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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works

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Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh

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Speaker 1: Clark to Charles W. Chuck Bryant. Yep, there's Jerry and

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Speaker 1: this is Stuff you Should Know. That was great, Thanks man.

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Speaker 1: Do I sound like Share? Have you sound like T

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Speaker 1: paying T Josh T Josh or Snoop Dogg? Does he

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Speaker 1: do the auto to? He factors into this big time

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Speaker 1: later on? Oh well, I don't even know about that,

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Speaker 1: so I've got some of my lead. This is kind

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Speaker 1: of fun. I don't know how much we're gonna do

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Speaker 1: that because people are probably like, stop it right now. Oh, Chuck,

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Speaker 1: I think we should do it a lot. Are you done? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I'm done. Um, we could have just auto tuned this

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Speaker 1: whole thing. Yeah, you know, maybe we should. Maybe we

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Speaker 1: should maybe from this moment, Flore, we should just started

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Speaker 1: tune the rest of the episode starting now. Let's sabotage

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Speaker 1: our careers. Uh, you've got an intro for this, fancy intro.

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Speaker 1: I think we just did it, buddy. Okay, well, let's

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Speaker 1: get in the way back machine then, my friend, Okay,

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Speaker 1: we don't have to go back that far because I

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Speaker 1: know where we're going, it's gonna be a short trip.

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Speaker 1: Let's go back to Oh Summer Boom. I'm you and

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Speaker 1: Iron the club. We're hanging out, we're drinking the rum

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Speaker 1: and coke. You can find us in the club and

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Speaker 1: uh we're we're dancing, We're getting down and grooving too.

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Speaker 1: Uh to share his latest jam, Believe Believe. It's a

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Speaker 1: hot jam, a hot, hot, hot jam that's released in

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Speaker 1: the summer. It's summertime. As you can tell, it's hot

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Speaker 1: in the club. Cheat, and I've got on my my

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Speaker 1: my short pants. I'm us like I'm out for a

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Speaker 1: night at the Rocks. I'm wearing a shirt. So I noticed, Actually,

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Speaker 1: how did you not? Well? Yeah, the third nipple really

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Speaker 1: stands out. So we're in the club where jamming and

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Speaker 1: share song is on, and uh, something happens at about

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Speaker 1: thirty five seconds into the song, and you and I

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Speaker 1: are just like, whoa daddy? Did you just hear that?

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Speaker 1: It changes everything. It changed the whole tone of the club,

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Speaker 1: Like the club was like okay, and now it's banging

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Speaker 1: yek Yeah, because of a little something called auto tune. Uh,

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Speaker 1: what sounded like a little electronic glitch was very purposeful

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Speaker 1: and it was the first time the auto tune had

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Speaker 1: been used in this way. So what Josh is auto

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Speaker 1: tune was quite a set up? Uh, can we do

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Speaker 1: the rest of the episode in the club? Yeah? Why not? Okay,

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Speaker 1: just keep those rumbings cokes coming. Okay, that's cool. Um,

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Speaker 1: So let me let me stop you for a second. Right,

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Speaker 1: because the way you described it, you made it sound

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Speaker 1: like everybody was like, oh, Share just used auto tune. No, no,

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Speaker 1: everybody said what was that? That was awesome? Although some

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Speaker 1: people were like, what was that? Don't ever do that again,

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Speaker 1: but most people were like, wow, Shared just released her

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Speaker 1: biggest hit of her entire career, and it was a

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Speaker 1: pretty long career. She just came back like that just

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Speaker 1: established her comeback was this track, and it actually became

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Speaker 1: one of the greatest best selling singles of all time. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I think, I mean, it would have been a

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Speaker 1: probably a big song anyway, but I think most definitely

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Speaker 1: auto tune kicked it into the stratasy, gave it just

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Speaker 1: the extra something. It became part of the talking but

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Speaker 1: everyone was talking about it. So everybody went to her

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Speaker 1: producer and said, dude, how did you do that? We

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Speaker 1: want to know how to do that, and he was like, vocoder. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he lied, He lied, He lied big time. He lied

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Speaker 1: in person to other producers, he lied in interviews, he lied, lied,

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Speaker 1: lied about how he made that track because he wanted

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Speaker 1: to keep it to himself because it was so huge,

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Speaker 1: and it became so huge, Chuck that at first Auto

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Speaker 1: Tune was called the Share Effect. Even the company that

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Speaker 1: produced Auto Tune and Terry's, which we'll talk about in

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Speaker 1: a minute, called it in their instructional book, the Share Effect.

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Speaker 1: They probably still do, don't they. They don't mention it

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Speaker 1: any longer. Yeah, um. But the so it was, it

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Speaker 1: was a huge deal, and this guy lied and kept

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Speaker 1: it under wraps, and for many years it was very mysterious. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Let's actually, if you live under a rock, let's go

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Speaker 1: ahead and play that clip of the very first thirty

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Speaker 1: five seconds into that song where Share says I can't

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Speaker 1: break through. Yeah, right there, boom right there. Music changed

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Speaker 1: from that point forward. So what what this guy, what

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Speaker 1: her producer was saying was vocoder. Vocoder is something that's

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Speaker 1: been around for a very long time. If you've ever

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Speaker 1: listened to any Pete Frampton, Peter Frampton and he things,

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Speaker 1: do you feel like we do that whole long guitar

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Speaker 1: solo or whatever. He's breathing into a tube connected to

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Speaker 1: his guitar, which is electrifying his voice. Vocoder had been

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Speaker 1: around for a very long time, but there's different ways

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Speaker 1: of doing it. That That was definitely the tube effect

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Speaker 1: through the guitar, but you can also just use it to,

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Speaker 1: you know, make your voice robotic like Beck to turn

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Speaker 1: tables in a microphone or Mr Roboto with sticks, But

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Speaker 1: all different ways to use it. This thing, this sounded different,

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Speaker 1: the share effect. It was a little different, sure, And

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Speaker 1: I wonder how this guy talked his way out of Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I mean like if if if a producer like, okay,

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Speaker 1: well show me how you did it on vocoder, if

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Speaker 1: he was like over here and then just like ran

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Speaker 1: out of the room, I don't. I don't think he

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Speaker 1: talked out of it. I think he was just another

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Speaker 1: line music producer and he was just like okay, well busted, okay.

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Speaker 1: So um, Apparently along the way people figured out here

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Speaker 1: there what this guy did believe and they started using

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Speaker 1: it themselves, but very very sparsely. All right, So, Josh,

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Speaker 1: what is auto tune? All right? I'll answer your question

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Speaker 1: because I'm gonna keep asking it, all right. So auto

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Speaker 1: tune is a plug in originally released for the audio

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Speaker 1: editing software pro tools. Yeah, it's a software piece that

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Speaker 1: allows you and the original UM intent and how it's

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Speaker 1: still mostly used is to pitch correct UM singer's voice.

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Speaker 1: So when you, when you or I go into the

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Speaker 1: studio to record those albums that will never release, but

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Speaker 1: we just record for fun. Um we hit flat notes

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Speaker 1: here there. Oh not me. I have perfect pitch. I

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Speaker 1: hit flat notes here there, perfect um, and everybody does.

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Speaker 1: It's a normal thing. Sure for most of eternity. UM

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Speaker 1: music producers would say, blue Eyes chairman, I need another take.

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Speaker 1: That was a great take, but you had a couple

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Speaker 1: of flat notes. Give me another take just like that one.

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Speaker 1: And Frank would finish his scotch, put out a cigarette

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Speaker 1: and say you get one more shine hood. What was

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Speaker 1: the Joe? Oh you didn't even see spinal tap, did you? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you finally saw it, finally, Okay, But I don't remember

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Speaker 1: any Frank Sinatra t Yeah there was. When Bruno Kirby

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Speaker 1: is the Limo Drivers, He's talks about Sammy Davis's book,

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Speaker 1: Yes I can, and he says what they should have

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Speaker 1: called it is. Yes, I can as long as Frank

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Speaker 1: says it's okay, because Frank called the shots. For all

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Speaker 1: those guys, I do remember that. Um So, Frank would

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Speaker 1: one more take, and this could be like take twelve

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Speaker 1: or fifteen or twenty, depending on like how how much

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Speaker 1: how much the person was feeling at The singer was

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Speaker 1: feeling it at the time and would be happy to

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Speaker 1: hang around the studio whatever was keeping the singer there

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Speaker 1: at the studio. As long as that was around the singer,

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Speaker 1: the singer was happy to give it one more try,

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Speaker 1: one more try, right, drugs maybe, um or if they

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Speaker 1: had like a really good candy bowl, who knows, I

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Speaker 1: gotta stay for the skittles. Um So. The editor then

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Speaker 1: or the music producer would then take all of these

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Speaker 1: different tracks and would go through and I can't imagine

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Speaker 1: how awful this would be. Take the best part of

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Speaker 1: this track and edit it together with the best part

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Speaker 1: of that track, and like we're talking like pre digital air,

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Speaker 1: so like they're spicing together tape from what I understand,

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Speaker 1: right to get the best possible complete take piece together

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Speaker 1: from many different takes. Right, So Okay, that's that's what

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Speaker 1: they did. All of a sudden, there's this new software

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Speaker 1: that just runs through a take and says, oh, well,

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Speaker 1: I see what note or what key the singers singing in,

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Speaker 1: But this this particular notes just a little out, so

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Speaker 1: I'm going to nudge it into the key that the

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Speaker 1: singer was going for. And now, all of a sudden,

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Speaker 1: one take is all it takes. Yeah. I mean what

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Speaker 1: it did was it cut down on studio time, which

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Speaker 1: is super expensive, which was very appealing because now you

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Speaker 1: could churn out songs that are more rapid rate and

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Speaker 1: a cheaper rate. And uh, it was it was a

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Speaker 1: little sort of a secret tool that they didn't intend

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Speaker 1: to like get out to the public. I don't think

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Speaker 1: they wanted everyone to know this stuff. No, it was

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Speaker 1: meant for professionals. Yeah, And basically it was just it

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Speaker 1: was the musical audio equivalent of cosmetics. Yeah. Doctor. It

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Speaker 1: was invented by Dr Harold Andy Hilda Brand, and he

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Speaker 1: likened it to make up and the New Yorker likened

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Speaker 1: it to um, like getting rid of a red eye

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Speaker 1: and a photograph. It was just you use it just

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Speaker 1: enough so that you can't tell it's there, but it

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Speaker 1: makes for a more pleasant um overall composition. Right, what

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Speaker 1: Share had done, or what shares producers had done, is

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Speaker 1: take this thing and used it to the nth degree. Yes,

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Speaker 1: supposedly it was just a joke, and Share was like,

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Speaker 1: I love that, but that's like I don't know if

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Speaker 1: that's an urban legend, ear if that's fact. Well, from

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Speaker 1: what I read that her producer, she was she wanted like, um,

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Speaker 1: she had heard like some telephone effect that she was

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Speaker 1: interested in using, like she wanted something and I guess

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Speaker 1: the producer had stumbled upon that and UM played it

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Speaker 1: for but it was like you're not gonna like this,

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Speaker 1: but listen to this weirdness and she was like that

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Speaker 1: I want that. Nice, that's what I read. Well, I

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Speaker 1: think that it's due to her giving it the green light.

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Speaker 1: Then that was truly like uh, foresight, like a masterful

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Speaker 1: move by Share. You know, well, Share has a lot

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Speaker 1: of ForSight. You know, they say, don't don't doubt Share

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Speaker 1: and Share has a lot of foresight. Never bet against Share. Yeah, Um,

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Speaker 1: so when you did make that decision, it changed, like

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Speaker 1: you said, it changed everything. And well, well, I I

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Speaker 1: we can't talk enough about this, but we're going to

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Speaker 1: take a break and then come back and talk more

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Speaker 1: about it right after this, all right, josh, Uh. What

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Speaker 1: I found most interesting about this while researching what UM

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Speaker 1: was what Andy Hildebrand did before he did this. He

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Speaker 1: was a musician. He was played flute professionally since he

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Speaker 1: was a young teenager. Even went to University of Illinois

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Speaker 1: go Fighting a Line I on a music scholarship. Yet

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Speaker 1: he chose to work for Exxon Mobile for seventeen years

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Speaker 1: looking for oil. Yeah, the two weren't too terribly far apart, right, well,

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Speaker 1: as we will find out. So he's a professional floutist,

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Speaker 1: classically trained flout is a good one from what I understand,

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Speaker 1: flouting his flute, yes, um. And he went to college

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Speaker 1: to get an electrical engineering degree, I think. And basically

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Speaker 1: when when he went to work for the oil companies,

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Speaker 1: it was an oil exploration and he figured out a

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Speaker 1: programmer he designed to software UM that when you set

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Speaker 1: off an explosive charge underground, it measured the pitch of

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Speaker 1: stuff of the sound waves that that were created. Right,

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Speaker 1: So as they traveled through rock, different types of rock,

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Speaker 1: just the pitch basically, and this software like analyzed the

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Speaker 1: pitch that was coming through and could create a subsurface

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Speaker 1: map of the rock below, and oil companies have long

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Speaker 1: known that this type of rock is associated with oil,

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Speaker 1: and this type of rock is not maybe a'll financial

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Speaker 1: guess and this type of rock. So with this guy

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Speaker 1: creating an audio visual map of the subsurface area, oil

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Speaker 1: companies no longer had to just drill and drill and

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Speaker 1: hope that they found um oil. He would say, this

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00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:29,880
Speaker 1: is a pretty pretty great place to drill because this

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00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:33,360
Speaker 1: kind of rock is there. That's right. It's called auto correlation.

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Speaker 1: And it saved Exxon a lot of money and he

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Speaker 1: somehow made a lot of money. I thought it was

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Speaker 1: gonna be one of those things where like XN was

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Speaker 1: just like thanks, you work for us, you wint here's

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Speaker 1: yours a year. But apparently he UM earned enough money

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Speaker 1: to retire by the age of forty thanks to this

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Speaker 1: innovation and UM in the early he got out of

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Speaker 1: the oil business and found it like it's just a

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Speaker 1: popularity content. Yeah. Uh. He founded UH in Terrorists Audio

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Speaker 1: Technologies and UH kind of near Silicon Valley in Scott's Valley, California.

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Speaker 1: And I think still they only have about ten employees.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a pretty small operation. It's all centered

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Speaker 1: around him and his ideas, and he is the main

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Speaker 1: inventor um. One of the first things he invented was

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Speaker 1: something called Infinity, which is a program that where you

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Speaker 1: could loop samples um over and over and over, like seamlessly.

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Speaker 1: Apparently that was a necessary thing. I didn't know that.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, think about it. We're talking like early nineties.

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00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:39,560
Speaker 1: That was like the oh eight acid house revolution. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I just didn't realize. I guess he made it easier,

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Speaker 1: probably is my guess. Yes, I think he enabled it.

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00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:50,360
Speaker 1: He enabled technos the impression I have, Oh yeah, interesting

240
00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,960
Speaker 1: looping samples together seamlessly. Well, but you could already do that.

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Speaker 1: What I'm saying is is he clearly found a way

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Speaker 1: to do it better and more efficiently. He didn't invent looping, No,

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00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:06,440
Speaker 1: he made it better, Yeah, exactly. Another thing he did

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00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:10,720
Speaker 1: was invented the microphone modeler. Modeling is a big thing

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00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:14,600
Speaker 1: in music. You can get um guitar amplifiers that model,

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00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:19,440
Speaker 1: uh basically means imitate other amps. I have a modeling

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Speaker 1: amp which I don't use anymore because it's uh not

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00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:25,600
Speaker 1: very good, but it models. There's like twelve different classic

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00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:30,720
Speaker 1: amps models supposedly, but he inventled the modeling microphone, which

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00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:33,440
Speaker 1: means you could mimic like classic microphones or like a

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Speaker 1: harmonica mike and vintage mics like the Elvis Presley that

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00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:41,200
Speaker 1: cool looking mike. Sure that was on there? Oh? Is

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00:15:41,200 --> 00:15:44,840
Speaker 1: that the silver kind of rounded rectangular one. Noel's got

254
00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:48,600
Speaker 1: one on his desk. Yeah, yeah, that's associated with Elvis Presley. Well,

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Speaker 1: I mean just the music of that time. But I

256
00:15:51,120 --> 00:15:53,480
Speaker 1: always picture Elvish. Yeah, you know what I mean, I

257
00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:55,720
Speaker 1: can see that. Yeah, have you ever seen his grandson,

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Speaker 1: by the way, quick sidebar? No, his name is quick sidebar,

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00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:04,520
Speaker 1: quick sidebar Pressley. It's weird name, but you know, Lisa

260
00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:09,760
Speaker 1: Marie was his mom, So yeah, um, that was very funny.

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00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,720
Speaker 1: By the way, he uh, just look him up. I

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00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,360
Speaker 1: think what's his name. I can't remember his name. His

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00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:21,560
Speaker 1: last name is the father's name for Lisa Marie's first husband,

264
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Speaker 1: is who she had him with. Uh yeah, just look

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00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:29,400
Speaker 1: at Elvis Presley's grandson. It is creepy. Dude looks exactly

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Speaker 1: like Elvis at that age, like scary, scary, eerily similar

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00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:38,720
Speaker 1: that I don't know, doesne that I do know? If

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00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:41,600
Speaker 1: he sings, he probably use his auto tune probably because

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Speaker 1: of singers. Apparently his auto tune its hem even higher

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Speaker 1: than that. Really, how about that? Admit it? You know? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's the thing about auto tune where, um, you deny

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Speaker 1: that you use it even though you're totally aware that

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00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:02,840
Speaker 1: everyone uses it. Um. I read an article where apparently

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Speaker 1: this one producer said that he's worked with two artists

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00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:11,240
Speaker 1: that have haven't used it everyone else has, and it

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00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:14,359
Speaker 1: was Nico Case and Nellie for Tato. And then apparently

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00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:17,080
Speaker 1: later after that, Nelly for Tato released a single that

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Speaker 1: had tons of auto tune on it. She may be

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Speaker 1: the only artist in the world who hasn't used auto tune,

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Speaker 1: either subtly or um to the nth degree. Well, that's

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00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:33,440
Speaker 1: certainly not true. I think there are plenty of indie artists.

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Speaker 1: But if you're talking, you should read this Verge article.

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00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:39,680
Speaker 1: It basically lays it out like, no, everyone uses this

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00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:44,240
Speaker 1: even if so. Apparently producers don't even necessarily tell the

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00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:47,159
Speaker 1: band that it's being used right then, because there's a

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00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:51,680
Speaker 1: live function, so that the monitors or the headphones that um,

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00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:55,879
Speaker 1: the band is hearing is being run through auto tune,

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00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,360
Speaker 1: so what they're hearing is already corrected, so they think

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00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:02,159
Speaker 1: they just did a perfect take. Yeah, I'm just wary

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00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:06,000
Speaker 1: of anytime someone says out of twenty million singers, one

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00:18:06,040 --> 00:18:09,679
Speaker 1: person doesn't that's just very dubious claim. I don't know,

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00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:13,320
Speaker 1: we're talking music industry here, especially when a lot of

293
00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,720
Speaker 1: people are making their own music in their own homes. Well,

294
00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:18,879
Speaker 1: that's another thing. They're not a part of the pop machine.

295
00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:23,160
Speaker 1: They don't have stats on that, you know. Yeah, I'm

296
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Speaker 1: just I'm just saying that's that sounds like a load

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00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:27,879
Speaker 1: of garbage to me. I'm sure more than one person

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00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:33,840
Speaker 1: doesn't just one. Um. So auto tune came about, apparently

299
00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:38,960
Speaker 1: this is the tail because of a dinner that Hilda

300
00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,119
Speaker 1: Brand was at. He was having lunch with a sales

301
00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:44,160
Speaker 1: rep and the wife said something funny like, hey, Andy,

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Speaker 1: can you once you invent something to make me sing

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00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:53,080
Speaker 1: in tune? And he went, no, great idea that we

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Speaker 1: should have auto tuned, that maybe we could maybe maybe

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00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:00,240
Speaker 1: it was maybe it just happened. Uh. And so he said,

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00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:03,760
Speaker 1: you know what, Uh, if I can tell Jed Clampitt

307
00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:06,400
Speaker 1: where the oil is, then I can make you sing

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00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:09,760
Speaker 1: in tune. And he did, and he did. He created

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00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:14,919
Speaker 1: auto tune and um we've kind of mentioned how it works. Basically,

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00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:20,119
Speaker 1: it takes a it takes that take of a singer's song.

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00:19:20,680 --> 00:19:25,000
Speaker 1: It takes the vocals of the song, and you select

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00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,560
Speaker 1: what key you're singing in, and then auto tune goes

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00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,760
Speaker 1: through and makes this map of this of that audio

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00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:34,640
Speaker 1: of the vocal track, and it goes through and says

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00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,720
Speaker 1: that this one's a little flat, this one's a little low,

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00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:41,880
Speaker 1: or whatever, um and it just nudges these things into

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00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:45,000
Speaker 1: tune into into the key that it's supposed to be in.

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00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,000
Speaker 1: So all all of the notes that the singer hits

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00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,560
Speaker 1: and that take are within the correct key, meaning that

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00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:55,560
Speaker 1: they all sound great. It's a perfect take, right well, yeah,

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00:19:55,600 --> 00:19:57,520
Speaker 1: and the the key there is it's in the original

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00:19:57,560 --> 00:20:01,040
Speaker 1: tone and inflection of the artist, so you can't tell

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00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:03,600
Speaker 1: it's happening. No. And there's actually if you look, if

324
00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:08,680
Speaker 1: you look at the um uh Auto Tune product demo videos,

325
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:14,040
Speaker 1: it's amazing. So there's a there's an um an automatic

326
00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:17,240
Speaker 1: version where like it just you select the key and

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00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:19,119
Speaker 1: like auto tune do its thing, and it does a

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00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:21,760
Speaker 1: pretty great job. One of the one of the ways

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00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:25,760
Speaker 1: that it does this is um it adds like millisecond

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00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:30,880
Speaker 1: pauses in between notes. There's little spaces between notes, which

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00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:35,840
Speaker 1: gives it a natural feel. Um. There's other selections that

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00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:39,200
Speaker 1: you can make, like throat length. You can select grow

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00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:42,560
Speaker 1: how long the singer's throat is uh, and you can

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00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,880
Speaker 1: do that note by note um, so you can make

335
00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:48,360
Speaker 1: the whole thing even more natural. Until basically, what you've

336
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:54,760
Speaker 1: done is taught auto tune how to simulate a particular

337
00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:59,600
Speaker 1: singers singing style and voice so that when it when

338
00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:03,119
Speaker 1: a us that no, it doesn't within the same exact

339
00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:05,159
Speaker 1: range that the singer would have done had they hit

340
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:09,280
Speaker 1: it correctly. It's pretty amazing and advanced stuff totally. What

341
00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:12,439
Speaker 1: when when normal people think of auto tune, like you

342
00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,719
Speaker 1: and me who are not in the music biz um,

343
00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:20,000
Speaker 1: we we think of this thing that's called the zero function. Yes,

344
00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:21,600
Speaker 1: and you know what, let's take a break and we

345
00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:24,080
Speaker 1: will explain what the zero function is right after this.

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00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:44,480
Speaker 1: Stop all right, the suspense is kidling me. You're gonna

347
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:51,480
Speaker 1: kid let's kid alright. Zero function. That was essentially what

348
00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:56,760
Speaker 1: the share effect was, Okay, right, yes, go ahead no

349
00:21:56,760 --> 00:21:58,280
Speaker 1: no, no no go ahead, no, no go ahead. You just

350
00:21:58,320 --> 00:21:59,680
Speaker 1: sat up in your chair like you were about to

351
00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:02,359
Speaker 1: arm kind I've been Do you go ahead? Do you

352
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:05,480
Speaker 1: talk about it? Well, what auto tune does in the

353
00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:09,800
Speaker 1: in terms of the zero function is it gets rid

354
00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:14,560
Speaker 1: of all of that space and when shares voice changes,

355
00:22:15,080 --> 00:22:18,719
Speaker 1: it's immediate. Yeah, all of those notes go right up

356
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:22,520
Speaker 1: against each other, and it creates this robotic sounding voice. Yeah,

357
00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:25,560
Speaker 1: there's no like rise, it's there's it's not like a

358
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:30,439
Speaker 1: what's the word I'm looking for? It's uh. It's not

359
00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:33,800
Speaker 1: like a normal vibrato that you would get because in

360
00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:37,719
Speaker 1: the normal vibrato there's there's pauses, there's space in between

361
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:41,240
Speaker 1: the notes. With this, it's note note all pressed up

362
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:44,720
Speaker 1: against each other, compressed way, and that zero function, um

363
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:49,159
Speaker 1: is what what It takes any spaces out between the

364
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,640
Speaker 1: notes and creates that robot sound. Yeah, because I think

365
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 1: auto tune has has a range of numbers to make

366
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:56,719
Speaker 1: it flow more seamlessly. And when they took it all

367
00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:58,800
Speaker 1: the way down to zero, which means there's nothing there,

368
00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:00,639
Speaker 1: it created that weird I act that they were like,

369
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:04,560
Speaker 1: share your listen to this, it's weird. Yeah, and she's like,

370
00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 1: I like weird. It's great, baby, I hear number one

371
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:16,720
Speaker 1: hit in my future. No, you gotta wrot. It's great, baby, No,

372
00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:22,640
Speaker 1: that was that was Jack from Will and Grace. Oh

373
00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:24,399
Speaker 1: do you remember when he thought he was talking to

374
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: a share impersonator. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, And he's like, no,

375
00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:34,280
Speaker 1: if I could turn back to turn. He was teaching

376
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:36,960
Speaker 1: her how to say it, sing it correctly. I thoroughly

377
00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 1: enjoyed Will and Grace. It was great. Agreed, All right,

378
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 1: where are we? Well? You were talking about the share effect, right,

379
00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:48,359
Speaker 1: and that's what it was called again and Tari has

380
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:51,240
Speaker 1: called this zero function the share effect for many years

381
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:55,200
Speaker 1: and um and over time, remember her producer just kept

382
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 1: lying and lying and lying. Over time, other producers independently

383
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:01,280
Speaker 1: figured out why he had done that. He had used

384
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 1: the zero function, which is a really obscure tool on

385
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:13,640
Speaker 1: a software suite that not everybody knew about. Right, So

386
00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:16,680
Speaker 1: it took some some brainpower and some experimentation, but little

387
00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:19,720
Speaker 1: by little some producers figured it out. This one producer

388
00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:22,960
Speaker 1: um did a remix of a j Lo song and

389
00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:25,439
Speaker 1: used it, and he I think was the second person

390
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:30,320
Speaker 1: to use it, um publicly and uh for a brief time,

391
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,240
Speaker 1: it became known as the Jal effect. Of course, anybody

392
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:36,080
Speaker 1: who used this without fessing up to it. At first

393
00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 1: in the early two thousands, it was called the whatever effect.

394
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:43,200
Speaker 1: And there's this producer rapper down in Florida named T Paine,

395
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:48,440
Speaker 1: and T Paine heard this JL effect. He went on

396
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,960
Speaker 1: a mission to figure out what this was, and he

397
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 1: finally apparently took him years to figure it out. He

398
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 1: finally figured out that it was the zero effect on

399
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:02,760
Speaker 1: this pro tools plug in UM and he started using

400
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:06,199
Speaker 1: it and just went crazy with it. Like up to

401
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:08,439
Speaker 1: this point it was used to like tweak or it

402
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:11,800
Speaker 1: would maybe make UM a track of just a little

403
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: weird over here, something like that. He used it as

404
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 1: often as he possibly could. Yeah. He basically said the

405
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 1: zero function and tee pain are one and the same. Yeah,

406
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:24,080
Speaker 1: And it became known as the tea pain effect. Really

407
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,920
Speaker 1: because when people asked him how he did it, guess

408
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:32,440
Speaker 1: what he said folder did he really? Yes, Yes he did.

409
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 1: And for years he managed to make a mint because

410
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:38,240
Speaker 1: the whole thing was in hip hop or in pop.

411
00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 1: If you wanted this tea pain effect, te pain needed

412
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,560
Speaker 1: to console at least if not produce your record. That

413
00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 1: was like ten years after the Share effect. People not

414
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,359
Speaker 1: know that I I he managed to pull it off

415
00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:52,360
Speaker 1: for years and years and years. Good for tea Pain

416
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 1: is what I say? Yes, you know, yeah, I mean

417
00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 1: he apparently was like, um, I guess on a plane ride.

418
00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,200
Speaker 1: Usher was the same plane and asked to speak to him,

419
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: and she was like, I've got to get something off

420
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 1: my chest. You really screwed up music like big time

421
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:11,600
Speaker 1: well S. Pain was like, I've made a bunch of

422
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 1: money doing this and people seem to like it, so

423
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,359
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna stop. Hildebrand has been vilified by many,

424
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:19,440
Speaker 1: and he said, you know what, I just make the car.

425
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:22,080
Speaker 1: I don't drive it down the wrong side of the road. Yeah.

426
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:26,000
Speaker 1: It's a great quote because a lot of people hate

427
00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:28,159
Speaker 1: auto tune and things. That's the worst thing that happened

428
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:31,160
Speaker 1: to music. A lot of people like it and say,

429
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 1: when you use it for what it's supposed to be

430
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:35,240
Speaker 1: used for, it can really help out. Because you know,

431
00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:38,040
Speaker 1: it's not like everyone uses it all the time. I'm

432
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 1: sure some people need it way more than others. Well,

433
00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,439
Speaker 1: even if you're using it as a like cosmetic touch,

434
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 1: like kill the brand originally designed it for a lot

435
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 1: of people say no, we shouldn't even be doing that,

436
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:51,399
Speaker 1: because if you go back and listen to things like

437
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,440
Speaker 1: Bob Dylan or The Beach Boards or um, just a

438
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:58,120
Speaker 1: lot of these original artists that didn't use these kind

439
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 1: of effects on their voice. Um, when they sang and

440
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,600
Speaker 1: their recordings made it through the studio, there were still

441
00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:08,240
Speaker 1: flat notes here there, but it was their music, it

442
00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:11,360
Speaker 1: was their voice, it was their vocals in these tracks,

443
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,119
Speaker 1: and everyone came to know and love them. But now,

444
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:18,320
Speaker 1: because everything is auto tuned perfectly, even the stuff that

445
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,040
Speaker 1: you don't you can't hear it's auto tune because they're

446
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 1: not using zero function, but just the fact that it's

447
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,240
Speaker 1: been running through the auto tune, this stuff sounds really

448
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:28,800
Speaker 1: rough by comparison. So a lot of people are like

449
00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:32,920
Speaker 1: auto tune has ruined music. It ruined music that people

450
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 1: love for decades because now by comparison it seems rough. Well.

451
00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:41,119
Speaker 1: But it also, like a good ear can tell if

452
00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:44,640
Speaker 1: something's auto tune, it has this weird tin equality that, um,

453
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 1: it doesn't sound natural. So I think it they will

454
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 1: be blowback and a and a reversion back to older methods. Okay,

455
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:54,680
Speaker 1: I bet you. Jack White has an auto tune that's

456
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:58,679
Speaker 1: the most purest of pure guys. No, he uses all

457
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:00,919
Speaker 1: sorts of weird vocal effects on his stuff. No, but

458
00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 1: as far as like I bet he has ask him,

459
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 1: he wouldn't admit it. Apparently that's part for the course. Um,

460
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 1: so te Pain. If we can get back to the

461
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:18,639
Speaker 1: history of this drink, so te Pain. Right, he's huge,

462
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,959
Speaker 1: like he's just everything he drops is just blowing up

463
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 1: all over the place. He's getting invited to consult and

464
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:31,840
Speaker 1: produce on uh Kanye's album, which ultimately had every track

465
00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:33,680
Speaker 1: had auto tune on it by the time Tea Pain

466
00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:37,159
Speaker 1: got done with that, right. Um, have you heard his

467
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 1: Queen Bohemian raapsody live? No? Is it good? Oh? No,

468
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 1: oh no, it's there's a video that someone spliced of

469
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 1: him and he and Freddie Mercury. It's one of the

470
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: worst things I've ever heard on the stage. I've got

471
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 1: to check it out. It's terrible. Okay, Um, I gotta

472
00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 1: see that. It's good. So um the tea Pain effect. Yeah,

473
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 1: and if you wanted this effect, you had to have

474
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:05,840
Speaker 1: t pain. Well Snoop Dogg says that's enough of that finally,

475
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: and he releases something called Sensual Seduction, and it's one

476
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,440
Speaker 1: of the better rap videos you've ever seen. It's pretty good.

477
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:16,560
Speaker 1: There's a star wipe in it, so you know I

478
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 1: love it. Um. So Snoop releases this using the te

479
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:24,479
Speaker 1: Pain effect to great degree, but he didn't consult with

480
00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:27,280
Speaker 1: T Pain. T Paint had nothing to do with this record.

481
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 1: So Snoop kind of opened the floodgates saying, if you

482
00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:33,200
Speaker 1: guys want to use this, go use it. But what's

483
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: interesting if you watch that video when Snoop is doing

484
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 1: like the the t pain effect of the auto tune stuff,

485
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,200
Speaker 1: he's actually got a tube going to a synthesizer to

486
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,120
Speaker 1: make it look like he's using a vocoder. Interesting that

487
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:50,320
Speaker 1: weird like in his video. But anyway, he sure that

488
00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 1: wasn't a marijuana smoking divide. It may have been, it

489
00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 1: may have been the other thing about it, um, but

490
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,920
Speaker 1: Snoop changed everything in in that he took tea Pain

491
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:02,520
Speaker 1: now to the equation and really open the floodgates for

492
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:07,160
Speaker 1: anybody and everybody to use this stuff. Simultaneously, jay Z

493
00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:10,320
Speaker 1: was trying to close those floodgates and push all of

494
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 1: it back in. Yeah, I think jay Z um uh

495
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 1: it clearly jumped the shark. At a certain point. You

496
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:20,200
Speaker 1: know when major ad brands are making ads using the

497
00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 1: latest and greatest. That it's years late, first of all,

498
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 1: and that means that has definitely jumped the shark. And

499
00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:30,480
Speaker 1: in two thousand nine, uh Windy's had a Frosty Posse

500
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,960
Speaker 1: commercial where a gang of office workers built it out

501
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:38,160
Speaker 1: auto tuned rhymes while searching for Frosty's. I don't remember

502
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 1: that add do you? I know? But I went and

503
00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 1: watched it. Of course. How is it pretty great? It's

504
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:45,240
Speaker 1: what you think it is pretty great. It's awesome. Okay, no,

505
00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 1: it's terrible. And jay Z apparently saw this and was enraged,

506
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:51,560
Speaker 1: and so he wrote a song called d O a

507
00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:55,160
Speaker 1: Death of auto Tune. I know we're facing a recession,

508
00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:58,640
Speaker 1: but the music y'all making gonna make it the great depression.

509
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 1: Get back to wrap ut painting too much, that's calling

510
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 1: that's calling someone out ye hard. Yeah, but other auto tune,

511
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:11,480
Speaker 1: um auto tune. The news was a big YouTube pit.

512
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, man, that um the bed intruder song. Yeah,

513
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 1: let's um. Let's play a clip from that From two

514
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:21,520
Speaker 1: thousand and ten. It was a local news footage from Huntsville, Alabama,

515
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 1: of Antoine Dodson delivering human being. Yeah, about a neighborhood

516
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:30,080
Speaker 1: intruder and someone auto tune that the Gregory Brothers did.

517
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 1: That's right, let's hear that real quick start. You are

518
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 1: really go for the man got away, leaving behind the evidence.

519
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:46,080
Speaker 1: I was okay by some sold don't sold, don't so

520
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: don't song be climbing a windows? He snatching up people

521
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 1: up trying to write? Have you listened recently? Now? It's

522
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 1: pretty great? Yeah? Yeah, but again that was in two

523
00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:03,959
Speaker 1: thousand ten, and I think that even kind of had

524
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 1: a pretty short shelf life. Unless they're still doing it,

525
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 1: I don't know, Well, what do you say, The Gregory Brothers,

526
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 1: the Brooklyn Soul band. Yeah, they started out doing auto

527
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:14,840
Speaker 1: tune the news and they would take the news and

528
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 1: just auto tune it and turn it and like just

529
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:19,520
Speaker 1: produce it overproduce it um. And they did that with

530
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: the Bed and Shooter song, and that actually became the

531
00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,520
Speaker 1: number one video on YouTube of all of two thousand ten.

532
00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:28,960
Speaker 1: I look the original the original video has a hundred

533
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 1: and twenty eight million views right now. Yeah, yeah, it's

534
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 1: pretty impressive stuff. At at the same point, like now,

535
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 1: auto tune has become a parody of itself. It's it's

536
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 1: being used in ads, here's this progression. Something starts out,

537
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:49,800
Speaker 1: someone uses it artistically, someone comes along and overuses it,

538
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:53,440
Speaker 1: then everybody starts to overuse it. Then Wendy's makes a

539
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 1: commercial using it. Newsweek finally gets around to writing an

540
00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:01,280
Speaker 1: article about it, and then years after we record a

541
00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:04,280
Speaker 1: podcast on it, and then the thing finally dies. Yeah,

542
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,800
Speaker 1: and then fifteen or twenty years after that it becomes

543
00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:11,240
Speaker 1: hip again. Yes, you know, that's the progression. So the

544
00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:13,440
Speaker 1: point that we're at though, now, Chuck, it's not so

545
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:15,440
Speaker 1: cut and dry, man. It's not as cut and dry

546
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,120
Speaker 1: as jay Z would like to have you think. Because

547
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,520
Speaker 1: he came out with this death of auto tune track

548
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 1: in like two thousand nine. Auto tune is still around

549
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 1: very much. And now it's getting the point where if

550
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 1: like um the Verge and I can't remember the other

551
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 1: article I read, they're both on this podcast page. If

552
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:37,600
Speaker 1: they're to be believed, they're credible sources, and they certainly

553
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:40,720
Speaker 1: seemed like it from these articles. There's a there's this

554
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 1: growing question of um, is auto tune here to stay?

555
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: People are starting to compare it to the initial reaction

556
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,720
Speaker 1: that people had to the electric guitar. It was a

557
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 1: lot different from the original guitar, and people it took

558
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 1: a lot of getting used to, or like when Bob

559
00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:01,360
Speaker 1: Dylan went electric, a lot of people didn't like that,

560
00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:04,440
Speaker 1: but then look at what happened now with the electric guitar.

561
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:06,960
Speaker 1: A lot of people tried different stuff with it and

562
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 1: it became a standard. Some people are wondering if auto

563
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:13,279
Speaker 1: tune is going to fulfill the same destiny. I think

564
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 1: most people are hoping that it does not. Yeah, well,

565
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:19,400
Speaker 1: I mean sweetening vocals is nothing new, Like reverb is

566
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 1: a tried and true thing for years and embraced. H

567
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:25,000
Speaker 1: does that sweetened vocals? I thought that was always used

568
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,560
Speaker 1: to like make it weird. Now it's it's sort of

569
00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 1: like it gives it an echo, a like you're singing

570
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:32,280
Speaker 1: in a big empty church hall or something. But it

571
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:36,359
Speaker 1: makes it sweetens it. It doesn't like correct anything, but

572
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,400
Speaker 1: when I say sweetens it, it just makes it sound

573
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:42,520
Speaker 1: a little better. Reverbs a great tool, right. The point

574
00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:46,960
Speaker 1: is as artificial. Yeah, it's not natural. Yeah, they it's

575
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:49,640
Speaker 1: they tried to replicate like singing in a big empty

576
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,799
Speaker 1: echo e hallway, uh, with an effect and it worked, right.

577
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 1: And another argument in favor of auto tune that I've

578
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 1: seen is simply taking a human voice and recording it

579
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 1: automatically makes it artificial, like if they're not there in

580
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 1: the room with you singing to you at that moment.

581
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: Anything else is artificial, So what's the problem. So just

582
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:15,319
Speaker 1: to let people know, I put out to text during

583
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:19,600
Speaker 1: the episode to musician friends Jack White, No. I texted

584
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:24,719
Speaker 1: Lucy Wayne Wright our buddy Jerry from our TV show.

585
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 1: She's not answered, which means she's used auto tune. Kidding

586
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:32,800
Speaker 1: and our buddy Joey c Are from the Henry Clay People,

587
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 1: formerly of Henry Clay People, now with fakers, And he said,

588
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:39,120
Speaker 1: I think there were a few harmonized us and as

589
00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 1: on one of our old records where we did some

590
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 1: pitch correcting, but that's it, I think, maybe so definitely

591
00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 1: he's probably be mad that I said that. Thank you

592
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:54,840
Speaker 1: for being forth right, Joey. Yeah, good guy. Are you

593
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 1: got anything else about autit Yeah? Just a really quick um.

594
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 1: This is from a great website. Tin artists that are

595
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 1: essentially computer programs. They just have the most auto tuned people.

596
00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:10,120
Speaker 1: They have t Pain, Kesha, Chris Brown, Maroon Five, Black

597
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:14,000
Speaker 1: Eyed Peas, Deaft Punk, Paris Hilton, who I forgot actually

598
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:17,239
Speaker 1: had a song the cast of Glee Katy Perry, and

599
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:19,920
Speaker 1: number one was owl City who. I don't even know

600
00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: what that is. There's a huge outcry apparently among Glee

601
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: fans for Glee to stop using so much auto tune.

602
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,240
Speaker 1: I think the deal is. They're like, well, these are actors,

603
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:32,640
Speaker 1: like yeah, And there's another there's a big scandal with

604
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 1: u K's got talent or something weird like that, um

605
00:36:37,880 --> 00:36:40,120
Speaker 1: where they were using a lot of auto tune for

606
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:46,360
Speaker 1: the auditions. It was like comeme on. Well anyway, man,

607
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:50,319
Speaker 1: that's not a very surprising list. So this has been

608
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: grumpy old men. I don't feel like we've been grumpy yet.

609
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:59,000
Speaker 1: We haven't like, condemned it out right. No, Nico Casey,

610
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,360
Speaker 1: she condemns it out right. Yeah, Emily, I have an

611
00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:05,640
Speaker 1: agreement about Nico case but we could both marry her, okay,

612
00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:09,560
Speaker 1: if she was ever available to us. She's right behind you.

613
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:14,480
Speaker 1: Oh my god. Uh so we have a very well

614
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:16,640
Speaker 1: done finish up your a deal. Sorry, I just jumped

615
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:20,080
Speaker 1: the gonka. Thank you, Ah, you don't have anything else

616
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:23,800
Speaker 1: about No, I was just teasing. We have a special

617
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:28,200
Speaker 1: listener mail with guests. Well, hold on let me finish first. Okay, okay, Well,

618
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 1: since Chuck doesn't have anything, it's the end. And if

619
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:33,359
Speaker 1: you want to know more about auto tune, you can

620
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:35,520
Speaker 1: type those words into the search bar at how stuff

621
00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 1: works dot com. And this article, I have to say,

622
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 1: by the way, was the most definitive article about auto

623
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:44,799
Speaker 1: tune on the internet. How about that. It's a good one.

624
00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:47,960
Speaker 1: Uh So you can go look that up. And since

625
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:51,160
Speaker 1: I said definitive, it's time for listener mail, and it's

626
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:54,399
Speaker 1: a special one. Like Chuck said, that's right. Today we

627
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 1: um got a joint listener mail to ourselves into Holly

628
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 1: and Tracy from stuff you missed in history class. Yep,

629
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 1: So we're gonna bring them in right, Yeah, we're gonna

630
00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 1: read the email and we're going to talk about its implications.

631
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 1: Let's start now. So, without further ado, we actually have

632
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:17,040
Speaker 1: Holly and Tracy of stuff you missed in history class

633
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:22,719
Speaker 1: with us. Hi and Tracy, we have actually not with us,

634
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:26,160
Speaker 1: she's with us in spirit and voice from Boston. I

635
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:29,040
Speaker 1: know it's pretty it's pretty interesting when it comes in

636
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:31,920
Speaker 1: through your headphones, but the other person somewhere else, it's

637
00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 1: kind of awesome. And this is how you guys do

638
00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:38,800
Speaker 1: the show now, right? Yes, we also have like an

639
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 1: online you know, we have a Google hangout where we

640
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 1: both are so we can see each other as well.

641
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:48,279
Speaker 1: We should have done that Tracy in here with her

642
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:52,200
Speaker 1: little video image or like um hologram of or they'd

643
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:54,400
Speaker 1: be pretty cool too. That's true, all right. So I

644
00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:55,920
Speaker 1: think the first thing I should do. You have a

645
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:58,400
Speaker 1: picture of me like our old boss. Oh well, I

646
00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:00,120
Speaker 1: do have a picture of you. I have the all

647
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:04,040
Speaker 1: its side that he gave out. So, um, I think

648
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:05,359
Speaker 1: the first thing we should do is just read. I'll

649
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 1: read the email here and then we will discuss like adults.

650
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:11,480
Speaker 1: How about that? Uh So, like I said, already set

651
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:13,239
Speaker 1: it up that we both got an email from a

652
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:16,719
Speaker 1: listener and she says the following, and this is from

653
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:21,319
Speaker 1: Amanda Lions. Hey, guys and gals. She didn't say that,

654
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:26,680
Speaker 1: of course, I just did. Well, you should read it, okay, Josh, Chuckers,

655
00:39:26,719 --> 00:39:29,160
Speaker 1: Holly and Tracy, and of course a hello to Jerry

656
00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:32,440
Speaker 1: and Nol. Yeah. I'm a social worker from Portland, Oregon

657
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:35,520
Speaker 1: with a passion for human equity and respect. One of

658
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 1: the original members of the s Y s K Army

659
00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 1: and a more recent listener to missed in History. I

660
00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:45,239
Speaker 1: binged for about five months before I got all caught up.

661
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 1: So how about that. I'm concerned about something I've heard

662
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:50,000
Speaker 1: a few times on the History podcast, and I was

663
00:39:50,000 --> 00:39:52,440
Speaker 1: wondering if you guys would be willing to get together

664
00:39:53,080 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 1: we are and look into something to fulfill my curiosity.

665
00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,640
Speaker 1: When Josh and Chuck received corrections, they thank people for

666
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:03,360
Speaker 1: being nice and frequently ask people not to be jerks

667
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:06,480
Speaker 1: when correcting them. When Holly and Tracy talk about corrections

668
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:10,400
Speaker 1: they receive, they ask people to be nice and have

669
00:40:10,560 --> 00:40:14,759
Speaker 1: referred to corrections on several occasions as hate mail. My

670
00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:17,759
Speaker 1: concern is that listeners may be more disrespectful Holly and

671
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:20,319
Speaker 1: Tracy because they are women, and even if listeners are

672
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:22,000
Speaker 1: rude to Josh and Chuck, they may rein it in

673
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 1: when making corrections because there are men. Could be completely

674
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 1: off base. But if I'm right, I feel like the

675
00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:30,760
Speaker 1: discrepancy should be addressed on the podcast to raise awareness

676
00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:33,839
Speaker 1: about how people treat men and women differently, and even

677
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 1: to address people's tendency to feel protected by the anonymity

678
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:38,759
Speaker 1: of the Internet and say things online they wouldn't say

679
00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:42,879
Speaker 1: to someone's face and Uh so, Manda, we did talk

680
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:44,879
Speaker 1: about it via email, and now we're going to talk

681
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:48,520
Speaker 1: about it like regular human folks. And Tracy really has

682
00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:51,759
Speaker 1: the wealth of information because of her job and what

683
00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:55,359
Speaker 1: you know she's been responsible for in the past. Oh yeah,

684
00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:59,800
Speaker 1: that sounds serious. Yeah. I was part of the management

685
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:02,600
Speaker 1: with a website for several years before I started actually

686
00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:05,959
Speaker 1: being on a podcast, and for a chunk of that time,

687
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:09,160
Speaker 1: most of the podcasters reported to me. So even though

688
00:41:09,200 --> 00:41:12,279
Speaker 1: I wasn't managing the podcast program, I was sort of

689
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:15,680
Speaker 1: keeping tabs on the iTunes reviews for everybody. And there

690
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 1: was a definite, definite trend in that the podcast that

691
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:25,000
Speaker 1: had women on them got disproportionately more vicious comments about

692
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 1: what their voices sounded like versus the podcast with men

693
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 1: on them, which got less of that. So this is

694
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,480
Speaker 1: news to me. Misogyny on the internet. I had not

695
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:40,320
Speaker 1: I wasn't aware that that was the thing that was

696
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 1: a beautiful blind spot of all time. No, I can imagine,

697
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:49,120
Speaker 1: And I know Tracy, you've like pointed some of these

698
00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 1: out before. Um, for us, it's it's like, yeah, we'll

699
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:56,520
Speaker 1: get hate mail every once in a while. Um, but

700
00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 1: it's kind of easy to dismiss because even if it

701
00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:02,280
Speaker 1: is to erect it at us, it's not necessarily directed

702
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 1: at our gender or whatever it's or even if it

703
00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:09,320
Speaker 1: is personal, it's it's dumb. It's just it's just dumb stuff.

704
00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:12,200
Speaker 1: It's easy to not take personally, even when it's meant

705
00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:16,200
Speaker 1: to be personal. But um, that's me speaking. Is like

706
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:19,400
Speaker 1: a white male age eighteen to forty nine, you know,

707
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:23,040
Speaker 1: so I can imagine that like when someone attacks you

708
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 1: just just based on your gender, or even worse, if

709
00:42:26,719 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 1: they're coming after you and they don't even realize that

710
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:32,800
Speaker 1: they're being driven by this, um, this disdain for your gender,

711
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:35,319
Speaker 1: that has to make it a lot harder to just

712
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:41,200
Speaker 1: just dismiss. Yeah, well, yeah, how you can go. I

713
00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:43,760
Speaker 1: was gonna say, for me, I mean I am lucky

714
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:46,360
Speaker 1: and that I really give very few damns about what

715
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:48,680
Speaker 1: most people think, like unless you're sitting in my lap

716
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:51,319
Speaker 1: or paying my paycheck, Like it's great if you like me,

717
00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:53,319
Speaker 1: but if you don't, that's cool too. Like everybody do

718
00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 1: your thing. But eventually, like the landslide builds up and

719
00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:02,920
Speaker 1: it's not it's not so much that I'm heartbroken or traumatized,

720
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:05,040
Speaker 1: but it just wears you down after a while where

721
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 1: you're like, why am I doing this just to get

722
00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:11,920
Speaker 1: more of this crap? Yeah? Well, and we definitely have,

723
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 1: like we have been called slurs based on our gender before,

724
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:21,160
Speaker 1: We have been called the C word over the pipe une. Yeah. Well,

725
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:23,839
Speaker 1: and then the I told you about that when we

726
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:26,799
Speaker 1: were discussing the email in our email conversation, I told

727
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:28,480
Speaker 1: you about the person who wrote to us and said

728
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:30,399
Speaker 1: they didn't understand how I could be in the same

729
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 1: room with Holly without strangling her. Like, that's the kind

730
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:34,640
Speaker 1: of stuff that people will write to us and be

731
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 1: really awful, But we do get a whole lot of

732
00:43:37,480 --> 00:43:40,520
Speaker 1: them that I don't think people are consciously being misogynistic,

733
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:42,920
Speaker 1: but they're talking to us and about us in a

734
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:45,320
Speaker 1: very gendered way. So people tell us that we sound

735
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:48,680
Speaker 1: shrill or that we sound bossy, and those aren't words

736
00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:51,000
Speaker 1: that people would use to describe men most of the time.

737
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 1: Most of their um and all of the articles that

738
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:02,600
Speaker 1: had come out lately of out, especially vocal fry and

739
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,640
Speaker 1: other things that people criticize about women's voices that they

740
00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:09,160
Speaker 1: don't generally criticize about men's voices. Every single time I

741
00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:11,160
Speaker 1: read it, and I'm like, I could have written that

742
00:44:11,239 --> 00:44:14,480
Speaker 1: about my job and my experience being a woman talking

743
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:18,600
Speaker 1: on the internet. So which one, Um, which one hits

744
00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 1: home the most? Like one that's a just a direct

745
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:25,239
Speaker 1: personal attack are the ones that or the person is

746
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:33,000
Speaker 1: just being unconsciously misogynistic, which to me would seem more entrenched. Yeah,

747
00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 1: to me, the second one is worse. And it's especially

748
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:38,680
Speaker 1: worse because a lot of the implicitly gendered criticism that

749
00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:43,560
Speaker 1: we get is also from women. The hardest part, Yeah,

750
00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:46,239
Speaker 1: that's the hardest part for me to deal with. Yeah,

751
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:49,800
Speaker 1: when they're real specific, for example, like the person who

752
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:54,160
Speaker 1: wants me to be strangled. Um, at the end of

753
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,440
Speaker 1: the day, I'm like, he's working through his own stuff,

754
00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 1: Like I have really have very little to do with this.

755
00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:00,480
Speaker 1: So I may have been the trigger the you know,

756
00:45:00,719 --> 00:45:03,520
Speaker 1: cause this little outrage bomb, but really it has very

757
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:06,160
Speaker 1: little to do with me that I think almost of

758
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 1: the time that is the case. These are people who

759
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:12,280
Speaker 1: have their own gripes in life and are probably angry,

760
00:45:12,360 --> 00:45:15,560
Speaker 1: unhappy people. Yes, But then, as Tracy said, when you

761
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:17,799
Speaker 1: get those ones that are like they they're not even

762
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 1: conscious of how it's playing out, you realize how much

763
00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:28,920
Speaker 1: it is a bigger, sort of systemic social problem because

764
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,080
Speaker 1: most of those people are not evil, they don't intend

765
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:36,719
Speaker 1: to be misogynistic. They're not conscious that they're separating the

766
00:45:36,719 --> 00:45:42,520
Speaker 1: two genders and judging them differently on different criteria. So yeah,

767
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:44,680
Speaker 1: those are, as Tracy said, a little more disturbing because

768
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:46,800
Speaker 1: you realize that it's kind of like the silent creep

769
00:45:46,880 --> 00:45:50,319
Speaker 1: that underlays everything. Well, we do get a lot of

770
00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:52,640
Speaker 1: emails that are great from people who are great, and

771
00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:54,919
Speaker 1: the majority of the email that we get is great,

772
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:56,399
Speaker 1: so we like, I don't want to make it sound

773
00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,319
Speaker 1: like every person who writes to us is awful. Um,

774
00:45:59,360 --> 00:46:01,360
Speaker 1: And we talked about corrections on the episode a lot

775
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,640
Speaker 1: of times from people who write it in and everything

776
00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:05,960
Speaker 1: is fine and everything is very respectful. So to me,

777
00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:09,320
Speaker 1: a correction is you said this person died in nineteen

778
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:13,320
Speaker 1: and eighteen, but really it was nineteen seven. That's a correction,

779
00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:15,279
Speaker 1: and that's fine. But then we'll also get ones that

780
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:17,400
Speaker 1: are like, I can't believe you didn't even bother to

781
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:20,080
Speaker 1: look this up. You completely butchered it. I don't know

782
00:46:20,120 --> 00:46:22,439
Speaker 1: why you don't even put more thought into what you're doing,

783
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:24,960
Speaker 1: because it's really important that you represent yourselves as well,

784
00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:27,960
Speaker 1: And that's when I'm like, that's hate mail. Yeah, we

785
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:29,840
Speaker 1: get those. Yeah, we get a lot of those, but

786
00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 1: I never feel like those are like, uh, have anything

787
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:36,600
Speaker 1: to do with my gender? Yeah, in those cases absolutely,

788
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:38,799
Speaker 1: I mean we get the same exact emails where it's

789
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:41,600
Speaker 1: just like you, you guys are total idiots, like how

790
00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:43,719
Speaker 1: how could you drop the ball this badly? And it's

791
00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:47,360
Speaker 1: like we basically said exactly what you're saying, We just

792
00:46:47,400 --> 00:46:51,120
Speaker 1: said it slightly differently. It definitely doesn't warrant this kind

793
00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 1: of reaction, you know, Um yeah, I I why do

794
00:46:56,640 --> 00:47:01,160
Speaker 1: you think there is a gender or bias or a gender?

795
00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 1: Why is it worse for you guys being women? Do

796
00:47:05,480 --> 00:47:09,480
Speaker 1: you think not just in common history of the world,

797
00:47:09,719 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 1: but I know, like how how long do you have?

798
00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 1: But I mean, like even even beyond comments like why

799
00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: is the internet so geared towards hating women? I mean,

800
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:20,759
Speaker 1: what's what's the deal with that? Do you guys? Is

801
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:24,520
Speaker 1: there is there a general understanding or idea behind it

802
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 1: lonely angry men? Is my guess? Well? I think it's

803
00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 1: it's super complex, right, There's no one simple answer. Like

804
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:34,480
Speaker 1: some of it is that we have reached an age

805
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 1: where the disparity in terms of UH gender equality has

806
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:44,520
Speaker 1: shrunk at the same time that a lot of people

807
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:48,440
Speaker 1: have this outlet readily available to them. So there's progress

808
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:50,480
Speaker 1: being made, but there are also the people who are

809
00:47:50,480 --> 00:47:53,279
Speaker 1: still kicking and screaming as they get dragged into a

810
00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:57,120
Speaker 1: future they're not comfortable with. But then there's also just

811
00:47:57,160 --> 00:47:58,879
Speaker 1: the thing that again I don't think people are even

812
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:01,880
Speaker 1: conscious of it where it is new for many people,

813
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:05,759
Speaker 1: and even people that are younger and have maybe grown

814
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:09,240
Speaker 1: up in a more kind of old school traditional environment,

815
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 1: be at household or community, where they're not even conscious

816
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:16,840
Speaker 1: of why they're more upset at women. There's just something

817
00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:21,719
Speaker 1: about women, you know, sharing knowledge or being assertive or

818
00:48:21,719 --> 00:48:24,480
Speaker 1: being confident that just rankles them. And they don't even

819
00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:27,000
Speaker 1: register that it's because it's a woman. They just know

820
00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 1: there's something about that person I hate and it's something

821
00:48:29,560 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 1: they're just not used to and they haven't kind of

822
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:38,480
Speaker 1: made the the mental accustomization to. Oh. Sometimes people that

823
00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 1: aren't dudes have stuff to say as well. Do you

824
00:48:41,480 --> 00:48:46,200
Speaker 1: think the same experiences extrapolatable under race as well as gender,

825
00:48:46,200 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 1: and well, I mean I know it is, but I

826
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:52,000
Speaker 1: mean is it almost like a step for step do

827
00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:58,520
Speaker 1: you think I think it's probably pretty similar models. Yeah, well,

828
00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:01,360
Speaker 1: speaking like as the ass a white person in a

829
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:03,560
Speaker 1: room of white people who are on the phone right now.

830
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:07,280
Speaker 1: The worst days I have ever had managing our Facebook page,

831
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:10,680
Speaker 1: our days when we talk about something that has to

832
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:15,440
Speaker 1: do with systemic racism and we'll we'll get a flood

833
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:20,280
Speaker 1: of similarly implicitly racist comments from people who really don't

834
00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:22,479
Speaker 1: know that the view that they just put out there

835
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:26,319
Speaker 1: is racist. Like, that's sort of the same thing. Like

836
00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:28,319
Speaker 1: a lot of people do things that are misogynists, not

837
00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:31,480
Speaker 1: really consciously being misogynist. That just it comes out and

838
00:49:31,480 --> 00:49:33,879
Speaker 1: they're not consciously aware of it, and it's we see

839
00:49:33,880 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 1: the same thing on our Facebook posts in subjects that

840
00:49:37,560 --> 00:49:41,120
Speaker 1: are related to race really pretty often. So at the

841
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:43,040
Speaker 1: end of the day, when you guys get a bunch

842
00:49:43,080 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 1: of these, say, on just a particularly bad day, what

843
00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 1: what do you do? I mean, do you battle this?

844
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:51,439
Speaker 1: Do you just brush it off and be like, these

845
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:53,640
Speaker 1: guys are idiots and whether they like it or not,

846
00:49:53,680 --> 00:49:56,480
Speaker 1: they are going to be dragged into the future against

847
00:49:56,560 --> 00:49:59,080
Speaker 1: their will. Uh, you know, what do you do a

848
00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:02,360
Speaker 1: combination of both? Or do you look at your status

849
00:50:02,360 --> 00:50:08,520
Speaker 1: is a perennial top twenty podcast and say, clearly, who

850
00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:10,759
Speaker 1: cares what they say? Because we're really good at what

851
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:14,880
Speaker 1: we do, because we're very successful. I do a combination

852
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:17,840
Speaker 1: of things. I have kind of a library of links

853
00:50:17,880 --> 00:50:20,880
Speaker 1: about vocal fry and whatever. Anyone writes directly to us

854
00:50:20,920 --> 00:50:24,240
Speaker 1: to complain about vocal fry, I kind of send them, hey,

855
00:50:24,239 --> 00:50:28,160
Speaker 1: why don't you listen to this? Uh this American Life

856
00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:32,440
Speaker 1: segment all about vocal fry in which Ira Glass has

857
00:50:32,520 --> 00:50:35,560
Speaker 1: vocal fry the entire segment, but nobody complains at him

858
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:40,040
Speaker 1: about it. Um. So I like I specifically will address that.

859
00:50:40,080 --> 00:50:42,319
Speaker 1: I will specifically address things that people say on our

860
00:50:42,320 --> 00:50:46,439
Speaker 1: Facebook page in public, because I feel like our role

861
00:50:46,560 --> 00:50:50,600
Speaker 1: as a podcast about history does not include allowing people

862
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 1: free rein to be racist in public and have that

863
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:56,960
Speaker 1: not be challenge. Um. But when it comes to the

864
00:50:57,680 --> 00:50:59,560
Speaker 1: like the email that Holly and I got that was

865
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:02,160
Speaker 1: that was so bad pretty recently, that was the person

866
00:51:02,200 --> 00:51:09,440
Speaker 1: who was basically advocating me murdering Holly. Um, I was

867
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:11,960
Speaker 1: actually traveling. I went down to the hotel bar and

868
00:51:11,960 --> 00:51:15,720
Speaker 1: how to drink there? You got a book and tried

869
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:17,680
Speaker 1: to chill Yeah, I tried and chill out about it,

870
00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:25,319
Speaker 1: booze everything. Well, um, thank you both for addressing this.

871
00:51:26,160 --> 00:51:28,960
Speaker 1: I'm sorry we didn't solve this problem here in this this.

872
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:32,799
Speaker 1: Thank you for having us on the show. Of course. Um,

873
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:34,560
Speaker 1: if anyone out there and stuff you should know Land

874
00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:36,600
Speaker 1: has not checked out stuff you missed in history class,

875
00:51:37,080 --> 00:51:40,759
Speaker 1: you definitely should because it is super awesome and as

876
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:43,279
Speaker 1: are both of you. And I don't want to strangle you,

877
00:51:43,360 --> 00:51:51,080
Speaker 1: but I want to hug your necks. Nope, you've got

878
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:56,520
Speaker 1: to have it. And now she don't move no more. Nope.

879
00:51:56,560 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 1: But thanks for coming in. And uh, we should do

880
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:01,480
Speaker 1: this more often, you know, we should. We should have

881
00:52:01,520 --> 00:52:03,000
Speaker 1: a whole show where we just get together and do

882
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:05,560
Speaker 1: roundtable stuff. We can have yappy pow wow party time.

883
00:52:06,280 --> 00:52:09,960
Speaker 1: That would be fun. Yeah. Well, if you have something

884
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:12,120
Speaker 1: to say about all this, and we're sure you will,

885
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:14,319
Speaker 1: we want to hear from you. You can tweet to

886
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:17,320
Speaker 1: us at s Y s K podcast. You can tweet

887
00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:20,440
Speaker 1: the stuff you missed in history class at at missed

888
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:23,359
Speaker 1: in History. You can join us on Facebook dot com

889
00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:25,920
Speaker 1: slash stuff you should know. You can join stuff you

890
00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:29,960
Speaker 1: missed in History class at missed in History, Facebook dot com,

891
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:32,920
Speaker 1: slash miss in History make it easy? What about email?

892
00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:34,960
Speaker 1: How do they get in touch of your history? Podcast

893
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:36,799
Speaker 1: at how stuff works dot com And you can hit

894
00:52:36,880 --> 00:52:39,000
Speaker 1: us up at stuff podcast at how stuff works dot

895
00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:40,960
Speaker 1: com and at all as always joined us at our

896
00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:43,640
Speaker 1: home on the Web, Stuff you Should Know dot com

897
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 1: and missed in History dot com. For more on this

898
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:54,720
Speaker 1: and thousands of other topics, does it how stuff works

899
00:52:54,719 --> 00:53:02,400
Speaker 1: dot com