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Speaker 1: The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely

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Speaker 1: those of the authors and participants and do not necessarily

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Speaker 1: represent those of iHeart Media, Tenderfoot TV, or their employees.

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Speaker 1: This series contains discussions of violence and sexual violence. Listener

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Speaker 1: discretion is advised. Hey, it's been here. Today's a bonus

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Speaker 1: episode before we return to the regular series. So we've

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Speaker 1: been getting some interesting voicemails and questions and there's some

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Speaker 1: stuff we want to investigate and follow up on, and

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Speaker 1: doing this episode gives us a little more time to

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Speaker 1: do that. So anyway, let's get to it. Hey, then,

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Speaker 1: my name is Clarissa. I have been listening to your

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Speaker 1: podcast for the last few days, and it's kind of

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Speaker 1: crazy to me because I listened to a lot of

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Speaker 1: true crime podcasts and this one especially hit home because

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Speaker 1: it's where I live. Um. I live in Burnham, Illinois,

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Speaker 1: which is right between Chicago and Northwest Indiana. I'm right

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Speaker 1: between Hammond and Chicago technically, um and randomly, I also

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Speaker 1: lived in Texas Houston, So I feel super related to

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Speaker 1: this story and I just wanted to know what information

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Speaker 1: you're looking for. So if you have any uh, leaves

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Speaker 1: or anything that I could possibly help look into. Since

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Speaker 1: I live in the area, I would love to be

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Speaker 1: able to help get any information that I can. Hey, Clarissa,

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Speaker 1: thanks for the offer, and we'll definitely keep that in mind.

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Speaker 1: But probably the thing that would help the most of

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Speaker 1: this point is just spreading word about the podcast and

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Speaker 1: just kind of awareness about how you know, Darren Vaughan

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Speaker 1: might be linked to these other cold cases. I'm still

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Speaker 1: very interested in talking to people who knew on at

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Speaker 1: various stages of his life to try to verify some

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Speaker 1: of his stories. And I'm also interested in talking to

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Speaker 1: China or people that knew her um about how it

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Speaker 1: was that she knew that Tira Beatty was dead in

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Speaker 1: an abandoned building, what was going on there? And Clarissa

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Speaker 1: also stay tuned because in an upcoming episode, we are

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Speaker 1: going to discuss a cluster of murders in Chicago and

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Speaker 1: explore whether or not Von might have been connected to it. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Speaking of Chicago, here's another voicemail. This is Pam Zeckman,

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Speaker 1: former CBS reporter who did the story with Tom Hargrove

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Speaker 1: on the possible serial killer in the Chicago area. I

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Speaker 1: just wanted to tell you that I listened to your

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Speaker 1: podcasts and you did a terrific job with it, and

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Speaker 1: I know you have a lot more coming out, and

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Speaker 1: I wanted to just tell you that I thought I

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Speaker 1: was very impressed. Thanks bye. I was really excited to

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Speaker 1: get that voicemail. I wonder if if Hargrove shared the

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Speaker 1: podcast with her for context she was actually involved opped

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Speaker 1: in them rage Tavern staying that I mentioned in episode

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Speaker 1: one where the journalists made the fake bar to expose

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Speaker 1: city corruption. Um and Harger have actually mentioned her to me.

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Speaker 1: Um in one of his interviews that he was thrilled

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Speaker 1: to work with her about that cluster of serial murders

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Speaker 1: in Chicago. So the next message comes from Twitter, so

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Speaker 1: we'll have a text to speech algorithm read that one.

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Speaker 1: What's up, man, love listening to your pods. I'm from

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Speaker 1: Northwest Indiana. Back in the summer oft I met my

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Speaker 1: uncle at eighteen Street Brewery in Gary. My uncle works

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Speaker 1: in downtown Chicago and rides the train to work, and

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Speaker 1: there is a train stopped right by the brewery in Gary.

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Speaker 1: So it had to be around five o'clock or so.

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Speaker 1: There were probably ten to twenty people total at the brewery.

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Speaker 1: It was a Friday night, normally a pretty mixed race crowd.

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Speaker 1: This guy is sitting at the bar stuck out though.

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Speaker 1: A couple of months pass and van S mugshot pops

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Speaker 1: up on the low cool news. Uncle and I immediately

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Speaker 1: text each other and say, wasn't that the guy we've

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Speaker 1: seen at the brewery? He had one to two beers

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Speaker 1: while we were there. He was chatting with the bartender

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Speaker 1: and people at the bar. He left before us. Not

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Speaker 1: a groundbreaking story for you, but maybe you can reach

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Speaker 1: out to the brewery and see if he was a

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Speaker 1: regular or something. Good luck and keep crushing it. So

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Speaker 1: I contacted that brewery. They were saying it was a

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Speaker 1: small operation back in so probably the owner is the

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Speaker 1: one to speak to you. So I've tried to get

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Speaker 1: in contact with him and I'll let you guys know

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Speaker 1: if anything comes from it. Also, a computer pronouncing Vaughan's

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Speaker 1: last name is Van reminded me that that's a question

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Speaker 1: I've gotten a couple of times now. So his name

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Speaker 1: is Darren Vaughan, but a lot of the early news

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Speaker 1: reports pronounced it as Van, so I thought that was

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Speaker 1: his name until months into the project, and a lot

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Speaker 1: of people I interviewed. Also, I thought his name was

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Speaker 1: pronounced van and, but from the interrogation tapes, you know

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Speaker 1: it's clearly Vaughan and and a lot of people close

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Speaker 1: to the case, um, you know know that it's Vaughn.

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Speaker 1: But but even then, sometimes if I was interviewing them

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Speaker 1: early on, I might have said Van and they started

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Speaker 1: saying Van Hi. Then this is how they tuned him

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Speaker 1: from Birmingham, Alabama. I've been listening to Algorithm every week

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Speaker 1: on my directory work, So thanks for the great interial

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Speaker 1: question for you for the upcoming human A. Are you

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Speaker 1: finding it challenging to navigate the language around sex works

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Speaker 1: for the series, especially since Vawn himself uses such dehumanizing

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Speaker 1: language when it comes from the victims. Thanks in advance

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Speaker 1: for answering my question. I've gotten comments from a couple

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Speaker 1: of listeners about my use of the word prostitute on

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Speaker 1: the podcast, basically telling me that there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: stigma associated with that word, um, and that many prostitutes

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Speaker 1: prefer to be called sex workers. I'm going to try

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Speaker 1: to be better about using the term sex worker verse

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Speaker 1: as prostitute, but there are some places where I think

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Speaker 1: is still appropriate to use the term you know, for example,

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Speaker 1: if we're talking about statistics, like you know, what's the

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Speaker 1: percentage of the victims of serial killers who are prostitutes,

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Speaker 1: and you know what's the percentage of victims who are

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Speaker 1: sex workers? Those numbers will be different, and I think

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Speaker 1: we need to be you know, very specific sometimes, right,

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Speaker 1: because sex workers is this bigger, more all encompassing term

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Speaker 1: that includes people like strippers or people involved in pornography,

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Speaker 1: and you know, those people's risks, for example, being victimized

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Speaker 1: in crime, are going to be different than people who

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Speaker 1: are engaging in prostitution. And in fact, you know, even

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Speaker 1: within prostitution there's different levels. Street prostitution is a lot

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Speaker 1: higher risk than being in your own room the way

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Speaker 1: Africa was is actually one of the least risky ways

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Speaker 1: of doing prostitution. But you know, nothing is ever completely

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Speaker 1: risk free. There are also sex workers who do self

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Speaker 1: identify as prostitutes. For example, here's a voicemail from Maxine Dugan. Hey, Hi,

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Speaker 1: it's Maxcine Dugan UM callings from San Francisco, California. I'm

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Speaker 1: with the Erotic Service Providers Union UM. The Erotic Service

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Speaker 1: Providers Union is by and for those who labor erotically

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Speaker 1: to gain you know, their agency through solidarity organizing for occupational,

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Speaker 1: social and economic rights UM and I myself work as

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Speaker 1: a prostitute of thirty plus years, so I find that

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Speaker 1: your show is phenomenal in that the woman who was

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Speaker 1: looking for Africa, her friend is able to tell the

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Speaker 1: police that she knows the phone number of the guys

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Speaker 1: who saw Africa laugh, and she gives it to the

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Speaker 1: police and they're able to get him into custody. That

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Speaker 1: woman's faced inn array of felony charges for facilitating prostitution,

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Speaker 1: you know, which has been recriminalized in recent years as

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Speaker 1: sex trafficking, when really she's just a part of Africa's

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Speaker 1: you know security. You know. I'm glad she was able

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Speaker 1: to do the right thing and tell the police the

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Speaker 1: crucial information to end this particular serial killer's reign of terror.

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Speaker 1: She deserves a metal. Marvin and Tara's story reminds me

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Speaker 1: of Sarah Derrid's story, who goes missing in the Lower

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Speaker 1: East Side of Vancouver, BC in the late ninete Sarah's

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Speaker 1: customer tries to report her missing to the police, but

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Speaker 1: the police had some arbitrary rule that had to be

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Speaker 1: a relative to report the missing person, so the customer

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Speaker 1: context Sarah's sister, Maggie, and Maggie was able to report um,

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Speaker 1: but given Sarah's status as a street based drug using

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Speaker 1: prostitute you know, which are all criminalized activities, the police

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Speaker 1: don't find her until they find her DNA on the

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Speaker 1: property of a now convicted serial killer, Robert Pickton. The

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Speaker 1: podcast also reminds me of the Green River Killer victims,

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Speaker 1: whose boyfriends were often labeled as TIMPs when they tried

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Speaker 1: to report the missing to the police, so the Seattle

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Speaker 1: Police Department dismissed them because the missing people's status as

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Speaker 1: street based prostitutes, and the police also responded with conducting

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Speaker 1: stam operations for certain known prostitution areas you know, which

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Speaker 1: only had the effect of forcing those workers until less

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Speaker 1: populated and not will at areas where they became easier

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Speaker 1: targets for the Green River Killer. I really appreciate that

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Speaker 1: that feedback, Maccine, and thanks for listening. I hope that

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Speaker 1: regardless of how anyone feels about sex work and it's legality,

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Speaker 1: I hope that we can at least all agree that,

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Speaker 1: you know, we need to find some ways to make

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Speaker 1: it as safe as possible. Sex workers need to be

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Speaker 1: able to go to police to report crimes, and when

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Speaker 1: they do report crimes, they need to be taken seriously. Similarly,

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Speaker 1: when a sex worker disappears, police need to to take

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Speaker 1: that seriously as well, and and treat it the way

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Speaker 1: they would treat any other missing person case. We need

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Speaker 1: to demand that from the police, and we need to

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Speaker 1: hold the police accountable. So our next voicemail comes from Lima, Ohio,

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Speaker 1: which is the city in western Ohio where vond moved

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Speaker 1: as a teenager and went to high school. I'm currently

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Speaker 1: listening to your episode where mentioned bomb was dan Lima

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Speaker 1: and graduated in nine. I live outside of Lima. Lima

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Speaker 1: is a really freaking rous town. Um, I don't go

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Speaker 1: to Lima for anything. I know he would have been

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Speaker 1: a juvenile, but I just wondered if he checked any

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Speaker 1: and soul murders at that time that might have fit

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Speaker 1: m oh. I also wondered, um, did he ever come

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Speaker 1: back to Lina to visit his mother. It's a great podcast,

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Speaker 1: thank you. So in the interrogations, Vaughan didn't confess to

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Speaker 1: any murders in Lima. He does mention that during that

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Speaker 1: time he was arrested um. He says he was arrested

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Speaker 1: as a juvenile on a cun running charge. I was

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Speaker 1: going on probation in line as a juven I remember,

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Speaker 1: I all were you there because there was shiploaded guns.

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Speaker 1: I think we was we're shiving like two or three

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Speaker 1: hundred guns of money. I don't know what they gave,

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Speaker 1: but I know they dropped the gun charge because I

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Speaker 1: was the kids. Because they wanted to adults. I think

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Speaker 1: you a tl but he wanted to a dealt so

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Speaker 1: you think you dealt with a t F. I didn't

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Speaker 1: deal with him. I think they deal with other part

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Speaker 1: of the case. They just want to get the kids

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Speaker 1: out of the way. I got you because they wanted

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Speaker 1: the help. They wanted the people that was actually moving

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Speaker 1: in crazy and achievement. Right. What was the name of

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Speaker 1: the game that was doing old game? They hacked They

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Speaker 1: didn't have games. Then. We just had a bunch of

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Speaker 1: trades in his white boys. When I hooked up with

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Speaker 1: they wanted on some of my classmates, bigger brothers and

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Speaker 1: uncles and stuff like that, right, because they've been eyeballing

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Speaker 1: them for a while. I don't know if ant F

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Speaker 1: gun was they one of them, but I know it

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Speaker 1: was a whole, big old mess a valley. Was it

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Speaker 1: in the favorite No, they kept pretty quiet. They rated

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Speaker 1: on two or three houses. We had guns all over

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Speaker 1: the place. I remember that, and I was like, Hey,

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Speaker 1: told him mom, he's a kid. We don't even want him.

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Speaker 1: We got the delts. I know they wanted our guy

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Speaker 1: because our guy had the nations to other guy. You

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Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. Yeah, they're trying to move up

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Speaker 1: because I'm one of my best friends. I never speak

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Speaker 1: to you again, said you brought that trader to us. Really, dude,

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Speaker 1: that broke into it, Like I told you, droking to

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Speaker 1: his stepfather. I've had all the guns, um, he told

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Speaker 1: He told him everybody. Essentially, there's a kid he was

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Speaker 1: friends with. His dad owned a ton of guns, and

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Speaker 1: kid's mom found out, and you know, the the kid

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Speaker 1: ended up getting them all in trouble. That's the only

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Speaker 1: crime he mentions from that time period. But at the

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Speaker 1: same time, just because he didn't confess any murders doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean they didn't happen, especially because he wanted the death penalty. Um.

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Speaker 1: And he said he didn't want to involve other jurisdictions,

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Speaker 1: so he was only going to confess to murders in Indiana.

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Speaker 1: So Von would have been in Lima from around seven

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Speaker 1: to and according to Hargrove's data set, there is one

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Speaker 1: unsolved strangulation from this time period. It's a thirty five

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Speaker 1: year old black woman who was strangled in it's anonymized data,

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Speaker 1: so you don't have a name, you don't have a month.

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Speaker 1: That makes it hard to find articles about it. But

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Speaker 1: I did find the Ohio Attorney General's office lists of

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Speaker 1: unsolved homicides, and I tried to look it up on

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Speaker 1: there and it didn't show up, you know, So I'm

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Speaker 1: not exactly sure what that means. It might mean it

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Speaker 1: was originally entered into the database is unsolved, but it's

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Speaker 1: been solved um sometime later, and that's why it's not

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Speaker 1: on this cold case database that the higher Attorney General keeps.

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Speaker 1: Or it might be that that jurisdiction which isn't actually Lima,

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Speaker 1: but it is Fort Shawnee, um, you know. So it

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Speaker 1: could be something where the Trinee General asked Evere to

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Speaker 1: submit their cold cases. They didn't submit it. Um. So

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Speaker 1: if anyone knows anything about the strangulation of a woman

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Speaker 1: in Fort Shawnee. Um. In, if someone else wants to

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Speaker 1: take up this lou thing and tell me what they find,

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Speaker 1: I'd really appreciate that, alright. So the next message comes

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Speaker 1: from Facebook. It's a message from someone who came across

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Speaker 1: the podcast. They're talking about Vaughan and they say he

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Speaker 1: was a door fiend who used to hang out. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what that means. Door fiend, drug fiend. Um.

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Speaker 1: He was a door fiend who used to hang out

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Speaker 1: in a crack house off Broadway and forty three. Whenever

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Speaker 1: he got high, he tapped into satan. He had a routine.

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Speaker 1: He appeared disoriented so that a crack would leave with him.

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Speaker 1: After he flashed some money and hit the dope, they leave.

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Speaker 1: They were never missed. I told Gary at a recorded

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Speaker 1: council meeting about sanitation that they had a serial killer.

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Speaker 1: He lived off a fifty second. He had been killing women.

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Speaker 1: His partner is a serial killer too. UM. So this

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Speaker 1: person wanted to remain anonymous. I've actually gotten back in

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Speaker 1: touch with her. UM heard her story. It is pretty wild,

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Speaker 1: so look forward to that in one of these upcoming episodes.

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Speaker 1: She encountered Vaughan during this period when he was committing

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Speaker 1: a bunch of these crimes. And some of it seems

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Speaker 1: to also verify UM information I've gotten from other sources.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, alright, here's here's when I've gotten a couple

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Speaker 1: of times I've gotten a couple of people will ask

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Speaker 1: about my accent. I also know the way I talk

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Speaker 1: can sound different when I'm in the interviews versus when

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Speaker 1: I'm narrating. It is harder than you might think to

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Speaker 1: sound natural and keep your voice consistent across the thirty

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Speaker 1: minute episode. And as for the accent, I grew up

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Speaker 1: outside DC in northern Virginia. I did live for a

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Speaker 1: couple of years in Mexico when I was a kid,

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Speaker 1: you know, around the time I was first learning how

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Speaker 1: to speak, So some of my speech patterned might come

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Speaker 1: from that experience as well. Some people have been asking

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Speaker 1: for more nuts and bolts information about the algorithm and

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Speaker 1: how it works. Uh, if you go back to episode two,

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Speaker 1: I think you can get a fuller explanation there. But

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Speaker 1: I think it's maybe just people thinking that the algorithm

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Speaker 1: is more complicated than it is. Um. The first thing

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Speaker 1: it does is it groups together murders based on geography,

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Speaker 1: the victim's gender, and the method of killing. There're been

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Speaker 1: a couple of different versions of the algorithm. I think

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Speaker 1: the original one also factored in the victim's age. UM.

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Speaker 1: Now it's simpler and it just focuses on geography, gender,

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Speaker 1: method of killing. You know, they they've compiled over seven

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Speaker 1: hundred thousand homicides mainly from FBI data UM and you

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Speaker 1: can then kind of divide those up into a hundred

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Speaker 1: thousand different groups, right, and so in each one of

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Speaker 1: these groups, it will be the same place, all the

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Speaker 1: victims will be the same gender, killed in the same way.

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Speaker 1: Now you have these a hundred thousand different groups, and

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Speaker 1: you can rank those by the percentage of murders that

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Speaker 1: were solved, and you can see which clusters have extremely

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Speaker 1: low solution rates, right, so where they haven't made an

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Speaker 1: arrest or or they at least didn't make an arrest

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Speaker 1: at the time that they had entered it into the

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Speaker 1: FBI's Supplemental homicide reports UM, and you can look for

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Speaker 1: clusters that have extremely low solution rates, and you can

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Speaker 1: look at that kind of across the entire time period

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Speaker 1: that they have data for, or you can do this

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Speaker 1: lighting window analysis where you look for a specific time

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Speaker 1: period where that area had, you know, an extremely low

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Speaker 1: solution rate for that particular type of murder. Right. And

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Speaker 1: one of the explanations for why they might have that

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Speaker 1: low solution rate is because there's a serial killer who

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Speaker 1: is active, who is getting away with multiple crimes and

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Speaker 1: making that type of crime harder to solve. So Hargrove

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Speaker 1: believes that these clusters that have very low solution rates,

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Speaker 1: those are more likely to contain victims of serial killers.

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Speaker 1: And that's in part because that's what you see with

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Speaker 1: the Green River killer, and a lot of the other

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Speaker 1: clusters that he looked at early on um seemed to

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Speaker 1: also match that pattern. Um. But this stuff isn't an

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Speaker 1: exact science, right, So just because one of these clusters

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Speaker 1: has a low solution rate doesn't mean that that area

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Speaker 1: necessarily had a serial killer, or that even if they

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Speaker 1: did have a serial killer active in that area during

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Speaker 1: that time period, it doesn't mean that the killer was

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Speaker 1: responsible for all of the murders in that cluster. Right. So, UM, imagine,

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Speaker 1: you know, Vaughan is killing all these people, right, but

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Speaker 1: it's still very possible that someone else could strangle someone.

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Speaker 1: UM in Lake County during that same time period, right,

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Speaker 1: and that murder also doesn't get solved, and the algorithm

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Speaker 1: has no way of separating them, right. So it's not

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Speaker 1: this magic bullet that only identifies murders by serial killers,

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Speaker 1: but but it can kind of flag that they're an

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Speaker 1: unusual number of you know, this certain kind of murder

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Speaker 1: that haven't been solved, and you know, I think it's

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Speaker 1: it's at least telling you that something is going on there. Right, So,

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Speaker 1: even if it's not a serial killer, why aren't these

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Speaker 1: murders being solved? And maybe someone should look into them?

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Speaker 1: And we're doing a deep dive right now into this

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Speaker 1: cluster and Gary, but I imagine that you would find,

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Speaker 1: you know, incredibly interesting stories, which I for one of

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Speaker 1: these clusters you looked into. I've also had some listeners

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Speaker 1: who are hoping that this would be less of a

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Speaker 1: deep dive into Vaughan and you know, this one specific

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Speaker 1: case and more more of a deep dive into the

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Speaker 1: algorithm and how it and other technology could be used

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Speaker 1: to find serial killers in different cities across the country.

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Speaker 1: So I picked this case in particular because I think

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Speaker 1: it's very illustrative of the algorithm's potential. But I am

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Speaker 1: very interested in exploring clusters and other cities, um, you know,

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Speaker 1: especially kind of ongoing clusters where you know there might

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Speaker 1: be someone out there and an active right now, because

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Speaker 1: you know that's that's a place that we could really

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Speaker 1: potentially do some good. And I hope on future seasons

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Speaker 1: of the show we can do just that. You know.

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Speaker 1: An if you're enjoying the show and you're interested in

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Speaker 1: there being more seasons of Algorithm that explore other cities,

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Speaker 1: you know, please tell a friend about the show and

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Speaker 1: leave a review on Apple Podcasts. I know I'm always

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Speaker 1: asking you guys to do that stuff, and you know

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Speaker 1: it can feel like a drop in the bucket, but

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Speaker 1: when it comes to these companies making a decision about

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Speaker 1: whether or not to make another season of the show,

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Speaker 1: h that kind of stuff is really important. Um. And

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Speaker 1: also I'm looking for suggestions of cities that you think

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Speaker 1: should be investigated. So if you have any ideas, you know,

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Speaker 1: if you think there's something weird going on where you live,

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Speaker 1: or you've heard crazy stories about cities that might have

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Speaker 1: active serial killers right now, please let me know and

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Speaker 1: we can see what the algorithm says and look into it.

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Speaker 1: I really do appreciate all of you who listened and

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Speaker 1: left voicemails or reached out on Twitter. UM, if you

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Speaker 1: haven't yet, please do. I'm sure we'll have another episode

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Speaker 1: like this soon. So you can leave a voicemail at

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Speaker 1: eight five zero one zo nine. That's five zero one nine. UM.

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Speaker 1: You can message me on Twitter at b N underscore

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Speaker 1: KU E B R I c H. That's been underscore Keybrick.

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Speaker 1: So we'll be back very soon with some episodes that

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Speaker 1: are looking into some of the cold cases that the

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Speaker 1: Algorithm identified and looking into Vaughan's possible connection to those murders.

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Speaker 1: This episode was written and produced by me ben Key Brick.

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Speaker 1: Algorithm is executive produced by Alex Williams, Donald Albright, and

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Speaker 1: Matt Frederick. Production assistance in mixing by Eric Quintana. The

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Speaker 1: music is by Makeup and Vanity Set in Blue Dot Sessions.

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Speaker 1: Thanks to Christina Dana, Miranda Hawkins, Jamie Albright, Rema l

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Speaker 1: k Ali, Trevor Young, and Josh Thane for their help

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Speaker 1: and notes.