Speaker 1: Of course, Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This
Speaker 1: classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. Without
Speaker 1: no doubt, this gentleman that would bring into the table
Speaker 1: is responsible for some of the best music you've ever danced,
Speaker 1: ever listened to. Of Course, these talented family, the Silver's family,
Speaker 1: have been in our lives for so long. They're amazing harmonies.
Speaker 1: Of course, him branching out on his own to do
Speaker 1: production for like The Whispers, Shallamar, Lakeside, Evelin, Champion King,
Speaker 1: so many, so many groups, so many groups, just this
Speaker 1: classic sound of boogie, you know, kind of hosting disco,
Speaker 1: and we call it book. He's one of the greatest
Speaker 1: and so so so happy that he took time out
Speaker 1: to come speak to us. This is Leon Silvers, the third.
Speaker 1: This is from January thirty first, twenty eighteen lest classic.
Speaker 1: Here we Go.
Speaker 2: Supremo something So Supremo. Role called Supremo Sun Sun Supremo.
Speaker 2: Role Call, Supremo Son Son Supremo, Roll Call, Supremo Son
Speaker 2: Son Supremo roll Call.
Speaker 1: I got nothing, Yeah, no, really, I got nothing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm sober whelmed by grands. I have nothing.
Speaker 2: Sprema So Supremo roll call Suprema Son Son Suppremo Ro.
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, Yeah, let's see how I sound. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Now do I sound better?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: The second time.
Speaker 2: Fund Sun Supremo role called Supremo Sun Son Supremo role
Speaker 2: call my.
Speaker 1: Name is Fante. Yeah, call me your friend. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: it's not too Yeah. Only one can win.
Speaker 2: Supremo Road Suprema So Supremo Road Suprema.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: The show to be on. Yeah, let's put some tea on.
Speaker 1: Yeah and talk to missus Silver.
Speaker 5: Supremo, Son Son sup Roll Mulesman struggling. Yeah, to write
Speaker 5: these rhymes. Yeah, almost called a ghost writer. Yeah, on
Speaker 5: the hotline.
Speaker 2: Son Son Supremo Roll Call Supremo.
Speaker 3: Roll it's my em Yeah. And I ain't feeling bad yeah,
Speaker 3: Leon Silvers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, got me think about DC Cab.
Speaker 2: So Supreme Road Supremo.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah.
Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1: So frame.
Speaker 2: Up frame, Roll up up up frame.
Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen. That was the greatest contribution ever, ever
Speaker 1: ever to to.
Speaker 6: Wow.
Speaker 5: Okay, dude, I'm sweating over here.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry.
Speaker 3: I'm nervous.
Speaker 1: You know, I know we're nervous about this episode because
Speaker 1: we didn't mock like you normally. We mocked like you
Speaker 1: is intro and we we you caught a break this
Speaker 1: time because you came through with the DC that was
Speaker 1: he went real deeper that that. Okay, look, I'm just
Speaker 1: putting it out there. We're just gonna go all over
Speaker 1: the place because the reason why I feel as though
Speaker 1: we commit to the show. Yes, you know, we're about
Speaker 1: the whatever, the teaching of excellence and bringing people and
Speaker 1: exposing him to the audience, you know, to audience that
Speaker 1: might not know him, stuff like that. But just sometimes
Speaker 1: you just want to nerd out on your favorite and
Speaker 1: I there's so much. There's not enough that I can
Speaker 1: say about the gentleman that we have with us right now.
Speaker 1: I can say that, you know, he is. I mean,
Speaker 1: he's such a genius in every area that he's ever
Speaker 1: done in crafting harmonies and his musicianship and his songwriting.
Speaker 1: I mean he damned near it invented a genre of music.
Speaker 1: He killed disco. He literally killed this of all the
Speaker 1: like he invented genres, and he inspired some of our
Speaker 1: greatest I told Jimmy Jam that he was coming on
Speaker 1: our show, and even Jimmy Jam had to bow down
Speaker 1: because of all that he learned from this man. I'm
Speaker 1: about to start crying right now. Ladies and gentlemen, please
Speaker 1: welcome to the show, Leon Silvers. Yes, man, you don't
Speaker 1: know how happy we are right now, Like we're just
Speaker 1: shout out to dang funk shout the day funk. Yeah.
Speaker 1: We have so many questions about your life, Like I've
Speaker 1: never idolized someone so much that I really don't know
Speaker 1: that much about because you rarely did interviews and things
Speaker 1: like that that matter. But let's just should we rapid fire?
Speaker 1: Do we?
Speaker 6: Just we?
Speaker 1: I want to go, Let's go through the journey. Okay,
Speaker 1: now I'm gonna say it. Let's start at the beginning.
Speaker 1: You all got to be proud of me. I haven't
Speaker 1: said that in a while, but this time. Okay. So uh,
Speaker 1: I believe your entire family is from Tennessee. Correct, Uh,
Speaker 1: please be wrong?
Speaker 3: Suck everybody except me Fastergian Pat.
Speaker 1: Where were you born?
Speaker 3: I was born in South Ben, Indiana. Oh yes, My
Speaker 3: father was going to college out there and my mother
Speaker 3: and I was born on the campus and only stayed
Speaker 3: there three days after I was born, So I know
Speaker 3: nothing about South Ben, Indiana.
Speaker 6: I was.
Speaker 1: I was born there for three days. I was there
Speaker 1: for three years. Wait, you born in South ben Memorial Hospital. Wow,
Speaker 1: that's amazing, That's that's crazy. Yeah, So just I just
Speaker 1: want to know it all, like talk about the beginnings
Speaker 1: in Tennessee and how music entered into the household.
Speaker 3: Well about Tennessee, I can't remember too much except Roy Rogers,
Speaker 3: so I was too. After about two years, we hit
Speaker 3: the train and came to LA. I think I was
Speaker 3: two or three years old, and La is where everything
Speaker 3: started the Motown sound for me.
Speaker 1: Why did you guys move to Los Angeles?
Speaker 3: I think my father got a gig at what is it, uh,
Speaker 3: some kind of space company something. He was doing some
Speaker 3: kind of work I couldn't remember, but he his work
Speaker 3: brought us out there. And everybody wasn't born yet. It
Speaker 3: was just myself, Charmaine.
Speaker 1: Charmaine Charmaine is the eldest sister and you're the eldest brother.
Speaker 3: No, Olympia is the oldest of the family. Olympia and
Speaker 3: then myself, Charmaine and James Jonathan. Uh, that was who
Speaker 3: was only four of us when we went to LA
Speaker 3: and it started with me was the Motown sound. I
Speaker 3: was into James Jamison on bass period and Benny Benjamin
Speaker 3: the drums. Uh, And that was my start in music.
Speaker 3: I was taking hangers acting like high hats. I took
Speaker 3: the drum, the little broom the sweeping part, used that
Speaker 3: as a rim and snare, and the box spring I
Speaker 3: used as a kick drum. And that's how I started
Speaker 3: music right there.
Speaker 1: You know, that's where most people would take the broom
Speaker 1: and make that to a guitar. You thought to make that?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Was were there any adults that were musicians that were
Speaker 1: influential in your life at that point.
Speaker 3: Where no, I'm just Jamison and Benny Benjamin. I didn't
Speaker 3: know nobody yet. That was only about six or seven
Speaker 3: there at seven.
Speaker 1: What was it about that music that called you the bass?
Speaker 3: I got a guitar when I was like, we did
Speaker 3: we just did four part harmony because I was teaching
Speaker 3: everybody this lower Scudder's commercial back in the day. And
Speaker 3: my brother was three years old, but he held four
Speaker 3: part harmony. So we was doing this Lower Scudder's commercial,
Speaker 3: and my father heard us and started teaching us some
Speaker 3: four freshman type harmony back in the day at high
Speaker 3: lows and all that, and so we did it real easy,
Speaker 3: and he got a manager and they put us on
Speaker 3: we were called the Little Angel, right, and they put us
Speaker 3: on Spike Jones arc Link letters show all these names
Speaker 3: from back in the day. And that's where my brother,
Speaker 3: he was three when we did our first TV show,
Speaker 3: and he held he gave everybody our parts when we
Speaker 3: forgot him, so he As far as harmony is concerned.
Speaker 1: How did you guys even know how to notate harmony?
Speaker 1: Because well, one thing I think our audience should know
Speaker 1: is I feel like the the one distinction that separated
Speaker 1: you guys from any of your contemporaries Jackson Stair Steps,
Speaker 1: whoever was young at that time, was you guys had
Speaker 1: the most unusual harmony structures ever? Was that from not knowing?
Speaker 1: Like who taught you those dissonant and chromatic harmonies that
Speaker 1: weren't average?
Speaker 3: And I think, well, my father was into the four
Speaker 3: Freshmen and the high lows and all that. So he
Speaker 3: he saw us doing three part harmony and one lead
Speaker 3: on this Laura scuddis commercial and I gave him their parts,
Speaker 3: but it was, you know, simple stuff like you know,
Speaker 3: and he saw we can hold a note, not get off,
Speaker 3: So he started giving us harder songs, songs like It's
Speaker 3: a Blue World and well, I forgot the name of
Speaker 3: those songs, but uh it was four and five part harmony,
Speaker 3: and we stayed on it and didn't get off. I
Speaker 3: don't know why. My mother could have been an opera singer.
Speaker 3: She was studying for a minute, So I guess that's
Speaker 3: why we uh we just felt we can do it,
Speaker 3: and we just did it. You know. It wasn't no
Speaker 3: why or whatever. We just did it, stayed on the notes.
Speaker 3: And I actually was the worst holding the note. Yeah, James,
Speaker 3: this was the best, and then it was Charmaine, then Olympia.
Speaker 3: Than me, I was last. I always forget my note,
Speaker 3: you know. But James had the ear for holding the notes,
Speaker 3: and he was the youngest.
Speaker 1: What year was this this was?
Speaker 3: I was like I was like seven six, but.
Speaker 1: I mean, like in what year was it?
Speaker 3: Like probably sixty fifty nine or something like. I was
Speaker 3: born in fifty three, so okay, around fifty nine or
Speaker 3: something like that or sixty.
Speaker 1: So there wasn't even a template out at the time
Speaker 1: to or besides maybe Frankie Lymon and the teenagers, which
Speaker 1: is more like fifty seven to fifty, but there were
Speaker 1: no kids groups or that sort.
Speaker 3: Of thing to no, just Frankie Lyman, what's your name?
Speaker 3: Sound kind of like a kid little Anthony back then imperiods.
Speaker 3: I listened to him for a minute.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so were you guys instantly in pursuit of the
Speaker 1: next level? Was just to find a record deal? Or
Speaker 1: was it just like we did this television show and
Speaker 1: that's it.
Speaker 3: Well, back then we didn't have no leads. It was
Speaker 3: off harmony, so we would just stand there and sing,
Speaker 3: no personality, no charisma or nothing, just singing holding the notes.
Speaker 3: And we were so young that I guess the crowd
Speaker 3: thought it was amazing that we were singing that kind
Speaker 3: of stuff, But we was just ready to get off
Speaker 3: the stage and go play kind of thing. But I
Speaker 3: loved music. I was the one teaching them and actually
Speaker 3: sometime making.
Speaker 1: Them saying but.
Speaker 3: I got into the motown thing, and then from there
Speaker 3: we didn't get into seriously making moves to record companies
Speaker 3: till I was around I guess thirteen or fourteen or fifteen,
Speaker 3: something like that, because that's when when the Jacksons came out.
Speaker 3: That's when I got serious and I started teaching that
Speaker 3: when my brother, because he had the most powerful voice
Speaker 3: and I was he said, I can't say. I said, well,
Speaker 3: just nothing again, you won't do nothing unless you practice it.
Speaker 3: He had the tone. So I work with him every
Speaker 3: day and practice till after a year or so he
Speaker 3: was riffing and all that.
Speaker 1: You know, So all your brothers and sisters are literally
Speaker 1: coming out the wound one by one during this period.
Speaker 1: You're just waiting for them to get of age.
Speaker 3: And like everybody, there was nobody that came in my
Speaker 3: family that couldn't hold a harmony. They could do that
Speaker 3: before they could do a lead. We had to practice
Speaker 3: our leads.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 3: So as far as when they give them apart, they'd
Speaker 3: hold it and we sing to somebody else's part, they
Speaker 3: would keep it and never blend into the other person's
Speaker 3: part or anything like that. We all had that, I guess.
Speaker 3: But the leads we had to work on, and worked
Speaker 3: him and Foster. But Edmund worked the hardest. Uh and
Speaker 3: his tone reaped the benefits because I worked at it
Speaker 3: at home. And then when we got with Freddie Perrin, uh,
Speaker 3: he heard Edmans's voice right off the bat.
Speaker 1: So, but that was the one in the Capitol years.
Speaker 3: I'm jumping too fast, go ahead.
Speaker 1: So what label was pride associated with? MGM.
Speaker 3: Yeah, a friend of Mike Curb, which was Mike Wiener Curb.
Speaker 3: Mike Curb was running MGM when we were signed, and
Speaker 3: he was only twenty four years old.
Speaker 1: Wait, so the Mike Curb congregation.
Speaker 3: That's one of my favorite breakdingwsime exactly, the coming down. Yeah,
Speaker 3: oh my god. Yeah, he was cool. He was the
Speaker 3: one that really hit me with the commercial thing because
Speaker 3: I was doing I was really kind of into back
Speaker 3: then that social conscious type writing, the you know, because
Speaker 3: the Black Panthers was out and all that stuff, so
Speaker 3: socially conscious music was kind of in, and I was
Speaker 3: into that from a third grip from this history teacher,
Speaker 3: Mr Simon. But he was the one who told me, well, Leon,
Speaker 3: your music has to be more commercial, you know. And
Speaker 3: I was on that tip, like, well, what do you know?
Speaker 3: You only do pop music, you know, you know, because
Speaker 3: we knew how more. I mean, MGM was as far
Speaker 3: as motown was. And he's like, you're right, but even
Speaker 3: if I do pop music, it has to be commercial.
Speaker 3: You're doing R and B, it's got to be as commercial.
Speaker 3: And I didn't want to hear that, but I did,
Speaker 3: and I started changing after I had that meeting because
Speaker 3: he wanted to give He made up pride after that.
Speaker 3: It's all. He told us to do this song called
Speaker 3: what It Takes, an old Barry Gordy song, and he
Speaker 3: wanted us to do it, and we did it, and
Speaker 3: it you know, it wasn't nothing. You know, it didn't
Speaker 3: do nothing. And this meeting with me, I didn't know
Speaker 3: it at the time, was to get inside whoever was
Speaker 3: the head of leader of the group type of thing.
Speaker 3: And I was more like trying to tell him, we
Speaker 3: know what we're do and just let us do it,
Speaker 3: because I realized they put us on the shelf for
Speaker 3: the Osmonds because they didn't right, Yeah, but we didn't
Speaker 3: know that when we signed and they didn't tell, you know,
Speaker 3: we just we didn't have no records out for a year.
Speaker 3: We didn't even go in the studio for a long
Speaker 3: time after the Osmonds was out. But you know, I
Speaker 3: understand the marketing thing, you know, uh, they didn't want
Speaker 3: no other competition out there, and we were a family
Speaker 3: group that could sing harmony and all that, so they
Speaker 3: signed us.
Speaker 1: Well, then I gotta ask then if because I know
Speaker 1: with one bad Apple not At one point did MGM say, hmm,
Speaker 1: this sounds close like ABC. All right, Silvers, here you go,
Speaker 1: like this should be for you instead of the Osmonds.
Speaker 3: Or no, the Odumans were signed already and they were
Speaker 3: specially targeted to be the off the other side, a
Speaker 3: white group family group and a black family group. That
Speaker 3: was I understand the marketing after, but we didn't know
Speaker 3: that was the case till, like, you know, years later,
Speaker 3: And I didn't believe it even after people was telling
Speaker 3: me because I wasn't caring about that, you know, as
Speaker 3: long as we can come out, that was my thing.
Speaker 3: So their whole thing was done, and all of a
Speaker 3: sudden we heard them out and he was on MGM.
Speaker 3: Nothing was told or anything, and it just came out,
Speaker 3: you know, And I actually liked the record. I thought
Speaker 3: it was you know. But Mike Curb was cool because
Speaker 3: he made up pride and well he got his friend
Speaker 3: Michael Veener to uh credible bar because incredible bargle man.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah yeah, and that was a funny story too.
Speaker 3: But he they were schoolmates, Curb and Mike Veener, and
Speaker 3: he always wanted to get into the record business and
Speaker 3: Mike Curb gave him that shot and gave us put
Speaker 3: us on another label because MGM was more pop than anything.
Speaker 3: They never had no R and B groups on MGM,
Speaker 3: so Pride was the label that he put us on.
Speaker 3: Got a well KEG. Johnson got a black promoter and
Speaker 3: Mike Veener was the head of Pride and we hit
Speaker 3: with Fool's Paradise our first record. Well there was R
Speaker 3: and B hit, you know, I didn't get no pop play,
Speaker 3: but uh, that was that. And when we started practicing,
Speaker 3: we went on the road and things were happening quick
Speaker 3: because we had the big naturals and people automatically oh
Speaker 3: another Jackson's and we had the bigger naturals. So can you.
Speaker 1: Clear how those your actual naturals home?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, I had to know it for his weeks
Speaker 1: or not because they were so perfect. The Silvers Afros
Speaker 1: for me, the real standard of the Afro, not the
Speaker 1: Jackson five like that. You know.
Speaker 3: Well, we we had a concept. I thought, if you
Speaker 3: would we would go to bed instead of with the
Speaker 3: natural flattening it up, we would brush our hair up
Speaker 3: and take rubber bands and have a unicorn going up
Speaker 3: and to sleep like that. And we took the rubber
Speaker 3: bands off, it would just lay out like that.
Speaker 1: Wow, so that was our natural secrets revealed. You think,
Speaker 1: I ain't gonna do this, only braid my hair so
Speaker 1: can have that effect. I was like, damn, I could
Speaker 1: just unicorm shit, you're fired, thank you? Oh man? So
Speaker 1: h knowing or you know, I don't. I don't know
Speaker 1: how big of a presence the Jackson Five were in
Speaker 1: you guys's life as far as like that's the goal
Speaker 1: or if it was some sort of eclips it was.
Speaker 3: It was big.
Speaker 1: Oh sorry, no, well I'm asking like, was there a
Speaker 1: thing like well until we reached the status of the
Speaker 1: Jackson Five, like we haven't made it yet or that
Speaker 1: sort of thing, And at least with the Pride Records.
Speaker 3: It wasn't openly said because we were kind of controlling
Speaker 3: our We were writing our songs, we were doing our
Speaker 3: own harmony. We didn't have a corporation like guys that
Speaker 3: knew what they were doing, you know too, So we
Speaker 3: learned everything. So it was like a great feeling each
Speaker 3: level of it. So we wasn't even thinking. We was
Speaker 3: just happy to be in it really and doing our
Speaker 3: own music.
Speaker 7: So those prior records, was that you in the studio
Speaker 7: like just pretty much doing everything.
Speaker 1: How much was that and how much?
Speaker 3: But Jerry Butler had three guys, well two Keg Johnson
Speaker 3: and Jerry Peters working with his company, and he sent
Speaker 3: them first to meet us. And he met us at
Speaker 3: the six Flags Magic Mountain doing a show, and backstage
Speaker 3: after the show he brought his records. I guess that
Speaker 3: he wanted well that he did want us to hear
Speaker 3: from Jerry Butler, telling him to let him hear this.
Speaker 3: And I had my base ready in an amp and
Speaker 3: we were all sitting in a line, well in a circle,
Speaker 3: half circle, and we knew he was coming, so we
Speaker 3: was prepared to play our songs. And he said, I
Speaker 3: heard you all right, Keg did, and we looked at
Speaker 3: each other and said yeah yeah, And he said, okay,
Speaker 3: let me hear something. So we started playing Fool's Paradise
Speaker 3: at the record first record and I start off with
Speaker 3: the bass and and then Charmain started singing, and we
Speaker 3: all you know, and Keg just walked over to the
Speaker 3: trash can and then okay, that's one, let me hear
Speaker 3: another one, and through through the records in the trash
Speaker 3: in front of us. You know, we liked that we
Speaker 3: was teenagers. We was like we looked at each other. Yeah,
Speaker 3: so that was great. We clicked right off the bat,
Speaker 3: you know when he did that.
Speaker 1: You know so well, even though buying these records and
Speaker 1: seeing the production and stuff, I knew that you wrote
Speaker 1: the songs, but yeah, I was trying to figure out,
Speaker 1: like how much production control you had these songs.
Speaker 3: I didn't. I was learning then. I didn't want to produce.
Speaker 3: I didn't even play on it, and I didn't want to.
Speaker 3: He asked me did Keg was the producer, but it
Speaker 3: was supposed to be. It was Keg and Jerry Peters
Speaker 3: that were the producers. Jerry Butler wasn't going to produce,
Speaker 3: but it was his company that was hired and some
Speaker 3: things went down. But Keg was the producer, and he
Speaker 3: asked me, did I want to play on it? Because
Speaker 3: he liked everything he heard and he was worried. He
Speaker 3: wasn't going to tell Jerry. Now I didn't notice at
Speaker 3: the time, but he was. He wasn't going to tell
Speaker 3: Jerry till later. Oh wo, because Jerry was busy still,
Speaker 3: he was still hot with his career. He was on
Speaker 3: tour and all that stuff. So, uh, we was actually
Speaker 3: in the studio cutting this stuff. Before Jerry even knew
Speaker 3: that we didn't do his record. But I didn't know this.
Speaker 3: I just heard it from a phone conversation with my mother,
Speaker 3: Mike Wiener, and Keg because Keg was with Jerry and
Speaker 3: they were about to get rid of him. Because Jerry
Speaker 3: came in and came down, and I remember I had
Speaker 3: to go in the studio and he was telling me, now,
Speaker 3: this is what I wanted y'all to do, and he
Speaker 3: played a way worse bubblegum record than one Bad Apple,
Speaker 3: and I like that, this was horrible. It was bubble gum.
Speaker 3: So I was like, you know, I was from the
Speaker 3: Nickason Garden and Watts, so yeah, I wasn't even trying
Speaker 3: to hear it. But I liked Jerry Butler, so I said, well, yeah,
Speaker 3: we're not doing that, That's all I said. I didn't
Speaker 3: want to say nothing else because I liked him. I just,
Speaker 3: you know, let me cut to the chase and I
Speaker 3: play around. We ain't doing it, and he said, oh
Speaker 3: why not. Yeah, it's too bubblegum, That's all I said.
Speaker 3: And he said, oh, okay, you sure, that's all he said,
Speaker 3: and I said yeah, and he let it go. He
Speaker 3: just made sure everything went through his company KEG, and
Speaker 3: then was gonna get fired. But I liked the way
Speaker 3: he handled itself with us when he threw the records
Speaker 3: in the trash, so I stood up for him. I
Speaker 3: told him, Oh, if you get rid of KEG, we
Speaker 3: ain't doing nothing. I didn't know what I was I was,
Speaker 3: but I meant what I said. I was only about
Speaker 3: what eighteen No, I was seventeen or something. But I
Speaker 3: was the one that everybody was listening to, and they
Speaker 3: like KEG, and we were doing our own things. So
Speaker 3: I just told Mike Wiener, Hey, if you get rid
Speaker 3: of KEG, we ain't doing nothing. We'll go somewhere else.
Speaker 7: Before y'all got into the studio, how were you writing
Speaker 7: your songs like fools preadicce writing them on base at home?
Speaker 3: This bass? Oh, I would use the base excuse me
Speaker 3: as a harmonic to the melody that I would sing.
Speaker 3: Oh ways, I wouldn't do it as a you know
Speaker 3: a lot of people stay on E for the funk
Speaker 3: type thing. I would use it as a keyboard. I
Speaker 3: would always play the bass of harmonic to my melody
Speaker 3: and then the chords would you could you could hear
Speaker 3: different ones you know as you listening to the melody
Speaker 3: and the bass.
Speaker 1: So are a majority of the songs that you write.
Speaker 1: Do you write it on bass? Verse before you never
Speaker 1: on piano?
Speaker 3: Never on Okay, now I do because you know you
Speaker 3: got a studio in your hand. Now you know you
Speaker 3: could do anything really, But back then, if I did
Speaker 3: a melody, I immediately went to the bass and did
Speaker 3: the harmonic bass line because that was like my keyboard.
Speaker 1: So for for those first four three or four initial
Speaker 1: Silvers albums that didn't catch you on the way that
Speaker 1: showcase quitte on and once you guys went to Capitol,
Speaker 1: But was it at all shocking to you that those
Speaker 1: records would be discovered in a new light in the
Speaker 1: era of rare groove culture and hip hop sampling, Like
Speaker 1: because even though in your mind you might think like,
Speaker 1: oh well, okay, those first few records weren't hitting like
Speaker 1: you know, our Capital years, But for a lot of us, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the holy grail. Oh my god. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: the first album alone with with uh wish I could
Speaker 1: talk to you. I'll never be ashamed, Like there's least
Speaker 1: like in my eyes, like that first Silver Records has
Speaker 1: at least six six or seven gems on it that
Speaker 1: we see in the light of sampling and how it's
Speaker 1: so was it at all shocking to you that, like
Speaker 1: some thirty five years later, forty years later, that suddenly
Speaker 1: like even in my DJ said like I'll play only
Speaker 1: one can win, as so that is all?
Speaker 3: Well? Actually I felt great. I mean it was like
Speaker 3: an honor for And then I started thinking, how does
Speaker 3: that happen? You know? And then I's the only thing
Speaker 3: I could think of is Wow, it was young people
Speaker 3: that picked that up, and I was young at the
Speaker 3: time when I wrote it. So it's like twenty years
Speaker 3: later that same spirit and you know, musical DNA if
Speaker 3: you will, you know, only the young could hear that,
Speaker 3: because I was like, wow, that must be it. The
Speaker 3: same thing with mister me all those songs that were
Speaker 3: sampled I wrote when I was younger than.
Speaker 7: Eighteen, right, No, that's that's a whole twenty minute conversation
Speaker 7: just on that song.
Speaker 1: Yes, Well what's started man with? Yeah? With mistermeanor like,
Speaker 1: how how did you come with that?
Speaker 6: Uh?
Speaker 3: Wow, I didn't. The base came first.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 3: I was just I was stomping my foot and I
Speaker 3: was just hitting mm hmmmmm. No, I was just doing
Speaker 3: the first one first mm hm oh. And then I
Speaker 3: started repeating those two over and over and I would
Speaker 3: hit my foot kind of hard on the ground like
Speaker 3: a kick. And I had one of them old. It
Speaker 3: was I think it was a Signo cassette player. They
Speaker 3: only made one. It had one big, giant speaker. It
Speaker 3: was a Mono radio cassette player. Man, it had the
Speaker 3: perfect compression for that mic. Because I recorded that baseline
Speaker 3: stomping my feet with that cassette. Man, it was the
Speaker 3: best sound ever. I did everything. I went and bought
Speaker 3: two of those.
Speaker 1: Ye that's what the that's what the iPhone sounds like now,
Speaker 1: and sort of I track a lot of my drums
Speaker 1: up with the iPhone, like on the floor, like thirteen
Speaker 1: feet away from me, and it's the same, perfect man.
Speaker 3: So I just loved that. I kept that cassette till
Speaker 3: it evaporated. You know. It just had that the misdemeanor
Speaker 3: vibe on it. And I just recorded that and then
Speaker 3: said the hook. I don't remember if I had the
Speaker 3: words already, I did, probably did, and I was and
Speaker 3: I knew because I listened to that melody lower octave
Speaker 3: with the base and the same register, and it's wrong.
Speaker 3: It's the most horrible melody with the baseline because it's
Speaker 3: one of them notes that if you do an octave
Speaker 3: high you can get away with it. It sounds cool,
Speaker 3: almost funky, but if you do it in the same
Speaker 3: register like an octave lower, the worst thing to your ear,
Speaker 3: you couldn't. I hated it when I when I heard
Speaker 3: it like that, but uh, I knew what I had
Speaker 3: when I actually did the melody with the bassline, it
Speaker 3: sounded great. I just knew I had something that would
Speaker 3: people would like. I don't know why. It just had
Speaker 3: a feeling y, you know.
Speaker 1: And how old was Foster when he cut that?
Speaker 3: He was around I think ten, uh.
Speaker 1: Turn eleven, like ten years old? Then out were you?
Speaker 1: Were you? Because of the pristine level of musicianship that
Speaker 1: a lot of the Pride era records were under. Were
Speaker 1: you guys always using the same musicians in the studio
Speaker 1: or was it did you have a relationship with these
Speaker 1: musicians or was just like who's here today?
Speaker 3: We met him because we wanted to be at every session.
Speaker 3: So it was mainly Chuck Rainy on bass.
Speaker 1: Or what oh man?
Speaker 3: Those two were the bass players those guys were just
Speaker 3: moonlight Like no, they were the top.
Speaker 1: But well, I'm just saying like, well, like yeah.
Speaker 3: Well, Keig Keg and Jerry Peters they were real good
Speaker 3: producers back then. They did uh, Gray, what's that song
Speaker 3: that friends of Friends of distinct? Yeah, they did that
Speaker 3: and uh you got me go in and and so
Speaker 3: Keig Johnson and Jerry Peters were formidable producers themselves. So
Speaker 3: and Jerry Peters was great keyboardist and arranger. So they
Speaker 3: knew all the top musicians and I'd go to every session.
Speaker 3: David t was main guitar. Uh Felder. They switch up
Speaker 3: on keyboard guys because there was a lot of them,
Speaker 3: but it was always kind of jazz oriented. Guys still alive,
Speaker 3: Yes he is.
Speaker 1: Wait, uh, it's just hit me. Was it one of
Speaker 1: your brothers or or three? Somehow? You guys were actually
Speaker 1: involved in the Jackson five cartoon Edmund.
Speaker 3: He was Marlon's voice.
Speaker 1: Here's a voice of you. You mentioned something, well, a
Speaker 1: lot of us are not California residents, but I have
Speaker 1: family out here. And you said Nickerson Nickerson Gardens, which
Speaker 1: instantly struck fear in my heart. I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: hands up, Yeah, well, a lot of the We're All
Speaker 1: in the Same Gang video was shot there. How yeah,
Speaker 1: how knowing what I know about, you know, LA gang
Speaker 1: culture and that stuff, especially that being the most notorious
Speaker 1: housing projects in l A. How did the eleven of
Speaker 1: you escape that unscathed? Was it just like leave the
Speaker 1: silvers alone, like they're going to make it one day?
Speaker 3: Or well, no, we you know, you had to kind
Speaker 3: of get busy.
Speaker 1: But it's like, Okay, we're going to do soul Tree
Speaker 1: one day and then come back and you got to
Speaker 1: fight your way inside your crib or.
Speaker 3: No, actually we were. We were singing then, we were
Speaker 3: learning and building our our voices then. And I was
Speaker 3: going to verbum Day High School. It was a Catholic
Speaker 3: school in the in the middle of watts and it
Speaker 3: was the Nickerson Garden was around it actually, and I
Speaker 3: went there to play basketball because I got a little
Speaker 3: scholarship there. And we entered a talent show from verbum
Speaker 3: Day and actually before the Brothers Johnson's name was Brothers Johnson.
Speaker 3: They were in that talent show too, wow, and they
Speaker 3: won their place. No, they didn't even go to the
Speaker 3: but you could if you had somebody that did, you
Speaker 3: could be in that talent show and we didn't have
Speaker 3: no band. We were just doing a cappella. So we
Speaker 3: put put about seven or eight chairs and put a
Speaker 3: one leg on the chair and appella. You know. So
Speaker 3: we we got one second place. But there was a
Speaker 3: guy named Wylie Brooks there and he came up to
Speaker 3: us and said, I have a friend at MGM.
Speaker 1: You know that reminds me who arranged your version of yesterday?
Speaker 1: That that all acapella?
Speaker 3: Who did that? I think? I think did we do
Speaker 3: it ourselves? I think we did. I can't remember anybody else.
Speaker 3: Oh no, there wasn't a arranger that helped us. When
Speaker 3: we were doing our show for Las Vegas, George something.
Speaker 3: He helped us out. But then we changed it and.
Speaker 1: So you guys would still do the the a cappella
Speaker 1: beatles yesterday just the way that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we we We did our show at the Rolls
Speaker 3: a couple of months ago and we kept that in
Speaker 3: the show. We put that back in the show.
Speaker 1: That that is like, yeah a lot of people, that's
Speaker 1: the most jaw dropping. Were you professionally taught eventually how
Speaker 1: to notate music or was.
Speaker 3: It just like I don't know how to read it all. Wow,
Speaker 3: dog man, I'm gonna learn though too.
Speaker 1: So even on the base that was just our self taught.
Speaker 1: You talked yourself.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I was. I was into jameson that. That
Speaker 3: was the teacher right there.
Speaker 1: Well from me, can we go to the years capital
Speaker 1: trying to So how did the MG situation? Well, not implode,
Speaker 1: but how did you guys eventually get the attention of
Speaker 1: Capitol records. I don't really remember too much.
Speaker 3: Except that.
Speaker 1: Who's managing the group.
Speaker 3: At when we were on Pride it was a manager
Speaker 3: called Nordy Stein. He would always try to chime in
Speaker 3: and then when we didn't react fast, he would say,
Speaker 3: it's just a thought leon. So we knew Nordy Stein
Speaker 3: like that. But he was cool. He got gigs, and
Speaker 3: I didn't. I liked him. Really.
Speaker 1: How how are you guys able to keep the discipline
Speaker 1: of the group? I mean, because again, it's nine of you,
Speaker 1: and you are going into uncharted territory of stardom, and
Speaker 1: you're in Hollywood and you know obviously I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't know if you're the father figure of the group,
Speaker 1: but I would assume that as the eldest brother you
Speaker 1: had to keep Oh yeah, it was in line, and
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 3: It was I didn't believe in nothing halfway. And I
Speaker 3: was a good disciplinary and I mean Foster he was
Speaker 3: the only one that really showed because he was into
Speaker 3: football like I was into basketball. So he didn't want
Speaker 3: to practice at all when and he would cry and
Speaker 3: try to get out of it, you know that kind
Speaker 3: of stuff. But he eventually came through. But I would
Speaker 3: do like, hey, I ain't getting on stage getting booed ever,
Speaker 3: so y'all, let's let's go practice. And we had the
Speaker 3: Jackson's to look up to as far as steps, professionalism
Speaker 3: and it, but they were they were worked through professionalisms
Speaker 3: and professional people.
Speaker 1: I gotta ask you a question, okay U, because I
Speaker 1: mean I haven't seen you guys on Soul trained billions
Speaker 1: of times and you know all your steps are immaculating
Speaker 1: and all those things. Did you guys ever work with
Speaker 1: Charlie Atkins? Oh?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that was Arlie that that move on Boogie Fever,
Speaker 3: that first move. We we usually would change certain steps
Speaker 3: because some of them guys would get a little too feminine,
Speaker 3: and you know, we from the niggas and guns, so
Speaker 3: we'd be like, okay, don't worry about that we.
Speaker 1: Changed that, but.
Speaker 3: Child, yeah, well sometimes it was you know, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: and we didn't we knew which which one to edit
Speaker 3: out and to put in. But Charlie's step, I said,
Speaker 3: oh no, that ain't going nowhere. You got to keep that,
Speaker 3: you know, just don't fall because it'll be a domino theory.
Speaker 1: Because it's so amazing to see the nine of y'all
Speaker 1: do it. Okay, here's the thing, as as the soul
Speaker 1: trained attict that I am, the first minute of the
Speaker 1: show to me is the most important part of the
Speaker 1: show because it's when sim McCoy's gonna let you know
Speaker 1: who's on the show with guest stars, you know. And
Speaker 1: the thing is when they show the act that's on.
Speaker 1: You know, it's usually just a one and a half
Speaker 1: second or two second action shot. And as a kid
Speaker 1: not knowing who the Silvers were, and it was like
Speaker 1: with guest stars the Silvers and all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: see I just never that was the most magical thing.
Speaker 1: And the thing was its like before the age of
Speaker 1: the VCR and that stuff. I mean, I had to
Speaker 1: suffer for like twenty years just waiting to see the game,
Speaker 1: imagining that thing and begging people like, do you know
Speaker 1: doncran News can't just get the episode. They're finally like
Speaker 1: finding that episode in Japan, like some twenty five years later. Man,
Speaker 1: I wanted the ball like a baby. But yeah, like
Speaker 1: the steps were so maculate and but again it's like
Speaker 1: how it's like one false one false move and it's
Speaker 1: down here like one person went to the left one.
Speaker 3: But like whoa, yeah, but we staggered it because we
Speaker 3: we learned okay, no no straight lines. It's just so
Speaker 3: they'd stagger them, like being if the first one, second,
Speaker 3: one's a little back, third one's up back, that kind
Speaker 3: of thing.
Speaker 1: What would y'all rehearsed at at this time?
Speaker 3: At this point, we had a garage that we turned
Speaker 3: into a little studio because I had a four track studio.
Speaker 3: Uh back then it was kind of big, but it
Speaker 3: was four tracks. So we rehearsed their steps and are
Speaker 3: songs you know, and uh in the garage. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Describe working with Freddy Parrin, who did he produce the
Speaker 1: first Capitol record?
Speaker 3: Yes, Uh, that was that's what I learned production. Why
Speaker 3: not you like I learned well, it's I mean, he
Speaker 3: was he was great. I learned a lot from him,
Speaker 3: but he did kind of take one of our songs. Oh,
Speaker 3: but I mean it was like it's like we got
Speaker 3: through it and we were still cool laughter. Because it
Speaker 3: was a song called Stealing from the Cookie Jar. Wow
Speaker 3: I was the title of it, and the bass line was.
Speaker 4: Boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom
Speaker 4: boom boom boom boom boom.
Speaker 3: I went jazz on it on that third part. Freddy,
Speaker 3: after he played the song and we sung it was
Speaker 3: going off and he said, uh, play that back, and
Speaker 3: that part We remember him playing it back because we thought, oh,
Speaker 3: Freddy likes, he's gonna choose this one type thing. Then
Speaker 3: a couple of weeks later he called us up and Hotline.
Speaker 3: He played Hotline for us and Jenny your song and
Speaker 3: it well, the baseline.
Speaker 4: Was boom boom boom boom doom doo doo doo doo
Speaker 4: doo doo.
Speaker 3: And he went back to But Jonathan and Ricky, my brothers,
Speaker 3: they were like, hey, and and uh with my man
Speaker 3: who wrote it with Freddy, great writer, he said he
Speaker 3: did like this. Yeah, yeah, it's almost like you did.
Speaker 3: Uh that was you know, but I mean we got
Speaker 3: past it because I was thinking, okay, if we the
Speaker 3: record ain't out yet, y'all Ken Lewis, Kenny Saint Louis, Yeah,
Speaker 3: great writer. He I thought it was kind of funny
Speaker 3: because I was happy because Wow, I did something that
Speaker 3: dude liked. But it was like we were minors. Well
Speaker 3: I wasn't, but but Jonathan and them still were, and
Speaker 3: they were the one more active on doing something about it.
Speaker 3: And I said, well, you know what, let's just leave
Speaker 3: it alone because you can't copyright a bassline. I mean,
Speaker 3: either it's arrangement or because I found out, you know,
Speaker 3: and then the record ain't made nothing yet. So if
Speaker 3: we stopped the process Freddie panning him going back off,
Speaker 3: then Capitol Records may drop us. Let's go on and
Speaker 3: let Freddy do his thing. It's not like he took
Speaker 3: our song. It's just a bassline he got an idea
Speaker 3: from because it's not exactly the same. So I convinced
Speaker 3: him to say, oh, okay, you know, because it could
Speaker 3: have been a bad situation because we I was about
Speaker 3: sixteen or seventeen then, so and Freddie was already uh oh,
Speaker 3: you know, but he didn't steal nothing. Really, it was
Speaker 3: just an idea that he took because my song was
Speaker 3: totally different melody wise. So but we know how that
Speaker 3: goes now when your food for thought, you know what
Speaker 3: I'm saying. But I let it go and we had
Speaker 3: a great rapport with Freddy, and I learned a lot
Speaker 3: from him because he would work on one line at
Speaker 3: every point of the song. And one time he's working
Speaker 3: so hard on one record on the hotline, and I
Speaker 3: just thought he was crazy. I was just what the
Speaker 3: what is he thinking? So at the end, I said,
Speaker 3: why did you go over that one so much? And
Speaker 3: he said, well, you know how you hear records sometimes
Speaker 3: and every part you start liking better and better. Sometimes
Speaker 3: it happens like Magic's my and then other times you
Speaker 3: set up your chorus better, you set up your ad
Speaker 3: lib better, and it's like people listening don't know they
Speaker 3: why they like the song better, and you get more
Speaker 3: people and the more you hear it, the more you
Speaker 3: like that part. And I still thought he was crazy.
Speaker 3: I said, oh okay, and then it got me performing it.
Speaker 3: When you you know, when you start performing, you there's
Speaker 3: certain things you know already, so it's like second nature.
Speaker 3: But in a certain part of a song you like better,
Speaker 3: and I said, oh, I like this part, and then
Speaker 3: it hit me that's the So I was like, okay,
Speaker 3: I got to listen to this guy.
Speaker 1: You know, can you tell the day Tripper story?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah that I mean that was kind of
Speaker 3: a hard part of my life. I thought I had
Speaker 3: messed up because this uh reporter for the Times, Hunt
Speaker 3: is his name, he was he was a he put
Speaker 3: he cut up my words and acted like I was
Speaker 3: downing Freddy Parent because I said I had told him, well,
Speaker 3: I don't like the assembly line production attitude, but I
Speaker 3: was talking about other producers. And then I said, but
Speaker 3: Freddy Parent, he listens to my He left that ship
Speaker 3: out and put Leon's tired of the assembly line production attitude,
Speaker 3: and then he put in there Freddy Pearn's name after
Speaker 3: talking about something else. Then he said, I quote and said, well,
Speaker 3: boogiey Fever's cool, but that's for kids. I don't like
Speaker 3: boogie fever like in passing, laughing like, but but it
Speaker 3: was a hit and it did good for us. He
Speaker 3: left that out and put Leon right after the assembly
Speaker 3: line production attitude.
Speaker 1: And I was sounded like a hater that mean man. Sorry, Yeah,
Speaker 1: but also U was that the first time? That was
Speaker 1: that the first time you got to meet James Jamerson,
Speaker 1: Like that's him playing the baseline of Boogie Fever. Correct, No,
Speaker 1: that's not James Jamerson.
Speaker 3: No, it was either Wilton Felder or Truck Rainey.
Speaker 1: Okay, wait, pretty parent, I could have sworn that. No,
Speaker 1: I never met him. I was at every session I think.
Speaker 1: Was I a Bookie?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 1: I was there. No, it wasn't James Jamison. Wow, think
Speaker 1: that's on his UH discography whatever the on the website.
Speaker 3: I may not have been at Bookie Fever's session. I
Speaker 3: was at the vocal thing, so it could have been.
Speaker 3: Could have been that. I may not have been there
Speaker 3: on that one.
Speaker 1: Was on James Jamison's page that well, then damn. I
Speaker 1: thought it was a moment like, hey, I've always left
Speaker 1: your base player. No, have you ever got to meet him?
Speaker 3: I didn't really meet him, and I was mad when
Speaker 3: I you know, because I always wanted to. I'd even
Speaker 3: called a couple of UH session that a person thought
Speaker 3: that he was playing on because he had came out
Speaker 3: to l a excuse me. By the time I got there,
Speaker 3: the session was over, and you know, I was trying
Speaker 3: to just go bump into him and and just say
Speaker 3: because I never told him face to face, he's the
Speaker 3: reason I started bass. I mean, I got a guitar.
Speaker 3: We was doing a show when we was the Little
Speaker 3: Angels at that it was called the Moula Rouge. I
Speaker 3: think back then, I don't know. It was that that
Speaker 3: building that Nickelodeon was in for a while on Sunset.
Speaker 3: They had a Christmas party and it was us and
Speaker 3: Dennis the Mints the original original Yeah, and we were
Speaker 3: backstays throwing a football and then they called us on
Speaker 3: stage and gave us a present. At the end, I
Speaker 3: got a guitar and I took the two high strings
Speaker 3: off because I was so into motown and I used
Speaker 3: it as a bass That's how much I was a
Speaker 3: bass player. I wanted to be a bass player period.
Speaker 1: Wow. So was it New Horizons that you guys like
Speaker 1: decided to take control of the production and like, where
Speaker 1: does on silver is finally stepping and say.
Speaker 3: Oh, yeah, I forgot I got that.
Speaker 1: That was.
Speaker 3: When they were telling me about boogiey Fever and I said,
Speaker 3: I said, and passing, I said, well that that's that's
Speaker 3: I think they got that from the Beatles. Anyway, because
Speaker 3: that's a day tripper. So you can do a little
Speaker 3: bit and cut it off because I think back then
Speaker 3: the copyright was in bars. How much you did the
Speaker 3: exact same thing within a certain amount of bars and
Speaker 3: if you change it before that bar hit straight. Yeah,
Speaker 3: so that's after the stealing from the cookie jar concept.
Speaker 3: We thought, you know boogie well, No, that was after
Speaker 3: so well we we I just assumed that they peeped
Speaker 3: it because I used to peep things. But I would
Speaker 3: never be that blatant with it. I would just into
Speaker 3: a vibe and do my own, you know, of a
Speaker 3: song because there was a lot of motown ones that
Speaker 3: I loved, and you know, I would do my version,
Speaker 3: but not blatantly copy the bass or the chords or
Speaker 3: I didn't want to do that because I like my
Speaker 3: own ideas.
Speaker 1: So it was capital or ATV music, like hey wait
Speaker 1: a minute, or what went on the like did they
Speaker 1: notice at all? Like no, because he changed it before
Speaker 1: the bar before that? Was it totally?
Speaker 7: In your recording sessions, what was your what was your
Speaker 7: approach or your science to tracking the vocals and like
Speaker 7: tracking the harmonies. Would you cut everybody on like one
Speaker 7: mic and y'all sing around it or did you track
Speaker 7: them individually?
Speaker 3: Well, back then we did sometimes the girls on one
Speaker 3: mic and then the guy's on one mic, but it
Speaker 3: was all at the same time. Okay, I think I
Speaker 3: don't remember us separating back then like later on, you know,
Speaker 3: when I was producing then, I did that stacking thing different,
Speaker 3: But back then we were. They just would tell us okay, girls,
Speaker 3: Charmaine back or Oland back, and when we all they
Speaker 3: sung on one mic and then they would separate us
Speaker 3: with lowse and mid and highs. Freddy I mean, yeah,
Speaker 3: Freddy Parron and keg.
Speaker 1: So for the New Horizons record, and that meant a
Speaker 1: lot to me because I was given that eight track
Speaker 1: when I was like six, so I wow. I studied
Speaker 1: it profusely, but uh, I know that it didn't reach
Speaker 1: the level of the Something Special album and showcase. And
Speaker 1: knowing that you guys left Capital after then, is it
Speaker 1: implied that, okay, well, since it was the minist return
Speaker 1: or lower sales for this one, that you guys are
Speaker 1: just off the label or was it because Lark and
Speaker 1: Arnold left the Good Columbia.
Speaker 3: I think probably, Well, usually when the ANR guy leaves
Speaker 3: back then a lot people who the new A and
Speaker 3: I want to bring their own in so and you
Speaker 3: can only have so many artists at the so if
Speaker 3: you don't like the group, everything you know stops right there.
Speaker 3: And our last it makes it easier for him because
Speaker 3: our last green sheet didn't.
Speaker 1: Show too much.
Speaker 3: So and that's you know, I'm assuming that that's what
Speaker 3: it was, and that was Capital. I feel they made
Speaker 3: a mistake though, but that was in learning because we
Speaker 3: cut this song called what's it at the concert or off? Yeah,
Speaker 3: I got cut.
Speaker 1: We cut that way before any.
Speaker 3: Rider came out. It sat on Capital. I even called
Speaker 3: the Capital everybody from all the secretaries to come in
Speaker 3: after the after they were old, you know, they were
Speaker 3: done with their work, and said we went down to
Speaker 3: each office and said come on up. We wanted we
Speaker 3: need a crowd, and everybody came and we had them
Speaker 3: doing O. Then we had them do don't.
Speaker 1: Stop, get off.
Speaker 3: We had that whole crowd thing.
Speaker 1: And so you recorded that way before nineteen seventy eight,
Speaker 1: Well that was the first one. That was the first
Speaker 1: that was on the disco Fever album.
Speaker 3: But no, but I'm saying when we heard like we
Speaker 3: came from Japan and went to straight. I wanted to
Speaker 3: get home because we got tickets for that brothers Johnson
Speaker 3: Brick and Georgia Duke concert Man at the Forum, so
Speaker 3: we wanted to make that and I got We got
Speaker 3: back in town and I just heard everybody going.
Speaker 1: It was the crowd doing it. And I said, what
Speaker 1: what is that? And they said, whoa, that's what they
Speaker 1: do now when they like something. Wow.
Speaker 3: So I said, oh, the crowd likes something already, let's
Speaker 3: put that old record and you know, so that's what
Speaker 3: I did. But and I told Larkin, this is what
Speaker 3: the people are doing. So we we guaranteed certain mind
Speaker 3: of sales. When the public likes something that they done
Speaker 3: created and they hear it back on them, they it's
Speaker 3: a Dundell. Nobody listened. That thing sat for about two years,
Speaker 3: about four or five hits with and ours was the last,
Speaker 3: and it still went number one R and B.
Speaker 1: You know. So, so even though you weren't because I
Speaker 1: know by this time UH you had formed with UH
Speaker 1: or at least took it a day job with Dick Griffy,
Speaker 1: but you were still were you actively producing your your
Speaker 1: family's albums while still no, you weren't a member. You
Speaker 1: weren't a full member of these Castablanca records.
Speaker 3: No, no, no, I was out the group then, So
Speaker 3: how does that?
Speaker 1: How does that work? Because you know, you gotta start
Speaker 1: off as a nine and then like then you were seven,
Speaker 1: and it's like, how how do band members just leaving?
Speaker 1: Like I can't take it anymore?
Speaker 3: And that's no, I was kicked out of the group.
Speaker 6: Wait what Yeah?
Speaker 1: It was it was like, you know, did they blame
Speaker 1: you for New Horizons?
Speaker 3: No, no, I don't. It wasn't that.
Speaker 1: It's just I think everybody was growing there.
Speaker 3: They wanted to do a step. Everybody wanted to do
Speaker 3: their own you know. Well, because I was like, I
Speaker 3: took the approach as as leader when we was okay,
Speaker 3: what everybody got? I always and I took that into production.
Speaker 3: I give everybody a chance to let me see what
Speaker 3: you got, do it. Let's do whether it's some melody
Speaker 3: or ad lib whatever. I just prepared myself to come
Speaker 3: with it if they ain't got nothing that's worth anything.
Speaker 3: So and you have to use tact because I feel
Speaker 3: producers have to be psychologists babysitters.
Speaker 7: At some point the same thing. Last night, he said
Speaker 7: those exact same words about producers. It's babysitting. Psychology is
Speaker 7: counselors exactly.
Speaker 1: So by this point, who do you of your siblings?
Speaker 6: Like, who's.
Speaker 1: Who's are you in conflict with? Is it? Like you know, Angela,
Speaker 1: you you're singing them wrong? Note you sing too flatter.
Speaker 3: There wasn't no one person other than you know, when
Speaker 3: people get tired and they don't even know why, they
Speaker 3: just want something different because I don't. It didn't matter
Speaker 3: what word I said, even when it's okay, let's see
Speaker 3: what and then they come up with something. And then
Speaker 3: if there's silence, you know, someone else comes up with
Speaker 3: an idea, you know, so I would always do it
Speaker 3: what about? And then I'd already have something prepared and
Speaker 3: they was, ooh that's nice. All they took. It was
Speaker 3: two or three of them, you know, so and it
Speaker 3: was a lot of us. So I based everything off that.
Speaker 3: And then if something's not happening, I didn't even have
Speaker 3: to say I don't like that to steer the crowd.
Speaker 3: They would say it, or they would say, well I
Speaker 3: don't know about that, and then you just keep coming
Speaker 3: with it, which is the way it should be anyway,
Speaker 3: the best idea coming forward. But after a while, they
Speaker 3: were growing into what I already was. I was past minor,
Speaker 3: and I was developing my own thing, and everybody wanted
Speaker 3: to do their thing, I guess because and then when
Speaker 3: I had that meeting with them with al Ross, he
Speaker 3: was well, he did said like this, he had a
Speaker 3: contract on us for half and it was nine people
Speaker 3: plus my mother. Oh, and that's true, So that that's
Speaker 3: why I said what I said. But I had a
Speaker 3: meeting to try to and I told everybody, look, you
Speaker 3: guys are miners. He's not gonna want a chance or
Speaker 3: show that contract to nobody, so all we have to
Speaker 3: do is and I told mom just be cool, because
Speaker 3: I was already eighteen then, you know, so you know,
Speaker 3: I knew, you know, we'll just kicked me on off
Speaker 3: the group and we're straight, you know. But I was
Speaker 3: telling them how we we had a meeting and he
Speaker 3: got up. Everything was working until he got up out
Speaker 3: of the seat and said, Leon, I don't know what
Speaker 3: you think you're doing or who you think you're talking to,
Speaker 3: and that kind of thing. And I was like, I
Speaker 3: forgot to tell moms. Look, if he gets up and
Speaker 3: walks and I get up, don't worry I'm not going
Speaker 3: to hit him. I'm going to wait for him to
Speaker 3: hit me. Then it's really on. So I forgot to
Speaker 3: do that with her. So me from Nickerson gun, I
Speaker 3: ain't gonna let no man stand over me while I'm sitting.
Speaker 3: So when he got up and started walking around the table,
Speaker 3: I got up and was smiling. I thought that was enough.
Speaker 3: I said, so what, you're getting up for a while,
Speaker 3: And then I stood up and walked to meet him.
Speaker 3: And that's and when he stopped and sat on the desk,
Speaker 3: that's when Mom said, Okay, that's it. Stop, that's end there,
Speaker 3: and he knew what was up. Then, oh there's the way,
Speaker 3: okay cool. So from then on out, I was the
Speaker 3: bad guy. It didn't Mom was scared too, And that's moms.
Speaker 3: I couldn't get mad at her because I wasn't, you know.
Speaker 3: But I knew we had that meeting, and after that happened,
Speaker 3: he was I knew he was in her ear. And
Speaker 3: that's when I After I was out the group, I
Speaker 3: went hooked up with Dick Griffy.
Speaker 1: Okay, before we get to the Solar years, because I
Speaker 1: know you're bursting, I have one more question. What were
Speaker 1: your feelings on