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Speaker 1: Rivals is a production of I Heart Radio. Hello everyone,

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Speaker 1: and welcome to Rivals, the show about music beefs and

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Speaker 1: feuds and long simmering resentments between musicians. I'm Steve and

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Speaker 1: I'm Jordan's and today we're throwing it back old school

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Speaker 1: to what maybe the primordial rock rivalry. We're taking it

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Speaker 1: back to the dawn of Sun Records. In the feud

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Speaker 1: between Elvis Presley and Jerry Lee Lewis the King versus

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Speaker 1: the Killer, I can't wait. Elvis Presley is known as

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Speaker 1: the king of rock and roll, but Jerry Lee Lewis

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Speaker 1: is the king of rock and roll wildman. I like.

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Speaker 1: I feel like if Jerry Lee started his career today,

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Speaker 1: he would be canceled in about five minutes. You know.

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Speaker 1: His story is filled with scandals involving drugs, boos, guns,

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Speaker 1: underage cousins, two dead wives including one he might have murdered,

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Speaker 1: one bass player that he accidentally shot in the chest,

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Speaker 1: and many other unmentionables. Compared to Jerry Lee, even with

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Speaker 1: his own foibles, l this looks like an angel, which

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Speaker 1: might be why Jerry Lee literally tried to kill Elvius

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Speaker 1: at one point, which will get into in this episode.

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Speaker 1: There's so much crazy rock and roll lord to parse here.

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Speaker 1: I can't wait to get into it. So without further ado,

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Speaker 1: let's get into this mess. It all begins with Elvis,

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Speaker 1: as so many rock and roll tales. Do you know

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Speaker 1: the story little boy from Tupelo, Mississippi boring in a

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Speaker 1: two room shotgun shock? It's like a Chuck Berry lyric.

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Speaker 1: He was a shy kid. He gave his first musical

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Speaker 1: performance at a singing contest in his elementary school at

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Speaker 1: age ten, and he was dressed as a cowboy. He

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Speaker 1: stood on a stool to reach the mic, and the

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Speaker 1: best part is he only came in fifth place, which

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Speaker 1: I mean, I want to talk to those other four

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Speaker 1: people who like for the rest of their lives, were like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, I beat Elvis in a singing contest, right,

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Speaker 1: Like how wild would that be? When I'm gonna have

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Speaker 1: times a day. They slipp that into the conversation like

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Speaker 1: where are those people today? What are they doing? Please

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Speaker 1: get in touch, Please get in touch. We'd love to

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Speaker 1: hear from you. Soon after this, he got a guitar

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Speaker 1: for Christmas, which bummed him out because he wanted a

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Speaker 1: bike or a gun. Typical Misissippi kid. He learned it

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Speaker 1: and started bringing it to school to sing hillbilly music

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Speaker 1: during lunchtime. And he was seen as kind of a

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Speaker 1: loaner and teased as being a mama's boy and even

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Speaker 1: called trashy for playing this kind of wild hillbilly music.

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Speaker 1: And uh, one of his classmates was the younger brother

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Speaker 1: of a musician named Mississippi Slim who had a radio

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Speaker 1: show on a local Tupelo station, And he would take

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Speaker 1: Elvis down to the station and Slim would give him

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Speaker 1: guitar pointers, and that became one of his early musical influences.

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Speaker 1: The Presley Is also lived in a predominantly black neighborhood

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Speaker 1: where he absorbed those musical influence as well. So you've

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Speaker 1: got this hillbilly music played by you know, Memphis Slim

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Speaker 1: or Ernest tub or Hank Snow mixed with the blues

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Speaker 1: music that he heard in his neighborhood he loved, like

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Speaker 1: Rosetta Tharpe for example, and the gospel that he knew

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Speaker 1: from Pentecostal churches. This all blended into the very unique,

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Speaker 1: you know, musical gumbo that became Elvis's sound. Yeah, Elvis,

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Speaker 1: to me, in many ways, it was like a modern

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Speaker 1: man before his time. You know, he loved music and

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Speaker 1: he'd listened to anything. You know, it didn't matter where

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Speaker 1: it came from. If he liked it, he liked it.

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Speaker 1: You know, there was the R and B and hillbilly

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Speaker 1: music of Wars, But like you said, he was also

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Speaker 1: into gospel music, and he loved blues, and he was

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Speaker 1: into like crooner's like Dean Martin and Perry Como as well,

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Speaker 1: and even like the oppera singer, Mario Lanza, he was

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Speaker 1: a big fan of him as well. And I feel

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Speaker 1: like Elvis generally had like really good taste and in

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Speaker 1: a way I wonder like if his greatest talent was

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Speaker 1: as a curator, you know, like he had a gift

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Speaker 1: for being able to recognize what was good and synthesize

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Speaker 1: it into like one thing that he did in a

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Speaker 1: very unique way. If you look at Elvis's early life,

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Speaker 1: I feel like it takes like a really crucial turn

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Speaker 1: when he turns thirteen. That's when his family moves to Memphis,

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Speaker 1: which is, you know, of course, one of the great

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Speaker 1: American music cities of all time. And this is around

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Speaker 1: the time that like Elvis is hanging out in local

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Speaker 1: juke joints and watching live music and he actually got

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Speaker 1: to know BB King a little bit at this time,

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Speaker 1: Like this was this was like when BB King was

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Speaker 1: also really young and before he was famous. Alvis also

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Speaker 1: started playing music around like the public housing complex where

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Speaker 1: he lived, so he's starting to like dabble in performance.

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Speaker 1: But he was basically like a loaner at this time.

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Speaker 1: Like he had longside burns. He had like relatively long

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Speaker 1: hair for the time, and he slicked at back kind

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Speaker 1: of looked like a truck driver at the time. And

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Speaker 1: he was like a real sort of iconic class at

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Speaker 1: his school. He didn't sing publicly until three that's when

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Speaker 1: he entered a talent show at his high school. And

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Speaker 1: he would later say that, like, you know, I wasn't

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Speaker 1: popular in school, but then I entered in this talent show,

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Speaker 1: and when I came on stage, I heard people kind

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Speaker 1: of rumbling and whispering and so forth, because nobody even

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Speaker 1: knew I could sing. And it was amazing how popular

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Speaker 1: I became in school after that. And yeah, I can

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Speaker 1: just picture this. It's like the scene in the biopic

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Speaker 1: about Elvis, like where he starts to become the King.

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Speaker 1: It all begins at this moment. But the scene that

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Speaker 1: I would have always assumed that would have been in

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Speaker 1: a biopic is actually a myth. You know, everyone knows this,

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Speaker 1: this story of Elvis going to Sam Phillips's Son Records

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Speaker 1: in in August and ninety three too. You know, the

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Speaker 1: myth is that he went to cut two songs as

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Speaker 1: a birthday present for his mom, which that was sort

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Speaker 1: of the story that was put around, which is, you know,

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Speaker 1: very much in the Elvis image would be in this

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Speaker 1: like Sweet Mama's Boy, But in fact he showed up

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Speaker 1: just you know, because he was an ambitious guy. I mean,

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Speaker 1: the author Peter Grolnick, who the you know, definitive Elvis

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Speaker 1: memoir Last Train in Memphis. Uh And and there's a

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Speaker 1: part two called Careless Love he talks about there was

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Speaker 1: a much cheaper recording machine down the road at like

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Speaker 1: a general store. So if Elvis just wanted to make

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Speaker 1: a song, you know, record for his mother for a birthday,

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Speaker 1: he could have done it much cheaper and easier down

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Speaker 1: the street. So he definitely had his sights on being

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Speaker 1: discovered when he showed up to two Sun Records and

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Speaker 1: the receptionists trying to get a gauge on what kind

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Speaker 1: of musician he was and asked him who he sounded like,

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Speaker 1: and I love his reply. He said, I don't sound

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Speaker 1: like nobody, which is a hell of an intro, and

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Speaker 1: you know, very true. Sam Phillips wasn't in that day

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Speaker 1: the guy who ran the company. But the receptionist like

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Speaker 1: what she heard and left the note for Phillips saying

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Speaker 1: to hold onto this guy. So for a few months,

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Speaker 1: Phillips wasn't really sure what to do with Elvis. There

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Speaker 1: are a few failed auditions that he went on with

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Speaker 1: other groups. He was working as a trucker for a time,

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Speaker 1: and some musicians the audition for basically told him to

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Speaker 1: stick to his tay job. They really weren't into his

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Speaker 1: sound at all. Sam offered him a few songs to sing.

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Speaker 1: It didn't really click with his vocal style until Elvis

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Speaker 1: and the sort of ad hawk band that Philips put

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Speaker 1: together just started jamming and screwing around in between takes,

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Speaker 1: and they started messing around on a song called bats

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Speaker 1: all Right, Mama, and Sam Phillips knew a good thing

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Speaker 1: when he heard it, and that became Elvis's first hit

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Speaker 1: and the ad Hawk band that that Sam put Together

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Speaker 1: was with Bill Black and Scotty Moore, which became you know,

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Speaker 1: the iconic Elvis backing band. So Elvis is on his

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Speaker 1: way right now to fame and fortune and we all

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Speaker 1: know the story after that. Jerry Lee Lewis, he's not

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Speaker 1: yet famous at this point, but he's basically moving like

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Speaker 1: on a parallel track to Elvis now. Jerry Lee Lewis,

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Speaker 1: he was born in Faraday, Louisiana, in ninety five, the

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Speaker 1: same year as Elvis. Elvis was born in January of

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Speaker 1: that year. Jerry Lee was born in September, so but

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Speaker 1: like nine months or so separates them at that time,

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Speaker 1: so very close in age. Like Elvis, Jerley was born

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Speaker 1: into poverty. He was raised in the Christian faith, and

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Speaker 1: he was drawn to music at an early age. Actually

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Speaker 1: his parents mortgaged their house to buy Jerry Lee a piano.

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Speaker 1: And like Elvis, Jerry Lee grew up singing gospel music.

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Speaker 1: And while they had a similar Christian background, I feel

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Speaker 1: like their take on Christianity was much different. Like if

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Speaker 1: you listened to like the gospel records that Elvis made,

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Speaker 1: they're very much like sort of talking about the afterlife

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Speaker 1: in this very sort of like peaceful and tranquil kind

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Speaker 1: of way. It's looking at like the Holy Spirit as

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Speaker 1: being like a way to sort of save you and

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Speaker 1: to deliver you from darkness, whereas like Jerry Lee definitely

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Speaker 1: was like of the fire and brimstone variety of Christianity,

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Speaker 1: like where he was very focused on sin and hell

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Speaker 1: and the devil and where you know, desire is intense,

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Speaker 1: and like the punishment for desire is intense. And you

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Speaker 1: can see how these contrasting views of spirituality we're gonna

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Speaker 1: like define these guys as they move forward. You know,

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Speaker 1: Jerry would actually like talk later in life about how

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Speaker 1: he wanted to be a preacher at one point. And

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Speaker 1: his cousin, of course is Jimmy Swagger, which I don't

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Speaker 1: know if people still remember Jimmy Swagger, but like in

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Speaker 1: the nineteen eighties, he was a very famous televangelist and

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Speaker 1: he actually ended up getting busted in the red light

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Speaker 1: district in New Orleans for messing around with ten dollar prostitutes.

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Speaker 1: Jimmy Swagger and Jerry Lee, I think they both dealt

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Speaker 1: with the devil, shall we say, Jordan's yeah, that's a

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Speaker 1: that's a good way to put it. So Anyway, Jerry Lee,

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Speaker 1: you know, he's getting his first exposure as a performer,

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Speaker 1: playing the piano in church. But by the time, you know,

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Speaker 1: he's around fifteen or so, he's starting to get into

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Speaker 1: trouble because he's playing like rock and roll versions essentially

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Speaker 1: of hymns. And this is also around the time that

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Speaker 1: he earned his nickname The Killer, which is like one

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Speaker 1: of the coolest nicknames I think in rock and roll,

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Speaker 1: Like King of rock and Roll, that's a pretty cool nickname.

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Speaker 1: But like the Killer to me is like untouchable, and

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Speaker 1: it's somewhat ironic given his you know, eventual life because again,

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Speaker 1: like he was at one point accused of like killing

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Speaker 1: one of his wives. But he insists that, like he

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Speaker 1: was called the Killer not because he was murdering people,

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Speaker 1: but because he was such a good musician. Like there's

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Speaker 1: a quote in the just Fantastic Nicktasha's Jerry Lee Lewis

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Speaker 1: biography hell Fire, where Jerry Lee actually says that he

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Speaker 1: hates that nickname, but he said has been stuck with

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Speaker 1: it ever since he was a kid. And he said,

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Speaker 1: I don't think they mean to kill it like I

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Speaker 1: kill people. I think they mean it musically speaking, and uh,

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Speaker 1: that's my Jerry Lewis impression. I kind of made him

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Speaker 1: sound more Cajun probably than he actually is. But anyway,

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Speaker 1: you get the point. It was pretty good, pretty good.

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Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, it's it's really fascinating, like he said,

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Speaker 1: like how he really leaned into this sort of darker

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Speaker 1: side and it comes through in his music. Elvis and

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Speaker 1: Jerry that they had similar musical influences growing up in

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Speaker 1: their teenage years, and in nineteen fifty four, when Elvis's

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Speaker 1: was just career was just starting to take off with Sun,

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Speaker 1: Jerry Lee was playing nightly you know, honky tonks in

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Speaker 1: on the banks of the Mississippi, and uh, as he

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Speaker 1: would say years later, he kept hearing the name Sam

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Speaker 1: Phillips and Sun Records and particularly his Alvis career continued

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Speaker 1: to rise through fifty five and fifty six, and in

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Speaker 1: fifty six, when Elvis left Sun Records for a major

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Speaker 1: label deal at at our ci A, Jerry Lee Lewis thinking,

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Speaker 1: you know, being the enterprising, uh piano punisher that we know, thought,

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Speaker 1: you know what, Sam Phillips might be looking for a replacement.

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Speaker 1: So he his dad drive from Louisiana to Memphis and

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Speaker 1: go straight to Sun Records, and his associates more or

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Speaker 1: less tell Jerry Lee to kind of lay off the

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Speaker 1: rock and roll. I said, you know, Elvis has got

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Speaker 1: that tied up. Why don't you do something else? So,

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Speaker 1: you know, you tell that to Jerry Lee right away.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's like waving a red flag in front

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Speaker 1: of a bull. Elvis is now the man to beat,

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Speaker 1: and so he says, you know what, I don't think

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Speaker 1: so I think I can beat this guy. Um, And

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Speaker 1: he's talking to the receptionist at the Sun Records studio saying,

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Speaker 1: you know what, we we got all the rock and

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Speaker 1: roll we need, you need a new sound. He said, no,

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Speaker 1: I'm a hit. They all say that, son, Well, I'm

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Speaker 1: not all. I'm different, which again, this guy has got

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Speaker 1: confidence to spare. So for a few months, Jerry Lee

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Speaker 1: was a little more than just like a session man

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Speaker 1: for Sam Phillips, and he played I didn't realize that

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Speaker 1: he played on the Carl Perkins song Matchbox and songs

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Speaker 1: by Billy Lee Riley. But this all leads to his

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Speaker 1: first meeting with Elvis, which has been memorialized as the

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Speaker 1: famous Million Dollar Quartet session. Yeah, and you know it's

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Speaker 1: interesting looking back on this because we have all seen

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Speaker 1: that photo. It's Elvis, it's j. D. Lewis, and it's

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Speaker 1: Carl Perkins, and Johnny Cash was there, but like was

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Speaker 1: he in the photograph? I don't remember. I don't think

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Speaker 1: he was in the photograph, or if he was, he

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Speaker 1: was like photoshop Dan, but I don't think he was

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Speaker 1: in that picture. So, like Jerry Lee Lewis really like

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Speaker 1: was not famous at this point, you know, like those

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Speaker 1: other guys were already established stars. But Jerry Lee, like

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Speaker 1: you said, he was the session musician, and he had,

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Speaker 1: you know, a lot of confidence, but he hadn't really

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Speaker 1: had like his big hits yet. So like just being

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Speaker 1: in the company of these guys and being photographed with them,

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Speaker 1: I mean that, you know, is a great way to

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Speaker 1: elevate yourself, you know, to put yourself in the company

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Speaker 1: these guys. I mean, you look at that photo down

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Speaker 1: it's like the fifties version of like the Traveling Willbury's.

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Speaker 1: Essentially this is an incredible thing, and they actually ended

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Speaker 1: up like recording this session, Like Elvis sett at the

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Speaker 1: piano and he was playing you know, some of his

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Speaker 1: favorite gospel songs like Piece in the Valley and also

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Speaker 1: plays like a show tune called he Belonged to My Heart.

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Speaker 1: You know. Again, Like, I don't think anything like incredibly

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Speaker 1: musically momentous came out of this session, but just the

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Speaker 1: fact that these guys were all in the same room

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Speaker 1: together and again captured a moment really before Jerry Lee

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Speaker 1: Lewis was a star. It really was just like history

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Speaker 1: in the making. And I think it elevated Jerry le

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Speaker 1: Lewis in a way that would like kind of put

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Speaker 1: him on his way shortly when he started having like

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Speaker 1: his big hits. So, as you were saying, Elvis was

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Speaker 1: actually on piano for most of this session, and then

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Speaker 1: as soon as he steps up for a minute, Jerry

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Speaker 1: immediately slides in and starts bashing out versions of like

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Speaker 1: when the Saints go Marching in and other songs, and

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Speaker 1: Elvis is impressed and he's like, well, wrong, man's been

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Speaker 1: sitting here at this piano and Jerry Lee is much

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Speaker 1: less humble. That was my slight Elvis impression. Jerry Lee

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Speaker 1: was like, I dig it. I appreciate that, Thank you,

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Speaker 1: thank you, And Jerry le He's like, yeah, man, I've

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Speaker 1: been waiting to tell you all along. Scoot over. He

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Speaker 1: tells Elvis to scoot over on the pianos stool. It's

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Speaker 1: safe to say that Elvis got a kick out of

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Speaker 1: this guy. I mean, at this point, he's, you know,

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Speaker 1: one of the biggest stars in the country and I

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Speaker 1: have this kind of you know, rascally guy. Tell him

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Speaker 1: scoot over on the piano stool. He likes this, He's

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Speaker 1: got spunk. So Elvis extends his hand and you know,

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Speaker 1: they kind of have a proper introduction, and Elvis invites

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Speaker 1: him to head over to it to his house. And

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Speaker 1: Sam Phillips had called the newspaper reporter that day. He's

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Speaker 1: very good at, you know, knowing a publicity moment when

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Speaker 1: he sees one. And ELVISO was a reporter about Jerry

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Speaker 1: Lee's as that boy can go. I think he's a

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Speaker 1: great future ahead of him. He has a different style

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Speaker 1: and the way he plays piano just gets inside me.

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Speaker 1: So this coast sign from Elvis right off the bat,

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Speaker 1: it's definitely a huge boon to Jerry Lee's career. So

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Speaker 1: Jerry Lee ends up becoming a star in seven with

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Speaker 1: the release of a whole lot of shaping going on,

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Speaker 1: ends up being a huge hit. It spends twenty nine

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Speaker 1: weeks on the Pop chart, peaking at number three. It

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Speaker 1: also tops the country in Western and R and B charts,

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Speaker 1: and it really puts Jerry Lee on his way. And

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Speaker 1: you can see, like if you look at his early

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Speaker 1: career that he's basically following like the Elvis Presley template

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Speaker 1: for success. Like he's on Elvis's label of course, Sun Records.

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Speaker 1: He used Elvis's former manager as his booking agent, who

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Speaker 1: like booked Jerry Lee into like a lot of the

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Speaker 1: same venues in the South that Elvis played when he

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Speaker 1: was building up his career, and you know, you listen

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Speaker 1: a whole lot of shaking going on, and it's definitely

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Speaker 1: in the same style that Elvis was doing at that time.

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Speaker 1: Again that mix of like hillbilly and R and B music,

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Speaker 1: although again there's I think a certain edge to Jerry

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Speaker 1: Lee that like Elvis never really had. But it's interesting

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Speaker 1: because like Elvis of course was the first to the door,

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Speaker 1: so like he was always going to be the most controversial,

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Speaker 1: and because Elvis was the trailblazer in a way, it

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Speaker 1: kind of made it easier for Jerry Lee Lewis like

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Speaker 1: to follow in his wake. Like there's there's that example

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Speaker 1: of Jerry Lee Lewis playing the Steve Allen Show uh

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Speaker 1: in July of nineteen seven, and this was a year

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Speaker 1: after Elvis did that show, and of course that was

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Speaker 1: an infamous performance, like where Steve Allen like made fun

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Speaker 1: of Elvis for the song hound Dog, and I think

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Speaker 1: like he made him sing that song to an actual dog.

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Speaker 1: Just the idea of like, you know, rock and roll

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Speaker 1: is this fat and like, we're gonna make fun of

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Speaker 1: this guy, make, you know, try to make him look

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Speaker 1: like a fool on television. Well, Jerry le Lewis goes

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Speaker 1: on and he doesn't get the same treatment. He doesn't

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Speaker 1: have to sing to a dog, which is great for

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Speaker 1: Jerry Lee Lewis. And we've seen other examples of this

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Speaker 1: in this series where you have again the Trailblazer and

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Speaker 1: then you have the person kind of follows in their

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Speaker 1: wake that benefits from, you know, not having to do

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Speaker 1: with like a lot of the same problems that the

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Speaker 1: trail boyz er had to deal with. And Jerry Lee

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Speaker 1: becomes sons biggest seller and Sam Phillips dotes on him

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Speaker 1: accordingly to the exclusion of the rest of the artists,

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Speaker 1: and he starts getting resented by the rest of the

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Speaker 1: sun Stable. But you know it's a good reason. Great

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Speaker 1: Balls of Fire goes the number two on the Billboard

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Speaker 1: Single Charts. In night another appearance on Steve Allen on

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Speaker 1: American Bandstand, Yeah, Breathless, which was another top ten record,

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Speaker 1: And this was written by Otis Blackwell, who had written

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Speaker 1: two of Elvis's biggest hits, Don't Be Cruel and All

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Speaker 1: Shook Up May seventeen ninety eight, is declared Jerry Lee

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Speaker 1: Lewis day and Elvis had a similar honor a short

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Speaker 1: time before. I mean, you could definitely see that, you know,

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Speaker 1: he's following in Elvis's footsteps, absolutely, And you know, I

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Speaker 1: was just thinking about like other examples of this dynamic

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Speaker 1: that we've talked about on this show, Like you could

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Speaker 1: say that, like Elvis was like the Beatles and Jerry

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Speaker 1: Lee was like the Rolling Stones. Elvis was Nirvana, and

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Speaker 1: Jerry Lee Lewis was Pearl Jam. You know, Elvis was

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Speaker 1: Whitney hughes Din, Jerry Lewis was Mariah Carey, Elvis was

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Speaker 1: the Backstreet Boys, Jerry Lee Lewis was in Sync. You know,

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Speaker 1: we could do this all day long, just drawing parallels

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Speaker 1: here and I think one thing that we've seen in

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Speaker 1: this dynamic in the past is that like the person

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Speaker 1: who goes second is often like the bad boy alternative

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Speaker 1: to like again the trailblazer who went first. You know,

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Speaker 1: like the one who comes second tends to be edgier

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Speaker 1: and bolder, and they also like tend to talk more

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Speaker 1: smack in the press about the trailblazer, you know, in

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Speaker 1: this situation, you know, like if Elvis was bothered that

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Speaker 1: this guy, Jerry Lee Lewis was kind of like, you

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Speaker 1: know in a way kind of like sucking up some

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Speaker 1: of his energy, Like he didn't show it in the press,

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Speaker 1: like he was always like pretty magnanimous. Like around the

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Speaker 1: time that like Elvis put out Teddy Bear and that

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Speaker 1: song was someone overshadowed by the success of whole lot

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Speaker 1: of shaking going on. Someone asked Elvis about Jerry Lee

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Speaker 1: Lewis and and Alvis said, you know, there's plenty of

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Speaker 1: room for all of us. And you know, we've talked

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Speaker 1: about this before that like even before Jerry Lee was big,

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Speaker 1: he would you know, say nice things about Jerry Lee

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Speaker 1: and the press and just talking about how talented he was.

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Speaker 1: And you have to pay attention to this guy because

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Speaker 1: he's a great musician. Jerry Lee, on the other hand,

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Speaker 1: was not magnanimous at all about Elvis. You know, he

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Speaker 1: would never miss an opportunity basically to say that he

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Speaker 1: was the actual king of rock and roll and that

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Speaker 1: he was way more talented than Elvis ever was. Now

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Speaker 1: what's crazy to me is that, like, you actually interviewed

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Speaker 1: Jerry Lee Lewis, didn't you. I did, And you know,

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Speaker 1: I gotta say I was. This was a few years ago.

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Speaker 1: I was terrified because I had heard all these stories

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Speaker 1: about how he would start interviews by just like throwing

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Speaker 1: a pistol down on the table, like that was how

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Speaker 1: he would like, Oh, that was his opening opening gambit.

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Speaker 1: But like interviewing, like it's like interviewing like a like

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Speaker 1: a serial killer or something like I'd be terrified of

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Speaker 1: Jerry Lee Lewis. Yeah, I felt like Jodie Foster going

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Speaker 1: to interview Hannibal Lecter, like kind of being led in.

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Speaker 1: It was. It was very Yeah, it was. It was

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Speaker 1: pretty freaky, but I mean it was awesome. It was.

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Speaker 1: It was, although I will say it was one of

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Speaker 1: those interviews that I kind of wish I had, like

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Speaker 1: a real live like subtitles going because he's got that

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Speaker 1: like Cajun grawl that is just sort of like like

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Speaker 1: hardened into this, like gravelly. It was kind of hard

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Speaker 1: to understand my point, but he was, you know, he

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Speaker 1: was something. And yeah, even what would it have been,

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Speaker 1: it would have been sixty years later he was still

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Speaker 1: talking about Elvis. He said, Elvis was not rock and roll.

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Speaker 1: He was rockabilly. And that's a lot different from rock

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Speaker 1: and roll. Oh baby, a lot of shaking going on. Now,

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Speaker 1: that's rock and roll. Elvis won the Jackson and a

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Speaker 1: few of those people they were rockabilly, but I was

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Speaker 1: rock and roll, and you just can't beat rock and roll.

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Speaker 1: And he he spoke about this again and again he

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Speaker 1: hates the term rockabilly, considers it something that was sort

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Speaker 1: of imposed on these country boys by by the outside world.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, but the whole time when he was talking

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Speaker 1: to me, it would just be peppered with these little

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Speaker 1: digs at Elvis. He was saying like, oh, yeah, Elvis

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Speaker 1: always took my advice. Little did he know I wasn't

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Speaker 1: always given him great advice. And he just kind of

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Speaker 1: laughed conspiratorially. Yeah, it was seeing their relationship even though

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Speaker 1: it was a long gun still seems to sort of

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Speaker 1: continue to this day in his eyes. And uh, yeah

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Speaker 1: it was. It was funny and really interesting just to

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Speaker 1: sort of see that dynamic play in front of me. Now,

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Speaker 1: it didn't gerually tell you about the time that and

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Speaker 1: Elvis went dreg racing. Yeah, he told me this great

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00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:06,000
Speaker 1: story about how they both had the same car, which

429
00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:08,120
Speaker 1: again I think is very telling. I have no doubt

430
00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:10,000
Speaker 1: in my mind that Elvis bought something and then Jerry

431
00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:11,680
Speaker 1: Lee went out and bought the same thing. But anyway

432
00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:15,080
Speaker 1: to Cadillac Eldorados. They saw each other coming and Elvis

433
00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:17,760
Speaker 1: apparently pulled into his lane so that they were heading

434
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:19,280
Speaker 1: on a collision course. And they were playing a game

435
00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:22,680
Speaker 1: at Chicken. So Elvis Jerry Lewis are playing a game

436
00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:26,600
Speaker 1: at Chicken in Memphis in two Cadillac Eldorados. According to him,

437
00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:29,639
Speaker 1: Elvis broke first, uh, and then he jumped out of

438
00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:32,720
Speaker 1: the car. Jerry Lee jumped out of his and Elvis

439
00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:35,359
Speaker 1: started screaming at him, I'm gonna sue you, and Jerry

440
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:37,200
Speaker 1: Lee said, suit me, sue me for what he said,

441
00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:40,080
Speaker 1: mean woman blues. I guess um Elvis had sung the

442
00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,800
Speaker 1: song Mean Woman Blues in some one of the movies

443
00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:44,280
Speaker 1: he did around that it might have been King Creole.

444
00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:46,480
Speaker 1: I forget which which movie was, and then Jerry Lee

445
00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:48,879
Speaker 1: covered it later and Jerry Ley said, no, no, man,

446
00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:51,080
Speaker 1: I had no idea even even saying that song. I

447
00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:53,000
Speaker 1: just ain't by by the way I rewrote it. I

448
00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:54,359
Speaker 1: did it all. I made it my own. What are

449
00:19:54,359 --> 00:19:57,880
Speaker 1: you talking about? So? Um, you know, I think that

450
00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:00,800
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee, that's the thing about on second you can

451
00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:03,159
Speaker 1: always be the underdog. And every time that you like

452
00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:06,560
Speaker 1: triumph over, you know, the main guy, the goliath, you

453
00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:09,080
Speaker 1: you look even cooler. And still sixty years later, I

454
00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:12,879
Speaker 1: think Jerry Lee sees himself as being the uh, the

455
00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:15,480
Speaker 1: the underdog, and it shows just how much he loved

456
00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:19,520
Speaker 1: being in Elvis's metaphorical rear view mirror and um in

457
00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:21,720
Speaker 1: later years, it's it sort of makes the other person

458
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:25,959
Speaker 1: sound like this resentful lunatic when telling the story, but uh, yeah,

459
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,360
Speaker 1: it was. It was definitely. It was a fascinating way

460
00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:30,440
Speaker 1: to spend an afternoon with Jerry Lee talking about playing

461
00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:34,399
Speaker 1: a game and chicken with Elvis. So getting back to

462
00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:37,200
Speaker 1: the fifties, you know, in nineteen fifty seven, that's a

463
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,399
Speaker 1: big year for jerry Lee Lewis. That's a breakout year

464
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:41,480
Speaker 1: where he starts to become a big rock star getting

465
00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:44,719
Speaker 1: into Night. It looks at first like it's gonna be

466
00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:47,199
Speaker 1: an even better year for him, in part because this

467
00:20:47,240 --> 00:20:49,800
Speaker 1: is the year that Elvis got drafted into the army.

468
00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:54,200
Speaker 1: So Jerry Lee basically like has the Southern bad boy

469
00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:57,400
Speaker 1: lane all to himself now. So when times get good

470
00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,320
Speaker 1: for jerry Lee Lewis, Jerry Lee does what he always

471
00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:04,760
Speaker 1: does and he self destructs in spectacular fashion. And it

472
00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:09,159
Speaker 1: happens on when Jerry Lee arrives at Heathrow Airport in

473
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:12,320
Speaker 1: London to begin a concert to her Now, Jerry Lee

474
00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:15,240
Speaker 1: happens to be accompanied by a young girl, and reporters

475
00:21:15,280 --> 00:21:18,639
Speaker 1: ask like who is this? Is this perhaps your younger sister,

476
00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:22,199
Speaker 1: or like the friend of a younger sister or something,

477
00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,400
Speaker 1: and Jerry Lee says, no, this is my wife. And

478
00:21:25,840 --> 00:21:28,960
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee says that she's fifteen years old, which is

479
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:31,680
Speaker 1: pretty gross by itself, but it turns out that she's

480
00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:36,240
Speaker 1: actually thirteen years old and also Jerry Lee's second cousin.

481
00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:39,359
Speaker 1: Now this would be like a terrible scandal just on

482
00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:42,080
Speaker 1: its own. I think. But it also turns out that

483
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee was still married when he married his cousin,

484
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:47,919
Speaker 1: So it turns out that I guess he was like

485
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,280
Speaker 1: an accidental big amist for like a period of time,

486
00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:53,679
Speaker 1: like when he's married to multiple women. What blows me

487
00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:58,080
Speaker 1: away about this is that, like Jerry Lee didn't seem

488
00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:00,880
Speaker 1: to know that like people would react badly to this.

489
00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,600
Speaker 1: You know, he didn't try to hide it at all,

490
00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,720
Speaker 1: That's what I mean. Like he was openly talking about

491
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,600
Speaker 1: this girl. He like paraded her in front of cameras.

492
00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:11,879
Speaker 1: You know, it'd be like if R. Kelly was like

493
00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:15,359
Speaker 1: openly a sleeves bag like in the media, Like if

494
00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:17,160
Speaker 1: he wasn't trying to conceal that he was with young

495
00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:19,639
Speaker 1: girls all the time. And it just leads me to

496
00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:22,239
Speaker 1: believe that like, yeah, Jerry Lee just didn't know that

497
00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:24,160
Speaker 1: this was wrong, you know, Like he thought, well, there's

498
00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:26,560
Speaker 1: nothing wrong with me marrying my cousin, there's nothing wrong

499
00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:30,440
Speaker 1: with me being with a thirteen year old girl. However, uh,

500
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:33,080
Speaker 1: the rest of the world did not agree, and Jerry

501
00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:36,879
Speaker 1: Lee faced a terrible backlash. Almost immediately, he was blacklisted

502
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,399
Speaker 1: from the radio. Dick Clark banned him from American Bandstand

503
00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:42,879
Speaker 1: he made He went from making ten thousand dollars a

504
00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:46,359
Speaker 1: night to two fifty dollars a night, you know, basically,

505
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:50,040
Speaker 1: like he was canceled big time again, Like this would

506
00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,440
Speaker 1: have been a time like where Elvis he could have

507
00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:55,600
Speaker 1: taken a shot at Jerry Lee here very easily. Jerry

508
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:58,240
Speaker 1: Lee was down for the count. But like when someone

509
00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:00,840
Speaker 1: asked him about this controversy, see, you know again, like

510
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:02,679
Speaker 1: when he was in the army, he was stationed in

511
00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:06,000
Speaker 1: Germany at the time, Elvis said, he's a great artist.

512
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 1: I'd rather not talk about his marriage except that if

513
00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:10,720
Speaker 1: he really loves her, I guess it's all right. Like

514
00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 1: I guess we should admire Elvis's restraint here, but like

515
00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,240
Speaker 1: maybe he actually should have been a little more judgmental.

516
00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:21,679
Speaker 1: But I think we're gonna find out shortly why Elvis

517
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,479
Speaker 1: maybe didn't judge Jerry Lee too harshly for marrying an

518
00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,679
Speaker 1: underage girl, right exactly. I mean, Elvis didn't have the

519
00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 1: same kind of spectacular fall from grace, but he had

520
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:32,560
Speaker 1: his own slide after his discharge from the army in

521
00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 1: the early sixties. And this was you know, the famous

522
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,520
Speaker 1: sort of rock and roll bleak period. It was after

523
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:40,040
Speaker 1: the you know, the famous crash that killed Buddy Holly

524
00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:43,520
Speaker 1: and the Big Bopper and Richie Vallens and uh, Jay

525
00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:46,240
Speaker 1: Lee Lewis is canceled, and Chuck Berry had some legal issues,

526
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:48,840
Speaker 1: and I think Little Richard had disavowed rock and roll

527
00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:50,359
Speaker 1: and went to the church. At this point, it was

528
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:53,560
Speaker 1: a bleak time, filled with you know, Fabian and Frankie

529
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:57,560
Speaker 1: Avalon and those kind of teen idol figures, and Uh, Elvis,

530
00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,440
Speaker 1: his songs that he's putting out are more or less

531
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,960
Speaker 1: like sound track fodder for these really rather horrible movies

532
00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:07,200
Speaker 1: that he's making. Songs like fun and Alcapolco and Kissing Cousins.

533
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:09,159
Speaker 1: It was just a little close to home. Uh do

534
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,960
Speaker 1: the clams spin out? Um? In later years. I love

535
00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:16,320
Speaker 1: how Jerry Lee Lewis lays the sort of dearth of

536
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:19,119
Speaker 1: rock and roll in this period squarely at the feet

537
00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,560
Speaker 1: of Elvis, because he would say in later years, Elvis

538
00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,640
Speaker 1: let the Bobbies take it, Bobby Vitten, Bobby Darren, all

539
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,120
Speaker 1: the Bobbies, and they turned it into this like sugary,

540
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,159
Speaker 1: saccharine mess. I always think that was funny. Cherry Lee

541
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:33,720
Speaker 1: blamed him purely for that. Um, but yeah, it concided

542
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,879
Speaker 1: coincided in this general late fifties backlash against rock and

543
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 1: roll and then the period before the early sixties British invasion.

544
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: But like what you were saying earlier, there was a

545
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:45,199
Speaker 1: certain sense of Elvis not wanting to kick Jerry Lee

546
00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:47,440
Speaker 1: because there was the sense of, almost by the grace

547
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 1: of God, go I from Elvis because when he was

548
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 1: in Germany he met a teenager named Priscilla who was

549
00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:58,680
Speaker 1: I believe fourteen at the time, and uh, and they

550
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,960
Speaker 1: started seeing each other casually at first, I should say. Yeah,

551
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:05,280
Speaker 1: Elvis was twenty four when he met Priscilla. And there

552
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,920
Speaker 1: was a real effort by like Elvis's wranglers, like including

553
00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 1: like Colonel Tom Parker and like the guys in the

554
00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:13,520
Speaker 1: Memphis Mafia, you know Memphis Mafia of course, being like

555
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:16,680
Speaker 1: that circle of friends that always surrounded Elvis and and

556
00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:19,280
Speaker 1: took care of everything for him. You know, they looked

557
00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,680
Speaker 1: at Jerry Lewis and they're like, oh my god, Elvis's

558
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 1: dating fourteen year old girl. We can't let this get out.

559
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:27,840
Speaker 1: So there was a lot of effort made to like

560
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:31,160
Speaker 1: basically like make this as like innocent as it could

561
00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:33,920
Speaker 1: be you know, basically pursuing you know, a fourteen year

562
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 1: old girl when you are twenty four year old man.

563
00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:38,959
Speaker 1: So like I guess the early dates, like we're chaperone,

564
00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:41,360
Speaker 1: and like when she moved to Memphis, like she lived

565
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:44,040
Speaker 1: in a separate house from Elvis, she actually lived with

566
00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 1: Elvis's mom and dad, and then she was going to

567
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:49,800
Speaker 1: like a Catholic girls school at the time. Um and

568
00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:53,119
Speaker 1: Elvis and Priscilla actually didn't get married until nineteen seven,

569
00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:56,639
Speaker 1: when she was twenty one, So they did it above board,

570
00:25:56,960 --> 00:25:58,720
Speaker 1: I guess. And you know, it is funny to me

571
00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 1: because you know, we've talked about how like Elvis was

572
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,080
Speaker 1: first and Jerry Lee was second, and like early on

573
00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:05,680
Speaker 1: jerry Lee kind of followed the path that Elvis took

574
00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,360
Speaker 1: to success. But I feel like in this respect, like

575
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 1: jerry Lee was the trailblazer and Elvis followed him, and

576
00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 1: like I was basically like used Jerry Lee as an

577
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:16,399
Speaker 1: example of what not to do. It's like, well, if

578
00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 1: I'm going to date underage girl, I have to keep

579
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 1: it secret at least from the media. And it worked.

580
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:22,639
Speaker 1: I mean, he was able to get away with it.

581
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 1: I think it's funny that, like Jerry Lee like knew

582
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:27,960
Speaker 1: about this the entire time, and he referred to Priscilla

583
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:32,200
Speaker 1: as a live in litleita. So I just wonder like

584
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:34,960
Speaker 1: he must have been like pretty irritated that, like Elvis

585
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 1: got away with this thing that like ruined his career.

586
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 1: And I don't know how much of this was Colonel Tom,

587
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:42,160
Speaker 1: but Elvious seemed a lot more image conscious and good

588
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:44,360
Speaker 1: at manipulating that than Jerry Lee Lee did. I think

589
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:46,760
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee always took the path of like this is me,

590
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:48,400
Speaker 1: take it or leave it, this is who I am.

591
00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 1: But Elvis I think was more concerned with with how

592
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:55,000
Speaker 1: things presented, and obviously that you know, served very well.

593
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 1: I mean you think of the famous like comeback concert

594
00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 1: after he was released from the Army, when he's singing

595
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,640
Speaker 1: with Frank Sinatra, Like he knew how to move over

596
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 1: into that lane and become the all around entertainer and

597
00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 1: graduate from being young, wild rock and roll to something

598
00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 1: that you could make a bunch of movies. I mean,

599
00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:14,240
Speaker 1: you can't imagine Jerry Lee making you know, King Creole

600
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:17,840
Speaker 1: or something like that, and like or clam Bake Jerry

601
00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 1: laund or Viva Las Vegas, like dancing with the and Margaret.

602
00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:26,119
Speaker 1: But what's amazing to me though about Jerry Lee is that, like,

603
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:28,879
Speaker 1: you know, he has this terrible scandal that like for

604
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:31,919
Speaker 1: all intens of purposes, like should have just like blacklisted

605
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,919
Speaker 1: him forever. But he actually did have a comeback in

606
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: the nineteen sixties. Yeah, at the end of the sixties

607
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,680
Speaker 1: he became more of a country artist. He made a

608
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:42,320
Speaker 1: lot of in roads in Nashville on the label Smash

609
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 1: and Uh in nineteen six and he scored some huge

610
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,719
Speaker 1: hits like Another Place, Another Time, What made Milwaukee famous,

611
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 1: made a loser out of me, She still comes around

612
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:53,560
Speaker 1: the left of me. And to Make Love Sweeter for

613
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:55,400
Speaker 1: You was his first number one in the country charts

614
00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:57,919
Speaker 1: since Great Balls of Fire a decade earlier. Yeah, I

615
00:27:57,960 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 1: just want to do a quick shout out to to

616
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 1: like this class a live album that Jerry Lee put

617
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 1: out in nineteen sixty four called Live at the Star Club.

618
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,239
Speaker 1: I don't know if you've heard this. It's like an

619
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,679
Speaker 1: incredible record is recorded in Hamburg, Germany with this band

620
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 1: called the Nashville Teens, and it's like one of the

621
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,800
Speaker 1: most like energetic and like chaotic live records like I've

622
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:18,119
Speaker 1: ever heard, like you feel like you're in the room

623
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 1: when Cherry Lee is playing, and whenever I put it on,

624
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,119
Speaker 1: I just pictured like really drunk Germans getting into fist

625
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,720
Speaker 1: fights in the audience. Well, like Jerry Lee is just

626
00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:30,120
Speaker 1: bashing out like mean women blues and like what I'd say,

627
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:32,440
Speaker 1: and all these great songs, And it really is like

628
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,200
Speaker 1: a fitting contrast, like with Elvis for most of the sixties,

629
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 1: because like Elvis wasn't touring at all at that time,

630
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: he was just making movies, and like Jerry Lee, you know, meanwhile,

631
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 1: I was like out on the road, like rocking his

632
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:45,000
Speaker 1: ass off, and like when you listen to Live at

633
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:46,880
Speaker 1: the Star Club, it sounds like he's playing for his

634
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 1: life because like in a way he is. You know,

635
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: it's like he had to, you know, kind of play

636
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:53,880
Speaker 1: his heart out or else, you know, he would have

637
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 1: just drifted into oblivion. We're gonna take a quick break

638
00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 1: to get a word from our sponsor before we get

639
00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:10,960
Speaker 1: to more rivals. So he finds his way back to

640
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 1: the top of the charts in November Night with to

641
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 1: Make Love Sweeter for You. Uh, this should be his

642
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:19,520
Speaker 1: great moment. You know, he's back after years in the wilderness,

643
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:23,760
Speaker 1: but This is when Elvis awoke the hip swiveling beast within.

644
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 1: It's been suggested that Elvis's famous NBC TV special in

645
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:31,440
Speaker 1: Late Night was sort of prodded along by by Jerry

646
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 1: Lee Lewis. He saw Jerry Lee back on the top

647
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:35,400
Speaker 1: of the charts, and and that was sort of what

648
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:36,840
Speaker 1: made him think, Okay, you know what, I got us

649
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 1: screwing around in these crappy movies and actually get back

650
00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 1: to doing what people love me for, which is rocking

651
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,719
Speaker 1: out in It's crazy to think, but Elvis hadn't had

652
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 1: a top ten hit in five years at that point,

653
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: and this TV special was Initially I think it was

654
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:52,520
Speaker 1: a lot smaller. I think it was supposed to be

655
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:54,680
Speaker 1: in a dendem to, like another movie. It was like

656
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 1: part of a movie deal, and it was just a

657
00:29:56,440 --> 00:30:02,360
Speaker 1: small thing. But then it became this huge, big budget extravaganza,

658
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 1: which is, you know, one of the most beloved Elvis

659
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 1: pieces of film ever. I mean, just when he opens

660
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 1: and stares down the camera singing trouble and then segueing

661
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 1: into guitar Man. I mean, it's it's what he does best.

662
00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 1: I think it's it's maybe my favorite. Yeah, I think

663
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 1: It's my favorite moment of Elvis on film, just that

664
00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:21,360
Speaker 1: opening shot when he's just staring down the camera lens

665
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 1: and you're right, I mean it's crazy. I think that

666
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 1: he hadn't performed live in more than seven years, and

667
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,959
Speaker 1: with that in mind, it's really nuts. How good he sounded.

668
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:32,880
Speaker 1: I mean both physically and vocally. He looks perfect. He's

669
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:35,200
Speaker 1: in this like great leather get up. That kind of

670
00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 1: is a cool way to harken back to how he was,

671
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:40,040
Speaker 1: you know in the fifties. Is twentysomething guy who drove

672
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:43,479
Speaker 1: kids wild on ed Sullivan. But he just ruled the

673
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 1: stage with the supreme confidence. It is great. It is

674
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 1: the moment that the King returned for his crown. It

675
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 1: was the highest rated TV special of the year. It

676
00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:55,400
Speaker 1: provided a huge shot in the arm to Elvis's music career,

677
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 1: and as a direct resolve of the production, he decided

678
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: to start refocusing on music and the memph sound that

679
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 1: he originally loved, and within weeks he recorded Suspicious Minds,

680
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 1: which reached number one, that year's first number one. And

681
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:09,080
Speaker 1: I think nearly ten years, you know, and I have

682
00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 1: to say that the Elvis of like this period, like

683
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 1: in the late sixties and even into the early seventies

684
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 1: is like my favorite Elvis period. You know, like he

685
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: looked and he sounded great, but he had like a

686
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:20,680
Speaker 1: more mature outlook that showed that he could grow out

687
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 1: of his teenatal image. And he mentioned suspicious minds. That's

688
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:25,440
Speaker 1: a great song. You have sounds like in the ghetto.

689
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 1: You have that record Elvis Country, which is great, just

690
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,240
Speaker 1: putting out tons of like wonderful music. Again, I feel

691
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: like Jerry Lee signifies the wildness of rock and roll

692
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 1: better than Elvis. But Elvis ultimately, to me, is like

693
00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,640
Speaker 1: the greater singer and like the overall better artist. To

694
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 1: get back to my earlier point, I think Elvis's greatest

695
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: talent ultimately was being able to bring together all these

696
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,520
Speaker 1: different kinds of music in a way that really hadn't

697
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:50,880
Speaker 1: been done before, and he made it like makes sense,

698
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:53,120
Speaker 1: you know, like you listened to the records that he made,

699
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:55,440
Speaker 1: you know, after that Comeback Special in the late sixties

700
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:57,880
Speaker 1: and early seventies, and like he's recording songs by James

701
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 1: Taylor and the b GS. He's making estan rock records.

702
00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,160
Speaker 1: He's getting into that like Tony Joe White style swamp

703
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 1: rock you know, he's doing easy listening ballads. There's like

704
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:09,320
Speaker 1: R and B. He's like all over the map, and

705
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,680
Speaker 1: it works because it's Elvis, and you feel like he's

706
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: just able to synthesize all these things into one sort

707
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 1: of really attractive package. I feel like the operatic background

708
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 1: of Elvis isn't appreciated enough. I mean, I think of

709
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,719
Speaker 1: those clips of like really I think towards the end

710
00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:25,640
Speaker 1: of his life, probably a few months before he died,

711
00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: those shows where he's singing, He's at the piano, singing

712
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,720
Speaker 1: unchained melody and he hits that high note and it's

713
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:34,120
Speaker 1: just I mean, he sounds like Caruso or something. I mean,

714
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 1: it is this you're right, and you hear the opera

715
00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 1: influence through that and then doing a version of the him.

716
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: How great thou art? I think in the same era

717
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 1: of shows, it's just unbelievable to hear that voice. I mean,

718
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 1: that's something that you know, you think of the hip swiveling,

719
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,160
Speaker 1: you think of the rock and roll stuff, but just

720
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,520
Speaker 1: the power of that is really something special, and he

721
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 1: uses it really well in this era. I agree. It's

722
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 1: one of my favorite Elvis eras this is around the

723
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 1: time when He's doing a series of shows at the

724
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:07,280
Speaker 1: International Hotel in Las Vegas, which is really some of

725
00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:10,120
Speaker 1: his best shows, I think, and in a move that

726
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:13,640
Speaker 1: was either passive aggressive or a genuine act of friendly

727
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 1: you know, Sun Records Brotherhood that can't tell which. Presley

728
00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,320
Speaker 1: tracked Jerry Lee Lewis down to some hotel in Columbus,

729
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:22,800
Speaker 1: Ohio and invited him to see the Vegas show at

730
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 1: the International, which Jerry Lee accepted. So Jerry Lee goes

731
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:30,000
Speaker 1: to seeing Elvis's show at the International Hotel and Elvis

732
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:32,160
Speaker 1: is a really great thing. He introduces him to the crowd.

733
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:34,040
Speaker 1: He has, you know, Jerry Lee stand up in the

734
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:36,200
Speaker 1: middle and uh, and the crowd gives him a big

735
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:39,240
Speaker 1: standing ovation, which is, you know, I think, very sweet.

736
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 1: The next year, Jerry Lee will be playing the International

737
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:45,000
Speaker 1: with his own band, but he's playing the lounge while

738
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:47,720
Speaker 1: Elvis is playing the main room. You could tell what

739
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: this gall Jerry Lee. Years later, he's talking to his

740
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:55,040
Speaker 1: biographer Rick Bragg, and Uh, he was saying, Yeah, I

741
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 1: was playing the lounge, but I mean the lounge was big.

742
00:33:57,480 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 1: I mean the main room would see like three thousand

743
00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 1: p bowl, but the room I was in was like

744
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 1: so I was hitting Elvis tip for tat, So you

745
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:07,400
Speaker 1: can tell even that this point years later, he was

746
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:10,400
Speaker 1: annoyed by that. Yeah, it was a big lounge. I

747
00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: like that as like his defense. It was a large lounge.

748
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:15,360
Speaker 1: Ye it was, you know, it was almost the lounge

749
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 1: was almost as large as the big room. Yeah, I'm

750
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:19,880
Speaker 1: sure that was true. And of course Jerry Lee had

751
00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:22,399
Speaker 1: to take shots at Elvis's show at the time. He said,

752
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:25,040
Speaker 1: like he had this big band with horns and violin

753
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:27,120
Speaker 1: stuff like that, and I don't think it ever came

754
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:29,279
Speaker 1: off that good. He was trying to prove something that

755
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:33,400
Speaker 1: didn't really need proven. And this has continued in Natasha's

756
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:36,600
Speaker 1: book hell Fire, where he actually writes about I guess

757
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:40,480
Speaker 1: how there was this confrontation supposedly between Jerry Lee and

758
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:43,040
Speaker 1: Elvis at this time, like where Jerry Lee confronted Elvis

759
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 1: about how he felt like he wasn't really staying true

760
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:47,479
Speaker 1: to his rock and roll roots. Like in the book

761
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:49,759
Speaker 1: it says, you don't know what you're doing, You're just

762
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:52,680
Speaker 1: Colonel Parker's puppet. And then Elvis shoots back, and this

763
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 1: is like one of the few times like when you

764
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,359
Speaker 1: feel like Elvis actually like fights back against Jerry Lee.

765
00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 1: He says, well, if I'm so dumb and you're so smart,

766
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:01,279
Speaker 1: how is it that I'm playing the main room and

767
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:04,440
Speaker 1: you're playing the lounge, which the very big lounge. Yeah,

768
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 1: Elvis didn't know how big this lounge was, but he's

769
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,040
Speaker 1: taking a shot at Jerry for doing that. And you know,

770
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 1: I guess like Jerry Lee also had an issue with

771
00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 1: Colonel Tom Parker, like in the anecdote, like accuses Elvis

772
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:17,960
Speaker 1: of being Colonel Tom Parker's puppet. Apparently there was like

773
00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 1: another incident like where Jerry Lee was like hanging out

774
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 1: in Elvis's dressing room and like Colonel Tom Parker like

775
00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 1: kicked Jerry Lee out, and like Jerry Lee was like,

776
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 1: I wouldn't let no loudmouth old man tell me who

777
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:30,840
Speaker 1: I can have a drink with. So yeah, again, I

778
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:33,239
Speaker 1: feel like this is like an instance again like where

779
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:35,640
Speaker 1: I think Elvis was genuinely trying to be nice to

780
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:38,640
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee Lewis and and Jerry Lee just couldn't really

781
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:41,280
Speaker 1: appreciate it. Yeah, I mean there was some other small

782
00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,120
Speaker 1: petty incidents between them in the seventies, was mostly Jerry

783
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 1: Lee as the guilty party. He would talk about him

784
00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:49,279
Speaker 1: on the press about betraying rock and roll in their

785
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 1: early sixties. He had a great quote, there's very few

786
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: great talents left. You got Elvis Pressley, Chuck Berry, Charlie Rich,

787
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:58,719
Speaker 1: bb King. I'm not saying I'm one of them. I'm

788
00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:03,239
Speaker 1: saying I'm the main on, which is great. And he

789
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:05,840
Speaker 1: records a cover of Billy Swan's I Can Help, and

790
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:08,640
Speaker 1: he's launching into his piano solo, and he goes on

791
00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 1: the mic and says, think about it, Elvis right in

792
00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:13,319
Speaker 1: the piano break. I mean, he loves taunting Elvis, and

793
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:16,799
Speaker 1: Elvis meanwhile, I guess the only way that he kind

794
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,359
Speaker 1: of played along was I guess, um, Jerry Lee got

795
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:22,239
Speaker 1: his own lear Jet, and so I was responded by

796
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 1: getting a bow and seven oh seven jet, which I'm

797
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:28,719
Speaker 1: fairly certain and significantly larger than a lear Jet. So

798
00:36:28,760 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 1: they moved on from competing over El Dorado's and now

799
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:34,640
Speaker 1: they're moving on to to having a pissing match with jets,

800
00:36:34,719 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 1: which is uh, which is great. I think you can

801
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 1: like see the plane at Graceland. I think it's across

802
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 1: the street, and like the TCB taking care of business

803
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:45,800
Speaker 1: is like written on like the back fin of the plane.

804
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,840
Speaker 1: It looks very badass and it yeah, definitely larger than

805
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:51,879
Speaker 1: a lear Jet. And this goes down in the ninety six,

806
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 1: the nation's bicentennial year, and this was a tough one

807
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:58,240
Speaker 1: for Jerry Lee. He was arrested for accidentally shooting his drummer,

808
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:01,120
Speaker 1: which is quite a sidebar you there. Yeah, it was

809
00:37:01,160 --> 00:37:03,600
Speaker 1: an accident. Shortan we have to emphasize that it was

810
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 1: an accident for legal reason, makes it okay. Yeah, we

811
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,359
Speaker 1: were emphasized that it was an accident. Uh. And this

812
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,359
Speaker 1: was also the year that Jerry Lee took Elvis up

813
00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 1: on his offer to visit grace Land and he got

814
00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 1: arrested for it. And now this is probably the single

815
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:19,680
Speaker 1: most mythical moment between these two. It went down in

816
00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:23,279
Speaker 1: the early morning hours of November twenty three, ninety six.

817
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:26,000
Speaker 1: It was actually his second attempt to enter grace Land

818
00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:29,279
Speaker 1: that week, the same time the previous evening, he rolled

819
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:31,359
Speaker 1: up in his Rolls Royce, only to be told by

820
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,520
Speaker 1: the gate guard that Elvis was asleep. So Jerry Lee

821
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:37,439
Speaker 1: very politely thanked the guy and drove off, but later

822
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: crashed his Rolls Royce and was cited for driving not

823
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,520
Speaker 1: only under the influence, but without a license. And then

824
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 1: so the next day he returns and there are really

825
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:48,600
Speaker 1: two versions of what happened next you Elvis his version

826
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:51,440
Speaker 1: and Jerry Lee's version. Yeah, So the Elvis version is

827
00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:54,839
Speaker 1: that Jerry Lee rolls up to Grace Land at like

828
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:58,280
Speaker 1: three in the morning, and uh, this time, he's driving

829
00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,920
Speaker 1: a new Lincoln Continent. I'm not supposed to be driving.

830
00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 1: Did he like buy the car that earlier that day?

831
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:06,480
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if he already had this

832
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,160
Speaker 1: car or if he bought a new car after crashing

833
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 1: the Rolls Royce. But anyway, he has a Lincoln Continental

834
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 1: and he's very drunk at the time, and he's very angry,

835
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:18,319
Speaker 1: and he happens to be armed with a thirty eight

836
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:21,320
Speaker 1: derringer and he's waving it around basically, and he's screaming

837
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:24,400
Speaker 1: and he's saying that he like, I want to see Elvis. Now.

838
00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:27,120
Speaker 1: The Memphis Mafia guys, you know, they're lounging about. They're

839
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:30,200
Speaker 1: probably playing poker or something, eating corn chips, you know,

840
00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 1: whatever it is that the Memphis Mafia guys do. They

841
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:35,800
Speaker 1: see this and they're like, we can't let this maniac

842
00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:38,680
Speaker 1: near Elvis, so they decided to call the cops, and uh,

843
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 1: during all the commotion, Elvis actually wakes up and he

844
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,800
Speaker 1: calls down and he says, what does that goddamn guy want?

845
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:47,120
Speaker 1: All I want to do is sleep. I don't want

846
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:50,120
Speaker 1: to talk to that crazy son of a bitch. Elvis

847
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:53,400
Speaker 1: tells his guard to quote lock his butt up and

848
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,080
Speaker 1: throw away the goddamn key, and then he basically like

849
00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:59,000
Speaker 1: gets a bowl of popcorn and starts watching the drama

850
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:03,279
Speaker 1: unfold on his close circuit TV. Now, Jerry Lee, this

851
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:05,319
Speaker 1: is the second time he's been turned away, so he's

852
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:09,040
Speaker 1: like really angry that he's been rebuked. So he gets

853
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,319
Speaker 1: behind the wheel of his car again. He's drunk as hell,

854
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,800
Speaker 1: he's armed with a thirty eight, and he starts ramming

855
00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:19,399
Speaker 1: the gate with his brand new Lincoln Continental. And apparently, like,

856
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know what he was gonna do

857
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 1: if he got inside Graceland. You know again, like I

858
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 1: said this earlier that he like literally tried to kill Elvis.

859
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:28,400
Speaker 1: I don't know if he was actually gonna shoot Elvis,

860
00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:31,479
Speaker 1: but like he was obviously not in the right mind

861
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 1: at this time, but he didn't end up hurting Elvis.

862
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:38,000
Speaker 1: He only hurt himself because he tried to throw an

863
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:42,279
Speaker 1: empty champagne bottle through his car window. Unfortunately, the car

864
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:45,760
Speaker 1: window I think was closed, so he broke the window

865
00:39:46,719 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 1: with this empty champagne bottle and he got like a

866
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:51,240
Speaker 1: bunch of glass in his face and you know, cuts

867
00:39:51,239 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 1: and all that stuff. So that is the Elvis version

868
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:56,560
Speaker 1: of this story. Now, Jerry Lee like he was basically saying, like,

869
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:58,719
Speaker 1: hey man, I was just playing around, right, I mean,

870
00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 1: like he was trying to down play the seriousness of

871
00:40:01,080 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 1: this incident. Yeah, he basically was saying that he was.

872
00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 1: He was coming from a club and you know what,

873
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:07,440
Speaker 1: the club owner had something to do with local law

874
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,319
Speaker 1: enforcement and gifted him this gun, and it was it

875
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 1: was a good, nice gun. He was. He appreciated having it,

876
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:15,359
Speaker 1: and he put it on the dashboard of his car

877
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:17,920
Speaker 1: so that if he got pulled over something and they

878
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 1: found it on him, he wouldn't be arrested for carrying

879
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 1: a concealed weapon. It wasn't concealed. It was right on

880
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:25,680
Speaker 1: top of the car. And so he pulled up, you know,

881
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 1: totally logical, Great, Jerry Lee Lewis logic right there. He

882
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 1: pulls up to Elvis's mansion, the grace Land talks to

883
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 1: the gate guy. The guy at the gate sees the

884
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 1: gun is what You're gonna kill Elvis, and Jerry Lee

885
00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 1: just totally just to RaSE the guys, that joke is like, yeah,

886
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:41,840
Speaker 1: that's right, I'm gonna kill kill Elvis. That's exactly what

887
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:44,319
Speaker 1: I'm here to do. Uh. And according to Jerry Lee,

888
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 1: it was just a joke that got out of hand.

889
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,120
Speaker 1: All he wanted to do was to see his friend.

890
00:40:49,560 --> 00:40:51,600
Speaker 1: And he would say go on record saying that he

891
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:56,319
Speaker 1: was really hurt that Elvis, uh, you know, allowed him

892
00:40:56,360 --> 00:40:58,440
Speaker 1: to to be locked up. He was he was charged

893
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:02,200
Speaker 1: with carrying a pistol and public drunkenness and um, it

894
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 1: really hurt his feelings. And uh, I believe that was

895
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 1: the last time they ever saw each other. And they

896
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:10,600
Speaker 1: didn't see each other the last time they ever interacted. Yep.

897
00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:13,160
Speaker 1: I think Jerry Lee ended up getting cited for like

898
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:15,680
Speaker 1: carrying a pistol in public drunkenness and released on a

899
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:18,240
Speaker 1: twitter and fifty dollar bond. You have to love Memphis

900
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:21,040
Speaker 1: like I love that. That's all that happened to Jerry Lee.

901
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:22,640
Speaker 1: That's all that's all he had to pay it out

902
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:24,840
Speaker 1: of jail. But yeah, you know, Jerry Lee and Elvis

903
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 1: they never saw each other again because, sadly, as we

904
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:30,840
Speaker 1: all know, on August sixteenth, nine seventy seven, Elvis Presley

905
00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 1: passed away at the age of forty two. Quick aside

906
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,760
Speaker 1: about this. You know, Elvis uh and Jerry Lee Lewis

907
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:40,279
Speaker 1: were both customers of the infamous doctor Nick, who like

908
00:41:40,560 --> 00:41:43,200
Speaker 1: was the doctor Like I think he eventually lost his

909
00:41:43,239 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 1: license because he was like over prescribing drugs to Elvis,

910
00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 1: you know, and obviously contributed to his death. But I

911
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:52,880
Speaker 1: think you like continued to hook Jerry Lee Lewis up

912
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:55,560
Speaker 1: with drugs like after that happened. Like if you read

913
00:41:55,560 --> 00:41:57,640
Speaker 1: stories about Jerry Lee Lewis in the early eighties, he

914
00:41:57,680 --> 00:42:00,279
Speaker 1: was like literally like taking like a hypodermic needle and

915
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:03,080
Speaker 1: like injecting drugs into his stomach because he had like

916
00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:05,440
Speaker 1: stomach issues at the time, and apparently that didn't really

917
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:07,720
Speaker 1: help his stomach. It just made his stomach issues worse,

918
00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 1: which you never would have predicted that that would happen

919
00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:13,000
Speaker 1: that you know, drunk asked Jerry Lee Lewis shoving needles

920
00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:15,040
Speaker 1: into his stomach would be a bad thing, But at

921
00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 1: the time when Elvis died, someone asked Jerry Lewis what

922
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,120
Speaker 1: he thought about it, and Jerry Leuie Lewis was, let's

923
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:23,440
Speaker 1: say again like he didn't have great relations with the press.

924
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:25,399
Speaker 1: You know, this goes back to the fifties. He's showing

925
00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:27,880
Speaker 1: off his underage bride to the press. You know, flash

926
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:30,239
Speaker 1: forward now to the death of Elvis. You would think

927
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:33,520
Speaker 1: that he would offer, you know, solemn words of tribute

928
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:36,839
Speaker 1: or condolences to his family. No, Jerry Lee doesn't do that.

929
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:39,239
Speaker 1: What he says, instaid is that I was glad that

930
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:42,680
Speaker 1: Elvis died. Just another one out of the way. I mean, Elvis,

931
00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:45,680
Speaker 1: this Elvis. That all we hear about is Elvis. What

932
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:49,200
Speaker 1: the ship did Elvis do except take dope? I couldn't

933
00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:53,680
Speaker 1: get hold of. Uh. Look, we've only got one left

934
00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:56,120
Speaker 1: to live. We don't have the promise of the next breath.

935
00:42:56,200 --> 00:42:58,520
Speaker 1: I know what I am. I'm a romp and stomp

936
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:01,439
Speaker 1: and piano player and son of a bitch, A mean

937
00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:03,719
Speaker 1: son of a bitch, but a great son of a bitch,

938
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:06,239
Speaker 1: a good person. I don't know about that. Jerry Lee

939
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:10,040
Speaker 1: never heard nobody unless they got in my way. And uh,

940
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:11,919
Speaker 1: I'm sure that he was like out of his mind

941
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 1: drunk when he gave this quote. At least I hope

942
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 1: he was like not in his right mind when he

943
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:18,319
Speaker 1: gave it. But like he said something later that I

944
00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:21,799
Speaker 1: think is actually like pretty telling of like both his

945
00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:25,840
Speaker 1: own worldview and I think a fairly accurate summation of Elvis.

946
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:27,799
Speaker 1: You know, he said, I got a mean streak in me.

947
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:31,439
Speaker 1: Elvis did too, he hit his I didn't hide mind,

948
00:43:31,719 --> 00:43:34,360
Speaker 1: I gotta laid open sometimes. And you know, whatever you

949
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:36,080
Speaker 1: want to say about Jerry Lee Lewis, I mean, I

950
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:39,719
Speaker 1: think he is maybe like a legitimately evil guy, Like

951
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:42,799
Speaker 1: in a lot of ways, he's not dishonest. You know,

952
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:46,759
Speaker 1: he's upfront with his demons, and uh, you know that's true.

953
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:48,719
Speaker 1: I think for better or worse, Yeah, I think that

954
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 1: Elvis got away with stuff because he played the good

955
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:54,720
Speaker 1: southern mama's boy, and Jerry Lee was just always unapologetically

956
00:43:54,880 --> 00:43:56,600
Speaker 1: you know, as he named one of his albums, I

957
00:43:56,719 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 1: mean old man, And uh, you know I like that that.

958
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 1: Sam Phillips sort of judged how these two guys felt

959
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:04,439
Speaker 1: about each other had a great quote where he said,

960
00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 1: for two monumental people, you know you're gonna have a

961
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 1: little jealousy, which is really good if it doesn't go

962
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 1: beyond the bounds of reasonable taste. Elvis Presley, every time

963
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 1: he had the chance to listen to Jerry Lee, he did.

964
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:16,360
Speaker 1: Every time Jerry had a chance to listen to Elvis,

965
00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:19,400
Speaker 1: he did. It wasn't just camaraderie, it was total respect

966
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:21,960
Speaker 1: for each other as great musicians. Where do they rank

967
00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:25,360
Speaker 1: in the pantheon of music? Uh? Let Jerry Lee have

968
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:29,719
Speaker 1: a line? Uh after me was Elvis and uh coming

969
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:32,319
Speaker 1: from Jerry Lee. That's high praise all right hand. We'll

970
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:43,719
Speaker 1: be right back with more rivals. We've not reached the

971
00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:45,520
Speaker 1: part of our episode where we give the pro side

972
00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:47,840
Speaker 1: of each part of the rivalry. Let's talk about Elvis

973
00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:51,279
Speaker 1: Presley first. This might be an insane argument to make,

974
00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:54,040
Speaker 1: but I kind of feel like at this point Elvis

975
00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:57,719
Speaker 1: is maybe like a little bit underrated. I think think

976
00:44:57,760 --> 00:44:59,960
Speaker 1: the worst thing to happen to his legacy was being

977
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:02,640
Speaker 1: dubbed the King of rock and roll because it always

978
00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:04,960
Speaker 1: compels people to take him down a peg. I mean,

979
00:45:05,000 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 1: it's true, Elvis is just one part of a scene

980
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:09,840
Speaker 1: in like that early fifties rock and roll world that

981
00:45:09,880 --> 00:45:12,920
Speaker 1: includes Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Buddy Holly, and of course

982
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:15,919
Speaker 1: Mr Jerry Lee Lewis, and all those artists are kings

983
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 1: of rock and roll. What I would say about Elvis though,

984
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:20,200
Speaker 1: is that I think his music was the broadest out

985
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:22,680
Speaker 1: of all those icons, Like he drew on a wider

986
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:24,880
Speaker 1: range of influences, and I think he was able to

987
00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:27,640
Speaker 1: synthesize just an incredible amount of music in a way

988
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 1: that hadn't really been done before. Yeah, I agree with

989
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:33,000
Speaker 1: all those other people you mentioned. I almost think I

990
00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:36,040
Speaker 1: would listen to of the Chuck Berrys, Little Richards, Buddy Holly's,

991
00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:37,600
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee Lewis is. I think I would listen to

992
00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:40,600
Speaker 1: Elvis's last in that list, just because I find the

993
00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: other so much more fiery and just compelling. But as

994
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:48,840
Speaker 1: a figure, I am absolutely and completely captivated by Elvis.

995
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:52,960
Speaker 1: I've getten to Graceland, I've watched many docks and books

996
00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:54,800
Speaker 1: about him, and I'm still it's the same way I

997
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:57,319
Speaker 1: fell with the Beatles too. It's this spell, it's this

998
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:01,160
Speaker 1: this phenomenon that I still ruggle to make sense of,

999
00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:05,719
Speaker 1: how this this whole industry around him, and the cultural

1000
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:08,320
Speaker 1: impact and just even just the economics of it all

1001
00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 1: was just all by this one guy. That was the

1002
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 1: craziest part of going the Grace Land too, because you

1003
00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 1: go there and you know, it's like seeing the Mona

1004
00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:17,880
Speaker 1: Lisa or something. It's a lots smaller than you you

1005
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:20,200
Speaker 1: built it up in your mind, and the human scale

1006
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 1: of it is really fascinating. So just to think about

1007
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:25,759
Speaker 1: how one guy could have such an oversized impact like

1008
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:29,319
Speaker 1: that is just is so so so interesting to me.

1009
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 1: But like I said, musical talent, I don't think this

1010
00:46:32,239 --> 00:46:34,960
Speaker 1: is a really you know, groundbreaking argument. I think that

1011
00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:38,720
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee out ranks him in that department. But vocally, yeah,

1012
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:41,680
Speaker 1: I think that his his musical style really ran the

1013
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:44,759
Speaker 1: gamut from you know, rock and roll growl that some

1014
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 1: of the gospel stuff that he did in later years,

1015
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 1: I think it was amazing. As his country records, I

1016
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:52,040
Speaker 1: definitely think he had a wider musical pal than Jerry Lee.

1017
00:46:52,360 --> 00:46:54,560
Speaker 1: So if we go over to the Jerry Lee Lewis side,

1018
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:57,040
Speaker 1: you know, so much of our show is talking about

1019
00:46:57,040 --> 00:47:01,000
Speaker 1: like crazy people in rock bands, but Jerry le Lewis

1020
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:03,800
Speaker 1: to me is like the original rock and roll maniac,

1021
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:06,279
Speaker 1: and I think he might be crazier than anyone else

1022
00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:08,720
Speaker 1: in rock history. I mean, like the passage of time

1023
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 1: hasn't really dulled the dangerous edge of his music or

1024
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:14,200
Speaker 1: his persona. Like I think again, if he did any

1025
00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:15,759
Speaker 1: of the things that he did in the fifties now,

1026
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:18,719
Speaker 1: like he'd probably be canceled even quicker than he was

1027
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:22,240
Speaker 1: in the nineteen fifties. And uh, I still feel like today,

1028
00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:24,440
Speaker 1: like there's no one that can hold a candle to him,

1029
00:47:24,480 --> 00:47:26,680
Speaker 1: just as far as being an incredible character. Like you know,

1030
00:47:26,680 --> 00:47:29,560
Speaker 1: we talked about Marilyn Manson in a recent episode, but

1031
00:47:29,640 --> 00:47:32,919
Speaker 1: like so much of him is like constructed. There's nothing

1032
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:35,799
Speaker 1: constructed about Jerry Lee Lewis. If anything, there's probably lots

1033
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:38,839
Speaker 1: of terrible things that we don't know about him. He's

1034
00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:40,840
Speaker 1: like a like a sinister onion, you know, like with

1035
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:44,439
Speaker 1: just layers of evil upon evil. But it gives him,

1036
00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 1: I think, an edge, uh. And but it gives him,

1037
00:47:47,719 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 1: I think, an edge that just makes him totally unique

1038
00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 1: in rock history. And that's in addition to his music,

1039
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:55,440
Speaker 1: which I think today even now is still great and

1040
00:47:55,480 --> 00:47:57,400
Speaker 1: it's still a loud and it's still rackus and like

1041
00:47:57,440 --> 00:48:00,320
Speaker 1: if you like again edgy, dangerous rock and roll jerythe

1042
00:48:00,400 --> 00:48:01,880
Speaker 1: Lewis is always going to be at the top of

1043
00:48:01,920 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 1: that list. Oh yeah, absolutely. I mean Jerry Lee was

1044
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:06,680
Speaker 1: a better pure musician than Elvis, and they both knew it.

1045
00:48:06,719 --> 00:48:09,040
Speaker 1: Elvis once said that if he could play piano like

1046
00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:12,200
Speaker 1: Jerry Lee, he would quit singing. I think musically, Jerry

1047
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:14,440
Speaker 1: contributed more to the genre than than Elvis did. I

1048
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:16,719
Speaker 1: think he's truer to the spirit of rock and roll.

1049
00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:19,279
Speaker 1: I mean, the sex, the drugs, the guns, the insanity.

1050
00:48:19,440 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 1: I mean, even though Elvis maybe the sort of rock

1051
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:24,480
Speaker 1: star archetype, I'm hard pressed to name someone who lived

1052
00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 1: the more rock and roll life than Jerry Lee Lewis.

1053
00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:29,160
Speaker 1: So if you look at these guys together, I mean, look,

1054
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:31,360
Speaker 1: as we've talked about in this episode, they pushed and

1055
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:34,440
Speaker 1: they prodded each other like for for decades, you know.

1056
00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:36,520
Speaker 1: And and in a way this is someone reductive, but

1057
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:38,359
Speaker 1: you could say that it was a battle between God

1058
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:41,520
Speaker 1: and Satan, you know, for the soul of rock and roll.

1059
00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:44,919
Speaker 1: And uh they also you know, were and of course

1060
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 1: when they both ended up dating teenagers, they were kind

1061
00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:49,319
Speaker 1: enough to look the other way. So, you know, even

1062
00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:51,879
Speaker 1: though they were battling, they were nice when it came

1063
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 1: to their underage brides give the final word to Jerry

1064
00:48:55,160 --> 00:48:59,600
Speaker 1: Lee again, Elvis was the greatest, but I'm the best. Okay, Well,

1065
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:01,160
Speaker 1: this is the part the episode that where we would

1066
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:03,200
Speaker 1: normally like why I guess I would normally say, like

1067
00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:05,440
Speaker 1: a terrible pun and then we would say, like, we're

1068
00:49:05,440 --> 00:49:08,440
Speaker 1: gonna be back next week with more beefs and feuds

1069
00:49:08,440 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 1: and long swimming resentments. And actually we did record that

1070
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:14,600
Speaker 1: part of this episode when we originally like like did

1071
00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 1: this uh this thing, but like we found out after

1072
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:20,040
Speaker 1: we record this episode that like I Heart Radio is

1073
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:23,000
Speaker 1: not going to be picking up our option, so like

1074
00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:25,640
Speaker 1: we are no longer on the network, which means like

1075
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:28,000
Speaker 1: for you, like you don't really care what network we're on,

1076
00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:30,200
Speaker 1: but it means that, like I don't know where the

1077
00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 1: show goes from here at best at the moment, we

1078
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:36,000
Speaker 1: are going on hiatus. There have been discussions that we

1079
00:49:36,080 --> 00:49:38,560
Speaker 1: might end up on another network, in which case we'll

1080
00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:42,120
Speaker 1: be back soon and everything will proceed as normal. But uh,

1081
00:49:42,239 --> 00:49:44,520
Speaker 1: it's also possible that this is like the last episode

1082
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:48,600
Speaker 1: of Rivals ever, which is like a surprise and a disappointment.

1083
00:49:48,920 --> 00:49:50,840
Speaker 1: But I think the moral of the story here is

1084
00:49:50,880 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 1: that you don't make fun of David geffin I think

1085
00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:58,439
Speaker 1: the long arm of David Geffen has taken us out

1086
00:49:58,560 --> 00:50:01,279
Speaker 1: Jordan's so, you know, I I'm I'm sorry to say it.

1087
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:03,120
Speaker 1: You know, hopefully we'll be back, but you know, if

1088
00:50:03,160 --> 00:50:05,320
Speaker 1: we're not, it's been a pleasure doing this with you,

1089
00:50:05,480 --> 00:50:08,000
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, I hope everyone enjoyed the show

1090
00:50:08,040 --> 00:50:10,680
Speaker 1: while it lasted. I just got to say, man, I

1091
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:13,279
Speaker 1: knew I shouldn't have criticized the boys of Sound. That

1092
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:17,000
Speaker 1: really probably it. It is Don Henley and David geff

1093
00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:19,880
Speaker 1: and they finally made up and uh they were like,

1094
00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 1: let's conspire to take out this medium popular music podcast

1095
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:27,080
Speaker 1: so that we can feel something again. Yeah, I think

1096
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 1: that's what happened. Again. It's disappointing, but life goes on again.

1097
00:50:31,280 --> 00:50:33,600
Speaker 1: We may be back, but we may not be back.

1098
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:36,319
Speaker 1: I don't know. This is like a cliffhanger that we're

1099
00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:38,640
Speaker 1: leaving you on. So if we are back, I look

1100
00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:41,760
Speaker 1: forward to talking to you guys again about these summering

1101
00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:43,960
Speaker 1: resentments and beefs and feuds soon. If this is our

1102
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:46,400
Speaker 1: last episode, thank you for your support. You know, we

1103
00:50:46,480 --> 00:50:50,759
Speaker 1: had an outpouring of very nice comments on Twitter when

1104
00:50:50,840 --> 00:50:53,719
Speaker 1: when I said that we were being dropped by our

1105
00:50:53,760 --> 00:50:56,359
Speaker 1: heart and I really appreciate that, and uh, I know

1106
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:58,960
Speaker 1: Jordan's I'm sure you appreciate it too, So thank you

1107
00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:01,600
Speaker 1: all for listening, maybe for the last time, but you know,

1108
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:04,360
Speaker 1: maybe not we'll see you know. I mean sort of

1109
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:06,279
Speaker 1: sad that this is audio and not videos, so we

1110
00:51:06,320 --> 00:51:08,799
Speaker 1: can't do any like montages to that Green Day song

1111
00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:10,920
Speaker 1: or in My Life or something. But yeah, I mean

1112
00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:12,840
Speaker 1: I feel like Captain von Trapp at the end of

1113
00:51:12,840 --> 00:51:15,279
Speaker 1: the Sound of Music, you know, like Rival's listeners, like

1114
00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:17,759
Speaker 1: maybe not be seeing you again for perhaps quite a

1115
00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:19,680
Speaker 1: long time. But I just want to say thank you

1116
00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:22,440
Speaker 1: to everyone who listened, tweeted at us, left nice reviews.

1117
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:24,239
Speaker 1: I mean, we read them, and I can't tell you

1118
00:51:24,320 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 1: how much it means to us both. And you know,

1119
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:27,560
Speaker 1: you get into music at a certain age because it

1120
00:51:27,560 --> 00:51:29,680
Speaker 1: makes you feel less alone, it makes you feel connected,

1121
00:51:29,880 --> 00:51:31,560
Speaker 1: and just the chance to do that with all of

1122
00:51:31,560 --> 00:51:34,879
Speaker 1: you through the show was just so extremely special. And

1123
00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:36,640
Speaker 1: I also got to say, if you're a music fan

1124
00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:38,440
Speaker 1: and you get a chance to talk to Stephen Hyden,

1125
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:40,880
Speaker 1: it's a joy. If you're a music journalist and you

1126
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:42,719
Speaker 1: get a chance to talk to Stephen Hyden. It's an

1127
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:45,480
Speaker 1: education and a privilege, you know. I mean for anyone listening,

1128
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:47,120
Speaker 1: I don't care how many books you've read. I don't

1129
00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:49,480
Speaker 1: care how many documentaries you've seen. Hell, you could have

1130
00:51:49,560 --> 00:51:53,000
Speaker 1: interviewed the artist themselves. Steven still knows more about them

1131
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:55,240
Speaker 1: just off the dome. I mean, his wealth of knowledge

1132
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:58,759
Speaker 1: and his fingertips is deep, vast and a inspiring. It

1133
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:00,839
Speaker 1: was my first time doing a pod cast and really

1134
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:02,520
Speaker 1: my first time on Mike since I had did a

1135
00:52:02,600 --> 00:52:05,000
Speaker 1: radio show in college. And you know, writers tend to

1136
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:07,400
Speaker 1: be silent, shy types, and at least in my case,

1137
00:52:07,640 --> 00:52:09,799
Speaker 1: and if you're doing something with Stephen Hyden, I don't

1138
00:52:09,840 --> 00:52:11,680
Speaker 1: care what it is, he will make you better at it.

1139
00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:13,719
Speaker 1: So I just want to thank him as well. That

1140
00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:17,080
Speaker 1: is incredible and incredibly sweet. George. I feel like that

1141
00:52:17,239 --> 00:52:18,879
Speaker 1: is not really true to the spirit of the show.

1142
00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:20,600
Speaker 1: I feel like we should be ending this on like

1143
00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:24,320
Speaker 1: a feud between you and I. So I'm just gonna

1144
00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:29,720
Speaker 1: say that your episode outlines way too long, and I'm

1145
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:32,960
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be throwing a shoe at you the next

1146
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,120
Speaker 1: time I see you in person. So so look out

1147
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:38,319
Speaker 1: for the Jordan runtub versus Stephen Hyden feud. It's gonna

1148
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:42,560
Speaker 1: get ugly once this episode ends, so look forward to that.

1149
00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:45,040
Speaker 1: So on that note, I think it's time to wrap up,

1150
00:52:45,040 --> 00:52:48,040
Speaker 1: so thank you again for listening, maybe for the last time.

1151
00:52:48,320 --> 00:52:52,160
Speaker 1: We'll find out soon. Take care. Thanks everyone, and Stephen

1152
00:52:52,200 --> 00:53:00,480
Speaker 1: you hear from My Lawyer. Rivals is a production of

1153
00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:03,360
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. The executive producers are Shaan Tytone and

1154
00:53:03,400 --> 00:53:06,960
Speaker 1: Noel Brown. Supervising producers are Taylor Chicogne and Tristan McNeil.

1155
00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:10,160
Speaker 1: The producer is Joel hat Stat. I'm Jordan run Tug.

1156
00:53:10,320 --> 00:53:12,359
Speaker 1: I'm Stephen Hyden. If you like what you heard, please

1157
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 1: subscribe and leave us a review. For more podcast for

1158
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:18,040
Speaker 1: My heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast,

1159
00:53:18,320 --> 00:53:20,040
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.