1 00:00:02,360 --> 00:00:06,680 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:10,560 Speaker 2: Welcome back everyone. Now. AstraZeneca recently became the first British 3 00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:12,879 Speaker 2: company to reach a market value of more than two 4 00:00:12,960 --> 00:00:16,159 Speaker 2: hundred billion dollars or actually two hundred billion pounds, with 5 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 2: a big bed on cancer drugs, helping to drive a 6 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 2: rally in the pharma giant. Now shares lower today after 7 00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:25,760 Speaker 2: a lung cancer drug it's developing with partner showed mixed 8 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 2: results in a late stage trial. Now joining us for 9 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:31,480 Speaker 2: an exclusive conversation on that, but also much more. Ascal Soio, 10 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:35,279 Speaker 2: the chief executive of Astrazenica, Pascal Stolio, as always, thank 11 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 2: you so much for giving us a little bit of 12 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:41,560 Speaker 2: your busy schedule. Now, you published some disappointing results overnight 13 00:00:41,760 --> 00:00:45,440 Speaker 2: in this late stage trial of lung Trunker, which you 14 00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:48,280 Speaker 2: could still develop in the future. But are you worried 15 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:49,720 Speaker 2: that this will affect your numbers? 16 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: Good morning, consent. 17 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 3: It won't affect our numbers because actually, first of about 18 00:00:57,120 --> 00:00:59,320 Speaker 3: the study, I think it's important to remember it was 19 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:04,040 Speaker 3: a second studying, second third line meta studying lund cancer. 20 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:08,960 Speaker 3: That study is actually positive and in the group of 21 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:12,920 Speaker 3: patients where we're looking together, a coward so called non squaremas. 22 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 1: We delivered a two months improvement. 23 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:20,759 Speaker 3: In of all survival versus a very active standard treatment 24 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:23,920 Speaker 3: Taxo teal, which hasn't been betted by bidden by any 25 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:26,640 Speaker 3: other therapy for the last twenty years or so. 26 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:28,040 Speaker 1: So a very strong set. 27 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:31,759 Speaker 3: Of results, not as perfect as we would have liked, 28 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,160 Speaker 3: and of course as a result, people are questioning what 29 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 3: kind of a power we will get. We're always looking 30 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:44,759 Speaker 3: at targeting patients who will benefit the most, delivered better 31 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 3: for his benefits, so we've also been developing an AI 32 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 3: based test that will enable us to treat the patients 33 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 3: who will deliver the most benefit, the so called drop 34 00:01:56,640 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 3: two positive patients. 35 00:01:58,200 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 1: We have a receptor on their. 36 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 3: So with this we believe that we have a way 37 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:06,200 Speaker 3: forward and should really not affect our numbers in a 38 00:02:06,280 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 3: long term. 39 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:11,120 Speaker 2: So you still have this ambition of reaching eighty billion 40 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:14,399 Speaker 2: dollars actually in sales by twenty thirty. Do you think 41 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:17,160 Speaker 2: you'll get approval of some kind of other approval for 42 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:17,720 Speaker 2: this drug. 43 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think we will get an approval. 44 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:22,679 Speaker 3: The question that people are debating is what kind of 45 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:25,639 Speaker 3: approval we get initially. In second line, I think it's 46 00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:28,640 Speaker 3: important to remember that the vast majority of the potential 47 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 3: of this medicine is in the first line metasthetic lung cancer, 48 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:36,120 Speaker 3: which we are developing right now. We have several studies 49 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 3: and we have really good hope and good reason to 50 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:43,440 Speaker 3: believe those studies will be positive. We also have presented 51 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:47,399 Speaker 3: the World Long Congress a study called neo Course which 52 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,959 Speaker 3: is in earlier lines. Again that was very encouraging, very positive. 53 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:54,920 Speaker 3: So the big potential is in the earlier lines of 54 00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 3: treatment and that is going very well, So that is 55 00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:02,359 Speaker 3: not affecting our confidence in the drug. And beyond this rug, 56 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 3: we have many other of. 57 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 2: Course, Vesca, you're one of the industry leaders, of course 58 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:11,480 Speaker 2: in oncology, but also cardiovascular and respiratory. What other areas 59 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 2: do you earmark for growth and do you have the 60 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 2: internal capabilities of doing it alone or are you targeting 61 00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:18,600 Speaker 2: M and A. 62 00:03:18,600 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 3: Actually we can do it alone and our focuses can 63 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 3: sell of course, as we just talked about, and in cancer, 64 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:26,640 Speaker 3: we are developing a whole range of products on tibioty 65 00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:31,880 Speaker 3: drug conjugates by specific imminotherapies, and importantly we're also working 66 00:03:31,960 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 3: very hard on cell therapy, and cell therapy is opening 67 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 3: the potential to cure some cancers. We're also working on 68 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:41,720 Speaker 3: technologies that he set engages, so a whole range of 69 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 3: new technologies that will improve the. 70 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 1: Treatment of cancer. 71 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:50,640 Speaker 3: Outside of cancer, we're working on cardiovascular disease metabolism. We 72 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 3: have a whole range of products to treat obesity and 73 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:59,720 Speaker 3: metabolic diseases. And then we're also working on respiratory iminology 74 00:03:59,760 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 3: and anually on were diseases. So you can see that 75 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:07,080 Speaker 3: a whole portfolio goes much beyond data or the product 76 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 3: we are just talking about a minute ago. 77 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 2: There have been a lot of questions, of course about 78 00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 2: your side in Liverpool. Has the government reduced state aid 79 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 2: available for this investment. 80 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 1: We are still in discussion with the government. 81 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 3: We are committed to this investment, but of course you 82 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,599 Speaker 3: know we have to wait for the final conclusion of 83 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:27,360 Speaker 3: this discussion. 84 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:29,240 Speaker 1: I can't say much more at this point. 85 00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 3: It is an important investment for us in the UK, 86 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 3: of course, an important investment for pandemic preparedness, but you know, 87 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:39,400 Speaker 3: I can't say much more at this point. 88 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:44,040 Speaker 2: Is the UK lacking incentives for manufacturing and R and 89 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:47,160 Speaker 2: D investments in general, or is this also something that's 90 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:48,080 Speaker 2: under negotiation. 91 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:51,960 Speaker 3: I think the government has really been making quite a 92 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 3: number of efforts to attract investment in manufacturing. The bigger 93 00:04:57,080 --> 00:05:00,479 Speaker 3: issue in the UK, quite frankly, is access to since 94 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:04,719 Speaker 3: pharmaceutical companies want to invest in research and development in 95 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 3: countries where they believe their medicines will be able to 96 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,840 Speaker 3: add patients, so they will be reimbursed and. 97 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:13,440 Speaker 1: Patients will be able to benefit. 98 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:17,440 Speaker 3: And in the recent past access and reinvestment has become 99 00:05:17,480 --> 00:05:19,920 Speaker 3: more and more difficult, not only for US, but for 100 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 3: other medicines as well, and that's probably the biggest disincentive 101 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 3: to a pharmaceutical company to commit and invest in the UK. 102 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:34,880 Speaker 2: Several Astrozenic employees have also been detained in China relation 103 00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:38,560 Speaker 2: to two probes. Are you aware of Astrozeneca actually breaking 104 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:41,680 Speaker 2: any laws in relation to those investigations. 105 00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:45,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's something with a very seriously of course. 106 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:48,600 Speaker 3: It's important though to remember the context of it. It's 107 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:53,920 Speaker 3: a small number eight nine employees that are affected by 108 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 3: this investigation. We have twelve thousand field based employees in 109 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 3: the in China. It's a big country, as we all know. 110 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:06,440 Speaker 3: We are the largest pharmastical company in China. We have 111 00:06:06,839 --> 00:06:10,359 Speaker 3: sixteen almost seventeen thousand employees twelve thousand in the field, 112 00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 3: so we are looking at a smaller number of people. 113 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:18,040 Speaker 3: We have found policies complaints for we see with twin people, 114 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:21,479 Speaker 3: we of course investigate, but it's impossible to have a 115 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 3: complaints offica being each and every one of our field 116 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 3: based employee. 117 00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:28,479 Speaker 1: So we are working very closely with the authorities. 118 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:31,479 Speaker 3: And I think actually what the government is doing is 119 00:06:31,520 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 3: not affecting us on it, it's affecting all the companies 120 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 3: and it's a good thing because we need to really 121 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 3: make sure that we can operate in a very compliant 122 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 3: environment in the in in China like. 123 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 1: Warehouse in the world. 124 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:47,920 Speaker 2: What are some of the key threads for us Zenneka 125 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:50,240 Speaker 2: in relation to doing business in China and how can 126 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:52,760 Speaker 2: you actually mitigate some of those risks. 127 00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:56,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, of course we're all aware of the geopolitical tensions 128 00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:59,359 Speaker 3: between the US and China and particular, so what we 129 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:03,720 Speaker 3: have been doing, of course follow the laws and regulations 130 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:06,920 Speaker 3: in the US, in China everywhere, but also we've been 131 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 3: building our supply Chine in China, so we can supply 132 00:07:10,600 --> 00:07:16,240 Speaker 3: China from China and also supply some emerging markets from China. 133 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:20,920 Speaker 3: So we have several new investments, manufacturing investments in China 134 00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:24,280 Speaker 3: for many of our new medicines, and in parallel to this, 135 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 3: we're investing in the US. Recently, we invested in a 136 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:36,760 Speaker 3: cell serrupy manufacturing plant in the US in Maryland. So 137 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 3: you can see we're building two supply chains that are 138 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:42,520 Speaker 3: going to be independent from each other and enabling us 139 00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:45,760 Speaker 3: to supply China on the one hand, in the Western 140 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 3: world on the other hand. 141 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 2: Would you ever actually consider spinning off the business in China. 142 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:55,480 Speaker 1: No, I mean it's a very important part of our company. 143 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 3: First of all, there are lots of patients who need 144 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:00,800 Speaker 3: our medicines in China. But also importantly the last three 145 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 3: four five years, China has become a very important part 146 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:07,280 Speaker 3: of global innovation in our industry. There are lots of 147 00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 3: new medicines that are invented in China that we can 148 00:08:11,280 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 3: licenseing or co develop with Chinese companies that will benefit 149 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 3: people around the world. So we believe that China will 150 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 3: remain an important part of our company, not only because 151 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 3: we sell there, but also because we manufacture export and 152 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 3: also can source innovation from China that will benefit the 153 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 3: entire world. 154 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 2: You mentioned the US, What do you need from the 155 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 2: next president of the United States of America when it 156 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 2: comes to healthcare. 157 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:41,640 Speaker 3: Yes, I was listening to Grace Peters, who was with 158 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,840 Speaker 3: you a few minutes ago, and she was talking about policy. Essentially, 159 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:48,960 Speaker 3: we need policies that will support innovation in our sector, 160 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 3: innovation in biomedicines, innovation in research and development. The US 161 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:58,959 Speaker 3: has been the country that has been driving innovation in 162 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:02,319 Speaker 3: our industry censors for many years, and I believe will 163 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:05,000 Speaker 3: remain so for a long time to come. China is 164 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 3: the other big driver of innovation. Unfortunately Europe has been 165 00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:13,640 Speaker 3: falling behind. So what we need is continued investment in 166 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:20,320 Speaker 3: basic research. We need a continued investment in biotech, in 167 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 3: startups through private investment that is of course incentivized to 168 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 3: invest in those emerging companies. And finally, we need, of 169 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:34,360 Speaker 3: course access for medicines, so that is really a key 170 00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:39,040 Speaker 3: part of incentivizing pharmaceutical companies make sure that their medicines 171 00:09:39,200 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 3: can actually help patients. 172 00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 2: I mean, looking at your share price, where does the 173 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:46,319 Speaker 2: market most under estimate Astrasenca. 174 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:49,960 Speaker 3: I think the market under estimates the strength of our 175 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 3: portfolio and the growth we can deliver over the next. 176 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:54,719 Speaker 1: Number of years. 177 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:59,320 Speaker 3: You know, the pharmaceutical industry is not a very simple 178 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 3: endeavor we all know, and it's not for the faint hearted. 179 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:04,600 Speaker 1: And you never will have. 180 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 3: A linear development. You have ups and downs, and that's 181 00:10:08,559 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 3: what we've had in the last ten twelve years. But 182 00:10:11,760 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 3: in general we are moving in the right direction. We 183 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:18,560 Speaker 3: have a verse from portfolio and people are underestimating several 184 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:21,880 Speaker 3: of the products we have in the portfolio and reacting to, 185 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:27,040 Speaker 3: you know, events that happened on the day as opposed 186 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:30,520 Speaker 3: to sometimes looking at the long trend, our long term shoulders. 187 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:34,360 Speaker 3: You know, they of course look at those events, but 188 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:36,960 Speaker 3: they keep their eye on the long term, which is, 189 00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:39,560 Speaker 3: you know, where we can be in twenty thirty and beyond, 190 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 3: and that is clearly a good place because we have 191 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:45,839 Speaker 3: good development plans and will continue going. 192 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:50,000 Speaker 2: So, given the setback with Taichi Sankyo, what are you 193 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:52,680 Speaker 2: most excited about what's coming up in the pipeline? 194 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:56,200 Speaker 3: Well, I should say that remains a very important product 195 00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:59,880 Speaker 3: for us. It's a setback in time if if if 196 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 3: it's a setback, I mean, we'll have to see what 197 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,440 Speaker 3: the header decides. But even if we had a more 198 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:10,040 Speaker 3: limited approval than we're looking for, you know, we don't 199 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:11,600 Speaker 3: know what we will get. We have to wait for 200 00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 3: the DA but it's a timing issue because these new 201 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:18,600 Speaker 3: tests we have developed will enable us to expand our 202 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 3: presents and are using second third line and then we 203 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:23,240 Speaker 3: have the studies in the first line, and then we 204 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 3: thanks to this test, we'll go into other indications potentially 205 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:30,439 Speaker 3: rest of course, but also many others, so that all 206 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:35,040 Speaker 3: remains an important portfolio about product. Our portfolio antibody drug 207 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:38,680 Speaker 3: conjugates is very exciting. Our best specifics in oncology are 208 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 3: very exciting. Our portfolio products in obesity and cardio metabolism 209 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:45,600 Speaker 3: is also very exciting. 210 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 1: Sensor up. 211 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:51,560 Speaker 3: The overall both in oncology and immunology is very exciting. 212 00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 3: So there's a lot of products that really are going 213 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:58,239 Speaker 3: to change the future of medicine and drive out walls. 214 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:01,599 Speaker 2: Thank you so much for your time today. That was 215 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 2: Pascal sol Hio, of course, the chief executive of Astrozenega.