1 00:00:05,440 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: As I got into how my family gained and then 2 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:10,560 Speaker 1: lost control of a plot of land in East Texas, 3 00:00:11,200 --> 00:00:13,360 Speaker 1: I learned that we were part of a broader trend 4 00:00:14,160 --> 00:00:18,880 Speaker 1: for Black Americans after slavery. Owning land was freedom, it 5 00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:24,439 Speaker 1: was autonomy and importantly economic security because farming was big 6 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: business back then, and some black families have been farmers 7 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:31,080 Speaker 1: for generations all the way up to the present day. 8 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:36,280 Speaker 1: Take one black farmer in Virginia, John Boyd, who grows 9 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 1: wheat and other crops. He also raised his cows. I 10 00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:44,000 Speaker 1: really was trained as a farmer by my dad and grandfather. 11 00:00:45,120 --> 00:00:49,239 Speaker 1: My mother's parents were sharecroppers, and I also worked on 12 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 1: their farm as a little boy, so I got to 13 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,160 Speaker 1: see it on both sides. You know what it was 14 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: like to to own your farm, and I also got 15 00:00:57,240 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 1: to see what it was like having grandparents as share croppers. 16 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: John comes from a long line of black farmers whose 17 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:06,040 Speaker 1: legacy stretches back to the end of the Civil War. 18 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: His farm is located in a southern Virginia town called Baskerville. 19 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:15,440 Speaker 1: In eighteen sixty eight, the Fourteenth Amendment grantited citizenship to 20 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:19,720 Speaker 1: black people, and after the Civil War, despite many obstacles, 21 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: black people were able to purchase some of the very 22 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:26,280 Speaker 1: land they've been forced to farm under slavery. By nine 23 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,840 Speaker 1: black men operated around four of all the farms in 24 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:34,440 Speaker 1: the US, but over the years that share of black 25 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:39,760 Speaker 1: farms declined, and in a big way. Today black people 26 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:43,559 Speaker 1: operate less than two percent of farms in America. White 27 00:01:43,560 --> 00:01:47,920 Speaker 1: people basically run the rest. So what happened to the 28 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:51,200 Speaker 1: black farming industry over the last century. Of course, I 29 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:53,559 Speaker 1: knew we had racial tensions in the country at that time, 30 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:56,160 Speaker 1: but I didn't see it as what I was about 31 00:01:56,160 --> 00:02:00,559 Speaker 1: to run into this major brick wall and I waken 32 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 1: in reality check with the government. It was a real 33 00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:07,040 Speaker 1: break up call for me. They really let me know 34 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 1: that there was a difference in the way many in 35 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:13,360 Speaker 1: his country view black and white and race relations. In 36 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:16,960 Speaker 1: the late nineteen eighties, John Boyd had only owned his 37 00:02:17,040 --> 00:02:19,920 Speaker 1: land for a few years, but he found himself on 38 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:23,080 Speaker 1: the verge of losing all of it and jeopardizing his 39 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:26,600 Speaker 1: family's legacy of ownership. There was a nine year period 40 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 1: in which I was trying to get farm operating loans, 41 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: so I was applying every year. I think I may 42 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:39,400 Speaker 1: have received one one loan and the rest were for denials, 43 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:44,520 Speaker 1: so totally last bit of the eighties and early nineties. Uh, 44 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:50,200 Speaker 1: every every everything just blew up. The thing is what 45 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 1: happened to John Boyd was also happening to tens of 46 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 1: thousands of other black farmers. And it was happening because 47 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: they were black. But those houses of farmers were about 48 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 1: to take on the government, and their fight represents a 49 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 1: long overlook chapter in the push for black equality. The 50 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:21,560 Speaker 1: data shows that the median white family has ten times 51 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: more wealth than the average black family. One of the 52 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 1: drivers of that wealth gap is redlining. Economists often point 53 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:33,400 Speaker 1: to the absence of African American generational wealth forces. Be heard, 54 00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 1: and we're gonna not the United States, the problem of avriculture. No, 55 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 1: that we're not leaving until we were seeing justice. I'll 56 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: come on in. It's a trend propelled not just by 57 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 1: economic forces, but by white racism in local white political 58 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 1: and economic power. It's much easier to integrate a lunch 59 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,960 Speaker 1: counter than it is to guarantee an annual income, for instance, 60 00:03:54,040 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 1: to get rid of positive Welcome back to the paycheck. 61 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:07,119 Speaker 1: I'm Rebecca Greenfield and I'm Jackie Simmons. This week we're 62 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:13,160 Speaker 1: talking about land, specifically farmland. Today, when we think about 63 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 1: wealthy dynasties, we don't usually think about generations of farmers. 64 00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:20,400 Speaker 1: But for most of the twentieth century, farming was a 65 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 1: huge part of life in America. It was a huge 66 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 1: part of black life. Running a farm was a good 67 00:04:27,080 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 1: way to make a living, and owning the land meant 68 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:33,400 Speaker 1: farmers could pass wealth to their children. But over the 69 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 1: last century, black people lost nearly all their farm land. 70 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 1: We're talking about a huge amount of black wealth that 71 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 1: assembly vanished. By one estimate, the land alone was worth 72 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: three fifty billion dollars. So what made that wealth disappear. 73 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 1: A lot of it goes back to farming loans, and 74 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:55,919 Speaker 1: it's the U. S Department of Agriculture that's responsible for 75 00:04:56,000 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 1: dispensing those loans. That's where John Boyd comes and Elizabeth 76 00:05:01,880 --> 00:05:10,160 Speaker 1: Rembert has a story. John Boyd thought his first piece 77 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:13,279 Speaker 1: of farmland when he was eighteen. He wanted to follow 78 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 1: in his parents and his grandparents footsteps, and as soon 79 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 1: as he was old enough, he set out to carve 80 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: out his own piece of property. I bought my first 81 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:27,280 Speaker 1: farm in from another black farmer by the name of 82 00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 1: Russell sally Ah. He was having difficulties with then it 83 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:37,760 Speaker 1: was called the Farmer's Home Administration, and so he agreed 84 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:40,160 Speaker 1: to sell me as farm But what John didn't know 85 00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:43,039 Speaker 1: was that the difficulties that Russell was having with the 86 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 1: Farmer's Home Administration, those would foreshadow problems John himself was 87 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 1: going to have down the line. The Farmer's Home Administration 88 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 1: was a unit within the U s d A. The 89 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 1: U s d A is the biggest provider of money 90 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 1: to farmers in the US. It has a one hundred 91 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:05,200 Speaker 1: and fifty one billion dollar federal budget, and part of 92 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:08,240 Speaker 1: its mission is to operate like a big bank for farmers. 93 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:12,400 Speaker 1: It lends money to pay for seeds, equipment, and labor. 94 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:16,800 Speaker 1: The us DA's roots date all the way back to 95 00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln, who formally established the agency in eighteen sixty two. 96 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 1: He called it the People's Department because back then half 97 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:28,479 Speaker 1: of all Americans lived on a farm. But for a 98 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:31,120 Speaker 1: long time there was a problem at the U s 99 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:37,280 Speaker 1: d A. The agency, the so called People's Department, wasn't 100 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:41,599 Speaker 1: lending money equally to black and white farmers. In the 101 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: nineteen nineties, the agency took an average of two hundred 102 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 1: and twenty days to process a loan application for a 103 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:50,479 Speaker 1: black farmer versus the sixty days it took for a 104 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:54,599 Speaker 1: white farmers application. And between two thousand and six and 105 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:58,559 Speaker 1: two thousand and sixteen, black farmers represented less than three 106 00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 1: percent of the recipients of the U. S d A's 107 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 1: direct loans, but they made up more than thirteen percent 108 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 1: of the farmers who lost their land to foreclosure. Those 109 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 1: discrepancies had major consequences, and John was about to find 110 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: out that, as with many things in the US, landownership 111 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 1: was completely skewed to white people. Skewed as in, black 112 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:28,119 Speaker 1: people own less than one percent of American farmland. White 113 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:32,800 Speaker 1: people basically own the rest. Economists call this the land gap. 114 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:37,120 Speaker 1: A better name for it might be the land Chasm, 115 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 1: the Grand Canyon of inequity. Black landownership began to fall 116 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 1: off after its peak in nineteen ten. Many black farmers 117 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: didn't have wills or estate plans, so banks, real estate companies, 118 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: and other predatory actors were able to force property sales. 119 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 1: When black landowners died, some stopped farming due to intimidation 120 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:05,280 Speaker 1: violent race riots. One farmer told me she remembers racist 121 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 1: neighbors burning crosses on the land her family owned, and 122 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 1: then there was the U. S d A, which was 123 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 1: locking black farmers out and causing them to lose their land. 124 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 1: The impact of losing that land lasted generations. I talked 125 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: to Thomas Mitchell, a law professor at Texas A and 126 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 1: M about the cost of what black farmers were shut 127 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:41,679 Speaker 1: out of, not just the land itself, but the economic 128 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:45,440 Speaker 1: power it could have had to secure college educations and 129 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:50,000 Speaker 1: build wealth over generations. He added all of that potential 130 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:53,040 Speaker 1: value that would have been built on the land to 131 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,560 Speaker 1: the three hundred and fifty billion dollars he estimates the 132 00:08:56,600 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 1: farmland itself is worth, and he came up with a 133 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 1: dollar figure that represents everything black farmers have lost over 134 00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:08,640 Speaker 1: the years. We're thinking that that additional impact could be, 135 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:14,679 Speaker 1: you know, somewhere between four hundred and five billion dollars, 136 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:19,120 Speaker 1: so that the overall negative net impact of this loss 137 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 1: of land could be on the order of a trillion dollars. 138 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: A trillion dollars. That's a really huge number to wrap 139 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:31,360 Speaker 1: your head around. But what Thomas is saying is that 140 00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 1: the gulf between black and white land ownership is a 141 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:40,880 Speaker 1: root cause of the gap between black and white wealth. Now. 142 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 1: John Boyd the farmer that we heard from earlier, he 143 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,840 Speaker 1: wasn't thinking about the wealth gap or the land gap 144 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 1: or structural inequality back in the nineties. He just wanted 145 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:56,439 Speaker 1: to farm. And usually when a person wants to farm, 146 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:58,439 Speaker 1: the U. S d A can be a partner in that. 147 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:03,440 Speaker 1: It's purpose is to help farmers with the resources they need. 148 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:09,160 Speaker 1: One of those resources credit. Access to credit is a 149 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 1: make or break issue for most farmers, especially for young farmers. 150 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:16,800 Speaker 1: Farmers often need loans to get the seed in the 151 00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:20,760 Speaker 1: ground and the equipment running. After they harvest and sell 152 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:23,440 Speaker 1: their crops, they can use that money to pay back 153 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:27,720 Speaker 1: the loan, and it's a cycle for every season. But 154 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 1: if they never get that loan, or if they don't 155 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:33,560 Speaker 1: get it on time or get enough money, it sets 156 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 1: their harvest back and then their ability to pay loans back. 157 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:42,240 Speaker 1: To start the process of getting credit and resources, farmers 158 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:44,840 Speaker 1: head into their local U. S d A office and 159 00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:48,480 Speaker 1: sit down with the loan officer. But in John's first 160 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:50,840 Speaker 1: meeting with his county's U. S d A loan officer 161 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:54,600 Speaker 1: back in the mid nineteen eighties, he could tell that 162 00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:58,599 Speaker 1: borrowing wouldn't be easy for one The U s d 163 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:02,880 Speaker 1: A officer would own, you see, black farmers once a week, 164 00:11:03,880 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 1: so we all had the same letters. Your apartment is 165 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:12,560 Speaker 1: at nine o'clock nine am Wednesday morning, and we would 166 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 1: all come to the office with the with the same letter. 167 00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:19,600 Speaker 1: And what he experienced next was disturbing. It was, you know, 168 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:22,680 Speaker 1: a time period where he tore my application up and 169 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:26,160 Speaker 1: tossing in the trash can. This man spat on me. 170 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:32,760 Speaker 1: He left the door open, he talked boastfully loudly about 171 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:35,240 Speaker 1: what he wasn't gonna do, and uh, you know, if 172 00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:36,960 Speaker 1: he was going to do something, this is all he 173 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:40,440 Speaker 1: was gonna do. And it was a real quick, all 174 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: right opening experience for the way blacks were treated versus whites, 175 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:49,679 Speaker 1: especially in the South. John says that white farmers were 176 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 1: treated very differently. He says that once he was meeting 177 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 1: with a loan officer when a white farmer walked in. 178 00:11:57,480 --> 00:12:00,240 Speaker 1: John says the loan officer handed over a government check 179 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:04,800 Speaker 1: for one hundred and fifty seven thousand dollars. According to John, 180 00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 1: after exchanging pleasantries with the white farmer and making plans 181 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 1: for dinner, the loan officer casually reminded him to come 182 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 1: back and fill out the paperwork for the loan because 183 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:20,839 Speaker 1: he'd estimated based on the previous year's numbers. John had 184 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:24,560 Speaker 1: been practically begging for a loan for a tiny fraction 185 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: of that amount. So here this farmer have received a 186 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:31,160 Speaker 1: farm operating on for hundred fifty seven thousand dollars. He 187 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:35,640 Speaker 1: hadn't even done the paperwork, the correct paperwork on the loan, 188 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:38,880 Speaker 1: and I was pretty much big and pleading for five 189 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:44,080 Speaker 1: thousand dollar operating loan. And he had this conversation as 190 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 1: though I was invisible. John says the U. S d 191 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: A operated like a whites only country club, where you 192 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:52,640 Speaker 1: had to be a part of the club to get 193 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:55,840 Speaker 1: the money that you need for your farm. And this 194 00:12:55,960 --> 00:13:00,240 Speaker 1: discrimination against black farmers was so widespread that people called 195 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:05,839 Speaker 1: the U. S d A the Last Plantation in news articles, studies, 196 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,480 Speaker 1: and even in court documents. The U. S d A 197 00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:13,080 Speaker 1: is a federal agency, but many loan decisions are made 198 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:18,280 Speaker 1: locally by committee members. They're elected by their local communities, 199 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 1: and the overwhelming majority of these committee members were white, 200 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 1: So they were just your local guys, but they had 201 00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:31,079 Speaker 1: a huge amount of influence and power. On a whim. 202 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 1: They could reject, delay, or reduce loans to farmers. Here's 203 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:39,200 Speaker 1: John talking about the loan officer. He told me one 204 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 1: time he was the next thing to God in his county. 205 00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:46,679 Speaker 1: He controlled all the bank boards, and he said, nobody 206 00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:50,680 Speaker 1: lends more money in this county than I do. And 207 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 1: if you don't learn how to speak to me, you're 208 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:54,600 Speaker 1: not going to get any any money, and you won't 209 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:58,160 Speaker 1: be and you won't be farming very long. That's what 210 00:13:58,240 --> 00:14:02,400 Speaker 1: he said. And got into it, and I told him 211 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:05,600 Speaker 1: I didn't I didn't know what Jesus Christ, no God 212 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:07,920 Speaker 1: look like I said. But he can't look like you. 213 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 1: He can't act like you. John applied every year for 214 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:15,199 Speaker 1: an operating loan, which was essential in getting seeds in 215 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 1: the ground to be able to make money in the harvest, 216 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:23,680 Speaker 1: but nearly every single application was denied, and without those loans, 217 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:26,320 Speaker 1: John couldn't get the profit from his farm that he 218 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 1: needed to pay down the debt he inherited from the 219 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 1: previous owner. One day, John says, the USDA tried to 220 00:14:34,040 --> 00:14:37,760 Speaker 1: take some of the land away from him. John says 221 00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 1: his loan officer wanted him to sign over his land 222 00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:44,880 Speaker 1: to a white landowner in the area, and then John 223 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:48,440 Speaker 1: could rent land from the white farmer, So basically, you 224 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 1: wanted me to be a share crop. John says he 225 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 1: refused to sign the paperwork because he refused to give 226 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 1: up on his land. He was determined to fight to 227 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:02,120 Speaker 1: keep it. He borrowed money from his family and friends, 228 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 1: and that helped him scrape together enough to make the 229 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: minimum payment each month for a while, until one day 230 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:16,760 Speaker 1: he couldn't. And then one night, at midnight, federal agents 231 00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:18,720 Speaker 1: sent by the U. S d A showed up banging 232 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:21,720 Speaker 1: on his front door. They woke up his five year 233 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:25,680 Speaker 1: old son, who looked on as strangers loaded his father's 234 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:30,600 Speaker 1: belongings into trucks. You know, they kept choosing to sell 235 00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 1: me out rather than to work with me to see 236 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:35,600 Speaker 1: what they could do to help me stay on the farm. 237 00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:40,160 Speaker 1: John knew this wasn't just happening to him. He started 238 00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 1: calling up other black farmers in the area to talk 239 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:45,080 Speaker 1: about their experiences dealing with the U. S d A. 240 00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 1: And he found the discrimination by local loan officers was 241 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:52,960 Speaker 1: sort of an open secret. We would shake our heads, 242 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:58,440 Speaker 1: but we didn't have a real conversation. Must Old Black 243 00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 1: pride is the definition of that Black farmers like John 244 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 1: were losing their land, their operations and their ability to 245 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:10,800 Speaker 1: improve their lives and their children's lives because they couldn't 246 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:21,440 Speaker 1: get loans. So John decided to fight back. He started 247 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: a group called the National Black Farmers Association to represent 248 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 1: black farmers interests and to get people to take him seriously, 249 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:33,520 Speaker 1: and he started suing the government. First, John tried to 250 00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:36,080 Speaker 1: contest his own loan rejection with the U. S d A. 251 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 1: Then he started finding lawsuits on behalf of other farmers 252 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:42,840 Speaker 1: for their discrimination at the hands of the U. S 253 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:48,200 Speaker 1: d A. And then in he led a group of 254 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 1: sixty farmers to Washington, d C. That was campaigning and 255 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:57,560 Speaker 1: and protesting and cities around the country. And I took 256 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:01,000 Speaker 1: my mule there. I took my tractor there. John's message 257 00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:04,600 Speaker 1: as he and a crowd of protesters led literal mules 258 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:09,040 Speaker 1: around the seat of government. We have our mule. Now 259 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 1: we're looking for our forty acres. I went over to 260 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:22,159 Speaker 1: the department for the first day and there were a 261 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: group of black farmers picketing the Department of Agriculture. That's 262 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,679 Speaker 1: s Dan Glickman. Today he's a senior policy fellow at 263 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:35,399 Speaker 1: a think tank, but back in he had recently been 264 00:17:35,440 --> 00:17:39,160 Speaker 1: appointed to be Secretary of Agriculture by President Bill Clinton. 265 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 1: He had served nine terms in Congress as a representative 266 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,640 Speaker 1: from Kansas, and he thought he was pretty well steeped 267 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:50,239 Speaker 1: on the issues farmers face until he got to the U. 268 00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:53,160 Speaker 1: S d A. I was a congressman for eighteen years 269 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:56,520 Speaker 1: from Kansas, has served on the Agriculture Committee that entire time, 270 00:17:57,040 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 1: and do not recall ever one hearing on this subject 271 00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:04,960 Speaker 1: of discrimination against a minority or black farmers. He says 272 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,800 Speaker 1: his first impulse was to figure out what was going on. 273 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:10,440 Speaker 1: So I talked to my staff and I said, let's 274 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 1: get into this thing. Let's figure out what's happening. I 275 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 1: talked to the farmers who are picketing for a short time, 276 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: and I said, well, I'll get to work on it. 277 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 1: I don't know anything about it. Then he went to 278 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 1: the White House and talked to Bill Clinton personally. Essentially, 279 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:29,800 Speaker 1: he says, the President told him make this right. And 280 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:34,439 Speaker 1: it was complicated because the picketing didn't stop, and we 281 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:39,639 Speaker 1: had the open sessions that were pretty emotional, not only 282 00:18:39,680 --> 00:18:43,040 Speaker 1: in Washington and around the country. I took a team 283 00:18:43,119 --> 00:18:46,240 Speaker 1: and we listened to farmers in various states, particularly in 284 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:50,480 Speaker 1: the South. We did open town meetings, and you could 285 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:53,880 Speaker 1: sense the high level of emotion and the belief that 286 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:57,639 Speaker 1: this system wasn't working for a large number of people. 287 00:18:58,040 --> 00:19:00,800 Speaker 1: When Dan listened to the farmers stories, he said he 288 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:05,639 Speaker 1: knew these experiences weren't isolated loan denials or just random offenses. 289 00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:09,600 Speaker 1: The stories traced back to a much bigger history of 290 00:19:09,720 --> 00:19:17,360 Speaker 1: racism and its hold on agriculture, property and opportunity. One 291 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:19,679 Speaker 1: farmer that Dan heard a lot from was John Boyd. 292 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:23,919 Speaker 1: By this time, John had filed a lot of lawsuits 293 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:27,400 Speaker 1: against the U. S d a's Civil Rights Office alleging 294 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,080 Speaker 1: that the U. S d A was discriminating against him 295 00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:36,000 Speaker 1: and other black farmers, and Dan, as Agriculture secretary, was 296 00:19:36,040 --> 00:19:44,600 Speaker 1: the defendant in many of those lawsuits. The movement was growing. 297 00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:48,800 Speaker 1: The protests John led and the lawsuits he filed were 298 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:54,080 Speaker 1: getting national media attention, and that media attention led more 299 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:56,480 Speaker 1: and more black farmers to go public with their own 300 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 1: experiences of discrimination at the hands of the U. S 301 00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:06,080 Speaker 1: d A. John got an update from Washington the U. 302 00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:08,840 Speaker 1: S d A's Civil Rights Office was going to settle 303 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:12,680 Speaker 1: the complaint that he had filed against the agency over discrimination. 304 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:17,240 Speaker 1: John saw it as a victory after so many years 305 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:21,040 Speaker 1: of fighting for him. It confirmed what he had always 306 00:20:21,080 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 1: known he had been treated unfairly. It included a twelve 307 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:30,000 Speaker 1: page document that stated outright that the U. S d 308 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:35,120 Speaker 1: A had discriminated against John. He wouldn't tell me exactly 309 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:37,600 Speaker 1: how much he got, but it was enough to buy 310 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:41,440 Speaker 1: some land back. But the loan officer in Virginia, who 311 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 1: John says, spat on him and tore up his loan application. 312 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:50,480 Speaker 1: John says, he retired, so there there was no no 313 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:55,760 Speaker 1: act of pity for anyone who discriminated against any of us. 314 00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:00,720 Speaker 1: John's case turned out to be bigger than him. His 315 00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 1: settlement and all of his activism set the stage for 316 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:07,840 Speaker 1: something that would go way beyond him and put more 317 00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:10,960 Speaker 1: than two billion dollars in the hands of thousands of 318 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 1: black farmers. Soon after John's own case was settled with 319 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:25,760 Speaker 1: the U. S d A, he worked with a farmer 320 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 1: from North Carolina named Timothy Pickford to file what would 321 00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:36,040 Speaker 1: become the largest class action lawsuit in US history. The 322 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:41,840 Speaker 1: lawsuit became known as Pigford Versus Glickman. Timothy Pigford's lawyers 323 00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:44,840 Speaker 1: claimed the U. S d A had discriminated against black 324 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:48,919 Speaker 1: farmers when doling out loans and assistants. It was a 325 00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:53,400 Speaker 1: familiar complaint by now, but the Pigford case took things further. 326 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,960 Speaker 1: It also said the U. S d A had not 327 00:21:57,119 --> 00:22:03,040 Speaker 1: properly handled complaints of prejudice. In fact, the agency wasn't 328 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 1: handling the complaints at all. The U. S d A 329 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:11,040 Speaker 1: Civil Rights Office, which was supposed to investigate reports from farmers, 330 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:15,960 Speaker 1: hadn't functioned properly for more than a decade. That meant 331 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 1: submissions were ignored and complaints of racism were just collecting 332 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:27,120 Speaker 1: dust for years while farmers lost their livelihoods. Pigford recruited 333 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:29,480 Speaker 1: more than four hundred other black farmers to join the 334 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 1: class action lawsuit, and the case landed in the hands 335 00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:37,240 Speaker 1: of a federal judge named Paul Friedman, who approved the 336 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: landmark settlement, and in the order he released in court, 337 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:46,760 Speaker 1: he traced the legacy of racism and agriculture all the 338 00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 1: way back to the U. S. Government's original reparations promise, 339 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 1: when Union generals pledged those forty acres and a mule 340 00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:57,080 Speaker 1: to freed slaves at the end of the Civil War. 341 00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:01,760 Speaker 1: He called the dysfunction of the agency's civil rights office 342 00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 1: the quote culmination of a string of broken promises that 343 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:09,359 Speaker 1: had been made to African American farmers for well over 344 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:15,680 Speaker 1: a century. Paul Friedman's decision provided a starting point for 345 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:20,120 Speaker 1: any black farmer who felt they'd experienced discrimination between nine 346 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:25,800 Speaker 1: and nine. They could now come forward to try and 347 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 1: prove their case for damages. Some people wanted the money 348 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,960 Speaker 1: because of just compensation for past wrongs. Some of the 349 00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:38,920 Speaker 1: people wanted money to use for operating their existing farms, 350 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: operating loans, and some of the people wanted it to 351 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:46,800 Speaker 1: buy additional farm land. Black farmers were struggling with economic 352 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:49,679 Speaker 1: problems and agriculture that it was that were affecting almost 353 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 1: all farmers. That's Dan Glickman again. He says the way 354 00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 1: the settlement was structured was probably the closest thing the 355 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 1: US has come to issuing real reparations to Black Americans. 356 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:08,000 Speaker 1: When black farmers around the country heard about the lawsuit, 357 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 1: they started coming out in droves, each with their own 358 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:15,560 Speaker 1: personal story of racism at the hands of the U. 359 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:19,639 Speaker 1: S d A. Now came the question of who was 360 00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:24,040 Speaker 1: entitled to payments and how much? How do you prove 361 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,280 Speaker 1: that as a black farmer you lost your land because 362 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:31,520 Speaker 1: of systemic discrimination and how much money can really make 363 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:36,120 Speaker 1: that right. The court appointed a monitor named Randy Roth 364 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:40,439 Speaker 1: to review every claim of discrimination and determine who was 365 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:45,720 Speaker 1: eligible for compensation. Randy and her team traveled the country 366 00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:49,399 Speaker 1: and processed tens of thousands of those farmers claims to 367 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,640 Speaker 1: determine if the U. S d a Had discriminated against them. 368 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:56,119 Speaker 1: So for a farmer to win in the case, the 369 00:24:56,240 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 1: farmer had to specifically identify similarly situated white farmer who 370 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:06,240 Speaker 1: was treated more favorably. The way they did that was 371 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:10,199 Speaker 1: by digging through old public documents. One of the ways 372 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 1: that they found the information was to go to their 373 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:20,600 Speaker 1: county courthouse and see what loans white farmers had recorded. 374 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 1: You record a security interest in a loan, and that 375 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:29,400 Speaker 1: was for many people a very fruitful way to get 376 00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:32,879 Speaker 1: information about white farmers loans. By the end of the 377 00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:36,880 Speaker 1: settlement and a subsequent class action suit known as Pigford, 378 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 1: two over two billion dollars was paid out by the 379 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:47,879 Speaker 1: US government to black farmers across the country. The thing 380 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:51,760 Speaker 1: about Pigford was, by the time of the settlement, a 381 00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:55,640 Speaker 1: lot of the damage had already been done from nineteen ten, 382 00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:59,320 Speaker 1: which is largely considered the peak of black land ownership. 383 00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 1: Black people had lost nine of their land, and even 384 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,840 Speaker 1: the two billion dollars that the Pigford suits doled out, 385 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:13,680 Speaker 1: mostly in fifty dollar increments to individual farmers, didn't come 386 00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:16,520 Speaker 1: close to the amount of money that black farmers really 387 00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:19,720 Speaker 1: lost at the hands of the U. S. D As 388 00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 1: discriminatory practices. But John Boyd says that the money did 389 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:29,520 Speaker 1: help a lot of people. Fifty dollars to struggling in 390 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:32,440 Speaker 1: farmer who has no money is a real shot in 391 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,680 Speaker 1: the arm up. So it did help. Did it give 392 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:38,560 Speaker 1: the land back? No? Was the enough settlement to to 393 00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:41,359 Speaker 1: make all of the discrimination go away from U? S 394 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,399 Speaker 1: toda to answer is no, But did it help the 395 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:48,400 Speaker 1: people who got the money? Absolutely? So you know, here 396 00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 1: again I see it. I see it on both sides 397 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,320 Speaker 1: of the coin for farmers who were were treated brutally 398 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 1: and awful by the government. No, it was not enough 399 00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:03,359 Speaker 1: money for settlement, but it was a building block. And 400 00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:06,240 Speaker 1: you know, if you're building the building, you build it 401 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 1: in blocks. John sees the Pigford settlements and all of 402 00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:13,680 Speaker 1: the organizing it took to get there, as a crucial 403 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:17,360 Speaker 1: chapter in the long fight for equality. For Black Americans. 404 00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:22,240 Speaker 1: There's a huge gap in the history when people, when 405 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:25,080 Speaker 1: these experts talk, they go from the sixties two the 406 00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:28,439 Speaker 1: Black Lives Matter, and and the Black farmer movement, like 407 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:33,120 Speaker 1: I said, was is absent from that conversation. John's payout 408 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 1: came after decades of fighting, decades of hard times, and 409 00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:42,160 Speaker 1: the money came at a personal cost. He'd been traveling 410 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:46,440 Speaker 1: around the country talking to farmers and lobbying politicians. He'd 411 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:50,800 Speaker 1: gotten divorced, he spent time away from his son, and 412 00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:53,440 Speaker 1: then he got a victory that he knows wasn't enough, 413 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:59,800 Speaker 1: but it's still got him land. These days, John spends 414 00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:02,680 Speaker 1: most to his time on the three acre Virginia farm 415 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,800 Speaker 1: that he was able to hold onto in part with 416 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 1: the settlement money. He spends his days like any farmer. 417 00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 1: He wakes up early in the morning to feed the cows, 418 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,879 Speaker 1: plant seed or plow fields, fix equipment, and check on 419 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:21,160 Speaker 1: his crops and livestock. He's trying to impart his love 420 00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:23,480 Speaker 1: of the land on the young farmers he works with 421 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:31,359 Speaker 1: as the president of the National Black Farmers Association. In 422 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,760 Speaker 1: all my interviews, the Pigford case has come across as 423 00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 1: something that's set a huge precedent while failing to make 424 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:43,800 Speaker 1: black farmers whole. It's a big deal that a federal 425 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 1: agency literally paid retribution for its discrimination and that the 426 00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:54,160 Speaker 1: nation's largest class action lawsuit attempts to atone for racism. 427 00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:58,040 Speaker 1: But is that really enough? Two billion dollars is a 428 00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:02,320 Speaker 1: lot of money compared to the hundreds of billions black 429 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:07,160 Speaker 1: landowners lost or were denied over a century. Well, as 430 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:11,120 Speaker 1: John says, it's a drop in the bucket, and it 431 00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 1: didn't bring about the systemic changes to bridge the land gap. 432 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 1: So John is still fighting because he says that land 433 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,720 Speaker 1: in America tells a bigger story about race and power, 434 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:27,640 Speaker 1: and that as long as there's an unequal landownership, wealth 435 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 1: and power will be out of balance as well. I 436 00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:33,240 Speaker 1: hate to keep going back to my dad and grandfather, 437 00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:37,520 Speaker 1: but they taught me the land is the most powerful 438 00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 1: tool that you can possess. Uh. Landless culture as a 439 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 1: powerless culture. If you don't own any land as a 440 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: group of people, you don't have any boggaining power. You 441 00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 1: don't have any power as a as a group of people. 442 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,920 Speaker 1: My grandfather said, Uh, you can't leave your pH d 443 00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 1: to your children, but I can leave my whole raggedy farm. 444 00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:03,720 Speaker 1: You know, the give them some financial stability, land is it? 445 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,520 Speaker 1: Listening to John Boyd got me thinking about the obstacles 446 00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:22,560 Speaker 1: black people face back when my family farmed their land 447 00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:26,600 Speaker 1: in East Texas in the early twentieth century. But his 448 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 1: story also jolted me into realizing that black people even 449 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:34,800 Speaker 1: today struggle to hold onto their farms. The upshot is 450 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:37,920 Speaker 1: Black involvement in what used to be a cornerstone of 451 00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:42,080 Speaker 1: the US economy has been stripped to almost nothing. Owning 452 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:45,680 Speaker 1: a farm is only one way to make money from land. Today, 453 00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,520 Speaker 1: there's a far more common wealth building tool that, at 454 00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:53,000 Speaker 1: least in theory, is accessible to far more Americans. Hopes 455 00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 1: next week on the paycheck we dig into the way 456 00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:58,680 Speaker 1: as black people are still being left out of the 457 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:04,080 Speaker 1: housing market. It's embarrassing right there. I feel like there 458 00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 1: is no safe place for me to have this conversation 459 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:11,080 Speaker 1: because I'm going to get judge one way or another. Oh, 460 00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:16,600 Speaker 1: you know, it's it's a lot. I feel betrayed to Yeah, 461 00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:24,440 Speaker 1: I feel left behind. I feel left behind. Before we go, 462 00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:29,120 Speaker 1: we have a request for you. Experts estimate that closing 463 00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 1: the racial wealth gap would take around thirteen trillion dollars 464 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 1: give or take a trillion or two. That works out 465 00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:39,480 Speaker 1: to about three hundred thousand dollars for every black American. 466 00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: We'd like to know what would you do with that 467 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:46,640 Speaker 1: three hundred thousand dollars? How might it change your life? 468 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: How might your life stay the same? Record a voice 469 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 1: memo with your answers to these questions and email it 470 00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,680 Speaker 1: to me at our Greenfield at Bloomberg dot net, or 471 00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,520 Speaker 1: leave a voicemail for us at six or six three 472 00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:03,239 Speaker 1: two or three four nine. Oh. We may use your 473 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:07,280 Speaker 1: voice on the show. Thanks for listening to the Paycheck. 474 00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:10,840 Speaker 1: If you like the show, please rate, review, and subscribe 475 00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. This episode was hosted by Me, 476 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:19,560 Speaker 1: Rebecca Greenfield and me Jackie Simmons. Today's episode was edited 477 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 1: by Francesco Levi and reported by Elizabeth Rimbert and Shelley Banjo. 478 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,920 Speaker 1: This episode was produced by Lindsay Cradowell. We also had 479 00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:32,480 Speaker 1: production help from Magnus Hendrickson and Ethan Brooks, an editing 480 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:36,080 Speaker 1: help from Janet Paskin Rocksheeta Solujia, Jackie Simmons and me. 481 00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 1: Our original music is by Leo Sidron. Francesca Levi is 482 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:42,920 Speaker 1: Bloomberg's head of podcasts. We'll see you next time.