Speaker 1: LinkedIn News.
Speaker 2: Now, the thing about burnout is it sneaks up on you.
Speaker 2: I remember I was in a job. I was having
Speaker 2: chest pains and so I went to the doctor and
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm having these heart palpitations.
Speaker 1: Am I having like a heart attack? Mind you? I'm
Speaker 1: like the twenty five years old the job. I'm like,
Speaker 1: what's happening? Is it now? Is now my time?
Speaker 2: And two are like and he was like, no, You're
Speaker 2: not having a heart attack. But we went down this
Speaker 2: checklist and he said, I think you are exhibiting like
Speaker 2: early signs of burnout.
Speaker 3: From LinkedIn News and I heard podcasts. This is Let's
Speaker 3: Talk offline, a show about what it takes to thrive
Speaker 3: in the early years of your career without sacrificing your values,
Speaker 3: sanity or a sleep.
Speaker 2: I'm Gianna Prudenti and I'm Jamaie Jackson Kadsten. So when
Speaker 2: you're early in your career, you are hustle in. I mean,
Speaker 2: you might give me all of the assignments you want
Speaker 2: me to do that presentation. Sure, you want me to
Speaker 2: come into work early. Absolute Utely, you're saying yes to
Speaker 2: everything because honestly, you're trying to prove to others, maybe
Speaker 2: even to yourself, that you can do the job.
Speaker 1: But what can that lead to? Yeah, you guessed it, burnout.
Speaker 1: It's true.
Speaker 3: I've been there, and so have many other gen Zers.
Speaker 3: Get this. Ninety eight percent of gen Z workers have
Speaker 3: battled burnout symptoms.
Speaker 1: Ninety eight ninety eight.
Speaker 3: Wow, I know that means it feels like you're running
Speaker 3: on empty, but you keep pushing yourself to the max
Speaker 3: and stressing yourself out, all at the expense of your
Speaker 3: mental health. Well, we're here to tell you that it
Speaker 3: doesn't have to be that way, and we're going to
Speaker 3: help you prevent burnout before it's too late.
Speaker 1: There's different types of burnouts. There's levels to this.
Speaker 2: Okay, so it's for today's conversation, we are specifically talking
Speaker 2: about work burnout. So when it comes to work burnout,
Speaker 2: that is the feeling of things like stress and exhaustion
Speaker 2: when you think or do anything related to your job.
Speaker 2: I mean you are feeling drained, you're feeling unmotivated. You
Speaker 2: could also be feeling worn out physically, but I think
Speaker 2: this also comes down to your emotional and mental state
Speaker 2: as well. And unfortunately, the thing about burnout is if
Speaker 2: you're not careful. It also can affect your job performance.
Speaker 2: So there are a number of things that can contribute
Speaker 2: to job burnout. I mean, so, just thinking off the
Speaker 2: top of my head, it's things like having a lack
Speaker 2: of control. I see this a lot, particularly when you
Speaker 2: have things like layoffs or like workforces are impacted. You
Speaker 2: feel like you're out of control and you want to
Speaker 2: just grasp it and you don't have it having too
Speaker 2: much or even.
Speaker 1: Too little to do. Now.
Speaker 2: Look, I love this one, gee, because we always talk
Speaker 2: about being overworked, but underwork can also add to burnout too,
Speaker 2: because you start wondering, am I doing enough? Am I
Speaker 2: feeling fulfilled? Am I walking in my life's purpose?
Speaker 1: Babe? You're twenty one? Okay? Are you relaxed? These are
Speaker 1: the questions that we're thinking about. Yeah, I know, I know.
Speaker 1: It keeps us up at night.
Speaker 2: Obviously, office conflict, right, you know, we had a whole
Speaker 2: episode on work friendships, right, But what happens when that
Speaker 2: friendship goes sour? Or what happens when that little booth
Speaker 2: thing and the other department and yeah, y'all break up
Speaker 2: and now you're grieving and you see them eating chicken
Speaker 2: in the cafeteria with somebody else.
Speaker 1: Who are you? Sorry? That sounds very personal.
Speaker 2: Sorry anyway's not speaking from personal experience.
Speaker 3: No, No, I'm not.
Speaker 1: Crashing out whatsoever. A lack of support.
Speaker 2: We talked about this a lot, particularly around managers and
Speaker 2: co workers. Lack of support can just make you feel
Speaker 2: like you're in an unsafe environment. But another one that
Speaker 2: I think is so important here is personal life issues.
Speaker 2: I feel this one deeply because your personal life can't
Speaker 2: affect your work life. I know people like to separate,
Speaker 2: and to some degree there should be a separation of
Speaker 2: church and state. But the truth of the matter is
Speaker 2: you're human and what's happening out there is bound to
Speaker 2: also come a little bit into your office settings.
Speaker 1: They bleed in.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you're feeling some sort of way, but you
Speaker 3: kind of ignore those feelings because maybe you don't know
Speaker 3: what it is, and you really want to prove yourself,
Speaker 3: whether you're like starting a new job or early in
Speaker 3: your career, so you're really willing to kind of put
Speaker 3: your mental health aside and just like keep pushing forward,
Speaker 3: and then that comes at a cost, right, So I
Speaker 3: think what's important with burnout is if you're starting to
Speaker 3: feel those symptoms that Jamay was explaining, you have to
Speaker 3: ask yourself a few questions to kind of diagnose yourself.
Speaker 3: And these are some questions that Mayo Clinics suggests asking. So, first,
Speaker 3: do you question the value of your work? Do you
Speaker 3: drag yourself to work and have trouble getting started? Do
Speaker 3: you feel removed from work and the people you work with?
Speaker 3: Do you feel a little satisfaction from the work you
Speaker 3: get done? Do you doubt your skills and abilities? Do
Speaker 3: you feel let down by your job? Are you experiencing
Speaker 3: physical ailments like frequent headaches, stomach issues, trouble sleeping with
Speaker 3: no known cause. If you're answering yes to a lot
Speaker 3: of these questions, that's likely a sign that you are
Speaker 3: experiencing burnout.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I like that there are questions that we can all
Speaker 2: sort of ask ourselves at least to start the conversation.
Speaker 1: So, gee, what's been your experience with burnout?
Speaker 3: I experienced burnout maybe a year or so ago. I
Speaker 3: feel like it kind of was this perfect storm between
Speaker 3: things in my personal life and work life, and I
Speaker 3: remember just feeling like just numbed out, like I was
Speaker 3: super unmotivated. We work in a very creation heavy role,
Speaker 3: and I was just not feeling creative whatsoever. Like the
Speaker 3: idea of having to put words down on paper was
Speaker 3: this exhausting task for me, and I just felt super drained.
Speaker 3: I really had no energy even for social interactions in
Speaker 3: or out of work. I wanted to like kind of
Speaker 3: just like be by myself. I didn't have like the
Speaker 3: mental capacity to take anything in. You know, everything that
Speaker 3: I was good at is now such a struggle. And
Speaker 3: then I started having conversations with one colleague, one of
Speaker 3: my work for friends, and she really helped me kind
Speaker 3: of work through it because it was the first time
Speaker 3: I had experienced something like that, and when it's related
Speaker 3: to your job, all of a sudden, I was like,
Speaker 3: oh no, Like I was always a very like driven person,
Speaker 3: always ambitious, like high functioning anxiety work, you know, like
Speaker 3: a lot of I think some of my success at
Speaker 3: work is just being like the type a anxious person
Speaker 3: that I am, And suddenly I just wasn't that person anymore.
Speaker 3: Like I was in this very self driven role, but
Speaker 3: I could not get myself to get my work done,
Speaker 3: and if I did, it was like blah, yeah and yeah.
Speaker 3: It definitely took me a while to like work through
Speaker 3: it because I didn't really know how to get out
Speaker 3: of that funk.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was.
Speaker 3: It was definitely like a WHOA moment for me.
Speaker 2: I'm so thankful that you were able to have someone
Speaker 2: who you could talk to because to your point, when
Speaker 2: you do make work part of your identity and in
Speaker 2: some way by being that person you know people can
Speaker 2: depend on or doing good work, it feels very personal.
Speaker 1: When you can't do that, it was scary.
Speaker 3: I was like, okay, am I not able to do
Speaker 3: my job all of a sudden, like what happened? Yeah,
Speaker 3: And it's not like the cure for burnout is something
Speaker 3: that happens overnight, and it can really feel like isolating
Speaker 3: and you're like, I don't want to you know, you're
Speaker 3: nervous to ask for help or to vocalize that because
Speaker 3: you want to be seen as somebody who can get
Speaker 3: the job done and be a high performer, especially if
Speaker 3: that's a reputation you've built for yourself and now something's changed.
Speaker 3: But like you were saying, your personal life really bleeds
Speaker 3: into work. It's not something that you can always you know,
Speaker 3: perfectly separate and have boundaries around. So you know, undoubtedly
Speaker 3: it's something that many people probably will experience throughout their career. Yeah,
Speaker 3: is it something you've experienced before?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I am similar to you.
Speaker 2: I had a really really bad burnout session like last year,
Speaker 2: like to the point where I should I know what
Speaker 2: was together, but I stopped creating altogether. And as someone
Speaker 2: who people would say, I love your personal brand, I
Speaker 2: love that you create, all of a sudden, it felt
Speaker 2: like overnight, I just I walked away from everything. I
Speaker 2: stopped posting on social media, I stopped creating content from
Speaker 2: my website. I even stopped doing speaking events. And it's
Speaker 2: like the cyclical thing because there was so much happening
Speaker 2: in my personal life. My mother in law was really,
Speaker 2: really sick. My husband was her caretaker, so I became
Speaker 2: her caretaker and in a sense, and then she passed,
Speaker 2: and it was such a moment of just like trying
Speaker 2: to process grief, but like life goes on and you
Speaker 2: had to keep going, and then there were transitions, and
Speaker 2: so there were also like all of these things happening inside.
Speaker 2: I had out so many pile ups, and you know,
Speaker 2: one of the things that I think about a lot
Speaker 2: is I had just also started to just let myself
Speaker 2: go the girl who people say, oh, she dresses nice,
Speaker 2: so she always looks. I had just stopped caring about
Speaker 2: my appearance. And I think the sad thing is it's
Speaker 2: like you want to yell into the void, help, help,
Speaker 2: but then you're also like, but who cares?
Speaker 1: And you feel that way? Is this solution? What is
Speaker 1: the solution? Now?
Speaker 2: What's interesting though, And you know, the things you love
Speaker 2: are the things that you find ways to talk about.
Speaker 2: I'll never forget. There was an instance where I had
Speaker 2: gotten an opportunity as an influencer to promote a movie,
Speaker 2: and so they invited me to the movie premiere and
Speaker 2: so I got really excited. I got dressed up that night,
Speaker 2: we went, and I walked away from that night being like,
Speaker 2: this is what I need to be doing.
Speaker 1: I need to be getting back into acting.
Speaker 2: Like there's just something about getting back into something that
Speaker 2: you absolutely love. And then that's when I started to
Speaker 2: enroll in the classes and it healed me, It really did.
Speaker 2: Now it's taken what a year plus for me to
Speaker 2: finally be at a point where I'm creating content again.
Speaker 2: I'm getting myself out there. But I would be lying
Speaker 2: if I said that sometimes I approach the things that
Speaker 2: I love with caution because I don't want them to
Speaker 2: burn me out again. You get scarred, and you expect
Speaker 2: when you are Anyone who has ever dealt, particularly with
Speaker 2: depression knows you get into those spells and when you
Speaker 2: are out, you are so thankful, but you're like, please, God,
Speaker 2: don't let me get there again. And I think burnout
Speaker 2: is one of those things.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 2: The thing about burnout is it sneaks up on you.
Speaker 2: I remember I was in a job. I was having
Speaker 2: chest pains, and so I went to the doctor and
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm having these heart palpitations.
Speaker 1: Am I having like a heart attack? Mine?
Speaker 4: You?
Speaker 1: I'm like a twenty five the job. I'm like, what's happening?
Speaker 1: Is it now?
Speaker 2: Is now my time? And you are like and he
Speaker 2: was like, no, You're not having a heart attack. But
Speaker 2: you know, he asked me very similar questions to what
Speaker 2: you mentioned earlier. We went down this checklist, and he said,
Speaker 2: I think you are exhibiting like early signs of burnout.
Speaker 2: I was overworking myself. I was not giving myself a
Speaker 2: work life balance. I wasn't setting boundaries a lot of things.
Speaker 2: Giann and I have been talking.
Speaker 1: To you all about all about the boundary and all
Speaker 1: circles back to boundaries.
Speaker 2: But it really was I think with some of the
Speaker 2: this also goes back to millennials particularly we come from
Speaker 2: like grind culture, right, like hustle culture, muscle culture. Yeah,
Speaker 2: like nobody cares if you're tired, Like, if you're tired,
Speaker 2: that means you're right exactly. Yeah, And so I had
Speaker 2: to sort of unlearn and I honestly it was kind
Speaker 2: of post pandemic that I learned this about slowing down
Speaker 2: and taking the time to advocate for myself and set boundaries.
Speaker 2: And it really has been over the last year and
Speaker 2: a half where I've said I have to go even
Speaker 2: a step further to make sure that I prevent the
Speaker 2: burnout in the first place.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I just want to give a quick shout out to
Speaker 3: the amazing millennial woman in my life, including you, because
Speaker 3: I feel like it's unfortunate to say that. I feel
Speaker 3: like you guys experience that and now because of that,
Speaker 3: you're like protecting us from that. So I feel like
Speaker 3: a lot of informal mentors I have in my life
Speaker 3: have said, you know, like I've been there, here's what
Speaker 3: you like I want you to do to stop yourself
Speaker 3: from getting to that point, or like get yourself out
Speaker 3: of it when you are, because this is just not
Speaker 3: not good.
Speaker 1: It's worth it.
Speaker 2: I think that what's so important is that you have
Speaker 2: to remember, at least I like to think of it
Speaker 2: as this, that everything is working out for you, like
Speaker 2: everything is. And so if you really believe that, Like
Speaker 2: on the surface level, we could say, oh, it's working
Speaker 2: out for me, But if you're still allowing things to
Speaker 2: stress you out, if you're still staying in toxic environments,
Speaker 2: if you're still not pursuing the things that you're passionate about.
Speaker 1: Do you really believe it?
Speaker 2: If you really believe that things are working out for you,
Speaker 2: that also means I don't have to stress out on
Speaker 2: this job because I'm still going to get where I
Speaker 2: need to get to, yeah, and wherever I need to
Speaker 2: get to. You know, if you already think of everything
Speaker 2: as ordained steps for you, you will be okay.
Speaker 3: Easier so than benders.
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 3: I know, literally, we know how hard it can be
Speaker 3: to put yourself first, especially when it comes to work.
Speaker 3: But after the break, we're going to talk about ways
Speaker 3: to tackle burnout and also get ahead of the problem.
Speaker 3: All right, we're back talking about dealing with burnout at work.
Speaker 3: Something I've been really trying to work on over the
Speaker 3: last few years is putting my mental health first. And
Speaker 3: that seems like, Okay, yeah, great, obviously you should be
Speaker 3: doing that, but it is really hard when you're balancing
Speaker 3: your job with your personal life and you know, you
Speaker 3: want your performance to be great and you want to
Speaker 3: do good at your job, and sometimes you sacrifice your
Speaker 3: mental health for that. But we are here to tell
Speaker 3: you that you got to put your mental health first
Speaker 3: and because having that mindset is really going to help
Speaker 3: you kind of get ahead of the problem when it
Speaker 3: comes to burnout and learn. If you're going to learn
Speaker 3: anything from me, it's you know, not to just go
Speaker 3: on overdrive and ignore it until you crash.
Speaker 1: Just think about it.
Speaker 2: Do you really want the thing that you want if
Speaker 2: you can't even enjoy it because you mentally aren't even there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then you get to it and you're like, Okay,
Speaker 3: I was just like kind of black out the whole
Speaker 3: journey to get here because I was just unwell, right, Yeah, Okay,
Speaker 3: So like Jamay and I were saying before, I mean,
Speaker 3: all of this really does come back to setting boundaries
Speaker 3: around your job. And we did a whole episode about
Speaker 3: how to set work boundaries a few months ago, so
Speaker 3: we're not going to spend too much time talking about it,
Speaker 3: but the TLDR is that setting those work boundaries is
Speaker 3: going to be the first step to preventing burnout. So
Speaker 3: check out that work boundaries episode if you haven't already.
Speaker 3: Listen the other thing, and you kind of mentioned this
Speaker 3: before when you talked about getting back into acting. When
Speaker 3: you bring things into your life that give you joy,
Speaker 3: it rejuvenates you. So really invest in your hobbies. I
Speaker 3: think when I was dealing with burnout, my whole life
Speaker 3: was work. I had nothing outside that was really an
Speaker 3: outlet for me. Yeah, and you know this really gets me.
Speaker 3: Everyone's always like, well do you work out? Like yes,
Speaker 3: I wish I was the girlie who was working out
Speaker 3: for mental health like that, ain't me, Like, I'm working
Speaker 3: out because I need to with them, not as much
Speaker 3: as a release as I wish.
Speaker 1: It was the fact that some people do this for
Speaker 1: fun runners high. It ain't real for me. It's not
Speaker 1: high for me. It's not I'm on the ground, my
Speaker 1: tang I'm ready.
Speaker 3: But you have to remember that You're more than your job, right,
Speaker 3: It's not your whole life. So you have to make
Speaker 3: time outside of work for your hobbies and passions and
Speaker 3: make sure that you're investing in those interests. And that
Speaker 3: can really reduce the stress on the job. So yeah,
Speaker 3: exercise is like one of them. If that's your release, great,
Speaker 3: But doing things that just bring you joy. For me,
Speaker 3: it's cooking a great meal. There's nothing I love more
Speaker 3: than like coming home from a long day. Everyone stay
Speaker 3: out of the kitchen like it's just me. I don't
Speaker 3: need a sous chev Okay, I want to just sit there.
Speaker 3: I want to chop. I want to chop all night.
Speaker 3: I want to listen to the music. And I'm decompressing.
Speaker 1: See. But you know what I love.
Speaker 2: I love that you mentioned hobbies that don't even have
Speaker 2: anything to do with work, because I think sometimes people
Speaker 2: swap work for work and oh my god, and I
Speaker 2: don't think you should do that, particularly if you're trying
Speaker 2: to fight burnout. I think another thing that's really important
Speaker 2: here is that you should seek support. Now, I think
Speaker 2: that support can also happen internally here, so you can
Speaker 2: also talk to your manager, you can talk to co workers,
Speaker 2: particularly with the manager. Let me focus on that one first.
Speaker 2: I think that you can have an honest conversation with
Speaker 2: them about how you're feeling, come with solutions right also,
Speaker 2: and like kind of give them a lay of the land.
Speaker 2: I have done this before with managers of mine, where
Speaker 2: I have said, like, I am really stressed out based
Speaker 2: upon my workload. Can you just help me review everything
Speaker 2: that I have and help me prioritize, like what is
Speaker 2: the most important versus least? And one thing that I
Speaker 2: have found is that by giving them that access, they're able.
Speaker 2: A good manager is good to identify, Okay, here's what
Speaker 2: I can take off of your plate, or what you
Speaker 2: can outsource to somebody else. And then they're also going
Speaker 2: to help you figure out because if you're like me,
Speaker 2: you think everything is a level ten priority and it's not. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and that also adds to the stress, which then also
Speaker 2: leads to burnout. Your co workers are also people you
Speaker 2: lean on, right, Like the idea of like being able
Speaker 2: to talk to someone like you did right or like
Speaker 2: I do sometimes like you need that. And then also
Speaker 2: obviously external friendships and so the people outside of your
Speaker 2: job are gonna help remind you that this is not
Speaker 2: your whole life, right, yes, because you know what, they're
Speaker 2: gonna be sick of it.
Speaker 1: They're gonna be like, I'm tired of you. My roommate's like,
Speaker 1: I'm done with this same thing. You keep talking, all right.
Speaker 2: She's gonna be like, of course you're burned out. You're
Speaker 2: working twelve hour days. Let's go to halfy hour. But
Speaker 2: like you need that, and then like you'd be like,
Speaker 2: oh wow, this thing that I thought was this huge
Speaker 2: thing in my life really is a lot smaller.
Speaker 1: So you got to get outside. You have to have support.
Speaker 1: Another thing.
Speaker 2: It's also not a bad idea to consider taking breaks.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, when it comes to breaks, there's a couple
Speaker 2: of different breaks that I need. The first break is
Speaker 2: literally taking a break, go outside during your lunch break, okay,
Speaker 2: or stop working while you eat. I'm guilty, much so guilty,
Speaker 2: but like, seriously, give yourself a few minutes every day
Speaker 2: to just ground yourself. I have to force myself to
Speaker 2: go get coffee, or to get outside to get some
Speaker 2: fresh air, or even just the walk to and from
Speaker 2: the you know, the train stations. Those little things allow
Speaker 2: you to get some more mental clarity and to just breathe, right,
Speaker 2: because sometimes we're not breathing.
Speaker 3: Okay, I've never breathing. I've never I just tried to
Speaker 3: shout this in therapy. I'm always holding my breath.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, not good, not good.
Speaker 2: But you definitely should just figure out ways to take breaks.
Speaker 2: Now obviously those are the smaller ones, right, and then
Speaker 2: goes back to boundaries, knowing when you're gonna clock in,
Speaker 2: when you're gonna clock out, giving your weekends to yourself.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Can I just say something.
Speaker 3: Some people actually add calendar holds on their calendars to
Speaker 3: remind themselves to break. And that's something that I want
Speaker 3: to start doing too, because you can literally power through
Speaker 3: the day and I'd be like, oh.
Speaker 1: Guilty, Yeah that is me.
Speaker 3: I got a top and that was it. Like that's
Speaker 3: something I've learned from you. Because if you don't put
Speaker 3: that hold, people will block.
Speaker 1: It, I guess. But even when you have the whole
Speaker 1: people will still oh, double book you. I'd be double tripple.
Speaker 3: You gotta set that soundary and you gotta enforce it.
Speaker 2: I don't like it, am I Mariah Carey. Everyone just
Speaker 2: want a piece that's the same meaning. But aside of those,
Speaker 2: like also another type of break that is important.
Speaker 1: Here are like longer breaks.
Speaker 2: Okay, So here's the thing, guys, burnout is not the
Speaker 2: same as just like a stressful day in the office,
Speaker 2: which is why you have to be very thoughtful and
Speaker 2: intentional when you ask yourself these questions of how you're feeling,
Speaker 2: keeping a diary or a log of how long this
Speaker 2: has been going on, and if you can being able
Speaker 2: to talk to people, and you know, gauge like, okay,
Speaker 2: is this kind of becoming a bigger thing. I say
Speaker 2: this because burnout is not something you solve over one weekend.
Speaker 1: Staying in burnout is.
Speaker 2: A long term thing, so you have to come up
Speaker 2: with a long term strategy. What breaks can hopefully do
Speaker 2: is if you have the opportunity to take PTO or
Speaker 2: discretionary time off or whatever. If you can take time
Speaker 2: off short, use that. But if you cannot, you need
Speaker 2: to also start looking into resources that might allow you
Speaker 2: to take additional days for mental health or even being
Speaker 2: able to take longer spans of time. Now we'll have
Speaker 2: it down in the show description more resources for you all.
Speaker 2: But I do know that there are also mental health
Speaker 2: resources that are offered by FMLA, so this can also
Speaker 2: give you weeks.
Speaker 1: Of time off. What's Family Medical Leave Act. I haven't
Speaker 1: heard of that you.
Speaker 2: Have access to it, and it's really great. I mean
Speaker 2: a lot of people know FMLA for things like maternity
Speaker 2: or paternity care. Also if you're out on medical leave.
Speaker 2: But let me tell you this, the same way you
Speaker 2: care when you have a medical procedure and you need
Speaker 2: time off work, you got to take the same care
Speaker 2: for your mind. Okay, So definitely make sure you check
Speaker 2: out the resources and the show description. Guys, we will
Speaker 2: have them out there because I don't want to misquote anything.
Speaker 2: But the point is, do your research. Know that it
Speaker 2: is okay to take small breaks, but if you are
Speaker 2: actually getting to the point of burnout that you are
Speaker 2: now like, okay, this is impacting my life, it is
Speaker 2: okay to look into resources to give you longer breaks
Speaker 2: of time. You should be medically and legally protected.
Speaker 3: Before you mentioned seeking support from your manager, and you
Speaker 3: were sharing how you've gone about that in the past,
Speaker 3: and I want to talk more about that, and that
Speaker 3: brings us to our listener question. So this is our
Speaker 3: segment Dear Work Bestie, where we bring in questions from
Speaker 3: our listeners. This week's comes from Ben in Washington.
Speaker 4: Lately, there's been a lot going on at working in
Speaker 4: my personal life. I'm not feeling as motivated as I
Speaker 4: usually am about my job. I'm starting to feel kind
Speaker 4: of overwhelmed. How do I tell my manager how feeling
Speaker 4: without making them feel like I'm incapable of doing my job?
Speaker 3: So if you guys listen to our Boundaries episode, you
Speaker 3: will realize I've already cried at work, like I have
Speaker 3: got to the point where I'm crying in my cubicle
Speaker 3: to my manager. But of course I'm okay, thank you
Speaker 3: to a trauma.
Speaker 1: I love you though you know it's funny.
Speaker 3: I laugh now, I laugh now, but you know there
Speaker 3: are steps you can take to prevent that from happening. So,
Speaker 3: similar to Bin, I was feeling overwhelmed and scared that
Speaker 3: my performance was slipping. So I wanted to have that
Speaker 3: conversation with my manager. And I think if you're you
Speaker 3: have a good manager, they don't want you to fail
Speaker 3: if you feel like you have a trusted relationship with
Speaker 3: that person, right And I think it's going into that conversation,
Speaker 3: like you were saying before, being open and just saying
Speaker 3: I'm feeling overwhelmed right now, and here's what's on my plate,
Speaker 3: And you can literally say I don't want the quality
Speaker 3: of my work to slip. I know I can do
Speaker 3: a good job, but I feel like I'm going to
Speaker 3: get to the point where I'm unable to maintain the
Speaker 3: quality of my work because of how I'm feeling. And
Speaker 3: so yeah, I think vulnerable really wins here. But of
Speaker 3: course not everyone has that relationship with their manager. But
Speaker 3: I do think I think you can kind of come
Speaker 3: in with the problem solution approach of saying like, hey,
Speaker 3: here's what you know I think I can be doing
Speaker 3: to kind of like lessen this overwhelm what do you
Speaker 3: think about this? Right? And I think your manager will
Speaker 3: be like, oh, okay, great or no, actually, why don't we
Speaker 3: try this? But you kind of need to bring them
Speaker 3: in as a partner either way to kind of figure
Speaker 3: out the solution forward.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I love that a lot, because, like we talked about earlier,
Speaker 2: your manager can help you prioritize. When I was thinking
Speaker 2: about what Ben was saying, I was like, I think
Speaker 2: it's also important to ask yourself, like, what is taking
Speaker 2: the toll right, because if it's one of those bigger
Speaker 2: projects figuring out maybe are there other coworkers you can
Speaker 2: bring on who you can partner with and having that.
Speaker 2: But it's if it's the small, like little things figuring
Speaker 2: out how to delegate. For me, I find that, like
Speaker 2: it's the small tasks that usually me out because my
Speaker 2: brain is like in strategy docs all day or working
Speaker 2: on big projects. So that allowed me to also figure out, Okay,
Speaker 2: I can now block off time on my calendar to
Speaker 2: go towards answering emails.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I love that you said first like figure out what
Speaker 3: is you know, what are your main stressors, and then
Speaker 3: also like ask your manager to help you prioritize, and also,
Speaker 3: like I guess, speaking from my personal experience, like if
Speaker 3: it is stuff in your personal life, you know, a
Speaker 3: good manager understands that you are a whole human and
Speaker 3: you have life outside the office. You know, you don't
Speaker 3: have to tell everyone exactly the full story, right.
Speaker 1: I think if the you.
Speaker 3: Know, pandemic taught anybody anything, it's like, we have life
Speaker 3: outside of the office, and you need to account for that.
Speaker 3: And that's why you know, prioritizing mental health is so important.
Speaker 3: And remember that you were hired for a reason. Your
Speaker 3: manager isn't going to say Oh wow, you're incapable of
Speaker 3: doing your job now because you just told me this
Speaker 3: vulnerable thing about yourself. I do think people respect that,
Speaker 3: but when you're starting out, you feel like, oh, that
Speaker 3: vulnerability is something I can't show because I'm proving myself.
Speaker 3: Where if you have a good manager, that's something that
Speaker 3: they're going to, you know, be proud of you for
Speaker 3: doing and help you kind of problem solved.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean to your point, you are proving yourself.
Speaker 2: You're proving that you can take ownership, You're proving that
Speaker 2: you are coming with a solution oriented mindset. You're proving
Speaker 2: that I want to succeed in this job. I just
Speaker 2: need a little help because it's like this. Everyone is
Speaker 2: going to suffer grief at some point in their life.
Speaker 2: Everyone is going to suffer something. You know, We've talked
Speaker 2: about layoffs, We've talked about you know, being impacted by
Speaker 2: different things that are happening industries. So many themes and
Speaker 2: topics that we've talked about on this podcast are things
Speaker 2: that are going to touch people at some point or another.
Speaker 2: So it would naturally benefit your employer to understand that
Speaker 2: you are a person and that these things are going
Speaker 2: to affect you in a different way, like what affects
Speaker 2: G is going to affect me in a different way
Speaker 2: because of life circumstances. That is where you create that partnership.
Speaker 2: But I just want to also say that if you
Speaker 2: are experiencing continued burnout, take it from the girl who
Speaker 2: literally has had to go to the hospital about this
Speaker 2: hair was falling out.
Speaker 1: I was not cute.
Speaker 2: It was not cute. I wasn't eating or I was overeating.
Speaker 2: I was doing a lot. It was a whole lot
Speaker 2: of everything. If you are realizing that you are in
Speaker 2: this continued burnout stage, it really might be time for
Speaker 2: you to consider walking away. You are no lesser of
Speaker 2: a person if you decide you have to do that.
Speaker 2: In fact, I commend you for being able to prioritize
Speaker 2: your mental health. Now obviously I get it. It's much
Speaker 2: easier said than done here and I know, like you
Speaker 2: can look out and you can see the industry, you
Speaker 2: can see the economy, and you're nervous to take that leap.
Speaker 2: And I also understand that not everyone has the privilege
Speaker 2: of just being able to leave their job. But if
Speaker 2: you are not getting the support that you need, if
Speaker 2: you have listened to this entire episode. You have noted
Speaker 2: a lot of things that you see in yourself. If
Speaker 2: you've had these conversations with your manager, if you've had
Speaker 2: these conversations with HI, if you work in an environment
Speaker 2: that does not respect your boundaries, it really might be
Speaker 2: time for you to start thinking about that exit plan.
Speaker 3: And I just want to add one last thing is
Speaker 3: don't be afraid to seek the help of a mental
Speaker 3: health professional. You know, I've been in therapy for I
Speaker 3: think most of my life and it's definitely helped me
Speaker 3: create those boundaries around work and personal life. That has
Speaker 3: helped kind of prevent the burnout. And then when I
Speaker 3: was in that period because of a lot of it
Speaker 3: was due to my personal life. I mean, therapy you know,
Speaker 3: saved me in that time. So definitely consider seeking support
Speaker 3: if you have the resources and the means to do so. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and also see if you know your employer has a
Speaker 3: mental health benefit and maybe they work with a therapy provider.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I love that you mentioned that.
Speaker 2: One thing that I was thinking of is that sometimes
Speaker 2: your friends, your family, your loved ones could also be
Speaker 2: the same ones who gaslight you, which.
Speaker 1: Is why you have to have wise counseled a third
Speaker 1: party of.
Speaker 2: It you do like and they may not mean anything
Speaker 2: negative by it. But you know, your parents, who have
Speaker 2: stayed in the same job for fifty years are not
Speaker 2: gonna tell you that at the first sign of burnout.
Speaker 1: To me, I know, sometimes.
Speaker 3: My mom would be like, oh, just like just say
Speaker 3: you can't handle it.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I I just put on a nice outfit
Speaker 2: as a makeup.
Speaker 1: When you look good, you feel good. I'm like, now
Speaker 1: what I'm burned out? Mommy. No, they do, they do,
Speaker 1: they do.
Speaker 2: But but to your point, I mean, the mental health
Speaker 2: professional will be able to give you an objective viewpoint
Speaker 2: of your situation, which is always nice to have so
Speaker 2: you feel safe and supported. I mean, honestly, I think
Speaker 2: that's always a great person to bounce ideas off of,
Speaker 2: because otherwise, girl, you're gonna be asking yourself, am I crazy?
Speaker 2: I mean, they're honestly there to help you navigate those thoughts,
Speaker 2: So shout out to them. Okay, everyone, let's all take
Speaker 2: a collective deep breath.
Speaker 1: That was great, right, I know that was a lot.
Speaker 2: An overcoming burnout doesn't happen overnight, but we hope that
Speaker 2: after this combo, you start taking the first steps towards
Speaker 2: addressing that burnout coming up? Have you ever talked about
Speaker 2: your salary with your coworkers?
Speaker 1: Is it still taboo? That's next?
Speaker 3: All right, Tom, you dropped so many gems you too,
Speaker 3: like usual. Something I'm taking away from our conversation that
Speaker 3: you said is the break's part of this, right. I
Speaker 3: really appreciate how protective you are of your time and
Speaker 3: how you don't only set your boundaries, you enforce them
Speaker 3: and you have agency over your time. That's something that
Speaker 3: I want to get better with. So my action item
Speaker 3: for today is, like, I'm set. I'm going to put
Speaker 3: some calendar holds on to break girl and maybe set
Speaker 3: some reminder to breathe because my therapist had to do
Speaker 3: that and I haven't even need to breathe.
Speaker 1: You need to do it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's okay. My voice teacher tells me all
Speaker 2: the time. You need to breathe.
Speaker 3: How we like it might take breaks and breathes like,
Speaker 3: but seriously, but you have to remind yourself sometimes.
Speaker 2: Sometimes the small things are really the most effective, and
Speaker 2: they're the things that will give you the biggest benefit.
Speaker 2: You just don't even realize it. I think one thing
Speaker 2: that's been important that you actually mentioned is just the
Speaker 2: importance of hobbies. Now, this is something that has been
Speaker 2: a game changer for me this year, as I've been
Speaker 2: getting into things that I even took like a pottery class.
Speaker 1: A couple of times. Terrible.
Speaker 3: Wait, can I say something, I also wanted to take
Speaker 3: pottery classes.
Speaker 1: Why is it so expensive? Nobody talks about how expensive
Speaker 1: hobbies can be. It's so expensive. Stick to cooking.
Speaker 2: I know, right, literally, it's so expensive. But I do
Speaker 2: think that there's such a fun thing about just trying
Speaker 2: out hobbies, trying new things that you've never experienced before.
Speaker 2: Sometimes they even show you things that you would want
Speaker 2: to do. We have a whole episode on side hustles,
Speaker 2: turning them into your full nine to five or so.
Speaker 2: I think like there's just so much that you can
Speaker 2: do and decentering work. Decentering something doesn't make it less important.
Speaker 2: It just means that you're not fixated on it and
Speaker 2: you have to govern your own agency.
Speaker 1: In that say it again.
Speaker 2: So I really hope that you guys are taking some
Speaker 2: of these tips away. But before you head out, another
Speaker 2: tip of the week, cringe, go Gianna.
Speaker 1: We have cringe. Are cool? It's our favorite, well my
Speaker 1: favorite segment, I don't know. Is it your favorite? I
Speaker 1: think so? Okay, I think it's fun.
Speaker 2: Right, Well, we get to discuss all things workplace culture,
Speaker 2: in the trends, and we're determining whether they are cool
Speaker 2: or cringe.
Speaker 1: That almost rhymed? I think maybe in my head, Gianna, whatever.
Speaker 3: I don't think.
Speaker 1: What are we talking about this week?
Speaker 3: Okay, we're talking about discussing your salary with your coworkers.
Speaker 1: How much do you make? What do you feel? How
Speaker 1: do I feel? Yeah, let me take a sip of profit?
Speaker 3: Question?
Speaker 1: What a crazy question? How do you feel drying?
Speaker 2: So I think I come at this topic in a
Speaker 2: very particular way because as someone who was a freelancer,
Speaker 2: like a freelance journalist for a number of years in
Speaker 2: her career, the only way I knew how to get
Speaker 2: paid was by asking my community, well, what were you
Speaker 2: getting paid? Yeah, and that was still very taboo then, right,
Speaker 2: but you would quickly learn, oh, the same editor that's
Speaker 2: giving you seventy five bucks for a story is paying
Speaker 2: someone else to seventy five. And so I have always
Speaker 2: been a person who's like, I can ask if you
Speaker 2: feel comfortable sharing feel you know, share If you don't,
Speaker 2: that's totally fine.
Speaker 1: I also think that having.
Speaker 2: Paid transparency and salari transparency allows you to know whether
Speaker 2: you are being played or not. Even in corporate facilities. Now,
Speaker 2: there are some companies that make sure from an equitable
Speaker 2: standpoint that people are being compensated fairly, but there are
Speaker 2: a lot of companies that just don't do that.
Speaker 1: Girl.
Speaker 2: So the only way you are going to know if
Speaker 2: you are being low balled or like if you're not
Speaker 2: actually advancing as quickly as your peers is just by
Speaker 2: having those conversations. But again, it doesn't bother me at all.
Speaker 2: I just always say, like, if you ask, be careful
Speaker 2: for what you ask, because you might find out. You
Speaker 2: might find out that you getting played, and then I
Speaker 2: think people get a lot upset.
Speaker 1: What do you think.
Speaker 3: I love that you said that, because I think if
Speaker 3: you're asking, you got to prepare to either be like
Speaker 3: pleasantly surprised that you're earning more or hurt that you're
Speaker 3: earning less, and that can definitely impact the way you
Speaker 3: view your colleague. So you just need to be aware
Speaker 3: of that going in. But I remember in our negotiation episode,
Speaker 3: you said you found out you were being underpaid in
Speaker 3: one of your early jobs because you spoke to one
Speaker 3: of your guy colleagues, right.
Speaker 2: Yep, I found out I was getting paid like twenty
Speaker 2: thousand dollars less than him, and it was wild because
Speaker 2: we were doing the same type of work. But you
Speaker 2: know what I think is important because you said this,
Speaker 2: and it's like it had nothing new to him, right,
Speaker 2: And I think we take it personal all of a sudden.
Speaker 2: If I found out Gianna was making like three times myself,
Speaker 2: I would be like.
Speaker 3: Gianna, but if podcast over, But it's like, it has
Speaker 3: nothing to do with you.
Speaker 2: I have so many details you could have negotiated that
Speaker 2: you might actually have experience that I don't know of
Speaker 2: that's reflected on that resume. There's there's so many factors here, right, Like,
Speaker 2: so the number is just a number on paper, But
Speaker 2: I do think that it is a number that you
Speaker 2: can use to inform your strategy moving forward.
Speaker 3: Okay, I agree with you. I think there's a lot
Speaker 3: of value in having transparent conversations with your I will
Speaker 3: say work friends, because they need to be trusted.
Speaker 1: Colleagues, very trusted.
Speaker 2: Yes, we're not just throwing this around like a Friday night, No, no, no, no.
Speaker 3: I honestly remember at one point, like a few of
Speaker 3: us like gathered in a conference room and we were
Speaker 3: like we talked about it because you know, when it
Speaker 3: comes to promotions, when it comes to raises, you don't
Speaker 3: know what you don't know, correct, And like you were saying,
Speaker 3: sometimes pay transparency within a company isn't you know, super transparent.
Speaker 3: So having those conversations with your colleagues can be really
Speaker 3: informative when you think about like asking for a raise
Speaker 3: and going after promotion. It didn't tarnish my view of
Speaker 3: them whatsoever, but it just gave me information that I
Speaker 3: had in the back of my head as context. And
Speaker 3: now listen, I wasn't going into any negotiations saying well
Speaker 3: I know so and so is making X y Z
Speaker 3: that part. No, Like listen, like that is not something
Speaker 3: that you throw in somebody else's face. That's not used
Speaker 3: as ammunition. It's like background research that you got to
Speaker 3: keep in your head. Yes, and it's just all context.
Speaker 1: At the end of the day.
Speaker 2: Some things don't need to be said out loud, and like,
Speaker 2: so if someone actually was open and vulnerable enough with
Speaker 2: you to share that information, don't use it to don't, don't.
Speaker 1: Don't organize them. Yeah, yeah, so I agree again, is
Speaker 1: it cool or crazy?
Speaker 3: I think it's cool.
Speaker 1: I think it's cool. It can get cringe if you
Speaker 1: be chatting it up, you go about that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And if a friend tells you, you don't go
Speaker 3: tell other people.
Speaker 2: No, that's just between you and a friend, like me,
Speaker 2: Gianna and like one other person could be in a
Speaker 2: room together.
Speaker 1: If Gianna tell me some information, I heard it.
Speaker 2: If the walls, if oh gosh, lord, what would happen?
Speaker 1: Then well, we want to know from you all.
Speaker 2: Are you all having conversations around salary with your coworkers, family, friends,
Speaker 2: loved ones, strangers on the street.
Speaker 1: Like how how open are we?
Speaker 2: I want to know what's the level of open what's
Speaker 2: the level of openness these days?
Speaker 1: Let us know.
Speaker 2: But in the meantime, thank you guys so much for
Speaker 2: listening to another fun, slightly chaotic, but very action packed episode.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we always end on the chaotic noise.
Speaker 1: Always gotta go out strong.
Speaker 3: Okay, Yeah, you guys can let us know your take
Speaker 3: in the newsletter this week. Make sure you're following. It's
Speaker 3: called Let's Talk offline, where we go even deeper into
Speaker 3: the topics we discuss on the podcast. The link is
Speaker 3: in the show to description and in my LinkedIn bio
Speaker 3: this week, let us know in the comments or share
Speaker 3: a post on LinkedIn and tag Jamay and I about
Speaker 3: your take on cool Cringe. We want to chat with
Speaker 3: all of our work besties.
Speaker 1: Yes now.
Speaker 2: Also, thank you Ben for sending in your question. We
Speaker 2: loved answering it and we hope that it was valuable
Speaker 2: for you you all. You all can also send us
Speaker 2: your questions. Information on how to do that is in
Speaker 2: the show description. Make sure you check out the show description.
Speaker 2: There is a lot of resources that will be down there.
Speaker 3: Also, make sure you guys rate and follow the show
Speaker 3: so you get notified when new episodes get released. And
Speaker 3: we would love to hear from you what you're taking
Speaker 3: away from the show, how you're feeling about it. Let
Speaker 3: us know, leave a review, let us know all right,
Speaker 3: before you go, remember we've always got your back, So
Speaker 3: something comes up. Let's Talk Offline. I'm Jianna Predenti.
Speaker 1: And I'm Jamaie Jackson Gadsden, Stay diving.
Speaker 3: Let's Talk Offline is a production of LinkedIn News and
Speaker 3: iHeart Podcasts. The show is produced by Western Sound. Our
Speaker 3: producer is Sabrina Fang. The show is edited by Savannah Wright.
Speaker 3: Our associate producer is Sarah Dilley. Alex mckinnis is our engineer,
Speaker 3: and Ben Adair is the executive producer.
Speaker 2: Executive producers at iHeart Podcasts are Katrina Norvell and Nikki Etour.
Speaker 2: We got support from LinkedIn's Jesse Hemple, Sarah Storm and
Speaker 2: Ayana Angel. Maya Pope Chappelle is director of Content, Dave
Speaker 2: Pond is head of News Production, Courtney Coop is Head
Speaker 2: of Original Programming, and Dan Roth is the editor in
Speaker 2: chief of LinkedIn