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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here

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Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of

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Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election.

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Speaker 1: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade

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Speaker 1: the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent

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Speaker 1: coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about,

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Speaker 1: it just means the absolute world to have your support.

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Speaker 1: But enough with that, let's get to the show. Good morning, everybody,

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Speaker 1: Happy Thursday. We have an amazing show for everybody today.

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Speaker 1: What do we have Bristal Indeed, we do lots of

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Speaker 1: big stories breaking this morning. Big news on TikTok, continued

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Speaker 1: market fallout after that SVB bailout, and another bank that

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Speaker 1: may be on the brink and it is a really

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Speaker 1: big one, so we'll definitely talk about that. We also

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Speaker 1: have some new details about what exactly happened behind the

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Speaker 1: scenes in terms of crafting that bailout. Jamie Diamond was involved,

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Speaker 1: Nancy Pelosi was involved. Former Obama officials who are now

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Speaker 1: bankers were involved, So definitely want to break all of

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Speaker 1: that down for you. We also are tracking the freak

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Speaker 1: out over Rhonda Santis' comments on Ukraine. Big news out

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Speaker 1: of Michigan. We're right to work has now been repealed

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Speaker 1: its anti union legislations, the first time in sixty years

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Speaker 1: that a state has gone in the other direction actually

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Speaker 1: repealed right to work. And a big old debate on

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Speaker 1: wokeness that Sager and I are going to weigh into.

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Speaker 1: You guys probably have already seen this viral clip, but

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Speaker 1: we wanted to react to it potentially debated. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: we might agree, might not. And we also have lever

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Speaker 1: news in the show. They have been doing phenomenal reporting

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Speaker 1: on SVB and they have a couple of new, brand

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Speaker 1: new blockbuster reports there about the deregulation that helped contribute

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Speaker 1: to this entire crisis. Sager obviously not in the studio

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Speaker 1: today down in Texas handling some personal family business. Yes,

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Speaker 1: thank you everybody for bearing with me. My dad got

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Speaker 1: into a little bit of an accident. My mom is

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Speaker 1: an India right now, on the other side of the globe,

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Speaker 1: so I had to come down here on the drop

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Speaker 1: of a hat and help them out. So everybody bear

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Speaker 1: with me technologically and all of that. But we're still

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Speaker 1: going to have a great show for everybody, just as

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Speaker 1: a reminder though, Spotify for those who are watching us

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Speaker 1: the show. So there you go breaking Points dot com.

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Speaker 1: good to go. And I genuinely do enjoy the experience myself.

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Speaker 1: In fact, Counterpoints had a huge week. They had their

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Speaker 1: largest number ever podcast downloads tooesday. People are loving it

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Speaker 1: for Counterpoints as well. All right, let's get to the

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Speaker 1: news because we have some big news that broke late

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Speaker 1: last night. Go ahead and put this up on the screen, guys.

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Speaker 1: So the Biden administration is taking a much more aggressive

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Speaker 1: stance with regard to TikTok. The headline from the New

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Speaker 1: York Times here is they say the US pushes for

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Speaker 1: TikTok sale to resolve national security concerns. The demand hardens

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Speaker 1: the White House's stance towards the popular video app, which

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Speaker 1: is owned by the Chinese internet company byte Dance. Let

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Speaker 1: me just read a little bit from this report. They

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Speaker 1: say the Biden administration wants TikTok's Chinese ownership to sell

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Speaker 1: the app or face a possible ban. TikTok set on

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Speaker 1: Wednesday as the White House hardens it stance. The new

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Speaker 1: demand to sell the app was delivered to TikTok in

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Speaker 1: recent weeks to people with knowledge said it is owned

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Speaker 1: by Byteedance. The move is a significant shift in the

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Speaker 1: Biden Administration's position toward TikTok, which has been under scrutiny

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Speaker 1: over fears that Beijing could request American's data from the app.

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Speaker 1: They had been trying to negotiate an agreement that would

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Speaker 1: apply new safeguards to the data and eliminate a need

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Speaker 1: for byte Dance to sell it shares in the app,

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Speaker 1: but the demand for a sale hardens. The administration's approach

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Speaker 1: harkens back to the position of former President Donald Trump,

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Speaker 1: who threatened to ban TikTok unless it was sold to

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Speaker 1: an American company. So, Sager, what do you make of this?

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Speaker 1: What is the significance of this shift? And you know,

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Speaker 1: do you think it's the right move? Oh? I absolutely

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Speaker 1: think it's the right move. And let me just take

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Speaker 1: a step back and explain to people why the Trump

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Speaker 1: administration's attempt here failed. So, the reason that the Trump

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Speaker 1: attempt to force a sale of part of TikTok to

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Speaker 1: Oracle failed is because US investors in Byte Dance, the

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Speaker 1: Chinese holding company, were able to sue and say that

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Speaker 1: it was a violation of their fiduciary rights. Now, what

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Speaker 1: has ended up happening is that the Biden administration has

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Speaker 1: endorsed a bipartisan bill in Congress by Senator Mark Warner

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Speaker 1: and some other Republicans that would actually give the president

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Speaker 1: the unilateral authority to ban the app without having to

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Speaker 1: go through the process injured in court. So what Biden

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Speaker 1: has communicated to TikTok here is you can either force

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Speaker 1: a sale or when this legislation passes, we will just

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Speaker 1: straight up ban you. It gives them the hammer that

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Speaker 1: Trump did not have in his arsenal while he was

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Speaker 1: the president, and also frankly, just because he didn't do

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Speaker 1: it in a competent enough manner and basically just lost interest.

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Speaker 1: So a force sale here would require buyt Dance to

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Speaker 1: completely divest itself of any ownership stake in TikTok. That

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Speaker 1: is going to be very difficult for a number of reasons.

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Speaker 1: Number One, even if by Dance and its CEO Jiang

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Speaker 1: Jiming agreed to sell TikTok to a US investor, A,

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Speaker 1: it needs to be valued properly for ByteDance shareholders in China,

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Speaker 1: But b it has to be approved by Chinese regulators. Now,

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Speaker 1: why would China voluntarily allow one of the greatest spyware

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Speaker 1: apps of all time that potentially over one hundred million

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Speaker 1: Americans are coming to contact with almost on a daily basis,

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Speaker 1: and approve that on a regulatory manner. To them, the

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Speaker 1: money is second, and the soft power use of TikTok

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Speaker 1: has always been number one. And then two on the

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Speaker 1: Biden side, having the authority to ban it and to

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Speaker 1: try and force a sale. They are going to have

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Speaker 1: to go then and get involved on the deal breaking

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Speaker 1: brokering process, almost like they are within the banks, because

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Speaker 1: it will be difficult for somebody to raise the amount

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Speaker 1: of capital to actually buy TikTok. I mean, we should

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Speaker 1: remember this is a social media app on par with

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Speaker 1: Facebook and with Google. I mean, it's a gigantic company.

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Speaker 1: It's pouring and making oodles of money in its advertising.

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Speaker 1: It's actually quite innovative in terms of not only its

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Speaker 1: algorithm but a lot of its new advertising strategy. So

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Speaker 1: I'm personally a bit dubious crystal that a forced sale

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Speaker 1: will occur, because even if somebody were to come up

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Speaker 1: with who knows, I mean, we could be talking about

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Speaker 1: one hundred two hundred billion dollars in a financing deal

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Speaker 1: in the US, or even some sort of conglomerate ownership stake.

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Speaker 1: Will the Chinese regulators even sign off on this? So

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Speaker 1: I don't think that the future is long for TikTok

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Speaker 1: in this world here in the U. So you think

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Speaker 1: they're basically going to dare the US administration to ban

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Speaker 1: TikTok rather than allow it to be solables, because then

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Speaker 1: they know they're not really getting anything out of it

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Speaker 1: if it gets sold to a third party. Let's think

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Speaker 1: about it from our perspective. Right now, China does not

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Speaker 1: allow any US based social media company to operate in China.

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Speaker 1: Let's say China was like, okay, Facebook, you have to

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Speaker 1: sell Facebook to a Chinese company? Would we really allow

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Speaker 1: them to do that? Like, just just think about it

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Speaker 1: from our perspective. Our tech byt Dance is a sign

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Speaker 1: of serious pride inside of China. It's one of the

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Speaker 1: most successful technology companies literally of all time, is genuinely

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Speaker 1: revolutionary in the social media world. And it's also they

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Speaker 1: have proprietary algorithms of technology that they use on their

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Speaker 1: own version of TikTok inside of China. So just for

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Speaker 1: that reason, I'm dubious that they would actually allow the

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Speaker 1: intellectual property and the sale to go through. But I

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Speaker 1: could be totally wrong. It could be that byte Dance

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Speaker 1: and it's CEO are able to finagle this through the SEAC.

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Speaker 1: But given the way that we know that Shishingping has

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Speaker 1: approached Chinese tech companies, I think that the day of

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Speaker 1: deference to money, to capitalism and to these tech CEOs,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of long been over in China. That's why

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Speaker 1: they threw Jack Mob basically in a prison for a

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Speaker 1: couple of months and showed him who's boss took the

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Speaker 1: ali Ipo and all that off, And it was specifically

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Speaker 1: to show them They're like, look, the party is in charge.

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Speaker 1: All private business is subject to the interests of the CCP. Again,

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Speaker 1: I could be totally wrong, but you know, just from

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Speaker 1: a pure capital perspective, Look, we're in a down market

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Speaker 1: right now. Tech companies obviously are not doing so well.

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Speaker 1: It's probably the worst time to try and pursue a

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Speaker 1: for sale. And then on top of that, Chinese regulators

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Speaker 1: would have to pursue it. So it is certainly possible.

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Speaker 1: I shouldn't speak to declaratively, but for a lot of

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Speaker 1: the reasons that I'm laying out here, I think it

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Speaker 1: will be difficult for them to try any sort of sale.

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Speaker 1: It's possible, though, it's certainly well. There are some corporate

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Speaker 1: aligned incentives for the Biden administration to ban it, because

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Speaker 1: obviously TikTok has been eating everyone's lunch, especially where teenagers

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Speaker 1: and young people are concerned. So you know, Suckerberg would

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Speaker 1: be super happy, Elon would be super happy, and especially

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Speaker 1: Google owner of course, of YouTube would be incredibly happy

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Speaker 1: because all of these companies have been trying to effectively

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Speaker 1: replicate the magic that TikTok has with their algorithm, their

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Speaker 1: for you page, these short, you know, viral videos that

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Speaker 1: have caught fire among young people in this country. So

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Speaker 1: you know, they would be happy, certainly to have one

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Speaker 1: of their competitors knocked off the playing field. And it

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Speaker 1: always makes something more likely to happen when corporate America

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Speaker 1: is going to be on your side and going to

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Speaker 1: be behind you in terms of taking that action. That's

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Speaker 1: such an excellent point. No single company has suffered more

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Speaker 1: because of TikTok than Meta. I mean, Facebook and Instagram

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Speaker 1: daily active users amongst teenagers plummeted. TikTok basically is eating

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Speaker 1: their lunch. YouTube has, you know, they're attempting with shorts,

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Speaker 1: Instagram obviously with reels, and I'm sure you know Twitter

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Speaker 1: at Snapchat I know also has been trying to play

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Speaker 1: in this game. But you're right, and one of the

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Speaker 1: this is why it's complicated. I don't want to say

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Speaker 1: we should ban it in order to benefit Facebook. I

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Speaker 1: think a better way to do it would be the

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Speaker 1: way that the Indians have it, so Instagram reels did

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Speaker 1: not necessarily take the line share of what the Indian

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Speaker 1: user base was using TikTok for. There were a variety

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Speaker 1: of new competitors that sprang up in the space, So

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Speaker 1: I think it would be ideal to have some maybe

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Speaker 1: a revival of mine, but in my you know, in

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Speaker 1: my opinion, a brand new or a new actual wild

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Speaker 1: West type competition for this type of technology in this

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Speaker 1: user so it doesn't just get rolled up into a

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Speaker 1: larger technology company. So I want to acknowledge that you're right,

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Speaker 1: which is that there's a reason that Facebook's Mark Zuckerberg,

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Speaker 1: after basically at one point allegedly offering to name his

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Speaker 1: child after Shishingping in twenty fifteen to get Facebook in there,

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Speaker 1: is now like I am a great, big American warrior,

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Speaker 1: and that's why we need to ban TikTok. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: get out of here. Yeah, I don't sell your soul

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Speaker 1: if you could go into China. And it's not like

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Speaker 1: any of these people are like really serious about privacy

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Speaker 1: concerns either, So it's all you know, that's all of ours.

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Speaker 1: I mean, listen, let's be real. The most likely thing

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Speaker 1: to happen if TikTok is banned. Is that those you

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Speaker 1: are going to go to the existing platforms because they

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Speaker 1: have gigantic monopolies and at this point they've had some

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Speaker 1: time to try to build capabilities and functions on their

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Speaker 1: own platforms that replicate some of what TikTok ultimately did.

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Speaker 1: But you know, I think the security national security concerns

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Speaker 1: here are obviously legitimate. And just one final note on this,

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Speaker 1: Apparently the CEO of TikTok is scheduled to testify before

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Speaker 1: the House Energy and Commerce Committee next week. He's of

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Speaker 1: course expected face questions about the apps sizes to China

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Speaker 1: as well as concerns that delivers harmful content to young people,

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Speaker 1: so that will be something to keep an eye on.

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Speaker 1: All right, we want to shift to what is happening

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Speaker 1: this morning in terms of the stock markets. There has

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Speaker 1: been it's been kind of a roller coaster ride ever

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Speaker 1: since the Biden administration announced their big bailout of SVB,

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Speaker 1: backstopping all the depositors, not really just SVB or even Signature,

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Speaker 1: but really kind of tacitly all depositors across the country,

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Speaker 1: announcing a new lending facility at the FED to try

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Speaker 1: to shore up the balance sheets and profiles of mid

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Speaker 1: sized bands. Thanks so initially there was encouraging signs the

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Speaker 1: shares drop, then they were back up, and then the

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Speaker 1: latest fallout has a lot to do with the fact

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Speaker 1: that Credit Sue, which is a gigantic bank is announced

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Speaker 1: that they were on shaky ground and one of their

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Speaker 1: biggest financial backers also said they were not going to

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Speaker 1: give them an infusion of cash, so that created more

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Speaker 1: uncertainty in the market. Let's go and put this up

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Speaker 1: on the screen. That's the very latest from CNBC this morning.

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Speaker 1: Apparently Dow futures are down, regional bank shares dropped. Their

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Speaker 1: analysis here is that futures tied to the Dow Juhns

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Speaker 1: industrial average felt Thursday is regional banks slid once again

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Speaker 1: on growing fears of a crisis in banking within the

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Speaker 1: US and Europe. Credit Suite announced overnight they will borrow

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Speaker 1: up to nearly fifty four billion dollars from the Swiss

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Speaker 1: National Bank to try to assure short short term liquidity.

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Speaker 1: That did offer some relief, but ultimately looks like not

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Speaker 1: enough to quell fears on Wall Street this morning, and

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Speaker 1: just to give you a sense of what they have

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Speaker 1: been looking like in these markets, and what a wild

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Speaker 1: ride it has been this week. Let's go ahead and

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Speaker 1: put this up on the screen. You can see here

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Speaker 1: there's a chart, this from Neil Irwin. He says, just

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Speaker 1: your standard issue forty plus basis point drop in the

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Speaker 1: two year yield on treasuries blowing through Monday's lows. Very cool,

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Speaker 1: very normal. And for those who aren't you well steeped

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Speaker 1: in all the financial jargon, et cetera, all this means

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Speaker 1: is it's a sign that investors are fleeing for safety.

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Speaker 1: That's what this indicates. They're worried about the volatility and

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Speaker 1: they are fleeing to what they consider to be the

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Speaker 1: safest of assets, these two year treasury bonds. Let's go

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Speaker 1: ahead and put this next piece up on the screen

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Speaker 1: because it spells out the issues with credit suee. So

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Speaker 1: what happened here is they put out a statement that said,

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Speaker 1: effectively like we got some problems, and they went to

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Speaker 1: one of their top lenders to try to secure some

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Speaker 1: additional funding. They said no, and so that is what

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Speaker 1: created this all out in the European markets. Now, yesterday

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Speaker 1: we got an announcement from the Swiss National Bank that

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Speaker 1: they will provide liquidity to Credit Suisse if necessary in

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Speaker 1: hopes of shoring up the fallout that's happening there, because

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Speaker 1: as SVB is nothing compared to the size of Credit

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Speaker 1: Swie truly, so if there were really major issues there,

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Speaker 1: that would be a huge problem, not just for Europe

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Speaker 1: but for all of global banking. This is really crazy,

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Speaker 1: and it's actually interesting to take a step back and

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Speaker 1: realize that what happened to SVB while SBV, where we

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Speaker 1: watch very much, was irresponsible with the way that they

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Speaker 1: handled their balance sheet, and it did reveal a ticking

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Speaker 1: time bomb kind of the center of all banking, which

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Speaker 1: is that because they were reliant so much on heavily

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Speaker 1: on treasuries and in their asset balance sheet in order

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Speaker 1: to cover their deposits, whenever the Federal Reserve was increasing

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Speaker 1: rates and decreasing that amount, you at the exact same

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Speaker 1: time you had capital crunches across the entire industry, and

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Speaker 1: you made money more expensive to borrow. People were actually

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Speaker 1: tapping into their real hard earned cash, So you both

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Speaker 1: devalued the assets that a lot of these banks were

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Speaker 1: purchasing that they deemed safe, and they also had to

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Speaker 1: increase the amount of cash that they were giving out.

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Speaker 1: So this isn't quite what happened with mortgage backed securities,

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Speaker 1: but I think it's an unintended consequence of the Federal Reserve.

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Speaker 1: And to me, look, I mean it just it reveals

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Speaker 1: all of these people were so called geniuses that make

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Speaker 1: the financial system run, from the Federal Reserve to the

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Speaker 1: Department and Treasury to these highly paid multi millionaire one

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Speaker 1: hundred millionaire bankers. They don't know what they're doing. And

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Speaker 1: when they don't know what they're doing, who actually steps

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Speaker 1: in in this case might be the Swiss taxpayer, who knows,

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Speaker 1: you know how much more the US taxpayer may be

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Speaker 1: on the hook here. But clearly we are seeing contagion

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Speaker 1: within the market that goes deep. And I think that

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Speaker 1: says a lot also because Crystal, now the bankers are

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Speaker 1: more upset about the Fed. Now the financial media is

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Speaker 1: willing to step in and talk about the Federal Reserve

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Speaker 1: and as problems. Not when they were trying to intentionally

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Speaker 1: make people be unemployed, No, no no, no, no, that was

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Speaker 1: completely fine and it didn't bear any scrutiny. Yes, But

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Speaker 1: now that their asses are on the line and those

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Speaker 1: of their friends, suddenly there's a lot of freak out

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Speaker 1: and a lot of attention being paid to what exactly

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Speaker 1: the FED is going to do, whether they're going to

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Speaker 1: continue to lift rates or whether they're going to go

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Speaker 1: in the opposite direction. And I actually in my monologue,

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Speaker 1: I am doing a deep dive on the many, many

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Speaker 1: FED failures that contributed to getting us to this point,

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Speaker 1: and that you know, that doesn't absolve the sins of

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Speaker 1: the bank managers at Silicon Valley Bank or any of

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Speaker 1: these other places, but you know, they were as regulators

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Speaker 1: completely asleep at the switch and helped with their interest

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Speaker 1: rate actions, both in providing easy money for so long

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Speaker 1: and then with the speed that they've been hiking interest rates,

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Speaker 1: they helped create these conditions of panic and contagion that

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Speaker 1: we are seeing now. Just to give you a little

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Speaker 1: bit more of the backstory here with regard to credit suitees,

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Speaker 1: which I think is important, they announced on Tuesday they

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Speaker 1: had found quote material weakness in financial reporting process from

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Speaker 1: prior years, so that's what's set off the initial freak out.

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Speaker 1: Then they went to the Saudi National Bank, which is

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Speaker 1: their largest financial packer, and they were like, nah, we're

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Speaker 1: not going to help you. Out on this one. So

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Speaker 1: that's what really led to the spiraling situation. I think

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Speaker 1: it's also important to point out, and we've probably done

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Speaker 1: some reporting on this in the past in our show,

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Speaker 1: that Credit Swie is not the most above board of banks.

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Speaker 1: I mean, Swiss banks obviously famous for being like, you know,

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Speaker 1: places where the worst people in the world go to

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Speaker 1: bank because of their intense secrecy and privacy laws. They

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Speaker 1: you know, were caught maintaining there's a big leak of

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Speaker 1: their data. They were caught maintaining bank accounts for human

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Speaker 1: trafficker in the Philippines, a Hong Kong stock exchange boss

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Speaker 1: jailed for bribery, a billionaire who murdered the murder of

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Speaker 1: his Lebanese pop star girlfriend, executives who looted Venezuela state

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Speaker 1: oil company, corrupt politicians from Egypt to Ukraine, et cetera.

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Speaker 1: In any case, so there's a lot of legacy issues,

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Speaker 1: let's say, with credits. And now this latest turmoil is

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Speaker 1: not just impacting them obviously not just impacting Switzerland, but

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Speaker 1: European stocks have really taken a hit, and stocks of

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Speaker 1: large banks including Wells Fargo, Goldman, Sachs, JP, Morgan City, group,

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Speaker 1: they all have suffered as people get more concerned about

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Speaker 1: where this could all end up. So let's talk about

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Speaker 1: some of the analysis, some of the more alarming analysis

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Speaker 1: of how this could all ultimately play out. Let's go

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Speaker 1: and put this next piece up on the screen, or

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Speaker 1: I guess we have a thought actually from Nouriel Rabini,

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Speaker 1: who's a famed economist talking about the fallout from credit

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Speaker 1: sweee and warning that this could be a Lehman Brothers

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Speaker 1: moment for European and for global markets. Let's take a

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Speaker 1: listen to that. However, the problem is that credited sweets

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Speaker 1: by some stands, might be too big to fail but

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Speaker 1: also to be saved. Is not clear that unlike the

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Speaker 1: United States, they federal system as enough resources to go

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Speaker 1: engineer failout. So SVP was only about the one hundred

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Speaker 1: and fifty billion dollars of assets, while in the case

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Speaker 1: of credit Swiss was speaking about at least a seven

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Speaker 1: hundred billion. So anything will happen to credit wist would

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Speaker 1: be of systemic effect for not just the European financial

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Speaker 1: system but also for the global financial system. So if

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Speaker 1: Silicon Valley Bank created equal effects in global financial market,

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Speaker 1: something bad happening to credit Swiss will be an order

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Speaker 1: of magnitud more severe, something more like a Liman moment.

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Speaker 1: Something more like a Liman moment. What did you make

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Speaker 1: of that, Zaga? Yeah, I mean, look, I think we

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Speaker 1: should take it. You know, I referenced this I was

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Speaker 1: reading Too Big to Fail, also rereading it on the

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Speaker 1: flight down here to Texas. And something that really comes

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Speaker 1: through throughout all of it was the greed with the

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Speaker 1: bankers up until the very last moment, where they wanted

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Speaker 1: to get the best deal possible even though they were

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Speaker 1: the ones that caused the system, but also the indifference

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Speaker 1: of federal regulators, who they're really just playing completely off

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Speaker 1: the seat. You know. Sometimes they're like, no, we're not

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Speaker 1: gonna have moral where we have to make sure we

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Speaker 1: don't put moral hazard. We're gonna let Leman fail. And

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Speaker 1: then oh and then they completely panic bail out AIG

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Speaker 1: past Tarp, bail out every large bank and broker deals,

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Speaker 1: but Bear Sterns get ones deal, Leman doesn't get another one.

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Speaker 1: The haphazard nature of it just shows you these people again,

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Speaker 1: they're not gods and kings. They're just like the rest

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Speaker 1: of us. They barely have any idea what they're doing,

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Speaker 1: but the consequences are so so high. So the lesson

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Speaker 1: of Leman moment really to me is we have no

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Speaker 1: idea what's going to happen. The best answer was to

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Speaker 1: have prudent financial regulation a decade ago, and now they

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Speaker 1: got us into this mess, right, and for regulators to

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Speaker 1: actually do their job and to have to have good

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Speaker 1: regulation in place is step one. Which we know that

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Speaker 1: Dodd Frank was insufficient to start with, and then it's

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Speaker 1: been shipped away and rolled back in the ensuing years,

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Speaker 1: and then you have regulators that obviously we're not paying

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Speaker 1: a time. I mean, with Silicon Valley Bank in particular,

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Speaker 1: we know a lot of details of what went wrong there.

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Speaker 1: At this point there were internal concerns that were raised

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Speaker 1: with executives about exactly what their balance sheet looked like.

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Speaker 1: I mean, so this was entirely predictable and was in

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Speaker 1: fact predicted not only by people who were inside of

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Speaker 1: that bank viewing, you know, what the balance sheet looked like,

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Speaker 1: and you know, using their brains to realize that they

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Speaker 1: had tremendous, tremendous risk due to the FED continuing to

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Speaker 1: hike rates and the concentration of their clients and relying

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Speaker 1: on depositors that were all, you know, Silicon Valley venture

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Speaker 1: backed startups. So you had that. You also had an

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Speaker 1: outside short seller who has been for months saying Silicon

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Speaker 1: Valley Bank is in trouble. Just look based on publicly

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Speaker 1: available information, look at what this balance sheet looks like.

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Speaker 1: But somehow regulators were caught completely unawares. And as you

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Speaker 1: pointed out previously, Soccer not even on the list of

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Speaker 1: potentially troubled banks. So I thought it was interesting. Ray Dali,

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Speaker 1: who is the founder of Bridgewater, he had an analysis

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Speaker 1: of what is going on now, and again I do

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Speaker 1: think it is really worth emphasizing none of these people

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Speaker 1: gave a shit about the FED hiking rates until suddenly

431
00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:12,560
Speaker 1: it was the banking sector that was having trouble. When

432
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:14,560
Speaker 1: it was regular people whose jobs were at stake and

433
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,480
Speaker 1: the policy was actively being engineered to hurt them, they

434
00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,439
Speaker 1: didn't care. Suddenly they're very interested. Okay, let's put Ray

435
00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:24,160
Speaker 1: Dalio's LinkedIn post that he has up on the screen. Here.

436
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,680
Speaker 1: He says what I think about the Silicon Valley Bank

437
00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:29,920
Speaker 1: situation and his analysis, and I think this is interesting.

438
00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:32,399
Speaker 1: He says, I think it is a very classic event

439
00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:36,440
Speaker 1: in the very classic bubble bursting part of the short

440
00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:38,800
Speaker 1: term debt cycle, which lasted about seven years give or

441
00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:41,960
Speaker 1: take about three in which the tight money to curtail

442
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,280
Speaker 1: credit growth and inflation. And by tight money he means

443
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:48,680
Speaker 1: the FED hiking rates leads to a self reinforcing debt

444
00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:52,800
Speaker 1: credit contraction that takes place via a domino falling like

445
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:57,960
Speaker 1: contagion process that continues until central banks create easy money

446
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:01,200
Speaker 1: that negates the debt credit contraction, thus producing more new

447
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:03,040
Speaker 1: credit and debt, which creates the seeds for the next

448
00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:06,199
Speaker 1: big debt problem. Until these short term cycles build up

449
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:08,239
Speaker 1: the debt assets and liabilities to the point that they

450
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:11,720
Speaker 1: are unsustainable and the whole thing collapses in a debt

451
00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:15,639
Speaker 1: restructuring and debt monetization, which typically happens about once every

452
00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,760
Speaker 1: seventy five years, give or take about twenty five years.

453
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:23,199
Speaker 1: So to put that in the PLAINUS language that I can, basically,

454
00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:27,240
Speaker 1: the FED created a bubble, inflated a bubble over years

455
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:31,280
Speaker 1: and years of basically zero interest rates, and certainly during

456
00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:35,840
Speaker 1: the coronavirus crisis when they injected trillions of dollars into

457
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:40,200
Speaker 1: the system to backstop bonds and all sorts of treasuries

458
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:42,240
Speaker 1: and all sorts of other things. Okay, so they created

459
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,480
Speaker 1: this bubble. They have now popped this bubble, and there's

460
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:49,080
Speaker 1: going to be a cycle of you know, potential recession, contagion,

461
00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:53,320
Speaker 1: freak ount, et cetera, until the Federal Reserve reserve versus

462
00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:56,960
Speaker 1: course and starts reinflating the bubble. And they will continue

463
00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:00,639
Speaker 1: in this cycle until you have some massive blow up

464
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:03,600
Speaker 1: explosion that is too big in terms of our economic

465
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 1: situation for them to be able to resolve just with

466
00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:12,320
Speaker 1: hiking rates or loosening policy. Well, you know, the actual

467
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,840
Speaker 1: answer to this is called congress. It's called fiscal policy.

468
00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:19,080
Speaker 1: We're not supposed to be run by barons in the

469
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:24,359
Speaker 1: Federal Reserve. We're supposed to have a democratic republic where

470
00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:27,399
Speaker 1: we get to weigh in and pass laws so that

471
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:30,480
Speaker 1: the ways that we conduct commerce don't put us all

472
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 1: in danger once every twenty five years. I mean, it's

473
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:37,120
Speaker 1: not that long since two thousand and eight. The really

474
00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,440
Speaker 1: crazy part when you read these books is how many

475
00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:42,440
Speaker 1: of the same people are running the same banks after

476
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,200
Speaker 1: they crash the ecopomy into the ground, even two thousand

477
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:47,879
Speaker 1: and eight. So we have the very same people in

478
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 1: charge here what the hell is going on? I don't know.

479
00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:53,359
Speaker 1: I can't help but step back and take a less

480
00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:56,199
Speaker 1: detached view of this and say, we have got to

481
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:59,480
Speaker 1: step in and do our jobs to make sure that

482
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,720
Speaker 1: this stuff doesn't keep happening. But we don't because everybody

483
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,680
Speaker 1: is making too much goddamn money at the top. Yeah. Well,

484
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 1: and there it has been since the Clinton administration that

485
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,639
Speaker 1: we were we had a president where there was not

486
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:18,160
Speaker 1: extraordinary action taken by the FED. So we are on

487
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,400
Speaker 1: this merry go round that Dalio describes here, and it's

488
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,919
Speaker 1: sort of spinning faster and faster because you know, the

489
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:25,919
Speaker 1: bailounts in two thousand and eight were really obvious and

490
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 1: really clear and set our politics on a crazy course

491
00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:32,159
Speaker 1: that we're still reckoning with now. But you know, the

492
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:36,200
Speaker 1: bail outs during the Corona Irish crisis were extraordinary as well.

493
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 1: And again it was because there's an understanding that Congress

494
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,800
Speaker 1: and the actual like parts of our democracy that the

495
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,399
Speaker 1: people have to say in are utterly dysfunctional. So they

496
00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 1: have these mechanisms in place that with regard to the FED,

497
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,920
Speaker 1: they're able to leverage to backstop the wealthiest and best

498
00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:58,159
Speaker 1: connected among us, while anybody else is just screwed and

499
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 1: hoping that maybe one day the Congress get a round

500
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:03,399
Speaker 1: to dealing with their problems. And you know, it's become

501
00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 1: particularly clear because it is true, inflation affects everybody. It's

502
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 1: devastating for working class people. It really is important that

503
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:14,880
Speaker 1: it be dealt with. But as we've been wondering from

504
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,239
Speaker 1: the beginning and raising a lot of questions about, it

505
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:20,960
Speaker 1: was never clear that hiking interest rates, the FED hiking

506
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:23,680
Speaker 1: interest rates was actually going to deal with that issue.

507
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:25,679
Speaker 1: And in fact, it hasn't. Right, we just got new

508
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:29,120
Speaker 1: inflation numbers that were not good. So even though they've

509
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:33,199
Speaker 1: embarked on this extraordinary course and you know, potentially broken

510
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 1: some important things in the economy, it still has not

511
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 1: gotten inflation under control. Because the FED can't end the

512
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:43,880
Speaker 1: war in Ukraine, the FED can't you know, unscrew our

513
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:47,040
Speaker 1: supply chain issues. The FED can't end the climate crisis,

514
00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:50,640
Speaker 1: which is also contributing to additional supply chain issues. And

515
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:54,160
Speaker 1: so even though they continue tightening and tightening and tightening

516
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:57,679
Speaker 1: at the expense of working people, it's not actually dealing

517
00:26:57,720 --> 00:26:59,720
Speaker 1: with the issue that they claim and purport to be

518
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 1: trying to solve. Yeah, I think that's well said. There's

519
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,199
Speaker 1: two ways to solve inflation, supply side, demand side. You

520
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:07,680
Speaker 1: can try both, but we're only trying one. And when

521
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:10,360
Speaker 1: you try one, crazy stuff happens. I don't think there's

522
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,200
Speaker 1: another way to say it. And I have one more

523
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,119
Speaker 1: piece here for you, sort of echoing what Dalio is saying,

524
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: Go ahead and put this up on the screen. From

525
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 1: The Guardian, CEO Blackrock, Larry Fink says that the collapse

526
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:26,439
Speaker 1: of Silicon Valley Bank could just be the start of

527
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:29,520
Speaker 1: a slow rolling crisis in the financial system, with more

528
00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:33,400
Speaker 1: seizures and shutdowns coming. So a lot of warnings here

529
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,880
Speaker 1: about where we are headed. He says it's too early

530
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,399
Speaker 1: to know how widespread the damages. The regulatory response has

531
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 1: so far been swift and decisive. Actions have helped stave

532
00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:44,200
Speaker 1: off contagion risk, but markets remain on edge. I mean,

533
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:46,920
Speaker 1: I actually have some real questions about that. In some ways,

534
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:49,400
Speaker 1: I think the fact that the federal government had such

535
00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:52,919
Speaker 1: an over the top response actually may have freaked investors

536
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 1: out more because what we've seen, what we were warned of,

537
00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:02,040
Speaker 1: was bank runs of depositors pulling their cash, and that

538
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,119
Speaker 1: may have happened to some extent. But what we have

539
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,800
Speaker 1: seen much more than that is investors who are herd

540
00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: beasts freaking out because of the over the top reaction

541
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,240
Speaker 1: of the federal government and you know, pulling their money

542
00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 1: from the stocks of these various banks. I think that's

543
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:20,480
Speaker 1: a great point, and I don't think we should lose

544
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 1: sight though, of who's actually making a ton of money

545
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,840
Speaker 1: from that, and this is the banks, Like, you're right,

546
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:27,600
Speaker 1: that may be the case in terms of their stock,

547
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:30,400
Speaker 1: but you know they have got that extraordinary Fed bailout

548
00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 1: that they've been able to backstop on. And I think

549
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:34,640
Speaker 1: your point is a good one. Another lesson from two

550
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:38,160
Speaker 1: thousand and eight, whenever investors realized that the federal government

551
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,600
Speaker 1: was taking the actions that it was in some cases

552
00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:44,479
Speaker 1: that actually triggered stock collapses because people were like, if

553
00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 1: the Feds have to step in, there's no private market solution,

554
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 1: then this thing is dead if we had to rely

555
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:52,600
Speaker 1: completely right government to save it. Right. Yeah. No, I

556
00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: think that's a great point, and it's also a great

557
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 1: way to transition into we now have three different behind

558
00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 1: the scenes looks at the way that this bailout came together.

559
00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:04,000
Speaker 1: You know, they're all like, oh my god, an extraordinary

560
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:07,240
Speaker 1: seventy two hours, et cetera. The framing of all these pieces,

561
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:09,360
Speaker 1: I don't know whether it's really accurate or not. Basically

562
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 1: is that Biden was very reluctant to do much of

563
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 1: anything here, and then through a series of conversations with

564
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 1: various wealthy and individual and well connected people, they came

565
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 1: around to doing taking the absolutely extraordinary measures that we

566
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:28,200
Speaker 1: have detailed here at great length on this show. You're

567
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 1: gonna love. Let's go and put this first one up

568
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:33,800
Speaker 1: on the screen. This was flagged by Peter Conti Brown, who,

569
00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 1: by the way, is a great follow in terms of

570
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,880
Speaker 1: if you're interested in different financial analysis. Very interesting guy,

571
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 1: he says. He points out that Jamie Diamond was flagged

572
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 1: in this New York Times piece as being influential and

573
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 1: convincing the Deputy Treasury Secretary that there were real problems.

574
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:52,680
Speaker 1: Heeries says, if the fact that Jamie Diamond told the

575
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 1: Deputy Treasury secretary there was potential contagion without a banking

576
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 1: bail out played a significant role in this, I might

577
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 1: lose a part of my so and this is from

578
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:03,160
Speaker 1: the New York Times report. What they say is on

579
00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 1: Friday afternoon, this is when you know the regulators have

580
00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 1: already come in and shut down SVB. The Deputy Treasury

581
00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:13,000
Speaker 1: Secretary met with Jamie Diamond, CEO of course of JP

582
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 1: Morgan Chase and Co. At mister Diamond's office in New York.

583
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:19,200
Speaker 1: Could the failure of the SVB, the megastartup lender that

584
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:21,840
Speaker 1: had just collapsed, spread to other banks and create a

585
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:25,200
Speaker 1: systemic risk to the financial system. There is potential, mister

586
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:28,480
Speaker 1: Diamond said, according to people familiar with the conversation, So

587
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 1: basically what you have here, Sager, is the Deputy Treasury

588
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 1: Secretary going to ask a banker if he thinks that

589
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:38,719
Speaker 1: banks should get a bailout. Some things never changed, Crystal

590
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 1: Jamie Diamond being one of them. The other being if

591
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: you actually read that article to its astounding, they're like,

592
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:48,520
Speaker 1: Wally Adamio met with Diamond at his office, and you're like, wait,

593
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 1: why is the Treasury secretary at the headquarters of JP

594
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:55,400
Speaker 1: Morgan Chase. I thought that the government was the one

595
00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 1: who was in charge and that they are supposed to

596
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,000
Speaker 1: come to you. So you're basically going and then you know,

597
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 1: this is how I love how all this stuff works,

598
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: because it just takes the entire curtain back and we

599
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:09,240
Speaker 1: can all see they're like, further conversations happened at a

600
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 1: private dinner where top banking regulators in the Senate were

601
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 1: with a bunch of Wall Street billionaires. Yes, it was

602
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:19,640
Speaker 1: a pre arranged dinner. And you're like, wait, so why

603
00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 1: were you on dinner? Right? Yeah, here, I've got that part.

604
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:24,400
Speaker 1: Let's go in for the New York Times piece of

605
00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:26,280
Speaker 1: on the screen, because I mean, we have to go

606
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 1: through some of these details, because it truly is just

607
00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:33,360
Speaker 1: absolute mask off for who our government cares about, who

608
00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:36,240
Speaker 1: they're talking to, how things actually happen and get done.

609
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 1: The headline here from the New York Times is how

610
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 1: Washington decided to rescue Silicon Valley banks depositors. Officials were

611
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:44,200
Speaker 1: initially unsure about the need for the measures they eventually

612
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 1: announced it shot up the financial system, but changed their

613
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 1: minds quickly after conversations like you know, the ones with

614
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:53,400
Speaker 1: Jamie Diamond, et cetera. Here's the part you were referring to, Sager.

615
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 1: They say a dramatic government intervention seemed unlikely. On Thursday

616
00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 1: evening when Peter or Zag, former President Barack Obama's first

617
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 1: budget director and now CEO of financial Advisory at the bank,

618
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 1: Lazard posted a previously scheduled dinner at the bank's offices

619
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 1: in New York City's Rockefeller Center. Among those in attendance

620
00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:18,480
Speaker 1: were the aforementioned Deputy Treasury Secretary, pair of influential senators

621
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,959
Speaker 1: Mike Crappo, Republican of Crapo, I guess I'm supposed to say,

622
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,720
Speaker 1: Republican of Idaho, Mark Warner, Democratic Virginia. Both were sponsors

623
00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 1: of that terrible law that actually rolled back regulations. You

624
00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: also had Blair Ephron, a large Democratic donor whose firm

625
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 1: Centerview Partners had just been hired by Silicon Valley Bank

626
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:39,960
Speaker 1: to advise it on its liquidity crunch. Mister Ephron and

627
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:43,000
Speaker 1: the w treachery Secretary spoke as it became evident that

628
00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 1: SVB was running out of options and that a sale

629
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:49,320
Speaker 1: or some bigger intervention might be necessary. You also have

630
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 1: details here about how Lael Brainard, who's the new director

631
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 1: of Biden's National Economic Council, was flooded with phone calls

632
00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:01,400
Speaker 1: from you know, wealthy investors and other people who had

633
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 1: real skin in the game in terms of Silicon Valley situation,

634
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:07,520
Speaker 1: you know, telling her that she really needed to make

635
00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:10,760
Speaker 1: sure that they were doing what was necessary. They have

636
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:12,840
Speaker 1: this great line here they say. Other officials across the

637
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 1: administration were skeptical, worrying that the lobbying blitz miss Brainard

638
00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: and others receiving was purely a sign of wealthy investors

639
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:23,200
Speaker 1: trying to force the government to backstop their losses. A

640
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:26,800
Speaker 1: couple more highlights that I cannot leave found here. Gavin Newsom,

641
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 1: who Ken Klippenstein is reported had accounts at this bank.

642
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 1: I guess they were involved with like the financing of

643
00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 1: his wineries, vineyards. None of that was disclosed, of course,

644
00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:41,400
Speaker 1: but he was pressuring Biden aggressively for government intervention. Rocanna,

645
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:45,880
Speaker 1: who represents Silicon Valley, was cornering Steve Roshetti, a top

646
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 1: White House aid, at the Gridiron Club dinner in Washington.

647
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:53,200
Speaker 1: And you had a host of other influential Democrats like

648
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:56,600
Speaker 1: Nancy Pelosi and others, Maxine Waters and others from the

649
00:33:56,680 --> 00:34:00,040
Speaker 1: California delegation who were also very critical. I could go

650
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 1: on here, but I think you get the point of

651
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 1: exactly how many like wealthy influential people who had stood

652
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,320
Speaker 1: to lose money or whose friends stood to lose money

653
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:14,400
Speaker 1: were involved in crafting this bailout. Yeah, what's the George

654
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:16,759
Speaker 1: Carlin saying it's a big club and you ain't in it.

655
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:21,840
Speaker 1: I mean, look, that's that's my only takeaway. Your small business,

656
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:24,759
Speaker 1: you have a problem, good luck, You're going to be

657
00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 1: on the waiting list for your bank. You wait an

658
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:30,520
Speaker 1: hour and a half. You're somebody who has a problem.

659
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,400
Speaker 1: Your bank adds an extra fee for your checking account,

660
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:35,880
Speaker 1: two and a half hours on the phone to maybe

661
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:39,040
Speaker 1: get yelled at and told no by a customer service representative.

662
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:42,799
Speaker 1: Your multi billionaire, your money goes down in Silicon Valley Bank,

663
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:45,560
Speaker 1: you just call ahead of the National Economic Council. You

664
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:48,799
Speaker 1: get to see somebody at dinner and buttonhole them. This

665
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:53,320
Speaker 1: is the clearest evidence and shows you the system is rigged.

666
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:56,600
Speaker 1: It's not for you. It is literally not to your benefit.

667
00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 1: It is one designed for them to protect all of

668
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:03,440
Speaker 1: their wealth in the guise of public service, and is

669
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:07,439
Speaker 1: specifically the California governor who can remember this too. It's

670
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,799
Speaker 1: not just the FEDS that took over Silicon Valley Bank,

671
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:14,480
Speaker 1: it was also California financial authorities, of which we can assume, yes,

672
00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:18,440
Speaker 1: some say over. It's a massive, massive conflict of interests

673
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:20,400
Speaker 1: all the way here up to the top. Will he

674
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:23,920
Speaker 1: ever recuse himself or apologize for any of this? Absolutely not.

675
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:25,879
Speaker 1: It's just I don't know. I don't know what else

676
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 1: to say. I want to say the reporting here from

677
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:30,439
Speaker 1: the Times Washington Post good and put the Washington Post

678
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:32,360
Speaker 1: up on the screen. This was in part. One of

679
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:35,879
Speaker 1: the journalists on this was Jeff Stein. This is very

680
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 1: revealing and I'm very grateful for this reporting about who

681
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 1: they were speaking to, etc. This is actually the one

682
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:44,480
Speaker 1: that talks about the Gridiron dinner. They also highlight sounding

683
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:47,400
Speaker 1: alarms were the likes of Reid Hoffman, founder of LinkedIn

684
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:53,280
Speaker 1: partner Greylock AMN, major VC prolific donor to Democrats, including Biden.

685
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:56,520
Speaker 1: He took his concerns to Democratic lawmakers and administration officials.

686
00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 1: Ron Conway, another of the area's leading investors with original

687
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:02,080
Speaker 1: stakes and ab and b Facebook and Google worked with

688
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 1: Pelosi and Newsom to put pressure on the White House,

689
00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: Treasury Department and elected officials. Politico had their own peace.

690
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 1: They really focused on the fact that Biden's inner circle

691
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:16,279
Speaker 1: in order to try to pressure him go and put

692
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:17,840
Speaker 1: this last hairshet up on the screen there. It is

693
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 1: in order to try to pressure him into taking the

694
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:23,279
Speaker 1: action that they had been persuaded by Jamie Diamond and

695
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 1: Reid Hoffman needed to be taken. They emphasized a potential

696
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,520
Speaker 1: impact on workers' paychecks. They believed it would resonate both

697
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 1: the president and the public, said one of the people

698
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:34,880
Speaker 1: for both familiar with the deliberations. They urged Biden to

699
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 1: speak to the public before US markets opened to ward

700
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:40,840
Speaker 1: off runs on other regional banks. And again, let me

701
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,320
Speaker 1: just say, for the million time, none of these people

702
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,759
Speaker 1: cared about the FED policy of hiking rates explicitly to

703
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:50,640
Speaker 1: push workers out of the job. But now they're fixated

704
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:54,279
Speaker 1: on the impact on workers' paychecks. Now they care when

705
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 1: it's you know, wealthy, well connected, their friends and buddies

706
00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 1: who are blowing up their phones, suddenly they need to

707
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:07,360
Speaker 1: push for extraordinary action here. It's so incredibly revealing of

708
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:11,280
Speaker 1: exactly how this town works. You know, people in East

709
00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 1: Palestine who still don't know whether their water is safe.

710
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 1: They're not able to button hole Steve Roschetti at the

711
00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:22,319
Speaker 1: freaking Gridiron dinner. They don't have previously scheduled dinners in

712
00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:25,480
Speaker 1: New York at some bankers offices with Mark Warner and

713
00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:29,480
Speaker 1: Crepo and the Deputy Treasury secretary, and they are left

714
00:37:29,520 --> 00:37:32,960
Speaker 1: completely out in the cold. This level of access and

715
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:37,319
Speaker 1: control by the wealthy, the well connected, the influential, the

716
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 1: big donor class. You know, Reid Hoffman is maybe the

717
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:45,239
Speaker 1: largest Democratic donor. It is so revealing the way this

718
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:49,320
Speaker 1: all ultimately came together. Yeah, listen, those meals at the

719
00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 1: French laundry, they don't pay themselves. Somebody's got to pay

720
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 1: the tab. I think those haircuts are cheap, looking like

721
00:37:56,600 --> 00:37:59,439
Speaker 1: the Vampire twenty four to seven. That's an expensive game.

722
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:01,879
Speaker 1: So somebody's got to pay for it. Might as well

723
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 1: be us, right, might as well be the taxpayers. Apparently

724
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 1: there was an extraordinary moment. So Elizabeth Warren, you know,

725
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 1: every once in a while you get a little bit

726
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:12,640
Speaker 1: of vintage Warren comes out and reminds you what she

727
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,080
Speaker 1: used to be and what she used to focus on.

728
00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:18,279
Speaker 1: So she has been very aggressive in terms of, you know,

729
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:20,960
Speaker 1: the bailout, and she has for a while been very

730
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:24,120
Speaker 1: aggressive in questioning the direction of the FED. She clearly

731
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 1: is not a fan of Jerome Pale, the current FED chair.

732
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 1: She got asked one of the dumbest questions I literally

733
00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 1: have ever seen asked in an appearance on CNBC when

734
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: the host asked her whether it would be sufficient for

735
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 1: banks to just stress test themselves, take a listen. Even

736
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,040
Speaker 1: those are much smaller, though than the bigger banks that

737
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:46,680
Speaker 1: are more than two hundred and fifty billion, and we've

738
00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:49,279
Speaker 1: had a number of those CEOs on the shows in

739
00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 1: the last few days. Fifth third Schwab. They do their

740
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:56,719
Speaker 1: own stress testing. Not everyone was behaving in a risk

741
00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:59,759
Speaker 1: profile and a risk manner that Silicon Valley Bank was.

742
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I taught school for many, many years, and

743
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:06,840
Speaker 1: I did not let my students do their own testing.

744
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:10,360
Speaker 1: The testing that is meaningful is the testing that comes

745
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:12,960
Speaker 1: from the outside, and it's also the testing where you

746
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:16,640
Speaker 1: don't give the answers in advance. The whole point of

747
00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:20,040
Speaker 1: stress testing is for someone on the outside of the

748
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 1: bank to say what could go wrong here, and to

749
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,920
Speaker 1: make sure that the bank could withstand those kinds of

750
00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:32,520
Speaker 1: problems like a sudden increase in interest rates. That's the

751
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:35,400
Speaker 1: point behind the stress testing. And for these banks to

752
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:41,560
Speaker 1: say not to worry, we're testing ourselves is truly laughable.

753
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:44,480
Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, she probably could have just ended her

754
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 1: answer after laughing in that lady's face. Yeah, that's all

755
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:51,239
Speaker 1: that you should Sandy. C is truly wild because it's

756
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:53,880
Speaker 1: one of those where they every once in want sometimes

757
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:55,440
Speaker 1: you do really good stuff. I know the people who

758
00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:57,799
Speaker 1: work there, and when they keep it down the middle.

759
00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:02,040
Speaker 1: It's a great journalist, right, Yeah, Branischwartz is some of

760
00:40:02,080 --> 00:40:04,839
Speaker 1: the best reporting in the game in terms of big

761
00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 1: donor money and how it's all working up there at

762
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:11,240
Speaker 1: the top. But man, mask off moment, these these banks

763
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 1: stress tests themselves. Can you imagine saying that? Especially? I

764
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:18,239
Speaker 1: couldn't even say that in a normal time. Why would

765
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:23,200
Speaker 1: you say it now? Now the potential Lehman moment financial crisis?

766
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 1: And you're like, why should these banks be stress tested

767
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:28,640
Speaker 1: by the what you know, by the way they do.

768
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,000
Speaker 1: They were stress testing themselves in two thousand and seven,

769
00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:32,759
Speaker 1: in two thousand and eight. How did that work out?

770
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:37,200
Speaker 1: That's the entire point of the goddamn stress test. It's nuts. Yeah,

771
00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:40,440
Speaker 1: I love too the way she frames it. She's like, well,

772
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 1: I've been talking to a lot of CEOs of these

773
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:45,920
Speaker 1: banks and they assure me they're good to go. They

774
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 1: do their own stress testing, No need to worry. It's like,

775
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:54,719
Speaker 1: oh my god, it's amazing, absolutely amazing. At the same time, Warren,

776
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 1: like I said, has been very aggressive on this. I

777
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,239
Speaker 1: think she and Katie Porter have been kind of standouts

778
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 1: in terms of DeMay answers. She so, there's now been

779
00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 1: announced there's going to be a review of Silicon Valley Bank.

780
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 1: The poor risk management decisions and the bonuses that were

781
00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 1: handed out on the day of the FDIC, you know,

782
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:17,880
Speaker 1: regulators coming and shutting down the bank, the stock sales

783
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:21,400
Speaker 1: that occurred in the weeks and months prior to the

784
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:25,080
Speaker 1: bank's utter collapse, and Elizabeth Warren put this up on

785
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:28,239
Speaker 1: the screen. She has written a letter calling for j

786
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:32,400
Speaker 1: Powell to recuse himself from the review of SVB. What

787
00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:35,240
Speaker 1: she says here is FED Chair Pal's actions to allow

788
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:37,560
Speaker 1: big banks like Silicon Valley Bank to boost their profits

789
00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:41,160
Speaker 1: by loading upon risk directly contributed to these bank failures.

790
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:44,560
Speaker 1: For the FEDS inquiry to have credibility, Powell must publicly

791
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 1: and immediately recuse himself from this internal review. It's appropriate

792
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:52,839
Speaker 1: for Vice Chair for Supervision bar to have the independence

793
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:57,080
Speaker 1: necessary to do his job. So she is certainly using

794
00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 1: this opportunity to push Jerome Pal even for than she

795
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:03,320
Speaker 1: already has been in previous interactions with him, some of

796
00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:07,640
Speaker 1: which we played here, let's hope. But unfortunately in Congress

797
00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:09,520
Speaker 1: right now, with the way that the Republicans have already

798
00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:12,080
Speaker 1: been acting. You know, Nancy Mace, I think was out

799
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:14,400
Speaker 1: there being like, why are we pointing fingers in the

800
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 1: middle of the prist like that? Well, wait, isn't that

801
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,680
Speaker 1: the whole point whenever you have a taxpayer bailout, I mean,

802
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:23,600
Speaker 1: and look for all the semantics, you can say whatever

803
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:26,239
Speaker 1: you want, maybe no taxpayer money will be involved. I

804
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:28,319
Speaker 1: still actually, if you have to see any proof of that,

805
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:30,319
Speaker 1: when the full faith and credit of the United States

806
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:32,640
Speaker 1: is the only thing holding up your private business, then

807
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:35,319
Speaker 1: you're not actually a private business. Okay. You know here

808
00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 1: at BP we stand on our own feet, as every

809
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:41,319
Speaker 1: other small business literally across the country. We don't need

810
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 1: somebody to come in and say, actually, your cameras are

811
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:46,680
Speaker 1: worth more than they actually are to make sure that

812
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 1: we can float and stay above. They would laugh in

813
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:51,840
Speaker 1: your face if you're any other business on earth. No,

814
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,279
Speaker 1: they wouldn't laugh in your face. They would like send

815
00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:58,839
Speaker 1: you to prison. Yeah, there is right in God. Yeah,

816
00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:01,840
Speaker 1: but you know, if you're if you're friends with Jamie

817
00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 1: Diamond and you're going to dinners at you know, banker's

818
00:43:04,560 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 1: offices with Mark Warner and Crepo and whoever, then you'll

819
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 1: get a little bit of different treatment. And I do

820
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 1: want to say, you know, with regards to anything happening here,

821
00:43:14,520 --> 00:43:17,799
Speaker 1: First of all, the Biden administration dropped the ball. If

822
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 1: they wanted new regulations put in place, the time to

823
00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:26,320
Speaker 1: push for it would have been before you offer the pailout.

824
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:28,800
Speaker 1: You have to get something from these people at least

825
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:31,120
Speaker 1: to start to demand like this is what I want

826
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 1: to see on my desk from Congress in response to

827
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:37,800
Speaker 1: these actions. So that's number one. Number two Mark Warner,

828
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 1: who was one of the what was it sixteen or

829
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:43,120
Speaker 1: seventeen Democrats who voted alongside all fifty of the Republicans

830
00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 1: to deregulate these banks, in particular back during the Trump era,

831
00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:51,520
Speaker 1: he was asked on the Sunday Shows, Hey, you know,

832
00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:54,400
Speaker 1: would you rethink that vote? Did you maybe take the

833
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,719
Speaker 1: wrong approach here? He doubled down, He stood by it.

834
00:43:57,880 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 1: He's like, no, I think they needed a lighter regulation.

835
00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:04,120
Speaker 1: Touch It's like, really, even now as you look at this,

836
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:07,960
Speaker 1: you can't admit that this was a disaster and mistake. Nope,

837
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:11,400
Speaker 1: he's standing by a zager. Yeah, you know, of course

838
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:14,319
Speaker 1: he is, and all of these people. This is part

839
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:16,880
Speaker 1: of the problem. We talked about this with Iraq. Iraq

840
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:18,920
Speaker 1: is on the mind because we're coming up on the

841
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:22,759
Speaker 1: twentieth anniversary in a couple of days, and you know,

842
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:28,560
Speaker 1: it's the details get convoluted, and the general public knows

843
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:31,640
Speaker 1: that things are wrong, but they're not following every single

844
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 1: nitty gritty reason as to why something happens, and then

845
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:37,600
Speaker 1: enough time passes before the truth eventually comes out, and

846
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:39,920
Speaker 1: then boom, by that time, it's too late. It's kind

847
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:43,319
Speaker 1: of like how everybody learned about Glass Stiegel and all

848
00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:46,600
Speaker 1: of the deregulation during the Clint administration, mostly from the

849
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:49,600
Speaker 1: Michael Lewis book The Big Short and from a lot

850
00:44:49,719 --> 00:44:52,920
Speaker 1: of the books and analysis of the global financial crisis,

851
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,440
Speaker 1: maybe a year and a half so afterwards. But by

852
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,319
Speaker 1: that time, Dodd Frank was basically all lost. So by

853
00:44:58,360 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 1: the time it entered into the public with consciousness, public

854
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:03,120
Speaker 1: policy and everybody had all just kind of moved on.

855
00:45:03,200 --> 00:45:04,560
Speaker 1: And of course the media, as we showed it with

856
00:45:04,560 --> 00:45:07,120
Speaker 1: the CNBC clip, they're just carrying water for these people.

857
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:08,680
Speaker 1: So it's a tough I don't really know how to

858
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:15,880
Speaker 1: fix it percent All right, let's move on to a

859
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:18,839
Speaker 1: little bit of a freak count over some comments that

860
00:45:19,040 --> 00:45:21,879
Speaker 1: Ron DeSantis made and also comments that Trump has made

861
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:25,440
Speaker 1: with regard to how they would approach the war in Ukraine.

862
00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:30,040
Speaker 1: Our friends Emily and Ryan over on Counterpoints covered the

863
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:34,879
Speaker 1: responses that DeSantis and others sent into Tucker Carlson. You'll

864
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:37,399
Speaker 1: recall it. He put out, you know, a questionnaire and said, hey,

865
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:40,239
Speaker 1: if you're running for president on the Republican side, I

866
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 1: want to hear from you. Here are the questions I have.

867
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:44,960
Speaker 1: Go ahead and you know, fill it out and send

868
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:46,520
Speaker 1: it in so we can talk about it here on

869
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:49,960
Speaker 1: the show. And a number of people did, including Ron DeSantis,

870
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:53,279
Speaker 1: and he positioned himself, you know, he's been kind of

871
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:56,320
Speaker 1: like trying to have it both ways in terms of Ukraine,

872
00:45:56,320 --> 00:45:58,279
Speaker 1: and he's still with the even with this statement kind

873
00:45:58,320 --> 00:46:01,319
Speaker 1: of left himself some wiggle room, but much more clear

874
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:04,799
Speaker 1: statement on the side of the Ukraine skeptics. And this

875
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:09,040
Speaker 1: has created a full blown freak out among you know,

876
00:46:09,080 --> 00:46:11,440
Speaker 1: a bunch of the Rupert Murdoch properties that have been

877
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:14,239
Speaker 1: very friendly to Ron DeSantis. A lot of the sort

878
00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:16,400
Speaker 1: of like donor class very upset about this, and of

879
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:19,640
Speaker 1: course neo CON's like Lindsey Grammage, McConnell, et cetera, who

880
00:46:19,719 --> 00:46:22,520
Speaker 1: are current office holders. But let's start with this. This

881
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:26,080
Speaker 1: pertains specifically to Trump and Zager. I want to get

882
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:28,000
Speaker 1: your reaction to all of this, because I know you

883
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:29,719
Speaker 1: have many thoughts. Go ahead and put this up on

884
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:34,760
Speaker 1: the screen, guys. This is from the former NATO chief.

885
00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 1: He says it would be a geopolitical catastrophe if Trump

886
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:41,719
Speaker 1: were to be nominated because in the campaign his influence

887
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 1: would be destructive. He's talking about the fact that, you know,

888
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:48,920
Speaker 1: even if he just wins the nomination and loses the

889
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:52,920
Speaker 1: general election, that he is pushing the Republicans to be

890
00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:57,480
Speaker 1: more Ukraine skeptical, more skeptical of additional aid. Let me

891
00:46:57,560 --> 00:46:59,520
Speaker 1: just read a little bit more of this, he says.

892
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:02,560
Speaker 1: The former By the way, this former NATO chief, whose

893
00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:05,520
Speaker 1: last name is Rasmussen, serves as an advisor to the

894
00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:08,760
Speaker 1: Ukrainian government and recently came to Washington to c members

895
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:12,200
Speaker 1: of Congress and Biden administration officials. He is lobbying them

896
00:47:12,239 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: to supply more and heavier weapons and to make long

897
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:19,760
Speaker 1: term security guarantees to Ukraine. He also predicts that Biden

898
00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 1: will wind up sending warplanes, calling it merely quote a

899
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:27,560
Speaker 1: question of time. So this person is says that Trump's

900
00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:31,640
Speaker 1: views on Ukraine are a geopolitical catastrophe. These people don't

901
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:35,240
Speaker 1: actually believe in democracy. If Donald J. Trump is nominated

902
00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:40,200
Speaker 1: or Ron DeSantis is nominated by the GOP primary democratic process,

903
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:43,759
Speaker 1: that is a reflection of the views of people in

904
00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:46,239
Speaker 1: the United States. In America. Now I'll listen. I have

905
00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 1: a definite critique of our primary system. There's a lot

906
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 1: of things that we could do, but based upon all

907
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:53,960
Speaker 1: the polling data that we have, this is not a

908
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 1: fringe view. Almost fifty percent of Americans agree with the way,

909
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:02,319
Speaker 1: the approach and the rhetoric that Trump and DeSantis laid

910
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:04,280
Speaker 1: out there. As you said, let's be careful with DeSantis,

911
00:48:04,320 --> 00:48:07,319
Speaker 1: he did leave himself a significant amount of wiggle room.

912
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:10,760
Speaker 1: But what really strikes me is the anti democratic nature

913
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:12,920
Speaker 1: of all of this, which is shut up. This is

914
00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:17,040
Speaker 1: about democracy, This is about autocracy. This is about things

915
00:48:17,080 --> 00:48:19,319
Speaker 1: that are much bigger than you could ever understand, like

916
00:48:19,520 --> 00:48:21,360
Speaker 1: NATO and all that. And that's part of the reason

917
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:23,960
Speaker 1: why we're not really allowed to ask any of the

918
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:27,120
Speaker 1: real politic questions here about well, what if this does

919
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:29,319
Speaker 1: draw us into a broader war, At what point do

920
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:33,399
Speaker 1: Ukrainian interests actually subjugate American interests? At what point would

921
00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:37,080
Speaker 1: American interests diverge completely from Ukraine whatever's in the best

922
00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:39,800
Speaker 1: interest of Ukraine and whatever's in the best interests of America.

923
00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:42,839
Speaker 1: The neo cons like Nikki Haley and Mike Pence are

924
00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:45,400
Speaker 1: saying that they're one to one. There is no state

925
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:47,400
Speaker 1: on the planet of which there is a one to

926
00:48:47,400 --> 00:48:50,439
Speaker 1: one relationship for the US and anyone else. So their

927
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:54,600
Speaker 1: inability to articulate it that way is fundamentally anti democratic,

928
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 1: And it reminds me of the way that a lot

929
00:48:56,640 --> 00:49:00,120
Speaker 1: of the generals and the foreign policy intelligentsia react to

930
00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:03,560
Speaker 1: the Trump candidacy in twenty sixteen, when he laid out

931
00:49:03,880 --> 00:49:08,399
Speaker 1: a consistent rhetorical again not on policy rhetorical America first

932
00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:12,800
Speaker 1: vision of the US approach to NATO and specifically really

933
00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 1: to the US of the world with our trade deals.

934
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:19,920
Speaker 1: Everybody in the kind of Atlantic religion of basically what

935
00:49:19,920 --> 00:49:22,439
Speaker 1: I've been starting to call it in terms of their

936
00:49:22,480 --> 00:49:25,439
Speaker 1: pledging support to Ukraine and all that it has much

937
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:27,680
Speaker 1: more to do with ideology than it ever really has

938
00:49:27,719 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 1: to do with making a case to people. So if

939
00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:33,919
Speaker 1: you believe it would be a geopolitical catastrophe, then run

940
00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:38,279
Speaker 1: on it. I think that DeSantis and Trump's view is

941
00:49:38,360 --> 00:49:42,960
Speaker 1: extremely underrepresented in American politics, and should it come to

942
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:46,040
Speaker 1: the national stage in a clear choice between hawkishness on

943
00:49:46,200 --> 00:49:49,239
Speaker 1: Ukraine and dubbishness on Ukraine, a it would be a

944
00:49:49,360 --> 00:49:51,400
Speaker 1: very easy vote for a lot of people to cast, frankly,

945
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:54,440
Speaker 1: including me, and I think that it would be a

946
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 1: spark a genuine debate and challenge the assumptions that a

947
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,120
Speaker 1: lot of these people put forward in the media, as

948
00:50:00,160 --> 00:50:04,440
Speaker 1: you I I one hundred percent cosign, especially your comment

949
00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:06,920
Speaker 1: that you know this guy does not actually believe in

950
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:09,160
Speaker 1: democracy and he gives up the game. He has this

951
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:12,240
Speaker 1: quote in here. He says, the mere fact that Trump's

952
00:50:12,239 --> 00:50:15,239
Speaker 1: thinking appeals to a certain element, a certain segment of

953
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:19,080
Speaker 1: the American public will push American politics in the wrong direction.

954
00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:24,240
Speaker 1: So what does that mean? He knows that the American people,

955
00:50:24,840 --> 00:50:27,200
Speaker 1: some percentage of which not all is at this point

956
00:50:27,239 --> 00:50:30,160
Speaker 1: fifty to fifty and within the Republican base more are

957
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,799
Speaker 1: more on Trump's side on this. He knows that his

958
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:36,439
Speaker 1: whole bet is like, let's just make sure no one

959
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:39,080
Speaker 1: can say any of this and then we can keep

960
00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:40,840
Speaker 1: a lid on things and keep things moving in the

961
00:50:40,840 --> 00:50:45,080
Speaker 1: same direction they've been moving. So very very revealing the

962
00:50:45,120 --> 00:50:49,400
Speaker 1: thinking of this individual. At the same time, Nikki Haley

963
00:50:49,640 --> 00:50:52,520
Speaker 1: now taking some more shots at DeSantis. Let's go and

964
00:50:52,560 --> 00:50:55,000
Speaker 1: put this up on the screen. She says, this is

965
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 1: kind of funny. She says, oh, this is sorry, this

966
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:01,640
Speaker 1: is Cornyn on DeSantis. He's as poll tested answers are

967
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:05,360
Speaker 1: not leading. Put the next one up on the screen here, guys,

968
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:09,560
Speaker 1: this is nicky Haley. She says, Trump is right when

969
00:51:09,560 --> 00:51:12,000
Speaker 1: he says DeSantis is copying him, first in his style,

970
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:14,560
Speaker 1: then on entitlement reform now in Ukraine. I have a

971
00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:16,600
Speaker 1: different style than Trump, and while I gree with him

972
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:20,160
Speaker 1: on most policies, I do not on those. She goes

973
00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:24,640
Speaker 1: on to say Republicans deserve a choice and not an echo,

974
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:27,799
Speaker 1: which is kind of a clever line there. But I

975
00:51:27,840 --> 00:51:31,399
Speaker 1: also find it so revealing that even as look, she's say,

976
00:51:31,520 --> 00:51:34,319
Speaker 1: separating herself from Trump on a couple of issues here,

977
00:51:34,640 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 1: but all the fire is trained at Ron DeSantis, who

978
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:41,120
Speaker 1: is not winning in the most of the polls right now,

979
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:43,960
Speaker 1: but clearly these few will continue to have this like

980
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:47,280
Speaker 1: fanciful notion that Trump is just going to somehow magically disappear,

981
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:49,000
Speaker 1: and so the person they really need to take head

982
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:51,640
Speaker 1: on is Ron DeSantis. I took that away as well.

983
00:51:51,640 --> 00:51:53,040
Speaker 1: So there are two things to say. Number One, I

984
00:51:53,080 --> 00:51:56,239
Speaker 1: actually do think Nikki Haley is correct. Ron DeSantis has

985
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:59,440
Speaker 1: previous very hawkishcus on Russia. He said that there's no

986
00:51:59,520 --> 00:52:03,560
Speaker 1: distance from between myself and Ronald Reagan. He criticized President

987
00:52:03,640 --> 00:52:08,719
Speaker 1: Obama for not sending enough heavy weaponry to Ukraine. Again, look,

988
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:12,080
Speaker 1: maybe he changed his view. I have no idea Rhetorically.

989
00:52:12,120 --> 00:52:14,239
Speaker 1: I still think it is a victory that he is

990
00:52:14,280 --> 00:52:17,600
Speaker 1: not taking the Neocon line. But as Michael Tracy and

991
00:52:17,640 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 1: others have been pointing out, while did he intimated that

992
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:24,640
Speaker 1: it is not a core national security interest to support

993
00:52:25,280 --> 00:52:30,000
Speaker 1: Ukraine against Russia. He did not necessarily use the Ironcliat language.

994
00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:32,560
Speaker 1: And if you parse what he said about not sending

995
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:35,720
Speaker 1: F sixteens and about not getting US ground troops involved,

996
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:39,640
Speaker 1: that's basically the Biden policy. DeSantis did not go as

997
00:52:39,680 --> 00:52:43,799
Speaker 1: far as Donald Trump, who literally is calling for immediate

998
00:52:43,960 --> 00:52:47,239
Speaker 1: peace talks between Ukraine and Russia and promising to bring

999
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:49,480
Speaker 1: the conflict to a close in twenty four hours. Okay,

1000
00:52:49,560 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 1: I don't think that's actually going to happen. But Trump

1001
00:52:52,239 --> 00:52:55,319
Speaker 1: is by far the farthest out there away from the

1002
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:59,000
Speaker 1: Washington consensus and is a genuine break from the Biden

1003
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:01,480
Speaker 1: foreign policy, not only saying we're not going to send

1004
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:03,720
Speaker 1: more weapons, not just saying it's not a core national

1005
00:53:03,719 --> 00:53:06,400
Speaker 1: security interest to not only support Ukraine, but also to

1006
00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:09,799
Speaker 1: not support regime change in Russia. Trump is the clear

1007
00:53:09,960 --> 00:53:13,280
Speaker 1: choice here for anybody who wants to see or wants

1008
00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:17,280
Speaker 1: more peace in Ukraine, at least without a maximalist supporting

1009
00:53:17,320 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 1: aims of the Ukrainian government. So I kind of do

1010
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:24,120
Speaker 1: think that Nikki Haley is correct. DeSantis is a very

1011
00:53:24,719 --> 00:53:27,239
Speaker 1: look I mean, to the extent that he's genuine as

1012
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:30,239
Speaker 1: any politician is. I have no idea, but given his

1013
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:33,680
Speaker 1: basic sea change on this issue, it does seem to

1014
00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 1: me that he doesn't have as well grounded views in

1015
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:40,239
Speaker 1: foreign policy as Trump. Look again, he got rolled on

1016
00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:44,800
Speaker 1: a genuine policy level, but his consistent rhetoric on foreign

1017
00:53:44,840 --> 00:53:47,800
Speaker 1: policy and a way America is getting screwed was basically

1018
00:53:47,840 --> 00:53:52,080
Speaker 1: correct and was consistent for almost thirty five or forty years. Again,

1019
00:53:52,120 --> 00:53:55,080
Speaker 1: it did not manifest itself in his actual dealings in

1020
00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:58,239
Speaker 1: the White House, but his worldview and his outlook was

1021
00:53:58,280 --> 00:54:02,319
Speaker 1: effectively consistent throughout his entire adult life. So that's why

1022
00:54:02,360 --> 00:54:04,480
Speaker 1: whenever I look at these two things, I can't help

1023
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:07,880
Speaker 1: but say, Nikki Hilly's not necessarily wrong here. Yeah, no,

1024
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 1: I agree. I have zero confidence or faith that either

1025
00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:15,359
Speaker 1: one of these would either one of these guys would

1026
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:17,560
Speaker 1: actually do the things that they're claiming they would do.

1027
00:54:18,160 --> 00:54:21,120
Speaker 1: Dysantis because of his history and some of his ties.

1028
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:23,759
Speaker 1: Trump because when he was in office, like we saw

1029
00:54:23,840 --> 00:54:25,920
Speaker 1: what happened there. So I just want to put all

1030
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:28,080
Speaker 1: of that out there. But yeah, I mean, if you,

1031
00:54:28,320 --> 00:54:32,240
Speaker 1: Trump has clearly leaned in harder on the Ukraine skeptic

1032
00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:36,320
Speaker 1: side of things. And another thing that I noticed, Sager,

1033
00:54:36,880 --> 00:54:39,520
Speaker 1: is that DeSantis, who again is rhetoric was not as

1034
00:54:39,520 --> 00:54:44,120
Speaker 1: strident as Trump's is getting has created a total freak

1035
00:54:44,120 --> 00:54:47,920
Speaker 1: out among the establishment Republican class that I have not

1036
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:50,520
Speaker 1: seen a similar freak out. Maybe I just missed it

1037
00:54:50,840 --> 00:54:53,880
Speaker 1: over Trump making far more strident comments. They just are

1038
00:54:53,960 --> 00:54:55,600
Speaker 1: kind of like, well, I don't really want to take

1039
00:54:55,640 --> 00:54:57,279
Speaker 1: this guy on, but this one I'm going to lose

1040
00:54:57,280 --> 00:54:59,440
Speaker 1: my mind about. I think they also were hoping that

1041
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:03,279
Speaker 1: Desanta would be an ally in their hawkishness. New York

1042
00:55:03,280 --> 00:55:06,160
Speaker 1: Times had a breakdown of a lot of this. Here's

1043
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:10,759
Speaker 1: a Jonathan Swan tweet highlighting Lindsay Graham not taking DeSantis's

1044
00:55:10,840 --> 00:55:15,120
Speaker 1: Ukraine statement well. Quote the Neville Chamberlain approach to aggression

1045
00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:18,240
Speaker 1: never ends well, said Graham, comparing DeSantis to the British

1046
00:55:18,239 --> 00:55:21,439
Speaker 1: Prime minister who appeased Adolf Hitler. Put the next one

1047
00:55:21,560 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 1: up on the screen. This is the full New York

1048
00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:25,879
Speaker 1: Times report. You know, they got all kinds of quotes

1049
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:28,480
Speaker 1: in here. They got quotes from Liz Cheney. DeSantis is

1050
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:31,480
Speaker 1: wrong and seems to have forgotten the lessons of Ronald Reagan.

1051
00:55:31,920 --> 00:55:35,319
Speaker 1: Hugh Hewitt, I'm sorry, Mark or Rubio talking to Hugh

1052
00:55:35,360 --> 00:55:37,680
Speaker 1: Hewitt says I don't know what he's trying to do

1053
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:39,880
Speaker 1: or what the goal is. And or John Cornyn, as

1054
00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:43,080
Speaker 1: I said before, says he's disturbed. Governor Chris Christie says

1055
00:55:43,120 --> 00:55:45,800
Speaker 1: it is naive and a complete misunderstanding of the historical

1056
00:55:45,880 --> 00:55:48,879
Speaker 1: context of what's going on this one? I really enjoyed Sager.

1057
00:55:48,960 --> 00:55:52,200
Speaker 1: They reached out for comment to Charles Kupperman, who served

1058
00:55:52,280 --> 00:55:55,600
Speaker 1: under John Bolton as w D National Security Advisor in

1059
00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:58,680
Speaker 1: the Trump administration. He said, mister DeSantis had shown a

1060
00:55:58,760 --> 00:56:02,040
Speaker 1: very poor understanding of our nationalist security interests and this

1061
00:56:02,120 --> 00:56:05,759
Speaker 1: one was interesting. A very well known conservative Wall Street

1062
00:56:05,800 --> 00:56:10,319
Speaker 1: Journal Calmness Kimberly Strassel. She urged DeSantis not to join

1063
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:14,440
Speaker 1: what she called mister Trump's GOP surrender caucus. Quote, the

1064
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:18,000
Speaker 1: governor has an opportunity to contrast a bold, well thought

1065
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:21,040
Speaker 1: out foreign policy with mister Trump's opaque retreatism. And I

1066
00:56:21,080 --> 00:56:23,400
Speaker 1: say that's noteworthy because obviously Wall Street Journal is a

1067
00:56:23,480 --> 00:56:27,879
Speaker 1: Ruper Murdoch property, and they have been pushing DeSantis relentlessly

1068
00:56:27,920 --> 00:56:30,600
Speaker 1: on Fox News, Wall Street Journal and other of their

1069
00:56:30,600 --> 00:56:33,919
Speaker 1: outlets as well. Yeah. You know what I took away

1070
00:56:33,920 --> 00:56:36,719
Speaker 1: from this, which is that it hurts more whenever it's

1071
00:56:36,840 --> 00:56:39,040
Speaker 1: like the one who you thought was going to be

1072
00:56:39,080 --> 00:56:41,040
Speaker 1: the guy to take on Trump. With Trump, so much

1073
00:56:41,040 --> 00:56:43,359
Speaker 1: of this is priced in. That's why many of these

1074
00:56:43,360 --> 00:56:46,120
Speaker 1: senators and others don't even really bother responding to what

1075
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:48,759
Speaker 1: he says. Also because there's a bigger political price. But

1076
00:56:48,840 --> 00:56:51,799
Speaker 1: with DeSantis, it's kind of like an Anakin Skywalker thing.

1077
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:54,160
Speaker 1: It's like you were the chosen one. Man. He's like,

1078
00:56:54,200 --> 00:56:56,960
Speaker 1: you were the chosen one. You were to deliver us

1079
00:56:57,200 --> 00:57:01,040
Speaker 1: from Trump, not embrace him. And yet that's what's the

1080
00:57:01,160 --> 00:57:04,080
Speaker 1: kind of rhetorically that he's been doing here. Yeah, I honestly,

1081
00:57:04,120 --> 00:57:06,719
Speaker 1: I've been really been enjoying the freak out. Also, you know,

1082
00:57:06,760 --> 00:57:10,120
Speaker 1: once again, just to show you how historically illiterate and

1083
00:57:10,160 --> 00:57:12,560
Speaker 1: really just brain dead a lot of foreign policy thinking,

1084
00:57:12,800 --> 00:57:16,000
Speaker 1: are we able to have any conversation without bringing up

1085
00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 1: Neville Chamberlain. I actually was not aware that history began

1086
00:57:20,000 --> 00:57:23,400
Speaker 1: in nineteen thirty eight. You know, color me shock. It

1087
00:57:23,440 --> 00:57:27,320
Speaker 1: turns out that relations between states, especially in this part

1088
00:57:27,320 --> 00:57:29,680
Speaker 1: of the world, in Ukraine and Russia, goes back, oh,

1089
00:57:29,720 --> 00:57:32,640
Speaker 1: I don't know, several thousand years, one hundred years even,

1090
00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 1: you know, just select for the last five hundred years,

1091
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:37,120
Speaker 1: you're gonna get a very different view not only of

1092
00:57:37,120 --> 00:57:39,840
Speaker 1: the conflict, but also just of the way that many

1093
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:42,680
Speaker 1: different types of conflicts and are brought to an end.

1094
00:57:43,480 --> 00:57:46,000
Speaker 1: And that's ultimately what the question is is like is

1095
00:57:46,040 --> 00:57:48,240
Speaker 1: putin Hitler or is he r run of the mill

1096
00:57:48,480 --> 00:57:53,640
Speaker 1: Russian czar slash like Soviet apparatchic, because those are actually

1097
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:57,720
Speaker 1: two very different policy responses. Because I think it's hitler.

1098
00:57:57,920 --> 00:58:01,120
Speaker 1: Other things have happened in history other than World War two,

1099
00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:05,600
Speaker 1: very important, very significant, very horrific event. But other things

1100
00:58:05,600 --> 00:58:08,760
Speaker 1: in history have happened besides World War Two. So we

1101
00:58:08,840 --> 00:58:12,040
Speaker 1: have some pretty significant breaking news this morning, Sager. We

1102
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:16,720
Speaker 1: actually have footage, now official footage, of that US drone

1103
00:58:17,200 --> 00:58:20,840
Speaker 1: being taken down by a Russian fighter jet. It's actually

1104
00:58:20,880 --> 00:58:26,160
Speaker 1: pretty crazy because you see the Russian jet spraying appears

1105
00:58:26,200 --> 00:58:30,440
Speaker 1: to be fuel onto the drone. Twice they come by

1106
00:58:30,520 --> 00:58:33,080
Speaker 1: and like spray the fuel on the drone and then

1107
00:58:33,120 --> 00:58:35,400
Speaker 1: the drone goes down. So let's take a look at that.

1108
00:58:35,640 --> 00:58:38,920
Speaker 1: Minutes ago, we just got dramatic new video from the

1109
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:42,360
Speaker 1: Pentagon released by the military where you can see a

1110
00:58:42,440 --> 00:58:45,320
Speaker 1: Russian fighter jet as it was approaching the back of

1111
00:58:45,320 --> 00:58:48,920
Speaker 1: the American drone that has now been down four to

1112
00:58:48,960 --> 00:58:52,400
Speaker 1: five thousand feet in the Black Sea. Yeah, what are

1113
00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:55,080
Speaker 1: your takeaways there? Yeah, I mean that's look. I mean,

1114
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:58,160
Speaker 1: the number one is it was an intentional act. There's

1115
00:58:58,240 --> 00:59:02,320
Speaker 1: no very clearly, there's no. Well, we were flying closely

1116
00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:04,800
Speaker 1: and there was a flyby and we happened to No,

1117
00:59:04,960 --> 00:59:08,640
Speaker 1: that was one intentional for a reminder. You know, I

1118
00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:11,680
Speaker 1: know Counterpoints covered this yesterday, but this happened in the

1119
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:14,480
Speaker 1: Black Sea, and I guess American and Russian forces now

1120
00:59:14,680 --> 00:59:17,040
Speaker 1: attempting or I guess Russians are attempting to recover it.

1121
00:59:17,080 --> 00:59:20,440
Speaker 1: They don't think that American forces will be able to. Obviously,

1122
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:22,680
Speaker 1: they chose the drone for a reason, because it's an

1123
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:25,440
Speaker 1: unmanned aircraft. This is something that you know a lot

1124
00:59:25,480 --> 00:59:28,440
Speaker 1: of nations do whenever we're in either disputed airspace or

1125
00:59:28,440 --> 00:59:30,960
Speaker 1: whenever they want to kind of ratchet up the tensions

1126
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:33,560
Speaker 1: but don't want to take it too far flybys of

1127
00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:37,360
Speaker 1: destroyers and others or other classic examples. So I don't

1128
00:59:37,400 --> 00:59:40,680
Speaker 1: want to minimize it and say that it's nothing. But also,

1129
00:59:40,920 --> 00:59:43,400
Speaker 1: you know, there's a reason that Donald Trump, for example,

1130
00:59:43,440 --> 00:59:47,560
Speaker 1: did not shoot down a Russia an Iranian plane in response,

1131
00:59:47,640 --> 00:59:51,080
Speaker 1: because there's a proportionality to these things. I know that

1132
00:59:51,160 --> 00:59:54,080
Speaker 1: General Millie spoke with his top Russian counterpart as some

1133
00:59:54,120 --> 00:59:58,000
Speaker 1: sort of deconfliction. Clearly, the Russians are trying to show,

1134
00:59:58,200 --> 01:00:00,840
Speaker 1: you know, fire a warning shot across the bow, and

1135
01:00:00,880 --> 01:00:02,920
Speaker 1: I think that's exactly the way we should read this.

1136
01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:07,840
Speaker 1: It can be dangerous though, because obviously that's a dangerous maneuver.

1137
01:00:08,200 --> 01:00:11,600
Speaker 1: What if the Russian pilot miscalibrates and then he dies,

1138
01:00:11,640 --> 01:00:13,720
Speaker 1: and then they try to blame it on us. This

1139
01:00:13,760 --> 01:00:17,360
Speaker 1: is exactly what happened in the Hainan Island incident with China.

1140
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:20,600
Speaker 1: So we can't dismiss this and say that it's nothing. However,

1141
01:00:20,840 --> 01:00:26,880
Speaker 1: we should have a calibrated response. Yes, very fraught situation here,

1142
01:00:27,080 --> 01:00:30,960
Speaker 1: and the fighter jet ultimately, you know, does clip the drone,

1143
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:34,400
Speaker 1: which is what sends it down. Centator Lindsay Graham has

1144
01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:38,080
Speaker 1: some big ideas about how exactly we should deal with this.

1145
01:00:38,320 --> 01:00:40,000
Speaker 1: He was speaking of Sean Hannity a couple of nights ago.

1146
01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:43,640
Speaker 1: Let's take a listen. They shot down our drone. What

1147
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:48,000
Speaker 1: should our answer be, Well, we should hold him accountable

1148
01:00:48,000 --> 01:00:51,480
Speaker 1: and say that if you ever get near another US

1149
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:55,280
Speaker 1: set flying in international waters, your airplane would be shot down.

1150
01:00:55,280 --> 01:00:58,640
Speaker 1: What would Ronald Reagan do? Right now? He would start

1151
01:00:58,640 --> 01:01:01,680
Speaker 1: shooting Russian planes down if they were threatening our assays?

1152
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:05,200
Speaker 1: So what would Ronald Reagan do? Would start shooting down

1153
01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:08,560
Speaker 1: Russian planes. You know, this is the other funny thing,

1154
01:01:08,640 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 1: the whole fetishization of Reagan. Reagan both rhetorically was tough

1155
01:01:13,600 --> 01:01:17,479
Speaker 1: on the Soviet Union. He certainly was and did take

1156
01:01:17,760 --> 01:01:21,200
Speaker 1: a rollback, you know, a rollback foreign policy, and did

1157
01:01:21,240 --> 01:01:24,440
Speaker 1: confront them in many ways, like in Afghanistan others. At

1158
01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:27,560
Speaker 1: the same time, if you read any books about the

1159
01:01:27,560 --> 01:01:30,040
Speaker 1: way that he dealt with them, he was terrified of

1160
01:01:30,120 --> 01:01:34,280
Speaker 1: one on one nuclear conflict and very much wanted to

1161
01:01:34,360 --> 01:01:37,440
Speaker 1: avoid this at all costs, including part of the reason

1162
01:01:37,480 --> 01:01:41,320
Speaker 1: why he actually pursued some diplomatic overtures on nuclear policy

1163
01:01:41,560 --> 01:01:44,360
Speaker 1: and on others. So anyway, I think that people don't

1164
01:01:44,360 --> 01:01:48,760
Speaker 1: really seem to recall what actually happened under the Reagan administration,

1165
01:01:49,280 --> 01:01:52,520
Speaker 1: and it just shows you the cavalier nature with Lindsey

1166
01:01:52,560 --> 01:01:56,360
Speaker 1: Graham is just willing to, you know, just casually push

1167
01:01:56,680 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 1: literal World War three and war with Russia. This is

1168
01:02:00,800 --> 01:02:05,760
Speaker 1: also why their use of every time somebody says something

1169
01:02:05,880 --> 01:02:09,360
Speaker 1: counter narrative, as Ron DeSantis did, that they immediately call

1170
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:13,400
Speaker 1: him never Chamberlain, surrender caucus and all that they're using

1171
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:17,120
Speaker 1: this potent rhetoric, when in reality they are ones who

1172
01:02:17,240 --> 01:02:20,720
Speaker 1: are pushing extraordinarily dangerous rhetoric, and yet they seem to

1173
01:02:20,720 --> 01:02:24,400
Speaker 1: not suffer any media or political consequence for doing so,

1174
01:02:24,680 --> 01:02:28,680
Speaker 1: because nobody's like, hey, that's actually completely nuts to advocate

1175
01:02:28,720 --> 01:02:32,560
Speaker 1: for something like that. The Republicans really right now have

1176
01:02:32,760 --> 01:02:35,520
Speaker 1: a totally split mind. On the one side, you have

1177
01:02:35,600 --> 01:02:38,280
Speaker 1: people whose criticism of Biden is he's not doing enough.

1178
01:02:38,680 --> 01:02:40,840
Speaker 1: We needed at the beginning, we needed to know fly zoh,

1179
01:02:40,920 --> 01:02:43,600
Speaker 1: we need to be shooting down Russian jets, we need

1180
01:02:43,640 --> 01:02:47,080
Speaker 1: to be sending F sixteen's. That's one side of the criticism,

1181
01:02:47,120 --> 01:02:50,280
Speaker 1: as offered there by Sean Hannity and Lindsey Graham. The

1182
01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:53,720
Speaker 1: other side is the Trump and now sort of DeSantis

1183
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:57,360
Speaker 1: critique of we should not be giving them a blank check,

1184
01:02:58,040 --> 01:03:01,440
Speaker 1: in Trump's case, at least rhetorically pushing for, you know,

1185
01:03:01,480 --> 01:03:03,280
Speaker 1: some sort of a peace deal to bring an end

1186
01:03:03,280 --> 01:03:08,439
Speaker 1: to hostilities. So they're actually at completely polar opposite ends

1187
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:11,280
Speaker 1: of the spectrum here in terms of how they rhetorically

1188
01:03:11,320 --> 01:03:14,200
Speaker 1: are saying that we should approach the conflict. Yeah, no,

1189
01:03:14,280 --> 01:03:16,440
Speaker 1: I agree. I mean, look, Trump himself has actually been

1190
01:03:16,440 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 1: on both sides of that extreme. By the way, we

1191
01:03:18,400 --> 01:03:22,720
Speaker 1: should remember some of his early comments in this conflict. Yeah,

1192
01:03:23,000 --> 01:03:26,120
Speaker 1: I really have no, It's difficult. Right, the base clearly

1193
01:03:26,280 --> 01:03:28,520
Speaker 1: is in one place. Trump is trying to placate that.

1194
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:30,880
Speaker 1: On a policy level, He's completely all over the place.

1195
01:03:30,920 --> 01:03:34,040
Speaker 1: Desantists is trying to calibrate towards the base as well.

1196
01:03:34,080 --> 01:03:36,840
Speaker 1: But the Senators just are completely out of touch with

1197
01:03:36,920 --> 01:03:39,200
Speaker 1: the rest of the Republican Party. They're basically in lockstep

1198
01:03:39,200 --> 01:03:43,320
Speaker 1: with the Democrats, if not more so, advocating for hawkish actions.

1199
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:47,120
Speaker 1: So look, you know, the whole bipartisan issue of our

1200
01:03:47,160 --> 01:03:51,760
Speaker 1: time actually is just being hawkish unfortunately. And you know,

1201
01:03:52,120 --> 01:03:54,120
Speaker 1: any time I see a challenge to that, I absolutely

1202
01:03:54,120 --> 01:03:56,960
Speaker 1: welcome it, but know also a what they're up against,

1203
01:03:57,000 --> 01:03:59,480
Speaker 1: and b whether that person could be you know, a

1204
01:03:59,520 --> 01:04:02,760
Speaker 1: wolf and chiefs clothing. Yeah, well said, there's a story

1205
01:04:02,760 --> 01:04:04,439
Speaker 1: coming out of Michigan that I wanted to make sure

1206
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:07,320
Speaker 1: to get in the show because this is actually quite

1207
01:04:07,360 --> 01:04:11,160
Speaker 1: extraordinary from a historic perspective. Put this up on the screen.

1208
01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:15,840
Speaker 1: So the Michigan legislature has now rolled back voted to

1209
01:04:16,000 --> 01:04:19,040
Speaker 1: repeal the state's right to work law that's of course

1210
01:04:19,080 --> 01:04:23,120
Speaker 1: an anti union law yesterday since that law was originally

1211
01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:26,240
Speaker 1: passed back in twenty twelve, Michigan has lost roughly forty

1212
01:04:26,360 --> 01:04:31,080
Speaker 1: thousand union members. I don't know if you remember twenty twelve,

1213
01:04:31,600 --> 01:04:35,320
Speaker 1: they were huge protests over this, Michigan being one of

1214
01:04:35,360 --> 01:04:38,640
Speaker 1: the hotbeds of initial union activity. I mean, this is

1215
01:04:38,680 --> 01:04:41,040
Speaker 1: like the heart and soul of the labor movement. So

1216
01:04:41,120 --> 01:04:44,280
Speaker 1: when Rick Snyder and the Republicans passed this right to

1217
01:04:44,320 --> 01:04:48,280
Speaker 1: work legislation, it was a really big deal. Part of

1218
01:04:48,320 --> 01:04:51,520
Speaker 1: why this is so extraordinary is because let's put the

1219
01:04:51,560 --> 01:04:54,520
Speaker 1: map that we have up on the screen. There were

1220
01:04:54,640 --> 01:04:58,040
Speaker 1: at least now there's twenty six There were twenty seven states,

1221
01:04:58,040 --> 01:05:00,280
Speaker 1: and this has to be officially signed into law, but

1222
01:05:00,320 --> 01:05:03,120
Speaker 1: there were twenty seven states that had passed right to

1223
01:05:03,160 --> 01:05:08,640
Speaker 1: work legislation. This is the first time in sixty years

1224
01:05:09,280 --> 01:05:11,480
Speaker 1: that a state has actually voted to go in the

1225
01:05:11,680 --> 01:05:16,040
Speaker 1: other direction and repeal right to work. Now, there have

1226
01:05:16,120 --> 01:05:19,760
Speaker 1: been some encouraging signs in terms of a growing labor movement.

1227
01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:23,560
Speaker 1: Of course, we've covered extensively the grossroots efforts at Starbucks,

1228
01:05:23,840 --> 01:05:28,840
Speaker 1: at Amazon, Arii other workplaces. You also have, you know,

1229
01:05:29,160 --> 01:05:34,320
Speaker 1: public support for unions at near record highs. The numbers

1230
01:05:34,360 --> 01:05:37,280
Speaker 1: still continue to be extraordinarily grim though in terms of

1231
01:05:37,360 --> 01:05:40,960
Speaker 1: overall union density, you continue to sort of have that

1232
01:05:41,280 --> 01:05:44,479
Speaker 1: eroded and eaten away. But this is another hopeful sign

1233
01:05:44,560 --> 01:05:48,200
Speaker 1: that things politically, the wins have really politically shifted, because

1234
01:05:48,760 --> 01:05:52,440
Speaker 1: you know, even the Virginia Legislature is a good example

1235
01:05:52,520 --> 01:05:55,680
Speaker 1: to contrast here. So the Virginia legislators Democrats had, you know,

1236
01:05:55,720 --> 01:05:57,600
Speaker 1: they had the House, they had the Senate, they had

1237
01:05:57,640 --> 01:06:00,840
Speaker 1: the governor under Ralph Northam in the previous set, and

1238
01:06:01,120 --> 01:06:03,280
Speaker 1: they didn't bother to repeal right to work. They didn't

1239
01:06:03,280 --> 01:06:06,080
Speaker 1: even really talk about repealing right to work. Now, Michigan

1240
01:06:06,160 --> 01:06:08,800
Speaker 1: is a different state that's not so suburban centric. But

1241
01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:12,080
Speaker 1: I even think just between that time and now, labor

1242
01:06:12,120 --> 01:06:14,720
Speaker 1: issues have come more to the forefront, and Democrats have

1243
01:06:14,840 --> 01:06:18,600
Speaker 1: stopped just caving to Republicans or actively helping them in

1244
01:06:18,640 --> 01:06:21,080
Speaker 1: crushing unions and are now starting to push in the

1245
01:06:21,120 --> 01:06:23,840
Speaker 1: opposite direction. So I think it's a it's quite a

1246
01:06:23,880 --> 01:06:27,439
Speaker 1: turning point. I think it's because frankly, of pressure from

1247
01:06:27,520 --> 01:06:29,919
Speaker 1: the amount of union votes that were starting to go

1248
01:06:29,960 --> 01:06:33,320
Speaker 1: to Republicans, and Michigan just came off that big victory

1249
01:06:33,360 --> 01:06:36,840
Speaker 1: for Democrats in the midterm elections. But we shouldn't recall

1250
01:06:37,080 --> 01:06:40,920
Speaker 1: or we shouldn't forget that Trump won Michigan in twenty sixteen.

1251
01:06:41,040 --> 01:06:44,360
Speaker 1: He barely lost it in twenty twenty. So if you

1252
01:06:44,440 --> 01:06:45,960
Speaker 1: want to make sure that you're going to keep some

1253
01:06:46,040 --> 01:06:48,720
Speaker 1: of that union vote and actually keep the state from

1254
01:06:48,760 --> 01:06:52,680
Speaker 1: being competitive, you need to shore up every single constituency

1255
01:06:52,960 --> 01:06:54,800
Speaker 1: for what you got. So it's actually not a bad

1256
01:06:54,880 --> 01:06:57,000
Speaker 1: thing really that they did it, but that's one of

1257
01:06:57,040 --> 01:06:59,959
Speaker 1: the They're capitalizing on the gains that they made based

1258
01:07:00,120 --> 01:07:02,360
Speaker 1: on the Row versus Wade decision and then trying to

1259
01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:05,479
Speaker 1: cement it with some of the economic ones, specifically because

1260
01:07:05,480 --> 01:07:08,040
Speaker 1: we saw so much union vote go to Trump in

1261
01:07:08,120 --> 01:07:10,360
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen. So I look at this as a smart

1262
01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:13,200
Speaker 1: savvy move on the Democrats part. If they did it

1263
01:07:13,240 --> 01:07:16,280
Speaker 1: more nationally, they would do they would do better in elections. Right. Well,

1264
01:07:16,320 --> 01:07:19,240
Speaker 1: this is what was always so idiotic about them either

1265
01:07:19,400 --> 01:07:23,480
Speaker 1: abandoning the labor movement or actively partnering with Republicans to

1266
01:07:23,480 --> 01:07:26,760
Speaker 1: crush it, is that for them, just from a political

1267
01:07:26,840 --> 01:07:31,560
Speaker 1: strategy perspective, it was absolutely idiotic. This is the first

1268
01:07:31,560 --> 01:07:35,360
Speaker 1: time in forty years that Democrats have held the House

1269
01:07:35,440 --> 01:07:38,560
Speaker 1: and the Senate in Michigan, so this was a really

1270
01:07:38,640 --> 01:07:42,360
Speaker 1: unusual opportunity presented to them by the combination of you know,

1271
01:07:42,520 --> 01:07:45,080
Speaker 1: Roe versus Wade, and also some of the like stop

1272
01:07:45,120 --> 01:07:48,280
Speaker 1: the steal insanity that people just viscerally rejected. It was

1273
01:07:48,360 --> 01:07:50,680
Speaker 1: a party line vote in the state Senate, so you

1274
01:07:50,760 --> 01:07:55,720
Speaker 1: had twenty Democrats and seventeen Republicans vote against, and the

1275
01:07:56,000 --> 01:07:58,720
Speaker 1: House voted already to pass the law last week. Now

1276
01:07:58,720 --> 01:08:00,400
Speaker 1: they've got to sign off on the final language and

1277
01:08:00,400 --> 01:08:02,680
Speaker 1: then I'll go to Gretchen Whitmer's desk to sign. But

1278
01:08:03,200 --> 01:08:06,080
Speaker 1: it was interesting of a sign of the times for

1279
01:08:06,280 --> 01:08:09,919
Speaker 1: you know, in my opinion, of Democrats changing their view

1280
01:08:10,000 --> 01:08:13,400
Speaker 1: of what's politically strategic for them. And also I think

1281
01:08:13,400 --> 01:08:16,840
Speaker 1: you also have to say the success of these grassroots

1282
01:08:17,040 --> 01:08:21,000
Speaker 1: movements has also really put pressure on legislators to back

1283
01:08:21,080 --> 01:08:24,240
Speaker 1: up some of their words with real action. Yeah. No,

1284
01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:27,000
Speaker 1: I think that's right, and it is an extraordinary move. It.

1285
01:08:27,120 --> 01:08:30,479
Speaker 1: Also what I'm curious is to see if Republicans, I'm

1286
01:08:30,479 --> 01:08:32,000
Speaker 1: not going to say they're going to start repealing it.

1287
01:08:32,320 --> 01:08:34,400
Speaker 1: I wonder though, if anybody's going to keep running on

1288
01:08:34,439 --> 01:08:36,240
Speaker 1: it the way that the Scott Walkers of the world

1289
01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:39,360
Speaker 1: and others did specifically in these types of states. I mean,

1290
01:08:39,360 --> 01:08:41,840
Speaker 1: they would just be fools to do so, even Trump

1291
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:44,000
Speaker 1: as well, I'd be very curious to see where you know,

1292
01:08:44,040 --> 01:08:47,240
Speaker 1: he may appoint a non labor friendly and LRB, but

1293
01:08:47,360 --> 01:08:49,200
Speaker 1: I'd be curious to see, like, if he was asked

1294
01:08:49,200 --> 01:08:52,160
Speaker 1: directly about it, what he would actually say, because something

1295
01:08:52,160 --> 01:08:53,880
Speaker 1: tells me that the winds are shifting, and I think

1296
01:08:53,920 --> 01:08:56,559
Speaker 1: this is just the forefront of that fight. Yeah, I

1297
01:08:56,560 --> 01:08:59,080
Speaker 1: think that's well said. All right, guys. So you may

1298
01:08:59,120 --> 01:09:04,479
Speaker 1: have already seen this viral clip of an author Bethany Mandel,

1299
01:09:04,560 --> 01:09:07,640
Speaker 1: who went on our former show Rising with Robbie and

1300
01:09:07,680 --> 01:09:11,040
Speaker 1: with Brianna, and Brianna asked her what should have been

1301
01:09:11,080 --> 01:09:14,960
Speaker 1: a very simple question, especially Bethany just wrote a book

1302
01:09:15,000 --> 01:09:17,800
Speaker 1: that is effectively about like her being anti woke and

1303
01:09:17,840 --> 01:09:20,680
Speaker 1: a pushback on wokeness. So Brianna asked her, a very

1304
01:09:20,680 --> 01:09:23,160
Speaker 1: simple question doesn't go particularly well, let's take a look

1305
01:09:23,200 --> 01:09:27,080
Speaker 1: at that. And for Americans consider themselves very liberal and

1306
01:09:27,120 --> 01:09:29,479
Speaker 1: probably fewer of them consider themselves to be woke. And

1307
01:09:29,520 --> 01:09:33,000
Speaker 1: so you know, when we talk about you, would you

1308
01:09:33,000 --> 01:09:34,559
Speaker 1: mind the finding well, because it's come up a couple

1309
01:09:34,560 --> 01:09:35,639
Speaker 1: of times and I just want to make sure we're

1310
01:09:35,680 --> 01:09:41,960
Speaker 1: on the same page. So, I mean, woke is sort

1311
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:51,040
Speaker 1: of the idea that I this is going to be

1312
01:09:51,080 --> 01:09:53,240
Speaker 1: one of those moments that goes viral. I mean, woke

1313
01:09:53,520 --> 01:09:55,559
Speaker 1: is something that's very hard to define, and we've spent

1314
01:09:55,600 --> 01:09:58,880
Speaker 1: an entire chapter defining it. It is sort of the

1315
01:09:59,000 --> 01:10:04,280
Speaker 1: understanding that we need to totally re imagine and reduce

1316
01:10:04,360 --> 01:10:12,439
Speaker 1: society in order to create hierarchies of oppression. Sorry, it's

1317
01:10:12,479 --> 01:10:20,000
Speaker 1: hard to explain in a fifteen second SoundBite, So no, wait, listen.

1318
01:10:20,080 --> 01:10:23,080
Speaker 1: I want to be compassionate because I've certainly had brain

1319
01:10:23,120 --> 01:10:27,200
Speaker 1: malfunctions on air, but I will say her response to this,

1320
01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:29,240
Speaker 1: which went by, I have millions of views on Twitter.

1321
01:10:29,240 --> 01:10:32,920
Speaker 1: Everybody was passing this thing around. Her response really made

1322
01:10:33,000 --> 01:10:36,040
Speaker 1: things a lot worse because she tried to blame Brianna,

1323
01:10:36,240 --> 01:10:38,680
Speaker 1: who I didn't even think. Brianna wasn't asking like an

1324
01:10:38,720 --> 01:10:43,240
Speaker 1: aggressive question. No, this is like a really basic you know, Okay,

1325
01:10:43,280 --> 01:10:45,000
Speaker 1: let's just make sure we're all on the same page

1326
01:10:45,040 --> 01:10:48,479
Speaker 1: and define our terms here. So Bethany went on Twitter,

1327
01:10:48,600 --> 01:10:51,800
Speaker 1: and in part what she said is just before we

1328
01:10:51,840 --> 01:10:54,760
Speaker 1: went on air, Brianna Joy Gray was on a hot mic.

1329
01:10:54,840 --> 01:10:58,559
Speaker 1: I heard her demeaning parenting in general, and colorful and

1330
01:10:58,680 --> 01:11:01,880
Speaker 1: nasty terms, staying parents only have kids in order to

1331
01:11:01,920 --> 01:11:05,800
Speaker 1: perpetuate their own narcissism. Robbie responded, there are some good

1332
01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:08,160
Speaker 1: ones and some bad ones, and she said that that

1333
01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:11,240
Speaker 1: threw her off for the segment. I mean, first of all,

1334
01:11:11,280 --> 01:11:14,679
Speaker 1: I just don't believe you. But second of all, yeah,

1335
01:11:14,760 --> 01:11:16,680
Speaker 1: second of all, like you're like seven minutes into the

1336
01:11:16,720 --> 01:11:19,720
Speaker 1: segment when this happens, and it's like only then that

1337
01:11:19,800 --> 01:11:23,880
Speaker 1: the parenting, the hit on parenting before the segment even started,

1338
01:11:23,920 --> 01:11:28,360
Speaker 1: really gets to you. Look, take the L That's my response.

1339
01:11:28,760 --> 01:11:30,880
Speaker 1: Just take it. Sometimes you just got to take the L.

1340
01:11:31,040 --> 01:11:33,439
Speaker 1: That's it sometimes. Listen, I've been on the other side

1341
01:11:33,439 --> 01:11:35,559
Speaker 1: of that clip. I get it all right. Yeah, at

1342
01:11:35,600 --> 01:11:39,960
Speaker 1: the nobody's perfect. That said, I think that she did

1343
01:11:39,960 --> 01:11:43,559
Speaker 1: herself a disservice. And look, the fair critique is if

1344
01:11:43,600 --> 01:11:45,559
Speaker 1: you are going to write a whole book about this,

1345
01:11:46,080 --> 01:11:48,200
Speaker 1: then you actually and you're going to go on TV

1346
01:11:48,360 --> 01:11:50,960
Speaker 1: to promote it. Yeah, you actually kind of do need

1347
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:53,120
Speaker 1: a fifteen second answer, And I could give you a

1348
01:11:53,120 --> 01:11:55,800
Speaker 1: better one. Bethany, read my book because it's not something

1349
01:11:55,840 --> 01:11:58,960
Speaker 1: that I can summarize in a single sentence. There you go,

1350
01:11:59,160 --> 01:12:02,320
Speaker 1: that's actually a decent one, or the hollow and false

1351
01:12:02,360 --> 01:12:07,360
Speaker 1: moral superiority on racial and gender issues. That's not necessarily,

1352
01:12:07,439 --> 01:12:09,840
Speaker 1: in my opinion, the best definition, but that's one that

1353
01:12:09,880 --> 01:12:13,479
Speaker 1: you could probably put together in a single sentence, or

1354
01:12:13,600 --> 01:12:16,240
Speaker 1: you could just say, look, it's one of those things

1355
01:12:16,400 --> 01:12:20,880
Speaker 1: like the famous Supreme Court quote on pornography. You know

1356
01:12:20,920 --> 01:12:22,880
Speaker 1: it when you see it. I think all of those

1357
01:12:22,880 --> 01:12:26,280
Speaker 1: are valid responses. I don't think that any of them

1358
01:12:26,320 --> 01:12:29,840
Speaker 1: really capture the essence of what it actually means. I

1359
01:12:29,840 --> 01:12:32,439
Speaker 1: actually think that Supreme Court one I laid out is

1360
01:12:32,479 --> 01:12:36,719
Speaker 1: probably the best definition. Unfortunately, just because as you have showed, Crystal,

1361
01:12:37,000 --> 01:12:39,040
Speaker 1: it can mean anything to anyone, which is part of

1362
01:12:39,040 --> 01:12:42,800
Speaker 1: the problem with trying to define and that that is

1363
01:12:42,880 --> 01:12:46,080
Speaker 1: actually that's why this clip won so viral, I think

1364
01:12:46,120 --> 01:12:48,840
Speaker 1: for a couple of reasons, because, I mean, when you

1365
01:12:48,920 --> 01:12:53,719
Speaker 1: see the right claiming that the Silicon Valley Bank bailount

1366
01:12:53,800 --> 01:12:57,080
Speaker 1: is all about wokeness, you realize the term has lost

1367
01:12:57,240 --> 01:12:59,680
Speaker 1: any sort of real meaning, and so it's in the

1368
01:12:59,720 --> 01:13:02,600
Speaker 1: kind of that moment where people look at this and

1369
01:13:02,640 --> 01:13:04,679
Speaker 1: it's like, Okay, this kind of gives up the game

1370
01:13:04,840 --> 01:13:08,040
Speaker 1: that you just are using the word wokeness to define

1371
01:13:08,080 --> 01:13:10,519
Speaker 1: anything that you don't like and that you object to.

1372
01:13:11,520 --> 01:13:14,040
Speaker 1: I think there are kind of two components. And the

1373
01:13:14,040 --> 01:13:15,519
Speaker 1: reason I wanted to talk to you about this is

1374
01:13:15,560 --> 01:13:18,639
Speaker 1: because I actually do think. Obviously it's a contested term. Obviously,

1375
01:13:18,680 --> 01:13:21,280
Speaker 1: the definition of it in some corners of the right

1376
01:13:21,320 --> 01:13:23,800
Speaker 1: has been expanded to just mean like anything I don't like,

1377
01:13:23,880 --> 01:13:26,280
Speaker 1: and I'm just gonna, you know, throw this termount of

1378
01:13:26,439 --> 01:13:29,240
Speaker 1: about a bank bailout or about an environmental policy, like

1379
01:13:29,320 --> 01:13:31,200
Speaker 1: whatever it is i'm going I disagree with. I'm just

1380
01:13:31,200 --> 01:13:33,360
Speaker 1: gonna say it's woke and use that as my catch

1381
01:13:33,360 --> 01:13:36,960
Speaker 1: all phrase for something that I disagree with. But you know,

1382
01:13:37,040 --> 01:13:42,120
Speaker 1: the original idea of wokeness was like an awareness of injustice,

1383
01:13:42,120 --> 01:13:47,040
Speaker 1: which okay, no problem with that whatsoever. Where my critique

1384
01:13:47,439 --> 01:13:52,760
Speaker 1: of wokeness comes in is when you add authoritarian tactics

1385
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:57,519
Speaker 1: in service of supposed social justice. Ends to me, that's

1386
01:13:57,560 --> 01:14:00,599
Speaker 1: one piece of it. The other piece of it is

1387
01:14:00,680 --> 01:14:06,120
Speaker 1: a level of superficiality that distracts from deeper problems. So

1388
01:14:06,280 --> 01:14:07,800
Speaker 1: this is some of what I talked about in my

1389
01:14:08,040 --> 01:14:10,320
Speaker 1: monologue about how you know, the anti woke people, some

1390
01:14:10,360 --> 01:14:13,080
Speaker 1: of them have adopted similar authoritarian tactics that we should

1391
01:14:13,120 --> 01:14:16,799
Speaker 1: also stand against. But you know, when you're using tactics

1392
01:14:16,840 --> 01:14:20,760
Speaker 1: of censorship, canceling, et cetera, that's authoritarian piece. The superficial

1393
01:14:20,840 --> 01:14:24,719
Speaker 1: piece is you know when you're putting up a Black

1394
01:14:24,760 --> 01:14:28,920
Speaker 1: Lives Matter banner on the Amazon website and pretending like

1395
01:14:29,000 --> 01:14:32,400
Speaker 1: this has anything to do with social justice, or you know,

1396
01:14:32,560 --> 01:14:36,800
Speaker 1: putting the first black woman vice president up there and

1397
01:14:36,880 --> 01:14:39,479
Speaker 1: pretending like this is some victory for all black people

1398
01:14:39,560 --> 01:14:43,400
Speaker 1: when actually the policy aims and core values that she's

1399
01:14:43,439 --> 01:14:46,960
Speaker 1: pursued have been very damaging at times for those communities.

1400
01:14:47,360 --> 01:14:49,400
Speaker 1: So to me, those are the two pieces of it.

1401
01:14:49,400 --> 01:14:54,400
Speaker 1: It's like authoritarian tactics plus the sort of superficial personal

1402
01:14:54,479 --> 01:15:00,080
Speaker 1: identity lens of politics that erases everything else. Yeah, I

1403
01:15:00,120 --> 01:15:05,160
Speaker 1: think superficiality and authoritarianism are the two hallmarks of wokeness.

1404
01:15:05,240 --> 01:15:08,960
Speaker 1: I mean, I live in a neighborhood where it'll be

1405
01:15:09,040 --> 01:15:13,240
Speaker 1: like Black Lives Matter flag, Ukraine flag, trans flag, Gay

1406
01:15:13,280 --> 01:15:16,799
Speaker 1: Pride flag, and then that very same person will lobby

1407
01:15:16,880 --> 01:15:20,120
Speaker 1: against affordable housing and you're like, well, hold on a second,

1408
01:15:20,160 --> 01:15:23,479
Speaker 1: so what's going on here? Are we talking about your

1409
01:15:23,479 --> 01:15:26,280
Speaker 1: home values or are we talking about Black Lives Matter?

1410
01:15:26,320 --> 01:15:30,559
Speaker 1: Because those actually are pretty incongruent if you were to

1411
01:15:30,280 --> 01:15:32,360
Speaker 1: get into it. But that's the whole point is you're

1412
01:15:32,400 --> 01:15:35,160
Speaker 1: not actually getting into it. So I think virtue signaling

1413
01:15:35,400 --> 01:15:39,320
Speaker 1: and superficiality and specifically authoritarianism at the very heart of

1414
01:15:39,360 --> 01:15:41,200
Speaker 1: what all of this is. And I think it is

1415
01:15:41,280 --> 01:15:44,320
Speaker 1: unfortunate that Bethany was unable to get at that because

1416
01:15:44,439 --> 01:15:47,360
Speaker 1: I think, you know, rightfully, people not even necessarily should

1417
01:15:47,360 --> 01:15:49,720
Speaker 1: be quote opposed to it. But I don't think that

1418
01:15:49,720 --> 01:15:53,880
Speaker 1: that is a functional way to have a society with

1419
01:15:53,960 --> 01:15:58,560
Speaker 1: three hundred and thirty million people of differing views and backgrounds,

1420
01:15:58,800 --> 01:16:02,000
Speaker 1: of ethnicities. We are one of the most heterogeneous nations

1421
01:16:02,240 --> 01:16:05,439
Speaker 1: literally on all of planet Earth. It somehow seems to work.

1422
01:16:05,520 --> 01:16:09,679
Speaker 1: Sometimes it doesn't end that authoritarian mindset, by the way,

1423
01:16:09,880 --> 01:16:13,040
Speaker 1: and you pointed us all the way out too, you know, authoritarian. Look,

1424
01:16:13,120 --> 01:16:16,439
Speaker 1: I'm here in my hometown of College Station, Texas. I

1425
01:16:16,479 --> 01:16:18,880
Speaker 1: don't you know, I hate wokeness, But let me tell

1426
01:16:18,880 --> 01:16:22,880
Speaker 1: you something, I hate oppressive evangelical culture just as much

1427
01:16:23,000 --> 01:16:25,040
Speaker 1: because and one of the reasons that I rebel against

1428
01:16:25,080 --> 01:16:28,160
Speaker 1: wokeness is because I know what it is like from

1429
01:16:28,240 --> 01:16:30,439
Speaker 1: the other side. You know, I've i grew up in

1430
01:16:30,520 --> 01:16:33,439
Speaker 1: a place and in a time where questioning the Iraq

1431
01:16:33,520 --> 01:16:37,519
Speaker 1: War here in my hometown, or really just anything on

1432
01:16:37,840 --> 01:16:41,639
Speaker 1: social issues, or even you know, raising a thought which

1433
01:16:41,680 --> 01:16:47,240
Speaker 1: didn't abide by the Southern Baptist Convention was crushed and

1434
01:16:47,479 --> 01:16:51,840
Speaker 1: was looked down upon with such nastiness and with censorship

1435
01:16:51,880 --> 01:16:54,479
Speaker 1: also even from the highest levels, including some of my teachers.

1436
01:16:54,520 --> 01:16:57,000
Speaker 1: I've given the evolution example here before on the show,

1437
01:16:57,680 --> 01:16:59,479
Speaker 1: so I know what it is. And also I lived

1438
01:16:59,479 --> 01:17:02,400
Speaker 1: in the Middle East, very oppressive authoritarian country in Qatar,

1439
01:17:02,640 --> 01:17:06,360
Speaker 1: so these are places where you know it fundamentally comes

1440
01:17:06,400 --> 01:17:09,080
Speaker 1: down to, in my opinion, for some people, a rejection

1441
01:17:09,200 --> 01:17:12,759
Speaker 1: of that authoritarianism. But it doesn't necessarily need to also

1442
01:17:12,840 --> 01:17:15,400
Speaker 1: be kind of a how would you say, a trojan

1443
01:17:15,479 --> 01:17:19,320
Speaker 1: horse for authoritarianism of another kind. Yes, well said, And

1444
01:17:19,400 --> 01:17:22,519
Speaker 1: I think where I really differ because Bethany did go

1445
01:17:22,560 --> 01:17:27,920
Speaker 1: on Twitter and give her considered definition short definition of wokeness.

1446
01:17:28,120 --> 01:17:30,840
Speaker 1: She said, it's a radical belief system, suggesting our institutions

1447
01:17:30,840 --> 01:17:33,639
Speaker 1: are built around discrimination, claiming all disparity as a result

1448
01:17:33,640 --> 01:17:37,479
Speaker 1: of that discrimination seeks a radical redefinition of society in

1449
01:17:37,520 --> 01:17:39,920
Speaker 1: which equality of group result is the endpoint. Enforced by

1450
01:17:39,920 --> 01:17:42,240
Speaker 1: an angry mob. And I think where I really differ

1451
01:17:42,479 --> 01:17:46,479
Speaker 1: from people like Bethany and other like you know, anti

1452
01:17:46,560 --> 01:17:50,920
Speaker 1: woke activists at this point is that the tactics are

1453
01:17:51,000 --> 01:17:55,479
Speaker 1: authoritarian and quite terrible for a democratic society. Right, the

1454
01:17:55,520 --> 01:17:59,960
Speaker 1: tactics are completely unacceptable, but the aims are actually quite small.

1455
01:18:00,479 --> 01:18:04,879
Speaker 1: And you know, to get the certain like quota racial

1456
01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:07,840
Speaker 1: quota diversity metric on a board, or to have some

1457
01:18:07,920 --> 01:18:10,479
Speaker 1: like corporate virtue signal, or like I said, to just

1458
01:18:10,600 --> 01:18:13,519
Speaker 1: you know, change that personal identity characteristics of the Vice

1459
01:18:13,520 --> 01:18:17,560
Speaker 1: President of the United States. And my half joking definition

1460
01:18:18,120 --> 01:18:21,439
Speaker 1: of wokeness is that it's basically like a CIA op

1461
01:18:21,800 --> 01:18:26,040
Speaker 1: to disrupt progressive groups and keep them focused on interpersonal

1462
01:18:26,160 --> 01:18:30,520
Speaker 1: squabbles and cancel culture among themselves rather than actually pursuing

1463
01:18:30,840 --> 01:18:34,479
Speaker 1: the more transformational end goals that their groups are supposed

1464
01:18:34,479 --> 01:18:38,400
Speaker 1: to ultimately be about. So my half joking definition of wokeism,

1465
01:18:38,400 --> 01:18:40,519
Speaker 1: but there's some truth to that. I mean, no one

1466
01:18:40,560 --> 01:18:44,439
Speaker 1: has been more hurt by this canceled culture direction of

1467
01:18:44,880 --> 01:18:48,240
Speaker 1: the left than progressive organizations who are supposed to be

1468
01:18:48,240 --> 01:18:50,519
Speaker 1: getting things done in the world, and instead, as Ryan

1469
01:18:50,560 --> 01:18:53,240
Speaker 1: Grimm has documented a great length are spending all their

1470
01:18:53,280 --> 01:18:56,599
Speaker 1: times like fighting with each other and you know, taking

1471
01:18:56,680 --> 01:19:00,400
Speaker 1: days off to deal with their supposedly toxic workplace. Yeah.

1472
01:19:00,760 --> 01:19:02,800
Speaker 1: I think that's very well said. You know, I think

1473
01:19:02,880 --> 01:19:05,439
Speaker 1: it is an op really on everybody because it also

1474
01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:07,880
Speaker 1: you know, there's a certain type of conservative mind which

1475
01:19:08,520 --> 01:19:10,519
Speaker 1: this is all, this is all they think about. You know.

1476
01:19:10,720 --> 01:19:13,639
Speaker 1: I think we we were all chatting privately recently about

1477
01:19:13,640 --> 01:19:17,240
Speaker 1: the more recent Shane Gillis the special that he did

1478
01:19:17,720 --> 01:19:20,000
Speaker 1: which is out there on YouTube. The comedian. He talks

1479
01:19:20,040 --> 01:19:22,479
Speaker 1: about his Fox News dad. He's a guy who lives

1480
01:19:22,479 --> 01:19:24,720
Speaker 1: in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. He's like, do you believe what's going

1481
01:19:24,720 --> 01:19:26,760
Speaker 1: on the southern border. He's like, he's so mad he

1482
01:19:26,840 --> 01:19:29,800
Speaker 1: can't even and he can't even explain. And it's like, yeah,

1483
01:19:29,880 --> 01:19:34,200
Speaker 1: it's like that's you know, it's weaponized in two directions

1484
01:19:34,560 --> 01:19:37,040
Speaker 1: as a distraction. So and look, I can be guilty

1485
01:19:37,040 --> 01:19:39,240
Speaker 1: of it. And shit drives me crazy too. I get it.

1486
01:19:39,320 --> 01:19:42,639
Speaker 1: I really I get why all of this stuff works.

1487
01:19:42,720 --> 01:19:44,720
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think it was unfortunate for her, But

1488
01:19:44,960 --> 01:19:47,280
Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe honestly I have less empathy just

1489
01:19:47,320 --> 01:19:48,840
Speaker 1: because I'm like, if you're going to do an entire

1490
01:19:48,840 --> 01:19:50,479
Speaker 1: book and you're literally going to go on a promo

1491
01:19:50,600 --> 01:19:52,960
Speaker 1: tour for it. Then you know that's kind that's on you.

1492
01:19:53,040 --> 01:19:55,240
Speaker 1: That's one of the most basic questions. Literally, that is

1493
01:19:55,280 --> 01:19:56,680
Speaker 1: And I think that's why I went viral. That's my

1494
01:19:56,840 --> 01:19:59,799
Speaker 1: left I'm trying to be nice, but if I'm being honest,

1495
01:20:00,040 --> 01:20:03,719
Speaker 1: I don't want to becau isn't such a basic question.

1496
01:20:04,000 --> 01:20:07,400
Speaker 1: It's like, come on, get it together. That'd be like

1497
01:20:07,439 --> 01:20:09,800
Speaker 1: if somebody asked you and I if you were not

1498
01:20:09,840 --> 01:20:12,360
Speaker 1: on somebody's show, and they go, what is populism? And

1499
01:20:12,400 --> 01:20:17,040
Speaker 1: I was like, WHOA. I wrote a book about it,

1500
01:20:17,040 --> 01:20:25,120
Speaker 1: but I can't explain it. It was like, come on, Crissell,

1501
01:20:25,160 --> 01:20:27,280
Speaker 1: what are you taking a look at? Well, now that

1502
01:20:27,280 --> 01:20:29,160
Speaker 1: we are a few days out from the Silicon Valley

1503
01:20:29,160 --> 01:20:30,680
Speaker 1: bail and I've had some time to reflect on some

1504
01:20:30,680 --> 01:20:33,040
Speaker 1: of the deeper problems in the banking sector and in

1505
01:20:33,080 --> 01:20:35,519
Speaker 1: our economy that has led us to this place of

1506
01:20:35,560 --> 01:20:40,600
Speaker 1: frequent crises, crashes, and bailouts requiring ever escalating dramatic interventions,

1507
01:20:41,120 --> 01:20:43,719
Speaker 1: and all roads seem to lead back to one place,

1508
01:20:44,160 --> 01:20:46,439
Speaker 1: the FED. Whether you look at the micro causes of

1509
01:20:46,439 --> 01:20:49,200
Speaker 1: this bank failure, the details of this bail out, or

1510
01:20:49,680 --> 01:20:51,639
Speaker 1: you zoom ount to look at how we ended up

1511
01:20:51,680 --> 01:20:54,599
Speaker 1: in Gilded Age Part two. Here the Fed's choices are

1512
01:20:54,640 --> 01:20:58,160
Speaker 1: at the center of these stories. Now the TLDR is

1513
01:20:58,200 --> 01:21:00,919
Speaker 1: this for the course a four president in two decades,

1514
01:21:01,080 --> 01:21:05,280
Speaker 1: the FED has claimed extraordinary powers and then chosen to

1515
01:21:05,479 --> 01:21:09,320
Speaker 1: use them only on behalf of the wealthy and well connected. First,

1516
01:21:09,360 --> 01:21:11,840
Speaker 1: let's start with the specifics of this particular crisis. Silicon

1517
01:21:11,920 --> 01:21:14,519
Speaker 1: Valley bank leadership deserves all the shame and blame in

1518
01:21:14,560 --> 01:21:19,120
Speaker 1: the world, but greed and idiocy are a permanent feature

1519
01:21:19,200 --> 01:21:22,400
Speaker 1: of human societies, which is exactly why we build safeguards

1520
01:21:22,400 --> 01:21:25,120
Speaker 1: into systems to protect blameless people from the greed and

1521
01:21:25,520 --> 01:21:28,599
Speaker 1: idiocy of others. So where the hell was the FED

1522
01:21:28,760 --> 01:21:31,720
Speaker 1: while Silicon Valley was loading up on uninsured deposits from

1523
01:21:31,760 --> 01:21:34,200
Speaker 1: a group of clients under severe pressure from the fed's

1524
01:21:34,200 --> 01:21:37,599
Speaker 1: own interest rate moves, while also loading up with long

1525
01:21:37,680 --> 01:21:42,200
Speaker 1: term treasuries subject to the exact same risk. This crisis

1526
01:21:42,320 --> 01:21:45,000
Speaker 1: was entirely predictable, and was in fact predicted by at

1527
01:21:45,040 --> 01:21:47,559
Speaker 1: least one short seller who has been posting about it

1528
01:21:47,600 --> 01:21:50,320
Speaker 1: on Twitter for months. Making matters worse is the fact

1529
01:21:50,360 --> 01:21:53,759
Speaker 1: that Silicon Valley Banks CEO actually sat on the board

1530
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:56,320
Speaker 1: of the San Francisco FED. Not exactly a great look.

1531
01:21:56,800 --> 01:21:59,200
Speaker 1: The FED was asleep at the switch, failing at one

1532
01:21:59,200 --> 01:22:02,880
Speaker 1: of their most essential tasks. What's more, Lever News is

1533
01:22:02,920 --> 01:22:06,160
Speaker 1: reporting that the FED actually gave SVB a special waiver

1534
01:22:06,280 --> 01:22:09,280
Speaker 1: in twenty seventeen that allowed them to double dip as

1535
01:22:09,320 --> 01:22:12,639
Speaker 1: both a traditional deposit taking bank with a huge venture

1536
01:22:12,680 --> 01:22:16,920
Speaker 1: backed clientele and also an investor in the very venture

1537
01:22:16,960 --> 01:22:20,920
Speaker 1: capital funds which were backing their clients. This left the

1538
01:22:20,920 --> 01:22:23,759
Speaker 1: bank doubly exposed to the tech winter, which has crushed

1539
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:26,879
Speaker 1: startup valuations, dried up funding, and led to mass layoffs

1540
01:22:26,880 --> 01:22:30,040
Speaker 1: in large tech companies. So if the FED can't be

1541
01:22:30,080 --> 01:22:33,479
Speaker 1: trusted in their role as regulator, what can they do

1542
01:22:33,640 --> 01:22:36,320
Speaker 1: well well. The dual missions of the Fed's monetary policy

1543
01:22:36,400 --> 01:22:39,240
Speaker 1: are supposed to be unemployment and inflation, and of course,

1544
01:22:39,240 --> 01:22:41,320
Speaker 1: the FED has made a big show of dramatic interest

1545
01:22:41,360 --> 01:22:45,000
Speaker 1: rate spikes in order to try to curb inflation. Their

1546
01:22:45,040 --> 01:22:48,080
Speaker 1: explicit goal with these actions are to crush labor, spike

1547
01:22:48,120 --> 01:22:50,559
Speaker 1: unemployment and lower wages under the theory that this will

1548
01:22:50,560 --> 01:22:52,920
Speaker 1: help to get inflation under control. Now, let's put the

1549
01:22:53,000 --> 01:22:57,080
Speaker 1: sociopathy of this policy aside and just ask how's that

1550
01:22:57,160 --> 01:23:01,000
Speaker 1: going well? As some of us predicted, doesn't really appear

1551
01:23:01,000 --> 01:23:03,559
Speaker 1: to be working well at all. We've got new numbers

1552
01:23:03,560 --> 01:23:06,400
Speaker 1: on inflation and they ain't great. The top line annual

1553
01:23:06,479 --> 01:23:09,799
Speaker 1: numbers showed some improvement, but under the surface the news

1554
01:23:10,000 --> 01:23:13,880
Speaker 1: was all uniformly bad. The core consumer price INDECKS jumped

1555
01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:16,560
Speaker 1: point five percent month over month. That was the fastest

1556
01:23:16,800 --> 01:23:21,040
Speaker 1: fastest acceleration since September. In other words, the medicine is

1557
01:23:21,120 --> 01:23:24,479
Speaker 1: not working, but it could very well be killing the patient.

1558
01:23:24,840 --> 01:23:27,640
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Warren has been warning of exactly the scenario for

1559
01:23:27,680 --> 01:23:29,920
Speaker 1: some time now, notably last week in a pretty hot

1560
01:23:29,960 --> 01:23:33,639
Speaker 1: exchange with FED chair Jerome pal Take a listen. In December,

1561
01:23:33,680 --> 01:23:36,120
Speaker 1: the FED released its projections on the state of the

1562
01:23:36,120 --> 01:23:39,920
Speaker 1: economy under your monetary policy plan. According to the Fed's

1563
01:23:39,960 --> 01:23:43,639
Speaker 1: own report, if you'll continue raising interest rates as you plan,

1564
01:23:44,080 --> 01:23:47,320
Speaker 1: unemployment will be four point six percent by the end

1565
01:23:47,360 --> 01:23:49,920
Speaker 1: of the year, more than a full point higher than

1566
01:23:49,960 --> 01:23:53,080
Speaker 1: it is today, Chair Pale, If you hit your projections,

1567
01:23:53,400 --> 01:23:55,599
Speaker 1: do you know how many people who are currently working

1568
01:23:55,840 --> 01:23:59,840
Speaker 1: going about their lives will lose their jobs? I don't.

1569
01:24:00,520 --> 01:24:02,000
Speaker 1: I don't have that number in front of me, I

1570
01:24:02,040 --> 01:24:05,400
Speaker 1: will say it's an intended consequence, but it is, and

1571
01:24:05,400 --> 01:24:07,280
Speaker 1: it's in your report, and that would be about two

1572
01:24:07,400 --> 01:24:10,040
Speaker 1: million people who would lose their jobs, people who are

1573
01:24:10,080 --> 01:24:12,800
Speaker 1: working right now making their mortgages. So, chair Pal, if

1574
01:24:12,800 --> 01:24:15,599
Speaker 1: you could speak directly to the two million hard working

1575
01:24:15,640 --> 01:24:18,920
Speaker 1: people who have decent jobs today who you're planning to

1576
01:24:19,000 --> 01:24:21,720
Speaker 1: get fired over the next year, what would you say

1577
01:24:21,720 --> 01:24:23,439
Speaker 1: to them? How would you explain your view that they

1578
01:24:23,479 --> 01:24:25,880
Speaker 1: need to lose their jobs? I would explain to people

1579
01:24:26,080 --> 01:24:29,400
Speaker 1: more broadly, that inflation is extremely high and it's hurting

1580
01:24:29,479 --> 01:24:32,080
Speaker 1: the working people of this country badly, all of them,

1581
01:24:32,240 --> 01:24:33,559
Speaker 1: not just two million of them, but all of them

1582
01:24:33,600 --> 01:24:36,720
Speaker 1: are suffering under high inflation. And we are taking the

1583
01:24:36,760 --> 01:24:40,000
Speaker 1: only measures we have to bring inflation down, and putting

1584
01:24:40,040 --> 01:24:41,600
Speaker 1: two million people out of work is just part of

1585
01:24:41,600 --> 01:24:43,400
Speaker 1: the cost, and they just have to bear it well

1586
01:24:43,400 --> 01:24:46,080
Speaker 1: they will. Will working people be better off if we

1587
01:24:46,160 --> 01:24:48,640
Speaker 1: just walk away from our jobs and inflation remains five

1588
01:24:48,720 --> 01:24:51,200
Speaker 1: six percent? And you know what, chair Pal, to be fair,

1589
01:24:51,320 --> 01:24:54,240
Speaker 1: he's got a point. Inflation does hurt workers. The FED

1590
01:24:54,360 --> 01:24:56,760
Speaker 1: does have a limited set of tools to deal with it.

1591
01:24:56,800 --> 01:25:00,000
Speaker 1: There is no substitute for having a functioning legislative branch

1592
01:25:00,240 --> 01:25:03,400
Speaker 1: that is more appropriate for dealing with the supply chain, war,

1593
01:25:03,600 --> 01:25:07,160
Speaker 1: price gouging, and climate crises related price increases that are

1594
01:25:07,200 --> 01:25:11,160
Speaker 1: at the core of this persistent inflation. But the current

1595
01:25:11,160 --> 01:25:14,160
Speaker 1: bailout response really exposes the game that the feed is

1596
01:25:14,160 --> 01:25:16,760
Speaker 1: playing here because for them, as explained by a drown Powell,

1597
01:25:16,800 --> 01:25:20,960
Speaker 1: there ordinary workers getting hurt, well, that's just unintended consequences,

1598
01:25:21,000 --> 01:25:24,679
Speaker 1: necessary pain. But everything that hurts rich people is deemed

1599
01:25:24,760 --> 01:25:29,080
Speaker 1: an emergency. They interpret their powers in an extraordinarily broad

1600
01:25:29,200 --> 01:25:32,120
Speaker 1: way when it comes to helping the wealthy and the

1601
01:25:32,120 --> 01:25:35,080
Speaker 1: well connected, yet they throw up their hands when it

1602
01:25:35,080 --> 01:25:39,000
Speaker 1: comes to helping anyone else. Remember one of the primary

1603
01:25:39,040 --> 01:25:42,120
Speaker 1: political justifications offered for this new bailout, which has created

1604
01:25:42,200 --> 01:25:44,599
Speaker 1: as a de facto policy that one hundred percent of

1605
01:25:44,640 --> 01:25:47,959
Speaker 1: every rich person's deposits are backed by US, dear taxpayer,

1606
01:25:48,280 --> 01:25:50,760
Speaker 1: and that every bank is now too big to fail,

1607
01:25:51,080 --> 01:25:54,240
Speaker 1: was that workers in Silicon Valley might lose their jobs. Now,

1608
01:25:54,280 --> 01:25:57,720
Speaker 1: I am sympathetic to those concerns. I genuinely, genuinely am.

1609
01:25:57,880 --> 01:26:00,599
Speaker 1: Losing a job can be traumatic, devastated, and in some

1610
01:26:00,680 --> 01:26:03,920
Speaker 1: instances even life ending. But why does the FED care

1611
01:26:03,960 --> 01:26:06,800
Speaker 1: so much about these particular workers, yet have such a

1612
01:26:06,920 --> 01:26:10,360
Speaker 1: blase callus regard for the millions of workers that their

1613
01:26:10,439 --> 01:26:13,880
Speaker 1: rate policy is explicitly engineered to toss out of a job.

1614
01:26:14,439 --> 01:26:16,960
Speaker 1: The details of this bailout go even deeper, though, allowing

1615
01:26:16,960 --> 01:26:18,519
Speaker 1: me to get a little bit wonky here for a moment,

1616
01:26:18,560 --> 01:26:21,839
Speaker 1: to try to explain a key point in crafting its response.

1617
01:26:22,120 --> 01:26:25,679
Speaker 1: The FED invoked its power under section thirteen to three

1618
01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:28,960
Speaker 1: of the Federal Reserve Act. Is explained by Nathan Tankas

1619
01:26:28,960 --> 01:26:31,400
Speaker 1: and his substack notes on the crises. He knows that

1620
01:26:31,439 --> 01:26:34,120
Speaker 1: section thirteen three requires an emergency or what in the

1621
01:26:34,160 --> 01:26:38,760
Speaker 1: law they describe as quote unusual and exigent circumstances. Now,

1622
01:26:38,960 --> 01:26:41,439
Speaker 1: an emergency is, of course, all in eyes of the beholder.

1623
01:26:41,600 --> 01:26:44,439
Speaker 1: The FED clearly thinks rich vc is having to provide

1624
01:26:44,439 --> 01:26:47,120
Speaker 1: a bridge loan to the portfolio companies is an emergency.

1625
01:26:47,439 --> 01:26:50,720
Speaker 1: But the aforementioned millions of people losing jobs because of

1626
01:26:50,760 --> 01:26:55,240
Speaker 1: FED policy is not an emergency. As Tankas writes, if

1627
01:26:55,240 --> 01:26:59,280
Speaker 1: this is an emergency, then basically any moderately sized event

1628
01:26:59,439 --> 01:27:02,360
Speaker 1: with a knock on effect on the economy is an emergency.

1629
01:27:02,800 --> 01:27:06,400
Speaker 1: Unusual in exigen circumstances see now to be little more

1630
01:27:06,640 --> 01:27:09,680
Speaker 1: than a day where there was moderately bad weather, or

1631
01:27:09,720 --> 01:27:12,519
Speaker 1: at least I would add moderately bad weather for the

1632
01:27:12,560 --> 01:27:15,240
Speaker 1: bankers and investors that the FED is deeply connected to

1633
01:27:15,400 --> 01:27:19,080
Speaker 1: and apparently very persuaded by. The fundamental problem is this

1634
01:27:19,479 --> 01:27:21,640
Speaker 1: Congress is dysfunctional and corrupt, so our fates are all

1635
01:27:21,680 --> 01:27:23,920
Speaker 1: subject to the whims of courts and of the Fed.

1636
01:27:23,960 --> 01:27:26,559
Speaker 1: As one person on Twitter said, roughly speaking, the current

1637
01:27:26,560 --> 01:27:29,759
Speaker 1: definition of democracy is ruled by judges and central bankers.

1638
01:27:30,280 --> 01:27:34,920
Speaker 1: We desperately need a working, actual democracy. But hey, list

1639
01:27:34,920 --> 01:27:37,840
Speaker 1: if we're going to be ruled by powerful, undemocratic institutions,

1640
01:27:38,160 --> 01:27:40,519
Speaker 1: they could cut us in on the deal. Here. Ryan

1641
01:27:40,560 --> 01:27:43,639
Speaker 1: Cooper at The American Prospect floats one good potential idea

1642
01:27:43,680 --> 01:27:46,880
Speaker 1: with regards to the FED. He says, a banking public option.

1643
01:27:46,960 --> 01:27:49,800
Speaker 1: It's a pretty simple concept. Right now, only banks can

1644
01:27:49,840 --> 01:27:52,920
Speaker 1: have accounts with the FED. What if everyone could? Now

1645
01:27:52,960 --> 01:27:55,879
Speaker 1: the benefits would be immense to ordinary people. Every American

1646
01:27:55,880 --> 01:27:59,320
Speaker 1: could have a free basic checking account, zero fees, zero

1647
01:27:59,320 --> 01:28:04,200
Speaker 1: transaction cost. Transfers between these accounts would also be free

1648
01:28:04,320 --> 01:28:08,040
Speaker 1: and quick. Any government stimulus programs like the previous STiMi checks.

1649
01:28:08,280 --> 01:28:12,400
Speaker 1: They could be easily deposited instantaneously and critically, by cutting

1650
01:28:12,439 --> 01:28:16,880
Speaker 1: out the rapacious banking middlemen, citizens could immediately benefit from

1651
01:28:17,040 --> 01:28:20,320
Speaker 1: higher interest rate earnings on their accounts when the FED

1652
01:28:20,400 --> 01:28:23,400
Speaker 1: does lift rates. Right now, when the FED lifts rates,

1653
01:28:23,520 --> 01:28:27,439
Speaker 1: banks basically do nothing. They keep savings account interest near zero.

1654
01:28:27,880 --> 01:28:30,960
Speaker 1: With a FED account, you would instantly benefit from the increase,

1655
01:28:31,040 --> 01:28:36,680
Speaker 1: thus ending a massive FED subsidy that banks currently benefit from. Unfortunately,

1656
01:28:36,680 --> 01:28:38,840
Speaker 1: when the FED ask their other banker friends about this idea,

1657
01:28:38,880 --> 01:28:41,000
Speaker 1: I'm sure they're going to argue, it's terrible, its disastrous.

1658
01:28:41,040 --> 01:28:43,400
Speaker 1: Forget about it. They'll continue crafting policies that are of

1659
01:28:43,439 --> 01:28:45,759
Speaker 1: the rich, by the rich, and for the rich. Only

1660
01:28:45,840 --> 01:28:48,040
Speaker 1: massive public pressure of the sort that made Powell in

1661
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:50,280
Speaker 1: the rest field their power was at risk, would make

1662
01:28:50,320 --> 01:28:53,000
Speaker 1: them change course. Otherwise we will just continue to lock

1663
01:28:53,080 --> 01:28:56,760
Speaker 1: in a two tier system. Rich people's minor problems are

1664
01:28:56,760 --> 01:29:02,400
Speaker 1: an emergency. Regular people's actual catastrophes those are just collateral damage.

1665
01:29:02,560 --> 01:29:05,479
Speaker 1: A lot has been revealed here, Sager about the Fed's actions,

1666
01:29:05,520 --> 01:29:08,360
Speaker 1: and if you want to hear my reaction to Crystal's monologue,

1667
01:29:08,360 --> 01:29:14,920
Speaker 1: become a Premium subscriber today at Breakingpoints dot Com. All right, Saga,

1668
01:29:14,920 --> 01:29:17,639
Speaker 1: we're looking at a very important story happening right now

1669
01:29:17,680 --> 01:29:21,360
Speaker 1: with US relations in India. So the Biden administration about

1670
01:29:21,400 --> 01:29:25,519
Speaker 1: sixteen months ago put former LA Mayor Eric Garcetti up

1671
01:29:25,560 --> 01:29:28,479
Speaker 1: for consideration as the US ambassador to India. Now you

1672
01:29:28,560 --> 01:29:31,400
Speaker 1: might be asking, what the hell does the LA mayor

1673
01:29:31,560 --> 01:29:34,599
Speaker 1: know anything about India? Why does this person even deserve

1674
01:29:34,640 --> 01:29:38,080
Speaker 1: this post literally at all? And a lot of Indians

1675
01:29:38,080 --> 01:29:40,360
Speaker 1: in India were wondering the same thing, and they viewed

1676
01:29:40,360 --> 01:29:42,640
Speaker 1: it as a snub. They viewed it even more so

1677
01:29:42,840 --> 01:29:46,040
Speaker 1: as a snub though, because Eric Garcetti has been credibly

1678
01:29:46,080 --> 01:29:50,760
Speaker 1: accused of covering up widespread sexual harassment under his reign.

1679
01:29:50,840 --> 01:29:52,720
Speaker 1: So let's go and put this up there on the

1680
01:29:52,760 --> 01:29:54,840
Speaker 1: screen from the New York magazine, and I'm just going

1681
01:29:54,920 --> 01:29:56,960
Speaker 1: to go ahead and read from this. So this was

1682
01:29:57,040 --> 01:30:00,640
Speaker 1: reporting from journalists for Yashar Ali. But the effort was

1683
01:30:00,720 --> 01:30:05,360
Speaker 1: undone because his longtime strategist, Rick Jacobs, his closest advisor

1684
01:30:05,400 --> 01:30:09,360
Speaker 1: and chief fundraiser, was accused by at least a dozen people,

1685
01:30:09,800 --> 01:30:15,960
Speaker 1: including city employees, of forcible kissing and touching, making crude

1686
01:30:15,960 --> 01:30:21,920
Speaker 1: remarks and gestures. Several people with knowledge, including those people

1687
01:30:21,960 --> 01:30:26,200
Speaker 1: who actually were victims of mister Jacobs said that Garcetti

1688
01:30:26,640 --> 01:30:30,240
Speaker 1: knew of the allegations and witnessed some of the incidents,

1689
01:30:30,439 --> 01:30:34,439
Speaker 1: but ignored it because of Jacob's political value. Now you know,

1690
01:30:34,520 --> 01:30:37,280
Speaker 1: Jacob says he didn't do anything wrong, and so did

1691
01:30:37,760 --> 01:30:40,200
Speaker 1: so did Eric Garcetti says, oh, I had no idea

1692
01:30:40,360 --> 01:30:42,720
Speaker 1: about literally any of it. Here's the thing, though, a

1693
01:30:42,760 --> 01:30:45,880
Speaker 1: lot of Democrats actually did believe this, as well as

1694
01:30:45,880 --> 01:30:48,960
Speaker 1: many Republicans who viewed him as unqualified for the posts.

1695
01:30:49,200 --> 01:30:53,040
Speaker 1: So a private back channel was made. Senators said, look,

1696
01:30:53,160 --> 01:30:55,639
Speaker 1: we don't want to publicly come out against Biden. Biden,

1697
01:30:55,800 --> 01:30:59,120
Speaker 1: you need to withdraw Eric Garcetti in terms of his consideration.

1698
01:30:59,439 --> 01:31:02,400
Speaker 1: He used to do it. Biden, I guess made some

1699
01:31:02,560 --> 01:31:06,000
Speaker 1: crazy deal with Garcetti, maybe because of fundraising or whatever

1700
01:31:06,080 --> 01:31:08,880
Speaker 1: during the campaign, and said, no, I'm going to back Eric.

1701
01:31:08,920 --> 01:31:11,160
Speaker 1: I'm not going to believe any of these accusers, even

1702
01:31:11,200 --> 01:31:14,120
Speaker 1: though there's pretty good evidence to support literally all of

1703
01:31:14,160 --> 01:31:16,320
Speaker 1: these accusations. On top of the fact that the guy

1704
01:31:16,439 --> 01:31:19,120
Speaker 1: is not qualified to be the US ambassador India. So

1705
01:31:19,120 --> 01:31:21,559
Speaker 1: the keep putting pressure, They keep putting pressure, and finally

1706
01:31:21,680 --> 01:31:27,000
Speaker 1: the logjam breaks, Democratic senators in conjunction with Republicans, decide

1707
01:31:27,040 --> 01:31:30,080
Speaker 1: to vote for this guy. Here is Senator Bob Menendez,

1708
01:31:30,200 --> 01:31:33,559
Speaker 1: who is the head of the Foreign Services Committee, actually

1709
01:31:33,560 --> 01:31:37,320
Speaker 1: coming out and saying, well, these accusers, he said he

1710
01:31:37,360 --> 01:31:39,400
Speaker 1: didn't do anything wrong, So we're just going to go

1711
01:31:39,400 --> 01:31:41,080
Speaker 1: ahead and vote for him. Take a listen to that.

1712
01:31:41,640 --> 01:31:49,200
Speaker 1: There's a lot of review of his file, reviews of witnesses,

1713
01:31:50,280 --> 01:31:52,479
Speaker 1: and the bottom line, not only does he deny it,

1714
01:31:53,120 --> 01:31:57,520
Speaker 1: but other witnesses deny that in fact he had any knowledge.

1715
01:31:57,840 --> 01:32:01,240
Speaker 1: Is a national security imperative. We have to balance concerns

1716
01:32:01,280 --> 01:32:06,840
Speaker 1: people might have about the nominee against the real risk

1717
01:32:06,920 --> 01:32:09,320
Speaker 1: of waiting another year until we have an ambassador on

1718
01:32:09,320 --> 01:32:15,360
Speaker 1: the ground. I have significant concerns over his nomination to

1719
01:32:15,400 --> 01:32:22,880
Speaker 1: this position. The way, you know, certain the environment that

1720
01:32:23,080 --> 01:32:25,759
Speaker 1: was allowed to exist in his office over an extended

1721
01:32:25,800 --> 01:32:28,200
Speaker 1: period of time, So only Mark Kelly, they are even

1722
01:32:28,200 --> 01:32:30,439
Speaker 1: willing to say it. Todd Young's is some people have

1723
01:32:30,720 --> 01:32:33,439
Speaker 1: some concerns. Look, we're not talking about like some one

1724
01:32:33,520 --> 01:32:36,360
Speaker 1: or two people here. We're talking about literally a dozen.

1725
01:32:36,439 --> 01:32:39,160
Speaker 1: And also one of them is a former LAPD officer.

1726
01:32:39,200 --> 01:32:43,040
Speaker 1: But let's take a step back. This is a massive

1727
01:32:43,120 --> 01:32:47,200
Speaker 1: snub to one of the world's largest country countries, the

1728
01:32:47,240 --> 01:32:52,120
Speaker 1: world's largest democracy, ostensibly one of the most important geopolitical

1729
01:32:52,160 --> 01:32:56,040
Speaker 1: partners in the world, especially if your entire goal is

1730
01:32:56,120 --> 01:32:59,800
Speaker 1: to have better relations in Asia and try and form

1731
01:32:59,840 --> 01:33:03,360
Speaker 1: you alliances against China or at the very least shore

1732
01:33:03,439 --> 01:33:05,320
Speaker 1: up your alliances as the Chinese try to do the

1733
01:33:05,360 --> 01:33:08,320
Speaker 1: same thing. India is of course a natural partner. On

1734
01:33:08,360 --> 01:33:10,599
Speaker 1: top of that, what have we learned with the entire

1735
01:33:10,720 --> 01:33:13,800
Speaker 1: Ukraine situation, which is India, through the sheer force of

1736
01:33:13,840 --> 01:33:17,080
Speaker 1: its economy and its unwillingness to go along with the

1737
01:33:17,120 --> 01:33:19,960
Speaker 1: West in its view of the Ukraine conflict, has actually

1738
01:33:20,400 --> 01:33:23,519
Speaker 1: helped the Russian economy and has shown a real split

1739
01:33:23,840 --> 01:33:26,479
Speaker 1: in the Asia Pacific. That's something that the US needs

1740
01:33:26,479 --> 01:33:28,679
Speaker 1: to do everything in its power to try and shore

1741
01:33:28,760 --> 01:33:32,320
Speaker 1: up to have the best relations possible. And instead this

1742
01:33:32,400 --> 01:33:36,000
Speaker 1: is an insult to actually send somebody not only accused

1743
01:33:36,000 --> 01:33:39,800
Speaker 1: of fostering and having a terrible managerial process where you're

1744
01:33:39,840 --> 01:33:42,960
Speaker 1: basically covering up sexual assault because of somebody's political value,

1745
01:33:43,000 --> 01:33:47,000
Speaker 1: but somebody who is so wholly unqualified for the job.

1746
01:33:47,080 --> 01:33:49,600
Speaker 1: So I can assure you that in New Delhi that

1747
01:33:49,720 --> 01:33:52,000
Speaker 1: this is seen as both a snub as an insult.

1748
01:33:52,080 --> 01:33:54,680
Speaker 1: Of course, they won't say it privately, they won't say

1749
01:33:54,720 --> 01:33:58,000
Speaker 1: it publicly, But overall, the handling of the Biden administration

1750
01:33:58,080 --> 01:34:01,640
Speaker 1: here shows their unseeriousness towards relations with India, which is

1751
01:34:01,640 --> 01:34:05,160
Speaker 1: a vital not only trading partner, but geopolitical partner if

1752
01:34:05,200 --> 01:34:07,799
Speaker 1: you do actually want to pursue some semblance of peace

1753
01:34:08,040 --> 01:34:11,000
Speaker 1: across this globe, and then they're handling of this also

1754
01:34:11,160 --> 01:34:13,080
Speaker 1: just shows it. They're full of it whenever it comes

1755
01:34:13,120 --> 01:34:15,240
Speaker 1: to me too, So I'm curious what you think, Crystal

1756
01:34:15,479 --> 01:34:18,280
Speaker 1: about all of this. To be honest, I never covered this,

1757
01:34:18,479 --> 01:34:21,360
Speaker 1: and if you want to hear my reaction to Sager's monologue,

1758
01:34:21,400 --> 01:34:27,720
Speaker 1: become a premium subscriber today at Breakingpoints dot com. Thank

1759
01:34:27,760 --> 01:34:29,400
Speaker 1: you guys so much for watching. Thank you for bearing

1760
01:34:29,439 --> 01:34:31,479
Speaker 1: with me down here, taking care of my dad and

1761
01:34:31,520 --> 01:34:34,240
Speaker 1: college station. I should probably be back in the studio

1762
01:34:34,400 --> 01:34:36,240
Speaker 1: on Monday, so everything would be good to go. And

1763
01:34:36,600 --> 01:34:39,559
Speaker 1: thank you everybody for Spotify who is signing up and

1764
01:34:39,600 --> 01:34:41,840
Speaker 1: taking advantage of the full show there. I know that

1765
01:34:41,960 --> 01:34:44,559
Speaker 1: it's an awesome viewing experience. So again, if you want

1766
01:34:44,600 --> 01:34:46,240
Speaker 1: to come to a Premium member and watch the full

1767
01:34:46,280 --> 01:34:49,479
Speaker 1: show on Spotify, available only to our premiums. You can

1768
01:34:49,520 --> 01:34:52,439
Speaker 1: sign up at breakingpoints dot com. Love to use Sager,

1769
01:34:52,520 --> 01:34:54,599
Speaker 1: and to your dad and to all of you out

1770
01:34:54,600 --> 01:34:56,360
Speaker 1: there as well, and we'll see you back here next week.

1771
01:35:03,640 --> 01:35:05,639
Speaker 1: Connect to the Town cont