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Speaker 1: Hey, folks, it is Friday, March twenty seventh, and here's

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Speaker 1: something you don't hear every day out of Florida. They

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Speaker 1: have granted a stay of execution for a death row inmate.

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Speaker 1: But the case gets more interesting because the clock is

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Speaker 1: still ticking on that execution robes.

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Speaker 2: Help us with this.

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Speaker 1: Welcome this episode of Amy and TJ. This is a

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Speaker 1: scheduled execution for next week. It could or could not

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Speaker 1: go through robes based on some DNA testing that is pending.

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Speaker 1: This is a hell of a high stakes case right now.

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Speaker 3: It certainly is, and all eyes are on the state

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Speaker 3: of Florida.

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Speaker 4: This is almost unheard of. That's why it's it's.

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Speaker 3: First of all, it's very very rare that the Supreme

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Speaker 3: Court would step in and stay this execution pending further

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Speaker 3: order first place.

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Speaker 4: But it's even a bigger deal.

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Speaker 3: That it's happening in the state of Florida because this

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Speaker 3: was a heinous crime. A former police officer convicted of

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Speaker 3: raping and murdering an eleven year old girl. We're talking

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Speaker 3: about James Aaron Duckett.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Look, Florida, we've done a lot of executions, and

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Speaker 1: not like execution stories out of Florida. And just for

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Speaker 1: that context, Robes, it's given how DeSantis is signing death

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Speaker 1: Warrens left and right to hear that one has been

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Speaker 1: halted days.

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Speaker 2: Before it was supposed to go through.

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Speaker 1: Today is the twenty seventh, it's scheduled for the thirty first,

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Speaker 1: and it still might go through. It might not go through.

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Speaker 1: And I guess, Robes, is it possible this man could

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Speaker 1: go free given the stakes we're talking about. We won't

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Speaker 1: give you everybody these details, but I've we haven't discussed

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Speaker 1: that to this Are we really talking about this man

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Speaker 1: could possibly, yes, get exonerated.

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Speaker 4: Yes, all of the above is possible.

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Speaker 3: He could be he could still be executed on Tuesday,

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Speaker 3: and he could just have a postponed execution that would

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Speaker 3: be rescheduled for a later date. Or he could be

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Speaker 3: completely exonerated. It really is one of those three things.

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Speaker 3: This is a big deal, and we're recording this just

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Speaker 3: before noon on Friday. They have given the Supreme Court

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Speaker 3: has given the State of Florida a deadline by the

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Speaker 3: end of business today. They have to let the court

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Speaker 3: know where this DNA evidence is, what the status of

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Speaker 3: the testing is.

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Speaker 4: That is what's at play here.

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Speaker 3: James Aaron Duckett's attorneys say that they now have a

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Speaker 3: new way of testing some DNA that was found in

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Speaker 3: that little girl's pants, basically that they say they believe

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Speaker 3: could exonerate their clients.

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Speaker 1: And this was back in May of nineteen eighty seven,

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Speaker 1: is what we're talking the communities outside of Orlando.

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Speaker 2: I have that right where he was.

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Speaker 1: But yes, he did work as a police officer for

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Speaker 1: little Teresa mccabee was out eleven years old. The officer

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Speaker 1: runs into her and another friend says their outpass curfew,

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Speaker 1: says she needs to get in his car. That is

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Speaker 1: the last time she's seen and she's reported missing. The

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Speaker 1: next day, her body was found in a lake. Medical

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Speaker 1: examiner determined this eleven year old girl robes just and

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Speaker 1: again we got a thirteen year old in old house.

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Speaker 1: I just think about the child that did. Just to

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Speaker 1: hear what the medical examiners say this girl went through

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Speaker 1: was just awful.

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Speaker 4: It's absolutely horrific.

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Speaker 3: Yes, the medical examiner said that little Oh my gosh,

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Speaker 3: this little girl was sexually assaulted, she was strangled and

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Speaker 3: then drowned.

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Speaker 4: That's just awful.

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Speaker 3: It's hard to even get your head around just the

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Speaker 3: viciousness and the cruelty. But I also look, there was

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Speaker 3: a lot of evidence. When you go through what happened

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Speaker 3: in the trial, I'm actually kind of shocked that the

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Speaker 3: Supreme Court, I believe the decision was six to one

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Speaker 3: correct saying putting a stay on this execution.

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Speaker 1: But when we go back, I'm sorry, we didn't just

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Speaker 1: think this was the State Supreme Court, so not the

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Speaker 1: US Supreme Court. I guess the US Supreme Court, this

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Speaker 1: never gets involved.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, they say no, thanks hard pass.

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Speaker 3: The State Supreme Court voted six to one so overwhelmingly

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Speaker 3: in favor of staying the execution. But you go back

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Speaker 3: and you read what came out in court and the

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Speaker 3: evidence that was presented against him, it's kind of it

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Speaker 3: kind of looks like everything points to this former police officer.

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Speaker 1: You know, I kind of little off the direction we're going,

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Speaker 1: But you made me think of it, robes, shouldn't we

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Speaker 1: get it?

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Speaker 2: Right?

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Speaker 1: I mean, should no matter what if there's a question, Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's give it a couple of days, let's figure this out.

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Speaker 3: You know, you make a very good point, and I

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Speaker 3: think that's pretty much where the Supreme Court was at

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Speaker 3: this point, because they even said according to court records,

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Speaker 3: that even the state of Florida acknowledged that this evidence

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Speaker 3: could prove his innocence. And so if there's even a

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Speaker 3: thought or a question or a possibility that this new

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Speaker 3: evidence or a new way of testing this evidence is available,

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Speaker 3: why shouldn't we Why wouldn't we do this before executing

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Speaker 3: a man?

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Speaker 4: You can't undo that.

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Speaker 1: So this is yes DNA. I believe it was seeming

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Speaker 1: that it was found on the little girl's pants. They

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Speaker 1: have that, and they have had that, but it hasn't

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Speaker 1: gone through whatever latest and greatest DNA testing. I did

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Speaker 1: see a report as well that he it's been talked

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Speaker 1: about in the past, and he wasn't on board with

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Speaker 1: even having this DNA test.

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Speaker 3: That was what the prosecutor was trying to argue, saying, Look,

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Speaker 3: he had this testing, this new testing available to him starting.

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Speaker 4: In twenty twenty four, and they've known.

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Speaker 3: About the DNA, They've known about that since the very

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Speaker 3: beginning of the case. So why wouldn't he have pursued

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Speaker 3: the testing in twenty twenty four? Why wait until you

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Speaker 3: actually have an execution day set? Because Governor DeSantis set

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Speaker 3: this execution date fairly recently, and it wasn't until he

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Speaker 3: got his date where he was like, oh wow, that's

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Speaker 3: the day I'm going to die. That he then tried

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Speaker 3: to get this process going.

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Speaker 1: Thank your shot, I guess take your shot. You got

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Speaker 1: nothing else to lose. And maybe that's why they did it.

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Speaker 1: But who knows how this now DNA is going to

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Speaker 1: work out. But robes if this DNA which he is

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Speaker 1: claiming could clear him, first of all, does it well?

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Speaker 4: So that's my point.

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Speaker 3: The other evidence in the case, and they're saying yes,

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Speaker 3: But maybe the other evidence in the case.

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Speaker 4: Could be explained.

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Speaker 3: Some of it could be explained just by the mere

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Speaker 3: fact that he had her in his vehicle to allegedly

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Speaker 3: take her home. And I don't know what he's alleging

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Speaker 3: that maybe when he dropped her off, someone else must

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Speaker 3: have taken her.

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Speaker 1: Who knows, But I mean this would have to clear

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Speaker 1: him if the girl was sexually assaulted, and that I

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Speaker 1: mean the semen that was left behind doesn't belong to

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Speaker 1: this guy. That's exculpatory. I mean, does that nicely hear him? Yes,

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Speaker 1: that would that somebody else. But like you said, roll

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Speaker 1: all this other stuff he pieced together, some of its circumstantial,

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Speaker 1: some of it seemed to be hard evidence of the interaction.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes, so the evidence that was presented at trial.

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Speaker 3: First of all, both of their fingerprints were on the car,

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Speaker 3: So both his James Ducketts and Teresa mcabee's fingerprints were

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Speaker 3: on his car. I think that could be explained just

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Speaker 3: by the fact that she was seen in his car

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Speaker 3: getting into his car.

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Speaker 4: So that's okay.

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Speaker 3: But the tire tracks to his vehicle match the tire

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Speaker 3: tracks left behind at the lake where her body was found.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's tough to get around.

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Speaker 3: And then the blood and hair from the victim were

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Speaker 3: traced back to him.

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Speaker 2: That's how they got to him in the first place.

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Speaker 2: That it was. So again, how you going to explain

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Speaker 2: it away? Who knows?

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Speaker 3: And then to me one of the more damning ones.

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Speaker 3: And I know this is circumstantial, but this still had

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Speaker 3: some weight when I was reading about it. Other girls

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Speaker 3: in the area testified that this dude, this police officer,

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Speaker 3: James Duckett, was creepy, would offer them rides and.

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Speaker 4: Tried to assault them.

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Speaker 3: So there was a pattern of behavior that was established

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Speaker 3: by three other young girls who testified at his trial.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and some of that, it's some of that's circumstantial,

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Speaker 1: and some of that seems to be evidence pointing towards him.

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Speaker 1: But Ropes is he if he thought this DNA was

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Speaker 1: there and could clear him, he would have been screaming

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Speaker 1: for the past twenty whatever years. Test that DNA.

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Speaker 4: But what's the point of screaming that now?

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Speaker 3: So you get it postponed, so there's a stay of executions,

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Speaker 3: so you can get another week, another month, maybe another year.

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Speaker 3: But ultimately, if that DNA is tested, that's the final nail.

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Speaker 3: And I mean it is going to be I shouldn't

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Speaker 3: say if it is going to be tested. When it

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Speaker 3: comes back, if it shows it's his DNA, he just

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Speaker 3: puts the final note.

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Speaker 4: I guess he has nothing to lose. Maybe it would

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Speaker 4: be the point I would.

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Speaker 1: Say, we have seen again, Roe, we just happened to

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Speaker 1: have covered a lot of executions and at the end

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Speaker 1: they try everything, and we have seen some try things

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Speaker 1: that and have the same argument from the judges and

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Speaker 1: the prosecutors like this was here the whole time you

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Speaker 1: had twenty years, you could have tried this option. You're

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Speaker 1: just trying to delay. And yes, Robes, I bet somebody

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Speaker 1: if you knew you were supposed to die next Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: and they pushed it to Wednesday.

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Speaker 2: You would appreciate it, right. You fight for it at.

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Speaker 1: The end, You fight forever, every last second, in every

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Speaker 1: last breath. And maybe that's all this is. However, Robes

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Speaker 1: what if? What if is DNA is tested?

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Speaker 4: You know it's you make a good point.

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Speaker 3: And if you're, if you're at any point a part

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Speaker 3: of the process that leads to the execution of a man,

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Speaker 3: however legal and however warranted it may be in the

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Speaker 3: eyes of most people, you still if you had any doubt,

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Speaker 3: it's just a the tiniest pinprick of a doubt that.

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Speaker 4: Would stay with you. It would stay with me.

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Speaker 3: It would be one of those things where why wouldn't

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Speaker 3: we have tested the DNA, Why wouldn't we have turned

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Speaker 3: over every rock, Why wouldn't we have just made sure,

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Speaker 3: beyond a shadow of a doubt that this man absolutely

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Speaker 3: is guilty of this horrific crime against this eleven year

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Speaker 3: old girl.

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Speaker 1: So the testing point, as we're speaking, we don't know

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Speaker 1: the status, but the court has given the state a

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Speaker 1: deadline of this evening, early evening to let them know.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if they need the results of the

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Speaker 1: but they want at least the status.

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Speaker 4: They want at least the status.

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Speaker 3: But from what I've read, it's very well possible that

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Speaker 3: we will actually have the results of the DNA testing

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Speaker 3: by late today.

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Speaker 1: And so you have a stay in place by the court.

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Speaker 1: They can lift that at any time that they want to.

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Speaker 1: So I guess some more legal wrangling needs to take place.

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Speaker 1: But through all this, yes, he wants the DNA test it,

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Speaker 1: but he has been proclaiming his innocence. Stay here, we

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Speaker 1: will let you hear what his attorneys the statement they

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Speaker 1: put out having to do with all this latert back

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Speaker 1: and forth just days before execution day.

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Speaker 3: Welcome back everyone to this Friday episode here on Amy

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Speaker 3: and TJ, where we are talking about something we don't

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Speaker 3: talk about very often, the state of Florida. The state

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Speaker 3: Supreme Court there put a stay of execution on a

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Speaker 3: man convicted of a heinous crime, and just days away

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Speaker 3: from execution. We're talking about former police officer James Aaron Duckett.

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Speaker 3: He was convicted of sexually assaulting and murdering an eleven

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Speaker 3: year old girl, Teresa mccabee, back in nineteen eighty seven.

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Speaker 3: His scheduled execution was set for Tuesday, March thirty first,

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Speaker 3: but the court has stepped in saying, wait a minute,

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Speaker 3: we need to know there is a new way of

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Speaker 3: testing DNA that was found on those I think it

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Speaker 3: was her little it was her pants, correct semen on

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Speaker 3: her pants. So this is now we are waiting for

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Speaker 3: final word of where the process is in the testing

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Speaker 3: and if we actually have perhaps even some results from

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Speaker 3: the DNA testing by the end of the day today.

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Speaker 4: So this is this is.

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Speaker 3: An hour by hour, moment by moment case, because there

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Speaker 3: are we've mentioned three things that could happen.

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Speaker 1: I just thought about another thing I didn't think about before.

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Speaker 1: What if is inconclusive? Is there any chance is not

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Speaker 1: a good enough sample?

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Speaker 3: If it's income exclusive, I would imagine the standing of

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Speaker 3: the court nineteen ninety he was convicted, that would have

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Speaker 3: to stand, and the decision by the jury to vote

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Speaker 3: for death that would have to stand.

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Speaker 4: So this might just be a brief pause.

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Speaker 3: This could be a longer stay while they figure things out,

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Speaker 3: or he could be exonerated.

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Speaker 1: This is incredible. I am We're sitting here talking about

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Speaker 1: a crime. How many years ago was this growth on

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Speaker 1: this one?

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Speaker 4: Forty almost forty years ago? Thirty nine years ago.

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Speaker 1: So we are looking at a clock and in a

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Speaker 1: few hours we could find word that this guy is innocent,

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Speaker 1: he didn't do it.

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Speaker 2: I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I don't know how many people out there are proclaiming

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Speaker 1: his innocence necessarily other than his own legal team at

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Speaker 1: this point, but that would be incredible. We are this

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Speaker 1: is a weird countdown or weird thing to be waste

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Speaker 1: on standby.

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Speaker 3: For yeah, on a Friday afternoon, knowing that there is

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Speaker 3: the possibility that his execution will go forward four days

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Speaker 3: from now. This is what his attorney had to say

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Speaker 3: following the Court's order or the Supreme Court's order, James

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Speaker 3: Duckett has steadfastly professed his innocence for the nearly four

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Speaker 3: decades he has been on death row. DNA testing currently underway,

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Speaker 3: as ordered by the Circuit Court, has the potential to

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Speaker 3: conclusively establish mister Duckett's innocence. Mister Duckett and his defense

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Speaker 3: team are grateful for the Court's decision, recognizing the importance

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Speaker 3: of ensuring that the testing proceeds in a careful, thorough

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Speaker 3: and orderly manner. We remain hopeful that the results will

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Speaker 3: bring long awaited clarity and justice.

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Speaker 2: Hopeful it brings clarity injustice.

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Speaker 4: It could yes, actually it either way. It could do that.

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Speaker 1: Very well, but well said, and it seems like they

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Speaker 1: were leaving open the possibility, well, this might not go

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Speaker 1: their clients.

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Speaker 3: Because all the other evidence points directly at James Duckett.

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Speaker 3: So yes, if this bit of sperm, if this bit

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Speaker 3: of DNA that was on that little girls' pants, if

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Speaker 3: that has a different suspect another person, yeah, the whole

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Speaker 3: thing is upended. His innocence now is literally hanging in

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Speaker 3: the balance. But to imagine, I haven't even let myself

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Speaker 3: think about thirty nine years behind bars for a crime

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Speaker 3: you didn't commit. And he was a former police officer

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Speaker 3: and maybe he was a little creepy. Maybe he was

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Speaker 3: and had some bad behavior or some tendencies, but maybe

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Speaker 3: he didn't actually commit this crime.

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Speaker 1: Also, maybe he's guilty as l and bottom line is

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Speaker 1: just fine, and you know what, but it's okay. We

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Speaker 1: talk about the death penalty plenty here and to know

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Speaker 1: that everybody feels comfortable with. Even if you don't like

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Speaker 1: the death penalty, you can at least say an innocent

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Speaker 1: man is not.

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Speaker 2: Being you know what.

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Speaker 3: And I think that either way, if he's if he's

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Speaker 3: exonerated because of the DNA, obviously that's a massive win

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Speaker 3: for James Duckett and perhaps even pointing police an investigator

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Speaker 3: in the right direction for the person who is responsible

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Speaker 3: if that's the case. But if it proves, if it

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Speaker 3: confirms that he in fact did rape and murder this

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Speaker 3: little girl as he was previously convicted of.

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Speaker 4: That does give peace of mind.

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Speaker 3: It gives peace of mind to everyone involved in the

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Speaker 3: process that they got the right guy and that the

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Speaker 3: right guy is paying for his sins on Tuesday. So

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Speaker 3: this is a really interesting case. It's developing. We will,

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Speaker 3: of course keep our eye on this, but we thought

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Speaker 3: we would let you know what's happening right now in

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Speaker 3: the state of Florida. But with that, everyone, thank you

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Speaker 3: so much for listening to us. I'm Amy Robach alongside TJ.

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Speaker 1: Holmes.

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Speaker 4: We'll talk to you soon.