Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wok F Daily with
Speaker 1: Meet your Girl Daniel Moody recording from the Home Bunker. Folks.
Speaker 1: Let's just start off today with my thoughts which I
Speaker 1: shared yesterday on Tommy Tuberville, the senator who apparently needed
Speaker 1: to be told the definition of white nationalism so that
Speaker 1: he could walk back his white nationalist thoughts about white
Speaker 1: nationalists being able to join the military and referring to
Speaker 1: them as Americans. Tommy Tuberville is sixty eight fucking years old,
Speaker 1: so I would really love it if mainstream media would
Speaker 1: stop giving these motherfuckers the benefit of the out as
Speaker 1: if Tommy Tuberville is in elementary school and is just
Speaker 1: learning these topics for the first fucking time. He is not.
Speaker 1: And it is the same way that I had to
Speaker 1: listen during the entirety of Trump's disastrous administration from people
Speaker 1: like Susan Collins and others that say that Donald Trump
Speaker 1: will quote grow into the position, are we fucking dumb?
Speaker 1: Like it is this idea of perpetual adolescence that white
Speaker 1: men are given in this country. Oh you're sixty something,
Speaker 1: you're seventy something, you're eighty something. Oh they don't know,
Speaker 1: they'll learn. Give me a fucking break. It is intellectually
Speaker 1: dishonest at best and gaslighting at fucking worse. By chasing
Speaker 1: people down like Tommy Tuberville and asking them to define
Speaker 1: statements that were very fucking clear, run with what it
Speaker 1: is that they said, instead of trying to get them
Speaker 1: to backtrack on what it is that you know that
Speaker 1: they believe, and then to boot Tommy Tuoperville's backtracking on
Speaker 1: his white nationalist or American statement was well, I was
Speaker 1: a football coach, so I dealt with more minorities than
Speaker 1: a lot of people. You dealt with like slave masters
Speaker 1: dealt with enslaved Africans. Get the fuck out of here.
Speaker 1: It is just so wild to me the way that
Speaker 1: journalists just refuse to take these people at their word
Speaker 1: and print the fucking truth. Tommy Tuberville is a racist,
Speaker 1: and he's a fucking terrorist right now in the Senate
Speaker 1: as he holds up confirmations for the military because he
Speaker 1: doesn't want women in the military to be able to
Speaker 1: have access to abortions. I am so tired of them
Speaker 1: talking about activism when this is the kind of terrorism
Speaker 1: that they are doing. What does it say folks about
Speaker 1: our government. When you can have one fucking senator hold
Speaker 1: up an entire fucking agency, it means it's broken. And
Speaker 1: those are the conversations that we should be having on
Speaker 1: a regular basis. And instead of oh, Tommy Tuberville backtracks
Speaker 1: on his fucking white nationalist beliefs, it should be Tommy
Speaker 1: Tuberville believes that white nationalists are Americans that should have
Speaker 1: the ability to join the military. It is bullshit. The
Speaker 1: Republican Party is the white nationalist party. If you are
Speaker 1: a Republican you support white nationalism, plain and simple. You
Speaker 1: attack LGBTQ people, you attack black people, you attack indigenous people,
Speaker 1: you attack women, you attack people of color, you attack Muslims.
Speaker 1: That is the protocol of the Republican Party. And to
Speaker 1: say or print anything to the contrary is a fucking lie.
Speaker 1: It is not neutrality. I'm just so tired of mainstream media.
Speaker 1: I'm so tired of this party. I'm so tired of
Speaker 1: them making it so easy to run against them. And yes,
Speaker 1: Democrats are trying to figure out what their fucking messaging is.
Speaker 1: If you thought, folks that the twenty twenty election was
Speaker 1: the most consequential election of our time, I don't even
Speaker 1: know what to refer to twenty twenty four as, but
Speaker 1: it is literally the battle between good and evil, right
Speaker 1: and wrong, authoritarianism and democracy. This country is not just backsliding.
Speaker 1: We are hanging on by a fucking thread. And for
Speaker 1: folks that say, oh, well, Biden's age, I don't give
Speaker 1: a fuck of Biden as one hundred and fifty. If
Speaker 1: that man still has breath in his body and that
Speaker 1: is who the fucking nominee is, then that is who
Speaker 1: we're voting for, plain and fucking simple. Because the alternative,
Speaker 1: whether it's Donald Trump or DeSantis or fucking Haley or
Speaker 1: Pence or any other of those Republican fucking clowns, the
Speaker 1: alternative is fascism and white nationalism. That is it.
Speaker 2: So if you.
Speaker 1: Want that, don't vote right our vote for one of
Speaker 1: these fucking third party candidates that are also a fucking
Speaker 1: clown show. Today, I am aggravated. The entire story around
Speaker 1: Tuberville just has me on one. Coming up next, dear friends,
Speaker 1: my conversation with our in house doctor, doctor Jonathan Metzel,
Speaker 1: is back after a very long break from the show,
Speaker 1: so I'm excited to get into conversation with him. Folks.
Speaker 1: I am so excited to welcome back after a very
Speaker 1: long break, our friend UH in house doctor doctor Jonathan Methel.
Speaker 1: Back to WOKF Jonathan, it has been a long time
Speaker 1: since we've chatted. I would love to say that things
Speaker 1: in America have gotten surprisingly better since you've been gone.
Speaker 1: They haven't. But I want to start off with the
Speaker 1: fact that you know, over the holiday, the fourth of
Speaker 1: July holiday, that a lot of people celebrated. You know,
Speaker 1: I just chose to drink by a pool because it's
Speaker 1: a day off. But I'm not celebrating America. You know,
Speaker 1: there were countless shootings, right, some of which elevated to
Speaker 1: headline news, others did not. And I and I know
Speaker 1: that you've been traveling abroad a bit and and I
Speaker 1: wanted to get you know, just your read out on one,
Speaker 1: Why is it just that everyone is off, so everyone
Speaker 1: goes and grabs their guns over holidays? Like why the
Speaker 1: escalation in shooting happens during that time? Uh is number one?
Speaker 1: And then two while you were traveling abroad, I know,
Speaker 1: speaking a lot about your your upcoming book and just
Speaker 1: your work around you know, gun violence, Like what is
Speaker 1: the perspective, what are you being what is being reflected
Speaker 1: back at you from the from people abroad in terms
Speaker 1: of how they are seeing America right now.
Speaker 2: Well, hey, everybody, first, it's great to be back sitting
Speaker 2: by a pool. Signs really good right now. Maybe we
Speaker 2: should do a pool side chat one of these days. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that would be awesome. I I will say, so, I
Speaker 2: was I was going. I was in not so far
Speaker 2: the UK. I was in London and through Durham in
Speaker 2: the north of the UK, and then through Scotland and Edinburgh.
Speaker 2: And I will say definitely, to be fair, it's just
Speaker 2: a weird moment for the world, Like the whole world
Speaker 2: isn't working right now. People are still kind of reeling
Speaker 2: with the rise of fascism and a war of aggression
Speaker 2: like we haven't seen in really a very very long time,
Speaker 2: and climate instability everywhere, and so the whole, the whole
Speaker 2: world is reeling. You know. I go to the Middle
Speaker 2: East a lot, and they're up ended. So but I
Speaker 2: will say that there's something so particular about guns in
Speaker 2: America that you even if the whole world's on fire,
Speaker 2: they're still going to like stop for a minute and say,
Speaker 2: and what the hell is wrong with what the hell's
Speaker 2: wrong with America, and and and and definitely I got
Speaker 2: that the most around around the shootings on the fourth July,
Speaker 2: I've actually been doing a fair bit of British media.
Speaker 2: I did a piece in The Guardian and I have
Speaker 2: a piece coming out in The Independent about this because
Speaker 2: I just got contacted because everybody was like, hey, look,
Speaker 2: this is your national holiday. What the hell is going
Speaker 2: on here? And so it was, on one hand, pretty
Speaker 2: remarkable was happening around what was a long Fourth of
Speaker 2: July weekend. Remember we had everybody. Everybody kind of took
Speaker 2: off like six weeks before and after for Fourth of July.
Speaker 2: But but I will say that it was it was
Speaker 2: it was hot, it was you know, muggy, and it
Speaker 2: was the opening line for my Independent piece is Americans
Speaker 2: celebrated the Fourth of July house holiday in the most
Speaker 2: American way possible by ducking for cover because.
Speaker 1: Damn Jonathan Wow.
Speaker 2: Okay, because that's kind of become our national autobiography. That
Speaker 2: in a way that that's kind of what we saw.
Speaker 2: So there were I think eighteen mass shootings on record
Speaker 2: on the Fourth of July weekend. Twenty two people died
Speaker 2: at least, but I think that's an undercount. One hundred
Speaker 2: people injured, But I think that's an undercount, and that's
Speaker 2: just the high profile mass shooting. That's not all the
Speaker 2: other shootings that we probably had on that weekend too,
Speaker 2: about you know, suicide and partner violence and all the
Speaker 2: other stuff and stuff. So what I said is, in
Speaker 2: a way, the fourth of July shooting is a reflection
Speaker 2: of America right now, that this is our national autobiography,
Speaker 2: this is the world we live in. And there are
Speaker 2: I think are particular reasons. Right in the summer, people
Speaker 2: are out, they're socializing together, they are getting conflict. It's muggy,
Speaker 2: they're irritable. People are also I mean, they just have
Speaker 2: more time to shoot each other around holiday weekends. And
Speaker 2: also I think particularly around fourth of July, there's symbolism
Speaker 2: about out. You know, there are fireworks and things exploding
Speaker 2: and grudges and remember lest year we had a shooting
Speaker 2: at a parade in Illinois, and so there are particular
Speaker 2: things about Fourth of July. But I would also say
Speaker 2: that the numbers on fourth of July weren't that different
Speaker 2: from the numbers for the June or for you know,
Speaker 2: the month before that, And so in a way just
Speaker 2: it just becomes kind of what we've got. And part
Speaker 2: of the story is about a reflection of American trauma,
Speaker 2: and another story is about our complete inability, our complete
Speaker 2: inability to work together to address something that is a
Speaker 2: threat to all of us.
Speaker 1: You know, when you say it is our national autobiography,
Speaker 1: dock and cover, and I think about you know, one,
Speaker 1: I did not realize that it was eighteen mass shootings,
Speaker 1: and you're saying that that's an undercount. You bring up
Speaker 1: the shooting that happened last year where we saw baby
Speaker 1: strollers and sandals and everything abandoned after the shooting that
Speaker 1: happened during the Fourth of July parade. And what was
Speaker 1: funny is that I had gone with friends and their kids.
Speaker 1: They wanted to take their kids down to you know,
Speaker 1: a little like kid parade that was happening in their town,
Speaker 1: and I was terrified, you know, I was terrified to go.
Speaker 1: And I just I want to lift up what you
Speaker 1: just said, like with regard to the collective trauma, right
Speaker 1: like parades, outdoor concerts, movie, you know, outdoor movies like
Speaker 1: these are things that people look forward to and socialize
Speaker 1: around during the summer, and these are the places that
Speaker 1: are most terrorized during the summer, and so can you
Speaker 1: just speak to like this collective trauma and the fact
Speaker 1: that we continue to move through it, right, And also
Speaker 1: like how other people like you said that you're doing
Speaker 1: a lot of writing, you know, with with you know,
Speaker 1: with regard to the British press, how they are looking
Speaker 1: at us, like does the rest of the world. Just
Speaker 1: like because I have not traveled abroad probably in a year,
Speaker 1: and one of the things I like to do is
Speaker 1: just you know, I like to talk to the drivers.
Speaker 1: I like to talk to the people that are you know,
Speaker 1: working and and get a sense of like what their
Speaker 1: views are on you know, on America as well as
Speaker 1: you know, on the country that I happen to be in,
Speaker 1: because I think that it's very raw. But like, talk
Speaker 1: to us about this collective trauma and how we kind
Speaker 1: of just pick up and move through it.
Speaker 2: Well, we habituated. That's kind of the term. I mean,
Speaker 2: if you think about the first mass shootings that we
Speaker 2: heard about when we kind of entered the mass shooting era,
Speaker 2: Columbine or Sandy Hook, Parkland, those were real moments of
Speaker 2: national reckoning, and now it's just they happened so often.
Speaker 2: And it's not just that they happen so often, it's
Speaker 2: that we've lost faith in our political system. And so
Speaker 2: it used to be we would a mass shooting would happen.
Speaker 2: I remember around Sandy Hook I was on Fox News
Speaker 2: all the time, and they were like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: what can we do to fix this? And people were
Speaker 2: marching down the street. Member there were all those huge
Speaker 2: marches in midtown here in New York. And so I
Speaker 2: think part of the story here is just a threat
Speaker 2: to our existence that is met with a complete lack
Speaker 2: of trust in our political system to fix it or
Speaker 2: address it, or even meaningfully engage it. And I think
Speaker 2: that's really part of the story here is you know,
Speaker 2: partially in the piece if it ever gets published, you
Speaker 2: never know what kind of edits they're going to make.
Speaker 2: But I say the framework of Fourth of July is
Speaker 2: like a celebration of you know, life, liberty, the pursuit
Speaker 2: of happiness, and what kind of liberty you have. I
Speaker 2: interview all these parents who who say that they're avoiding
Speaker 2: block parties and not letting their kids go to firecrackers
Speaker 2: because you don't know what is a firecracker and what
Speaker 2: is a gun? A gunshot, and so in a way,
Speaker 2: the impingement on our liberty of thinking you might or
Speaker 2: somebody you love might be the next statistic of a
Speaker 2: mass casualty event is really a real effect on our
Speaker 2: own liberty. Right. We're affecting our freedom, our ability to move.
Speaker 2: And I don't think a lot of people with respect
Speaker 2: are really soothed by the idea of we'll just take
Speaker 2: a gun and you can fire back. It just doesn't
Speaker 2: work that way. That you know, it's very clearly a
Speaker 2: ridiculous response, and so in a way, it's just it
Speaker 2: impacts daily life and daily death and death in our
Speaker 2: country in a real way. But I guess the other part,
Speaker 2: having done this research my book in January talks about
Speaker 2: this more is I've interviewed a lot of gun owners
Speaker 2: who want reform. Also, even in the piece, I interview
Speaker 2: some gun owners who say, look, I'm a gun owner,
Speaker 2: but what we have now is insane. And so it's
Speaker 2: not like it's like a Democrat versus Republican issue totally.
Speaker 2: I mean, it is because of who gets elected, but
Speaker 2: it's also there are these things that just seem really
Speaker 2: basic common sense across the rest of the world. Background checks,
Speaker 2: registering insurance liability, all the things you would do for
Speaker 2: a car, and you can't even do those really basic things.
Speaker 2: And in fact, our Supreme Court right now is poised
Speaker 2: to make things considerably worse with a case they're going
Speaker 2: to hear next year. I can't even believe they're going
Speaker 2: to hear this about whether someone convicted of domestic Yes,
Speaker 2: And so in a way, it's just really, this is
Speaker 2: really what minority rule means. It's not just about like
Speaker 2: imposing the will of five percent of the people and
Speaker 2: everybody else. It's also not letting people work together to
Speaker 2: solve problems. When left in a room together, they could
Speaker 2: find I think some reasonable compromise positions.
Speaker 1: I mean the fact, you know, to your point, the
Speaker 1: fact that the Supreme Court would even hear that kind
Speaker 1: of case, would even say, oh, yeah, this is a
Speaker 1: both sides issue. Let's let's let's hear this out. That
Speaker 1: somebody that has been convicted of domestic violence should own
Speaker 1: a weapon right, and that goes against you know, their right.
Speaker 1: This is the same fucking court you know that you
Speaker 1: have had declare that those that have served time shouldn't
Speaker 1: be able to get their right to vote back. But
Speaker 1: if you beat somebody, you can get your gun back.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and part part of that story. I've actually done
Speaker 2: it number of interviews about this because I'm like, what
Speaker 2: the hell, and not surprisingly people support it on the right.
Speaker 2: I'm not everybody, but the people who reflectively support gun rights,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, how can you possibly support this? And
Speaker 2: what they said is it's just the principle that the
Speaker 2: principle is government.
Speaker 1: There's no fucking principle. Like Jonathan, I can't like, there's.
Speaker 2: Good the thing they said that the government should have
Speaker 2: no role in regulating weapons. That's that's what they're thinking.
Speaker 2: And because I tell you to be honest, when I
Speaker 2: first heard the case, I thought, great, finally we're going
Speaker 2: to get some limitations on this friggin madness. But when
Speaker 2: I did these interviews, I'm like, oh crap, they're actually
Speaker 2: doing this to prove the opposite point, which is that
Speaker 2: there's no limitation whatsoever. And I think Kathy Hoschel had
Speaker 2: a pop ed in the New York Times about this
Speaker 2: or has one coming up, and other people are writing
Speaker 2: about it. But it's it's just a weird. It's a
Speaker 2: weird world we live in right now.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's weird, Jonathan. But it's like everywhere that
Speaker 1: you look, So I want to I want to go
Speaker 1: to your to your time. You know in the UK,
Speaker 1: everywhere that you look, there is not a country that
Speaker 1: isn't dealing with either the rise of fascism, minority rule,
Speaker 1: just the disenfranchisement of you know, of voters, and also
Speaker 1: just the withering of democracy. So talk to us about
Speaker 1: like your time in the UK and what you heard,
Speaker 1: you know while you were there.
Speaker 2: I'm going to get in trouble. I was worried you
Speaker 2: might ask me that, because I will say for sure.
Speaker 2: I mean there are governments falling apart, right and left.
Speaker 2: And before that, I as you know, I was in Israel,
Speaker 2: and you know, say what you will about Israeli politics.
Speaker 2: There are there is a wide range of political views
Speaker 2: there and the fact that like the judiciary has been
Speaker 2: taken over by the same right wing machine is put it.
Speaker 2: People are in shock. I have a lot of friends
Speaker 2: here who it's like America is going down the tubes,
Speaker 2: and so we're moving to Portugal. A lot of people
Speaker 2: are moving to Portugal.
Speaker 1: It's on my list.
Speaker 2: And Portugal had a fascist party, a right wing party
Speaker 2: that had never gotten like more than one percent of
Speaker 2: the vote, and now they're pulling at like thirty percent.
Speaker 2: So the whole world is like, oh, you got a
Speaker 2: strong man. Well I need a strong man too. And
Speaker 2: before I answer your actual question, I will say we
Speaker 2: have a you know, this twenty twenty four election. We
Speaker 2: thought the twenty twenty election was the most important election
Speaker 2: of our lifetime. The twenty twenty four election really is
Speaker 2: the most important election of our lifetimes because America can
Speaker 2: reset the clock on this stuff, or we can go
Speaker 2: down that same path. And I just feel like if
Speaker 2: the American election goes to the far right, that is,
Speaker 2: that's just going to tip everything else over in a way,
Speaker 2: and also of course enable Putin and all these guys.
Speaker 2: So anyway, but your question was about the UK, and
Speaker 2: I will say there. I mean, if you just walk
Speaker 2: down the street in the UK, and if you want
Speaker 2: an example of like what the hell's going on in America,
Speaker 2: you'll find it anywhere. Everybody's like what the hell's going
Speaker 2: on in America? But I will say that there were
Speaker 2: there was a lot of like I mean across Europe,
Speaker 2: how do we play pay for social programs? How do
Speaker 2: we pay for healthcare? How do we pay for retirement?
Speaker 2: How come conservatives are rising back up in our own governments?
Speaker 2: And so I just think there's a model of liberalism
Speaker 2: that is, and I'd be curious your sense about this,
Speaker 2: there's a model of liberalism that just not responding to
Speaker 2: the to the rights of fascism. In other words, like
Speaker 2: I think the europe model that I've seen is like like,
Speaker 2: look at France, you know, trying to raise like France
Speaker 2: is going broke basically because of immigration and raising the
Speaker 2: raising the retirement age and all these kind of things.
Speaker 2: And the model of kind of liberal socialism can't pay
Speaker 2: for I can't pay for what they're doing in a way.
Speaker 2: And so I just feel like liberalism is not an
Speaker 2: answer to fascism right now, or we need a better answer.
Speaker 2: I don't know. That's my sense of Europe. That's a
Speaker 2: very broad answer. I realized.
Speaker 1: We've actually never seen liberalism in action in any real way.
Speaker 1: What we get is centrists at best, and we and
Speaker 1: we call it liberalism. We've actually never I don't know,
Speaker 1: maybe point tell me, point to a progressive body and
Speaker 1: tell me that like, oh, this is this is what
Speaker 1: the rest of the world has tried to model after
Speaker 1: I've never seen it, right, Like we we we referred
Speaker 1: to said Obama was liberal, Obama was not liberal, Obama
Speaker 1: was a centrist. Right, we say Bill Clinton was a
Speaker 1: Bill Clinton was a centrist. Biden is a centrist. Right,
Speaker 1: So I'm not quite sure when we talk about liberalism,
Speaker 1: we've never seen that in action, not in this country.
Speaker 2: What would liberalism look like right now? I mean, again,
Speaker 2: I'm thinking a lot about Europe, and I'm thinking about
Speaker 2: what's the I guess it's really I think it's a
Speaker 2: fair question. What's the model of liberalism that we're advocating
Speaker 2: for in the face of I mean, look, what, like
Speaker 2: is RFK Junior a liberal? Like he's he's fucking crazy,
Speaker 2: He's fucking crazy.
Speaker 1: Like he's absolutely that's I mean to say that that
Speaker 1: man who doesn't believe in vaccines, who like is the
Speaker 1: biggest proponent of conspiracy theories, and all he does is
Speaker 1: have the last name Kennedy is a liberal. He's not
Speaker 1: even a little I don't know what you would call
Speaker 1: his political affiliation besides nuts, Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean, And part of that story is extreme positions
Speaker 2: have become mainstream. Right Kenned. We've known about Kennedy and
Speaker 2: the health community for years and everybody's like, oh, that
Speaker 2: guy's a nut. But but I will just say, it
Speaker 2: just feels like a very unstable moment. But but I
Speaker 2: don't know, this is I know we're going off topic.
Speaker 2: We can talk about this some other time, but like,
Speaker 2: what's a liberal position, for example, on the war on Ukraine?
Speaker 2: Like do we let putin win? Do we keep fighting
Speaker 2: by funding the military? It's like, it's not it's not clear, right,
Speaker 2: There are all these there are all these issues where
Speaker 2: I just think, I just think what it means to
Speaker 2: be a liberal is is it's much easier to be
Speaker 2: a fascism right now because it gives you like easy answers,
Speaker 2: even if they're fake, which is like trust and authoritarians.
Speaker 2: But it's I don't know, I'm not doing a very
Speaker 2: job of articulating this, but it does feel like what
Speaker 2: does it mean to be a liberal right now? Is
Speaker 2: something that I just felt a lot of resonance between
Speaker 2: like things I've been thinking and what I was talking
Speaker 2: about with people in the UK.
Speaker 1: I mean, for me, what does it mean to be
Speaker 1: a liberal at this moment? It means to be looking
Speaker 1: at the the multiple crises that we're dealing with and
Speaker 1: at like, what would it mean to be a liberal
Speaker 1: And I don't even think that the word liberal is right.
Speaker 1: It would be oh, looking at the fact that as
Speaker 1: a globe, we have had the hottest days on record
Speaker 1: since we have been measuring the fucking temperature on this
Speaker 1: planet in the last week, it would look like an
Speaker 1: emergency meeting being pulled together of all of the world
Speaker 1: leaders to actually not just put together a paper plan,
Speaker 1: but an actual fucking plan about how we're going to
Speaker 1: combat climate change in a real way. That is affecting
Speaker 1: everyone right now, not just people in America, not just
Speaker 1: the wildfires in Canada, not just you know, flooding that
Speaker 1: is happening in Europe. That it is affecting everyone, And
Speaker 1: this is like an emergency meeting, right What does it
Speaker 1: look like to pull together again the world leaders to say,
Speaker 1: we have a real issue in terms of the rise
Speaker 1: of fascism and authoritarianism in this country, on this planet,
Speaker 1: and if we are serious about advancing democracy and we're
Speaker 1: serious about advancing human rights, then as a collective, we
Speaker 1: need to come up with a plan that is about
Speaker 1: us as globe citizens that can also be be implemented
Speaker 1: in each of our countries, right, like, like, to me,
Speaker 1: that's not a liberal idea. It's actually looking at the
Speaker 1: fucking problems that are in front of us, instead of
Speaker 1: pretending that they're not there, or wasting time in arguments
Speaker 1: with people trying to define what we know is already happening.
Speaker 2: I mean, this is why, as I've said a million times,
Speaker 2: I'm voting for you for sure. Like, I think that's
Speaker 2: a very clear and our tail it and great framing,
Speaker 2: and I can totally support that, right, I think that
Speaker 2: should that's what needs to happen. Right, we're burning and
Speaker 2: flooding and shooting our way into oblivion, right, I.
Speaker 1: Mean, that's it. That if your book at it, if
Speaker 1: your book had it have already gotten a title, that
Speaker 1: that would have been in the title.
Speaker 2: I tried to believe me, they're so afraid I'm going
Speaker 2: to offend people that they you know, they're they're they're
Speaker 2: afraid of anyway, that's a different tomic. But but but no,
Speaker 2: But but I guess the issue is and I think
Speaker 2: that's a fair point. You made a couple of points
Speaker 2: of which is let's try to think like what and
Speaker 2: we can talk about this on later show. What systems
Speaker 2: are working right now? I think where is it working
Speaker 2: right now? Because, like, I agree with everything you just said,
Speaker 2: but I would also say that that requires a functioning government.
Speaker 2: And we have a government right now where like Tommy
Speaker 2: is like, is like holding up the whole government based
Speaker 2: on a social agenda about wokeism is underwining like promotions
Speaker 2: of people in the military, and and that's happening all
Speaker 2: across the government. People are are I mean, are we
Speaker 2: have a government of petulance right now? And he's definitely
Speaker 2: the worst defender, but there are plenty of people who
Speaker 2: are doing that. And so in a way what you've
Speaker 2: suggested is right, but it also requires like functioning governance.
Speaker 2: So I just think we should also think like where
Speaker 2: is working, Like, let's is there something we can emulate
Speaker 2: about where is where is working?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that that's right, and we'll have to,
Speaker 1: you know, put a pin in that for for today.
Speaker 1: But I do think that it is worth looking and
Speaker 1: who is doing anything right right now? Right because when
Speaker 1: when you look around the globe, when you look at
Speaker 1: these supposed democracies around the globe, they are playing defense
Speaker 1: and that is not a good position to be in,
Speaker 1: right when we're when we're kind of looking at the
Speaker 1: the the access of power really shifting right into a
Speaker 1: way that we could have never imagined would happen. After
Speaker 1: World War Two, after what after what we have all
Speaker 1: collectively seen and known and have America potentially pee part
Speaker 1: of that access of evil. If this next election goes
Speaker 1: the way of the Republicans, that is exactly what will happen.
Speaker 2: And you know, if we lose the election and they
Speaker 2: then give carte blanche for Putin to do all this
Speaker 2: other stuff and the bazillion other things, and there's an
Speaker 2: access of that and the orbons of the world and
Speaker 2: stuff like that, Like, that's a really different that's a
Speaker 2: really different world than the one we're living in. I
Speaker 2: totally agree. So let's figure out somebody simplace to lift
Speaker 2: up and then let's start yeah.
Speaker 1: And having a conversation above that. Well, thank you, my friend.
Speaker 1: It is wonderful to have you back on wokea app.
Speaker 1: Always appreciate you, Jonathan.
Speaker 2: Take everybody, and next week we'll be talking about puppies.
Speaker 2: So hang in there.
Speaker 1: That is it for me today, dear friends on woke app.
Speaker 1: As always, Power to the people and to all the people.
Speaker 1: Power get woke, and stay woke as fuck.