WEBVTT - The Narcissism Epidemic 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.480 Hey, fam I'm Jada Pinkett Smith and this is the 0:00:02.480 --> 0:00:05.840 Red Table Pop podcast, all your favorite episodes from the 0:00:05.880 --> 0:00:10.040 Facebook watch show in audio produced by Westbrook Audio and 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:13.080 I Heart Radio. Please don't forget to rate and review 0:00:13.400 --> 0:00:18.560 on Apple podcasts. On this Red Table talk how to 0:00:18.640 --> 0:00:22.920 spot a narcissist in your life. Everyone is getting hurt 0:00:22.960 --> 0:00:25.279 by this. I've never seen anything like this. The biggest 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:29.360 warning signs these are the people willing to manipulate, to exploit, 0:00:29.720 --> 0:00:33.160 to lie, to cheat, to steal. I know some people 0:00:33.200 --> 0:00:34.839 like that. The worst thing you can do to a 0:00:34.920 --> 0:00:37.560 narcissist has forgive them. They're gonna take your forgiveness and 0:00:37.560 --> 0:00:40.879 turn it into a weapon. You're in a relationship with 0:00:40.880 --> 0:00:44.559 a malignant narcissist, how the hell do you get out? 0:00:44.640 --> 0:00:47.280 It can be dangerous. He just blew my mind with that. 0:00:50.040 --> 0:00:53.000 So today we're doing a show on narcissisms. It's really 0:00:53.000 --> 0:00:56.320 affecting people in a like a really strong way. I 0:00:56.440 --> 0:01:00.640 definitely feel like I have narcissistic traits, definitely. I don't 0:01:00.640 --> 0:01:04.759 know if I'm a clinical narcissist because there is a difference. 0:01:05.400 --> 0:01:08.440 I mean, the industry I'm in, who's not a narcissist 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:13.600 in it. We cultivate narcissism. In my industry, everything is 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:16.080 about me, me, me, me me. All right, well let's 0:01:16.080 --> 0:01:25.600 go talk to our narcissist expert. So this is one 0:01:25.640 --> 0:01:31.039 of our most requested topics. Yeah, this narcissistic epidemic is 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:34.240 serious business for me. I'm just trying to in my 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:38.199 journey as of late, just trying to identify any traits 0:01:38.200 --> 0:01:41.880 of narcissism within myself, which I know exists. I mean, 0:01:42.040 --> 0:01:45.479 one of the most narcissistic industry would agree with that. 0:01:45.600 --> 0:01:47.480 And then on top of it, now that we have 0:01:47.560 --> 0:01:51.480 social social media, I think that just breeds narcis because 0:01:51.520 --> 0:01:56.120 I still find it a little strange to be constantly 0:01:56.200 --> 0:02:01.640 taking pictures of yourself and posting like go everywhere you go. Well, 0:02:01.640 --> 0:02:04.720 I know for you, Willo, You've always had a very 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:08.280 interesting relationship with social media because people would always be 0:02:08.280 --> 0:02:11.600 asking me like post selfiees, post selfies, and that would 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:15.160 make me so like, what's going Like that's us even 0:02:15.200 --> 0:02:17.600 in your instead of your life. You do everything you 0:02:17.639 --> 0:02:21.480 can to get attention off of you. Yeah, like everything, 0:02:21.960 --> 0:02:28.880 but are you drawing? Honestly, yeah, I think it's the 0:02:28.919 --> 0:02:33.079 coolest thing because you're so opposite of most young people 0:02:33.160 --> 0:02:36.079 your age. So today we have a beautiful woman that's 0:02:36.120 --> 0:02:39.160 coming to speak to us who's written many books on 0:02:39.160 --> 0:02:45.080 this subject, doctor Romany. She is a psychologist, professor, and 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:52.200 a world renowned expert on narcissism. Welcome, Thank you. I've 0:02:52.200 --> 0:02:55.079 watched you talk about this. You're so passionate. I can 0:02:55.120 --> 0:03:01.480 tell that it is your life's work. Have people understand 0:03:01.919 --> 0:03:05.600 what narcissism is all about. Everyone is getting hurt by this. 0:03:05.720 --> 0:03:08.080 I never I've never seen anything like this. What is 0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:11.760 the definition of narcissism. A lot of people think it's 0:03:11.760 --> 0:03:14.600 somebody who's just into themselves. Yeah, that's what I thought. 0:03:15.000 --> 0:03:17.680 Could be anything, but it's it's actually almost the opposite 0:03:17.680 --> 0:03:21.160 of self love. I'd almost call itself hate. These are 0:03:21.240 --> 0:03:25.680 people who have no empathy for other people. They're really grandiose, 0:03:25.720 --> 0:03:30.200 so deeply entitled. They're arrogant. They can't deal with frustration, 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:33.560 and when face was frustration, they become rageful. You can't 0:03:33.560 --> 0:03:36.280 win an argument with a narcissist, and I see that. 0:03:36.440 --> 0:03:39.320 I see that in people so much. They never want 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:42.280 to feel wrong, so I always take it and I 0:03:42.320 --> 0:03:45.640 don't like that, so I just that that's one percent 0:03:46.040 --> 0:03:49.960 my thing, because I'm like, this is gonna be an argument. 0:03:50.360 --> 0:03:53.160 You're gonna not want to feel wrong, right, So I'm 0:03:53.160 --> 0:03:56.960 just gonna cut the middleman and just be like responsibility. 0:03:57.000 --> 0:03:59.320 I'm the person who takes all the blame. Right. Here's 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:01.240 the thing. If you did it ten times in a 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:04.560 row with a partner who had some of these narcissistic tendencies, 0:04:04.840 --> 0:04:07.080 they could easily crawl in there and take advantage of 0:04:07.720 --> 0:04:09.680 other things that you're going to look for with the 0:04:09.800 --> 0:04:14.600 narcissists are constantly seeking validation. Narcissists are very, very sensitive, 0:04:14.840 --> 0:04:18.000 hyper sensitive to the point of being paranoid, because when 0:04:18.000 --> 0:04:22.360 it comes down to the core, they're deeply insecure. So 0:04:22.400 --> 0:04:26.600 that's not self love right right. But because they're so insecure, 0:04:26.920 --> 0:04:29.760 they open up with, look how great I am. And 0:04:29.800 --> 0:04:32.039 that's why it sells so well in the entertainment industry 0:04:32.080 --> 0:04:33.840 because they can fake it till they make it. When 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:36.760 I keep facing it. If you work in the entertainment industry, 0:04:36.960 --> 0:04:41.120 an account the narcissists, it's not possible. It's not possible. Time, 0:04:41.640 --> 0:04:45.360 it's it is not possible. It's like going to the 0:04:45.400 --> 0:04:50.080 beach and not seeing Sam like that. It's really harmful 0:04:50.120 --> 0:04:53.040 because it's one thing to fake it for a performance. 0:04:53.080 --> 0:04:56.600 It's quite another to be with a person who invalidates 0:04:56.640 --> 0:05:00.880 you all the time. Are there different levels to narcissism, 0:05:01.040 --> 0:05:04.320 So the classical form of narcissism is sort of what 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:07.360 most people picture, that sort of grandiose Look how great 0:05:07.400 --> 0:05:09.760 I am, Look at my car, look at my dress. 0:05:09.839 --> 0:05:12.080 I'm all that right, So they sort of suck all 0:05:12.120 --> 0:05:14.960 the oxygen. We're often entertained by them. They're very charming, 0:05:15.279 --> 0:05:18.160 that's why people get drawn in. But the flip side 0:05:18.160 --> 0:05:20.080 of that of the narcissists, we miss what we call 0:05:20.160 --> 0:05:23.960 the covert narcissists. Those are the dark knights of the 0:05:24.040 --> 0:05:28.359 narcissistic world, because they come off as really victimy. The 0:05:28.440 --> 0:05:30.720 world never saw how great I was. You know, if 0:05:30.720 --> 0:05:32.800 the world knew how great I was, I'd be the 0:05:32.880 --> 0:05:36.200 next big thing. So they're very angry at the world. 0:05:36.440 --> 0:05:39.240 They're very sullen. They can often look depressed, so we 0:05:39.279 --> 0:05:41.560 miss them because they're not putting on the big show. 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:46.080 We don't associate that. But they're angry, very angry. They're 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:48.480 very angry. They can be very dangerous as it all 0:05:48.520 --> 0:05:52.440 goes off. Those are often covert narcissists. The Joker is 0:05:52.480 --> 0:05:56.520 a covert because Joker has a very covert narcissistic field. Exactly. 0:05:56.640 --> 0:06:01.120 That's because look at his whole life with nothing one exactly, 0:06:01.200 --> 0:06:02.880 nothing went his way, and then he said, I'm going 0:06:02.920 --> 0:06:05.880 to make you see. That's then we go on to 0:06:05.960 --> 0:06:09.480 the malignant narcissists, which to me is the most dangerous 0:06:09.600 --> 0:06:12.080 dark narcissists of all, because these are the people who 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:15.000 not only can be quite grandiose and charming, but they're 0:06:15.000 --> 0:06:19.880 willing to manipulate, to exploit, to lie, to cheat, to steal, 0:06:20.160 --> 0:06:24.280 to throw one of the most They're dangerous and they 0:06:24.320 --> 0:06:26.680 are and to me, it's like the last stuff on 0:06:26.720 --> 0:06:30.360 the train before being a psychopath. Yeah, one last one though. 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:33.719 What we call the noble narcissist. These are the people 0:06:33.760 --> 0:06:37.120 who do lots of good things, lots of charitable stuff, 0:06:37.120 --> 0:06:39.280 and donate lots of money, but the reason they do 0:06:39.320 --> 0:06:42.280 it is only to get validation. These are the people 0:06:42.320 --> 0:06:44.599 like I need my name on the building, lots of 0:06:44.600 --> 0:06:48.840 Instagram post hashtag rescue Saturday, or they look really good 0:06:48.920 --> 0:06:55.840 rescuing to it look good, it look so it's that. 0:06:55.920 --> 0:06:57.880 But what they are is there often they look like 0:06:57.920 --> 0:07:01.360 a savior to the community, but hind closed doors, they 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:04.000 are cruel to their families, They're cruel to their partners, 0:07:04.040 --> 0:07:06.039 and everyone will say, you're so lucky to have that 0:07:06.120 --> 0:07:08.960 mother a father. They are saving the world, and you're thinking, 0:07:08.960 --> 0:07:11.800 oh my god, my life is a living nightmare. This 0:07:11.840 --> 0:07:17.600 is deep. Yeah, that's that's for real. What would be 0:07:17.800 --> 0:07:21.360 some of the traits? Okay, the real thing that this 0:07:21.400 --> 0:07:24.120 all spins on is that lack of empathy. Okay, just 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:30.360 don't care about other people. How do you notice that? Okay, 0:07:30.480 --> 0:07:33.680 you're very distracted. They often like to say I have 0:07:33.760 --> 0:07:35.560 a d h D. I'm like, do you have a 0:07:35.640 --> 0:07:37.239 d h D? You just managed to talk about yourself 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:38.960 for an hour, so that a d h D apparently 0:07:39.040 --> 0:07:43.440 only five minutes ago. So I know some people like context. 0:07:43.480 --> 0:07:46.640 Yeah right, they can't be bothered. They can talk about 0:07:46.680 --> 0:07:48.800 themselves all the time, and then once you say something, 0:07:48.840 --> 0:07:51.880 they're like, how about we just go do something else. 0:07:52.080 --> 0:07:55.520 Then you're just like all right, And they just don't 0:07:55.640 --> 0:07:58.720 care when the conversations not about them, So they will 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:01.640 take take take, and can be devastating for people. And 0:08:01.680 --> 0:08:03.120 it's a lot for a person to get their head 0:08:03.160 --> 0:08:05.240 around that you just don't care. I know there are 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:09.040 just people who have those traits but don't necessarily have 0:08:09.080 --> 0:08:12.440 the diagnosis. Very few people have the diagnosis. So you 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:15.680 hear people talk about narcissistic personality disorder, and that's the 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:18.440 sort of mental illness, right and honestly in the research 0:08:18.480 --> 0:08:20.680 one to four percent. So people are saying, well, that 0:08:20.680 --> 0:08:22.520 can't be the case, because it's like every other person 0:08:22.560 --> 0:08:25.480 I encounter. And that's because when we talk about narcissism, 0:08:25.640 --> 0:08:28.960 and it's almost an adjective basically, like calling someone stubborn 0:08:29.600 --> 0:08:33.440 or friendly or agreeable. If you say someone's narcissistic, it's 0:08:33.480 --> 0:08:35.840 really a sign that this is someone where it's really 0:08:35.880 --> 0:08:38.640 invalidating to be in their presence. Have you ever had 0:08:38.679 --> 0:08:42.560 experienced yes? Really, it put me in dangerous situations. It 0:08:42.679 --> 0:08:45.520 made me cynical more than anything. It broke my heart. 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:48.040 For a while, I lived in that reality of I 0:08:48.240 --> 0:08:52.160 was nothing and I didn't deserve better than that. And 0:08:52.440 --> 0:08:55.640 to break those narratives, some of which were ancient for me, 0:08:56.080 --> 0:08:58.320 it took a lifetime of work. I've been in therapy 0:08:58.400 --> 0:09:01.199 for a long time. It's made me much more cautious 0:09:01.480 --> 0:09:03.760 and so I'm very discerning when I meet new people, 0:09:03.760 --> 0:09:07.480 like what about you, Jada? Where you ever? Hurt? Big time, 0:09:08.120 --> 0:09:12.559 big time devastated because you bring people into your your 0:09:12.600 --> 0:09:16.680 inner sanctum when they make you believe that they're one thing, 0:09:17.880 --> 0:09:20.360 and then something happens and then you realize they are 0:09:20.520 --> 0:09:24.800 something completely and utterly different, and it can be very 0:09:24.800 --> 0:09:28.240 painful and dangerous. And it also leads you to doubt 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:32.240 yourself because the biggest fallout of narcissistic abuse is the 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:34.520 amount of self doubt that leaves a person when they 0:09:34.520 --> 0:09:40.319 doubt themselves professionally, the relationships and all their decision making. 0:09:40.480 --> 0:09:42.120 Some of them will say, I can't even go to 0:09:42.160 --> 0:09:44.360 the grocery store anymore and make a reasonable decision. I 0:09:44.400 --> 0:09:48.200 always say to people, there's two surefire signs you're in 0:09:48.200 --> 0:09:52.040 a relationship with the narcissists. Number One, you feel compelled 0:09:52.280 --> 0:09:56.480 to start recording all your conversations because you feel like 0:09:57.600 --> 0:09:59.920 I must have heard that wrong. That's how much they 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:03.520 feel like they're losing their reality. Number Two, you feel 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:06.640 the need to write these really long texts and emails 0:10:06.679 --> 0:10:10.840 to them explaining yourself because they don't listen. Why would 0:10:10.840 --> 0:10:13.800 they read your email? But people will spend hours days 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:18.520 writing these long letters, emails, texts, explaining everything, thinking that 0:10:18.600 --> 0:10:20.680 maybe if they take the time to read it, they'll 0:10:20.760 --> 0:10:23.040 understand it. I said, they don't want to understand it, 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:25.040 so you just wasted three days unless it made you 0:10:25.120 --> 0:10:27.760 feel better to write it something else. I tell folks, 0:10:27.760 --> 0:10:30.560 it's what I call the nine ten rule. We tend 0:10:30.600 --> 0:10:33.960 to put nine of our effort and our energy into 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:36.920 the most toxic people in our world, leaving only ten 0:10:37.000 --> 0:10:42.080 percent for the good, loving, healthy people. Narcissistic people are 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:45.360 a full time job. If we flip the math and 0:10:45.400 --> 0:10:48.560 gave to the good people and ten percent to the 0:10:48.640 --> 0:10:51.720 unhealthy ones, it would be so much better for our health. 0:10:52.080 --> 0:10:55.640 It sounds like narcissists know what they're doing. They're not 0:10:55.679 --> 0:10:58.079 aware that they're insecure. Their lack of self awareness means 0:10:58.080 --> 0:11:00.959 they're not even aware of what they're doing to other people. Sadly, 0:11:01.280 --> 0:11:03.920 narcissistic get rewarded for their behavior, so it's hard. They're 0:11:03.960 --> 0:11:07.439 always getting told by the world, you're great, you're fantastic. 0:11:07.520 --> 0:11:09.800 It's hard to end the pattern. Yeah, I've worked with 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:11.920 clients who are in their eighties, and I've worked with 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.240 clients who are eighteen and I'm gonna be frank with you. 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:16.920 I actually think the Baby Boomers are the most narcissistic 0:11:16.960 --> 0:11:23.120 generation of all. They were generation. It's all about me. 0:11:23.160 --> 0:11:25.280 I gotta make it about me. And what ended up 0:11:25.280 --> 0:11:28.200 happening is they've kind of robbed the treasury. The millennials 0:11:28.200 --> 0:11:31.840 are really suffering financially. They're putting your dreams on ice 0:11:32.360 --> 0:11:34.440 and the baby wears on no problem, sort of taking 0:11:34.440 --> 0:11:37.040 their half out of the middle. So that feels narcissistic 0:11:37.080 --> 0:11:43.520 to me, all due respect. Wow, that is really interesting. 0:11:43.640 --> 0:11:47.439 I was not expecting that. So I actually think we're 0:11:47.440 --> 0:11:49.720 throwing the poor millennials under the bus. They've got a 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:52.040 lot more heart than my colleagues who were the Baby Boomers. 0:11:53.040 --> 0:12:02.719 Just lost my job, but that never guess the millennials 0:12:02.840 --> 0:12:07.080 have their moments. Taking a selfie doesn't make you a narcissist, 0:12:07.280 --> 0:12:10.200 but living and dying by that selfie, that's where it 0:12:10.200 --> 0:12:14.600 becomes that when you're entire what about when every single 0:12:14.640 --> 0:12:17.480 photo on your Instagram that's the problem, That's what I'm saying, 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:20.040 When it becomes a measure of a person's self worth, right, 0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:22.400 So you have to figure out what's normative. Do you 0:12:22.440 --> 0:12:26.319 think people over time, have just become just more insecure. 0:12:27.000 --> 0:12:30.000 Do you know why I think about it. I can't 0:12:30.080 --> 0:12:32.839 get you to buy something unless I can convince you 0:12:32.840 --> 0:12:36.440 you need it. So if I tell you a lot prettier, 0:12:36.480 --> 0:12:38.600 if you're wearing a different pair of shoes exactly, and 0:12:38.640 --> 0:12:41.320 if you're vulnerable to that message, which most people are, like, 0:12:41.360 --> 0:12:43.520 I need to have the shoes. How do you become 0:12:43.520 --> 0:12:45.800 a narcissist if you're not born that way? There's no 0:12:45.880 --> 0:12:48.880 narcissistic babies. This one's on the squarely under sadly on 0:12:48.920 --> 0:12:51.560 the shoulders of the parents. Kids who are narcissistic either 0:12:51.600 --> 0:12:55.880 had narcissistic parents themselves or really distracted parents. Kids who 0:12:55.880 --> 0:12:58.679 are overindulged, meaning that they get anything they want, all 0:12:58.720 --> 0:13:04.400 the experience, any money, but their emotional needs are completely undernourished. 0:13:05.200 --> 0:13:07.160 That's the difference there as far as they're concerned. They 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:10.040 go to Disneyland every weekend, but sometimes they just want 0:13:10.040 --> 0:13:12.199 to cry and say I feel sad, I feel scared, 0:13:12.240 --> 0:13:15.200 and there's no adult to be found when that happens. 0:13:15.520 --> 0:13:19.800 That over indulgence against under indulgence teaches the child that 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:23.120 only they're outside external stuff matters, and then kids will 0:13:23.120 --> 0:13:25.240 only get valued for what they do. You kick a 0:13:25.360 --> 0:13:27.840 soccer ball, well, you're saying, well, you get good grades, 0:13:28.080 --> 0:13:31.360 you look pretty. Those kids learn that realize I'm only 0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:33.760 about the things I do and how I look, and 0:13:33.840 --> 0:13:37.400 nobody cares about my inside world. By the time they're 0:13:37.400 --> 0:13:40.040 about sixteen, seventeen eighteen, that starts to emerge, and there's 0:13:40.040 --> 0:13:41.280 not a whole heck of a lot you can do 0:13:41.320 --> 0:13:43.960 about it. This is not a pattern that changes. It 0:13:44.000 --> 0:13:48.079 doesn't change. So you're telling me that a narcissist can't 0:13:48.080 --> 0:13:51.160 be cured. I this is this is what healthy. This 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:53.280 is what healthy you need to be for a healthy 0:13:53.320 --> 0:13:58.079 relationship right up here? Okay, respectful, client, compassionate, they're present, 0:13:58.120 --> 0:14:02.000 all that good stuff. Okay, here's the narcissist. All right. 0:14:02.559 --> 0:14:06.080 Even a good therapist like me and I have a 0:14:06.160 --> 0:14:08.360 third of my clients or narcissists. I can get them 0:14:08.400 --> 0:14:11.959 up to here. We got a problem, so we can 0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:14.440 teach them to be on time. But now they're on 0:14:14.480 --> 0:14:17.120 time and not listening to you. So how does one 0:14:17.280 --> 0:14:20.040 open their life to a narcissist? And they're so good 0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:22.480 at making you feel like the center of their universe. 0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:24.640 We actually call it love bombing. It's like getting a 0:14:24.640 --> 0:14:27.560 butterfly underglass. It's a game. And then once they get 0:14:27.560 --> 0:14:30.120 the beautiful creature underglass, they put it up on a 0:14:30.160 --> 0:14:33.240 shelf and they forget about it, and it hurts. That 0:14:33.320 --> 0:14:35.040 day they discard you and just put you up on 0:14:35.080 --> 0:14:37.880 the shelf is a cold, dark day because you felt 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:40.160 the sun was only shining for you. I feel like 0:14:40.560 --> 0:14:43.160 a lot of people who have those issues in romantic 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:46.480 relationships do that for some reason, like they want to 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:49.840 win you, and then they get you, and then it's 0:14:49.920 --> 0:14:53.160 like now they turn right and they play the game. Well, 0:14:53.200 --> 0:14:56.280 they're really good at courtship, you know, it's the big gesture. 0:14:56.480 --> 0:14:59.600 And everything happens too fast. You're moving in too fast, 0:14:59.600 --> 0:15:02.240 you're getting engaged too fast, you're getting married too fast. 0:15:02.480 --> 0:15:04.360 And in that way, they kind of trap you even more. 0:15:04.360 --> 0:15:08.040 Because narcissists are really controlling. Research shows they're more likely 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:10.960 to get a partner than a person who's less narcissistic 0:15:11.120 --> 0:15:13.280 because they are so successful so they make more money. 0:15:14.360 --> 0:15:18.720 But the person that falls for that seems like it 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:22.280 would be a person with really low self esteem. Maybe 0:15:22.480 --> 0:15:25.360 not necessarily. That's why it's strange. It's almost there's two 0:15:25.400 --> 0:15:28.080 groups it's what you're saying. It's people who are themselves 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:31.280 very insecure, who come from tough backgrounds, and who are 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:35.960 people pleasers. People pleasers are very vulnerable to narcissism. Where 0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:42.240 do they become people pleasers? But they fall for it 0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:44.240 because they want to fix and they run around in 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:46.920 circles and they keep giving that narcissist all the supply 0:15:47.040 --> 0:15:50.200 the narcissist. God. But isn't people pleasing part of just 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:53.600 wanting to be accepted in light? But why can't you 0:15:53.640 --> 0:15:56.640 just be enough without doing all the effort? When your 0:15:56.680 --> 0:15:59.160 people please, you're really are putting in an active effort, 0:15:59.160 --> 0:16:02.520 almost like I'm not good enough unless I'm doing something. Yeah, 0:16:03.400 --> 0:16:06.800 I might have a little bit of that hearing it 0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:09.080 like that is like I used to hear people please 0:16:09.160 --> 0:16:10.960 and be like, oh, that's not me. But then when 0:16:10.960 --> 0:16:13.160 it's like, oh no, like you want to help, it's 0:16:13.200 --> 0:16:15.840 more of like I'm here for you, it's more like 0:16:15.920 --> 0:16:19.000 about me, Like I feel like I'm not doing my part. 0:16:19.920 --> 0:16:21.760 But then why do you have to do a part? 0:16:22.040 --> 0:16:25.080 You see, a natural relationship is not that effortful. But 0:16:25.200 --> 0:16:28.360 a lot of people can, especially women, grow up believing 0:16:28.400 --> 0:16:31.000 they have to do to earn love because, believe it 0:16:31.080 --> 0:16:34.800 or not, people start seeing her from my cold dependence. 0:16:34.920 --> 0:16:37.920 That's what I'll take care of you in six weeks, 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:43.960 will be quick. Tomorrow's good. That's right. This ship, we're good. 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:47.840 But on the flip side. And this is what's so interesting. 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:51.080 People from really happy families fault for these folks because 0:16:51.080 --> 0:16:53.400 we want to think this really insecure people with low 0:16:53.440 --> 0:16:57.120 self esteem, people from really happy families actually believe love 0:16:57.200 --> 0:17:00.520 can cure everything. Let's forgive, let's your second chances. The 0:17:00.560 --> 0:17:02.680 worst thing you can do to a narcissist is forgive 0:17:02.720 --> 0:17:04.639 them and give them second chances because they're going to 0:17:04.760 --> 0:17:06.720 run with that and they're going to take your forgiveness 0:17:06.720 --> 0:17:10.560 and turn it into a weapon. So what happens to 0:17:10.680 --> 0:17:15.800 the person was in a relationship with a narcissist. People 0:17:15.840 --> 0:17:18.480 get stuck in these part of It's like an addiction. 0:17:18.880 --> 0:17:22.080 It's like chasing a high. I've got people ten years 0:17:22.160 --> 0:17:24.480 into a marriage, we're saying, I just want to go 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:26.520 back to that weekend in Miami. I said that weekend 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:28.160 Miami was ten years ago. I mean, I don't care 0:17:28.200 --> 0:17:32.160 how good the sex was, that was still one weekend. Okay, 0:17:32.440 --> 0:17:35.399 what narcissists are masterful at is as soon as they 0:17:35.480 --> 0:17:39.000 feel like their partners pulling away, it's love bombing Part two, 0:17:39.440 --> 0:17:41.400 Part three, and you see how it becomes an addiction. 0:17:41.600 --> 0:17:43.880 The other person in the relationship learns like, oh, if 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:47.320 I start pulling back, then they're gonna chase me, and 0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:50.840 that starts becoming a new dysfunctional cycle. But the big 0:17:50.920 --> 0:17:52.879 mistake that keeps people in is they think they can 0:17:52.960 --> 0:17:56.000 change the narcissist. Some people spend twenty years trying to 0:17:56.080 --> 0:17:58.840 change this person. I'm going to dress differently, I'm gonna 0:17:58.840 --> 0:18:01.000 lose weight, I'm going to make more money, I'm gonna 0:18:01.000 --> 0:18:03.640 pay more attention. I'm going to watch football. I'm going 0:18:03.720 --> 0:18:06.040 to have one kid. I'm gonna have five kids. And 0:18:06.160 --> 0:18:08.639 that's a lot of what keeps narcissists in business is 0:18:08.680 --> 0:18:12.119 we still believe in fairy tales. I really think someone's 0:18:12.160 --> 0:18:14.560 going to sweep in and make it all better. So 0:18:14.600 --> 0:18:18.160 are they usually cloaked in like some sob stories. Always 0:18:18.320 --> 0:18:21.840 a lot of narcissistic people have really rough back stories. 0:18:22.440 --> 0:18:24.520 They may have been neglected, they may have been abused, 0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:27.640 But here's the rub. It's not an excuse for abusing 0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:30.960 someone Now, that's never acceptable. And if somebody says the 0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:33.480 reason I'm like this with you, the reason I'm mean 0:18:33.600 --> 0:18:36.199 to you is because this was done to me, I 0:18:36.240 --> 0:18:38.119 tell the person who is being victimized by this, you 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:39.840 got to get out because you didn't do that to 0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:42.560 them in the first place. Abuse is never excusable. I 0:18:42.560 --> 0:18:45.040 don't care what a person's backstory is. So if you're 0:18:45.040 --> 0:18:49.840 in a relationship with a malignant narcissist, how the hell 0:18:49.880 --> 0:18:52.000 do you get it? It's not easy, it's actually scary, 0:18:52.080 --> 0:18:53.680 and it can be dangerous. Like I'm not going to 0:18:53.760 --> 0:18:56.520 sugarcoat this, okay, Please just find your power and walk 0:18:56.520 --> 0:19:01.720 out door. Because malignant narcissists do something we call coercive controls. 0:19:01.800 --> 0:19:04.520 It's like what you've seen in classical domestic abuse situations. 0:19:05.040 --> 0:19:08.359 They track a person's comings and goings. They know everyone 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:10.800 you talk to. They isolate you from the people you love. 0:19:11.080 --> 0:19:12.760 You don't feel like you have a safe place to 0:19:12.800 --> 0:19:15.440 go to anymore. There's often financial abuse. People in these 0:19:15.480 --> 0:19:18.560 relationships will sometimes give up their careers because they've become 0:19:18.600 --> 0:19:21.960 so isolated and they're faking it to the world. Many times, 0:19:22.000 --> 0:19:24.240 other people don't know how bad it is. Now In 0:19:24.320 --> 0:19:26.760 the worst of these cases, it gets very dangerous. There's 0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:29.520 a need for restraining orders, and sometimes these stories do 0:19:29.720 --> 0:19:33.080 end tragically. There's no minimizing this. I have worked with 0:19:33.119 --> 0:19:35.720 women who it takes us four or five years to 0:19:35.720 --> 0:19:38.040 get them out, and there's no clock on this. So 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:41.000 it's because of the mental and emotional attachment. It is, 0:19:41.040 --> 0:19:45.000 it's it's but it's mental and mental control. Somebody literally 0:19:45.080 --> 0:19:48.360 running you like a puppet and so and then sometimes 0:19:48.400 --> 0:19:51.320 people leave and it's terrifying. There they are years in 0:19:51.400 --> 0:19:54.680 court dealing with horrific custody battles because many times the 0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:57.240 narcissists doesn't actually really want the kid. They want to 0:19:57.240 --> 0:20:00.880 stick it to their acts, and that narcissist parent may 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:04.359 turn those kids against their healthy parents. That's not unusual either. 0:20:04.720 --> 0:20:08.840 So the fallout from this is huge. I get that. 0:20:08.960 --> 0:20:12.160 I think we have so much judgment when we see 0:20:12.200 --> 0:20:17.160 people in certain kinds of entanglements and not really understanding 0:20:18.320 --> 0:20:24.280 it's all about about you know, that's danger of it. Also, 0:20:24.400 --> 0:20:27.240 it's have a I would think it's have a package it. 0:20:28.040 --> 0:20:31.320 You're gonna be with me, I'm gonna take care of you. 0:20:31.320 --> 0:20:35.600 You don't have to work, you know, you just enjoy 0:20:35.760 --> 0:20:38.120 your life and you don't need those friends over there. 0:20:38.160 --> 0:20:40.040 They you don't need they bringing you down. And always 0:20:40.040 --> 0:20:43.400 wait for the ultimate narcissistic love sentence. No one's ever 0:20:43.440 --> 0:20:45.320 going to love you the way I love you. I 0:20:45.359 --> 0:20:51.560 do that is that's like wearing a malignant narcissisting stuff. 0:20:51.840 --> 0:20:53.600 Get out, like go to the bathroom during the day, 0:20:53.960 --> 0:20:56.680 and why the window out the bathroom, like you need 0:20:56.720 --> 0:20:59.520 to get out, like one is gonna love you like 0:21:00.440 --> 0:21:06.919 But yet some people think that's romantic. I'm so, and 0:21:06.920 --> 0:21:11.360 they are considered love songs, not psychopathology songs. Right, it's 0:21:11.520 --> 0:21:15.399 really really dark that song Every move you made, every 0:21:15.400 --> 0:21:23.919 breath you take. I'll be watching that'scissist a whole playlist 0:21:24.520 --> 0:21:26.919 because it's really scary. But keep in mind to what 0:21:27.000 --> 0:21:29.800 malignant narcissists and all narcissist due to their partners they 0:21:29.800 --> 0:21:32.639 confuse them. They do something called gas lighting, and gaslighters 0:21:32.680 --> 0:21:35.560 when you doubt someone's reality. Okay, because people say that 0:21:35.600 --> 0:21:38.879 a lot, and I wasn't quite sure what that meant either, 0:21:39.320 --> 0:21:42.160 you're being too sensitive as a classic example of gas lighting, 0:21:42.480 --> 0:21:46.880 because you are actually denying someone's emotions that never happened. 0:21:47.280 --> 0:21:52.400 I never said that you're crazy, you're the narcissist. That's 0:21:52.400 --> 0:21:54.720 all gas light. It's like being an occult. It's like 0:21:54.760 --> 0:21:56.480 living with a bunch of mirrors, but none of them 0:21:56.520 --> 0:21:58.879 show your own reflection. That's what it's like to be 0:21:58.960 --> 0:22:02.800 a narcissistic when wow, oh my god, that's so scared 0:22:02.880 --> 0:22:05.879 that they overtake their minds and the person is so 0:22:05.920 --> 0:22:07.880 confused that it gets to be too hard to leave. 0:22:07.880 --> 0:22:11.320 They actually believe they're a bad person. They're too sensitive, 0:22:11.520 --> 0:22:14.920