WEBVTT - From the Vault: Blood Squirting From the Lizard’s Eye, Part 1 0:00:06.120 --> 0:00:08.560 Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. This is 0:00:08.640 --> 0:00:11.399 Robert Lamb. Today is Saturday, so we have an older 0:00:11.400 --> 0:00:13.360 episode of Stuff to Blow Your Mind to share with 0:00:13.440 --> 0:00:16.800 you here. This one was originally published eight thirteen, twenty 0:00:16.840 --> 0:00:19.919 twenty four. It is Blood Squirting from the Lizard's Eye, 0:00:20.239 --> 0:00:28.400 Part one. 0:00:24.600 --> 0:00:28.320 Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:34.440 --> 0:00:36.960 Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My name 0:00:37.000 --> 0:00:38.040 is Robert Lamb. 0:00:38.000 --> 0:00:41.080 And I am Joe McCormick. And today on Stuff to 0:00:41.120 --> 0:00:43.400 Blow Your Mind, we are going to be talking about 0:00:43.400 --> 0:00:48.919 an animal, about the horned lizard or frenosoma, a genus 0:00:48.920 --> 0:00:52.239 of lizard native to North America, also known as horned 0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:55.720 toads or horny toads. From what I've been reading, I 0:00:55.720 --> 0:00:58.480 think the people in the biological sciences prefer the more 0:00:58.520 --> 0:01:02.800 accurate lizard, applely because they are certainly not toads, though 0:01:03.080 --> 0:01:06.679 there are reasons for calling them toads, mainly that they 0:01:06.720 --> 0:01:07.560 look like toads. 0:01:07.959 --> 0:01:10.319 Now, we're going to probably try and stick to horned lizard. 0:01:10.760 --> 0:01:13.240 I'm probably going to say horned lizard because I like 0:01:13.319 --> 0:01:16.760 using the more antiquated term and it sounds more demonic. 0:01:17.319 --> 0:01:21.000 But we also might say, horny toad, horned toad, horn toad, 0:01:21.400 --> 0:01:22.119 and so forth. 0:01:22.240 --> 0:01:26.520 Throughout the episode, Horned Lizard makes me think learned lizard. 0:01:27.600 --> 0:01:29.520 You know, doesn't it suggest a kind of wisdom? 0:01:29.800 --> 0:01:34.240 Yeah? Yeah, sometimes lizards can appear quite wise, so I 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:34.720 buy that. 0:01:35.240 --> 0:01:37.160 And in fact, you might even think about some of 0:01:37.160 --> 0:01:41.200 the species of horned lizards as especially wise or discerning 0:01:41.280 --> 0:01:44.920 among the reptile kind, because they, as we get into 0:01:45.040 --> 0:01:48.480 later in this episode, they have some anti predator strategies 0:01:48.800 --> 0:01:52.160 that really require snap judgment calls about say what type 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:53.600 of predator you're dealing with? 0:01:54.000 --> 0:01:55.520 That's right? And I don't know if we'll get into 0:01:55.560 --> 0:01:58.120 it in this episode or the next, but among the Navajo, 0:01:58.280 --> 0:02:02.080 among the DNA people, they're sometimes called grandfather, so I 0:02:02.080 --> 0:02:04.720 think there is often that vibe of maybe sort of 0:02:04.720 --> 0:02:06.760 wisdom and power to them. 0:02:07.120 --> 0:02:09.240 Though I have to admit I did come to this 0:02:09.360 --> 0:02:13.200 topic through more base and if you know, us predictable routes. 0:02:13.480 --> 0:02:17.520 So my window into talking about horned lizards was the 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:20.239 fact that for sci fi horror nerds like us, it's 0:02:20.280 --> 0:02:22.239 alien summer. Would you agree, Rob. 0:02:22.320 --> 0:02:24.960 Oh, yeah, it's been an alien summer for me. We've 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:28.720 been chatting about alien movies and the upcoming alien movie. 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:30.359 So yeah, there's a lot of excitement in the air. 0:02:30.520 --> 0:02:32.880 Yeah, there's a new alien movie coming out in theaters 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:36.519 later this week, Alien Romulus. Of course, there's no guarantee 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:38.160 ahead of time it's going to be good. I don't 0:02:38.160 --> 0:02:41.760 think they've even released the critics embargo yet. But I'm 0:02:41.840 --> 0:02:46.240 just recklessly letting myself get excited regardless tempering expectations is 0:02:46.240 --> 0:02:46.800 for the week. 0:02:47.160 --> 0:02:50.080 That's right, Say yes to Xenomorph and then figure the 0:02:50.120 --> 0:02:50.840 rest out later. 0:02:52.440 --> 0:02:55.320 You know, if I'm disappointed, I'm disappointed, It'll be okay. 0:02:56.120 --> 0:02:58.280 So we've had Aliens on the brain for a few 0:02:58.320 --> 0:03:01.280 months here, and we've covered a couple of Aliens copycat 0:03:01.280 --> 0:03:03.519 movies on Weird House Cinema. We'll probably do at least 0:03:03.560 --> 0:03:05.200 one more, I think that's right. 0:03:05.440 --> 0:03:08.280 We also had a seven part Monster Fact series on 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:11.040 the various creatures and organisms of the alien universe, with 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:12.560 part seven publishing this week. 0:03:12.800 --> 0:03:16.000 Mm hmm. But so we've got all this excitement running 0:03:16.040 --> 0:03:18.840 through us, and I was looking to find some real 0:03:18.880 --> 0:03:21.959 world biology to cover that had parallels an alien. We've 0:03:21.960 --> 0:03:24.480 already done a lot of topics along these lines in 0:03:24.480 --> 0:03:29.320 the past, and the idea of the xenomorph's weaponized blood 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:32.160 took hold. So in the Alien movies if you haven't 0:03:32.160 --> 0:03:36.920 seen them, the creature in these movies has extremely potent 0:03:37.120 --> 0:03:41.560 acid for blood, which appears to serve as a defense strategy. 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:44.840 So if you cause injury to one of the Xenomorphs, 0:03:44.880 --> 0:03:47.320 you are likely to get some of its blood on 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:51.880 yourself or on your critical infrastructure, such as the inside 0:03:51.880 --> 0:03:55.000 of your spacecraft hull, and that blood will burn through 0:03:55.040 --> 0:03:58.000 bodies and space ships alike. So, as observed by the 0:03:58.080 --> 0:04:01.800 characters in the first movie, there's real danger in injuring 0:04:01.800 --> 0:04:03.120 the creature. How do you fight it? 0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:06.440 That's right. It's also worth pointing out that there is 0:04:06.480 --> 0:04:11.440 at least some acid fluid as projectile in the xenomorph world. 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:14.800 The most, I would say, I guess the key example 0:04:14.800 --> 0:04:17.680 would be in nineteen seventy nine's Alien the first film, 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:20.960 as we see that emergent face hugger seem to use 0:04:21.000 --> 0:04:24.760 acidic secretions to burn through Caine's helmet in order to 0:04:24.839 --> 0:04:29.040 access his face. Now, naturally, given that certain wounds, especially 0:04:29.120 --> 0:04:31.320 lethal wounds to a Xenomorph, could result in a jet 0:04:31.360 --> 0:04:34.240 of acidic blood, we could easily classify that as a 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:37.880 form of defensive spray, and then in Alien three and 0:04:38.040 --> 0:04:41.640 Alien Resurrection, the third and fourth movies in the franchise, 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:46.080 we actually see xenomorphs using an offensive acid spray attack, 0:04:46.600 --> 0:04:48.719 And of course this has also been used to various 0:04:48.720 --> 0:04:52.360 effects in Alien video games for ranged enemies, as well 0:04:52.400 --> 0:04:56.000 as in Alien comic books and so forth. Also worth 0:04:56.000 --> 0:04:58.800 pointing out that, given our current Mortal Kombat discussions on 0:04:58.839 --> 0:05:01.960 Weird House Cinema, the acid spit is one of the 0:05:01.960 --> 0:05:05.080 signature moves of the green clad Ninja reptile. 0:05:05.440 --> 0:05:07.800 Is it really a spit because the animation looks to 0:05:07.839 --> 0:05:09.640 me more like projectile vomit. 0:05:10.720 --> 0:05:13.040 I think it depends. At least in the first game. 0:05:13.080 --> 0:05:15.320 He was in Mortal Kombat too, he would definitely spit. 0:05:15.920 --> 0:05:18.720 It was like a kind of a sound over and 0:05:18.720 --> 0:05:20.640 over again, and I think it got a little more 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:21.720 vomity later on. 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:25.960 Okay, Now, of course, it's fairly common in the natural 0:05:26.000 --> 0:05:29.080 world to find animals that produce some kind of toxic 0:05:29.120 --> 0:05:33.600 defensive fluid that they use to protect themselves against predators 0:05:33.720 --> 0:05:38.400 or attack prey. But what seemed less common, though perhaps 0:05:38.600 --> 0:05:41.880 more common than you would think, was that the defensive 0:05:41.920 --> 0:05:45.760 fluid in question was actually the animal's own blood. 0:05:46.120 --> 0:05:47.839 That's right, because a part of the logic here, of course, 0:05:47.920 --> 0:05:49.880 is we tend to think vampire like when we think 0:05:49.880 --> 0:05:52.440 about an organism's blood. Right, it's part of the prize, 0:05:52.480 --> 0:05:55.960 it's part of the predator's claim. So broadly speaking, it would, 0:05:55.960 --> 0:05:58.320 on the surface anyway, seem illogical to think that a 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:01.000 predator could be harmed by blood of its prey. 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:04.800 But here is where the horned lizard comes in. If 0:06:04.800 --> 0:06:07.560 you know one thing about the horned lizard, it is 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:12.280 probably that these various species of lizards have a defensive 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:16.040 adaptation of squirting blood out of their eyes. 0:06:16.640 --> 0:06:18.760 That's right. They're kind of Internet famous for this, a 0:06:18.760 --> 0:06:22.120 lot of clips, a lot of a lot of animations 0:06:22.120 --> 0:06:25.240 and videos. I should also add that if you know 0:06:25.320 --> 0:06:27.440 one thing, you should probably know two things. Also, that 0:06:27.440 --> 0:06:31.080 there to some extent horned up, right, because right, I 0:06:31.200 --> 0:06:33.159 call them horned lizards, right. 0:06:33.600 --> 0:06:36.560 But while lots of animals are spiky or horned in 0:06:36.560 --> 0:06:39.000 some way, I would say that the blood squirting out 0:06:39.040 --> 0:06:42.839 of the eyes is such a shocking behavior, such a 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:48.960 bizarre and seemingly rare adaptation, that you would almost have 0:06:49.040 --> 0:06:51.359 to wonder if it's not real, Like, is that something 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:54.120 people just made up or does that really happen? And 0:06:54.160 --> 0:06:55.880 according to the author of a book that I'm going 0:06:55.960 --> 0:06:59.200 to cite in this episode, reports of it have sometimes 0:06:59.200 --> 0:07:02.640 in the past been dismissed as tall tales, but they're 0:07:02.680 --> 0:07:06.880 not tall tales. The Horned Blizzard's weaponized blood is absolutely real, 0:07:07.040 --> 0:07:10.400 and it is the subject of some interesting scientific investigation. 0:07:11.040 --> 0:07:12.400 So this is going to be really fun to get 0:07:12.440 --> 0:07:15.880 into now. When we were doing our pre research, though, Joe, 0:07:15.880 --> 0:07:18.440 you brought up a resource that we've looked to in 0:07:18.480 --> 0:07:22.480 the past, and that's the California herbs dot com website 0:07:22.760 --> 0:07:24.600 where they have a wonderful I mean it's not just 0:07:24.640 --> 0:07:28.200 about this, but they have a huge listing of various 0:07:28.920 --> 0:07:33.240 herp appearances in various films, many of which are very 0:07:33.320 --> 0:07:38.760 much in the domain of weird house cinema meaning reptiles, yes, yeah, yeah, 0:07:38.800 --> 0:07:44.200 for herpetologist cinema files. And they have a list there 0:07:44.240 --> 0:07:47.320 that you shared with me of horned lozerds in movies, 0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:50.000 and there are a few that I was familiar with, 0:07:50.560 --> 0:07:52.920 you know, because they're pretty popular films. I think what 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:54.440 outlot Josie Wales is on there. 0:07:54.720 --> 0:08:00.080 Yeah, but they they are apparently a number of you know, 0:08:00.600 --> 0:08:04.400 westerns I guess where there are horned lizards, which makes 0:08:04.440 --> 0:08:06.360 sense because you know, you find a lot of these 0:08:06.520 --> 0:08:09.280 several of these species are very common in the American Southwest. 0:08:10.040 --> 0:08:14.640 But also Jodroowski's Holy Mountain is included there, his film 0:08:14.680 --> 0:08:17.520 from nineteen seventy three that does have a very memorable 0:08:17.600 --> 0:08:21.400 hert scene, though it may contain shots of actual hurts 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:25.760 being exploded with fireworks, so you know, go into that 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:27.520 one with a certain amount of caution. But it's I mean, 0:08:27.520 --> 0:08:29.640 it's Holy Mountains, so I'd advise a great deal of 0:08:29.800 --> 0:08:32.800 content consideration before you watch it. Anyway, It's kind of 0:08:32.840 --> 0:08:35.880 a titan of surreal cinema and an important film when 0:08:35.880 --> 0:08:39.640 you're looking at weird psychotronic pictures and you know, Mexican 0:08:39.720 --> 0:08:42.800 cinema certainly cinema of the nineteen seventies. But it is 0:08:42.840 --> 0:08:43.600 not for everyone. 0:08:43.960 --> 0:08:46.360 Yeah, that's not movie Night with the grandparents. 0:08:46.760 --> 0:08:48.640 Yeah, I believe the scene in question. It's been a 0:08:48.640 --> 0:08:50.720 long time since I've seen it, and I have only 0:08:50.760 --> 0:08:52.800 seen it like used to. The only way you could 0:08:52.840 --> 0:08:54.840 watch it would be like a rip of a Japanese 0:08:54.880 --> 0:08:58.719 laser disc, and they're much better sources for it available now, 0:08:58.760 --> 0:09:02.480 But there is an extended scene where the conquest of 0:09:02.520 --> 0:09:08.920 Mexico is recreated with frogs and toads and lizards standing 0:09:08.960 --> 0:09:12.800 in for the various actors and sides in this conflict. 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:15.480 I did not remember that detail. There's a lot I've 0:09:15.480 --> 0:09:16.960 forgotten about Holy Mountain. 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:20.320 So I would say cameo appearance by the horned lizard. Now, 0:09:20.320 --> 0:09:22.040 it's worth noting at the top here that we're not 0:09:22.160 --> 0:09:25.640 dealing with a single species when we're discussing horned lizards, 0:09:25.920 --> 0:09:29.640 but rather an entire genus of North American lizards, and 0:09:29.679 --> 0:09:33.600 that's Phinosoma, including some twenty one species which range as 0:09:33.640 --> 0:09:36.319 far north as parts of Canada and on the southern 0:09:36.440 --> 0:09:38.880 end range all the way through Mexico and into Guatemala. 0:09:39.280 --> 0:09:42.480 And of these again, somewhere around twenty one species, at 0:09:42.600 --> 0:09:45.960 least eight species squirt blood from the eye region. So 0:09:46.080 --> 0:09:49.480 just an example of range here, there's the greater short 0:09:49.480 --> 0:09:53.480 horned lizard or Hernandez is short horned lizard, and it 0:09:53.520 --> 0:09:56.600 can be found as far north as southern Saskatchewan and 0:09:56.640 --> 0:10:00.600 Alberta and south into the Texas Panhandle in central Mexico. 0:10:00.920 --> 0:10:03.160 And this is one of the species of bloodshooters. 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:05.800 Yeah, that's right. But as you said, Rob, the various 0:10:05.800 --> 0:10:08.760 species of horned lizards can be found all over the 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:12.960 part of North America, from down in southern Mexico all 0:10:13.000 --> 0:10:16.199 the way up to the southern part of Canada. And 0:10:16.240 --> 0:10:18.040 you can look up maps that show you sort of 0:10:18.160 --> 0:10:23.040 different estimated ranges of the different species. But yeah, you'll 0:10:23.040 --> 0:10:26.480 find them all throughout the arid and semi arid regions 0:10:26.520 --> 0:10:29.440 of the North American West. Here, I think it would 0:10:29.440 --> 0:10:31.400 be a good place to introduce one of my major 0:10:31.480 --> 0:10:35.319 sources for this episode, which is a book called Introduction 0:10:35.440 --> 0:10:39.760 to Horned Lizards of North America by Wade C. Sherbrook. 0:10:39.880 --> 0:10:42.839 This was published by University of California Press in two 0:10:42.880 --> 0:10:46.760 thousand and three, and the author, Wade Sherbrooke, was director 0:10:46.880 --> 0:10:50.599 of the Southwestern Research Station of the American Museum of 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:56.319 Natural History, and so one of the questions Sherbrooke addresses 0:10:56.360 --> 0:10:59.160 in the introduction of this book is why are horned 0:10:59.280 --> 0:11:05.160 lizards commonly referred to as toads, horned toads, horny toads. Well, 0:11:05.200 --> 0:11:07.840 they really do kind of look like toads. They tend 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:11.800 to have a wide body when viewed from above, especially 0:11:11.840 --> 0:11:15.440 in certain defensive postures where they sort of flatten and 0:11:15.520 --> 0:11:18.160 widen their bodies out to create to sort of turn 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:21.800 their backs into a shield. They tend to for lizards 0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:25.920 have a short, blunt snout which can resemble a toad's head, 0:11:26.480 --> 0:11:30.160 and they also have an awkward walking gait. They tend 0:11:30.160 --> 0:11:33.559 to have a camouflaged appearance which helps them blend into 0:11:33.720 --> 0:11:37.960 their often sandy or gravelly surroundings, and this can resemble 0:11:38.040 --> 0:11:41.080 the model color patterns and bumpy texture you would see 0:11:41.080 --> 0:11:43.280 on the backs of some toads, so in lots of 0:11:43.320 --> 0:11:45.760 different ways they look like toads, and this led to 0:11:45.880 --> 0:11:50.480 the name of their genus. Frinosoma means toad body, phrenoss 0:11:50.600 --> 0:11:54.640 toad and soma of course means body, toad body, total 0:11:54.679 --> 0:11:58.319 toad body to add to the toad comparisons to make 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:00.800 them even more of a toad body. Can observe how 0:12:00.840 --> 0:12:04.360 they eat. Now, the different species of horned lizards have 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:09.600 some different different diets. Some are more sort of taking 0:12:09.640 --> 0:12:12.440 what they can get than others, but some are quite 0:12:12.600 --> 0:12:17.760 specialized to eating insects and specifically ants, specifically even more 0:12:17.960 --> 0:12:22.200 harvester ants. And if you watch the horned lizards eat 0:12:22.240 --> 0:12:26.199 harvester ants. When they specialize in this food source, they 0:12:26.240 --> 0:12:30.320 have a kind of a sticky, flicking tongue action, much 0:12:30.400 --> 0:12:33.839 like we associate with toads and frogs. I was reading 0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:37.000 in one part of the Sherbrook book about how exactly 0:12:37.080 --> 0:12:40.160 it is that these horned lizards can eat these incredibly 0:12:40.240 --> 0:12:44.920 venomous ants, and apparently they have a strategy of like 0:12:45.080 --> 0:12:47.559 flicking them into the mouth, and then as they swallow 0:12:47.640 --> 0:12:50.840 the ant, the ant becomes covered in this layer of 0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:55.240 mucus that comes out of glands in the lizard's throat, 0:12:55.720 --> 0:12:59.200 and this coating of mucus surrounds the ant as the 0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:04.360 ant is is digested and essentially disables it from biting 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:08.280 or stinging the lizard from the inside until it is 0:13:08.679 --> 0:13:11.920 well dead and able to be digested. And these lizards 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:14.120 have to eat a lot of these ants because ants 0:13:14.160 --> 0:13:17.319 are not super nutritious like they've got There's not a 0:13:17.360 --> 0:13:20.600 lot of meat on that bone. It's mostly bone. 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:22.880 That's right. Like For instance, one of the other big 0:13:22.920 --> 0:13:25.840 ant eaters out there is of course the mammalian ant eater, 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:28.840 and they are known to eat tons of ants and termites. 0:13:29.240 --> 0:13:31.480 I've seen estimates of like thirty thousand ants and termites 0:13:31.520 --> 0:13:34.760 a day, But even that is still a low calorie diet, 0:13:34.760 --> 0:13:36.600 and it's one of the reasons that we think that 0:13:36.640 --> 0:13:40.080 ant eaters have one of the lowest mammalian body temperatures. 0:13:40.600 --> 0:13:43.520 But in terms of the the what we're dealing with here, 0:13:43.600 --> 0:13:47.360 the horned lizards consumption of ants, I found an interesting 0:13:47.559 --> 0:13:50.920 article that answers the question, well, how do they eat 0:13:50.920 --> 0:13:53.320 them safely? This was from two thousand and eight published 0:13:53.360 --> 0:13:56.840 in the journal jazz A by Sherbrooke and Schwink, And 0:13:56.880 --> 0:14:00.520 the answer is in the title Horned lizards Incapacity Dangerous 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:03.280 ant prey with mucus. And we've already touched on the 0:14:03.320 --> 0:14:07.280 main aspect of this, but they provide one more little 0:14:07.280 --> 0:14:10.440 detail that I really like. They write, quote, we show 0:14:10.520 --> 0:14:13.280 that they're derived feeding kind of mattics that are associated 0:14:13.320 --> 0:14:17.640 with unique mucus secreting hyrngel papilia that apparently serve to 0:14:17.640 --> 0:14:21.600 immobilize and incapacitate dangerous ants as they are swallowed by 0:14:21.640 --> 0:14:25.960 compacting them and binding them in mucus trans And then 0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:29.960 they later add the detail ants extracted from fresh killed 0:14:30.040 --> 0:14:34.760 horned lizard's stomachs are curled ventrally into balls and bound 0:14:34.800 --> 0:14:35.440 in mucus. 0:14:35.880 --> 0:14:39.560 Take an ant as you're swallowing it, coat it with slime, 0:14:39.640 --> 0:14:41.760 and wadd it up into a ball so that you 0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:44.800 can digest it without it getting into trouble inside your 0:14:44.840 --> 0:14:58.400 digestive tract. That's right, Roll them up, all right, So 0:14:58.520 --> 0:15:01.640 that is horned lizards as predators. But I wanted to 0:15:01.720 --> 0:15:05.040 focus for the majority of today's episode on horned lizards 0:15:05.160 --> 0:15:08.320 as prey because it is, of course in their role 0:15:08.360 --> 0:15:12.480 as prey and in their anti predator defense strategies that 0:15:12.520 --> 0:15:15.280 we see the jets of blood emerge from the eyes. 0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:17.360 So here I want to go back to that book 0:15:17.400 --> 0:15:20.600 I mentioned by Wade Sherbrook. He has an excellent section 0:15:20.720 --> 0:15:24.200 in this book called Enemies and Defense, which sort of 0:15:24.360 --> 0:15:28.920 covers a nearly comprehensive list of different sort of predator 0:15:28.960 --> 0:15:34.520 prey relationships between horned lizard species and the predators that 0:15:34.600 --> 0:15:39.520 target them, and the strategies they have for resisting these predators. So, 0:15:39.720 --> 0:15:43.160 as we alluded to earlier, horned lizards are of course 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:47.760 covered in spikes and scales. This is a pretty sophisticated 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:50.440 armor defense. If you've never seen what a horned lizard 0:15:50.520 --> 0:15:52.240 looks like by the way, you should look one up. 0:15:52.240 --> 0:15:55.200 I mean, first of all, they are beautiful, but this 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:57.680 will give you a better idea of what we're talking 0:15:57.680 --> 0:16:01.680 about as we continually reference the armour moving on. They 0:16:01.720 --> 0:16:05.280 tend to have spikes and scales along different parts of 0:16:05.280 --> 0:16:09.840 their bodies, such as sort of spiky flank protrusions running 0:16:09.880 --> 0:16:13.120 down the lateral sides of the body, but then also 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:16.880 sometimes some kind of bumpy or tough coverings on the back, 0:16:17.240 --> 0:16:22.040 and then especially bony spike protrusions around the crown of 0:16:22.080 --> 0:16:25.280 the head. So some of the spiky looking things, usually 0:16:25.280 --> 0:16:28.760 the smaller ones are just more modified scales, but the 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:32.880 spikes around the head are actually like hard, sharp bony 0:16:33.000 --> 0:16:36.680 spikes now covered in spikes and scales. As they are, 0:16:36.720 --> 0:16:39.160 you might not think that a horned lizard would look 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:42.320 very appetizing, but you know, out here in the arid 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:45.840 and semi arid regions of the American West, many predators 0:16:45.880 --> 0:16:49.200 will take whatever they can get, and so horned lizards 0:16:49.240 --> 0:16:52.040 are indeed a prey animal to many species of predators. 0:16:52.560 --> 0:16:56.360 Juveniles are the most vulnerable to predation. They're smaller and 0:16:56.440 --> 0:17:00.000 they have less developed armor, so many are eaten between 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:03.080 the time they hatch from their eggs and the first hibernation. 0:17:04.160 --> 0:17:06.840 But Sherbrooke in this chapter gets into a list of 0:17:06.920 --> 0:17:10.040 different predators, and the first one I want to look 0:17:10.080 --> 0:17:14.680 at is his section on the long nosed leopard lizard 0:17:14.920 --> 0:17:19.480 or the Gambelia whizly zennii. These are worth looking up 0:17:19.480 --> 0:17:21.720 a picture of as well, because while they're not very 0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:23.919 interesting in terms of shape, they're just sort of like 0:17:24.040 --> 0:17:28.520 larger looking predatory lizards. They do have a truly leopard 0:17:28.600 --> 0:17:30.280 looking coloration pattern. 0:17:31.080 --> 0:17:33.280 Yeah. Yeah, they're quite quite fetching in their own right. 0:17:33.760 --> 0:17:37.000 So these lizards will frequently attack and eat horned lizards, 0:17:37.040 --> 0:17:42.000 especially juveniles, and the general strategy here is not super complicated. 0:17:42.040 --> 0:17:44.480 It is to bite them near the head and then 0:17:44.600 --> 0:17:48.199 swallow them whole head first. You know, this is just 0:17:48.280 --> 0:17:52.080 me reasoning from the pictures, but the sort of backwards 0:17:52.080 --> 0:17:55.320 pointing orientation of the head spikes, because they sort of 0:17:55.320 --> 0:17:59.320 extend backward from the head like a crown, it makes 0:17:59.359 --> 0:18:02.040 it seem like it would probably be easier to swallow 0:18:02.119 --> 0:18:05.280 a horned lizard head first rather than tail first, Like 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:08.200 if you went backwards, I would think the spikes would 0:18:08.400 --> 0:18:11.080 would be more likely to catch like hooks in the 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:13.960 lining of the throat and the digestive system. But it 0:18:14.000 --> 0:18:16.600 also seems like eating one of these things head first 0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:19.520 would be a very no going back scenario. You know, 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:21.600 once you start eating a big one, you're committed. 0:18:21.920 --> 0:18:23.760 Yeah, yeah, you can't put it in reverse. 0:18:24.920 --> 0:18:28.480 Sherbrook says in the book about defensive strategies that when 0:18:28.640 --> 0:18:32.119 attacked by a leopard lizard a horned lizard, and again, 0:18:32.480 --> 0:18:35.960 defensive strategy is very somewhat by species, so we'll be 0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:39.720 speaking in some generalities here, but the horned lizard will 0:18:39.760 --> 0:18:43.439 often try to defend itself by flattening out its back 0:18:43.560 --> 0:18:46.360 into a wide shield shape so it wants to look 0:18:46.400 --> 0:18:50.320 as wide as possible, and then tilting and orienting its 0:18:50.440 --> 0:18:55.159 armored shield back toward the predator. And again, adults with 0:18:55.240 --> 0:18:59.040 well developed armor are much less vulnerable to leopard lizards. 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:03.840 The next category is birds. A number of different birds 0:19:03.920 --> 0:19:07.920 prey on horned lizards. Sherbroke mentions hawks such as the 0:19:07.960 --> 0:19:13.520 red shouldered hawk or buteolineatis, but also smaller birds like 0:19:13.600 --> 0:19:18.080 the prairie falcon, the American kestrel, and the loggerhead shrike. 0:19:18.600 --> 0:19:23.200 Predatory birds with powerful talons and beaks have an advantage 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:26.240 when preying on these lizards because they have the ability 0:19:26.280 --> 0:19:29.760 to tear the lizard apart and eat it piece by piece, 0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:33.359 making it a somewhat easier proposition to consume that this 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:36.960 spiky animal as opposed to an armored adult that needs 0:19:37.000 --> 0:19:41.000 to be swallowed whole. However, it does still come with risks. 0:19:41.400 --> 0:19:45.119 Sherbrooke mentions one case of a red shouldered hawk that 0:19:45.280 --> 0:19:48.800 was found dead after having eaten a couple of Texas 0:19:48.800 --> 0:19:52.720 horned lizards. Apparently one of the horns had pierced through 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:56.720 the hawk's throat from the inside. Oh, and I can't 0:19:56.760 --> 0:20:01.320 help but apply like a human level of grossed out 0:20:01.359 --> 0:20:03.159 to this. Like I know it's just part of the 0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:05.639 you know, their way of making a living, but I 0:20:05.920 --> 0:20:08.840 cannot imagine eating something this spiky. 0:20:09.960 --> 0:20:12.320 And it's like a like a like a wheat then, 0:20:12.320 --> 0:20:13.840 except even worse right. 0:20:14.119 --> 0:20:16.760 Yeah, Oh, it's like you know, you ever think when 0:20:16.760 --> 0:20:18.760 you're like eating a tortilla chip and you don't chew 0:20:18.760 --> 0:20:22.480 it upright and you get a shard caught in your throat. Yeah, Okay. 0:20:22.480 --> 0:20:25.399 Another bird that preys on these animals is the greater 0:20:25.560 --> 0:20:31.000 road runner or Geocossics californian Us. The Greater Roadrunner has 0:20:31.119 --> 0:20:34.920 an interesting strategy where it grabs the horned lizard by 0:20:34.960 --> 0:20:37.760 a leg or by the tail with its beak, and 0:20:37.800 --> 0:20:40.359 then it whips them up in the air and slams 0:20:40.400 --> 0:20:43.040 them back down against the ground repeatedly, so it is 0:20:43.200 --> 0:20:47.359 beating the lizard against the earth, using centrifugal force to 0:20:47.400 --> 0:20:50.879 smash it dead. Basically, it bashes it and bashes it 0:20:51.200 --> 0:20:53.919 until it is dead and busted up, and this allows 0:20:53.960 --> 0:20:57.040 the roadrunner to take its time orienting the lizard so 0:20:57.080 --> 0:21:00.520 it can be swallowed whole head first by attached to 0:21:00.520 --> 0:21:03.800 a picture for you of the Greater Roadrunner trying to 0:21:03.840 --> 0:21:06.199 get this whole lizard into its mouth head first that 0:21:07.000 --> 0:21:08.480 I don't know how this is going to happen. This 0:21:08.560 --> 0:21:11.560 is just a photo from the book. It's not animated, 0:21:11.600 --> 0:21:12.439 but I believe in you. 0:21:13.000 --> 0:21:16.359 Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, roadrunners are such interesting, weird 0:21:16.400 --> 0:21:18.879 creatures in their own ride. I don't feel like the 0:21:18.920 --> 0:21:22.080 cartoons properly prepared. As for the reality, I've only seen 0:21:22.680 --> 0:21:24.480 I've only seen them in the wild, I think one 0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:28.200 or two times while I'm in the Arizona. But it's 0:21:28.320 --> 0:21:30.520 like it's like seeing like the ghost of a dinosaur 0:21:30.600 --> 0:21:31.640 run by. It's pretty neat. 0:21:32.080 --> 0:21:34.760 Yeah yeah yeah. And of course, in the case of 0:21:35.040 --> 0:21:38.200 the roadrunner, swallowing it headfirst once again keeps the horns 0:21:38.240 --> 0:21:41.640 pointed away from the bird's vital organs. It's going down 0:21:41.680 --> 0:21:43.320 the digestive tract. 0:21:43.560 --> 0:21:44.200 Clever girl. 0:21:44.600 --> 0:21:48.840 Yeah yeah, okay, So another bird predator chiwawin ravens or 0:21:48.920 --> 0:21:53.280 corvas crypto. Lucas Sherbrook says that these birds, they've got 0:21:53.320 --> 0:21:57.480 an interesting difference here. They bring dead horned lizards to 0:21:57.520 --> 0:22:01.919 their nests to feed their young, but the ravens render 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:05.240 them safe by not feeding them to their young hole, 0:22:05.320 --> 0:22:08.960 but instead ripping them open and only feeding the soft 0:22:09.040 --> 0:22:12.120 inerds to the hatchlings, so only guts for the children, 0:22:12.600 --> 0:22:15.359 and then the carcass with the hard parts is discarded. 0:22:15.520 --> 0:22:17.280 All right, Well, that's not surprised. Leave it to the 0:22:17.400 --> 0:22:21.760 ravens to intelligently dissect before feeding. 0:22:21.760 --> 0:22:24.119 To the end, they're like a tourist at a beach 0:22:24.200 --> 0:22:26.880