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Speaker 1: Hey, what, Welcome in Doug Gottlieb here, and you are

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Speaker 1: listening to All Ball, All Basketball all the time. And reminder,

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Speaker 1: you can listen to The Doug Gotlieb Show daily three

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Speaker 1: to six Eastern, twelve to three Pacific on your Fox

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Speaker 1: Sport radio affiliate or I Heart Radio Apple or Sirius

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Speaker 1: x M two seventeen or two oh three. Can remember

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Speaker 1: which is which, but you can figure it out. I

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Speaker 1: think Serious is first and next M is second, or

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Speaker 1: I don't know, you'll figure it out. I'm on the

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Speaker 1: same station as Dan Patrick. No better. Good. Um. Rob

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Speaker 1: Murphy is our guest this week on the All Ball Podcast.

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Speaker 1: He's a really talented I guess you'd say young. He's

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Speaker 1: in his mid forties. Young coach at e M you.

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Speaker 1: He's been the head coach. This is ninth year. Wow,

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Speaker 1: long time. And it's an AMU program that after Ben

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Speaker 1: Brown left went to cal It fell out of hard

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Speaker 1: times and they've resuscitated it. Two years ago. His best year,

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Speaker 1: last year's senior Lady and team three best players with

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Speaker 1: seniors and and they struggle. I'll ask him about that,

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Speaker 1: but it's also about his personal journey. Grew up in Detroit,

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Speaker 1: you're not going to believe all the different instrecacies of

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Speaker 1: his upbringing what led him to being the man he

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Speaker 1: is today, the parent he is today, the coach he

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Speaker 1: is today. And by the way, he has a new

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Speaker 1: book out. It's called Deep by Rob Murphy. Once you

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Speaker 1: hear the interview, you're gonna want to buy the book

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Speaker 1: and you're gonna want to get to know this guy's

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Speaker 1: amazing guy. Um okay, let's let me give you a

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Speaker 1: quick little uh line on Kentucky being beaten by Evansville.

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Speaker 1: And while it's not panic, it's not canceled the season. Um,

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Speaker 1: it's really cool for Walter. Walter McCarty. You know, a

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Speaker 1: team that was picked eight in their league and last year,

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Speaker 1: one of his first games, they played Xavier. They nearly

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Speaker 1: beat Xavier. Xavier did not have the season that Kentucky's

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Speaker 1: expected to have, the one ranked number one the country.

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Speaker 1: And we all know that it's really hard to tell

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Speaker 1: who is who's what and who's not. We know that

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Speaker 1: parody has arrived, and we also know that you know

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Speaker 1: when you have when you have players, um, when you

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Speaker 1: when you have a variety of guys like uh, like

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Speaker 1: Evansville has, you know, I mean they have kJ Riley,

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Speaker 1: who was there with the old coaching staff, and of

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Speaker 1: course average Fortuny game last year, combined with Sam Cunliff,

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Speaker 1: who this is his third stop, isn't it. Yeah, his

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Speaker 1: third stop us that Arizona State for like a minute,

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Speaker 1: and then Kansas and now at Evansville. So you get

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Speaker 1: you get some older guys at the at the mid

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Speaker 1: major level. But Walter McCarthy is a gem of a

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Speaker 1: guy and I think a gem of a coach. And

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Speaker 1: I just I thought they played harder. Obviously they hit

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Speaker 1: five more three pointers that that's a big difference. And

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Speaker 1: the question becomes, I guess twofold one, will Kentucky have

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Speaker 1: the shooting to win big? And two. As much as

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Speaker 1: we could say they're a young team, they're not really.

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Speaker 1: Nate Sistina is not. He's a grad transfer senior. Nick

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Speaker 1: Richards has been there, Ashton Higgins has been there. Uh

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Speaker 1: Quick Lee has been there, and and like you know,

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Speaker 1: we like to do this thing where obviously Quil Culil

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Speaker 1: Whitney is there one starting freshman. They're starting one freshman,

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Speaker 1: so it's not like they have all ten year old

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Speaker 1: running around out there and they're being beaten by thirteen

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Speaker 1: year olds, Like you've got some experience, and now you're

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Speaker 1: seeing why Nick Richard, Janeshton Hagen's and Hagen's really struggled,

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Speaker 1: you know out you know there's things he does well,

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Speaker 1: shooting the basketball not one of those things. So can

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Speaker 1: they have the shooting? Think about what they lost some

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Speaker 1: last year. You lose both of your both of your

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Speaker 1: star wings. You know, Tyler Hero was a walking bucket

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Speaker 1: um and and you know you're you're not left with

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Speaker 1: with much. Johnny Jazan can really shoot, but he was

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Speaker 1: I don't know if he's ready to truly be a

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Speaker 1: star on this team, but they do need his offense,

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Speaker 1: and eventually Tyrese Maxie will earn his way into the

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Speaker 1: starting lineup. But Tyrese max is really a talented player

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Speaker 1: who did hit some shots, you know, hit the big

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Speaker 1: shots against Michigan State, but he's not a great shooter.

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Speaker 1: Like that's not really what he I wouldn't say that's

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Speaker 1: what he does. He's a score, he's a bucket. He's

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Speaker 1: a guy who can go get his But I don't

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Speaker 1: think that he's a shooter. So does Kentucky have the shooting?

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Speaker 1: The answer so far is no. But I also think

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Speaker 1: that the lack of sustained effort is surprising, not because

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Speaker 1: it's this row in the season, but because this is

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Speaker 1: not a group of Kentucky players that they're throwing out

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Speaker 1: five freshman at once. And the hardest adjustment you make

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Speaker 1: when you go to college basketball how hard you have

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Speaker 1: to play in comparison to the opponent, how hard you

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Speaker 1: have to practice. And I'm surprised that Kentucky was frankly

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Speaker 1: outplayed by Evansville at the time of this recording last night.

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Speaker 1: Those are my expectations for Kentucky. Like I thought Florida

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Speaker 1: would be better, but man, they got man handled, man

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Speaker 1: handle black Shirt got manh handed by Florida State and

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Speaker 1: Florid stay continues to dominate Florida. I would have thought

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Speaker 1: Florida was was better. Man. Maybe this is an SEC story. Um,

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Speaker 1: we'll we'll see how the rest of the SEC kind

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Speaker 1: of develops. I do think the PAC twelve is pretty good.

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Speaker 1: We saw Oregon State lose to Oklahoma. UM, but Oregon

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Speaker 1: State is mid pack right, They have I think a

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Speaker 1: really good starting life. The question is gonna be point

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Speaker 1: guard play has been has been an issue UM and

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Speaker 1: trace Tinkle might is he's the best player in the

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Speaker 1: PAC twelve doesn't mean he's the best prospect. Fifth year

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Speaker 1: senior gonna average twenty and ten and probably four or

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Speaker 1: five assists, Like he's a tremendous player. But their lack

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Speaker 1: of bench depth, and you know, end of the day,

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Speaker 1: it's he and Thompson and Kyler. Kelly is really just

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Speaker 1: a shot blocker. They don't They haven't had great point

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Speaker 1: guard player and that's why they've lost so many close games.

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Speaker 1: I feel like, but Oregon, UH, Arizona, USC, UM, Washington,

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Speaker 1: those are all like legit n c A caliber teams.

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Speaker 1: And then we'll see about Arizona State that I have

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Speaker 1: high expectations for. Be Hurley's team has a lot of fighting.

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Speaker 1: Remy Martin now in his third year, the third year,

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Speaker 1: it feels like he's been there forever. He's only been

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Speaker 1: there three years. So I'm I'm fascinating to see what

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Speaker 1: Arizona State looks like. I'm gonna get a chance to

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Speaker 1: see San Diego State, Utah State in person over the

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Speaker 1: next couple of days. I'll report back next week. Let

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Speaker 1: me just say this about the A C C games

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Speaker 1: being played early in the season, do I agree with

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Speaker 1: the idea of Jim Beheim, Like, hey, it's this is

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Speaker 1: just for the a CEC network. I sure, sure, And

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Speaker 1: TV does pay a lot of the bills, and we

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Speaker 1: make excuses for TV, you know, for we make excuses

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Speaker 1: for bad games being on TV or crazy travel schedule,

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Speaker 1: like well, TV want to have, Like, look, every game

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Speaker 1: you play is gonna be on TV. I don't, actually, Mike,

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Speaker 1: when I take a breath, I don't mind it because

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Speaker 1: the a c C regular season champion has been devalued

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Speaker 1: already because there's so many teams and mismatch schedules. It

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Speaker 1: doesn't mean that Virginia when they wanted hasn't been the

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Speaker 1: best team. But if you don't play Carolina twice, you

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Speaker 1: don't play Duke twice, and they play each other twice

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Speaker 1: and play you twice, or only play you once and

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Speaker 1: they're playing you on the road, it's it's hard to

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Speaker 1: determine who is truly a league champion. But it's weird.

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Speaker 1: It's almost like you wish they would play half the

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Speaker 1: league season early and then have like maybe Christmas time

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Speaker 1: or during some sort of break when you play nonconference

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Speaker 1: games and then play him again like those early non

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Speaker 1: conference games. I mean, teams are gonna look completely different

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Speaker 1: in February and March. Think about it. Think about you know,

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Speaker 1: Boston College won their first game of the year in

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Speaker 1: Boston College opened up the season with an a c

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Speaker 1: C game against wake Forest. I want you to take

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Speaker 1: a breath and think about the idea that they don't

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Speaker 1: play wake Forest again until January nine. What if they

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Speaker 1: play wake Forest in the a c C tournament like

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Speaker 1: in March, you play in November, you play in January,

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Speaker 1: playing in March, the teams will look completely different each time.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't bother me because it does give you a

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Speaker 1: chance to truly evaluate how a team has evolved. But

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Speaker 1: at some point this is going to be there'll be

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Speaker 1: a damaging law us to an a C C team,

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Speaker 1: And let's see if they do it next year, There'll

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Speaker 1: be a damaging loss to an a C C team

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Speaker 1: because you know, Syracuse played Virginia well before they already

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Speaker 1: and scored what was it, thirty four points or something

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Speaker 1: like that. Now Virginia is gonna be good, it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 1: But there will be a loss to a team that,

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Speaker 1: when the game was played was actually healthy and pretty good.

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Speaker 1: So I don't. I don't hate the A c C

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Speaker 1: teams playing each other early. I understand it. I think

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Speaker 1: it's kind of cool. And I do think that uh

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Speaker 1: A c C regular season play or the regular season

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Speaker 1: champion has been devalued by these deep, deep conferences. But

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Speaker 1: I'll also tell you that, um, it's at the end

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Speaker 1: of the year. We look at your resume. Seeing a

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Speaker 1: game in November, I struggle to take it seriously because

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Speaker 1: teams are so very different. But that's not the way

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Speaker 1: that the That's not the way the net rating works.

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Speaker 1: The net rating is the net rating, regardless of the

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Speaker 1: month of the season the game is played in. And

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Speaker 1: that strikes that the opposite of how I I believe

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Speaker 1: those last ten games should be important. Let's turn our

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Speaker 1: attention to the NBA. I give you more college basketball stuff,

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Speaker 1: um next week. You know, I watched Trey Young last

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Speaker 1: night and he was amazing, amazing for the Hawks. And

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Speaker 1: my my issue with Trey Young heading into his career was,

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Speaker 1: uh one, there's a lot of discussion about how he

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Speaker 1: fit into a team kind of concept. You know, his

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Speaker 1: dad rayed for who was a really good player man

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Speaker 1: kind of thing, great scoring guard at Texas Tech, I

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Speaker 1: played against him. I thought he was awesome. Um, he

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Speaker 1: was so protective of Trey at a young age that

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Speaker 1: I don't know if he was the guy's guy. You know,

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Speaker 1: he went to you know, he went to high school

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Speaker 1: and in college right down the street from each other,

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Speaker 1: and he spent the families very tighten it. And because

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Speaker 1: of it, there were a lot of people like, well

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Speaker 1: do you ever fit in with the team? And the

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Speaker 1: team didn't buy into and leading the country and scoring

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Speaker 1: and assist and he didn't play defense, and there's some

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Speaker 1: dysfunction there. I'll never forget. I talked to Brad Stevens

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Speaker 1: and I asked him about it was about a different

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Speaker 1: player in the NBA, and it might even been about

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Speaker 1: Jalen Brown and how they didn't win when he was

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Speaker 1: a cow. And he's like, look, if you evaluate the

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Speaker 1: player and you think the player is a supreme competitor, like,

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Speaker 1: you're not gonna draft somebody that you think lacks the

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Speaker 1: competitive gene, the the defense thing that when the guys

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Speaker 1: don't play defense in college or don't have the toughness

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Speaker 1: in college, toughness is hard because you can't just instill

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Speaker 1: in just decide one day I'm a tough player. But

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Speaker 1: and we got around to talking about Trey, and I

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Speaker 1: remember him saying like, look, you're tough enough to lead

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Speaker 1: the country and scoring and assists, you're probably tough enough

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Speaker 1: to play defense. It's a bit of a mentality. But

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Speaker 1: but his his point was, look, all these guys they

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Speaker 1: come out and people go, I don't know if he's

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Speaker 1: gonna guard anybody, but in the NBA if you don't,

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Speaker 1: if you don't get anybody, you're gonna get embarrassed every

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Speaker 1: And if you evaluate somebody to have a high level

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Speaker 1: of competitiveness, they're going to compete defensively and they're gonna

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Speaker 1: get better. Now what's his ultimate ceiling? I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I still I thought that that the problem with Trey

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Speaker 1: was gonna be a little bit like Steph, which is

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Speaker 1: early in your career you can get coach fired because

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Speaker 1: you have to have him have the ball. They have

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Speaker 1: to have the ball to make plays to be who

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Speaker 1: they are. There are gonna be some older players to

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Speaker 1: get jealous of the overhandling of the ball and some

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Speaker 1: of the shots that you take and the lack of

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Speaker 1: defensive toughness. The genius to what the Hawks have done

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Speaker 1: is for the most part, obviously Vince Carter's exception. They

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Speaker 1: have a young team, so they're totally bought into Tray,

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Speaker 1: and by the way, Tray has gotten tougher, stronger, and better.

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Speaker 1: He's still not a good defensive player, but he's not

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Speaker 1: a swinging gate. He's not Isaiah Thomas, for example. And

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Speaker 1: the shot making is really, really remarkable. I don't know

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Speaker 1: why he wanted to be compared to Steve Nash. It's

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Speaker 1: because I guess everybody respects Nash is passing. But he's

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Speaker 1: starting to look like as close as anybody we've seen

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Speaker 1: to steph in terms of the difficulty of shot and

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Speaker 1: the percentage of makes. It's a long way to go

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Speaker 1: right because they're still not winning big. But I'll be

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Speaker 1: the first to admit appear to be wrong on Trey

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Speaker 1: Young and how much you can win with him in

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Speaker 1: the early stages of his career. A couple of quick

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Speaker 1: things around the NBA. The Lakers are gonna sit Anthony

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Speaker 1: Davis at the time of this recording, this is a

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Speaker 1: Wednesday night, so it drops on Thursday. He's not gonna play.

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Speaker 1: They're gonna beat the Warriors, and I get that the

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Speaker 1: Warriors are sitting there going like, we're not gonna sit Steff.

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Speaker 1: Why would Steph Curry come back and play in the spring?

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Speaker 1: Clay is not gonna play. He's not gonna play. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if you want to call it tanking or

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Speaker 1: just being smart. This is a waste of a season

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Speaker 1: for the Warriors. It's I've never seen anything like these

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Speaker 1: litany of injuries they have. It's crazy, like of their

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Speaker 1: top eight heading into the season, six are out and

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Speaker 1: and you know the finals, I mean a two times

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Speaker 1: M v P and Clay It's it's it's remarkable. So

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Speaker 1: you know, now the question would become if you're the

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Speaker 1: if you're the Warriors, my guests would be they're going

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Speaker 1: to continue. I mean, Danceel Russells gonna put up huge

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Speaker 1: numbers this year, but eventually you try and move D'anceelo Russell.

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Speaker 1: I think that's the deal. I think we're all kind

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Speaker 1: of in on that, like then really fit with who

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Speaker 1: they are. Maybe they keep him because he can just score,

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Speaker 1: but it doesn't defend the way they defend. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: He's a pick and roll player than not pick and

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Speaker 1: roll team, but they will be this year. So the

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Speaker 1: question would be who would they draft? Right, wouldn't it be?

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Speaker 1: Would it be fun to just we're gonna have to

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Speaker 1: dedicate segments to who are they going to draft? Because

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Speaker 1: that would be super interesting to me, more so than

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Speaker 1: their actual season this year. The season this year is

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Speaker 1: kind of a mess. And then could they would they

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Speaker 1: trade away d'anzelo, probably for a couple of older pieces

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Speaker 1: more than for any sort of draft picks, wouldn't they Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that that seems reasonable. On the other side, instead of

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Speaker 1: talking about but they take James Wiseman, Like I do

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Speaker 1: think if you're the Warriors, as much as you'd like

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Speaker 1: to replenish and get young players, get an Isaiah Steward

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Speaker 1: or Anthony Anthony Everarde is a stud by the way,

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Speaker 1: he's the freshman at Georgia. He could have been a

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Speaker 1: senior in high school this year. I think Cole Anthony

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Speaker 1: is gonna be right there for the number one overall pick,

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Speaker 1: ahead of like a LaMelo Ball. But if you're the Warriors,

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Speaker 1: are gonna try and win over the next couple of years.

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Speaker 1: I don't think Wiseman put is he's not advanced enough.

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Speaker 1: Anthony Averages not nineteen year old, are gonna help you

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Speaker 1: win an NBA championship. I don't think so. Maybe they

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Speaker 1: acquire that draft pick and then traded as an asset,

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Speaker 1: but they're taking on the Lakers, and I think the

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Speaker 1: Lakers are are real. I think Crusoe getting major minutes

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Speaker 1: changes them and gives them an incredibly athletic finishing lineup.

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Speaker 1: I'm not a huge Rondo guy, but if Rondo plays

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Speaker 1: ten minutes of game fifteen minutes a game, he can pass.

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Speaker 1: He's smart as hell. Lebron likes playing with him, and

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Speaker 1: he actually can make a shot. Now he's not. You

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Speaker 1: don't want to go to him for ten threes a game,

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Speaker 1: but he can't make a shot. Lakers are coming together,

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Speaker 1: and the thought is they at Andre Goodal at some

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Speaker 1: point this year, and now you have Kyle Kuzmo, who

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Speaker 1: has given them bench pop. That's a really good team.

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Speaker 1: That's a championship caliber team. But with all the talk

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Speaker 1: about resting guys and load management, isn't at least curious

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Speaker 1: to everybody else? What do the Lakers do? Like the

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Speaker 1: Brons like, hey, if I'm healthy, I play. Okay, We've

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Speaker 1: only played a full season once and all that ego aside,

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Speaker 1: Hey dude, your legacy is going to be determined in

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Speaker 1: l a by what you do in the playoffs, and

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Speaker 1: you're more likely to be healthy in the playoffs if

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Speaker 1: you sit in the regular season like I don't. I

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Speaker 1: don't know that. Once you get a term like load management,

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Speaker 1: it becomes something that catches like wildfire. And I get

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Speaker 1: that it was harder back in the day, not having

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Speaker 1: the treatment you have today, not having the private planes

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Speaker 1: and the great hotels and all the nutrition. But if

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Speaker 1: you're the Lakers, like this is like quiet letter, doesn't

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Speaker 1: surprise me. Everybody knew he's gonna play sixty games. That's

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Speaker 1: what we did. He won a championship. That seems to

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Speaker 1: work for him. Do I love it? No, But we

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Speaker 1: knew it was coming. For the Lakers, they really have

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Speaker 1: to manage the health of this team because so many

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Speaker 1: of their big pieces are either oft injured guys or

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Speaker 1: guys that are over thirty years old who are more

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Speaker 1: likely to get hurt. That to me is the biggest

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Speaker 1: story of the Lakers, because now they'll defend. They seem

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Speaker 1: to have enough shooting, and Lebron and a d work

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Speaker 1: together quite well. Modern day travelers know that luggage is

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Speaker 1: That's Away travel dot com slash all ball. Well, let's

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Speaker 1: welcome him in. He's the head coach of Eastern Michigan

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Speaker 1: and he's been there since man since two thousand let

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Speaker 1: even there that long. He's won a hundred and forty

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Speaker 1: four games. He's also a new author as an Amazing

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Speaker 1: Kind of Life Journey. He's Rob Murphy and he joins

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Speaker 1: us on the All Ball podcast. Coach, how are you?

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Speaker 1: I'm pretty good, dog, Thanks for having me. I've been

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Speaker 1: here nine years now, going into year nine here at

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Speaker 1: the Eastern Michigan and I'm excited about it and things

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Speaker 1: are going well. You know, it's interesting we're about the

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Speaker 1: same age, a couple of years older than me, but

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Speaker 1: you remember, like Eastern My I have like to Eastern

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Speaker 1: Michigan memories for my lifetime. Right. One is the n

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Speaker 1: c A tournament run with Real Boykin and the other

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Speaker 1: was before I think it was before that was ABC

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Speaker 1: D camp was there, um going into my junior year. Right,

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Speaker 1: So I've been on campus. I've been in the dorms

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Speaker 1: back then, the field house didn't have air conditioning. Um

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Speaker 1: it was it was it was a ways back. Um

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Speaker 1: as a you know, as somebody who who grew up

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Speaker 1: in Detroit, Michigan, like, what's this is? That is Eastern

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Speaker 1: Michigan at home. It is, yeah, thirty minutes you know

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Speaker 1: from Detroit, where I grew up. I actually signed with

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Speaker 1: Eastern Michigan to play football here. I was a you know,

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Speaker 1: a really good football player coming out of high school.

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Speaker 1: I didn't score high enough on the A C T

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Speaker 1: or S A T at the last minute, so I

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Speaker 1: had to take another route and show to play Division

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Speaker 1: two basketball. So for me, in two thousand and eleven,

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Speaker 1: it became a full circle for me to be back

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Speaker 1: here and be a part of Eastern Michigan and be

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Speaker 1: at home. Yeah, you have a fascinating life tale. And

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Speaker 1: I want to get into your book, get into your

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Speaker 1: journey and you know some of the some of the

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Speaker 1: stops along the way. Um. But but what part of

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Speaker 1: Detroit did you grow up in? On the west side

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Speaker 1: of Detroit? Um? You know. I wanted to low income areas, Dexter, Davison,

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Speaker 1: the area is where I started. Then we moved over

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Speaker 1: to a seven mile in living or area and then

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Speaker 1: to seven mile in shape for area. But the west

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Speaker 1: side of Detroit, um, you know. And and I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: change it, uh, you know, for for nothing. My upbringing

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Speaker 1: and my experiences were tough. But I turned all of

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Speaker 1: that uh pain in the in the power and kind

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Speaker 1: of used it to my advantage to continue to navigate

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Speaker 1: through life. Um okay, so what's the West Side known for? Like,

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Speaker 1: you know, there's there's different parts. I grew up in

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Speaker 1: southern California, Right, Orange County was known as being you

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Speaker 1: know more kind of lily white and soft. Right, even

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Speaker 1: though you had Mike Hopkins, I know, a friend of

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Speaker 1: yours like Mike is anything but soft. Right. East side

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Speaker 1: of Los Angeles is mostly Hispanic. West side of Los

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Speaker 1: Angeles is is like Jewish, right, So I'm just going.

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Speaker 1: West side of Detroit is known as what just the

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Speaker 1: molar city is known as. Uh. You know, uh you

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Speaker 1: put your hard hat on. There's a lot of rough areas,

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Speaker 1: so you have to bring a lot of toughness to

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Speaker 1: uh to navigate through that neighborhood. Um. You know what

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Speaker 1: we were known for early on? I happened to go

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Speaker 1: to Mufford High School and Eddie Murphy put us on

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Speaker 1: the map and when he wore at a Mufford T

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Speaker 1: shirt in Beverly Hills, cop Uh. So we always take

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Speaker 1: credit for Eddie Murphy being one of our own. Um,

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Speaker 1: but the West Side was known as you know, your

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Speaker 1: hard workers to navigate through there, and you gotta be

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Speaker 1: tough to come out of there. I I don't recommend

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Speaker 1: a ton of books, but one of the reasons I

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Speaker 1: had you on was I when you're When I saw

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Speaker 1: what your book was about and I started to read

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Speaker 1: some about it, I was like, Wow, this is amazing

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Speaker 1: to kind of bury your soul. So um, okay, so

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Speaker 1: you grew up in the West Side. Um, you only

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Speaker 1: met your dad twice? Right? Is that that's right? That's correct? What? What? What?

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Speaker 1: What do you remember about those meetings? I don't remember

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Speaker 1: even how he looked, to be honest with you, They

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Speaker 1: were very quick meetings. UH. And remember the last time

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Speaker 1: I remember going to UH to meet him, and my

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Speaker 1: mother took me. It was I was about three and

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Speaker 1: a half four years old, and he wouldn't come out

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Speaker 1: of an apartment complex. I can remember him looking down

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Speaker 1: UH and wouldn't come down. But my mom was, I believe,

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Speaker 1: stopping by to get some money from him or something,

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Speaker 1: and he kind of threw a bag out of the

427
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:44,000
Speaker 1: window with some money in it. And that's the last

428
00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 1: sight I ever had with my dad. And I was

429
00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:48,119
Speaker 1: four years old at the time. So being in a

430
00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,520
Speaker 1: single parent home at that time, you know, my mother

431
00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:53,680
Speaker 1: a lot of care, a lot of love, but it

432
00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:58,280
Speaker 1: was it was really rough. Okay. So then, um so

433
00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:03,120
Speaker 1: then you're your uncle was selling drugs at your mom's basement.

434
00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:06,680
Speaker 1: Well yeah, well, well I came from a family who

435
00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:11,560
Speaker 1: was around an environment of drugs and alcohol. And you

436
00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:15,200
Speaker 1: know my family, I mean obviously was was involved with

437
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,000
Speaker 1: a lot of those situations. And uh, you know my

438
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,360
Speaker 1: uncle who was taking care of me at the time,

439
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:23,400
Speaker 1: who was pretty much my father's figure, my mother's brother,

440
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:27,640
Speaker 1: I was into a lot of different, uh illegal activities. Um.

441
00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:29,639
Speaker 1: And you know, as you begin to get older, you

442
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:32,399
Speaker 1: you learn about that and you you see it, uh

443
00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:34,639
Speaker 1: and you tend to mimic it or try to copy it.

444
00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:37,520
Speaker 1: But fortunately for me, I had my little league coaches

445
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:39,320
Speaker 1: because my mother kept me in the sports and kept

446
00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:41,760
Speaker 1: me away from, you know, the tough times and the

447
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:43,800
Speaker 1: hard times as much as she could. So my little

448
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,600
Speaker 1: league coaches begin to you know, show me a different

449
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:48,480
Speaker 1: life and and and put me in a a in

450
00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:51,960
Speaker 1: a different lane. Along my high school coach continued to,

451
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:55,080
Speaker 1: uh to embrace me and kind of give me, uh

452
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:58,639
Speaker 1: you know the importance of education and how athletics can

453
00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,240
Speaker 1: help save my life if I, uh just listened and

454
00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 1: was coachable, and that's what I was able to do. Okay,

455
00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:06,440
Speaker 1: but we we are kind of burying the lead a

456
00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:09,560
Speaker 1: little bit in that. So your uncle's involved in the

457
00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,440
Speaker 1: legal activities, but then you found out your your mom

458
00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,639
Speaker 1: was actually kind of overseeing it, like she was like

459
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,600
Speaker 1: almost like the kingpin, right, yeah, yeah, you know it's

460
00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:21,159
Speaker 1: it's it's funny, Doug, because you when you when you

461
00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:24,159
Speaker 1: think back when I started writing this book. Uh, you know,

462
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:27,359
Speaker 1: one memory leads to the next memory, and before you

463
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:29,119
Speaker 1: know what, you got ten to twelve memories in the

464
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,800
Speaker 1: first chapter. Uh. And you know, as unfortunate as the

465
00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,480
Speaker 1: situation was, you know, my mom lost her life in

466
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,200
Speaker 1: the tragic murder at twenty nine years old. I was thirteen.

467
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:40,680
Speaker 1: But during those times when I was growing up and

468
00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:45,600
Speaker 1: you know, obviously learning her involvement and understood stood how

469
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:49,800
Speaker 1: much she was involved in it and how she ran it. H.

470
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 1: I still sometimes can't grasp a young woman being pregnant

471
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:58,359
Speaker 1: with me at the age of fifteen, having me at sixteen, uh,

472
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:03,359
Speaker 1: a week after her her fifteenth her sixteenth birthday and

473
00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 1: being nineteen being a part of illegal activities, but also

474
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:12,280
Speaker 1: being the leader in the in the illegal activities. Uh.

475
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 1: It's still baffling to me at at that age how

476
00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 1: she was able to navigate and do a really really

477
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,040
Speaker 1: good job to the best of her ability, Uh, to

478
00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:23,959
Speaker 1: keep me and my younger brothers away from it as

479
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 1: much as she could. That's a remarkable You mentioned your

480
00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:31,160
Speaker 1: little league coaches and your your high school basketball coach.

481
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:33,679
Speaker 1: Who was the most influential who? Because you were as

482
00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:35,359
Speaker 1: you point out, you're a great football player and I

483
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:37,520
Speaker 1: want to get to some of the other stuff with football.

484
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:40,200
Speaker 1: But who who If you said, like this is the

485
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 1: guy who saved me, who would have been? It would

486
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,040
Speaker 1: be Venus Jordan. That was my high school coach. I

487
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 1: met him when I was in the tenth grade. He

488
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 1: took over at Muntford High School. Uh, and he is

489
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:53,920
Speaker 1: the one that kind of pulled me to the side.

490
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,800
Speaker 1: He said, you know, you know, Rob, you're a leader.

491
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:59,199
Speaker 1: You communicate well, whatever group of guys you're with, they

492
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:02,639
Speaker 1: follow you. Um. But if you can channel that to

493
00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 1: the positive group and uh, you know, and and continue

494
00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:07,720
Speaker 1: to do the right things in life, you can go

495
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:10,639
Speaker 1: a long way. So my senior year, I had signed

496
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,080
Speaker 1: to play football here at Eastern Michigan and when I

497
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:16,439
Speaker 1: didn't pass the A C t UH he told me to, UH,

498
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 1: you know, go to college. I'm gonna help you get

499
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 1: to another school, which was Central State University. Said, I

500
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:24,920
Speaker 1: want you to major in education. I want you to

501
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,639
Speaker 1: come back here and teaching in Detroit public school system.

502
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 1: I'm gonna save my high school job for you. Once

503
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,440
Speaker 1: you graduate from college, I'm gonna save this job for you,

504
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:35,639
Speaker 1: and you can come back here and start teaching and coaching.

505
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:39,480
Speaker 1: So he gave me the vision. He gave me the direction.

506
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:43,040
Speaker 1: UH took his advice a major in education. Once I graduated,

507
00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 1: I came back to Detroit and started teaching and coaching. Now,

508
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:48,639
Speaker 1: at that time, I never even envisioned myself coaching at

509
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,439
Speaker 1: the college level. I was the first one in my family,

510
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,639
Speaker 1: uh to go to graduate from high school, to attend

511
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 1: college and graduate from college. So being a teacher in

512
00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,080
Speaker 1: the high school coach was the end all be all

513
00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:01,639
Speaker 1: from where I was from. UH. So I was excited

514
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:03,160
Speaker 1: to do that. But it was my high school coach

515
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:07,119
Speaker 1: who gave me the vision in direction at a young age. UH. Okay,

516
00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:09,320
Speaker 1: Central State, isn't that, like you kind of in the

517
00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:14,119
Speaker 1: middle of nowhere. Yeah, well before Zeno Ohio. Uh. Unfortunately

518
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,680
Speaker 1: for me, I I chose that school at the last minute.

519
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:20,120
Speaker 1: My coach had relationships where he connected me with Kevin Porter,

520
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 1: who was a NBA a former NBA point guard at

521
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,240
Speaker 1: the time, it was the head coach at Central State University.

522
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,440
Speaker 1: So he gave me the opportunity to play for him. Um,

523
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:30,399
Speaker 1: and to be able to play for a former NBA

524
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,440
Speaker 1: player was intriguing to me. But even the things that

525
00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:36,840
Speaker 1: he went through in life, um, and and the challenges

526
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:39,920
Speaker 1: he had from high school to college and going to

527
00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:42,119
Speaker 1: the n b A and and and being you know,

528
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 1: blackballed actually from some of his activities. Uh. He kind

529
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:47,880
Speaker 1: of taught me a lot as well. But he gave

530
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,440
Speaker 1: me that opportunity. Uh, and I thank him for it

531
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: to this day. You mentioned your mom died when your thirteen.

532
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 1: You only met your dad twice. I mean, your high

533
00:26:56,720 --> 00:27:00,880
Speaker 1: school coaches guardening is guiding you. But like, how where

534
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,000
Speaker 1: did this drive? And for for people who don't know

535
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: like this, we'll get to the I want to continue

536
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:07,480
Speaker 1: to get to the book and to other parts of

537
00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:09,960
Speaker 1: your journey, But you wrote the book yourself. This is

538
00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:12,200
Speaker 1: not like, Hey, I hired a ghostwriter, sat in the room,

539
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 1: he recorded, and then he kind of filled in all

540
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:17,000
Speaker 1: the blanks. Like you sat down. Like you're an incredibly

541
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:22,560
Speaker 1: driven person to succeed in obviously in sports and in life.

542
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:25,640
Speaker 1: You have your own foundation, which you know preaches education

543
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,879
Speaker 1: and reading. But like, this is how when you're like

544
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:31,560
Speaker 1: fourteen and you have no mom and you have no dad,

545
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 1: and though the people around you kind of protected you,

546
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:39,159
Speaker 1: they're involved. They're involved in legal activity. Like how do

547
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 1: you not get involved in that? You're in the West

548
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 1: side of Detroit and all the stuff going on. How that?

549
00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 1: How did you stand the straight and narrow? Yeah, it's

550
00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:48,359
Speaker 1: it's the toughest thing. Doug and I talked about the

551
00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:51,800
Speaker 1: angels and I and I those angels were, uh, you know,

552
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 1: my high school coach, even the friends, my peers, or

553
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,159
Speaker 1: guys that were a few years older than me, for

554
00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 1: for whatever reason, Um, they always tell me, um that

555
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:03,879
Speaker 1: I was destined to do great things. I don't know

556
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,600
Speaker 1: how my high school coach and how even my peers

557
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 1: would think or feel that way. Um. Obviously I was

558
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,919
Speaker 1: really good in Little league football, basketball and baseball at

559
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 1: the time, but I was always encouraged to stay away

560
00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:19,240
Speaker 1: from it. Um, But I always wanted to hang around

561
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:21,720
Speaker 1: that group because that's who I was around. I was

562
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,919
Speaker 1: living with my grandmother. I still have my uncle. Um.

563
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:27,600
Speaker 1: I think the Catrell family in the Washington family, those

564
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 1: are two families that during my journey allowed me to

565
00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:32,360
Speaker 1: live with them. But I still was, you know, kind

566
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:35,239
Speaker 1: of my own person who was making my own decisions. Uh.

567
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:39,040
Speaker 1: So fortunately for me, um, you know, I've I've kind

568
00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 1: of grasped, you know, the activities in which my mother,

569
00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 1: uh was involved with. I understand that was the environment

570
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:48,480
Speaker 1: and that's all she knew and my family knew. Um.

571
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 1: But at the same time, I always thought it was

572
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 1: a bigger picture. Always watched, you know, the Dallas Cowboys

573
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,320
Speaker 1: and the San Francisco forty Niners in the playoffs, and

574
00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:00,640
Speaker 1: I envisioned myself one day playing NFL or football. And

575
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 1: then as I continue to watch high school basketball, you know,

576
00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:07,000
Speaker 1: I started my love started with Syracuse basketball because of

577
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 1: Derrick Coleman. So we're always watching, you know, the athletes,

578
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,240
Speaker 1: and I said, man, it has to be a better

579
00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:15,760
Speaker 1: life for me in the future. I don't want to

580
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,480
Speaker 1: go down the same road as some of the folks

581
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 1: that I see, you know, going to prison or losing

582
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 1: their lives to senseless crimes. Uh. And it's continued to

583
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,200
Speaker 1: be my peers in my high school coach who kind

584
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: of just took hold of me and said, you know,

585
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 1: you you're special, your leader, you communicate well, uh, and

586
00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:36,080
Speaker 1: you're gonna do great things. I don't know how they

587
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,360
Speaker 1: saw it, but I listened and not try to continue

588
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 1: to do the right thing. Uh. You finish up at

589
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 1: Central State, UM, and you did come back and coach

590
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: and teach in high school. But like this is like

591
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: right out of high school, right out of college. I

592
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:56,200
Speaker 1: see you years old. Yes, yes, At the time, I

593
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 1: graduated UM, and that was like an accomplishment, first one

594
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 1: in my family to attend college and graduate from college.

595
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 1: So I immediately, um, you know, I came back home.

596
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 1: I took my uh my head uh high school coaches advice,

597
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:12,360
Speaker 1: coach Jordan's advice, and I, you know, applied to be

598
00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 1: a teacher and educator in the Detroit public school system.

599
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,440
Speaker 1: And when I did that, I had probably ten offers

600
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 1: teaching jobs because it was a lack of of African

601
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 1: American male teachers, UM as as as being in the

602
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: school system, so I took the opportunity there. I started

603
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 1: coaching at Central High School. I was very, very fortunate

604
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:35,800
Speaker 1: early in my coaching career to running to a guy

605
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 1: by the name of Antonio Gates. Uh he was sixteen

606
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:41,000
Speaker 1: at the time and uh junior in high school him

607
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 1: in Dante Darling. So that those guys got my coaching

608
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 1: uh career off to a great start. Uh you know,

609
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 1: right away uh playing in the state finals and then

610
00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,240
Speaker 1: the following year planning I winning the state championship with

611
00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 1: those guys and then moving on the Crockett High School

612
00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 1: and coaching Maurice Ager there and winning another state champion

613
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 1: and ship. So between those winning environments, college coaches would

614
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,320
Speaker 1: would come in. So at that time, Perry Watson, you know,

615
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:09,800
Speaker 1: he opened his door for me to learn a lot

616
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 1: from him, and Tommy Amaker being the head coach in Michigan,

617
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 1: and Brian Ellaby right before him, and coach Tom Izzo

618
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 1: has been a tremendous helped me throughout my career. But

619
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 1: those guys here locally kind of opened their doors for

620
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 1: me as a young coach for me to learn, Uh.

621
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 1: You know more basketball and then what the college game

622
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,200
Speaker 1: was all about. And I built a lot of relationships

623
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 1: through recruiting of those student athletes I was coaching. So

624
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 1: when an opportunity came up at Kent State, I was

625
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,480
Speaker 1: able to get that opportunity. Um okay, so yeah I

626
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: Kent State. That was back when Kent State had um

627
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 1: oh Man, No, just Antonio. It was a little what

628
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 1: was little point guard's name, DeAndre Haynes was there. You

629
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,400
Speaker 1: may be thinking about Andrew Minsher and Trevor Hoffman, those

630
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,640
Speaker 1: guys there. Well, yeah, Tevor Hoffman, right like that? That

631
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,280
Speaker 1: was that was you guys had a squad there. Yeah,

632
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:01,640
Speaker 1: I'm it's him by one year because I went there

633
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:03,760
Speaker 1: right after they went to the Elite eight. Uh with

634
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 1: with Trevor and Andrew and Antonio Gates, Lay had that

635
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:08,800
Speaker 1: team to the Lade eight. And I was able to

636
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: go there the following year when stand he went to Arkansas,

637
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 1: Jim Christian gave me a great opportunity. Okay, So, uh

638
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:16,640
Speaker 1: Antonio Gates in high school? What was he like as

639
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:21,239
Speaker 1: a player? Monster? Uh? The guy was multi dimensional. Uh.

640
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:23,880
Speaker 1: Con shooter from the outside was great, off the bounce

641
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 1: was an exceptional passer. Um. He was always unassuming because

642
00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,040
Speaker 1: he was about two thirty five to forty and he

643
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 1: was Cabacchevy at the time. But he was a great player.

644
00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 1: I remember in the summer going uh, you know, into

645
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: his senior year. He was in Vegas, and I'll never

646
00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: forget him playing against Corey mcgetty and the Michigan Mustage

647
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:46,000
Speaker 1: at the time beat uh. Corey mcghetty's team in in

648
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 1: the UH in the tournament in Vegas. There at the

649
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 1: big time. And then from there he continued to be

650
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 1: great as a basketball player. But Nick Saban at the

651
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 1: time was at Michigan State recruited him to play football,

652
00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:00,080
Speaker 1: and everybody told him he had a future there. He

653
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 1: didn't love it, um, but he just went to a

654
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 1: Michigan State to play football. It didn't work out. He

655
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 1: loved basketball so much. He bounced around and ended up

656
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 1: at Kent State making that run and and you know,

657
00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:12,240
Speaker 1: going to the NFL as a free agent, and the

658
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 1: rest is history, do you think? And then I did

659
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: a podcast. I grew up playing with Tony Gonzalez and UM,

660
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 1: I don't think I think Tony would play UM in

661
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:27,640
Speaker 1: this NBA. In the small ball NBA. But now now

662
00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:29,640
Speaker 1: Tony was kind of the same thing in terms of

663
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:34,280
Speaker 1: being a monster, crazy competitor, crazy athlete, but he did.

664
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:37,320
Speaker 1: He was not a great passer, Um, he just wasn't

665
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 1: he just he just out competed people for the basketball

666
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:43,000
Speaker 1: at either end of the floor. When you when you

667
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 1: look at Draymond, like in this NBA with Antonio Gates, work, Yeah,

668
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:50,160
Speaker 1: he would work and he would be a better Draymond

669
00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:53,200
Speaker 1: Green's funny you, uh you bring up Draymond Green because

670
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 1: when Draymond was at Saconda High School, everybody would compare

671
00:33:56,600 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 1: him to Antonio Gates, and people didn't really believe because

672
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:02,640
Speaker 1: he wasn't a high level recruit. They always said Draymond

673
00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 1: was undersized, he couldn't really shoot, and he wasn't that quick,

674
00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:09,120
Speaker 1: but he was very versatile, uh, and he could pass

675
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 1: the ball, and more importantly, he had he has the

676
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 1: heart of a line and he was a winner and

677
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 1: he always wanted the high school level, which translated onto

678
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:19,880
Speaker 1: Michigan State and it has continued to translate on to

679
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:23,400
Speaker 1: the Golden State Warriors. But Antonio was Draymond Green, but

680
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:27,400
Speaker 1: much better as a passer. Uh. In a score and

681
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 1: the same type of toughness. Alright, So two thousand four,

682
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 1: how did you get the Syracuse job? Oh? Man, it's is.

683
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,200
Speaker 1: I think Troy Weaver to this day. Uh, you know,

684
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:41,239
Speaker 1: the vice president of the Oklahoma Thunder. One Sunday, I

685
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 1: was sitting, you know, at home, and I got an

686
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,040
Speaker 1: incoming call. It was private. I had a next tell

687
00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:48,759
Speaker 1: phone I'll never forget, and it was Troy Weaver. I

688
00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:51,319
Speaker 1: happened to just answer the phone. I wasn't gonna answer

689
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:53,800
Speaker 1: the phone dogs true story. I looked at my phone

690
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 1: like incoming call. So something told me to flip the

691
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:00,359
Speaker 1: next twel is Troy Weaver on the other line, and uh,

692
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:04,920
Speaker 1: coach Troy. And I'm like, Troy, Troy. We were Syracuse.

693
00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:07,799
Speaker 1: So I'm like, oh wow, what's up. At the time

694
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 1: that me and Troy knew each other, but we didn't

695
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:12,719
Speaker 1: have a relationship. We just knew each other through maybe

696
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:15,279
Speaker 1: seeing each other on the road. He asked me, did

697
00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:17,880
Speaker 1: I have an interest in coming to Syracuse? So immediately

698
00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:20,600
Speaker 1: I thought he was talking about a basketball camp or

699
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:22,839
Speaker 1: you know, I didn't know. I'm like, sure, what I mean,

700
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:24,239
Speaker 1: what's going on? He said, When I'm gonna take an

701
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:27,960
Speaker 1: NBA job here? In the next seventy two hours. Um,

702
00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 1: and I'm looking for, you know, a young guy, uh

703
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 1: with relationships to continue to help coach behind uh, you know,

704
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:39,439
Speaker 1: lead this program and help coach. And so I said, wow,

705
00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:42,839
Speaker 1: so yeah, sure I would have an interest. So when

706
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:44,759
Speaker 1: is this all going to happen? He said, Well, you

707
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:46,200
Speaker 1: don't have to come on an interview this week. I'm

708
00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 1: gonna talk to coach tomorrow. He'll call Coach Christian and

709
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,359
Speaker 1: get permission to speak with you, and then we'll get

710
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:54,839
Speaker 1: the ball rolling. So you know, I couldn't sleep that night, Doug,

711
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:56,879
Speaker 1: I was up all night. I went into my office

712
00:35:56,920 --> 00:36:01,320
Speaker 1: Monday morning, Coach Bayham called Coach Christian permission. Coach Bayham

713
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 1: called me ten minutes later. I had a great conversation

714
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 1: with him on that Monday. I flew to Syracuse that Wednesday.

715
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:10,720
Speaker 1: I was there for thirty minutes and he said, welcome

716
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:13,880
Speaker 1: to Syracuse. So I'm forever thankful for Troy and for

717
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,919
Speaker 1: every thankful for Coach Beyhood for giving me a life

718
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:20,279
Speaker 1: changing the opportunity and even you know, Coach Behoom. You know,

719
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:25,480
Speaker 1: in today's world, especially at high level BCS schools, in

720
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:29,719
Speaker 1: schools with tradition and history. They hired guys who played there.

721
00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:32,239
Speaker 1: If you look at Syracuse staff now, uh, they have

722
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:35,240
Speaker 1: all former players, the same with Duke in most places

723
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:38,080
Speaker 1: like that. So he took another chance on the outsider.

724
00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:40,359
Speaker 1: And I think me and Troy are the only two

725
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,839
Speaker 1: guys that maybe have worked for coach Beheim that are

726
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:45,400
Speaker 1: not Syracuse alone. So for him to believe in me

727
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:48,480
Speaker 1: and give me that life changing opportunity that started with Troy,

728
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:53,719
Speaker 1: but him believing in me, Um, I'm forever thankful, Bob.

729
00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:58,319
Speaker 1: Pretty pretty amazing experience. Um, you guys had. You guys

730
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:01,760
Speaker 1: had so many great runs while you were there. Who

731
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,279
Speaker 1: is the player who you felt like you connected with

732
00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:07,800
Speaker 1: the most? I connected with a ton of guys, And

733
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:10,319
Speaker 1: it started with a keen Work and jocks Josh Pace.

734
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 1: Uh you know those guys were seniors at the time.

735
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:15,720
Speaker 1: Uh they came into the pro I came into the program,

736
00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 1: they were already established. They were national champions. Josh Pacing,

737
00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:22,200
Speaker 1: Keen Work as seniors accepted me. They allowed me to

738
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:24,839
Speaker 1: coach them, They allowed me to uh get them better

739
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:27,800
Speaker 1: on the court. So I'm forever thankful for them to

740
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:32,120
Speaker 1: make in my transition very easy as an existent coach

741
00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 1: at that level. And then we recruited a host of

742
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 1: players at that time. But I think the closest player

743
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:40,920
Speaker 1: I was with and maybe two would be Dante Green

744
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:44,400
Speaker 1: and Chris Joseph. Those two guys in particularly were two

745
00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:47,880
Speaker 1: of my favorites. And through the recruitment process, with Dante

746
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 1: learning about his his childhood and losing his mom at

747
00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:53,560
Speaker 1: an early age, we were able to talk more about

748
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 1: life and where he was and how he was trying

749
00:37:56,600 --> 00:37:59,680
Speaker 1: to help raise his little brother living with his grandmother. Um.

750
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 1: So between him and Chris Joseph out a two, uh

751
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:06,000
Speaker 1: connected with the most. But it was a family atmosphere there.

752
00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:08,520
Speaker 1: And you know, every guy that you know we helped

753
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:11,360
Speaker 1: coach Behem recruit. We all got along and we did

754
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:15,400
Speaker 1: a tremendous job. Dante is an interesting one because I

755
00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:18,880
Speaker 1: remember talking with Coach Beheim about it when he declared

756
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:21,120
Speaker 1: for the NBA draft. You only played one year, it's

757
00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:25,359
Speaker 1: your huge the first round pick, um and and there

758
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 1: was the like, yeah, he really should stay, but he

759
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:33,040
Speaker 1: has his family to kind of to take care of, right, Um,

760
00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:35,600
Speaker 1: Like I think he was born he was an Air

761
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:38,799
Speaker 1: Force brad right when he mean he was his mom

762
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 1: was yes, for sure. And you know, coach Behem kind

763
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:43,880
Speaker 1: of talked him into coming back. It would have been

764
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:46,960
Speaker 1: beneficial for Dante, um, you know, and I gave him

765
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,480
Speaker 1: the same advice. But obviously, um, you know the student athletes,

766
00:38:50,840 --> 00:38:53,000
Speaker 1: you know, after that first year and you McDonald all

767
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 1: American and you see everybody in your class, you know,

768
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:58,520
Speaker 1: one and done. And then Dante went to the same

769
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:02,160
Speaker 1: high school as Carmelo, so uh, he was following that

770
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 1: same the same footsteps of Carmelo Bear from Baltimore, Attendant

771
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 1: towns in Catholic and now he's choosing Syracuse. So he's

772
00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:10,160
Speaker 1: you know, he wants to come in and be one

773
00:39:10,239 --> 00:39:13,799
Speaker 1: and done, just like Carmelo Anthony. Unfortunately, he wasn't good

774
00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:16,839
Speaker 1: as Carmelo Anthony, but he was good enough to play

775
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:19,839
Speaker 1: in the NBA. I think he would have been better

776
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:22,399
Speaker 1: off stand another year to mature a little bit more

777
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:26,080
Speaker 1: and tighten up his game. Nothink. Uh. That would have

778
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,560
Speaker 1: helped him last longer, have a longer career in the NBA.

779
00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:32,120
Speaker 1: But he's a great young man. He's still making money

780
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:35,279
Speaker 1: playing basketball, and he talks about going back continuing to

781
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:37,600
Speaker 1: get his education. Yeah, I mean, it's it's a really

782
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 1: hard one, right, Like, how do you tell somebody, because

783
00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:41,960
Speaker 1: because if the the goal is the NBA, you get

784
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:44,600
Speaker 1: drafted the NBA, then it's hard to talk you out

785
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 1: of that. On the other hand, you're like, look, man,

786
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:47,960
Speaker 1: if you could just wait a year, You're like, well,

787
00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 1: if I wait a year, you know, there's there's there's

788
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:52,719
Speaker 1: all these other things that could go wrong, and I

789
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 1: know it's a it's I it's and especially with the

790
00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 1: family things and take care of his brother. It's a

791
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:02,400
Speaker 1: incredibly hard one. Okay, So go ahead, No, go ahead, No,

792
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:04,759
Speaker 1: I was I was saying, you know, just the pressures

793
00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 1: too of trying to follow the guys in your class

794
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:11,640
Speaker 1: come to Syracuse and follow the Carmelo Anthony's success, and

795
00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 1: then you have a million agents and a different million

796
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 1: outsiders continuing to beat you up and tell you why

797
00:40:17,719 --> 00:40:20,160
Speaker 1: you should leave because they don't have your best interests

798
00:40:20,160 --> 00:40:22,040
Speaker 1: at heart during those times, because they're just trying to

799
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:23,440
Speaker 1: figure out how they can get to you where you

800
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:25,879
Speaker 1: can get to the NBA and they can make money,

801
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 1: and everybody kind of wants to be a part of,

802
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,920
Speaker 1: you know, the millionaires. So you know, with everybody tugging

803
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:35,759
Speaker 1: at him, um, you know, he made the decision. I

804
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:39,000
Speaker 1: just thought he probably could have benefited from one more year.

805
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 1: And you know, I know, we can go into this

806
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:44,719
Speaker 1: later if you have the time. But the stipend was

807
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:47,959
Speaker 1: not even in place at that time, because if we could,

808
00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:51,360
Speaker 1: if Dante could even get the eighteen and two thousand

809
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:54,319
Speaker 1: dollars that my student athletes here at Eastern Michigan get

810
00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:57,280
Speaker 1: every month, that would have been money in his pocket

811
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 1: where he wouldn't have had to just rush and go

812
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 1: to make money. Yeah, I mean, I look, do I

813
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 1: think the stipend is a good thing. I do, But

814
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, are you're fighting over two No

815
00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 1: one's gonna say, like, Okay, I'd rather to have to

816
00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 1: make two thousand dollars and stay in school than go

817
00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:16,320
Speaker 1: and make five thousand dollars or a million dollars and

818
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:18,160
Speaker 1: playing in the NBA though, right, And I do agree

819
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 1: with that. I do agree with that, Doug. But at

820
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,200
Speaker 1: the same time, that that two to three dollars as

821
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:28,000
Speaker 1: we we couldn't give. Now, I'm like, he would get it.

822
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:30,839
Speaker 1: He would get it. He would get a pell, right,

823
00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:32,600
Speaker 1: So you get a pell which is like six thousand,

824
00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:35,360
Speaker 1: which is big, And then yeah, I mean, and the

825
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:38,640
Speaker 1: because he wasn't. I don't know. If he's listened as

826
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:40,200
Speaker 1: a parent like your parent, you can get a little

827
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,239
Speaker 1: bit more. But okay, I agree that the cost of

828
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:44,560
Speaker 1: attendance of the stipend is a is a is a

829
00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 1: big thing, um. But I also think that you know,

830
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:50,399
Speaker 1: it's it's chump change in comparison to like you said,

831
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 1: what they're being told is out there for them, and

832
00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 1: then you try and have a legit conversation with them,

833
00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:57,839
Speaker 1: go like, look, I get that you could make five

834
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:00,200
Speaker 1: hundred thousand or a million for a couple of years

835
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:02,080
Speaker 1: if you leave now, but if you stay a year,

836
00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:05,399
Speaker 1: you can make two or three million and then make

837
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:08,319
Speaker 1: fifty to a hundred million dollars if you, like you said,

838
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:10,279
Speaker 1: tighten up your game. But it's a really hard thing

839
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:12,520
Speaker 1: for a kid, even if you're giving them a stipend,

840
00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, people still agree with you.

841
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:18,240
Speaker 1: With a kid like Dante and his situation, he probably

842
00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:21,840
Speaker 1: would have stayed. Given the cost of attendance check and

843
00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 1: the pail and all the you know, occasional meals and

844
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:28,319
Speaker 1: snacks and pre and postgame meals. He would have been fine. Now,

845
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:30,960
Speaker 1: you can't sell everything. Every kid on that because Dante

846
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:35,040
Speaker 1: was one of the better kids that you know Syracuse basketball.

847
00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 1: I mean, it's exciting and it's fun, and it's you know,

848
00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:39,359
Speaker 1: college is the best time of your life. I don't

849
00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:40,960
Speaker 1: care how much money you're gonna make in the n

850
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,360
Speaker 1: b A. And he kind of understood that, but to

851
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:46,600
Speaker 1: be able to offer him nothing, it was a tough deal.

852
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:49,800
Speaker 1: So that's when he made a decision to leave. Yeah, yeah, no,

853
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:52,120
Speaker 1: I mean and I remember, I remember the All Star

854
00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:55,360
Speaker 1: break the next year, he was back there sitting courtside,

855
00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:58,279
Speaker 1: and I could just I could just think, like all

856
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,479
Speaker 1: those all those guys come back like man and thirty people.

857
00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 1: Everybody cares about you. It is it is a it

858
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 1: is a hard trade. You lost to Marquette in two

859
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:13,680
Speaker 1: thousand and eleven in the second round. That ended up

860
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 1: being your last game as a coach at Syracuse. What

861
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:20,719
Speaker 1: take me through the process of how you got the

862
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,040
Speaker 1: Eastern job. Well, first of all, I was one of

863
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:26,480
Speaker 1: the toughest losses, uh during my tenure at Syracuse. We

864
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:28,839
Speaker 1: felt we had a team that could make a run.

865
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:31,680
Speaker 1: And you know, Marquette with Jay Crowder and Jimmy Butler,

866
00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:33,840
Speaker 1: those guys They were really, really tough and it was

867
00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:36,879
Speaker 1: tough for us to be matched up against another big

868
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 1: East opponent in the second round as well Sow, but

869
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:42,560
Speaker 1: they beat us. That was a tough loss. And then

870
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:45,080
Speaker 1: at that point, Um, we were going back to the

871
00:43:45,160 --> 00:43:47,239
Speaker 1: drawing board to you know, get better for next year.

872
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: And the first opportunity came was the Kent State opening,

873
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 1: uh because Gino Ford had went to Bradley, so the

874
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:56,759
Speaker 1: job opened up at the final four our interview for

875
00:43:56,840 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 1: that job, it came down to me and Rob send

876
00:44:00,239 --> 00:44:02,399
Speaker 1: her off and maybe someone else. But I didn't get

877
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:06,879
Speaker 1: that job. I really wanted it. Um. Antonio Gates got

878
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:09,720
Speaker 1: involved and I thought I did well in my interview,

879
00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:11,960
Speaker 1: but it crushed me when I when I didn't get

880
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:14,880
Speaker 1: the job, and then a week that's a that's hold on,

881
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 1: that's a that's a hard thing. Like I've I haven't

882
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:19,239
Speaker 1: been involved in as many as you were involved in.

883
00:44:20,200 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 1: But when you really think like you got you got

884
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:27,560
Speaker 1: Antonio Gates, you've been there before. You know you got

885
00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:30,200
Speaker 1: you got Detroit Unlock. You're coming from Syracuse. You guys

886
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:32,879
Speaker 1: have had an incredible amount of success. You know, you're

887
00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:36,080
Speaker 1: respected guy into profession and I know it was a

888
00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:39,160
Speaker 1: quick turnaround between that and Eastern But what was that

889
00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 1: like for you to not get a job that I'm

890
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:42,919
Speaker 1: sure you went to sleep at night the night before

891
00:44:42,920 --> 00:44:44,839
Speaker 1: you found out you weren't getting it, thinking I'm gonna

892
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:47,520
Speaker 1: get this thing. Well, I was crushed, to be honest

893
00:44:47,600 --> 00:44:49,480
Speaker 1: with it, all the things you just mentioned, working for

894
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:51,760
Speaker 1: a Hall of Fame coach, having success at the highest

895
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:54,040
Speaker 1: level of being it can't stay for two years, and

896
00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 1: both years we were in the postseason helping deliver one

897
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 1: of the best play is not the best player in

898
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:03,640
Speaker 1: the history of basketball. They're being Antonio Gates getting him

899
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:07,920
Speaker 1: involved in his big time donation to the athletic department. Uh,

900
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:11,160
Speaker 1: everything was pointing in my direction. Um, But I also

901
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:15,080
Speaker 1: understood Rob send her off being there as well because

902
00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:16,920
Speaker 1: he was my roommate on the road and somebody that

903
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:19,279
Speaker 1: was really really close to me. So we were going

904
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:21,120
Speaker 1: up against each other for the job. So he ended

905
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:24,160
Speaker 1: up getting the job, but I was still crushed because

906
00:45:24,200 --> 00:45:27,640
Speaker 1: I wanted that opportunity at that time. Um. You know,

907
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:29,919
Speaker 1: I can remember, you know, for a couple of days

908
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:32,920
Speaker 1: just being disappointed and and wondering what I ever get

909
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:36,560
Speaker 1: another great opportunity that fits me, because everybody wants to

910
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:37,960
Speaker 1: be a head coach, but you want to get a

911
00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:40,400
Speaker 1: job that fits you that you can be successful, and

912
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:43,040
Speaker 1: you don't want to take any job, especially when you're

913
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 1: at Syracuse. So you know, I was crushed. For a

914
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 1: week later, Um, Eastern Michigan opened up, and and that

915
00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:53,000
Speaker 1: was really challenging to just get in the interview process. Um.

916
00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:56,359
Speaker 1: You know, immediately, you know, I had my agent call

917
00:45:56,520 --> 00:46:00,160
Speaker 1: to UH to gauge the interests of me just get

918
00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:03,719
Speaker 1: a candidate, and I was turned down. They told me, no,

919
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:06,760
Speaker 1: I couldn't get in the pool. So I couldn't understand

920
00:46:06,840 --> 00:46:10,200
Speaker 1: that with me being thirty minutes from home. Uh, you know,

921
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 1: it's a job that I wanted, even battered and I

922
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:15,560
Speaker 1: want to king State. Now I'm at home and the

923
00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 1: program is at at a certain level and at that

924
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:20,360
Speaker 1: time the bottom of the MAC, and I felt it

925
00:46:20,440 --> 00:46:22,080
Speaker 1: was a perfect opportunity to me to go in there

926
00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 1: and grind and and and you know, bring Eastern Michigan

927
00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:28,719
Speaker 1: basketball to relevancy as it was once before. So I

928
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 1: couldn't get in the interview process. I remember talking to

929
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 1: Coach Beheid. He called coach, he called Dave being for me,

930
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:36,240
Speaker 1: who was his college roommate, who was the married detrade

931
00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 1: at the time. Uh So, Dave made a few calls

932
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:41,840
Speaker 1: and I was able to at least get myself in

933
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:45,960
Speaker 1: the pool. Uh So, it was ten candidates and I

934
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:49,759
Speaker 1: was the only African American in the pool. And I

935
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:53,560
Speaker 1: was told, and I'm being very very candid and honest,

936
00:46:53,640 --> 00:46:56,680
Speaker 1: I was told that they did not want to hire

937
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 1: the anxiety same person they had just hired, meaning coach

938
00:47:01,719 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 1: Ramsey assistant. Les Ramsey was an assistant at Michigan. Uh

939
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:09,359
Speaker 1: he was from Michigan, and he was actually from ims

940
00:47:09,520 --> 00:47:12,680
Speaker 1: Lanti and he was African American. And so I think

941
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:15,440
Speaker 1: I thought they wanted to go away from the assistant

942
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:17,680
Speaker 1: coach at a high level school that was from the area.

943
00:47:17,719 --> 00:47:20,759
Speaker 1: They wanted somebody with head coaching experience already. They just

944
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:22,920
Speaker 1: wanted to go in a different direction. So I was

945
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:25,800
Speaker 1: told I couldn't get in the pool. So after you know,

946
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:28,200
Speaker 1: They've being helped out and made a few calls, and

947
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 1: I kept pushing different buttons. Uh they finally called back

948
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:33,600
Speaker 1: and said, Okay, we'll put you in the pool. So

949
00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:37,120
Speaker 1: I said, okay, fine. The interview started on Monday. Um,

950
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:40,440
Speaker 1: Unfortunately I didn't hear my agent or I didn't hear

951
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:44,239
Speaker 1: back from anybody until Thursday. So by that time, uh,

952
00:47:44,360 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 1: you know, I was at home. I told my wife.

953
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:50,080
Speaker 1: I said, uh, you know what I'm not I'm gonna

954
00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:52,800
Speaker 1: take myself out of this. I'm just gonna concentrate on

955
00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:56,520
Speaker 1: Syracuse basketball and continue to do what I'm doing. And

956
00:47:56,640 --> 00:47:59,920
Speaker 1: this was Thursday, so my phone, my phone rings may

957
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:03,600
Speaker 1: be two and a half three hours later, like, uh,

958
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:06,279
Speaker 1: it was my agent and said, you know what, they

959
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:08,400
Speaker 1: finally put you in the pool. But here's the thing.

960
00:48:08,440 --> 00:48:10,640
Speaker 1: You gotta fly out tomorrow. Your interview will be at

961
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:13,960
Speaker 1: Saturday morning at eight am. The president has to go

962
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:17,240
Speaker 1: to graduations, so they're gonna just slip you in interview

963
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 1: you and you can. So I said, like, man, should

964
00:48:19,640 --> 00:48:21,839
Speaker 1: I even do that? It sounds like, you know, they

965
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:25,760
Speaker 1: completed their interviews and I'm just going because for hr purposes,

966
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:28,759
Speaker 1: I'm in this pool. Um, So I said, Man, I

967
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:30,959
Speaker 1: hadn't made too many calls. I got too many people

968
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:33,320
Speaker 1: on board helping me. Now I'm just gonna go for

969
00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:35,920
Speaker 1: the experience. And you know, so I, you know, told

970
00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:38,560
Speaker 1: him I wouldn't be there. I fly there Friday, fly

971
00:48:38,719 --> 00:48:43,040
Speaker 1: here Friday, checking at the Marriott, and I called Coach

972
00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:46,440
Speaker 1: Bayham at midnight uh Friday and at midnight. Now my

973
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:48,319
Speaker 1: interview is at eight am. They're gonna pick me up

974
00:48:48,360 --> 00:48:51,040
Speaker 1: at seven thirty am. So I as coaches. You talked

975
00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 1: to the president, he said, I talked to her. She

976
00:48:52,719 --> 00:48:56,400
Speaker 1: didn't you know, go either way, but she says she

977
00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:59,759
Speaker 1: was excited to meet you tomorrow. And he told me, said,

978
00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:03,000
Speaker 1: you have a great job here at Syracuse. You know

979
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:04,920
Speaker 1: you're going there, You say what you want to say.

980
00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:08,279
Speaker 1: You pretty much interview them because they need you more

981
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:10,680
Speaker 1: than you need them. They just don't know it. But

982
00:49:10,840 --> 00:49:12,440
Speaker 1: just going there, and if you don't get the job,

983
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:13,800
Speaker 1: you come back here and you've got one of the

984
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:15,840
Speaker 1: greatest jobs in America, and you just stay here and

985
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:18,919
Speaker 1: we continue to work to get you another job, whether

986
00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:21,520
Speaker 1: it's next year or this year or whenever. So having

987
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:25,400
Speaker 1: that talk with Coach behind Friday night before going in

988
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:27,560
Speaker 1: there at eight am was great because I took a

989
00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:31,399
Speaker 1: different approach mentally. I said to myself, I'm just gonna

990
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:33,760
Speaker 1: go in here and you know, tell them how I feel,

991
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:38,680
Speaker 1: and whatever happens happens, because I'm already believe that I'm

992
00:49:38,719 --> 00:49:42,400
Speaker 1: just in this you know, interview pool just to hr purposes.

993
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:44,200
Speaker 1: So I go in there and I interview with the

994
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:48,560
Speaker 1: president last about thirty minutes. Uh, it went great. She

995
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:52,800
Speaker 1: was impressed, probably surprised at my presentation and my booklet

996
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:55,320
Speaker 1: that I went through with her, and I remember leaving

997
00:49:56,080 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 1: her and then going and speaking with the Border regents.

998
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,840
Speaker 1: Was was eight you know region around the table. I

999
00:50:00,880 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 1: did the same thing in there, and they were impressed.

1000
00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:05,279
Speaker 1: And by the time I got to the A D said,

1001
00:50:05,280 --> 00:50:08,480
Speaker 1: while your name is buzzing around here, UM, kind of

1002
00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:11,000
Speaker 1: walked me through what you've shown them and how you

1003
00:50:11,080 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 1: can build Eastern Michigan basketball. And I did the same

1004
00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:18,000
Speaker 1: thing with him. Um. I end up leaving. I landed

1005
00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 1: in Washington, d C. Because I left there to just

1006
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:22,520
Speaker 1: continue to recruits the Syracuse because I didn't think I

1007
00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:24,600
Speaker 1: can get the job. It's already had plans to go

1008
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:27,200
Speaker 1: see some guys and uh, my phone ring. I was

1009
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:30,120
Speaker 1: at Hurts and it was the athletic director, Derry Gragg

1010
00:50:30,160 --> 00:50:32,440
Speaker 1: at the time, said Hey, I think I want to

1011
00:50:32,520 --> 00:50:35,960
Speaker 1: offer you are head coaching position. So we talked and

1012
00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:38,680
Speaker 1: accepted the job for the eight hours later, and I've

1013
00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:43,000
Speaker 1: been here ever since. Wow, Rob Murphy, Um, in the

1014
00:50:43,080 --> 00:50:45,960
Speaker 1: thirteen years before you got there. They're only two winning

1015
00:50:46,080 --> 00:50:50,800
Speaker 1: seasons at Eastern obviously. Uh, you've you've turned that around.

1016
00:50:51,040 --> 00:50:55,840
Speaker 1: You know, you've had three plus win seasons. Um, But

1017
00:50:55,920 --> 00:50:58,360
Speaker 1: there's still kind of the next step, right. And I

1018
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:02,839
Speaker 1: thought I thought last year with Paul Jackson, Elijah Many

1019
00:51:02,920 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 1: and James Thompson, I thought last year would be the year.

1020
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:10,160
Speaker 1: Why wasn't it the year? We we we We didn't

1021
00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:13,319
Speaker 1: play as a team, Doug Um. You know, we had

1022
00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:16,080
Speaker 1: a great year of the year before we lost Tim Bond,

1023
00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:18,719
Speaker 1: who I thought was the Google guy who people didn't

1024
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:24,000
Speaker 1: realize was very impactful for our team. It was Defensive

1025
00:51:24,040 --> 00:51:26,520
Speaker 1: Player of the Year. Uh. He had a lot of versatility.

1026
00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:29,799
Speaker 1: But with those guys coming back, the challenge for us

1027
00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:33,520
Speaker 1: was to stick with the wee over me concept and

1028
00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:36,520
Speaker 1: that summer guys put their name in the draft. They

1029
00:51:36,560 --> 00:51:39,799
Speaker 1: were getting caused by agents telling them what they needed

1030
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:41,560
Speaker 1: to work on or what they needed to do if

1031
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:45,280
Speaker 1: they returned to school. So when James and Elijah decided

1032
00:51:45,320 --> 00:51:49,640
Speaker 1: to return to school, they were more thinking about what

1033
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:51,320
Speaker 1: I what do I need to do to get to

1034
00:51:51,320 --> 00:51:54,400
Speaker 1: the NBA. This is my last year, so I ran

1035
00:51:54,480 --> 00:51:56,840
Speaker 1: into a lot of that. Uh, so I had to

1036
00:51:57,200 --> 00:52:00,680
Speaker 1: you know, coach every practice and every game, but it's

1037
00:52:00,680 --> 00:52:03,000
Speaker 1: not about you. And even Paul Jackson, who had a

1038
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:05,399
Speaker 1: chance to go and make money playing basketball, people were

1039
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:07,880
Speaker 1: telling him as my point guard, what he needed to do.

1040
00:52:08,400 --> 00:52:10,040
Speaker 1: And I told those guys, no, we need to do

1041
00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:12,399
Speaker 1: what we did the last year in the previous year,

1042
00:52:12,440 --> 00:52:15,640
Speaker 1: and winning take care takes care of everything. If we

1043
00:52:15,840 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 1: just win, it doesn't matter what your numbers are. But

1044
00:52:19,239 --> 00:52:22,680
Speaker 1: those guys never really bought into that. Um, they were

1045
00:52:22,760 --> 00:52:26,239
Speaker 1: kind of indifferent about even coming back to school, and

1046
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:28,520
Speaker 1: then when they came back, they were thinking about themselves.

1047
00:52:28,600 --> 00:52:31,239
Speaker 1: So it was a tough year. You can't win that way,

1048
00:52:31,680 --> 00:52:37,080
Speaker 1: and unfortunately for us, we had to learn the hard way. Um.

1049
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:41,600
Speaker 1: You mentioned calling Jim Beheim at midnight, which which is

1050
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:44,719
Speaker 1: awesome that you know he was so engaged and picked up.

1051
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:48,800
Speaker 1: What's what's the most interesting thing about coach Beheim that

1052
00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:53,360
Speaker 1: only people who have worked for him. No, Uh, you know,

1053
00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:55,239
Speaker 1: he's a great guy dog. I mean, you know, he

1054
00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:58,680
Speaker 1: always has that blank stare on people see him get

1055
00:52:58,719 --> 00:53:01,200
Speaker 1: on the officials or get on the play airs. But

1056
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:03,400
Speaker 1: he's a family man. He's a great husband, he's a

1057
00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:06,960
Speaker 1: great father. Um. I remember for three months I I

1058
00:53:07,120 --> 00:53:10,520
Speaker 1: had a chance to actually live with coach behind um

1059
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:13,160
Speaker 1: my house was being built in Syracuse. They didn't finish

1060
00:53:13,239 --> 00:53:16,400
Speaker 1: on time and we sold our house previously, uh, and

1061
00:53:16,480 --> 00:53:18,960
Speaker 1: him and his wife opened up their doors for my

1062
00:53:19,120 --> 00:53:21,279
Speaker 1: wife and me and my wife and our children at

1063
00:53:21,320 --> 00:53:24,359
Speaker 1: the time too to live with them for those three months.

1064
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:27,160
Speaker 1: And through that those three months, I've really really seen

1065
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:29,640
Speaker 1: the love and care, uh that he gives to his

1066
00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:32,880
Speaker 1: wife and his children. How he jokes, um, you know,

1067
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:36,439
Speaker 1: how he just loves to talk, whether it's basketball where

1068
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:39,680
Speaker 1: there's different subjects about life. But he's a great mentor

1069
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:42,840
Speaker 1: and a great guy. And I'm so appreciative obviously obviously

1070
00:53:42,920 --> 00:53:46,480
Speaker 1: of the opportunity, but of him just opening up his

1071
00:53:46,640 --> 00:53:49,440
Speaker 1: family to my family and always making us, you know,

1072
00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:51,479
Speaker 1: feel like we had was a part of his family

1073
00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:55,879
Speaker 1: in Syracuse. He is a major league ship talker, you over,

1074
00:53:56,360 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 1: I've never and I don't think people would like major

1075
00:54:00,600 --> 00:54:06,200
Speaker 1: league ship talker. And it's in in a no you

1076
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:10,840
Speaker 1: have no chance, golf, on the basketball floor, on the

1077
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:14,520
Speaker 1: golf course wherever. Like he's a big time ship talker. Yeah.

1078
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:18,959
Speaker 1: But but but baby, he talks, But he's a competitor, Doug.

1079
00:54:19,080 --> 00:54:22,400
Speaker 1: He wants to win and I hate to say by

1080
00:54:22,440 --> 00:54:25,760
Speaker 1: any means necessary because the Syracuse everything is above board,

1081
00:54:26,280 --> 00:54:30,080
Speaker 1: but he wants to win in everything, and he wants

1082
00:54:30,160 --> 00:54:33,480
Speaker 1: to be right about everything. Um. But that's just a

1083
00:54:33,560 --> 00:54:36,400
Speaker 1: part of his competitive spirit. But that's the reason that

1084
00:54:36,480 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 1: he's been able to be at Syracuse and have the

1085
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:41,760
Speaker 1: success he's had for forty or four years. Is actually

1086
00:54:41,840 --> 00:54:44,719
Speaker 1: unbelievable when you look back at over the years and

1087
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:50,479
Speaker 1: the challenges, how resilient and and how you know, good

1088
00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:53,120
Speaker 1: he has continued to be over the course of these

1089
00:54:53,160 --> 00:54:55,360
Speaker 1: many years. And again, I can't thank him enough for

1090
00:54:55,920 --> 00:54:59,759
Speaker 1: giving me a life changing opportunity. I want to talk

1091
00:54:59,800 --> 00:55:03,319
Speaker 1: about the Jerry McNamara run because you were there right uh,

1092
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:06,400
Speaker 1: And like, look, Serric he has had a lot of

1093
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:09,880
Speaker 1: dudes that could really really play obviously, uh, Mellow and

1094
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:12,920
Speaker 1: a Keen Back when Mellow was a freshman they won

1095
00:55:12,960 --> 00:55:15,359
Speaker 1: the national championship. That was before I know you got there.

1096
00:55:15,400 --> 00:55:18,600
Speaker 1: But but the Jerry McNamara run, like there's there was

1097
00:55:18,680 --> 00:55:22,680
Speaker 1: something just freaking magical And there is something about ques

1098
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:25,200
Speaker 1: in the garden in the Big East Tournament and it's

1099
00:55:25,239 --> 00:55:28,279
Speaker 1: obviously not there anymore. What was that like to do

1100
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:31,279
Speaker 1: you remember about the the Jerry McNamara experimence. Oh? Well,

1101
00:55:31,560 --> 00:55:33,520
Speaker 1: for us that we had a tough year and I

1102
00:55:33,600 --> 00:55:36,160
Speaker 1: can remember the last game of the season going to DePaul.

1103
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:39,600
Speaker 1: The last two games we lost to DePaul by forty

1104
00:55:40,280 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 1: at DePaul when DePaul was a really good got crushed.

1105
00:55:43,719 --> 00:55:45,719
Speaker 1: And then we came back home for a senior Day

1106
00:55:46,160 --> 00:55:48,719
Speaker 1: and we lost to Villanova when they had Randy Foy

1107
00:55:49,640 --> 00:55:52,920
Speaker 1: and all of those guys, Kyle Laurie, Alan Ray. They

1108
00:55:52,960 --> 00:55:54,600
Speaker 1: had a hell of a team and they crushed us

1109
00:55:54,600 --> 00:55:57,839
Speaker 1: on senior Day, which was Jerry McNamara senior day. Uh

1110
00:55:58,000 --> 00:56:00,879
Speaker 1: So it was real gloomy around the accused at that time.

1111
00:56:01,560 --> 00:56:04,640
Speaker 1: But we went into the Big East Tournament and that

1112
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:10,680
Speaker 1: first three he made to be Cincinnati um was was unbelievable.

1113
00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:12,680
Speaker 1: I can remember him coming to the bench and I

1114
00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:14,400
Speaker 1: was the first one that greeted them and they went

1115
00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:17,120
Speaker 1: to the scores table and I said, Mac, are you

1116
00:56:17,280 --> 00:56:20,279
Speaker 1: sure you was behind the line? Murph? I was behind

1117
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:24,120
Speaker 1: the line? Game over? So are you game over? I was?

1118
00:56:24,239 --> 00:56:27,160
Speaker 1: I was behind the line. So we knew we would

1119
00:56:27,160 --> 00:56:29,719
Speaker 1: be moving on and just from there the way we

1120
00:56:29,840 --> 00:56:33,040
Speaker 1: we we won. Uh, we just got our energy back,

1121
00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:35,160
Speaker 1: We got our life back with that one shot, that

1122
00:56:35,320 --> 00:56:37,880
Speaker 1: one make, and then from there it just seemed like

1123
00:56:38,120 --> 00:56:41,919
Speaker 1: everything continued to fall into place. We couldn't do anything wrong.

1124
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:45,320
Speaker 1: And Jerry was an unbelievable leader. He hit all of

1125
00:56:45,360 --> 00:56:47,719
Speaker 1: those shots at the end of those games too, you know,

1126
00:56:47,880 --> 00:56:50,759
Speaker 1: propel us to the Big East championship. But even his

1127
00:56:50,880 --> 00:56:54,799
Speaker 1: point guard play and his leadership at the time was incredible,

1128
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,399
Speaker 1: and all the guys bought in and we rallied around him,

1129
00:56:57,480 --> 00:56:59,960
Speaker 1: and him being a senior, we wanted to send him

1130
00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:03,880
Speaker 1: out the right way. So he was incredible. Coach was

1131
00:57:03,960 --> 00:57:06,800
Speaker 1: incredible doing that run, and we were very fortunate to

1132
00:57:06,880 --> 00:57:09,560
Speaker 1: win a Big East UH Tournament championship and going and

1133
00:57:09,640 --> 00:57:12,319
Speaker 1: participate in the n C Double A Tournament. How are

1134
00:57:12,400 --> 00:57:14,319
Speaker 1: you different now as the head coach than you were

1135
00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:17,680
Speaker 1: when you first took the Eastern job. Um, just having

1136
00:57:17,760 --> 00:57:22,400
Speaker 1: more patience, Uh, having more understanding. Uh. You know, we're

1137
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:25,520
Speaker 1: in a now world. We never really lived in a

1138
00:57:25,640 --> 00:57:28,440
Speaker 1: moment um. So when I became a head coach, you know,

1139
00:57:28,720 --> 00:57:31,080
Speaker 1: I was looking at the next job because that was

1140
00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:35,240
Speaker 1: what everyone said you should do. Oh well, Eastern Michigan

1141
00:57:35,320 --> 00:57:37,640
Speaker 1: is a stepping stone job. You're supposed to go there

1142
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:39,600
Speaker 1: and win and leaving two or three years and do

1143
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:42,240
Speaker 1: something different. So I had a couple of NBA offers,

1144
00:57:42,280 --> 00:57:44,680
Speaker 1: which you know, I was intrigued with, and that was

1145
00:57:44,920 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 1: a big deal my first few years. And then I

1146
00:57:47,400 --> 00:57:50,360
Speaker 1: started thinking about you know, winning here and and and

1147
00:57:50,760 --> 00:57:53,600
Speaker 1: moving on. But then I you know, start thinking about

1148
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:57,000
Speaker 1: my purpose, uh, you know, of why am I in

1149
00:57:57,120 --> 00:57:59,960
Speaker 1: this spot? Um? And why am I Why did I

1150
00:58:00,160 --> 00:58:02,360
Speaker 1: get this job? And you know, I started my foundation

1151
00:58:02,400 --> 00:58:05,920
Speaker 1: in two thousand and fourteen, which has impacted the lives

1152
00:58:05,960 --> 00:58:08,880
Speaker 1: of a lot of underprivileged youth and families in Detroit

1153
00:58:08,960 --> 00:58:11,640
Speaker 1: and here in the Ipsilanti community. Uh So I began

1154
00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:13,960
Speaker 1: to think differently. This was a dream job for me.

1155
00:58:14,040 --> 00:58:16,880
Speaker 1: I'm thirty minutes away from home, so I just you know,

1156
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:19,680
Speaker 1: put two feet in the Siemen here and said I

1157
00:58:19,760 --> 00:58:21,680
Speaker 1: was gonna build this program and I was here to stay.

1158
00:58:21,760 --> 00:58:24,960
Speaker 1: So I've just learned to have more post patients focus

1159
00:58:25,080 --> 00:58:27,240
Speaker 1: on the now and not so much the future. You

1160
00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:30,360
Speaker 1: want to plan, uh and be a few years ahead.

1161
00:58:30,560 --> 00:58:33,000
Speaker 1: And that's what successful people do. But for the most part,

1162
00:58:33,120 --> 00:58:35,520
Speaker 1: I've had more patients than I've lived in the moment,

1163
00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:38,920
Speaker 1: and the most important thing for me has been Eastern

1164
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:41,960
Speaker 1: Michigan basketball. So if I'm here for another fifteen years,

1165
00:58:42,040 --> 00:58:44,400
Speaker 1: that's great. If I do something different and we and

1166
00:58:44,480 --> 00:58:48,160
Speaker 1: I move on, that's great. But just having patients, living

1167
00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:50,000
Speaker 1: and coaching in the moment to make sure I can

1168
00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:54,320
Speaker 1: give these student athletes UM teaching everything I can uh

1169
00:58:54,560 --> 00:58:57,840
Speaker 1: every single day that I'm here. I know, considering your upbringing,

1170
00:58:57,960 --> 00:59:01,560
Speaker 1: your your your family, and being a parent is incredibly

1171
00:59:01,760 --> 00:59:03,560
Speaker 1: important to you. So how do you balance that? You

1172
00:59:03,640 --> 00:59:06,360
Speaker 1: can technically set your own schedule, how do you like

1173
00:59:06,520 --> 00:59:09,320
Speaker 1: your day when you practice, when you meet, how do

1174
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:11,520
Speaker 1: you have your family time so that you can do

1175
00:59:11,600 --> 00:59:15,000
Speaker 1: your job both at home and at work or during

1176
00:59:15,160 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 1: during the season, you know, obviously, Doug, it's extremely, extremely tough, UM,

1177
00:59:19,640 --> 00:59:22,880
Speaker 1: because you want to put everything into winning every single

1178
00:59:22,960 --> 00:59:27,760
Speaker 1: basketball game. Obviously, you know, the last eight seasons, we've

1179
00:59:27,800 --> 00:59:30,560
Speaker 1: graduated thirty out of thirty two of our student athletes,

1180
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:34,000
Speaker 1: so we're doing well in the academic department. But obviously

1181
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:37,600
Speaker 1: my job is to win basketball games regardless. So during

1182
00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:40,959
Speaker 1: the season it's tough. We you know, you know, spend

1183
00:59:41,120 --> 00:59:43,880
Speaker 1: time and talking to my kids. At from seven fifteen

1184
00:59:43,880 --> 00:59:47,040
Speaker 1: at eight o'clock they go to school. UM, I may

1185
00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:49,280
Speaker 1: work out for forty five minutes to an hour, gets

1186
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:52,800
Speaker 1: to the office. At nine fifteen. We have meetings, um,

1187
00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:55,720
Speaker 1: you know, just for this breakdown of practice, breakdown of

1188
00:59:56,000 --> 00:59:59,560
Speaker 1: the next opponent. Um. You know. After that, we kind

1189
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:01,760
Speaker 1: of break and have our our time before we practice.

1190
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:04,520
Speaker 1: At one thirty, we practiced for a few hours. We

1191
01:00:04,640 --> 01:00:07,640
Speaker 1: may have some guys shoot afterwards. Um. And after that

1192
01:00:07,760 --> 01:00:09,520
Speaker 1: we may meet again as a staff, and I allow

1193
01:00:09,640 --> 01:00:12,160
Speaker 1: my staff to go spend time with family because it

1194
01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:15,960
Speaker 1: is important. But in season, we put everything in our

1195
01:00:17,600 --> 01:00:21,600
Speaker 1: life to win each and every basketball game, and that

1196
01:00:21,760 --> 01:00:23,560
Speaker 1: takes a lot because we have to spend time with

1197
01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:25,720
Speaker 1: our players. Um. You know, we have the M B. E.

1198
01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:28,960
Speaker 1: MU boardroom talk. Now. When my book came out, you know,

1199
01:00:29,000 --> 01:00:30,959
Speaker 1: obviously I knew it was going to impact the life

1200
01:00:31,720 --> 01:00:34,440
Speaker 1: live different lives around the country, but more importantly, I

1201
01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:37,680
Speaker 1: wanted it to impact our student athletes here. So we

1202
01:00:37,840 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 1: have the boardroom talk, what we call it going into

1203
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:43,560
Speaker 1: the lab or we talk life, athletics and basketball. And

1204
01:00:43,680 --> 01:00:47,080
Speaker 1: I think that's really beneficial. Into you know, helping our

1205
01:00:47,320 --> 01:00:51,160
Speaker 1: student athletes continue to grow and evolve into who they're

1206
01:00:51,200 --> 01:00:53,160
Speaker 1: becoming while they're here with me, and orders for them

1207
01:00:53,200 --> 01:00:56,320
Speaker 1: to be successful when they leave us. So family time

1208
01:00:56,520 --> 01:00:58,720
Speaker 1: is limited during the season, a lot more in the offseason.

1209
01:00:58,920 --> 01:01:02,000
Speaker 1: But I always keep every thing into perspective because you

1210
01:01:02,040 --> 01:01:03,520
Speaker 1: want to give love to your family, you want to

1211
01:01:03,560 --> 01:01:06,480
Speaker 1: give love to your your second family here, which are

1212
01:01:06,560 --> 01:01:08,200
Speaker 1: the Eastern Michigan Eagles. And I think we have a

1213
01:01:08,280 --> 01:01:12,080
Speaker 1: great balance. You mentioned your boardroom talk and you you're

1214
01:01:12,160 --> 01:01:15,880
Speaker 1: mentor to so many people. It is interesting and look,

1215
01:01:16,600 --> 01:01:19,200
Speaker 1: I know that we both we have all comes in

1216
01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:21,760
Speaker 1: different perspectives on the n c A thing whatever. But

1217
01:01:22,080 --> 01:01:25,200
Speaker 1: I think that the part that gets massively undersold by

1218
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:30,800
Speaker 1: people in my business is the importance of college and

1219
01:01:31,160 --> 01:01:34,000
Speaker 1: the relationships like look you pointed out like a Syracuse

1220
01:01:34,120 --> 01:01:38,120
Speaker 1: Jim Beeheim higher Syracuse guys, right, like the we we

1221
01:01:38,360 --> 01:01:40,920
Speaker 1: undersell when you go to college, you're now part of

1222
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:45,240
Speaker 1: that university family and that basketball family. And one is

1223
01:01:45,280 --> 01:01:48,520
Speaker 1: important because so many people come from either split families

1224
01:01:48,640 --> 01:01:50,960
Speaker 1: or you know, all different sorts of family units. But

1225
01:01:51,120 --> 01:01:53,959
Speaker 1: too because that's really your future. Whereas if you skip

1226
01:01:54,080 --> 01:01:57,520
Speaker 1: over that process now when basketball stops. The only thing

1227
01:01:57,600 --> 01:01:59,640
Speaker 1: you have is NBA or g League. Those are the

1228
01:01:59,680 --> 01:02:02,520
Speaker 1: only actions that that you have, and there's just a

1229
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:05,680
Speaker 1: limited number of jobs there. Um. But I think the

1230
01:02:05,720 --> 01:02:08,520
Speaker 1: part that gets undersold the most is how so many

1231
01:02:08,640 --> 01:02:11,440
Speaker 1: coaches and maybe not to the level that you do

1232
01:02:12,120 --> 01:02:16,120
Speaker 1: invest in these players to help mentor them now and

1233
01:02:16,360 --> 01:02:19,520
Speaker 1: into the future. Um, with all your friends in coaching,

1234
01:02:20,160 --> 01:02:22,840
Speaker 1: and I would I would say having your own foundation,

1235
01:02:22,960 --> 01:02:26,880
Speaker 1: writing a sharing your story. I think you're probably at

1236
01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:30,480
Speaker 1: the highest level in terms of of how important mentorship

1237
01:02:30,600 --> 01:02:33,280
Speaker 1: is to your players. But do you think maybe, and

1238
01:02:33,600 --> 01:02:35,600
Speaker 1: this feels like a set up question, but do you

1239
01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:37,480
Speaker 1: think we in the media do a good enough job

1240
01:02:37,560 --> 01:02:41,280
Speaker 1: of explaining what the college experience truly is outside of

1241
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:44,160
Speaker 1: just the basketball games twice or three times a week.

1242
01:02:44,680 --> 01:02:47,440
Speaker 1: I don't. It's never really talked about because it all

1243
01:02:47,560 --> 01:02:51,840
Speaker 1: comes down to, uh, you know obviously the big schools, uh,

1244
01:02:51,880 --> 01:02:54,000
Speaker 1: the n C Double A Tournament, the games that are

1245
01:02:54,080 --> 01:02:56,760
Speaker 1: on TV. UH, So we don't really talk about what

1246
01:02:56,920 --> 01:02:59,520
Speaker 1: goes on behind the scenes. UM. You know, for me

1247
01:03:00,160 --> 01:03:02,280
Speaker 1: for what, you know, how I was you know, brought

1248
01:03:02,360 --> 01:03:05,760
Speaker 1: up in an environment and the challenges and the obstacles. Uh.

1249
01:03:05,880 --> 01:03:07,960
Speaker 1: You know, I think it's important for us as coaches

1250
01:03:08,040 --> 01:03:12,280
Speaker 1: to spend more time outside of the court, um, with

1251
01:03:12,440 --> 01:03:15,440
Speaker 1: our student athletes. UM. You know you you would hope

1252
01:03:15,560 --> 01:03:17,280
Speaker 1: and what I've learned you you would hope that they

1253
01:03:17,320 --> 01:03:21,000
Speaker 1: would just learn it, uh just through basketball, through film,

1254
01:03:21,200 --> 01:03:24,680
Speaker 1: through through practice, through travel, Uh, just them being in

1255
01:03:24,760 --> 01:03:29,440
Speaker 1: the team uh the team uh atmosphere. Um. But I

1256
01:03:29,560 --> 01:03:31,440
Speaker 1: think we need to take it a step further and

1257
01:03:31,520 --> 01:03:35,320
Speaker 1: really really spend time and get to know our student athletes.

1258
01:03:35,480 --> 01:03:38,000
Speaker 1: So we talked in our boardroom about leadership. You know

1259
01:03:38,040 --> 01:03:43,400
Speaker 1: obviously accountability, mindset, decision making, how to be resilient. And

1260
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:46,240
Speaker 1: I allowed my guys to talk to tell me what's

1261
01:03:46,280 --> 01:03:48,640
Speaker 1: on their mind because I want to get to know them.

1262
01:03:48,680 --> 01:03:51,080
Speaker 1: I think their teammates should get to know them. And

1263
01:03:51,200 --> 01:03:53,960
Speaker 1: it's interesting, you know, we had one uh forty eight

1264
01:03:54,040 --> 01:03:58,480
Speaker 1: hours ago and you know, the Zach Winston situation happened,

1265
01:03:58,840 --> 01:04:01,920
Speaker 1: which was really unfore and you know, obviously everybody has

1266
01:04:01,960 --> 01:04:04,600
Speaker 1: kind of rallied around Cashes and you know, his family

1267
01:04:05,240 --> 01:04:07,720
Speaker 1: with what happened with his brother. UM, but it was

1268
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:10,400
Speaker 1: interesting just to get the feedback from what some of

1269
01:04:10,520 --> 01:04:14,000
Speaker 1: my guys felt, because you don't know what our student

1270
01:04:14,040 --> 01:04:16,720
Speaker 1: athletes are going through. It can be a depression, Uh,

1271
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:19,880
Speaker 1: can be anxiety. It can be so many things that

1272
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:23,360
Speaker 1: we don't know that's not talked about or it's not heard.

1273
01:04:23,560 --> 01:04:25,960
Speaker 1: And even in my book, uh, if you even go

1274
01:04:26,080 --> 01:04:29,440
Speaker 1: to page thirty two, I talked about the being alone,

1275
01:04:29,520 --> 01:04:33,360
Speaker 1: the dysfunction, how I masked everything and didn't really tell

1276
01:04:33,400 --> 01:04:36,200
Speaker 1: anybody how I felt, uh day to day with what

1277
01:04:36,360 --> 01:04:38,240
Speaker 1: I was going through. I would just you know, go

1278
01:04:38,360 --> 01:04:40,280
Speaker 1: to school, and this was I was talking about the

1279
01:04:40,360 --> 01:04:44,160
Speaker 1: time that I was in high school. Um, so nobody

1280
01:04:44,280 --> 01:04:46,680
Speaker 1: really asked me, you know, what I was going through

1281
01:04:46,880 --> 01:04:48,919
Speaker 1: or or you know. Obviously my high school coach looked

1282
01:04:48,960 --> 01:04:52,200
Speaker 1: after me, but we didn't have deep, deep, deep conversations.

1283
01:04:52,400 --> 01:04:54,800
Speaker 1: So for me to kind of have an understanding of

1284
01:04:54,880 --> 01:04:57,520
Speaker 1: what somebody may be going through and not really tell it,

1285
01:04:58,040 --> 01:05:00,520
Speaker 1: I think we just need to U spent more time

1286
01:05:00,560 --> 01:05:03,280
Speaker 1: when our guys outside of the court. So I've kind

1287
01:05:03,320 --> 01:05:05,040
Speaker 1: of set up this venue for us to come in

1288
01:05:05,160 --> 01:05:07,600
Speaker 1: and talk about anything and everything that's on their mind.

1289
01:05:07,640 --> 01:05:11,440
Speaker 1: It can be girlfriends, academic struggle, depression, and in our

1290
01:05:11,520 --> 01:05:14,880
Speaker 1: last boardroom, some guys says some interesting things which helped

1291
01:05:14,920 --> 01:05:17,080
Speaker 1: me better understand them. Where they come from and what

1292
01:05:17,160 --> 01:05:18,840
Speaker 1: they may be going through, and I'm able to help

1293
01:05:18,920 --> 01:05:21,120
Speaker 1: them and lead them uh to where it may not

1294
01:05:21,320 --> 01:05:24,320
Speaker 1: end up being a tragic situation and they know they

1295
01:05:24,400 --> 01:05:27,360
Speaker 1: have me and my staff uh here to to support

1296
01:05:27,400 --> 01:05:31,080
Speaker 1: them through anything. You you mentioned that in the pool,

1297
01:05:31,360 --> 01:05:34,600
Speaker 1: the hiring pool at at e MU, you're the only

1298
01:05:34,640 --> 01:05:38,160
Speaker 1: African American candidate and obviously you're replacing a Charles Rams

1299
01:05:38,240 --> 01:05:43,480
Speaker 1: used an African American head coach. Um, It's like inside

1300
01:05:43,600 --> 01:05:47,120
Speaker 1: locker rooms and coaches offices, races race is discussed. But

1301
01:05:47,200 --> 01:05:49,800
Speaker 1: I think differently than the rest of the world. Um,

1302
01:05:50,920 --> 01:05:55,080
Speaker 1: I just I wonder, and this is an honest question,

1303
01:05:55,360 --> 01:05:58,560
Speaker 1: is do you think we've reached the point in college

1304
01:05:58,640 --> 01:06:02,800
Speaker 1: basketball where a race of a coach doesn't matter, Like

1305
01:06:03,040 --> 01:06:07,040
Speaker 1: we're actual accomplishments matter. Have we gotten because there is

1306
01:06:07,120 --> 01:06:10,720
Speaker 1: something there is something loaded there, um where hey, we

1307
01:06:10,800 --> 01:06:13,960
Speaker 1: want a guy with head coaching experience. Well, okay, that

1308
01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:16,760
Speaker 1: does trim down the number of African American candidates in

1309
01:06:16,800 --> 01:06:20,120
Speaker 1: your pool, right because more white coaches have gotten more opportunities.

1310
01:06:20,520 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 1: So it might not be. It might there, there might

1311
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:28,480
Speaker 1: not be, it might not intentionally be racist or whatever

1312
01:06:28,840 --> 01:06:32,040
Speaker 1: or limiting, but it is in terms of the percentage

1313
01:06:32,040 --> 01:06:35,840
Speaker 1: of potential candidates. Right. So I just I having experienced

1314
01:06:35,880 --> 01:06:38,640
Speaker 1: it now as a head coach for nine years, have

1315
01:06:38,760 --> 01:06:45,560
Speaker 1: we gotten to that point where, um, where race doesn't matter. No,

1316
01:06:45,720 --> 01:06:48,000
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think we'll get to that point

1317
01:06:48,040 --> 01:06:51,200
Speaker 1: anytime soon, Doug. If you just, you know, look at

1318
01:06:51,200 --> 01:06:54,480
Speaker 1: the opportunity is there's not a lot of African African

1319
01:06:54,520 --> 01:06:58,000
Speaker 1: American head coaches, uh, you know at a Division one level.

1320
01:06:58,200 --> 01:07:00,800
Speaker 1: I mean, I believe if given opera tunity, like a

1321
01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:05,080
Speaker 1: fair opportunity, um, you know, you'll see more. Um. But

1322
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:08,760
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't. I don't want to say it's racist. Um.

1323
01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:12,200
Speaker 1: What what I understood about me being in the pool

1324
01:07:12,400 --> 01:07:15,880
Speaker 1: at Eastern Michigan is that they just didn't want the

1325
01:07:16,040 --> 01:07:19,400
Speaker 1: same type of profile that they had just hired. Um.

1326
01:07:19,920 --> 01:07:22,240
Speaker 1: I came in and won the job, and obviously I

1327
01:07:22,440 --> 01:07:24,400
Speaker 1: was hired here. So I don't think it was a

1328
01:07:24,520 --> 01:07:27,640
Speaker 1: racist situation at that time. But I think if you

1329
01:07:27,800 --> 01:07:31,280
Speaker 1: just look at the percentages of how many African Americans

1330
01:07:31,400 --> 01:07:33,920
Speaker 1: are in the position, whether it's the college level or

1331
01:07:33,960 --> 01:07:37,840
Speaker 1: the professional level, we don't get those same opportunities. And

1332
01:07:38,040 --> 01:07:39,920
Speaker 1: just to take it a step further. I mean, I've

1333
01:07:39,960 --> 01:07:44,080
Speaker 1: been here nine years. I'm the lowest paid coach in

1334
01:07:44,200 --> 01:07:50,040
Speaker 1: this UM conference. My staff are the lowest paid assistant

1335
01:07:50,080 --> 01:07:53,600
Speaker 1: coaches and support staff in our conference. I don't like

1336
01:07:53,760 --> 01:07:56,160
Speaker 1: to think that it's because of the color of my skin.

1337
01:07:56,640 --> 01:07:59,760
Speaker 1: But at the same time, I'm not compensated as much

1338
01:07:59,840 --> 01:08:03,200
Speaker 1: as maybe somebody you know, coaching out another school of

1339
01:08:03,280 --> 01:08:06,600
Speaker 1: a different race. So for me, I just do my

1340
01:08:06,720 --> 01:08:08,920
Speaker 1: job at a high level. I don't really think about

1341
01:08:09,080 --> 01:08:11,800
Speaker 1: those situations because I'm fortunate to be in this situation

1342
01:08:12,360 --> 01:08:17,280
Speaker 1: UM and throughout uh, you know, my UM you know,

1343
01:08:17,479 --> 01:08:20,840
Speaker 1: college experience since I left high school. Jim Christian gave

1344
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:25,200
Speaker 1: me an unbelievable opportunity, Jim Beheim gave me an unbelievable opportunity,

1345
01:08:25,640 --> 01:08:29,679
Speaker 1: and then Sue Martin and Dr grag who was athletic

1346
01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:32,000
Speaker 1: director here at the time, gave me a great opportunity.

1347
01:08:32,439 --> 01:08:34,720
Speaker 1: So I tell people, you know, you have to be

1348
01:08:34,800 --> 01:08:36,840
Speaker 1: in position to get the opportunity, and when you get

1349
01:08:36,880 --> 01:08:40,680
Speaker 1: your opportunity, you gotta make the best of it. Black, whiter, indifferent, UM.

1350
01:08:41,360 --> 01:08:46,280
Speaker 1: But we don't get these opportunities, which is really really sad. UM.

1351
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:49,760
Speaker 1: The most I don't want to see the best. The

1352
01:08:49,840 --> 01:08:52,840
Speaker 1: most challenging coach that you faced in the MAC is

1353
01:08:52,880 --> 01:08:59,240
Speaker 1: who it would be coach Keith dan Brod. But he's

1354
01:08:59,240 --> 01:09:02,240
Speaker 1: no longer in the MAC. He's at Duqueesne now. But

1355
01:09:03,080 --> 01:09:07,680
Speaker 1: his team's uh, you know always we're efficient offensively and

1356
01:09:07,760 --> 01:09:10,640
Speaker 1: they play really really good defense. Uh. He did a

1357
01:09:10,680 --> 01:09:13,320
Speaker 1: phenomenal job during his tenure in the MAC, and uh

1358
01:09:13,439 --> 01:09:15,720
Speaker 1: it's a reason where he was able to uh get

1359
01:09:15,720 --> 01:09:19,240
Speaker 1: a bigger job. All right. Um, the one thing you

1360
01:09:19,400 --> 01:09:21,040
Speaker 1: feel like you need to do better as a next

1361
01:09:21,080 --> 01:09:25,840
Speaker 1: and no coach, Um, just continue to uh to learn,

1362
01:09:26,200 --> 01:09:28,639
Speaker 1: uh and evolve. I think we do a really good

1363
01:09:28,720 --> 01:09:31,559
Speaker 1: job here of running our our offense, whether his own

1364
01:09:31,640 --> 01:09:35,240
Speaker 1: or man. Our spacing is really good. We had twenty

1365
01:09:35,360 --> 01:09:38,080
Speaker 1: three assists in our first game in twenty in our

1366
01:09:38,160 --> 01:09:40,960
Speaker 1: game last night. Uh. So it just shows my team

1367
01:09:41,479 --> 01:09:43,800
Speaker 1: is brought into each other. They turned it down good

1368
01:09:43,800 --> 01:09:46,439
Speaker 1: shots for great shots. Uh. And if we can continue

1369
01:09:46,479 --> 01:09:49,760
Speaker 1: to do that, um offensively, we were really good basketball team.

1370
01:09:50,479 --> 01:09:54,040
Speaker 1: The book is a phenomenal one. It's called Deep. I

1371
01:09:54,160 --> 01:09:56,280
Speaker 1: encourage you to go out and pick it up Amazon

1372
01:09:56,439 --> 01:09:59,479
Speaker 1: or whatever you wherever you order books. Uh. He's Rob

1373
01:09:59,560 --> 01:10:02,559
Speaker 1: Murphy and he's the head coach of Eastern Michigan. Coach,

1374
01:10:02,640 --> 01:10:04,439
Speaker 1: I know you got a game tomorrow night, you had

1375
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:07,320
Speaker 1: one last night. I appreciate you fitting us into your schedule.

1376
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:09,320
Speaker 1: Your your journey is amazing by the way. You Go

1377
01:10:09,400 --> 01:10:13,639
Speaker 1: to Rob Murphy Foundation dot org for more information. Coach,

1378
01:10:13,680 --> 01:10:15,639
Speaker 1: thanks so much for joining us, and thanks for having

1379
01:10:15,680 --> 01:10:18,280
Speaker 1: me Doug, I greatly appreciate it. You've always been good

1380
01:10:18,320 --> 01:10:21,200
Speaker 1: to me, so thanks for having me on. Be sure

1381
01:10:21,280 --> 01:10:23,880
Speaker 1: to catch the live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show

1382
01:10:24,000 --> 01:10:28,920
Speaker 1: weekdays at three pm Easter noon Pacific. Hey, thanks for

1383
01:10:29,000 --> 01:10:31,240
Speaker 1: listening to the All Ball Podcast. Make sure you listen

1384
01:10:31,240 --> 01:10:33,479
Speaker 1: to my daily radio show three to six Eastern twelve

1385
01:10:33,520 --> 01:10:36,120
Speaker 1: three Pacific, Fox Sports Radio, I Heart Radio app or

1386
01:10:36,200 --> 01:10:38,360
Speaker 1: Series x M two seventeen or two oh three. I'm

1387
01:10:38,439 --> 01:10:41,800
Speaker 1: Doug Gottlieb, and you have been listening to All Ball