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Speaker 1: They're happy January twelfth, and welcome to I guess what

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Speaker 1: we could call the first sort of normal episode of

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Speaker 1: the Chuck podcast for calendar year twenty twenty.

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Speaker 2: Six, I say fourth normal.

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Speaker 1: Obviously my schedule didn't change, but we had a few specials.

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Speaker 1: We had some special mailbag episodes. I did a couple

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Speaker 1: of what ifs in there.

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Speaker 2: I will admit there were a.

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Speaker 1: Few more what ifs we wanted to do, but you know,

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Speaker 1: look there's only there's only a certain amount of content

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Speaker 1: we can create and a certain amount of content that

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Speaker 1: you guys want to consume, and you know you don't

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Speaker 1: want to oversaturate anything in any particular category. But for

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Speaker 1: the at the end of the day, this is sort of,

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Speaker 1: you know, my first full week back fully folk, well,

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Speaker 1: I say fully focused.

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Speaker 2: I'll admit that I have.

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Speaker 1: A tiny part of my brain focused on January nineteenth,

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Speaker 1: down in hard Rock Stadium, where the University of Miami

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Speaker 1: will be taking on the Indiana Hoosiers, where we're going

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Speaker 1: to find out if the University of Miami is simply

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Speaker 1: a supporting cast member in the lifetime Hallmark movie Love

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Speaker 1: Story between Fernando Mendoz and Kurt Signetti. Of course, that

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Speaker 1: this is a different movie and that Kurt Signetti and

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Speaker 1: Fernando Mendoza are supporting characters in one about the comeback

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Speaker 1: of a great college football dynasty known as the University

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Speaker 1: of Miamy. So yes, it is about the only positive

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Speaker 1: thing I feel like I feel comfortable even celebrating in

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Speaker 1: public these days. And I'm going to get to a

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Speaker 1: full football report, including sort of my explanation of how

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Speaker 1: Miami loses and my explanation of how Miami wins. And

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Speaker 1: for those of you that keep very close track of

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Speaker 1: my sports teams, let's just say my son is in

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Speaker 1: the fetal position having to do with the disaster that

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Speaker 1: is the Green Bay Packers. Nothing more embarrassing than to

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Speaker 1: lose to the lowly Chicago Bears. We Packer fans don't

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Speaker 1: have a lot of respect for that Bears organization. They've

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Speaker 1: been nice little brothers for decades and decades to lose

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Speaker 1: that way, to lose the way they did, so I

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Speaker 1: have a few strong feelings to share on that and

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Speaker 1: to channel some of my son's rage, because he's very frustrated.

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Speaker 1: He says, you're happy he doesn't live and die by

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Speaker 1: the University of Miami the way I do. So he's

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Speaker 1: jealous that I have something to be happy about in football,

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Speaker 1: and he feels as if he has nothing to be

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Speaker 1: happy about in football right now. But let's be honest,

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Speaker 1: those are good problems to have. I think we all

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Speaker 1: would prefer to be focusing on that, And obviously I

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Speaker 1: will get to that, but it's going to be at

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Speaker 1: the end of the podcast. Let me give you a

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Speaker 1: quick little sort of contents if you will table of

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Speaker 1: contact of what you're going, what you should expect today.

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Speaker 2: I have a little bit.

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Speaker 1: Of my thoughts on what I am deeming the year

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Speaker 1: of living dangerously. I think we, all of us, it's

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Speaker 1: global citizens, are living in the most tumultuous year perhaps

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Speaker 1: that we've experienced yet. I hope I'm wrong, but all

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Speaker 1: the ingredients are there for what could be a year

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Speaker 1: of life being dangerously, whether it's domestically internationally. If we

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Speaker 1: can get to the end of this calendar year without

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Speaker 1: significant number of lost lives somewhere around this globe, I

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Speaker 1: think we will call that a win. But the bottom

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Speaker 1: line is it feels very unsteady, very uncertain, and there

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Speaker 1: is no doubt with the entire globe. I think there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of this anxiety, and I want to get

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Speaker 1: at that anxiety. I also want to do a deep

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Speaker 1: dive on the incident in Minnesota, with a little bit

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Speaker 1: of reflection on another incident that took place some thirty

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Speaker 1: five years ago that actually is worthy of some comparison.

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Speaker 1: I'll also today is a Monday, which means we are

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Speaker 1: going to have a Toddcast time machine and we're going

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Speaker 1: to go back to nineteen eighteen and talk about sort

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Speaker 1: of a moment that helped spark the idea that America

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Speaker 1: was a global superpower and that America essentially could be

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Speaker 1: the leading benevolent power in the world, and how we

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Speaker 1: wanted to how we want, what kind of example we

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Speaker 1: wanted to set, what kind of world order we wanted

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Speaker 1: to build, and the success with which we did that.

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Speaker 1: And now we're at the brink of destroying everything that

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Speaker 1: helped make this country so great for so long. We'll

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Speaker 1: do a few q and as, and then of course

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Speaker 1: we will get to my brilliant football takes that I

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Speaker 1: know so many of you hang your hat on, more

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Speaker 1: so perhaps than anything else. But I digress, But let

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Speaker 1: me get to a large idea that I want to

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Speaker 1: live with leave you with today, because look, I've been

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Speaker 1: out and about traveling both on interstates around there. I've

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Speaker 1: traveled a bit internationally over the last three or four weeks.

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Speaker 1: I've run into a variety of people in different walks

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Speaker 1: of life, different socioeconomic classes. And what's interesting is how

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Speaker 1: common the questions I get when people recognize me, and

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Speaker 1: the kind of questions that they throw at me that

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Speaker 1: aren't specific with details, but all thematically pretty much the

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Speaker 1: same whether they are on Team Blue or Team Red

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Speaker 1: these days, and it's simply this, are we going to

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Speaker 1: be okay?

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Speaker 2: And my instinct when.

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Speaker 1: I get that question is simply to say, yeah, of

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Speaker 1: course we are. We've been through this before, and you've

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Speaker 1: heard me say this. And there are plenty of times

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Speaker 1: in American history where we've been on the brink of

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Speaker 1: something bad and we've pulled back. Sometimes we've pursued bad

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Speaker 1: policies and we've eventually learned the hard way. That gives

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Speaker 1: me optimism because I do think we are eventually going

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Speaker 1: to get out of this and be in a better place.

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Speaker 1: The question is how much damage is done before we

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Speaker 1: get to that work in the road. And that's where

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Speaker 1: I can't always provide full comfort to people. I have

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Speaker 1: this sort of dark joke that I say at times

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Speaker 1: about climate change, and I'll say this. I say, in

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Speaker 1: two hundred years from now, if the world's population is

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Speaker 1: cut in half, let's say the world's population is three

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Speaker 1: billion in the year twenty two hundred, will you say

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Speaker 1: we survived climate change? So the answer is, yes, the

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Speaker 1: species did, but we lost a lot of lives. Our

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Speaker 1: population shrunk quite a bit, right, You see where I'm

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Speaker 1: going here, right.

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Speaker 2: The point is.

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Speaker 1: We're going to survive all of this. The question is

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Speaker 1: how much damage is done until we get to that

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Speaker 1: point where we don't have the anxiety that we all

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Speaker 1: feel today, Which is why I am deeming twenty twenty

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Speaker 1: six the year in which the globe, but in particular

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Speaker 1: the United States, isn't a year of living dangerously. We've

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Speaker 1: had other dangerous years, and again I hope I'm wrong.

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Speaker 1: I hope this proves not to be the case, but

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Speaker 1: I think, unfortunately all of the circumstantial evidence is pointing

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Speaker 1: in that direction. So the framing question I want to

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Speaker 1: come back to isn't where should we be headed? It's

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Speaker 1: more basin basic than that. It's simply where are we

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Speaker 1: actually headed? Because the honest answer is, weren't some uncharted

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Speaker 1: waters here?

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Speaker 2: Right?

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Speaker 1: We've had similar experiences with nationalism, We've had similar experiences

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Speaker 1: with over exuberant, exuberant executive power. We've had all sorts

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Speaker 1: of times when the federal government has done things that

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Speaker 1: if that has harmed a class of people unfairly.

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Speaker 2: So, yes, we've.

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Speaker 1: Been down these roads before, but we always seem to

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Speaker 1: have a moral compass that we would eventually follow The

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Speaker 1: question is does that moral compass work. Some of these

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Speaker 1: things I'm gonna are going to sound repetitive to some

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Speaker 1: of you because I've talked about them in the past.

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Speaker 1: You know, I think one of the ways to understand

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Speaker 1: what has been now a quarter century of what I

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Speaker 1: would describe as rolling, unresolved anxiety about the current shape

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Speaker 1: of our economy and our economic outlook, our cultural transition.

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Speaker 1: None of this is quite landed, right. We have not

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Speaker 1: fully fully embraced what this new economy is going to

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Speaker 1: look like. Globalization is certainly one where there's been a

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Speaker 1: revolution against AI is only going to accelerate even more. Globalization,

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Speaker 1: which is only going to accelerate more anxiety, identity status,

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Speaker 1: all of that has been up in the air, and

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Speaker 1: all of it's been playing out across the entire twenty

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Speaker 1: first century. This isn't just an American story. It's been

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Speaker 1: a global story as well, right, Bresit wasn't a trigger

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Speaker 1: in this country, bregsit was one of the big triggers

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Speaker 1: in Europe. You had a mass migration crisis in the

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Speaker 1: Mediterranean Sea that helped trigger a lot of nationalism in

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Speaker 1: Europe and a lot of xenophobia in Europe, and you know,

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Speaker 1: of course we have not dealt with why are there

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Speaker 1: so many Why is there so many surges from the

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Speaker 1: Global South to try to come into the westernized world. Well,

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Speaker 1: the global South is in deep, deep trouble for a

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Speaker 1: variety of reasons, and that is something that has been unresolved. Look,

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Speaker 1: globalization has created massive wealth, wealth we hadn't seen before,

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Speaker 1: massive efficiency, massive displacement. Entire communities have been lost, not

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Speaker 1: just not just on jobs, but a.

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Speaker 2: Sense of purpose.

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Speaker 1: So globalization created massive wealth, massive efficiency, and massive display.

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Speaker 1: Entire communities lost not just jobs, but they lost a

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Speaker 1: sense of purpose. You just go through the state of Iowa.

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Speaker 1: I've told you those stories in the past, and for

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Speaker 1: a while, the promise was, don't worry. All of this

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Speaker 1: is eventually going to stabilize. The next generation will be fine.

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Speaker 1: The system will catch up. This is what happened right

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Speaker 1: in the early twentieth century. The system caught up and

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Speaker 1: we had this thriving middle class economy by the nineteen fifties.

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Speaker 1: That hadn't happened yet. Doesn't mean it still won't. But

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Speaker 1: the problem is our anxiety is still there.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: That is why we've been in this vote against mindset.

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Speaker 1: We have not liked the system that's in place, and

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Speaker 1: we have held political leaders accountable who are in charge

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Speaker 1: when the system is in place. And now, of course

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Speaker 1: we have AI, right that is about to pour gasoline

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Speaker 1: on this globalization. In what globalization created some fear, AI

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Speaker 1: is going to create a ton more fear. Globalization really

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Speaker 1: impacted blue collar America. AI is going to impact all

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Speaker 1: of America from blue collar jobs, pink collar jobs, white

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Speaker 1: collar jobs, you name it. And that unease is only

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Speaker 1: going to add more to this anxiety that is out there.

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Speaker 1: So the fear is compounding and it's not replacing old anxiety,

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Speaker 1: it's essentially stacks on top of it.

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Speaker 2: And then when you combine.

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Speaker 1: Economic fear with cultural displacement, right the sort of the

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Speaker 1: changing look of America, if you will, you get a

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Speaker 1: public that is unsettled enough to be persuadable and exhausted

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Speaker 1: enough to be dangerous. And that's why I do think

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Speaker 1: we are in a you know, one of the you know,

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Speaker 1: we this could be the year that we are living

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Speaker 1: and it's certainly a year that I feel like we're

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Speaker 1: living dangerously. Then you layer on top what has been

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Speaker 1: a really poor political response to this anxiety. Politicians have

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Speaker 1: tried to respond to this anxiety, and we've seen policy

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Speaker 1: making that I would argue, in my view, hasn't resolved

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Speaker 1: the problem and in some cases has made the anxiety

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Speaker 1: and the uncertainty worse. Not everyone may agree with me

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Speaker 1: on that, but it's hard to argue with the results.

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Speaker 1: Just look, we can just take the issue of tariffs right,

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Speaker 1: Look at how that is destroyed and hurt this economy,

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Speaker 1: impacted cost of living, all sorts of things. This has

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Speaker 1: been a failure. This is an obvious failure of this policy.

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Speaker 1: It has created all sorts of global instability.

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Speaker 2: None of this.

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Speaker 1: Has gone well for the United States because what we

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Speaker 1: I think are learning here is trade policy that flexes

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Speaker 1: muscle in the short term, leaves businesses unsure and out

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Speaker 1: of plan. Immigration policy that's in strong signals but creates

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Speaker 1: chaos without clarity that also hurts business, that's also impacted

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Speaker 1: your budget at home. Economic nationalism can feel emotionally satisfying,

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Speaker 1: we want these jobs in America, but it often raises

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Speaker 1: costs and utility for the very set of voters that

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Speaker 1: the policy was supposed to protect. And that's the world

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Speaker 1: we're living in right now. So the intent may be

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Speaker 1: to calm fear or to help people wherea no, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: somebody is going to get your back, and the outcome

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Speaker 1: often does the opposite. When promises that are made go

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Speaker 1: unmet or unfulfilled, then you haven't even angry or public

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Speaker 1: and maybe they will no longer trust the political system

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Speaker 1: to come up with those answers. And then that brings

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Speaker 1: me to the international layer of this world and of

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Speaker 1: this moment of a year that we're living in that

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Speaker 1: I think is pretty dangerous because every day now feels

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Speaker 1: like we're on almost a regime watch moment. Is there

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Speaker 1: going to be real change in Menezuela? We haven't done

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Speaker 1: regime change there. We just knocked out a leader. But

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Speaker 1: did we just break it?

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Speaker 2: We own it?

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Speaker 1: What are we doing with it? We may have weakened

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Speaker 1: the regime. If the regime is still in charge. There

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Speaker 1: seems to be all sorts of crackdowns. There seems to

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Speaker 1: be unsafe for Americans.

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Speaker 2: How did that happen?

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Speaker 1: What are we going to do when you're half in

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Speaker 1: half out right again? The pottery barn rule we broke it?

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Speaker 2: Are we going to go in there? And now?

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Speaker 1: And fix it and what's hot? What you know the

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Speaker 1: issues currently happening in Venezuela. Are we going to suddenly

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Speaker 1: decide we're going to get involved in Iran?

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Speaker 2: Right?

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Speaker 1: The good news is these protesters are in the streets

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Speaker 1: like never before. I will be shocked if the Iranian

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Speaker 1: regime can last this calendar year. I think this is

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Speaker 1: going to be one of the biggest stories in the

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Speaker 1: on the planet is when the supreme leader falls in Iran?

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Speaker 1: But how involved should the United States get? And if

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Speaker 1: you get so involved, the actually help the regime stay

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Speaker 1: in power longer. It is a really precarious moment the

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Speaker 1: the you know, look, I remember when these when this

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Speaker 1: protest movement in Iran sparked up in the early days

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Speaker 1: of Obama. Obama said certain things and now there's in hindsight,

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Speaker 1: should he have done more? But the more you do,

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Speaker 1: the more involved you get America, the more involved we

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Speaker 1: get the expectations that were suddenly in charge.

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Speaker 2: Are we rebuilding? You know? It is?

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Speaker 1: It is one of those that the more a global

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Speaker 1: superpower tries to play the game of risk, tries to

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Speaker 1: sit here and manipulate situations, the more it usually doesn't work.

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Speaker 1: And I think given already what we've seen as an

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Speaker 1: unsteady and uneven and we had no Okay, you're gonna

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Speaker 1: get involved in Venezuela, what are you doing the next day?

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Speaker 1: We had no plan. It's clear we don't have a plan.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he is just winging it right now. There

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Speaker 1: was no plan at all. Do we have a plan

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Speaker 1: for Cuba because they're winging it there. There's no plan

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Speaker 1: at all. And if you get involved in I run,

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Speaker 1: what's your plan? Are we really going the irony that

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Speaker 1: suddenly the United States and Donald Trump has decided if

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Speaker 1: you're going to be a nation destructor, then you have

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Speaker 1: no choice but to become a nation builder. And we

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Speaker 1: have just we're trying to destroy the regimes in Venezuela, Iran,

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Speaker 1: and Cuba, and if we are the ones that essentially

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Speaker 1: help break the place, then we're going to have no

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Speaker 1: choice but to play a role in it.

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Speaker 2: Now. I happen to think that.

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Speaker 1: We should play a role in these places, but a

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Speaker 1: benevolent role. We can't play the malevolent role. And the

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Speaker 1: fact is history, look as much as there's yeah, I

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Speaker 1: want to see this stuff happen, history says the more

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Speaker 1: involved we get the more skepticism the public itself sometimes

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Speaker 1: has with our involvement, and it actually can backfire. It

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Speaker 1: can it can strengthen leaders that were weak at one point.

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Speaker 1: In fact, we're seeing that Latin America already, the President

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Speaker 1: of Columbia is not very popular. It's a he's overseeing

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Speaker 1: economy that's not very popular. He's overseen a security situation

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Speaker 1: that's not very popular. Political party that is a bit

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Speaker 1: more aligned with the West, a bit more aligned with

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Speaker 1: US priorities in the hemisphere, is favored to win. But

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Speaker 1: all of a sudden, the more heavy handed we are

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Speaker 1: taking with Venezuela, the more suddenly those that are seen

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Speaker 1: as more friendly the United States are being met with

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Speaker 1: more skepticism by the voter, because guess what, there's a

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Speaker 1: history in Latin America of skepticism of United States power

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Speaker 1: and how much they want to exert in those places.

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Speaker 1: So these are good things. Morduro gone, that would be

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Speaker 1: a great thing. The remnants of this Castro regime going

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Speaker 1: away in Cuba, that could be a good thing. Getting

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Speaker 1: rid of the Iatolin Iran that that is all a

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Speaker 1: good thing for people that are being abused in those countries.

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Speaker 1: These are undemocratic dictatorships where anybody that spoke out was

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Speaker 1: thrown in prison, was mistreated, sometimes killed. These regimes have

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Speaker 1: to go, but they have to you know, it has

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Speaker 1: to be the people in these countries that overthrow. You know,

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Speaker 1: if we are seen as the instigator, it will not

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Speaker 1: go well. In fact, why are we having the situation

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Speaker 1: that we have in Iran because of how involved we

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Speaker 1: got in Iran's politics for so long in the fifties, sixties,

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Speaker 1: and seventies. So the reason we have the regime we

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Speaker 1: have in Iran is arguably due to our heavier hand

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Speaker 1: in that country's politics in that country, going back decades

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Speaker 1: I want to make here about to twenty twenty six

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Speaker 1: being the year we're living dangerously because every headline now

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Speaker 1: feels like a tipping one, like okay, this is going

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Speaker 1: to be a big one, and it's not always clear

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Speaker 1: whether the tip is going to be towards progress. Well,

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Speaker 1: the tip will be disaster. Right, it's progress to get

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Speaker 1: rid of a brutal dictator. It can turn into disaster

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Speaker 1: if there's no plan for a regime that is more democratic,

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Speaker 1: more free, and more responsive to the people. And of course,

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Speaker 1: all of this is happening under an American president who

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Speaker 1: clearly intends and I think this is the motivation, but

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Speaker 1: you know, he just wants He just wants attention and

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Speaker 1: wants to be involved and wants to put his historical

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Speaker 1: stamp on this era whatever and whatever means necessary, if

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Speaker 1: it means just acquiring somebody else's Nobel Peace Prize to

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Speaker 1: say hey, I've got the Peace Prize that I should

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Speaker 1: have gotten, you know, it's something silly like that, or

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Speaker 1: going after Greenland so that somehow the history books will

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Speaker 1: say he got Greenland, or who knows, maybe he does

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Speaker 1: get serious about Canada again. I know Canadians are very

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Speaker 1: nervous about this right, the suddenly embracing of the sphere

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Speaker 1: of influence, the fact that you have people like JD.

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Speaker 1: Vance trying to redefine America first as hemisphere first. That

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Speaker 1: will suddenly rationalize taking the resources of another country, the

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Speaker 1: oil in Venezuela, for instance. So that only adds to

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Speaker 1: the anxiety. It only adds to the uncertainty, and it

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Speaker 1: only I think makes us all a bit less safe.

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Speaker 2: Are we are?

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Speaker 1: We are less safe today than when Donald Trump wasn't president.

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Speaker 1: The world is less safe. The world was safer before

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Speaker 1: he took office. Maybe the world wasn't as it wasn't

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Speaker 1: just in a lot of places. And this isn't to

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Speaker 1: say he hasn't stumbled into doing the right thing in

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Speaker 1: certain in certain points of his presidency, like getting the

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Speaker 1: cease fire in Israel and gossm But his actions have

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Speaker 1: put America more in harm's way, not less, And his

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Speaker 1: actions domestically have goaded more Americans to go after each other.

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Speaker 1: That's just a fact. Is it directly his fault or

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Speaker 1: is it us? Is it us behaving this way? We

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Speaker 1: don't have to take our cues from him, but he

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Speaker 1: is certain creating an environment that he hopes this is

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Speaker 1: what happens. He remembered what I think as a bug

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Speaker 1: dividing America. Some in his administration see as a feature

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Speaker 1: that division means more power and more influence. When division,

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Speaker 1: all it does is eventually erode away all of our freedoms.

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Speaker 1: So we'll see what happened. He's trying to remake parts

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Speaker 1: of the world order. He's trying to redraw norms. He's

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Speaker 1: trying to personalize power. He's trying to put a name

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00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,720
Speaker 1: on this era, from trade to alliances to rhetoric about

436
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:47,680
Speaker 1: borders and maps and sovereignty. This presidency is pushing hard

437
00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:52,920
Speaker 1: to basically upend the entire post Cold War assumption that

438
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 1: defined American leadership for the last forty years, arguably defined

439
00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:59,639
Speaker 1: American leadership since post World War Two. History is going

440
00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 1: to render this verdict, and we'll see how it turns out.

441
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 2: But here's the thing.

442
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,160
Speaker 1: It doesn't feel like there's a middle ground verdict available here,

443
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 1: does it this era is going to be remembered either

444
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 1: as the beginning of something necessary or the beginning of

445
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:14,760
Speaker 1: something destructive.

446
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:17,360
Speaker 2: And I think.

447
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 1: Because we realize there's only probably two paths here, that

448
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:26,919
Speaker 1: binary choice only adds to the anxiety we're all feeling.

449
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:29,960
Speaker 1: And I'm sorry to add to your anxiety by sort

450
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: of maybe giving you an explanation for it. But it's

451
00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:39,439
Speaker 1: the it's the world we live in. We also have

452
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,760
Speaker 1: this split reality that we're all living in because there's

453
00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 1: an America that's on social media that looks like it

454
00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:47,680
Speaker 1: is on the brink of civil war. Right, just watching

455
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 1: the left and right go after each other arguing over

456
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 1: the facts and the narrative of what happened in Minneapolis

457
00:26:57,040 --> 00:26:59,679
Speaker 1: really makes you feel uncomfortable, like, oh my god, what

458
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,639
Speaker 1: is social media going to do to us? And then

459
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,840
Speaker 1: there's the America I experience in the real world where

460
00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 1: it doesn't feel anywhere near that. Right, it does feel

461
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,000
Speaker 1: as if if we could all get off social media

462
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:15,000
Speaker 1: and touch grass, that maybe we would be in a

463
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 1: slightly better place. But it isn't all now an online situation, right,

464
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 1: because you have moments, flashpoints. The shooting in Minneapolis involving

465
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 1: an ice officer at this protest. This one event has

466
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:37,480
Speaker 1: enormous symbolic weight. It's the kind of moment that makes

467
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:40,920
Speaker 1: people think, are we one more incident away from something spiraling?

468
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 1: All of this feels like tender. It feels like the

469
00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 1: conditions exist where a spark could matter far more than

470
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:54,879
Speaker 1: it should. And you sometimes there are political leaders that

471
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:59,560
Speaker 1: almost seem to be embracing searching for this spark. Watching

472
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,119
Speaker 1: jd Vance go borderline unhinged in the White House press

473
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:11,240
Speaker 1: room trying to defend the the ICE officer's decision to

474
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:17,920
Speaker 1: respond to a protester with lethal force couldn't be any

475
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:19,800
Speaker 1: less American. And then we're going to sit here and

476
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:26,120
Speaker 1: lecture another country for killing protesters if we're if we

477
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:31,800
Speaker 1: are not protecting our own citizens' First Amendment rights, constitutional rights,

478
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,280
Speaker 1: we are no better than any of these other authoritarian regimes.

479
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 1: And that is something that has gotten lost with some

480
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,840
Speaker 1: elected officials and that and look, you may not like

481
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:48,440
Speaker 1: the protesters who are protesting the policies that are behind

482
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,720
Speaker 1: these ICE rates. And I'm trying really hard here, and

483
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: I would I would I would like I would like

484
00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:01,520
Speaker 1: folks to try hard to The issue isn't whether there

485
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:05,280
Speaker 1: should be ICE or not ICE. ICE is not the problem.

486
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:09,440
Speaker 1: It's the leadership at Homeland Security. It's the policies that

487
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 1: are being implemented that ICE is following. It's the recruitment

488
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:19,720
Speaker 1: process for ICE officers that clearly is training them to

489
00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 1: treat fellow American citizens as threats, not as constituents. But

490
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:34,520
Speaker 1: I do think you should separate out. This isn't ICE

491
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 1: isn't the problem. It's the leadership of ICE that's the problem.

492
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: We should have border patrol and we should be keeping

493
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,920
Speaker 1: track of who comes into our country and who isn't

494
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:50,840
Speaker 1: who shouldn't be in our country.

495
00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 2: But how we.

496
00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 1: Enforce the law well sends a message of who we

497
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 1: are as a country, who we are as a people.

498
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 1: Are we a democracy? And the way these ICE officers

499
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 1: at least are behaving, it is clear they have poor

500
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:20,600
Speaker 1: training because again, why did they immediate go to shoot

501
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 1: to kill? And I understand that there's a p you

502
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,560
Speaker 1: don't ever draw your weapon if you're not gonna shoot

503
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 1: to kill. There's this mindset, right, which is a bit

504
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 1: of a military mindset that shouldn't always be used for

505
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: suburban neighborhoods. But there's not a lot of evidence, and

506
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:43,200
Speaker 1: again he feared for his life. The training should be

507
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 1: to make sure that car can't be used to kill

508
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 1: you if you're truly worried about that. But I don't

509
00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:54,920
Speaker 1: think there's any evidence that anybody shot at the tires

510
00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:58,480
Speaker 1: to disable the vehicle without having to kill more people.

511
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:01,680
Speaker 1: In fact, doing what this officer did actually put more

512
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:06,200
Speaker 1: people's lives in danger. By shooting the driver, her weight

513
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,120
Speaker 1: falls onto the gas pedal and then puts more people's

514
00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 1: lives in danger. So this is a situation where you're

515
00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: supposed to be a de escalator. If you're in federal

516
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 1: law enforcement, any law enforcement, you're supposed to be a

517
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 1: de escalator. But instead this person chose to escalate. And

518
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 1: of course the recording that even DHS didn't hide, where

519
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:33,600
Speaker 1: an officer is heard calling the deceased woman and effing bitch.

520
00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 1: You now know the mindset that is in these officers.

521
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:43,280
Speaker 1: So again I understand the anger that's out there with

522
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:48,680
Speaker 1: some that says abolish ice, and I think some of

523
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 1: you might argue it's the whole institution's been poisoned. Look,

524
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 1: it is the leadership and the training. If we get

525
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,120
Speaker 1: rid of it, we're going to bring something similar in

526
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 1: its place, and if you're not advocating for that, you're

527
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 1: going to end up losing the larger argument.

528
00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 2: On that too.

529
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,719
Speaker 1: I'm just making an obvious political point.

530
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:11,640
Speaker 2: Here.

531
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:15,239
Speaker 1: Whether you may not like that point, but it's I

532
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: think it plays out as pretty factually correct. Now, here's

533
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:22,320
Speaker 1: the thing. We've been here before, kind of sort of

534
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 1: right after the fall of the Berlin Wall. Through much

535
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 1: of the nineties, the global order felt like it was

536
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 1: shifting constantly. Old assumptions collapse, new systems emerged. There was

537
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:32,720
Speaker 1: a time we thought Russia was going to be one

538
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 1: of our closest allies. There was real optimism. There was

539
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:41,680
Speaker 1: a lot of confusion as well. But here's another uncomfortable truth,

540
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 1: and it's perhaps why we're in the situation we're in now.

541
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:48,920
Speaker 1: We didn't get that transition right. And I think now

542
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 1: the longer we go, the longer the Ukraine War goes,

543
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:59,200
Speaker 1: the longer our instability grows, the longer we have questions

544
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:05,000
Speaker 1: about globalism. I think the fair that the critique is

545
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 1: that we didn't get this right, because if we had,

546
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 1: we probably wouldn't be living with this much unresolved anger

547
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:13,440
Speaker 1: and instability at the moment. Some of the assumptions we

548
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:20,040
Speaker 1: made about globalization, democracy, institutions, inevitability, they didn't hold. So look,

549
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 1: history never offers clean handoffs. It offers messy middle chapters.

550
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:25,840
Speaker 1: And it's very possible that what we thought was an

551
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 1: ending in the nineties was actually a beginning that we

552
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:33,320
Speaker 1: totally misunderstood, which brings me to the voters, because the

553
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: voters are going to have their say during this year

554
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,760
Speaker 1: living dangerously, because right now it feels like we're on

555
00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:42,479
Speaker 1: a collective roller coaster. When you know that feeling when

556
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,640
Speaker 1: you're on a roller coaster for too long, especially one

557
00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: you didn't choose, you just wanted to stop. You just

558
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 1: want to get off the ride because when you're on it,

559
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:55,120
Speaker 1: you don't feel in control of anything. So we've been

560
00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:58,160
Speaker 1: living through this vote against politics roller coaster for almost

561
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 1: two decades now that have been driven more by disgust

562
00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:05,120
Speaker 1: than belief, more about stopping something than building something. And

563
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 1: I think we're about to have another one yet again

564
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:11,080
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty six. But here's the deeper question beneath

565
00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 1: the service, and this is what I'm going to you know,

566
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:17,720
Speaker 1: in a year of living dangerously, hopefully we can find

567
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,200
Speaker 1: some leaders who have a vision of getting us through this,

568
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:24,680
Speaker 1: and hopefully we'll find a leader or two that can

569
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:27,760
Speaker 1: offer voters a version of change that doesn't feel like chaos.

570
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 1: Donald Trump was a change agent, but he's been a

571
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 1: chaotic change agent, and he's made more things worse than better.

572
00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 1: But he did shine a light on a lot of

573
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 1: things that were broken that need fixing, that should have

574
00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:45,719
Speaker 1: been addressed years ago. And you know, he may be

575
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:48,799
Speaker 1: nothing but a complainer, but it doesn't mean he's not

576
00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 1: right about some of these things to complain about. But voters,

577
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 1: you know, we are fickle because we want two things

578
00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:56,640
Speaker 1: at the same time that are very difficult to bring

579
00:34:56,680 --> 00:35:00,440
Speaker 1: stability and change. Politicians are never good about build delivering

580
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,320
Speaker 1: both simultaneously. It's very difficult. You're either a change agent

581
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:07,399
Speaker 1: or you're a stabilizing force. It's hard to be both

582
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,960
Speaker 1: in this current way our politics work, especially in the

583
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,720
Speaker 1: communications side. So let me leave you with this thought,

584
00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:18,359
Speaker 1: and that is, I think it's going to be bad

585
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:21,040
Speaker 1: politics to be on the side of chaos. And it's

586
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:25,040
Speaker 1: been true, right Donald Trump's chaos led to Democratic victories

587
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:27,839
Speaker 1: In twenty eighteen, Donald Trump's chaos and handling COVID led

588
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:32,320
Speaker 1: to Joe Biden's presidency in twenty twenty. But Joe Biden's

589
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 1: chaos led to a return to Donald Trump. Right, we

590
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:40,239
Speaker 1: don't like chaos. It's going to be good politican to

591
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:42,799
Speaker 1: be on the side of calm instability. Right now, Donald

592
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:45,600
Speaker 1: Trump is neither calm nor stable. That's a fact that

593
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:49,480
Speaker 1: is not going and so I would be hesitant to

594
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 1: be on the side of a force that is trying

595
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 1: to do their own version of disruption. You've got to

596
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 1: figure out how to create stable disruption if such a

597
00:35:58,200 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 1: thing exists. That said, calm doesn't mean stasis, stability doesn't

598
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 1: mean restoration, and forward doesn't mean reckless. So we'll see

599
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,240
Speaker 1: if there is anybody out there, any either political party

600
00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:14,520
Speaker 1: that actually can articulate a vision that says, yes, the

601
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:19,000
Speaker 1: system needs to be changed. No, chaos isn't a strength. No,

602
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:22,640
Speaker 1: we're not going backwards. And yes, here's what forward actually

603
00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:27,000
Speaker 1: looks like. Because if we don't get out of this loop,

604
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 1: we're going to continue to be defaulting to vote against

605
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:33,080
Speaker 1: politics until at some point a group of voters decide

606
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 1: politics isn't working. Let's go down the authoritarian route. We

607
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 1: already have elements on the right that have given up

608
00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:43,960
Speaker 1: on small D democracy. They are fully embracing Peter Thiel

609
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 1: JD Vance are part of this don't let them fool you.

610
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:51,360
Speaker 1: That is a wing of the part Elon Musk, this

611
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 1: sort of the Silicon Valley red pillars. None of them

612
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:58,719
Speaker 1: believe in small de democracy, not a single one of

613
00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 1: them a wan, you know, And that is should scare

614
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 1: the but Jesus out of most of it. I don't

615
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:10,279
Speaker 1: think Donald Trump necessarily ascribes to all that, but he

616
00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:13,279
Speaker 1: is so easily manipulated by money that he'll ascribe to

617
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:20,200
Speaker 1: whoever will fund him. But that is something that I

618
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,680
Speaker 1: think the more we fail at solving problems in a

619
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:28,239
Speaker 1: small D democratic society, the more you will see some

620
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:34,120
Speaker 1: of that anti you know, democracy doesn't work. Mindset take

621
00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:36,399
Speaker 1: hold on the left, just as we've seen it take

622
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:41,520
Speaker 1: hold on the right. Because there's always political physics. What

623
00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:44,440
Speaker 1: starts on one side of the aisle almost always shows

624
00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 1: up on the other side of the isle at some form.

625
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 1: Sometimes it's reactive, but it always seems to show up.

626
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:54,440
Speaker 1: So are we going to be okay? I don't have

627
00:37:54,480 --> 00:38:00,479
Speaker 1: any answer. I think America will eventually be okay. This moment,

628
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:04,440
Speaker 1: we're not so Okay, politics at twenty twenty six is

629
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:08,719
Speaker 1: going to change us a lot. How it changes us,

630
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:12,400
Speaker 1: I think is a total unknown. We are living in

631
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:14,359
Speaker 1: a year. We are going to live a year of

632
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:18,920
Speaker 1: living dangerously due to our domestic politics, due to the

633
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:24,960
Speaker 1: global uncertainty, due to this great power competition, a spark

634
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:29,560
Speaker 1: of some sort of violent military clash. The sparks are everywhere,

635
00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 1: and we don't know which one of them is going

636
00:38:31,719 --> 00:38:34,600
Speaker 1: to turn into an out of control wildfire and which

637
00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:38,640
Speaker 1: one of them proves to be a total and complete

638
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 1: done So. It's not the greatest way to ring in

639
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:45,920
Speaker 1: the quote unquote new year, but I think it's the

640
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:50,680
Speaker 1: most honest way to ring in to start this year, because.

641
00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:51,920
Speaker 2: I think that's that's where we are.

642
00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:56,319
Speaker 1: It's not where any of us want to be, no

643
00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:58,480
Speaker 1: matter which side of the political eye, none of us,

644
00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:03,439
Speaker 1: I think, enjoy living with this much anxiety. I don't

645
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 1: doesn't appear we have the leaders to meet this moment.

646
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 1: And this is not just to criticize Donald Trump. I

647
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:17,200
Speaker 1: don't see it on the left either right now. But

648
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:22,279
Speaker 1: guess what, twenty twenty six, we're holding auditions America. America's

649
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 1: looking for a forward looking leader who will bring stability

650
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:32,319
Speaker 1: and change and actually gives a damn about all Americans,

651
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:38,800
Speaker 1: regardless of others they're super liberal or super conservative. That's

652
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653
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654
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Speaker 1: was sixteen when my father passed away.

655
00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:53,760
Speaker 2: We didn't have any money.

656
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,279
Speaker 1: He didn't leave us in the best shape. My mother,

657
00:39:56,480 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 1: single mother, now widow, myself sixteen to figure.

658
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:01,680
Speaker 2: Out how am I going to pay for college?

659
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Speaker 1: And lo and behold. My dad had one life insurance

660
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,200
Speaker 1: policy that we found wasn't a lot, but it was

661
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:11,360
Speaker 1: important at the time, and it's why I was able

662
00:40:11,480 --> 00:40:14,800
Speaker 1: to go to college. Little did he know how important

663
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:18,640
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664
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666
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667
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Speaker 1: Ethos is an online platform that makes getting life insurance

668
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669
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670
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671
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674
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677
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Speaker 1: twenty five, Business Insider named Ethos the number one no

678
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680
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:13,440
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681
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682
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683
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Speaker 1: something you should really think about, especially if you've got

684
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Speaker 1: a growing family.

685
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:29,440
Speaker 2: A reader sent me a.

686
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:31,840
Speaker 1: Note on social media that I thought was quite.

687
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 2: Good, and he said, and he said, you know, he's a.

688
00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 1: Fan of the historical context that I like to bring

689
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:42,280
Speaker 1: to this podcast. And he said, hey, have you thought

690
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:46,320
Speaker 1: there's an interesting thought exercise out there about what happened

691
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:50,400
Speaker 1: in Minneapolis that might be worth talking about? And it

692
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:55,160
Speaker 1: was Ruby Ridge. Well, I did my own deep dive

693
00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:58,319
Speaker 1: on Ruby Ridge. I was sort of took place early

694
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 1: in my political reporting career, literally the first year I

695
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:06,120
Speaker 1: started working full time covering politics. And I will say

696
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:10,600
Speaker 1: it's a pretty I think it's a worthwhile comparison. So

697
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:15,799
Speaker 1: I wanted to spend a few minutes putting the two

698
00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:20,560
Speaker 1: stories together. It's a good thought exercise, and it isn't

699
00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 1: going to be an exercise that's here to declare heroes

700
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:26,200
Speaker 1: or villains, but it's simply to examine how we process

701
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:30,680
Speaker 1: federal power depending on whose ox is getting gored. Because

702
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:32,440
Speaker 1: one of the hardest things in politics right now, I

703
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:35,759
Speaker 1: was admitting when our own personal reactions are shaped less

704
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 1: by facts than by what tribe we're a member of.

705
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:41,680
Speaker 1: So to do that, let's do a quick history lesson.

706
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:44,239
Speaker 1: This is not my official podcast time machine. I got

707
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:47,799
Speaker 1: something else for you after the Mark Xandy interview, but

708
00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:51,759
Speaker 1: I want to do you know, what's happening in Minneapolis,

709
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 1: I think is something that if the federal government doesn't

710
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:02,680
Speaker 1: get religion about transparency and mistigation and honesty soon, it's

711
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,120
Speaker 1: going to do some lasting damage that will be hard

712
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:07,360
Speaker 1: not on why so I whant to take you back

713
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:10,399
Speaker 1: to an incident that many on the right are well

714
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:13,839
Speaker 1: aware of. It's called Ruby Ridge. Ruby Ridge was not

715
00:43:13,960 --> 00:43:16,840
Speaker 1: actually a single event. It was the end of a long,

716
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:20,320
Speaker 1: escalating standoff. It actually began in nineteen eighty nine nineteen

717
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:23,239
Speaker 1: ninety when federal authorities accused a gentleman by the name

718
00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:26,719
Speaker 1: of Randy Weaver of selling two sought off shotguns to

719
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:30,960
Speaker 1: an ATF in format. Weaver missed a court date. Now

720
00:43:30,960 --> 00:43:33,360
Speaker 1: there's still a dispute over whether the notice was confusing

721
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:37,920
Speaker 1: or mishandled, but missing the court date triggered a warrant

722
00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:45,240
Speaker 1: being issued for his arrest. The circumstances here matter because

723
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:51,280
Speaker 1: the original offense was nonviolent, and everything that followed escalated

724
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:57,320
Speaker 1: far beyond that. Sounds familiar right Minneapolis. The conversation between

725
00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:01,279
Speaker 1: the ice officers and misgood, But I'll continue.

726
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 2: So.

727
00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:05,640
Speaker 1: In August of nineteen ninety two US marshals were surveilling

728
00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:10,800
Speaker 1: Weaver's remote cabin in Idaho. A confrontation occurred involving Weaver's

729
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,840
Speaker 1: teenage son and a family friend. A federal marshal was killed,

730
00:44:15,880 --> 00:44:20,560
Speaker 1: and that meant the FBI's hostage rescue team took over. Now,

731
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 1: the FBI adopted site specific rules of engagement. It was

732
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:28,640
Speaker 1: not standard policy, and it turned out to be very controversial.

733
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:35,600
Speaker 1: Once the investigation surfaced this fact, the rules effectively allowed

734
00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 1: agents to shoot any armed adult male seen outside the cabin. Eventually,

735
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:46,040
Speaker 1: the Justice Department would acknowledge that this was a constitutionally

736
00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:52,200
Speaker 1: flawed policy. Then, on August twenty second, nineteen ninety two,

737
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:57,640
Speaker 1: an FBI sniper named Laan Harichi fired two shots. The

738
00:44:57,719 --> 00:45:01,360
Speaker 1: second shot killed a woman named Vicki Weaver, Randy Weaver's wife,

739
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:05,399
Speaker 1: as she stood behind the cabin door holding her infant daughter.

740
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:15,520
Speaker 1: A mother holding a baby was killed by a federal sniper. Now,

741
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:19,759
Speaker 1: let's get to the aftermath and the accountability. Unlike what

742
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:23,680
Speaker 1: we saw in Minneapolis this week, the federal government did

743
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 1: not deny the need for an investigation. In fact, there

744
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:32,360
Speaker 1: were multiple inquiries the Department of Justice, congressional inquiries, internal

745
00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:36,359
Speaker 1: FBI reviews. The Weaver family, in fact, received a three

746
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:41,719
Speaker 1: point one million dollar civil settlement. An FBI official would

747
00:45:41,760 --> 00:45:45,040
Speaker 1: later go to prison for destroying evidence that was related

748
00:45:45,040 --> 00:45:49,319
Speaker 1: to the case. Now it's worth noting, and some of

749
00:45:49,360 --> 00:45:53,319
Speaker 1: you already know this if you're well educated about sort

750
00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:59,320
Speaker 1: of different, sort of ideological fights between the right and

751
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:01,920
Speaker 1: the federal government. Ruby Ridge became a symbol, especially on

752
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:06,480
Speaker 1: the right of federal overreach, secrecy, and a government circling

753
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:11,880
Speaker 1: the wagons. So here's why Ruby Ridge lodged so deeply

754
00:46:11,920 --> 00:46:15,640
Speaker 1: in conservative memory. It reinforced the idea of a deep

755
00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:19,680
Speaker 1: state abusing power. It fed militia movements and distrust of

756
00:46:19,719 --> 00:46:24,800
Speaker 1: federal law enforcement. This incident was a recruiting tool, and importantly,

757
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:27,520
Speaker 1: even the federal government eventually conceded that something had gone

758
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:31,480
Speaker 1: wrong procedurally, which one could argue might have helped de

759
00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:37,520
Speaker 1: escalate the situation, unlike what we see right now with

760
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:43,200
Speaker 1: Homeland Security, the government George HW Bush's government, by the way,

761
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:47,319
Speaker 1: Bill Barr's Justice Department, back in nineteen ninety two, ninety one,

762
00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:50,960
Speaker 1: and ninety two, the government there accepted the premise that

763
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:57,400
Speaker 1: this incident demanded scrutiny. Now let's fast forward more than

764
00:46:57,400 --> 00:47:02,640
Speaker 1: thirty years to Minneapolis. Obviously, the cases aren't identical. There's

765
00:47:02,680 --> 00:47:06,800
Speaker 1: different contexts, there's different agencies, there's different facts that should

766
00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:10,200
Speaker 1: still be under investigation. But the reaction does tell us something.

767
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:13,919
Speaker 1: A federal agent kills a civilian during an enforcement action,

768
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: video circulates almost immediately and before investigations are complete, you

769
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:24,560
Speaker 1: have national political figures defining the victim, not just the incident, right,

770
00:47:24,760 --> 00:47:29,680
Speaker 1: Christy nom calling this person a terrorist, the domestic terrorist,

771
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:32,720
Speaker 1: and of course Jade Vange pouring gasoline on this fire.

772
00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:37,439
Speaker 1: So here we had a case where the narrative solidifies first.

773
00:47:37,480 --> 00:47:40,240
Speaker 1: The fact finding comes later, if it comes at all.

774
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:43,960
Speaker 2: So at Ruby Ridge, the.

775
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:48,839
Speaker 1: Government, a Republican administration, eventually said we need to.

776
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:49,160
Speaker 2: Look at this.

777
00:47:50,760 --> 00:47:54,280
Speaker 1: In Minneapolis, we have not yet seen the same institutional humility.

778
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 1: There's been no equivalent of an independent commission. There's been

779
00:47:57,520 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 1: no immediate acknowledgment that procedures themselves may be issue here.

780
00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:07,880
Speaker 1: That difference matters as much as the shooting itself. So

781
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:10,520
Speaker 1: here's the uncomfortable part. In nineteen ninety two, many on

782
00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:14,040
Speaker 1: the right saw a victim of federal tyranny. In twenty

783
00:48:14,080 --> 00:48:17,160
Speaker 1: twenty six, many of those same voices instinctively are defending

784
00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:21,400
Speaker 1: the use of federal force because the target doesn't agree

785
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:27,200
Speaker 1: with them. She was a liberal. This is somehow she

786
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:30,759
Speaker 1: was in She was protesting what Ice was doing that

787
00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 1: somehow for some people as serving as a well she

788
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:40,520
Speaker 1: got what she asked for. Of course, now many on

789
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:43,239
Speaker 1: the left who wants trusted federal institutions now see a

790
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:47,760
Speaker 1: victim where others see justification. There should be a huge

791
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:55,359
Speaker 1: moment for the libertarian right to welcome new adherents from

792
00:48:55,360 --> 00:49:01,480
Speaker 1: the left. BENI, we had the same power, same legal shields,

793
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:05,040
Speaker 1: by the way, and a different political reaction. What change

794
00:49:05,120 --> 00:49:08,440
Speaker 1: wasn't the law. What change was who we identify with.

795
00:49:10,360 --> 00:49:12,520
Speaker 1: And this is the bigger lesson. This isn't about equating

796
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:17,280
Speaker 1: the two tragedies. Two mothers were killed by a federal officer,

797
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:22,840
Speaker 1: one in Ruby Ridge, one in Minneapolis. I'm just simply

798
00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:25,040
Speaker 1: asking whether we still believe the same rules should apply

799
00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:28,160
Speaker 1: no matter who's in the crosshairs. Ruby Ridge taught us

800
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:31,399
Speaker 1: a federal power demands scrutiny even when agents believe they're

801
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:34,479
Speaker 1: acting in good faith. The real question today is whether

802
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:40,360
Speaker 1: we still believe that or only when it's politically convenient.

803
00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:48,520
Speaker 1: But the behavior right now, particularly of Christino, of Tom Holman,

804
00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:50,839
Speaker 1: I mean, think about Tom Holman putting him out there

805
00:49:50,840 --> 00:49:54,960
Speaker 1: as a as a defender of this the minute you

806
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:58,919
Speaker 1: don't the minute you politicize the rule of law, which

807
00:49:58,920 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 1: Donald Trump has done.

808
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:01,600
Speaker 2: Right, if you.

809
00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:06,720
Speaker 1: Attack cops at January sixth, you get pardoned by Donald Trump.

810
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:14,160
Speaker 1: If you simply protest a law enforcement action in Minneapolis.

811
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:20,800
Speaker 1: You can get killed, and it's okay. If Donald Trump,

812
00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:29,920
Speaker 1: Christy know JD. Verns want Americans to respect Ice and

813
00:50:30,040 --> 00:50:34,800
Speaker 1: respect their policy decisions, they have to respect the constitutional

814
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:41,719
Speaker 1: rights of every single person in this country. As guess

815
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:45,160
Speaker 1: who has constitutional rights? Not just citizens, but everybody in

816
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:49,120
Speaker 1: this country. And if we can't show ourselves that we

817
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 1: live by these truisms, who are we to tell Iran

818
00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:56,640
Speaker 1: what they're doing is wrong. Who are we to tell

819
00:50:56,719 --> 00:51:00,399
Speaker 1: Venezuela and the Maduro regime that what they're doing is wrong.

820
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:02,479
Speaker 1: Who are we to tell the Cubans that what they're

821
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 1: doing is wrong? Who are we to tell the Chinese

822
00:51:04,680 --> 00:51:10,200
Speaker 1: that we're there when we're exhibiting behavior that can be

823
00:51:10,360 --> 00:51:17,040
Speaker 1: used as what about ism by our international call them

824
00:51:17,080 --> 00:51:35,040
Speaker 1: competitors or potential adversaries, then we lose who we are.

825
00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:41,120
Speaker 1: So I put that one in there today because I

826
00:51:41,120 --> 00:51:44,759
Speaker 1: thought it was a really smart thought exercise, and I

827
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:48,480
Speaker 1: would just challenge my friends on the right, think about

828
00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:50,959
Speaker 1: the facts of Ruby Ridge, think about everything, and tell

829
00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:53,960
Speaker 1: me how the same level of scrutiny that many on

830
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:56,319
Speaker 1: the right demanded of the federal government and got from

831
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:59,440
Speaker 1: the federal government due to the actions at Ruby Ridge.

832
00:52:00,719 --> 00:52:03,880
Speaker 1: They applied directly right here at the actions and the

833
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 1: questionable actions of.

834
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 2: What happened with Ice.

835
00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:10,879
Speaker 1: And if you are not interested in a full, transparent

836
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 1: investigation that includes both federal and state authorities, then you

837
00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:21,080
Speaker 1: clearly have no interest in getting to the truth. And

838
00:52:21,120 --> 00:52:22,800
Speaker 1: if you have no interest in getting to the truth,

839
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:26,759
Speaker 1: well I would argue you yourself have ceased to be

840
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:30,880
Speaker 1: an American in good standing. All right, let's sneak in

841
00:52:30,920 --> 00:52:33,400
Speaker 1: a break, and when we come back, let's talk economy

842
00:52:33,480 --> 00:52:44,440
Speaker 1: with my friend mister Mark Sandy. All Right, let me

843
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:52,919
Speaker 1: go into the time machine, the podcast time machine. We're

844
00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:54,799
Speaker 1: going to go back, as I said, little more than

845
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:57,440
Speaker 1: one hundred years ago, and as you know, I like

846
00:52:57,520 --> 00:53:00,000
Speaker 1: to use the week that is, so it's January twelve

847
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:04,160
Speaker 1: through the eighteenth. Okay, all right, I'm fudging fudging here

848
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:06,520
Speaker 1: a little bit because the event I'm going back to

849
00:53:06,600 --> 00:53:10,719
Speaker 1: is actually in January eighth, nineteen eighteen, but it was

850
00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:14,240
Speaker 1: the reaction to set event on January eighteenth that began

851
00:53:14,360 --> 00:53:18,200
Speaker 1: trickling in on January twelve, thirteen and fourteenth. So I

852
00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:21,080
Speaker 1: feel I feel like I can get away with this

853
00:53:21,360 --> 00:53:25,319
Speaker 1: fudging of a day or two on it. So what

854
00:53:25,440 --> 00:53:29,880
Speaker 1: am I talking about? January eighth, nineteen eighteen. It is

855
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:32,359
Speaker 1: the day that the sitting President of the United States

856
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:38,600
Speaker 1: at the time, Woodrow Wilson, decided to lay out a

857
00:53:38,640 --> 00:53:42,279
Speaker 1: blueprint of what the world could look like for the

858
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:47,239
Speaker 1: rest of the twentieth century as a way. Essentially, what

859
00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 1: it was was the speech that outlined which eventually would

860
00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:54,800
Speaker 1: become the twentieth century world order. So let's go back

861
00:53:56,760 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 1: to It's a moment when the United States tried and

862
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:04,280
Speaker 1: it wasn't the first time we tried it at the time,

863
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:06,200
Speaker 1: but it was the fierce time we tried it in

864
00:54:06,719 --> 00:54:10,200
Speaker 1: a more in its purest form, if you will, to

865
00:54:10,239 --> 00:54:14,080
Speaker 1: define what kind of global power we wanted to be.

866
00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:17,160
Speaker 1: And we didn't want to do it through conquest. We

867
00:54:17,200 --> 00:54:20,120
Speaker 1: didn't want it to do it through empire building. We

868
00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:22,840
Speaker 1: were trying to do it through ideas. And you have

869
00:54:22,880 --> 00:54:25,800
Speaker 1: to understand, you know, we had just seen the fall

870
00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:28,720
Speaker 1: of the Ottoman Empire, We had just seen the fall

871
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:32,560
Speaker 1: of other empires. We were still thinking in empire. We

872
00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:36,359
Speaker 1: had the Russian Revolution, it just sort of began and

873
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,359
Speaker 1: it was doing its own form of empire building, and

874
00:54:39,400 --> 00:54:41,640
Speaker 1: we were just as Woodrow Wilson making the case that

875
00:54:41,760 --> 00:54:46,080
Speaker 1: we shouldn't have any more empires. So it's January nineteen eighteen.

876
00:54:46,600 --> 00:54:49,520
Speaker 1: World War One is still raging. Millions have died from

877
00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:54,880
Speaker 1: this great war. Europe is physically shattered and psychologically exhausted.

878
00:54:55,560 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 1: Russia has just collapsed from its into its own way.

879
00:55:01,560 --> 00:55:04,080
Speaker 1: No one knows how the war's going to end or

880
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:08,160
Speaker 1: what replaces the old order when it does so. Into

881
00:55:08,200 --> 00:55:12,040
Speaker 1: that uncertainty stepped Woodrow Wilson, standing before a joint session

882
00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,279
Speaker 1: of Congress. This was no state of the Union. This

883
00:55:14,440 --> 00:55:17,719
Speaker 1: was a speech to a joint session. And what he

884
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:20,719
Speaker 1: delivers is not a battle plan. It's not even really

885
00:55:20,760 --> 00:55:24,000
Speaker 1: a peace plan. It is a vision, his vision and

886
00:55:24,040 --> 00:55:26,520
Speaker 1: how the world should work. And what's remarkable about it

887
00:55:26,560 --> 00:55:29,600
Speaker 1: is is it essentially was the blueprint.

888
00:55:30,560 --> 00:55:30,919
Speaker 2: The time.

889
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:33,440
Speaker 1: The speech was radical. Wilson's speech, what we now call

890
00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:38,160
Speaker 1: the Fourteen Points Speech, was radical not because it promised victory,

891
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:41,560
Speaker 1: but because it rejected the logic that had produced the

892
00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:46,080
Speaker 1: war in the first place. Europe had spent centuries operating

893
00:55:46,080 --> 00:55:50,239
Speaker 1: on the following premises, secret treaties, balance of power, politics,

894
00:55:50,360 --> 00:55:53,440
Speaker 1: imperial competition, spheres of influence.

895
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:54,239
Speaker 2: If you will, right.

896
00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:59,160
Speaker 1: Well, Wilson thought the system was obsolete and dangerous, and

897
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:01,839
Speaker 1: he opens with a direct shot at old diplomacy. He said,

898
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:05,520
Speaker 1: this open covenants of peace openly arrived at, after which

899
00:56:05,560 --> 00:56:09,600
Speaker 1: there shall be no private international understandings of any kind.

900
00:56:09,880 --> 00:56:13,680
Speaker 1: That sentence alone was considered revolutionary. There were there would

901
00:56:13,680 --> 00:56:17,239
Speaker 1: be no more secret deals, there'd be no more hidden clauses,

902
00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:21,239
Speaker 1: there'd be no alliances that quietly obligated nations to die

903
00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:26,640
Speaker 1: for decisions that were made behind closed doors. Wilson believed

904
00:56:26,640 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 1: secrecy is what caused World War One, these bizarre alliances

905
00:56:30,120 --> 00:56:32,560
Speaker 1: that force countries in the war that some of whom

906
00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:36,640
Speaker 1: didn't want to be in. So transparency, he believed, might

907
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:41,279
Speaker 1: have actually might prevent the next war. Yes, it's idealistic,

908
00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:45,839
Speaker 1: but hey, that was America. That is what it is

909
00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:49,279
Speaker 1: to be an American is to sometimes espouse the idealistic

910
00:56:49,760 --> 00:56:51,759
Speaker 1: and see if you can find a path close to it.

911
00:56:52,840 --> 00:56:57,000
Speaker 1: Immediately alarms. What's funny is that immediately his speech alarms

912
00:56:57,239 --> 00:57:00,879
Speaker 1: the European powers who have been living, thriving on these

913
00:57:00,920 --> 00:57:07,000
Speaker 1: secret arrangements. So the speech is called fourteen points, but

914
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:11,040
Speaker 1: really Wilson is advancing four big principles In this speech,

915
00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:15,480
Speaker 1: the biggest one is openness and transparency. This is the

916
00:57:15,520 --> 00:57:18,680
Speaker 1: moral core of Wilson. He argues that diplomacy should be

917
00:57:18,720 --> 00:57:22,760
Speaker 1: accountable not just to governments, but to people. How radical right.

918
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:26,160
Speaker 1: This is the first time a world leader frames foreign

919
00:57:26,200 --> 00:57:28,520
Speaker 1: policy is something that must be legitimate in the eyes

920
00:57:28,560 --> 00:57:32,840
Speaker 1: of the public, not just effective for elites, i e.

921
00:57:33,160 --> 00:57:36,600
Speaker 1: It can't just be transactional just for people in power.

922
00:57:37,400 --> 00:57:40,440
Speaker 1: Just because you get rich off of a deal President Trump,

923
00:57:40,520 --> 00:57:45,360
Speaker 1: doesn't mean it's necessarily good for America in nineteen eighteen.

924
00:57:45,560 --> 00:57:49,760
Speaker 1: That's a new idea because for much of the previous

925
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:52,920
Speaker 1: century the world worked the way Donald Trump wants the

926
00:57:52,920 --> 00:57:57,360
Speaker 1: world to work today. The second big idea is economic

927
00:57:57,440 --> 00:58:04,040
Speaker 1: interdependence ah and to economic internationalism, not economic nationalism. So

928
00:58:04,080 --> 00:58:06,600
Speaker 1: Wilson calls for free trade, freedom of the seas, and

929
00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:11,840
Speaker 1: equal economic access all right, not outcomes, just access. He

930
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:14,320
Speaker 1: says this in the speech, the removal, so far as possible,

931
00:58:14,320 --> 00:58:17,920
Speaker 1: of all economic barriers and the establishment of equality of

932
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:22,320
Speaker 1: trade conditions among all the nations consenting to the peace,

933
00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:27,720
Speaker 1: free trade for those that want peace. This is the

934
00:58:27,760 --> 00:58:33,760
Speaker 1: intellectual ancestor of globalization, the idea that shared prosperity makes

935
00:58:34,120 --> 00:58:38,560
Speaker 1: war irrational. There's a lot of truthiness to this, and

936
00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:41,440
Speaker 1: what happens when you have When the biggest country on

937
00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:45,640
Speaker 1: earth decides to pursue economic nationalism, so does everybody else.

938
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:51,160
Speaker 1: And that's why I have my opening monologue in this episode,

939
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:54,400
Speaker 1: which is twenty twenty six, the year we're living dangerously.

940
00:58:55,640 --> 00:58:58,919
Speaker 1: Back to Wilson, he's betting that capitalism plus rules will

941
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:03,360
Speaker 1: equal peace. Yes, it's idealistic, but guess what it is

942
00:59:03,400 --> 00:59:06,000
Speaker 1: the whole point of who we are and what we

943
00:59:06,080 --> 00:59:08,720
Speaker 1: claim that we want to be. It's a bet that

944
00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:13,280
Speaker 1: the twentieth century keeps making with frankly mixed results. Though

945
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:15,720
Speaker 1: it had been it was really good for the free world.

946
00:59:16,760 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 1: Third point of his speech was self determination. This may

947
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:21,640
Speaker 1: be the most explosive idea in the speech.

948
00:59:21,720 --> 00:59:22,160
Speaker 2: At the time.

949
00:59:22,440 --> 00:59:25,000
Speaker 1: Wilson is arguing that people, not empires, should decide their

950
00:59:25,040 --> 00:59:29,240
Speaker 1: political futures. Not everybody has embraced democracy in nineteen eighteen. Okay,

951
00:59:29,880 --> 00:59:35,080
Speaker 1: borders should reflect identity, language, and consent. This line electrifies Europe.

952
00:59:35,200 --> 00:59:38,800
Speaker 1: It also quietly terrifies the imperial powers, because once you

953
00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:42,320
Speaker 1: say self determination, you can't easily limit it to Europeans.

954
00:59:42,840 --> 00:59:43,400
Speaker 2: Colonize.

955
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:45,520
Speaker 1: Peoples in Africa, Asia and the Middle East are listening

956
00:59:45,600 --> 00:59:50,560
Speaker 1: quite closely and noticing in what parts of the world

957
00:59:50,600 --> 00:59:55,600
Speaker 1: Wilson has chosen to stay silent. A League of Nations.

958
00:59:56,280 --> 00:59:58,600
Speaker 1: The final point is the most important one. Right Wilson

959
00:59:58,640 --> 01:00:02,000
Speaker 1: proposes a general association of nations must be formed for

960
01:00:02,040 --> 01:00:05,440
Speaker 1: the purpose of affording mutual guarantees of political independence and

961
01:00:05,560 --> 01:00:10,800
Speaker 1: territorial integrity to great and small states alike. This is

962
01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:14,680
Speaker 1: the heart of Wilsonianism. This is something the right. There

963
01:00:14,720 --> 01:00:17,720
Speaker 1: are elements of the right that have hated Wilson. If

964
01:00:17,760 --> 01:00:19,960
Speaker 1: those of you remember, Glenn Beck has been obsessed with

965
01:00:20,040 --> 01:00:23,680
Speaker 1: being an anti Wilsonian for years. It's because of this right.

966
01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:27,320
Speaker 1: It's the fear of a global world order. It's the

967
01:00:27,360 --> 01:00:31,840
Speaker 1: fear that America is it exceptional compared to everybody else

968
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:34,440
Speaker 1: on Earth. Our ideas are exceptional compared to a lot

969
01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:37,840
Speaker 1: of people on Earth. But you don't accept the premise

970
01:00:38,960 --> 01:00:41,760
Speaker 1: that we all should have equal access.

971
01:00:41,360 --> 01:00:43,720
Speaker 2: To the opportunity that we want.

972
01:00:45,480 --> 01:00:49,520
Speaker 1: So there's been a fight over Wilsonianism for over one

973
01:00:49,560 --> 01:00:53,080
Speaker 1: hundred years, ever since he said it. He believed in

974
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:56,960
Speaker 1: collective security, permanent diplomacy, and an international body designed not

975
01:00:56,960 --> 01:00:59,600
Speaker 1: to win wars, but to simply prevent them. It is

976
01:00:59,640 --> 01:01:02,480
Speaker 1: the filosophical foundation of the United Nations, NATO, and the

977
01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:05,560
Speaker 1: post World War iiO Liberal Order nineteen eighteen. Though it

978
01:01:05,600 --> 01:01:09,680
Speaker 1: was just an idea. Now, look, we're going to get

979
01:01:09,720 --> 01:01:12,000
Speaker 1: to the different comparisons. I mean, I think in the

980
01:01:12,040 --> 01:01:16,680
Speaker 1: Wilsonian idealistic mindset, you know, those that would be in

981
01:01:16,720 --> 01:01:18,880
Speaker 1: this League of Nations had to actually agree to these

982
01:01:18,920 --> 01:01:21,880
Speaker 1: principles of freedom, of democracy, of power to the people.

983
01:01:22,600 --> 01:01:25,040
Speaker 1: I think the flaw in the United Nations is accepting

984
01:01:25,120 --> 01:01:27,680
Speaker 1: any country no matter how they treat their people. But

985
01:01:28,120 --> 01:01:31,840
Speaker 1: I digress. So why was the world listening? And here

986
01:01:31,880 --> 01:01:33,680
Speaker 1: why did the speech matter so much? Well, here's why

987
01:01:33,680 --> 01:01:36,840
Speaker 1: it mattered so much. Wilson isn't speaking as a defeated

988
01:01:36,880 --> 01:01:40,480
Speaker 1: power or a desperate one. Right, the United States enters

989
01:01:40,520 --> 01:01:45,360
Speaker 1: World War One late, our economy is booming, our cities

990
01:01:45,360 --> 01:01:49,120
Speaker 1: are intact, our population has not been traumatized the way

991
01:01:49,160 --> 01:01:54,480
Speaker 1: Europe's was. Wilson wanted to position America not as a conqueror,

992
01:01:55,280 --> 01:01:57,840
Speaker 1: but as an arbiter. He says, this what we seek

993
01:01:57,880 --> 01:01:59,840
Speaker 1: is the reign of law based upon the consent of

994
01:01:59,840 --> 01:02:04,560
Speaker 1: the governed. Practice what we preach. Right now, Look, we

995
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:06,720
Speaker 1: hadn't We weren't a perfect union in nineteen eighteen. Not

996
01:02:06,760 --> 01:02:08,480
Speaker 1: everybody had the right to vote nineteen eighteen. So I

997
01:02:08,520 --> 01:02:11,680
Speaker 1: don't want to I don't want to sugarcoat that, but

998
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:15,000
Speaker 1: we certainly were trying to build a more perfect union.

999
01:02:15,520 --> 01:02:18,440
Speaker 1: And in that principle was one that Wilson was articulating

1000
01:02:18,920 --> 01:02:23,280
Speaker 1: for the world. And the line landed to exhausted Europeans.

1001
01:02:23,320 --> 01:02:27,000
Speaker 1: Wilson sounded like the future to small nations. He also

1002
01:02:27,040 --> 01:02:31,800
Speaker 1: sounded like a protector to old empires. He sounded like

1003
01:02:31,840 --> 01:02:38,080
Speaker 1: a threat. So let's fast forward to nineteen nineteen. Right,

1004
01:02:38,120 --> 01:02:39,960
Speaker 1: this is a year after he gives the famous speech.

1005
01:02:40,760 --> 01:02:44,160
Speaker 1: The war is over, the Paris Peace Conference begins, and

1006
01:02:44,200 --> 01:02:47,760
Speaker 1: this is where Wilson's vision collides with power politics. France

1007
01:02:47,760 --> 01:02:52,360
Speaker 1: wants Germany Weekend permanently. Britain wants to preserve it's empire

1008
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:57,360
Speaker 1: whatever was left. Italy wants territory. Everyone wants guarantees. Wilson

1009
01:02:57,400 --> 01:03:01,080
Speaker 1: wants principles. He famously says there must not be a

1010
01:03:01,120 --> 01:03:04,800
Speaker 1: balance of power, but a community of power. I know

1011
01:03:04,960 --> 01:03:07,800
Speaker 1: it sounds naive, but my gosh, it's good to know.

1012
01:03:07,880 --> 01:03:10,920
Speaker 1: Somebody tried. But Paris is not a seminar. It's a

1013
01:03:10,920 --> 01:03:14,960
Speaker 1: negotiation among traumatized nations. The result is the Treaty of Versailles,

1014
01:03:15,040 --> 01:03:19,480
Speaker 1: which of course essentially signs the death warrant for so

1015
01:03:19,600 --> 01:03:23,360
Speaker 1: many because it helps bring upon World War two. Germany

1016
01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:26,560
Speaker 1: is punished, borders are redrawn in perfectly, self determination is

1017
01:03:26,600 --> 01:03:29,120
Speaker 1: applied inconsistently, Resentment is baked.

1018
01:03:28,840 --> 01:03:29,480
Speaker 2: Into the peace.

1019
01:03:30,800 --> 01:03:33,600
Speaker 1: All Wilson got was an agreement on the lega Nations,

1020
01:03:34,200 --> 01:03:37,000
Speaker 1: but it was at a steep cost elsewhere. And of

1021
01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:41,200
Speaker 1: course the ultimate irony was the United States. The country

1022
01:03:41,200 --> 01:03:45,800
Speaker 1: that proposed said League of Nations never joins it. The

1023
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:50,160
Speaker 1: Senate rejects the treaty. Isolationism wins. Wilson campaigns for it anyway,

1024
01:03:50,280 --> 01:03:53,960
Speaker 1: he collapses from a stroke. It looks like it's all

1025
01:03:54,000 --> 01:03:58,040
Speaker 1: over America invents modern international idealism and walks away from it.

1026
01:03:58,160 --> 01:04:01,080
Speaker 1: Such an American thing to do, sometimes right, This is

1027
01:04:01,120 --> 01:04:04,440
Speaker 1: the moment, though, that the world something learns something lasting

1028
01:04:04,440 --> 01:04:09,000
Speaker 1: about the United States. American leadership is powerful, but it

1029
01:04:09,080 --> 01:04:16,800
Speaker 1: is not always permanent, and the American people sometimes don't

1030
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:23,320
Speaker 1: always follow the path that a leader wants them to take. Anyway,

1031
01:04:23,400 --> 01:04:26,240
Speaker 1: It's an important speech because you could argue every major

1032
01:04:26,280 --> 01:04:29,680
Speaker 1: global debate that we have today traces back to this speech.

1033
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:37,280
Speaker 1: Ukraine that self determination versus spheres of influence, Venezuela, same thing, Taiwan,

1034
01:04:37,920 --> 01:04:42,280
Speaker 1: same thing. So look, it's an important speech.

1035
01:04:45,240 --> 01:04:49,880
Speaker 2: Which row Wilson. I know, there's there is.

1036
01:04:51,360 --> 01:04:57,840
Speaker 1: Plenty of stuff and plenty of his political views that

1037
01:04:57,840 --> 01:05:01,200
Speaker 1: are a little that are terrible. I think he was

1038
01:05:01,720 --> 01:05:06,320
Speaker 1: He dabbled in eugenics. He certainly was an avowed racist.

1039
01:05:06,960 --> 01:05:09,920
Speaker 1: A lot of Americans were avowed racist back then, Teddy Roosevelt,

1040
01:05:10,920 --> 01:05:15,000
Speaker 1: there were quite a few. But this is why you

1041
01:05:15,040 --> 01:05:20,160
Speaker 1: got to be careful of a racing history. Every political

1042
01:05:20,200 --> 01:05:23,520
Speaker 1: leader in America has had good and bad. The question

1043
01:05:23,560 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 1: is how much of the good outweighed the bad, how

1044
01:05:25,080 --> 01:05:26,760
Speaker 1: much of the bad outweigh the good. That's a debate

1045
01:05:26,800 --> 01:05:31,560
Speaker 1: that sometimes lasts forever with certain presidents, others not so much.

1046
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:33,680
Speaker 1: But the bottom line is.

1047
01:05:35,000 --> 01:05:37,000
Speaker 2: The world you know, the.

1048
01:05:39,240 --> 01:05:43,880
Speaker 1: World order that did keep relative peace in the twentieth century,

1049
01:05:43,920 --> 01:05:51,120
Speaker 1: that essentially gave America soft power. One could argue it

1050
01:05:51,360 --> 01:05:57,720
Speaker 1: was Wilson himself that helped build it, and it sparked

1051
01:05:57,760 --> 01:06:00,520
Speaker 1: the idea that helped build the mechanism that gave us

1052
01:06:01,720 --> 01:06:07,120
Speaker 1: the soft power advantage that we've all benefited from. And

1053
01:06:08,280 --> 01:06:10,959
Speaker 1: we can find flaws in this system that have hurt

1054
01:06:11,040 --> 01:06:16,080
Speaker 1: certain communities at different times, but the overall trajectory for

1055
01:06:16,120 --> 01:06:20,959
Speaker 1: this country has been positive. Taking all of that away, completely,

1056
01:06:21,000 --> 01:06:27,200
Speaker 1: reversing everything we've pursued over the last hundred years puts

1057
01:06:27,240 --> 01:06:29,800
Speaker 1: America in a place that I think we are not

1058
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:33,320
Speaker 1: going to like anyway.

1059
01:06:33,360 --> 01:06:33,960
Speaker 2: There's your.

1060
01:06:35,960 --> 01:06:40,000
Speaker 1: There's your time machine for the week. Wilson's fourteen point speech.

1061
01:06:40,520 --> 01:06:42,720
Speaker 1: If you've never read it, go take a look. It's

1062
01:06:42,760 --> 01:06:47,959
Speaker 1: amazing how both pressure it was and at the same

1063
01:06:48,040 --> 01:06:50,720
Speaker 1: time how naive it could sound, and at the same

1064
01:06:50,800 --> 01:06:56,200
Speaker 1: time how kind of a bummer it is. That there's

1065
01:06:56,480 --> 01:06:59,520
Speaker 1: we're not really having any good debates like this today.

1066
01:07:00,040 --> 01:07:00,920
Speaker 1: Will be nice to fee there.

1067
01:07:09,800 --> 01:07:12,520
Speaker 2: All right, let's do a little Ask Chuck, Ask Chuck.

1068
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:18,840
Speaker 2: Remember Ask Chuck.

1069
01:07:19,200 --> 01:07:22,760
Speaker 1: You can email any questions to ask Chuck at vchucktodcast

1070
01:07:22,800 --> 01:07:25,560
Speaker 1: dot com. You can do it in the comments section

1071
01:07:25,640 --> 01:07:26,280
Speaker 1: of YouTube.

1072
01:07:26,320 --> 01:07:27,160
Speaker 2: You can do it.

1073
01:07:28,120 --> 01:07:32,280
Speaker 1: We will take a look at the replies and acts

1074
01:07:32,320 --> 01:07:34,960
Speaker 1: and Instagram and Facebook. It's a little harder to get

1075
01:07:34,960 --> 01:07:37,080
Speaker 1: those questions, but you want to leave questions there.

1076
01:07:37,160 --> 01:07:39,800
Speaker 2: Great. We really encourage.

1077
01:07:39,360 --> 01:07:42,680
Speaker 1: You to to so that we actually see these questions,

1078
01:07:42,680 --> 01:07:44,680
Speaker 1: to send them to ask Chuck at the Chuck podcast

1079
01:07:45,760 --> 01:07:48,720
Speaker 1: dot com. And with that, let's get into a few questions.

1080
01:07:50,320 --> 01:07:52,280
Speaker 1: I'm gonna read these first two straight up and then

1081
01:07:52,320 --> 01:07:54,720
Speaker 1: respond to both of them collective. They're both about Minneapolis.

1082
01:07:55,560 --> 01:07:57,840
Speaker 1: Number one, loving the fired up Chuck Todd this morning. Amen,

1083
01:07:57,880 --> 01:07:59,840
Speaker 1: everything you said on the podcast, Thank you for speaking.

1084
01:08:00,200 --> 01:08:02,120
Speaker 1: We need more voices of reason like yours right now.

1085
01:08:02,920 --> 01:08:05,240
Speaker 1: Pat Ps, I live in Minneapolis. Of the episode hit

1086
01:08:05,360 --> 01:08:08,440
Speaker 1: especially close to home. Here's another comment, Chuck, thank you

1087
01:08:08,480 --> 01:08:10,400
Speaker 1: from the bottom of my heart for today's secial episode

1088
01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:12,960
Speaker 1: on ice in Minneapolis. I'm heartbroken for my city. I'm

1089
01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:14,960
Speaker 1: terrified Trump will use this as an excuse to come

1090
01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:17,960
Speaker 1: in stronger and destroy our kindness. Please keep using your

1091
01:08:17,960 --> 01:08:20,000
Speaker 1: platform for this truth bomb. I appreciate you so much.

1092
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:25,759
Speaker 1: All the best, Kim. Look, it's why I spend some time.

1093
01:08:26,640 --> 01:08:31,040
Speaker 1: I hope you've digested the Ruby Ridge comparison. You know

1094
01:08:31,439 --> 01:08:35,720
Speaker 1: everybody wants to quickly put everybody's reaction to Minneapolis in

1095
01:08:35,800 --> 01:08:39,080
Speaker 1: a left prism or a right prism. I'm here, what

1096
01:08:39,240 --> 01:08:42,280
Speaker 1: is right and what is wrong. All I am begging

1097
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:48,040
Speaker 1: our elected officials to do is to put themselves in

1098
01:08:48,120 --> 01:08:52,000
Speaker 1: the shoes of Renee Good when they want to protest

1099
01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:55,360
Speaker 1: a policy they don't agree with. Do they think responding

1100
01:08:55,360 --> 01:09:01,799
Speaker 1: with lethal force is the right answer here? Political views

1101
01:09:02,120 --> 01:09:06,240
Speaker 1: should not justify violence in the United States of America.

1102
01:09:06,760 --> 01:09:09,799
Speaker 1: We have constitutional rights for a reason.

1103
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:13,360
Speaker 2: All right.

1104
01:09:13,520 --> 01:09:17,880
Speaker 1: Next question comes from Scott L. Navy veteran Jacksonville, Florida.

1105
01:09:18,240 --> 01:09:19,720
Speaker 1: He goes, I got a couple of questions I've been

1106
01:09:19,760 --> 01:09:21,519
Speaker 1: mulling over. First, I can't help but wonder why the

1107
01:09:21,560 --> 01:09:24,360
Speaker 1: US hasn't taken stronger action to remove the leader of Haiti.

1108
01:09:24,400 --> 01:09:26,080
Speaker 1: Does it all come down to a lack of strategic

1109
01:09:26,120 --> 01:09:29,599
Speaker 1: interest like oil? And Second, do you think Rob Emmanuel

1110
01:09:29,600 --> 01:09:31,640
Speaker 1: could realistically pose a challenge to Gavin Newsom for the

1111
01:09:31,680 --> 01:09:36,160
Speaker 1: Democratic presidential nomination? And Scott wants to head also says

1112
01:09:36,240 --> 01:09:40,240
Speaker 1: hashtag Maybe veteran from Jacksonville, Florida, you should also say

1113
01:09:40,320 --> 01:09:44,200
Speaker 1: Jaguar fail. Right, It's a let's hope this is a

1114
01:09:47,040 --> 01:09:50,200
Speaker 1: that the Jaguars can get some positive vibes in the

1115
01:09:50,280 --> 01:09:54,800
Speaker 1: NFL playoffs. And I am fully I will admit I

1116
01:09:54,880 --> 01:09:58,240
Speaker 1: am responding to this question in the middle of said game.

1117
01:09:59,200 --> 01:10:05,080
Speaker 1: But I digress. I'm with you on Haiti, right, I,

1118
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:10,479
Speaker 1: and you're I have a your your initial cynicism is

1119
01:10:10,520 --> 01:10:11,240
Speaker 1: my cynicism.

1120
01:10:11,320 --> 01:10:11,439
Speaker 2: Right.

1121
01:10:11,479 --> 01:10:15,479
Speaker 1: If there was a natural resource that was seen as

1122
01:10:15,840 --> 01:10:19,800
Speaker 1: incredibly important in the United States, do I think we'd

1123
01:10:19,800 --> 01:10:22,839
Speaker 1: be taking a stronger hand in Haiti? I would that, said.

1124
01:10:25,200 --> 01:10:25,559
Speaker 2: Man.

1125
01:10:25,920 --> 01:10:30,400
Speaker 1: Presidents of both parties have screwed up Haiti. It has

1126
01:10:30,439 --> 01:10:34,080
Speaker 1: been a hard thing to get at the right. There's

1127
01:10:34,120 --> 01:10:41,400
Speaker 1: we've we don't seem to ever get Haiti right, you know,

1128
01:10:41,439 --> 01:10:43,400
Speaker 1: you look, it's one of those you know. One of

1129
01:10:43,439 --> 01:10:47,320
Speaker 1: the great mysteries to me is this island of Hispaniola, right,

1130
01:10:47,439 --> 01:10:50,679
Speaker 1: this mountain range that separates the Dominican Republic from Haiti,

1131
01:10:50,720 --> 01:10:53,559
Speaker 1: and the Dominican Republic is in one of these great

1132
01:10:53,640 --> 01:10:56,559
Speaker 1: tourist spots, one of the great place many Americans I

1133
01:10:56,600 --> 01:10:58,840
Speaker 1: know love going to the Dominican have a great time.

1134
01:10:59,280 --> 01:11:03,240
Speaker 1: Such a great stable country, producer of incredible baseball talent,

1135
01:11:03,320 --> 01:11:06,479
Speaker 1: and all sorts of other things. We you know, most

1136
01:11:06,520 --> 01:11:09,960
Speaker 1: of the if you're a cigar smoker, your favorite cigars,

1137
01:11:10,000 --> 01:11:12,160
Speaker 1: many of them are rolled in and grown in the

1138
01:11:12,160 --> 01:11:15,679
Speaker 1: tobacco grown in the Dominican and yet this mountain range

1139
01:11:16,040 --> 01:11:18,479
Speaker 1: and we have and then you have Haiti like it

1140
01:11:18,720 --> 01:11:21,799
Speaker 1: just it's it's it's heartbreaking. As somebody grew up in Miami,

1141
01:11:21,800 --> 01:11:26,040
Speaker 1: the whole thing is heartbreaking, and it's it's it's an

1142
01:11:26,120 --> 01:11:30,720
Speaker 1: amazing culture. The Haitian culture, art culture, food cultures is

1143
01:11:30,840 --> 01:11:33,679
Speaker 1: just it's a real treat if you've if you've never

1144
01:11:33,720 --> 01:11:35,880
Speaker 1: experienced it, and I highly encourage.

1145
01:11:35,520 --> 01:11:39,519
Speaker 2: It, but I've been.

1146
01:11:43,080 --> 01:11:46,000
Speaker 1: You know, this decision to outsource, you know, it's weird

1147
01:11:46,400 --> 01:11:48,880
Speaker 1: if if we're gonna are we going to cherry pick

1148
01:11:49,240 --> 01:11:53,519
Speaker 1: what's America first in the hemisphere? Right, Look, instability in

1149
01:11:53,560 --> 01:11:57,080
Speaker 1: Haiti is not good for stability in South Florida. You know,

1150
01:11:57,680 --> 01:12:00,559
Speaker 1: Instability in Haiti is not good for stability in the Caribbean.

1151
01:12:00,760 --> 01:12:03,360
Speaker 1: Instabilitying the Caribbean is not good for the United States.

1152
01:12:03,479 --> 01:12:06,840
Speaker 1: So I think we need to figure out how to

1153
01:12:06,880 --> 01:12:11,439
Speaker 1: be a better a better partner here in Haiti. But look,

1154
01:12:11,479 --> 01:12:15,960
Speaker 1: there's a lot of corruption. The gang issue has been

1155
01:12:16,439 --> 01:12:20,960
Speaker 1: you know, and is sending the US military the answer? Right, Like,

1156
01:12:21,080 --> 01:12:29,840
Speaker 1: is that really gonna work? The outsourcing to Kenya, I

1157
01:12:29,880 --> 01:12:32,879
Speaker 1: know there's been some concern that their rules of engagement

1158
01:12:32,880 --> 01:12:35,080
Speaker 1: are not the same as maybe what the United States

1159
01:12:35,600 --> 01:12:37,880
Speaker 1: or what other American militaries would use.

1160
01:12:38,800 --> 01:12:40,080
Speaker 2: So it is.

1161
01:12:42,240 --> 01:12:45,120
Speaker 1: I suspect we'll turn our focus to Haiti after we're

1162
01:12:45,160 --> 01:12:48,000
Speaker 1: done focusing on Venezuela and Cuba. And who's to say

1163
01:12:48,040 --> 01:12:53,639
Speaker 1: that even happens at all. But let me add one

1164
01:12:53,680 --> 01:12:57,120
Speaker 1: more cynical response to your question there, Scott, which is,

1165
01:12:57,840 --> 01:13:03,800
Speaker 1: if the Haitian political community had more political power in

1166
01:13:03,880 --> 01:13:08,160
Speaker 1: South Florida, would South Florida members of Congress care more

1167
01:13:08,160 --> 01:13:11,120
Speaker 1: about the issue itself and bring that attention right. The

1168
01:13:11,280 --> 01:13:15,160
Speaker 1: reason Venezuela is on top of the president's agenda, the

1169
01:13:15,200 --> 01:13:18,200
Speaker 1: reason Cuba's near the top of the president's agenda because

1170
01:13:18,240 --> 01:13:21,479
Speaker 1: Marco Ruby has made sure it has. Haiti's not a

1171
01:13:21,479 --> 01:13:24,360
Speaker 1: priority for him. So therefore Haiti hasn't been a priority

1172
01:13:24,360 --> 01:13:28,160
Speaker 1: for Donald Trump. So that would be another aspect of this.

1173
01:13:28,840 --> 01:13:32,040
Speaker 1: But unstable Haiti is bad for not just Haiti, but

1174
01:13:32,080 --> 01:13:33,960
Speaker 1: it's bad for the United States, it's bad for South Florida,

1175
01:13:33,960 --> 01:13:38,200
Speaker 1: it's bad for the Caribbean. But it does feel as

1176
01:13:38,240 --> 01:13:41,680
Speaker 1: if this shouldn't be an American alone answer, right, you know,

1177
01:13:41,720 --> 01:13:43,640
Speaker 1: we need the help of everybody in the Caribbean on

1178
01:13:43,680 --> 01:13:48,600
Speaker 1: this one. As for your question on Rob Emmanuel. I'm

1179
01:13:48,640 --> 01:13:56,519
Speaker 1: skeptical that either Ram or Gavin. Look, I don't know

1180
01:13:56,560 --> 01:13:57,439
Speaker 1: how much you know.

1181
01:13:57,520 --> 01:13:58,280
Speaker 2: I look at this.

1182
01:14:00,160 --> 01:14:03,960
Speaker 1: Is is Gavin Newsome the tortoise of the hair right

1183
01:14:04,000 --> 01:14:05,760
Speaker 1: if you want to use that. He looks like a

1184
01:14:05,800 --> 01:14:09,880
Speaker 1: hair to me, he's raced out in front by being

1185
01:14:09,920 --> 01:14:12,519
Speaker 1: the guy that will take on Trump. But I'm not

1186
01:14:12,560 --> 01:14:14,400
Speaker 1: sure being the guy that takes on Trump is the

1187
01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:18,320
Speaker 1: number one thing Democratic primary voters are going to want

1188
01:14:18,520 --> 01:14:21,000
Speaker 1: in January of twenty twenty eight. It may be what

1189
01:14:21,040 --> 01:14:23,320
Speaker 1: they want right now because Donald Trump is the threat

1190
01:14:23,360 --> 01:14:28,519
Speaker 1: that's in front of them. So you're asking me, I

1191
01:14:28,560 --> 01:14:30,960
Speaker 1: don't stand with the premise. I don't view Gavin as

1192
01:14:31,000 --> 01:14:34,479
Speaker 1: the front run I view Gavin as sort of being

1193
01:14:34,760 --> 01:14:37,800
Speaker 1: the chief anti Trump spokesperson for the party right now,

1194
01:14:37,840 --> 01:14:40,320
Speaker 1: who's got the most credibility with the base of the party,

1195
01:14:41,000 --> 01:14:44,240
Speaker 1: being the anti Trumper. But I'm not sure I see

1196
01:14:44,280 --> 01:14:47,240
Speaker 1: him as I don't equate that with presidential front runner

1197
01:14:47,240 --> 01:14:49,160
Speaker 1: status that I know with polling shows, but I don't

1198
01:14:49,200 --> 01:14:52,640
Speaker 1: think it's there yet. That's for Rom Emmanuel, you know,

1199
01:14:53,200 --> 01:14:56,599
Speaker 1: I tell you his his tenure in Chicago's aging. Well,

1200
01:14:56,640 --> 01:14:58,960
Speaker 1: we're about to have our second straight one term mayor

1201
01:14:58,960 --> 01:15:02,439
Speaker 1: in Chicago's the last two term mayor. So while you

1202
01:15:02,479 --> 01:15:07,040
Speaker 1: could argue that he didn't solve the problem with gangs

1203
01:15:07,080 --> 01:15:09,439
Speaker 1: in that city, and he didn't get at some of

1204
01:15:09,479 --> 01:15:12,360
Speaker 1: the sort of intractable problems that the daily machine had

1205
01:15:12,360 --> 01:15:14,960
Speaker 1: never been able to deal with, let alone wrong, he

1206
01:15:15,040 --> 01:15:17,120
Speaker 1: certainly seemed to manage the city a heck of a

1207
01:15:17,120 --> 01:15:19,479
Speaker 1: lot better than the two more liberal replacements that have

1208
01:15:19,560 --> 01:15:24,120
Speaker 1: had so I do think his tenure in Chicago is

1209
01:15:24,160 --> 01:15:25,040
Speaker 1: aging better.

1210
01:15:24,880 --> 01:15:25,679
Speaker 2: By the month.

1211
01:15:26,200 --> 01:15:32,479
Speaker 1: When it comes to the most recent mayors. You know,

1212
01:15:32,880 --> 01:15:36,640
Speaker 1: it's interesting will the next Democratic nominee. Can you be

1213
01:15:36,880 --> 01:15:39,840
Speaker 1: completely at war with the progressive left and get the

1214
01:15:39,880 --> 01:15:43,320
Speaker 1: Democratic nomination or do you need to accommodate the progressive

1215
01:15:43,360 --> 01:15:49,000
Speaker 1: left somewhere? And I think that the likely nominee is

1216
01:15:49,040 --> 01:15:51,760
Speaker 1: going to be somebody that isn't antagonistic to any wing

1217
01:15:51,840 --> 01:15:54,559
Speaker 1: of the party, but is seen as somebody who can

1218
01:15:54,640 --> 01:16:01,760
Speaker 1: quote unquote Win. I'm not sure rom can escape what

1219
01:16:01,960 --> 01:16:05,680
Speaker 1: will be a ferocious progressive left. And he may be

1220
01:16:05,760 --> 01:16:08,559
Speaker 1: the person they choose to take down almost as symbol,

1221
01:16:09,640 --> 01:16:11,960
Speaker 1: but he may serve an important you know, he may

1222
01:16:12,400 --> 01:16:18,000
Speaker 1: his candidacy may matter a lot because it forces conversations

1223
01:16:18,000 --> 01:16:22,120
Speaker 1: in the democratic debate that maybe others aren't having. I

1224
01:16:22,160 --> 01:16:26,639
Speaker 1: think his commentary on school reform has been quite strong.

1225
01:16:26,880 --> 01:16:31,640
Speaker 1: You should take a look at it. And yes, you

1226
01:16:31,640 --> 01:16:34,879
Speaker 1: could say his record in Chicago's mixed on school reform,

1227
01:16:35,439 --> 01:16:38,200
Speaker 1: but you know he's speaking with a clarity when it

1228
01:16:38,200 --> 01:16:40,639
Speaker 1: comes to social media and how much that's harming our kids.

1229
01:16:40,960 --> 01:16:42,760
Speaker 1: He's calling for the full ban of social media for

1230
01:16:42,800 --> 01:16:45,639
Speaker 1: anybody under the age of sixteen, really treating social media

1231
01:16:45,760 --> 01:16:50,599
Speaker 1: like smoking. I think he is going to be an

1232
01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:54,679
Speaker 1: important voice. I am skeptical that either Newsome or rom

1233
01:16:54,760 --> 01:16:59,000
Speaker 1: can overcome some of the negatives that I think will

1234
01:16:59,000 --> 01:17:03,040
Speaker 1: get exposed in a prime on that front. Next question

1235
01:17:03,080 --> 01:17:06,640
Speaker 1: comes from Adam from Wilton Manors, Florida. Hey, do you

1236
01:17:06,640 --> 01:17:09,240
Speaker 1: think an attack on Columbia or the arrest of President

1237
01:17:09,280 --> 01:17:11,920
Speaker 1: Petro would be a mistake for the administration. Columbia isn't

1238
01:17:11,960 --> 01:17:14,880
Speaker 1: like Iran or Venezuela. Americans live, work, and retire there.

1239
01:17:15,000 --> 01:17:17,280
Speaker 1: There are over fifty daily US flights or military has

1240
01:17:17,280 --> 01:17:20,040
Speaker 1: helped train Theirs, and their defense is strong. Any misstep

1241
01:17:20,080 --> 01:17:22,960
Speaker 1: to turn public sentiment against Americans and put are citizens

1242
01:17:22,960 --> 01:17:26,520
Speaker 1: at risk. President emboldened by the Venezuela operation might underestimate

1243
01:17:26,520 --> 01:17:30,480
Speaker 1: the fallout. Also, what if there were no smartphones or podcasts?

1244
01:17:30,800 --> 01:17:33,600
Speaker 1: Where would you be today? I love it? Thanks for

1245
01:17:33,640 --> 01:17:36,519
Speaker 1: the great podcast. Glad you're an independent Adam from Wilton Manors.

1246
01:17:39,040 --> 01:17:41,719
Speaker 1: Well then we would all be trying to write letters

1247
01:17:41,760 --> 01:17:44,519
Speaker 1: to the editor. Right, we'd go back to there if

1248
01:17:44,560 --> 01:17:48,439
Speaker 1: there were no if there were no smartphones or podcasts,

1249
01:17:49,439 --> 01:17:52,880
Speaker 1: Imagine there's no people. Sorry, now I'm starting to make

1250
01:17:52,920 --> 01:17:54,760
Speaker 1: me think we should start singing. Imagine.

1251
01:17:55,400 --> 01:17:55,840
Speaker 2: I don't know.

1252
01:17:56,680 --> 01:17:59,200
Speaker 1: Is that going to cost my That may cost me

1253
01:17:59,320 --> 01:18:02,000
Speaker 1: a lot of money to even sing that that rights

1254
01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:04,479
Speaker 1: Paul McCartney will beating down my door. I don't know

1255
01:18:04,520 --> 01:18:07,320
Speaker 1: who has the rights to imagine is that Yoko has

1256
01:18:07,360 --> 01:18:12,639
Speaker 1: the rights? But anyway, but I digress. Look, you you

1257
01:18:12,720 --> 01:18:14,880
Speaker 1: surface an issue that I'm worried about, which is the

1258
01:18:16,040 --> 01:18:22,760
Speaker 1: tactical event that extracted Maduro out of Venezuela was a

1259
01:18:22,840 --> 01:18:28,559
Speaker 1: huge success, was in a very effective military operation.

1260
01:18:28,720 --> 01:18:29,280
Speaker 2: Hardstop.

1261
01:18:30,560 --> 01:18:34,600
Speaker 1: Does that give the president comfort that he can just

1262
01:18:34,680 --> 01:18:38,479
Speaker 1: do this more willing nilly? I do fear he is

1263
01:18:38,640 --> 01:18:41,680
Speaker 1: going that he is going to accept more risk with

1264
01:18:41,720 --> 01:18:45,360
Speaker 1: his decisions than ever before. Right, and he's already been

1265
01:18:45,360 --> 01:18:48,759
Speaker 1: doing this what would have been seen as politically risky,

1266
01:18:48,880 --> 01:18:52,599
Speaker 1: pardoning everybody that participated in January sixth, he just went

1267
01:18:52,640 --> 01:18:56,879
Speaker 1: ahead and did it, pardoning the you know, a narco,

1268
01:18:58,520 --> 01:19:01,240
Speaker 1: you know, pardoning a former president of a country who

1269
01:19:01,320 --> 01:19:06,120
Speaker 1: was accused by his own justice department. And I remembers

1270
01:19:06,120 --> 01:19:08,920
Speaker 1: Trump's justice department that indicted the former president of Honduras

1271
01:19:09,240 --> 01:19:15,960
Speaker 1: on drug charges. The fact that he pardoned him, and

1272
01:19:16,000 --> 01:19:18,639
Speaker 1: there's been no consequences, right, So, you know, he keeps,

1273
01:19:19,240 --> 01:19:21,760
Speaker 1: he keeps, you know, use the third rail, whatever you

1274
01:19:21,800 --> 01:19:24,120
Speaker 1: want to call it, keeps touching the hot stove, and

1275
01:19:24,160 --> 01:19:26,800
Speaker 1: he doesn't he doesn't think his hand's been burned. Now,

1276
01:19:26,800 --> 01:19:29,160
Speaker 1: maybe the reputation of the United States his hand has

1277
01:19:29,200 --> 01:19:31,439
Speaker 1: been burned, and that's going to be really hard to

1278
01:19:31,479 --> 01:19:34,000
Speaker 1: recover from long after Donald Trump is dead and gone.

1279
01:19:35,240 --> 01:19:39,400
Speaker 1: But he himself has not felt any punishment with the

1280
01:19:39,520 --> 01:19:43,400
Speaker 1: risks he's taken. So you are right to be concerned

1281
01:19:43,439 --> 01:19:48,240
Speaker 1: that he may feel more emboldened than ever. Look, I'm

1282
01:19:48,360 --> 01:19:51,880
Speaker 1: very worried you know Columbia. Look, Petro is less friendly

1283
01:19:51,880 --> 01:19:55,120
Speaker 1: to the United States. He kind of ran a campaign

1284
01:19:55,360 --> 01:19:58,960
Speaker 1: against you know, but Columbia has been a fairly normal

1285
01:19:59,520 --> 01:20:02,960
Speaker 1: democrac as it's finally come out right. It has been operating.

1286
01:20:03,000 --> 01:20:05,040
Speaker 1: It's been an important ally in the United States and

1287
01:20:05,320 --> 01:20:07,280
Speaker 1: down there. The Columbia Free Trade Agreement was one of

1288
01:20:07,320 --> 01:20:10,200
Speaker 1: the first ones we signed in Latin America. That was binary.

1289
01:20:11,520 --> 01:20:15,320
Speaker 1: It's been good for both countries. You are correct. There's

1290
01:20:15,360 --> 01:20:20,639
Speaker 1: a lot of American businesses that have headquarters in various

1291
01:20:20,640 --> 01:20:25,000
Speaker 1: cities in Colombia. It is a It's also become a

1292
01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:30,240
Speaker 1: fairly popular place to vacation as well. Now Colombia has

1293
01:20:30,240 --> 01:20:34,000
Speaker 1: been you know, the the chaos in Venezuela which was

1294
01:20:34,040 --> 01:20:37,559
Speaker 1: there before we extracted Maduro was creating all sorts of

1295
01:20:37,560 --> 01:20:45,280
Speaker 1: border issues for Colombian Columbia. Ironically, before Donald Trump started

1296
01:20:45,280 --> 01:20:49,640
Speaker 1: trash talking President Petro, it was pretty clear that the

1297
01:20:50,640 --> 01:20:53,439
Speaker 1: next election, which is you know, Columbia holds its presidential

1298
01:20:53,439 --> 01:20:56,679
Speaker 1: elections later this year, the next election was likely going

1299
01:20:56,720 --> 01:20:58,320
Speaker 1: to go to the political party that was a bit

1300
01:20:58,360 --> 01:21:01,560
Speaker 1: more friendly to the United States. It's somewhat of a

1301
01:21:01,680 --> 01:21:02,439
Speaker 1: right leaning party.

1302
01:21:05,520 --> 01:21:05,720
Speaker 2: You know.

1303
01:21:05,760 --> 01:21:07,479
Speaker 1: I know that there was a lot of concern when

1304
01:21:07,520 --> 01:21:11,160
Speaker 1: Petro won. I happened to be I happen to know

1305
01:21:11,240 --> 01:21:14,479
Speaker 1: a little extra something about the politics of Colombia due

1306
01:21:14,520 --> 01:21:19,120
Speaker 1: to a friend of mine who's been very involved with

1307
01:21:19,360 --> 01:21:23,559
Speaker 1: charity in Colombia for decades, and so I've I've gotten

1308
01:21:23,560 --> 01:21:25,640
Speaker 1: to know some Colombian officials.

1309
01:21:26,600 --> 01:21:27,080
Speaker 2: Quite a bit.

1310
01:21:27,280 --> 01:21:32,160
Speaker 1: And so I guess my fear of what he's doing

1311
01:21:32,200 --> 01:21:36,160
Speaker 1: with Petro is that he ends up strengthening that you know,

1312
01:21:36,280 --> 01:21:40,400
Speaker 1: leftist party and then they and then he's succeeded by

1313
01:21:40,400 --> 01:21:44,160
Speaker 1: a fellow leftist just basically being able to run on

1314
01:21:44,200 --> 01:21:47,880
Speaker 1: anti Americanism. And I'd say that is, you know, in

1315
01:21:47,920 --> 01:21:50,639
Speaker 1: the same way, running as anti Trump is so good

1316
01:21:50,720 --> 01:21:54,679
Speaker 1: inside certain primaries in America, and running his pro Trump

1317
01:21:54,760 --> 01:21:57,960
Speaker 1: is really helpful in certain primaries in America. Being an

1318
01:21:57,960 --> 01:22:03,920
Speaker 1: anti American running against anti americanism or American imperialism, it's

1319
01:22:03,960 --> 01:22:09,679
Speaker 1: a very powerful message to run on in Latin America,

1320
01:22:10,479 --> 01:22:15,439
Speaker 1: in parts of Asia, in parts of Europe, so certainly

1321
01:22:15,439 --> 01:22:18,040
Speaker 1: in Africa. So that is something that I fear is

1322
01:22:18,080 --> 01:22:21,799
Speaker 1: that this stuff boomerangs. I mean, look at Lula's ratings

1323
01:22:21,800 --> 01:22:26,559
Speaker 1: in Brazil. Right when Trump targeted Lula, Lula who was

1324
01:22:26,640 --> 01:22:31,920
Speaker 1: not being wasn't being overly embraced by the Brazilian population.

1325
01:22:33,680 --> 01:22:36,639
Speaker 1: It's kind of a mediocre economy, things weren't going great.

1326
01:22:37,479 --> 01:22:42,000
Speaker 1: Suddenly saw his popularity surge after Trump attacked him over

1327
01:22:42,040 --> 01:22:45,839
Speaker 1: the Bolsonaro decision and just did the arbitrary tariffs on Brazil.

1328
01:22:46,560 --> 01:22:49,800
Speaker 1: It actually strengthened him politically and probably is going to

1329
01:22:49,840 --> 01:22:50,600
Speaker 1: be why he gets re.

1330
01:22:50,640 --> 01:22:51,639
Speaker 2: Elected later this year.

1331
01:22:51,760 --> 01:22:56,280
Speaker 1: Brazil also holds election this year. So that's what I fear,

1332
01:22:56,680 --> 01:22:59,720
Speaker 1: is what anti Americanism brings brings to that.

1333
01:23:08,160 --> 01:23:09,760
Speaker 2: I'm going a little lenkier than I want.

1334
01:23:09,840 --> 01:23:15,479
Speaker 1: But hey, it's football time, and I hope now you

1335
01:23:15,560 --> 01:23:18,840
Speaker 1: realize that no matter who you listen to about college football,

1336
01:23:19,040 --> 01:23:23,280
Speaker 1: Kirk Kurbstreet, Paul fine Bomb, Josh Pate, Clay Travis, you

1337
01:23:23,360 --> 01:23:25,760
Speaker 1: name it, there is only one person that told you

1338
01:23:25,800 --> 01:23:28,280
Speaker 1: the University of Miami was probably the best team in football.

1339
01:23:29,760 --> 01:23:33,440
Speaker 1: Now we have one more chance to prove it January nineteenth.

1340
01:23:34,040 --> 01:23:35,639
Speaker 2: I can't wait. I'll be there.

1341
01:23:37,280 --> 01:23:40,360
Speaker 1: So first I'm going to paint you the picture, the

1342
01:23:40,479 --> 01:23:41,800
Speaker 1: dream scenario.

1343
01:23:41,360 --> 01:23:45,559
Speaker 2: In my head and how I have envisioned all of this.

1344
01:23:47,880 --> 01:23:51,439
Speaker 1: The last time Miami played for a national title on

1345
01:23:51,560 --> 01:23:57,600
Speaker 1: its home field, and we're an underdog, was actually the

1346
01:23:57,720 --> 01:24:00,559
Speaker 1: very first time Miami played for a national title on

1347
01:24:00,680 --> 01:24:05,320
Speaker 1: its home field. The team they played was this juggernaut

1348
01:24:05,479 --> 01:24:10,120
Speaker 1: from the Midwest. The team colors were red and white.

1349
01:24:10,920 --> 01:24:15,720
Speaker 1: They were undefeated. They looked like a proceed They just

1350
01:24:15,880 --> 01:24:22,400
Speaker 1: never made mistakes. They were barreling through everybody. But they'd

1351
01:24:22,439 --> 01:24:27,639
Speaker 1: never face the speed of the University of Miami. That team,

1352
01:24:27,680 --> 01:24:32,000
Speaker 1: of course, was the Nebraska Cornhuskers. Go big red right now.

1353
01:24:32,840 --> 01:24:37,400
Speaker 1: Miami didn't blow out Nebraska. Miami eventually would blow Miami

1354
01:24:37,439 --> 01:24:40,800
Speaker 1: in the Florida States. Eventually, Miami and the style of

1355
01:24:40,840 --> 01:24:45,040
Speaker 1: play Miami introduced to college football in nineteen eighty three

1356
01:24:45,200 --> 01:24:49,439
Speaker 1: would become the norm, and more schools would emulate how

1357
01:24:49,439 --> 01:24:52,600
Speaker 1: Miami built its program in order to go forward. So

1358
01:24:52,680 --> 01:24:56,880
Speaker 1: here we are again, Miami. It's been a long time coming,

1359
01:24:57,520 --> 01:25:02,280
Speaker 1: twenty three years, and where the underdog, and in fact

1360
01:25:02,439 --> 01:25:05,639
Speaker 1: we're an irrational underdog. People are recency biased.

1361
01:25:05,720 --> 01:25:06,280
Speaker 2: Look forget.

1362
01:25:07,400 --> 01:25:11,599
Speaker 1: You know, Miami may not win this game. I think

1363
01:25:11,640 --> 01:25:14,720
Speaker 1: it's all. I will lay out the scenario of how

1364
01:25:14,720 --> 01:25:17,960
Speaker 1: they don't win this game. But I know one thing,

1365
01:25:18,040 --> 01:25:20,320
Speaker 1: they ain't getting blown out. Miami can't get blown out

1366
01:25:20,360 --> 01:25:22,639
Speaker 1: by anybody. Miami doesn't get blown out. Not a new

1367
01:25:22,640 --> 01:25:27,080
Speaker 1: Mario Crystobal. You know he MUCKs up a game when

1368
01:25:27,120 --> 01:25:29,200
Speaker 1: he doesn't have the talent to keep up with somebody,

1369
01:25:30,000 --> 01:25:32,000
Speaker 1: and sometimes he can muck up a game when we

1370
01:25:32,040 --> 01:25:35,040
Speaker 1: do have the talent to keep up with somebody. But

1371
01:25:35,080 --> 01:25:38,200
Speaker 1: I will promise you this, Indiana hasn't faced the physicality

1372
01:25:38,479 --> 01:25:44,600
Speaker 1: that is Miami, and maybe nobody believed it at the

1373
01:25:44,600 --> 01:25:48,000
Speaker 1: start of this playoff because of these preconceived notions about

1374
01:25:48,439 --> 01:25:55,400
Speaker 1: the ACC. Ask Ohio State, Ask the two SEC teams.

1375
01:25:55,439 --> 01:25:58,200
Speaker 1: My favorite stat, by the way, Miami has won more

1376
01:25:58,240 --> 01:26:00,920
Speaker 1: games against SEC opponents in twenty two, twenty five three

1377
01:26:02,160 --> 01:26:05,559
Speaker 1: than the University of Florida did in the SEC, who

1378
01:26:05,600 --> 01:26:09,479
Speaker 1: only had two. We loved little We love little stats

1379
01:26:09,520 --> 01:26:09,680
Speaker 1: like that.

1380
01:26:11,479 --> 01:26:12,320
Speaker 2: So I am.

1381
01:26:12,800 --> 01:26:15,680
Speaker 1: I couldn't be more thrilled that Indiana is the heavy favorite,

1382
01:26:15,760 --> 01:26:19,160
Speaker 1: that Miami is being discounted again, although it is interesting

1383
01:26:19,200 --> 01:26:21,720
Speaker 1: that Miami is at least less of a of an

1384
01:26:21,760 --> 01:26:25,760
Speaker 1: underdog against Indiana than they were against Ohio State. I

1385
01:26:25,800 --> 01:26:28,400
Speaker 1: know I look at this through reading, excuse me, through

1386
01:26:28,400 --> 01:26:35,679
Speaker 1: orange and green glasses, one hundred percent. But when I look,

1387
01:26:36,400 --> 01:26:40,599
Speaker 1: you know, there's there's let's go, let's look at this backwards.

1388
01:26:40,600 --> 01:26:42,400
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you the result and then you and

1389
01:26:42,400 --> 01:26:44,320
Speaker 1: then I think we will start filling in the blanks.

1390
01:26:44,840 --> 01:26:46,880
Speaker 1: Miami wins this game, and it looks a lot like

1391
01:26:46,920 --> 01:26:48,960
Speaker 1: the Ohio State game, which I think if Miami wins

1392
01:26:48,960 --> 01:26:50,439
Speaker 1: this game, it has to look a lot like the

1393
01:26:50,439 --> 01:26:53,240
Speaker 1: Otia State game. You're looking at something like twenty four

1394
01:26:53,200 --> 01:26:57,280
Speaker 1: to seventeen, twenty four to twenty one, you know, at

1395
01:26:57,280 --> 01:27:00,639
Speaker 1: best twenty four fourteen. But really it's a one score game.

1396
01:27:00,800 --> 01:27:03,000
Speaker 1: Miami obviously tacked on a quick late score that put

1397
01:27:03,000 --> 01:27:05,639
Speaker 1: it out of reach, but it's a one score game,

1398
01:27:05,720 --> 01:27:10,800
Speaker 1: and it's physical, and it's it's messy, it's tough, all

1399
01:27:10,840 --> 01:27:16,120
Speaker 1: those things. Miami also played pretty mistake free in that.

1400
01:27:16,920 --> 01:27:19,800
Speaker 1: But if you look at Indiana, if Mimi wins the game,

1401
01:27:19,840 --> 01:27:22,960
Speaker 1: then we will say this. Indiana actually never faith that.

1402
01:27:23,120 --> 01:27:27,679
Speaker 1: The only you know, the two games they almost lost.

1403
01:27:28,280 --> 01:27:30,639
Speaker 1: Two of the three games they almost lost Ohio State, Iowa,

1404
01:27:31,200 --> 01:27:34,760
Speaker 1: and Penn State. The Ohio State and Iowa games were

1405
01:27:34,800 --> 01:27:38,720
Speaker 1: the ones where they were physically beaten up and they

1406
01:27:38,760 --> 01:27:41,720
Speaker 1: had to essentially escape. Now they may escape a win

1407
01:27:41,760 --> 01:27:45,240
Speaker 1: against Miami. This is a very well coached team. They

1408
01:27:45,280 --> 01:27:49,040
Speaker 1: don't make mistakes. Miami has thrived on making other teams

1409
01:27:49,080 --> 01:27:52,200
Speaker 1: make mistakes. You know, when you look at the Old

1410
01:27:52,240 --> 01:27:54,880
Speaker 1: Miss game, it's astonishing Miami won, but it shows you

1411
01:27:54,920 --> 01:27:57,439
Speaker 1: how much better Miami really was. An Old Miss. Miami

1412
01:27:57,479 --> 01:27:59,360
Speaker 1: made a slew of mistakes and still won the game.

1413
01:28:00,000 --> 01:28:03,000
Speaker 1: Miami dropped three interceptions and still won the game. Right,

1414
01:28:03,280 --> 01:28:06,639
Speaker 1: Miami committed some penalties that shouldn't They shouldn't have committed

1415
01:28:06,640 --> 01:28:08,720
Speaker 1: that they didn't commit against Ohio State, still won the game.

1416
01:28:09,000 --> 01:28:11,360
Speaker 1: But Ole Miss had no business being there. God blessed them.

1417
01:28:11,600 --> 01:28:13,680
Speaker 1: They had a great they had they had they had

1418
01:28:13,720 --> 01:28:15,200
Speaker 1: the one of the best players on the field in

1419
01:28:15,240 --> 01:28:19,000
Speaker 1: Trinidad Chambliss. But I think it's clear that they were

1420
01:28:19,160 --> 01:28:21,320
Speaker 1: There is a small gap. It's not a big gap

1421
01:28:21,360 --> 01:28:29,360
Speaker 1: between Miami and Old Miss, but there's a gap. Miami

1422
01:28:29,400 --> 01:28:33,720
Speaker 1: has to play a nearly flawless game, and which they

1423
01:28:33,760 --> 01:28:35,880
Speaker 1: did against Ohio State. I think they only had one

1424
01:28:35,920 --> 01:28:43,519
Speaker 1: accepted penalty. That's a big deal. The other aspect to this,

1425
01:28:45,680 --> 01:28:52,879
Speaker 1: and that sort of has me is sort of okay.

1426
01:28:55,400 --> 01:28:59,840
Speaker 1: Has Indiana actually faced tough competition in the playoff versus

1427
01:29:00,080 --> 01:29:04,479
Speaker 1: Miami's face. Indiana faced Alabama, a team that now in hindsight,

1428
01:29:04,640 --> 01:29:09,320
Speaker 1: never belonged, and Oregon, a team that never physically belonged. Look,

1429
01:29:09,360 --> 01:29:11,640
Speaker 1: they had the record. I'm not saying they shouldn't have

1430
01:29:11,680 --> 01:29:13,519
Speaker 1: been in the playoff eleven to one. They deserve to

1431
01:29:13,520 --> 01:29:14,200
Speaker 1: be in the playoff.

1432
01:29:14,760 --> 01:29:16,840
Speaker 2: But who did they beat? And they should have.

1433
01:29:16,880 --> 01:29:18,960
Speaker 1: Lost to Iowa and they almost lost to Iowa. The

1434
01:29:19,040 --> 01:29:22,120
Speaker 1: toughest team they played. They didn't play Ohio State. They

1435
01:29:22,120 --> 01:29:24,040
Speaker 1: almost lost to Penn State, which turned out not to

1436
01:29:24,080 --> 01:29:27,320
Speaker 1: be that impressive of a win. And of course, despite

1437
01:29:27,360 --> 01:29:29,679
Speaker 1: getting a pick six, they still lost by double digits

1438
01:29:29,680 --> 01:29:32,360
Speaker 1: to Indiana the first time, and they lost that game

1439
01:29:32,400 --> 01:29:37,040
Speaker 1: at home. So you know, as Indiana played anybody, and

1440
01:29:37,200 --> 01:29:38,960
Speaker 1: you know, again, I go back to the toughest team

1441
01:29:39,000 --> 01:29:41,519
Speaker 1: Indiana's played this year as Ohio State, a team we

1442
01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:43,519
Speaker 1: beat by tied. That we have one common opponent team

1443
01:29:43,560 --> 01:29:45,080
Speaker 1: we beat by ten points, a team they beat by

1444
01:29:45,120 --> 01:29:50,800
Speaker 1: three points. So again, I just I say all that

1445
01:29:50,880 --> 01:29:54,320
Speaker 1: to say there's no the point spread here is absurd,

1446
01:29:54,640 --> 01:29:56,880
Speaker 1: But it doesn't matter. It's not about what the point

1447
01:29:56,920 --> 01:29:59,240
Speaker 1: spread should be, it's what gets you fifty to fifty money.

1448
01:29:59,600 --> 01:30:01,840
Speaker 1: And guess that's what There's a real opportunity here for

1449
01:30:01,880 --> 01:30:05,040
Speaker 1: smarter college football fans if you really want to dabble

1450
01:30:05,040 --> 01:30:09,559
Speaker 1: in gambling, because I think the numbers, eye test, everything

1451
01:30:09,640 --> 01:30:13,479
Speaker 1: shows Indiana shouldn't be a favorite like that. So don't

1452
01:30:13,520 --> 01:30:15,519
Speaker 1: be surprised if you see all the quote unquote sharp

1453
01:30:15,560 --> 01:30:18,040
Speaker 1: start taking Miami. Doesn't mean Miami's going to win this game,

1454
01:30:21,200 --> 01:30:23,639
Speaker 1: but it means I think that we have so we'll see. Look,

1455
01:30:23,720 --> 01:30:27,120
Speaker 1: I am I am hoping that Miami is not a

1456
01:30:27,160 --> 01:30:32,839
Speaker 1: supporting cast member in the in the Fernando Mendoza Hallmark

1457
01:30:33,560 --> 01:30:38,439
Speaker 1: of the Week movie and I and the whole He's

1458
01:30:38,439 --> 01:30:41,040
Speaker 1: coming home and he went to the same high school

1459
01:30:41,040 --> 01:30:45,040
Speaker 1: as Mario crystal Ball. I'm very curious how the Columbus

1460
01:30:45,120 --> 01:30:49,400
Speaker 1: High community is handling this, you know, are they are

1461
01:30:49,400 --> 01:30:51,040
Speaker 1: they houses divided about Mario?

1462
01:30:51,479 --> 01:30:53,280
Speaker 2: This is you know, Christopher Columbus High.

1463
01:30:53,120 --> 01:30:58,400
Speaker 1: School is a hugely sort of almost symbolically important institution

1464
01:30:58,560 --> 01:31:02,360
Speaker 1: in the Cuban community Miami. So it's going to be

1465
01:31:02,400 --> 01:31:05,320
Speaker 1: interesting to see see if there's a there's a real

1466
01:31:05,320 --> 01:31:09,719
Speaker 1: divide there or not. But look, regardless of what happens,

1467
01:31:09,880 --> 01:31:13,840
Speaker 1: this has been a very successful season for Miami. I

1468
01:31:13,880 --> 01:31:18,120
Speaker 1: think we now know this expanded playoff. Whoever wins the title,

1469
01:31:18,320 --> 01:31:21,800
Speaker 1: you can't say they didn't have to go through a juggernaut. Right,

1470
01:31:22,000 --> 01:31:23,680
Speaker 1: if Miami wins the title, they will have had to

1471
01:31:23,720 --> 01:31:26,120
Speaker 1: have gone eight to zero against ranked teams. They will

1472
01:31:26,160 --> 01:31:30,639
Speaker 1: have beaten number one, number two, number six, number seven,

1473
01:31:30,720 --> 01:31:32,200
Speaker 1: and if you want to throw a Notre Dame in

1474
01:31:32,240 --> 01:31:34,960
Speaker 1: there also, so basically more than half of the top

1475
01:31:35,040 --> 01:31:36,960
Speaker 1: ten they would have had to defeat in order to

1476
01:31:37,040 --> 01:31:39,720
Speaker 1: lay claim to a national title. If that is not

1477
01:31:39,880 --> 01:31:45,120
Speaker 1: what we all envisioned what a playoff should do. You know, look,

1478
01:31:45,120 --> 01:31:46,840
Speaker 1: there's a lot of things we've got to fix with

1479
01:31:46,880 --> 01:31:49,880
Speaker 1: this sport. Obviously, I feel pretty good about it at

1480
01:31:49,880 --> 01:31:52,040
Speaker 1: the moment because my team is succeeding at the rules

1481
01:31:52,040 --> 01:31:56,439
Speaker 1: that they currently are, but ultimately this is serving its

1482
01:31:56,479 --> 01:31:59,719
Speaker 1: purpose nobody. Yes, Miami's playing on its home field now,

1483
01:32:00,320 --> 01:32:02,080
Speaker 1: but look at the juggernaut they had to go through

1484
01:32:02,160 --> 01:32:04,040
Speaker 1: in order to even get there, and this was kind

1485
01:32:04,080 --> 01:32:06,680
Speaker 1: of a random happenstance. I am a little nervous that

1486
01:32:06,760 --> 01:32:08,840
Speaker 1: Indiana might have more fans at that game than Miami,

1487
01:32:08,840 --> 01:32:11,759
Speaker 1: because Indiana's got a much larger fan base and they're

1488
01:32:11,840 --> 01:32:15,640
Speaker 1: they're doing you, They're gonna spend Yolo money. I'm not

1489
01:32:15,680 --> 01:32:19,960
Speaker 1: sure Miami fans are going to spend Yolo money. Okay,

1490
01:32:20,000 --> 01:32:22,880
Speaker 1: because I think we Miami fans are cocky enough to

1491
01:32:22,920 --> 01:32:26,360
Speaker 1: assume that we're just we're back and this is gonna

1492
01:32:26,960 --> 01:32:29,200
Speaker 1: you know, we're going to be in this position sooner

1493
01:32:29,320 --> 01:32:30,040
Speaker 1: rather than later.

1494
01:32:30,120 --> 01:32:30,360
Speaker 2: Now.

1495
01:32:31,000 --> 01:32:33,400
Speaker 1: I hope we have a mindset win the win it now,

1496
01:32:33,439 --> 01:32:34,840
Speaker 1: because you never know when you're going to be this

1497
01:32:34,920 --> 01:32:40,360
Speaker 1: close again. But there a few other things. Look, I've

1498
01:32:40,360 --> 01:32:44,000
Speaker 1: given Channon Dawson a lot of grief. I nitpick, I

1499
01:32:44,040 --> 01:32:46,519
Speaker 1: pick a lot of knits at his play calling. It's

1500
01:32:46,520 --> 01:32:49,479
Speaker 1: been very good. It was you know, I think we

1501
01:32:49,520 --> 01:32:52,240
Speaker 1: all agreed. We knew that he had to open things up.

1502
01:32:52,520 --> 01:32:54,920
Speaker 1: If Miami was there was gonna if Mimi was gonna

1503
01:32:54,920 --> 01:32:56,600
Speaker 1: win a national title, Carson Beck was going to have

1504
01:32:56,600 --> 01:32:58,720
Speaker 1: to win one of the games. Well, Carson Beck just

1505
01:32:58,720 --> 01:33:01,920
Speaker 1: won a game, and there was some questions could he

1506
01:33:02,000 --> 01:33:03,640
Speaker 1: do it? Mario Chris Ball was going to have to

1507
01:33:03,640 --> 01:33:05,240
Speaker 1: manage the clock. While I think he managed the clock

1508
01:33:05,280 --> 01:33:07,960
Speaker 1: as well as he could down there, I think somebody

1509
01:33:08,000 --> 01:33:10,200
Speaker 1: was saying, oh, you shouldn't left sixteen seconds on. You

1510
01:33:10,280 --> 01:33:13,360
Speaker 1: had to score the touchdown. Okay, you know, I don't

1511
01:33:13,360 --> 01:33:15,880
Speaker 1: think Carson Beck, you know, just taking a knee at

1512
01:33:15,880 --> 01:33:18,520
Speaker 1: the half inch yard line before I would have gone bonkers.

1513
01:33:18,840 --> 01:33:21,920
Speaker 1: You get the touchdown at that point, sixteen seconds was

1514
01:33:21,960 --> 01:33:26,240
Speaker 1: sixteen seconds. And if you're wondering about the pass interference,

1515
01:33:26,280 --> 01:33:27,840
Speaker 1: for those of us that have had the nightmare of

1516
01:33:27,840 --> 01:33:30,519
Speaker 1: pass interferences at the Fiesta Bowl, which by the way,

1517
01:33:30,760 --> 01:33:32,720
Speaker 1: that's a huge monkey off of Miami's back. We had

1518
01:33:32,720 --> 01:33:35,040
Speaker 1: been oh for the state of Arizona, and we finally

1519
01:33:35,040 --> 01:33:36,880
Speaker 1: won a game in the state of Arizona. That's our

1520
01:33:36,920 --> 01:33:39,800
Speaker 1: first ever Fiesta Bowl victory. And the irony that there's

1521
01:33:39,840 --> 01:33:42,920
Speaker 1: an uncalled pass interference penalty. Here's why I don't think

1522
01:33:42,960 --> 01:33:45,080
Speaker 1: it's that big of video. One, the ball was uncatchable.

1523
01:33:45,439 --> 01:33:47,680
Speaker 1: We don't talk enough about that. There was not a

1524
01:33:47,720 --> 01:33:48,320
Speaker 1: catchable ball.

1525
01:33:48,360 --> 01:33:53,559
Speaker 2: I don't care. Two, I think if if if.

1526
01:33:53,400 --> 01:33:54,880
Speaker 1: That had been a ten yard pass and not a

1527
01:33:54,880 --> 01:33:57,040
Speaker 1: thirty yard pass, it would have they would have flagged

1528
01:33:57,040 --> 01:34:00,479
Speaker 1: it for pass interference. I think officials know that that play,

1529
01:34:00,640 --> 01:34:03,840
Speaker 1: it's a close call, but guess what, so what if

1530
01:34:04,080 --> 01:34:07,280
Speaker 1: they had another shot at it, they'd have gotten one

1531
01:34:07,280 --> 01:34:11,559
Speaker 1: more shot from the twenty. Okay, I'm pretty confident. You

1532
01:34:11,600 --> 01:34:13,400
Speaker 1: know I wouldn't have wanted to see one more play,

1533
01:34:13,680 --> 01:34:17,280
Speaker 1: don't get me wrong, and the crazy Ole Miss voodoo.

1534
01:34:17,360 --> 01:34:17,840
Speaker 2: That may be.

1535
01:34:18,120 --> 01:34:22,599
Speaker 1: They may have pulled off there, but I don't think

1536
01:34:22,640 --> 01:34:25,759
Speaker 1: you could say that's why Miami won the game. It's

1537
01:34:25,800 --> 01:34:28,479
Speaker 1: not like the past interference heard around the world back

1538
01:34:28,520 --> 01:34:33,160
Speaker 1: in January two thousand and three when it did decide

1539
01:34:34,120 --> 01:34:38,639
Speaker 1: the national championship. And I think all of us agree,

1540
01:34:39,600 --> 01:34:42,000
Speaker 1: let the players decide these things. You don't want the

1541
01:34:42,040 --> 01:34:46,160
Speaker 1: refs having that much impact. One other thing that I

1542
01:34:46,160 --> 01:34:49,439
Speaker 1: hope Miami is very careful of. I feel like in

1543
01:34:49,640 --> 01:34:51,920
Speaker 1: our attempt to hit as hard as possible, and we

1544
01:34:52,000 --> 01:34:56,320
Speaker 1: definitely hit harder than most teams, we're walking the line

1545
01:34:56,840 --> 01:35:00,240
Speaker 1: on late hits. We got flagged correctly on a of

1546
01:35:00,280 --> 01:35:02,760
Speaker 1: late hits. We've not been flagged for a couple that

1547
01:35:02,840 --> 01:35:05,720
Speaker 1: I worry about. We need to be careful here. You

1548
01:35:05,720 --> 01:35:08,519
Speaker 1: don't want to stop aggressiveness, but you got to do

1549
01:35:08,560 --> 01:35:13,400
Speaker 1: it within reason, and that's the There's a fine line

1550
01:35:13,400 --> 01:35:17,120
Speaker 1: between toughness and undisciplined, and they've more. They've been tough

1551
01:35:17,240 --> 01:35:20,080
Speaker 1: and disciplined just about all year long. There was a

1552
01:35:20,080 --> 01:35:21,559
Speaker 1: few moments in that Old Miss game.

1553
01:35:21,400 --> 01:35:22,320
Speaker 2: I was concerned about.

1554
01:35:23,080 --> 01:35:25,040
Speaker 1: I'm less concerned about it with Indiana. I don't think

1555
01:35:25,080 --> 01:35:27,640
Speaker 1: Indiana is a trust talker. I think by and I

1556
01:35:27,640 --> 01:35:29,040
Speaker 1: think this is going to be I think this is

1557
01:35:29,080 --> 01:35:31,320
Speaker 1: going to be a physically brutal game. I think it's

1558
01:35:31,360 --> 01:35:33,920
Speaker 1: going to be shockingly low scoring. Actually some people won't

1559
01:35:33,960 --> 01:35:36,559
Speaker 1: be shocked about it. And I do think it's going

1560
01:35:36,600 --> 01:35:38,000
Speaker 1: to be a bit of a war of attrition. I

1561
01:35:38,000 --> 01:35:40,360
Speaker 1: think when you're on your sixteenth game, as both teams

1562
01:35:40,400 --> 01:35:47,400
Speaker 1: are going to be, it is it is a You're

1563
01:35:47,400 --> 01:35:48,760
Speaker 1: going to have more players fought, and.

1564
01:35:48,720 --> 01:35:49,320
Speaker 2: I think.

1565
01:35:51,840 --> 01:35:54,479
Speaker 1: It's I think this is just a reality. One of

1566
01:35:54,520 --> 01:35:57,000
Speaker 1: the Indiana or Miami is going to lose this game

1567
01:35:57,040 --> 01:36:00,240
Speaker 1: because a key player is going to get hurt. When

1568
01:36:00,240 --> 01:36:04,240
Speaker 1: you're doing this for sixteen games, that likelihood only gets higher,

1569
01:36:04,760 --> 01:36:07,920
Speaker 1: and especially as the stakes get higher. I do think

1570
01:36:07,960 --> 01:36:11,760
Speaker 1: a trie you know, how physically ready are they for

1571
01:36:11,800 --> 01:36:15,320
Speaker 1: this game? How hurt are both teams? My guess is

1572
01:36:15,400 --> 01:36:18,840
Speaker 1: that's one thing that Indiana has in over Miami, which

1573
01:36:18,920 --> 01:36:21,559
Speaker 1: is they haven't had to play They've had two games

1574
01:36:21,560 --> 01:36:23,960
Speaker 1: where they got to basically take their foot off the

1575
01:36:23,960 --> 01:36:26,680
Speaker 1: gas in the second half. Miami hasn't been able to

1576
01:36:26,680 --> 01:36:30,519
Speaker 1: do that. Does that wear and tear show up in

1577
01:36:30,560 --> 01:36:32,439
Speaker 1: the fourth quarter of a very close game.

1578
01:36:33,000 --> 01:36:35,040
Speaker 2: These are some of the things that I worry about there.

1579
01:36:35,680 --> 01:36:41,080
Speaker 1: As with my Packers, I have reluctantly concluded that Lafloor's

1580
01:36:41,080 --> 01:36:46,320
Speaker 1: got to go. There's an interesting stat out there. Eighty

1581
01:36:46,400 --> 01:36:50,080
Speaker 1: five percent of Super Bowl winning coaches won the Super

1582
01:36:50,080 --> 01:36:51,960
Speaker 1: Bowl within the first six years of being the head

1583
01:36:52,000 --> 01:36:56,639
Speaker 1: coach of said franchise. Laflour just finished his seventh year,

1584
01:36:57,520 --> 01:37:00,920
Speaker 1: still hasn't been to a super Bowl. Record is great

1585
01:37:01,720 --> 01:37:03,840
Speaker 1: the last three years, though the trend line is not

1586
01:37:03,880 --> 01:37:08,439
Speaker 1: in the good right direction. They just lose too many games,

1587
01:37:08,520 --> 01:37:11,040
Speaker 1: just like they lost that Bears game. Hot start, the

1588
01:37:11,120 --> 01:37:17,360
Speaker 1: scripted portion, the stuff they game plan does great, halftime comes,

1589
01:37:18,120 --> 01:37:22,519
Speaker 1: the other team adjusts, but Green Bay isn't ready. And

1590
01:37:22,600 --> 01:37:27,160
Speaker 1: every game, I mean that script that green Bay game happened.

1591
01:37:27,840 --> 01:37:30,040
Speaker 2: Big lead, looks like it's over.

1592
01:37:30,600 --> 01:37:33,120
Speaker 1: Suddenly by the fourth quarter the other team has a

1593
01:37:33,160 --> 01:37:41,000
Speaker 1: shot at winning. I think it's it's you know, just

1594
01:37:41,080 --> 01:37:46,200
Speaker 1: like it was time with Harbaugh in Baltimore. Sometimes it's

1595
01:37:46,280 --> 01:37:49,760
Speaker 1: just time. This one feels like it's time. Look, I'd

1596
01:37:49,760 --> 01:37:52,920
Speaker 1: love to see Laflour with my with with with Kmore

1597
01:37:53,000 --> 01:37:57,200
Speaker 1: down in Tennessee and and help Lafloor, and I think

1598
01:37:57,280 --> 01:38:01,479
Speaker 1: Laflour is a great quarterback tutor. He got two more

1599
01:38:01,560 --> 01:38:02,439
Speaker 1: MVP seasons for.

1600
01:38:04,640 --> 01:38:05,400
Speaker 2: Aaron Rodgers.

1601
01:38:05,760 --> 01:38:07,920
Speaker 1: He turned Jordan Love into an elite quarterback. So I

1602
01:38:08,760 --> 01:38:12,840
Speaker 1: think there's It's a tremendous coach, but he is stuck

1603
01:38:12,880 --> 01:38:15,800
Speaker 1: with a bad special teams coach for too long. He

1604
01:38:15,840 --> 01:38:20,120
Speaker 1: has made some questionable decisions. Halfley's been a great hire

1605
01:38:20,120 --> 01:38:22,519
Speaker 1: at DC, but he's stuck with the old DC too long.

1606
01:38:23,240 --> 01:38:25,479
Speaker 1: So I you know, I think that when you start

1607
01:38:25,479 --> 01:38:27,799
Speaker 1: to evaluate his work and then you start to realize

1608
01:38:28,960 --> 01:38:31,439
Speaker 1: that first stat I don't think that's an accident.

1609
01:38:31,600 --> 01:38:31,800
Speaker 2: Right.

1610
01:38:32,080 --> 01:38:34,800
Speaker 1: If you don't make it work in that first five

1611
01:38:34,880 --> 01:38:39,559
Speaker 1: or six years, it's hard to get there, and all the.

1612
01:38:39,600 --> 01:38:40,320
Speaker 2: Ingredients were there.

1613
01:38:40,400 --> 01:38:43,000
Speaker 1: Yes, we had injuries, but you have injuries every year.

1614
01:38:43,760 --> 01:38:46,799
Speaker 1: How many you know, the best head coach has overcome them.

1615
01:38:47,240 --> 01:38:51,040
Speaker 1: He's a good head coach, but he's not been great

1616
01:38:51,080 --> 01:38:53,120
Speaker 1: because a great head coach would already have had Green

1617
01:38:53,160 --> 01:38:55,000
Speaker 1: Bay in at least one Super Bowl over the last

1618
01:38:55,040 --> 01:38:59,320
Speaker 1: seven years. So I think he's gone. I think that's

1619
01:38:59,360 --> 01:39:02,240
Speaker 1: the direction they go. They have a new president and

1620
01:39:02,479 --> 01:39:05,080
Speaker 1: Ed Policy, son of Carmen Policy, who ran the forty

1621
01:39:05,160 --> 01:39:07,920
Speaker 1: nine ers for years and at the end of their heyday,

1622
01:39:08,520 --> 01:39:13,479
Speaker 1: their first heyday back in the eighties and nineties. I'm

1623
01:39:13,560 --> 01:39:18,240
Speaker 1: intrigued by John Harbaugh. I think bringing in you know

1624
01:39:18,400 --> 01:39:20,400
Speaker 1: he's gonna want to go. And if you look at it,

1625
01:39:20,439 --> 01:39:22,880
Speaker 1: if green Bay does open, then suddenly the two best

1626
01:39:22,920 --> 01:39:24,920
Speaker 1: jobs on the board are green Bay in Baltimore we

1627
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:29,920
Speaker 1: know Harbaugh and going back to Baltimore. You know Harbaugh

1628
01:39:30,000 --> 01:39:34,080
Speaker 1: with Mike mcdanielis play caller. I just throw out a

1629
01:39:34,120 --> 01:39:36,400
Speaker 1: couple of ideas. We'll see what sticks.

1630
01:39:36,560 --> 01:39:38,240
Speaker 2: All right, I've gone on too long.

1631
01:39:41,400 --> 01:39:43,040
Speaker 1: I'm not going to say I'm not going to violate

1632
01:39:43,120 --> 01:39:46,840
Speaker 1: Larry David's rule. It's now January twelfth. It's no longer

1633
01:39:46,880 --> 01:39:49,680
Speaker 1: a new year. But welcome, unfortunately, to the year that

1634
01:39:49,680 --> 01:39:54,040
Speaker 1: we're living dangerously and let's hope it doesn't end as

1635
01:39:54,160 --> 01:39:57,519
Speaker 1: terribly as many of us fear this year could play out.

1636
01:39:57,680 --> 01:39:59,920
Speaker 2: So with that, I will see you forty eight.

1637
01:40:00,040 --> 01:40:06,519
Speaker 1: It was when I unploded. M m m hm.