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Speaker 1: Israeli media reports three hospitals in Gaza City are currently surrounded.

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Speaker 1: The Israelis believe there are Hamas fighters inside the complexity

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Speaker 1: of this though there are still patients inside, thousands of

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Speaker 1: Palestinians still not heating those warnings by the Israelis to

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Speaker 1: head to the south. Some in the hospital simply don't

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Speaker 1: have the ability to do so.

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Speaker 2: That's topic number one for Mike Lyons on the difficulties

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Speaker 2: of what's going on in the Middle East right now.

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Speaker 2: The Israelis have hospitals surrounded, there are Herramas fighters in

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Speaker 2: there and patients. Here's problem number two. These latest astroke

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Speaker 2: was supposed to be a message to around to tell

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Speaker 2: its proxy groups to stop attacking the US.

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Speaker 3: Fool sage.

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Speaker 2: Well, it seems either they didn't hear the warning or

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Speaker 2: they didn't heed it with the obvious risk that this

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Speaker 2: could escalate. Yeah, so we bombed something somewhere to let

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Speaker 2: our ind know we're serious. Remember what Kamala Harris said,

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Speaker 2: don't Yeah, don't. Well, after we hit them, punch them

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Speaker 2: in nose. They've attacked our troops four times since then,

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Speaker 2: at least four. There's a risk it'll escalate. Better anyway

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Speaker 2: to discuss these topics and more. Please welcome Mike Lyons.

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Speaker 2: You see Mike on CNN, respected military analyst. Mike. Always

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Speaker 2: great to talk to you.

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Speaker 3: How are you taking away, guy, It's great to be back.

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Speaker 2: Which of those you want to tackle first?

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Speaker 3: I think about hospitals, right, Gaza City's got the most

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Speaker 3: amount of hospitals per capita for the density of their population. Like,

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Speaker 3: you can't swing a dead cat and not hit a

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Speaker 3: hospital there. Now, that's you think that's on purpose. I

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Speaker 3: mean for a population that's growing and has got you know,

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Speaker 3: more children and a lot of old people. That's for

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Speaker 3: a reason. That's because when Hamas built hospitals, they make

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Speaker 3: military headquarters out of them.

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Speaker 2: So they call everything a hospital. That's pretty clever.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, right, And so again Israel is doing everything it

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Speaker 3: can to try to send messages about about them and

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Speaker 3: what you I think what's left now in some of

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Speaker 3: these places are some last minute martyrs because really what

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Speaker 3: they are going to they're all going to die. The

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Speaker 3: hamask guys that are there, and maybe the leadership is

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Speaker 3: now starting to infiltrate back to the South because they

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Speaker 3: realized they're losing this fight here in the town. But yeah,

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Speaker 3: this is this is a you know, a population that

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Speaker 3: that allows itself for Hamas to you to hide itself behind.

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Speaker 3: So I don't know what else to say. It's a

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Speaker 3: kind of warfare we haven't seen in this century as

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Speaker 3: blatant as it is. And with my problem is the

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Speaker 3: rest of the world is not on israel side, or

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Speaker 3: is not on the side of what's clearly the good

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Speaker 3: guys here when it comes to how this war should

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Speaker 3: be propagated.

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Speaker 2: I want to talk more about that in a little bit.

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Speaker 2: But as a retired gentleman of the United States Army,

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Speaker 2: is there any ambiguity at all in international law, US law,

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Speaker 2: any law you can think of about using human shields

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Speaker 2: and who is responsible for the death of those people?

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Speaker 3: If it comes no, it is, and it's it's Amasa's responsibility.

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Speaker 3: But we're dealing with a group that doesn't have any

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Speaker 3: accountability to that lag. We're not going to be able

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Speaker 3: to prosecute that. We're not going to be able to,

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Speaker 3: you know, drag them in front of some World Tribune someplace,

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Speaker 3: and it's not going to have But we're not going

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Speaker 3: to get their surrender. Like all the things that we

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Speaker 3: want about war that happened in the Second World War.

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Speaker 3: You know, you drag the Japanese on the Missouri and

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Speaker 3: you make them surrender and those things. Those days are over.

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Speaker 3: So we're at this point where we're letting them get

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Speaker 3: away with whatever they want, and we're holding the Israeli

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Speaker 3: soldier to this incredibly high standard. Now again, no one's

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Speaker 3: murdering civilians in combat. I mean, that's clearly a war crime.

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Speaker 3: We're not Meli, we're not going in that direction. But

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Speaker 3: in the same token, what we asked the Israeli soldier

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Speaker 3: to do, to be a warf fire on this street

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Speaker 3: and then a peacekeeper in this in this instance, and

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Speaker 3: then all of a sudden, now you're back to being

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Speaker 3: a warf fighter. I mean the whip saw and is

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Speaker 3: just driving them crazy. It's just not a reasonable expectation

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Speaker 3: for a performance what they're trying to do.

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Speaker 2: Right. Yeah, My point really didn't have anything to do

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Speaker 2: with prosecuting himoser or anything like that. It's to make

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Speaker 2: it infinitely clear to Americans who might be listening, there

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Speaker 2: is no ambiguity. If you position fighting forces intentionally among

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Speaker 2: civilians and those civilians are killed, it's not your opponent

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Speaker 2: who is guilty by any international accord.

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Speaker 3: No, well, but there's no there's no way that we're

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Speaker 3: not going to do anything about it, though, because they're

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Speaker 3: going to still hold Israel to the higher standards.

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Speaker 2: Right that, legally speaking, you're right, but that's not going

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Speaker 2: to matter to millions of people on the streets, the

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Speaker 2: public opinion, you know, battle over this whole. That's why

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Speaker 2: I'm trying to knock some sense into their heads, which

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Speaker 2: is really really frustrating. So I'm just hot to trot

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Speaker 2: for this story. I've been wanting to ask you this

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Speaker 2: all week long. How many times can Iran attack us

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Speaker 2: before we hit them really hard? Or is this a

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Speaker 2: good idea that we're holding back?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, we've got this visual deterrent, right, we show another

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Speaker 3: ship shows up, we send a tweet on a submarine.

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Speaker 3: The problem is this administration does not want to get

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Speaker 3: to the point where us we have to go after

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Speaker 3: Iran for whatever reason. I think we know the reason,

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Speaker 3: because they we do the This administration deep down thinks

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Speaker 3: we can still all get along. And and and Ron

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Speaker 3: has control of these samalistic groups within Syria and within

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Speaker 3: within Iraq and these places, and what do we do

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Speaker 3: when they're hurting our soldiers with TBIs and one died,

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Speaker 3: and like, it's time to get them out of there.

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Speaker 3: If we're not going to protect them, it's just time

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Speaker 3: to go. We're going we're hitting logistical supply places back.

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Speaker 3: We should be going after the people, and we're not

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Speaker 3: going at it in any kind of proportionality. We should

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Speaker 3: be disapportional, we should be going after multiple strikes. So

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Speaker 3: I don't get it. And if again, if I was

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Speaker 3: a I'm a parent of a soldier that's in that place,

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Speaker 3: get my son or daughter out of there. It's Enough's enough.

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Speaker 3: It's just crazy.

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Speaker 2: Because what I was wondering the other day was is

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Speaker 2: Secretary Austin like clenched fist, grinding his teeth going along

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Speaker 2: with this because he serves at the pleasure of the

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Speaker 2: commander in Cheaper you think he's on board.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a great question. I don't know. I think

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Speaker 3: I'd like to think the clenched fist. I know a

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Speaker 3: lot of his classmates, I know a lot of people

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Speaker 3: in that generation. I don't get it, because again, we

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Speaker 3: want to we have to be protection of our force

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Speaker 3: has got to be the priority. But then, but then

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Speaker 3: you've got to deal with the Secretary of State who

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Speaker 3: goes on today in Indian TV and talks about too

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Speaker 3: many Palestinians being killed. I mean, the guy stepping on

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Speaker 3: his own program. Two days ago, we were okay about,

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Speaker 3: you know, about what Israel was doing, and now he's

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Speaker 3: not okay with it. I I just the level again

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Speaker 3: of whip song back and forth of this administration is

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Speaker 3: just be on the pale right now. I don't I

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Speaker 3: don't know what else, what else to say. And again

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Speaker 3: Israel is rolling their eyes at us because they're not stopping.

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Speaker 3: They're not they're not going to be influenced by any

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Speaker 3: of this.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm reminded of a lot of domestic politics being

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Speaker 2: so stupid. I think they're overthinking influencing the public around

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Speaker 2: the world by you know, conceding. Yeah, the Palestinians are suffering,

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Speaker 2: and it's terrible, and it is terrible. If you have

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Speaker 2: a beating heart, it's it's awful. But yeah, I just

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Speaker 2: it feels like a feckless, indecisive foreign policy to I've

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Speaker 2: been wondering whether they've just decided, Look, any escalation in

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Speaker 2: the region is going to be bad for us long term,

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Speaker 2: so we got to keep this as tight as we can.

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Speaker 2: Our guys aren't getting killed. I think one contractor was

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Speaker 2: who was an American serving his country. But I think

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Speaker 2: they might be wrong. I think that's the theory. I

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Speaker 2: don't know.

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Speaker 3: Sure, No, they don't want to face off against the

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Speaker 3: Iranians and and talk to a bunch of retard guys

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Speaker 3: over the last couple of weeks and it's like it's time.

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Speaker 3: I mean, there's no other way around this that you know,

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Speaker 3: they're not The terrence is not working. The turrence fails

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Speaker 3: in Ukraine, to Turrens failed in Israel, and it's starting

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Speaker 3: to fail with us because we're just not willing to,

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Speaker 3: you know, you know, to pull the trigger here. And

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Speaker 3: every time the Secretary of State or somebody comes up

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Speaker 3: with the Israelis have to be doing more, Well, tell

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Speaker 3: me exactly what tell tell me specifically what more you

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Speaker 3: want to do, because you're not going to get them

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Speaker 3: to stop. And a pause is actually inhumane because they're

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Speaker 3: going to pause and they're going to give people some

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Speaker 3: time to move out, and then they're going to start

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Speaker 3: it all up again. So so again, this is war.

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Speaker 3: This is no that's no other content strict that we're

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Speaker 3: talking about. Here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, as a guy like you who's been studying the

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Speaker 2: history of war, we're into a new era in a

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Speaker 2: whole bunch of different ways geopolitically and then communications, the

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Speaker 2: fact that we see it all live in the moment,

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Speaker 2: not couched by some you know journalists days later in

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Speaker 2: the New York Times. You watch it live and then

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Speaker 2: get the influence of all the Twitter followers in their bs.

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Speaker 2: And that's so crazy.

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Speaker 3: And the administration now is putting out that they're getting

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Speaker 3: cables from foreign countries about the problem with you know,

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Speaker 3: the Arab world is upset about this, and we have

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Speaker 3: to be careful. And I want to go you go

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Speaker 3: to those diplomats to do their job job and go

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Speaker 3: convince the Arab nations that what's going on in Israel

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Speaker 3: is not Israel's fault. Like push back, like the Abraham

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Speaker 3: records were good. Get Saudi Arabia back in the game. Here,

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Speaker 3: nothing's going to we agree, nothing's going to happen until

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Speaker 3: you get Arab nations involved with Gaza anyway. In the

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Speaker 3: other portion, for the refugees, like I said, the Egyptians

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Speaker 3: can't build that wall back fast enough any time to

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Speaker 3: make a hole in it to let any kind of

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Speaker 3: humanity and efforts to go through it. Now there's there's

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Speaker 3: a reason for that. So again that no one has

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Speaker 3: any solutions other than you know, do better.

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Speaker 2: They can do more, Mike, one final thought for a movie.

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Speaker 2: We came across a brilliant comment. I'm sorry a column

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Speaker 2: yesterday that quoted extensively from General Sherman's letter to the

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Speaker 2: people and governors of Atlanta, the city council. I believe

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Speaker 2: it was explaining why he was going to burn the

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Speaker 2: city and they're pleased to him not to were misplaced,

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Speaker 2: and it's summarized as I completely understand what you're saying,

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Speaker 2: and it's a terrible thing to do. I wish I

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Speaker 2: didn't have to do it. But the kindest thing I

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Speaker 2: can do for you is end this war. And that's

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Speaker 2: what we intend to do.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's what Israel was trying to do, I think,

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Speaker 3: and and the scourge of terrorism exists in the world

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Speaker 3: that it's a cloud that hangs over our head. It's

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Speaker 3: been hanging over our head for twenty something years, really

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Speaker 3: since nine to eleven. And the Arab nations have got

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Speaker 3: to recognize that, you know, they could help solve the problem.

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Speaker 3: You know, we have a combating Terrorism Center at West Point.

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Speaker 3: We've devoted so many resources, are trying to figure out

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Speaker 3: how to do this, and it just has to get

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Speaker 3: back to plain old powers. This has to gets back to,

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Speaker 3: you know what, We're going to eliminate the scourge from

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Speaker 3: the earth. And whether it's one Hamaskay at a time,

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Speaker 3: you know, Barack Obama, let's him say, oh, we're going

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Speaker 3: to create a whole new generation of terrorists. Well guess

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Speaker 3: what if we sit there and do nothing, We're going

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Speaker 3: to do the same thing. So we've got to do something.

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Speaker 3: And again, I choose to fight. There's a time to

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Speaker 3: fight right now, and that's what it Israel's doing. So

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Speaker 3: so good for them.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if I've ever heard you so fired up.

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Speaker 2: Well I believe there's a war for American society going

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Speaker 2: on right now.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, yeah, I do too. And again, watching this,

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Speaker 3: you know, a year from election day, watching this administration,

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Speaker 3: you know, we can't even protect our own borders. You

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Speaker 3: look at look at our own things that we're having

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Speaker 3: a problem with internally. It's just it's it's it's I

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Speaker 3: don't want this, this scourage that's happening there to hit

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Speaker 3: our shores, and let's hope it doesn't.

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Speaker 2: So this sort of stuff has been your entire adult life.

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Speaker 2: Tomorrow's Veterans Day. Give us a few seconds on what

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Speaker 2: Veterans Day means to you.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just glad it's the holiday that it is now.

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Speaker 3: I mean when I first got in the military, would

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Speaker 3: come home and I'd say, hey, I'm in the I'm

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Speaker 3: in the Army, and people would say to me, I'm glad.

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Speaker 3: I don't think anybody did that anymore. So I'm just

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Speaker 3: glad that we celebrate veterans down and of other generations.

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Speaker 3: I'm not not necessarily mine, but it's just it's something

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Speaker 3: I'm trying to keep a low profile on. But God

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Speaker 3: bless the veterans that are out there.

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Speaker 2: And thank you for a service Mike clients, It's always enlightening. Mike,

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Speaker 2: thanks a million, both for your service and for spending

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Speaker 2: some time.

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Speaker 3: Thanks thanks as for me, Yep Armstrong and Getty