WEBVTT - TechStuff Tackles the StarWars Program 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.840 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 0:00:03.160 --> 0:00:08.920 It's ready. Are you get in touch with technology with 0:00:09.039 --> 0:00:17.920 tech Stuff from how stuff works dot com. Hello again, everyone, 0:00:17.960 --> 0:00:21.279 welcome to tech stuff. My name is Chris Polette and 0:00:21.360 --> 0:00:24.040 I am an editor here at how stuff works dot com. 0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:26.560 Sitting across from me, one of my favorite peeps in 0:00:26.560 --> 0:00:29.720 the whole world is senior writer Jonathan Strickland. Is it 0:00:30.080 --> 0:00:34.360 a fast ship. It's the ship that made the Kessel 0:00:34.479 --> 0:00:38.680 run in less than twelve post sex. She's fast enough 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:43.559 for you, old man. You have to get credit for 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:46.720 this quote. You actually have to. You can't just name 0:00:46.760 --> 0:00:49.240 the original source. You have to figure out the secondary 0:00:49.240 --> 0:00:53.159 source right well, and to be fair, the secondary source 0:00:53.680 --> 0:00:58.120 paraphrases the primary source. So um, yes, we're going to 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:01.560 talk today about Star Wars Wars. This comes to us 0:01:01.560 --> 0:01:10.479 courtesy of a little listener mail. This listener mail comes 0:01:10.520 --> 0:01:13.480 from Eric, and Eric says, weeks ago, when Ronald Reagan's 0:01:13.480 --> 0:01:16.399 on birthday came and went, it got me thinking about 0:01:16.480 --> 0:01:19.600 his Star Wars satellite program. I know Star Wars involved 0:01:19.600 --> 0:01:22.319 satellites and it theoretically would be able to kill any 0:01:22.400 --> 0:01:25.520 bad guy. America set its sights on. However, I don't 0:01:25.520 --> 0:01:27.200 know much about how it works. Could you do a 0:01:27.240 --> 0:01:30.600 podcast on it? Thanks? Ps. Could Star Wars be able 0:01:30.640 --> 0:01:34.360 to destroy Room Hilda and the Philosophizer? First of all, Eric, 0:01:34.880 --> 0:01:38.119 it's not an assassination system, it's an anti missile system. 0:01:38.160 --> 0:01:41.120 And second of all, nothing can stop Room Hilda and 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:48.320 the Philosophizer, So maybe some broad first, So you want 0:01:48.360 --> 0:01:50.680 to talk a little bit about well, I guess before 0:01:50.720 --> 0:01:52.920 we even talk about the Star Wars program, what we 0:01:52.960 --> 0:01:56.160 need to do is take a little trip in the 0:01:56.200 --> 0:01:59.040 way back machine. We haven't done that for a while. Now, 0:01:59.760 --> 0:02:03.480 did uh? Did uh stuff you missed in history class? 0:02:03.520 --> 0:02:06.760 Bring it back? Uh? You know? We actually we have 0:02:06.840 --> 0:02:10.360 a secondary unit. Um. I when we when we did 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:14.519 the renovation on the the the studio space, I made 0:02:14.520 --> 0:02:17.680 sure that we got a second one just for tech stuff. Okay, 0:02:17.680 --> 0:02:20.079 good because they don't leave it plugged in. Right. Well, 0:02:20.080 --> 0:02:22.160 this one over here, you'll you'll notice it looks kind 0:02:22.200 --> 0:02:25.280 of like okay, so it looks like a third hand 0:02:25.520 --> 0:02:28.880 um police call box. But trust me, it'll it'll work 0:02:28.960 --> 0:02:32.920 just fine. So so let's all right, get in, all right, 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:35.000 I'm right behind here. Alright, you just budge over just 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:37.240 a little bit. Unfortunately, this one is not larger on 0:02:37.280 --> 0:02:39.480 the inside than it is on the outside. Let's just 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:43.839 set this for October four, nineteen fifty seven, and uh, 0:02:44.040 --> 0:02:47.320 push the button, Frank, I can't reach the button. All right, 0:02:47.360 --> 0:02:52.359 I'll push the button, alright, And here we are October four, 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:56.520 nineteen fifty seven in this what was then the Soviet Union. 0:02:56.760 --> 0:03:01.480 Get out is not roomy in here. Oh sorry, all right, 0:03:03.440 --> 0:03:06.799 that's better. Hey, there's that that tune that's in tetris um. 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:11.240 So anyway, it's nineteen fifty seven, October four, Soviet Union. 0:03:11.280 --> 0:03:15.240 You know what's about to happen? Does it beep? It does? 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:17.480 In fact, that's pretty much all it does. There's going 0:03:17.520 --> 0:03:21.079 to be the launch of the Sputnik satellite, the first 0:03:21.160 --> 0:03:25.880 man made satellite launched into Earth orbit deep In fact, 0:03:25.960 --> 0:03:28.400 that is a direct quote. Yes, it's pretty much. All 0:03:28.400 --> 0:03:30.760 it did was orbit the Earth and beep. But here's 0:03:30.840 --> 0:03:33.720 here's the other important thing about sput Nick. It was 0:03:33.800 --> 0:03:36.080 not only was it the first man made satellite, but 0:03:36.160 --> 0:03:39.920 it made America, like the general public of America realized 0:03:40.520 --> 0:03:44.000 that the Russians had developed technology that would not just 0:03:44.080 --> 0:03:47.880 allow them to launch a rocket into space, but theoretically 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:50.920 launch a rocket from the Soviet Union that could go 0:03:51.000 --> 0:03:53.720 all the way and reach the United States of America 0:03:54.520 --> 0:03:58.480 right now, keeping in mind that this is shortly after 0:03:58.960 --> 0:04:01.320 the end of a Wars, or at least much closer 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:06.120 than it is now, and people were still very concerned 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:11.200 about what was dawning as the atomic Age. With the 0:04:11.600 --> 0:04:15.240 dropping of the the atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki 0:04:15.280 --> 0:04:18.719 that ended the Second World War, other countries were beginning 0:04:18.720 --> 0:04:21.320 to test those realized that they were terrible weapons, all 0:04:21.320 --> 0:04:23.960 of us in the world, everywhere, and you know, all 0:04:24.000 --> 0:04:27.800 of a sudden it became a concern that other people, 0:04:27.920 --> 0:04:33.159 especially you know, countries that were not necessarily friendly to 0:04:33.160 --> 0:04:36.200 the United States and the Soviet Union had undergone what 0:04:36.360 --> 0:04:41.000 can only be described as political turmoil over the decades 0:04:41.040 --> 0:04:44.080 since World War One. Really, and sorry, I was dancing 0:04:44.080 --> 0:04:46.640 around that. Yeah, but it's well, we have to talk 0:04:46.680 --> 0:04:49.160 about it because the Cold War, that's what Star Wars 0:04:49.160 --> 0:04:52.200 program is all about. Yes, it was so so we 0:04:52.279 --> 0:04:56.600 had these political the strain on on the political relationship 0:04:56.640 --> 0:04:59.000 between the United States of America and the Soviet Union. 0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:03.960 They had dia trically opposing political philosophies, right, and now 0:05:04.040 --> 0:05:07.680 these very very potent weapons which going from needing to 0:05:07.720 --> 0:05:11.280 be dropped as bombs from planes to being equipped on 0:05:11.360 --> 0:05:15.479 top of missile warheads. We're talking about longer and longer ranges. 0:05:15.760 --> 0:05:18.320 What parts of the world can you hit with a 0:05:18.400 --> 0:05:22.039 rocket of this type? And then suddenly there is a 0:05:22.120 --> 0:05:25.680 thing in space that is beeping? But what does that mean? 0:05:25.720 --> 0:05:27.560 Does that mean that you can hit anywhere in the 0:05:27.640 --> 0:05:30.600 world if you launch the rocket from the right, you know, 0:05:30.640 --> 0:05:35.080 at the right altitude and attitude and apogee right, yeah, yeah, exactly, 0:05:35.120 --> 0:05:38.279 instead of having to send a bunch of aircraft to 0:05:38.360 --> 0:05:42.159 fly over a target space and drop bombs, you know, 0:05:42.320 --> 0:05:46.320 those aircraft could be intercepted and could be shot down. Um, 0:05:46.800 --> 0:05:50.200 you could, uh, there were things that you could do 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:53.360 in that case. The thought of a missile being launched 0:05:53.400 --> 0:05:56.080 across the world and then hitting your nation was much 0:05:56.120 --> 0:05:59.320 more frightening because what could you do against that. Well, 0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:02.520 that's what sort of propelled the whole idea of the 0:06:02.520 --> 0:06:05.880 Strategy Strategic Defense Initiative or star Wars program. Well, let's 0:06:05.920 --> 0:06:07.760 let's get back into the machine and get back to 0:06:07.800 --> 0:06:11.520 modern day. Seriously, we have to cutphobic all right, well, 0:06:11.600 --> 0:06:14.440 let's look just held deeply and get in all right, 0:06:17.000 --> 0:06:23.120 shut up, we got to move this lever because okay, 0:06:20.080 --> 0:06:27.320 great and we're back all right, let me just get 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:31.280 out of here. Okay, now somebody else can have that one. 0:06:31.320 --> 0:06:33.880 The studio seems nice and room he now, doesn't it. 0:06:34.520 --> 0:06:36.760 All right, So now that we're back in the present day, 0:06:36.760 --> 0:06:38.839 we can talk a little bit about what happened after 0:06:38.880 --> 0:06:41.240 the spot Nick launch. You essentially had a lot of 0:06:41.279 --> 0:06:45.640 research and development poured into these these long range missile programs. Eventually, 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:48.920 the the intercontinental Ballistic missile or i C b M 0:06:49.040 --> 0:06:54.680 became a product of this. So this began what was 0:06:55.240 --> 0:07:01.200 a philosophy that was called later mutual assured destruction. Is 0:07:01.240 --> 0:07:07.120 it a Is it any coincidence that the initials spell mad? Well, 0:07:07.400 --> 0:07:09.760 you had to be mad to follow it, right, So 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:13.440 the idea of being that you, whoever has the most weapons, 0:07:13.840 --> 0:07:16.080 gets to scare off everyone else from attacking you because 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:18.160 we have more than you. Yeah, the idea being that 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:21.720 that really the idea came down to each each side 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:26.720 of this opposing philosophy, this this cold war so called 0:07:26.760 --> 0:07:31.480 because there weren't outright hostilities breaking out, uh that you 0:07:31.560 --> 0:07:34.400 had to have enough weapons to ensure that you could 0:07:34.400 --> 0:07:36.920 destroy your enemy, and both sides had it, and the 0:07:36.960 --> 0:07:40.520 idea being that with both sides having these weapons, there'd 0:07:40.520 --> 0:07:43.000 be it would be crazy to actually launch an attack, 0:07:43.040 --> 0:07:47.040 because you would know that you would also be attacked 0:07:47.120 --> 0:07:49.960 and that you would suffer just as your enemy suffered. 0:07:50.720 --> 0:07:53.280 So that was the mutual assured destruction, the idea that 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:56.040 it's so dangerous to launch an attack, no one would 0:07:56.160 --> 0:07:59.920 dare do so. Problem is that that relies on human 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:03.320 acting in a rational way, and that of course it's 0:08:03.320 --> 0:08:05.440 not always the case. In fact, this you could argue 0:08:06.040 --> 0:08:09.360 that this was the same philosophy that existed in Europe 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:13.880 prior to World War One, that European nations were building 0:08:13.960 --> 0:08:17.280 up armed armies and navies. They were really pouring money 0:08:17.280 --> 0:08:20.720 into their armed forces, with the idea being that if 0:08:20.800 --> 0:08:23.000 you had a very strong armed force, no one would 0:08:23.000 --> 0:08:27.320 ever dare attack you. So therefore, just by increasing tensions, 0:08:27.440 --> 0:08:31.160 by by increasing the size of your military, you could 0:08:31.200 --> 0:08:34.439 ensure peace, even though it would be a very tense piece. Unfortunately, 0:08:34.440 --> 0:08:37.920 as World War One proved, that did not work. So 0:08:37.960 --> 0:08:42.720 we tried it again with nuclear weapons um and and 0:08:42.760 --> 0:08:45.920 to some I think just for the sake of clarification, 0:08:46.000 --> 0:08:47.640 right now, I would say it's safe to say that 0:08:47.640 --> 0:08:53.040 that that hasn't gone away. There's still huge nuclear stockpiles 0:08:53.840 --> 0:08:57.880 in the United States and in USA, the former Soviet Union, 0:08:58.120 --> 0:09:01.040 and and many other countries around the world now. And 0:09:01.080 --> 0:09:06.000 even though the Soviet Union itself collapsed, it looks you 0:09:06.000 --> 0:09:08.800 could you could say that the political and the political 0:09:08.880 --> 0:09:11.760 attitude in what in the former Soviet Union is once 0:09:11.800 --> 0:09:16.720 again at least at least somewhat antagonistic towards the United 0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:21.080 States government. Right there, there are political tensions between the 0:09:21.160 --> 0:09:24.240 United States and the countries that were in the former 0:09:24.280 --> 0:09:28.520 Soviet Union. Well, you know, you can see, uh, even 0:09:28.520 --> 0:09:32.240 some of our younger listeners will probably remember the tension, 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:34.960 uh if you follow the news at all, and I 0:09:35.040 --> 0:09:38.640 recommend that you do. Um, the tension generated from North 0:09:38.720 --> 0:09:42.520 Korea's fairly recent tests in the last two or three 0:09:42.600 --> 0:09:45.880 years where they were testing nuclear weapons and and missile 0:09:45.920 --> 0:09:50.160 technology bo um. And you know, of course this causes 0:09:50.160 --> 0:09:54.720 a lot of tension with South Korea and Japan UM, 0:09:54.760 --> 0:09:57.040 but also for for other countries around the world, even 0:09:57.120 --> 0:10:00.520 even Europe, which you know probably you wouldn't wow. You know, 0:10:00.559 --> 0:10:04.560 they're pretty far away, you know, still it affects these 0:10:04.559 --> 0:10:09.839 things are no longer local conflicts with this technology. So, um, 0:10:09.880 --> 0:10:13.680 you know, the ideas are it hasn't gone away, certainly, right. 0:10:13.720 --> 0:10:16.720 You still have these political ideologies that are in opposition 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:18.679 with each other. But then you also have like global 0:10:18.720 --> 0:10:22.440 corporations that span multiple countries, some of which have these 0:10:23.120 --> 0:10:28.120 political ideologies that conflict with the corporation's home country. It's 0:10:28.160 --> 0:10:32.120 main matters much more complicated. It's not just political, it's financial. 0:10:32.240 --> 0:10:36.320 And you know, of course we're all nuclear weapons are nondiscriminatory, right, 0:10:36.360 --> 0:10:40.360 they don't. They don't target just military installations, military personnel. 0:10:40.920 --> 0:10:44.480 This is these are weapons that target enormous areas and 0:10:44.559 --> 0:10:48.520 essentially are going to wipe out massive civilian populations were 0:10:48.559 --> 0:10:51.360 they to be um uh, you know, hit by a 0:10:51.440 --> 0:10:56.960 nuclear attack. So that's kind of what spawned this idea 0:10:56.960 --> 0:11:00.760 of the Strategic Defense initiative. And you have you actually 0:11:00.840 --> 0:11:04.680 looked at the the announcement that kind of unveiled this 0:11:04.720 --> 0:11:09.920 to the world, right, Um, yeah, I. And in doing 0:11:09.920 --> 0:11:11.960 the research for this this you can actually date the 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:17.000 Strategic Defense Initiative back to a specific date, although really 0:11:17.040 --> 0:11:21.000 the idea goes back farther. But when people picking a 0:11:21.000 --> 0:11:24.400 a significant date in the history of the s D, 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:29.840 I uh most pick March when President uh Ronald Reagan 0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:33.920 addressed the country on issues of national security. Now, UM, 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:37.560 a while back, I actually had found a series of 0:11:37.600 --> 0:11:42.040 podcasts on presidents that were being offered by UM, I 0:11:42.080 --> 0:11:45.199 believe PBS. They were free, so I downloaded and watched 0:11:45.240 --> 0:11:47.679 several of them, and I kind of, um, you know, 0:11:48.040 --> 0:11:50.920 Reagan's term two terms were during my lifetime, but I 0:11:50.920 --> 0:11:53.280 don't remember a lot about about him and what he 0:11:53.320 --> 0:11:56.000 was like. And I, from what I understand, he you know, 0:11:56.040 --> 0:11:57.760 although I think a lot of people see him a 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:01.320 sort of a a militarist in some respects because he 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.480 did he did stress in this message you know, look 0:12:03.520 --> 0:12:05.400 we can't We've got to be tough. We want to 0:12:05.440 --> 0:12:08.480 deter our enemies. But UM, I think he was also 0:12:09.320 --> 0:12:11.440 he he kind of didn't like this stress. From what 0:12:11.480 --> 0:12:14.040 I understand, he the stress that that brings on, because 0:12:14.120 --> 0:12:17.480 it's a stressful environment. You're always wondering if you have 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:21.520 more weapons than the other people, if your arms cash is, 0:12:21.559 --> 0:12:24.079 if you have more more soldiers and sailors and marines. 0:12:24.720 --> 0:12:28.200 Looking at looking at uh as stressful. Yeah, you start 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:30.920 looking at statistics like if we were hit by a 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:34.119 first strike, how many of our weapons would remain operable 0:12:34.200 --> 0:12:36.480 so that we could strike back. I mean, when you're 0:12:36.559 --> 0:12:40.000 looking at that scenario, you're already saying, we've been hit 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:44.520 and we've lost a massive amount of our infrastructure, our citizens, 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:49.719 We've taken huge losses. Can we strike back? I mean, 0:12:49.720 --> 0:12:51.800 when you when you have to ask yourself that question, 0:12:51.920 --> 0:12:54.400 that is, I mean, that's a tough question because you're 0:12:54.440 --> 0:12:57.840 already talking about defeat in a way, no one wins 0:12:57.880 --> 0:13:02.480 in that situation, right right, right? So um he uh 0:13:02.559 --> 0:13:06.400 And in this particular speech wasn't particularly long address, um, 0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:10.400 but this was Yeah, it's not very long, and it's 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:13.679 easy to find, but it's kind of interesting because it 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:17.440 takes a different tack, if you will. Um basically said, look, 0:13:17.480 --> 0:13:20.600 I want to offer you a different idea, an idea 0:13:20.640 --> 0:13:24.120 that might bring you hope. Rather than trying to destroy 0:13:24.240 --> 0:13:28.720 our enemies outright necessarily, why don't we embark on a 0:13:28.800 --> 0:13:33.720 plan to uh to intercept and destroy these weapons before 0:13:33.720 --> 0:13:36.520 they reach us? And that means we don't necessarily have 0:13:36.679 --> 0:13:39.959 we can we can focus instead on protecting ourselves rather 0:13:40.000 --> 0:13:45.080 than destroying our enemies. Um. Although to be sure, I'm 0:13:45.080 --> 0:13:49.040 sure that he wanted to rely on uh mutually to 0:13:49.080 --> 0:13:51.559 assure destruction to some degree as a defense initiative. And 0:13:51.600 --> 0:13:53.440 I think, you know, frankly, you could argue that it 0:13:53.480 --> 0:13:56.720 does have some value. But you know, he said, look, 0:13:56.880 --> 0:13:59.440 let's instead of doing this, let's do something new and used. 0:13:59.480 --> 0:14:01.720 We've got a lot of technology available to us to 0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:06.080 make sophisticated weapons and defense systems. Let's create a network 0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:10.640 of defenses that will intercept and destroy nuclear weapons before 0:14:10.640 --> 0:14:14.280 they could actually reach us. UM. And you know, he 0:14:14.280 --> 0:14:16.199 doesn't really get into a lot of the details in 0:14:16.240 --> 0:14:20.160 the address, so that that comes later. And although although 0:14:20.200 --> 0:14:21.840 I think it, I think it only took the next 0:14:21.920 --> 0:14:24.800 day before someone called it the star Wars program. Yeah, 0:14:24.800 --> 0:14:27.720 it didn't, because you know, there are a lot of 0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:30.040 pieces to it, and it's a lot of it is 0:14:30.080 --> 0:14:34.240 about you know, weaponizing space espentially essentially, you know, where 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:36.400 you're saying, let's put stuff in the sky that can 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:40.000 shoot other stuff out of the sky and um, but 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:42.960 it's not just about that. There were ground defenses, there 0:14:42.960 --> 0:14:46.440 were airborne defenses, there were space born defenses, all as 0:14:46.480 --> 0:14:50.360 part of this overall network and uh it's not even 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:54.840 that simple because it's shifted over time to mean different 0:14:54.880 --> 0:14:58.520 things during different presidents and different departments took over parts 0:14:58.560 --> 0:15:01.360 of the of the What was originally all part of 0:15:01.360 --> 0:15:04.680 the Strategic Defense Initiative, some of that broke off and became, 0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:09.640 uh specifically an Air Force initiative, so it was no 0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:13.720 longer part of s d I. It was a different program. 0:15:13.800 --> 0:15:17.520 Um and uh so so yeah, I mean it's it's 0:15:17.600 --> 0:15:19.480 kind of you think about it. How are you going 0:15:19.560 --> 0:15:21.840 to do that? How are you going to stop missiles 0:15:21.880 --> 0:15:25.280 before they even you know, come down and hit the earth. 0:15:25.440 --> 0:15:28.200 And there were a lot of proposals, so it seems 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:33.680 pardon the not pun but weird pun like thing, uh 0:15:33.960 --> 0:15:36.560 pie in the sky sort of thing. Yeah, um so 0:15:36.640 --> 0:15:38.960 I am thinking of a giant pie stopping missiles. But yeah, 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:41.640 how are you going to spend money on that's going 0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:46.640 to do this? Yeah, I've lost him so uh so, yeah, 0:15:46.680 --> 0:15:48.960 it was it was supposed to stop i c b 0:15:49.240 --> 0:15:54.080 ms from reaching the United States. Now, part of it was, hey, 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:55.840 if you can destroy it in space before it even 0:15:55.840 --> 0:15:58.360 reenters the atmosphere, because you know, some i c b 0:15:58.560 --> 0:16:02.440 ms do they reach a low orbit and then at 0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:04.360 their at their peak, they are in a low orbit 0:16:04.400 --> 0:16:08.160 and then they re enter on a trajectory towards their target. Yes, 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:11.720 that's why they're intercontinental UM. But yes, there are other 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:16.640 weapons that don't reach that that altitude UM. And it's 0:16:16.680 --> 0:16:19.240 interesting because if you look at the history and the 0:16:19.320 --> 0:16:22.880 various proposals that were all part of s d I, 0:16:23.080 --> 0:16:25.400 you start to realize that they were figuring this out 0:16:25.440 --> 0:16:27.560 as they were going along as well, like there were 0:16:27.640 --> 0:16:31.000 the Originally, a lot of the idea was that, well, 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:32.880 we can as long as we can shoot down the 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:37.040 missile or destroy the missile before it before it gets 0:16:37.480 --> 0:16:40.600 uh you know, before it makes contact, then that's acceptable. 0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:44.120 Except for the fact that there was the discovery of hey, uh, 0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:49.600 these these blasts are releasing gig enormous electromagnetic pulses or 0:16:49.640 --> 0:16:52.520 e m p s, and that means that were you 0:16:52.600 --> 0:16:56.000 to detonate a nuclear weapon, even at a fairly high 0:16:56.040 --> 0:16:59.480 altitude over the United States, that e MP could end 0:16:59.560 --> 0:17:03.400 up affecting the electronics on the ground or even in 0:17:03.440 --> 0:17:05.280 the air. So you're talking about all the airplanes that 0:17:05.359 --> 0:17:07.879 maybe in the area, you're talking about all the electronics 0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:09.639 in the area of like the power grid in the area. 0:17:09.680 --> 0:17:13.440 It could create blackouts in over a massive range because 0:17:13.480 --> 0:17:16.440 I mean a big enough EMP could put a load 0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:19.960 not just on that region's power grid, but the neighboring 0:17:19.960 --> 0:17:23.879 regions as well. So, uh, you know, we we did 0:17:23.960 --> 0:17:26.359 an entire podcast about e m p s in the past, 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:27.959 so if you if you really want to know more 0:17:27.960 --> 0:17:30.000 about them, I recommend you check that out because it 0:17:30.080 --> 0:17:33.880 is it's interesting tactic as well as just a side 0:17:33.880 --> 0:17:37.399 effect of the nuclear war arms program in the first place. 0:17:37.840 --> 0:17:41.760 So that kind of led to discussions about, well, what 0:17:41.800 --> 0:17:45.239 we really need our defense initiatives that would allow us 0:17:45.280 --> 0:17:49.040 to shoot down missiles as as close to when they 0:17:49.119 --> 0:17:54.040 launch as possible and um and to be perfectly clear, 0:17:54.080 --> 0:17:56.000 I mean, if you go to the Department of Defense, 0:17:56.359 --> 0:18:00.680 they have unclassified documents, lots of them, lots of them 0:18:00.680 --> 0:18:03.160 that you can read. And there's one that's uh that's 0:18:03.320 --> 0:18:06.440 a memorandum for the Secretary of Defense that is the 0:18:06.520 --> 0:18:10.719 Space component of US Military Strategy and war Fighting Requirements 0:18:10.720 --> 0:18:15.119 for US Military Space Systems. That document makes it very 0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:19.920 clear they're talking specifically about the Soviets. The term Soviets 0:18:19.960 --> 0:18:24.479 appears multiple times through this document, which is several pages long, 0:18:24.560 --> 0:18:28.040 is written in n so you know there was there 0:18:28.040 --> 0:18:30.760 were no illusions. This was not you know, some sort 0:18:30.800 --> 0:18:34.960 of vague defense system that was meant to protect the 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:38.160 United States from any attacker. This was something that was 0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:42.400 that was talked about with the Soviets in mind in particular. Um, 0:18:42.600 --> 0:18:45.920 so part of that was talking about you know, we mentioned, 0:18:46.040 --> 0:18:47.840 or you mentioned, Chris, that there were going to be 0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:50.399 ground based systems as well as ones in space and 0:18:50.480 --> 0:18:53.600 in the air. Uh. This this meant that your ground 0:18:53.600 --> 0:18:56.680 based systems were essentially things like radar stations where you 0:18:56.680 --> 0:19:00.800 can detect that missile had had launched, because as missiles 0:19:00.840 --> 0:19:02.720 were going at altitudes that were high enough to be 0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:07.920 detectable by radar. The the space element eventually came to 0:19:08.000 --> 0:19:10.440 the conclusion that there needed to be satellites that would 0:19:10.440 --> 0:19:13.040 be positioned directly over the Soviet Union in order for 0:19:13.080 --> 0:19:15.600 this to be effective, so that we could launch a 0:19:15.760 --> 0:19:20.920 counter measure from space to interfere with the I, C, B, 0:19:21.160 --> 0:19:26.560 M S. And UM, you know, there were several systems 0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:29.720 that we're going to rely on one of your favorite 0:19:29.960 --> 0:19:34.920 technologies lasers. Actually, I would I would argue at least 0:19:35.320 --> 0:19:37.000 I don't know about you, Chris, when I was a 0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:41.240 kid in the eighties, my perception, and granted, remember I 0:19:41.280 --> 0:19:43.400 was a kid, I only I only knew about this 0:19:43.480 --> 0:19:46.600 kind of because adults talked about it, right, But as 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:49.520 a kid, I always imagined that the Star Wars program 0:19:49.560 --> 0:19:53.000 was all about lasers. I never, I never knew as 0:19:53.040 --> 0:19:55.040 a kid during the time when this was actually happening 0:19:55.080 --> 0:19:58.600 that that was just one of many proposals. But to 0:19:58.640 --> 0:20:01.080 talk about the lasers, the system them that was proposed, 0:20:01.080 --> 0:20:05.119 the initial one with X ray lasers was really really 0:20:05.280 --> 0:20:10.920 kind of interesting, and ultimately people like scientists and and 0:20:11.040 --> 0:20:13.840 military personnel determined that it was not feasible. But the 0:20:13.920 --> 0:20:18.160 idea was that you would launch satellites into orbit position 0:20:18.240 --> 0:20:22.119 them over the Soviet Union. These satellites would actually contain 0:20:22.320 --> 0:20:27.160 a nuclear warhead inside the satellite. The satellite would also 0:20:27.240 --> 0:20:30.639 contain lazing material. You might want to go back and 0:20:30.680 --> 0:20:35.040 listen to our Laser's podcast to hear about lazing material. 0:20:35.359 --> 0:20:38.720 But that the nuclear explosion when you when you detonated 0:20:38.760 --> 0:20:42.280 the warhead would provide the energy that would emit an 0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:46.080 extremely powerful X ray laser using this lazing material, and 0:20:46.080 --> 0:20:48.560 that you would include lots and lots of lasers in 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:51.080 a in a single satellite, like two dozen of them 0:20:51.119 --> 0:20:53.400 in there, so that they could shoot down multiple targets 0:20:54.080 --> 0:20:59.000 from one detonation. I believe at the time UH the 0:20:59.119 --> 0:21:03.000 United States had estimated that the Soviet Union had lots 0:21:03.000 --> 0:21:05.800 and lots of warheads, but only I think fewer than 0:21:05.840 --> 0:21:09.040 two thousand actual missiles. So the idea was that you 0:21:09.040 --> 0:21:12.240 had to have enough satellites to shoot down the majority 0:21:12.320 --> 0:21:15.639 of those two thousand or so or fewer missiles in 0:21:15.760 --> 0:21:20.159 order to protect the United States. So in order to 0:21:20.200 --> 0:21:22.199 shoot them down, you would have to detonate a nuclear 0:21:22.240 --> 0:21:25.080 warhead within this satellite and have it contained in such 0:21:25.080 --> 0:21:30.320 a way that the energy is then UH directed into 0:21:30.480 --> 0:21:33.000 a lasing medium shoots an X ray laser. The X 0:21:33.080 --> 0:21:37.120 ray laser hits the missile and UH and shoots it down. 0:21:38.080 --> 0:21:39.280 And to do that, of course, you also have to 0:21:39.320 --> 0:21:40.840 have a tracking system. You have to figure out how 0:21:40.880 --> 0:21:44.200 you're gonna track it. Originally I think they were looking 0:21:44.280 --> 0:21:47.840 at um at at radar, but then there was the 0:21:47.880 --> 0:21:54.000 possibility of having of the Soviet Union launching decoys using 0:21:54.200 --> 0:21:58.240 radar reflectors so that the radar would have false readings saying, oh, 0:21:58.440 --> 0:22:01.240 here's a missile over here, and by shooting lots and 0:22:01.240 --> 0:22:02.920 lots of these up in the air all at once, 0:22:03.400 --> 0:22:05.320 it would mean you would waste a lot of your 0:22:05.400 --> 0:22:10.920 your defense initiative shooting down dummies essentially. There was also 0:22:10.960 --> 0:22:15.280 a talk about using UH sensors that would detect heat signatures, 0:22:15.600 --> 0:22:17.919 and you would see the heat signature from a missile 0:22:17.960 --> 0:22:20.480 is going to be much larger than a decoy, So 0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:22.919 then you just aim for the big ones, right, But 0:22:23.000 --> 0:22:25.719 this is not this is a non trivial problem figuring 0:22:25.760 --> 0:22:28.160 out not just how to make the laser work, which 0:22:28.200 --> 0:22:30.919 by the way, no one really ever figured out a 0:22:31.040 --> 0:22:34.639 reliable way of doing that, but figuring out the targeting 0:22:34.680 --> 0:22:38.439 system so that you can look reliably target and shoot 0:22:38.480 --> 0:22:41.520 down these missiles without missing them, because that energy is 0:22:41.520 --> 0:22:44.439 gonna keep on going. If you miss that missile, it's 0:22:44.440 --> 0:22:48.280 going to hit something else. Stupid physics. Yeah, and we're 0:22:48.280 --> 0:22:50.840 talking X ray lasers. I mean this, this is really 0:22:51.280 --> 0:22:53.840 X ray lasers powered by a nuclear explosion. This is 0:22:53.920 --> 0:22:57.760 a very powerful beam of light. And then you have 0:22:57.880 --> 0:23:02.120 you know, the brilliant pebbles. Alliant pebbles, yes, which were 0:23:02.160 --> 0:23:07.040 the UH basically autonomous spacecraft. Yes, you know, just sort 0:23:07.040 --> 0:23:09.280 of coasting around it. They're looking for stuff to shoot 0:23:09.280 --> 0:23:12.440 down or collide with. Yeah, a lot of it was 0:23:12.440 --> 0:23:15.320 was kind of the idea of not necessarily even shooting 0:23:15.359 --> 0:23:18.320 something down, but just putting something in the way of 0:23:18.359 --> 0:23:21.119 the missile so that it would, uh, it would end 0:23:21.200 --> 0:23:24.040 up destroying itself or falling to the Earth, you know, 0:23:24.160 --> 0:23:27.560 something like that, where you're not you're not necessarily trying 0:23:27.560 --> 0:23:30.600