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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds and CNN data guru Harry Enton says,

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Speaker 1: the Big Beautiful Bill is the most unpopular piece of

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Speaker 1: legislation in decades. We have such a great show for

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Speaker 1: you today. Notice his own Evan McMorris. Santoro stops by

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Speaker 1: to talk to us about why Republicans are acting so irrationally.

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Speaker 1: Then we will talk to the Shadow Dockets author Steve

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Speaker 1: Vladdock just about how many laws the Trump administration is

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Speaker 1: breaking in DC and elsewhere. But first we have the

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Speaker 1: very important stories the media is missing.

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Speaker 2: All right, Molly, there's an interesting thing we've learned the border.

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Speaker 2: Everybody's always when will maga start to break? Even just

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Speaker 2: a few of them with mister Trump. And the next

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Speaker 2: two stories going to go over seemed to be it,

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Speaker 2: which is they're very mad that the Epstein grand jury

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Speaker 2: transcripts won't be unsealed because a federal court has ruled

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Speaker 2: that way.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: By the way, anyone who knows about federal grand juries

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Speaker 1: knows that the chances of having a grand jury testimony,

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Speaker 1: it's a much higher bar to releasing it than other stuff.

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Speaker 1: The other thing that's so stupid about this is like

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Speaker 1: the Trump administration has tens of thousands of pages of documents.

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Speaker 1: Release the fucking documents. You don't need the grand jury.

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Speaker 4: It took a thousand employees to read those, right.

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Speaker 1: This is like the fakest of the fake, fakey fakeisms.

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Speaker 1: Like none of this is real. I mean, it's just

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Speaker 1: crazy crazy, It truly is. I mean I have nothing

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Speaker 1: to say here, you know, I mean I have stuff

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Speaker 1: to say, which is this is so fucking stupid.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, you know, hashtag released the files. I

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Speaker 2: really liked the thing. Evan refers to later that Al Jones,

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Speaker 2: we've all finally reached a thing that we agree with him,

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Speaker 2: like release the Epstein files. Everybody's in unison, from Alex

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Speaker 2: Jones onto lefty freaks like us.

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Speaker 1: Yes, lefty freaks. That's right, baby, No release Epstein files.

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Speaker 1: Like the grand jury thing is bullshit. We know it's bullshit.

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Speaker 1: It's not about a grand jury. Just release all of

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Speaker 1: the tens of thousands of pages of files you have.

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Speaker 2: So the other thing MAGA is very mad at, along

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Speaker 2: with seemingly everybody, is that in Las Vegas there were

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Speaker 2: a handful of quote unquote child sex predators, and one

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Speaker 2: was released because they work in Israeli intelligence and they

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Speaker 2: were released by the age who has ties to the

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Speaker 2: Israeli government, and the State Department is doing everything and

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Speaker 2: ken to hush up. And shockingly, mega influencers are quite

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Speaker 2: quite mad about this because their brand is to protect

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Speaker 2: the children.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so in Israeli official charge to child sex trafficking,

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Speaker 1: Ram flees the US. He gets let out. He's a

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Speaker 1: senior Israeli cybersecurity official. He was arrested during an undercover

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Speaker 1: operation in Nevada targeting child sex predators. He posted a

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Speaker 1: ten thousand dollars bail and then he just fled Israel.

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Speaker 1: Why was his past sport not confiscated? Why was he released?

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Speaker 1: Why is any of this going on? Attorney General Pambondy,

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Speaker 1: you may know her from her complete inability to do

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Speaker 1: any of the stuff that she said she was going

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Speaker 1: to do. She is outraged, quote unquote, But you know

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Speaker 1: who's even more outraged. Marjorie Taylergreen and Thomas Massey, two

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Speaker 1: Republicans who have criticized Israel, perhaps because they don't get

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Speaker 1: any money from APEC. Doj should file federal charges and

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Speaker 1: demand immediate extradition, said Jack Pisobic. I don't think Jack

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Speaker 1: understands the close relationship between net Yahoo and Donald Trump.

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Speaker 1: You know who is happy to criticize Jews.

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Speaker 2: Candice Ollen really hurt really wait wait wait, by you're

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Speaker 2: telling me she's taking time from transvestigating.

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Speaker 4: To do that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you'd be shocked because Candace Owens is known to

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Speaker 1: be such a good faith actor. But Candice owns, yes,

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Speaker 1: criticizing not very shocking.

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Speaker 2: But on a more serious note, I do think it's

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Speaker 2: a very interesting intersection of that. Trump's kind of like

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Speaker 2: modus operande in this administration has been that if you're

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Speaker 2: on my side, you get away with whatever.

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Speaker 4: And turns out, yeah, it turns out.

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Speaker 2: Mega has drawn a strong border of saying like, we

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Speaker 2: really don't like this part of it. You know, we

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Speaker 2: our whole thing is we're protecting these children. It's the

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Speaker 2: only thing that makes us feel like we're decent people

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Speaker 2: when we do bad things and hate everyone.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I don't know. The whole thing is like,

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Speaker 1: there are words, but the words are hypocrites moron's you know,

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Speaker 1: there are a lot of words here.

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Speaker 2: Well, let's move on to the other wig of this thing.

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Speaker 2: A thing that I my neuroses keep accelerating on is

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Speaker 2: how much Trump and Magas seem to be enriching themselves.

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Speaker 2: Trump bought more than one hundred million bonds since January,

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Speaker 2: filing showing.

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Speaker 1: I'm shocked, shocked. I tell you to hear this gambling

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Speaker 1: going on in this casino. Donald Trump purchased at least

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Speaker 1: one hundred and three million dollars worth of corporate and

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Speaker 1: muniees since taking office in January. So the documents released

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Speaker 1: Tuesday night show that Trump began the bond buying spree

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Speaker 1: one day, okay, one day after being sworn in January

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Speaker 1: twenty first, he purchased a bond belonging to the Triborough

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Speaker 1: Bridge and Tunnel Association. He's just buying bonds. Now, Why

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Speaker 1: is he buying bonds? I don't know. I do know

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Speaker 1: that there's a lot of stuff going on in the

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Speaker 1: markets right now, including there's some anxiety in the bond

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Speaker 1: markets because of that, all of the sort of stagflationary

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Speaker 1: things that Trump is doing. So I don't know. The

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Speaker 1: point is eighty percent of Americans want their electeds not

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Speaker 1: to make money off of them like they don't want

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Speaker 1: elected's trading stocks. So my sense is that perhaps this

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Speaker 1: is yet another unpopular thing Donald Trump is doing.

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Speaker 2: Sounds about right, speaking of very unpopular things, pro Publica

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Speaker 2: has a new astounding report that RFK Junior vowed to

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Speaker 2: find the environmental causes of autism and then he shut

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Speaker 2: down the research trying to do just that, probably because

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Speaker 2: the research was probably not going to end up doing

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Speaker 2: that because he just can't read research properly.

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Speaker 1: No, I think he did this because the research is

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Speaker 1: going to show that pollution has effects on people, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know that it causes autism.

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Speaker 2: I was more even going to say the other thing,

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Speaker 2: which is just that the whole origin story of RFK

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Speaker 2: is that he read studies wrong, and so like, why

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Speaker 2: have science when you can't read.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but he also was once an environmentalist and now

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Speaker 1: does not give a fuck about that because he's a Republican.

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Speaker 1: I think it's really important to remember that. Like I

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Speaker 1: remember so many people being like, well, it'll be good

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Speaker 1: if he gets sort of pesticides, it'll be good if

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Speaker 1: he does this. He does that, He's never going to

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Speaker 1: do that stuff, right. The only thing he's going to

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Speaker 1: do is the stuff that he has a financial incentive,

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Speaker 1: and like, you know, he's going to do things like

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Speaker 1: hurt scientific research, prevent vaccines.

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Speaker 2: This is like being like, oh, I'm going to go

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Speaker 2: to an amusement park filled with razor blades on every ride,

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Speaker 2: but maybe one of them will be fun.

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Speaker 1: Right, It's like, you know, medical research, encouraging snake oily

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Speaker 1: things like doing the stuff that is just what we

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Speaker 1: expect from him. But it is incredibly annoying and also

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Speaker 1: just incredibly soul crushing to watch this guy do this.

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Speaker 1: Evan McMorris Santro is a reporter at Notice. Evan, Welcome

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Speaker 1: to Fast Politics.

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Speaker 3: Nice to be here.

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Speaker 1: Texas House Republicans, the House of the State House of

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Speaker 1: Texas has come back. They have a plan to steal

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Speaker 1: five seats and Representative Callier, there's one representative who is

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Speaker 1: not not having it.

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Speaker 3: This is such an interesting moment that has happened with

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Speaker 3: this Texas redinteresting thing because you do have you've had

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Speaker 3: this kind of broad based fight that has started in Texas,

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Speaker 3: and we've learned a lot about how Texas legislature works, right,

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Speaker 3: Like you can't leave the state or they can't have

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Speaker 3: the you know, the legislature. They want to do this

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Speaker 3: thing where they want to now because they're freak out

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Speaker 3: about these Democrats leaving them again. They want to give

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Speaker 3: them like this twenty four to seven police, for instance's

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Speaker 3: mind around them. Yeah, and one of the members is

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Speaker 3: you know, says no, I don't want to do that

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Speaker 3: and held out and is trying to block that from happening.

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Speaker 3: But the upshot to this is that this Texas thing

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Speaker 3: is going to happen, right, They're going to get these seats,

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Speaker 3: It's going to get redrawn, and that is really kicked off.

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Speaker 3: The most unexpected part of this twenty twenty six cycle.

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Speaker 1: Is that it is can we just I'm going to

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Speaker 1: interrupt you because we're and also we can say it's

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Speaker 1: going to get redrawn. But you know, from what I

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Speaker 1: understand from the people I've talked to, if they were

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Speaker 1: to stay out of the state until November, they could

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Speaker 1: prevent it from being redrawn.

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Speaker 3: Well that's right. Well, this is what I just kind

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Speaker 3: of get into the I can think. Right, this is

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Speaker 3: the most fascinating thing about this is that these Democrats

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Speaker 3: and I don't know really exactly what has happened with this.

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Speaker 3: I mean, in my experience when you have sixty seventy

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Speaker 3: people in one place, they don't always agree on everything.

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Speaker 3: So they kind of had to come back because enough

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Speaker 3: of either enough of them wanted to come back that

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Speaker 3: they had to come back. But their their line on

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Speaker 3: this is that they came back because they have activated

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Speaker 3: this national political push now to redistricting other places and

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Speaker 3: try to push back on this. But yes, the truth

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Speaker 3: is this has now become basically a rhetorical argument in Texas.

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Speaker 3: It's not only this morning I got a press release

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Speaker 3: from Texas Democrats telling me, you know, we're doing this thing.

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Speaker 3: We're bad, So they can have their vote, but we're

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Speaker 3: going to put an amendment on the bill from the

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Speaker 3: Texas lawmakers that forces them to vote that they would

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Speaker 3: say that they don't want to release the Epstein files,

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Speaker 3: effectively trying to do this Epstein files tie in that,

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Speaker 3: like we would only redistrict if the Epstein files were

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Speaker 3: released first. Whatever. It's just kind of a whole rhetorical

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Speaker 3: argument when obviously they had all the power and they

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Speaker 3: were gone, and when they come back, the power Texas

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Speaker 3: Democrats becomes, which is very very little power. They don't

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Speaker 3: have much, so now they're asking for every other Democrat

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Speaker 3: in blue states to sort of step up and help

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Speaker 3: them out. And it's a very complicated process. I mean,

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Speaker 3: we don't really know how this is going to shake out.

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Speaker 3: We do know Texas is going to get these five

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Speaker 3: seats unless the Democrats find some way to leave again

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Speaker 3: and stay out, Texas is going to get.

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Speaker 1: Them, which stuff should and could. And I don't understand

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Speaker 1: like this is partisan redistricting because Donald Trump is wor

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Speaker 1: about losing the House because he sees the polling and

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Speaker 1: he sees the people screaming at the town halls, and

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Speaker 1: he knows that taking stuff away from people to give

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Speaker 1: a tax cut to very rich people is not the

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Speaker 1: winning is not the winning move that you think it is,

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Speaker 1: you know is. And there is a guy who ran

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Speaker 1: on bacon, right, he was going to make things cheaper,

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Speaker 1: and now we have these tariffs which are wildly inflationary

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Speaker 1: and expensive, and he somehow thinks that bullying the chair

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Speaker 1: of the Fed or causing the FED to no longer

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Speaker 1: be independent is the way to get inflation to go down.

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Speaker 1: But you know, we know if you cut rates when

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Speaker 1: inflation is still a problem, then what is going to

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Speaker 1: happen more inflation, and it's like where we are right now,

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Speaker 1: there is no way this is not stagflation. Right there

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Speaker 1: is no way. The last quarter was negative growth. This quarter,

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Speaker 1: maybe it's not negative growth, but it sure feels like

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Speaker 1: negative growth unless the AI numbers pump it out up

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Speaker 1: to the point where it's not. I mean, we won't

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Speaker 1: know until the quarter's over. But and Trump is just like,

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Speaker 1: I can bully my way out of this, but everything

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Speaker 1: he wants to do is going to hurt the economy more.

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Speaker 3: It's a very cynical type of politics going on right now,

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Speaker 3: because it's not even just the idea that you're going

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Speaker 3: to sort of bully your way out, but you know,

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Speaker 3: maybe you just change the numbers and change the way

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Speaker 3: things work. I'll tell you this. I talked to somebody

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Speaker 3: who worked in the Biden administration on economic policy just

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Speaker 3: the other day, when like the jobs, when the when

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Speaker 3: the the inflation numbers have come out, the CPI number,

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Speaker 3: seventy summers have come.

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Speaker 1: Out before the rummit, before Trump decided that he needed

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Speaker 1: a summit, Yes.

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Speaker 3: Before the summit, but well summit, And I was talking

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Speaker 3: about this idea of looking how they look at these

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Speaker 3: numbers and how they're at this moment and they're saying, like, look,

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Speaker 3: trumppanomics is here, like Trump's argument, and We've talked I've

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Speaker 3: talked to White House about this a bunch of times,

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Speaker 3: and they will tell you every single time prices are

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Speaker 3: just not going to go up, that that's the answer.

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Speaker 3: I'm like, what are you going to do when process

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Speaker 3: go up? What's your messaging for when prices go up?

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Speaker 3: What are you going to say about our prices go up?

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Speaker 3: There is a message that they could use, which is,

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Speaker 3: you know, they have this sort of general vision that

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Speaker 3: there's a short term pain but long term gain, et cetera.

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Speaker 3: They don't even sat.

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Speaker 1: Dolls instead of twenty dollars, that's right.

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Speaker 3: Their thing is they say, now, they're just not going

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Speaker 3: to go up right now. By you people who spend

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Speaker 3: a lot of time during that inflationary period saying hey,

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Speaker 3: but look at this number, Hey but look at this number.

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Speaker 3: But look at this thing we did. They recall that

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Speaker 3: not working out very well for them. And they're watching

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Speaker 3: the Trump administration now and they're sort of seeing what

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Speaker 3: they see as a sort of willful a willful disregard

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Speaker 3: for what these numbers actually show and The reality is,

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Speaker 3: eventually this all comes out in the wash. Someone has

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Speaker 3: to be right here, right. The Trump administration says these

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Speaker 3: prices are not going to go up. Every economist says

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Speaker 3: they are going to go up. Yeah, when the prices

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Speaker 3: go up.

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Speaker 5: There has to be somebody there. You know, there're going

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Speaker 5: be a political conversation to have about that. And there

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Speaker 5: just really has been no teeing up a bit or setting.

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Speaker 3: Up for it. There has only been this idea that

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Speaker 3: the numbers I don't like, those numbers are wrong, will

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Speaker 3: fire those people. Will just change the way the numbers work.

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Speaker 3: We'll just change the numbers all around. You talk about

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Speaker 3: this thing with the Texas redistrict thing, it is all

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Speaker 3: part and partial of that. Like this is a mid

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Speaker 3: term that's going to be a challenge for the Republican Party.

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Speaker 3: Then the idea is what if we just change the electorate,

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Speaker 3: And that is this is not an administration that has

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Speaker 3: been actively focused on defending the things that they're doing

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Speaker 3: their ideas. We can just change the sort of facts

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Speaker 3: around those things, and then what we're doing is great.

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Speaker 3: It's a very different way of doing politics than I've

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Speaker 3: ever seen before.

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Speaker 5: And when it comes to things and it can work

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Speaker 5: in a place like Texas where you can redraw those lines,

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Speaker 5: you can get those five seats. But when it comes

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Speaker 5: to the prices consumers pay for things going up, you know,

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Speaker 5: the Bide administration did a lot for consumers, pushed a

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Speaker 5: lot about it. They the actual higher prices. I think

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Speaker 5: Trump's gonna have the same problem. The prices go up.

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Speaker 1: You have to you can't pretend like they're meal vegetables.

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Speaker 1: And we talked about this actually on the podcast yesterday.

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Speaker 1: There is nearly forty percent spike in the price of

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Speaker 1: wholesale vegetables. I mean, seems like a lot. I know

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Speaker 1: that Americans don't like vegetables, but they still you know,

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Speaker 1: like that's a lot.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I'm just thinking about this headline I

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Speaker 3: read today that McDonald's is forcing its franchisees to lower

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Speaker 3: the price of a value meals. And I'm wondering, like,

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Speaker 3: which is more important, value meals going down the vegetables

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Speaker 3: going up. But yeah, no, it mean, it's true. It's

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Speaker 3: it's true. It's it's not just that it's energy, it's

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Speaker 3: alters of other things. It's it's these consumer goods. I mean, look,

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Speaker 3: as you mentioned earlier they try the message with this

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Speaker 3: when Trump was out there with this whole live simply thing,

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Speaker 3: you don't need to buy as much stuff as you

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Speaker 3: used to buy.

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Speaker 1: You don't need buy with the golden toilet, the guy

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Speaker 1: with the golden toilet is telling you that it's time

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Speaker 1: to stop spending money.

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Speaker 3: It was one of those few moments, and there's been

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Speaker 3: a couple in this administration, but one in the few

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Speaker 3: moments when his own team, his own base was like,

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Speaker 3: what are you saying? What are you talking about? I

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Speaker 3: mean I talked to a guy in New Hampshire, like

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Speaker 3: economist up there, who like used to work in politics,

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Speaker 3: and he was like, this is the kind of stuff

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Speaker 3: that like Soviet Russia would say. Like that was one

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Speaker 3: of those things that it's not a message. You didn't

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Speaker 3: see Trump rollout to have a have less Christmas. That

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Speaker 3: was like an actual long term policy plan. They have

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Speaker 3: shifted away to this precus You're just not going to

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Speaker 3: go up. It's just not true. It's just not happening.

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Speaker 3: It's just not going to happen because like that didn't

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Speaker 3: really work. So the fact is this exact problem that

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Speaker 3: is this really important problem in American politics. So is

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Speaker 3: on one hand, some of these things do take a

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Speaker 3: long time to change. It does take a long time

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Speaker 3: to make big progress. That is the whole Biden argument, right, like,

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Speaker 3: we've seeded the ground for all of this, you know,

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Speaker 3: manufacturing construction and returning on shoring all this stuff and

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Speaker 3: rebuilding America's power in this stuff and building energy projects.

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Speaker 3: But they're gonna take a long time. And people said,

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Speaker 3: I don't care it costs me more money to buy

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Speaker 3: stuff right now, and we just said, really, have not

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Speaker 3: seen This administration just has not embraced even the possibility

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Speaker 3: of that happening, and they are trying basically anything they

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Speaker 3: can to change it. We're gonna fire the FED. We'll

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Speaker 3: just change the way that works. We'll change the way

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Speaker 3: the FED works, which you know they can't really do,

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Speaker 3: but we're gonna try to do that, right, and we're

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Speaker 3: gonna like them. We're just gonna fire the head of

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Speaker 3: the BLS.

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Speaker 4: We don't like the numbers.

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Speaker 3: Maybe we won't just we just won't release numbers. Maybe

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Speaker 3: maybe it's Katie numbers again. The idea here, and this

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Speaker 3: comes out of Trump's mouth himself, and the last time

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Speaker 3: he ran for president was that, like Mom, and pop,

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Speaker 3: you know, Joe and chain consumer they know the prices

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Speaker 3: go up and they don't like it. So it all

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Speaker 3: manners thinks can be set up here. All man are

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Speaker 3: are sort of you know, mumba jumbo can be done.

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Speaker 4: But when people go to the.

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Speaker 5: Grocery store, they remember and the problem is, what are

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Speaker 5: you going to do this? The Masri says, the based

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Speaker 5: down whether I do it when that happens, which every

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Speaker 5: economist says is going to happen very soon if it

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Speaker 5: isn't already happening now.

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Speaker 1: So that is the question, and it's sort of this

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Speaker 1: interesting philosophical question. And you know, I love stuff like

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Speaker 1: that because I am very in my own way nihilistic.

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Speaker 1: So I love this philosophical question of like you have

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump, who occupies Earth two right, he believed, you know,

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Speaker 1: his people believe things like QAnon. They believe what he

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Speaker 1: tells it with them. He has a sort of religious

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Speaker 1: hold on his people, and they suspend their disbelief to

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Speaker 1: trust him the way they trust megachurch pastors, you know

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Speaker 1: that kind of thing. So here's a question. And they

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Speaker 1: really even with COVID right like they said things like

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Speaker 1: I mean, a great example is the ivermactin it didn't mark,

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Speaker 1: but people were able to, for whatever reason, still not

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Speaker 1: believe that it didn't work. Even though it didn't work.

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Speaker 1: They would say, you know, maybe you were better or

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Speaker 1: even I mean, there was this great reporting about this

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Speaker 1: child who died of measles in Texas. I mean great reporting,

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Speaker 1: like very accurate reporting, not great because obviously horrible, but

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Speaker 1: very sad in it. The parents would not say that

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Speaker 1: not being vaccinated was why the kid died of measles.

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Speaker 1: They believe that the kid was not treated correctly when

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Speaker 1: they got measles and that that So it's like this

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Speaker 1: kind of bug in the machine, right, like you almost

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Speaker 1: get it, but you don't totally get it. And here

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Speaker 1: we have something like you elected Donald Trump because he

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Speaker 1: said he was going to make things cheaper. Things are

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Speaker 1: now more expensive. It's like COVID, right, Donald Trump said

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Speaker 1: COVID's going to go away. He killed a million people.

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Speaker 3: This is the difference that Trump has. Trump does not

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Speaker 3: have a lot lot of base problems, right. Democrats have

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Speaker 3: a lot of base problems. They have them all the time,

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Speaker 3: they're having them now, they're going to have them in

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Speaker 3: a month. It's like this is their main problem is

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Speaker 3: that like what are Democrats, what are they like?

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Speaker 5: Who are they?

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Speaker 3: What are they about? Republicans like Trump, They're for Trump.

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Speaker 3: Trump's the guy. They're into Trump. He doesn't have that problem, right,

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Speaker 3: But he does have the problem that other politicians have,

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Speaker 3: which is the one of like he brought new people

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Speaker 3: into the fold who maybe weren't like hardcore Trumpers, but

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Speaker 3: they're like, all right, well, this guy's gonna do this

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Speaker 3: about price, He's going to take care of this stuff.

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Speaker 3: He's gonna end these wars. You're gonna do this stuff.

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Speaker 3: You know, this this working class electorate that like they

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Speaker 3: they touted and how excited they were to win those

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Speaker 3: people over they brought them in. You know, his independent

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Speaker 3: numbers are not good at all, Like they've gone down

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Speaker 3: a great deal. They're not good. So even though he

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Speaker 3: he has something that I think Democrats are often very

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Speaker 3: envious of for good reason, which is that like the

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Speaker 3: base is going to go along when he goes to

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Speaker 3: Congress and says I want something, Congress says okay, right,

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Speaker 3: despite the fact they're maybe ever kind of Republicans inside

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Speaker 3: that Congress. Right, that's the truth. But when it comes

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Speaker 3: to the election, that has to happen. The general conversation

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Speaker 3: has to happen. This is going to be one as

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Speaker 3: these things often are on these people who switch around

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Speaker 3: and who look around, and who expect a lot of

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Speaker 3: things from their politicians that politicians will often say, well,

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Speaker 3: those tras.

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Speaker 5: Are a little bit unrealistic. I can't really do all

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Speaker 5: of that, but voters want them to, and Trump if

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Speaker 5: he can't. If Republican Party is walking into a situation

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Speaker 5: where they have raised prices on people, They have made

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Speaker 5: it more difficult than into access healthcare because of the

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Speaker 5: stuff that they have cut in their reconciliation bill. They

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Speaker 5: have raised prices on a lot of things. And maybe

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Speaker 5: there's more involvement in you know, in wars, maybe there's

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Speaker 5: you know, maybe American forces are now helping to protect Ukraine.

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Speaker 5: Other things that were really motivating in that conversation. Then

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Speaker 5: politics just become real again. Like when you get like

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Speaker 5: the Trump administration and Trump, I think really likes to

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Speaker 5: talk about this, say about his base. He gets really

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Speaker 5: nervous on the base as mad We saw how much

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Speaker 5: effort they put into trying to shut up people about

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Speaker 5: this Epstein issue, never from his own base, but the

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Speaker 5: Chanlelners that he has is that there are people who are.

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Speaker 3: Not hardcore Trumpers who voted for Trump, and will they

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Speaker 3: vote for Republicans again after they have seen stuff that

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Speaker 3: they don't like from Trump And we don't we don't know,

434
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:32,240
Speaker 3: but we also have not seen extremely three D chess

435
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:35,919
Speaker 3: brilliant messaging from this White House that would suggest that

436
00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,480
Speaker 3: they care a lot about it either. And that's very interesting.

437
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,359
Speaker 1: Well, no, that is, I mean that's the that's always

438
00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:43,960
Speaker 1: the Trump thing, right, he doesn't care about other Republicans.

439
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:45,480
Speaker 1: He doesn't want to lose the House because he doesn't

440
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:49,000
Speaker 1: want to get impeached again. Does he want Jade Vance

441
00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:51,960
Speaker 1: to be his air apparent? No? Did he care? You

442
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:54,560
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like he wants himself to be

443
00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 1: his air apparent?

444
00:22:56,119 --> 00:22:57,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he'd raised it. He's reached a ton

445
00:22:57,720 --> 00:22:59,800
Speaker 3: of money for twenty twenty six, like more than anybody

446
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,439
Speaker 3: had as I had talked to several Democrats who are like,

447
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:04,880
Speaker 3: this is a pretty serious number. This could be really

448
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,959
Speaker 3: real for us. There are definitely factors here, But in

449
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:10,959
Speaker 3: terms of the sort of cover he is giving his people,

450
00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:13,160
Speaker 3: you know, he didn't even do like a national tour

451
00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,320
Speaker 3: after his Bill passed. You know, he just kind of

452
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 3: brings it up when he's at the Kennedy Center talking

453
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:19,200
Speaker 3: about something completely different. You know, now they're back to

454
00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:21,840
Speaker 3: talking about crime. That's you know, that's the DC thing.

455
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,520
Speaker 3: I just think that when you're talking about this and

456
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:26,800
Speaker 3: this is all sort of part and partial to one thing,

457
00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:29,840
Speaker 3: is that like there is this cynical play, which is

458
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:32,480
Speaker 3: that like, if we can just change the playing field enough,

459
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:37,040
Speaker 3: then these laws of gravity may not apply. And that's

460
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,920
Speaker 3: not entirely impossible, right, I mean, like if California can't

461
00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:43,479
Speaker 3: get this registricted gun, which is a complicated process, you know,

462
00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:47,200
Speaker 3: all of a sudden, people who are looking at history

463
00:23:47,240 --> 00:23:48,960
Speaker 3: and excited about stuff, like they're looking at a whole

464
00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:51,159
Speaker 3: different map than they expected. A founder station jump on

465
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 3: the bandwagon. That changes these things.

466
00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:55,640
Speaker 5: But it you know, it doesn't really change the sort

467
00:23:55,680 --> 00:24:00,359
Speaker 5: of actuality of like whether or not he's building some right,

468
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:02,919
Speaker 5: Like he's building something that that is lasting, and it

469
00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:03,760
Speaker 5: doesn't seem to me.

470
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 3: Like that's such a huge focus. So like there's true

471
00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:09,720
Speaker 3: things happening at once. It's a cynical play that could

472
00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:12,600
Speaker 3: backfire because people might just be so annoyed by the

473
00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 3: fact that they're that, you know, the rules are being

474
00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,119
Speaker 3: changed around them. But there's also the effort of like,

475
00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,439
Speaker 3: these people have questions about what about things that are

476
00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:22,159
Speaker 3: being done right now. They have questions about things that

477
00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:25,320
Speaker 3: are happening. They have questions about these immigration procedures that

478
00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:28,399
Speaker 3: they've seen, They have questions about these tariffs, they have

479
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:31,640
Speaker 3: questions about this reconciliation bill. And we are not hearing

480
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:33,560
Speaker 3: a great deal of answers from the White House to

481
00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:34,240
Speaker 3: those questions.

482
00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 1: I don't think that the images of the seven plane closed,

483
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:47,560
Speaker 1: guys with the face masks beating up the Uber driver,

484
00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:52,600
Speaker 1: the Uber eatst driver, the food delivery guy are going

485
00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:54,919
Speaker 1: to help this man win elections. Now he is going

486
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:58,879
Speaker 1: to have unlimited money because the rich people really are

487
00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:03,320
Speaker 1: happy with the tax cut. And Elon mush is already

488
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:03,960
Speaker 1: meeting with JD.

489
00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:04,239
Speaker 6: Van.

490
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:08,240
Speaker 1: So like, clearly this crew, the third.

491
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:09,840
Speaker 3: Party thing really lasted a long time, didn't it.

492
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:14,200
Speaker 1: They're almost like, my man is just a liar, but

493
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,320
Speaker 1: you know, like he's constantly you know, so we met

494
00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,440
Speaker 1: with Jadvan, So like, these guys are gonna have unlimited money.

495
00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:23,440
Speaker 1: But the question is, and I think like there's always

496
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 1: want to be cynical when you're covering this political climate

497
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:32,040
Speaker 1: because everything is so stupid and craven. But I saw

498
00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 1: an ice guy running down the street carrying a four

499
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 1: eleven foot girl. I mean, I just don't see how

500
00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:45,760
Speaker 1: this ends up being okay, you know what I mean

501
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,399
Speaker 1: that people, the voters don't aren't.

502
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 3: Like what well, you know, I'll tell you this is

503
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,760
Speaker 3: one of those things. I earlier today I saw a

504
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 3: clip from the podcaster Tim Dillon, the comedian Tin Dylan, right,

505
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:00,159
Speaker 3: he was heat on these guys who was made a

506
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 3: sphere type guy when Trump jd Vance appeared in his show,

507
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,639
Speaker 3: like he became one of these Trumper guys. But he

508
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:15,520
Speaker 3: was saying this ice stuff, this DC occupation, this federal

509
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:18,800
Speaker 3: forces down there checking everybody, what they're doing all the time,

510
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:22,040
Speaker 3: taking over This is the comes so that Alex Jones

511
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:24,920
Speaker 3: warned us about, you know, you know, he was definitely

512
00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:29,359
Speaker 3: not excited about this, and this is this is one

513
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:31,920
Speaker 3: of those things where you know, in my experience have

514
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 3: been covering this stuff. You know for a while now,

515
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:40,160
Speaker 3: incumbents are always shocked by the thing that catches them.

516
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:43,040
Speaker 3: They're always sort of in their world, doing their thing,

517
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:45,879
Speaker 3: running around, having the time of their lives. And you know,

518
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:50,000
Speaker 3: these guys, these sort of libertarian leaning guys who were

519
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:53,480
Speaker 3: really excited by Trump saying, hey, comedy's gonna be legal again.

520
00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:57,880
Speaker 3: You can say the R one. It's about freedom. Man.

521
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:00,119
Speaker 3: They're not the types to say like, oh good, but

522
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 3: I wanted wanted a police state to happen, Like that's

523
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:04,480
Speaker 3: you know, this is sort of like, this is the

524
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 3: kind of thing where it's like, but if you're a

525
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,119
Speaker 3: Trump person and the Trump White House peop wills say

526
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:11,000
Speaker 3: this to you repeatedly. When you ask them about this,

527
00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:13,359
Speaker 3: they will say, you know, this is exactly what Trump

528
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:15,480
Speaker 3: promised and what he ran on, and of course this

529
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:17,680
Speaker 3: is all true. All these things that are happening. We're

530
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:20,120
Speaker 3: kind of you know, we're previewed in Protect twenty twenty five.

531
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,560
Speaker 3: Pre you been on a campaign trail. But that is

532
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:26,639
Speaker 3: not actually why people gravitate towards a person, right, And

533
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 3: so when you have someone like Tim Dillon starting to

534
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:30,440
Speaker 3: say this like this is a police state, I don't

535
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 3: like this. This is the same guy who was like,

536
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:34,960
Speaker 3: I don't know about those Epstein stuff that's happening. I

537
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,680
Speaker 3: don't know that Tim Dillon speaks for a massive electorate

538
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 3: or something like that. But it does speak to the

539
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:41,879
Speaker 3: fact that, like this is not a thing that the

540
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 3: white has to just rely on these people to love

541
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,239
Speaker 3: everything that they're doing, and if they start to question them,

542
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:49,399
Speaker 3: they start to turn on them. They find themselves in

543
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:51,480
Speaker 3: the position of everybody else that gets turned on. And

544
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 3: I don't know, like I said, you know, it's such

545
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:56,919
Speaker 3: a long time before twenty twenty six, We don't know

546
00:27:56,920 --> 00:28:00,879
Speaker 3: what will happen. But I just keep looking at these experiences,

547
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 3: and you know that economic reporting I did last week

548
00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:05,639
Speaker 3: where they were just you know, these Biden people were

549
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 3: sure scratching their heads kind of saying, I can't We've

550
00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 3: seen this movie.

551
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 5: They're doing the same. They're trying to do what we did.

552
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 5: They're trying to buy those it didn't work for us.

553
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,400
Speaker 3: Looking at this stuff that's going on with the immigration,

554
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:19,720
Speaker 3: uh you know the immigration stuff where you know, you

555
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:23,439
Speaker 3: saw the President himself even say, all right, I hear you.

556
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:25,920
Speaker 3: Farmers don't like this. This is not where they we

557
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:27,879
Speaker 3: you know, the hospitality industry, We're going to do something

558
00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:33,360
Speaker 3: immediately pushing back on that. That doesn't alleviate the concerns

559
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 3: that farmers had about this that doesn't change what they said.

560
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,440
Speaker 3: It's just the White House saying, Oh, don't worry about it,

561
00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:41,000
Speaker 3: they'll come around. Don't worry about it. They're not important.

562
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:44,920
Speaker 3: And at some point these people start to become important

563
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 3: and it starts to become a damage a damaging thing.

564
00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:49,440
Speaker 3: And I think that, like, this is sort of a

565
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 3: white House that right now is and you know, it

566
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 3: was built around the idea of a sort of siege mentality.

567
00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 3: Everyone's against us all the time, everyone's lying about us,

568
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:03,600
Speaker 3: everything that is not true. Only the most pure heart,

569
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 3: only the most pure of spirit that love us, that

570
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 3: have loved Trump forever, are allowed to cross its threshold.

571
00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:12,600
Speaker 3: That is a recipe for, like I said, a very

572
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 3: envious situation for Democrats to watch when they think about

573
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:18,040
Speaker 3: their own administrations that they have. But it's also a

574
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:24,160
Speaker 3: recipe for myopia and a recipe for making mistakes when

575
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:27,200
Speaker 3: it comes to swing voters. This happens all the time,

576
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 3: and so I do think that we're at the end

577
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 3: of a little period of time now where this is

578
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,640
Speaker 3: starting to stack up in ways that are going to

579
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 3: be really tough questions for them to actually have to

580
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,479
Speaker 3: deal with if they find voters really want to know

581
00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:44,440
Speaker 3: more about it. You know what I mean. That's that's

582
00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 3: how I think about it.

583
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:48,480
Speaker 1: Evan, thank you. I hope you will come back.

584
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:50,400
Speaker 3: I mean tell them, of course I love doing this show.

585
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 4: I love you. Mauley.

586
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 1: Oh, I know.

587
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:54,800
Speaker 3: I don't care what your audience says. We are friends.

588
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 3: I like that people know that we're friends. They can

589
00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 3: be bored as they want.

590
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 1: Stephen Vladdock is a CNN contributor, a professor at Georgetown

591
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 1: Law School, and the author of The Shadow Docket. Welcome

592
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:11,240
Speaker 1: to Fast Politics, Stephen Vladock.

593
00:30:11,480 --> 00:30:12,720
Speaker 4: Thanks really great to be back with you.

594
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:14,800
Speaker 1: The thing that I wanted to talk to you about

595
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: because you're a lawyer, but you're really a scholar, and

596
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:21,920
Speaker 1: you really focus on the constitutionality of things I think

597
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 1: that's fair right, and how the Supreme Court does and

598
00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 1: doesn't weigh in on things like The Shadow Docket, which

599
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,960
Speaker 1: is your most recent book. I wonder if you could

600
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:36,480
Speaker 1: explain to us what the federal takeover of the District

601
00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:40,960
Speaker 1: of Columbia, where this sort of legality ends and where

602
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:41,560
Speaker 1: it begins.

603
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:43,640
Speaker 6: So I think it might be helpful to actually break

604
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 6: out four different things that the federal government is.

605
00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 4: Doing at once.

606
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 6: The first and probably at least on its face, the

607
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:57,400
Speaker 6: least controversial is Surgeon federal law enforcement presence in DC.

608
00:30:57,880 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 6: You know, we'll talk about about the checkpoints, but at

609
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 6: least in the abstract, there's lots of authority and lots

610
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:06,040
Speaker 6: of history and lots of precedent for the federal government

611
00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:09,720
Speaker 6: to use various of its own law enforcement agencies in DC.

612
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 6: The second piece of it is Trump's attempt to take

613
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 6: over the DC Metropolitan Police Department, which started with the

614
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 6: invocation for the very first time of a statute Congress

615
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,280
Speaker 6: passed in nineteen seventy three is part of the Home

616
00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 6: Rule Act that let the president use the MPD during

617
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 6: emergencies for up to thirty days, but you know, doesn't

618
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 6: allow him to take it over. And so we you know,

619
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:35,920
Speaker 6: Attorney General Bondi tried to take it over, a judge

620
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 6: pushed back. She then sort of changed her mind. So

621
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:43,640
Speaker 6: there's some federal oversight slash involvement with the MPD, but

622
00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:45,920
Speaker 6: there's there has not been a full takeover mally. The

623
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,720
Speaker 6: other two things are the military. So the DC National

624
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 6: Guard is unique among the fifty four National Guard units

625
00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 6: that exist in that it is always subject to the

626
00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:57,800
Speaker 6: command and control of the president as opposed to a

627
00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 6: governor even in the other federal territories. President Trump called

628
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 6: out the tiny DC National Guard, although it's not clear

629
00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:06,640
Speaker 6: that they're doing much of anything besides standing around on

630
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 6: the mall. And then the fourth piece of it is

631
00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 6: President Trump has solicited a bunch of red state governors

632
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:16,840
Speaker 6: to send their own national guards without being federalized at

633
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:21,600
Speaker 6: the governor's request, basically into DC. And so what is

634
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 6: effectively happening is this bizarre confluence of Trump trying to

635
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:31,680
Speaker 6: look like he is federalizing DC by relying on four

636
00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:34,280
Speaker 6: different sets of authorities, none of which actually let him

637
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:36,680
Speaker 6: do it, but all of which are at least being

638
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:41,120
Speaker 6: invoked somewhat plausibly, if not ultimately persuasively. So that's the

639
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 6: weird place we find ourselves in.

640
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 1: So much of this seems not legal today, things like checkpoints.

641
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 1: Could you talk us through checkpoints?

642
00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:49,560
Speaker 4: Yeah?

643
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 6: So what is hard in talking about this is that

644
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 6: there's no one bright line.

645
00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 4: Is this or is this legal? Ors this not legal?

646
00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:00,440
Speaker 6: Answer again, because Trump is really doing four very different things.

647
00:33:00,520 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 6: I think the first time I should be said before

648
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:05,240
Speaker 6: we get to checkpoints, is it is all like bullshit

649
00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 6: in the sense that it is all based on a

650
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 6: completely nonsense pretext, which is that there has been some

651
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:15,960
Speaker 6: surge of violent crime in the disch of Columbia. That's

652
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 6: just not true based on the government's own data, which

653
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 6: Trump is now suggesting as somehow flawed. Molly, it's not

654
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:25,760
Speaker 6: what you know most of the Washingtonian and certainly I know,

655
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 6: are experiencing. So problem number one is that it feels illegal,

656
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:32,960
Speaker 6: at least in part because no one buys the narrative,

657
00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 6: no one buys the pretext. But for better or for worse,

658
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 6: the Supreme Court has let the President get away with

659
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:43,320
Speaker 6: pretextual things like the travel ban. And so you know,

660
00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 6: the fact that he's invoking an authority, for example, with

661
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 6: regard to the Met Pelton Police Department that it is

662
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:51,360
Speaker 6: only supposed to be available during an emergency doesn't change

663
00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 6: the fact that, like the statute doesn't say, what doesn't

664
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,560
Speaker 6: doesn't constitute an emergency. And so I think at least

665
00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:00,560
Speaker 6: three of these moves that the National Guard moves I

666
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 6: think are challengeable on their face. I think what he's

667
00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:05,760
Speaker 6: doing to the MPD is challengeable on its face, But

668
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:09,360
Speaker 6: the real illegality to me, Molly, as you suggest is

669
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:11,759
Speaker 6: coming in what they're actually doing on the ground. There

670
00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:15,120
Speaker 6: hasn't been a ton of media coverage of just how

671
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 6: many checkpoints have been set up in DC.

672
00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:19,839
Speaker 4: You know, there were videos.

673
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 6: About the one on Fourteenth Street last week, but you

674
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,080
Speaker 6: know there are now a couple of different checkpoints every

675
00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:27,840
Speaker 6: day in various parts of DC. And that's where I

676
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,719
Speaker 6: start getting nervous, because the Supreme Court, for better or

677
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:33,680
Speaker 6: for worse, has been pretty clear that, you know, there's

678
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:37,759
Speaker 6: no power on the government's part to just do checkpoints

679
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 6: for fundsies. When the Supreme Court has upheld checkpoints, it

680
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:44,080
Speaker 6: has always been because the checkpoint was in furtherance of

681
00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 6: some special need. So you know, a sobriety checkpoint on

682
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:51,560
Speaker 6: New Year's Eve, or a checkpoint near the scene of

683
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:55,600
Speaker 6: an accident where the government's looking for witnesses, or you know,

684
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 6: close to the border, an immigration checkpoint, right like, those

685
00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:03,200
Speaker 6: have been upheld. But the notion that like, because the

686
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:07,360
Speaker 6: President claims without any factual basis that there's more violent

687
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:10,840
Speaker 6: crime in the city at large, you know, the sixty

688
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:14,839
Speaker 6: plus square mile city, we can put checkpoints in neighborhoods

689
00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 6: where there's no evidence of increased crime, Molly, at least

690
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,120
Speaker 6: based on the presidents we have, that should be unconstitutional.

691
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:24,879
Speaker 6: The challenges may yet to be coming. But that's where

692
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:27,360
Speaker 6: I get nervous, is sort of legally what's happening on

693
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:32,080
Speaker 6: the ground, and then politically, the sort of the desensitization

694
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,920
Speaker 6: to just how extraordinary the president's invocation of all these

695
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:36,759
Speaker 6: authorities has been.

696
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:40,240
Speaker 1: So I want you to make me feel better about

697
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:44,439
Speaker 1: the Supreme Court. I'm sorry to tell you, but this

698
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:48,080
Speaker 1: is all just about my therapy. It strikes me that

699
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,719
Speaker 1: this Supreme Court is loath to run any kind of

700
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: just like this Congress loaths to run any kind of

701
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:57,000
Speaker 1: checks on Donald Trump.

702
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:00,480
Speaker 6: I think that's not necessarily wrong, Molly, but if I

703
00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:02,160
Speaker 6: can try to make it feel a little bit better.

704
00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:04,160
Speaker 1: I want to be wrong. I'm telling you.

705
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,320
Speaker 4: The problem is, Molly. I think two things are true.

706
00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:10,960
Speaker 6: I think that this Supreme Court, and especially the three

707
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:14,520
Speaker 6: justices who really matter, the three justices whose votes are

708
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:17,960
Speaker 6: going to drive the results in Trump related cases, by

709
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:21,560
Speaker 6: whom I mean, you know, Chief Justice John Roberts, Justice Breckavanaugh,

710
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 6: is Amy Cony Barrett. I don't think they want confrontations

711
00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 6: with President Trump. And I think that a lot of

712
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,359
Speaker 6: their behavior to this point over the last seven months,

713
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:35,160
Speaker 6: in granting so many of these so called emergency applications,

714
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 6: reflects that. But I also think that the Court is,

715
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 6: you know, zealous of nothing more molly than guarding its

716
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 6: own power. And the one time in all of these

717
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:49,760
Speaker 6: cases so far where it looked like Trump was actually

718
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:52,839
Speaker 6: about to defy not a lower federal court but the

719
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 6: Supreme Court itself, the Justices stepped in it like one

720
00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 6: in the morning on a Saturday. And so I wish

721
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:00,920
Speaker 6: they had stepped in a little more. I think some

722
00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:03,799
Speaker 6: of their rulings in the Trump cases are really problematic,

723
00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 6: as I've as you know, as I've written about it,

724
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:08,080
Speaker 6: perhaps nauseating length in my newsletter.

725
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 4: I don't know.

726
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 6: I still have a little bit of faith, not that

727
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 6: the justices are altruists, but that their interest in preserving

728
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 6: the court's own authority and you know, the separation of

729
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:22,279
Speaker 6: powers more generally, is going to mean that if we

730
00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:25,200
Speaker 6: really get to that, you know, break the glass type

731
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:27,520
Speaker 6: of moment, they're going to be inclined to try to,

732
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 6: you know, rain the president in. I think the trickier part,

733
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 6: MOLLI is trying to sort of help folks see that

734
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:36,480
Speaker 6: we haven't gotten there yet, right. I think there are

735
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:39,239
Speaker 6: so many folks who when I post on social media, oh,

736
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:42,000
Speaker 6: you know this is illegal. The contention doesn't let Trump

737
00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:44,520
Speaker 6: do this? People are like, well, how's that work so far?

738
00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 6: And actually it's worked more than I think a lot

739
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:50,880
Speaker 6: of people will concede. I mean, the Supreme Court has

740
00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:54,200
Speaker 6: right ruled for Trump. I think it's now sixteen times,

741
00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:56,960
Speaker 6: and that's a lot, but Trump has actually lost. By

742
00:37:56,960 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 6: my count mally, we're now north of one hundred and

743
00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:03,719
Speaker 6: twenty district court rulings that have blocked something President Trump

744
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 6: wanted to do, and sixteen it sounds like a lot

745
00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:08,239
Speaker 6: in the abstract, it's a lot for the Supreme Court.

746
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,640
Speaker 6: It's actually a pretty small percentage of one hundred and twenty.

747
00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:13,160
Speaker 6: It's just my way of saying, I think that the

748
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:16,680
Speaker 6: law is constraining Trump. I think that the law will

749
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 6: continue to constrain Trump. The tricky part is not being

750
00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:24,960
Speaker 6: dumers about the politics, because I think part of what's

751
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,960
Speaker 6: happening in d C is an effort by this administration

752
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 6: to make it seem like normal that you know, surgeon

753
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:36,080
Speaker 6: federal law enforcement and deploying troops all over the streets

754
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:38,640
Speaker 6: of American cities is something we do in this country

755
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 6: and it's not. And I think that's you know, that's

756
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:44,600
Speaker 6: what scares me about DC. I'm not scared there's going

757
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:47,839
Speaker 6: to be some like armed confrontation in DC. I'm scared that, like,

758
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:50,480
Speaker 6: you know, if he tries to pull this nonsense with

759
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:53,279
Speaker 6: some other city where there won't be nearly the same

760
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,120
Speaker 6: kind of legal authorities, people will be like, well, he

761
00:38:56,200 --> 00:38:58,239
Speaker 6: did it in d C. And throw their hands.

762
00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 1: Up, right right, right, No, No, I agree. I'm glad

763
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 1: to hear you say that, by the way, about the law,

764
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:08,000
Speaker 1: because it feels like there's so much stuff that the

765
00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:13,439
Speaker 1: Trump administration's doing that seems pretty dicey at best. I mean,

766
00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:18,520
Speaker 1: the motivation of protecting their own power. It's not exactly altruism,

767
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:20,840
Speaker 1: but at least it's some kind of check.

768
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:22,880
Speaker 4: Well, let's go back to DC for a second.

769
00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 6: If Trump really were unbound by the law, if law

770
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:29,960
Speaker 6: were irrelevant, if the law had nothing to do with

771
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:32,480
Speaker 6: what he was doing, then that doesn't explain what's happened

772
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:34,879
Speaker 6: in DC. Right then he wouldn't have started with DC.

773
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:37,800
Speaker 6: He would have started with Chicago, right or New York.

774
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 6: He wouldn't have started with, like the place over which

775
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 6: the federal government has more of a claim to power

776
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,320
Speaker 6: than anywhere else in the country under both the Constitution

777
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,600
Speaker 6: and a series of statutes. He wouldn't have started with the

778
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:51,840
Speaker 6: one place where he has direct control over the National Guard,

779
00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:54,640
Speaker 6: and he would be using all of these authorities to

780
00:39:54,719 --> 00:39:57,280
Speaker 6: do more than he's doing. Like, I think the checkpoints

781
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,919
Speaker 6: are unconstitutional, but I think that's a close question under

782
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:04,040
Speaker 6: the precedents. What we don't see we don't see. You know,

783
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:07,800
Speaker 6: troops just randomly arresting people on the street, we don't see.

784
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:10,600
Speaker 6: You know, troops bargin in the people's houses. We don't

785
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 6: see Trump, for example, you know, having the military doing

786
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 6: traffic stops. Right, And so I just you know, I

787
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:19,920
Speaker 6: know that the law is not drawing the lines people

788
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:23,200
Speaker 6: want it to draw, and I'm with everyone on that.

789
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:26,600
Speaker 6: But I think it's worth appreciating how much of what

790
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:30,719
Speaker 6: he's doing in DC is actually hyper legalized, because he's

791
00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:34,560
Speaker 6: trying to rely on the DC specific authorities to create

792
00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:38,000
Speaker 6: this momentum for authorities he won't have in other cities.

793
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,719
Speaker 1: Right, But he's also trying to intimidate, right, I mean,

794
00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:47,799
Speaker 1: he's been trying to intimidate journalist, democratic elected people, and judiciary,

795
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:51,120
Speaker 1: perhaps the Supreme Court. So I am glad to have

796
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 1: you here. This has now become you talking of the ledge.

797
00:40:54,560 --> 00:41:02,040
Speaker 1: Clearly this guy is authoritarian curious probably oritarian, very curious.

798
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:05,000
Speaker 1: Like when you look at the things like the redistricting,

799
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:09,560
Speaker 1: the five seat redistricting, which means that Texas will actually

800
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:13,040
Speaker 1: manage to steal five House seats. I mean, don't you

801
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:16,799
Speaker 1: feel like the sort of the rules, the law, all

802
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,399
Speaker 1: of our sort of norms are just being put into

803
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:21,120
Speaker 1: a blender make me feel better?

804
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 6: So I think the norms are being put into a blender.

805
00:41:24,200 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 6: I don't think the laws are right. I mean, partisan

806
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:28,960
Speaker 6: jerry mandarin is a scurge, but it is a scurge

807
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:30,520
Speaker 6: that has been with us for a long time.

808
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:32,719
Speaker 4: And I wish.

809
00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 6: That the Supreme Court in twenty nineteen had not basically,

810
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:40,279
Speaker 6: you know, washed its hands of any responsibility for supervising

811
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:43,880
Speaker 6: partisan jerry mandering. But it did molly, which means democratic

812
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:46,200
Speaker 6: states can do it too, and so we'd all be

813
00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 6: better off in the world without it. But I also

814
00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:51,319
Speaker 6: think that at least for now, that by itself is

815
00:41:51,360 --> 00:41:53,200
Speaker 6: not the end of democracy.

816
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:53,600
Speaker 4: Right.

817
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,560
Speaker 6: What I worry about more is, you know, when Trump

818
00:41:57,680 --> 00:42:00,600
Speaker 6: comes out like on Monday, and you know, talks about

819
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 6: how he's going to go after mail and voting, he's

820
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,239
Speaker 6: going to you know, try to do other things, right like, So,

821
00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:10,520
Speaker 6: you know that's just totally bananas legally, because the president

822
00:42:10,680 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 6: doesn't control elections.

823
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,920
Speaker 1: Right, right, there's on the state level, one hundred.

824
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:18,920
Speaker 6: Percent, right, the Constitution leaves the regulation of even federal

825
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 6: elections to the states. Now, Congress has the power to

826
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:26,080
Speaker 6: set uniform national rules, but you know that requires malli

827
00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 6: new legislation which would have to be filibuster proof in

828
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 6: the Senate, and nothing like that would be I guess

829
00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:34,840
Speaker 6: part of the problem is that I think Trump governs

830
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:40,080
Speaker 6: by a combination of bullying and intimidation and a combination

831
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:43,000
Speaker 6: of sort of grandiose claims of authority he doesn't have.

832
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 6: And the bullying and intimidation often succeed in getting people

833
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:50,840
Speaker 6: to do the things voluntarily that he could not compel

834
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 6: them to do. And so, you know, my concern about

835
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:57,280
Speaker 6: the Texas president is less that Texas is creating five

836
00:42:57,400 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 6: more seats for Republicans and more that Texas jumped when

837
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,400
Speaker 6: Trump told it to right that like, you know, states

838
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:06,880
Speaker 6: are like oh yeah, yeah, that states are basically at

839
00:43:06,960 --> 00:43:10,280
Speaker 6: least red states are basically acting the way Trump says,

840
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:12,560
Speaker 6: which is that they're just agents of the federal government.

841
00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:15,640
Speaker 6: The Founders would roll over in their graves at the

842
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:18,800
Speaker 6: suggestion that states are agents of the federal government. That's

843
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:21,920
Speaker 6: the bigger concern for me is not what he can

844
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:26,279
Speaker 6: do directly, but how much power he's able to amass

845
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:30,440
Speaker 6: just by you know, bullying, intimidating, you know, scaring his

846
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:33,160
Speaker 6: base whatever. And that's why I think it's so important

847
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:35,560
Speaker 6: for folks to be really well educated about what he

848
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:36,919
Speaker 6: can and can't actually do.

849
00:43:37,200 --> 00:43:41,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, it feels like we're kareeming towards some kind of showdown,

850
00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:43,960
Speaker 1: right or numerous ones.

851
00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:46,640
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean the problems I don't know what the

852
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:48,399
Speaker 6: flashpoint is going to be. I mean, part of what's

853
00:43:48,440 --> 00:43:50,959
Speaker 6: really really troubling about DC is I think Trump would

854
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:53,719
Speaker 6: love nothing more than to provoke in, you know, an

855
00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:57,200
Speaker 6: incident you know, everyone keeps waiting for, for the Reichstag fire.

856
00:43:58,239 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 6: I don't know if we're kareeming toward so much as

857
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:03,440
Speaker 6: we are sliding down in icy slope and trying to

858
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 6: figure out if we can stop ourselves.

859
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:05,839
Speaker 4: I will say this.

860
00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 6: I think the courts are continuing, I think to do

861
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:13,120
Speaker 6: a pretty good job of you know, holding the feet

862
00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:15,200
Speaker 6: to the firelacet I mean, Molly, DC is a good

863
00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:18,000
Speaker 6: example of this. There were two steps to the attempt

864
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 6: to take over of the MPD. When DC sued, after

865
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:24,400
Speaker 6: you know, turning General, Bondi tried to claim that she

866
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:27,080
Speaker 6: was now in charge of the MPD, the judge who

867
00:44:27,160 --> 00:44:29,120
Speaker 6: was assigning here the case, Judge Rey Is, convened to

868
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:32,880
Speaker 6: hearing within like four hours, and by that night Bondi

869
00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:35,279
Speaker 6: had rescinded her order and had you know, sort of

870
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:38,440
Speaker 6: conformed her conduct to what the statute actually authorizes. So

871
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 6: I think we are heading for some kind of you

872
00:44:41,680 --> 00:44:43,879
Speaker 6: know moment, Molly, but I don't know what it is,

873
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:47,160
Speaker 6: and I haven't given up yet on the idea that,

874
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:50,360
Speaker 6: you know, until that moment, maybe even in that moment,

875
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:53,440
Speaker 6: the courts are actually going to be, you know, a

876
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:59,960
Speaker 6: realistic bulwark against Trump's authoritarian, curious impulses and his just

877
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:02,640
Speaker 6: indifference to you know, to accountability.

878
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:06,080
Speaker 1: We never had to get here, and it just makes

879
00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:09,799
Speaker 1: me so it's so bad. The other thing that I

880
00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 1: want you to talk about is what's happening sort of

881
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 1: on the Supreme Court docket right now, like they are

882
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 1: on vacation for the summer, but they're putting stuff on

883
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 1: the docket still like Oberfeld.

884
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:26,960
Speaker 6: Yeah, so I think again, what's going on with Obergefel.

885
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 6: The same sex marriage ruling is another really good example

886
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:33,440
Speaker 6: of I guess me howlan at the moon about people

887
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:39,000
Speaker 6: being nuanced. So the Obergafell media cycle started because the

888
00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:43,279
Speaker 6: crazy Kentucky clerk Kim Davis, who's.

889
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:45,680
Speaker 1: Been married four times, is.

890
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:49,040
Speaker 6: Back at the Supreme Court trying to get out of

891
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:53,280
Speaker 6: a damage's judgment that was entered against her for refusing

892
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:58,360
Speaker 6: to marry people after Obergafel, and the media cycle started. Molly,

893
00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 6: I think like last week or two weeks ago, because

894
00:46:01,320 --> 00:46:04,680
Speaker 6: the Supreme Court ordered the respondents, the plaintiffs who sued

895
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:07,600
Speaker 6: Kim Davis to file a response to her certin petition.

896
00:46:07,960 --> 00:46:11,799
Speaker 6: That is a nothing burger, that is not news. And

897
00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 6: someone who doesn't know what they're doing thought that signal

898
00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:18,520
Speaker 6: that the court was interested in over rulin O Berga fell,

899
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:20,719
Speaker 6: you know, and the promise is that even if the

900
00:46:20,760 --> 00:46:22,040
Speaker 6: court is and oh, by the way.

901
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:23,279
Speaker 4: I actually don't think it is.

902
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:26,319
Speaker 6: The Davis case is the worst possible vehicle because she

903
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:29,640
Speaker 6: didn't even raise that question in the trial court. She

904
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:33,279
Speaker 6: forfeited it, which is what the federal appeals Court found. So,

905
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:37,319
Speaker 6: you know, everyone gets sort of stirred up to you know,

906
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 6: a five alarm fire because one reporter doesn't understand how

907
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 6: the Supreme Court works.

908
00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:43,600
Speaker 4: This is not to say that all is well at

909
00:46:43,640 --> 00:46:44,439
Speaker 4: the Supreme Court.

910
00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:46,480
Speaker 6: I mean, I think the justices are up to plenty

911
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:49,440
Speaker 6: of other things I'm not too excited about. You know,

912
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:54,520
Speaker 6: the cases about Louisiana's congressional redistricting, for example, have now

913
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 6: turned into a bit of a referendum on whether states

914
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:02,080
Speaker 6: are ever allowed to draw you know, majority minority districts

915
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:06,200
Speaker 6: without violating the Constitution. That would be a remarkable step

916
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:09,600
Speaker 6: backwards in my view for you know, civil rights in

917
00:47:09,600 --> 00:47:12,280
Speaker 6: this country. Do you know the Court just last week

918
00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:15,640
Speaker 6: in an emergency application, the Court left in place, to

919
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:20,640
Speaker 6: me a really problematic Mississippi law that requires age verification

920
00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:24,560
Speaker 6: before folks can use social media. And you know that

921
00:47:24,680 --> 00:47:26,200
Speaker 6: means that you have to turn over a whole bunch

922
00:47:26,239 --> 00:47:29,160
Speaker 6: of personally identifying information in order to actually access a

923
00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:32,360
Speaker 6: whole bunch of constitutionally protected speech. Justice Kavanaugh wrote this

924
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:34,920
Speaker 6: concurrence where he said, I think this law is unconstitutional,

925
00:47:34,960 --> 00:47:37,160
Speaker 6: but I'm going to leave it in place anyway. You know,

926
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 6: the court is up to a lot of to me, mischief,

927
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:41,879
Speaker 6: but I think it's not quite at the level of

928
00:47:42,040 --> 00:47:44,719
Speaker 6: Oberga fell as vulnerable as soon as next term.

929
00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:46,400
Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you, Steven.

930
00:47:46,719 --> 00:47:48,840
Speaker 6: Thanks that's always way to be with IMALI. And you know,

931
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:51,719
Speaker 6: I can't tell you how much I appreciate your pensiant

932
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:54,120
Speaker 6: for trying to bring a little bit of sanity to

933
00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:55,160
Speaker 6: all of the drama.

934
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:03,080
Speaker 1: No moment cool, Jesse Cannon Molli.

935
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 2: One of the things we've been discussing a lot here

936
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:08,640
Speaker 2: is the total lack of concern ICE seems to have

937
00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:11,439
Speaker 2: about well, whether they're getting the right people, the way

938
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:14,640
Speaker 2: they treat them, anything at all, pretty much because they've

939
00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:18,000
Speaker 2: basically been instructed that they will have impunity or that

940
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,640
Speaker 2: they could act with on impunity. And the Senate probe

941
00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:22,040
Speaker 2: has uncovered exactly that.

942
00:48:22,520 --> 00:48:27,640
Speaker 1: So John ass Off leading this investigation hundreds of reports

943
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:32,880
Speaker 1: since January, including accounts of miscarriages, child neglect, sexual abuse

944
00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 1: at ICE detention centers in dozens of states. Does this

945
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:41,160
Speaker 1: surprise anyone. It's like again, shocking but not surprising. Forty

946
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:45,920
Speaker 1: one cases of physical and sexual assault, fourteen involving pregnant detainees,

947
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:49,680
Speaker 1: eighteen involving children. I thought they wanted to protect children.

948
00:48:49,719 --> 00:48:53,120
Speaker 1: I always told that this crew wanted to protect children.

949
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 1: But this does not seem like a lot of child

950
00:48:56,680 --> 00:48:59,680
Speaker 1: protection because they don't really care about any of this.

951
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:01,680
Speaker 1: And by the way, a lot of these people not

952
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:06,200
Speaker 1: criminals okay either are just people who are here illegally,

953
00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:11,960
Speaker 1: which technically is a civil violation and not a criminal violation.

954
00:49:12,239 --> 00:49:15,399
Speaker 1: By the way, contracts flowing to private prisons, So you're

955
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 1: going to see a lot more of this stuff because

956
00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:21,160
Speaker 1: this is what they do. It is our moment of frockery.

957
00:49:21,160 --> 00:49:24,640
Speaker 1: It should be our moment of rockery every day. That's

958
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:31,160
Speaker 1: it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday,

959
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:35,879
Speaker 1: Thursday and Saturday to hear the best minds and politics

960
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:40,200
Speaker 1: make sense of all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast,

961
00:49:40,600 --> 00:49:44,000
Speaker 1: please send it to a friend and keep the conversation going.

962
00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:45,640
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.