WEBVTT - Pebble Beach Golf Links with Garrett Morrison

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome back to another edition of the Frida Egg Podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>Today's episode on Pebble Beach in the US Open is

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<v Speaker 1>And exciting week they are in the merchandise tent, So

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<v Speaker 1>if you're coming on the grounds, go go say hi

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<v Speaker 1>to the b Dratty boys in the merchandise tent. So

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<v Speaker 1>today's episode we sit down with Garrett Morrison, who is

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<v Speaker 1>the news hire the Fried Egg. So Garrett is a

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<v Speaker 1>now our managing editor and will be starting He just

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<v Speaker 1>started in June, so expect to see a lot more

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<v Speaker 1>content from Garrett. He will be writing, he will be

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<v Speaker 1>editing my hack words, and he will be kind of

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<v Speaker 1>building out more editorial for The Fried Egg. So should

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<v Speaker 1>have a lot more new stuff coming on the fried

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<v Speaker 1>egg dot com and enhance a lot of the stuff

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<v Speaker 1>that we're already doing with the newsletter and podcast and

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<v Speaker 1>content in general. So very excited to have Garrett on

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<v Speaker 1>and excite for you guys to hear his thoughts on

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<v Speaker 1>Pebble He's lived out here for the last couple of years,

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<v Speaker 1>teaching at the Stevenson School, which is actually inside the

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<v Speaker 1>gates of Pebble Beach. So without further ado, here is

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<v Speaker 1>Garrett Morrison and our first of our pods from Pebble Beach.

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<v Speaker 2>I miss the green, for example, I'm already upset when

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<v Speaker 2>I find my ball in the bunker. I'm really upset.

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<v Speaker 2>And when I find my ball in a brid egg

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<v Speaker 2>Friday egg, the dreaded Frida egg, Frida egridagg bride egg Lie,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm about ready to run.

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<v Speaker 1>Off of the course. So you're moving to Oregon?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? Yeah, it's exciting.

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<v Speaker 1>Portland area.

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<v Speaker 2>Portland area just outside of Portland, in a town called

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<v Speaker 2>Happy Valley. And we could afford to buy a house there,

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<v Speaker 2>which was the main motive to move away from Pebble Beach,

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<v Speaker 2>which is not a place where we can buy a house.

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<v Speaker 2>And so we are packing up all our stuff and

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<v Speaker 2>going north.

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<v Speaker 1>That's exciting. What have you ever been? Have you ever

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<v Speaker 1>heard of that mcmhimon's pub course, Edgefield?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? I have.

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<v Speaker 1>I went on a bachelor party there, like my best

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<v Speaker 1>friends bachelor party group of like college buddies that aren't

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<v Speaker 1>real golfers, and we had like the best time, Like

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<v Speaker 1>you know, we had guys that never played golf that

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<v Speaker 1>were like having a great time and it was so neat.

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<v Speaker 1>It was like one of the coolest places I've ever bet.

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<v Speaker 2>What's the course?

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<v Speaker 1>Like, I mean, it's not anything great, but it's just

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<v Speaker 1>like so approachable. You you walk in and the you know,

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<v Speaker 1>the bar is like the clubhouse, and I think it

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<v Speaker 1>costs a dollar to rend a golf ball, but then

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<v Speaker 1>they give you, you know, just a putter and a

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<v Speaker 1>wedge and the longest hole is like seventy yards and

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<v Speaker 1>it plays like straight up hills and straight down hills.

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<v Speaker 1>There's some blind shots and this little par three and

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<v Speaker 1>you know, you hit off mats. But it was it

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<v Speaker 1>was so easy to play, you know, and so fun

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<v Speaker 1>because like I think we spent spend like three hours there,

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<v Speaker 1>and you get any non golfer out somewhere for three

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<v Speaker 1>hours on golf course. It's kind of a big success, right.

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<v Speaker 2>I like incidental golf. That's sort of incidental golf. Like

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<v Speaker 2>you you go to a place to to drink some

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<v Speaker 2>beer and oh, hey there's a golf course there, maybe

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<v Speaker 2>maybe we should play, and people are into it, right,

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<v Speaker 2>who wouldn't normally be into playing golf.

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<v Speaker 1>They have an eleven hole course and a twenty two

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<v Speaker 1>hole course. Really yeah, and then it's like they do

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<v Speaker 1>like mcmenumons, I think, like a distillery brewery right type place.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes it is. Yeah, there are other locations in Portland.

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<v Speaker 2>They're like city locations of mcmentimon's it's a whole thing.

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<v Speaker 1>I think this one's edge shield. Okay, you gotta check

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<v Speaker 1>that out.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, definitely for sure. Yeah, there are some good places

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<v Speaker 2>in Portland. It's an interesting golf town because there's like

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<v Speaker 2>a variety of courses. There are the kind of serious

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<v Speaker 2>eighteen hole courses that you would expect to be there,

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<v Speaker 2>but then there are a few places here and there

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<v Speaker 2>that are just kind of funky. In Oregon in general,

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<v Speaker 2>there's a lot of pasture golf. There's a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>backyard golf, just families, random people who have built golf

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<v Speaker 2>courses on their land. And there's the Portland Children's course

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<v Speaker 2>that Seamus is working on right now that might be

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<v Speaker 2>pretty cool eventually. And so it is a really interesting

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<v Speaker 2>like golf area because of the different options available, and

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<v Speaker 2>it's a little bit undiscovered up there, even though Bandon

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<v Speaker 2>is in the same state.

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like the whole Pacific Northwest is undiscovered. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>outside of like the places that have had a budget

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<v Speaker 1>to pay for marketing and pr Like, you know, everybody

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<v Speaker 1>knows about Sylvie's because they did it massive PR thing

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<v Speaker 1>when they opened Gamble Sands. You know, they they push hard.

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<v Speaker 1>But then there's all kinds of places like that, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>Wine Valley, that all the Dan Hickson stuff, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>and then you have all that Chandler Egan. You're gonna

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<v Speaker 1>be You're gonna be deep in Chandler Egan.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna it's is gonna grow, Yeah, because I you know,

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<v Speaker 2>Chandler Egan did the the first nine at Pacific Grove,

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<v Speaker 2>and so I've I've always sort of been interested in him. Obviously,

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<v Speaker 2>he did the work at Pebble Beach that everybody's obsessed with.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, he was located in Oregon for a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of his you know, kind of golf architecture career. There's

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<v Speaker 2>just a ton of Chandler Eagan courses around and he

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<v Speaker 2>did some interesting work. For sure.

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<v Speaker 1>He's from Chicago, you know, Chicago neks.

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<v Speaker 2>It always goes back to Chicago.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So you know, everybody tries to move into these

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<v Speaker 1>gates here at seventeen mile Drive. You're moving out, I know.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Well, you know, the reason I'm here is complicated.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm a I'm a teacher at a boarding school, or

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<v Speaker 2>I was a teacher at a boarding school, I suppose

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<v Speaker 2>I should say. And so we moved here because I

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<v Speaker 2>got this job, and because we decided to live on

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<v Speaker 2>campus and I was a member of the residential faculty,

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<v Speaker 2>and so we live here for free essentially, which sounds

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<v Speaker 2>like a really good deal, and it definitely is a

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<v Speaker 2>really good deal. But it's the only reason that we're

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<v Speaker 2>able to live here. And so, yeah, it's it's been

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of fun. But I'm also excited about about

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<v Speaker 2>the new adventure.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So you know, a lot of listeners probably don't know,

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<v Speaker 1>you know that if they don't, if they're not on Twitter,

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<v Speaker 1>if they aren't you know, reading the website all the time.

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<v Speaker 1>Garrett is our new managing editor of The Friday eg.

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<v Speaker 1>We're growing, It's got them from one to two. Got

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<v Speaker 1>a tall task o. We're doubling cleaning up my my

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<v Speaker 1>garbage writing it's not garbage any so, uh, Garrett, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>excited to have him come on here. And uh so

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<v Speaker 1>that's why he's moving from from Pebble Beach, which is uh,

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<v Speaker 1>I almost feel for you.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, it's it is kind of a golf mecca, obviously,

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<v Speaker 2>it's and and people have pointed out that irony, You're

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<v Speaker 2>you're you're going off to be a golf writer, a

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<v Speaker 2>golf journalist or whatever, and you're moving away from Pebble Beach.

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<v Speaker 2>That doesn't seem quite right. But it's obviously a great

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<v Speaker 2>place to go on a vacation and to have like

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<v Speaker 2>a once in a lifetime experience. There are a few

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<v Speaker 2>better places for that. But to be a local golfer

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<v Speaker 2>in this area is a little bit weird because there

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<v Speaker 2>are basically two golf courses that you can play on

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<v Speaker 2>a regular basis affordably.

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<v Speaker 1>They don't have a good local right at Pebble.

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<v Speaker 2>Beach, the local rate sucks. It's like six hundred dollars.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, it's not a local rate. Yeah. So I've

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<v Speaker 2>played a lot of Pacific Grove Muni, which obviously is

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<v Speaker 2>one of my favorite places in the world, and that's great.

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<v Speaker 2>I play at Monterey Pines a good bit, and those

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<v Speaker 2>are essentially the two courses that you can play on

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<v Speaker 2>a regular basis. You can the local rate at Poppy Hills.

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<v Speaker 2>The NCGA rate is pretty good, but it's not like

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going out to Spyglass every Thursday and playing a

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<v Speaker 2>round of golf. You know, this is this is a

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<v Speaker 2>spot for vacationers. It's not really it's not really a

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<v Speaker 2>golf spot for locals.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's it's ironic, how like you know, if you're

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<v Speaker 1>if you're not a resort guest, like and just the

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<v Speaker 1>whole area, because then once you get out there isn't

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<v Speaker 1>you know, there's a lot of golf, but there's not

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of golf that's like built for everyday play.

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<v Speaker 2>No.

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<v Speaker 1>And you know, like if you're not a member at.

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<v Speaker 3>NPCC, which is one of the most expensive places in

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<v Speaker 3>the world, if you remember right, then you know there's

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<v Speaker 3>there's not much or Cypher's point, there's not much for

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<v Speaker 3>the you know, everyday golf.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I totally agree with that. Yeah, the places here

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<v Speaker 2>are built to be destinations, which is really cool. But

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<v Speaker 2>it makes the dynamic of being here and being an

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<v Speaker 2>obsessive golfer as I am, a little bit odd. So

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<v Speaker 2>I'm actually looking forward to the options in Oregon and

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<v Speaker 2>being able to go a number of different places, have

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<v Speaker 2>places to go with my kids. That'll be fun.

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<v Speaker 1>What got you back? You know, I know you kind

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<v Speaker 1>of stopped playing golf when you were in grad school

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<v Speaker 1>and you you know, fell kind of away from golf.

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<v Speaker 1>What got you back into golf?

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<v Speaker 2>I got back into golf after moving here and just

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<v Speaker 2>sort of taking walks around the area with my son,

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<v Speaker 2>who was a baby at the time, so I'd have

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<v Speaker 2>them in the stroller and i'd be taking these walks

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<v Speaker 2>around the Pebble Beach area, which is where the school

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<v Speaker 2>I work at is located. Basically, this school is between

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<v Speaker 2>Spyglass Hill and Poppy Hills and Pebble Beaches just down

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<v Speaker 2>the road. So when i'd go out in the stroller

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<v Speaker 2>and take these walks, I'd see these awesome golf courses

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<v Speaker 2>and they seemed a little bit unattainable, but I of

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<v Speaker 2>course knew about them because I had been into golf

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<v Speaker 2>when I was younger, and I had specifically been into

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<v Speaker 2>golf course architecture, and so I had studied these courses

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<v Speaker 2>in a way and kind of knew them, and it

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<v Speaker 2>was cool to see them in person, just walking around

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<v Speaker 2>the neighborhood. Then one day I was down in Pacific

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<v Speaker 2>Grove again taking a walk with my son in the stroller,

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<v Speaker 2>and I was at a Silmar State beach, which has

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<v Speaker 2>a great stretch of paths along the ocean, and I

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<v Speaker 2>was pushing him along one of these paths, and Pacific

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<v Speaker 2>Grove Golf Links came into view the back nine at

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<v Speaker 2>Pacific Grove Golf Links, which is routed through these natural dunes,

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<v Speaker 2>and I just thought that it looked amazing. It looked accessible,

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<v Speaker 2>it looked like a place that I'd feel comfortable walking

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<v Speaker 2>up to and playing, even though I hadn't been out

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<v Speaker 2>on a golf course for a while. And so I

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<v Speaker 2>got interested in playing again. I played a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>at Pacific Grove. There are members of the faculty here

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<v Speaker 2>at this school who are really into golf, and they

0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:25.800
<v Speaker 2>started inviting me out for rounds, and so I got

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<v Speaker 2>my game a little bit back into shape, and pretty

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<v Speaker 2>soon I was completely obsessed with the game again, just

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<v Speaker 2>like I had been when I was twelve years old,

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<v Speaker 2>you know. And so that's essentially how I got back

0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:44.240
<v Speaker 2>into playing. And you know, around late twenty sixteen, started

0:12:44.400 --> 0:12:48.839
<v Speaker 2>a golf Twitter account and began writing about the game,

0:12:49.360 --> 0:12:52.560
<v Speaker 2>and that has snowballed from there.

0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:57.000
<v Speaker 1>It's yeah, it's get back into it, and everybody, I

0:12:57.000 --> 0:12:59.400
<v Speaker 1>feel like, ever, I think that your story is a

0:12:59.559 --> 0:13:02.640
<v Speaker 1>common because I think so many people once they graduate

0:13:02.720 --> 0:13:05.920
<v Speaker 1>college or go to college, graduate college, there's there's a

0:13:05.920 --> 0:13:08.520
<v Speaker 1>lot of people that you know, the obviously there's golf

0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:10.480
<v Speaker 1>nuts that never fall out of it, but like there

0:13:10.480 --> 0:13:12.640
<v Speaker 1>are a lot of golf nuts that fall out of

0:13:12.640 --> 0:13:15.520
<v Speaker 1>it because like early on in life, it becomes if

0:13:15.520 --> 0:13:17.839
<v Speaker 1>you live in a city very difficult, or if you're

0:13:17.880 --> 0:13:20.960
<v Speaker 1>in grad school like or once you're in college, like

0:13:21.120 --> 0:13:23.439
<v Speaker 1>college was probably the time I played the least amount

0:13:23.480 --> 0:13:26.360
<v Speaker 1>of golf, yes, and and right after college because like

0:13:26.760 --> 0:13:30.000
<v Speaker 1>it's just it's expensive and it's hard to find the

0:13:30.040 --> 0:13:31.680
<v Speaker 1>time at that time in your life.

0:13:31.920 --> 0:13:37.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, no, I basically didn't play at all between

0:13:37.440 --> 0:13:44.599
<v Speaker 2>ages twenty and thirty two, and I never even have

0:13:44.800 --> 0:13:49.720
<v Speaker 2>the impulse to go play. And yeah, I think part

0:13:49.760 --> 0:13:51.840
<v Speaker 2>of it was the cost, and also part of it

0:13:51.920 --> 0:13:56.080
<v Speaker 2>was just none of my friends played golf, right, Nobody

0:13:56.120 --> 0:13:58.760
<v Speaker 2>I knew who is my age, who was in their

0:13:58.800 --> 0:14:04.760
<v Speaker 2>twenties played golf. And that definitely changed once I started

0:14:04.760 --> 0:14:06.720
<v Speaker 2>working here and a lot of my friends were in

0:14:06.760 --> 0:14:11.400
<v Speaker 2>their thirties and forties, and part of what they would

0:14:11.480 --> 0:14:14.120
<v Speaker 2>do on the weekends sometimes is go out, find a

0:14:14.160 --> 0:14:17.640
<v Speaker 2>group and play golf. Uh, And so that gets you

0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:20.360
<v Speaker 2>back into it. But yeah, when I was in graduate school,

0:14:20.360 --> 0:14:22.760
<v Speaker 2>I was in graduate school at Northwestern so in Evanston,

0:14:22.800 --> 0:14:26.440
<v Speaker 2>which is just north of Chicago, and and there's that's

0:14:26.440 --> 0:14:29.840
<v Speaker 2>where Canal Shores is, and you know there's some cool,

0:14:30.200 --> 0:14:32.880
<v Speaker 2>affordable options around there. Obviously, you know the golf well

0:14:32.880 --> 0:14:37.320
<v Speaker 2>in the area, but nobody I knew was going out

0:14:37.360 --> 0:14:39.840
<v Speaker 2>to those golf courses except for a couple of professors

0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:42.640
<v Speaker 2>here and there, and so I think that's a big

0:14:43.040 --> 0:14:43.680
<v Speaker 2>reason why.

0:14:44.800 --> 0:14:47.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, it's hard. It's it's hard to go play

0:14:48.000 --> 0:14:48.720
<v Speaker 1>by yourself.

0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:49.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly.

0:14:51.440 --> 0:14:55.280
<v Speaker 1>So with uh, with you've been you're the local here,

0:14:55.560 --> 0:14:58.280
<v Speaker 1>mm hmm. We got this week, we got a big

0:14:58.320 --> 0:15:02.800
<v Speaker 1>tournament going on here. You know, I know you're moving,

0:15:02.920 --> 0:15:06.680
<v Speaker 1>but there's an influx of people in Monterey.

0:15:06.360 --> 0:15:09.760
<v Speaker 2>There seemed to be. The population seems to have increased recently.

0:15:10.640 --> 0:15:14.080
<v Speaker 2>Traffic's a little worse, right right, traffic has become a nightmare.

0:15:14.880 --> 0:15:18.520
<v Speaker 1>So what uh, what are your impressions? I know, you

0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:21.400
<v Speaker 1>know you've you've been out at Pebble you you covered,

0:15:21.840 --> 0:15:24.680
<v Speaker 1>you were out there for the at and T you

0:15:24.760 --> 0:15:27.320
<v Speaker 1>played a media day, and then you've lived here obviously,

0:15:27.400 --> 0:15:30.360
<v Speaker 1>so you've lived on grounds or what, uh, what are

0:15:30.360 --> 0:15:32.960
<v Speaker 1>you expecting this week at the US Open?

0:15:34.080 --> 0:15:37.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, I think we're going to see a classic Pebble

0:15:38.000 --> 0:15:42.680
<v Speaker 2>Beach US Open basically If there's not a whole lot

0:15:42.720 --> 0:15:46.240
<v Speaker 2>of weather, the golf course will still be challenging, but

0:15:46.880 --> 0:15:52.040
<v Speaker 2>relatively benign compared to say, Shinnecock Hills last year. And

0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:55.160
<v Speaker 2>if we do get a little bit of wind, it'll

0:15:55.200 --> 0:16:00.280
<v Speaker 2>get nasty really quickly. You know. The golf course is hard.

0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:04.840
<v Speaker 2>It's obviously narrow. They've been working on making the rough thicker.

0:16:05.680 --> 0:16:08.440
<v Speaker 2>The greens are presumably going to be going to firm

0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:12.680
<v Speaker 2>out as the as the week goes on. So yeah,

0:16:12.720 --> 0:16:14.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, essentially it'll be a hard golf course, but

0:16:15.000 --> 0:16:18.000
<v Speaker 2>I think it'll be really familiar to people who have

0:16:18.080 --> 0:16:20.440
<v Speaker 2>seen a lot of Pebble Beach tournaments. You know, they

0:16:20.440 --> 0:16:22.120
<v Speaker 2>haven't done anything radical out there.

0:16:22.400 --> 0:16:25.080
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's I think one of the things with Pebble

0:16:25.240 --> 0:16:30.520
<v Speaker 1>is that it's the venue that requires like the least

0:16:30.640 --> 0:16:35.000
<v Speaker 1>almost work from the USGA, because they know how it is.

0:16:35.160 --> 0:16:37.960
<v Speaker 1>They you know, they've come here so many times that

0:16:38.600 --> 0:16:41.560
<v Speaker 1>it's like, you know, they do this, and they do this,

0:16:41.800 --> 0:16:44.040
<v Speaker 1>and then they're kind of set and ready to go.

0:16:45.720 --> 0:16:49.000
<v Speaker 1>What what are your kind of general thoughts with how

0:16:49.040 --> 0:16:50.720
<v Speaker 1>they present the course for this week.

0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:57.680
<v Speaker 2>So they have obviously brought in the mowing lines a lot,

0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:00.320
<v Speaker 2>you know, that's the main difference that you'll see see

0:17:00.360 --> 0:17:05.320
<v Speaker 2>between how pebble beach is presented normally during the pro

0:17:05.440 --> 0:17:08.880
<v Speaker 2>am and how pebble beach is presenting during the during

0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:13.600
<v Speaker 2>the US Open. And so it's a couple of the

0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:17.080
<v Speaker 2>holes look a little awkward as a result, and you'll

0:17:17.119 --> 0:17:20.639
<v Speaker 2>see bunkers kind of lost in the rough. You'll see

0:17:22.000 --> 0:17:28.159
<v Speaker 2>holes that just seem like they should be wider, using

0:17:28.240 --> 0:17:31.520
<v Speaker 2>rough as a as a penalty. And so that's the

0:17:31.960 --> 0:17:35.879
<v Speaker 2>main setup move that I've seen out there. It was

0:17:36.200 --> 0:17:38.480
<v Speaker 2>just like this during the pro am, right, So they

0:17:38.600 --> 0:17:41.760
<v Speaker 2>they the USGA came in and started doing its work

0:17:41.880 --> 0:17:44.199
<v Speaker 2>a while ago. I believe we saw it during the

0:17:44.280 --> 0:17:45.720
<v Speaker 2>US Amateur like this as well.

0:17:45.800 --> 0:17:48.120
<v Speaker 1>Right, that's when, right when they had started, you could

0:17:48.119 --> 0:17:51.600
<v Speaker 1>start to see where they were, yeah, narrowing up, like specifically,

0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:55.320
<v Speaker 1>I remember eleven, which I think that's that's like one

0:17:55.320 --> 0:17:58.680
<v Speaker 1>of the downfalls of it is like I think eleven

0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:01.720
<v Speaker 1>would be, especially with the modern game, the way it

0:18:01.840 --> 0:18:05.199
<v Speaker 1>is one of the most compelling holes. If the you know,

0:18:05.240 --> 0:18:07.679
<v Speaker 1>when people watch pebble this week, you can look at

0:18:07.720 --> 0:18:10.280
<v Speaker 1>eleven and you can say, wow, that fairway should be

0:18:10.400 --> 0:18:14.680
<v Speaker 1>double the size at least maybe maybe two and a

0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:17.520
<v Speaker 1>half times the size. And you look at this and

0:18:17.560 --> 0:18:19.960
<v Speaker 1>it's a you know, it's kind of one of those

0:18:20.000 --> 0:18:23.879
<v Speaker 1>three those shortish par fource, which it's not a short

0:18:23.960 --> 0:18:26.800
<v Speaker 1>par force, not driveable, but it's one of those driving

0:18:26.880 --> 0:18:31.239
<v Speaker 1>pitch holes that have become really fascinating. And you know,

0:18:32.160 --> 0:18:34.480
<v Speaker 1>I think, like what's going to happen is people just

0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:38.320
<v Speaker 1>are going to hit iron up the left and you

0:18:38.320 --> 0:18:41.720
<v Speaker 1>know then or you know, fairway would up the left,

0:18:42.119 --> 0:18:44.440
<v Speaker 1>and that's that everybody's going to do the same thing.

0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:48.879
<v Speaker 1>Whereas that green, the way it sits, the angle of

0:18:48.920 --> 0:18:53.520
<v Speaker 1>it and the slopes of it, you have an opportunity

0:18:53.640 --> 0:18:56.520
<v Speaker 1>where driver up the right would leave you a really

0:18:56.560 --> 0:18:59.760
<v Speaker 1>weird shot. But people might pull driver to try and

0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:03.120
<v Speaker 1>get that you know, fifty yards shot because the mentality

0:19:03.119 --> 0:19:06.639
<v Speaker 1>of pros has been banged into their head. Get closer

0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:09.760
<v Speaker 1>whenever you can, and that would be that's like one

0:19:09.800 --> 0:19:14.320
<v Speaker 1>of those holes where it has the counterintuitive ability to

0:19:14.480 --> 0:19:17.520
<v Speaker 1>challenge somebody that that does the status quo.

0:19:17.800 --> 0:19:21.400
<v Speaker 2>Right. Yeah, So eleven, just to just to describe it, obviously,

0:19:21.440 --> 0:19:24.800
<v Speaker 2>it's a hole that plays uphill. It's about three hundred

0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:29.720
<v Speaker 2>and ninety yards. The green receives shots best from the left.

0:19:30.760 --> 0:19:34.440
<v Speaker 2>There's the green is angled that way, it runs uphill

0:19:34.520 --> 0:19:37.800
<v Speaker 2>that way, and there's a bunker up hill very much. So, yeah,

0:19:37.840 --> 0:19:41.399
<v Speaker 2>so it's a very small grain. I believe the small right.

0:19:41.280 --> 0:19:44.360
<v Speaker 1>To left right over that that's bunker. So if you're

0:19:44.400 --> 0:19:47.080
<v Speaker 1>over on the right, which is now, like you know,

0:19:47.560 --> 0:19:49.920
<v Speaker 1>from where the right edge of the faraway is, there

0:19:49.920 --> 0:19:52.439
<v Speaker 1>should be forty more yards of fairaway exactly, but like

0:19:52.480 --> 0:19:54.720
<v Speaker 1>nobody's going to be over there, and that's where you

0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:59.040
<v Speaker 1>have this really weird shot with the green running away right.

0:19:59.240 --> 0:20:01.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, so the thing that has happened in the setup

0:20:02.119 --> 0:20:05.480
<v Speaker 2>is that they've moved the fairway over to the left,

0:20:05.600 --> 0:20:08.760
<v Speaker 2>as you've suggested right there. So they they've moved it

0:20:08.880 --> 0:20:12.440
<v Speaker 2>to the good angle into the green. Right now, you

0:20:12.600 --> 0:20:13.760
<v Speaker 2>don't really have a choice.

0:20:13.840 --> 0:20:18.600
<v Speaker 1>You have to play a whole They hit it right correct, right.

0:20:18.560 --> 0:20:21.600
<v Speaker 2>Lights here you go. Yeah, and for the twenty ten

0:20:21.720 --> 0:20:24.800
<v Speaker 2>US open, I believe that they did the opposite. They

0:20:24.840 --> 0:20:27.439
<v Speaker 2>moved it over to the right, which is which is

0:20:27.520 --> 0:20:30.760
<v Speaker 2>just sort of subistic. Yeah, exactly, I would. I would.

0:20:31.000 --> 0:20:33.480
<v Speaker 2>You could argue that that's worse, and so maybe it's

0:20:33.480 --> 0:20:35.160
<v Speaker 2>a good move that if they were going to narrow

0:20:35.240 --> 0:20:37.840
<v Speaker 2>that fairway by half that they move it over the

0:20:37.840 --> 0:20:39.919
<v Speaker 2>other direction. But it's a good example of how the

0:20:39.960 --> 0:20:43.280
<v Speaker 2>course becomes slightly less interesting. You know, the eleventh hole

0:20:43.480 --> 0:20:46.359
<v Speaker 2>is not necessarily the most brilliant hole in the world,

0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:49.360
<v Speaker 2>even as it is, but the width of that fairway

0:20:49.440 --> 0:20:51.840
<v Speaker 2>and the way that the green receives from a particular

0:20:51.920 --> 0:20:56.440
<v Speaker 2>angle does introduce at least some sense of lateral strategy.

0:20:56.760 --> 0:20:59.040
<v Speaker 1>See. That's the thing though I think about it, is

0:20:59.080 --> 0:21:04.359
<v Speaker 1>like that's a that hole. And this is something about

0:21:04.400 --> 0:21:06.800
<v Speaker 1>golf courses, like you know, you just get done with

0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:13.000
<v Speaker 1>a six hole stretcher, eight hole stretch on the ocean. Yeah,

0:21:13.040 --> 0:21:16.520
<v Speaker 1>really nine if you count three. So you just go

0:21:16.600 --> 0:21:19.880
<v Speaker 1>through like probably the most brilliant stretching golf and everybody

0:21:19.880 --> 0:21:22.000
<v Speaker 1>will bag on that hole, but I think it's a

0:21:22.000 --> 0:21:25.320
<v Speaker 1>brilliant hole. It plays uphill, it gets it's a connector hole,

0:21:26.119 --> 0:21:29.320
<v Speaker 1>but it's got like you know, you just played like

0:21:29.600 --> 0:21:31.640
<v Speaker 1>you know, you just had you know, if you wanted

0:21:31.640 --> 0:21:33.679
<v Speaker 1>to compare it to a song, you just had Jimmy

0:21:33.760 --> 0:21:37.600
<v Speaker 1>Hendrix wailing away on the guitar for like, you know,

0:21:37.760 --> 0:21:42.680
<v Speaker 1>three minutes and it's time to just you know, bridge

0:21:42.680 --> 0:21:46.040
<v Speaker 1>something to our next, our next interval, and it provides

0:21:46.119 --> 0:21:49.800
<v Speaker 1>like a really different hole than what you've seen the

0:21:49.880 --> 0:21:53.240
<v Speaker 1>last you know six, where you're playing up a hill,

0:21:53.640 --> 0:21:57.159
<v Speaker 1>you're you know, and you feel like you can get

0:21:57.240 --> 0:22:01.800
<v Speaker 1>one after eight, nine, ten, which is among the hardest

0:22:02.280 --> 0:22:04.880
<v Speaker 1>you know, three hole stretches in golf.

0:22:04.840 --> 0:22:08.679
<v Speaker 2>Right, yeah, And so it's gettable, but you can also

0:22:09.080 --> 0:22:11.080
<v Speaker 2>have a hard time on that hole. Don't you think

0:22:11.119 --> 0:22:13.760
<v Speaker 2>it would be would it be more interesting or would

0:22:13.760 --> 0:22:16.800
<v Speaker 2>it be just cliched if there were something actually guarding

0:22:16.840 --> 0:22:19.840
<v Speaker 2>the left side of that hole? So is to make

0:22:19.880 --> 0:22:23.960
<v Speaker 2>the play over to the left less attractive because there's

0:22:24.000 --> 0:22:25.720
<v Speaker 2>currently no reason not to go there.

0:22:25.880 --> 0:22:28.119
<v Speaker 1>Right to me, it seems like so there's there's like

0:22:28.200 --> 0:22:31.359
<v Speaker 1>seventy yards about of width that you could have.

0:22:31.320 --> 0:22:33.360
<v Speaker 2>Right, yes, yeah, it's huge.

0:22:33.640 --> 0:22:35.720
<v Speaker 1>So for maybe sense like that would be like a

0:22:35.720 --> 0:22:39.720
<v Speaker 1>great place for a center line bunker that skews left.

0:22:39.840 --> 0:22:42.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, right, that's that's what I can And this is

0:22:42.320 --> 0:22:45.240
<v Speaker 2>a great example of the Pebble Beach discussion that a

0:22:45.280 --> 0:22:49.840
<v Speaker 2>lot of people interested in golf course architecture have. It's

0:22:49.840 --> 0:22:53.760
<v Speaker 2>a great course, like to be clear, Pebble Beach is amazing,

0:22:54.440 --> 0:22:57.680
<v Speaker 2>but there's this impulse that I have, and I try

0:22:57.720 --> 0:23:00.600
<v Speaker 2>to fight against it a little bit, not to nitpick

0:23:00.720 --> 0:23:03.640
<v Speaker 2>everything that I think is wrong with the course because

0:23:03.680 --> 0:23:06.679
<v Speaker 2>it's so brilliant and because it's in such a great setting,

0:23:08.200 --> 0:23:12.199
<v Speaker 2>and because it also falls short in its presentation in

0:23:12.240 --> 0:23:15.600
<v Speaker 2>a lot of ways. You at least I have this

0:23:15.760 --> 0:23:19.880
<v Speaker 2>tendency to go around thinking about what could be and

0:23:19.920 --> 0:23:24.800
<v Speaker 2>to ignore what's actually there. The eleventh is a good example,

0:23:24.840 --> 0:23:26.840
<v Speaker 2>because I just said a couple of minutes ago, I

0:23:26.880 --> 0:23:30.679
<v Speaker 2>don't think it's that brilliant of a hole, and maybe

0:23:30.720 --> 0:23:33.320
<v Speaker 2>it's not fully what it could be, but it's a

0:23:33.320 --> 0:23:36.240
<v Speaker 2>good hole, yeah, well placed in the.

0:23:36.280 --> 0:23:38.680
<v Speaker 1>Round, yeah. Like and for the land that it goes,

0:23:39.000 --> 0:23:41.680
<v Speaker 1>you know, probably it jounts across some of the least

0:23:41.680 --> 0:23:45.359
<v Speaker 1>interesting land on the golf course, and it's very you know, simple.

0:23:45.400 --> 0:23:48.000
<v Speaker 1>It's like, you know, two would be an example of

0:23:48.240 --> 0:23:50.240
<v Speaker 1>some of the least interesting land on the golf course.

0:23:50.240 --> 0:23:52.119
<v Speaker 1>And they have one of the boldest you know, they

0:23:52.160 --> 0:23:54.160
<v Speaker 1>have some of the boldest stuff there with that, surely

0:23:54.480 --> 0:23:58.160
<v Speaker 1>Sahara Bunker And what do you what do you think

0:23:58.200 --> 0:24:01.000
<v Speaker 1>about in general? So like a lot of people will

0:24:01.040 --> 0:24:03.040
<v Speaker 1>be like, oh, the inland holes aren't that great?

0:24:04.320 --> 0:24:09.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Well, I think that just saying in a blanket

0:24:09.680 --> 0:24:13.520
<v Speaker 2>way the inland holes aren't great is an impoverished take

0:24:14.240 --> 0:24:18.639
<v Speaker 2>like that that's not If you play those holes, you

0:24:18.680 --> 0:24:21.920
<v Speaker 2>see that at least some of them are obviously really good.

0:24:23.040 --> 0:24:25.359
<v Speaker 2>Some of my favorites would be three. I mean, if

0:24:25.359 --> 0:24:28.080
<v Speaker 2>we're considering that an inland hole, but that's a really

0:24:28.080 --> 0:24:33.200
<v Speaker 2>good hole. Thirteen is one of my favorites uphill par

0:24:33.359 --> 0:24:37.680
<v Speaker 2>four with you know, a fair way and a green

0:24:37.760 --> 0:24:40.679
<v Speaker 2>that used the slopes of the land in really good ways.

0:24:41.400 --> 0:24:45.240
<v Speaker 2>Sixteen is a fun hole to play. You know, there

0:24:45.280 --> 0:24:48.280
<v Speaker 2>are a lot of interesting inland holes that if you

0:24:48.400 --> 0:24:50.600
<v Speaker 2>just take them for what they are and don't try

0:24:50.600 --> 0:24:55.600
<v Speaker 2>to compare them to what's on the cliffs, are great holes.

0:24:56.240 --> 0:24:58.120
<v Speaker 2>At the same time, I do think that there are

0:24:58.119 --> 0:25:01.960
<v Speaker 2>some weak inland holes right now and some just okay ones,

0:25:02.640 --> 0:25:07.560
<v Speaker 2>and maybe that's a little bit disappointing, but it also

0:25:07.720 --> 0:25:10.520
<v Speaker 2>serves as a contrast for what's out on the cliffs.

0:25:11.400 --> 0:25:13.760
<v Speaker 2>So I don't think twelve is a great hole. I

0:25:13.800 --> 0:25:17.120
<v Speaker 2>don't think fifteen is a great hole. In fact, fifteen

0:25:18.040 --> 0:25:20.600
<v Speaker 2>really could use some work right now.

0:25:20.840 --> 0:25:23.560
<v Speaker 1>But they've got a couple of pop bunkers out there.

0:25:23.560 --> 0:25:26.280
<v Speaker 1>That just like it's like, what where, where did this

0:25:26.359 --> 0:25:26.879
<v Speaker 1>come from?

0:25:27.160 --> 0:25:34.760
<v Speaker 2>Arnold Palmer believe, I think is more of a rhetorical question.

0:25:34.920 --> 0:25:37.399
<v Speaker 1>But you know, I'm glad that you gave any the

0:25:37.480 --> 0:25:41.760
<v Speaker 1>exact answer. But like you know, they just pop up

0:25:41.760 --> 0:25:44.600
<v Speaker 1>and you're like, wait, this doesn't really fit here. It

0:25:44.640 --> 0:25:48.120
<v Speaker 1>doesn't fit the style. It's like the stylistic and that's

0:25:48.160 --> 0:25:51.000
<v Speaker 1>like the one of the crazy things to me is

0:25:51.000 --> 0:25:54.800
<v Speaker 1>that of you know, a place like this should have,

0:25:55.720 --> 0:25:58.159
<v Speaker 1>if anything, it should have eye candy. It should be

0:25:58.240 --> 0:26:01.439
<v Speaker 1>like the most eye candy spot in the world, right

0:26:01.680 --> 0:26:06.640
<v Speaker 1>But from a from a golf architecture standpoint, it couldn't

0:26:06.680 --> 0:26:10.400
<v Speaker 1>be further from eye candy. It's like I I source

0:26:10.680 --> 0:26:15.800
<v Speaker 1>all the way around with like there's mismatched bunkers, there's

0:26:16.040 --> 0:26:17.120
<v Speaker 1>you know, it's.

0:26:17.000 --> 0:26:20.080
<v Speaker 2>Just a field of bunkers out there, and those all

0:26:20.119 --> 0:26:24.639
<v Speaker 2>appeared in the first decade of the two thousands. In

0:26:24.720 --> 0:26:27.480
<v Speaker 2>the first decade of the twenty first century, that whole

0:26:27.920 --> 0:26:32.800
<v Speaker 2>used to have very minimalistic bunkering. In fact, it didn't

0:26:32.800 --> 0:26:35.919
<v Speaker 2>really have any fairway bunkers. There was maybe one about

0:26:35.960 --> 0:26:37.720
<v Speaker 2>thirty yards short of the green and a couple of

0:26:37.800 --> 0:26:43.640
<v Speaker 2>green side but of course Pebble Beach started getting anxious

0:26:43.920 --> 0:26:46.960
<v Speaker 2>about how it was being played by the pros by

0:26:46.960 --> 0:26:51.160
<v Speaker 2>one pro by one pro in particular, crazy thing one

0:26:51.240 --> 0:26:56.400
<v Speaker 2>pro Yeah, yeah, initials t W Yeah. It's the way

0:26:56.440 --> 0:27:01.359
<v Speaker 2>that he was playing the course freaked him out, and

0:27:02.000 --> 0:27:04.800
<v Speaker 2>all of a sudden, all these bunkers appeared. The reaction

0:27:05.040 --> 0:27:09.080
<v Speaker 2>was to add bunkers rather than add length, because there's

0:27:09.119 --> 0:27:12.159
<v Speaker 2>not much more length to be added out there. A

0:27:12.200 --> 0:27:16.080
<v Speaker 2>lot of bunkers appeared in the first decade of the

0:27:16.080 --> 0:27:20.320
<v Speaker 2>two thousands, and not just on that hole, but other holes.

0:27:20.400 --> 0:27:22.920
<v Speaker 2>If you just look at the Google Earth historical imagery,

0:27:22.920 --> 0:27:28.399
<v Speaker 2>you'll see the response to the distance explosion and to Tiger.

0:27:29.800 --> 0:27:33.480
<v Speaker 1>It's interesting because I think it kind of changed the

0:27:33.520 --> 0:27:37.119
<v Speaker 1>ethos of the course in the sense of like it

0:27:37.160 --> 0:27:42.680
<v Speaker 1>went from a course that was challenging in a very

0:27:42.720 --> 0:27:48.640
<v Speaker 1>subtle and nuanced form, where the challenge came from these

0:27:48.680 --> 0:27:53.560
<v Speaker 1>small greens. That those small greens really freak out really

0:27:53.600 --> 0:27:56.720
<v Speaker 1>good players more so than the average player, because the

0:27:56.760 --> 0:28:00.840
<v Speaker 1>average players only going to hit a handful means every round,

0:28:01.359 --> 0:28:04.520
<v Speaker 1>and then you throw in uneven lives, which a lot

0:28:04.560 --> 0:28:07.760
<v Speaker 1>of times, you know, if I'm playing with a twenty handicap.

0:28:07.800 --> 0:28:10.240
<v Speaker 1>I'll be like, hey, you know you chunk that because

0:28:10.280 --> 0:28:12.720
<v Speaker 1>the ball was like three inches above your feet, so

0:28:12.760 --> 0:28:15.600
<v Speaker 1>you should just joke up, you know, because the club

0:28:15.680 --> 0:28:17.320
<v Speaker 1>was way too long, And they're like, oh, I didn't

0:28:17.359 --> 0:28:20.440
<v Speaker 1>even realize that, And like I think about it because

0:28:20.480 --> 0:28:22.520
<v Speaker 1>like if I have a wedge from from like a

0:28:23.160 --> 0:28:25.359
<v Speaker 1>side hill lie with the three inches above, I'm like

0:28:25.440 --> 0:28:28.720
<v Speaker 1>freaking out. I'm like thinking, like how far right am

0:28:28.720 --> 0:28:31.199
<v Speaker 1>I aiming? Because the ball goes way left off this

0:28:31.359 --> 0:28:33.800
<v Speaker 1>lie with a high lofted club, you know. And this

0:28:33.960 --> 0:28:36.639
<v Speaker 1>is like the type of challenge that pebble presents is

0:28:36.720 --> 0:28:38.880
<v Speaker 1>you never have a flat lie and you're hitting into

0:28:38.920 --> 0:28:44.800
<v Speaker 1>these little tiny targets, and by by narrowing and adding bunkers,

0:28:45.200 --> 0:28:48.680
<v Speaker 1>it just removes some of the thought from it because

0:28:48.720 --> 0:28:51.960
<v Speaker 1>it just started to become more of a uniform. This

0:28:52.080 --> 0:28:54.240
<v Speaker 1>is hit it here, hit it here, hit it here,

0:28:54.880 --> 0:28:56.280
<v Speaker 1>test right.

0:28:56.800 --> 0:28:59.960
<v Speaker 2>I think that's true. And covering some of the fit

0:29:00.000 --> 0:29:03.480
<v Speaker 2>faway and rough covers up some of the most severe

0:29:03.600 --> 0:29:05.840
<v Speaker 2>lies that you might have in the fairway.

0:29:06.280 --> 0:29:07.280
<v Speaker 1>That's a great point.

0:29:08.640 --> 0:29:12.840
<v Speaker 2>Adding bunkers in addition to that, on both sides of

0:29:12.840 --> 0:29:18.000
<v Speaker 2>the green and both sides of the fairways removes some

0:29:18.040 --> 0:29:20.760
<v Speaker 2>of the places where you might play your ball and

0:29:20.800 --> 0:29:24.360
<v Speaker 2>get in trouble. You know, a common move in the

0:29:24.400 --> 0:29:26.680
<v Speaker 2>first decade of the twenty first century at Pebble Beach

0:29:27.040 --> 0:29:30.200
<v Speaker 2>was to add a bunker on the other side of

0:29:30.240 --> 0:29:32.240
<v Speaker 2>the green, or add a bunker on the other side

0:29:32.280 --> 0:29:35.080
<v Speaker 2>of the fairway when there was already a bunker just

0:29:35.120 --> 0:29:37.680
<v Speaker 2>on one side of the fairway. At a lot of

0:29:37.920 --> 0:29:40.080
<v Speaker 2>holes at Pebble Beach, there would be that bunker on

0:29:40.160 --> 0:29:43.560
<v Speaker 2>one side of the fairway and a bunker on one

0:29:43.600 --> 0:29:47.000
<v Speaker 2>side of the green. That would dictate the strategy of

0:29:47.000 --> 0:29:49.800
<v Speaker 2>the hole. You know, play close to the bunkers and

0:29:50.240 --> 0:29:54.120
<v Speaker 2>you'll have better angles. By adding bunkers on both sides.

0:29:55.600 --> 0:29:59.480
<v Speaker 2>Your vision is directed at the middle of the fairway.

0:30:00.000 --> 0:30:01.880
<v Speaker 2>A lot of the times you're not trying to play

0:30:01.920 --> 0:30:03.680
<v Speaker 2>to the edges so much. And when you don't play

0:30:03.760 --> 0:30:07.640
<v Speaker 2>to the edges, you're not getting some of those crazy

0:30:07.880 --> 0:30:10.480
<v Speaker 2>bad angles that you might have found previously.

0:30:11.160 --> 0:30:14.920
<v Speaker 1>It's something that it like narrows your focus. Like it's like,

0:30:15.480 --> 0:30:18.680
<v Speaker 1>you know, I think one of the things that and

0:30:19.040 --> 0:30:21.200
<v Speaker 1>you see it when you play say a Tom Doak

0:30:21.320 --> 0:30:25.240
<v Speaker 1>or like a Billcourr course, and I remember you know,

0:30:25.280 --> 0:30:29.080
<v Speaker 1>it's like when you leave, when they leave a side

0:30:29.120 --> 0:30:33.600
<v Speaker 1>of the green open your view, your eye gets drawn

0:30:33.680 --> 0:30:39.120
<v Speaker 1>there because really good golfers think about where they can miss,

0:30:39.720 --> 0:30:42.440
<v Speaker 1>and if you have less places you can miss, it

0:30:42.560 --> 0:30:46.160
<v Speaker 1>narrows your focus in a way, if that makes sense totally.

0:30:46.240 --> 0:30:49.440
<v Speaker 2>And a good example is the fourth hole, Yeah, Kevin

0:30:49.440 --> 0:30:53.560
<v Speaker 2>Moore has talked about this on Twitter, where that fairway

0:30:53.640 --> 0:30:56.960
<v Speaker 2>is normally very wide. It extends out to the left

0:30:57.080 --> 0:31:01.880
<v Speaker 2>away from the cliffs, and when the fairway is that wide,

0:31:02.440 --> 0:31:05.880
<v Speaker 2>you're thinking, maybe I should go left here, Maybe I

0:31:05.880 --> 0:31:09.120
<v Speaker 2>should play an iron toward that bunker out to the

0:31:09.200 --> 0:31:12.400
<v Speaker 2>left instead of risking the cliffs and on that whole,

0:31:12.520 --> 0:31:14.640
<v Speaker 2>I don't think that's that good of a play. I

0:31:14.640 --> 0:31:16.960
<v Speaker 2>think you should probably just hit it up the gut

0:31:17.960 --> 0:31:20.120
<v Speaker 2>and let the slope of the fairway take your ball

0:31:20.160 --> 0:31:22.960
<v Speaker 2>a little bit to the right. And it's really not

0:31:23.160 --> 0:31:25.040
<v Speaker 2>that risky of a shot. You'd have to hit a

0:31:25.080 --> 0:31:28.480
<v Speaker 2>really bad shot to end up on the beach. So

0:31:28.640 --> 0:31:31.800
<v Speaker 2>when they take that left portion of the fairway away,

0:31:32.240 --> 0:31:36.360
<v Speaker 2>you're just thinking, that's my option. I better just put

0:31:36.360 --> 0:31:39.320
<v Speaker 2>it up that part of the fairway. I don't have

0:31:39.360 --> 0:31:42.080
<v Speaker 2>the option to play left and so now everybody's going

0:31:42.160 --> 0:31:46.360
<v Speaker 2>to be approaching the hole in what's probably the strategically

0:31:46.440 --> 0:31:48.000
<v Speaker 2>or the tactically correct.

0:31:47.720 --> 0:31:53.880
<v Speaker 1>Way, and its homogenizes the product of the golf.

0:31:54.080 --> 0:31:59.000
<v Speaker 2>I agree with that at the same time, so we're

0:31:59.040 --> 0:32:01.360
<v Speaker 2>saying all these things that could be better, So we've fallen.

0:32:01.160 --> 0:32:02.680
<v Speaker 1>Into the track exactly. I know.

0:32:03.080 --> 0:32:04.880
<v Speaker 2>I know that. I know that. So I want to

0:32:04.920 --> 0:32:07.520
<v Speaker 2>ask you. I know that the take that Pebble Beach

0:32:07.680 --> 0:32:10.120
<v Speaker 2>is overrated annoys.

0:32:09.640 --> 0:32:14.200
<v Speaker 1>You a little bit, right, yeah, it does, so expand

0:32:14.240 --> 0:32:16.280
<v Speaker 1>on that a little bit. Well, I think it's in

0:32:16.360 --> 0:32:21.280
<v Speaker 1>terms of when I think about overrated golf, Like, you know,

0:32:21.280 --> 0:32:24.080
<v Speaker 1>I don't think Pebble Beach falls into the category of

0:32:24.440 --> 0:32:27.600
<v Speaker 1>necessarily overrated. Maybe it's a little high for where it

0:32:27.640 --> 0:32:30.360
<v Speaker 1>should be in the rankings, right, I guess that's in

0:32:30.480 --> 0:32:34.480
<v Speaker 1>terms overrated. But that's with we're talking about rankings, you know,

0:32:34.720 --> 0:32:37.360
<v Speaker 1>like and that's talking about rankings, which is like, you know,

0:32:37.400 --> 0:32:39.280
<v Speaker 1>the worst thing to be talking about, because like I

0:32:39.280 --> 0:32:42.640
<v Speaker 1>think it's just completely trivial to rank. Of course, it's like, oh,

0:32:42.720 --> 0:32:45.120
<v Speaker 1>you know, well, like my ranking is going to change

0:32:45.200 --> 0:32:47.800
<v Speaker 1>every day of the week. Like if you ask me tomorrow,

0:32:47.880 --> 0:32:51.760
<v Speaker 1>like I'll have a different favorite course in Chicago, you know,

0:32:52.000 --> 0:32:53.600
<v Speaker 1>and then you ask me the next day, I might

0:32:53.640 --> 0:32:55.680
<v Speaker 1>go with somebody else. It just depends on what mood.

0:32:56.040 --> 0:33:01.080
<v Speaker 1>But anyways, like with Pebble, Like I mean, it's it's unbelievable.

0:33:01.440 --> 0:33:04.240
<v Speaker 1>It's a it's an unbelievable golf course with an unbelieving

0:33:04.280 --> 0:33:07.520
<v Speaker 1>like the the assets the golf course has, which we've

0:33:07.520 --> 0:33:11.720
<v Speaker 1>already touched on, like the incredible land movement and the

0:33:11.800 --> 0:33:15.280
<v Speaker 1>routing the way it uses it, you know that and

0:33:15.640 --> 0:33:20.000
<v Speaker 1>the greens you know, are diabolical, like the golf course

0:33:20.120 --> 0:33:22.640
<v Speaker 1>at its core. And and this is maybe part of

0:33:22.800 --> 0:33:25.600
<v Speaker 1>why I think this way, is that I'm always a dreamer.

0:33:25.760 --> 0:33:29.600
<v Speaker 1>I like I dream and I think past like I'm

0:33:29.640 --> 0:33:31.800
<v Speaker 1>able to be like, well, they can just scrooce that up,

0:33:31.840 --> 0:33:34.160
<v Speaker 1>They'll fix that. And I think about what a golf

0:33:34.200 --> 0:33:36.400
<v Speaker 1>course could be a lot of times rather than what

0:33:36.480 --> 0:33:39.560
<v Speaker 1>it is in this current state. But but Pebble Beach

0:33:39.760 --> 0:33:42.680
<v Speaker 1>is a just I think, like a masterclass in like

0:33:43.200 --> 0:33:48.560
<v Speaker 1>the why you know, the inability to move dirt has

0:33:49.160 --> 0:33:52.480
<v Speaker 1>yielded the best you know, the inability to move dirt

0:33:52.520 --> 0:33:56.480
<v Speaker 1>at a massive scale yielded the best golf courses because

0:33:56.560 --> 0:33:58.920
<v Speaker 1>the lay of the land like and so many had

0:33:58.920 --> 0:34:03.880
<v Speaker 1>Pebble Beach gotten built fifty years later like one of

0:34:03.880 --> 0:34:06.840
<v Speaker 1>its neighbors, we would see a lot of flat fairways,

0:34:06.880 --> 0:34:09.680
<v Speaker 1>like we would see this incredible topography on these sand

0:34:09.760 --> 0:34:13.240
<v Speaker 1>dunes flattened now, Like there are a lot of things

0:34:13.280 --> 0:34:15.960
<v Speaker 1>that they could do. And but like at the end

0:34:16.000 --> 0:34:18.160
<v Speaker 1>of the day, like the I always think back to

0:34:18.200 --> 0:34:20.520
<v Speaker 1>the business side of it. It's like they are jammed

0:34:20.520 --> 0:34:23.640
<v Speaker 1>and filled every every day regardless of what they do,

0:34:23.680 --> 0:34:24.440
<v Speaker 1>which is crazy.

0:34:24.600 --> 0:34:25.760
<v Speaker 2>Why would they change anything?

0:34:26.080 --> 0:34:28.239
<v Speaker 1>Like what so like why would you change if this

0:34:28.400 --> 0:34:32.279
<v Speaker 1>is that that being said? Like why you know, my

0:34:32.360 --> 0:34:34.520
<v Speaker 1>pitch to him to change would be like listen, like

0:34:35.360 --> 0:34:38.600
<v Speaker 1>your golf course, the architecture, the look of it doesn't

0:34:38.640 --> 0:34:42.000
<v Speaker 1>fit the vibe of what you're trying to do, like

0:34:42.320 --> 0:34:45.879
<v Speaker 1>you know, like anybody that has an eye for golf architecture.

0:34:46.480 --> 0:34:48.319
<v Speaker 1>I mean it would be like if you put like

0:34:48.360 --> 0:34:51.800
<v Speaker 1>a nineteen seventies you know, if you replace the lodge

0:34:51.800 --> 0:34:55.880
<v Speaker 1>with like nineteen seventies like you know, architecture, you know,

0:34:55.920 --> 0:35:00.520
<v Speaker 1>cookie cutter architecture. You know, if you put that building there,

0:35:00.680 --> 0:35:02.400
<v Speaker 1>like and maybe that's the way you would have to

0:35:02.400 --> 0:35:07.120
<v Speaker 1>pitch them is that superimposed, you know, nineteen seventies, designed

0:35:07.239 --> 0:35:11.200
<v Speaker 1>like urban building in the lodge's position, and say this

0:35:11.280 --> 0:35:13.480
<v Speaker 1>is what your golf course is. To anybody that has

0:35:13.520 --> 0:35:16.200
<v Speaker 1>a clue about golf course architecture, you know, this is

0:35:16.280 --> 0:35:20.720
<v Speaker 1>the way it's being presented, but from like the idea

0:35:20.760 --> 0:35:24.799
<v Speaker 1>of the of the golf course, the decisions, the way

0:35:24.840 --> 0:35:28.759
<v Speaker 1>it makes golfers feel. And the one thing I will

0:35:28.800 --> 0:35:32.200
<v Speaker 1>say is I played in this I played in this

0:35:32.280 --> 0:35:36.880
<v Speaker 1>event this spring with a group of skill level players

0:35:37.719 --> 0:35:42.080
<v Speaker 1>and we played all three resort courses, Spanish Bay, Spyglass,

0:35:42.320 --> 0:35:46.320
<v Speaker 1>and Pebble. We had a fifteen handicap in the group.

0:35:46.600 --> 0:35:50.880
<v Speaker 1>And the place that the fifteen handicap had clearly the

0:35:50.920 --> 0:35:55.320
<v Speaker 1>best chance and clearly like played the best, you know,

0:35:55.800 --> 0:35:59.239
<v Speaker 1>was Pebble Beach. And I thought about it. I've thought

0:35:59.280 --> 0:36:01.560
<v Speaker 1>about it a ton. You know, there was the least

0:36:01.600 --> 0:36:04.520
<v Speaker 1>like obvious hazards out there. You know, he could run

0:36:04.560 --> 0:36:07.760
<v Speaker 1>the ball up onto greens, missing short, which is where

0:36:08.080 --> 0:36:11.520
<v Speaker 1>you know, a fifteen handicap misses more than long almost

0:36:11.640 --> 0:36:14.080
<v Speaker 1>never gets you in trouble, you know, like, and then

0:36:14.120 --> 0:36:16.120
<v Speaker 1>he could pitch up and make putts, and he gets

0:36:16.160 --> 0:36:18.799
<v Speaker 1>on the green, he could make putts and to me

0:36:19.000 --> 0:36:22.880
<v Speaker 1>that's something he played by far the best at Pebble

0:36:22.920 --> 0:36:26.120
<v Speaker 1>Beach and compared to the other two. And then you know,

0:36:26.160 --> 0:36:28.239
<v Speaker 1>we played Cypress the next day. He played really well

0:36:28.239 --> 0:36:32.439
<v Speaker 1>at Cypress, but at Spanish Bay he played very well

0:36:32.480 --> 0:36:35.839
<v Speaker 1>for a little stretch, but then like the wind picked

0:36:35.920 --> 0:36:38.520
<v Speaker 1>up and you could tell he had no hope. And

0:36:38.640 --> 0:36:41.480
<v Speaker 1>at Spyglass he had no hope all day. You know,

0:36:41.560 --> 0:36:43.560
<v Speaker 1>it was just beating him over the head with the

0:36:43.600 --> 0:36:45.960
<v Speaker 1>same you know, asking him to hit the ball further

0:36:46.040 --> 0:36:49.960
<v Speaker 1>than he could and higher and longer than he could

0:36:49.960 --> 0:36:54.040
<v Speaker 1>all day. And to me, that's the brilliant of Pebble

0:36:54.080 --> 0:36:58.040
<v Speaker 1>Beach because at Pebble Beach I was the most uncomfortable

0:36:58.160 --> 0:37:01.160
<v Speaker 1>I was at any of the courses because I was

0:37:01.560 --> 0:37:05.360
<v Speaker 1>always like fidgety about oh this lie, I don't really

0:37:05.440 --> 0:37:08.759
<v Speaker 1>like this webshot, like this just seems like and you

0:37:08.960 --> 0:37:11.080
<v Speaker 1>I just like you're thinking about all the places you

0:37:11.120 --> 0:37:13.719
<v Speaker 1>can miss it because of that lie, like you know,

0:37:13.760 --> 0:37:17.120
<v Speaker 1>you when you when you if you make it more simulation,

0:37:17.280 --> 0:37:21.040
<v Speaker 1>which is I think what we see. We can week

0:37:21.120 --> 0:37:24.040
<v Speaker 1>out on tour a lot, not necessarily like last week.

0:37:24.080 --> 0:37:26.360
<v Speaker 1>We were actually a good stretch of tour golf lately

0:37:26.640 --> 0:37:30.240
<v Speaker 1>like a sneaky good stretch between Colonial we had Byron,

0:37:30.640 --> 0:37:32.120
<v Speaker 1>we have Hamilton.

0:37:33.160 --> 0:37:34.120
<v Speaker 2>It's a good time of year.

0:37:34.280 --> 0:37:36.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, like we've had a good stretch. But like for

0:37:36.480 --> 0:37:39.439
<v Speaker 1>the most part, we see like if you just took

0:37:39.480 --> 0:37:41.080
<v Speaker 1>these guys from the range and put them on a

0:37:41.080 --> 0:37:44.279
<v Speaker 1>golf course, that's what we're seeing. And like Pebble Beach

0:37:44.360 --> 0:37:47.000
<v Speaker 1>is like the complete antithesis of that. Like if I

0:37:47.040 --> 0:37:49.160
<v Speaker 1>was getting ready for Pebble Beach, like I'd be hitting

0:37:49.200 --> 0:37:52.560
<v Speaker 1>a lot of sidehill lie shots, right and like getting

0:37:52.600 --> 0:37:54.719
<v Speaker 1>in Like that's like the complete opposite of what you

0:37:54.800 --> 0:37:55.960
<v Speaker 1>do on a driving range.

0:37:56.560 --> 0:37:59.279
<v Speaker 2>Yes, right, Well, if you're if you spend most of

0:37:59.320 --> 0:38:01.520
<v Speaker 2>your time on a drive range, you'll find yourself really

0:38:01.560 --> 0:38:04.719
<v Speaker 2>frustrated at Pebble Beach. And to return to your point

0:38:04.760 --> 0:38:08.280
<v Speaker 2>earlier about how if Pebble Beach were built fifty years later,

0:38:09.600 --> 0:38:13.040
<v Speaker 2>everything would be flattened. I think that's really true because

0:38:13.080 --> 0:38:16.600
<v Speaker 2>Pebble Beach is built on this slope, right, everything slopes

0:38:16.600 --> 0:38:20.120
<v Speaker 2>toward the ocean, and it's really consistent, and so probably

0:38:20.160 --> 0:38:23.200
<v Speaker 2>the thought of a modern architect would be, well, this

0:38:23.280 --> 0:38:27.480
<v Speaker 2>is not ideal. There's not much variety inherent in this

0:38:28.000 --> 0:38:32.560
<v Speaker 2>movement of the land. There might be some unfair lies

0:38:32.680 --> 0:38:35.560
<v Speaker 2>in the fairway. We better flatten at least a few

0:38:35.560 --> 0:38:39.240
<v Speaker 2>of these, and then the golf course would have suffered

0:38:39.280 --> 0:38:42.120
<v Speaker 2>as a result. But because they couldn't do that, in

0:38:42.239 --> 0:38:46.320
<v Speaker 2>nineteen nineteen, Jack Neville and Douglas Grant just found ways

0:38:46.400 --> 0:38:49.799
<v Speaker 2>to use that slope in many, many different ways. If

0:38:49.840 --> 0:38:52.640
<v Speaker 2>you go through the golf holes at Pebble Beach, you'll

0:38:52.640 --> 0:38:56.840
<v Speaker 2>see a pretty balanced variety of ball below your feet

0:38:56.920 --> 0:39:01.480
<v Speaker 2>lies and ball above your feet lies. You'll get just

0:39:01.560 --> 0:39:06.160
<v Speaker 2>about as many of one as the other. Some holes

0:39:06.200 --> 0:39:09.879
<v Speaker 2>go uphill, some holes go downhill, and.

0:39:09.760 --> 0:39:12.880
<v Speaker 1>That is kind of like that speaks to the brilliant,

0:39:12.960 --> 0:39:17.840
<v Speaker 1>the unseen brilliance of the inland holes in a way,

0:39:18.000 --> 0:39:22.840
<v Speaker 1>because they balance the the on the water holes that

0:39:23.040 --> 0:39:25.600
<v Speaker 1>mostly play in one direction with the left to right

0:39:25.640 --> 0:39:26.840
<v Speaker 1>ball below your feet.

0:39:26.600 --> 0:39:29.560
<v Speaker 2>Lies, Yeah, you have fade lies on or for a

0:39:29.640 --> 0:39:33.360
<v Speaker 2>right hand or you have fade lies on six, eight, nine,

0:39:33.400 --> 0:39:36.200
<v Speaker 2>and ten. And then when you go back the other direction,

0:39:36.239 --> 0:39:39.440
<v Speaker 2>it's playing across the slope in another direction, and you

0:39:39.520 --> 0:39:43.720
<v Speaker 2>have a lot of for a right hand or draw lies. Yeah,

0:39:43.800 --> 0:39:46.920
<v Speaker 2>it's balanced out there, and so the routing. You know,

0:39:47.560 --> 0:39:49.360
<v Speaker 2>the routing of Pebble Beach gets a lot of attention.

0:39:49.400 --> 0:39:52.080
<v Speaker 2>I think it's it's widely regarded as a great routing,

0:39:52.600 --> 0:39:55.000
<v Speaker 2>but it's thought of as a great routing primarily because

0:39:55.040 --> 0:39:57.279
<v Speaker 2>of how many holes it's able to get out on

0:39:57.320 --> 0:40:00.160
<v Speaker 2>the water. But that's not at all why it it's

0:40:00.160 --> 0:40:03.040
<v Speaker 2>a great routing. It's because of how the holes play

0:40:03.239 --> 0:40:07.880
<v Speaker 2>and how the slopes, the slope of the property is

0:40:07.880 --> 0:40:09.919
<v Speaker 2>incorporated into the strategy of the whole.

0:40:10.239 --> 0:40:14.040
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I think that that idea with the the movement

0:40:14.120 --> 0:40:18.759
<v Speaker 1>of the land is in the in the small targets

0:40:19.360 --> 0:40:23.040
<v Speaker 1>is prevalent at the majority of the golf courses that

0:40:23.080 --> 0:40:30.200
<v Speaker 1>we would consider the great championship golf courses in America. Right, So, Augusta,

0:40:30.760 --> 0:40:33.200
<v Speaker 1>Everybody's going to be like, oh, well, those greens are huge,

0:40:33.239 --> 0:40:35.799
<v Speaker 1>but the targets are tiny, Right, So you.

0:40:35.800 --> 0:40:37.600
<v Speaker 2>Have to hit the right section of the green.

0:40:37.560 --> 0:40:40.759
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, or else you're it's basically like chipping because it's

0:40:40.800 --> 0:40:44.759
<v Speaker 1>going to be very, very very difficult to Tupat Shinnecock,

0:40:45.040 --> 0:40:49.200
<v Speaker 1>the same thing. Tremendous land movement and the greens are big,

0:40:49.239 --> 0:40:51.480
<v Speaker 1>but the targets become smaller, and that not all the

0:40:51.520 --> 0:40:53.960
<v Speaker 1>greens out there are huge, but they're you know, like

0:40:54.160 --> 0:40:57.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, one is like you know you're hitting from

0:40:57.600 --> 0:40:59.920
<v Speaker 1>you know, pretty flat, and one's actually one of the flat.

0:41:00.120 --> 0:41:03.160
<v Speaker 1>But that's a tiny target. Ten you know, you've got

0:41:03.200 --> 0:41:09.680
<v Speaker 1>a a tremendous slope and then that that that green

0:41:09.800 --> 0:41:12.960
<v Speaker 1>just sits there and it's like a tiny little perch

0:41:13.160 --> 0:41:15.719
<v Speaker 1>that you're like, how do I hit it onto this tabletop?

0:41:16.960 --> 0:41:20.480
<v Speaker 1>But with with that, you know that land movement and

0:41:20.600 --> 0:41:25.400
<v Speaker 1>small targets and and what's amazing is like Shinnacock's one

0:41:25.400 --> 0:41:29.760
<v Speaker 1>of the most playable courses for ladies in the world,

0:41:30.719 --> 0:41:33.640
<v Speaker 1>and it's from the beginning one of the most difficult

0:41:33.680 --> 0:41:37.400
<v Speaker 1>golf courses you can put a professional male golfer out onto.

0:41:38.200 --> 0:41:40.640
<v Speaker 2>Right, these courses have stood the test of time, and

0:41:40.680 --> 0:41:43.359
<v Speaker 2>there's a reason why. And so there are a lot

0:41:43.360 --> 0:41:46.000
<v Speaker 2>of lessons that we can learn from Pebble Beach. And

0:41:46.160 --> 0:41:49.080
<v Speaker 2>I think that when you're watching the telecast this weekend,

0:41:49.920 --> 0:41:53.840
<v Speaker 2>what one thing to look at would be how the

0:41:53.880 --> 0:41:58.160
<v Speaker 2>players are addressing the ball, because it doesn't always register immediately.

0:41:58.400 --> 0:42:02.000
<v Speaker 2>You don't always notice that the b is way below

0:42:02.200 --> 0:42:05.560
<v Speaker 2>the feet of a player when you're just watching a telecast,

0:42:05.840 --> 0:42:07.280
<v Speaker 2>but I think you'll be able to tell.

0:42:07.680 --> 0:42:10.239
<v Speaker 1>I was just thinking about Pinehurst number two too. It

0:42:10.320 --> 0:42:13.400
<v Speaker 1>does the same thing where you have those tiny little

0:42:13.400 --> 0:42:17.360
<v Speaker 1>targets and the Santels of Carolina has a really nice

0:42:17.400 --> 0:42:20.120
<v Speaker 1>movement to it. So you're hit and you're rarely hitting

0:42:20.120 --> 0:42:23.200
<v Speaker 1>from that flat lie and you're hitting these small, tiny

0:42:23.280 --> 0:42:25.919
<v Speaker 1>targets and that's like and that's another course where people

0:42:25.960 --> 0:42:28.360
<v Speaker 1>are like, why is it, Why can't why can't more courses?

0:42:28.440 --> 0:42:31.360
<v Speaker 1>Why can't we have more championship courses like Pinehurst number

0:42:31.360 --> 0:42:33.319
<v Speaker 1>two And it's like, well, you have to have a

0:42:33.360 --> 0:42:36.799
<v Speaker 1>combination of really great land that people don't, you know,

0:42:36.880 --> 0:42:39.480
<v Speaker 1>try and fiddle with and make fair and then you

0:42:39.560 --> 0:42:42.879
<v Speaker 1>and then have greens that Now for a quick word

0:42:42.920 --> 0:42:46.440
<v Speaker 1>from our sponsors. Today's episode is powered by ted am

0:42:46.520 --> 0:42:49.280
<v Speaker 1>ror Trade. Whether on the course or in the market,

0:42:49.320 --> 0:42:51.080
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0:42:51.160 --> 0:42:54.000
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0:42:54.000 --> 0:42:56.279
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0:42:56.440 --> 0:42:59.279
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0:42:59.320 --> 0:43:02.080
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0:43:02.120 --> 0:43:04.440
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0:43:04.880 --> 0:43:09.840
<v Speaker 1>Member SIPC. Now back to Garrett Morrison. So why why

0:43:11.719 --> 0:43:14.400
<v Speaker 1>this is a bigger question is like why don't we

0:43:14.480 --> 0:43:16.200
<v Speaker 1>have more golf courses built like that?

0:43:18.800 --> 0:43:26.080
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. Well, the concern with fairness came came

0:43:26.160 --> 0:43:28.680
<v Speaker 2>in in a big way at the same time that

0:43:28.719 --> 0:43:31.799
<v Speaker 2>the ability to move a lot of land came in, right.

0:43:32.560 --> 0:43:36.000
<v Speaker 2>I guess that's it because when when you see these

0:43:36.560 --> 0:43:39.959
<v Speaker 2>fairways that are tilted extremely one direction or the other,

0:43:40.440 --> 0:43:41.960
<v Speaker 2>a lot of people will think, well, I hit it

0:43:41.960 --> 0:43:43.760
<v Speaker 2>in the middle of the fairway and it's not fair

0:43:43.840 --> 0:43:46.879
<v Speaker 2>that I've got the ball way above my feet. And

0:43:46.960 --> 0:43:49.440
<v Speaker 2>so maybe that's one reason. I don't know, do you

0:43:49.560 --> 0:43:51.560
<v Speaker 2>do you? Do you have any theories? Because there are

0:43:51.600 --> 0:43:55.799
<v Speaker 2>only a few of them, right, These big browny championship

0:43:55.840 --> 0:43:58.360
<v Speaker 2>golf courses that have existed for one hundred years and

0:43:58.560 --> 0:44:01.640
<v Speaker 2>somehow are just as challenge for the best players as

0:44:01.640 --> 0:44:03.279
<v Speaker 2>they were years ago.

0:44:03.440 --> 0:44:07.160
<v Speaker 1>I think maybe also not only just fair and I

0:44:07.280 --> 0:44:11.399
<v Speaker 1>bang on fair a lot, but also the I think

0:44:11.560 --> 0:44:18.000
<v Speaker 1>maybe less time and thought went into routing when you

0:44:18.040 --> 0:44:21.400
<v Speaker 1>could move dirt because you weren't thinking about like, okay,

0:44:21.400 --> 0:44:25.799
<v Speaker 1>this is a really you know, tough portion to navigate.

0:44:26.600 --> 0:44:29.400
<v Speaker 1>We could just dynamite and blow this up and reshape

0:44:29.440 --> 0:44:31.960
<v Speaker 1>it is what people thought then, you know, it's like

0:44:32.040 --> 0:44:34.640
<v Speaker 1>we can change the land, so like, you know, we

0:44:34.640 --> 0:44:36.879
<v Speaker 1>can route this however we want, because we can change

0:44:36.920 --> 0:44:41.040
<v Speaker 1>the land versus like, you know, the ability not to

0:44:41.120 --> 0:44:44.680
<v Speaker 1>change the land forces you to, you know, route in

0:44:44.719 --> 0:44:45.399
<v Speaker 1>a certain way.

0:44:45.719 --> 0:44:48.400
<v Speaker 2>It forces you to use some ingenuity. It's the old

0:44:49.160 --> 0:44:54.920
<v Speaker 2>old maxim that restrictions enhance creativity, you know, not not

0:44:55.040 --> 0:44:58.120
<v Speaker 2>the other way around. And there are some restrictions at

0:44:58.120 --> 0:45:00.560
<v Speaker 2>Pebble Beach, right It might seem like they're there, aren't

0:45:00.640 --> 0:45:04.440
<v Speaker 2>because the courses set has such a huge scale. But

0:45:04.920 --> 0:45:08.040
<v Speaker 2>the course doesn't just wander wherever it wants. It basically

0:45:08.080 --> 0:45:13.279
<v Speaker 2>stays in this footprint. And if it were built in

0:45:13.320 --> 0:45:16.120
<v Speaker 2>the modern era, one maybe land would have been moved,

0:45:16.120 --> 0:45:18.759
<v Speaker 2>but also maybe the golf course would have gone just

0:45:18.800 --> 0:45:22.000
<v Speaker 2>wherever it wanted to. And that's what a lot of

0:45:22.040 --> 0:45:24.760
<v Speaker 2>modern golf courses do. They just kind of wander out

0:45:24.960 --> 0:45:28.319
<v Speaker 2>into these places, going wherever they want to go. You know,

0:45:28.400 --> 0:45:32.000
<v Speaker 2>we can make it work. But some of these older

0:45:32.040 --> 0:45:35.200
<v Speaker 2>golf courses that we're talking about had more limited property.

0:45:35.560 --> 0:45:38.960
<v Speaker 2>You had to work with the same set of topographical

0:45:39.000 --> 0:45:41.520
<v Speaker 2>features and use them in a bunch of different ways,

0:45:42.080 --> 0:45:46.600
<v Speaker 2>and that's where their beauty and challenge comes from. You know,

0:45:46.640 --> 0:45:51.000
<v Speaker 2>we've talked before about focal points on golf courses, places

0:45:51.040 --> 0:45:54.160
<v Speaker 2>where holes return to the same portion of the property

0:45:54.239 --> 0:45:58.520
<v Speaker 2>over and over again. You don't get that on golf

0:45:58.560 --> 0:46:04.560
<v Speaker 2>courses that wander off into parts unknown, right you and

0:46:04.640 --> 0:46:08.399
<v Speaker 2>you and Jeff Oglvie talked about this. You only get

0:46:08.440 --> 0:46:11.080
<v Speaker 2>that feeling of returning to the same place and getting

0:46:11.160 --> 0:46:14.920
<v Speaker 2>it to know it again when you have a limited property,

0:46:14.960 --> 0:46:17.719
<v Speaker 2>because you have to do that. And so there are

0:46:17.760 --> 0:46:20.879
<v Speaker 2>just so many ways in which the restrictions that were

0:46:20.880 --> 0:46:25.120
<v Speaker 2>imposed on golf courses built one hundred years ago actually

0:46:25.440 --> 0:46:30.160
<v Speaker 2>created forms of challenge and beauty that you can't just manufacture.

0:46:30.880 --> 0:46:34.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I agree with that, and I was, yeah, I

0:46:34.880 --> 0:46:38.760
<v Speaker 1>mean in Pebble has that where we have some focal

0:46:38.800 --> 0:46:43.319
<v Speaker 1>points and you know, you've got that section where three,

0:46:43.880 --> 0:46:47.719
<v Speaker 1>fourteen six are all kind of like that little point

0:46:47.800 --> 0:46:50.799
<v Speaker 1>there where there's you know, a nice little ravine, and

0:46:50.840 --> 0:46:55.000
<v Speaker 1>then you've got you've got the stretch back where you

0:46:55.040 --> 0:46:58.520
<v Speaker 1>know ten t and twelve like you know, you had

0:46:58.560 --> 0:47:01.000
<v Speaker 1>that certain way and obviously it's a little bit different.

0:47:01.040 --> 0:47:02.880
<v Speaker 1>It's it's got a little bit of an out and

0:47:02.920 --> 0:47:06.600
<v Speaker 1>back like a links land, right, which is which it

0:47:06.280 --> 0:47:09.839
<v Speaker 1>is different. But like obviously they really wanted to maximize

0:47:09.840 --> 0:47:13.800
<v Speaker 1>that coast and and also they had restrictions in terms

0:47:13.800 --> 0:47:16.319
<v Speaker 1>of like the plan because they had to fight for

0:47:16.400 --> 0:47:19.080
<v Speaker 1>it not to be all houses in the first place,

0:47:19.440 --> 0:47:22.279
<v Speaker 1>so they didn't they weren't afforded like you know, the

0:47:22.320 --> 0:47:25.440
<v Speaker 1>ability to play up into the forest or down and

0:47:25.480 --> 0:47:28.080
<v Speaker 1>not that they would wanted to, but you know, that's

0:47:28.120 --> 0:47:30.800
<v Speaker 1>that's it was a great point you just made about

0:47:30.840 --> 0:47:32.880
<v Speaker 1>like the restrictions, because I start to think about it

0:47:32.880 --> 0:47:35.239
<v Speaker 1>because then you you know, we had an era and

0:47:35.560 --> 0:47:37.640
<v Speaker 1>j Blozi told me once and that it was a

0:47:37.680 --> 0:47:43.120
<v Speaker 1>really good comparison. Is like is that in a way

0:47:43.160 --> 0:47:47.400
<v Speaker 1>it almost like followed like how interior design where like

0:47:48.040 --> 0:47:51.080
<v Speaker 1>in the fifties, sixties, seventies, like what was in vogue

0:47:51.200 --> 0:47:55.560
<v Speaker 1>is like houses with very like defined room spaces and

0:47:55.800 --> 0:47:59.640
<v Speaker 1>very closed off like treed like corridored holes would be

0:47:59.719 --> 0:48:02.480
<v Speaker 1>like to find room spaces like this is the kitchen,

0:48:02.760 --> 0:48:05.040
<v Speaker 1>this is the living room, this is the family room.

0:48:05.320 --> 0:48:08.600
<v Speaker 1>But like today, you know, we've gone back to this

0:48:08.760 --> 0:48:12.280
<v Speaker 1>like the most comfortable houses are the kitchen that flows

0:48:12.320 --> 0:48:15.560
<v Speaker 1>into the great room and living room, and that I

0:48:15.560 --> 0:48:18.239
<v Speaker 1>think is a really good But Pebble's always been that

0:48:18.520 --> 0:48:21.399
<v Speaker 1>because like you get out, you know, once you play

0:48:21.440 --> 0:48:23.640
<v Speaker 1>one and two, you hit three, you make the turn

0:48:23.680 --> 0:48:26.400
<v Speaker 1>to four and then four, you're like, all of a sudden,

0:48:26.480 --> 0:48:29.359
<v Speaker 1>everything opens up and you're like, whoa, here it is.

0:48:29.760 --> 0:48:31.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it opens up and you see it for the

0:48:31.960 --> 0:48:34.400
<v Speaker 2>first time when you play those holes along the cliffs,

0:48:34.880 --> 0:48:36.160
<v Speaker 2>and then you see it again when you.

0:48:36.120 --> 0:48:38.000
<v Speaker 1>Come back right, come back on top of.

0:48:38.080 --> 0:48:45.240
<v Speaker 2>You get to review what you have experienced in holes twelve, thirteen, fourteen.

0:48:45.400 --> 0:48:47.720
<v Speaker 2>That view from the fourteenth green is just a great

0:48:47.760 --> 0:48:50.960
<v Speaker 2>way to close out that portion of the golf course,

0:48:51.000 --> 0:48:53.440
<v Speaker 2>and then you're taken over to another part of the

0:48:53.480 --> 0:48:56.799
<v Speaker 2>property to finish up right.

0:48:57.000 --> 0:48:59.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And I can't even now that I think about it,

0:48:59.239 --> 0:49:02.640
<v Speaker 1>Like That's another aspect of it being such a great

0:49:02.680 --> 0:49:07.640
<v Speaker 1>championship course is that the intimacy of it, you know,

0:49:07.760 --> 0:49:11.640
<v Speaker 1>like whereas I can't think of a like somewhere I

0:49:11.680 --> 0:49:16.640
<v Speaker 1>love watching championship golf that is like a corridored off,

0:49:16.800 --> 0:49:20.520
<v Speaker 1>like it's very siloed, you know, where like you know,

0:49:20.600 --> 0:49:25.240
<v Speaker 1>somebody's over here, and like it's there's something about where

0:49:25.920 --> 0:49:29.080
<v Speaker 1>when somebody's making a surge in they're five holes ahead

0:49:29.080 --> 0:49:33.399
<v Speaker 1>of the leader who's playing you know, nine and there

0:49:33.440 --> 0:49:37.440
<v Speaker 1>on fourteen, like them them being like in the same vicinity.

0:49:37.480 --> 0:49:41.760
<v Speaker 1>There's something about that. It's like the energy within the tournament.

0:49:42.600 --> 0:49:47.440
<v Speaker 2>If you just stand near the sixth fairway, eighth fairway,

0:49:48.280 --> 0:49:52.520
<v Speaker 2>ninth t that area, and fourteen is kind of running

0:49:52.520 --> 0:49:55.319
<v Speaker 2>by those holes a little bit up the slope, you'll

0:49:55.360 --> 0:49:58.759
<v Speaker 2>see a ton of stuff. It's it's a hub of activity, right,

0:49:58.960 --> 0:50:01.920
<v Speaker 2>And that's of course where they at the patron tent

0:50:02.040 --> 0:50:05.440
<v Speaker 2>and all that all that stuff, But aside from that,

0:50:05.960 --> 0:50:08.279
<v Speaker 2>you'll just see a lot of golf. Right.

0:50:08.600 --> 0:50:10.680
<v Speaker 1>One thing that drove me nuts was the twelfth hole.

0:50:11.160 --> 0:50:12.320
<v Speaker 1>All those trees they.

0:50:12.160 --> 0:50:14.279
<v Speaker 2>Have there along the left side.

0:50:14.400 --> 0:50:17.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I was looking at it. I was like, God,

0:50:17.200 --> 0:50:20.239
<v Speaker 1>they're just blocking an unbelievable view of the ocean. Like it.

0:50:20.400 --> 0:50:22.400
<v Speaker 1>And this goes back to what I was saying about,

0:50:22.440 --> 0:50:26.640
<v Speaker 1>like how like you know, from an architecture standpoint, like

0:50:26.920 --> 0:50:30.920
<v Speaker 1>almost everything they do is so against their like culture

0:50:31.000 --> 0:50:35.239
<v Speaker 1>as a company, right, Like, yeah, it's unbelievable.

0:50:35.280 --> 0:50:38.400
<v Speaker 2>It's the same thing behind the third green, right, and

0:50:38.480 --> 0:50:41.520
<v Speaker 2>maybe those are necessary plantings there. There are just these

0:50:41.560 --> 0:50:45.680
<v Speaker 2>hedges that block the first view that you get of

0:50:45.719 --> 0:50:48.640
<v Speaker 2>the ocean coming down that fairway. Yeah, you know, you've

0:50:48.680 --> 0:50:52.239
<v Speaker 2>just got buildings and hedges where they're just used to

0:50:52.239 --> 0:50:55.840
<v Speaker 2>be an open vista. And just imagine teeing off on

0:50:55.880 --> 0:50:58.400
<v Speaker 2>the third hole, right, it's a severe dog leg left

0:50:58.800 --> 0:51:01.520
<v Speaker 2>and it's and you can't really see the ocean yet.

0:51:01.520 --> 0:51:03.879
<v Speaker 2>When you're standing on the third tee, you've just come

0:51:03.920 --> 0:51:06.560
<v Speaker 2>across the road from the second green. You hit your

0:51:06.600 --> 0:51:08.759
<v Speaker 2>te shot and it's kind of a blind tea shot

0:51:08.800 --> 0:51:11.719
<v Speaker 2>because you're going around some trees and you walk out

0:51:11.760 --> 0:51:14.440
<v Speaker 2>onto the fairway and then boom, you look down the

0:51:14.480 --> 0:51:16.800
<v Speaker 2>fairway and you can see all the way to the ocean.

0:51:16.800 --> 0:51:21.600
<v Speaker 2>You can see the seventeenth green out there. Unbelievable part

0:51:21.840 --> 0:51:26.680
<v Speaker 2>of the round, really amazing, adventurous part of the routing,

0:51:27.400 --> 0:51:30.400
<v Speaker 2>and it's a little bit blunted now because of the

0:51:30.440 --> 0:51:33.680
<v Speaker 2>things that block it. And that that that's just presentation.

0:51:34.120 --> 0:51:35.399
<v Speaker 1>That third hole is a great hole.

0:51:35.520 --> 0:51:37.600
<v Speaker 2>It's a really good hole. Yeah, and it's it's all

0:51:37.600 --> 0:51:40.799
<v Speaker 2>about that green orientation. Right. It's a fun drive. You know,

0:51:40.840 --> 0:51:42.560
<v Speaker 2>you can kind of sling it down there and if

0:51:42.560 --> 0:51:44.880
<v Speaker 2>you if you're willing to launch it into the to

0:51:45.000 --> 0:51:49.719
<v Speaker 2>the unknown, you'll definitely get an advantage. And then you've

0:51:49.760 --> 0:51:52.239
<v Speaker 2>got the ball above your feet and you've got a

0:51:52.280 --> 0:51:58.120
<v Speaker 2>green that receives shots best from you know, from a fade,

0:51:58.480 --> 0:52:00.879
<v Speaker 2>you know shape for a right hander. So you've got

0:52:00.880 --> 0:52:03.959
<v Speaker 2>this draw lie and a green that seems to beg

0:52:04.000 --> 0:52:05.480
<v Speaker 2>for a fade.

0:52:05.560 --> 0:52:08.399
<v Speaker 1>What are some other holes other than three that you're

0:52:08.560 --> 0:52:09.360
<v Speaker 1>keen to watch?

0:52:10.040 --> 0:52:12.840
<v Speaker 2>And we've already talked about four. It's one of my

0:52:12.880 --> 0:52:16.880
<v Speaker 2>favorite holes on the golf course and players can approach

0:52:16.920 --> 0:52:20.040
<v Speaker 2>that hole in a number of different ways. During the

0:52:20.080 --> 0:52:23.520
<v Speaker 2>pro am earlier this year, in the final round, Paul

0:52:23.600 --> 0:52:28.240
<v Speaker 2>Casey and Phil Mickelson showed up on that tee. Paul Casey,

0:52:28.239 --> 0:52:31.759
<v Speaker 2>I believe, was leading by two or three and they

0:52:31.800 --> 0:52:35.440
<v Speaker 2>had just kind of, you know, fought to a draw

0:52:35.560 --> 0:52:37.880
<v Speaker 2>on the first three holes, and then they came to

0:52:37.920 --> 0:52:41.759
<v Speaker 2>the fourth tee. Paul Casey played out left conservatively. Phil

0:52:41.800 --> 0:52:44.280
<v Speaker 2>Mickelson pulled out a three wood hit at about three hundred

0:52:44.360 --> 0:52:48.399
<v Speaker 2>yards up the fairway and had a fifty yard pitch

0:52:48.440 --> 0:52:51.280
<v Speaker 2>into the green. He birdied that hole. Paul Casey parted

0:52:51.719 --> 0:52:53.680
<v Speaker 2>and it was off to the races. Phil Micholson ended

0:52:53.760 --> 0:52:56.319
<v Speaker 2>up shooting sixty five and winning the tournament. But I

0:52:56.360 --> 0:52:59.759
<v Speaker 2>thought that that moment on the fourth tee was a

0:53:00.200 --> 0:53:03.040
<v Speaker 2>hinge point in the tournament. You know. It was you

0:53:03.080 --> 0:53:04.360
<v Speaker 2>know a place where.

0:53:04.520 --> 0:53:08.120
<v Speaker 1>That's a hole that you're looking to make a birdie.

0:53:08.239 --> 0:53:10.960
<v Speaker 2>Yes, yeah, if you want to win the golf tournament.

0:53:11.480 --> 0:53:14.520
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's like that. You know, probably plays the three

0:53:14.680 --> 0:53:17.520
<v Speaker 1>seven or something and it's one of those holes like

0:53:17.560 --> 0:53:19.520
<v Speaker 1>it's not quite a three and a half like where

0:53:19.560 --> 0:53:22.239
<v Speaker 1>you it's it, but like the three seven in like

0:53:22.719 --> 0:53:25.080
<v Speaker 1>you know, and the other thing, when you don't make

0:53:25.120 --> 0:53:28.280
<v Speaker 1>a birdie, there's a there's all of a sudden a stress,

0:53:28.640 --> 0:53:31.080
<v Speaker 1>like your stress level, your pulse almost goes up a

0:53:31.080 --> 0:53:33.520
<v Speaker 1>little because you know, you just you didn't get one

0:53:33.560 --> 0:53:34.720
<v Speaker 1>where you could get one.

0:53:34.880 --> 0:53:38.120
<v Speaker 2>And it's the first hole on the cliffs, right, and

0:53:38.120 --> 0:53:42.440
<v Speaker 2>and so there's already that heightened sense of here comes

0:53:41.920 --> 0:53:42.400
<v Speaker 2>the reds.

0:53:42.440 --> 0:53:46.080
<v Speaker 1>Like the psychological thing. Yeah, it gives you, like it

0:53:46.160 --> 0:53:48.719
<v Speaker 1>discomforts you a little when you don't make birdie there

0:53:48.880 --> 0:53:51.720
<v Speaker 1>and then you're on that you're in that exposed cliff

0:53:51.880 --> 0:53:55.120
<v Speaker 1>area where you know, any myth any big myths, right,

0:53:55.239 --> 0:53:59.960
<v Speaker 1>is disastrous. There's something about the psychological aspect of the cliff.

0:54:00.360 --> 0:54:03.120
<v Speaker 1>Mm hmm. You know whether or not you want to.

0:54:03.239 --> 0:54:04.840
<v Speaker 1>It's not the same as like a creek.

0:54:05.320 --> 0:54:07.839
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, of course not. Yeah, And this is why

0:54:07.840 --> 0:54:10.080
<v Speaker 2>it's silly when people say, well, if Pebble Beach weren't

0:54:10.120 --> 0:54:14.239
<v Speaker 2>on the ocean, it wouldn't be considered that great of

0:54:14.239 --> 0:54:18.839
<v Speaker 2>a course. Well, it's the whole thing, right, is those

0:54:18.880 --> 0:54:22.000
<v Speaker 2>cliffs and how raw and intimidating they look.

0:54:22.520 --> 0:54:24.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, like you just don't want to go anywhere near them.

0:54:24.880 --> 0:54:25.000
<v Speaker 2>No.

0:54:25.280 --> 0:54:28.760
<v Speaker 1>I think it might also be something about like human nature,

0:54:29.120 --> 0:54:31.719
<v Speaker 1>like how you get uncomfortable by cliff side.

0:54:32.040 --> 0:54:36.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, because you feel like you could fall off. Yeah,

0:54:36.040 --> 0:54:38.240
<v Speaker 2>and it and it becomes a mental thing in your swing.

0:54:38.280 --> 0:54:41.920
<v Speaker 2>As much as you might be telling yourself to play

0:54:41.920 --> 0:54:45.239
<v Speaker 2>the right shot in the middle of your swing, your

0:54:45.280 --> 0:54:48.879
<v Speaker 2>body is gonna do something that that you don't want

0:54:48.920 --> 0:54:51.239
<v Speaker 2>it to do. And and for me, the response is

0:54:51.280 --> 0:54:54.600
<v Speaker 2>to hit a lot of balls to the left, away

0:54:54.640 --> 0:54:55.280
<v Speaker 2>from the cliffs.

0:54:55.400 --> 0:54:59.479
<v Speaker 1>That's how. Yeah, I hit it into the my second shot,

0:54:59.480 --> 0:55:05.080
<v Speaker 1>I hit it in to the short on aid like

0:55:05.120 --> 0:55:06.879
<v Speaker 1>short right, and I had to hit the drop from

0:55:06.880 --> 0:55:09.320
<v Speaker 1>the cliff from like just right in front of the cliff,

0:55:09.840 --> 0:55:11.600
<v Speaker 1>and I was like, God, this is really I don't

0:55:11.640 --> 0:55:14.200
<v Speaker 1>like hitting a shot from here. Like I felt like,

0:55:14.200 --> 0:55:16.560
<v Speaker 1>like you're nervous about the club flying out of your hands,

0:55:16.600 --> 0:55:18.759
<v Speaker 1>And you're like, why would I be nervous about a

0:55:18.760 --> 0:55:19.960
<v Speaker 1>club flying out of my hands?

0:55:20.120 --> 0:55:21.000
<v Speaker 2>When has that happened?

0:55:21.080 --> 0:55:24.280
<v Speaker 1>Never happened in my life? Right, But all of a sudden,

0:55:24.280 --> 0:55:26.479
<v Speaker 1>I'm like two feet from a cliff and I feel

0:55:26.600 --> 0:55:30.120
<v Speaker 1>this sensation that you don't. And I that's what made

0:55:30.120 --> 0:55:32.399
<v Speaker 1>me think about like the subliminal thing. And it would

0:55:32.400 --> 0:55:35.160
<v Speaker 1>be interesting to ask, like a mental guy that if

0:55:35.200 --> 0:55:40.080
<v Speaker 1>there's anything to that, sure that's it? This you know

0:55:40.120 --> 0:55:42.520
<v Speaker 1>we've got in two years, we've got Tory pines, which

0:55:42.880 --> 0:55:47.080
<v Speaker 1>like one could say that pebble uses the cliffs so well,

0:55:47.400 --> 0:55:49.879
<v Speaker 1>like because of the way, so you know a lot

0:55:49.880 --> 0:55:52.959
<v Speaker 1>of and I think this is something that would happen

0:55:53.080 --> 0:55:55.560
<v Speaker 1>today if somebody came in a re routed pebble, they'd

0:55:55.600 --> 0:55:59.000
<v Speaker 1>figure out way more ways to get greens on cliffs.

0:55:59.520 --> 0:56:02.640
<v Speaker 1>But we have less playing area on the cliffs. We

0:56:02.719 --> 0:56:05.680
<v Speaker 1>might have more holes on the cliffs if you rerouted it,

0:56:06.000 --> 0:56:09.680
<v Speaker 1>but there'd be less significant playing area on the cliffs. Sure, Yeah,

0:56:09.880 --> 0:56:12.160
<v Speaker 1>where like I know, I've to talked to some people

0:56:12.239 --> 0:56:14.759
<v Speaker 1>where they've said, like, I don't think the routings that

0:56:14.800 --> 0:56:18.440
<v Speaker 1>good because like you're done with they don't They don't

0:56:18.719 --> 0:56:20.600
<v Speaker 1>have as many holes as they could on.

0:56:20.560 --> 0:56:24.480
<v Speaker 2>The cliffs, right, Yeah, because nine and ten are long

0:56:24.560 --> 0:56:28.560
<v Speaker 2>holes that just stretch out and use that whole stretch

0:56:28.560 --> 0:56:32.839
<v Speaker 2>of coastline. But the way they use it is so brilliant. Yeah,

0:56:33.120 --> 0:56:37.480
<v Speaker 2>the priority, another architects priority might be I want to

0:56:37.480 --> 0:56:41.160
<v Speaker 2>maximize the views, the number that people could take. Yeah,

0:56:41.480 --> 0:56:46.160
<v Speaker 2>And Pebble does maximize the cliff side playing area for sure,

0:56:46.200 --> 0:56:48.960
<v Speaker 2>and that's part of it. Is the is the vistas

0:56:49.000 --> 0:56:51.960
<v Speaker 2>and the impact of being up there, which can't be discounted.

0:56:51.960 --> 0:56:53.680
<v Speaker 2>That's part of what makes it a great golf course.

0:56:53.760 --> 0:56:55.840
<v Speaker 2>But the way it uses the cliffs, it'd.

0:56:55.640 --> 0:56:58.879
<v Speaker 1>Be interesting to look at like say band and Dunes. Yeah,

0:56:58.960 --> 0:57:04.680
<v Speaker 1>amount of cliffs and like amount of of of legitimate

0:57:04.760 --> 0:57:06.880
<v Speaker 1>playing area on the on the.

0:57:06.719 --> 0:57:12.120
<v Speaker 2>Cliffs, Pebble Beach uses way more. And it's also it's

0:57:12.160 --> 0:57:14.960
<v Speaker 2>a different the coastline is different in its nature. Yeah,

0:57:15.040 --> 0:57:18.920
<v Speaker 2>you get such variety of coastline at Pebble Beach. At Bandon,

0:57:19.360 --> 0:57:22.440
<v Speaker 2>you're up in the stratosphere, right. Those cliffs are huge

0:57:23.080 --> 0:57:25.760
<v Speaker 2>and and there are holes that play along the edges

0:57:25.800 --> 0:57:29.120
<v Speaker 2>of them and and use them brilliantly and everything. But

0:57:29.600 --> 0:57:32.600
<v Speaker 2>at Pebble Beach, what you have is, uh, you know,

0:57:32.720 --> 0:57:36.240
<v Speaker 2>four or five different phases of cliff side playing area

0:57:37.080 --> 0:57:40.120
<v Speaker 2>Four and five are along still Water Cove, which is

0:57:40.200 --> 0:57:43.959
<v Speaker 2>just so beautiful and peaceful. It's like this marine sanctuary.

0:57:44.360 --> 0:57:46.439
<v Speaker 2>There would never be a golf course built there now,

0:57:47.240 --> 0:57:51.000
<v Speaker 2>and and the cliffs are kind of medium sized. And

0:57:51.040 --> 0:57:56.640
<v Speaker 2>then on six you climb up to this the famous

0:57:56.840 --> 0:58:00.080
<v Speaker 2>peninsula out there where you're just way up in the

0:58:00.120 --> 0:58:05.480
<v Speaker 2>air and you're on this spectacular bluff. And then you know,

0:58:05.640 --> 0:58:08.160
<v Speaker 2>from the sixth green you play down to the ocean

0:58:08.160 --> 0:58:11.280
<v Speaker 2>on the seventh and you go across a huge chasm

0:58:11.320 --> 0:58:14.360
<v Speaker 2>on the eighth. So six, seven, and eight have have

0:58:14.480 --> 0:58:18.400
<v Speaker 2>this natural feature of enormous size. Then you get to

0:58:18.480 --> 0:58:20.400
<v Speaker 2>nine and ten and it goes back to kind of

0:58:20.480 --> 0:58:24.200
<v Speaker 2>medium sized cliffs where you're playing along Carmel Beach and

0:58:24.240 --> 0:58:26.920
<v Speaker 2>you see people walking their dogs and you kind of

0:58:26.920 --> 0:58:30.560
<v Speaker 2>get a view of what that town is like out there, Okay,

0:58:30.600 --> 0:58:33.280
<v Speaker 2>and then you go back and then eighteen is right

0:58:33.400 --> 0:58:36.240
<v Speaker 2>on the sea wall, right on the ocean. Yeah, there's

0:58:36.360 --> 0:58:39.760
<v Speaker 2>variety of cliff side locations. It's not just all one thing.

0:58:40.080 --> 0:58:43.360
<v Speaker 2>And that's I think what makes Pebble Beach so beautiful

0:58:43.600 --> 0:58:46.680
<v Speaker 2>and interesting is it's not just that it's on the ocean.

0:58:46.720 --> 0:58:49.760
<v Speaker 2>It's that the particular ocean side property that it has

0:58:50.440 --> 0:58:55.880
<v Speaker 2>is more varied, I think than any golf landscape on

0:58:56.000 --> 0:58:57.240
<v Speaker 2>the ocean that I've ever seen.

0:58:57.720 --> 0:59:01.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's in Tory Pines is pretty uniform.

0:59:01.600 --> 0:59:04.520
<v Speaker 2>How high way up high. Yeah, you can't really get

0:59:04.560 --> 0:59:07.360
<v Speaker 2>to the edges in a lot of places at Tory Pines.

0:59:07.680 --> 0:59:10.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's a that's a great point. I never thought

0:59:10.880 --> 0:59:14.400
<v Speaker 1>about how the the and that plays into the the

0:59:14.520 --> 0:59:17.640
<v Speaker 1>unbelieving this is what you know? That take of like

0:59:17.680 --> 0:59:21.440
<v Speaker 1>Pebble is overrated is like that that plays into like

0:59:21.520 --> 0:59:23.640
<v Speaker 1>that well, that's a that's a kind of a lazy

0:59:23.880 --> 0:59:28.280
<v Speaker 1>take because there's so much like once you get out there,

0:59:28.320 --> 0:59:32.040
<v Speaker 1>Like that's Pebble is overrated is almost a take of

0:59:32.080 --> 0:59:35.320
<v Speaker 1>somebody who hasn't really been to Pebble and like and

0:59:35.480 --> 0:59:39.360
<v Speaker 1>seen what and you know, have a full grasp of

0:59:39.400 --> 0:59:43.439
<v Speaker 1>like what you know is out there, because like you've

0:59:43.440 --> 0:59:46.000
<v Speaker 1>got up and down, you've got side hills, and then

0:59:46.080 --> 0:59:49.200
<v Speaker 1>you have the varied settings of the cliffs and with

0:59:49.360 --> 0:59:52.160
<v Speaker 1>that like still Watercove, it's called still Watercove for a

0:59:52.440 --> 0:59:55.800
<v Speaker 1>for a reason. Right like within you know, just six

0:59:55.920 --> 1:00:00.400
<v Speaker 1>hundred yards that the weather conditions can be like significantly different,

1:00:00.480 --> 1:00:04.240
<v Speaker 1>like the type of wind you're facing, like it, because

1:00:04.280 --> 1:00:07.320
<v Speaker 1>like that is what's really cool is like you get

1:00:07.320 --> 1:00:09.560
<v Speaker 1>out to that point on six and it's just so

1:00:09.640 --> 1:00:13.320
<v Speaker 1>it can be so raw out there, very exposed, yeah

1:00:13.440 --> 1:00:16.920
<v Speaker 1>and versus four and three where it's much more docile

1:00:17.040 --> 1:00:20.600
<v Speaker 1>and yeah and uh, and then you hit that that scape.

1:00:20.640 --> 1:00:25.040
<v Speaker 1>That's it. That's also like an interesting aspect of of pebble,

1:00:25.160 --> 1:00:28.720
<v Speaker 1>which is like how it paces itself in the round

1:00:28.840 --> 1:00:33.600
<v Speaker 1>with the with the component of weather, like where off

1:00:33.640 --> 1:00:37.320
<v Speaker 1>the bat you're you're you're kind of protected, and then

1:00:37.440 --> 1:00:40.040
<v Speaker 1>in the middle of the round it's gonna throw everything

1:00:40.080 --> 1:00:43.360
<v Speaker 1>it's got at you. But then it allows the clothes

1:00:43.520 --> 1:00:46.640
<v Speaker 1>to be less about the weather and more about the

1:00:46.640 --> 1:00:50.640
<v Speaker 1>guy that can survive that. Really you know that that

1:00:51.520 --> 1:00:54.120
<v Speaker 1>when they throw everything in the kitchen sink at you,

1:00:54.200 --> 1:00:56.720
<v Speaker 1>and then it gives you some opportunities coming down the

1:00:56.720 --> 1:01:00.000
<v Speaker 1>stretch to score and finish with you know, some great

1:01:00.160 --> 1:01:01.640
<v Speaker 1>shots that separate you.

1:01:02.000 --> 1:01:04.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's a really good point. When the wind kicks

1:01:04.480 --> 1:01:09.480
<v Speaker 2>up six, seven, eight, nine, ten, Yeah, it doesn't get

1:01:09.560 --> 1:01:12.400
<v Speaker 2>much harder than that. When the wind is blowing in

1:01:12.440 --> 1:01:18.520
<v Speaker 2>the prevailing direction. Wow, those holes become really really hard

1:01:18.560 --> 1:01:19.680
<v Speaker 2>and really intimidating.

1:01:20.160 --> 1:01:21.920
<v Speaker 1>And I like how it's right in the middle.

1:01:22.360 --> 1:01:25.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you go through this trial and you come out

1:01:25.760 --> 1:01:29.160
<v Speaker 2>the other side and you have an opportunity for some heroism.

1:01:29.680 --> 1:01:34.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah exactly. I mean that's it's it's got that that feel.

1:01:34.840 --> 1:01:38.200
<v Speaker 1>Like I think that like Yale has this feel and

1:01:40.000 --> 1:01:44.280
<v Speaker 1>it's it's like it's an adventure in a way. And

1:01:44.320 --> 1:01:47.200
<v Speaker 1>I think the setting of it and the way the

1:01:47.600 --> 1:01:50.280
<v Speaker 1>scale of the land and this is you know scale

1:01:50.320 --> 1:01:52.560
<v Speaker 1>I think gets thrown around way too much. But like

1:01:52.840 --> 1:01:54.840
<v Speaker 1>when we say, when I say scale, like I'm saying

1:01:54.840 --> 1:01:58.760
<v Speaker 1>the enormity of it is that it makes you feel

1:01:58.760 --> 1:02:01.600
<v Speaker 1>like and there's no better depiction of the normandy of

1:02:01.640 --> 1:02:03.960
<v Speaker 1>it than like the picture that you see of a

1:02:04.000 --> 1:02:07.920
<v Speaker 1>guy walking up that six, you know, walking up six

1:02:08.040 --> 1:02:11.400
<v Speaker 1>up the big hill to the green, where like it's

1:02:11.440 --> 1:02:15.120
<v Speaker 1>an adventure to hit a long iron from an uneven

1:02:15.240 --> 1:02:16.640
<v Speaker 1>lie up over that.

1:02:17.040 --> 1:02:20.360
<v Speaker 2>Right, You're not thinking the sixth hole is not necessarily

1:02:20.400 --> 1:02:24.840
<v Speaker 2>about lateral strategy. It's not about the analysis of how

1:02:24.880 --> 1:02:28.920
<v Speaker 2>the architecture is is promoting certain angles. It's just about

1:02:29.680 --> 1:02:33.440
<v Speaker 2>get your ball on the short grass and then have

1:02:33.640 --> 1:02:38.560
<v Speaker 2>the guts to get up that natural landform.

1:02:38.840 --> 1:02:42.840
<v Speaker 1>Yes, And that's like the and that that hole is

1:02:42.880 --> 1:02:46.080
<v Speaker 1>a microcosm of the course where it's an adventure, like

1:02:46.360 --> 1:02:49.040
<v Speaker 1>and you have this start where it's you know, you're

1:02:49.120 --> 1:02:51.520
<v Speaker 1>it's easing you into this and then all of a

1:02:51.560 --> 1:02:55.240
<v Speaker 1>sudden it just like goes full octane and then you know,

1:02:55.880 --> 1:02:59.680
<v Speaker 1>eighteen's almost like a perfect perfect way to close, because

1:02:59.720 --> 1:03:02.320
<v Speaker 1>then it becomes like, do you have the guts you

1:03:02.480 --> 1:03:06.120
<v Speaker 1>We're gonna we're gonna ask you one last time to

1:03:06.240 --> 1:03:08.640
<v Speaker 1>pull this off, Like you got to take this on

1:03:09.120 --> 1:03:12.240
<v Speaker 1>and you can't bail, right, you have to commit and

1:03:12.360 --> 1:03:15.439
<v Speaker 1>hit this shot. And uh. And that's I think that's

1:03:15.480 --> 1:03:19.240
<v Speaker 1>the thing that's really neat about Pebble Beach is like

1:03:19.360 --> 1:03:23.640
<v Speaker 1>the idea of the journey, right, and that's what golf

1:03:23.640 --> 1:03:25.960
<v Speaker 1>courses that go out and in I think have that

1:03:26.400 --> 1:03:29.040
<v Speaker 1>ability to be a little bit more like that than

1:03:29.320 --> 1:03:32.280
<v Speaker 1>a golf course that has returning nines. There's something about

1:03:32.360 --> 1:03:35.920
<v Speaker 1>like when you go out like, it's not like nine,

1:03:36.000 --> 1:03:38.520
<v Speaker 1>it's not time for a break, Like you're out there

1:03:39.040 --> 1:03:41.520
<v Speaker 1>like and you're you're continuing to go on, you.

1:03:41.480 --> 1:03:45.760
<v Speaker 2>Know, Yeah, yeah, absolutely, I don't know.

1:03:46.000 --> 1:03:48.800
<v Speaker 1>That's that's Pebble Who do so what what do you? Uh?

1:03:49.120 --> 1:03:52.920
<v Speaker 1>What are you watching for? From a player perspective.

1:03:53.520 --> 1:03:59.160
<v Speaker 2>Well, at Pebble Beach, I think a lot of different

1:03:59.200 --> 1:04:03.200
<v Speaker 2>players have a chants. You know, at the PGA Championship,

1:04:03.960 --> 1:04:07.880
<v Speaker 2>we talked about how only a few guys could win

1:04:08.080 --> 1:04:11.320
<v Speaker 2>that tournament or really had any chance. I think what

1:04:11.400 --> 1:04:14.560
<v Speaker 2>we'll see here is a setup that will look to

1:04:14.720 --> 1:04:19.680
<v Speaker 2>people in a lot of ways superficially as similar, but

1:04:20.320 --> 1:04:24.720
<v Speaker 2>it's a completely different kind of golf course. And so

1:04:24.920 --> 1:04:28.120
<v Speaker 2>I think that honestly, so many different players could do

1:04:28.280 --> 1:04:32.440
<v Speaker 2>well at Pebble Beach. It just depends on who's striking

1:04:32.480 --> 1:04:32.800
<v Speaker 2>the ball.

1:04:32.800 --> 1:04:33.040
<v Speaker 1>Well.

1:04:33.360 --> 1:04:36.200
<v Speaker 2>The reason it's so different from beth Page is I

1:04:36.240 --> 1:04:39.720
<v Speaker 2>think pretty simple, it's just a shorter golf course, right, and.

1:04:41.160 --> 1:04:46.720
<v Speaker 1>Are more severe and smaller. Yeah, so where like you

1:04:46.760 --> 1:04:49.200
<v Speaker 1>could be less precise at beth Page and get away

1:04:49.200 --> 1:04:50.520
<v Speaker 1>with it on your approaches.

1:04:50.760 --> 1:04:53.840
<v Speaker 2>That's true. Yeah, No, you can't get away with any

1:04:53.960 --> 1:04:57.360
<v Speaker 2>kind of leaking shot at Pebble, right if you're hitting

1:04:57.360 --> 1:04:59.120
<v Speaker 2>off one of those hanging lies and you let the

1:04:59.120 --> 1:05:01.840
<v Speaker 2>ball move to much or you don't account for the

1:05:01.840 --> 1:05:05.440
<v Speaker 2>wind enough, then yeah you're dead. So you have to

1:05:05.440 --> 1:05:08.640
<v Speaker 2>be super precise. But you know, Pebble is just going

1:05:08.760 --> 1:05:11.720
<v Speaker 2>to be a touch over seven thousand yards. So this

1:05:11.800 --> 1:05:15.880
<v Speaker 2>is an incredibly small ballpark for these guys. I think

1:05:16.400 --> 1:05:20.760
<v Speaker 2>where where the action might be is not just the

1:05:20.880 --> 1:05:24.280
<v Speaker 2>usual sub suspects. You know, Brooks kept guys probably going

1:05:24.360 --> 1:05:26.760
<v Speaker 2>to do well, you know, I mean, like we're probably

1:05:26.760 --> 1:05:29.160
<v Speaker 2>going to keep picking him until he stops winning every

1:05:29.200 --> 1:05:29.680
<v Speaker 2>other major.

1:05:29.840 --> 1:05:32.960
<v Speaker 1>It's important to like note that, like the the guys

1:05:33.000 --> 1:05:35.520
<v Speaker 1>that hit it really far and really straight are also

1:05:35.600 --> 1:05:36.720
<v Speaker 1>the best players in the world.

1:05:36.840 --> 1:05:39.240
<v Speaker 2>They still have the advance. Dustin Johnson plays well at

1:05:39.240 --> 1:05:41.080
<v Speaker 2>Pebble Beach. Everybody did you know that?

1:05:41.320 --> 1:05:44.880
<v Speaker 1>So I think there we need to like reclassify DJ

1:05:45.520 --> 1:05:51.200
<v Speaker 1>Rory JT. Brooks, Like they shouldn't be termed bombers. They

1:05:51.240 --> 1:05:54.479
<v Speaker 1>should be just termed like they need a different term.

1:05:54.720 --> 1:05:55.959
<v Speaker 2>They're the best players in the world.

1:05:56.160 --> 1:05:59.520
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So, like like when you think bomber, think like

1:05:59.720 --> 1:06:02.360
<v Speaker 1>guys who hits it really far, who's ranked fortieth in

1:06:02.400 --> 1:06:02.760
<v Speaker 1>the world.

1:06:03.080 --> 1:06:06.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, So these and and all of those guys

1:06:06.600 --> 1:06:08.840
<v Speaker 2>that you named. It's been said over and over, but

1:06:08.880 --> 1:06:12.880
<v Speaker 2>it bears repeating that they're incredibly accurate relative to.

1:06:12.880 --> 1:06:16.040
<v Speaker 1>Their length and incredibly skilled in other facets of the game.

1:06:16.120 --> 1:06:17.400
<v Speaker 2>They have complete games.

1:06:17.480 --> 1:06:20.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like Brooks is one of the best players around

1:06:20.640 --> 1:06:22.120
<v Speaker 1>the greens and one of the best players on the

1:06:22.160 --> 1:06:24.960
<v Speaker 1>greens to go along with his immense power, and he's

1:06:25.000 --> 1:06:26.600
<v Speaker 1>a top ten strokes gained approach guy.

1:06:27.000 --> 1:06:29.200
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, And I think there's a tendency when you

1:06:29.240 --> 1:06:31.280
<v Speaker 2>come to a course like Pebble that's a little bit

1:06:31.400 --> 1:06:35.560
<v Speaker 2>shorter and where precision players have a real chance. I

1:06:35.560 --> 1:06:38.480
<v Speaker 2>think there's a tendency to forget about the fact that

1:06:39.000 --> 1:06:41.960
<v Speaker 2>those four or five players that we just mentioned are

1:06:42.000 --> 1:06:44.360
<v Speaker 2>still the best players in the world. DJ and are

1:06:44.400 --> 1:06:45.000
<v Speaker 2>still favorite.

1:06:45.040 --> 1:06:47.360
<v Speaker 1>Hears so little about DJ and he was like a

1:06:47.440 --> 1:06:50.080
<v Speaker 1>final round collapse away from running away from with.

1:06:51.880 --> 1:06:55.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, And the weather turned that day on Sunday

1:06:55.240 --> 1:06:59.120
<v Speaker 2>in twenty ten, and DJ was was three up going

1:06:59.160 --> 1:07:02.800
<v Speaker 2>into the final round. This is a different Dustin Johnson

1:07:03.120 --> 1:07:06.640
<v Speaker 2>coming into this tournament, and he he has a really

1:07:06.680 --> 1:07:09.680
<v Speaker 2>really good chance. So you know, before getting into some

1:07:09.720 --> 1:07:13.800
<v Speaker 2>of the some of the the sexy picks, obviously, I'm

1:07:13.880 --> 1:07:16.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking that one of those guys is probably gonna

1:07:16.400 --> 1:07:19.720
<v Speaker 2>win the golf tournament. But uh, you know, some interesting

1:07:19.760 --> 1:07:23.400
<v Speaker 2>players to look at, players who might do well at

1:07:23.400 --> 1:07:28.760
<v Speaker 2>this course would be Web Simpson, Matt Kucher. Is chess

1:07:28.840 --> 1:07:32.080
<v Speaker 2>Revy in the field, yeah, yeah, reve yeah, oh of

1:07:32.120 --> 1:07:34.720
<v Speaker 2>course he is. But he could do well, right, He's.

1:07:34.560 --> 1:07:36.920
<v Speaker 1>Played well in the last two opens. I was talking

1:07:36.960 --> 1:07:39.640
<v Speaker 1>with Polly on the Shotguns start last night and I

1:07:39.720 --> 1:07:42.240
<v Speaker 1>kept bringing up chez Revy and he he wasn't buying it,

1:07:42.480 --> 1:07:45.840
<v Speaker 1>but I chess Rev he plays well at the AT

1:07:45.920 --> 1:07:48.400
<v Speaker 1>and T. But he said, one thing is overrating at

1:07:48.480 --> 1:07:50.800
<v Speaker 1>and T peronerformance because there's only half the rounds are

1:07:50.800 --> 1:07:53.040
<v Speaker 1>at Pebble. But at the same time, like, chess Revy

1:07:53.040 --> 1:07:55.919
<v Speaker 1>to me, fits this golf course. But he's not really

1:07:56.000 --> 1:07:58.880
<v Speaker 1>good around the greens, but he's so good tea too green.

1:07:59.040 --> 1:08:01.880
<v Speaker 2>Yes, yeah, and he seems to do well in majors, right.

1:08:01.920 --> 1:08:04.320
<v Speaker 2>He always seems to pop up on the leaderboard and

1:08:04.320 --> 1:08:07.320
<v Speaker 2>everybody acts surprise, but he's been there a few times.

1:08:07.520 --> 1:08:11.680
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, I mean, so the twenty nineteen pro Am

1:08:11.800 --> 1:08:16.040
<v Speaker 2>so the pro Aram earlier this year. As as you mentioned,

1:08:16.600 --> 1:08:19.120
<v Speaker 2>there are just two rounds at Pebble Beach, but the

1:08:19.200 --> 1:08:22.920
<v Speaker 2>golf course was set up as narrow at the pro

1:08:23.000 --> 1:08:25.280
<v Speaker 2>Am as it will be in the open, and so

1:08:25.400 --> 1:08:29.559
<v Speaker 2>looking at the players who did well isn't necessarily going

1:08:29.600 --> 1:08:32.160
<v Speaker 2>to determine who you think is going to win, but

1:08:33.080 --> 1:08:35.599
<v Speaker 2>it's still kind of interesting. So the players who played

1:08:35.640 --> 1:08:39.000
<v Speaker 2>best at the twenty nineteen pro Am were at Pebble

1:08:39.040 --> 1:08:42.439
<v Speaker 2>Beach were Seawou Kim, who shot ten under over his

1:08:42.520 --> 1:08:45.720
<v Speaker 2>two rounds at Pebble Beach, Phil Mickelson obviously, who won

1:08:45.760 --> 1:08:48.120
<v Speaker 2>the golf the big Woo Woo could do well. Ball

1:08:48.120 --> 1:08:52.640
<v Speaker 2>striker Phil Mickelson at minus nine he obviously won the

1:08:52.640 --> 1:08:56.000
<v Speaker 2>tournament shot sixty five on Sunday. And then some interesting

1:08:56.080 --> 1:08:58.720
<v Speaker 2>names come up. Kevin Streelman, your favorite.

1:08:58.640 --> 1:09:01.679
<v Speaker 1>Kevin Streelman has to beat He's not in the field

1:09:01.720 --> 1:09:05.479
<v Speaker 1>this week, but he has an unbelievable record at at

1:09:05.600 --> 1:09:06.679
<v Speaker 1>and t he does well.

1:09:06.800 --> 1:09:09.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and so it's just like players of this type

1:09:09.280 --> 1:09:12.519
<v Speaker 2>keep popping up doing well at a Pebble Beach. Scott

1:09:13.200 --> 1:09:17.639
<v Speaker 2>Scott Stallings did well, Lucas Glover, Michael Thompson, Jim Feerick

1:09:17.960 --> 1:09:20.800
<v Speaker 2>and then Cameron Champ and so it's a.

1:09:20.760 --> 1:09:24.120
<v Speaker 1>Mixture, unbelievable Cameron Champ in there, and that's one of

1:09:24.160 --> 1:09:25.720
<v Speaker 1>the I think that's one of the cool things, is

1:09:25.760 --> 1:09:29.080
<v Speaker 1>like pebble Beach doesn't discriminate against a type of player.

1:09:29.160 --> 1:09:32.240
<v Speaker 2>That's exactly the point, Yeah, for sure. And so somebody

1:09:32.320 --> 1:09:37.040
<v Speaker 2>like Cameron Champ, although he hasn't played well recently, someone

1:09:37.200 --> 1:09:41.479
<v Speaker 2>like that, I don't think he's Yeah. Yeah, in any case,

1:09:42.040 --> 1:09:45.240
<v Speaker 2>players like that could do well. But also Jim Feurick

1:09:45.400 --> 1:09:49.439
<v Speaker 2>could could do well. So you know, the door is

1:09:49.520 --> 1:09:52.679
<v Speaker 2>open for a number of different players to win this Open.

1:09:52.800 --> 1:09:55.599
<v Speaker 2>I think that it will be a really interesting tournament

1:09:55.640 --> 1:09:56.200
<v Speaker 2>as a result.

1:09:56.960 --> 1:10:01.839
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I agree. I think there's there's why range of players.

1:10:02.120 --> 1:10:04.880
<v Speaker 1>I like him really compelled to pick Web Simpson, but

1:10:04.960 --> 1:10:07.840
<v Speaker 1>I whimped out last minute and picked DJ.

1:10:08.600 --> 1:10:10.160
<v Speaker 2>Well, that's not a bad choice though.

1:10:10.240 --> 1:10:12.519
<v Speaker 1>Polly said something. He's like, you know, keep in mind

1:10:13.000 --> 1:10:17.640
<v Speaker 1>US Opens, you know usually don't yield fluke winners, Like

1:10:17.960 --> 1:10:21.120
<v Speaker 1>usually the winner of a US Open is a very

1:10:21.400 --> 1:10:24.840
<v Speaker 1>high profile player, and that's what made me flip it

1:10:24.880 --> 1:10:27.360
<v Speaker 1>at the last minute. Even though Web Simpson's one web

1:10:28.080 --> 1:10:31.440
<v Speaker 1>Us might be the least fluky player of all fluky players.

1:10:31.640 --> 1:10:36.040
<v Speaker 2>He won at Olympic Club, which has some of the

1:10:36.280 --> 1:10:38.960
<v Speaker 2>features that we've been talking about. It's built on the

1:10:38.960 --> 1:10:42.080
<v Speaker 2>side of a hill, it's got fairly small targets. I'm

1:10:42.080 --> 1:10:43.960
<v Speaker 2>not saying web Simpson is going to win. It's just

1:10:44.040 --> 1:10:46.320
<v Speaker 2>that this is a really good chance for him. It's

1:10:46.360 --> 1:10:49.200
<v Speaker 2>also a really good chance for Matt Coucher, and that

1:10:49.240 --> 1:10:51.960
<v Speaker 2>would be fascinating to see him win, and people's reactions

1:10:51.960 --> 1:10:54.160
<v Speaker 2>to that at this point in that Couture's career.

1:10:54.560 --> 1:10:58.080
<v Speaker 1>Especially like the juxtaposition of people's reactions when he came

1:10:58.160 --> 1:11:02.240
<v Speaker 1>so close at Birkdale, where everybody's like, oh, man, look at.

1:11:02.600 --> 1:11:04.680
<v Speaker 2>The family man. You know where you feel that for him.

1:11:07.439 --> 1:11:11.280
<v Speaker 2>Things have changed for mac Houture's public image since since Birkdale.

1:11:11.760 --> 1:11:15.439
<v Speaker 2>But if he's not thinking right now, this is probably

1:11:15.520 --> 1:11:18.439
<v Speaker 2>my best chance to win a major, maybe for the

1:11:18.479 --> 1:11:20.559
<v Speaker 2>rest of my career. I don't know what he's thinking,

1:11:20.600 --> 1:11:23.240
<v Speaker 2>you know, because it's just it would be.

1:11:23.439 --> 1:11:27.560
<v Speaker 1>It would be perfect, A good juxtaposition of Northern California

1:11:27.600 --> 1:11:31.639
<v Speaker 1>golf courses would be it's going to be this open

1:11:31.680 --> 1:11:34.240
<v Speaker 1>at Pebble and Harding Park, right.

1:11:34.920 --> 1:11:37.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Do you think Harding Park is going to be

1:11:37.080 --> 1:11:39.080
<v Speaker 2>a little Bethpage.

1:11:39.800 --> 1:11:42.600
<v Speaker 1>I don't think even Bethpage, because Beth Page had like

1:11:42.680 --> 1:11:44.720
<v Speaker 1>the tremendous topography.

1:11:45.240 --> 1:11:46.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's true.

1:11:46.560 --> 1:11:48.920
<v Speaker 1>I think it's going to be like, it's gonna be

1:11:49.000 --> 1:11:53.120
<v Speaker 1>like TPC, you know, I mean it is a TPC.

1:11:53.320 --> 1:11:56.519
<v Speaker 2>Well, it's TPC Harding Park. Yeah right, I mean that

1:11:56.800 --> 1:11:59.880
<v Speaker 2>Harding Park could be set up in so many different ways, right,

1:12:00.040 --> 1:12:04.679
<v Speaker 2>because it's for daily play, it's it's it's super playable.

1:12:04.680 --> 1:12:07.160
<v Speaker 2>But I'm sure they're gonna do some do some nonsense

1:12:07.200 --> 1:12:07.439
<v Speaker 2>to it.

1:12:07.840 --> 1:12:11.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and it just doesn't have like it. The challenges

1:12:11.600 --> 1:12:15.519
<v Speaker 1>presented are the complete opposite ones where they're actually very

1:12:15.560 --> 1:12:19.800
<v Speaker 1>simple challenges versus the Pebble challenges, which we've you know,

1:12:20.040 --> 1:12:25.240
<v Speaker 1>talked for forty minutes about. So the yeah, so so

1:12:26.560 --> 1:12:29.360
<v Speaker 1>you know Web Web also like you know, when you

1:12:29.400 --> 1:12:33.240
<v Speaker 1>look at his major record heading in you know, he's

1:12:33.280 --> 1:12:36.919
<v Speaker 1>he's finished in the top twenty in the last six majors.

1:12:37.400 --> 1:12:39.080
<v Speaker 1>If you throw in the players, he has a win

1:12:39.120 --> 1:12:40.160
<v Speaker 1>in another top five.

1:12:40.640 --> 1:12:44.679
<v Speaker 2>I mean it's the signs are promising. Yeah for Web

1:12:44.720 --> 1:12:45.840
<v Speaker 2>definitely top five.

1:12:45.880 --> 1:12:48.280
<v Speaker 1>And then I was talking to Roberto Castro yesterday on

1:12:48.320 --> 1:12:52.160
<v Speaker 1>the range and he was saying that Hamilton was like

1:12:52.360 --> 1:12:56.719
<v Speaker 1>almost the best course you could couldn't play a better

1:12:56.760 --> 1:13:00.080
<v Speaker 1>course in prep for the for Pebble than Hamilton. You

1:13:00.160 --> 1:13:03.519
<v Speaker 1>hit a lot of different uh you know, the variety

1:13:03.560 --> 1:13:05.280
<v Speaker 1>of shots you hit off the tee is not like

1:13:05.520 --> 1:13:08.719
<v Speaker 1>there's some x amount of iron holes, x amount of fairway.

1:13:08.880 --> 1:13:10.719
<v Speaker 1>It would be like you hit driver, then he hit iron,

1:13:10.760 --> 1:13:13.000
<v Speaker 1>then he hit fairway. Would you know there was movement

1:13:13.040 --> 1:13:17.040
<v Speaker 1>in the fairways like thick rough, like in pretty narrow.

1:13:17.560 --> 1:13:19.920
<v Speaker 1>It was pretty fascinating to hear him talk about it

1:13:20.160 --> 1:13:23.920
<v Speaker 1>and you the same exact characteristics. And Web almost won

1:13:24.000 --> 1:13:25.400
<v Speaker 1>last week, right.

1:13:25.479 --> 1:13:28.200
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, yeah, he would be a really smart pick.

1:13:28.280 --> 1:13:30.240
<v Speaker 2>It's almost starting to seem too smart.

1:13:30.400 --> 1:13:33.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I know that's the problem him and like pop

1:13:33.880 --> 1:13:36.600
<v Speaker 1>off the page. And with the US Open, like you know,

1:13:36.680 --> 1:13:40.200
<v Speaker 1>you can just have one hole that completely derails everything.

1:13:40.320 --> 1:13:42.160
<v Speaker 1>So that's like the crazy I think that's one of

1:13:42.200 --> 1:13:44.840
<v Speaker 1>the cool things with the US Open is like in

1:13:45.680 --> 1:13:49.240
<v Speaker 1>major golf in general, you see where like that that

1:13:49.360 --> 1:13:52.880
<v Speaker 1>line is so thin where And I think this is

1:13:52.920 --> 1:13:55.880
<v Speaker 1>what maybe some of the issue with Beth Page was

1:13:55.880 --> 1:14:00.479
<v Speaker 1>was there was no there was no opportunity for like,

1:14:00.520 --> 1:14:02.120
<v Speaker 1>you never felt like there was going to be a

1:14:02.120 --> 1:14:04.839
<v Speaker 1>triple there was a triple bogie lurking. And that's something

1:14:04.880 --> 1:14:08.880
<v Speaker 1>that at Pebble can happen in a split second.

1:14:08.840 --> 1:14:11.960
<v Speaker 2>Right, especially if the wind kicks up. Anything could happen,

1:14:12.400 --> 1:14:17.479
<v Speaker 2>you know. I think that you'll see places on the

1:14:17.520 --> 1:14:20.080
<v Speaker 2>course that are a little bit softened. You know, in

1:14:20.240 --> 1:14:24.360
<v Speaker 2>previous US opens, the fourteenth Green has been the site

1:14:24.400 --> 1:14:27.519
<v Speaker 2>of some misery. You know, players just going back and forth,

1:14:27.600 --> 1:14:30.719
<v Speaker 2>back and forth, and it's still really severe. It's still

1:14:30.760 --> 1:14:34.080
<v Speaker 2>really hard that false front if you're you know, I

1:14:34.160 --> 1:14:36.599
<v Speaker 2>landed an approach shot ten feet short of that pin

1:14:36.680 --> 1:14:39.599
<v Speaker 2>and it came back off the and so I got

1:14:39.640 --> 1:14:42.960
<v Speaker 2>the full experience there. But they did extend the back

1:14:43.000 --> 1:14:46.320
<v Speaker 2>of that green. I believe there's more pinnable area. The

1:14:46.400 --> 1:14:49.559
<v Speaker 2>same is true of the seventeenth hole. The seventeenth Green

1:14:49.560 --> 1:14:53.840
<v Speaker 2>in twenty ten was basically impossible to hit, and they

1:14:53.960 --> 1:14:57.960
<v Speaker 2>rebuilt the thirteenth green. There are the places on the

1:14:58.000 --> 1:15:02.000
<v Speaker 2>golf course where you really saw hard ejections, guys just

1:15:02.080 --> 1:15:06.120
<v Speaker 2>going back and forth and making quadruple bogie. I don't

1:15:06.120 --> 1:15:09.200
<v Speaker 2>think you'll see as many of those but at the

1:15:09.240 --> 1:15:12.680
<v Speaker 2>same time, if the wind picks up at all, and

1:15:12.720 --> 1:15:15.400
<v Speaker 2>the forecast does not seem to suggest that it really will,

1:15:16.000 --> 1:15:20.120
<v Speaker 2>But if there's any weather whatsoever, things can turn in

1:15:20.200 --> 1:15:23.599
<v Speaker 2>an instant and it will get really interesting. And I

1:15:23.640 --> 1:15:26.080
<v Speaker 2>hope it does because it will highlight some of the

1:15:26.080 --> 1:15:29.080
<v Speaker 2>precision play. Is the person who has the golfer, who

1:15:29.120 --> 1:15:31.600
<v Speaker 2>has the best control over his golf ball, if the

1:15:31.600 --> 1:15:34.759
<v Speaker 2>wind picks up, will immediately become apparent.

1:15:34.880 --> 1:15:36.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. One of the things that's tough is that we're

1:15:36.720 --> 1:15:39.599
<v Speaker 1>seeing the same wind almost every day. Like it looks

1:15:39.600 --> 1:15:42.679
<v Speaker 1>like it's just going to be a west or west southwest.

1:15:42.120 --> 1:15:45.200
<v Speaker 2>Ten to fifteen miles per hour. It'll be I think

1:15:45.240 --> 1:15:48.000
<v Speaker 2>it'll be fairly predictable conditions, but it'll be beautiful, you know.

1:15:48.080 --> 1:15:51.920
<v Speaker 1>I think the television will be a television product will pop,

1:15:52.000 --> 1:15:55.200
<v Speaker 1>It'll look awesome. Yeah, So all right, this will be

1:15:55.240 --> 1:15:58.719
<v Speaker 1>the first of many pods, so I hope so yeah,

1:15:59.120 --> 1:16:01.320
<v Speaker 1>it we'll chop it up some more. But it was

1:16:01.920 --> 1:16:05.639
<v Speaker 1>good talking. Everybody followed Garrett. It's still g Ford right,

1:16:06.040 --> 1:16:09.400
<v Speaker 1>g Ford Golf, g Ford Golf at g Ford Golf

1:16:09.400 --> 1:16:14.080
<v Speaker 1>on Twitter and on Instagram, same thing, and uh, excited

1:16:14.080 --> 1:16:16.760
<v Speaker 1>to have him on. He'll have some a lot of

1:16:17.479 --> 1:16:20.200
<v Speaker 1>written content on the website. Go up there with the

1:16:20.320 --> 1:16:22.400
<v Speaker 1>Frida egg dot com and sign up if you haven't.

1:16:22.640 --> 1:16:24.920
<v Speaker 1>But we'll have a good championship. We'll have a few

1:16:24.960 --> 1:16:28.719
<v Speaker 1>more pods this week and look forward to Pebble Beach.

1:16:28.840 --> 1:16:31.280
<v Speaker 1>Hope this one. Hope this adds some color to people

1:16:31.280 --> 1:16:32.240
<v Speaker 1>that haven't been out here.

1:16:32.560 --> 1:16:46.080
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely thanks Andy,