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Speaker 1: Happy, Happy Monday. Everybody. My name is Kat, and welcome.

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Speaker 1: I am the host of You Need Therapy. I hope

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Speaker 1: you guys are all hanging in there as we're about

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Speaker 1: to round out. It's like the year that we never

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Speaker 1: thought would end. That also, somehow for me has just

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Speaker 1: kind of flown by. It's like where did it go?

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Speaker 1: And what did we do? Although when I look back,

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Speaker 1: I think I've done a lot, just different things than

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Speaker 1: I thought I was going to do, I suppose. But

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Speaker 1: I am especially excited because one thing I did in

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Speaker 1: was I spent a year doing this podcast. And this

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Speaker 1: week is the year anniversary of You Need Therapy. Wednesday

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Speaker 1: will be the exact date of our first episode, December six. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: I want to celebrate, so f y I. Wednesday, we're

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Speaker 1: gonna release another special episode of Couch Talks. This is

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Speaker 1: gonna be a Q and A, but it's going to

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Speaker 1: be a little bit more personal, and UM, I'm excited

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Speaker 1: about that because I don't answer a lot of the

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Speaker 1: personal questions that I get from you guys. I think

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Speaker 1: it's about time now. I just have to say with that,

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Speaker 1: how freaking grateful I am for everybody who's listening, even

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Speaker 1: if this is your first episode, I wouldn't be doing

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Speaker 1: this still if I didn't have a listener base in

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Speaker 1: an audience. And you guys are the best. And I

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Speaker 1: am so happy to see how so many people are

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Speaker 1: so open to learning about themselves, in their relationships and

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Speaker 1: honestly how the world works. And we aren't all out

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Speaker 1: here just trying to ignore life and the difficult parts

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Speaker 1: of it and the messy parts of it. We're trying

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Speaker 1: to move through it and go through it and face it.

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Speaker 1: And so I am grateful for you guys, and I'm

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Speaker 1: proud of you guys. At the same time. Also, I

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Speaker 1: have to say, I'm going to say this all again,

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Speaker 1: but super grateful for a lot of people, including Alex Booth,

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Speaker 1: who created this music for the intro. You can find

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Speaker 1: him at at Booth Tunes. I'm grateful for Amy who

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Speaker 1: found my podcast and decided that it was something that

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Speaker 1: more people need to see, and she gave me a

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Speaker 1: bigger platform by inviting me to be on this awesome

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Speaker 1: freaking platform of the network. And I'm grateful for everybody

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Speaker 1: at I Heeart. I don't know really any of them,

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Speaker 1: but they're really helping me on a lot and I'm

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Speaker 1: grateful for the producer of this podcast, Houston. Thank you

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Speaker 1: for really I mean, some of the episodes are quite

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Speaker 1: a mess before you guys hear them, So thank you

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Speaker 1: for you and what you do and all my friends.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm gonna stop because I'm gonna do this

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Speaker 1: again on most day. So I'm just really excited. We've

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Speaker 1: made it to a year and that's something worth talking about.

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Speaker 1: I think now onto the actual real juicy content of

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Speaker 1: this episode. We have more angiogram like praise hands everywhere

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Speaker 1: because I know you guys are loving this stuff. Now

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Speaker 1: that we have the basic understanding of the Instagram, what

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Speaker 1: it is, why we like it, what each type can

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Speaker 1: look like, now it's time to go a little bit deeper.

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Speaker 1: So thank you Katie for giving us the overview. And

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Speaker 1: now I have one of the experts of all experts

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Speaker 1: here today. His name is Ian Morgan Crome, and he

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Speaker 1: may sound very familiar to you because he not only

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Speaker 1: is the author of The Road Back to You, which

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Speaker 1: is a book that I recommend anybody to read. It

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Speaker 1: is my one of my favorite, if not my favorite,

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Speaker 1: Intagram books, he also has a podcast called Typology, and

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Speaker 1: it is all things inniogram. I highly recommend that as well.

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Speaker 1: He is like the person I think of when I

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Speaker 1: think of the Intagram. I've been to a couple of

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Speaker 1: his workshops, and I know just look up to him

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Speaker 1: when it comes to Instagram knowledge. So today I have

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Speaker 1: Ian on to talk about what happens and how each

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Speaker 1: number and type can respond and will respond to a crisis. Specifically,

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Speaker 1: we are talking about the crisis we were in today. Hello,

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Speaker 1: and throughout this episode you will hear how much my

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Speaker 1: sevenness can really come out, as you'll notice my mind

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Speaker 1: having like a million thoughts and questions the entire time.

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Speaker 1: I'm like bouncing off the walls almost. But I love

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Speaker 1: this conversation because I love when I get to be

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Speaker 1: the student in these and I love teaching people, and

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Speaker 1: I love talking about things that I'm really really knowledgeable

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Speaker 1: and confident in. But this is where I just get

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Speaker 1: to learn, and I'm learning with you, and I think

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Speaker 1: you guys are going to love learning what comes out

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Speaker 1: and this conversation. So without any more waiting, I want

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Speaker 1: to invite you to listen to and be in and

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Speaker 1: be with my conversation with Ian. Here it is okay, Well,

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Speaker 1: I have Ian Morgan kron Here an indiogram expert. Some

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Speaker 1: might call him the expert who he wrote The Road

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Speaker 1: Back to You, which is the book that I got

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Speaker 1: started with the indiogram on, then that I made everybody

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Speaker 1: else in my family get started on the Instagram on.

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Speaker 1: We're going to talk about all things Instagram, specifically crisis.

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Speaker 1: But before we get started, welcome, thank you. I'm glad

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Speaker 1: to be here. So you have a program coming out,

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Speaker 1: So before we get into all the meat of everything,

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Speaker 1: can you tell us a little bit about that. We

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Speaker 1: have now a background of what the Instagram is in

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Speaker 1: our heads thanks to Katie from last week. So people

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Speaker 1: I think are really interested in diving deeper into all

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Speaker 1: of that stuff, and I think this program might help

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Speaker 1: them do that. So can you tell us what it is? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Sure can so true you is sort of a deeper

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Speaker 1: dive into the antagram for each of the nine types.

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Speaker 1: And uh, what's cool about it is is I do

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Speaker 1: ninety minutes on each type. So you know, if you've

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Speaker 1: already heard about all nine numbers, you've had a general overview,

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Speaker 1: this is a chance for you too. In an a

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Speaker 1: la carte way, you can say, well, I'm a four

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Speaker 1: and so I'm just gonna buy the four module. Or

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Speaker 1: I'm married. I'm a four and I'm married to a seven,

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Speaker 1: and so I'll me get the four and seven module,

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Speaker 1: uh and watch those together. Or you can buy all nine. Right. Interestingly,

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Speaker 1: most people buy all nine, So you know, I think

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Speaker 1: that it's a really good opportunity for people to dive

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Speaker 1: deeper into the Instagram. True. You if you went to

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Speaker 1: my website, which is Ian Morgan kron I A N

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Speaker 1: M O R G A N C R O N

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Speaker 1: dot com uh and sign up with your email, you'll

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Speaker 1: get a you know, an email with a code and

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Speaker 1: all that stuff or the course. It's really great. People

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Speaker 1: have been really excited about. And what I think too

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Speaker 1: is I would want to buy I would definitely want

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Speaker 1: to have my wing to to look at that. But

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Speaker 1: I have miss typing anxiety. So I believe I'm a seven.

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Speaker 1: And I have obviously been proclaiming that I'm a seven

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Speaker 1: because I like being a seven, but I have fear

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Speaker 1: that I thought it was a six for a really

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Speaker 1: long time. And my mom, when she read the Road

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Speaker 1: Back to You, I asked her, I was like, what

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Speaker 1: do you think I am? After reading that she's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you're a four. I was like, no, I've never even

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Speaker 1: thought that, but now you have me questioning, and now

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Speaker 1: I don't think i'm a four, So I think that

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Speaker 1: I'm seven. We're gonna go with that today. I'm hoping

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Speaker 1: also to learn because I always find it interesting learning

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Speaker 1: about the different types and then learning about wings and

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Speaker 1: how to me sometimes the wings are to me the opposite,

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Speaker 1: like my wing can be the opposite of my actual number.

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Speaker 1: And when I learned about like an eight who has

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Speaker 1: a nine wing, I'm always very interested in that. And

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Speaker 1: it kind of like, I wonder, Look, what do you

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Speaker 1: think allows people to have such a strong If you're

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Speaker 1: at eight, such a strong I can make decisions, I

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Speaker 1: can do all this stuff. But then I like, I'm

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Speaker 1: go with the flow, you know what I mean. That

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Speaker 1: always drives me wild. It's hard for me to understand it. Sure,

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Speaker 1: So maybe just by way of just quickly, just talk

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Speaker 1: about what wings are and then I'll answer your question

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Speaker 1: more specifically. So you have a basic core type in

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Speaker 1: your your case, it's a seven, right the enthusiast, and

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Speaker 1: you have numbers on both sides of yours, so you

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Speaker 1: could have an eight wing or you could have a

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Speaker 1: six wing. One of the mistakes people make, and I

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Speaker 1: hear it all the time, is oh, I'm a four

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Speaker 1: with a nine wing, And I'm like, uh no, that's

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Speaker 1: I tell him, that's the scramble gram, not the angiogram.

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Speaker 1: Your wing can only be one of the two numbers

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Speaker 1: on either side of yours, right. That's why we call

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Speaker 1: them wings. And I think what you're describing is an

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Speaker 1: issue that lots of people have, including myself. You can

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Speaker 1: have what we call a heavy wing. You can have

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Speaker 1: a moderate wing, or you can have a light wing.

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Speaker 1: If you have a heavy wing, it simply means that

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Speaker 1: if you're av let's say you have a six wing,

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Speaker 1: that the influence of the sixth on your core type

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Speaker 1: is powerful. It's very very strong. It may be so

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Speaker 1: strong that you are ambivalent about whether or not I'm

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Speaker 1: a seven or I'm a six because the six is

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Speaker 1: so strong. You might have a moderate right or you

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Speaker 1: may have a wing that's so light you can barely

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Speaker 1: see any of its characteristic traits playing out in your

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Speaker 1: core side. And also, something else I try to remind

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Speaker 1: people of is that you really have two wings. It's

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Speaker 1: just that one is dominant. Right. I like to say

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Speaker 1: that you know, a bird with one wing just flies

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Speaker 1: in circles. You have both wings, yeah, and everything about that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you have a choice, I think, you know, like

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Speaker 1: I'm a four. I have a very strong three wing.

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Speaker 1: For a long time I thought I might be a three,

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Speaker 1: except I did not identify with its unconscious motivation. I

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Speaker 1: really identify with the floors unconscious motivation. But when I'm

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Speaker 1: writing a book and I'm doing a lot of research

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Speaker 1: and I'm hunker down alone, you know, I really just say, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I gotta lean into my five wing, where a lot

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Speaker 1: of those gifts can be found. I think when you

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Speaker 1: start to work with the Instagram consciously, like with real

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Speaker 1: conscious intent, you can make those kinds of decisions and

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Speaker 1: they really they pay off. It works, right, Like you say,

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Speaker 1: I do have this other wing that I can draw,

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Speaker 1: you know, energy and insight from and practices from. So

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Speaker 1: I hope that that answers your question. Yeah, and that

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Speaker 1: is helpful too, because I'm afraid of a lot of things.

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Speaker 1: But my fear and not like having the wrong number

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Speaker 1: I have. That to me just sounds like a six. Yes.

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Speaker 1: In fact, six are the people who have the hardest

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Speaker 1: time determining their number. Yeah. When I do workshops, sixes

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Speaker 1: will always wait till the end of the day. They

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Speaker 1: want to hear every single number before they make any decisions.

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Speaker 1: It's like they're afraid that, Oh my gosh, I hope.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to make the wrong decision. I want

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Speaker 1: to hear all my numbers, and then I want to

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Speaker 1: go around and ask other people what number they think,

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Speaker 1: you know, uh, and then yeah, because I don't trust

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Speaker 1: my inner compass to help me make that decision, and

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Speaker 1: I'm anxious about making a decision without getting some on

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Speaker 1: a validation from another source or maybe and hopefully an

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Speaker 1: authority on the topic, which I perceived everyone else is

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Speaker 1: more of an authority than I am. Yeah, that's that's

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Speaker 1: those beautiful sticks. Yeah, okay, So let's get into kind

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Speaker 1: of the meat of this and talk about I mean

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Speaker 1: or at the end of which I know and going

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Speaker 1: into one, I just feel like it's going to be

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Speaker 1: like a combination of the same year. But there's been

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Speaker 1: a lot of chaos and we've somehow found our way

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Speaker 1: in crisis for a whole year. So I want to

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Speaker 1: hear and learn about like the types and how some

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Speaker 1: people are living their best lives right now and killing

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Speaker 1: it and this is like their dream year in some scenarios,

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Speaker 1: and how some people. I mean, I'm a therapist and

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Speaker 1: I see all kinds of people. Some people are kind

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Speaker 1: of like the pandemic, I really like quarantine, and some

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Speaker 1: people feel like they are going to lose it at

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Speaker 1: any second. True, right, And so I want to talk

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Speaker 1: about like the differences and how some types thrive and

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Speaker 1: how some don't, and then how we can grow in

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Speaker 1: all of that. Sure we can, we can do that.

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Speaker 1: It was you were just saying that. I was thinking

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Speaker 1: to myself, I think everybody is living their best lives

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Speaker 1: possible to the extent that they can. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I just think I just think everybody is struggling. I

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Speaker 1: feel like our culture has sort of collective trauma, and

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Speaker 1: it certainly is showing up in lots of people's behaviors. Right.

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Speaker 1: It hasn't been awesome for for people. So anyway, I

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Speaker 1: have a lot of empathy for people that are are

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Speaker 1: struggling right now. I certainly have. I think for a

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Speaker 1: long time I was doing great and then it's like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm starting out to do great, you know. So anyway,

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Speaker 1: I've identify as a seven, like we have said, and

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Speaker 1: even I didn't hate it in the beginning, it wasn't

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Speaker 1: the worst thing ever. I think now at the end

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Speaker 1: of it, I'm exhausted and I'm just like want to

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Speaker 1: go on a vacation and like shoot off fireworks or something.

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Speaker 1: But in the beginning it was really easy for me

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Speaker 1: to find ways to make the most of it. Now

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Speaker 1: I'm just exhausted. So I think, I mean, even in

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Speaker 1: the typical sense of what certain types we're all at

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Speaker 1: the end of this year like, so, I think that

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Speaker 1: is such a good point to say we're living our

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Speaker 1: best lives to the best we can, absolutely, and some

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Speaker 1: numbers have better equipment than others to do that, like sevens.

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Speaker 1: You know, this is where the gift of reframing comes

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Speaker 1: in really handy, you know what I mean. Like for

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Speaker 1: a seven who's generally enthusiastic, very sunny, sees the silver

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Speaker 1: lining and everything, there is a point which, you know,

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Speaker 1: just exhaustion sets in and then some of those characteristic

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Speaker 1: features start to wane a little bit, you know, or

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Speaker 1: you go to your your number in stress, which for

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Speaker 1: you would be on a low unhealthy one. You start

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Speaker 1: to look like an unhealthy one. You become more moralistic.

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Speaker 1: You would start cleaning your sock tours and you know,

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Speaker 1: sort of making sure all the colors for a line,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean. You know, my son's a seven,

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Speaker 1: and I can always spot when he's in a bad

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Speaker 1: zone because he becomes critical, he can become judgmental, he

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Speaker 1: can take the moral high ground. He starts to be clean,

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Speaker 1: and my son starts, my seven starts to be clean.

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Speaker 1: I know something's ud the natural part of me, no,

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Speaker 1: because he's normally a yard sale. You know, there's just

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Speaker 1: always a million things in his wake, you know, So

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Speaker 1: that is everywhere I go. That is what my life

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Speaker 1: looks like. But yeah, I think that in the In

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Speaker 1: the beginning, for me, it was I'm not going to

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Speaker 1: get really down about this. This is going to be fine.

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Speaker 1: It's gonna be fine, We're all gonna be okay. It's

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Speaker 1: gonna last two weeks. I really believe that. And like

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Speaker 1: even with telehealth therapy, I was like, yo, it's not

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Speaker 1: that bad. Like there's a look at all these resources

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Speaker 1: we can use and at least we get to still

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Speaker 1: do therapy. Six months later, I'm like, oh my gosh,

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Speaker 1: I just want to like see a client in the flesh.

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Speaker 1: So I wonder, from your perspective, what numbers are, what

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Speaker 1: types had the hardest time in the beginning would you

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Speaker 1: have imagined, well, sixes would have had the hardest time. Remember,

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Speaker 1: the unconscious motivation of a six is a need to

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Speaker 1: feel safe and too insecure, And six is one of

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Speaker 1: the hallmark features of them is they are worst case

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Speaker 1: scenario thinkers. They're they're always thinking, what could go wrong?

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Speaker 1: How do I prepare for the worst. So sixes are

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Speaker 1: in the fear triad, along with fives and sevens. So

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Speaker 1: think of this way. Six is, when they're not doing great,

289
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Speaker 1: tend to be real pessimists. Sevens deal with fear with optimism.

290
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Speaker 1: So it's really it's they're just two different ways of

291
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Speaker 1: managing the same anxiety. You know, sevens will ignore what

292
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Speaker 1: the worst could have, you know what, the worst thing

293
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Speaker 1: on the horizon, whereas you know sixes are overly attuned

294
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Speaker 1: to what could go wrong and you know, so they're

295
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Speaker 1: both distortions. Yeah, And I wonder though when it comes

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Speaker 1: to crisis, because what I know about a six is

297
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Speaker 1: they're very prepared too, So are they in some ways

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Speaker 1: thriving in this year or would it be like, will

299
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Speaker 1: we not? That's too far to go. Well, the question

300
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Speaker 1: they would ask is am I prepared enough? That's great? Yeah,

301
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Speaker 1: I mean, okay, so I've got, you know, a year's

302
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Speaker 1: worth of gross reason in the basement, but I don't

303
00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:05,360
Speaker 1: have a bunker. Oh yes, you know, I'm overstating it.

304
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Speaker 1: But that's, you know, for the sake of illustration and humor.

305
00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:10,120
Speaker 1: But that's a little bit of what a six will

306
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Speaker 1: begin to question their preparedness. They are always self questioning,

307
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Speaker 1: well who is because I have I know so many

308
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Speaker 1: people who are like, you need to go get groceries,

309
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Speaker 1: and you need to get rice, and you need to

310
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Speaker 1: get beans, and you need to get a lot of

311
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Speaker 1: it because you won't be able to go to the

312
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Speaker 1: grocery store for a month probably, And I was like, what,

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Speaker 1: I don't I don't think I went. But at six

314
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Speaker 1: is the one getting all of that stuff? I guess, yeah,

315
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Speaker 1: and you're not getting enough. I mean sometimes a seven

316
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Speaker 1: and six couple or business partners things like that, if

317
00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:41,200
Speaker 1: they're both pretty self aware, they're awesome together. I do

318
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Speaker 1: a ton of corporate work, and I worked with a

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Speaker 1: company where the seven was the CEO, and the six

320
00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:48,280
Speaker 1: was the CFO. And the seven I got this big idea,

321
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Speaker 1: and the six is like, we gotta wait because otherwise

322
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Speaker 1: we won't make payroll if you spend all that money

323
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Speaker 1: on a great idea. And so they've just always balanced

324
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Speaker 1: each other out in a great way. You know, they

325
00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:00,000
Speaker 1: tempered each other. I think when I went grocery shop

326
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Speaker 1: been for the pandemic, I bought like fun food, like

327
00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:08,200
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, you boughts cups. You know. It's like,

328
00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:11,360
Speaker 1: I literally have four backs of races in my drawer

329
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Speaker 1: next to my desk. So that's what I got. I'm psychic.

330
00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:19,080
Speaker 1: I'm psychic. Oh that's amazing. You told yourself it was

331
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Speaker 1: for your clients, even though they were on unsum. You're like,

332
00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:24,520
Speaker 1: I gotta get those for my clients. No, I literally

333
00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:26,520
Speaker 1: bought them to put in the waiting room. I like

334
00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:29,160
Speaker 1: to buy the holiday receps because they're better. And this

335
00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:30,480
Speaker 1: is also what I did. I don't know if this

336
00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:33,120
Speaker 1: is just me, but they were three for ten dollars.

337
00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:35,680
Speaker 1: I just needed one bag, which was like three dollars,

338
00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:37,920
Speaker 1: but I was like, this is such a deal. So

339
00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:40,440
Speaker 1: then I have like six bags because like I should

340
00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:42,560
Speaker 1: get six of them, and now I have some clients

341
00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:45,520
Speaker 1: in the office, but yeah, they're mostly being eaten by me.

342
00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:49,840
Speaker 1: Oh that's hilarious. Okay, So what what do you think

343
00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:52,120
Speaker 1: about I mean with you a four? How has this

344
00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:54,760
Speaker 1: affected you? Like for what it force do in the

345
00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:58,560
Speaker 1: quarantine crisis time? So I'm one of those numbers who

346
00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:02,680
Speaker 1: tends easily to withdraw, okay, And I'm I'm very comfortable

347
00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:06,040
Speaker 1: being alone. You know, I'm what we might call an ambervert.

348
00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:09,960
Speaker 1: I'm somewhere between an introvert in an extrovert. But I

349
00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:13,280
Speaker 1: love silence, so it's it's not an issue for me.

350
00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:17,000
Speaker 1: But I love people. I can only take people in

351
00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,560
Speaker 1: reasonable doses, you know. I give be people all day.

352
00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:22,879
Speaker 1: Like when I do workshops, you know there're eight hours,

353
00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:24,800
Speaker 1: and so I may go from nine to five. You know,

354
00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:26,440
Speaker 1: I'm not a two. I used to work with the

355
00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:28,800
Speaker 1: two and he would be able to go out all

356
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:31,920
Speaker 1: night long after the workshop. He just loved the interpersonal

357
00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:34,080
Speaker 1: side of everything. He just wanted to be people all

358
00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:35,920
Speaker 1: the time. He got energy from it. And the five

359
00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:38,200
Speaker 1: o'clock hit and the client might say, Hey, why don't

360
00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:39,560
Speaker 1: you come out for drinks? With us or dinner, and

361
00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:41,760
Speaker 1: I'd be like, you know, I gotta be with you tomorrow,

362
00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:43,320
Speaker 1: and the best thing I can do for you right

363
00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:45,119
Speaker 1: now is go back to my room and be quiet.

364
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:48,399
Speaker 1: And that's my way of being loving towards them. Yeah,

365
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,040
Speaker 1: but I would be offended. Oh I'm so sorry. You

366
00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:53,400
Speaker 1: wouldn't because I put it in a way that maxisky.

367
00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:54,720
Speaker 1: And by the way, that's one of the gifts of

368
00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:56,960
Speaker 1: the angiogram is it would teach you that a four

369
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Speaker 1: some fours and particularly five, it's not personal. Yeah, it's

370
00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:03,840
Speaker 1: just I need to recharge. Yeah, I just don't have

371
00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:06,480
Speaker 1: that kind of relational steam. It's not that I don't

372
00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:08,960
Speaker 1: like you. I love you, But listen, I have to

373
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Speaker 1: do this with my kids. Yeah. You know, when they're

374
00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:13,159
Speaker 1: in my home for a week, I'm like, okay, I

375
00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:14,919
Speaker 1: got to spend an hour. They know that Dad has

376
00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:16,560
Speaker 1: to go to his room for an hour or two

377
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:18,679
Speaker 1: to read and be quiet and it's not personal. So

378
00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:20,919
Speaker 1: he can come back out late afternoon when we go

379
00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:23,320
Speaker 1: play top golf or something, and I'll be recharged and

380
00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:26,679
Speaker 1: ready to go. I think that's interesting, just because for

381
00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:28,879
Speaker 1: somebody who wants to go all the time, which I

382
00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:32,639
Speaker 1: also find myself as an extroverted introvert, like I like

383
00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:36,280
Speaker 1: my alone time too, but I find myself in spaces

384
00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:38,040
Speaker 1: where I'm like, why wouldn't they want to do that?

385
00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:39,719
Speaker 1: We've had such a great day. Why wouldn't they want

386
00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:41,280
Speaker 1: to celebrate the day with me at the end of

387
00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:42,879
Speaker 1: the day. But I think the key to that, as

388
00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:44,439
Speaker 1: you said, I would put it in a way that

389
00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:46,920
Speaker 1: was loving, and you would hear what I was saying. Yeah,

390
00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:51,320
Speaker 1: so you have enjoyed this time to recharge the whole year. Well,

391
00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:55,280
Speaker 1: I actually just got over codd No. Yeah, I got

392
00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:57,479
Speaker 1: it on a trip I had to take to Utah

393
00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:00,480
Speaker 1: and I had no choice. So my wife and I

394
00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:03,120
Speaker 1: both got it and we're you know, pretty darce sick.

395
00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:05,760
Speaker 1: So you know, I was sort of for about a

396
00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:09,240
Speaker 1: month out of commission glad to say we're pulling back

397
00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:11,320
Speaker 1: and I actually I can go out and be a

398
00:19:11,359 --> 00:19:16,119
Speaker 1: little less anxious about catching it. Um, yeah, because I

399
00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:19,320
Speaker 1: have some natural immunities. Now that said, you know, as

400
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:22,080
Speaker 1: a four I wouldn't say I've enjoyed it, because you know,

401
00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:24,959
Speaker 1: so many people have suffered. But I am, by nature

402
00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:29,159
Speaker 1: a person who's okay with silence and self reflection. I

403
00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:32,200
Speaker 1: don't run away from the voices in my head. I'm

404
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:35,359
Speaker 1: okay when I have not great feelings. And part of

405
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:37,320
Speaker 1: that is just the product of my having done a

406
00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:40,040
Speaker 1: lot of personal work on myself. And you know, I

407
00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,639
Speaker 1: go to therapy every week. I'm very attentive to my

408
00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:45,520
Speaker 1: inner world like most fours. And uh so that's been

409
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:49,639
Speaker 1: very helpful. What would you suggest to because my experiences

410
00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:54,840
Speaker 1: for as love therapy. Yeah, I have many therapists. I

411
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:59,560
Speaker 1: love therapists love us. I love them because that is

412
00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:02,359
Speaker 1: one I know. They're gonna come and they're going to talk,

413
00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:05,320
Speaker 1: and if I push them, they'll go. I'll ask them

414
00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:07,359
Speaker 1: to talk to a scarf, They'll talk to a scarf

415
00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:10,760
Speaker 1: and they'll start crying to the scarf. Like super easy

416
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:13,320
Speaker 1: to do a lot of really really important and helpful

417
00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:16,800
Speaker 1: experiential work with. So I love them and they love therapy,

418
00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:21,040
Speaker 1: and I would wonder what you would suggest how they

419
00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:24,040
Speaker 1: can take the qualities of their feelings to the best

420
00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:27,040
Speaker 1: of their ability through this, because what I've seen in

421
00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:29,760
Speaker 1: my experience with some of these people is it is

422
00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:32,320
Speaker 1: at this point and it depends on where they're feelings,

423
00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:35,240
Speaker 1: what they're going towards but some of them are it's

424
00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:38,240
Speaker 1: like almost become too much now because they're they've been

425
00:20:38,359 --> 00:20:43,199
Speaker 1: so feely for so many months, continuously about basically the

426
00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:47,360
Speaker 1: same essence of what's going on, and it's almost exhausting

427
00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:50,760
Speaker 1: now and a trait that they usually lean into. It's like,

428
00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:52,800
Speaker 1: I'm over it. Does that that makes sense what I'm

429
00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,080
Speaker 1: even saying? Yeah, I mean, I think the therapeutic approach

430
00:20:56,119 --> 00:20:57,960
Speaker 1: to that sort of thing isn't much different than it

431
00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:00,560
Speaker 1: would be at other times, which is first of all,

432
00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:04,399
Speaker 1: trying to help the four understand that their identity is

433
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:08,120
Speaker 1: not rooted in their feelings. You know, twos, threes, and fours,

434
00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:13,360
Speaker 1: all three of those numbers wrestle with identity. They have unstable,

435
00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:17,639
Speaker 1: you know, kind of identities, and that's why they're always

436
00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:23,200
Speaker 1: trying on new personalities or taking on new masks, right

437
00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:24,840
Speaker 1: because there's a lot of fear that if I don't

438
00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:27,720
Speaker 1: have a mask, there's nobody behind it, you know what

439
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:29,560
Speaker 1: I mean. It's like I don't have a sense that

440
00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:33,080
Speaker 1: I have an identity behind the projection that I'm putting

441
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:36,080
Speaker 1: out there into the world. So for fours, they over

442
00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:40,040
Speaker 1: identify with feelings. We oftentimes say about fours that they

443
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:43,600
Speaker 1: don't have feelings, they are their feelings, and so helping

444
00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:46,560
Speaker 1: a four understand that who they are is different than

445
00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:48,879
Speaker 1: their feelings, that they are not feelings, they are a

446
00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:51,840
Speaker 1: person having feelings. And I like to tell them I

447
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:54,160
Speaker 1: use the illustration you are the mountain, not the weather.

448
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:58,120
Speaker 1: And what that means is they're solid, they're grounded, they're

449
00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:01,000
Speaker 1: not the weather pattern. That's your feeling. That is good,

450
00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:04,040
Speaker 1: That is really good. Yeah. I borrowed it from the Buddhist.

451
00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:06,960
Speaker 1: Thank you Buddhist. So the weather comes in, maybe today

452
00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 1: it's sadness, maybe it's joy. Three hours later, guess what

453
00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:13,760
Speaker 1: you get a phone call, bad news, sad. Two hours later,

454
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:16,000
Speaker 1: someone calls and offers you a job doing great, You

455
00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:17,879
Speaker 1: know what I mean. It's like, but don't get hooked

456
00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:21,560
Speaker 1: to the feeling. Be the mountain, not the weather. And

457
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,879
Speaker 1: in another mantra I use with fours, is no emotion

458
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:29,240
Speaker 1: is final. Oh yes, yes, no emotion is final. That's important.

459
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:32,640
Speaker 1: And so they have to work on critical thinking so

460
00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:35,919
Speaker 1: that they're not always locked into their feelings as a

461
00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,800
Speaker 1: source of information or a way of processing the world. Yeah,

462
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:41,680
Speaker 1: you know that made me think of when you were

463
00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:44,520
Speaker 1: talking about one that's really helpful and too when you're

464
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:47,760
Speaker 1: talking about the two threes and fours, all having that

465
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 1: mask makes me wonder A three who is very mask

466
00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,480
Speaker 1: is their achievement and their job and their success. Well,

467
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:56,880
Speaker 1: a lot of people don't have that this year, whether

468
00:22:56,920 --> 00:22:59,639
Speaker 1: they lost their job or things haven't been going the

469
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:02,800
Speaker 1: way they were projected to, or they can't do their

470
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:07,199
Speaker 1: job because COVID restrictions don't allow it. What would you

471
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:10,040
Speaker 1: offer some of those people or how can what would

472
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,040
Speaker 1: you say to them? Because I just imagine that being

473
00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 1: really tough. It is tougher a three. Uh in particular,

474
00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:19,960
Speaker 1: though threes are you know, are incredibly adaptable people. So

475
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 1: for them to make the transition to zoom maybe frustrating, right,

476
00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:26,080
Speaker 1: and being in a home where there are distractions like

477
00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:29,119
Speaker 1: children or people around because they don't like to be

478
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,920
Speaker 1: interrupted when they're working. They will not be happy if

479
00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,200
Speaker 1: the kids are constantly running through and uh, you know,

480
00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:40,040
Speaker 1: the partner or spouses, you know, making demands on them,

481
00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:42,679
Speaker 1: that's going to be difficult for them. But you know,

482
00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 1: I oftentimes will tell any number Look, these challenges are

483
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:50,399
Speaker 1: opportunities for you to grow, as long as yourself aware

484
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:53,679
Speaker 1: and realize Look, this is a growing edge for me.

485
00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:57,560
Speaker 1: I have to learn as a three to be more present,

486
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:03,280
Speaker 1: recognized that other people's feelings are important, right, to be

487
00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:06,760
Speaker 1: adaptable in the moment, not to go, you know, under

488
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:10,640
Speaker 1: stressed into doing more working than usual from now you're

489
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:12,840
Speaker 1: just doing it from home, but you're really doubling down.

490
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 1: So I think for each type, if they think about it,

491
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,920
Speaker 1: they can tell themselves, you know, this is gonna be hard,

492
00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:21,120
Speaker 1: but this is also gonna be an opportunity to grow.

493
00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:25,280
Speaker 1: I'm forced to either grow or go here, you know

494
00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,440
Speaker 1: what I mean. It's like and choose to grow. Yeah,

495
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:30,879
Speaker 1: that is important to hear and even to repeat. You

496
00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,040
Speaker 1: can have a choice to grow or go. And I

497
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:35,919
Speaker 1: leaned so towards that because I think of my my optimism.

498
00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:38,320
Speaker 1: It's like, well, I don't I have two choices. I'm

499
00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:41,520
Speaker 1: going to choose the glass half full. That's easy for

500
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 1: me to hear, But I think it's important for everybody

501
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,720
Speaker 1: in this time to adapt because we can't control a

502
00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:50,159
Speaker 1: lot of what's happening, and we can control what we

503
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,600
Speaker 1: do with what we have. And so I think that

504
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:56,119
Speaker 1: is that's a great little statement you have. Also was

505
00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:58,840
Speaker 1: as you were saying that. Of course, my mind is

506
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 1: just bouncing, so bear with me in this. But I'm

507
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,959
Speaker 1: thinking about somebody like a nine. I would imagine they

508
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:08,320
Speaker 1: would be thriving, you know what. It all depends on

509
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:11,480
Speaker 1: the level of integration they have. If they're healthy nines,

510
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:15,840
Speaker 1: any type that's self aware, familiar with their patterns, able

511
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:18,640
Speaker 1: to step back and observe in the moment what's happening,

512
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:22,159
Speaker 1: and and then self regulating in some way, well, they

513
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 1: can do fantastically, right. I mean, there's gonna be some challenges.

514
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:27,800
Speaker 1: Some numbers will probably have an easier time than others,

515
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,600
Speaker 1: but to the degree that they're healthy. The healthier you are,

516
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:34,000
Speaker 1: the more resilient you will be. And you know, resilience

517
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:36,879
Speaker 1: is like such an important thing in the in the

518
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:39,760
Speaker 1: in life, you know, and oh you need a big time.

519
00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:42,440
Speaker 1: And part of it's hardwired. Some people are just more

520
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:46,120
Speaker 1: naturally resilient than other people for whatever reason. Right, but

521
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:51,040
Speaker 1: evidence based research tells us that everyone can learn resilience.

522
00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:53,640
Speaker 1: It's harder than being hardwired with it, but you can

523
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 1: learn it. I would say that any type can thrive

524
00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,280
Speaker 1: in this moment, but only to degree that they're self

525
00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: aware and they're doing their work with their type. Well,

526
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 1: and we've talked about on the podcast before, just talking

527
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,560
Speaker 1: about trauma in general and how we build resilience by

528
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:10,920
Speaker 1: moving through threats. So if we've never had to really

529
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:14,000
Speaker 1: turn on that system and our bodies will, it's never

530
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 1: going to learn how to work. And so I think

531
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 1: a lot of people have are afraid of going through

532
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:21,360
Speaker 1: trials and what we need to go through that kind

533
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 1: of stuff. And again I say that with the veil

534
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: of I try to view everything in the best way

535
00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:30,239
Speaker 1: I can. But that's just a fact of how we

536
00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:33,359
Speaker 1: move through our lives is to become resilient people a

537
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,720
Speaker 1: greater degree than we might be born. Some people might

538
00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:37,919
Speaker 1: be born with a little bit more. You have to

539
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 1: move through tough spaces, improve to yourself, Prove to yourself

540
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 1: that you can do something, Prove to yourself that this

541
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:48,879
Speaker 1: won't kill us. And it even makes me think about

542
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:52,479
Speaker 1: my nine friends who struggle with making just decisions in

543
00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:55,879
Speaker 1: general or speaking up for themselves. They don't really realize

544
00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:58,119
Speaker 1: that it's not going to kill them, and people will

545
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:00,359
Speaker 1: still love them until they do it, and then they

546
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,159
Speaker 1: let us love them exactly. I mean, the gift of

547
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:07,679
Speaker 1: the nine is they just radiate peace. They radiate that

548
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 1: old Julian Norwich quote, all shall be well, all shall

549
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 1: be well, all manner of things shall be well. Now,

550
00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:19,359
Speaker 1: when they're really struggling, they're distractable. If they're working from home,

551
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:22,560
Speaker 1: it's really hard for nines. They're not very self aware

552
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:26,000
Speaker 1: because they need structure. They like routine. They don't like

553
00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:29,639
Speaker 1: routine upset, they like the status quo. So that just

554
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,320
Speaker 1: are some of the challenges they'd have, you know, in

555
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:36,359
Speaker 1: the midst of it. And honestly, nines have less stamina

556
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 1: on the whole than any other number on the Instagram.

557
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,200
Speaker 1: And that's that's not a bad thing, right. I think

558
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:46,520
Speaker 1: productivity is overrated frankly, Um, I mean, I know that

559
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:49,399
Speaker 1: sounds funny. It's actually probably a good quote. I need

560
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,960
Speaker 1: to be careful, but probably is is worshiped in our

561
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,240
Speaker 1: culture in a way that I think it's very un Yeah, yes, yes, yes,

562
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:58,080
Speaker 1: And I want I want to hear more of your

563
00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 1: thoughts on that. I even talked about it's a while ago,

564
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 1: because in the beginning of Quarantine, it was all you

565
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,840
Speaker 1: saw on Instagram was how to be the most productive?

566
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:08,960
Speaker 1: How do you set your workspace up the best? How

567
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 1: do you do this? How do you do that? I

568
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,360
Speaker 1: even talked about it on somebody else's podcast and gave feedback,

569
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:16,280
Speaker 1: And then a couple of months later, I'm like, what

570
00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:18,640
Speaker 1: if we don't need to be productive this year? What if?

571
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,200
Speaker 1: What if the best we can do is wake up

572
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 1: and like actually put on pants instead of our pajamas,

573
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:27,640
Speaker 1: Like what if? Or maybe we need to be wearing

574
00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 1: ap pajamas all day? I put it in the terms

575
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:31,560
Speaker 1: as we're trying to like eat, pray, love and make

576
00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:34,439
Speaker 1: the most of this year and through it, when really,

577
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:36,639
Speaker 1: maybe that's not what we need. So I want to

578
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: hear what you mean by like you think productivity is

579
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:42,480
Speaker 1: overrated in what ways? First of all, is you know

580
00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 1: they're just constant ads and conversations around you gotta buy

581
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:50,640
Speaker 1: this journal or this new system for getting more done,

582
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:54,240
Speaker 1: more quickly, more efficiently. Here's the latest app for your

583
00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:57,240
Speaker 1: to do list. You know, it's just one thing after another,

584
00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 1: you know five the five ways to you know, get

585
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:03,000
Speaker 1: more done so you have more margin. It's like, actually,

586
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 1: most people do these productivity you know exercises or read

587
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 1: those books or use those tools. You know the goal

588
00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 1: of productivity is how can I get things done more efficiently,

589
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:17,720
Speaker 1: so I have more time not to be focused on productivity. Yes,

590
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,400
Speaker 1: but the problem is is that those people just continue

591
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,600
Speaker 1: to work harder. They fill their time with working just

592
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 1: being more for quote unquote producted and frankly, I mean

593
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:29,120
Speaker 1: I could talk a long time on this, because you know,

594
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: there's a lot of research about, you know, how much

595
00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: time you spend working in productivity and diminishing returns at

596
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 1: a certain amount of time, you know, etcetera. But there's

597
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 1: a there's a great quote by a woman named Evelyn Underhill,

598
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 1: and she says, you know, we spend most of our

599
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 1: lives conjugating the verbs to have, to want, and to do,

600
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: when the fundamental verb in the human life is to be.

601
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:54,400
Speaker 1: And I think we need to actually get some journals

602
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 1: and tools that teach us just how to be. You know.

603
00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:00,120
Speaker 1: That's why one of the best things that every I

604
00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:02,960
Speaker 1: can do, every type, and I so strongly urged this,

605
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 1: is to develop a daily mindfulness practice. I just think

606
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:12,800
Speaker 1: mindfulness meditation is for again evidence based research, right, It's

607
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,600
Speaker 1: just so clear that for us to learn how to

608
00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 1: live in the present moment, to be connected and grounded

609
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:22,080
Speaker 1: in ourselves, to learn how to sit and see our

610
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:26,760
Speaker 1: value just because we're actually in the moment nonproductive quote

611
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,720
Speaker 1: unquote we have no, we're not. There's no goal oriented

612
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:34,000
Speaker 1: activity in meditation, none, you know. And that's why what

613
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 1: someone tells me. I've had people tell me how do

614
00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:38,440
Speaker 1: I do this better and faster? It's like, no, that's

615
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 1: not this does not apply to meditation. You know. How

616
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 1: do I improve? How do I improve? You don't you

617
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:45,320
Speaker 1: get an a plus for showing up? That's all? Well,

618
00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:48,920
Speaker 1: I was gonna say the biggest thing I hear when

619
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,840
Speaker 1: I encourage people to find some mindfulness in their day,

620
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: I don't even care if it's thirty seconds. Do it

621
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 1: for thirty seconds. We can find more time as we go.

622
00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:58,800
Speaker 1: It's well, I'm not very good at that. I'm not

623
00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:03,280
Speaker 1: good at being mindful Mike, Well, of course you're not.

624
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:10,240
Speaker 1: But it's new, which brings a whole another thing. In adulthood,

625
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:12,400
Speaker 1: I think a lot of us won't do things that

626
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: are we haven't been doing our whole lives because in

627
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:18,440
Speaker 1: adults were expected to be good from the beginning. When

628
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:20,280
Speaker 1: we start, we have to be good as a kid.

629
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:22,360
Speaker 1: You can put a kid on a soccer field and

630
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 1: they can be horrible and we love it and we

631
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 1: think it's cute. But putting them on the soccer field

632
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 1: when they're bad is what allows them to grow and

633
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 1: become good. What do you think that is? And I

634
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:34,480
Speaker 1: wonder what types have the hardest time starting new stuff

635
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:37,800
Speaker 1: like that. Ones can have a lifetime struggle with it

636
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 1: because ones want to do things perfectly from the outset

637
00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:43,320
Speaker 1: that they could become anxious and worried. Well, if I

638
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:46,240
Speaker 1: can't do it perfectly from the outset, I'm going to procrastinate.

639
00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 1: I'm going to put it off because I just I'm worried.

640
00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 1: I'm worried that I won't do it right, quote unquote.

641
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:53,640
Speaker 1: And again, you see how that could help. But one

642
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, that's why it's called a practice, a

643
00:31:56,840 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 1: meditation practice. I just tell them it's perfect if you

644
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 1: show up. That's all you have to do is show up.

645
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 1: Another struggle for ones and meditation sometimes is the inner

646
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:10,240
Speaker 1: critic can really go off the rails. When you really

647
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:13,480
Speaker 1: silence the mind, quiet the mind, what you'll start to

648
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 1: hear those voices criticizing you should be doing this better,

649
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:17,800
Speaker 1: you ought to be doing this better, you must do

650
00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 1: that better. Your posture isn't right, you're not breathing correctly. Uh,

651
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 1: you know, gosh, why can't I get this right? Why?

652
00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 1: Why can't I go thirty minutes? You know, why do

653
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 1: I feel terrible sitting on this cushion, etcetera? You know,

654
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 1: too might say, you know, this is hard for me

655
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: because I'm such an interpersonal person. I love to be

656
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:37,520
Speaker 1: with people. You know, the twos have to do work

657
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:40,280
Speaker 1: on themselves in solitude. It's a really important thing for

658
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: them because if they're always around people doing the work,

659
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 1: they'll start helping other people to do the work and

660
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:47,040
Speaker 1: not do it themselves. So, you know, I could go

661
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 1: through all those numbers and say why each of them

662
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 1: would struggle with a mindfulness practice, which is to say,

663
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 1: starting on my mindfulness practice is hard for everybody. It's

664
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:57,840
Speaker 1: for different reasons. There are certain numbers that do better.

665
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 1: I think fours do better. I think fives do better.

666
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 1: I think nines do better with it. Sevens have a

667
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:08,520
Speaker 1: hard time because you have tigger brain. It's yeah, yeah,

668
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,040
Speaker 1: I mean, you know I know what I'm If I'm

669
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:13,040
Speaker 1: being interviewed by seven, I know what's going to happen.

670
00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 1: I know if I'm with the five, I know what's

671
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,000
Speaker 1: gonna happen, right, Sixes, you know, sixes get ansty their

672
00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 1: anxious types. Aids are like, I just want to you know,

673
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 1: this is a waste of time. I've brought such so

674
00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 1: much forward momentum all the time. So anyhow, Yeah, it's

675
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 1: it's a practice. And I think, going even back to

676
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:32,960
Speaker 1: the beginning of what brought that up, was the hardest

677
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:35,239
Speaker 1: thing that we have as a culture is to just

678
00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:38,000
Speaker 1: sit and to be. We're always trying to do and

679
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 1: make and create. I think that can show up no

680
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,280
Speaker 1: matter what your type is, just as our culture looks

681
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:45,880
Speaker 1: that way. And so I almost think of this year

682
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,800
Speaker 1: as like a big reset for us all to look

683
00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:52,440
Speaker 1: at what is important. If our to do list that

684
00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 1: we had I made last year because I write a

685
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 1: letter every year to myself at the end of the year,

686
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 1: I had so many things on this list that I

687
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:03,840
Speaker 1: was going to do this year. Is some interpersonal, some

688
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 1: just like relational with one person, some career wise. If

689
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:09,080
Speaker 1: I pulled up that list, I would like, I don't

690
00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 1: know that would be embarrassed. I think it would just

691
00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:13,320
Speaker 1: be funny. I don't think any of them happened. Maybe

692
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,239
Speaker 1: one of them happened. I'm not sure. But if we

693
00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:18,799
Speaker 1: cannot do all of these things on our to do

694
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 1: list and we're forced to look at this year, I

695
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 1: think we've just been forced to look at what is important,

696
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:27,120
Speaker 1: and that's to like be show up and be present

697
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 1: as a human with the people that we can be

698
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:34,040
Speaker 1: present with. I also wonder with the mindfulness, do you

699
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:36,120
Speaker 1: think it's the same thing as every type struggles in

700
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:38,320
Speaker 1: their own way being mindful, as every type struggles in

701
00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 1: their own way showing up as just like themselves without

702
00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:45,560
Speaker 1: offering something, whether it's my funness, my productivity, my job,

703
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:49,919
Speaker 1: my agreeableness, my assertiveness. Does everybody struggle to just show

704
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 1: up human as themselves without their stuff? Do you see that? Absolutely?

705
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:56,960
Speaker 1: And it's a lifelong journey towards showing up as your

706
00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:00,120
Speaker 1: true self. Yeah, I think that you know, certain number

707
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 1: do better at it than others. By nature, Nines do

708
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 1: a great job of just showing up as themselves. They're

709
00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 1: they're what you see is what you get people, And

710
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:12,879
Speaker 1: they're okay, just showing up in genes and and you know,

711
00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:16,200
Speaker 1: being themselves. Uh, And that's a lovely gift they have.

712
00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:19,280
Speaker 1: They have a lot to teach us, you know. So

713
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,919
Speaker 1: I think it's a lifelong journey towards authenticity. I think

714
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:27,439
Speaker 1: threes have the hardest time of it, but nines are fantastic.

715
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,480
Speaker 1: But we all have sets of adaptive strategems and coping

716
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:37,440
Speaker 1: mechanisms and defense systems that obscure our true self. They

717
00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:40,800
Speaker 1: obscure it. And so you know, part of the beauty

718
00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 1: of the instagram is that tells you what those things

719
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:45,880
Speaker 1: are and gives you a growth path to say, Okay,

720
00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 1: here's how I can begin to mitigate the influence of

721
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:51,400
Speaker 1: those strategies that I picked up as a little person

722
00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 1: and dragged with me into adulthood where they don't really

723
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,160
Speaker 1: serve me. How can I begin to sort of shed

724
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 1: those veils. I recently wasn't did psychodrama was a group

725
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:05,839
Speaker 1: therapy thing, and the therapist did this one. I'm sure

726
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 1: you do it, but it's a little bit of trauma

727
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:11,680
Speaker 1: work where she just I know this sounds of psycho therapist,

728
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:15,080
Speaker 1: but like a stuffed teddy bear on a chair. Right,

729
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:18,600
Speaker 1: step stuff to the drug here. And that's before you.

730
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I'm crying when she's introducing the concept and

731
00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:24,400
Speaker 1: she said, okay, so what I want you to do?

732
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: You know, I want you to come up here, and

733
00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 1: there's nine other people in the group, and I want

734
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:29,839
Speaker 1: you to tell me about some trauma in your life,

735
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:32,799
Speaker 1: things that were watershed, moments that were painful, that really

736
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:35,359
Speaker 1: changed you as a person. And every time I told

737
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:38,640
Speaker 1: one of these things, she put this very gauzy scarf

738
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:41,600
Speaker 1: over the bear. And the more scarves you put on,

739
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 1: the more difficult it was to see the bear. And

740
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:47,520
Speaker 1: by the time you got scarves, you couldn't see the

741
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: bear at all. It was completely gone, right, And that

742
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:54,839
Speaker 1: speaks to the things that grow up when we grow up,

743
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 1: things happened to us that hide we begin to create

744
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:01,640
Speaker 1: defense systems that hide our true self. And so that's

745
00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:03,840
Speaker 1: what the scarves represented. And then at the end of it,

746
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 1: she said, okay, I wanted to take each scarf off

747
00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:08,400
Speaker 1: and give it back to the person or the situation

748
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:10,160
Speaker 1: that gave it to you, and then you start peeling

749
00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 1: them up, and then at the end, here's this true

750
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:15,239
Speaker 1: self sitting on the chair. It was very powerful, and

751
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 1: I'm going to use it in workshops going out. Yes,

752
00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:20,239
Speaker 1: I have a bag of scarves in my office and

753
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 1: we do I do stuff similar to that often. But

754
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:25,839
Speaker 1: if you don't mind to ask you a question about

755
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:29,280
Speaker 1: that that exercise. Sure, how did you leave feeling differently

756
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 1: after experiencing that exercise? Well, I think there's something powerful

757
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:35,839
Speaker 1: about doing it in the group versus one on one

758
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:38,759
Speaker 1: in therapy. To have a group of people, um, and

759
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 1: I actually didn't know these people very well. We had

760
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 1: built very quick rapport because of the nature of what

761
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:46,359
Speaker 1: we were doing. And have people bear witness to your

762
00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:49,440
Speaker 1: pain and to the things that have come between you

763
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:52,839
Speaker 1: and your true self was very powerful. I think it's

764
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 1: a very powerful group of exercise. I don't know if

765
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:57,800
Speaker 1: I left feeling free of all that pain or anything

766
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,120
Speaker 1: like that. I always see these things as links the

767
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 1: long change. It's not like, oh, instant feeling, you know,

768
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:06,759
Speaker 1: it's like, no, one more step, one more step. So

769
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:08,919
Speaker 1: I don't go outside and think we're all the really

770
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:11,919
Speaker 1: good feelings right now. It's like they're there, We're gonna come.

771
00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 1: You know. It's a journey. It's not. And by the way,

772
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:15,920
Speaker 1: it's a journey that doesn't have a destination. You're never

773
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:18,479
Speaker 1: gonna find You're never going to get there in this. Yeah,

774
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 1: you're just gonna get better. Yeah, And thank you for

775
00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 1: saying that, because I think often we go into things

776
00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:25,719
Speaker 1: like that, and whether it's I'm going to go to

777
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,320
Speaker 1: a workshop or I'm going to go to residential treatment,

778
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 1: or I'm just gonna start therapy, and we think that

779
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:34,200
Speaker 1: after like thirty days, three days, I don't know that

780
00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:37,359
Speaker 1: everything is going to be different and easy and we're

781
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:40,279
Speaker 1: going to have no more problems. That's never it. It

782
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:43,279
Speaker 1: is a beginning of something that lasts forever. I will

783
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:46,640
Speaker 1: forever be in some kind of therapy, whether I'm going

784
00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 1: every week or I'm going once a month, or I'm

785
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,959
Speaker 1: going to workshops. I'm always on a quest to find

786
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:55,560
Speaker 1: the deeper, truer version of who I am because we're

787
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:58,280
Speaker 1: always experiencing life. So just like you put those scars

788
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:01,239
Speaker 1: on that bear, well you your life isn't over, so

789
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:03,880
Speaker 1: you're still having experiences that might throw a new scarf

790
00:39:03,920 --> 00:39:07,239
Speaker 1: on that bear. And by experiencing that exercise and having

791
00:39:07,239 --> 00:39:09,879
Speaker 1: the awareness and having the setup of help, you might

792
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: have your better equipped to be able to see when

793
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:15,719
Speaker 1: a scarf is being thrown towards you and whether you're

794
00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:18,200
Speaker 1: grabbing it and holding it tight across your head or

795
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 1: you're like, I'm going to give the scarf back to

796
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 1: this person. I would say that. Let's say you're, you know,

797
00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:26,640
Speaker 1: someone who has, because of some experience growing up, develop

798
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:29,759
Speaker 1: a lot of codependent traits, and you do this exercise

799
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:31,719
Speaker 1: and you do this work, it may be that you

800
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 1: don't you know, you're not going to completely lather and

801
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:38,360
Speaker 1: rinse all that codependency out of your psyche. Right. What's

802
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:41,560
Speaker 1: gonna happen is you're going to soften your grip on it.

803
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:43,480
Speaker 1: It's not going to be as tight now. You're going

804
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 1: to be able to spot when you're falling into those

805
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:49,920
Speaker 1: patterns and make new choices more quickly going forward than

806
00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,480
Speaker 1: you did in the past. Right. So that's how I'm

807
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 1: always like, you know, such, your such, your expectations correctly. Yeah,

808
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,200
Speaker 1: and I don't. I mean, you don't see clients one

809
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:01,200
Speaker 1: on one anymore, but you did in the past, right,

810
00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:05,360
Speaker 1: just as a therapist. Okay, So how often have you heard?

811
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:08,719
Speaker 1: I hear this all the time, and I work specifically

812
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:11,839
Speaker 1: with eating disorders and body image, so often what I

813
00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:14,040
Speaker 1: hear is when is this going to be over? How

814
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 1: long is this going to take? When is this not

815
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:18,160
Speaker 1: one of these voices going to go away? All of

816
00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:19,759
Speaker 1: this stuff? I hear that all the time, and I

817
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,480
Speaker 1: don't know. They most likely will never fully go away.

818
00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:24,960
Speaker 1: You're going to be better able to respond to them,

819
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:27,680
Speaker 1: and your like trueness of who you are and who

820
00:40:27,719 --> 00:40:29,319
Speaker 1: you want to be is going to become bigger than

821
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:33,279
Speaker 1: that disease self. But I think so often we want

822
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:35,879
Speaker 1: it to be lather and rinsed away, and I don't

823
00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 1: have experiences where that's ever really just been like healed.

824
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 1: That would be really cool if we could do that,

825
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:45,920
Speaker 1: but that I don't have that power. Right Well, you know,

826
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 1: as you know people in recovery, and I have a

827
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:52,360
Speaker 1: lot of personal experience with this. We go into treatment, UH,

828
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,840
Speaker 1: we come out, we have to continue going to meetings,

829
00:40:56,239 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 1: uh to meet with other addicts or alcoholics, or maybe

830
00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 1: it's an eating disorder group and you're in treatment for that, etcetera, etcetera.

831
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:07,680
Speaker 1: Because the disease doesn't go away, right, The disease doesn't

832
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 1: go away. You just live in a different relationship with

833
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:15,279
Speaker 1: it now it's not running your life anymore. By the way,

834
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:18,160
Speaker 1: I'm sure in your practice working with a lot of

835
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:20,440
Speaker 1: eating disorder people, and tell me if I'm right about this,

836
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:22,759
Speaker 1: you have a lot of Aniograham one. I knew you're

837
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 1: gonna say that I do, but you know what, I

838
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:29,200
Speaker 1: also think a lot of my clients might also because

839
00:41:29,239 --> 00:41:31,520
Speaker 1: I don't ever tell them what they are because I'm

840
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 1: not an expert in that. I think a lot of

841
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,359
Speaker 1: them are mistyped as well. But I do have a

842
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:38,680
Speaker 1: lot of ones, and ones are they can be challenging

843
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:41,160
Speaker 1: to work with at times because they wanted to be black,

844
00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:42,480
Speaker 1: and I mean they wanted to be black and white,

845
00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:45,480
Speaker 1: which is why they develop this kind of addiction. And

846
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,800
Speaker 1: it's also interesting for me as a seven when because

847
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:51,399
Speaker 1: I've struggled with my own eating disorder and in my

848
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:54,439
Speaker 1: stress level, I go to the unhealthy size of a one,

849
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:57,440
Speaker 1: which when I learned that, I was like, oh, I

850
00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:00,440
Speaker 1: always wondered why this is what I chose and it

851
00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:03,920
Speaker 1: makes sense now, but yeah, which which makes me even like,

852
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:05,799
Speaker 1: we're not going to go into it because it would

853
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,400
Speaker 1: be a whole another podcast. But addiction in the angiogram

854
00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:11,640
Speaker 1: is so fascinating to me because I hear so often

855
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:13,840
Speaker 1: that people are like sevens are addicts sevens or addicts

856
00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:15,920
Speaker 1: sevens are the most likely be addicts, and I'm like,

857
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,719
Speaker 1: first of all, we are all addicted to something, and

858
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:22,719
Speaker 1: I don't see that as a as a therapist, I

859
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:26,520
Speaker 1: don't see SEVENS as the most likely person to end

860
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:28,680
Speaker 1: up because I worked at a treatment center about an

861
00:42:28,719 --> 00:42:31,400
Speaker 1: hour away from Nashville for a while and when I

862
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:35,040
Speaker 1: started therapy, and I would could never say the majority

863
00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:38,319
Speaker 1: of clients were sevens. I think we all congravitate towards

864
00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:42,120
Speaker 1: addiction in our own stuff for different reasons. That's true.

865
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:44,799
Speaker 1: I see all types of people in the rooms where

866
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:47,800
Speaker 1: they're working on their recovery. I think that certain numbers

867
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:51,799
Speaker 1: are maybe a little bit more likely set up for addictions,

868
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:54,680
Speaker 1: and other types might say likely just more set up,

869
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,879
Speaker 1: you know. But because I also believe, you know, sort

870
00:42:57,880 --> 00:42:59,719
Speaker 1: of a little bit of a medical model, I'd say that,

871
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:03,520
Speaker 1: you know, there's a genetic component here and an environmental

872
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:07,640
Speaker 1: component here that will contribute to somebody being more likely

873
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:12,120
Speaker 1: to fall into either process addictions or chemical addictions, which

874
00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:14,160
Speaker 1: again I could talk to you for a whole other

875
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 1: hour on that, and maybe maybe in the future we

876
00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:19,640
Speaker 1: can do that. I would love to do that in

877
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:22,680
Speaker 1: the future. But before we wrap this up, one I

878
00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:24,640
Speaker 1: don't feel like and I feel bad because I feel

879
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:26,799
Speaker 1: like these people get left out. There's two numbers we

880
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:30,200
Speaker 1: haven't even touched on really, but fives one, I don't

881
00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:34,120
Speaker 1: know any fives. I'm I know maybe two I that

882
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:37,359
Speaker 1: I know, so in my like vicinity, I definitely don't

883
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:40,319
Speaker 1: have close relationships with them. I don't know why that is.

884
00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 1: It might be a natural thing, it might be a

885
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 1: mean thing. But how are five surviving this year? Have

886
00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:48,600
Speaker 1: Has it been easy? Has it been more difficult? Again?

887
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:50,960
Speaker 1: It all depends on the level of health. Okay, yes, yes,

888
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:53,480
Speaker 1: all depends on the level of self awareness of the type.

889
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:56,480
Speaker 1: I think. You know, you're a five and that sort

890
00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,800
Speaker 1: of average range, you know, not super self aware or

891
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:04,280
Speaker 1: not not super unself aware. You know, being alone isn't

892
00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:07,839
Speaker 1: real hard for fives. You know, being close to home

893
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:11,520
Speaker 1: isn't necessarily hard for fives. In fact, of all the types,

894
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:14,640
Speaker 1: they would find it the easiest. They tend to be introverted.

895
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,360
Speaker 1: They need a lot of time alone to recharge away

896
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:21,120
Speaker 1: from the demands of relationships. For that typically deplete them

897
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:23,920
Speaker 1: more than it does for other types. They love to

898
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:26,760
Speaker 1: research and gather knowledge. You know, at the beginning of COVID,

899
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:28,640
Speaker 1: I remember the friend of mine. I mean it has

900
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:30,759
Speaker 1: just been a month, you know that from the time

901
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:32,840
Speaker 1: at the start of the of the pandemic, and this

902
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:34,759
Speaker 1: guy knew more. I laughed, I said, you know more

903
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:38,960
Speaker 1: about COVID than Anthony Fauci. Now you have done you

904
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:41,880
Speaker 1: have done all the research, you have been out there reading,

905
00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:45,560
Speaker 1: you know all these obscure sources, and you know, it's

906
00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:47,480
Speaker 1: a little bit of a playground for fives, you know.

907
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:50,280
Speaker 1: And I don't want to make that a blanket statement,

908
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:54,000
Speaker 1: but I do think that for those five they put

909
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:56,160
Speaker 1: it this way, having to spend that time alone is

910
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:58,880
Speaker 1: just easier for them than let's say, for A two

911
00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,839
Speaker 1: or other types that are more personal than they are. Yeah,

912
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:03,840
Speaker 1: so A five is going to be doing all this

913
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:07,800
Speaker 1: research just because it's available and it become I guess somewhat,

914
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:10,600
Speaker 1: And this could be an assumption. It's interesting and it's

915
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:12,239
Speaker 1: the here now, and I can learn a lot about

916
00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 1: this thing. Six is going to be doing the research

917
00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 1: because they're freaked out. How are aids responding to it,

918
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:21,160
Speaker 1: or in general respond to crisis, Because I think of

919
00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:22,880
Speaker 1: them as like they're going to fix it, but I

920
00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:24,719
Speaker 1: don't know if that's they're going to tell me what

921
00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:26,640
Speaker 1: to do and what I shouldn't do. Well, you know,

922
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:30,320
Speaker 1: a true AID is kind of fearless and the danger

923
00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:34,080
Speaker 1: the danger of that is they think they think they're invincible,

924
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:37,360
Speaker 1: they think their bulletproof, and so that's a bit of

925
00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:40,160
Speaker 1: a danger. Um. I'd say. The the other thing about

926
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:43,920
Speaker 1: AIDS is they they're kind of they're kind of going

927
00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:46,760
Speaker 1: to be sort of a little led down when they've

928
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:50,160
Speaker 1: they've had two kind of exciting things. They've had an election,

929
00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:55,120
Speaker 1: very heated combatively you know election, and they had COVID

930
00:45:55,360 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 1: and which has had a lot of politicization and other things.

931
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:00,840
Speaker 1: I mean, they love a little bit of a conflict

932
00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:02,759
Speaker 1: and debate. Things may get a little cooler and they're

933
00:46:02,760 --> 00:46:05,920
Speaker 1: gonna be like a little bored because they don't have

934
00:46:05,960 --> 00:46:08,479
Speaker 1: a lot to you know, have an opinion about being

935
00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:11,560
Speaker 1: conversation about it with people who may disagree with them.

936
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:14,000
Speaker 1: But I think that aids who have they have more

937
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:16,239
Speaker 1: energy than any of the number on the Instagram. So

938
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:19,080
Speaker 1: if they're beginning to feel overly constrained or if they

939
00:46:19,160 --> 00:46:21,160
Speaker 1: feel this would be a hard thing for it's that

940
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:24,279
Speaker 1: others are placing limitations on them, they are not gonna

941
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:26,359
Speaker 1: like that. So I will tell you a funny story

942
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:28,880
Speaker 1: about eights in the in the pandemic. My mom is

943
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:32,680
Speaker 1: a very strong eighte. She's ninety. She's ninety two years old.

944
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:36,560
Speaker 1: And I said to her when the pandemic broke, I said, well, hey, mom, uh,

945
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:39,080
Speaker 1: have you just joking? I said? Have you do you

946
00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:41,920
Speaker 1: have COVID? You know? Or have you been attacked by COVID?

947
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:50,040
Speaker 1: And she goes, it wouldn't dare. Oh, man, I thought,

948
00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:54,879
Speaker 1: that's an eight for you. Oh that's good, that's really good.

949
00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:57,200
Speaker 1: You know. I one didn't know that they had the

950
00:46:57,239 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 1: most energy, but I think that and A along with me,

951
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:05,520
Speaker 1: the expectations of somebody like me. They're going stir crazy now,

952
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:08,640
Speaker 1: especially because their energy can't be spent on the election

953
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:10,719
Speaker 1: and all of that stuff. They'll be walking around the

954
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:14,160
Speaker 1: house working harder than just about anybody you know, and

955
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,480
Speaker 1: grinding away and uh, you know, after a while, all

956
00:47:17,560 --> 00:47:20,440
Speaker 1: of us need people, yeah, all of us. We are

957
00:47:20,520 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 1: social creatures. I miss hugging people. I miss face to

958
00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:27,560
Speaker 1: face time. Other people miss other people for different reasons.

959
00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:29,239
Speaker 1: But it doesn't matter what type you are. We are

960
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:32,440
Speaker 1: social creatures and we need each other. And so this

961
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:35,400
Speaker 1: is a season for empathy and for care. It's a

962
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:38,640
Speaker 1: season for understanding. I can't wait for everybody to get

963
00:47:38,640 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 1: off the crazy political media stuff that they're doing at home,

964
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:45,200
Speaker 1: watching the news, scrolling through Twitter. I mean this stuff

965
00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:49,560
Speaker 1: is toxic, watching conspiracy documentaries. Yes, and we really need,

966
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:54,200
Speaker 1: we really need to become people who see other people

967
00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:57,759
Speaker 1: as more complicated than their political position. You know, we're

968
00:47:57,800 --> 00:47:59,560
Speaker 1: there's so much more to us than these things. Those

969
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:02,360
Speaker 1: are a unions, that's all they are. They're just opinions.

970
00:48:02,360 --> 00:48:05,040
Speaker 1: They're not your identity. And so we we just need

971
00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:06,840
Speaker 1: to learn, all of us need to learn how to

972
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:09,720
Speaker 1: be more human again. Yeah, I think that's even a

973
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:11,960
Speaker 1: great way to wrap this up, is like all of

974
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:14,960
Speaker 1: us in some way are struggling in the end of

975
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:17,759
Speaker 1: this because of the fact that we were born to

976
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:22,200
Speaker 1: connect to people. Oh my gosh. Absolutely, And when next time,

977
00:48:22,280 --> 00:48:24,200
Speaker 1: if we ever have a chance to talk again, we'll

978
00:48:24,200 --> 00:48:26,400
Speaker 1: talk about addictions and that, you know, the opposite of

979
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:30,600
Speaker 1: addiction is connection. That's the you are, you are my people. Yes, yes,

980
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:33,400
Speaker 1: that's that's how important it is. We we you know,

981
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,719
Speaker 1: it's particularly people have insecure attachments. You know, we need

982
00:48:36,719 --> 00:48:39,840
Speaker 1: to get out there and be together and form attachments

983
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:42,279
Speaker 1: to other people, healthy attachment. And uh, when we're not

984
00:48:42,360 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 1: doing that, we're less than us. Yeah, how do you

985
00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:49,239
Speaker 1: encourage people, no matter what their type is, to connect

986
00:48:49,480 --> 00:48:51,960
Speaker 1: and grow in that attachment to the best we can

987
00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:55,040
Speaker 1: in the times we're in Because to me, when I foresee,

988
00:48:55,239 --> 00:48:57,120
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not I don't know what I'm talking

989
00:48:57,120 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 1: about when it comes to this, but I foresee things

990
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:01,520
Speaker 1: getting worse right now and the time we're in which

991
00:49:01,560 --> 00:49:03,720
Speaker 1: seemed like it was getting better and now it's like, oh,

992
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:06,239
Speaker 1: I'm about to go back to virtual therapy all of that.

993
00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:09,680
Speaker 1: So how do you suggest that we lean into connectedness

994
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:12,400
Speaker 1: and not so much into the scrolling through all of

995
00:49:12,440 --> 00:49:15,040
Speaker 1: the dangers and dooms of the world that separate us.

996
00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:17,359
Speaker 1: I go back to something I said earlier a little

997
00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:20,520
Speaker 1: bit differently. I think we need to work on the

998
00:49:20,520 --> 00:49:23,480
Speaker 1: attachment we have with ourselves. We need to become getting

999
00:49:23,520 --> 00:49:26,080
Speaker 1: more in touch with their own hearts, our own desires,

1000
00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:29,200
Speaker 1: to be grounded in them, because if we do that,

1001
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:30,839
Speaker 1: will be more prepared to go out into the world

1002
00:49:30,880 --> 00:49:33,640
Speaker 1: when the time comes to to form healthy attachments with

1003
00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:36,040
Speaker 1: other people. But we first have to do it with ourselves.

1004
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:40,680
Speaker 1: We need to forge what I call unconditional self friendship.

1005
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:43,719
Speaker 1: If you do that, then you'll be more capable of

1006
00:49:43,880 --> 00:49:46,879
Speaker 1: other friendships with with other people. You won't be if

1007
00:49:46,920 --> 00:49:49,600
Speaker 1: you don't have unconditional self friendship, you'll have a lot

1008
00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:53,560
Speaker 1: of trouble forging friendships and meaningful relationships with people. I

1009
00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 1: love that. So you heard it here. That's what we

1010
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:59,080
Speaker 1: need to do, moving into one which could look like

1011
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,799
Speaker 1: thank you for doing this. Yeah, yeah, you know, the

1012
00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:06,160
Speaker 1: optimist in me is like, it's gonna turn midnight is

1013
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:08,160
Speaker 1: going to happen, COVID's gonna go away, and we're going

1014
00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:10,920
Speaker 1: to start over. I don't think it's gonna happen, but

1015
00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:16,319
Speaker 1: that's what a little yeah I need to do that.

1016
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:19,520
Speaker 1: Thank you for doing this. I really enjoyed it and

1017
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:22,360
Speaker 1: learned a lot, and I would love to have another

1018
00:50:22,360 --> 00:50:25,480
Speaker 1: conversation about addiction. I also my brain, of course, it's

1019
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:28,799
Speaker 1: tiggering and thought. I've been dying to have a conversation

1020
00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:33,760
Speaker 1: with somebody about just our own like attachments and relationships,

1021
00:50:33,840 --> 00:50:37,560
Speaker 1: whether it be insecure, secure avoidance, whatever, and our angiogram

1022
00:50:37,680 --> 00:50:40,720
Speaker 1: number and if there's like a correlation with different numbers,

1023
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,280
Speaker 1: that would be fascinating. Do you ever do any worker

1024
00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:46,600
Speaker 1: conversations around that, you know, I haven't, but I'm always

1025
00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:49,279
Speaker 1: glad to get out there and process at Yeah, I

1026
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:51,440
Speaker 1: would love that. That would be really cool for me.

1027
00:50:51,560 --> 00:50:54,719
Speaker 1: So thank you for doing this. And again, how can

1028
00:50:54,760 --> 00:50:57,719
Speaker 1: people find the True You series and how do they

1029
00:50:57,719 --> 00:51:00,960
Speaker 1: find you? And your podcast which is awesome? Yeah, okay.

1030
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:03,600
Speaker 1: My podcast is called Typology t Y p O l

1031
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 1: O g Y. It's a podcast on which we explore

1032
00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:09,919
Speaker 1: the human personality through the lens of the aniogram. I

1033
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:12,839
Speaker 1: interview people of different types, which is so much more

1034
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:16,680
Speaker 1: powerful than me describing that type. To hear them articulate

1035
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:18,840
Speaker 1: what it's like to be them in the world is

1036
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:22,760
Speaker 1: incredibly powerful. Uh. And you know, just jump on wherever

1037
00:51:22,800 --> 00:51:25,319
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. It's easy to find. I have

1038
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:28,600
Speaker 1: a test on Instagram assessment called i e Q nine, which,

1039
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:31,600
Speaker 1: if you go to my it is the most accurate

1040
00:51:31,719 --> 00:51:35,560
Speaker 1: Instagram assessment available. It gives either a depending on which

1041
00:51:35,600 --> 00:51:38,600
Speaker 1: one you get, twenty two or forty four page reports

1042
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:41,319
Speaker 1: specific to you and your type. I think we linked that.

1043
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:44,399
Speaker 1: I think we linked that last week when we did

1044
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:46,799
Speaker 1: the Instagram I think we linked to your tests. Great,

1045
00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,239
Speaker 1: thank you so much again. Then obviously my book The

1046
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:52,440
Speaker 1: Road Back to You, an Instagram Journey to self discovery.

1047
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:55,239
Speaker 1: And then Finally, you can get all that time from

1048
00:51:55,280 --> 00:51:57,920
Speaker 1: my email list, find the true U course all my

1049
00:51:57,960 --> 00:52:01,360
Speaker 1: website which is E M I A N. Morgan M

1050
00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:05,160
Speaker 1: r G A N Cron c r o N dot com. Awesome,

1051
00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:10,560
Speaker 1: Thank you M.