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Speaker 1: All the Unpluggers Forgotten Season.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to another episode of Forgotten Seasons. This is

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Speaker 2: your host, Dylan Dreyfus. Today we are going to h

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Speaker 2: Town reliving the two thousand and nine Houston Rocket season

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Speaker 2: with their all defensive wing Shane Battier. This Rocket squad

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Speaker 2: won fifty three games, finished as the five seed in

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Speaker 2: a loaded Western conference. Their playoffs starting five was Aaron Brooks, Battier,

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Speaker 2: Ron Our Test, Luis Scola, and Yao Ming. You'll notice

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Speaker 2: no Te Mac in there. Mac battled injuries all year

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Speaker 2: and eventually called it a season in February micro fracture,

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Speaker 2: knee surgery unfortunately, really the beginning of the end for

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Speaker 2: Max stint in Houston. Yeao, on the other hand, who,

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Speaker 2: as you know, battled injuries just like t Mak, was

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Speaker 2: healthy this season. He plays seventy seven games all NBA

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Speaker 2: second team, but injury strikes at probably the worst possible time.

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Speaker 2: Midway through the Conference semi five final versus the Lakers,

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Speaker 2: he breaks his foot. Done for the playoffs. That conference

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Speaker 2: semifinals was a classic versus the Lakers. Houston advances past

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Speaker 2: b roy in Portland in round one and gets Kobe

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Speaker 2: and the Lakers in Round two without Mac or Yow,

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Speaker 2: they go toe to toe with the eventual champs, take

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Speaker 2: them to seven games. Our guy Battier is the primary

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Speaker 2: matchup versus Kobe, which, as you can expect, comes with

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Speaker 2: some legendary stories. Shane gets into all of that and more.

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Speaker 2: So let's get into it now. Quick reminder to leave

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Speaker 2: a rating and review if you are coming back to

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Speaker 2: the podcast. Really appreciate it. Forgotten Seasons with Shane Battier

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Speaker 2: on the two thousand and nine Rockets begins right now.

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Speaker 2: I am here with Duke. Great defense of Maestro Shane Battier. Shane,

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Speaker 2: how are you doing today.

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Speaker 1: Man, Dylan. It's great to be here man, Thanks for

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Speaker 1: having me.

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Speaker 2: I am very excited to get into this two thousand

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Speaker 2: and eight to nine Rocket season. Growing up, I was

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Speaker 2: a huge Tracy McGrady fan. I think these teams were

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Speaker 2: just tantalizing. You got McGrady and yaw to transcend in talents,

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Speaker 2: but it never seemed to really click at the same

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Speaker 2: time brutal injury luck, but this season was was uh

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Speaker 2: McGrady goes out and you guys make a run second

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Speaker 2: round Lakers seven games, But just getting into it sort

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Speaker 2: of a brief oral history of the Rockets. This is

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Speaker 2: year five of the McGrady yo era. This is year

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Speaker 2: three for you. Two years in a row, you guys

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Speaker 2: lose to Utah in round one. If you can remember,

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Speaker 2: like what is the energy going into this season eighth

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Speaker 2: nine coming off those two consecutive first round losses to Utah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so in year three, look, first of all, the

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Speaker 1: West was an absolute buzz saw and most people were

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Speaker 1: you know, it took fifty wins just to get like

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Speaker 1: like a five seed, which is like ridiculous. And you

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Speaker 1: talk about Dallas's Antonio and the Lakers and Portland and

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Speaker 1: just a ton of just really really good teams in Minnesota.

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Speaker 1: I mean, so like all these teams are really really good.

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Speaker 1: And so we played the Utah Jazz team, which was stacked.

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Speaker 1: I mean any other year you put them in the East,

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Speaker 1: and you know talking about you know, d will Is Prime,

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Speaker 1: Carolinka and his prime Ocurrent, It's prime, you know, Carlos Boozer.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they were a monster. So the tough one

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Speaker 1: in in the early years against the Jazz was we

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Speaker 1: lost game seven at home. Not too many teams this

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Speaker 1: game seven at home, and we did to Utah very

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Speaker 1: very good team in a four or five matchup. So

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Speaker 1: the next year we were banged up. I think Yao

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Speaker 1: was out for that. He didn't play, So you know,

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Speaker 1: you understand that loss. But you know, we had the

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Speaker 1: confidence that, you know, we were good enough to win it.

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Speaker 1: We thought that we had enough talent. We we thought

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Speaker 1: that you know, we had we had stars, we had

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Speaker 1: role players, we had great coaching. Uh So optimism was

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Speaker 1: was super high and we were just looking for just

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Speaker 1: one one year of health just to to try to

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Speaker 1: put it all together.

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Speaker 2: So the two main storylines going into this season for

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Speaker 2: you guys in the offseason, one is that Team X

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Speaker 2: coming off microfracture surgery, which he talked about is a

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Speaker 2: brutal surgery. And then the second is that you make

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Speaker 2: a big move training for Ron our Tests, who he's

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Speaker 2: been on the show. I'm a big Ron guy, but

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Speaker 2: no denying Around that time there were maybe questions, you know,

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Speaker 2: about his character. You guys end up both making All

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Speaker 2: defensive team and really being one of the best wing

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Speaker 2: defensive combinations of that era. First reaction when you heard

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Speaker 2: you guys are making a move to Ron our Test.

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Speaker 1: Look, I grew up playing against Ron. So Ron and

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Speaker 1: I are both Team mac Raw class in nineteen ninety seven.

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Speaker 1: So I knew Ron when we were thirteen years old.

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Speaker 1: And I love Ron just because that guy was just

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Speaker 1: a competitor. And you know, obviously he had a pass

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Speaker 1: with the with the palace throw it down, I guess,

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Speaker 1: I guess you could say. But no one ever questioned heart,

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Speaker 1: no one ever questioned his talent. And so I was excited.

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Speaker 1: I mean, but we you know, to go out there

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Speaker 1: with Ron, who who I had a relationship with, I was.

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Speaker 1: I was cool with it. And he can't win in

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Speaker 1: to Sleep without talent. And there's no doubt that Ron

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Speaker 1: was an amazing talent. And you know, I loved playing

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Speaker 1: defense with Ron because he was so different than me.

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Speaker 1: You know, I was about angles and about the strategy,

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Speaker 1: and he was just about you know, sheer brute force.

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Speaker 1: You know, he had these like meat cleavers for hands,

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Speaker 1: and he was like probably maybe maybe the strongest wing

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Speaker 1: I played against my entire career.

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Speaker 2: Wait, how much did he weigh this time?

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Speaker 1: He had to be at least two fifty, at least

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Speaker 1: two fifty and like a solid to fifty, you know,

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Speaker 1: and he going in the weight room, and he didn't

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Speaker 1: lift a lot of weights, and he was like country

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Speaker 1: strong even though he's from Queen's Bridge, and you know,

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Speaker 1: he threw up just you know, put racks on on

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Speaker 1: the on the bench, president, let's go play. And but

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Speaker 1: he was he was fun to watch. He was fun

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Speaker 1: to watch because he had a lot of antics. But

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Speaker 1: I think he played up a lot of his antics,

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Speaker 1: you know. Knowing Ron, he was actually a pretty a

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Speaker 1: pretty savvy defender.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, super nice guy too. I think you see him

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Speaker 2: on the court and you expect his personality to match that.

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Speaker 2: But my experience of him, soft spoken, super thoughtful guy.

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Speaker 2: So I'm a big fan of Ron. Two sort of

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Speaker 2: question about ross and roster construction. You're you're with the

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Speaker 2: Heat now as a consultant with with their owner ownership group.

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Speaker 2: We hear so much about the Heat culture. Do you

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Speaker 2: how much do you take it into account a player's reputation,

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Speaker 2: how they're going to fit into the locker room. Does

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Speaker 2: that sort of sway you away from certain guys or

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Speaker 2: are you betting on that Heat culture to be able

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Speaker 2: to shape and mold players when they come in.

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Speaker 1: Well, in Houston we had a really strong locker room.

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Speaker 1: You know, you talk about Louis skullav Roston, obviously Yaming.

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Speaker 1: You know, team Act. We didn't have a whole lot

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Speaker 1: of jerks, so we weren't too concerned about Ron and

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Speaker 1: the disruption. You know, Rick, Rick Adaman doesn't get enough

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Speaker 1: credit for being an amazing means in the Hall of

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Speaker 1: Fame now, but he was. He was a legend. And

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Speaker 1: what Rick did better than any other coach I played

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Speaker 1: with on any level. He really gave ownership to the team.

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Speaker 1: And it was never like this, this is my team

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Speaker 1: and do what I say and you know, when we win,

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Speaker 1: it's because of my plan. He really gave ownership to

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Speaker 1: the team, and it felt like it was our locker room.

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Speaker 1: It felt like it was our organization. And it takes

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Speaker 1: a unique, unique mind to do that, and Rick had that.

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Speaker 1: And so so when Ron comes into our locker room,

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Speaker 1: you know, we embraced him. No big deal. And as

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Speaker 1: long as you show up and you lace them up

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Speaker 1: and when it's seven thirty in the balls in the air,

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Speaker 1: you're ready to go and prepared, we don't care who

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Speaker 1: you are. And that's the beauty of ball. And you know,

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Speaker 1: so we had no concerns whatsoever with run on our team.

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Speaker 1: We're actually pretty happy. We thought we had a strong

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Speaker 1: enough locker room and culture that it didn't matter who

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Speaker 1: come in a locker room, they were going to help

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Speaker 1: us win.

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Speaker 2: Well, it works out with Alt McGrady this season, fifty

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Speaker 2: three wins, five seed in the West, number four overall defense.

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Speaker 2: You and Ron obviously a big part of that, and

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Speaker 2: sort of going into the construction of the roster. One

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Speaker 2: of my favorite parts about this team is just the

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Speaker 2: strength of the role players. You got Kyle Lowry, you

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Speaker 2: got Aaron Brooks, Carl Landry, von Wafer. Just talk about

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Speaker 2: sort of the the balance that this team had to

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Speaker 2: offer going one through eight, one through ten, where guys

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Speaker 2: are coming in and really shining in their role.

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Speaker 1: Well, look, you know, Darryl Moury and Sam Hanky, those

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Speaker 1: are my guys, and they find talent. You can say

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Speaker 1: whatever you want about their methods, those dudes find talent.

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Speaker 1: And you know, we had guys like second round picks,

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Speaker 1: guys off the G League, Mike Harris. We had so

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Speaker 1: much talent on the team, like people forget, like Aaron

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Speaker 1: Brooks was you know, it might have been All Star,

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Speaker 1: was borderline All Star. And was absolutely crushing. No one

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Speaker 1: could guard him and Kyle Lowry couldn't slip the floor.

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Speaker 1: Kyle Lowry is a Hall of Famer, and like it

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Speaker 1: was it was AB's team, you know, and Aby was

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Speaker 1: quick and when he put him in picking roll with

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Speaker 1: Yao ming like he was a handful, right, And next year,

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Speaker 1: you know Ab gets hurt, Kyle steps in, Kyle becomes

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Speaker 1: an All star. Right. We had Carl Landry was an

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Speaker 1: absolute monster, like people forget, like he was our go

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Speaker 1: to player down the stretch. We'd yelled me, you know,

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Speaker 1: Hall of Favor. We had t Mac and we were

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Speaker 1: running Turn four for Carl Lanry where we just turned

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Speaker 1: him out, gave the ball to Carl on the block

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Speaker 1: and Carl would go to work and like like Carl

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Speaker 1: and Andry. You know, we pulled Mike Harris out of

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Speaker 1: the real Grand Valley Vipers. He wins the game for

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Speaker 1: us that year. Steve Novak uh von Wafer was a

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Speaker 1: revelation and he was like supposed to be the fourteenth

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Speaker 1: guy and he comes in and he was just like

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Speaker 1: you know, Minnie John of the New Millennia, and so

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Speaker 1: you know, we had amazing talent. We had. We had

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Speaker 1: a play style that was very democratic and obviously throwing.

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Speaker 1: You know, the All Stars that we had, you know,

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Speaker 1: we talk about Louis scold them. I mean, just we

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Speaker 1: had so much talent that year, so we had enough

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Speaker 1: talent to win. There was no doubt we had enough

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Speaker 1: talent to win it. Just uh, we had a lot

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Speaker 1: of bad luck.

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Speaker 2: Speaking of Moury and Hanky, I think he's well known

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Speaker 2: more he was one of the first analytics driven GM

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Speaker 2: and I mean I don't have to explain who Sam

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Speaker 2: Hanky is and what his philosophy is. We would all

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Speaker 2: tapped into sort of their their philosophy as an analytics

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Speaker 2: first front office or are you just staying out of that?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well yeah, I mean those those guys changed my

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Speaker 1: life in my basketball career. They taught me a different

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Speaker 1: way to think about the game. And you know, I

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Speaker 1: spent a lot of time with them before every game

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Speaker 1: just trying to understand like how they look at players

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Speaker 1: and so, like Sam, they don't ever forget before every game.

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Speaker 1: I get drown my warm up. That's that with Sam

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Speaker 1: Hankey and then he'd sort of quiz me, okay, what's

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Speaker 1: more dangerous? You know, A lou Ol dang corner three

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Speaker 1: or Kyle Korb wing wing three, you know, a you know,

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Speaker 1: uh Kevin Durant dribble off the jumper at the elbow

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Speaker 1: or a you know, bulky knock bar corner three, and

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Speaker 1: so so, uh, you know, we sort of gamified it.

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Speaker 1: But I understood all the trade offs and and really

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Speaker 1: how to look at basketball through a through a data lens.

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Speaker 1: And I knew like what the shots were, you know,

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Speaker 1: I forget the players. I understood what the shots were

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Speaker 1: that beat you as as a defender and and what

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Speaker 1: won you games and what lost you games, right, and

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Speaker 1: so we did that every game. Is so I became

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Speaker 1: just you know, so enamored with the process of just

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Speaker 1: understanding who a guy was, you know, down to the

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Speaker 1: you know, the percentile. And you know, I knew guys

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Speaker 1: better than they new guys, you know, and and I

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Speaker 1: knew guys better than guys do themselves. And it gave

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Speaker 1: me a tremendous advantage on the defensive end. It hurt

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Speaker 1: me on the offensive ends. I knew what the answer

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Speaker 1: the question was, but it was a really really great

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Speaker 1: way to think about the game. And if I can

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Speaker 1: go back and play for those guys, Now I messed

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Speaker 1: up in my career that I actually practiced a two

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Speaker 1: point jibble jumper. Right, I wasted like hours of my

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Speaker 1: life practicing jump shots from the elbow. Right. If I

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Speaker 1: go back and now'll play, I get twenty rips up

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Speaker 1: from three, and that's it. I would never ribble. I

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Speaker 1: would have been.

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Speaker 2: The question about sort of just analytics. I mean, when

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Speaker 2: you have such an analytics driven front office, how do

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Speaker 2: you weigh that versus the eye test you know you have.

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Speaker 2: It might sound like a stupid question, but there's some

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Speaker 2: guys that maybe don't cater too well to an analytics model,

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Speaker 2: but when you watch them, you know they look they're

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Speaker 2: getting good shots. What is that sort of chess match

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Speaker 2: like in pendulum weighing a player that works great in

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Speaker 2: models and one that's just you know, it's not.

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Speaker 1: Either or you need both. Look, you still need the

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Speaker 1: qualitative and you could you know, you can't measure a

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Speaker 1: guy's hard or not Q or his ability to react

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Speaker 1: or ability to adjust during the game through through data.

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Speaker 1: There's some things that may hint, but like you need

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Speaker 1: it all, you know, and the best teams today are

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Speaker 1: the ones that married the data and and sort of

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Speaker 1: the eye test, the qualitative. Like you know, we have

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Speaker 1: models now where we know exactly what you should be

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Speaker 1: able to shoot from anywhere on the floor, any player

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Speaker 1: in the league, any player in the last twenty years,

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Speaker 1: based on how far the defender is away from you. Right,

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Speaker 1: So we know you're not hiding any player. You're not

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Speaker 1: fooling somebody into getting a max contract without the data

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Speaker 1: taking it up, right, So there's nowhere to hide anymore.

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Speaker 1: But that is not the entire story. Uh, There's so

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Speaker 1: much that goes into being a part of a championship

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Speaker 1: winning basketball team. Data is just a part of it,

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Speaker 1: and it will never replace it fully, but you can't

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Speaker 1: win without it.

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Speaker 2: Do you think playing hard now is a skill in

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Speaker 2: today's leader?

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Speaker 1: Now? I think guys play hard. I think that the

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Speaker 1: differentiator for the All Stars and for the truly, truly

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Speaker 1: great players and great teams the ability to think and

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Speaker 1: think under pressure. Right, these guys are so athletic now,

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Speaker 1: they're way more athletic than when I played. They're way

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Speaker 1: more skilled than when I played, Right, But the great

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Speaker 1: differentiators is can you think the game? And can you

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Speaker 1: think it quickly? And can you think it under pressure?

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Speaker 1: And you see the guys you can, and you see

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Speaker 1: guys you can't. All Right, So I don't care how

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Speaker 1: high you jump, how fast you are, how mad your

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Speaker 1: handle is. You can't think it. You're not gonna be

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Speaker 1: on the floor when when it's when it's not not

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Speaker 1: cracking time, And that will always be true for basketball.

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Speaker 2: That's a great way to put it. Jumping back in

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Speaker 2: real quick, I do want to spend just a few

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Speaker 2: minutes talking about the stars of this team, Uh, team

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Speaker 2: Ac and ya obviously team Max out, but just shedding

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Speaker 2: a little bit of light. You were with him for

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Speaker 2: the two seasons before in Houston. I imagine going up against

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Speaker 2: him in practice sometimes. I'm a part of his Ones

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Speaker 2: Basketball League, which he just launched, trying to find the

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Speaker 2: best one.

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Speaker 1: On one player.

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Speaker 2: Uh, and I just think there couldn't be a better

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Speaker 2: face for that league than than Tracey McGrady. Can you

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Speaker 2: just spend just a few moments talking about, uh, your

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Speaker 2: your memories of being t max teammate and just how

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Speaker 2: unstoppable he was on the wing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, look, you know I grew up again in

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Speaker 1: high school. I was class ninety seven, tax last ninety seven,

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Speaker 1: and you know Tea mac had a really interesting rise.

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Speaker 1: You know, he was really unheralded U till I think

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Speaker 1: it was junior year.

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Speaker 2: Were you at the ABC? Were you at the ABC?

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Speaker 1: I was at Nike. I was a Nike guy. He

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Speaker 1: was a But you heard about this guy t Mac,

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Speaker 1: you know, like wordy, I'm from Auburndale, Florida, and uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, just so explosive, so long, had all the

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Speaker 1: skills set, just really just came on the scene out

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Speaker 1: of nowhere. You just don't see that anymore. And you know,

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Speaker 1: obviously I guarded him in Toronto for a few years.

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Speaker 1: I was in the Western Conference always, so I saw

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Speaker 1: him twice years. You don't you don't see the guys

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Speaker 1: in the conference a whole lot, so you don't really

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Speaker 1: get to know them that well. You know, they're just

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Speaker 1: a handful of team. Mac was an absolute handful and

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Speaker 1: just so aggressive and he was a monster, you know,

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Speaker 1: especially early in his career before his injuries. When I

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Speaker 1: got to Houston, you know, it struck me about tam

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Speaker 1: Mac that I don't think he gets enough credit for

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Speaker 1: it is he's He's probably the best passer I ever

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Speaker 1: played with. You know, he was a great pitcher in

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Speaker 1: high school. But he saw everything everything, and you know,

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Speaker 1: as a shooter, like you just want the ball in

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Speaker 1: the pocket, all right, like hit me, hit me on

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Speaker 1: my chest, and I'm gonna give you an assist. In

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Speaker 1: tac he put that on the money every single time.

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Speaker 1: You know, it could be throw up here, one handed

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Speaker 1: bullet pass and so like super super underrated passer and

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Speaker 1: a willing passer as good as great as a story

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Speaker 1: as he was, and all the accolades were scoring. He

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Speaker 1: was a willing passer and just a really really savvy

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Speaker 1: basketball player. But you know, by far the best passer

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Speaker 1: and I played with a great passer, was the best

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Speaker 1: passer that I that I played with.

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Speaker 2: I think that's the first time I've heard that. But

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Speaker 2: he did put up some good assist umber some year

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Speaker 2: transitioning to the other head of that other head of

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Speaker 2: that two headed monster.

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Speaker 1: Yao Ming.

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Speaker 2: He plays seventy seven games this year. It's really his

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Speaker 2: last last hurrah in the league, and some of his

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Speaker 2: best basketball twenty two, ten and two. You have any

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Speaker 2: any good Yao stories. That's sort of encapsulek who he is.

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Speaker 2: I've heard that he's sort of underratedly like one of

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Speaker 2: the funnier guys in the league. Any anything you got

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Speaker 2: for yao?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I told a great story. Uh. You know,

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Speaker 1: he had a charity event at one night and he

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Speaker 1: came to the guys in the locker room and said, he, guys,

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Speaker 1: I want to invite you to my charity event. You

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Speaker 1: know this week it's so and so in Houston. You know,

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Speaker 1: please bring your wives or please bring your girlfriends, please

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Speaker 1: don't bring both. And I'm like, that's really good. So

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Speaker 1: I think y'all pretended not to speak English very well,

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Speaker 1: so people leave him alone. But he was actually like

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Speaker 1: hilarious and had a great sense of humor. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: was one of my favorite, most favorite teammates of all time.

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Speaker 1: You know, you talk about a guy who just worked

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Speaker 1: his tail off, cared about the team, just just wanted

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Speaker 1: to do his job for the team. And let me

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Speaker 1: tell you, y'all couldn't condition in the summer like you

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Speaker 1: wanted to because of his injury problems and his feet

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Speaker 1: and so it took him a while to get in

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Speaker 1: shape every year. But you know, around Christmas time when

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Speaker 1: he finally got an NBA shape, you know, there was

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Speaker 1: probably like a four or five week period, six week

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Speaker 1: period where there was no one who could touch him.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking Shack in his prime. He said it himself,

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Speaker 1: Dwight Howard in his prime. These guys they could not

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Speaker 1: handle him. I mean he was thirty and twenty and

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Speaker 1: seven every single night and just a monster. And the

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Speaker 1: problem was he couldn't keep it up and he got

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Speaker 1: fatigued because he was doing so much. And then like

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Speaker 1: he went back to Greetora Yao, which is still a

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Speaker 1: Hall of Fame, but every year he had this stretcher

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Speaker 1: just like, oh my gosh, this guy's unstoppable. He was unstoppable,

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Speaker 1: and so you know, all the talk about is Yao

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Speaker 1: Hall of Fame are absolutely because I saw firsthand there

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Speaker 1: was you know, there were weeks in the season he

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Speaker 1: was the best player at the universe. And what he's done.

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Speaker 2: I think the Hall of Fame also takes into account

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Speaker 2: just what you do, maybe a little bit outside of

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Speaker 2: the court to the global impact. Probably the NBA's second

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Speaker 2: biggest market right now, if I'm not mistaken, he's undeniable.

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Speaker 2: So shout out to Yao. Zooming out a little bit. Obviously,

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Speaker 2: you as one of the premier perimeter defenders in the league.

390
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Speaker 2: Curious to hear who the guys were that maybe made

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Speaker 2: you think a little bit harder, maybe made you a

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Speaker 2: little bit hotter. Obviously we know Kobe, who will get

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Speaker 2: into later, but were there any other guys on the

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Speaker 2: wing that, uh, maybe made you be the best version

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Speaker 2: of you when you matched up against him.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if I was the best version of

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Speaker 1: me and these guys worked, you know, it made me

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Speaker 1: work my ass off. You know, a guy's like Mellow,

399
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Speaker 1: you know, obviously Mellow and when he was younger with

400
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Speaker 1: an absolute monster and Genobili was just he was so tough,

401
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Speaker 1: so tough. I'm glad to see him in the Hall

402
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:30,240
Speaker 1: of Fame this year. You know, Paul Pierce was a handful.

403
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Speaker 1: You know, I caught Dirk a little bit on the wing,

404
00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:43,080
Speaker 1: you know, Lebron Young, Lebron, Young, Lebron young, Mellow. There

405
00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:45,240
Speaker 1: were so many great wings, some of the great wings

406
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Speaker 1: that you know, and you know Kobe was was the

407
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Speaker 1: best out of all of them. But uh, you know

408
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Speaker 1: that that was the fun part. Fun part was lacing

409
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Speaker 1: him up and okay, who I got to Okay, Mellow, Okay,

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Speaker 1: it's give me a long night, give me a long night.

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Speaker 1: But you know, hopefully I can make him work and

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Speaker 1: make him take a few more shots and then he

413
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:05,919
Speaker 1: wants to take and keep his efficiency down. So you know,

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Speaker 1: that's that's what I miss. I miss that feeling of

415
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Speaker 1: getting on the bus, you know, and Marina del Ray

416
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:15,800
Speaker 1: at the Ritz there and going to the Staples Center

417
00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:18,320
Speaker 1: and being like, oh shit, I got cobD tonight. You know,

418
00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:20,960
Speaker 1: this guy is thirsty. He's gonna try to embarrass me.

419
00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:24,560
Speaker 1: And there's nothing in life that replicates that feeling of

420
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Speaker 1: like I better bring it or I'm gonna be embarrassed.

421
00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:31,639
Speaker 1: And you know, that's the beauty of our league. So

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Speaker 1: many great players and every single night. And that's the

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Speaker 1: best thing about about playing in this sleep for thirteen years.

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Speaker 2: No, no Hinky Packet could give you any tips on Kobe.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I had to. I had trust me. Kobe's

426
00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:51,480
Speaker 1: book was was super was super thick, right, And you

427
00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:55,720
Speaker 1: know what made these guys so good is they just

428
00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:58,119
Speaker 1: had the green light and you knew they're getting up

429
00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:02,919
Speaker 1: twenty to thirty rips a night and you couldn't control that,

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Speaker 1: all right, So there's no one stopping these guys, all right,

431
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,400
Speaker 1: There's no Kobe Stoppers's no Carmelo stopper, right, So when

432
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,080
Speaker 1: he says they were, no, the best you could hope

433
00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:13,560
Speaker 1: for against these guys to be sort of the human

434
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:18,920
Speaker 1: yellow life, okay, and and get them to again take

435
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:20,680
Speaker 1: a ton of shots and not score a lot of points.

436
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:23,199
Speaker 1: All right, I think I did a great job. If

437
00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,160
Speaker 1: Cobe scored thirty, he took twenty seven shots, I did

438
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,520
Speaker 1: my job, all right. Everyone's like, oh, COVID get thirty

439
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,160
Speaker 1: or COVID get forty, and I'm thirty thirty five shots.

440
00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:34,919
Speaker 1: Like the points don't matter, is the shots, because if

441
00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,320
Speaker 1: you're taking a lot of shots to get those points,

442
00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:39,960
Speaker 1: you're not helping your team. And that's all you're trying

443
00:22:39,960 --> 00:22:43,280
Speaker 1: to do is trying to drag down the efficiency of

444
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:46,320
Speaker 1: the other player because you're not stopping. All right, Keep

445
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 1: them off the fall on, you know, make them turn

446
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:52,000
Speaker 1: the ball over a few times. Those that play the

447
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:54,080
Speaker 1: small place to help you win games in the end,

448
00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:56,080
Speaker 1: you know, regardless of points. You know, most fans just

449
00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:59,360
Speaker 1: look at the box corny points. That's only a very

450
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:02,320
Speaker 1: small part of the story. Actually, it's everything else in

451
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:06,440
Speaker 1: context that determines whether you win or lose and have success.

452
00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:10,720
Speaker 2: No, Kobe stoppers a slide dig at Ruben Patterson.

453
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 1: No, there's no there. There might be some Kobe you know,

454
00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:21,400
Speaker 1: yellow lights at times. No, No, no one's stopping anybody

455
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:22,320
Speaker 1: at that level.

456
00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:28,560
Speaker 2: Okay, so regular season fifty three wins, you guys grab

457
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 2: uh the five seed in the West. You got Portland

458
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,600
Speaker 2: in round one. You end up winning in six. But

459
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,159
Speaker 2: games two through four really close. They're all decided by

460
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 2: three points or less.

461
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:38,800
Speaker 1: Uh.

462
00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 2: What do you remember from that series? Maybe specifically a

463
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:46,360
Speaker 2: little Brandon Roy talk and one of the the more

464
00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:48,879
Speaker 2: the biggest what ifs of that generation. And this is

465
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 2: when he's really ascending into that superstar level.

466
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:55,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, ber Rose a monster man, and I think

467
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 1: he's sort of forgotten unfortunately, because he was an absolute

468
00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:01,280
Speaker 1: handful of this guy you're talking about playing at your

469
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:03,919
Speaker 1: own pace. You know, you could never speed him up.

470
00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:06,240
Speaker 1: You know, he got to his spots, he got the

471
00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 1: shots he wanted, and he was like a chess matter

472
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:11,479
Speaker 1: out there just controlling the floor. And he was the

473
00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:14,280
Speaker 1: first guy that I really, really, really I said, Sam,

474
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:17,119
Speaker 1: you know, Darryl, give me every give me the kitchen.

475
00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:20,439
Speaker 1: Think I'm Brandon Roy. Because interesting thing about him, he

476
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:23,760
Speaker 1: played differently in the fourth quarter, and in terms of

477
00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 1: like where he got his shots from, where he liked

478
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:29,640
Speaker 1: to catch the ball, from the pick and rolls he ran.

479
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:33,480
Speaker 1: And you know, that was really the first time I said, ah, okay,

480
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,240
Speaker 1: you know this is super interesting and like, you just

481
00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:38,600
Speaker 1: can't go play a guy, and especially in the playoffs,

482
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:41,760
Speaker 1: there's no secrets. You got to know a guy, you know,

483
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:46,720
Speaker 1: backwards in frontwards and just an absolute monster because he

484
00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 1: was athletic, you know, in the fourth quarter he's still

485
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:53,800
Speaker 1: front of punching on you and really sad that the

486
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 1: needles just gave out. And because he would have been

487
00:24:56,840 --> 00:24:58,240
Speaker 1: I think he would have been a Hall of Famer,

488
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:00,360
Speaker 1: you know. I know Ron our test call the best

489
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:01,879
Speaker 1: player he ever played against, and I think he was

490
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: trying to piss Kobe off. But we're going to get

491
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,639
Speaker 1: to that, no, you know, but we all respected b

492
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:10,679
Speaker 1: Roy and we all knew that he was a monster.

493
00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 1: You know. But for like, I was excited. That was

494
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,320
Speaker 1: the first time I'd ever been out in the playoffs.

495
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:16,680
Speaker 1: You know, as much success as I had at Duke,

496
00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:19,159
Speaker 1: you know, I went to the Memphis Grizzlies. We made

497
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 1: the playoffs three straight years. We got swapt three straight years,

498
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 1: all right, so I never never experienced the second round.

499
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:26,640
Speaker 1: We played Utah next two years in Houston. I lose

500
00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:29,160
Speaker 1: first round, first round. So I'm like, man, I'm getting

501
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 1: the older I didn't get the the first round. I

502
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 1: don't want to be that guy. So you know, we

503
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:38,560
Speaker 1: were we were banged up. I didn't have Team mac

504
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 1: h and so it was. It was an awesome series

505
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 1: to be closed out in six. So super super proud

506
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,440
Speaker 1: of that series. And uh, you know then we get

507
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:49,280
Speaker 1: the Lakers all they can handle in game seven and

508
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:51,800
Speaker 1: in seven games the next round, which was a really

509
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:53,040
Speaker 1: really fun series as well.

510
00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:57,520
Speaker 2: Quick question about just those uh you know those books

511
00:25:57,600 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 2: on the players that you got. Do you still have those?

512
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:05,280
Speaker 1: You know? I stole a few just from my own file,

513
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 1: just going back and looking at how I used to

514
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 1: think about guarded guys, and you know those are I

515
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,399
Speaker 1: really haven't shared those anybody, but I have a file

516
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 1: of the great ones just to show my kids one day. Look,

517
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,280
Speaker 1: I used to guard Kobe and Mellow and Lebron, and

518
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:24,640
Speaker 1: this is how I try to guard him.

519
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:26,520
Speaker 2: I mean, that's great. I would would love to see

520
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 2: one of those Lakers series. You mentioned that Ron was

521
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,359
Speaker 2: already trying to play mind games with him, saying, you know,

522
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:37,040
Speaker 2: Kobe's good, but I think Brandon Roy is better. I

523
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 2: saw a hilarious and just amazing article that was published

524
00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 2: right before the series talking about the match between you

525
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:49,440
Speaker 2: Ron and Kobe. Kobe was saying that I think he's

526
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:52,760
Speaker 2: quoted as you know, I torch Shane Battier every time.

527
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 2: You know, that's no no problem. Uh, you've called going

528
00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:00,159
Speaker 2: up against Kobe the ultimate chess match. Obviously on the

529
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 2: floor we see the banging, you know, those those isolations,

530
00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:07,199
Speaker 2: But talk about just the mental side about going up

531
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:11,800
Speaker 2: against Kobe at this time where you know he's he's

532
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:12,800
Speaker 2: running through the West.

533
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 1: What is that like? Well, first of all, you know

534
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: Ron was calling Kobe out. I took a complete opposite approach,

535
00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:23,000
Speaker 1: Like I never ever said I could guard Kobe. All right.

536
00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 1: I was kind of ere and I wanted I wanted

537
00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:27,959
Speaker 1: to be like the most passive guy, like I had

538
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,280
Speaker 1: an ego, all right. I wasn't selfless. I knew I

539
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 1: was a good defender, and I knew what my my

540
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 1: skills were. But I knew, like if I fired that

541
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 1: guy up, that's that's bad news for me. So I

542
00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 1: went out of my way to say, oh, man, Kobe

543
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 1: just missed shots. He's had a bad game, Like it

544
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,439
Speaker 1: wasn't me. It wasn't me. So that was but like

545
00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:48,199
Speaker 1: Kobe knew that. And Kobe actually wrote a page in

546
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:51,000
Speaker 1: his book, Mama Mentality about me, and he said, look,

547
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:53,919
Speaker 1: you know, Shane never admitted he could guard me. In fact,

548
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 1: he downplayed like his skills, you know, and he said,

549
00:27:57,119 --> 00:28:00,600
Speaker 1: but I saw through that false humility and attacked him

550
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:03,879
Speaker 1: because of it. And I read that after you passed,

551
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 1: and I started crying and laughed at the same time.

552
00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:08,600
Speaker 1: So I'm like, yes, that's exactly what I was trying

553
00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 1: to do. And so the battle between Kobe and I

554
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,000
Speaker 1: was like the game within the game within the game

555
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:15,240
Speaker 1: with the game. The only Hey and I knew we

556
00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:18,640
Speaker 1: were playing against each other. And that's why he's my favorite,

557
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 1: you know, player and to guard and to compete against,

558
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,800
Speaker 1: because it wasn't about just Lakers against the Rockets, great whatever,

559
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,399
Speaker 1: it was. It was this mental warker game that we

560
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 1: played with each other, and you know, it was the best,

561
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 1: uh you know that series. Look, you know, if you

562
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:41,080
Speaker 1: go on Twitter, you're going always people people like are

563
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 1: always killing me, Like Kobe towards Shane for forty in

564
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 1: Game two, and like, hey, he had a great game.

565
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 1: But like I looked at the numbers series and like

566
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:50,719
Speaker 1: I was okay with the numbers that he scored against me.

567
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 1: You know, he ever like twenty six, twenty seven points,

568
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 1: you know, forty five percent from from the field, only

569
00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:59,160
Speaker 1: got six three girls a game, And so like those

570
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 1: are the things I judge myself on, and I'm like

571
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:03,960
Speaker 1: I can live with that, you know. And the thing

572
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 1: about the story I tell you know, I got a

573
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:09,880
Speaker 1: lot of acclaim for the hand in the face tactic. Yep,

574
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: all right, And so people misunderstand like why I did that, right,

575
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,160
Speaker 1: and especially for a guy like Kobe. I knew Kobe

576
00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:21,520
Speaker 1: would go out of his way to prove that this

577
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: tactic wouldn't work on him because he never wanted to

578
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:27,200
Speaker 1: make he had a weakness. Well, what's the only way

579
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:30,280
Speaker 1: that he can prove that this doesn't work is to

580
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:33,240
Speaker 1: take a long two point dribble jump shot. What is

581
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:37,400
Speaker 1: Kobe Bryant's worst shot? A long two point dribble jump shot.

582
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 1: So I was completely fine with him trying to prove

583
00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 1: that this tactic didn't work because he was going to

584
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:48,200
Speaker 1: school weakness. Right, Whether he made it or he missed it,

585
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 1: it didn't matter to me. You know, people, oh he

586
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,560
Speaker 1: hit that shot the hand of the face, Like I

587
00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 1: didn't care. All they cared about is he took that shot.

588
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 1: And I knew if he took enough of those shots,

589
00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,920
Speaker 1: he was never going to have like these huge, huge,

590
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,280
Speaker 1: huge games over a long stretch of time. All right,

591
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 1: So like I never reacted to one game, never reacted one.

592
00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 1: I wanted to see how I played against the guy

593
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:11,880
Speaker 1: over or a series or a season or a career,

594
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,480
Speaker 1: and so like again, that was the mental game that

595
00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 1: I played, you know with Kobe. You know, prove it, Kobe,

596
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 1: keep proving it. He made he made a lot of jumpers,

597
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 1: but again I was like, I was completely fine with

598
00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: the shots that he made. Like that, I got mad

599
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 1: when I put him in the fall line and I

600
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 1: gave him twelve three year olds a game, and I

601
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:35,720
Speaker 1: gave him a bunch of dunks and layups like those

602
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:38,680
Speaker 1: are the ones that I lost sleepover, not for jumpers.

603
00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 2: I don't know, if I don't know, my colors aren't great,

604
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:43,840
Speaker 2: but I don't know if they're what the mix between

605
00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:47,440
Speaker 2: yellow and green is I think that's maybe what you

606
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:49,200
Speaker 2: what you caused him.

607
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:51,040
Speaker 1: At times?

608
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,640
Speaker 2: Is there one image it doesn't have to be from

609
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:57,200
Speaker 2: this season when you think of your battles on the

610
00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:59,880
Speaker 2: court on one image or one small SoundBite that that

611
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 2: sort of flashes in the mind.

612
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:07,720
Speaker 1: First against Kobe, artists in general, just Kobe, Kobe, Kobe,

613
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:13,240
Speaker 1: oh man. You know, it was always interesting. So Kobe again,

614
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 1: we're playing these mind games, and you know, before the game,

615
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 1: you know, there's always uh, you know, pleasantries, exchange whatnot.

616
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,040
Speaker 1: And there are some games from Kobe was just so

617
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:26,720
Speaker 1: talking to me, hey man, what's going on? How you doing?

618
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 1: What's going you know, what's going on? And then the

619
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 1: next game he wouldn't even look at me. He wouldn't

620
00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:35,240
Speaker 1: even look at me. And so like, I just I

621
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:38,320
Speaker 1: always like I chuckled with myself. I didn't care, you know,

622
00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:41,240
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm gonna guard you regardless whether you talk

623
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:44,640
Speaker 1: to me or not. And and so Kobe became like

624
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: a you know, this this thing in our family and

625
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 1: I'll never forget like, uh, my my son was just

626
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 1: born and my wife was holding him after the game

627
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 1: in Houston, and then you gotta walk by the wives

628
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 1: and family section go to the bus and Kobe stops

629
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 1: and go I didn't know it was my wife. Oh man,

630
00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:05,120
Speaker 1: what a what a good looking kid, you know, my

631
00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 1: son Zeke. And my wife's like thanks, like, don't talk

632
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:13,680
Speaker 1: to my son that. I was like, be beca't like

633
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 1: a family thing. But I you know, I it really

634
00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:20,960
Speaker 1: makes me sad when when you pass that we we've

635
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 1: never had this conversation. I know, I would give anything

636
00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 1: to be able to have this conversation. And like, you know,

637
00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 1: I know you're playing my games and you would say

638
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:31,720
Speaker 1: the same thing about about me, and and uh you

639
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 1: know that. That's why I think very highly of Kobe

640
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,720
Speaker 1: and and I'm just super sad that we'll never have

641
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 1: this conversation. Well we'll have this conversation in the end,

642
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:43,680
Speaker 1: in the in the big Staples Center in the sky

643
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 1: one day. But very very very sad, but blessed I

644
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:52,960
Speaker 1: had a chance to play against a guy who literally

645
00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: pushed me to the edge.

646
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:57,719
Speaker 2: I mean, I can't get enough of the Kobe stories.

647
00:32:57,720 --> 00:32:59,959
Speaker 2: And I think it's great, you know, all the end

648
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:02,479
Speaker 2: a community just keeping the legacy alive. You know, it's

649
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:04,880
Speaker 2: a it's a big legacy that's not going anywhere. But

650
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:07,440
Speaker 2: just hearing these stories from all these different people, and

651
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:10,160
Speaker 2: and every single person pretty much that played in the

652
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 2: league at the same time or shared a court with

653
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 2: him has like an incredible, extremely detailed story about him.

654
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 2: Uh so, thank you for sharing all that. Sort of

655
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:24,720
Speaker 2: just reflecting back, you know on that playoff run, like

656
00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 2: how cool is it just to say in a in

657
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:29,240
Speaker 2: a three or four week window, you you went toe

658
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:31,480
Speaker 2: to toe with with two guys like Brandon Royan Kobe

659
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 2: in the same playoffs and held your own and then

660
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 2: some yeah, look.

661
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 1: We gave him all the game handle. And you know,

662
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:40,520
Speaker 1: like I said, we we had we had talent. We

663
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: we could have caused some noise. You know that Game

664
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 1: seven against the Lakers that we lost in the Staples,

665
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: you know we just got blown outs. We just didn't

666
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 1: have anything else and left the tank and you know,

667
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: bying a mcgasol, we're just lamorrow of them were too big.

668
00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:57,480
Speaker 1: You know, we're starting Chuck Hayes Center. You know, Chuck

669
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,640
Speaker 1: is one of my favorite teammates of all of all time.

670
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 1: But you know I spoke to our team that year.

671
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:08,840
Speaker 1: We just had an amazing heart, amazing togetherness. You know,

672
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:12,719
Speaker 1: our coach, our coaching staff was amazing. We just got

673
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:14,440
Speaker 1: a really tough draw in the second round. I'm not

674
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 1: I'm not saying we could have beat the Lakers, but

675
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:20,880
Speaker 1: I remember I remember from that series that Phil Jackson

676
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 1: actually got really upset at the press conference because people

677
00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:26,600
Speaker 1: are just like, how are these rockets even like staying

678
00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:30,040
Speaker 1: in this series? And Phil Jackson goes, Chuck, Yes, is

679
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:32,520
Speaker 1: a good player. All right, you show some respect on Chuck.

680
00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 1: K So the Lakers new and they respect us. Even

681
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:37,399
Speaker 1: the world's like, you know, how these how are these

682
00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 1: little the little rockets that could staying on the court

683
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 1: with the eventual NBA champions Uh the Lakers with with Bonham, Gasol,

684
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:46,920
Speaker 1: Kobe and tomorrow to them?

685
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:50,920
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, also only plays three games, uh this series.

686
00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:52,279
Speaker 2: And I'm not going to put you on the spot,

687
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:55,480
Speaker 2: but if yea, I was healthy for for seven, it

688
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:56,200
Speaker 2: could be different.

689
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:58,359
Speaker 1: If we had if we had health and we had

690
00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:01,200
Speaker 1: team now, I would have liked our chances against anybody.

691
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:03,800
Speaker 1: You know, we would have had a shot against anybody,

692
00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 1: you know. But you know, people don't talk about, you

693
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:08,799
Speaker 1: know how great Tumbo was, all right, but Tumble again

694
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:11,280
Speaker 1: one of again, one of the greatest teammates of all time.

695
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:13,680
Speaker 1: You know, in the years that that Yao would go

696
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:17,880
Speaker 1: out the Ken Bay would just like you can't barely

697
00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:20,160
Speaker 1: run and lay up lines and get out there fifty

698
00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 1: years old, like grab fifteen boards and still block six

699
00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 1: shots like it was the damnedest thing of all time,

700
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 1: Mu Tumble and then you know still to this day,

701
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:31,759
Speaker 1: like keep black a shot, grab it, turn to the

702
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,640
Speaker 1: crowd and no, no, no, no no, We're like can't

703
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 1: We're out make them all them Fingerway. But so like

704
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:40,880
Speaker 1: you know, that's why that that team was so awesome.

705
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,280
Speaker 1: You know, it doesn't matter who stepped in, they produced,

706
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,400
Speaker 1: whether it's Kim and Mu Tumbo, Steve no Back, you know,

707
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:50,719
Speaker 1: Von Way for Carl Landry, we sculled just a really

708
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:53,399
Speaker 1: really cool team. But I'm glad we get a chance

709
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 1: to talk about because they are kind of a forgotten

710
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:59,759
Speaker 1: Uh we are a forgotten team in the late two thousands.

711
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:03,680
Speaker 2: And most finally, uh sort of just reflecting back, are

712
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:06,440
Speaker 2: are there any lessons or or a little details that

713
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:08,239
Speaker 2: you picked up maybe from the season or just your

714
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,480
Speaker 2: Rocketston in general, that that you carry with you in

715
00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:12,120
Speaker 2: front office?

716
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 1: Now? Yeah, look, you know I was lucky to win

717
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 1: two championships of the Miami Heat, and so coming here

718
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 1: from my time at Duke, the value of the locker

719
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 1: room is super important, all right. And it's easy to

720
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 1: be a good locker room and things are good, but

721
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 1: if you want to be a champion, you get to

722
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:37,040
Speaker 1: go through some stuff and it tests your ability to

723
00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:40,000
Speaker 1: come together as a team, to handle adversity, to to

724
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 1: sort of figure it out, all right, because you know,

725
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 1: no one's no one's trying to help you up when

726
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: you have in versity in the NBA to try to

727
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:49,360
Speaker 1: step on you, right, And that's competition. That's that's the

728
00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:52,759
Speaker 1: way it is. And so just having an amazing locker

729
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 1: room understanding how important team together is something I took

730
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 1: with me, you know, to my next team with the Heat,

731
00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:01,320
Speaker 1: and we had an amazing team industry in a great

732
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 1: locker room, and we had adversity like everybody else. But

733
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:07,840
Speaker 1: when you have a strong team, you can overcome it.

734
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:11,839
Speaker 1: And that is still you cannot win this championship, whether

735
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 1: it's the Warriors this year or or anybody or the Bucks,

736
00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:17,000
Speaker 1: you know, the last couple of years, you got to

737
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:20,359
Speaker 1: have a strong locker room, and there's there's no way

738
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:20,759
Speaker 1: around it.

739
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:25,839
Speaker 2: Mhm, truth to that. Excuse me, well, Shane, I really

740
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:28,759
Speaker 2: appreciate all the wisdom and taking a trip down memory

741
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:32,120
Speaker 2: laying with me. I think, like you said, uh, the

742
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 2: Rockets area in general I just find really fascinating again,

743
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:36,880
Speaker 2: but this specific team going toe to toe with the

744
00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:40,880
Speaker 2: eventual champs, having guys like Aaron Brooks, Kyle Lowry like

745
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,280
Speaker 2: you know, coming to their own on the big stage.

746
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:45,720
Speaker 2: And of course you and Ron's those battles against Kobe.

747
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 2: I want to, you know, try and keep those those

748
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:53,880
Speaker 2: days and games alive, so you know, without you that reliving,

749
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 2: that that goes away. So just thank you for for

750
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:58,240
Speaker 2: hopping on and giving us so much about this season.

751
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,920
Speaker 1: Well, it was was a really really fun time for me.

752
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 1: It was my it was my prime I thought as

753
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 1: a player, and so it's fun to relive with you, Dylan. Thanks,

754
00:38:09,440 --> 00:38:10,359
Speaker 1: thanks for bringing me on.

755
00:38:10,840 --> 00:38:13,040
Speaker 2: Thanks so much, and you know, well we'll look out

756
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 2: for those front office moves with the heat coming up.

757
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: All right, be good.

758
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:22,280
Speaker 2: That is a wrap forgotten seasons on the two thousand

759
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:25,919
Speaker 2: and nine Rockets with Shane Battier. I really liked that one.

760
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 2: I think you could tell really how much pride Shane

761
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:32,239
Speaker 2: took in that Kobe matchup and go in toe to

762
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:35,560
Speaker 2: toe with the legend. We will be back next week

763
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 2: with another episode, drop a rating, and a review. Really

764
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 2: appreciate it. This is your host, Dylan Dreyfus signing off.

765
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:44,400
Speaker 2: I will catch you next Tuesday.

766
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:44,960
Speaker 1: Peace,