Speaker 1: The volume, I don't. I can't remember the last two
Speaker 1: days of a golf tournament where I was more emotionally
Speaker 1: vested in a golfer than Rory McElroy. And I wasn't
Speaker 1: rooting against Justin Rose or Bryson Deshambeau, who I think
Speaker 1: has done an incredible one eighty rehab of his brand
Speaker 1: where he was unlikable and now is incredibly likable or
Speaker 1: at least more likable. But I was thinking about this
Speaker 1: John John Middlecoff, former NFL Scout three and out part
Speaker 1: of the volume is that what makes Rory We know
Speaker 1: he's a sensational talent, but he's got a phil Mickelson
Speaker 1: quality where you can you can see him buckle, you
Speaker 1: can see I mean when he takes that wedge from
Speaker 1: a buck twenty five out and puts it in the
Speaker 1: water in the creek, You're like, bro, I hit my
Speaker 1: irons great Saturday. It's gokey country club in Chicago suburb,
Speaker 1: Like I what is going on? And I think what
Speaker 1: finds him, what makes Rory so likable, is that he
Speaker 1: is vulnerable and he just has you know, four double
Speaker 1: bogies short wed shot in the creek. I think that
Speaker 1: just makes him incredibly watchable.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think. You know, I think every great golfer,
Speaker 2: definitely in my life, which I've been watching for almost
Speaker 2: thirty years now. Yea, like the Tiger Phil era is
Speaker 2: kind of defined by their greatness or disasters in majors. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, when I was a kid, Greg Norman, it
Speaker 2: was a big deal to like have a shark polo
Speaker 2: when I was a kid, wear him to school.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: When you think Greg Norman, you think a guy that
Speaker 2: unravels and fails. You know, Phil is weird because he's
Speaker 2: one of the greatest players in the history of the sport.
Speaker 2: He's won six majors, he's won the Masters three times,
Speaker 2: He's won forty five tournaments. But you remember him a
Speaker 2: lot of times for finishing second. Yes to Payne Stewart,
Speaker 2: he blasted out of bounds at wing foot in the
Speaker 2: mid two thousands.
Speaker 1: Taking big risks. He doesn't need to.
Speaker 2: And he's like that in life. Right when he made
Speaker 2: the comments about the Saudi's after he took their two
Speaker 2: hundred million dollars. You know, Rory's this kind of enigma
Speaker 2: because and I thought today actually symbolized his entire career. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean, he had a couple shots that are like
Speaker 2: the most incredible shots in the history of Masters. He
Speaker 2: hooked a seven iron around a tree to five feet
Speaker 2: on fifteen, and then he missed the putt, and then
Speaker 2: he missed the putt. You know, and I can't you know,
Speaker 2: Tiger's got this torn achilles. He's like, he's like a
Speaker 2: nineteen seventies NFL player on his bed with eighteen million injuries.
Speaker 2: Can you imagine Tiger watching this tournament and thinking, You know,
Speaker 2: Tiger was actually pretty boring as a champion because he
Speaker 2: didn't screw up. What was the famous quote, like dumb
Speaker 2: loses more than smart wins. Yeah, Tiger was very conservative.
Speaker 2: You know, Rory dunks into the water, he Bogei's eighteen
Speaker 2: to send it to a playoff after he's right in
Speaker 2: the middle of the fairway three hundred and thirty yards. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't know where you stood. I thought, the emotional
Speaker 2: roller coaster of that three and a half hours, how
Speaker 2: could he win in well, in extra hole? I thought
Speaker 2: he was gonna lose. Colin I didn't. I didn't have
Speaker 2: any faith he was going to win in extra holes
Speaker 2: because emotionally put yourself in his shoes. He had to
Speaker 2: be gutted to try to gather himself and keep his
Speaker 2: heart rate down. He probably wanted to cry.
Speaker 1: Well, it's funny because Phil Mickelson got himself into trouble
Speaker 1: because he was overly aggressive. But and he would buckle,
Speaker 1: but it was a different kind. Rory loses confidence. You
Speaker 1: can see it. And there are times on that wedge
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, he just lost confidence. He said it
Speaker 1: a little bit on the green jacket in ceremony in
Speaker 1: the room, which I thought was really emotional. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I just I think, you know, Tiger was such a
Speaker 1: great leader, like he never lost leeds. If Tiger led
Speaker 1: by five strokes going into Sunday, it was over. There
Speaker 1: was one US Open against rock O Media, which I
Speaker 1: found that was stirring with Tiger. Also his last Master's
Speaker 1: win where he was an older golfer was stirring and
Speaker 1: really emotional.
Speaker 2: Well, Colin O eight was stirring with Roco because he
Speaker 2: had a torn acl and a broken leg. He was healthy.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I know what you mean.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I mean I just thought the whole spectacle
Speaker 1: it was perfect weather amend corner, just the galleries or
Speaker 1: the patrons, the intensity, you know, I kept thinking to myself,
Speaker 1: so Bryson de Shambeau was to shambles his I mean,
Speaker 1: he had a distance issue all weekend, but he was
Speaker 1: putting great until Sunday. And it was interesting when they
Speaker 1: interviewed him afterwards. He took a little shot, a little
Speaker 1: projection when he said, you know, I don't remember the
Speaker 1: Sunday greens being that fast because he was really off now.
Speaker 1: He all weekend had sort of a distance issue, like
Speaker 1: he was long or short, but his putting kept him close.
Speaker 1: Whereas Rory's wedge and Rory's irons were either remarkable or mediocre.
Speaker 1: Rory today, frankly, think about that, how good Rory is.
Speaker 1: He had one of the worst shots ever the wedge
Speaker 1: end of the creek. He blew a four stroke lead.
Speaker 1: He hit a couple of putts, but he was hit
Speaker 1: and miss off the tee. You didn't know exactly what
Speaker 1: you were getting from Rory off the tee, and yet
Speaker 1: he won. I mean, how damn good do you have
Speaker 1: to be if you just if I just told you
Speaker 1: what his round was rough off the tee, one of
Speaker 1: the worst shots ever, gags a lead, you wouldn't think
Speaker 1: he'd win.
Speaker 2: Well, I thought I mean Colin he blew a. He
Speaker 2: had a two shot lead coming in today he was
Speaker 2: down one shot after two holes. I mean, it felt like,
Speaker 2: is this gonna be Greg Norman John Vandervelt Immediately, honestly,
Speaker 2: you felt bad for him, like how can this happen?
Speaker 2: But he had a couple shots today that I would
Speaker 2: say were phil like over trees. Yes, I mean he
Speaker 2: had one shot over a tree, yeah, the bender around
Speaker 2: the tree. Another shot over a tree from the left side.
Speaker 2: He had another shot on the right side. He did
Speaker 2: get a little lucky. I mean, one thing with Augusta,
Speaker 2: you can't really hit it out of bounds. You just
Speaker 2: there's tree trouble, but it's not. There's no rough right
Speaker 2: so you can spray it a little bit and there's
Speaker 2: just the golf gods are on your side. You're still
Speaker 2: gonna be okay, So the golf gods are on your side.
Speaker 2: Through the first three rounds, he was the best player
Speaker 2: in the tournament by a mile. Bryce and yesterday hit
Speaker 2: that like one hundred foot putt to instead of being
Speaker 2: down three down two eighteen. But he didn't even play
Speaker 2: that well yesterday, where Rory shot sixty six sixty six
Speaker 2: Friday and Saturday and on front and on Thursday, Rory's
Speaker 2: four under heading into fifteen hits it on two chips,
Speaker 2: it into the water. So he kind of unravels at
Speaker 2: the end. But he had played brilliantly and it just
Speaker 2: shows you that, Like, to me, one thing that's fascinating
Speaker 2: about Rory, and I always admire the Michael Jordan, the Brady's,
Speaker 2: even the young version of Mahomes. When you win, you
Speaker 2: win big, you make all the money, and you just
Speaker 2: keep grinding because you're addicted to the competition. That Tiger
Speaker 2: was notorious for this, right, Stevie Williams's caddy would be like,
Speaker 2: you know, we'd win, and Tiger would call me two
Speaker 2: days later and be like, I'll meet you at the
Speaker 2: range of six in the morning. Stee be like, take
Speaker 2: the week off and now that this gets the Monkey office.
Speaker 2: But and Ry had already won twice this year. He
Speaker 2: won a Pebble, and he won the Players. Now he's
Speaker 2: won the Masters. He's playing by far the best in
Speaker 2: the world. He's better and Scott he's off, you know, Bryson.
Speaker 2: Really he's outplayed Bryson twice. He screwed up last year
Speaker 2: in the putts at Viners. If Rory keeps the pedal
Speaker 2: of the medal, he might not win every major, but
Speaker 2: he could win like six seven times. He could have
Speaker 2: a historic year. You do wonder watch the way he
Speaker 2: broke down. Is he just gonna take like a month
Speaker 2: to just like not do anything. He wouldn't blame him.
Speaker 2: But if he keeps it down like Jordan or Tiger
Speaker 2: or those you know, Brady would he He's the best
Speaker 2: player in the world right now by by a pretty
Speaker 2: wide margin.
Speaker 1: I think yeah, And I thought Bryson de Shamble. His
Speaker 1: game is just listen, I like golf. I played it
Speaker 1: this weekend.
Speaker 2: How'd you play?
Speaker 1: But I am hitting my irons the last year as
Speaker 1: well as I can hit him, just as well as
Speaker 1: I can hit him.
Speaker 2: You need to give Bryce in a lesson.
Speaker 1: His game feels loose, Bryce, I mean he didn't. He
Speaker 1: was struggling getting the ball in the fair way. His
Speaker 1: wedges were hitting miss. He got it in the drink
Speaker 1: twice today. Now, his putting saved him over the weekend,
Speaker 1: but today when his putting went, it really unveiled. The
Speaker 1: truth about his game is the putting kept him around.
Speaker 1: His Gay mentioned it after the round. His game is
Speaker 1: just not right.
Speaker 2: Well, I think the old adage is you can talk
Speaker 2: to a fade, a drawer hook doesn't listen. And when
Speaker 2: you play that drawer hook one, it goes farther and
Speaker 2: it goes harder. And I know he's like all the
Speaker 2: greens were harder, Bryce, and the greens that the masters
Speaker 2: have been the same since you know, Arnold Palmer was
Speaker 2: playing in the fifties. They're hard, they're firm. Your irons
Speaker 2: weren't even close. And he plays this power draw which
Speaker 2: today turned into the last couple of days turned into
Speaker 2: a hook. He is you know the thing with Bryson,
Speaker 2: he's clearly mellowed out and the YouTube thing has changed
Speaker 2: his world. If he was a football player, I mean,
Speaker 2: this guy is a blue chip out of high school,
Speaker 2: out of college, like he has an elite talent, but
Speaker 2: he is he messes with all sorts of weird shit.
Speaker 2: I mean, he's got special made club He's a different cat.
Speaker 1: Wikipedia Bryson Deshambo's clubs and I was reading it over
Speaker 1: the weekend.
Speaker 2: It called three D.
Speaker 1: I mean, he doesn't he uses stuff nobody else has used.
Speaker 1: He has been very contrariant. I mean I thought it
Speaker 1: was funny when they came out today. The build up
Speaker 1: was like a Tyson fight. So De Shambo comes out,
Speaker 1: he's all gladator and you know they're both power players,
Speaker 1: but Rory plays fast and Deshambo has more pace. And
Speaker 1: you know, like Jim Man's talked about this, he said,
Speaker 1: you know, putting these two together is an advantage maybe
Speaker 1: for Bryce and because he'll try to slow. You know,
Speaker 1: the slower player can irk the faster player, and Rory
Speaker 1: likes to get up, hit and go. I find Rory
Speaker 1: very easy to watch. He's the antithesis of like Sergio
Speaker 1: Garcia in his prime, where you just it was irritating
Speaker 1: to watch him. So Bryson's not that slow, but Rory
Speaker 1: just gets up, hits it, and again, the thing with
Speaker 1: Rory is just how remarkable he is as a talent
Speaker 1: to win today. I mean he is. I think he
Speaker 1: had four double bogies.
Speaker 2: I don't know, It's never happened before in the history
Speaker 2: of the master Chee. That's right. Craig Stadler had three
Speaker 2: once and one at in eighty two. That was the
Speaker 2: only time anyone had three. The double bogee for normal
Speaker 2: human beings happens a lot for pro golfers. It does
Speaker 2: not happen very often, especially in a major. One can
Speaker 2: sink you.
Speaker 1: The I thought I was interesting on eighteen, which is
Speaker 1: the narrowest t shot. So here was Rory. He put
Speaker 1: himself in a position that's where I was on. So
Speaker 1: I flew in. So I watched every shot the last
Speaker 1: two days and I was watching, you know, my plane
Speaker 1: landed basically as that it at Lax as the tournament ended.
Speaker 1: So Master's app is amazing. I watched every shot, just fantastic,
Speaker 1: But that I found myself on the eighteenth because there
Speaker 1: was a lot of tension during the last two days.
Speaker 1: But on Saturday, it's kind of like, Okay, you can
Speaker 1: miss shots, it's fine. When he stepped up on eighteen
Speaker 1: and he delivered a beauty, I mean he just crushed it,
Speaker 1: and I felt like, okay, it's his. And then, in
Speaker 1: typical Rory fashion, he ended up going, you know, to
Speaker 1: a playoff. Going into the playoff, I kind of felt
Speaker 1: like Justin Rose was going to win it.
Speaker 2: Do you get nervous anymore anything you do in life?
Speaker 2: Like as often you get nervous, I don't What would
Speaker 2: it take for you to get nervous. You think you're
Speaker 2: calling the super Bowl or I mean, something that you
Speaker 2: but it'd have to be something that you can actually,
Speaker 2: you know, feel comfortable doing.
Speaker 1: Right. I get nervous for my kids. I get nervous.
Speaker 1: It's the only sport that I get nervous is golf.
Speaker 1: And I felt that because, like I loved Phil Mickelson,
Speaker 1: and there's something about the vulnerability of Rory that just
Speaker 1: connects with me. I had been rooting for him, and
Speaker 1: this is not anti anybody else. I was rooting for
Speaker 1: him all weekend. Well.
Speaker 2: Once once Rose basically split the fairway in extra holes,
Speaker 2: You're looking at Rory and you're thinking, how can you
Speaker 2: control your heart rate right now? Because you know he's
Speaker 2: Rose has no pressure on him. If I crumble, I'm
Speaker 2: going to be viewed as Honestly, it would have felt
Speaker 2: bigger than Greg Norman because you had unraveled, taken the lead, unraveled,
Speaker 2: taken the lead, unraveled taking the lead. It's I would say,
Speaker 2: it was kind of an unlike a situation. I've been
Speaker 2: watching golf for a long time. I don't ever remember
Speaker 2: around where a guy unravels takes the lead, unravels takes
Speaker 2: the lead and then has a chance to win it,
Speaker 2: and then he's eighteen like he did. I thought, if
Speaker 2: Rory snaps it into the trees or overcuts it into
Speaker 2: the trees, it's very understandable. And then the moment he's
Speaker 2: split the fairway, I thought, okay, this he does have.
Speaker 2: It's obviously Phil as well. I mean, Phil, what a
Speaker 2: major a couple of years ago as a fifty one
Speaker 2: year old. These guys have I think we under rate
Speaker 2: especially Phil and Rory because Tiger suck so much of
Speaker 2: the energy out, like I think Brady did this with Peyton,
Speaker 2: Like Peyton's got a lot of resolve to him as well,
Speaker 2: you know, Rory and Phil. And then when he won it,
Speaker 2: he almost felt like usually guys raised their hands up
Speaker 2: or whatever. Roy's hit the ground and cried almost like
Speaker 2: clearly a weight had been lifted off his entire career.
Speaker 2: That's where I get a little nervous that, like this,
Speaker 2: does he maintain this, because how could the same drive
Speaker 2: because of the pressure and this has been a decade
Speaker 2: running and think of the situations that have happened, I
Speaker 2: mean just last year losing to Bryson like he did.
Speaker 2: Now you just wonder like can he sustain this? And
Speaker 2: like you talked about the Bryce and Rory thing, I
Speaker 2: think what's pretty special about football is if you're in
Speaker 2: the same conference as your foe. You know, Peyton and
Speaker 2: Brady were both in the AFC. Well, if you both
Speaker 2: win the division, you're gonna automatically play each other every year.
Speaker 2: Teams are good, you're gonna play ech other on the
Speaker 2: playoffs every lot. We get that with Josh Allen and
Speaker 2: Patrick Mahomes in golf. How often we never really got
Speaker 2: Tiger Phil. It just never happened right in the biggest tournaments.
Speaker 2: Yet we've got Rory Bryson twice in six months. It's now.
Speaker 2: It didn't quite play out as good as the last time,
Speaker 2: but it does feel like I would expect this wouldn't
Speaker 2: chuck me if we got this a couple more times.
Speaker 2: I mean, this is it was just really cool, even
Speaker 2: if it didn't live up to the billing. Like you
Speaker 2: said it, it felt like like Dana White should have
Speaker 2: been walking right behind him right the height and then
Speaker 2: and then Bryson fell off. But Rory, you just felt
Speaker 2: like the fight was still going. He's just fighting some
Speaker 2: other guy. Yeah, that was I mean, I think we've
Speaker 2: seen some crazy Masters. Colin, That's that's got to be
Speaker 2: one of the more riveting multiple stretches of a couple
Speaker 2: hours we've ever seen.
Speaker 1: Well a year ago, I mean we saw John Rahm
Speaker 1: really struggle. He you know, he took that live money,
Speaker 1: and which is fine. I defended live guys forever same.
Speaker 1: I mean again, our government is in bed with the Saudi's.
Speaker 1: Everybody is.
Speaker 2: It.
Speaker 1: There's a difference between blaming and judging. I didn't blame
Speaker 1: any of the guys. If you want to be judgy
Speaker 1: on them, go for it. But you'd have taken the
Speaker 1: money too. It's like Chris Rock's joke man are as
Speaker 1: loyal as their options. If somebody offers one hundred and
Speaker 1: thirty million and you can play half the tournaments, you're
Speaker 1: gonna do it. I didn't think it was interesting. On
Speaker 1: like Thursday and Friday, you couldn't find bryceon to Shambo.
Speaker 1: It was like, are you guys gonna put them on television?
Speaker 1: And it was like, come on, guys, there is still
Speaker 1: let's talk about this sort of division between you know,
Speaker 1: the Masters and CBS. It's the longest running broadcast partnership
Speaker 1: in sports. It's like NBC and the Olympics, CBS and
Speaker 1: the Masters. How intense do you think the division is? Obviously,
Speaker 1: like on Thursday and Friday it was like, can we
Speaker 1: can we show bryceon to Shambo here? Folks, this is
Speaker 1: getting ridiculous. How intense do you think and ugly do
Speaker 1: you think the division is between the PGA and Live Still?
Speaker 2: I think it's pretty bad. And I think, you know,
Speaker 2: CBS and NBC, they're loyalty to the PGA Tour. I
Speaker 2: mean they've been in business with them forever, right, I
Speaker 2: mean specifically the PGA Tour. Obviously CBS has the Masters,
Speaker 2: but CBS calls. I don't know how many PGA Tour
Speaker 2: events during the year. I'd guess fifteen, you know. And
Speaker 2: I think the problem is is you're dealing with a
Speaker 2: group that I mean, Yostra has a access to a
Speaker 2: piggy bank that's bigger than any piggy bank in the
Speaker 2: history of the world. I mean, they got trillions of
Speaker 2: dollars and so yeah, it's like they can lose a
Speaker 2: billion dollars they don't even notice it. It'd be like
Speaker 2: someone losing ten bucks. And I think the PGA Tour,
Speaker 2: you know, Tiger's very involved. Well, where's his ego and
Speaker 2: his pride is based on the history of the PGA tour.
Speaker 2: That's what made him a billionaire and famous. And I
Speaker 2: think they're just a lot of egos, a lot of
Speaker 2: money on the line, and I think the tour could
Speaker 2: get very lucky that some of these guys like no One.
Speaker 2: You know, Fox just did business with Live and they're
Speaker 2: on Fox Sports one, and I think they put the
Speaker 2: Duru Tournament. But people just aren't watching because any time
Speaker 2: you start something new, it's hard to get people to gravitate.
Speaker 2: I don't care who you bring over. I mean, Bryson
Speaker 2: gets more people watching on YouTube. And I just think
Speaker 2: there's a lot of bitterness. There's a lot of money
Speaker 2: on the line. Some of the guys on the tour
Speaker 2: that didn't leave are bitter because those guys, you know,
Speaker 2: Bryson got two hundred million dollars and I didn't get any.
Speaker 2: So I don't think they're any closer. I mean, I've
Speaker 2: heard him talk about this for two years now, and
Speaker 2: there's no light at the end of the tunnel because
Speaker 2: they're both balking and balking and balking, and I think
Speaker 2: Live goes well. We have some demands if you're going
Speaker 2: to take our money, and I don't blame them. I
Speaker 2: think LIV wants to do a deal with the PGA Tour,
Speaker 2: but they also don't want their idea that was Live
Speaker 2: in this team golf, which golf is an individual sport,
Speaker 2: just like tennis. It doesn't mean occasionally there's a tennis tournament.
Speaker 2: I forget the Davis Cup where you play doubles, just
Speaker 2: like there's a Ryder Cup. We like watching golf to
Speaker 2: watch Pete Sampers play Andre Agassi, to watch Tiger Woods
Speaker 2: play Ernie Els and Phil Michlelson one on one. That's
Speaker 2: what golf is. And I think Live and their money
Speaker 2: loves their idea, which again I understand sticking to an idea.
Speaker 2: The tour wants no part of it and their players
Speaker 2: aren't going to agree to a deal that like, well
Speaker 2: we got to play in seven team tournaments. What they
Speaker 2: got going for them is I do think you know,
Speaker 2: at least there have been articles and rumors that guys
Speaker 2: like Bryson and Brooks miss being in the bright life. Sure,
Speaker 2: and there's something that Live can't bring to the table.
Speaker 2: So when their contracts end and they've made hundreds of men.
Speaker 2: They could just come back right And let's face it,
Speaker 2: if you could do a draft right of the pg Tour,
Speaker 2: could pick one person, and one person only, they wouldn't
Speaker 2: even hesitate. It'd be Bryson. And if none of the
Speaker 2: other guys ever came back rom multiple time major champion
Speaker 2: Dustin Johnson brooks kept, I don't think it would be
Speaker 2: that big a deal, but Bryson is. I think they
Speaker 2: would take him. And you can't convince me that Bryson.
Speaker 2: You gotta let him keep doing his YouTube stuff. Just
Speaker 2: acquiesce the world's changed. Let him do his YouTube stuff,
Speaker 2: let him play in the PGA Tour, and I think
Speaker 2: everything would be fine. I think he's the key pretty
Speaker 2: clearly because he's not going away. He loves golf, n
Speaker 2: he's the guy.
Speaker 1: At any one point in my life. You know, I've
Speaker 1: said this about all sports, baseball especially, don't listen to purists.
Speaker 1: You got them, don't listen to purists. Speed the game up,
Speaker 1: you know, make the bases larger, take away the defensive shift,
Speaker 1: don't become analytic, you know, dependent like like yeah so,
Speaker 1: and I feel like golf and any one time in
Speaker 1: my life there have been three golfers I was really
Speaker 1: interested in. And right now the four guys, if they're
Speaker 1: on that I'm really interested in are Rory Koepka, Bryce
Speaker 1: and Neshamba and Dustin Johnson. There's a bunch of Scotti.
Speaker 1: Scheffler doesn't do it for me. I know, he's great,
Speaker 1: doesn't do anything, you know, Bubba Watson had a role,
Speaker 1: doesn't do anything for me. So it's just there. It's
Speaker 1: always been about three guys, four guys. Even in the
Speaker 1: Arnie and Jack days, there was you know, there were
Speaker 1: a couple of players, maybe a Lee Trevino mixed in there,
Speaker 1: Johnny Miller for a few years, but Tom Wisekough, you
Speaker 1: know Tom Kite weren't moving the knee. So I kind
Speaker 1: of look at it like I thought, this weekend was
Speaker 1: the very best of golf. You got the Masters and
Speaker 1: the Undulating Course, which is just and it's a picture.
Speaker 1: It's literally, it's literally a picture, it's a postcard. And
Speaker 1: then you had, as Jim Nance said, this is a
Speaker 1: journey and an odyssey in one day for Rory mcelright.
Speaker 1: I just thought it gave you everything. I thought it
Speaker 1: gave you bad shots, blown leads, buckling, picturesque tradition. And
Speaker 1: I will say this, Bryce and de Shambeau. His mood
Speaker 1: changed by about the fifth hole. You I mean, honestly
Speaker 1: you could see him that he started hurrying up, but
Speaker 1: he tends to have a slower pace, like he started to.
Speaker 1: It was at one point one of the announcers said, like,
Speaker 1: he's just he sort of lost his personality. He's lost it.
Speaker 1: You could just sense he was getting really frustrated. And
Speaker 1: I don't know, I just thought it was the best
Speaker 1: final round I can remember. I kept thinking about rock
Speaker 1: O Media, Tiger Woods, US Open, That's what kept flashing
Speaker 1: in my head.
Speaker 2: I actually think the Masters has really really benefited the
Speaker 2: last couple of years from Live because these guys only
Speaker 2: get back together four times a year, and because of
Speaker 2: the calendar, it's the first time they get back together.
Speaker 2: And this is by far the biggest tournament of the year. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so it's the perfect combination. And like you said, I mean,
Speaker 2: the weather the last couple of days just look picturesque.
Speaker 2: Having the superstars the leader board was incredible. I just
Speaker 2: think that this tournament in a weird way, I hate
Speaker 2: Live because it's just it's made my life as just
Speaker 2: someone that wants to watch all these guys play together.
Speaker 2: Like you said, I don't care that who makes what?
Speaker 2: I just want to see all these guys play together.
Speaker 2: And it's separated them. But it's made this weekend specifically
Speaker 2: the last couple of years. I would say, it's put
Speaker 2: it on steroids. And it's hard even for the other
Speaker 2: majors to quite feel like this one because this one
Speaker 2: is just. The Masters has always been big. It's you know,
Speaker 2: every human being, whether you don't even like golf, knows
Speaker 2: the green jacket. Tiger took it to another level. I
Speaker 2: do think though the last couple of years, with them
Speaker 2: all getting back together, it feels like there's now Bryson
Speaker 2: is kind of I mean last year he had the
Speaker 2: lead after a couple of rounds. He's been a major
Speaker 2: factor of these last couple of years at the Masters.
Speaker 2: Has added an element to this tournament that, you know,
Speaker 2: without Tiger, it's just hard. I mean, the golf, this
Speaker 2: isn't football. I mean, football wouldn't be big enough. I
Speaker 2: remember being a kid, USFL tried to take away Steve
Speaker 2: Young and Bruce Smith and Jim Kelly, like you need
Speaker 2: you only have ten to fifteen to twenty guys that
Speaker 2: really matter in golf, you probably only got five or six. Yes,
Speaker 2: I can't lose two of them, right, And tennis was
Speaker 2: very dependent on Federer, Joker and nat All for basically
Speaker 2: fifteen twenty years.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: When I was a kid, it was Samperston agacy and
Speaker 2: that was kind of it. Yeah, And it's like golf
Speaker 2: is not big enough to handle this divide, but the
Speaker 2: majors don't really care because their master's in business with
Speaker 2: the Masters's. It works for them.
Speaker 1: Have you ever seen what you win when you win
Speaker 1: the Masters? So the purse this year was four point
Speaker 1: two million. You get the jacket, lifetime membership, invitation forever,
Speaker 1: You get all these exclusive places you know that you
Speaker 1: can you know, only a handful off. You get to
Speaker 1: use the locker room of Champions, which is just all
Speaker 1: time great, but it's one of the it's it's I
Speaker 1: think the only thing to me that compares to the
Speaker 1: Masters is when the US Open is at Pebble Beach,
Speaker 1: where I'm literally watching for the course and Pinehurst is great,
Speaker 1: but I'm not watching for Pinehurst. Pebble Beach. US Opens
Speaker 1: feel different, British Open feels different. Saint Andrews and I
Speaker 1: think the Masters, those three tournament PGA Championship, to me
Speaker 1: just doesn't you know again if I'm around, But it
Speaker 1: was interesting. So I'm watching Thursday and Friday on vacation,
Speaker 1: and I went and golf Saturday. I was just like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm into this beautiful day by the way, fifty degrees. Oh,
Speaker 1: it was just beautiful day in the suburbs of Chicago.
Speaker 1: But it was just one of those things where I
Speaker 1: think golf, even though you would argue it's not in
Speaker 1: a good place, it's got a lot of alphas. There's
Speaker 1: a little tension between all of them. They I mean,
Speaker 1: kepkn Bryson, de Shamble aren't tight that you can sense.
Speaker 1: It's pretty palpable. You can sense the tension between some
Speaker 1: of these guys because they're all really guys, guys. They're
Speaker 1: all very male, right, And I think, I don't know,
Speaker 1: I just watched this weekend and I thought to myself,
Speaker 1: golf's in a really good place at these Masters, at
Speaker 1: these majors.
Speaker 2: Well, I know, you know, living in Arizona, a lot
Speaker 2: of pros live here, and you know, I play golf
Speaker 2: at TBC where a lot of these guys practice. The
Speaker 2: live financial boom for the PGA Tour and these guys
Speaker 2: has been pretty incredible for the business. I mean, the
Speaker 2: top guys have always been rich, from Arnold Palmer to
Speaker 2: Jack to Tiger. But you know, my wife was showing
Speaker 2: an open house a couple of weeks ago with one
Speaker 2: of her colleagues. There was like four or five million
Speaker 2: dollars and the people looking at the open house, and
Speaker 2: the guy that was showing it is in the golf
Speaker 2: world and knows these people, introduces himself and realizes it's
Speaker 2: the wife of one of the caddies and she was
Speaker 2: looking for another caddi's wife. These are four or five
Speaker 2: million dollar house the caddies. And this is not you know,
Speaker 2: Rory's caddy. This is a guy probably somewhere forty to
Speaker 2: sixty in the world. These guys I mean Bryson or
Speaker 2: Rory net Jets you see. Yeah, the sixtieth guy ain't
Speaker 2: going to the commercial airport. So the wealth on the
Speaker 2: golf tour right now has never been top down, and
Speaker 2: it's an incredible time to be involved. As a high end,
Speaker 2: top one hundred golfer. You are an immediate millionaire and
Speaker 2: your caddi's doing well well your caddy.
Speaker 1: And also with Bryson being a YouTube sensation, everybody now
Speaker 1: understands there's influencer potential putting your stuff on YouTube, so
Speaker 1: showing a little personality is okay. So I think it's
Speaker 1: it's you know, they call him influencers. I think Bryson's
Speaker 1: an influencer, like he has the ability like a Connor
Speaker 1: McGregor in his prime, that if Connor was on the card,
Speaker 1: I would just go to I took my wife to
Speaker 1: two uf SEE cards, so I thought it was a
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Speaker 1: All right, here we go, Jason Timpf hoops tonight. We
Speaker 1: got a lot to talk about as the NBA Playoffs start.
Speaker 1: All the odds provided by DraftKings Sportsbook, by the way,
Speaker 1: when we mention them. So I'm gonna pick it up set.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go Houston Rockets over the Warriors, And I
Speaker 1: don't want to do confirmation bias or recency bias because
Speaker 1: I watched them struggle against Memphis and need an inbounds
Speaker 1: gaff by the Grizzlies to save it. But the Jonathan
Speaker 1: Kaminga piece is really a problem. So we've talked about this.
Speaker 1: It's a highly sophisticated offense. Veterans work, Iguidala kd Andrew Bogan,
Speaker 1: they work, Steph Clay, Draymond they work. You can be
Speaker 1: a quirky player like Draymond Green and still be a catalyst.
Speaker 1: What doesn't work is Wiseman, Jordan Poole, DiAngelo Russell who's
Speaker 1: a bit squarely when he was younger and Cominga's productive.
Speaker 1: But you can't put them on the floor of this unit.
Speaker 1: Kerr is it's do not play coach's decision. And they're
Speaker 1: dying for length. I mean I watched them last night
Speaker 1: and Zach Eaedi is a huge problem. They don't have
Speaker 1: any length and here comes Houston. They defend the three
Speaker 1: mon Thompson gave Steph fits last time they played length. Now,
Speaker 1: Kerr's the best coach, Curry's the best player. I am
Speaker 1: not denying that. But and if the games are close, Jason,
Speaker 1: you'll take the Warriors. Their clutch points are great. They're
Speaker 1: gonna win these one point games like last Night's just
Speaker 1: a great example of how the Warriors can manipulate the
Speaker 1: clock possessions and get better defensively when they have to.
Speaker 1: I don't like this matchup. I was looking at the odds.
Speaker 1: I don't like this matchup for the Warriors. Right now,
Speaker 1: the Rockets are plus one sixty five again, odds provided
Speaker 1: by DraftKings. I'm calling the upset. You think I'm crazy, size,
Speaker 1: lack of depth, Curry dependent, what say you?
Speaker 4: I don't want to see you're crazy. I think this
Speaker 4: is let's just put it this way. I think that
Speaker 4: a defensive minded Rockets team is more capable of beating
Speaker 4: Golden State than say, a defensive minded Magic team is
Speaker 4: capable of beating Boston.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 4: That said, I think that the other side of the
Speaker 4: floor is where it's going to become a problem. I
Speaker 4: have no doubts that Houston is going to cause problems
Speaker 4: for Golden States offense. In their last four games, they've
Speaker 4: held them to one hundred and five or fewer, and
Speaker 4: all four of them they've held them below one hundred
Speaker 4: three times.
Speaker 1: Yea.
Speaker 4: They they have a bunch of different things that they
Speaker 4: do that bother them. They put Alburn Shangoon on Moses Moody,
Speaker 4: which is really smart because it allows them to put
Speaker 4: all of their three best perimeter defenders on Draymond, Jimmy
Speaker 4: and Steph and just switch any action that involves those three.
Speaker 4: Aman Thompson is one of the most gifted athletes in
Speaker 4: terms of foot speed in the league.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, and the the Rockets have a zone look that
Speaker 4: worked really well against the against the Warriors a couple
Speaker 4: of weeks ago.
Speaker 2: There.
Speaker 4: I have no doubts that the Rockets will be able
Speaker 4: to drag the Warriors offense down into the mud. Here's
Speaker 4: the problem. I think the war I think the Warriors
Speaker 4: defense is nearly as good as Houston's defense, and I
Speaker 4: think that they are more of doing more damage to
Speaker 4: a Shanng Gooon, Jalen Green Fred Vanvliet led offense than
Speaker 4: the Rockets can do to the Warriors on the other
Speaker 4: end of the floor. I would not be surprised if
Speaker 4: it's a longer series. As a Lakers fan, I hope
Speaker 4: that it's very physical and that it wears them down.
Speaker 4: But I just have a really hard time believing that
Speaker 4: the Rockets are going to be able to score enough
Speaker 4: now to beat the Warriors four times now.
Speaker 1: They have shot better in the second half of the season.
Speaker 1: They have, so there was here's the thing, explain the
Speaker 1: coaminga piece. So listen. I was told this year's ago
Speaker 1: by an NFL executive. He says, be very careful about
Speaker 1: the last twenty games of the season. You're going to
Speaker 1: see teams with winning streaks. Half the league's tanking, and
Speaker 1: half the league is resting starters for the playoffs. So
Speaker 1: the Clippers go on this great last fifteen games and
Speaker 1: the Warriors have that energy when Jimmy Butler arrives and
Speaker 1: they're playing bad teams and they're just rolling people, and
Speaker 1: you're like, oh my god. And I fell for it,
Speaker 1: and I said, oh wait till Kaminga comes back. It
Speaker 1: was about three games with kaming in this group, and
Speaker 1: Steve Kerr's like, yeah, I'm not. I don't why doesn't
Speaker 1: it work with him? Because I could argue he's exactly
Speaker 1: what they need against Houston size, athletic ability, length. They
Speaker 1: look small last night against Memphis.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, right when the Jimmy trade went down,
Speaker 4: one of my initial takeaways was this is the end
Speaker 4: of Jonathan Kaminga in his time with the Golden State
Speaker 4: Warriors in terms of just him being a meaningful contributor
Speaker 4: to this team. The thing is is they were banking
Speaker 4: on Jonathan Kaminga becoming that player for the Warrior, of
Speaker 4: becoming the Jimmy Butler type of player for the Warriors,
Speaker 4: the big forward that they could put next to Draymond,
Speaker 4: that would be the scoring pop alongside the starters. As
Speaker 4: soon as they got Jimmy, they no longer had a
Speaker 4: role for him anymore. You want to know why Kerr
Speaker 4: went with Gie Santos last night. It's because Gi Santos
Speaker 4: plays the same position, but he can count on Gee
Speaker 4: to not do anything stupid, to just play super hard,
Speaker 4: to grab every rebound he can get, to take a
Speaker 4: why open catch and shoot three. Jonathan Kaminga's upside is
Speaker 4: on the ball if you clear the side for him
Speaker 4: and you let him go one on one facing up
Speaker 4: eighteen feet from the basket. He has a lot of
Speaker 4: potential in the long term to be very good at that,
Speaker 4: but he's not good enough at it now to take
Speaker 4: reps away from Steph and away from Jimmy, and so
Speaker 4: all they need from him is to play defense, to
Speaker 4: knock down wide open catch and shoot threes, and to
Speaker 4: play in their read and react in the half court.
Speaker 4: And he's not very good at any of those three things.
Speaker 4: And so it just is kind of like a death
Speaker 4: sentence in that regard for his role here. And I
Speaker 4: do think that it's probably in the best interest of
Speaker 4: everybody involved after this season is over to look to
Speaker 4: move on from Kminga. That said, you made a very
Speaker 4: interesting point specifically about this matchup. I understood the case
Speaker 4: for the DNPS with Kaminga for the last couple of games,
Speaker 4: super important games. You need higher floor, lower ceiling, like
Speaker 4: you need fewer mistakes. Yes, you couldn't take a risk
Speaker 4: with mistakes in those games. Sounderstood that case specifically for
Speaker 4: this matchup with Houston. They are so big and so
Speaker 4: athletic that I think it could. I think it could
Speaker 4: be a Jimmy Butler and Jonathan Kaminga type of series.
Speaker 4: I think the two of them and their athletic advantages
Speaker 4: could be something they have to lean on a lot,
Speaker 4: especially if the perimeter defense of Houston wears steph down
Speaker 4: over the course of the series. So if I was Kerr,
Speaker 4: I would definitely give Kaminga some burn here in the
Speaker 4: first couple games of this series, just to see what
Speaker 4: he's got. Now, if he's terrible, bail on him, go
Speaker 4: back to your rotation that you used in the last
Speaker 4: couple of games. But I think he's an asset as
Speaker 4: an athlete that you can't afford to keep in your
Speaker 4: back pocket for a series like this.
Speaker 1: And the Rockets are first of all, they defend the three,
Speaker 1: they got the best athlete in the series, and they
Speaker 1: rebound really well. They're gonna get if Kaminga doesn't play
Speaker 1: a lot they're gonna get second, They're gonna get a
Speaker 1: lot offensive rebound. They're gonna win offensive rebounding throughout this series.
Speaker 1: Looney's gonna play a lot. You're gonna have to play him.
Speaker 1: If you don't play kaminga a lot, you're giving up.
Speaker 1: You're gonna give up the glass. And you can win
Speaker 1: a series losing on the you know, in the in
Speaker 1: the world we play in now, you know, Boston can
Speaker 1: lose the rebounding battle and hit twenty eight threes and
Speaker 1: they win the game by fifteen. But I'll tell you,
Speaker 1: I think Houston. I think I think Houston's really gonna
Speaker 1: challenge him, and I think they're going to be low scoring.
Speaker 1: I think the one advantage that is clear cut, and
Speaker 1: you saw it last night with the Warriors, they're so
Speaker 1: good with two twenty to play in a tie game,
Speaker 1: they are they just know. I mean it's almost like,
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, people grabbing and clutching staph and
Speaker 1: you have to be more careful late because they may
Speaker 1: call a foul, and it's just they just figure out
Speaker 1: ways to get Steph really good looks. It's almost like
Speaker 1: red zone offense in the NFL, where it's cluttered and jammed,
Speaker 1: and yet the good teams find open people. I mean,
Speaker 1: he just I watched them, and I like last night
Speaker 1: they had a great game plan, jump out to a
Speaker 1: sixteen point lead, eighteen point lead, twenty point lead, but
Speaker 1: in the end, you're like, they just don't have bodies.
Speaker 1: They look incredibly small. Uh, And I just think that
Speaker 1: size is gonna make I think they're the close games
Speaker 1: Golden State wins, but I'm gonna give Houston a couple
Speaker 1: of games where they just dominate the glass. The Warriors
Speaker 1: look tired and they blow them out. It'll be a
Speaker 1: weird looking series.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I said something similar in my series preview, like I
Speaker 4: wouldn't be surprised if there was a game either early
Speaker 4: in the series, like a Game one or like a
Speaker 4: Game five with the Warriors are up three to one
Speaker 4: where the Rockets just beat the heck out of them
Speaker 4: and win by like twenty five thirty points that get
Speaker 4: going in transition, they look super athletic. I'm with you
Speaker 4: overall with the Warriors in the sense that, like there
Speaker 4: was this stretch post deadline where they were beating everybody,
Speaker 4: and yeah, the schedule was weak, but then they got
Speaker 4: a couple of impressive wins. You beat a decent Memphis team,
Speaker 4: you beat a Nuggets team without Jamal Murray, you beat
Speaker 4: that Lakers team that was one of the biggest wins
Speaker 4: that they had all season. That was a big, nationally televised,
Speaker 4: super important game for both teams that they won. But
Speaker 4: then after that, it's like they lose to Houston, they
Speaker 4: lose to San Antonio, they beat Portland, but then they
Speaker 4: lose to the Clippers at home in a must win game.
Speaker 4: And then last night for stretches, they looked on impressive
Speaker 4: as they were trailing in the fourth quarter. So I'm
Speaker 4: kind of it up in the air with the Warriors
Speaker 4: in general now because it's hard to tell how good
Speaker 4: they really are when they killed everybody for like two months,
Speaker 4: and then for the last two weeks they've looked pretty unimpressive.
Speaker 4: So I'm kind of up in the air with them.
Speaker 4: The main reason why I've been dropping them down in
Speaker 4: terms of where i'd rank them among contenders is I
Speaker 4: don't trust their shooting. Their shooting can go ice cold
Speaker 4: around Steph Curry, and then as you mentioned, they're a
Speaker 4: little bit vulnerable to size and physicality, which I think
Speaker 4: can cause some problems for them. I viewed them as
Speaker 4: a little bit more of a flawed contender now than
Speaker 4: I did two weeks ago.
Speaker 1: All Right, Lakers all odds provided by DraftKings are minus
Speaker 1: one ninety five against the Tea Wolves. I think this
Speaker 1: is a very favorable Laker matchup, and I think it's
Speaker 1: pretty obvious the Timberwolves outside of He's gonna have to
Speaker 1: score forty in a couple of these games. Julius Randall
Speaker 1: has historically kind of the classic, plays hard, plays with energy,
Speaker 1: very successful in the regular season, but everybody in the
Speaker 1: postseason plays with energy, and he comes right back. The
Speaker 1: regressions clear. He's a B player who plays with a
Speaker 1: energy and that is really valuable in the regular season,
Speaker 1: and then you get to the postseason and everybody's got
Speaker 1: equal time off and he's a B player and doesn't
Speaker 1: create sometimes can get a little ball selfish, go Bears,
Speaker 1: not an offensive player. Mike Conley's a play initiator but
Speaker 1: doesn't provide much offense. And the Lakers are the rare team.
Speaker 1: I mean, Boston may be the only team in the
Speaker 1: league that does this, that has three playmakers and three
Speaker 1: play initiators and at any one time can have the
Speaker 1: three best offensive players playing well on the floor. I
Speaker 1: don't think it's a good matchup for Minnesota at all.
Speaker 1: This was the bad draw in my opinion for the
Speaker 1: t Wolves. What do you think?
Speaker 4: I totally agree. I think there's a basic talent argument
Speaker 4: you can make for LA, which is like, who's better
Speaker 4: at or Luca? You're taking Luca. Who's better Lebron or
Speaker 4: Julius Randall? You're taking Lebron. Who's better Austin Reeves or
Speaker 4: a Jaden McDaniels or a Rudy Gobert or Dante DiVincenzo.
Speaker 4: You're taking Austin Reeves. So I think I think the
Speaker 4: Lakers top three guys are just better, and I think
Speaker 4: that that could be enough to make the case. Where
Speaker 4: I think it gets really interesting is the Timberwolve's greatest
Speaker 4: strength on defense is their combination of perimeter defenders and
Speaker 4: Rudy Gobert at the rim, and the Lakers can neutralize that. Unfortunately,
Speaker 4: as we saw in the Western Conference Finals last year,
Speaker 4: the best perimeter defender on Minnesota, Jaden McDaniels, can't guard Luca.
Speaker 4: He's too skinny. Luca can just throw him around like
Speaker 4: a rag doll. None of the perimeter defenders on Minnesota
Speaker 4: make Luca uncomfortable, and the Lakers with their five out
Speaker 4: groups with Dorian Finney Smith instead of Jackson Hayes, they
Speaker 4: can space Rudy out to where he cannot protect the
Speaker 4: rim without conceding a wide open three. When Rudy's on
Speaker 4: the perimeter, he's still a good defender, but he's not
Speaker 4: the transcendently impactful defender he is when he can sit
Speaker 4: right underneath the basket, So I think they neutralize him there.
Speaker 4: On the other end of the floor, the Lakers have
Speaker 4: struggled against spread out shooting like against Boston and really
Speaker 4: smart teams with speed like Golden State. Those are the
Speaker 4: teams that have really caused the Lakers issues post Lucatrade.
Speaker 4: You know who the Lakers have not struggled with post
Speaker 4: Luca trade. Defensively, the teams that they can load up on.
Speaker 4: You can load up on the Timberwolves. They are not
Speaker 4: a good spot up team. They are a team that
Speaker 4: you can put two on the ball with ant and
Speaker 4: not get burned. That's high level playmaking. It's just I
Speaker 4: look at this as a series where just all of
Speaker 4: the strengths and weaknesses line up in a way to
Speaker 4: where I think the Lakers just have a big advantage.
Speaker 4: This was one of the few series that I picked
Speaker 4: in five games. I think the Lakers are gonna beat
Speaker 4: him in five.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I feel the same way and the Lakers I
Speaker 1: could be wrong on this. I think they play as
Speaker 1: to defense as they need to. I think that when
Speaker 1: I watch them play out there are times I'm like, Oh,
Speaker 1: this is one of those games they really care about.
Speaker 1: And then there are other times I'm like, they're just
Speaker 1: not talking. This is one of those. They either all
Speaker 1: went out and had a nice dinner last night and
Speaker 1: bomba bino.
Speaker 2: They're just not that.
Speaker 1: When I watch them, I think they're as good as
Speaker 1: they want to be. Defensively, I don't think they're great,
Speaker 1: But like Denver's got limitations, there's just things, I mean, Jokic,
Speaker 1: there's just limitations. I think the Lakers actually have some
Speaker 1: pretty good lengthen defensive personnel outside of Luca. I think
Speaker 1: they'll they'll play good defense in the playoffs because they'll
Speaker 1: want to. They''ll want team when they want to. I
Speaker 1: think they're pretty capable.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And when you're as good offensively as they've been
Speaker 4: with their best groups. And by the way, that group
Speaker 4: with Dorian Finney Smith and Ruey next to Lebron, Luca
Speaker 4: and Austin has been torching everybody for a long time.
Speaker 4: Now that unit can really score the ball, so they
Speaker 4: have some margin for error on that side of the floor.
Speaker 4: It really is about Lebron. Lebron as like the orchestrator
Speaker 4: on the back line. He plays that Draymond Green esque role,
Speaker 4: just telling everybody where to go, calling out the plays
Speaker 4: as they're starting to take shape. And then Jared Vanderbilt,
Speaker 4: Ruey Hotchmura, Dorian Finney Smith. It's just a lot of six'
Speaker 4: nine rangy athletes that can cover. Ground i'm not gonna
Speaker 4: Lie colin like The lakers certainly have an uphill, climb
Speaker 4: and there are gonna be multiple series where there'll be
Speaker 4: an underdog if they get to the third and fourth.
Speaker 4: Round but this could not have broken better for them
Speaker 4: than it. Did now you only have to play one Of,
Speaker 4: DENVER okc and The. Clippers those are three of the
Speaker 4: most dangerous teams in The. West they only have to
Speaker 4: play one of. Them SO i think it actually broke
Speaker 4: really nicely for them. Here if they can take care
Speaker 4: of business against The timberwolves and beat whoever comes out
Speaker 4: of That Warriors rocket. Series they're right there in the
Speaker 4: in the Against Okay see in the conference. FINALS i
Speaker 4: think they've got a really good.
Speaker 1: CHANCE i said this the other. DAY i had actually
Speaker 1: somebody come up to me on the street Any it
Speaker 1: was a Former. Laker it Was sasha AND i, SAID i,
Speaker 1: SAID i, said the best Center i've ever. Seen complete
Speaker 1: Players kareem AND i grew up with. It he was
Speaker 1: a fourteen to fifteen Time All Defensive team ran the
Speaker 1: floor when he was, young, rebound, unstoppable offensive, force, cerebral
Speaker 1: prickly but could throw on. Elbow you, know Ask Kent.
Speaker 1: BENSON i think the player he went, after he could
Speaker 1: give you. Everything he was, wiry but he could be.
Speaker 1: PHYSICAL i think because of that defensive, prowess he is
Speaker 1: better Than. JOKIC i Think jokis is the second most
Speaker 1: gifted center of all. Time now people would Say, wilt
Speaker 1: But wilt was. Flaky you didn't know what the effort you.
Speaker 1: Got he wasn't easy to play. With you got different
Speaker 1: variations Of wilt depending on the night. Before And wilt
Speaker 1: was kind of Into wilt WHERE i Think jokic is
Speaker 1: actually a really good team. PLAYER i just think he's
Speaker 1: not engaged defensively all the. Time BUT i outside Of,
Speaker 1: KAREEM i mean generally with a, CENTER i can say shack, power, russell,
Speaker 1: defense a team, FOOTWORK i can say. SOMETHING i look
Speaker 1: At jokic And i'm, like, like If, KAREEM i, mean
Speaker 1: If kareem Or vetus s the Bonus Bill walton had a,
Speaker 1: baby it's, like you, KNOW i Think Bill walton is
Speaker 1: the one, player very, briefly not the Old walton with The,
Speaker 1: celtics who was, great but he wasn't as good as
Speaker 1: THE ucla or The Portland. Walton there was a time
Speaker 1: When Bill walton was like the best passing big, ever
Speaker 1: the best mid range, jumper ran the, floor could be super,
Speaker 1: physical kind of. Weird BUT i Think jokic. IS i
Speaker 1: just don't Think i've ever quite seen anything like. Him
Speaker 1: that's my. DAD i don't know If i've ever seen
Speaker 1: anything like.
Speaker 4: Him he's the best offensive Player i've ever. Seen Colin
Speaker 4: wow AND i have watched and rooted for two of
Speaker 4: the greats that have ever done that or rooted for.
Speaker 4: AGAINST i should SAY i Think lebron is on the
Speaker 4: short list of guys who are in that. CONVERSATION i
Speaker 4: Think steph is on the short list of guys who
Speaker 4: are in that. Conversation having rooted For lebron and then
Speaker 4: being terrified Of steph and rooting against him over the,
Speaker 4: YEARS i know what it's like to be on the
Speaker 4: other end of a player who like legitimately creates a
Speaker 4: great shot almost every time down the. Floor jokic makes
Speaker 4: it look even easier than those guys. Do it's the
Speaker 4: top tier playmaking piece that you get From, lebron the
Speaker 4: inverted spacing that you get From steph that creates all
Speaker 4: the dunks and layups right underneath the. Basket but mixed
Speaker 4: in with the lack of variants because Like, steph Like
Speaker 4: steph will have games where he just can't make a shot,
Speaker 4: right you, know that doesn't happen With. Jokic like if
Speaker 4: he gets into the five to ten foot, range it's
Speaker 4: going in two out of three, times like, Clockwork he's
Speaker 4: gonna make. It and so there's a lack of, variance
Speaker 4: there's a power element to. It he can kind of
Speaker 4: audible into different, players like it's, like, Okay i'm playing
Speaker 4: The Spurs i'm just gonna post up every single time
Speaker 4: down the.
Speaker 2: Floor watch.
Speaker 4: It watching This clippers, series we won't see as Much
Speaker 4: jokics post. Ups it's not his, advantage but guess. What
Speaker 4: he can run inverted ball screens and like literally play
Speaker 4: pick and roll as the handler out on the. Perimeter
Speaker 4: he can run two man game With Jamal. Murray his
Speaker 4: versatility and dependability night, tonight mixed with all the inverted
Speaker 4: stuff he does with the, SPACING i have never seen
Speaker 4: a player make it look easier on offense Than Nikola jokic.
Speaker 4: Did like it's it's rooting against him is absolute. Hell
Speaker 4: having had to do that over the last couple of.
Speaker 4: Years he deserves a good amount of criticism for what
Speaker 4: happened to their defense this, year especially in the second
Speaker 4: half of the. YEAR i thought he just straight up
Speaker 4: mailed it, in and you made some good points about
Speaker 4: how that might have had something to do With Mike.
Speaker 4: MALONE i agree with. You but even if you just
Speaker 4: take that and set it, aside he still had one
Speaker 4: of the greatest seasons in the history of the league
Speaker 4: because he's the greatest offensive player to ever touch the.
Speaker 1: Floor yeah it. Is you, know it's funny Because luca
Speaker 1: and him have kind of similar body types where they're
Speaker 1: in great shape probably you, know relative for the type
Speaker 1: for the, type But lucas got a lot Of hirk
Speaker 1: And jerkins start and stop to his game that gets.
Speaker 1: Open he's he's very good At he's just keeps you
Speaker 1: constantly on his hip and off. Balance you're never quite
Speaker 1: sure he's not, fast but he is kind of quick
Speaker 1: for his, size and he's always bouncing off you never
Speaker 1: loses kind of composure or the ball while there's. Contact
Speaker 1: but it's a start stop game that's. Hard you, know
Speaker 1: that's hard to. Defend jokis just sort of rolls into,
Speaker 1: you AND i think a lot of players they're Like
Speaker 1: draymond has said, this there's no real book on him
Speaker 1: because it's it's you, know in THE, nfl there's always
Speaker 1: that they always talk about that bad body offensive. Lineman
Speaker 1: Donald penn was known as this for The, raiders bad
Speaker 1: body so, effective like there was no weak. Spot he
Speaker 1: was weirdly, long and he had a weird ass and
Speaker 1: his shoulders were, huge and it was like a bad
Speaker 1: body offensive lineman where it's, like, yeah it's just defensive
Speaker 1: players couldn't quite figure out a weak. SPOT i think
Speaker 1: there's nobody else kind of quite built like, him that
Speaker 1: plays like, him so you, KNOW i mean there are
Speaker 1: certain guys in this. LEAGUE i mean just think about.
Speaker 1: It if you do the, silhouette nobody else had a,
Speaker 1: Skyhook nobody quite moves cardio wise Like. STEPH i think
Speaker 1: part of what he does is no other Big when
Speaker 1: you play, him it's just, okay this is there's no warm.
Speaker 1: Up this is the only guy that plays like. This
Speaker 1: And i'm not saying the league is, similar but there
Speaker 1: are a lot of, twitchy, long athletic guys who have
Speaker 1: similar moves that they've learned from camps and, coaches right
Speaker 1: and certain step. MOVES i Think jokic is a disaster
Speaker 1: to defend the. BODY i mean a lot of times
Speaker 1: he just leans in and you get trapped under him
Speaker 1: around the. BACK i ever see this when these big
Speaker 1: guys get trapped and he gets like three looks and
Speaker 1: you just Can't you can't get your hips aligned to
Speaker 1: box him.
Speaker 4: Out you can't jump when you're connected with. Him that's the.
Speaker 4: Thing this is why boxing out is so. Important when
Speaker 4: you box a player, out it keeps him groundbound so
Speaker 4: that you can come in from behind to get the
Speaker 4: rebound elsewhere on the. Floor, Similarly jokic does the same
Speaker 4: thing to defensive. Players he's constantly dislodging you and putting
Speaker 4: you in these situations where you are not athletic because
Speaker 4: he's disrupted your base so you can't, jump and then
Speaker 4: that way he just finds these little angles for these
Speaker 4: little release. POINTS i love the point you made about
Speaker 4: how the league is, changed BECAUSE i found this to
Speaker 4: be really. Fascinating so part Of Michael jordan's dominance was
Speaker 4: that the league was so big and, slow and so
Speaker 4: he was this lightning quick guard that he just cut
Speaker 4: through everyone like. Butter, similarly With, jokic the league is
Speaker 4: so thin and, fast yes that he's just a bowling
Speaker 4: ball that's just knocking everybody over on his way to the.
Speaker 4: Rim in a weird, way like part of it is
Speaker 4: just the timing of the. Era but to his, credit
Speaker 4: because this is the. Thing there are a lot of
Speaker 4: big centers that can't play in THE nba today because
Speaker 4: they can't do this or they can't do. That they
Speaker 4: struggle with, this they struggle with. That jokicic because he's
Speaker 4: good enough in all of these other areas to be
Speaker 4: a USEFUL nba, player can weaponize his, size and all
Speaker 4: of a, sudden it's, like oh, man there's four hundred
Speaker 4: and fifty players in this, league And Joel embiid might
Speaker 4: be the only guy big enough to actually deal with.
Speaker 4: Him and he's not even healthy all the, time so
Speaker 4: he just has a mismatch every single. Night because of
Speaker 4: the era that he plays, in.
Speaker 1: Well it's Like Derreck, henry the running back for The.
Speaker 1: Ravens as linebackers and safeties have gotten smaller because the
Speaker 1: game is. Faster linebackers are two twenty. Five Derek henry's to,
Speaker 1: Fifty so you, know twenty years ago linebackers were as
Speaker 1: big As Derrick, henry and now guys can't They Just
Speaker 1: derek is a physical mismatch and he gets a running.
Speaker 1: Start AND i do think That i've said. It the
Speaker 1: league over the last twelve years has become kind of
Speaker 1: the skinny jeans Euro, League like it's a lot of
Speaker 1: centers that weigh two forty three and he's just a load.
Speaker 1: Physically the