1 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wok F Daily with 2 00:00:14,720 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 1: Meet your Girl Daniel Moody recording from the Home Bunker. Folks. 3 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:24,599 Speaker 1: Let's just start off today with my thoughts which I 4 00:00:24,680 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 1: shared yesterday on Tommy Tuberville, the senator who apparently needed 5 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: to be told the definition of white nationalism so that 6 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 1: he could walk back his white nationalist thoughts about white 7 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 1: nationalists being able to join the military and referring to 8 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: them as Americans. Tommy Tuberville is sixty eight fucking years old, 9 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 1: so I would really love it if mainstream media would 10 00:00:56,960 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: stop giving these motherfuckers the benefit of the out as 11 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 1: if Tommy Tuberville is in elementary school and is just 12 00:01:04,520 --> 00:01:08,200 Speaker 1: learning these topics for the first fucking time. He is not. 13 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 1: And it is the same way that I had to 14 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 1: listen during the entirety of Trump's disastrous administration from people 15 00:01:16,319 --> 00:01:19,559 Speaker 1: like Susan Collins and others that say that Donald Trump 16 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:24,000 Speaker 1: will quote grow into the position, are we fucking dumb? 17 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 1: Like it is this idea of perpetual adolescence that white 18 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:33,520 Speaker 1: men are given in this country. Oh you're sixty something, 19 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: you're seventy something, you're eighty something. Oh they don't know, 20 00:01:37,240 --> 00:01:42,400 Speaker 1: they'll learn. Give me a fucking break. It is intellectually 21 00:01:42,480 --> 00:01:48,520 Speaker 1: dishonest at best and gaslighting at fucking worse. By chasing 22 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: people down like Tommy Tuberville and asking them to define 23 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: statements that were very fucking clear, run with what it 24 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 1: is that they said, instead of trying to get them 25 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 1: to backtrack on what it is that you know that 26 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:10,360 Speaker 1: they believe, and then to boot Tommy Tuoperville's backtracking on 27 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:15,640 Speaker 1: his white nationalist or American statement was well, I was 28 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: a football coach, so I dealt with more minorities than 29 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:23,520 Speaker 1: a lot of people. You dealt with like slave masters 30 00:02:23,800 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 1: dealt with enslaved Africans. Get the fuck out of here. 31 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:33,960 Speaker 1: It is just so wild to me the way that 32 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:39,840 Speaker 1: journalists just refuse to take these people at their word 33 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:45,800 Speaker 1: and print the fucking truth. Tommy Tuberville is a racist, 34 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:49,600 Speaker 1: and he's a fucking terrorist right now in the Senate 35 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:54,239 Speaker 1: as he holds up confirmations for the military because he 36 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 1: doesn't want women in the military to be able to 37 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:03,800 Speaker 1: have access to abortions. I am so tired of them 38 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:08,000 Speaker 1: talking about activism when this is the kind of terrorism 39 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:11,840 Speaker 1: that they are doing. What does it say folks about 40 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 1: our government. When you can have one fucking senator hold 41 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 1: up an entire fucking agency, it means it's broken. And 42 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,680 Speaker 1: those are the conversations that we should be having on 43 00:03:27,720 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 1: a regular basis. And instead of oh, Tommy Tuberville backtracks 44 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 1: on his fucking white nationalist beliefs, it should be Tommy 45 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 1: Tuberville believes that white nationalists are Americans that should have 46 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:46,360 Speaker 1: the ability to join the military. It is bullshit. The 47 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: Republican Party is the white nationalist party. If you are 48 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: a Republican you support white nationalism, plain and simple. You 49 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: attack LGBTQ people, you attack black people, you attack indigenous people, 50 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 1: you attack women, you attack people of color, you attack Muslims. 51 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 1: That is the protocol of the Republican Party. And to 52 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 1: say or print anything to the contrary is a fucking lie. 53 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:21,880 Speaker 1: It is not neutrality. I'm just so tired of mainstream media. 54 00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 1: I'm so tired of this party. I'm so tired of 55 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: them making it so easy to run against them. And yes, 56 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 1: Democrats are trying to figure out what their fucking messaging is. 57 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:40,240 Speaker 1: If you thought, folks that the twenty twenty election was 58 00:04:40,279 --> 00:04:43,800 Speaker 1: the most consequential election of our time, I don't even 59 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,160 Speaker 1: know what to refer to twenty twenty four as, but 60 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 1: it is literally the battle between good and evil, right 61 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:58,720 Speaker 1: and wrong, authoritarianism and democracy. This country is not just backsliding. 62 00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:02,359 Speaker 1: We are hanging on by a fucking thread. And for 63 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:04,600 Speaker 1: folks that say, oh, well, Biden's age, I don't give 64 00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 1: a fuck of Biden as one hundred and fifty. If 65 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 1: that man still has breath in his body and that 66 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 1: is who the fucking nominee is, then that is who 67 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:15,360 Speaker 1: we're voting for, plain and fucking simple. Because the alternative, 68 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:18,719 Speaker 1: whether it's Donald Trump or DeSantis or fucking Haley or 69 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:22,919 Speaker 1: Pence or any other of those Republican fucking clowns, the 70 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 1: alternative is fascism and white nationalism. That is it. 71 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:29,800 Speaker 2: So if you. 72 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 1: Want that, don't vote right our vote for one of 73 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 1: these fucking third party candidates that are also a fucking 74 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:46,559 Speaker 1: clown show. Today, I am aggravated. The entire story around 75 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 1: Tuberville just has me on one. Coming up next, dear friends, 76 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:55,920 Speaker 1: my conversation with our in house doctor, doctor Jonathan Metzel, 77 00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 1: is back after a very long break from the show, 78 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:06,599 Speaker 1: so I'm excited to get into conversation with him. Folks. 79 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:09,920 Speaker 1: I am so excited to welcome back after a very 80 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 1: long break, our friend UH in house doctor doctor Jonathan Methel. 81 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:21,039 Speaker 1: Back to WOKF Jonathan, it has been a long time 82 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:23,640 Speaker 1: since we've chatted. I would love to say that things 83 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:26,520 Speaker 1: in America have gotten surprisingly better since you've been gone. 84 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:31,280 Speaker 1: They haven't. But I want to start off with the 85 00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:37,040 Speaker 1: fact that you know, over the holiday, the fourth of 86 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:40,039 Speaker 1: July holiday, that a lot of people celebrated. You know, 87 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:43,280 Speaker 1: I just chose to drink by a pool because it's 88 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: a day off. But I'm not celebrating America. You know, 89 00:06:46,560 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 1: there were countless shootings, right, some of which elevated to 90 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:56,919 Speaker 1: headline news, others did not. And I and I know 91 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 1: that you've been traveling abroad a bit and and I 92 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:04,160 Speaker 1: wanted to get you know, just your read out on one, 93 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: Why is it just that everyone is off, so everyone 94 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:13,440 Speaker 1: goes and grabs their guns over holidays? Like why the 95 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 1: escalation in shooting happens during that time? Uh is number one? 96 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 1: And then two while you were traveling abroad, I know, 97 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 1: speaking a lot about your your upcoming book and just 98 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:28,800 Speaker 1: your work around you know, gun violence, Like what is 99 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 1: the perspective, what are you being what is being reflected 100 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:37,320 Speaker 1: back at you from the from people abroad in terms 101 00:07:37,320 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 1: of how they are seeing America right now. 102 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 2: Well, hey, everybody, first, it's great to be back sitting 103 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:49,440 Speaker 2: by a pool. Signs really good right now. Maybe we 104 00:07:49,440 --> 00:07:51,920 Speaker 2: should do a pool side chat one of these days. Yeah, 105 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 2: that would be awesome. I I will say, so, I 106 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 2: was I was going. I was in not so far 107 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 2: the UK. I was in London and through Durham in 108 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 2: the north of the UK, and then through Scotland and Edinburgh. 109 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 2: And I will say definitely, to be fair, it's just 110 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 2: a weird moment for the world, Like the whole world 111 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 2: isn't working right now. People are still kind of reeling 112 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 2: with the rise of fascism and a war of aggression 113 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 2: like we haven't seen in really a very very long time, 114 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:30,480 Speaker 2: and climate instability everywhere, and so the whole, the whole 115 00:08:30,520 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 2: world is reeling. You know. I go to the Middle 116 00:08:33,000 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 2: East a lot, and they're up ended. So but I 117 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,920 Speaker 2: will say that there's something so particular about guns in 118 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 2: America that you even if the whole world's on fire, 119 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 2: they're still going to like stop for a minute and say, 120 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 2: and what the hell is wrong with what the hell's 121 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:54,040 Speaker 2: wrong with America, and and and and definitely I got 122 00:08:54,080 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 2: that the most around around the shootings on the fourth July, 123 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,080 Speaker 2: I've actually been doing a fair bit of British media. 124 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 2: I did a piece in The Guardian and I have 125 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 2: a piece coming out in The Independent about this because 126 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 2: I just got contacted because everybody was like, hey, look, 127 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 2: this is your national holiday. What the hell is going 128 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 2: on here? And so it was, on one hand, pretty 129 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:20,800 Speaker 2: remarkable was happening around what was a long Fourth of 130 00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 2: July weekend. Remember we had everybody. Everybody kind of took 131 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 2: off like six weeks before and after for Fourth of July. 132 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 2: But but I will say that it was it was 133 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:38,680 Speaker 2: it was hot, it was you know, muggy, and it 134 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:43,200 Speaker 2: was the opening line for my Independent piece is Americans 135 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 2: celebrated the Fourth of July house holiday in the most 136 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,559 Speaker 2: American way possible by ducking for cover because. 137 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:51,400 Speaker 1: Damn Jonathan Wow. 138 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:56,199 Speaker 2: Okay, because that's kind of become our national autobiography. That 139 00:09:56,360 --> 00:09:59,200 Speaker 2: in a way that that's kind of what we saw. 140 00:09:59,240 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 2: So there were I think eighteen mass shootings on record 141 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 2: on the Fourth of July weekend. Twenty two people died 142 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,199 Speaker 2: at least, but I think that's an undercount. One hundred 143 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:13,720 Speaker 2: people injured, But I think that's an undercount, and that's 144 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:15,840 Speaker 2: just the high profile mass shooting. That's not all the 145 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:18,280 Speaker 2: other shootings that we probably had on that weekend too, 146 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:21,719 Speaker 2: about you know, suicide and partner violence and all the 147 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:24,679 Speaker 2: other stuff and stuff. So what I said is, in 148 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:29,040 Speaker 2: a way, the fourth of July shooting is a reflection 149 00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:32,880 Speaker 2: of America right now, that this is our national autobiography, 150 00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 2: this is the world we live in. And there are 151 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,280 Speaker 2: I think are particular reasons. Right in the summer, people 152 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 2: are out, they're socializing together, they are getting conflict. It's muggy, 153 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:49,560 Speaker 2: they're irritable. People are also I mean, they just have 154 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:54,480 Speaker 2: more time to shoot each other around holiday weekends. And 155 00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:59,599 Speaker 2: also I think particularly around fourth of July, there's symbolism 156 00:10:59,679 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 2: about out. You know, there are fireworks and things exploding 157 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 2: and grudges and remember lest year we had a shooting 158 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:09,760 Speaker 2: at a parade in Illinois, and so there are particular 159 00:11:09,800 --> 00:11:12,440 Speaker 2: things about Fourth of July. But I would also say 160 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:15,360 Speaker 2: that the numbers on fourth of July weren't that different 161 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:19,719 Speaker 2: from the numbers for the June or for you know, 162 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:22,280 Speaker 2: the month before that, And so in a way just 163 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:26,800 Speaker 2: it just becomes kind of what we've got. And part 164 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:29,439 Speaker 2: of the story is about a reflection of American trauma, 165 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:33,960 Speaker 2: and another story is about our complete inability, our complete 166 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 2: inability to work together to address something that is a 167 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 2: threat to all of us. 168 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 1: You know, when you say it is our national autobiography, 169 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:52,000 Speaker 1: dock and cover, and I think about you know, one, 170 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,679 Speaker 1: I did not realize that it was eighteen mass shootings, 171 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:58,719 Speaker 1: and you're saying that that's an undercount. You bring up 172 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 1: the shooting that happened last year where we saw baby 173 00:12:03,679 --> 00:12:08,600 Speaker 1: strollers and sandals and everything abandoned after the shooting that 174 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:11,560 Speaker 1: happened during the Fourth of July parade. And what was 175 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:16,480 Speaker 1: funny is that I had gone with friends and their kids. 176 00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:20,560 Speaker 1: They wanted to take their kids down to you know, 177 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:23,439 Speaker 1: a little like kid parade that was happening in their town, 178 00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:29,439 Speaker 1: and I was terrified, you know, I was terrified to go. 179 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 1: And I just I want to lift up what you 180 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,920 Speaker 1: just said, like with regard to the collective trauma, right 181 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:39,440 Speaker 1: like parades, outdoor concerts, movie, you know, outdoor movies like 182 00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:43,079 Speaker 1: these are things that people look forward to and socialize 183 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:47,040 Speaker 1: around during the summer, and these are the places that 184 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:51,080 Speaker 1: are most terrorized during the summer, and so can you 185 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: just speak to like this collective trauma and the fact 186 00:12:55,400 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 1: that we continue to move through it, right, And also 187 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 1: like how other people like you said that you're doing 188 00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:06,000 Speaker 1: a lot of writing, you know, with with you know, 189 00:13:06,040 --> 00:13:10,000 Speaker 1: with regard to the British press, how they are looking 190 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 1: at us, like does the rest of the world. Just 191 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:16,320 Speaker 1: like because I have not traveled abroad probably in a year, 192 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:19,000 Speaker 1: and one of the things I like to do is 193 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 1: just you know, I like to talk to the drivers. 194 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 1: I like to talk to the people that are you know, 195 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:27,679 Speaker 1: working and and get a sense of like what their 196 00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:30,880 Speaker 1: views are on you know, on America as well as 197 00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:32,760 Speaker 1: you know, on the country that I happen to be in, 198 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: because I think that it's very raw. But like, talk 199 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:40,680 Speaker 1: to us about this collective trauma and how we kind 200 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 1: of just pick up and move through it. 201 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:46,319 Speaker 2: Well, we habituated. That's kind of the term. I mean, 202 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 2: if you think about the first mass shootings that we 203 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:52,200 Speaker 2: heard about when we kind of entered the mass shooting era, 204 00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:57,440 Speaker 2: Columbine or Sandy Hook, Parkland, those were real moments of 205 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:03,080 Speaker 2: national reckoning, and now it's just they happened so often. 206 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:06,520 Speaker 2: And it's not just that they happen so often, it's 207 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 2: that we've lost faith in our political system. And so 208 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 2: it used to be we would a mass shooting would happen. 209 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 2: I remember around Sandy Hook I was on Fox News 210 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:20,480 Speaker 2: all the time, and they were like, oh my god, 211 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 2: what can we do to fix this? And people were 212 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:27,320 Speaker 2: marching down the street. Member there were all those huge 213 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:31,080 Speaker 2: marches in midtown here in New York. And so I 214 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:36,320 Speaker 2: think part of the story here is just a threat 215 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:41,240 Speaker 2: to our existence that is met with a complete lack 216 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 2: of trust in our political system to fix it or 217 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:48,720 Speaker 2: address it, or even meaningfully engage it. And I think 218 00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 2: that's really part of the story here is you know, 219 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:58,000 Speaker 2: partially in the piece if it ever gets published, you 220 00:14:58,000 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 2: never know what kind of edits they're going to make. 221 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 2: But I say the framework of Fourth of July is 222 00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 2: like a celebration of you know, life, liberty, the pursuit 223 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 2: of happiness, and what kind of liberty you have. I 224 00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:15,520 Speaker 2: interview all these parents who who say that they're avoiding 225 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 2: block parties and not letting their kids go to firecrackers 226 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:21,440 Speaker 2: because you don't know what is a firecracker and what 227 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 2: is a gun? A gunshot, and so in a way, 228 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 2: the impingement on our liberty of thinking you might or 229 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:31,560 Speaker 2: somebody you love might be the next statistic of a 230 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:35,320 Speaker 2: mass casualty event is really a real effect on our 231 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:39,400 Speaker 2: own liberty. Right. We're affecting our freedom, our ability to move. 232 00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 2: And I don't think a lot of people with respect 233 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:46,560 Speaker 2: are really soothed by the idea of we'll just take 234 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 2: a gun and you can fire back. It just doesn't 235 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:51,400 Speaker 2: work that way. That you know, it's very clearly a 236 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:55,240 Speaker 2: ridiculous response, and so in a way, it's just it 237 00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 2: impacts daily life and daily death and death in our 238 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 2: country in a real way. But I guess the other part, 239 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:03,880 Speaker 2: having done this research my book in January talks about 240 00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 2: this more is I've interviewed a lot of gun owners 241 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 2: who want reform. Also, even in the piece, I interview 242 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:15,520 Speaker 2: some gun owners who say, look, I'm a gun owner, 243 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:19,080 Speaker 2: but what we have now is insane. And so it's 244 00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:22,200 Speaker 2: not like it's like a Democrat versus Republican issue totally. 245 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:26,360 Speaker 2: I mean, it is because of who gets elected, but 246 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 2: it's also there are these things that just seem really 247 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:34,480 Speaker 2: basic common sense across the rest of the world. Background checks, 248 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:38,840 Speaker 2: registering insurance liability, all the things you would do for 249 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 2: a car, and you can't even do those really basic things. 250 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 2: And in fact, our Supreme Court right now is poised 251 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 2: to make things considerably worse with a case they're going 252 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:51,360 Speaker 2: to hear next year. I can't even believe they're going 253 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 2: to hear this about whether someone convicted of domestic Yes, 254 00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:02,560 Speaker 2: And so in a way, it's just really, this is 255 00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:05,359 Speaker 2: really what minority rule means. It's not just about like 256 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:07,919 Speaker 2: imposing the will of five percent of the people and 257 00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:12,119 Speaker 2: everybody else. It's also not letting people work together to 258 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:16,359 Speaker 2: solve problems. When left in a room together, they could 259 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:18,720 Speaker 2: find I think some reasonable compromise positions. 260 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:21,800 Speaker 1: I mean the fact, you know, to your point, the 261 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:25,600 Speaker 1: fact that the Supreme Court would even hear that kind 262 00:17:25,600 --> 00:17:29,480 Speaker 1: of case, would even say, oh, yeah, this is a 263 00:17:29,520 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 1: both sides issue. Let's let's let's hear this out. That 264 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:36,920 Speaker 1: somebody that has been convicted of domestic violence should own 265 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:40,360 Speaker 1: a weapon right, and that goes against you know, their right. 266 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:44,359 Speaker 1: This is the same fucking court you know that you 267 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:49,880 Speaker 1: have had declare that those that have served time shouldn't 268 00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:51,919 Speaker 1: be able to get their right to vote back. But 269 00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 1: if you beat somebody, you can get your gun back. 270 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, and part part of that story. I've actually done 271 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 2: it number of interviews about this because I'm like, what 272 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:07,120 Speaker 2: the hell, and not surprisingly people support it on the right. 273 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 2: I'm not everybody, but the people who reflectively support gun rights, 274 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:14,879 Speaker 2: and I'm like, how can you possibly support this? And 275 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 2: what they said is it's just the principle that the 276 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:19,480 Speaker 2: principle is government. 277 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:23,680 Speaker 1: There's no fucking principle. Like Jonathan, I can't like, there's. 278 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:28,439 Speaker 2: Good the thing they said that the government should have 279 00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:31,840 Speaker 2: no role in regulating weapons. That's that's what they're thinking. 280 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:34,200 Speaker 2: And because I tell you to be honest, when I 281 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 2: first heard the case, I thought, great, finally we're going 282 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 2: to get some limitations on this friggin madness. But when 283 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 2: I did these interviews, I'm like, oh crap, they're actually 284 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:44,840 Speaker 2: doing this to prove the opposite point, which is that 285 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 2: there's no limitation whatsoever. And I think Kathy Hoschel had 286 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:50,639 Speaker 2: a pop ed in the New York Times about this 287 00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:52,800 Speaker 2: or has one coming up, and other people are writing 288 00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 2: about it. But it's it's just a weird. It's a 289 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:57,920 Speaker 2: weird world we live in right now. 290 00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:02,359 Speaker 1: I mean, it's weird, Jonathan. But it's like everywhere that 291 00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 1: you look, So I want to I want to go 292 00:19:04,880 --> 00:19:07,400 Speaker 1: to your to your time. You know in the UK, 293 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:11,879 Speaker 1: everywhere that you look, there is not a country that 294 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:17,639 Speaker 1: isn't dealing with either the rise of fascism, minority rule, 295 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 1: just the disenfranchisement of you know, of voters, and also 296 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:28,960 Speaker 1: just the withering of democracy. So talk to us about 297 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 1: like your time in the UK and what you heard, 298 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:35,440 Speaker 1: you know while you were there. 299 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:37,520 Speaker 2: I'm going to get in trouble. I was worried you 300 00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:41,879 Speaker 2: might ask me that, because I will say for sure. 301 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,679 Speaker 2: I mean there are governments falling apart, right and left. 302 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,879 Speaker 2: And before that, I as you know, I was in Israel, 303 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:50,840 Speaker 2: and you know, say what you will about Israeli politics. 304 00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:54,320 Speaker 2: There are there is a wide range of political views 305 00:19:54,359 --> 00:19:57,200 Speaker 2: there and the fact that like the judiciary has been 306 00:19:57,240 --> 00:20:00,439 Speaker 2: taken over by the same right wing machine is put it. 307 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:03,520 Speaker 2: People are in shock. I have a lot of friends 308 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 2: here who it's like America is going down the tubes, 309 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:09,440 Speaker 2: and so we're moving to Portugal. A lot of people 310 00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 2: are moving to Portugal. 311 00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:11,920 Speaker 1: It's on my list. 312 00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 2: And Portugal had a fascist party, a right wing party 313 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,000 Speaker 2: that had never gotten like more than one percent of 314 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 2: the vote, and now they're pulling at like thirty percent. 315 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 2: So the whole world is like, oh, you got a 316 00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:26,400 Speaker 2: strong man. Well I need a strong man too. And 317 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 2: before I answer your actual question, I will say we 318 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:32,320 Speaker 2: have a you know, this twenty twenty four election. We 319 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:34,400 Speaker 2: thought the twenty twenty election was the most important election 320 00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:36,879 Speaker 2: of our lifetime. The twenty twenty four election really is 321 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:39,720 Speaker 2: the most important election of our lifetimes because America can 322 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:43,399 Speaker 2: reset the clock on this stuff, or we can go 323 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 2: down that same path. And I just feel like if 324 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:49,320 Speaker 2: the American election goes to the far right, that is, 325 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 2: that's just going to tip everything else over in a way, 326 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,280 Speaker 2: and also of course enable Putin and all these guys. 327 00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:59,480 Speaker 2: So anyway, but your question was about the UK, and 328 00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:02,880 Speaker 2: I will say there. I mean, if you just walk 329 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 2: down the street in the UK, and if you want 330 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:06,680 Speaker 2: an example of like what the hell's going on in America, 331 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 2: you'll find it anywhere. Everybody's like what the hell's going 332 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,760 Speaker 2: on in America? But I will say that there were 333 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:17,280 Speaker 2: there was a lot of like I mean across Europe, 334 00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:19,520 Speaker 2: how do we play pay for social programs? How do 335 00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:21,679 Speaker 2: we pay for healthcare? How do we pay for retirement? 336 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:26,159 Speaker 2: How come conservatives are rising back up in our own governments? 337 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:30,480 Speaker 2: And so I just think there's a model of liberalism 338 00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 2: that is, and I'd be curious your sense about this, 339 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,399 Speaker 2: there's a model of liberalism that just not responding to 340 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:39,080 Speaker 2: the to the rights of fascism. In other words, like 341 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:43,040 Speaker 2: I think the europe model that I've seen is like like, 342 00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:45,280 Speaker 2: look at France, you know, trying to raise like France 343 00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:48,879 Speaker 2: is going broke basically because of immigration and raising the 344 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:52,000 Speaker 2: raising the retirement age and all these kind of things. 345 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:55,680 Speaker 2: And the model of kind of liberal socialism can't pay 346 00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:58,920 Speaker 2: for I can't pay for what they're doing in a way. 347 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 2: And so I just feel like liberalism is not an 348 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 2: answer to fascism right now, or we need a better answer. 349 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:07,919 Speaker 2: I don't know. That's my sense of Europe. That's a 350 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 2: very broad answer. I realized. 351 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:16,000 Speaker 1: We've actually never seen liberalism in action in any real way. 352 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:21,000 Speaker 1: What we get is centrists at best, and we and 353 00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:24,879 Speaker 1: we call it liberalism. We've actually never I don't know, 354 00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:29,360 Speaker 1: maybe point tell me, point to a progressive body and 355 00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:31,880 Speaker 1: tell me that like, oh, this is this is what 356 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 1: the rest of the world has tried to model after 357 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 1: I've never seen it, right, Like we we we referred 358 00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:42,040 Speaker 1: to said Obama was liberal, Obama was not liberal, Obama 359 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,600 Speaker 1: was a centrist. Right, we say Bill Clinton was a 360 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 1: Bill Clinton was a centrist. Biden is a centrist. Right, 361 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:52,600 Speaker 1: So I'm not quite sure when we talk about liberalism, 362 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:58,440 Speaker 1: we've never seen that in action, not in this country. 363 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,160 Speaker 2: What would liberalism look like right now? I mean, again, 364 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:03,879 Speaker 2: I'm thinking a lot about Europe, and I'm thinking about 365 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:06,639 Speaker 2: what's the I guess it's really I think it's a 366 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:09,679 Speaker 2: fair question. What's the model of liberalism that we're advocating 367 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:15,040 Speaker 2: for in the face of I mean, look, what, like 368 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 2: is RFK Junior a liberal? Like he's he's fucking crazy, 369 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 2: He's fucking crazy. 370 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,119 Speaker 1: Like he's absolutely that's I mean to say that that 371 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: man who doesn't believe in vaccines, who like is the 372 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:30,439 Speaker 1: biggest proponent of conspiracy theories, and all he does is 373 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: have the last name Kennedy is a liberal. He's not 374 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:34,480 Speaker 1: even a little I don't know what you would call 375 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:37,480 Speaker 1: his political affiliation besides nuts, Yeah. 376 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:40,360 Speaker 2: I mean, And part of that story is extreme positions 377 00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:43,159 Speaker 2: have become mainstream. Right Kenned. We've known about Kennedy and 378 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,200 Speaker 2: the health community for years and everybody's like, oh, that 379 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,879 Speaker 2: guy's a nut. But but I will just say, it 380 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:53,320 Speaker 2: just feels like a very unstable moment. But but I 381 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,120 Speaker 2: don't know, this is I know we're going off topic. 382 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:57,080 Speaker 2: We can talk about this some other time, but like, 383 00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,719 Speaker 2: what's a liberal position, for example, on the war on Ukraine? 384 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:03,440 Speaker 2: Like do we let putin win? Do we keep fighting 385 00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:07,200 Speaker 2: by funding the military? It's like, it's not it's not clear, right, 386 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 2: There are all these there are all these issues where 387 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:13,159 Speaker 2: I just think, I just think what it means to 388 00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:16,240 Speaker 2: be a liberal is is it's much easier to be 389 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 2: a fascism right now because it gives you like easy answers, 390 00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:22,000 Speaker 2: even if they're fake, which is like trust and authoritarians. 391 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:24,120 Speaker 2: But it's I don't know, I'm not doing a very 392 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:28,760 Speaker 2: job of articulating this, but it does feel like what 393 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,879 Speaker 2: does it mean to be a liberal right now? Is 394 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,520 Speaker 2: something that I just felt a lot of resonance between 395 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:35,920 Speaker 2: like things I've been thinking and what I was talking 396 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:37,360 Speaker 2: about with people in the UK. 397 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 1: I mean, for me, what does it mean to be 398 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 1: a liberal at this moment? It means to be looking 399 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:49,000 Speaker 1: at the the multiple crises that we're dealing with and 400 00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 1: at like, what would it mean to be a liberal 401 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,320 Speaker 1: And I don't even think that the word liberal is right. 402 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,400 Speaker 1: It would be oh, looking at the fact that as 403 00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:02,440 Speaker 1: a globe, we have had the hottest days on record 404 00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:07,119 Speaker 1: since we have been measuring the fucking temperature on this 405 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:10,479 Speaker 1: planet in the last week, it would look like an 406 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:13,760 Speaker 1: emergency meeting being pulled together of all of the world 407 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,439 Speaker 1: leaders to actually not just put together a paper plan, 408 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:21,159 Speaker 1: but an actual fucking plan about how we're going to 409 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,480 Speaker 1: combat climate change in a real way. That is affecting 410 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:28,520 Speaker 1: everyone right now, not just people in America, not just 411 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 1: the wildfires in Canada, not just you know, flooding that 412 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 1: is happening in Europe. That it is affecting everyone, And 413 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,399 Speaker 1: this is like an emergency meeting, right What does it 414 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:41,760 Speaker 1: look like to pull together again the world leaders to say, 415 00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,440 Speaker 1: we have a real issue in terms of the rise 416 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:48,480 Speaker 1: of fascism and authoritarianism in this country, on this planet, 417 00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:52,280 Speaker 1: and if we are serious about advancing democracy and we're 418 00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:56,280 Speaker 1: serious about advancing human rights, then as a collective, we 419 00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,360 Speaker 1: need to come up with a plan that is about 420 00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:04,440 Speaker 1: us as globe citizens that can also be be implemented 421 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,879 Speaker 1: in each of our countries, right, like, like, to me, 422 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,760 Speaker 1: that's not a liberal idea. It's actually looking at the 423 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 1: fucking problems that are in front of us, instead of 424 00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:18,160 Speaker 1: pretending that they're not there, or wasting time in arguments 425 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,680 Speaker 1: with people trying to define what we know is already happening. 426 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,359 Speaker 2: I mean, this is why, as I've said a million times, 427 00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:27,760 Speaker 2: I'm voting for you for sure. Like, I think that's 428 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:31,520 Speaker 2: a very clear and our tail it and great framing, 429 00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:33,439 Speaker 2: and I can totally support that, right, I think that 430 00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,959 Speaker 2: should that's what needs to happen. Right, we're burning and 431 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:40,640 Speaker 2: flooding and shooting our way into oblivion, right, I. 432 00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:42,680 Speaker 1: Mean, that's it. That if your book at it, if 433 00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,680 Speaker 1: your book had it have already gotten a title, that 434 00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:46,840 Speaker 1: that would have been in the title. 435 00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:49,000 Speaker 2: I tried to believe me, they're so afraid I'm going 436 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 2: to offend people that they you know, they're they're they're 437 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:55,959 Speaker 2: afraid of anyway, that's a different tomic. But but but no, 438 00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:58,200 Speaker 2: But but I guess the issue is and I think 439 00:26:58,280 --> 00:26:59,840 Speaker 2: that's a fair point. You made a couple of points 440 00:26:59,840 --> 00:27:02,159 Speaker 2: of which is let's try to think like what and 441 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:05,200 Speaker 2: we can talk about this on later show. What systems 442 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,520 Speaker 2: are working right now? I think where is it working 443 00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:13,240 Speaker 2: right now? Because, like, I agree with everything you just said, 444 00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 2: but I would also say that that requires a functioning government. 445 00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:20,640 Speaker 2: And we have a government right now where like Tommy 446 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 2: is like, is like holding up the whole government based 447 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:28,840 Speaker 2: on a social agenda about wokeism is underwining like promotions 448 00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:32,439 Speaker 2: of people in the military, and and that's happening all 449 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:34,679 Speaker 2: across the government. People are are I mean, are we 450 00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:37,920 Speaker 2: have a government of petulance right now? And he's definitely 451 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:39,959 Speaker 2: the worst defender, but there are plenty of people who 452 00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:41,800 Speaker 2: are doing that. And so in a way what you've 453 00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:45,800 Speaker 2: suggested is right, but it also requires like functioning governance. 454 00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 2: So I just think we should also think like where 455 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,000 Speaker 2: is working, Like, let's is there something we can emulate 456 00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:53,840 Speaker 2: about where is where is working? 457 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that that's right, and we'll have to, 458 00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:00,640 Speaker 1: you know, put a pin in that for for today. 459 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:05,679 Speaker 1: But I do think that it is worth looking and 460 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 1: who is doing anything right right now? Right because when 461 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:12,200 Speaker 1: when you look around the globe, when you look at 462 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:17,040 Speaker 1: these supposed democracies around the globe, they are playing defense 463 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,080 Speaker 1: and that is not a good position to be in, 464 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:24,359 Speaker 1: right when we're when we're kind of looking at the 465 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:29,879 Speaker 1: the the access of power really shifting right into a 466 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,280 Speaker 1: way that we could have never imagined would happen. After 467 00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:35,960 Speaker 1: World War Two, after what after what we have all 468 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 1: collectively seen and known and have America potentially pee part 469 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:45,920 Speaker 1: of that access of evil. If this next election goes 470 00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:49,400 Speaker 1: the way of the Republicans, that is exactly what will happen. 471 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 2: And you know, if we lose the election and they 472 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:56,000 Speaker 2: then give carte blanche for Putin to do all this 473 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 2: other stuff and the bazillion other things, and there's an 474 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 2: access of that and the orbons of the world and 475 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:03,400 Speaker 2: stuff like that, Like, that's a really different that's a 476 00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:05,560 Speaker 2: really different world than the one we're living in. I 477 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 2: totally agree. So let's figure out somebody simplace to lift 478 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:11,600 Speaker 2: up and then let's start yeah. 479 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:15,719 Speaker 1: And having a conversation above that. Well, thank you, my friend. 480 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 1: It is wonderful to have you back on wokea app. 481 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,400 Speaker 1: Always appreciate you, Jonathan. 482 00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:25,080 Speaker 2: Take everybody, and next week we'll be talking about puppies. 483 00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:25,960 Speaker 2: So hang in there. 484 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 1: That is it for me today, dear friends on woke app. 485 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:38,840 Speaker 1: As always, Power to the people and to all the people. 486 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:42,040 Speaker 1: Power get woke, and stay woke as fuck.