: new work environment, it just breathes like a breath of

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Speaker 2: fresh air.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And there's also different types of work environments you can,

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Speaker 3: Like if you work in a more fast paced, startup

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Speaker 3: kind of environment and you want something a little bit

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Speaker 3: more stable, if stability even exists in this world, who knows.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I love what you've said because that it's

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Speaker 1: so true.

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Speaker 2: Or let's say, for instance, you've been working at a

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Speaker 2: company where you've been in the office, maybe you realize

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Speaker 2: because of different things, because of personal life boundaries, maybe

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Speaker 2: you say, okay, you know what I want to take

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Speaker 2: on a fully remote job, and so like, there are

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Speaker 2: just different things that you can do that you can

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Speaker 2: evaluate in job searching. And the last thing I will

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Speaker 2: say is that this is also a unique opportunity for

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Speaker 2: you to diversify your experience and your resume. Although I

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Speaker 2: totally understand and I support the idea of longevity at

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Speaker 2: a company because you can kind of tell this long

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Speaker 2: term story.

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Speaker 1: And I agree, right, I do agree.

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Speaker 2: I also think that what makes me some time a

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Speaker 2: really strong candidate is when they've seen, oh, Jamae has

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Speaker 2: worked at this company, this company, this company.

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Speaker 1: She's versatile because adaptable.

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Speaker 5: I am.

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Speaker 1: I've gone into all of these. Let me think about it.

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Speaker 2: Why would you not want to hire someone who's worked

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Speaker 2: for all your competitors. I mean, I'm not talking trade secrets,

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Speaker 2: but I mean, like, if you already know that this

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Speaker 2: person has unique skills that they've been able to bring

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Speaker 2: and thrive in at your competitor, why would they not

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Speaker 2: do the same thing for you.

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Speaker 1: You already like performed in the big lage.

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Speaker 2: I've proven my case. Put me on the main stage.

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Speaker 2: I'm Coachella baby.

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Speaker 4: Wow.

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Speaker 1: I was gonna go with a baseball reference and then

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Speaker 1: you would so.

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Speaker 2: I mean, coach Coachella Baseball something like that. God, oh yeah,

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Speaker 2: that's me throwing my chance an opportunity. But seriously, job

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Speaker 2: switching I think can be very beneficial if you think

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Speaker 2: about the long term strategy.

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Speaker 1: But where there's a pro there is usually a convent.

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Speaker 3: Here comes in Gianna, here comes I mean usually half

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Speaker 3: class full.

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Speaker 1: But for today's purposes, We got to talk about the cons.

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Speaker 1: You can be the antagonist.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so today I am the villain to tell you

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Speaker 3: that there are cons when you job hop too frequently.

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Speaker 3: Like I said before, job popping is more normalized than

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Speaker 3: it was in the past, but it's still going to

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Speaker 3: raise eyebrows and kind of spark some skepticism with employers,

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Speaker 3: especially if you know you're changing jobs like every year

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Speaker 3: or less than right, then it has somebody thinking, hm,

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Speaker 3: why so do you just need to be prepared to

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Speaker 3: address that in an interview.

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Speaker 2: I will definitely say though, that I think that that's

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Speaker 2: way too soon to lead unless you are in a

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Speaker 2: toxic work atmosphere or you just kind of can't get

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Speaker 2: the grounding. But if you're just like, actually, I've already

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Speaker 2: learned everything I need to in the nine months I'm

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Speaker 2: going to be gone now that you have not given

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Speaker 2: yourself adequate time to really grow in your role.

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Speaker 3: That's a really good call out. So, Jamai, you've made

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Speaker 3: a pretty good case for job switching.

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Speaker 1: Thank you. I say so myself.

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Speaker 3: But I think it's time we bring in Tim to

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Speaker 3: make the case for growing your career at a company

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Speaker 3: so he can.

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Speaker 1: Chair some of the pros.

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Speaker 2: What do you think, Ooh, it's gonna be like the

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Speaker 2: Gianna versus Tim versus Jimmy faceof.

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Speaker 1: I think I'm Switzerland lucky.

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Speaker 3: Leaving your first real adult job can feel like a

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Speaker 3: huge decision, but it.

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Speaker 1: Doesn't have to be.

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Speaker 3: Coming up, we're talking with creative executive Tim Cisano about

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Speaker 3: how to find opportunities to keep growing at your current company.

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Speaker 2: Today's conversation is all around figuring out should I stay

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Speaker 2: in the job or should I go on and try

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Speaker 2: something new? And the truth of the matter is, I

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Speaker 2: don't really know if it's as black and white as

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Speaker 2: a lot of people say. Thankfully, gian and I have

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Speaker 2: a guest in today's hot chain who's going to also

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Speaker 2: share their opinion. Gee, who do we bring on this week?

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Speaker 3: I am so excited to bring on Tim Cisano. He's

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Speaker 3: a creative EGZECH who has held roles at ABC Sports, ESPN,

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Speaker 3: and most recently left his decade long tenure as a

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Speaker 3: VP at Charter Communications, which is the telecommunications and mass

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Speaker 3: media company. He's also a content creator, well known for

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Speaker 3: his tiktoks. I love his videos, by the way, that

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Speaker 3: document his life and encourage people to slow down and

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Speaker 3: enjoy the simple, even mundane parts of everyday life, which

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Speaker 3: is a reminder I think all of us need sometimes.

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Speaker 3: He's a strong believer that there's a lot of opportunity

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Speaker 3: to grow at the same company, especially as someone who's

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Speaker 3: spent at least five years at each of the companies

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Speaker 3: he's worked for throughout his career. So we're excited for

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Speaker 3: him to share his insights with all of you guys.

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Speaker 4: Welcome Tim, Thank you for having me. Wow, how exciting.

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Speaker 4: Thank you for having me today.

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Speaker 2: We love talking to particularly creative creatives over here.

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Speaker 1: I love learning about people's journey.

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Speaker 2: So let's just start there, like, can you go us

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Speaker 2: a short summary of what your career journey so far

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Speaker 2: has been.

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Speaker 4: Started out part time everything, finally got my foot in

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Speaker 4: that door with ABC Sports full time. There's a graphics producer,

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Speaker 4: assistant producer, production associate for five years. Then I got

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Speaker 4: married and had a panic attack that I can't travel

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Speaker 4: with thirty six weeks a year and have a solid,

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Speaker 4: healthy relationship. So figured out that I really needed to

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Speaker 4: get a desk job on the business side and kind

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Speaker 4: of finagled my way into ESPN's marketing team. Did that

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Speaker 4: for seven years with ESPN, worked on some of their

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Speaker 4: biggest properties and some of the biggest brands on the planet,

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Speaker 4: and then I got this really interesting offer to go

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Speaker 4: to what was Time Warner Cable to reinvent the way

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Speaker 4: that they were offering creative services to small businesses, which

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Speaker 4: then became Charter Communications after a merger and acquisition situation.

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Speaker 4: Did that for the past eleven years, started making tiktoks

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Speaker 4: off the side of my desk. Shockingly, they blew up,

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Speaker 4: and now I'm a full time stay at home dad

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Speaker 4: that's doing a bit of writing and creating and consulting

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Speaker 4: and coaching and trying to figure it out all over again.

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Speaker 1: I love that.

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Speaker 3: So, Tim, You've been at a few companies throughout your career,

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Speaker 3: and at each of those companies you were there for

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Speaker 3: at least five years. So I'm wondering what went into

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Speaker 3: your decision to stay as long as you did.

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Speaker 4: The decision to stay throughout was because there was nothing

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Speaker 4: else that drew me away during the question of when

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Speaker 4: is it time to go is to me, it's such

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Speaker 4: an interesting one because you should always have your eyes

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Speaker 4: on what is out there. So I think everybody should

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Speaker 4: always have their head on a swivel. But at the

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Speaker 4: same time, you have to make the most of the

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Speaker 4: opportunity that's in front of you. There is no decision

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Speaker 4: to make until you have that offer on the table

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Speaker 4: or you're truly in a position where like, I got

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Speaker 4: to get out of here. But it's almost like, you know,

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Speaker 4: you get into a house and it's like, well, when

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Speaker 4: do I move? Will you move? When you find another house?

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Speaker 4: So how do you find another house? Will you start looking?

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Speaker 4: It's like these micro steps along the way, So focus

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Speaker 4: on micro because I also think it's so much easier

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Speaker 4: to digest. When you get so obsessed with like that

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Speaker 4: macro decision that's at the core of your question, then

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Speaker 4: it can become jarring and overwhelming. All you gotta worry

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Speaker 4: about is do I do a decent job, keep my

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Speaker 4: resume up to date? Am I generally aware of what

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Speaker 4: else is out there? You know? Just if you can

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Speaker 4: do those things, I think your brain is going to

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Speaker 4: breathe a little easier, and then it'll the right time

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Speaker 4: will come when the right time comes, versus you feeling like,

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Speaker 4: oh my goodness, there's like some sort of hard pivot

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Speaker 4: moment here, and now I'm going to jump or no,

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Speaker 4: I've got to figure something out, like just chip away

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Speaker 4: at it and amazing things will happen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I think sometimes people like just make

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Speaker 3: a rash decision because it's you know, you feel like

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Speaker 3: I need to get out and I got to do

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Speaker 3: it now, and then you realize, Okay, the grass was

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Speaker 3: not greener. I maybe you should have stayed and really

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Speaker 3: hold over this decision longer.

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Speaker 4: Totally.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So I want to ask because this is actually

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Speaker 2: something that offline, Gianna and I talk about a lot,

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Speaker 2: particularly around like when it's time to go and now

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Speaker 2: there are you know, people who out there who say,

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Speaker 2: you know, around year three or four of your tenure

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Speaker 2: at a company is when it's time to start looking

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Speaker 2: for a new job. What do you see as the

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Speaker 2: value of working at the same company for longer periods

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Speaker 2: of time?

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Speaker 4: Relationships, long term, significant trust that can be built both

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Speaker 4: with coworkers and people that are outside of your day

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Speaker 4: to day plus unless you feel like you're being truly, truly,

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Speaker 4: truly pigeonholed. And I think that a lot of people

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Speaker 4: don't give themselves enough credit for what they could actually

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Speaker 4: do in their current role to expand They feel like, oh,

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Speaker 4: I need this other place to give me additional responsibilities

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Speaker 4: or opportunities so that I can grow, which to me

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Speaker 4: is like, well wait a minute, you really I don't

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Speaker 4: think you could do that for yourself right now? Like

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Speaker 4: you really don't think you could go find some work

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Speaker 4: dessert as I would call it, in another section of

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Speaker 4: the company, to learn and to grow. So I would say,

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Speaker 4: have you really maximized what's at your current disposal? Are

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Speaker 4: there places where you could use your biggest, weirdest idea

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Speaker 4: and use the resources and the network that you currently

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Speaker 4: have to see if that could come to life. So

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Speaker 4: don't overlook the opportunities and the resources that you have

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Speaker 4: directly in front of you just because you feel like

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Speaker 4: there's some sort of time marker where you're like, oh,

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Speaker 4: begs must be cooked now. So I got to go yeah,

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Speaker 4: O wait.

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Speaker 3: And we have a really fun segment on the show

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Speaker 3: called Deer Work Bestie where we answer questions from our listeners.

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Speaker 3: So this week's comes from Joey in California.

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Speaker 5: I've been in my current job for a little over

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Speaker 5: a year now, and this is my first job out

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Speaker 5: of university. I really enjoy this role and I don't

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Speaker 5: anticipate leaving anytime soon, but I also don't want to

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Speaker 5: become too completely and close myself off to opportunities this

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Speaker 5: early in my career. How do you know when it's

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Speaker 5: time to leave your first job or company? And once

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Speaker 5: you know this, how do you approach this conversation, especially

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Speaker 5: with the manager you really care about and don't want

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Speaker 5: to disappoints.

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Speaker 4: I mean easy couple answers from my perspective. One, you

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Speaker 4: know when it's time to leave when you have another

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Speaker 4: offer on the table. Right, you're literally deciding between two

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Speaker 4: things that are sitting on your desk versus that kind

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Speaker 4: of stair step approach we discussed earlier. So Joey, always

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Speaker 4: have your head on the swivel. Know it's out there,

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Speaker 4: and it's okay to know what's out there. Then you'll

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Speaker 4: come to a point where you're like, Wow, this is

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Speaker 4: an amazing decision that I have to contemplate. And if

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Speaker 4: you're in a good environment, a good boss will be

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Speaker 4: okay with that. In fact, they'll be stoked, truly be

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Speaker 4: like wow, good for you. Good bosses should be in

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Speaker 4: a position and they should be efforting towards putting their

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Speaker 4: people in places where they could get poached where where

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Speaker 4: they know that this is a very attractive talent for X,

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Speaker 4: Y or Z purpose and it's inevitable.

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Speaker 3: And then how do you go about the conversation with

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Speaker 3: your manager when you bring that up.

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Speaker 4: I mean, my conversation with my manager was a you know,

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Speaker 4: and this is literally somebody that just did this. It

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Speaker 4: was it was different because I wasn't leaving for another job,

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Speaker 4: but it was like, all right, it's it's time. I

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Speaker 4: think for this specific question, it's very you want to

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Speaker 4: be very straightforward. I need to talk to you. I

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Speaker 4: have another offer. I'm really excited about this opportunity. It

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Speaker 4: kind of crushes me to sit here and have this

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Speaker 4: conversation with you directly, but at the same time, you know,

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Speaker 4: this seems like it's really in my best interest, and

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Speaker 4: I think that the smartest way to handle this is blank, right,

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Speaker 4: And only this person can say what blank is if

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Speaker 4: they're in a role where cool two weeks is fine enough.

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Speaker 4: If they're say, hey, this is one of our competitive

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Speaker 4: like you may want to keep that in mind. Like

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Speaker 4: if you can just be self aware and cognizant of

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Speaker 4: what the broader ramifications are and you're direct with the conversation.

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Speaker 4: That's all you can do. There's like way too many

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Speaker 4: nuances that there's in like one specific script. Be upfront,

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Speaker 4: be honest, be kind, be self aware, and you'll be

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Speaker 4: more than fine.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: What I appreciate is that you saying, like you know,

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Speaker 1: a good manager wants you to succeed, and not just succeed,

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Speaker 1: but be so darn good that other people want you to.

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Speaker 2: And I find that particularly when I talk to people

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Speaker 2: who are younger than me, and I like, even like

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Speaker 2: my mentees, they do have a lot of loyalty to

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Speaker 2: their manager. And I'm not saying that that's a bad

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Speaker 2: thing at all, but I always say, be weary that

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Speaker 2: you don't give so much loyalty to someone that you

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Speaker 2: stunt your own career, or that you feel like they

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Speaker 2: want you to only stay under them. And I love

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Speaker 2: that you have framed this idea around having a conversation

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Speaker 2: with people, being open and figuring out how do we

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Speaker 2: tackle this as a partnership, because I think, like, when

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Speaker 2: you look at it like that, that is really the

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Speaker 2: beginning steps of how you build your network that exists

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Speaker 2: long after you move out of a certain role or

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Speaker 2: a company.

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Speaker 4: I wholeheartedly agree yeah, don't. You don't want to be

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Speaker 4: in a position where you feel obligated to your and

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Speaker 4: I felt that way. I'm the boss that I just

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Speaker 4: walked away from, the best boss I ever had by

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Speaker 4: a country mile. There was a lot of emotional attachment

441
00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:31,200
Speaker 4: that went into that. But at the same time, too,

442
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,199
Speaker 4: I genuinely knew that he had my best interest at heart,

443
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:36,680
Speaker 4: and I knew that I kind of had to rip

444
00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:39,119
Speaker 4: the band aid off, even though I literally took almost

445
00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,479
Speaker 4: like a full year between all the different pieces that

446
00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:43,840
Speaker 4: I moved to make sure that this was done the

447
00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:47,720
Speaker 4: right way. But you know, I would ask yourself, like

448
00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:50,280
Speaker 4: why do I feel that way? Do you actually have

449
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,639
Speaker 4: that kind of relationship or you just scared to have

450
00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:56,240
Speaker 4: a direct conversation. There isn't a wrong answer, but if

451
00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:59,359
Speaker 4: you can be honest with yourself, then it'll start to

452
00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:04,080
Speaker 4: come and the more difficult conversations, especially ones like this

453
00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,879
Speaker 4: that you're comfortable having. If your intentions are good and

454
00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:10,679
Speaker 4: your efforts are solid, then you really can do no

455
00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:13,280
Speaker 4: wrong and don't don't let yourself get pinned in the

456
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,080
Speaker 4: corner be or some people could just use it as

457
00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:19,159
Speaker 4: an excuse. I like my manager too much, like be

458
00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:21,600
Speaker 4: honest with yourself and be honest with your surroundings and

459
00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:22,280
Speaker 4: you'll be fine.

460
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:23,440
Speaker 5: Yeah.

461
00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:27,240
Speaker 3: I love this idea of finding ways to grow within

462
00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:29,560
Speaker 3: your role and kind of expand your job description, and

463
00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:32,199
Speaker 3: like growing within a company doesn't always mean changing your

464
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:35,440
Speaker 3: title and moving up the ladder, but growing within your position.

465
00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:37,840
Speaker 3: I'm wondering, like, if you think about people who are

466
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,119
Speaker 3: just starting out and you want, let's say you have

467
00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:43,600
Speaker 3: this great idea, getting influence or getting people to buy

468
00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,760
Speaker 3: into that idea can be challenging, and especially when you

469
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:49,280
Speaker 3: know you're maybe the younger person on the team. So

470
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,840
Speaker 3: do you have any advice on getting that buy in

471
00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,879
Speaker 3: and like pitching yourself as the person to take on

472
00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:57,439
Speaker 3: that project or you know, the person to have the

473
00:22:57,520 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 3: idea for whatever initiative it might be.

474
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:00,400
Speaker 5: Yes.

475
00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:04,320
Speaker 4: And I love that question so so much because I've

476
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:06,720
Speaker 4: I do call this like how to bring your weirdest

477
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:08,560
Speaker 4: idea to life, because I've had a couple of those

478
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 4: where I just had this big, random, weird idea and

479
00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:14,240
Speaker 4: I remember being like, I'm so sure of this, and

480
00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:16,239
Speaker 4: then I would bring it into somebody's office to be

481
00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:18,760
Speaker 4: like that's great, and then they would go right back

482
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:22,439
Speaker 4: to work. When you think about going into somebody else's

483
00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:24,880
Speaker 4: office or having a big idea, you think like, oh,

484
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 4: this is so great, it's going to naturally pull people in.

485
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:30,360
Speaker 4: It's actually going to push people away for a couple

486
00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:32,639
Speaker 4: of different reasons. One, they have their own stuff to

487
00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 4: worry about. So if you walk in you got to

488
00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,840
Speaker 4: like this big game changing idea, you're basically saying, here's

489
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:40,760
Speaker 4: the thought that I have that's going to mean more

490
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,080
Speaker 4: work for you. Aren't you excited? Aren't you excited to

491
00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:45,200
Speaker 4: make me look great? Now?

492
00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 1: I'm so right, it's not.

493
00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,320
Speaker 4: Going to like. It's not unless you're saying, this is

494
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,200
Speaker 4: something that's going to change about my role and you're like,

495
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,359
Speaker 4: I've got the whole thing, don't worry about it. But like,

496
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:57,359
Speaker 4: most of those big ideas are going to change a

497
00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:59,679
Speaker 4: business or have some sort of impact on the company

498
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 4: or going to have cascade effects. So the steps to

499
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,199
Speaker 4: bringing it to life are one being okay with the

500
00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 4: fact that it's going to take a long time. Probably

501
00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 4: you're probably going to hear a lot of nose and

502
00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:13,120
Speaker 4: you're probably gonn get a lot of people that are

503
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 4: like that, even the ones that are really excited for you,

504
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:19,640
Speaker 4: and they think it's amazing, but like, I'm not here

505
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,240
Speaker 4: to help other people fulfill their dreams with all their

506
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,399
Speaker 4: respective here to do my job. If you first you

507
00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:28,639
Speaker 4: have to describe it really well in a simple way.

508
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 4: What is the idea? Can you describe it as simply

509
00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 4: as possible, and can you also explain why? Why? What

510
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:41,760
Speaker 4: does this impact the business? What is the upside? And

511
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:44,240
Speaker 4: then you have to be ready to have everybody poke

512
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:47,000
Speaker 4: a thousand holes in it, because that's what you need.

513
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 4: If you don't have all the holes poked in it,

514
00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 4: like there's a distinct possibility. With all the respect especially

515
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,720
Speaker 4: to people that are out of the gate. You might

516
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 4: have seen something. You might have walked in the door

517
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,119
Speaker 4: and immediately been like, here is another place for us

518
00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,800
Speaker 4: to double our business. Great, but that takes another four

519
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:05,800
Speaker 4: million dollars in investments, and it takes X, Y and z.

520
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:08,920
Speaker 4: But if you're willing to take the time to document

521
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:11,440
Speaker 4: it to even get people to poke holes in how

522
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:14,400
Speaker 4: you documented the idea, to shop it around to get

523
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,359
Speaker 4: a bunch of nos, to then put some yeses to

524
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 4: those nos. If you can explain it in a simple

525
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 4: way the impact you could have on the business, and

526
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 4: then you're willing to go do the legwork, you can

527
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:27,199
Speaker 4: start to create your own kind of stair step to

528
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,560
Speaker 4: get there and then be okay at the end if

529
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,840
Speaker 4: you don't get credit, because especially if you're earlier in

530
00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:36,320
Speaker 4: your career, chances are if you have something that mega

531
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,800
Speaker 4: blows up, the president of the company, the president of

532
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:41,720
Speaker 4: the department, whomever is going to be the one that

533
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,240
Speaker 4: gets a sound by in the New York Times, speaking

534
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,959
Speaker 4: from experience, not the senior manager that was over the

535
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:51,240
Speaker 4: side of the marketing team that nobody had any idea existed.

536
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:54,400
Speaker 4: But it pays off. It pays off big time.

537
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,080
Speaker 2: I think what I appreciate the most about what you

538
00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:00,560
Speaker 2: just outlined is this idea of like removing ego out

539
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:03,080
Speaker 2: of it, because it's so easy for anyone at any

540
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,080
Speaker 2: point in your career to attach your ego to a project.

541
00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:07,840
Speaker 2: You care about this idea. You want to put this

542
00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 2: baby out into the world. You want the credit, and

543
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 2: even though all of those things are valid, if you

544
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 2: really want the idea to succeed, sometimes you understand that

545
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:18,760
Speaker 2: you are going to have to build community. Sometimes that

546
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:20,360
Speaker 2: means you are going to have to get more no's

547
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:23,040
Speaker 2: than yes is. And I just really appreciate that because

548
00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:25,520
Speaker 2: that is definitely something I had to learn, both the

549
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:27,280
Speaker 2: easy and the hard way when I first started out,

550
00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:29,200
Speaker 2: and I just think more people should embrace this idea

551
00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 2: of removing the ego.

552
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:31,400
Speaker 1: I love that.

553
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:34,600
Speaker 3: I just want to quickly add too, that I've had

554
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,639
Speaker 3: to learn poking holes in something doesn't mean somebody just

555
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:40,760
Speaker 3: like wants to get you and catch you without the answer. Really,

556
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,480
Speaker 3: they're just curious and want to help you get to

557
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:46,600
Speaker 3: a stronger outcome. But it's really hard to kind of

558
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:48,239
Speaker 3: realize that in the moment because you feel like, oh,

559
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:50,399
Speaker 3: if I don't have the answer, then they're going to

560
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 3: think I'm stupid or I'm dumb. But really it's okay

561
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:54,840
Speaker 3: to say, hey, you know I don't have the answer.

562
00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 3: I'll come back to you and really work with that

563
00:26:57,119 --> 00:26:59,199
Speaker 3: person to kind of, like, you know, just get to

564
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 3: where you need to be totally.

565
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 1: So we talked about ways.

566
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:05,040
Speaker 3: To grow within your role, especially if you're early in

567
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:08,199
Speaker 3: your career, and you mentioned being proactive in that, like

568
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:10,760
Speaker 3: raising your hand for projects, coming up with new ideas.

569
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:14,159
Speaker 3: But sometimes you either you know, get pushed back or

570
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:18,840
Speaker 3: have trouble you know, identifying those opportunities. Because the scope

571
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 3: of your work can be kind of siloed when you're

572
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:23,520
Speaker 3: starting out. So I'm wondering, as somebody who's been in

573
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 3: management and executive positions, how can people early in their

574
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,960
Speaker 3: career work with their managers to identify those opportunities for

575
00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:32,160
Speaker 3: growth within the company.

576
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:36,119
Speaker 4: I think you have to do it on your own

577
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:38,600
Speaker 4: to a certain extent. A lot of this you're going

578
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:42,400
Speaker 4: to find out by trying and failing, So there isn't

579
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,000
Speaker 4: a bad place to start. I think as long as

580
00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:47,400
Speaker 4: you can do you have a thought on the business,

581
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:51,080
Speaker 4: and why are you cool to make the first key strokes?

582
00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:53,560
Speaker 4: I would say, don't ask your manager like you know,

583
00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 4: certainly you could ask your manager like, hey, I would

584
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 4: like to take a more responsibility, et cetera, but don't

585
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:03,359
Speaker 4: like that. The cheat code is your manager's probably got

586
00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:05,880
Speaker 4: enough on their plate where if they had additional work

587
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 4: for you, they're going to give you additional work. You

588
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:12,520
Speaker 4: should be okay to say here's some suggestions and have

589
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,080
Speaker 4: them be like I never thought of that, right, And

590
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:17,679
Speaker 4: then it's going to be on you on both sides

591
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 4: of that, And that you also have to be okay

592
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,240
Speaker 4: with the fact that your first five ideas could be wrong,

593
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,359
Speaker 4: or they could be pointed in different directions just because

594
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:28,960
Speaker 4: you don't know yet, and that's totally fine. That's growing

595
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,360
Speaker 4: and learning. So just don't stop with the new ideas,

596
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 4: don't stop thinking about how you can grow yourself from

597
00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:37,560
Speaker 4: your skill set, because it's all for you too. You

598
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:41,080
Speaker 4: get people can get confused, They're like, oh, well, this

599
00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:44,080
Speaker 4: is just for the company's benefit, it's for yours.

600
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:45,000
Speaker 5: Yeah.

601
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:48,400
Speaker 2: I think what's I'm taking away from this conversation And

602
00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 2: I really appreciate it because it's always a great reminder.

603
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 2: Is like, we are all innovators, and sometimes sometimes you

604
00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 2: have a great idea, it's just the wrong time. More like,

605
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:02,479
Speaker 2: not all of the day different variables are in place,

606
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,560
Speaker 2: but that doesn't make the idea not a good idea.

607
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:09,400
Speaker 2: So in the meantime, until all the variables fall into place,

608
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:12,959
Speaker 2: you can continue to pressure tests and gather information and

609
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 2: research and throw ideas. And I just like, I love

610
00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 2: this idea that we can all be pressure testers of

611
00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:21,400
Speaker 2: our own ideas, but we also can invite others to

612
00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:23,640
Speaker 2: do the same. But this idea that you have to

613
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:25,680
Speaker 2: keep putting one foot in front of the other. You

614
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 2: have to just keep going even when you get those rejections,

615
00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:30,040
Speaker 2: I think it's just a great lesson for us all

616
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:35,720
Speaker 2: to remember and again removing ego out of it. Well, Tim,

617
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 2: thank you so much for joining us. I know, me

618
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:40,000
Speaker 2: and Gianna we've taken in so much just from you,

619
00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 2: hearing you about your journey and even just like the

620
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:46,320
Speaker 2: temperature checks that you've given yourself over the years to

621
00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:48,719
Speaker 2: figure out when was it time to move on? And

622
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:50,440
Speaker 2: what I love the most is that like you have

623
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 2: not been prescriptive whatsoever and saying like you have to

624
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,240
Speaker 2: do it like this or not. And I think that's

625
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 2: going to resonate so much with our besties. So thank

626
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 2: you so much for coming on the podcast. We appreciate you, Tim.

627
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 3: Before we let you go, where can our listeners find you?

628
00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 4: They can find me on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, all the places.

629
00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 4: Look up my name, you'll find my stuff and hopefully

630
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:16,680
Speaker 4: it helps. Thank you, Tim, I appreciate you both. Thank

631
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:18,800
Speaker 4: you so much. This is a really fun conversation.

632
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 2: Tim gave a lot of great advice. And if you

633
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:28,640
Speaker 2: want to stay at your company, that's awesome. Now if

634
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 2: you want to leave, that's cool too. What's important is

635
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 2: that you feel like you're growing no matter where you

636
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 2: are in your career. After the break, I.

637
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:40,040
Speaker 1: Love a good holiday party, but can they be cringe?

638
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:52,560
Speaker 1: That's next? Okay, So Tim, give me a lot to

639
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:55,400
Speaker 1: think about. I kind of want to know where are

640
00:30:55,440 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: you still Switzerland? Do we need an offline? I think

641
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 1: right now?

642
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 3: I grow your career at a company as long as

643
00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:06,800
Speaker 3: you have opportunities to grow in your role and also

644
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:08,959
Speaker 3: potentially elsewhere within the company.

645
00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 5: Yeah.

646
00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 2: I really love when he said that, because we've said

647
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 2: it a couple times on the podcast. Now about like,

648
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,280
Speaker 2: have you really maxed out in your role? And I think,

649
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:19,320
Speaker 2: like so often everybody myself included, you always think, of

650
00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 2: course I have. But the truth of the matter is

651
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 2: you probably have opportunities to upscale. And I really appreciated

652
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 2: how he mentioned, like, if you are interested in doing

653
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 2: something else, even if it's not necessarily in your job description,

654
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 2: do you need to go to an entirely different company

655
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 2: to do that? Or can you raise your hand for

656
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:38,600
Speaker 2: internal projects? A good manager is also going to help

657
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 2: you figure out, Okay, how can this person continue to

658
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 2: grow and up level themselves whilst at the company. So

659
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:48,040
Speaker 2: I really appreciated him saying that because I think we all,

660
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:50,400
Speaker 2: no matter where you are at in your career, can

661
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 2: benefit from that. Yeah, but what do you think What

662
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:53,080
Speaker 2: was your takeaway?

663
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 1: Frow was a good reminder. What I'm taking away is,

664
00:31:57,600 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 1: you know, just like take a chill.

665
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 3: Though you didn't say that, but that's what I'm taking away.

666
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,760
Speaker 3: It's like, we get so kind of caught up with

667
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 3: these big macro decisions of like should I stay or

668
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:10,400
Speaker 3: should I leave? But when you kind of zoom in,

669
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:13,960
Speaker 3: there's so many micro steps and micro decisions.

670
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 1: That get you there. It's not this big like life

671
00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:17,760
Speaker 1: or death situation.

672
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:20,320
Speaker 3: If you have the privilege of making the decision, I

673
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:22,719
Speaker 3: should say, right, like, sometimes you have to leave for

674
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 3: whatever reason and maybe you don't have a lot of

675
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 3: say in it. But I think if you do have

676
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 3: the privilege to make the decision of staying or leaving,

677
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,040
Speaker 3: you don't need to get so caught up in like

678
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 3: this Blacker White situation.

679
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:34,360
Speaker 1: Take your time.

680
00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:36,240
Speaker 3: He said it was like a year lead up until

681
00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 3: he actually left right his last job. So you know,

682
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 3: take small steps and you know, take that informational interview,

683
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,520
Speaker 3: have that networking call, exhaust all your options within that

684
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 3: current role before you kind of have that other job

685
00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 3: offer on the table and then can make the decision.

686
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know.

687
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 2: I think what's been so illuminating about this conversation is

688
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 2: that whether you choose to stay and you want to

689
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,600
Speaker 2: grow in your career like at a company, or you

690
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:03,680
Speaker 2: choose to leave and explore other options, at the end

691
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:06,160
Speaker 2: of the day, it's your decision. And what I love

692
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 2: is that careers are just as unique as the person

693
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:12,920
Speaker 2: who's rocking it. I think at the end of the day,

694
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:15,640
Speaker 2: like we can only give you, guys like tips and

695
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:17,880
Speaker 2: things to think about, but you have to do what

696
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 2: is right for you. I'm still siding on the side

697
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 2: of a hop, skip and a jump, but I might

698
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:25,200
Speaker 2: linger a little bit.

699
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:27,720
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, you're sounding a little bit like Switzerland.

700
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:32,360
Speaker 2: I don't know if I'm that sweet, but but you

701
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 2: know what is sweet?

702
00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: Cringe or cool?

703
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:38,680
Speaker 2: You guys, this is where we discuss all things workplace

704
00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 2: culture and trends and we get to determine whether they

705
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 2: are cool or cringe. Gihan and I are doing something

706
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:47,640
Speaker 2: a little different this week, Gianna, what do we talk.

707
00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:52,320
Speaker 3: About special edition of cooler Cringe. We're talking about the

708
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:54,320
Speaker 3: holiday office party.

709
00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:58,040
Speaker 1: Happy holidays.

710
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 3: In honor of the holidays, we're gonna be doing a

711
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:06,120
Speaker 3: lightning round version of Cringe or Cool discussing the holiday

712
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,080
Speaker 3: office party. So we're going to go through a list

713
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:11,439
Speaker 3: of things related to holiday office parties and determine whether

714
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:13,200
Speaker 3: they're cringe or cool.

715
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 1: I'm first.

716
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:17,840
Speaker 3: Okay, guys, we don't even know what these are. Producer

717
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 3: just handed us notes. So let's say I'm first. Okay,

718
00:34:21,640 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 3: number one, having an open bar.

719
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:27,560
Speaker 2: I think it's cool because who doesn't want to, you know,

720
00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 2: get a little comfortable.

721
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,239
Speaker 1: You know, you want to be able to like rocking around, Yeah,

722
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 1: rocking around what you drink? Yeah, But I will say

723
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:37,279
Speaker 1: it's kind of cringe because some people don't know how

724
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:39,760
Speaker 1: to hold their Nika. Yeah, I love a holiday cocktail.

725
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:44,239
Speaker 1: But be foreale that you got to go back to

726
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:45,920
Speaker 1: work because you guys don't want to wake up the

727
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 1: next day. And I know some people have been there

728
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 1: being like, what did I say to my boss? Or

729
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:53,760
Speaker 1: you wake up? And who's no, Okay, what's your school

730
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,719
Speaker 1: of cringe? I'm just saying, all right, so consensus cool

731
00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 1: could be cringe cool, but too much it's cringe? Yeah? Okay, Okay,

732
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 1: you're nine is talking about work at the party.

733
00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 2: Oh okay, here's my thing.

734
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:11,399
Speaker 3: Oh god, But like, honestly, as a socially anxious girl,

735
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:13,920
Speaker 3: like sometimes you need that to break the ice. You

736
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,319
Speaker 3: might be making small talk with people that are not

737
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:18,479
Speaker 3: on your immediate team. I know you're like literally throwing

738
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:20,399
Speaker 3: up at the idea of a small talk. I see

739
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:21,840
Speaker 3: that on your face. But like, just stay with me

740
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:25,840
Speaker 3: for a moment here, stay brave. I think fine.

741
00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 1: But like, I mean, you're at work, So yeah, you're

742
00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 1: gonna talk about work. I think it's cool. Honestly, it's cool.

743
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:35,240
Speaker 1: Don't talk. Also, some people don't want to get too personal.

744
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:39,480
Speaker 2: Okay, so I really do we disagree? O, don't talk

745
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 2: to me Like, no, if I'm here to party, I'm

746
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:43,040
Speaker 2: not here to talk about work.

747
00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:45,760
Speaker 1: Okay. I've never been to like a party party like Holly.

748
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 2: No, I don't even like to go to like team

749
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:53,080
Speaker 2: happy hours and us talk about work. It's not happy anymore. Yeah,

750
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,200
Speaker 2: I guess at that point we might as well clock in.

751
00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:57,279
Speaker 2: You want me to print some things off while we're

752
00:35:57,280 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 2: at it.

753
00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't think we're being like, oh, did

754
00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:01,719
Speaker 3: you make updates to that project? I think it just

755
00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 3: like oh, what do you do at the company?

756
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,759
Speaker 1: No, you know what? You can't they can't. You can

757
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: ask me that all my day holiday party, I'm saying,

758
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:10,320
Speaker 1: bar away from jamatic.

759
00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:10,799
Speaker 5: Why are we.

760
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 1: Talking about this now? What does it matter what I do?

761
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:13,680
Speaker 5: Get?

762
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 1: Let's let's drink. So you want somebody, You're gonna be

763
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,440
Speaker 1: the one at the open bar. I'm trying to be

764
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:21,799
Speaker 1: out on the floor. I don't have time to be

765
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:23,399
Speaker 1: talking about roles and responsibility.

766
00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:25,239
Speaker 3: I've never been to a holiday party at work with

767
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:27,279
Speaker 3: the dance floor, so if there was one, I want

768
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 3: to be talking about work.

769
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:30,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, our holiday parties are a little bit more on

770
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 2: the corporate side. I've been in some more risque situations.

771
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:35,680
Speaker 1: We'll offline about that.

772
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, last one giving useless gifts in a white

773
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,279
Speaker 3: elephant gift exchange to be funny.

774
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:46,840
Speaker 1: Absolutely cringe. First of all, I hate bad gifts.

775
00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:51,359
Speaker 3: You know what this is cringe because I'm the type

776
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:53,000
Speaker 3: of person I feel like you're also like this, Like

777
00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:55,480
Speaker 3: I'm thoughtful about the gift. I'm spending so much time

778
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,279
Speaker 3: figuring out like what is gender neutral? What is going

779
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 3: to be like under the limit? What can somebody actually use?

780
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:04,160
Speaker 3: And then I'd be the one to get like a

781
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:07,200
Speaker 3: yo yo and be like, seriously, what am I doing with.

782
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:09,040
Speaker 1: This yo yo? And I know you didn't spend twenty

783
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 1: five dollars on the yo yo.

784
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:13,279
Speaker 2: That's my villain origin story, because how dare you have

785
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 2: me go up here to Macy's Harold Square with the

786
00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:20,200
Speaker 2: beautiful lights and I just spent all this money on

787
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:22,480
Speaker 2: a nice gift for you. Got them to do the

788
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:25,360
Speaker 2: premiere packaging package, the candles, you know how they do

789
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:27,520
Speaker 2: the cue, the little the little wrap.

790
00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 1: Oh my, you even a little bit above budget, Like

791
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:34,680
Speaker 1: I spent extra money for you to give you the

792
00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:37,560
Speaker 1: experience of a life. Here's the worst part.

793
00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:40,720
Speaker 3: You have to open it live and if you guys

794
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 3: don't know, like, I cannot hide a facial expression to

795
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:46,759
Speaker 3: save my life. So when I open that yo yo,

796
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, what's.

797
00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 1: The problem my face? I can I can lie on

798
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 1: my acting taps in heavy, but I'm dying inside.

799
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:00,880
Speaker 3: And that stops people from particip beating next year one

800
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:02,920
Speaker 3: thousand percent And then guess what next year is like?

801
00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:05,440
Speaker 1: Two people doing it? Then like just exchange each other seriously,

802
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:07,279
Speaker 1: Yeah no, I mean honestly, I think we can just

803
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,880
Speaker 1: mix the whole gift giving things. Let's just do like

804
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:10,480
Speaker 1: gift cards.

805
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, we're just a card a card. Okay, so we agree, cringe,

806
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 3: very cringe. Okay, so we agreed on to divide it

807
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:19,960
Speaker 3: on one pretty solid.

808
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:21,200
Speaker 1: I think I think we're doing all things.

809
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:24,319
Speaker 2: Had we ended together, I was getting a little We

810
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:28,800
Speaker 2: can talk more at the holiday party, yes, but not

811
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 2: about work. Noted well, I hope that you guys have

812
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:34,439
Speaker 2: also enjoyed this when we would definitely love to know

813
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:36,400
Speaker 2: which do you guys agree with?

814
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,440
Speaker 1: Are these topics cool? Cringe? Also let us know other ones,

815
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:42,279
Speaker 1: like holiday parties in general cooler cringe, Like, are you

816
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:43,359
Speaker 1: guys going? Is that the thing?

817
00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:43,560
Speaker 4: Now?

818
00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: Let's the vibe. Let's the vibe. I love a holiday party,

819
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 1: me too. I'm gonna go. Yeah, we can wear ugly sweaters.

820
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 1: Let's talk off I'm not sweaters anyways.

821
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:56,880
Speaker 3: All right, guys, let us know what you think you

822
00:38:56,880 --> 00:38:58,520
Speaker 3: can let us know in the newsletter this week, we'll

823
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:01,720
Speaker 3: be discussing the topics there. Make sure you're following the newsletter.

824
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:04,239
Speaker 3: It's called Let's Talk Offline. A link will be in

825
00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 3: the show description and also in my LinkedIn bio. You

826
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:10,560
Speaker 3: can also share posts on LinkedIn and tag Jamay and

827
00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 3: I letting us know your takeaways from this week's episode

828
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:14,920
Speaker 3: and your takes uncle or cringe.

829
00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:19,919
Speaker 2: Also, we have to give a warm holiday thank you

830
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:23,440
Speaker 2: to Joey for setting in your question. You have just

831
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,360
Speaker 2: given Gean and I the holiday gift of the spirit,

832
00:39:26,719 --> 00:39:30,000
Speaker 2: the spirit back, a spirit to keep going through the

833
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,520
Speaker 2: end of the year. Thank you Joey for your contribution

834
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,439
Speaker 2: and your amazing gift. You all too can also give

835
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:39,319
Speaker 2: us gifts of questions. Okay, information on how to do

836
00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:40,840
Speaker 2: that is in the show description.

837
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 3: Speaking of gifts, please rate and review the show and

838
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:47,200
Speaker 3: give us a follow so you get notified each week

839
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:48,120
Speaker 3: when episode drops.

840
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 1: I'd be the greatest gift of it. I'd be the

841
00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:50,160
Speaker 1: greatest gift.

842
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:51,960
Speaker 3: That's the only thing on our wish list is here

843
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:55,160
Speaker 3: maybe for you, but I will circle back the designer

844
00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:57,520
Speaker 3: bag centers. All right, guys, thank you so much for

845
00:39:57,560 --> 00:40:01,120
Speaker 3: listening this week. Before you go, remember we've always got

846
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:03,000
Speaker 3: your back, so if something comes up.

847
00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 1: Let's Talk Offline. I'm Jonna PRDUENTI and I'm Jamie Jackson Gadsden,

848
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:08,440
Speaker 1: Stay Thriving.

849
00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 3: Let's Talk Offline is a production of LinkedIn News and

850
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,839
Speaker 3: iHeart Podcasts. The show is produced by Western Sound. Our

851
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:20,240
Speaker 3: producer is Sabrina Fang. The show is edited by Savannah Wright.

852
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 3: Our associate producer is Sarah Dealey. Alex mckinnis is our engineer,

853
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:26,560
Speaker 3: and Ben Adair is the executive producer.

854
00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:31,600
Speaker 2: Executive producers at iHeart Podcasts are Katrina Norvel and Nikki Etour.

855
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:35,959
Speaker 2: We got support from LinkedIn's Jesse Hemple, Sarah Storm and

856
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 2: Ayana Angel. Maya Pope Chappelle is director of Content, Dave

857
00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:43,839
Speaker 2: Pond is head of News Production, Courtney Coop is head

858
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:47,160
Speaker 2: of Original Programming, and Dan Roth is the editor in

859
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 2: chief of LinkedIn