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Speaker 1: Welcome to Inside the Draft, a weekly preview of the

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Speaker 1: upcoming NFL Draft with insiders from around the country. T

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Speaker 1: minus three weeks. Yes, we are three weeks away from

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Speaker 1: the two thousand and twenty three NFL Draft. At the

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Speaker 1: end of April. The Indianapolis Colts currently sit would be

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Speaker 1: fourth overall pick. That's the first of nine picks in

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Speaker 1: this draft class for the Colts at the moment, barring

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Speaker 1: some trades and speculations still swirling regarding the top of

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Speaker 1: the draft of the quarterbacks, of where they're gonna land

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Speaker 1: and who might trade up to grab them, We're gonna

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Speaker 1: break it all down today like we always do. Welcome Inside,

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Speaker 1: our weekly installment of Inside the Draft. I'm Matt Taylor

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Speaker 1: with Casey Valier today and our guest on the phone,

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Speaker 1: one of the biggest draft names in the biz, Matt Miller,

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Speaker 1: is our guests from ESPN ESPN dot Com. Matt, appreciate

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Speaker 1: your time today. I know you're busy. Let's hop right

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Speaker 1: into the quarterbacks. We'll lead off with what do we

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Speaker 1: know about the top draft corps backs now that we

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Speaker 1: didn't know about a month ago at the NFL Combine

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Speaker 1: in Indianapolis. Yeah, I mean, I think most importantly, all

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Speaker 1: the pro days are over. We've seen you know, CJ. Strout,

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Speaker 1: Bryce Young, Anthony Rickson will leave us have their pro day,

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Speaker 1: and I think for teams that they helps answer a

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Speaker 1: lot of questions. You know, there's there's no substitute for

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Speaker 1: evaluating a quarterback in person to be able to see

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Speaker 1: the way they throw the balls. We will see the velocity.

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Speaker 1: All those things matter a lot. So we see it

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Speaker 1: at the combine, obviously see it at the Pro day

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Speaker 1: a little bit of a more controlled setting, and now

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Speaker 1: we'll get to the private workout portion of the pre

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Speaker 1: draft process. So you know, for me as as an analyst,

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Speaker 1: I think the last month is kind of adjusted my

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Speaker 1: rankings a little bit. I still see Alabama's Bryce Young

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Speaker 1: or obviously c J. Strout is the top players, but

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Speaker 1: I think Florida's Anthony Richardson has has definitely gained momentum,

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Speaker 1: and because of Richardson gaining momentum, it's pushed down. Kentucky's

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Speaker 1: will leave us a little bit. But stuff for good

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Speaker 1: quarterbacks in this draft. To myself and really anyone you

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Speaker 1: talked to, believe all four can be starters in the NFL. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you talk about those pro days, Matt who had the

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Speaker 1: most impactful pro day in your opinion, right, the pro

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Speaker 1: day that most helped themselves? I would say Bryce Young

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Speaker 1: just by virtue really of the fact that he didn't

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Speaker 1: throw out the combine and so there wasn't that opportunity.

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Speaker 1: You know, if you guys remember when we left Indianapolis

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Speaker 1: or when when I left, you guys stayed after the

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Speaker 1: cost behind all the talk was about Anthony Richardson, I

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Speaker 1: mean CJ strout to some degree. So I think Bryce

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Speaker 1: show just having that opportunity to go to the Alabama

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Speaker 1: Pro Day workout definitely helps him and maybe not help

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Speaker 1: in terms of, oh, we've got a sliding scale on

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Speaker 1: his stock. Right, You put yourself back into the conversation.

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Speaker 1: You know, you remind people of why you've been the

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Speaker 1: guy for the last two years. You know, why are

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Speaker 1: you you were the Eisland Trophy winner, why you were

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Speaker 1: able to elevate? Really, I mean some of the people

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Speaker 1: don't talk a lot about a very average Alabama team

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Speaker 1: offensively the past year that he was able to elevate.

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Speaker 1: So I think for Bryce, you're putting yourself back into

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Speaker 1: that mix as I belong here and I've been the guy,

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Speaker 1: you know, wire to wire, he's been the top quarterback

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Speaker 1: this year. So I think a little bit of a

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Speaker 1: reminder to INNFL teams of why he is who he

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Speaker 1: is now. For your perspective, as you said, the combine

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Speaker 1: is over, pro days are over, so now it's the

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Speaker 1: private individual workouts in those very important sit downs, those

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Speaker 1: interviews with these guys. From your perspective, how much will

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Speaker 1: all of your information change, because there's probably little that's

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Speaker 1: getting out, how much how does that affect these last

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Speaker 1: couple of weeks heading into the draft? For you, it

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Speaker 1: more so affects a mock draft than it does my rankings.

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Speaker 1: Behind the curtain, my rankings are set. It would take

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Speaker 1: something really unforeseen to change anything at this point. You know,

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Speaker 1: it would take an injury out of workout, which we've

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Speaker 1: seen before it happened, or take something off the field

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Speaker 1: either happening or being disclosed so that we won't see

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Speaker 1: a whole lot of change there, at least for me.

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Speaker 1: But I think from mock drafts, which is, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's what people pay attention to most when folks like

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Speaker 1: myself put out content, that is what will really start

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Speaker 1: to I'll try to hone in. You know, Carolina at

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Speaker 1: one feels like it's a decision between two players. I'll

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Speaker 1: try to hone in there, you know which guy? You know,

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Speaker 1: people whoever I can get to talk in Carolina or

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Speaker 1: people who are close to that situation, and you just

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Speaker 1: kind of go down the list, you know, Okay, what

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Speaker 1: do we what do we think's happening here at one? Okay,

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Speaker 1: well then what is that set up for two? And

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Speaker 1: I think you know, most importantly for you guys, what

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Speaker 1: happens at number four? Now let's stick with that. Let's

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Speaker 1: play a little hypothetical game with Carolina. Let's say they

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Speaker 1: trade it up and c. J. Strouds their guy and

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Speaker 1: then Bryce Young goes there at number two. Do you

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Speaker 1: think it's pretty set whether Arizona stays at three or

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Speaker 1: if you know, let's say the Colts jump up that

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Speaker 1: it's going to be an order of Richardson and will

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Speaker 1: Anderson kind of being in those or does Levis find

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Speaker 1: a way to slide in and go at one, two, three, four? Quarterbacks? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I think it depends on who has the pick. You know,

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Speaker 1: I feel like Arizona if they're smart, and I I

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Speaker 1: think they have a good front office say they're going

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Speaker 1: to hold onto that pick as long as they possibly

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Speaker 1: can because the value is going to be the highest

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Speaker 1: on Thursday night, you know, a Thursday night, about ten

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Speaker 1: minutes into the draft, when you want to trade that

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Speaker 1: pick because you want to you know, you want some

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Speaker 1: momentum to make that happen. So I think you know

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Speaker 1: the cult. Specifically, I would lean more towards Will Levis

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Speaker 1: because he's ready to play right away. I know a

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Speaker 1: lot of people are going to connect Shane stike In

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Speaker 1: in the scheme they ran at Philadelphia when he was

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Speaker 1: out into coordinator. They're gonna look at Anthony Richardson and say, well,

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Speaker 1: you can do the same thing. Absolutely could. I think

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Speaker 1: Anthony needs a little more time to develop some of

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Speaker 1: the mechanics to his game. So I would lean more

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Speaker 1: Will Levis. Now. If it's Seattle or Detroit and they

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Speaker 1: think quarterback, then it's then I would say more Anthony

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Speaker 1: Richardson because they have established starters. Same with the Las

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Speaker 1: Vegas Raiders. You've got starters there, gonna player like Richardson

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Speaker 1: could sit behind and learn from for a year and

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Speaker 1: not even not that he needs to learn the game.

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Speaker 1: I shouldn't shouldn't phrase it like that, He just needs

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Speaker 1: to make sure his mechanics are consistent. It would give

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Speaker 1: him time to seemore football because he started thirteen games

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Speaker 1: at college, and then also have that time to really

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Speaker 1: develop those mechanics to make sure that that's that it sticks.

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Speaker 1: When you get in crunch time and own you're starting

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Speaker 1: to rely on muscle memory. It's Matt Miller. He's an

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Speaker 1: NFL Draft insider for ESPN ESPN dot com. Follow his

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Speaker 1: work on Twitter at NFL Draft Scout is where you

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Speaker 1: can find him and Matt. There's a smattering of Colts

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Speaker 1: fans within the fan base that say, if the Panthers

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Speaker 1: and Texans draft quarterbacks and those players are CJ. Strout

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Speaker 1: and Bryce Young and whatever order for the Colts they want.

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Speaker 1: Some fans want the Colts to draft the best player

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Speaker 1: available four and then draft Hendon Hooker in the second round.

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Speaker 1: I got a two part question for you, what are

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Speaker 1: the odds Hooker is still available in the early part

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Speaker 1: of the second round? And then the second part is, Matt,

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Speaker 1: where would Hooker rank among these quarterbacks if he didn't

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Speaker 1: tear his ACL in November of last year? Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean I think that is definitely it's a strategy that's

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Speaker 1: gonna get floated out there a lot. I don't believe

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Speaker 1: Hindon Hooker will be on the board at number thirty five,

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Speaker 1: but roll now, this time of year, I do feel

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Speaker 1: like there is we have to be aware of. There's

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Speaker 1: a history of looking for that you know, elusive next quarterback.

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Speaker 1: Last year it was Desmond Rittard or Malik Willis. Hey,

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Speaker 1: could they could these guys in the late first round?

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Speaker 1: You know, could they sneak in? You know? Even Jalen

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Speaker 1: Hurts was that guy the year he came out. So

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Speaker 1: I'll say that with you know, a little bit of

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Speaker 1: a grain of salt added in right now, I don't

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Speaker 1: think Hendon Hooker will be there at thirty five. To

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Speaker 1: your second question, I would probably, I mean I would

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Speaker 1: have a first round grade on him if it weren't

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Speaker 1: for the Aclum. I love Hindon Hooker. Um. I would

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Speaker 1: have voted for him for the Heisman. I think he

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Speaker 1: is a fantastic player. To see him go from Virginia

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Speaker 1: Tech to Tennessee and have the best you know, touchdown

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Speaker 1: to intercepts the ratio of any quarterback in this class.

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Speaker 1: He has NFL size, he has an NFL he has

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Speaker 1: the mobility we all want. He does just does not

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Speaker 1: turn the ball over. He's a very clean prospect on

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Speaker 1: and off the field. So I'm a I'm a Hindon

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Speaker 1: Hooker fan, but I think a lot of NFL teams

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Speaker 1: are going to be fans of Hindon as well. And

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Speaker 1: you know, he's gonna come into play. I feel like

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Speaker 1: his talent is so good. He is going to come

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Speaker 1: into play in the late first round, and that might

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Speaker 1: be a trade, a team trade back up. So maybe

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Speaker 1: maybe your strategy is, hey man, we're gonna take Will

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Speaker 1: Anderson at four, and we're gonna find a way back

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Speaker 1: into the late first round so that we can get

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Speaker 1: Hindon Hooker. If that's the plan, I like it. And

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Speaker 1: I've talked this to Hindon's group. They think he's gonna

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Speaker 1: be ready sooner than later. You know, he tore the

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Speaker 1: AHL November nineteenth. Those seem like six month injuries now,

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Speaker 1: which is crazy to me, but that's a different conversation.

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Speaker 1: But you know, if that's a six month injury, you're

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Speaker 1: looking at you know, late may even even June if

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Speaker 1: you're conservative, before he's ready to go, and you know,

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Speaker 1: I mean, we're looking at a guy that could be ready,

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Speaker 1: you know, for training camp and the preseason. So and

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Speaker 1: he's he's a starter to me, he's ready to go

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Speaker 1: right away. He's started two years in the SEC. Like,

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Speaker 1: he's not a guy that has to sit and wait.

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Speaker 1: So it would be it would be very daring to say, hey,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna make We're gonna get back up for this guy.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you you've got to know your board and

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Speaker 1: you've got to know what other teams are doing. But

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Speaker 1: right would it would definitely be exciting. That's Matt Miller

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Speaker 1: again at NFL Draft Scout ESPN NFL Draft Analysts and

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Speaker 1: Insider joins us and speaking of your Twitter account, I

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Speaker 1: love it. Part of your your bio says scout the player,

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Speaker 1: not the helmets, And again I love that line. So

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Speaker 1: with that in mind, Matt, what do you say to

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Speaker 1: the people that say they wouldn't draft CJ. Stroud because

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Speaker 1: Ohio State hasn't churned down a lot of great NFL

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Speaker 1: quarterbacks over the years have produced in the NFL, played

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Speaker 1: at a high level on Sundays because they're on they're

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Speaker 1: on two good of teams, right they're on two good

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Speaker 1: of Ohio State teams with too much talent around them

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Speaker 1: at the college level, What do you say to those

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Speaker 1: people that are that are down on CJ. Stroud just

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Speaker 1: because of the helmet that he wore at the college level,

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Speaker 1: I would say Joe Burrow played on the most talented

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Speaker 1: college offense I've ever seen, and he's doing just fun.

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Speaker 1: I like it kind of simple right when he's like, hey,

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Speaker 1: you know, we've it's good. You know he did. He

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Speaker 1: played with towns and players and they're absolutely they made

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Speaker 1: his job easier at times. But also, you know, there's

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Speaker 1: the argument, did he make their job easier? I'm old.

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Speaker 1: Do you guys remember watching Dan with Fever at Central Michigan? Oh? Yeah, Hey,

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Speaker 1: his quarterback's really good. No, it turns out Antonio Brown

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Speaker 1: was really good. Sometimes time to see how we learned

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Speaker 1: these lessons and you try to stick with that. But

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, sometimes it's the quarterback and the

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Speaker 1: receiver who are pretty great, and time will tell on

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Speaker 1: how much CJ has helped those guys versus how much

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Speaker 1: they've helped him. Now I know, and the conversation. We've

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Speaker 1: talked a lot about quarterbacks in this top ten and

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Speaker 1: then maybe guys like Will Anderson, Jalen Carter, and maybe

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Speaker 1: Tyree Wilson. But there's a handful of guys that are

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Speaker 1: going to go in that top ten. They maybe aren't

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Speaker 1: getting enough pub you know, around leading up to the draft.

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Speaker 1: Who are a couple of those guys that we look

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Speaker 1: on this draft In a couple of years, you're gonna

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Speaker 1: go like, those are some of the best players in

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Speaker 1: this draft that maybe people weren't talking about leading into it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's a great point. I think there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of guys on defense that aren't getting talked about

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Speaker 1: because we are so enamored with the quarterback prospects, and

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Speaker 1: rightfully so. But I would highlight, you know, Devon Witherspoon,

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Speaker 1: the corner from Illinois who has a chance to be

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Speaker 1: a top ten pick. He's just not been talked about,

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Speaker 1: even though he's just, you know, fantastic incovery. He hits

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Speaker 1: like he weighs two hundred and twenty pounds but he's

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Speaker 1: one hundred and eighty pounds. His ability to excuse me

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Speaker 1: lostdown receivers is fantastic. He has proven ball skills, so

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Speaker 1: he's someone I think will instantly make a team better.

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Speaker 1: That is probably not getting a ton of talk about. Also,

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Speaker 1: Illinois is not necessarily a football hot bed, but but

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Speaker 1: he's certainly a really good player. Lucas van Ness from

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Speaker 1: Iowa and it's a really intriguing pass rusher. He wasn't

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Speaker 1: a starter at Iowa because they favor upperclassmen, and but

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Speaker 1: his production is fantastic and his linked his power. Watching

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Speaker 1: him work out at the combine, I could not believe

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Speaker 1: how agile he was and the way he played in space.

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Speaker 1: I mean even doing like he was doing outside linebacker

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Speaker 1: drop zone drops and attacking the ball as a pass

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Speaker 1: coverage drill. Its fantastic. He didn't drop a single pass.

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Speaker 1: So I think Van Nast is one of the hes

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Speaker 1: going to be a top fifteen pick. But he's one

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Speaker 1: of the secrets of this draft right now. Now you

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Speaker 1: mentioned Witherspoon, one of the areas the Colts need to

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Speaker 1: address because they lost to find Gilmour Brandon facing in

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Speaker 1: the offseason, haven't really signed a boy in the cornerback market.

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Speaker 1: Who are some cornerbacks and maybe you know they are

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Speaker 1: going to be taken in the first round, but maybe

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Speaker 1: a Day two pick. The culture keep an eye on.

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Speaker 1: It's such a good deep corner class that I think

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Speaker 1: you have a lot of options there. The DJ Turner

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Speaker 1: from Michigan is one of my favorite guys. He is

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Speaker 1: the best press corner in the draft. He also ran

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Speaker 1: you know, four to eight at the NFL Combine, so

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Speaker 1: he had to elite speed great also short area quickness

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Speaker 1: and burst. I mean, he's just an easy mover. Heeds

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Speaker 1: coast up a little bit coming out at Michigan scheme.

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Speaker 1: He could be a little bit handy at times, but

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Speaker 1: those are the trade that I think you can develop

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Speaker 1: to have, you know, NFL size and four to eight

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Speaker 1: speed and you've just dominated it thought in a scrimmage.

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Speaker 1: Those are the traits I would look for in a corner.

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Speaker 1: That's Matt Miller with us Casey Valley trying to veer

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Speaker 1: us off the topic of quarterbacks. I'm bringing us right

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Speaker 1: back in. I am not steering away from it for

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Speaker 1: too long. So I want to go just for you personally, Matt,

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Speaker 1: You've been doing this a long time. I want to

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Speaker 1: know where does Richardson rank for you on the Enigma

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Speaker 1: scale since you've been covering drafts right never in the

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Speaker 1: Passing League era, has a college quarterback with his mixture

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Speaker 1: of experience and production become a great quarterback in the NFL.

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Speaker 1: At the same time, no quarterback has had his measurables

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Speaker 1: and his athleticism and his talent given the same opportunity there.

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Speaker 1: So where does Richardson rank on? Just hard to pinpoint

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Speaker 1: and project what he is and what he can be. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so my first year professionally covering the draft is twenty ten,

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Speaker 1: So the twenty eleven draft that was Cam Newton. So

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Speaker 1: it reminds me of that situation where you know, Cam

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Speaker 1: had been at Florida, couldn't get on the field because

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Speaker 1: some guy named Tim Tebow. So he leaves, goes Duco,

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Speaker 1: transfers Auburn, and has that one year, played fourteen games,

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Speaker 1: I went through the ball under three hundred times, but

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Speaker 1: was the greatest player in college football that year. So

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Speaker 1: Richardson reminds me of that situation where and Richson didn't

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Speaker 1: have that level of success obviously, but someone who just

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Speaker 1: is so far outside of the mold of everyone else

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Speaker 1: at the position that you have to look twice because

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Speaker 1: of the size. I mean, he's just massive, and the

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Speaker 1: arm strength and the speed, I mean, he's got three

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Speaker 1: runs over eighty yards this year for touchdowns, So all

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Speaker 1: those things makes him stand out a lot. And as

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Speaker 1: you mentioned, you know, there's also the other side on

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Speaker 1: the outlier of being a career fifty four percent completion guy, right,

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Speaker 1: some of that some of that drops absolutely it is

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Speaker 1: you have to factor that in. But some of it's

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Speaker 1: also just bad passing, and you have to factor that into.

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Speaker 1: So I think he is. You know, people make the

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Speaker 1: comparisons to Cam Newton and Josh Allen for a reason

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Speaker 1: because Cam and Josh were both, you know, enigmatic passers

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Speaker 1: that had to improve their game to stick in the NFL.

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Speaker 1: And I think you could throw Lamar Jackson in there

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Speaker 1: as well, guys who just weren't that accurate in college

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Speaker 1: that had to really work to get better and became

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Speaker 1: good pros. And and Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson's case,

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Speaker 1: you know, great pros and Cam had it certainly stretched

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Speaker 1: in the NFL where he was at that level. So

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Speaker 1: Anthony is unique. But also I think there are some

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Speaker 1: guys you can look at and say, Okay, there's a

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Speaker 1: precedent here, and there's a plan for how to make

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Speaker 1: this work. Sticking with the quarterback theme we saw last

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Speaker 1: year mister irrelevant Brock Purty. You know he's playing in

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Speaker 1: the NFC Championship game with the forty nine ers. Is

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Speaker 1: that going to change the way that quarterbacks are drafted?

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Speaker 1: You think in this league with teams going to you

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Speaker 1: know later in the in the in the draft, taking

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Speaker 1: a flyer on a guy because of what you saw

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Speaker 1: in Brock Party, I think so. Um, I do think

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Speaker 1: we'll see a lot of quarterbacks drafted this year, whereas

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Speaker 1: you know, we've kind of seen a trend where you know,

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Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of players weren't getting drafted. Lady,

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Speaker 1: it was like I was just picked the guy up

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Speaker 1: as a UDFA. But I do think because of Party,

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Speaker 1: also because you know, a quarterback player is just it's down,

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Speaker 1: and even you know, we're starting to see guys age out.

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Speaker 1: You know, Tom Brady retires, Aaron Rodgers is you know,

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Speaker 1: probably close to retirement. Um. So I do think we're

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Speaker 1: gonna see a lot of teams you want to make

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Speaker 1: sure you get the guy. And so you know, I

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Speaker 1: came up in an era where people were preaching the

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Speaker 1: ron Wolf philosophy, as you draft a quarterback every year,

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Speaker 1: the worst case scenario is the guy competes for a job,

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Speaker 1: you know, and um, you have to have them. You

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Speaker 1: have to have three the body nine ers taught us

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Speaker 1: that in the playoffs. So I do think, you know,

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Speaker 1: this is a year where it's gonna help guys. It's

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Speaker 1: gonna help the steps of Bennett for the world, It's

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Speaker 1: gonna help the the Jake Hayners from Fresno State. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna help. Uh. You know, those those guys who

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Speaker 1: maybe before would be trade deficients and you're not going

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Speaker 1: to draft them. But then you look at a party

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Speaker 1: who is the definition of trade deficient at quarterback, you

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Speaker 1: right undersize he doesn't have a strong arm, not very

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Speaker 1: it is not, you know, a super athlete. But he's

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Speaker 1: just really accurate and he's really smart and in the

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Speaker 1: right scheme we saw that can have a lot of

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Speaker 1: a lot of production, a lot of success. So I

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Speaker 1: do think Brock is going to get a lot of

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Speaker 1: thank you cards from some of these quarterbacks. So otherwise

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Speaker 1: wouldn't have been drafted. Now, final thing with you, Bernard Ryman.

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Speaker 1: The Colts took in the third round last year, very

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Speaker 1: you know, very new to the left tackle position. What

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Speaker 1: was your great on Bernard Rhyman, And is there an

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Speaker 1: offensive lineman in this year's draft you can kind of

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Speaker 1: put in that similar mold as like a third round

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Speaker 1: guy that can't evolve into a starter. Yeah. I liked

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Speaker 1: Rhyman last year. I mean I did have him as

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Speaker 1: kind of a developmental offensive tackle just because of the

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Speaker 1: learning curve that was going to take place. I thought now,

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Speaker 1: I thought last year he improved down the stretch, which

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Speaker 1: is what we needed to see someone that, Hey, where

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Speaker 1: you're at right now is not where we expect you

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Speaker 1: to be. You know, you're a former tight end. You're

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Speaker 1: basically just an athlete. I actually had a a mid

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Speaker 1: round too great on Bernard coming coming out Central Michigan.

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Speaker 1: So I think he's you know, drafted about where I

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Speaker 1: expected and played as expected this past year. Another guy

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Speaker 1: who would be like him, one YEA Morris from Oklahoma

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Speaker 1: would probably be my pick. Someone who's played left tackle

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Speaker 1: played right tackle. Is a fantastic athlete, but just needs

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Speaker 1: to needs to learn the game a little bit, you know,

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Speaker 1: especially pass production. Chandler's of all from Incy State at guard.

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Speaker 1: Another guy just highly athletic, really good player, just needs

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Speaker 1: more time basically playing the position. But this is a

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Speaker 1: is not a top heavy offensive line class, but it's

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Speaker 1: a good offensive line class where I think you can

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Speaker 1: get guys like that on Day three that have the

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Speaker 1: tools to become starters. There you go, Matt Miller, NFL

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Speaker 1: Draft Analysts and insider for ESPN. Matt, what are you

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Speaker 1: working on? I know that you're your big mock draft

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Speaker 1: is coming out soon? Is that? Is that what you're

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Speaker 1: diving into, diving into the mock draft? But also you

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Speaker 1: know it's still time to study players. A lot of

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Speaker 1: a lot of catch up work right now. I'm making

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Speaker 1: sure that you know, if there's a player I don't

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Speaker 1: have sixty seconds to talking points about, I gotta make

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Speaker 1: sure I have those. So a lot of a lot

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Speaker 1: of tape study trying to get things finalized. Now. Well,

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Speaker 1: there you go, Matt Miller, NFL Draft Analysts and insider

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Speaker 1: for ESPN. Matt, thank you so much for the time.

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Speaker 1: I know those next couple of weeks are a lot

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Speaker 1: of fun, very busy, but definitely a fun time for you.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely appreciate you guys having me on