1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:05,720 Speaker 1: Welcome back to Behind the Bastards in our Spooky Week 2 00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:10,320 Speaker 1: Halloween podcast edition. Uh. This week, in addition to talking 3 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:14,239 Speaker 1: about a very spooky episode, we are based and Paul F. 4 00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:21,759 Speaker 1: Tompkins pilled. Paul, thanks for taking my pill. You do 5 00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 1: offer a lot of pills. It sucks because there's like 6 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 1: there's two hands, there's there's two pills, and then I 7 00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: come in with my pill and I'm like, can I 8 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: stick my hand in there and hopefully somebody will pick it? Yeah? Paul, Paul, Paul, Paul, Paul, 9 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 1: how are you doing well? You know? I after our 10 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: part one, I really had to take uh an industrial shower, 11 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:59,520 Speaker 1: um and just really think about we're humans a mistake? Um. 12 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 1: And so I've gotten I've just done a lot of thinking, 13 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 1: a lot of soul searching, and I think I've come 14 00:01:04,600 --> 00:01:09,600 Speaker 1: around to feel that people are are, you know, basically 15 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: good and I'm ready with that attitude to go into 16 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 1: part two. Wow. That is brave, Yeah, heroic even Oh boys, 17 00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 1: do you well? He killed Santa? He did murder Santa 18 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:32,720 Speaker 1: Claus got out of my mind. He did. He did 19 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 1: kill the living embodiment of childhood wonderment. He killed Santa 20 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:41,680 Speaker 1: because he was jealous that the kids he was molested with, 21 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:45,480 Speaker 1: like Santa, they liked an idea of a person and 22 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 1: he couldn't take it. That is like I think if 23 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 1: you were to explain that somehow to Hitler, like pre 24 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 1: losing his mind, Hitler hit would be like, well that's 25 00:01:55,840 --> 00:02:00,360 Speaker 1: a bit much like that's that's a bit far. Can there. 26 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:04,440 Speaker 1: I didn't even think about that. Oh boy, maybe maybe 27 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:09,520 Speaker 1: I'll try painting again. Yeah, back to painting. So by 28 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:12,280 Speaker 1: the time Pinochet had solidified his grip on power in 29 00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 1: the mid nineteen seventies, Colonia Dignidad was almost a state 30 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:18,760 Speaker 1: within a state. They had built a power plant, a 31 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:22,919 Speaker 1: television station, and two air strips to transport the timber, wheat, corn, 32 00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:26,639 Speaker 1: and brotworst the community produced. Since fucking was more or 33 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:30,320 Speaker 1: less for boating the workforce, Paul Shaffer needed to accomplish all. 34 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 1: This was built up through a novel method, abducting children 35 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 1: who went to his hospital. So like He's like, okay, kids, 36 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,360 Speaker 1: kids have to come here. Yeah, they have to they 37 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: need to go to the hospital. Their kids. I mean, 38 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 1: I'm kind of the king, so I guess, uh, I 39 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:52,800 Speaker 1: can make these kids do whatever I want. I can 40 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:55,600 Speaker 1: make it disappear. Um, let's try it and see how 41 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: it goes. Let's try and see how it goes. I 42 00:02:57,160 --> 00:03:00,160 Speaker 1: need someone to build my airstrip, he seems are you 43 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:02,200 Speaker 1: willing to say, you know what, this is nuts? But 44 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 1: if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. But if that is, 45 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:09,079 Speaker 1: you've hit upon, Paul, one of the common through lines 46 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 1: that all of our most dangerous bastards have. You can 47 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:13,920 Speaker 1: draw this to guys like Donald Trump. Guys like hit 48 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:16,760 Speaker 1: there A big part of their whole emo is just 49 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: like what if I can get away with this? Yeah, 50 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:21,080 Speaker 1: let me give it a shot. Yeah, let me give 51 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:24,960 Speaker 1: it a shot. You know I probably can't. Yeah, probably can't. 52 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:27,160 Speaker 1: And if I if I can't, then I'll say like, hey, 53 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:30,440 Speaker 1: I tried it. Yeah, but if I do, if I 54 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 1: do get away with this, I meaning the thing is, 55 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 1: it's living your life that way is incredible advice for 56 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:43,440 Speaker 1: like a career like it. It is like if you 57 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 1: if you're creative or something like, oh, you think you 58 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:47,240 Speaker 1: might want to write and give it a shot? Do it? 59 00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: You know, Um, you want to do stand up? Go 60 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 1: out there and do some stand up, you know, um, 61 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 1: you know you think you're good enough to be in 62 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 1: professional sports, well fucking try you know, see if you can, 63 00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:59,480 Speaker 1: like um in like in personal lives like oh okay, 64 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:01,720 Speaker 1: well you think you're into that person, go up and 65 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 1: ask him out, you know. Um Like, it's not bad 66 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: life advice, it's just these kind of people take it 67 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:11,120 Speaker 1: to the extent of Like, I bet I could build 68 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 1: my own power plan to have a totally self sufficient 69 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: torture commune in the middle of Chile that I keep 70 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: manned by abducting children at the hospital operate. There's no 71 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:22,799 Speaker 1: tryouts for cults, you know what I mean. You can't 72 00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:25,160 Speaker 1: go audition to be a cult leader. That's a thing. 73 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 1: There's no internship programs exactly. And I feel like I 74 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: feel like, once you get the cult formed, then the 75 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:36,559 Speaker 1: sky's the limit. Really yeah yeah, once you get it going, 76 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:38,839 Speaker 1: it builds inertia. You know, these people, if these people 77 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:42,279 Speaker 1: are gonna listen to me this far, there's let's see 78 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 1: what this baby could do. Yeah, let's let's let's get 79 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:50,640 Speaker 1: this thing on the fucking highway, you know. Absolutely so. 80 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,480 Speaker 1: The Colonial Hospital was absolutely essential to thousands of people 81 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 1: in the working area, and since it received government funding, 82 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:59,159 Speaker 1: the state had no interest in providing people with a 83 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:02,360 Speaker 1: second option. As a result, when young boys were admitted 84 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: for health problems and caught Shafer's eye, they were simply 85 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:09,720 Speaker 1: taken from their families. If said families who were very 86 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:13,400 Speaker 1: generally impoverished villagers complained safe would be like, well, you 87 00:05:13,520 --> 00:05:15,480 Speaker 1: got other kids, right, do you want them to have 88 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:18,360 Speaker 1: medical care? And again, one of the things that's fun 89 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:21,600 Speaker 1: like this is fucked up for a thousand reasons. This 90 00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:25,240 Speaker 1: is an oarriborous fund up. Inness. I learned about this 91 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 1: particular aspect of the cult from a harrowing interview in 92 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 1: that Netflix documentary series about the Colonia, and the boy 93 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:35,599 Speaker 1: relating this story says, I would have died from the 94 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 1: health issue that brought me to the hospital. They saved 95 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 1: my life and then abduct me so I could be 96 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:47,559 Speaker 1: molested for years. Like damn, it's fucking something else, Paul, Wow, 97 00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 1: it reminds me of something I once heard, um uh 98 00:05:53,560 --> 00:05:58,279 Speaker 1: someone saying in an interview, UM, you know, I don't 99 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 1: remember how they got to this in the conver station, 100 00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 1: but this person was saying, yeah, it would have been 101 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:05,680 Speaker 1: I think it would have been okay if I had 102 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 1: never been born. Like, considering how my life has gone 103 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: and the pain that's been in it. Like if I've 104 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:12,600 Speaker 1: never been born at all, that might have been better, 105 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 1: and I that never left my mind, Like that way 106 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: is extremely profound. And to save a child's life for that, Like, 107 00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 1: how does that not I don't know how those things 108 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 1: happening to you. Like it's bad enough to just be molested, 109 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 1: but to have been brought from the brink of death 110 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:37,240 Speaker 1: in order to be molested, the cycle, the psychological damage 111 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 1: that that does. I don't know how you're not thinking 112 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:41,840 Speaker 1: of that every moment of the day for the rest 113 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 1: of your life. Yeah, Like just getting up in the 114 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 1: morning with that in your background requires a tremendous amount 115 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:51,840 Speaker 1: of just like because we all know everybody says like 116 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:55,719 Speaker 1: the universe is unfair, but usually you're saying that from 117 00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 1: like your home with air conditioning and heating and like 118 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:05,039 Speaker 1: like fully fat and stuff like that's um somebody who 119 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 1: knows intimately, Yeah, it's real unfair, Like it is a 120 00:07:08,720 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: fucked up roll of some bad dice. Um, So good 121 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 1: for that person for being I mean, whatever else happened 122 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 1: in their life, they were like they had processed it 123 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:24,000 Speaker 1: enough to sit down to net with Netflix and like 124 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:27,000 Speaker 1: explain what happened to them. So I got nothing but 125 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:35,800 Speaker 1: respect for anybody who survives that. Um incomprehensible good lord. UM. 126 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 1: So any locals who might feel inclined to complain about 127 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:41,560 Speaker 1: the situation at this point are not just running up 128 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:44,480 Speaker 1: against the fact that this is their only hospital in 129 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 1: the area and whatnot. These people have money, um, but 130 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 1: the fact that Paul Schaefer now has the direct support 131 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 1: of the unquestioned dictator of the entire country. He doesn't 132 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:56,440 Speaker 1: just have people on the right wing who like him. 133 00:07:56,480 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 1: Now the guy running the country is his personal like possession. 134 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:06,320 Speaker 1: Augusto Pinochet is his homeboy. For his part, the general 135 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 1: allowed the colonial to import and export without paying taxes. 136 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 1: Some of these benefits Schaefer extended to local farmers, so 137 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:16,200 Speaker 1: Pinochet's like, hey, you don't got to worry about taxes, import, export, 138 00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 1: whatever you want. You got your own airstrips. You don't 139 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:20,120 Speaker 1: have to worry about customs duties. And one of the 140 00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 1: ways Schaefer builds local support is he goes to these 141 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 1: farmers in the area, kind of like the big local 142 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:27,160 Speaker 1: like the Chileans in the area who have influence, and 143 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 1: he's like, hey, you're gonna be able to sell your 144 00:08:29,160 --> 00:08:32,280 Speaker 1: ship for without customs duties. I'll achieuse my airport for free. 145 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:35,559 Speaker 1: But if anything happens, you got my back, you know, 146 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:40,959 Speaker 1: He's I'm not saying anything is going to happen, and 147 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:42,679 Speaker 1: I'm not going to say what types of things are 148 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 1: going to happen, but if anything happens, I mean it's 149 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: really this really does, like you know, it really plays 150 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 1: on how grateful are these people to have free, free healthcare, 151 00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 1: free healthcare where it's like you may hear that I'm 152 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:01,720 Speaker 1: a child Bill Lester, Like, yeah, you may hear that 153 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:05,199 Speaker 1: I have been operating a child molestation engine at an 154 00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: unfathomable scale, but but yeah you're not. When your daughter 155 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:19,360 Speaker 1: broker leg that ship was free, um yeah, it's it's wild. 156 00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 1: And these these local farmers who he's he gets you 157 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: know in bedwidth kind of not literally. Um, some of 158 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 1: these like these guys will defend him when like foreign 159 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:31,599 Speaker 1: journalists will come in to try to investigate what the 160 00:09:31,640 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: fox going on here, and they've got his back, like 161 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 1: it's a very hostile place to be looking into the colonial. 162 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 1: So Schaefer becomes the total like almost god to his followers. 163 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: They called him our eternal uncle, which make a creepy 164 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:52,760 Speaker 1: uncle joke here, but we shan't um I mean, is 165 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 1: this where they started re turnal uncle? I might have 166 00:09:57,640 --> 00:10:00,319 Speaker 1: some notes. They also called him the Supreme Lead, which 167 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:04,480 Speaker 1: is a little more traditional um. Daily prayer meetings served 168 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:07,120 Speaker 1: as a way for Shaeffer to institute strict groupthink and 169 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,360 Speaker 1: destroy any bonds besides the bond between him and his flock. 170 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:13,880 Speaker 1: He repeatedly forced his followers to repeat a definition of 171 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:16,400 Speaker 1: the word family that he said he'd found in the Bible. 172 00:10:16,679 --> 00:10:18,840 Speaker 1: He would ask who are my mother and father, and 173 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:24,040 Speaker 1: his congregation would respond those that do the work of God. Okay, 174 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:28,000 Speaker 1: So at this point there is still some sort of 175 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:32,520 Speaker 1: um uh Christianity aspect to this. Yeah, there always is. 176 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:36,720 Speaker 1: There always is. They're having services and you know, doing 177 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:38,960 Speaker 1: that sort of thing. But really it's all about him. 178 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:44,160 Speaker 1: It's all about him. It's Christianity has filtered through this pedophile. 179 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:48,520 Speaker 1: He's the instrument of God for them, but essentially he 180 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:52,679 Speaker 1: is their God. Yeah, it's like somebody distilled the Catholic 181 00:10:52,760 --> 00:11:02,199 Speaker 1: Church into a into a hard liquor. So the process 182 00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:05,480 Speaker 1: of having his followers confess their sins was formalized in 183 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:09,520 Speaker 1: a practice he called sealless sourgs, I'm not I don't 184 00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: speak German, which apparently means care of the soul. Confessions 185 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:16,000 Speaker 1: were supposed to happen as close to the moment of 186 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 1: the sin as possible, but Shaffer would also require his 187 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:21,080 Speaker 1: followers to meet with him and each other in small 188 00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 1: groups repeatedly throughout the day in order to give confession. 189 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:27,600 Speaker 1: Public confessions and mass were held at lunch and dinner. 190 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:30,560 Speaker 1: Members of the community would be expected to write the 191 00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:33,800 Speaker 1: names of sinners themselves and people they'd seen sin on 192 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 1: a blackboard near the entrance to the cafeteria. When everyone 193 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:40,079 Speaker 1: sat down, Schaeffer would read the names listed on the board. 194 00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: While everyone ate, every sinner was required to stand up 195 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:47,280 Speaker 1: and confess their sins. You were not allowed to deny sinning. 196 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 1: So if somebody else just writes your name and you 197 00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: don't know what the funk they're talking about, you have 198 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:53,560 Speaker 1: to come up with something like you have to like 199 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 1: you have to. Yeah. That reminds me of confession when 200 00:11:56,520 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 1: I was a kid, and like what had I done? Yeah? 201 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:03,199 Speaker 1: And so you know, going in, but you had to 202 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 1: go every week, and so sometimes you just make stuff up, um, 203 00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:09,680 Speaker 1: like mild things like I took the lord's name in vain, 204 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 1: or I disrespected my father or whatever, because you can't 205 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 1: just it just seemed without being told, you knew. I 206 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 1: can't just go in there and say I'm great. You 207 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: know that I kept it a hundred this week. You 208 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 1: had to. You had to come up with something you 209 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:26,760 Speaker 1: can't walk into confessionally like you know what, I NA 210 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 1: I'm nailing it right now, bro. Great. No, it's just 211 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:38,120 Speaker 1: so it's also so weird because it is like, I mean, 212 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:40,360 Speaker 1: as a kid, I remember being terrified of like minor 213 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:42,560 Speaker 1: sins that was going to go to hell. Course, yeah, 214 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 1: like some some stupid bullshit like um. But as an adult, 215 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,440 Speaker 1: it's like, dude's god, he's got other ship going, Like 216 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:53,560 Speaker 1: there's a lot happening right now. Like it's like walking 217 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 1: in on a guy as he's like watching a genocide 218 00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 1: occur and being like, you know what, man, I was 219 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:06,440 Speaker 1: lusting a little of it earlier today. Yeah, let me 220 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 1: make a note of that. Oh sorry, one second, they're 221 00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:12,080 Speaker 1: shooting the children again. I'm in seventh grade and I 222 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:15,600 Speaker 1: saw a bra strap and I got excited. Is that? 223 00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:18,120 Speaker 1: Did you have time for that? Right now? Yeah? You 224 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:19,920 Speaker 1: know what I was? I was paying attention to some 225 00:13:19,960 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 1: stuff in Bosnia. But let me just drop all that 226 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 1: right now, focus on this and I'll tell you what 227 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: I'm going to do, the same thing for both. Yeah, 228 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:40,200 Speaker 1: what an easy gig. Rwanda Genet's side and cheated on 229 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 1: a math test. Same, it requires the same thing from me. 230 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 1: Consider them taken care of. I made a note of it. 231 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 1: It's very funny. So what's not funny is all of this. 232 00:13:57,320 --> 00:14:01,320 Speaker 1: So yeah, every but he's got to like come up 233 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: with something to confess. And on Sundays, everybody's got to 234 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:07,000 Speaker 1: go next to a Schaeffer's house to confess yet again 235 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:09,199 Speaker 1: and pray for forgiveness. And they're spending all of their 236 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 1: time that's not working confessing basically. Now again, they're supposed 237 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:15,760 Speaker 1: to make a confession in the moment when they sin, 238 00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:17,960 Speaker 1: and Shaffer is not always going to be available for everybody. 239 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: There's hundreds of people on the compound. He's a busy man, 240 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: got a lot of crimes against humanity to commit. So 241 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:25,960 Speaker 1: if a sin occurs outside of one of those regular meetings, 242 00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 1: followers were expected to confess to the nearest fellow resident, 243 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:32,520 Speaker 1: who was expected to inform Schaefer of the sin. Immediately. 244 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:36,000 Speaker 1: This led to a thriving economy in betrayal because people 245 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 1: who came to Schaffer to inform him of the unreported 246 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:41,960 Speaker 1: sins of other residents were rewarded by having their own 247 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,640 Speaker 1: sins forgiven without punishment. So if you tell a Shaffer 248 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:46,560 Speaker 1: about something bad someone else did that they didn't tell 249 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:49,120 Speaker 1: him about, you get a free forgiveness. You don't have 250 00:14:49,160 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 1: to because there's punishments, right, you don't have to take 251 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:57,640 Speaker 1: the punishment. God, I know it's pretty bad. This is 252 00:14:57,680 --> 00:14:59,880 Speaker 1: like one of those things where it really really to 253 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 1: depends on nobody talking to each other. Yes, well, if 254 00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: two people talk, that's the devil exactly. Punishments for sins 255 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 1: ran the gamut from restrictions on food, extra hard labor, 256 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 1: or simply being berated in front of the group to 257 00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 1: being electrocuted with cattle prods and forced to take tranquilizers. 258 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 1: Some laborers, including children, were force fed tranquilizers and then 259 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 1: made to work industrial jobs with heavy machinery, like operating 260 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: wood saws at the mill, which is I don't know 261 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:32,000 Speaker 1: if you know much about saws that are the size 262 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,280 Speaker 1: of cars, but you shouldn't be on pills when you operate. 263 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: A lot of people say that, um, and so people 264 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:48,080 Speaker 1: get injured and dismembered all the time. Now we talk 265 00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 1: about this a lot, and I hope I think my 266 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 1: regular listeners probably don't labor under this misapprehension, But a 267 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:55,200 Speaker 1: lot of people do have the idea that like folks 268 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,040 Speaker 1: who wind up stuck in this situation or have some 269 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: sort of like they're they're dumb or they're week, there's 270 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:03,160 Speaker 1: something some flaw in them that allowed them to become 271 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:05,680 Speaker 1: dominated in this way. And first of all, I think 272 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 1: that's kind of victim blaming, But second I think it 273 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 1: misses number one. These aren't dumb people. They have their 274 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:15,400 Speaker 1: own power plant, like that if they built and operate themselves. 275 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 1: They have their own airstrips and like manage air travel 276 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:21,360 Speaker 1: and like yeah, like they know what they're there's These 277 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 1: are very intelligent, motivated people who are completely dominated by 278 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:29,840 Speaker 1: this guy. And in order to explain how that can happen, 279 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 1: I want to read a quote from Bruce Falconer in 280 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:34,080 Speaker 1: The American Scholar. He eats a really good job of 281 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:37,800 Speaker 1: laying this out. In Santiago in early two thousand and six, 282 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 1: I spoke with Dr Neils Biderman, a Chilean psychiatrist who, 283 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:44,000 Speaker 1: in association with the German embassy, had been making monthly 284 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 1: trips to Colonia Dignidad to study the psychology of its inhabitants. 285 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:51,360 Speaker 1: This is after Shaffer is gone. He offered observations from 286 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 1: his work. Everything was done to further the religion. He explained, 287 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 1: like in any sect, the colonos, that's the members of 288 00:16:56,920 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: the colony. The colony had a spiritual leader in Pulse Schaeffer, 289 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 1: to whom they formed a very strong attachment. There was 290 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:05,960 Speaker 1: a complex network of emotional connections in the colonia. It 291 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:08,640 Speaker 1: was not a concentration camp system in which prisoners tend 292 00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:11,240 Speaker 1: to think of themselves as individuals. It was a community, 293 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:14,479 Speaker 1: and the children suffered most of all. The pilgrims may 294 00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: have come to Chile for their religion, but once they 295 00:17:16,600 --> 00:17:19,200 Speaker 1: were there they became prey to a brutal and relentless 296 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,720 Speaker 1: cult of personality. The older colonos punished the younger ones 297 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:25,639 Speaker 1: under orders from Schaefer. Piederman continued, they were also the 298 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:28,359 Speaker 1: ones who were supposed to educate them. This involved keeping 299 00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 1: them away from their families, keeping them active all day, 300 00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:33,760 Speaker 1: and principally keeping them obedient and disciplined. They did whatever 301 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:38,119 Speaker 1: they needed to do, including psychopharmacology and electric shock. Over time, 302 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,960 Speaker 1: physical coercion became less necessary as the social system became 303 00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:44,960 Speaker 1: rooted in the psyche of the individual. So a lot 304 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:47,920 Speaker 1: of this torture is frontloaded. It's like an attack dose 305 00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:51,200 Speaker 1: of a drug in order to like, you don't have 306 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 1: to after a certain point, everyone is so inundated by 307 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:59,000 Speaker 1: this system that there's not resistance, There aren't kinks in it. 308 00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:04,719 Speaker 1: For most people, it works like again, I mean, this 309 00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:06,640 Speaker 1: is the thing is that I'm I'm as guilty as 310 00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:10,199 Speaker 1: anyone of of victim blaming people in cults because I 311 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 1: think your mind, of course, you go right away to 312 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:14,920 Speaker 1: what if it were me, and well that wouldn't happen 313 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:16,960 Speaker 1: to me, and blah blah bla blah, I wouldn't do this. Yeah. 314 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:20,959 Speaker 1: But it's like the the the way these work is 315 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:26,120 Speaker 1: because these people are these hideous geniuses who have figured 316 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:29,160 Speaker 1: this out. Sometimes it's simpler than other times. Sometimes it's 317 00:18:29,160 --> 00:18:32,000 Speaker 1: like they just know that it's if I just reinforce 318 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:34,080 Speaker 1: this thing over and over again that will wear people 319 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:36,920 Speaker 1: down and gets into their brains. But sometimes a guy 320 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:41,679 Speaker 1: like this comes along where it's like the the the 321 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,400 Speaker 1: way he has he has foreseen and forestalled every opposition 322 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:52,920 Speaker 1: to to uh to the programming is terrifying. Yeah yeah, yeah, 323 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:57,159 Speaker 1: And he's very um, he's he's just good at it. 324 00:18:57,240 --> 00:19:02,120 Speaker 1: And and that's the thing. It's these people don't think 325 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,440 Speaker 1: of it when they're asked to do something when they're 326 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 1: working these hours, when they're when they're they're being separated 327 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:08,639 Speaker 1: from like their kids. They're not thinking of it as 328 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:11,359 Speaker 1: a as a punishment. They're not thinking of it as 329 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:13,280 Speaker 1: this is what Shaffer is doing to me. They're thinking 330 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:17,680 Speaker 1: about this is what I am doing for the community. 331 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:21,560 Speaker 1: And people will by and large do pretty much anything 332 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 1: for their community, um, if they have one. If they don't, um, 333 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 1: I don't know. See the United States of America. So 334 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:35,639 Speaker 1: Schaffer came to consider sexual intercourse a tool of the devil. 335 00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: As we have already discussed, the problem with this is 336 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,280 Speaker 1: that people fuck. I don't know if you're aware of this, Paul, 337 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:44,639 Speaker 1: but they share? Do they share? Do? I'm not ashamed 338 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 1: to admit it myself. Wow. Wow, that's podcast history here. 339 00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 1: Tmzs front page isolate that use it as a drop. Yeah. Um, 340 00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 1: so matter what restrictions you try to put on it. 341 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:04,680 Speaker 1: People are not going to not fall in love, even 342 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:08,200 Speaker 1: if you completely separate men from women. Uh, they're they're 343 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:12,199 Speaker 1: gonna find a way, like life finds a way, you know, 344 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 1: as as as a mathematician once said, Obviously, Paul Shaffer 345 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:21,040 Speaker 1: tried to stop this. He punished men and women who 346 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: are caught together viciously. Entire an entire family would be 347 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:26,359 Speaker 1: shunned if their daughter had like a kiss with a boy, 348 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:30,120 Speaker 1: like your whole family is in is in trouble if 349 00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: that kind of stuff happens. Um But still people found 350 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:36,399 Speaker 1: ways to do it, and there was also a situation. 351 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 1: There were also situations in which Paul had to allow it. 352 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:43,160 Speaker 1: This increasingly becomes a thing the longer the colonia gets. 353 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:46,359 Speaker 1: He can't stop everybody from doing this because he needs 354 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:48,160 Speaker 1: a lot of these people. There are men and women 355 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:50,800 Speaker 1: in the colonia who, though loyal to him, are too 356 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:56,000 Speaker 1: valuable to control totally. There's doctors and nurses. Everything rides 357 00:20:56,040 --> 00:20:59,480 Speaker 1: on these people, these skilled professionals, and they do have 358 00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: like if you are an m d. You can leave 359 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:04,960 Speaker 1: and find something else to do, you know, like you 360 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:07,159 Speaker 1: don't you don't have to do this ship. Um, you 361 00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 1: have a lot more leverage than other people. UM. And 362 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 1: so in order to stop there for being kind of 363 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,040 Speaker 1: a power struggle with these folks, Schaefer would allow some 364 00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:19,199 Speaker 1: of these people to marry if they asked. Now, some 365 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:21,600 Speaker 1: of them, like the guy we talked about Hop who's 366 00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:24,160 Speaker 1: like the head doctor, he gets pretty much to live 367 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:27,040 Speaker 1: a normal life broadly, Like he's at the top of 368 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 1: this colt too. He's not molesting kids, I don't think, 369 00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:32,600 Speaker 1: but he he's kind of co leading things. He has 370 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 1: a lot of autonomy. Um. Other people generally had less. 371 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:38,440 Speaker 1: But of these people who are kind of more privileged, 372 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:40,919 Speaker 1: they could go to Shaffer. You couldn't say I'm in 373 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:43,560 Speaker 1: love with this person and I want to marry them, 374 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:45,840 Speaker 1: but you could say I I think God wants me 375 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:50,000 Speaker 1: to marry right, um, and they would go to Shaffer. 376 00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:52,160 Speaker 1: They would say this, and it would Shaffer's job. Then, 377 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,199 Speaker 1: if this was some of that, he was decided to 378 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:56,760 Speaker 1: let Mary to pick the person that they were going 379 00:21:56,800 --> 00:22:01,560 Speaker 1: to marry. UM. Now, maybe some times people he picked 380 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:03,520 Speaker 1: people that they wanted to marry as a general rule, 381 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:06,640 Speaker 1: though he used this as a situation to exert more control. 382 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:10,280 Speaker 1: Bruce Falconer describes it as a kind of sexual roulette 383 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:12,200 Speaker 1: where you were just sort of hoping that he would 384 00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 1: pick someone you actually wanted to be with. Um. But 385 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,680 Speaker 1: the way Schaefer usually did it again, unless someone was 386 00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:21,359 Speaker 1: high important enough that he couldn't funk with him, he 387 00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 1: would pick a woman that you couldn't possibly have a 388 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:26,760 Speaker 1: child with, right like. That was a big part of it, 389 00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:28,880 Speaker 1: because he doesn't want people having families. He doesn't want 390 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:33,159 Speaker 1: people having kids. How he's determined that, well, it's easy 391 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: if if the woman's been through menopause, you're not. Because 392 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:37,920 Speaker 1: so if some twenty year old who's got like a 393 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:39,960 Speaker 1: valuable skills, like I want to get married, he's like, 394 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:42,880 Speaker 1: here married this sixty five year old woman, Like that's 395 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: your wife now, right like, so it's this um. The 396 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:52,040 Speaker 1: strategy was effective. Only sixty or so children were born 397 00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 1: during the entire span Schaefer ran Colonia Dignidad, which was 398 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:58,480 Speaker 1: more than thirty years and again a couple hundreds of 399 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:02,480 Speaker 1: three hundreds something people here between nineteen and nineteen eighty nine, 400 00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:06,720 Speaker 1: no children were born there at all. So this is 401 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:11,560 Speaker 1: an extremely successful control regime. He has a lot of 402 00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:15,719 Speaker 1: control here, what I mean, like, what if he had 403 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:20,400 Speaker 1: thought about making a car that ran on water. Yeah, 404 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 1: you do have to think about, like, what could this 405 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 1: man have done? How many diseases could have been eradicated? Yeah, yeah, uh, 406 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:34,359 Speaker 1: the the amount of human ingenuity we would be doing 407 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,400 Speaker 1: Star trek ship. Now if every one of these guys 408 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:40,680 Speaker 1: and there's we we talk our our business is talking 409 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:42,359 Speaker 1: about these guys, every one of these guys with this 410 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:46,919 Speaker 1: level of dedication, had instead been like, yeah, fusion seems 411 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:52,000 Speaker 1: like a good idea, even even just like the head 412 00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:54,359 Speaker 1: of the department, you know, yeah, not even like that 413 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 1: as a scientist, just to organize it, yes, and to 414 00:23:57,040 --> 00:24:01,399 Speaker 1: motivate people exactly. Yeah. If Don Trump had dedicated every 415 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,120 Speaker 1: aspect of his charisma to feeding the poor, we would 416 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:06,040 Speaker 1: have a lot less starving poor people in the world 417 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: because he's good at motivating a certain subjective people. Um. 418 00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:15,120 Speaker 1: I remember thinking that if he had when when COVID 419 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 1: hit us, and if he had said, you know, we're 420 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 1: gonna John Wayne this and we're gonna do it better 421 00:24:20,280 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 1: than anybody. This thing faster, like but no, it's not real. 422 00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:27,879 Speaker 1: It's gonna be over soon. Yep, No, it's but no, 423 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:32,240 Speaker 1: chug your bleach. Yeah, you know who else wants you 424 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:36,360 Speaker 1: to drink bleach. Paul, know who the products and services 425 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:40,240 Speaker 1: are not? Are we not sponsored by Clorox anymore so? 426 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 1: They we're not. We're not sponsored by Claros anymore over. Well, 427 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:48,200 Speaker 1: you know, Paul, have I told you about my my 428 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:50,439 Speaker 1: my signature cocktail. Paul, I said, you're drinking out of 429 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,879 Speaker 1: a very fancy goblet here, and I wanted to I 430 00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 1: would love to hear about shore. It's called high ball. 431 00:24:57,680 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 1: Now here's what you do, Paul. You get a pint 432 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:01,760 Speaker 1: glass and you fill that eight percent of the way 433 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:06,320 Speaker 1: up with pure sparkling four oh nine, and then just 434 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: a drop of bleach. You want to keep a bottle 435 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 1: of vermouth nearby, open it up, don't pour it in, 436 00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:14,240 Speaker 1: just have it nearby, kind of like a good martini, 437 00:25:15,119 --> 00:25:16,919 Speaker 1: and then you chug that whole thing as fast as 438 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:19,399 Speaker 1: you can. That's high ball. And let me tell you, 439 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:22,439 Speaker 1: at the end of a long day, it's just what 440 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 1: it's just what you need. If I don't, if I 441 00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:30,639 Speaker 1: don't have four oh nine, is fantastic and acceptable substitute. Well, Paul, 442 00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:33,679 Speaker 1: that's that's You don't know this, but that's actually very 443 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:37,720 Speaker 1: offensive to my to my culture. I'm very sorry. You 444 00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 1: apologize now if you want to. I don't know. I 445 00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:46,199 Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know what to drink names all right, 446 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:51,800 Speaker 1: well you can tell one of us is a professional improviser. 447 00:25:55,680 --> 00:26:05,600 Speaker 1: Oh man, um, let's go to Savad. We're back and Paul, 448 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:10,199 Speaker 1: you mentioned a specific cleaning product that often comes, you know, 449 00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:12,680 Speaker 1: the giant jugs that like those kind of like the 450 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 1: like if you if you if you go to like 451 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:17,000 Speaker 1: a Mexican market, you get like the big cleaning supplies 452 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:19,840 Speaker 1: in the huge that are like purple and stuff. I 453 00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:23,119 Speaker 1: think Fantastico is one. When I was in Baja a 454 00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:25,400 Speaker 1: few years ago, I was living with our friend David Bell, 455 00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:29,440 Speaker 1: who who is rights for Cody Johnson's Outfit and does 456 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,399 Speaker 1: his own podcasts then a guest on the show. I 457 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:37,520 Speaker 1: found something called mes colito, which is a horrible It's 458 00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:42,439 Speaker 1: like mescal flavoring in sugar and liquor, and it's this 459 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 1: color of yellow that looks radioactive and it's sold in 460 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:49,680 Speaker 1: the same bottles they sell cleaning supplies in. But I'm 461 00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:51,800 Speaker 1: a jug of it, and for like a month, it 462 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:54,679 Speaker 1: would just gradually decrease as he would drink it. And 463 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:56,399 Speaker 1: I'm sure it took years off of his life. I 464 00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:03,639 Speaker 1: apologized to his mother for it. Um, but wow, I 465 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:08,280 Speaker 1: miss it, Paul. Ready to get back into this, Yeah, Robert, 466 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:14,040 Speaker 1: let's do it. Let's do it. Let's now. In the 467 00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:17,200 Speaker 1: rare occasions where a woman did get pregnant at the Colonia, 468 00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:20,280 Speaker 1: Schaeffer would order her isolated from the community, kept in 469 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:23,960 Speaker 1: solitude until she gave birth. The child was taken from 470 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:26,680 Speaker 1: her immediately and put with nurses who would care for 471 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,400 Speaker 1: and raise the child, while the woman went immediately back 472 00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:32,760 Speaker 1: to work. As you might expect, people born and forced 473 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,560 Speaker 1: to live in such circumstances did not always turn out 474 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: to be the apex of mental health. Turns out, it's 475 00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:43,280 Speaker 1: bad to separate children from the people who love them 476 00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:48,840 Speaker 1: and force them to live in a barracks. Who could 477 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 1: have known. Um. It also turns out that it's unfortunately 478 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,400 Speaker 1: pretty easy to make people who have already been manipulated 479 00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:58,040 Speaker 1: to accept the torture and repeated assault of their loved ones. 480 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:00,959 Speaker 1: It's easy to make those people tortured strangers for profit. 481 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:04,760 Speaker 1: And that brings us back to Augusto Pinochet. Germany and 482 00:28:04,840 --> 00:28:07,760 Speaker 1: Chile actually had a long military history together prior to 483 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:10,520 Speaker 1: the Cold War in eighteen seventy ones is Germans beat 484 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:13,160 Speaker 1: the French in a little scuffle called the Franco Prussian War. 485 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,119 Speaker 1: Prior to this, if you were a new country. And again, 486 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,480 Speaker 1: colonialism is like fading away in a lot of Latin 487 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:22,240 Speaker 1: America during the eighteen hundreds, right, all these different countries 488 00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:24,440 Speaker 1: are getting their independence and stuff, and they're all like 489 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:28,440 Speaker 1: figuring out, like thrust into the modern world independent, like, well, 490 00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:30,280 Speaker 1: we need an army now, Who's going to train them? 491 00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 1: At the start of the eighteen hundreds, it's the French, right, 492 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,400 Speaker 1: The French are historically like this gets ignored a lot 493 00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 1: because of how World War Two goes, but like for 494 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:42,520 Speaker 1: most of modern history, the French are like the army guys, 495 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 1: like the best soldiers in the world. A lot of 496 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:47,800 Speaker 1: people consider them. That ship changes in eighteen seventy one 497 00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:50,920 Speaker 1: and all of these Latin American nations that had lusted 498 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,720 Speaker 1: after getting like French people to train their armies start 499 00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:59,080 Speaker 1: hiring Germans um and that's where the kind of relationship 500 00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: with um between Chile and Germany starts. So a lot 501 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: of German military advisors Prussian officers are the ones who 502 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:08,880 Speaker 1: formed the Chilean Armed forces in the late nineteenth century, 503 00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:10,960 Speaker 1: and it actually if you want to know, like how 504 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 1: did a fascist take power in Chile? Well, all of 505 00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:17,160 Speaker 1: the guys who built the Chilean military, which is responsible 506 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 1: for the coup, we're guys who later were Nazis, and 507 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:23,360 Speaker 1: sometimes some of them were Nazis when they were doing it. 508 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 1: So like, yeah, it did it make sense? Um? During 509 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:31,200 Speaker 1: the Second World War, a new lieutenant general who had 510 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:35,080 Speaker 1: been trained by German officers named Augusto Pinoche sympathized with 511 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 1: the Nazis and expressed his enchantment with Irwin Rommel, easily 512 00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:45,040 Speaker 1: the fifth or sixth most overrated general officer in that war. Well, 513 00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:48,600 Speaker 1: now you don't need to be snarky, Robert, I bring 514 00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 1: the Ramel shade. That's what I'm here for anyway. Um, 515 00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,920 Speaker 1: we've already discussed the privileges Pinochet gave the colony, but 516 00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:00,720 Speaker 1: those privileges did come with a response of ability. As 517 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,800 Speaker 1: I introduced in the last episode, Colonia Dignidot's expertise in 518 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 1: torture made them a perfect auxiliary to the d I 519 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:11,760 Speaker 1: n A or dina UM, Pinochet's secret police force. We 520 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: don't know how many people they tortured, um, but thousands, 521 00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:20,120 Speaker 1: maybe like a lot. They tortured the shipload of people 522 00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:22,400 Speaker 1: and one of the people they by the way, this 523 00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:24,479 Speaker 1: is actually again some of these people are a lot 524 00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 1: of these people are former Nazis. A lot of people 525 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 1: organized and we don't know what all of them did 526 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,200 Speaker 1: during the war. Um, but there's an ugly and a 527 00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:35,480 Speaker 1: pretty global history of former Nazis, specifically being the people 528 00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 1: who helped train secret police for dictators to torture, and 529 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:40,800 Speaker 1: the U S supports a number of these guys. In fact, 530 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 1: Syria's infamous said Naya prison and it's incredibly Syria has 531 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:49,480 Speaker 1: one of the most like horrific torture programs of any 532 00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 1: nation today. Um. It was all organized by a former 533 00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:55,760 Speaker 1: member of the s S who like put together their 534 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 1: torture program, and the United States funded it from two 535 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:02,240 Speaker 1: thousand were like two thousand nine or ten, because we 536 00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:04,760 Speaker 1: would take people we captured in Iraq and we would 537 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:08,320 Speaker 1: send them over to Syria because we didn't couldn't torture 538 00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:12,000 Speaker 1: them the way that the Syrians could torture them. You're 539 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:15,080 Speaker 1: talking about the United States of America of America. Yes, 540 00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:20,440 Speaker 1: that's right, that's right, I know. Um, it turns out. 541 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 1: I mean, we were also funding Pinochet while he was 542 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 1: using Nazis to torture people. So we we do this 543 00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: a lot. Well, I hope we don't do it anymore. No, 544 00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 1: this is this. I think it's safe to say that 545 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies was the last time the United States 546 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:43,760 Speaker 1: did anything questionable in Latin America. It has been nothing 547 00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:47,320 Speaker 1: but smooth saying exactly, well, we got that out of 548 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,480 Speaker 1: our system. Yeah. Look, it's like, you know, you gotta, 549 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:52,720 Speaker 1: you gotta, you gotta. I don't know, I don't know 550 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:57,920 Speaker 1: what else. It's like. One of the people tortured at 551 00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:00,880 Speaker 1: the Colonia Dignidad was a guy named Louis Peebles. He 552 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:04,560 Speaker 1: was which is tragic story but very funny name. Um, 553 00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:06,320 Speaker 1: he survived, so we can laugh at the fact that 554 00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:10,680 Speaker 1: his name is Louis Peebles. Um. Peebles again, amazing. Was 555 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:14,200 Speaker 1: the former commander of a left wing militia. Um, you 556 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:17,360 Speaker 1: have to really be a frightening man. If you're a 557 00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:20,440 Speaker 1: militia leader named Peoples and people take you seriously like you, 558 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,160 Speaker 1: that's an extra like boy named Sue level of Like, Yeah, 559 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:26,480 Speaker 1: don't laugh at the name. It is funny that I 560 00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 1: never thought twice about the name Van Peebles. But people's 561 00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:34,080 Speaker 1: by itself. Yeah it's absurd, Yeah, Louis Peebles, Louis Pee. 562 00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:40,600 Speaker 1: So Peoples runs a left wing militia. It turns out 563 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:42,880 Speaker 1: running a left wing militia pretty hard in a country 564 00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:45,440 Speaker 1: that's been taken over by the fascists. He lasts a while. 565 00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:48,960 Speaker 1: Seventy three is when Pinochet is out of power. Most 566 00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:51,120 Speaker 1: of the resistance is stomped out in a week or so. 567 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:54,440 Speaker 1: Peoples isn't captured by the government until nineteen seventy five. 568 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:57,480 Speaker 1: February nineteen seventy five. So whoever he is, he's pretty 569 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 1: canny son of a bit. But you know, nobody's that 570 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 1: canny um. He was initially jailed in a military base, 571 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:08,000 Speaker 1: but then early one Sunday morning, soldiers bound him, blindfolded him, 572 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:11,240 Speaker 1: and drove him several hours away to Colonia Dignidad. Next 573 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,960 Speaker 1: from the American scholar quote. He was taken to an 574 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:18,160 Speaker 1: underground cellar that smelled of linoleum and wood polish, stripped 575 00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:20,680 Speaker 1: to his underwear, and fastened down with leather straps to 576 00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 1: an iron bed frame. His blindfold was replaced with a 577 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,040 Speaker 1: leather cap that came down over his eyes. It had 578 00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: a chin strap that held his jaw firmly in place, 579 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,480 Speaker 1: and ear flaps equipped with metal wires. More wires were 580 00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:34,960 Speaker 1: taped to his ankles, thighs, chest, throat, anus, and genitals, 581 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 1: all hooked into a voltage machine. The first session lasted 582 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 1: six hours. As Peebles was being shocked, they stabbed him 583 00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:44,760 Speaker 1: with needles that caused his skin to itch. Then they 584 00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,240 Speaker 1: put out cigarettes on his body and applied a sticky 585 00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:50,400 Speaker 1: substance to his eyes and mouth. Sometimes if he screamed, 586 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 1: they shoved it down his throat. I mean, I guess 587 00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:56,560 Speaker 1: at least they polished the floor. Yeah, they did polish 588 00:33:56,600 --> 00:34:00,200 Speaker 1: the floor. They're Germans, they're clean people. Um. Some times 589 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:04,680 Speaker 1: to do a problematic degree. Um. So the guy who's 590 00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:07,880 Speaker 1: doing all this, he hears a German Man talking. And 591 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,480 Speaker 1: when all of this becomes public later and Shafers in 592 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:14,880 Speaker 1: the news, he realizes the man torturing him was Paul Schaefer. Um. 593 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,440 Speaker 1: He was teaching them how to do their job. People's 594 00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:20,080 Speaker 1: later said. He was saying, you have to do it slowly, 595 00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:22,840 Speaker 1: you have to push here. Once or twice he punched 596 00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 1: me very hard below the belt. He realized that they 597 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:27,120 Speaker 1: weren't doing anything to me down there, so he said 598 00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:29,839 Speaker 1: you should also do it here, and he started beating me. 599 00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:31,920 Speaker 1: And I think this is him training the kids, the 600 00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:33,879 Speaker 1: young people. I think they're not children at this point. 601 00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:35,839 Speaker 1: But when they grow up, the ones who don't pull 602 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:37,759 Speaker 1: away from him cause emolested them, the ones who are 603 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:40,479 Speaker 1: like bonded to him, because that happens too, they become 604 00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:45,080 Speaker 1: like his torture people. Oh god, damn, it's pretty bad, Paul. 605 00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:50,120 Speaker 1: This guy wait, wait, he doesn't know when to quit. Well, 606 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: no one has stopped him yet. He has not not 607 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:59,719 Speaker 1: encountered a tremendous number of consequences to his actions so far. U, 608 00:35:00,239 --> 00:35:06,560 Speaker 1: everything's coming up shafer um at this point. Um. I'm 609 00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:10,080 Speaker 1: very interested now because we've talked about cult people before 610 00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,160 Speaker 1: and there's always there's always the moment where they go 611 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,239 Speaker 1: they do a thing that they like, it builds and 612 00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:18,640 Speaker 1: builds and builds, and there's a thing like what if 613 00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,880 Speaker 1: I tried this, and then that's when it all falls apart. 614 00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:25,279 Speaker 1: Cannot even imagine what it's going to be for this guy, 615 00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:29,600 Speaker 1: given what he's already done. I'm interested to see if 616 00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,200 Speaker 1: you'll consider it, like, because it's it would it's easy. 617 00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:34,480 Speaker 1: I know what it is it that is coming like 618 00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 1: you're right, you and you want you know, you're cult guys. Um, 619 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,760 Speaker 1: I'm interested if you'll think it's kind of like a deceleration. 620 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:44,279 Speaker 1: And by the way, because at the midpoint of the 621 00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:48,040 Speaker 1: story is he murdered Santa Claus Like it's hard. There's 622 00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:50,920 Speaker 1: not a lot of pressing the gas from there. I 623 00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,800 Speaker 1: tell you what, If it is a deceleration, that's fine 624 00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 1: by me. I wouldn't say notion to like pulling back 625 00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:05,480 Speaker 1: on that throttle a little bit, right. Um, So people's 626 00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:08,480 Speaker 1: survived his experience, and again one of the Pinochet kills 627 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:12,799 Speaker 1: a lot of people, but not he's not a he's 628 00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:15,600 Speaker 1: not a mass murdering fascist on the scale. If he's 629 00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: more like um, um, he's more like Francisco Franco. He's 630 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:20,279 Speaker 1: not like a Hitler kind of guy. Like his whole 631 00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:21,839 Speaker 1: thing is, I'm not going to kill them all. If 632 00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:23,840 Speaker 1: I torture them until they're too scared to do anything, 633 00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,640 Speaker 1: that's fine. Like Pinochet's body count in the grand scale 634 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:31,400 Speaker 1: of dictators is not tremendously. I he tortures a shipload 635 00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:35,080 Speaker 1: more people than he kills, and he doesn't have people's killed. Um. 636 00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 1: In fact, the guys eventually released and he quite wisely 637 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:41,800 Speaker 1: flees to Europe, which I think works out fine for Pinochet. Right. Um, 638 00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:44,200 Speaker 1: people's piece together what had happened to him. Over the 639 00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:46,640 Speaker 1: next several years, his new stories began to trickle out 640 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:51,879 Speaker 1: about Colonia Dignidad's relationship with Pinochet. He realizes, oh, this 641 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:55,240 Speaker 1: guy who and again their stories filtering back to Europe. 642 00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:57,319 Speaker 1: Again we've talked to there's a couple of people who 643 00:36:57,440 --> 00:36:59,520 Speaker 1: escape and they go to the media. Though so for 644 00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:02,080 Speaker 1: sin the beginning, there have been occasional stories in the 645 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:05,919 Speaker 1: media about allegations that this this German compound in Chile 646 00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:09,400 Speaker 1: as host to a pedophile and that. And once pinochets 647 00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:11,440 Speaker 1: e power, they start to be stories that come out 648 00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:14,279 Speaker 1: that like they might be torturing some people. Um, so 649 00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:17,880 Speaker 1: this is it's there. There's a constant kind of background 650 00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:21,080 Speaker 1: conversation in Germany and in Europe about what might be 651 00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 1: happening here. And when Peoples gets to Europe, he goes 652 00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,239 Speaker 1: to Amnesty International and in nineteen seventy seven they put 653 00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:29,879 Speaker 1: his testimony with a testimony of several other people who 654 00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:33,280 Speaker 1: had been tortured there and survived into a sixty page 655 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:36,680 Speaker 1: report with the subtitle a German community in Chile a 656 00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:41,360 Speaker 1: torture camp for the Dina. Schaefer's lawyers filed libel charges 657 00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:44,759 Speaker 1: against Amnesty International in a German court. This started a 658 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:47,680 Speaker 1: legal battle that would last almost twenty years and delay 659 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:52,600 Speaker 1: the publication of the report until nineteen seven, So twenty years. 660 00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:54,440 Speaker 1: They're able to stop this and from getting out in 661 00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 1: mass because he's got money. They've got money of the lawyers, 662 00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:01,239 Speaker 1: you know, it's it's the scientology. It there's every so 663 00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:03,120 Speaker 1: much of all of these different kind of cults that 664 00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:05,839 Speaker 1: are usually aren't involved with each other. Usually like if 665 00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:08,440 Speaker 1: you've got the hardcore, got them a less children and 666 00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:10,680 Speaker 1: murder people called, they don't really have the resources for 667 00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:13,680 Speaker 1: good lawyers and stuff. You know. Scientology never goes that 668 00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:16,880 Speaker 1: far with the brutal torture stuff because they the reason 669 00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 1: that they have the money is that they keep it on, 670 00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:23,000 Speaker 1: you know, on the edge of that. Schaefer does every 671 00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:25,480 Speaker 1: all of this stuff. He does all of the quasi 672 00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: respectable making money, interacting with the real world, you know, 673 00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:31,720 Speaker 1: having a legal team, and also the and we're balls 674 00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:37,360 Speaker 1: out like unspeakable evil kind of stuff. Like it's really 675 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:43,000 Speaker 1: a pretty remarkable story. Um. So like other escapes of 676 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:46,520 Speaker 1: the colonial people settled in Europe, Brussels to be specific. 677 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,200 Speaker 1: And because again this goes on for twenty years. So 678 00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:51,239 Speaker 1: he he does like live a life which is good. 679 00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:53,919 Speaker 1: Um and he continues, he spends years. Anytime anyone's willing 680 00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:57,480 Speaker 1: to talk about Paul Schaefer, he will tell his story. Meanwhile, 681 00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:01,799 Speaker 1: the torture continued. In fact, as Pinochet his regime went on. Uh, 682 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,600 Speaker 1: Pinochet came to rely on Shafer more and more. In 683 00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,239 Speaker 1: the late nineteen seventies and early nineteen eighties, the Dina 684 00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:11,200 Speaker 1: started taking dissidence to the colonial for execution. The bodies 685 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: were eventually buried in mass grace. We don't know how many. 686 00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:16,400 Speaker 1: All of them were dug up and burned at some 687 00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:19,439 Speaker 1: point after this. We know they were mass graves because 688 00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:21,120 Speaker 1: number one, you can tell that like there was a grave. 689 00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 1: There's little bits and pieces, you know, of clothing and stuff. 690 00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:26,840 Speaker 1: The cars of missing persons were found buried on the 691 00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:30,880 Speaker 1: property and whatnot, so we know what was going on. 692 00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 1: But the remains themselves were all destroyed. Again their their Germans, 693 00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:43,600 Speaker 1: they're very thorough. Um. Yeah. And former d I n 694 00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,120 Speaker 1: A DINA agents have admitted to taking people there to 695 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,359 Speaker 1: be disappeared. We we also do have testimony from people 696 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:50,960 Speaker 1: who were like dropping off dissidents to be murdered, who 697 00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:53,600 Speaker 1: were like, yeah, that's what we did there. Um again, 698 00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:56,799 Speaker 1: no idea how many people were killed, but a lot, 699 00:39:57,640 --> 00:40:03,400 Speaker 1: a mass grave number. You know. I'm these former DINA agents, 700 00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:05,640 Speaker 1: I mean, where are they that they're in a position 701 00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:07,640 Speaker 1: to say like, oh, yeah, we disappeared all those people 702 00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:10,960 Speaker 1: after This is one of those things when you have 703 00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:17,000 Speaker 1: a dictatorship like this that ends, and it doesn't end 704 00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:19,360 Speaker 1: in a massive civil war. When it ends in a 705 00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:21,359 Speaker 1: massive civil war, Yeah, those guys when they get tend 706 00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:23,080 Speaker 1: to get murdered if they get caught, right, Like, that's 707 00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:24,799 Speaker 1: what you do if it's a civil war. To the 708 00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:28,440 Speaker 1: old secret police, you fucking kill a lot of them. 709 00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:31,239 Speaker 1: This doesn't in that way. Pinochet's regime ends, but it's 710 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:33,920 Speaker 1: kind of like a negotiated thing and Pinochet gets to 711 00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:36,239 Speaker 1: be like a Congressman for life kind of thing like 712 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,560 Speaker 1: it's and things get a lot better in Chile. I 713 00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:42,600 Speaker 1: no one would disagree with that, but um, they don't. 714 00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:45,120 Speaker 1: They have a Truth and Reconciliation Commission. It's like in 715 00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:48,200 Speaker 1: South Africa, right, this system of apartheimes, but they don't like, 716 00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:50,520 Speaker 1: they don't like murder all of the people who did 717 00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:54,640 Speaker 1: the apartheid um. They have to integrate them into society. 718 00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:57,759 Speaker 1: And so a lot of these guys they say, like, Okay, 719 00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:00,000 Speaker 1: we're not gonna There are some people who do get punished, 720 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:01,759 Speaker 1: there are people who go to prison for the stuff 721 00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:03,680 Speaker 1: they did in the regime, but a lot of these 722 00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:06,560 Speaker 1: people are basically like, we need to know what happened, 723 00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:10,440 Speaker 1: but like, we're not going to to kill you over it, 724 00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:13,600 Speaker 1: and so, and I think there are people who feel bad. Yeah, yeah, 725 00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:14,759 Speaker 1: I don't want to spend a lot of time like 726 00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,920 Speaker 1: trying to morally whatever these guys. But basically, in exchange 727 00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:20,640 Speaker 1: for information, we will yeah we won't execute you, Yeah 728 00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:23,200 Speaker 1: we won't, or we won't like whatever, put you in 729 00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:25,399 Speaker 1: prison necessary, right because we were trying to figure out 730 00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:27,239 Speaker 1: what happened who disappeared. There's a lot of people who 731 00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:29,080 Speaker 1: have questions. I don't know if my family members alive 732 00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:31,480 Speaker 1: or dead. You know, you're trying to not I'm not 733 00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:32,960 Speaker 1: trying to come down one way or the other on 734 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:34,960 Speaker 1: it because it's not my country and not my decision 735 00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:39,279 Speaker 1: what should happen afterwards? Um, but yeah, that's what it's not. 736 00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:43,879 Speaker 1: The Pinochet's dictatorship doesn't end because the people like murder him, 737 00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:48,680 Speaker 1: you know. Um. So. Schaefer's nickname with the Dina was 738 00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:51,879 Speaker 1: the Professor, and the eyewitness accounts of people being sent 739 00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:54,400 Speaker 1: to the Colonial for execution all point to Schaefer being 740 00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:57,560 Speaker 1: the man who received victims and lead them to their execution. 741 00:41:57,600 --> 00:41:59,960 Speaker 1: He is a hands on dude, Like he's not delic 742 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,960 Speaker 1: eating this ship like Hitler's a delegator. Schaefer is. If 743 00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,279 Speaker 1: we're gonna be executing people, I'm gonna be there like 744 00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:07,240 Speaker 1: I'm gonna be picking them up. I'm gonna be taking 745 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:10,440 Speaker 1: them to the site like. Um. One former member of 746 00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:12,839 Speaker 1: the Colony told Bruce Falconer that he had been ordered 747 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:15,080 Speaker 1: by Schaefer directly to drive a bus load of thirty 748 00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:17,440 Speaker 1: five political prisoners into the hills of the Colony and 749 00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:19,600 Speaker 1: leave them by the side of a dirt road. As 750 00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:22,719 Speaker 1: this person drove away, he heard machine gun fire. Nobodies 751 00:42:22,719 --> 00:42:24,879 Speaker 1: were ever found, and there's a bunch of stories like that. 752 00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:28,240 Speaker 1: That's generally how they go. By nineteen eighty, the Colonial 753 00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:32,040 Speaker 1: had expanded from its initial acres to more than fifteen 754 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:35,560 Speaker 1: thousand acres. A sizeable chunk of this was stolen from 755 00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:38,480 Speaker 1: locals and the Catholic Church. Again, this comes up like 756 00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:40,759 Speaker 1: you've heard of liberation theology. There's this chunk of the 757 00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:43,640 Speaker 1: Catholic Church in South America during this period that's fighting 758 00:42:43,640 --> 00:42:47,360 Speaker 1: back against all of these like fascist dictators in militias 759 00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:50,720 Speaker 1: and stuff. So they don't have a lot of resistance 760 00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:52,799 Speaker 1: from the Pinochet regime when they just like show up 761 00:42:52,840 --> 00:42:56,479 Speaker 1: one day, Schaefer has his people like surround this group 762 00:42:56,520 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: of nuns who owned farmland and is like, what are 763 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:03,719 Speaker 1: you gonna do? And so they leave and he gets it. Um, yeah, 764 00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:05,920 Speaker 1: and this is probably like the mid nineteen eighties is 765 00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:09,120 Speaker 1: kind of win. His control is at its peak. But 766 00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:12,719 Speaker 1: while his personal control of his cult is at its peak, 767 00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:16,439 Speaker 1: he's now lost control of the international narrative. And as 768 00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,000 Speaker 1: this Washington Post report from nineteen eighty makes clear, his 769 00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:21,160 Speaker 1: Nazi passed had started to catch up to him on 770 00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:24,960 Speaker 1: the international stage. Quote. There have also been charges over 771 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:27,000 Speaker 1: the years that the colony is a way station in 772 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:30,640 Speaker 1: the South American Nazi underground where war criminals wanted by German, 773 00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:33,720 Speaker 1: Israeli or other authorities are allowed to hide. A Chilean 774 00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:35,960 Speaker 1: who visited the colony several years ago said that he 775 00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,239 Speaker 1: was told by Ursula, a nurse in the colony's ultra 776 00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:41,520 Speaker 1: modern hospital, that the doctors there were experts in performing 777 00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:45,640 Speaker 1: plastic surgery. Last December, Nazi hunters Simon of Eisenthal said 778 00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:48,600 Speaker 1: that he had evidence that Joseph Mingola, the third Reich's 779 00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:51,319 Speaker 1: infamous Angel of Death, had lived in the colony for 780 00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:55,800 Speaker 1: a time. Last year. The FBI had similar information, and 781 00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:58,640 Speaker 1: the colony they have a spokesman. The colony denies that 782 00:43:58,680 --> 00:44:00,640 Speaker 1: Mingler any other Nazis lived in the colony. We know 783 00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:03,080 Speaker 1: Nazis lived there, some of them, like I was in 784 00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:05,880 Speaker 1: the idea was in the very pack or whatever. We 785 00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:08,040 Speaker 1: we don't have as much as I wants, it would 786 00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:10,919 Speaker 1: be good to have on like what extent they were 787 00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:14,480 Speaker 1: actually part of the underground Nazi railroad, but it kind 788 00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,160 Speaker 1: of seems like they were a key aspect of helping 789 00:44:17,680 --> 00:44:21,920 Speaker 1: like hardcore war criminal Nazis move around and change their 790 00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:26,360 Speaker 1: appearance and stay in the underground and avoid prosecution. But 791 00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:29,560 Speaker 1: also like everything suggests that that is a thing that 792 00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:31,960 Speaker 1: he would do, that he would yea, he would this 793 00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:35,280 Speaker 1: is the guy. Yeah, yeah, I don't know if Mingolow 794 00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:39,719 Speaker 1: was there, um. Um, nobody does obviously, but um, I 795 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:43,120 Speaker 1: think he helped a lot of hardcore Nazi war criminals side. Um. 796 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:45,600 Speaker 1: That seems completely on brand for the time. I mean, 797 00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:49,919 Speaker 1: why not at that point and honestly on the low 798 00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:55,759 Speaker 1: end of his crime exactly. Yeah, maybe did that to 799 00:44:55,840 --> 00:44:59,560 Speaker 1: feel more respectable to him. Yeah, yeah, just just smuggling 800 00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:05,200 Speaker 1: some genocide committers. They already did the genocide. You should 801 00:45:05,239 --> 00:45:09,120 Speaker 1: see the ship I'm getting up to. Um. It is 802 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,120 Speaker 1: unclear whether or not yet any other famous Nazis hung 803 00:45:12,120 --> 00:45:14,920 Speaker 1: out there, but there were definitely Nazis. Schaffer and a 804 00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:17,399 Speaker 1: lot of the oldermen were Nazi veterans. They were huge 805 00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:20,480 Speaker 1: fans of Pinochet, who was himself a fascist. That nineteen 806 00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:23,480 Speaker 1: article from the Washington Post is maybe the first place 807 00:45:23,560 --> 00:45:26,280 Speaker 1: to describe the Colonial as a state within a state, 808 00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:29,239 Speaker 1: which it was, and they note that the private airstrips 809 00:45:29,239 --> 00:45:32,360 Speaker 1: and private communication system would make it simple for someone 810 00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:34,640 Speaker 1: to fly into the Colonial from outside of the country 811 00:45:34,680 --> 00:45:37,640 Speaker 1: without going through customs or being registered in any way. 812 00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:41,440 Speaker 1: So they're in the ideal situation to help Nazis stay underground. 813 00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:45,320 Speaker 1: The reporter on that article noted that he attempted to 814 00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:48,640 Speaker 1: visit the colonia, but was threatened with arrest by local police, 815 00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:51,200 Speaker 1: who swarmed him before he could get close and destroyed 816 00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:53,960 Speaker 1: his film role just to be sure. They claimed to 817 00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:57,400 Speaker 1: be acting on orders from the capital. Quote. The Chilean 818 00:45:57,440 --> 00:46:00,040 Speaker 1: government takes the attitude that the colony is located on 819 00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:02,600 Speaker 1: private property, which, unless there is a problem, should not 820 00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:05,359 Speaker 1: be entered by the police. Neither the police captain who 821 00:46:05,360 --> 00:46:07,840 Speaker 1: almost arrested me in December, nor the government officials in 822 00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:10,319 Speaker 1: Santiago could explain how the police would know if there 823 00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:14,200 Speaker 1: were a problem without regularly entering the vast commune. Chilian 824 00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:16,680 Speaker 1: peasants from the surrounding area, who hold the colony in 825 00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:19,520 Speaker 1: high regard, are given three medical care at its hospital, 826 00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:22,400 Speaker 1: but only during certain pre established hours. One Chili and 827 00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:25,200 Speaker 1: who spent three nights there, said he had uncovered microphones 828 00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:27,960 Speaker 1: hidden in his room, which his hosts then explained were 829 00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:30,360 Speaker 1: there to anticipate his needs. He also said that he 830 00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:32,320 Speaker 1: was followed wherever he went and was not allowed to 831 00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:35,879 Speaker 1: have spontaneous contact with members of the sect. I love 832 00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:39,279 Speaker 1: the idea explaining a bug by saying, oh wait, we 833 00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:41,000 Speaker 1: just want to know if you want stuff, which wouldn't 834 00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:43,759 Speaker 1: be better hosts. Yeah, it's going to be better rather 835 00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:46,360 Speaker 1: than you having to ask, like can I make a 836 00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:49,240 Speaker 1: sandwich in here? You know, we just make a sandwich, 837 00:46:49,440 --> 00:46:53,480 Speaker 1: just like a sandwich. Right now, I'm gonna go ask 838 00:46:53,560 --> 00:46:55,680 Speaker 1: for one. We just want this to be the best 839 00:46:55,800 --> 00:47:01,640 Speaker 1: damn hospital you've ever been to. It is funny that 840 00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:04,879 Speaker 1: you would even like, yeah, try to justify it, but yeah, 841 00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:07,560 Speaker 1: that is. And you also see in that quote everything 842 00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:10,160 Speaker 1: he's spent years doing coming on, Like he's got all 843 00:47:10,200 --> 00:47:12,040 Speaker 1: of this local support, not just from the government but 844 00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:15,040 Speaker 1: from the people. Like there is no getting in there, 845 00:47:15,160 --> 00:47:18,640 Speaker 1: there's no he has. Maybe this might be the most 846 00:47:18,719 --> 00:47:21,360 Speaker 1: total control I've ever heard of a cult leader establishing, 847 00:47:21,719 --> 00:47:25,560 Speaker 1: Like to be honest, this is yeah, it's it's something else. 848 00:47:25,680 --> 00:47:28,840 Speaker 1: He's got the ship locked up, Yeah he does. And 849 00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:30,759 Speaker 1: you know who else has their ship locked up? Paul? 850 00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:34,319 Speaker 1: Please tell me the products and services that support this 851 00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:51,520 Speaker 1: podcast perfect ideological black holes inescapable, that's behind the Bastard's guarantee. Ah, 852 00:47:52,280 --> 00:47:56,680 Speaker 1: we're back, Paul. So we just talked about how there's 853 00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:59,040 Speaker 1: some weird ship going on with Nazis maybe getting smuggled 854 00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:02,440 Speaker 1: through here. To add to that, there's a bunch of 855 00:48:02,440 --> 00:48:04,319 Speaker 1: stuff we just don't know enough about. As I would like, 856 00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:08,080 Speaker 1: there's a lot of unexplained financial irregularities behind the Colonial 857 00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:14,920 Speaker 1: and shape dudes s really I would have though. That's 858 00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:18,399 Speaker 1: the one thing that Paul Shapers insisted was I will 859 00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:24,040 Speaker 1: be scrupulous about the books. That nineteen eighty Washington Post 860 00:48:24,120 --> 00:48:26,560 Speaker 1: article noted that the Colonial maintained what it called a 861 00:48:26,680 --> 00:48:29,680 Speaker 1: mother house in Siegberg, Germany, where it would take care 862 00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:33,000 Speaker 1: of single mothers and would raise funds. Uh So they 863 00:48:33,080 --> 00:48:36,560 Speaker 1: continue to operate operate an orphanage in Germany, which they 864 00:48:36,719 --> 00:48:39,640 Speaker 1: use the establishment of this orphanage means there's a charity 865 00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:43,240 Speaker 1: in Germany, which means anonymous people only described as partners 866 00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:47,800 Speaker 1: can donate money to that orphanage, and all that money 867 00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:50,520 Speaker 1: goes to the Commune in Chile. And those partners are 868 00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:52,680 Speaker 1: maybe former members of the Nazi Party who were trying 869 00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:54,680 Speaker 1: to help smuggle people or get funds to them. A 870 00:48:54,680 --> 00:48:56,600 Speaker 1: lot of this might have been a money laundering operation 871 00:48:56,640 --> 00:48:59,640 Speaker 1: where we need to get money to this fucking S S. 872 00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:02,720 Speaker 1: Gen Role who's been hiding out in Argentina. We donate 873 00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:04,480 Speaker 1: to the Colonia. They take a cut off the top 874 00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:06,279 Speaker 1: and they pass the money onto this guy because they're 875 00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:10,840 Speaker 1: able to travel without like customs documents, Like all sorts 876 00:49:10,840 --> 00:49:15,400 Speaker 1: of shady ship is going on here. The thing the 877 00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:17,600 Speaker 1: thing to me when it gets to this point, especially 878 00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:20,000 Speaker 1: when there's when there's uh, you know, some kind of 879 00:49:20,360 --> 00:49:26,560 Speaker 1: when there's Christianity involved, is that what what level is 880 00:49:27,480 --> 00:49:32,480 Speaker 1: the Christianity uh entering Paul Shaffer's brain at this point? 881 00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:36,920 Speaker 1: Like is he does he still consider himself a religious person? 882 00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:40,520 Speaker 1: Like I say my prayers every night? Um? Or is 883 00:49:40,520 --> 00:49:42,880 Speaker 1: it just like at this point it's just like I 884 00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:47,520 Speaker 1: am fully I'm fully embracing my own Godhood and the 885 00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:50,600 Speaker 1: sham Like it's always to me the balancing like we 886 00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:53,440 Speaker 1: talked about before, the balancing of how much do I 887 00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:57,120 Speaker 1: believe in myself to be this thing and how much 888 00:49:57,160 --> 00:49:58,960 Speaker 1: of it is just a con? And I know it's 889 00:49:58,960 --> 00:50:01,680 Speaker 1: a con. But then when when when you still are 890 00:50:01,719 --> 00:50:05,040 Speaker 1: considering yourself a Christian or you're you're having some sort 891 00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:09,600 Speaker 1: of Christian aspect to your scam, Like how much do 892 00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:12,759 Speaker 1: you believe like in our Lord Jesus Christ on high 893 00:50:12,800 --> 00:50:15,680 Speaker 1: is smiling down upon me and the things that I'm 894 00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:20,480 Speaker 1: doing it is, Um, I don't know. I really have 895 00:50:20,640 --> 00:50:24,440 Speaker 1: no idea, because like, you're pretty far from the teachings 896 00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:27,520 Speaker 1: of the Bible when you are smuggling Nazis through Latin 897 00:50:27,560 --> 00:50:31,120 Speaker 1: America in while raping hundreds of children and torturing people 898 00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:37,280 Speaker 1: for Pinochet and laundering money and like not very Christian. 899 00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,200 Speaker 1: I would say, that's the only peak I would like 900 00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:43,600 Speaker 1: into their brains is to yeah, what are they thinking 901 00:50:43,640 --> 00:50:46,360 Speaker 1: at that moment? Or like, is there a point where 902 00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:48,840 Speaker 1: it's just abandoned and they're just like, I got a 903 00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:51,399 Speaker 1: good thing going here, I'm gonna keep it up. Uh, 904 00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:54,080 Speaker 1: It's it's a it's a useful means of control. Still, 905 00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:56,600 Speaker 1: you know, to say that that there's a there's a 906 00:50:56,640 --> 00:51:00,799 Speaker 1: power even greater than me that's guiding everything, and yeah, 907 00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:03,520 Speaker 1: and then I'm the like I I don't I have 908 00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:08,719 Speaker 1: trouble imagining that Schaefer believes in anything but power and 909 00:51:08,800 --> 00:51:13,680 Speaker 1: indulging his his his his wants. I do have trouble 910 00:51:13,680 --> 00:51:18,480 Speaker 1: believing that. Um, I don't know. Though obviously there's a 911 00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:20,640 Speaker 1: lot of belief in this organization and a lot of skills, 912 00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:23,120 Speaker 1: I think there's also just a lot of very cynical Nazis, 913 00:51:23,560 --> 00:51:26,319 Speaker 1: um using it for their own ship, right, which to me, 914 00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:29,839 Speaker 1: and it's the worst kind of Nazi, cynical Nazi at 915 00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:34,839 Speaker 1: least be a believer, you know. Um yeah, yeah, I 916 00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:40,160 Speaker 1: don't know. Um, it is hard to like, uh, it's 917 00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:42,680 Speaker 1: hard to really wrap your head around what is going 918 00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:45,160 Speaker 1: on in Paul's head if it's anything but just cold. 919 00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:48,759 Speaker 1: And it might because he's he's got to be a calculator, right, 920 00:51:48,840 --> 00:51:51,399 Speaker 1: Like I could see it just being sort of like 921 00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:53,840 Speaker 1: a dial tone in there, just like I get what 922 00:51:53,960 --> 00:51:55,440 Speaker 1: I want. These are the things that I'm doing in 923 00:51:55,520 --> 00:51:56,839 Speaker 1: order to get the things that i want. Yet it's 924 00:51:56,840 --> 00:51:59,080 Speaker 1: not like these guys ever really lay it out at 925 00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:01,600 Speaker 1: the end where they're like, you know it all bullshit, 926 00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:04,560 Speaker 1: I ad made it. Yeah, yeah, No, they don't ever 927 00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:07,680 Speaker 1: do that. Um, But yeah, I don't know. There were 928 00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:10,560 Speaker 1: constant rumors of foreign backers for the colonial rumors that 929 00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:13,080 Speaker 1: old Nazi war criminals had funneled money to it. It's 930 00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:17,160 Speaker 1: hospital again super good at plastic surgery, which is a 931 00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:20,200 Speaker 1: little odd for a rural Chilean medical facility that deals 932 00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:24,279 Speaker 1: primarily with obstetrics. Um. They of course ran several successful 933 00:52:24,280 --> 00:52:28,160 Speaker 1: businesses torture people for the Chilean state. So a lot 934 00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:29,480 Speaker 1: of the money may have come from that. It's hard 935 00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:32,680 Speaker 1: to say. One diplomatic observer cited by The Washington Post 936 00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:35,120 Speaker 1: noted that quote, no one knows who was behind the 937 00:52:35,160 --> 00:52:40,759 Speaker 1: central organization, which he claimed was located in Siegberg, Germany. Um, 938 00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:43,200 Speaker 1: this guy claimed that they'd put millions of dollars into 939 00:52:43,200 --> 00:52:45,719 Speaker 1: the colony rather than the funding the colony funding its 940 00:52:45,719 --> 00:52:48,759 Speaker 1: own endeavors, which I I just don't know what's going 941 00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:51,120 Speaker 1: on here, The observer went on to stay, the religious 942 00:52:51,120 --> 00:52:53,440 Speaker 1: and social aims of this group are very uncertain. It 943 00:52:53,520 --> 00:52:55,800 Speaker 1: is all very strange, and that is kind of the 944 00:52:55,880 --> 00:52:57,920 Speaker 1: untold story. Here's like how much of this, how much 945 00:52:57,920 --> 00:53:01,200 Speaker 1: of this? How much of Paul was If you keep 946 00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:04,640 Speaker 1: this operation going for these underground Nazis, you can do 947 00:53:04,680 --> 00:53:07,560 Speaker 1: whatever you want. Like how much was he um an 948 00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:10,360 Speaker 1: instrument of other people who helped him get established and 949 00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:12,000 Speaker 1: helped him do all this. I don't know. I don't 950 00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:13,640 Speaker 1: know how much of that is underpinning this. I don't 951 00:53:13,640 --> 00:53:15,719 Speaker 1: know if they come in later and are like, this 952 00:53:15,719 --> 00:53:17,480 Speaker 1: guy's got a good thing going, let's pump some money 953 00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:19,520 Speaker 1: into it, and like we can we can take advantage, 954 00:53:19,600 --> 00:53:22,160 Speaker 1: or if it's from sixty one, from the very start, 955 00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:24,600 Speaker 1: there's this shadow week of all of Nazis being like, 956 00:53:25,400 --> 00:53:27,839 Speaker 1: we need to build this thing. I really just don't know. 957 00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,480 Speaker 1: Could just be an innocent dude, could be an innocent 958 00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:36,440 Speaker 1: pedophile just working for the Nazis, Just an innocent Nazi pedophile, 959 00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:40,600 Speaker 1: just a regular nut upon the forces greater than him, exactly. 960 00:53:40,920 --> 00:53:44,720 Speaker 1: We've all felt that way at some point. Yeah, yeah. Um. 961 00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:47,719 Speaker 1: Journalists in nineteen eighty noted how suspicious it was that 962 00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:51,080 Speaker 1: the Colonia, ostensibly a religious mission, had no church. And 963 00:53:51,160 --> 00:53:54,600 Speaker 1: I actually think they're wrong, But that didn't even occur 964 00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:57,439 Speaker 1: to me. Yeah, there's not a single church there. Where 965 00:53:57,480 --> 00:54:00,759 Speaker 1: do these services happening. They're all in like the cafeteria. 966 00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:04,160 Speaker 1: And I actually think it's very funny that this religious 967 00:54:04,160 --> 00:54:06,719 Speaker 1: mission has no church. But I think the thing that 968 00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:08,960 Speaker 1: I think the reason these journalists think that it's weird 969 00:54:09,840 --> 00:54:12,560 Speaker 1: and suspicious is because they don't actually understand what these 970 00:54:12,560 --> 00:54:16,520 Speaker 1: people believe. There was no physical church because Schaefer was 971 00:54:16,600 --> 00:54:20,080 Speaker 1: the church. Wherever he is is the church, and he 972 00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:22,040 Speaker 1: could not abide the thought of worship that was not 973 00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:24,480 Speaker 1: centered around and directed by him. I think he hated 974 00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:26,719 Speaker 1: the idea that there would be a church because then 975 00:54:26,719 --> 00:54:28,600 Speaker 1: people could go there when he was not there and 976 00:54:28,640 --> 00:54:33,040 Speaker 1: worship like I am the worship, I am the vector 977 00:54:33,200 --> 00:54:38,000 Speaker 1: of this faith. Um. Yeah, that's my suspicion. All the 978 00:54:38,040 --> 00:54:40,840 Speaker 1: while this is going on, the abuse continued. In nineteen 979 00:54:40,960 --> 00:54:44,480 Speaker 1: seventy one, girl Matilda's sure Gillis wrote to her mother 980 00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:46,920 Speaker 1: back in Germany, no one is getting in here and 981 00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:50,400 Speaker 1: nobody is getting out, um, which is certainly how she 982 00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:53,319 Speaker 1: felt at the time, but is not quite true now. 983 00:54:53,440 --> 00:54:55,560 Speaker 1: Werner Schmitko was one of the kids we talked about 984 00:54:55,560 --> 00:54:58,920 Speaker 1: in episode one. He sailed to Colonia Dignidad in nineteen 985 00:54:58,960 --> 00:55:01,160 Speaker 1: sixty two as a two year old, and a few 986 00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:04,400 Speaker 1: years later he began being molested by Paul Schaefer. Schmidka 987 00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:07,440 Speaker 1: tried to escape the colonia five times over the years, 988 00:55:07,520 --> 00:55:09,799 Speaker 1: and even though he was never caught in doing this, 989 00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:12,160 Speaker 1: he was always he was never like he was alway 990 00:55:12,160 --> 00:55:15,080 Speaker 1: he got out successfully every time, he was always forced 991 00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:18,480 Speaker 1: to return. Um. And this is what's interesting to me. 992 00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:20,279 Speaker 1: He's like he would get out, he would be free 993 00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:22,719 Speaker 1: and clear, and then he would have to go back because, 994 00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:25,120 Speaker 1: as he explained, I had nobody to go to as 995 00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:27,239 Speaker 1: a child, you need your parents to go to to 996 00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:29,680 Speaker 1: cry to and say I can't take it anymore. But 997 00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:32,160 Speaker 1: the only answer was to run away, so he kept 998 00:55:32,200 --> 00:55:34,800 Speaker 1: winding up back at the colt after escaping and getting 999 00:55:34,800 --> 00:55:38,799 Speaker 1: punished and stuff. In nineteen eight, um it was it 1000 00:55:38,840 --> 00:55:42,279 Speaker 1: was ninety eight. So in Werner is escaping a bunch 1001 00:55:42,320 --> 00:55:44,400 Speaker 1: of times. A number of kids get out, a lot 1002 00:55:44,440 --> 00:55:46,600 Speaker 1: of them get brought back, some of them flee to Europe. 1003 00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:49,680 Speaker 1: But it's nineteen eighty eight before an escape happens that 1004 00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:52,600 Speaker 1: generates enough news in the right media climate for the 1005 00:55:52,640 --> 00:55:56,520 Speaker 1: international community Germany in particular, to start taking the allegations 1006 00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:59,399 Speaker 1: of abuse at the colonial seriously. And it happens when 1007 00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:03,160 Speaker 1: two young George and Lottie pack Moore, managed to escape 1008 00:56:03,200 --> 00:56:05,880 Speaker 1: to Canada and then get to Bonne where they testify 1009 00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:09,440 Speaker 1: before the Reichstag that German citizens were being sexually assaulted 1010 00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:12,840 Speaker 1: and forced to stay against their will. Lottie implicated a 1011 00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:16,319 Speaker 1: number of high ranking officials in the colonia, including doctor Hopp, 1012 00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:18,680 Speaker 1: saying that he'd been allowed to marry and own a 1013 00:56:18,719 --> 00:56:22,240 Speaker 1: car in return for enabling a regime of mass child rape. 1014 00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:25,239 Speaker 1: Dr Hopp had been the colonials, foreign emissary. He was 1015 00:56:25,239 --> 00:56:27,840 Speaker 1: the guy who would go overseas whenever there were questions 1016 00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:29,719 Speaker 1: about the colonial He's the guy who's talking to the 1017 00:56:29,719 --> 00:56:32,560 Speaker 1: press a lot of the time. Um he had connections 1018 00:56:32,560 --> 00:56:35,400 Speaker 1: with German diplomats. He brought people back sometimes when they 1019 00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:38,600 Speaker 1: would flee to foreign countries. When Lottie had first escaped 1020 00:56:38,600 --> 00:56:41,279 Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty, he had convinced foreign officials to send 1021 00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:43,800 Speaker 1: her back because she was a child, and she claims 1022 00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:46,719 Speaker 1: that when she protested, he threatened her another peep out 1023 00:56:46,719 --> 00:56:49,040 Speaker 1: of you, and you'll get an injection to keep you quiet. 1024 00:56:49,360 --> 00:56:52,319 Speaker 1: So this is like this, this guy gets to have 1025 00:56:52,360 --> 00:56:54,319 Speaker 1: a wife in a car, and a family and a 1026 00:56:54,400 --> 00:56:57,359 Speaker 1: job because he's doing this. Since Paul Schaeffer was still 1027 00:56:57,360 --> 00:56:59,520 Speaker 1: a wanted man in Germany, he sent Dr Hopp to 1028 00:56:59,520 --> 00:57:03,200 Speaker 1: represent cult in parliament. According to Reuters, hop testified that 1029 00:57:03,280 --> 00:57:05,880 Speaker 1: quote the group was one big family which in a 1030 00:57:05,960 --> 00:57:08,960 Speaker 1: quarter of a century had not a single divorce or suicide, 1031 00:57:08,960 --> 00:57:10,960 Speaker 1: and whose members were free to leave at any time, 1032 00:57:11,000 --> 00:57:14,440 Speaker 1: and we're not subjected to forced labor. Quote. Despite this, 1033 00:57:14,560 --> 00:57:16,600 Speaker 1: there have always been people, are groups who have slandered 1034 00:57:16,600 --> 00:57:20,040 Speaker 1: our society or individual members in an incredibly scandalous way 1035 00:57:20,040 --> 00:57:23,040 Speaker 1: by feeding misinformation to the press. So this is what 1036 00:57:23,080 --> 00:57:26,880 Speaker 1: he says in his testimony. In nineteen nine, the people 1037 00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:30,680 Speaker 1: of Chile forced Augusto Pinochet out of office via a plebiscite. 1038 00:57:30,800 --> 00:57:33,560 Speaker 1: He stepped down to a term as senator for life. 1039 00:57:33,600 --> 00:57:35,520 Speaker 1: And we'll talk about all this more at some point, 1040 00:57:35,520 --> 00:57:38,720 Speaker 1: I promise. After he leaves office, a Truth and Reconciliation 1041 00:57:38,720 --> 00:57:42,040 Speaker 1: Commission is formed to investigate human rights abuses during the regime. 1042 00:57:42,440 --> 00:57:46,360 Speaker 1: Attention was paid quite naturally to Colonia Dignidad, and an 1043 00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:50,120 Speaker 1: investigation into missing persons there, including Boris wise Feiler, who 1044 00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:53,439 Speaker 1: we opened the episode with, started back up. It would 1045 00:57:53,440 --> 00:57:55,880 Speaker 1: be a gross misuse of the words slow to say 1046 00:57:55,920 --> 00:57:58,560 Speaker 1: that justice was slow in this case. For more than 1047 00:57:58,680 --> 00:58:01,160 Speaker 1: half a decade, the coloe and he has stayed closed 1048 00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:03,240 Speaker 1: to the world, duing large part to the fact that 1049 00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:05,640 Speaker 1: the police were still very sympathetic to the old regime 1050 00:58:05,680 --> 00:58:09,720 Speaker 1: and thus to Schaffer. In nine six, Schaefer launched a 1051 00:58:09,760 --> 00:58:13,240 Speaker 1: new so Shaefer still in control, doing his thing after 1052 00:58:13,280 --> 00:58:16,920 Speaker 1: Pinochet leaves, and they're being investigated their kind of stonewalling, 1053 00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:20,800 Speaker 1: forcing police out fighting it in court um and he 1054 00:58:20,880 --> 00:58:23,960 Speaker 1: kind of continues business as usual, and in nineteen he 1055 00:58:24,040 --> 00:58:28,960 Speaker 1: launches a new educational initiative called the Intensive Boarding School. 1056 00:58:29,560 --> 00:58:33,280 Speaker 1: This was an immersive teaching program for local Chilean kids 1057 00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:36,240 Speaker 1: to study and live in the Colonia until they reached eighteen. 1058 00:58:37,000 --> 00:58:46,800 Speaker 1: Now this is bad, Yeah, it's not great. Like everything 1059 00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:49,640 Speaker 1: else Shaefer did, the Intensive Boarding School was away for 1060 00:58:49,720 --> 00:58:53,240 Speaker 1: him to molest a lot more children. Local parents saw 1061 00:58:53,240 --> 00:58:55,360 Speaker 1: it as an opportunity for their children to get a 1062 00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:59,480 Speaker 1: Western quality education and work experience for free, so they 1063 00:58:59,520 --> 00:59:02,800 Speaker 1: sent their kids to the colonia, and Paul Shafer molests 1064 00:59:02,800 --> 00:59:05,840 Speaker 1: and a lot of these kids. This situation goes on 1065 00:59:05,960 --> 00:59:09,040 Speaker 1: until the winter of nineteen six, when a twelve year 1066 00:59:09,080 --> 00:59:12,000 Speaker 1: old named Christo Ball smuggles a note out to his mother. 1067 00:59:12,320 --> 00:59:15,160 Speaker 1: The note read take me out of here. He raped 1068 00:59:15,200 --> 00:59:20,520 Speaker 1: me so yeah yeah, um, and this is the bridge 1069 00:59:20,520 --> 00:59:22,920 Speaker 1: too far for whatever reason, this is the thing that 1070 00:59:23,080 --> 00:59:27,400 Speaker 1: is the step too far. So she rescues him um, 1071 00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:29,800 Speaker 1: which was a dicey proposition, very dangerous thing to do. 1072 00:59:29,800 --> 00:59:31,680 Speaker 1: There's armed guards at all times, but she gets her 1073 00:59:31,760 --> 00:59:34,280 Speaker 1: kid out of here and once they're free, she takes 1074 00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:36,960 Speaker 1: him to a nearby clinic, where a doctor verifies that 1075 00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:39,280 Speaker 1: the boy had been raped this is the first time 1076 00:59:39,320 --> 00:59:43,200 Speaker 1: there is medical evidence of sexual abuse of one of 1077 00:59:43,240 --> 00:59:45,680 Speaker 1: the kids who was claiming that it's done by Paul Shaper. 1078 00:59:46,240 --> 00:59:49,280 Speaker 1: She did not believe local police would help her, obviously, 1079 00:59:50,120 --> 00:59:52,800 Speaker 1: so she flees to the capital of Santiago, and she 1080 00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:57,439 Speaker 1: finds the chief of Chile's National Detective Force, Louis Henriquez. 1081 00:59:58,120 --> 01:00:00,640 Speaker 1: We don't often have cop heroes on a show, but 1082 01:00:00,720 --> 01:00:03,040 Speaker 1: I will give Enriquez a lot of credit here. He 1083 01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:07,200 Speaker 1: is um a good guy. He does the right thing here, 1084 01:00:07,200 --> 01:00:09,720 Speaker 1: and it's one of those things where not a lot 1085 01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:13,040 Speaker 1: of most of the police in Chile are were fundamentally 1086 01:00:13,040 --> 01:00:15,800 Speaker 1: sympathetic to Pinochet. That's why they're willing to protect this 1087 01:00:15,840 --> 01:00:19,480 Speaker 1: massive child rape operation. But Louis Henriquez had been one 1088 01:00:19,520 --> 01:00:22,560 Speaker 1: of Salvador Allende's bodyguards. He had been there in the 1089 01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:26,600 Speaker 1: presidential palace when Ende committed suicide, so he was not 1090 01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:30,919 Speaker 1: a Pinochete loyalist um, and he gets he hears about 1091 01:00:30,920 --> 01:00:33,240 Speaker 1: what's going on, and he sticks to this case like glue. 1092 01:00:33,560 --> 01:00:37,080 Speaker 1: In mid August of nineteen six he succeeds in getting 1093 01:00:37,080 --> 01:00:40,400 Speaker 1: a judge to issue a warrant for Schaefer's arrest. Henriquez 1094 01:00:40,440 --> 01:00:43,479 Speaker 1: takes a team to capture the Nazi pedophile cult leader, 1095 01:00:43,720 --> 01:00:46,320 Speaker 1: but Schaefer's got a good intel apparatus, He's got cops 1096 01:00:46,320 --> 01:00:48,680 Speaker 1: inside who are loyal to him, and he gets warned 1097 01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:52,680 Speaker 1: before the raid hits. Bruce Falconer writes quote. A meeting 1098 01:00:52,720 --> 01:00:56,120 Speaker 1: was called on August nine to discuss what should be done. 1099 01:00:56,320 --> 01:00:59,920 Speaker 1: Schaefer seemed badly shaken as the Colonis discussed how to proceed, 1100 01:01:00,000 --> 01:01:01,880 Speaker 1: he kept his head down and never spoke a word. 1101 01:01:02,160 --> 01:01:05,760 Speaker 1: Shortly thereafter, he disappeared into the Colonia's network of subterranean 1102 01:01:05,800 --> 01:01:08,320 Speaker 1: bunkers and tunnels. It is widely believed that he was 1103 01:01:08,360 --> 01:01:12,360 Speaker 1: there underground when on November thirtieth, nineteen ninety six, Henriquez 1104 01:01:12,440 --> 01:01:15,200 Speaker 1: muscled his way into Schaefer's utopia for the first time. 1105 01:01:16,080 --> 01:01:19,200 Speaker 1: Enriquez had hoped to capture Schaeffer by surprise. He went 1106 01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:22,000 Speaker 1: in with thirty armed policemen in a caravan, but as 1107 01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:23,840 Speaker 1: his team made its way up the long dirt road, 1108 01:01:23,880 --> 01:01:26,840 Speaker 1: it was spotted by the colonia's lookouts, who gave warning. 1109 01:01:27,120 --> 01:01:29,560 Speaker 1: The caravan busted through a sequence of gates and only 1110 01:01:29,600 --> 01:01:32,520 Speaker 1: slowed as it approached the village itself. Henriquez had given 1111 01:01:32,600 --> 01:01:34,480 Speaker 1: orders to his men should they come under fire, not 1112 01:01:34,600 --> 01:01:37,320 Speaker 1: to retreat, but to move deeper into the village for cover. 1113 01:01:37,680 --> 01:01:41,400 Speaker 1: To his surprise, though resistance was minimal, the colonials were 1114 01:01:41,440 --> 01:01:44,640 Speaker 1: like zombies, or maybe like robots. Henriquez would later recall 1115 01:01:44,800 --> 01:01:47,840 Speaker 1: there were machines on off, on, off, on off. They 1116 01:01:47,840 --> 01:01:51,320 Speaker 1: didn't change moods like normal people. Though Schaefer's followers were 1117 01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:53,680 Speaker 1: generally subdued, at times they became aggressive and in a 1118 01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:57,400 Speaker 1: feuse cases they physically assaulted the police. Henriquez assumed these 1119 01:01:57,400 --> 01:01:59,680 Speaker 1: outburst signal that they were getting close to Schaefer, but 1120 01:01:59,720 --> 01:02:02,800 Speaker 1: in the in Henriquez and his police went home empty handed. 1121 01:02:04,760 --> 01:02:10,480 Speaker 1: Gotta be Yeah, what a thing to see breaking into 1122 01:02:10,480 --> 01:02:12,480 Speaker 1: this cult for the first time, seeing the way the 1123 01:02:12,600 --> 01:02:15,680 Speaker 1: people react to the outside world coming in. It's really chilling. 1124 01:02:15,760 --> 01:02:19,560 Speaker 1: Like the description of helly behaved and uh so, the 1125 01:02:19,560 --> 01:02:23,040 Speaker 1: obvious question is where where was he? Like? How did 1126 01:02:23,040 --> 01:02:25,800 Speaker 1: they was it? Was it that he wasn't there, that 1127 01:02:25,840 --> 01:02:28,720 Speaker 1: they couldn't they couldn't get to where he was, or 1128 01:02:29,520 --> 01:02:33,040 Speaker 1: we don't entirely know. The leading theory and Henriquez this 1129 01:02:33,080 --> 01:02:35,000 Speaker 1: theory is that he was there, he was very close by, 1130 01:02:35,040 --> 01:02:37,400 Speaker 1: but they had they had spent years building a system 1131 01:02:37,400 --> 01:02:43,280 Speaker 1: of underground bunkers, and he's underground, of course, right, Yeah, 1132 01:02:43,520 --> 01:02:49,240 Speaker 1: of course, this guy's got underground bunkers, underground bunkers and tunnels. 1133 01:02:49,880 --> 01:02:54,200 Speaker 1: God damn yeah. I mean, he's not an unprepared man 1134 01:02:56,080 --> 01:03:04,200 Speaker 1: to draw another boy Scouts comparison Paul uh So. To 1135 01:03:04,320 --> 01:03:07,680 Speaker 1: his immense credit, Henriquez sticks with the case for years. 1136 01:03:07,720 --> 01:03:10,720 Speaker 1: He executes more than thirty raids on the Colonia. They 1137 01:03:10,760 --> 01:03:13,440 Speaker 1: don't capture Schaffer. None of these capture Schaeffer, but they 1138 01:03:13,440 --> 01:03:15,760 Speaker 1: all get things. They all find evidence of what's been 1139 01:03:15,800 --> 01:03:18,600 Speaker 1: going on, evidence of the tortures, of the executions, of 1140 01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:23,000 Speaker 1: the child molestation um. Henriquez believes that Schaefer probably stayed 1141 01:03:23,080 --> 01:03:26,160 Speaker 1: underground for some time, maybe even years. We don't know 1142 01:03:26,280 --> 01:03:28,560 Speaker 1: when he fled Chile, but at some point in the 1143 01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:31,240 Speaker 1: late nineties he did finally leave the country. I guess 1144 01:03:31,280 --> 01:03:34,080 Speaker 1: I think Enriquez, I suspect a few of these raids happen, 1145 01:03:34,160 --> 01:03:36,640 Speaker 1: and he gets closer and closer, and eventually Schaefer's like, 1146 01:03:36,840 --> 01:03:39,320 Speaker 1: they're gonna get me. Eventually I have to leave, and 1147 01:03:39,360 --> 01:03:42,760 Speaker 1: he gets smuggled out. Life in the colonial changed little 1148 01:03:42,800 --> 01:03:45,400 Speaker 1: at first. One of his senior officers became the new 1149 01:03:45,520 --> 01:03:48,240 Speaker 1: leader um, and they try to keep up a lot 1150 01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:52,320 Speaker 1: of the old rules. But gradually things start to shift 1151 01:03:52,400 --> 01:03:55,520 Speaker 1: and change. Right, the molestation certainly seems to have ended 1152 01:03:55,520 --> 01:04:00,320 Speaker 1: when Schaefer left and things thaw a bit of Actually, 1153 01:04:00,360 --> 01:04:03,360 Speaker 1: the colonial adopts a democratic council of leaders. Now this 1154 01:04:03,400 --> 01:04:06,320 Speaker 1: doesn't work very well. It's dissolved very pretty quickly under 1155 01:04:06,360 --> 01:04:10,160 Speaker 1: intense debate. But gradually the close society cracks open and 1156 01:04:10,200 --> 01:04:14,160 Speaker 1: like normalcy starts to creep in. In time, some cult 1157 01:04:14,200 --> 01:04:16,800 Speaker 1: members started to break free of their mental programming. The 1158 01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:20,200 Speaker 1: Schaefer's hiding for years, and individuals who had been in 1159 01:04:20,240 --> 01:04:21,920 Speaker 1: the cult and who had been defending him start to 1160 01:04:21,920 --> 01:04:25,040 Speaker 1: cooperate with the investigation. Just like the I don't like 1161 01:04:25,120 --> 01:04:27,080 Speaker 1: the term brainwash, whatever is going on. Some of these 1162 01:04:27,120 --> 01:04:30,240 Speaker 1: people realize, like, you know what this was, This was bad, 1163 01:04:30,560 --> 01:04:33,880 Speaker 1: you know, UM. Some of them are probably people who 1164 01:04:33,920 --> 01:04:35,800 Speaker 1: defended him because they've been five or six when they 1165 01:04:35,840 --> 01:04:37,680 Speaker 1: came to the colony, or even born into the colony, 1166 01:04:37,720 --> 01:04:40,640 Speaker 1: and it it's not easy to overcome all that kind 1167 01:04:40,640 --> 01:04:44,400 Speaker 1: of programming. UM. So they start to give more and 1168 01:04:44,440 --> 01:04:48,360 Speaker 1: more information to Henriquez, who just keeps, like really doggedly, 1169 01:04:48,520 --> 01:04:50,800 Speaker 1: keeps going after this place, keeps trying to figure out 1170 01:04:50,800 --> 01:04:53,480 Speaker 1: what's happening, and gradually these people open up to him. 1171 01:04:53,520 --> 01:04:56,960 Speaker 1: They show Henriquez where the files from Pinochet's torture operations 1172 01:04:56,960 --> 01:04:59,680 Speaker 1: were kept. They hand over information that led to the 1173 01:04:59,760 --> 01:05:03,480 Speaker 1: larg just private arms cash in a Chilean history, thousands 1174 01:05:03,480 --> 01:05:06,120 Speaker 1: of grenades, dozens and dozens of rifles surface to air 1175 01:05:06,160 --> 01:05:10,320 Speaker 1: missile launchers like he's got a quite an arsenal um. 1176 01:05:11,120 --> 01:05:13,760 Speaker 1: And they also showed Henriquez the sight of the mass 1177 01:05:13,800 --> 01:05:17,360 Speaker 1: graves um, which again are empty, but there's stuff there 1178 01:05:17,440 --> 01:05:20,240 Speaker 1: that ties back to people who have gone missing. Now, 1179 01:05:20,440 --> 01:05:22,680 Speaker 1: one of the tips that Henriquez gets over the years 1180 01:05:22,760 --> 01:05:26,280 Speaker 1: leads to investigators moving Shafer's bed and finding a trapdoor 1181 01:05:26,360 --> 01:05:29,720 Speaker 1: hidden underneath it. In the secret chamber, they found what 1182 01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:33,920 Speaker 1: police described as an arsenal of fantasy weapons. The cult 1183 01:05:34,000 --> 01:05:39,640 Speaker 1: leaders private like weapons. Cash Um. He had three pencils 1184 01:05:39,720 --> 01:05:43,120 Speaker 1: rigged to fire twenty two caliber rounds, two pencils that 1185 01:05:43,160 --> 01:05:45,840 Speaker 1: could shoot darts. I think these may have been pins, 1186 01:05:45,840 --> 01:05:48,120 Speaker 1: and it may be a translation error because I don't 1187 01:05:48,120 --> 01:05:50,400 Speaker 1: know how a pencil could fire a bullet without the wood. 1188 01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:52,720 Speaker 1: Maybe it's a mechanical pencil. It had to have been 1189 01:05:52,840 --> 01:05:56,080 Speaker 1: if it's a pencil um, a camera that could fire darts, 1190 01:05:56,240 --> 01:05:59,160 Speaker 1: and several walking canes with guns built into them. Because 1191 01:05:59,160 --> 01:06:01,480 Speaker 1: Schafer was a very old man at this point, they 1192 01:06:01,480 --> 01:06:04,760 Speaker 1: found a walker that he had an electrocuting machine built 1193 01:06:04,760 --> 01:06:10,600 Speaker 1: into that could deliver shock. Weaponized walker. That's that's I know, 1194 01:06:10,720 --> 01:06:12,880 Speaker 1: that's pretty cool, right, can give it up for I'll 1195 01:06:12,920 --> 01:06:15,000 Speaker 1: give it up for that, and only that, for that, 1196 01:06:15,080 --> 01:06:21,360 Speaker 1: and only that. But the weaponized walker. All right, Look, 1197 01:06:22,120 --> 01:06:27,800 Speaker 1: we're fair here every now. It's incredible. Life in the 1198 01:06:27,840 --> 01:06:30,120 Speaker 1: Colonial did not become what many of us are likely 1199 01:06:30,160 --> 01:06:32,840 Speaker 1: to consider normal, but it did stop being a child 1200 01:06:32,920 --> 01:06:35,680 Speaker 1: rape cult, slash torture site. Which is all I've ever 1201 01:06:35,760 --> 01:06:39,240 Speaker 1: asked of anyone. Don't don't rape kids and torture people. 1202 01:06:39,840 --> 01:06:44,000 Speaker 1: Do one thing, Yeah, if you do one thing for me, 1203 01:06:44,320 --> 01:06:47,200 Speaker 1: don't be a pedophile, nazi torture rap And that's all 1204 01:06:47,200 --> 01:06:53,040 Speaker 1: I'll ask. That's all I'll ask. Yeah. So, meanwhile, Schaefer 1205 01:06:53,080 --> 01:06:55,200 Speaker 1: continued to be in the wind with a handful of 1206 01:06:55,240 --> 01:06:58,680 Speaker 1: his bodyguards. He was eventually tracked down, not by the law, 1207 01:06:59,000 --> 01:07:02,480 Speaker 1: by a Chilean t V journalist Corolla Fuintez, who spent 1208 01:07:02,520 --> 01:07:05,560 Speaker 1: more than a year tracking down leads. She eventually found 1209 01:07:05,640 --> 01:07:09,160 Speaker 1: him in Buenos Aires, in an expensive gated community. On 1210 01:07:09,240 --> 01:07:12,840 Speaker 1: March two, five, twenty four member swat team busted down 1211 01:07:12,840 --> 01:07:15,560 Speaker 1: the gate and entered his house. Fuintes followed them in 1212 01:07:15,600 --> 01:07:18,720 Speaker 1: order to make the arrest quote. I saw this old guy, 1213 01:07:18,960 --> 01:07:21,320 Speaker 1: very lost in space, lying on the bed. He was 1214 01:07:21,360 --> 01:07:24,880 Speaker 1: absolutely not dangerous. I remembered what the bars had told me. 1215 01:07:25,200 --> 01:07:27,479 Speaker 1: He didn't match the image of this bad evil guy. 1216 01:07:27,760 --> 01:07:30,080 Speaker 1: Shaffer did not resist arrest. As he was being hauled 1217 01:07:30,080 --> 01:07:33,040 Speaker 1: away in handcuffs. Shaefer only groaned and mumbled a question 1218 01:07:33,120 --> 01:07:39,640 Speaker 1: over and over, why why do you need a list? 1219 01:07:42,440 --> 01:07:46,080 Speaker 1: By the way, we must acknowledge that Corolla Fuentes is 1220 01:07:46,080 --> 01:07:50,640 Speaker 1: an awesome name. It's incredible and apparently an awesome journalist. Yeah, 1221 01:07:50,640 --> 01:07:53,920 Speaker 1: and I oh, I was gonna say, is Dwight Schultz 1222 01:07:53,960 --> 01:07:57,200 Speaker 1: still alive? Because maybe he could play the the older 1223 01:07:57,560 --> 01:08:03,640 Speaker 1: um uh Paul Schaefer m yeah yeah yeaph and and yeah, 1224 01:08:04,080 --> 01:08:07,800 Speaker 1: maybe a Walton Goggins could play him as a man. Yeah, yeah, 1225 01:08:07,960 --> 01:08:14,120 Speaker 1: Goggins is what this story needs to really really pop Netflix. 1226 01:08:14,160 --> 01:08:17,120 Speaker 1: It's already there was there was a movie recently made 1227 01:08:17,120 --> 01:08:20,360 Speaker 1: about the colonial But it's like a fiction movie really, 1228 01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:26,439 Speaker 1: yeah it's and it stars like big names. Yeah. Um, 1229 01:08:26,640 --> 01:08:33,040 Speaker 1: historical thriller, uh, starring Emma Watson, Daniel Brule, and Michael Nyquist. Wow. 1230 01:08:33,640 --> 01:08:41,639 Speaker 1: M yeah yeah big names directed by Florian Gallenberger. Um. Yeah, yeah, 1231 01:08:41,680 --> 01:08:43,479 Speaker 1: that's how you get for that. Yeah, Emma Watson, there's 1232 01:08:43,520 --> 01:08:48,760 Speaker 1: an Emma Watson movie about this. If if you I 1233 01:08:48,760 --> 01:08:51,840 Speaker 1: thought that's what this film needed. Um, I think a Goggins. 1234 01:08:51,840 --> 01:08:55,040 Speaker 1: Nothing against Emma Watson, but this cries for a Goggins. 1235 01:08:55,080 --> 01:09:01,439 Speaker 1: It screams to the heaven Goggin so um. Schaefer gets 1236 01:09:01,439 --> 01:09:04,120 Speaker 1: extradited into Chile in May of two thousand six. He 1237 01:09:04,200 --> 01:09:07,479 Speaker 1: is convicted of child molestation and sentenced to twenty years 1238 01:09:07,520 --> 01:09:10,759 Speaker 1: in prison. He receives further sentences after this, for possession 1239 01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:13,800 Speaker 1: of illegal weapons and for torture. He gets more time 1240 01:09:13,800 --> 01:09:16,200 Speaker 1: than he could possibly live for a number of different 1241 01:09:16,240 --> 01:09:19,479 Speaker 1: bad things. At one of his first interrogations, he is 1242 01:09:19,520 --> 01:09:22,120 Speaker 1: approached by Louis Peebles, one of the dissidents that he 1243 01:09:22,160 --> 01:09:25,599 Speaker 1: had personally tortured. Schaefer seemed to recognize the man again. 1244 01:09:25,640 --> 01:09:29,880 Speaker 1: He's very old at this point and he asks peebles like, oh, 1245 01:09:29,920 --> 01:09:32,160 Speaker 1: were you a lawyer who worked for us at some point? 1246 01:09:32,600 --> 01:09:35,880 Speaker 1: And people's response, no, I was once a guest in 1247 01:09:35,920 --> 01:09:39,040 Speaker 1: your home. You were very unkind. I never did anything 1248 01:09:39,080 --> 01:09:41,439 Speaker 1: to you or the colonial So why were you so 1249 01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:44,719 Speaker 1: cruel to me? And at this point Schaefer stops talking 1250 01:09:44,720 --> 01:09:47,559 Speaker 1: and pretends he can no longer understand Spanish. He can't 1251 01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:51,400 Speaker 1: actually even like for all that, can't even confront this 1252 01:09:51,439 --> 01:09:55,360 Speaker 1: guy and admittedly did to him. Um. In two thousand 1253 01:09:55,320 --> 01:09:57,640 Speaker 1: and ten, at age eighty eight, Paul Schaeffer died in 1254 01:09:57,680 --> 01:10:00,960 Speaker 1: a prison hospital from heart failure. Dr Happ, one of 1255 01:10:01,000 --> 01:10:03,920 Speaker 1: his chief lieutenants, lives in Germany today. They refused to 1256 01:10:03,960 --> 01:10:06,479 Speaker 1: extradite him to Chile to stand trial for his crimes. 1257 01:10:06,760 --> 01:10:09,680 Speaker 1: The German government has a policy of not extraditing citizens 1258 01:10:09,720 --> 01:10:14,240 Speaker 1: for most reasons pretty much. Um, so he's that this 1259 01:10:14,280 --> 01:10:17,599 Speaker 1: guy big part of it. Still doing fine, I mean, Germany. 1260 01:10:17,640 --> 01:10:19,639 Speaker 1: I feel like this is a good reason to Yeah, 1261 01:10:19,680 --> 01:10:21,400 Speaker 1: I feel like I feel like this would be a 1262 01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:24,000 Speaker 1: good reason if you're going to do it for any 1263 01:10:24,040 --> 01:10:26,280 Speaker 1: reason at all, this is the one I feel like. 1264 01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:30,759 Speaker 1: Nazi uh oh wait no, no, no, wait no. Chilean 1265 01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:35,800 Speaker 1: court in two thirteen, yet Chilean court um approved an 1266 01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:40,559 Speaker 1: extradition request, but as of two eighteen, yeah, that's Germany want. 1267 01:10:41,000 --> 01:10:43,559 Speaker 1: The Guardian article from two eighteen is Germany won't jail 1268 01:10:43,640 --> 01:10:47,280 Speaker 1: doctor from Nazi pedophile sect convicted in Chile. That's now 1269 01:10:47,320 --> 01:10:53,040 Speaker 1: there's a headline for you. There's a headline right there. Yeah. Um, 1270 01:10:53,080 --> 01:10:56,720 Speaker 1: if you're Germany, if you're Germany, you might not want 1271 01:10:56,720 --> 01:10:59,639 Speaker 1: there to be headlines that involved the phrase Germany won't 1272 01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:02,840 Speaker 1: jail doctor from Nazi pedophile sext. This is this is 1273 01:11:02,920 --> 01:11:07,000 Speaker 1: classic are we the baddies? The situation where it's like, 1274 01:11:07,000 --> 01:11:10,519 Speaker 1: oh wait where Germany? Look where we are? And that's 1275 01:11:10,560 --> 01:11:14,200 Speaker 1: probably how to get on this one. Huh does this 1276 01:11:14,240 --> 01:11:18,680 Speaker 1: look bad? Yeah? This might This might look bad. Um. 1277 01:11:18,840 --> 01:11:22,120 Speaker 1: Several of Shaffer's lieutenants have been convicted though, and wrought 1278 01:11:22,120 --> 01:11:25,200 Speaker 1: in a special war criminal prison in Chile. To this day, 1279 01:11:25,760 --> 01:11:29,880 Speaker 1: Colonia Dignidad still stands. It now goes by a different name, Paul, 1280 01:11:29,920 --> 01:11:33,000 Speaker 1: it calls it calls itself via Bavaria Um and it 1281 01:11:33,080 --> 01:11:38,040 Speaker 1: has rebranded. Yeah, you're gonna want a new name after that. 1282 01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:42,600 Speaker 1: Like that is like a restaurant in a theme park. Yeah, 1283 01:11:42,720 --> 01:11:44,920 Speaker 1: it's kind of like how the town of Auschwitch changed 1284 01:11:45,000 --> 01:11:49,280 Speaker 1: his name to Happy Town. The branding of this isn't 1285 01:11:49,320 --> 01:11:54,840 Speaker 1: gonna go good. Um, so they're now a tourist destination 1286 01:11:55,200 --> 01:11:57,960 Speaker 1: um for foreigners. They advertised that it's basically like, it's 1287 01:11:57,960 --> 01:12:01,080 Speaker 1: a it's an old German village from the century, frozen 1288 01:12:01,080 --> 01:12:03,160 Speaker 1: in time in the middle of Latin America. Come here 1289 01:12:03,200 --> 01:12:06,000 Speaker 1: and stay and enjoy the later hosen in the broadworst 1290 01:12:06,040 --> 01:12:10,120 Speaker 1: and the German dances. Don't worry there's no church. Yeah, 1291 01:12:10,160 --> 01:12:13,080 Speaker 1: there's no church none at all. Don't ask what there 1292 01:12:13,160 --> 01:12:16,760 Speaker 1: used to be here. Wow, that's that's a hard no, 1293 01:12:16,960 --> 01:12:19,280 Speaker 1: thanks for me. Yeah, I don't think I will be 1294 01:12:19,320 --> 01:12:21,840 Speaker 1: going there. I'm very excited to see Chile one day, 1295 01:12:21,880 --> 01:12:27,599 Speaker 1: but I don't think I'll be visiting Colonia Villa bavaria Um. 1296 01:12:27,600 --> 01:12:30,320 Speaker 1: In fairness, a lot of the people who running now 1297 01:12:30,360 --> 01:12:33,360 Speaker 1: were like victims of Shavers, right, They were kids he molested, 1298 01:12:33,360 --> 01:12:34,800 Speaker 1: and they're like, this is the only life I know. 1299 01:12:34,920 --> 01:12:37,519 Speaker 1: This is my home. Like I'm not going to say 1300 01:12:37,560 --> 01:12:42,040 Speaker 1: they shouldn't like, oh hey whatever, Like yeah, I'm certainly 1301 01:12:42,040 --> 01:12:43,720 Speaker 1: not the person to say, like what you should be 1302 01:12:43,760 --> 01:12:48,720 Speaker 1: doing is one of the kids who survives this swinging by. Yeah, 1303 01:12:48,760 --> 01:12:51,200 Speaker 1: I will not be taking a visit there though. Um. 1304 01:12:51,240 --> 01:12:53,240 Speaker 1: They have returned some of the land that was stolen 1305 01:12:53,240 --> 01:12:55,599 Speaker 1: from people, Um, including from the Catholic Church. They gave 1306 01:12:55,880 --> 01:12:57,479 Speaker 1: like gave back a bunch of the land that was 1307 01:12:57,520 --> 01:13:01,080 Speaker 1: taken under Shafer. Um and a bit of thank god, 1308 01:13:01,120 --> 01:13:03,120 Speaker 1: the Catholic Church got some of their land. But yeah, 1309 01:13:03,200 --> 01:13:06,240 Speaker 1: that was I know, you were really worried about those nuns. 1310 01:13:06,520 --> 01:13:10,040 Speaker 1: That's all I could think about Catholic Church. That way. 1311 01:13:10,080 --> 01:13:11,960 Speaker 1: We know at least some of the land is still 1312 01:13:12,000 --> 01:13:20,880 Speaker 1: being used to abuse children. This story a different way, 1313 01:13:20,880 --> 01:13:22,640 Speaker 1: and you were afraid there wasn't gonna be happy. Yet, 1314 01:13:23,120 --> 01:13:30,120 Speaker 1: don't worry, don't worry. The Catholics are still on the ground. Um. Yeah. 1315 01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:33,439 Speaker 1: The German state has offered a small stipend to victims 1316 01:13:33,479 --> 01:13:36,880 Speaker 1: of Paul Shaffer. It's like a few thousand bucks basically. Um. 1317 01:13:36,880 --> 01:13:40,240 Speaker 1: Although they are emphatic about this them giving the stipend 1318 01:13:40,400 --> 01:13:44,280 Speaker 1: does not mean they take any responsibility for his crimes. Yeah, 1319 01:13:46,120 --> 01:13:49,200 Speaker 1: no one's asking that. But you could have taken responsibility 1320 01:13:49,240 --> 01:13:53,880 Speaker 1: for like trying to get him extradited. Yeah yeah, yeah, 1321 01:13:54,080 --> 01:13:56,400 Speaker 1: that that makes it seem a little more like you're 1322 01:13:56,439 --> 01:13:59,200 Speaker 1: claiming responsibility. Yeah, that makes it seem like maybe there 1323 01:13:59,240 --> 01:14:01,759 Speaker 1: were some people in the German government who were involved 1324 01:14:01,800 --> 01:14:05,040 Speaker 1: in funneling money through this in order to protect Nazis, 1325 01:14:05,120 --> 01:14:07,400 Speaker 1: and maybe you don't want anyone looking man going timely 1326 01:14:07,439 --> 01:14:16,240 Speaker 1: into it. Um. I don't know, Paul, how you doing. 1327 01:14:18,000 --> 01:14:20,519 Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is the worst one I've 1328 01:14:20,520 --> 01:14:23,280 Speaker 1: done with you yet. Yeah, it's pretty bad. This is 1329 01:14:23,320 --> 01:14:28,519 Speaker 1: the worst one you've inflicted upon me. I really forget this. Um. Yeah, 1330 01:14:28,680 --> 01:14:32,360 Speaker 1: it's really like that is just every every aspect of 1331 01:14:32,400 --> 01:14:36,880 Speaker 1: the story is just true, horrific evil, and it's it's 1332 01:14:37,520 --> 01:14:41,559 Speaker 1: it's one of those things where you it's it's hard 1333 01:14:41,560 --> 01:14:46,560 Speaker 1: to fathom that this person is the same species as you. 1334 01:14:46,560 --> 01:14:48,599 Speaker 1: You know that that this is there are people like 1335 01:14:48,680 --> 01:14:52,280 Speaker 1: that that have walked this earth and and and currently 1336 01:14:52,280 --> 01:14:55,240 Speaker 1: walk this earth and maybe we'll find out um uh 1337 01:14:55,280 --> 01:14:58,680 Speaker 1: and even more hideous a person exists in our in 1338 01:14:58,680 --> 01:15:01,240 Speaker 1: our in our midst You know that somebody's walking around 1339 01:15:01,360 --> 01:15:04,679 Speaker 1: right now that's that's committing crimes like this. It's it's 1340 01:15:04,720 --> 01:15:08,639 Speaker 1: just impossible to wrap your mind around the the enormity 1341 01:15:08,680 --> 01:15:11,960 Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, it really is. But I will say, Paul, 1342 01:15:12,280 --> 01:15:14,519 Speaker 1: I have you on speed dial. If I do find 1343 01:15:14,520 --> 01:15:17,680 Speaker 1: a story that Santa Claus, we'll tell you what that 1344 01:15:17,760 --> 01:15:24,559 Speaker 1: might go right to voicemail. I'm gonna get a signal 1345 01:15:24,600 --> 01:15:28,720 Speaker 1: put up in the middle of Los Angeles. It's just 1346 01:15:28,760 --> 01:15:31,400 Speaker 1: a silhouette of Santa Claus with a pistol to his head. 1347 01:15:32,000 --> 01:15:41,560 Speaker 1: I'll know what it means. Oh good, Robert did more research. Oh, 1348 01:15:41,600 --> 01:15:48,559 Speaker 1: Paul got any pluggable to plug? I mean not right now. Um, 1349 01:15:48,600 --> 01:15:51,479 Speaker 1: I'm I've got some more live shows coming up in 1350 01:15:51,479 --> 01:15:55,400 Speaker 1: the future, but nothing that's uh that's available yet. But 1351 01:15:55,400 --> 01:15:59,200 Speaker 1: but yeah, follow me um on on Twitter at um 1352 01:15:59,200 --> 01:16:02,200 Speaker 1: p F Tompkins and my live shows are at Paul 1353 01:16:02,400 --> 01:16:04,840 Speaker 1: thompkins dot com slash live and I update that when 1354 01:16:04,840 --> 01:16:07,040 Speaker 1: I got a new thing. So um yeah, I'll be 1355 01:16:07,080 --> 01:16:10,240 Speaker 1: I'll be announcing things as they are announceable. Yeah, check 1356 01:16:10,280 --> 01:16:15,120 Speaker 1: out Paul's stuff. Um and uh, I don't know, just 1357 01:16:15,200 --> 01:16:17,400 Speaker 1: check out for a while, chill out. Everybody needs a 1358 01:16:17,439 --> 01:16:19,920 Speaker 1: little bit of a little bit of time to distress 1359 01:16:19,960 --> 01:16:23,280 Speaker 1: from this one. So we'll find a cat or a 1360 01:16:23,360 --> 01:16:28,840 Speaker 1: dog somewhere absolutely, Okay, who