WEBVTT - Ep. 42: A Bear Attack on Afognak Island 0:00:04.080 --> 0:00:07.720 Hey, everybody, Welcome from another episode of The Hunting Collective. 0:00:08.039 --> 0:00:12.320 I'm Ben O'Brien and today I'm joined by a very special, 0:00:12.480 --> 0:00:15.840 really a very badass individual. His name is Brad and 0:00:15.920 --> 0:00:20.000 Brad was a part of um a bear attack on 0:00:20.079 --> 0:00:23.480 a falk Neck island. He is been willing to give 0:00:23.600 --> 0:00:26.840 us here at the unt Collective the exclusive story of 0:00:26.880 --> 0:00:29.840 this attack. It wasn't only just an attack, it was 0:00:29.880 --> 0:00:33.400 a maeling. He sustained some very minor but also some 0:00:33.520 --> 0:00:36.720 very serious injuries along the way of this attack. He 0:00:36.800 --> 0:00:41.199 was hunting elk with somebody's there and UM, just an 0:00:41.200 --> 0:00:45.040 amazing story unfolded. You'all be you'll you'll know a fog 0:00:45.080 --> 0:00:47.800 Neck Island from Dmitri podcast from From the Meat Eater 0:00:47.880 --> 0:00:51.240 with Steve Rinella, Remy Warren, Be Honest, Pitelis and others. 0:00:52.520 --> 0:00:55.560 A fog Neck Island has become a place where bare 0:00:55.640 --> 0:00:59.720 attacks in the news are are fairly frequent. I mean, 0:00:59.760 --> 0:01:01.840 if you don't know about a falk Kneck Island, it's 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:06.240 It's in the Kodiak Island Archipelago on Coastal and Coastal Alaska. 0:01:06.680 --> 0:01:09.199 It's about twenty miles long and forty miles wide. There's 0:01:09.200 --> 0:01:12.400 just about thirty nine people that lived there. Who knows 0:01:12.720 --> 0:01:14.880 if that's even if that's even the right number. It's 0:01:14.920 --> 0:01:18.840 not a lot. Um. There's no roads, there's no stores. 0:01:18.920 --> 0:01:24.479 There's just herds of Roosevelt elk and hundreds of Kodiak 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:28.600 brown bears, which are uh it's one of the largest 0:01:29.560 --> 0:01:32.119 bears in the world. They could be up to thirteen 0:01:32.440 --> 0:01:36.880 hundred pounds their giant um you know, on the elk, 0:01:37.160 --> 0:01:39.280 the out there Roosevelt elk, and they were they were 0:01:39.280 --> 0:01:43.360 transplanted from the Olympic Peninsula of Washington State and in 0:01:43.440 --> 0:01:47.680 the late nineteen twenties and a lot of guys love 0:01:47.720 --> 0:01:51.280 to go hunt them, as did Brad and his four friends, 0:01:51.280 --> 0:01:54.200 but one ensued. It was one of the craziest stories 0:01:54.240 --> 0:01:58.280 you'll ever hear. And it's exclusive to this podcast, so 0:01:58.960 --> 0:02:04.720 please listen, enjoy, and learn from Brad and his bear 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:14.120 attack on the Brad. What's up? Man? As much? Man, 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:18.520 Thanks for having me here, Thanks for having me Sunny, Sunny, Sunny, 0:02:18.520 --> 0:02:22.520 San Diego. You got it. Um, there's lots to talk about, obviously, 0:02:22.560 --> 0:02:26.720 but um, first things first, when you know, we get 0:02:26.720 --> 0:02:28.520 into situation where I need it, this is this is 0:02:28.560 --> 0:02:30.880 the story. People are coming for the story, right, They're 0:02:30.919 --> 0:02:34.520 coming for the bear attacks story, of course. But we're 0:02:34.520 --> 0:02:37.600 gonna make him wait a minute. We're gonna make him dispense, 0:02:37.840 --> 0:02:41.760 give him a little bit suspense. Um, you know, I 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:46.000 want to talk about Kodiak and a fog neck islands. 0:02:46.600 --> 0:02:50.760 Um in the environment there first, because you spent some 0:02:50.800 --> 0:02:54.040 time around bears prior to been there for two and 0:02:54.080 --> 0:02:57.799 a half years now, So tell me about, um, your 0:02:57.840 --> 0:03:00.280 time in Kodiak and you know your experience of bears 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:03.480 or what kind of place it is, sure sure well 0:03:03.520 --> 0:03:06.320 first and foremost like the bear populations insane there. So 0:03:06.360 --> 0:03:09.919 it's it's the common occurrence of seeing bears. There's nothing 0:03:10.600 --> 0:03:13.040 short from what I'm used to. You know, my drive 0:03:13.080 --> 0:03:15.040 to work, I see a bear like pretty much every day. 0:03:15.440 --> 0:03:18.560 So let's back that up. If I drive to work 0:03:18.840 --> 0:03:22.560 pretty much the bear pretty much. No. Uh So I 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:25.840 live out and what's called the flats there's section Kodiak 0:03:25.880 --> 0:03:28.239 off and most people don't realize, but Kodiak is a 0:03:28.360 --> 0:03:31.519 huge island. It's actually second biggest in the US, I think, 0:03:31.520 --> 0:03:36.000 next to the big on Hawaii. But it's huge, but 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:38.600 only like a ten percent of it. People actually live on. 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:41.200 There's just the top right corner and that's where people live. 0:03:41.240 --> 0:03:42.720 And then that's it, and then there's like a few 0:03:42.760 --> 0:03:45.880 outlying a little like Port Towns type deal. But I 0:03:45.920 --> 0:03:48.680 think it's sixty seven miles of paved road. That's it. 0:03:48.920 --> 0:03:50.720 That's about as far as you can drive and go. 0:03:51.560 --> 0:03:54.080 I'm flowing over in the plains a couple of times 0:03:54.080 --> 0:03:56.680 and you're like, well, that's yeah, exactly so, and I 0:03:56.720 --> 0:03:58.200 know you're aware of this, but just for you know, 0:03:58.240 --> 0:04:02.440 for the people listening straight, it's section off basically to 0:04:02.480 --> 0:04:04.520 the main part of town. And then you've got the 0:04:04.520 --> 0:04:07.240 flats and everybody out there is called flat rats, and 0:04:07.440 --> 0:04:10.120 that makes me a flat rat. So there a little 0:04:10.120 --> 0:04:14.360 ways out in town. But you've got bears that they 0:04:14.400 --> 0:04:17.320 just get named by where they feed on the rivers 0:04:17.360 --> 0:04:20.480 down there, and there's just ample amounts of salmon the river, 0:04:20.920 --> 0:04:24.520 you know, going everywhere. But Sergeant's Creek is one of 0:04:24.560 --> 0:04:26.400 them where you just see people just line up on 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:31.200 the side road taking pictures and uh causing traffic DRAMs 0:04:31.400 --> 0:04:35.480 kind of it's real pain. But uh no, so that 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:38.920 between the busking Bear and Sergeant's Creek, it's like you're 0:04:38.960 --> 0:04:41.719 just seeing bears all the time. I've almost hit bears 0:04:41.760 --> 0:04:44.760 like I've hit deer back home, you know. So it's 0:04:44.760 --> 0:04:49.920 just it's a very common occurrence. And uh, ironically enough, 0:04:51.279 --> 0:04:53.279 I think it was like a week maybe a week 0:04:53.320 --> 0:04:58.520 and a half before the actual incident itself. There was 0:04:58.839 --> 0:05:03.440 a friend it was coming over to the house and uh, 0:05:03.480 --> 0:05:05.440 I lived in a guesthouse next to, you know, the 0:05:05.480 --> 0:05:07.160 main house, and we're all kind of gathered together in 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:09.200 the main house and it was late at night, real 0:05:09.320 --> 0:05:11.160 real dark out, and I was just going back over 0:05:11.200 --> 0:05:13.360 to my house to grab some you know, food and 0:05:13.440 --> 0:05:15.080 drinks and bring back over. While I stepped out of 0:05:15.120 --> 0:05:18.039 the house and there's horses on the property. But I 0:05:18.120 --> 0:05:19.960 come out of the house and a lady that was 0:05:20.000 --> 0:05:21.520 over there, I had her pickup truck, you know, just 0:05:21.560 --> 0:05:23.280 kind of parked in the driveway, and I didn't think 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:25.080 anything of it, and I you know, ran by and 0:05:25.080 --> 0:05:27.320 I heard some you know, kind of footsteps, and I 0:05:27.320 --> 0:05:29.360 just thought it was one of the horses. Well I 0:05:29.480 --> 0:05:31.080 just make it by the pickup truck and I just 0:05:31.120 --> 0:05:35.320 see this massive bear and it's just walking around like ship. 0:05:35.480 --> 0:05:38.400 You gotta be kidding me. And uh, fortunately, you know, 0:05:38.440 --> 0:05:40.400 it wasn't intact mood or anything startled it off. It 0:05:40.440 --> 0:05:43.039 was getting into some garbage and I actually shot it 0:05:43.080 --> 0:05:45.320 off the property. To that point, I had my my 0:05:45.880 --> 0:05:48.159 concealed carry on me and just just scared away, just 0:05:48.240 --> 0:05:49.760 kind of like, you know, shoe, get out of here. 0:05:49.839 --> 0:05:51.880 But uh, you know, it just goes to show like 0:05:51.920 --> 0:05:53.960 that if that bear wanted me, it was only ten 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:56.359 yards away when I was just walking by, like pitts black, 0:05:56.400 --> 0:05:58.040 like there had been nothing that I could have done. 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:00.320 There was some trash there for sure, like that's all 0:06:00.320 --> 0:06:02.720 it was interested in. And it's like, oh food and 0:06:02.880 --> 0:06:08.600 um uh right along those lines too, you know, after 0:06:08.640 --> 0:06:11.120 this whole thing has happened, and even before that, we've 0:06:11.360 --> 0:06:16.760 noticed real recently on Kodiak, uh, the bear kind of 0:06:16.839 --> 0:06:21.000 dynamic and what they're interested in. This past year has 0:06:21.040 --> 0:06:25.080 really changed, I think than the seasons prior. And I 0:06:25.520 --> 0:06:26.920 this is just a theory. I mean, Fish and Game 0:06:26.960 --> 0:06:32.480 could probably really dial it in, but the Reds didn't 0:06:32.600 --> 0:06:36.040 like run it all this year really just absence didn't happen. 0:06:36.040 --> 0:06:38.320 The salmon runs in general just started very very late. 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:40.760 You know, even the Silvers when they finally came in, 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:42.839 and it was a great season at the end, but 0:06:42.880 --> 0:06:44.440 I think the bears are really really hungry in the 0:06:44.440 --> 0:06:47.080 beginning and they're still kind of playing catch up because 0:06:47.200 --> 0:06:49.520 everywhere in town all we just see is just like 0:06:49.600 --> 0:06:51.880 bears pop and I'm getting into trash like way more 0:06:51.920 --> 0:06:54.000 than I've seen before in the past, and other guys 0:06:54.000 --> 0:06:55.800 that I know they've lived there for twenty plus years 0:06:55.800 --> 0:06:59.640 saying the same thing, like gathers it. Yeah, and and well, 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:03.039 unfortunately that I haven't been aggressive, but just like I 0:07:03.040 --> 0:07:06.360 don't know, bold and like getting into people's trash like that, 0:07:06.880 --> 0:07:09.200 I mean just everywhere in the sea, like right by 0:07:09.400 --> 0:07:12.000 dogs and other people's houses, and like they don't care. 0:07:13.200 --> 0:07:16.120 And I would say that's the difference is their city bears, 0:07:16.400 --> 0:07:20.559 you know, it's the equivalent of a city bear versus 0:07:20.600 --> 0:07:23.920 you know, the rural uh tunder type bear that you're 0:07:23.960 --> 0:07:27.560 gonna see out like hunting and stuff. And uh but yeah, 0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:32.600 they've they've really really been bold lately. And it's it's nuts. Yeah, 0:07:32.600 --> 0:07:35.640 And there's a lot of companies that run bear tours 0:07:35.680 --> 0:07:38.320 and things on kodiaks. I'm sure you're well aware, right, 0:07:38.480 --> 0:07:41.320 And it's just it's it's the most interesting part about 0:07:41.400 --> 0:07:44.920 the dichotomy that exists there of like you live there, 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:47.760 you see bears every day, like I see you know, 0:07:48.160 --> 0:07:51.840 maybe a deer every day or something like that. So 0:07:51.920 --> 0:07:54.800 the comparison of the two is is eerie to me, 0:07:54.880 --> 0:07:58.640 almost the same way that you know your daily your 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:02.360 daily experience with a bears, like oh there's one, there's one, 0:08:02.640 --> 0:08:06.680 there's another one. That's that's unreal. H oh, it's it's 0:08:06.760 --> 0:08:10.040 it's wild. So I I grew up in Maine, so 0:08:10.200 --> 0:08:13.000 black bear, you know, it's huge up there. But even 0:08:13.040 --> 0:08:16.720 growing up there, I mean we lived out in the sticks, 0:08:16.760 --> 0:08:19.200 like small town six hunr people, and I could count 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:21.680 on my hands the amount of times I've seen it bear. 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:23.080 That's what I mean. I mean, like, and I grew 0:08:23.120 --> 0:08:25.160 up hunching my entire life. So to my father, and 0:08:25.280 --> 0:08:27.240 you know, he finally, you know, he got one, and 0:08:27.320 --> 0:08:29.920 he's been trying for years and years and years, but 0:08:30.160 --> 0:08:33.160 you just don't see him. The recluse, you know, just wild, 0:08:33.200 --> 0:08:37.720 but not that is oh salmon, Yeah, I'm just trash 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:41.440 main Street. We don't care. Yeah, I mean that's you know, 0:08:41.480 --> 0:08:44.640 black bears are pretty much every state at this point, 0:08:45.720 --> 0:08:49.240 and um other than you know, Florida, is pretty famous 0:08:49.280 --> 0:08:52.079 for having a lot of black bear incidents. I mean, 0:08:52.120 --> 0:08:54.439 now new jerseys in the headlines around black bears. It's 0:08:54.440 --> 0:08:57.880 gonna shut the season down. Um. But but you don't. 0:08:57.920 --> 0:08:59.440 It's not something you know. I grew up in on 0:08:59.480 --> 0:09:01.760 the East Coast two and there were bears around, but 0:09:02.120 --> 0:09:03.640 I saw I think I can remember seeing one as 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:08.120 a kid while hunting, and so I'm not sure there's 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:11.800 many places on the planet Earth where you would see 0:09:11.840 --> 0:09:17.800 a bear every day on the tribute to work, it isn't. Um. So, 0:09:17.840 --> 0:09:21.760 how like when you when something like that happens, you 0:09:21.760 --> 0:09:24.000 come out, you see a bear in the trash can 0:09:25.000 --> 0:09:28.280 Is that something that ums talked about or is that 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:31.360 a daily occurrence? Is that something that you know, bears 0:09:31.440 --> 0:09:35.199 that close to you know, the dwelling bears that close 0:09:35.240 --> 0:09:38.880 to you know. Yeah, And I think most pupils experiences 0:09:39.080 --> 0:09:42.680 just they all come from the city, you know, and 0:09:42.760 --> 0:09:44.840 like being in those type environments. And I think those 0:09:44.920 --> 0:09:47.640 bears specifically are just they're more skittish, you know, they 0:09:47.679 --> 0:09:49.480 don't they don't want anything to do with you for 0:09:49.520 --> 0:09:53.480 whatever reason, Like they're not trying to protect anything, even 0:09:53.520 --> 0:09:55.959 the garbage and stuff. They don't really like you know, 0:09:56.080 --> 0:09:58.520 have dominance over. I've never seen anything like that or 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:00.360 her any incidents. I do think it's probably a matter 0:10:00.360 --> 0:10:03.680 of time, but it's definitely talked about, and of course, 0:10:03.840 --> 0:10:06.520 you know scares people, especially just seeing the size. Most 0:10:06.520 --> 0:10:09.520 people don't understand or really like they can't get the 0:10:09.559 --> 0:10:11.280 scale of it. You know, all you ever see is 0:10:11.320 --> 0:10:13.600 like TV and video and pictures and everything, and soon 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:16.680 you see like a massive bear. It's like it's pretty 0:10:16.679 --> 0:10:23.640 big eye opening image. Especially uh, you know the differences 0:10:23.720 --> 0:10:26.800 between the lower forty eight kind of bear where people 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:28.800 may have seen him before and then going to like 0:10:28.880 --> 0:10:31.000 Kodiak and I would think the same thing if I 0:10:31.040 --> 0:10:33.320 ever saw you know, polar bear like stepping it up 0:10:33.360 --> 0:10:36.440 in that realm too. It's like the more massively creature 0:10:36.480 --> 0:10:41.680 that more like yeah, really really like it's eye opening 0:10:41.720 --> 0:10:44.680 and funny enough, I've had that conversation with you know, 0:10:44.760 --> 0:10:46.800 differences and grizzlies and brown bears and you know the 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:49.560 coastal are in then uh, and yeah, they just get 0:10:49.720 --> 0:10:52.680 huge off that salmon, you know obviously where the Kodiak 0:10:52.720 --> 0:10:55.880 brown bear gets his name. But yeah, I know people 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:58.120 definitely talk about it, but for the most part, it's 0:10:58.120 --> 0:10:59.880 always just stories of like, oh, they come out and 0:11:00.000 --> 0:11:02.760 turn lights on or making noise and stuff like that, 0:11:02.800 --> 0:11:04.280 and bear just like runs off. That's what I was 0:11:04.280 --> 0:11:07.040 getting there. You know, you just don't it changes the 0:11:07.040 --> 0:11:09.520 first time somebody gets attacked in the front yard or 0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:12.320 somebody gets taking the garbage out and it gets you know, 0:11:12.600 --> 0:11:15.480 gets mauled, oh for sure. And it still worries me 0:11:15.600 --> 0:11:18.120 because we just see him around town. All I keep 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:20.360 thinking is like, man, that one kid waiting at the 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:23.160 school bus stop, you know that one time. And I 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:25.320 grew up in the same thing as like in sticks 0:11:25.320 --> 0:11:28.560 and like nobody would ever know, you know, unless there 0:11:28.600 --> 0:11:30.240 was a bunch of other kids or something like that around. 0:11:30.240 --> 0:11:32.079 But they're so small and like kind of easy targets 0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:33.679 that that's what I worry about. Like if that bear 0:11:33.720 --> 0:11:36.360 is hungry enough and finally sees that, and I'd be like, 0:11:37.000 --> 0:11:39.480 I'm gonna capitalize on this, and there's you know, that's 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:42.880 what's going to change everything, and yeah, then that would 0:11:42.920 --> 0:11:46.040 be gosh, that'd be terrible. But yeah, I mean it's 0:11:46.080 --> 0:11:50.280 it's just there's a different dynamic cohabitation. When you're cohabitating 0:11:50.320 --> 0:11:57.439 with a charismatic charismatic megafauna, giant fucking predator that could 0:11:57.559 --> 0:12:00.679 could could swipe you like that. I mean, it just is, 0:12:01.280 --> 0:12:06.080 you know, cohabitation with uncle, it's you're just you're helping 0:12:06.120 --> 0:12:09.120 manage that popular like the relationships a little bit easier 0:12:09.160 --> 0:12:12.680 to manage than when that's happening. But I have not 0:12:12.960 --> 0:12:14.840 you know, I know we both we have mutual friend 0:12:14.880 --> 0:12:16.680 Cole Cramer, Like I've talked to him a lot and 0:12:16.760 --> 0:12:19.559 hunting codyac with him a couple of years ago. It 0:12:19.679 --> 0:12:21.760 was in December, so we didn't see any bears, ye, 0:12:22.520 --> 0:12:27.080 thank god. Um, but just talking with him about that, 0:12:27.080 --> 0:12:29.240 I mean's a bear guide. Some of the stories that 0:12:29.640 --> 0:12:31.400 you know that he will tell. He's been on this 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:34.760 podcast and if you go back and listen to UM, 0:12:34.800 --> 0:12:37.559 I think it's episode eighteen with with Cole, you'll hear 0:12:37.640 --> 0:12:42.679 some of these stories. But bears are killing machines and 0:12:42.920 --> 0:12:46.480 they're just important, Like there's their meat processing four legs. 0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:50.400 They're just yeah, and that's all they're thinking about. So, Um, 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:52.679 the fact that you're living in this place, you know 0:12:52.880 --> 0:12:55.360 that you somehow, I mean you have to. There's no 0:12:55.400 --> 0:12:57.960 way that you're not getting used to habitually. You know, 0:12:58.120 --> 0:13:01.840 like habituated with bears, you are see him every day. 0:13:02.400 --> 0:13:05.520 Your your lens with which you see a bear is 0:13:05.559 --> 0:13:10.200 different than mine. Oh yeah, and I think, well one 0:13:10.200 --> 0:13:12.520 of the whole experiences definitely eye opening. And I don't 0:13:12.520 --> 0:13:14.280 think you ever really took it for granted. It definitely 0:13:14.320 --> 0:13:17.360 opened my eyes. But finally being you know, mauled and 0:13:17.400 --> 0:13:22.040 attacked really opened my eyes to me being a very 0:13:23.000 --> 0:13:28.320 big solo hunter and uh you know, just me and 0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:30.880 my bear spray. Yeah, not even that, It's like it 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:34.360 was always having my my gun on me and uh yeah, 0:13:34.760 --> 0:13:36.920 I don't know. It's definitely opened my eyes and changed 0:13:36.920 --> 0:13:39.400 my my thought process on doing that from now on. 0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:43.560 But ironically, myself and the guy who ended up, you know, 0:13:43.679 --> 0:13:47.679 shooting the bear, both of us prior to the attack 0:13:47.880 --> 0:13:52.000 had gotten our deer. You know, I bagged our first 0:13:52.080 --> 0:13:56.600 year on the road system solo, like we by ourselves. Yeah, okay, 0:13:57.000 --> 0:14:01.920 mine was on opening day, got mine opening day. And uh, 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:05.080 Cody acts like a jungle in the in the spring 0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:09.320 summertime like before that in opening days August first there 0:14:09.480 --> 0:14:13.000 and it is it's so the I mean the grass 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:15.240 there and all and all the growth is over my 0:14:15.280 --> 0:14:18.079 head like there would be no question me being like quiet, 0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:20.040 doing the same thing, not having anybody else, Like I'm 0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:23.720 not making any noise that it could adjust as easily 0:14:23.760 --> 0:14:26.160 happened the same way. Like you know, speaking up on 0:14:26.200 --> 0:14:28.280 bear or something like that, like this guy, you know, 0:14:28.600 --> 0:14:31.120 like makes you think again, and I'm like, okay, you know, 0:14:31.160 --> 0:14:33.760 I thought I had this kind of dialed in, Like Nope, 0:14:33.800 --> 0:14:36.080 not so much. Yeah, I mean there just is, there 0:14:36.280 --> 0:14:39.560 is a general helplessness when it comes to proximity to bears. 0:14:39.720 --> 0:14:42.280 I mean, you can be prepared as you'd like, you know, 0:14:42.360 --> 0:14:44.480 like I said, you can have a side arm, you 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:47.320 can have a rifle, you can have bear spray, and 0:14:47.320 --> 0:14:50.200 we'll get into your experience here in a minute. But 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:54.240 you know, most not most times, but there are plenty 0:14:54.280 --> 0:14:58.120 of times where none of that matters. No matter how 0:14:58.160 --> 0:15:02.520 prepared you are, you're still helpful. You're still helpless because 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:07.320 this is a giant killing machine for sure. You know, 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:09.640 when you're out there, it's uh, you're not really in 0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:11.440 the food chamber. Doesn't make you the top of the 0:15:11.440 --> 0:15:14.560 food chaining, you know, like those things can do whatever 0:15:14.600 --> 0:15:16.560 they want. And I'm sure we get you know, machines 0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:18.360 that make us a little more capable than they are. 0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:23.760 But no, it's an extremely massive and powerful animal. It's 0:15:23.920 --> 0:15:26.760 you know, built to do a lot of dating ball 0:15:26.880 --> 0:15:30.560 of hair and muscle, or of sucking pussies, you know, 0:15:32.240 --> 0:15:36.440 really compared to the com Yeah, I mean, like I said, 0:15:36.440 --> 0:15:40.600 I'm I've been in a lot of wilderness situations where 0:15:40.600 --> 0:15:42.600 we're talking before we hit recording, like, I'm just lucky 0:15:42.720 --> 0:15:45.640 enough to have never I've had experience where I've seen 0:15:45.680 --> 0:15:49.680 bears and but just lucky enough never to really I've 0:15:49.720 --> 0:15:53.560 had to make any real decisions around Um, you know 0:15:54.200 --> 0:15:59.120 my proximity to to a bear. Um, but you know, 0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:01.760 I live in Montana. There's lots of people that that 0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:05.160 go hunting in Montana and Wyoming and all over Canada 0:16:05.440 --> 0:16:10.560 and Kodiak every year put themselves in a situation where 0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:15.160 the odds are low. They're very low, but there are odds. 0:16:15.200 --> 0:16:17.160 That's say, you're gonna run into a grizzly band, You're 0:16:17.160 --> 0:16:21.720 gonna have to make a decision. Um, And that's you know, 0:16:22.160 --> 0:16:28.440 doing doing that willingly is taking on an immense, immense risk. Yeah, 0:16:28.480 --> 0:16:32.520 for sure, for sure, for sure, I know you're talking 0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:36.200 to you bro, No, No, I know it's I'm humbled 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:38.120 by the experience for sure. And you know there's I 0:16:38.160 --> 0:16:40.000 got no ill will towards bears at all, Like I 0:16:40.080 --> 0:16:42.200 was just looking forward to getting back on the horse 0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:47.240 and unfortunately missing all the seasons now, But I don't know, Yeah, 0:16:47.280 --> 0:16:50.880 it doesn't. It doesn't phaze me. I think like a 0:16:50.920 --> 0:16:52.680 lot of other people talk about it or think that 0:16:52.720 --> 0:16:54.640 you'll have some sort of like hate towards bears now, 0:16:54.640 --> 0:16:57.360 like kill all bears are all terrible things. He's like, no, no, 0:16:57.480 --> 0:17:01.280 not at all, Yeah, not at all. Yeah. So, and 0:17:01.400 --> 0:17:04.480 you grew up hunting, he said, with your dad's main 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:08.760 for plenty of bears in Maine. Yep, plenty of bears. 0:17:09.160 --> 0:17:12.480 You know what what was your um? You know, how 0:17:12.520 --> 0:17:14.040 how did you come up? How did you grow up hunting? 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:16.080 How did you get introduced to it? Like, you know, 0:17:16.160 --> 0:17:18.960 prior to living with Kody Ak, what was your so? 0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:22.639 Uh lived down in the sticks log having my father built. 0:17:22.720 --> 0:17:24.600 You know, I lived in the same house. You know, 0:17:24.720 --> 0:17:27.600 our entire lives and um prior to me, you know, 0:17:27.680 --> 0:17:29.840 going off to college, that's just all we did every 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:33.280 fall and the hunting seasons they are very, very different 0:17:33.320 --> 0:17:35.800 and much more stringent. I guess than a lot of 0:17:35.800 --> 0:17:37.919 other states, as I came to find out. But you 0:17:37.920 --> 0:17:40.520 only get one one dear season, like that's it, white 0:17:40.560 --> 0:17:43.119 tail deer, and like boom, you're done. I think there 0:17:43.200 --> 0:17:45.280 might be some uh you might be able to get it, 0:17:45.280 --> 0:17:48.800 like a second one with some of the extended seasons there, 0:17:48.840 --> 0:17:52.679 but it makes you a hard hunter growing up in 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:54.520 Maine and try to hunt. And I'm sure you know 0:17:54.560 --> 0:17:56.359 some of the other states are similar, but there is 0:17:56.400 --> 0:17:59.840 no warm hunting there. Like the coldest I've ever been 0:17:59.840 --> 0:18:01.760 in my life is, without a doubt, been times when 0:18:01.800 --> 0:18:03.879 I was hunting in Maine and just like sitting in 0:18:03.920 --> 0:18:06.719 the tree stand for five hours and like negative twenty 0:18:06.880 --> 0:18:10.120 and just freezing my sucking ass off. There's no way 0:18:10.119 --> 0:18:13.480 to give more. No, your blood's not moving, You're just 0:18:13.520 --> 0:18:16.480 sitting there. And that was the true test. And and 0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:18.240 the funny thing is is those are some of the 0:18:18.280 --> 0:18:20.159 best times I've ever had with my my pops, you know, 0:18:20.200 --> 0:18:22.000 growing up was just sitting in the tree stand like 0:18:22.040 --> 0:18:24.840 waiting or you know eventually we you know, split up 0:18:24.840 --> 0:18:27.200 and take a couple of different fields of fire there 0:18:27.240 --> 0:18:30.600 and uh yeah, just waiting for our gear. And it 0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:32.920 was a big deal, and that there's just no questions, 0:18:32.920 --> 0:18:35.720 like the more time you spend out, the more chance 0:18:35.760 --> 0:18:38.280 that you're gonna you know, see something or run into something. 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:43.919 And I never grew up really doing stocking because the 0:18:43.920 --> 0:18:47.879 main woods it's it's it's it's almost impossible something at 0:18:47.960 --> 0:18:49.480 least in the areas that we were in. There's probably 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:52.040 some more open open woods in different areas, but no, 0:18:52.359 --> 0:18:56.760 it's so thick they're and the time is season, everything's 0:18:56.880 --> 0:18:59.560 just snaps, it's crunchy, like you can't like it's it's 0:18:59.560 --> 0:19:03.200 almost some possible to actually like stock hunt deer there. 0:19:03.240 --> 0:19:06.399 The big, the big thing they're is just like sitting 0:19:06.400 --> 0:19:08.280 in the tree stand doing you're scouting and stuff in 0:19:08.280 --> 0:19:10.199 the preseason and find out where they're going to be 0:19:10.359 --> 0:19:12.600 and then just you know, waiting and setting up to 0:19:12.640 --> 0:19:16.720 their you know, your your dopist or whatever and accounting 0:19:16.720 --> 0:19:18.200 for the wind and have a different a couple of 0:19:18.240 --> 0:19:23.840 different sites. And father taught me everything for sure, but yeah, 0:19:23.880 --> 0:19:27.200 I started going with him well before I was able 0:19:27.240 --> 0:19:29.840 to hunt myself. And ten ten years old is the 0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:33.280 legal hunting age there. And uh, finally when I was ten, 0:19:33.600 --> 0:19:38.760 and this is one of my favorite stories actually, but uh. Uh. 0:19:38.960 --> 0:19:41.399 We had this place called Peas Farm and it was 0:19:41.480 --> 0:19:44.280 the uh and uh that was just a family that 0:19:44.280 --> 0:19:46.040 owned it, like back in the day. It's it's not 0:19:46.680 --> 0:19:51.119 there anymore, but huge tree stand at my pipe. My 0:19:51.200 --> 0:19:55.000 grandfather and his friends built up on this this huge 0:19:55.080 --> 0:19:57.600 back lot. Uh god, I don't even know how many 0:19:57.680 --> 0:19:59.760 years ago, and my father and I he wanted to 0:19:59.800 --> 0:20:01.800 take there's like okay, it's really big open spot and 0:20:01.840 --> 0:20:04.879 we're gonna go out, and ten years old and uh 0:20:04.960 --> 0:20:06.479 you know and not a stranger as the cold, but 0:20:06.520 --> 0:20:09.840 not really adept at it either. Finally go out and 0:20:09.960 --> 0:20:13.080 we're sitting there and of course, like I get cold 0:20:13.119 --> 0:20:15.440 within however, you know, an hour or two hours, because 0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:18.199 of course we're there before the sun rises. And it's like, okay, 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:21.880 no ten year old has ever hunted nuts that I'm cold. Yeah, yeah, 0:20:22.240 --> 0:20:25.040 it's it's inevitable. And so it's like okay, it's like, well, 0:20:25.040 --> 0:20:26.480 do you remember your way back to the truck, and 0:20:26.560 --> 0:20:28.080 like yeah, it's like okay, we'll just go back to 0:20:28.119 --> 0:20:32.040 the truck and and turn the heat on and uh 0:20:32.080 --> 0:20:33.760 and you know, warm yourself up and then if you're 0:20:33.760 --> 0:20:35.520 ready to like come on back out. And so I 0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:38.120 go to the truck and um, I'm just sitting there 0:20:38.160 --> 0:20:41.840 and uh. The other funny part was is I was 0:20:41.920 --> 0:20:44.119 too nervous to turn the truck on because of the noise, 0:20:44.200 --> 0:20:45.320 and I was like, I didn't want to do it, 0:20:45.359 --> 0:20:47.000 so I just thought I could just turn the truck 0:20:47.040 --> 0:20:48.679 on and like the heat would come out, but of 0:20:48.680 --> 0:20:51.480 course that's just air blocking, so I didn't actually really 0:20:51.480 --> 0:20:53.200 get warm, you know. Just the kind of the walk 0:20:53.280 --> 0:20:55.440 made me get warm, I think. But I was sitting 0:20:55.440 --> 0:20:57.399 in the truck for a little while and my uh, 0:20:57.480 --> 0:20:59.200 Pops comes back open to the truck, is like zach 0:20:59.359 --> 0:21:01.280 Zac come out. He's like, there's a there's a deer, 0:21:01.280 --> 0:21:04.240 and he's like, okay, so I get my right. When 0:21:04.240 --> 0:21:06.200 we go out and we're kind of stalking. At this point, 0:21:06.240 --> 0:21:08.680 he remembered seeing the duck and it was a duck 0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:11.639 buck and uh, it was just a young buck. And 0:21:11.960 --> 0:21:14.840 finally we week he sees it kind of down this 0:21:15.000 --> 0:21:19.119 path and uh, we get up on it and I 0:21:19.160 --> 0:21:21.240 can't see it, and him like he's like, it's right, 0:21:21.280 --> 0:21:23.119 it's right here. And I'm kind of like looking and like, 0:21:23.119 --> 0:21:25.400 oh I see it. I'm trying to see it through 0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:27.639 the scope and it's on full powered. I just can't 0:21:27.680 --> 0:21:29.320 get on and like I don't see it. I don't 0:21:29.440 --> 0:21:31.720 see it, and he's like it's right there, and he's 0:21:31.760 --> 0:21:34.160 kind of cracking up laughing at the same time. Unfortunately, 0:21:34.280 --> 0:21:36.560 this we just had to win, just right in the bucks, 0:21:36.560 --> 0:21:39.520 like laying down and like very very fortunate. Man. I 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:41.399 finally see it, like, oh yeah, I see I see it, 0:21:41.440 --> 0:21:44.520 and then uh yeah, I get get eyes on and 0:21:44.560 --> 0:21:47.040 take my shot. And it was laying down, didn't get up. 0:21:47.040 --> 0:21:48.439 It was just it was it was done, and I 0:21:48.480 --> 0:21:50.639 was just so excited and go over and get my 0:21:50.680 --> 0:21:53.879 first first deer kill. But it always just crapped me up. 0:21:53.880 --> 0:21:56.760 I'm like, it is just the worst deer kill that 0:21:56.800 --> 0:22:00.399 you could fussily imagine. I didn't do any work. Whoever 0:22:02.080 --> 0:22:04.520 out I tapped out, get out of the truck. You 0:22:04.560 --> 0:22:07.879 could have fallen over, like you were a safe. It 0:22:08.040 --> 0:22:10.480 was just about on pars what we call heat or 0:22:10.560 --> 0:22:13.960 hunting up there where people are just driving so you know, 0:22:14.240 --> 0:22:16.760 just you know, scouting glass in the fields, like what 0:22:16.840 --> 0:22:18.760 if anything is in the field after, you know, while 0:22:18.760 --> 0:22:21.480 I'm eating his donut. You know, my father hated that. 0:22:21.640 --> 0:22:25.200 He's like, no, those guys don't pay for it. No. 0:22:25.400 --> 0:22:28.040 One time I was in Saskatchewan hunt and they were like, here, 0:22:28.080 --> 0:22:31.120 what something call though? What's the thing called heater body suit? 0:22:31.200 --> 0:22:33.960 They were like, put this on. It was like negative twenty, 0:22:34.000 --> 0:22:37.200 like you're talking about. And I was like, okay, well 0:22:37.240 --> 0:22:38.879 you know what is it. It's like kind of like 0:22:38.920 --> 0:22:41.879 a sleeping bag. It's got heaters inside it, and so 0:22:42.160 --> 0:22:44.159 you sit there, you're totally comfortable. So I get up 0:22:44.160 --> 0:22:46.680 in this tree, stand, put on this little sleeping bag 0:22:46.720 --> 0:22:49.520 and turn it on, and I'm asleep in five minutes. 0:22:49.920 --> 0:22:52.040 Of course, I'm as sleep at five minutes. I mean 0:22:52.080 --> 0:22:55.840 I heated sleeping bag and I slept for like three 0:22:55.880 --> 0:23:00.720 hours working to get out of the tree. But but yes, 0:23:01.320 --> 0:23:04.040 I grew up much the same way. And so and 0:23:04.720 --> 0:23:06.639 the first year that I were killed, first year I 0:23:06.720 --> 0:23:09.800 was shot at fact, I just skinned her. I remember 0:23:09.840 --> 0:23:11.919 my my dad put shooting sticks on the ground. I 0:23:11.920 --> 0:23:14.680 put a rifle down. He's like, she's right there, she's 0:23:14.800 --> 0:23:17.959 fifty yards away. Like I don't I don't got it, man, 0:23:18.040 --> 0:23:20.080 I don't know what to do. I think I see 0:23:20.119 --> 0:23:23.399 the sky, but I'm not sure. And eventually popped a 0:23:23.440 --> 0:23:27.359 shot and skinner right shoulder. But yeah, I wish I 0:23:27.359 --> 0:23:29.959 had one laying down that great, yeah, exactly, Like it 0:23:30.040 --> 0:23:32.640 was easy killing there, but it was simpler that those 0:23:32.640 --> 0:23:35.920 times are simpler, you know, like that he weren't worried 0:23:35.920 --> 0:23:39.520 about how big it saidlers were or old spikeline. Yeah, 0:23:39.880 --> 0:23:42.960 I didn't need anything then you were just meat on 0:23:42.960 --> 0:23:46.960 the table. Yeah, first year kills the simplest form of 0:23:47.040 --> 0:23:50.800 hunting because it's just there's a deer, and I everything 0:23:50.880 --> 0:23:53.679 that goes into the actual killing of the deer is 0:23:53.720 --> 0:23:56.000 more important than the deer at that point, like getting 0:23:56.000 --> 0:23:59.560 your cross airs on it, exactly, hecty. I think the 0:23:59.640 --> 0:24:02.880 third line got was dough you know, the first time 0:24:02.880 --> 0:24:04.520 I got my my dope because you gotta get a 0:24:04.560 --> 0:24:07.399 permit to get dose up up there and yeah, well 0:24:07.440 --> 0:24:08.720 I got it. But you guys do a lot of 0:24:08.800 --> 0:24:12.399 venicity eating growing up. Yeah, Yeah, for sure. I'm always 0:24:12.400 --> 0:24:14.399 interested to ask, like how how it was cooked up, 0:24:14.400 --> 0:24:19.000 because there's always this like my dad cooked everything. Yeah no, no, 0:24:19.600 --> 0:24:21.520 I totally hear you. And it's funny because I've played 0:24:21.560 --> 0:24:23.000 around with like all kinds of different stuff and I 0:24:23.040 --> 0:24:26.399 really get into the cooking thing now, especially since all 0:24:26.440 --> 0:24:27.840 I do is eat game. Now. I don't even go 0:24:27.880 --> 0:24:31.880 to the grocery strud not for meat anyway, Like protein 0:24:32.040 --> 0:24:36.280 is halbot salmon, I'll go, dear, you know that's that's 0:24:36.280 --> 0:24:37.920 the freezer. You know, Phil it up and just changed 0:24:37.920 --> 0:24:40.280 it up every day. But no, I grew up with 0:24:40.520 --> 0:24:43.440 uh yeah, a lot of venison, um moose on a 0:24:43.480 --> 0:24:46.719 few occasions, caribou. My father went up to Canada and 0:24:46.880 --> 0:24:53.400 got some caribou at one point in time. Uh what else? 0:24:53.520 --> 0:24:54.960 We did have the black bear? When you got a 0:24:55.000 --> 0:24:57.240 black bearer at one time and eat, you know, country 0:24:57.240 --> 0:24:59.760 to belief, it's not that great eating, but you can't 0:24:59.760 --> 0:25:03.439 eat black bears like it's it's reasonable. And but his 0:25:03.520 --> 0:25:07.280 way was just straight up. It's like pan seared with butter, 0:25:07.320 --> 0:25:09.159 salt and pepper, and it's like that's it. And I 0:25:09.320 --> 0:25:12.679 was like, you know who put that cookbook out? Because 0:25:13.359 --> 0:25:16.520 it's not bad. I mean my like this last Thanksgiving, 0:25:16.560 --> 0:25:18.600 my dad tried up some tender learn I'm like, this 0:25:18.600 --> 0:25:21.080 tastes like my childhood and it's good. It's good. It's 0:25:21.080 --> 0:25:24.520 not good for you, but good. There must have been 0:25:24.520 --> 0:25:26.560 just a cookbook where somebody wrote like this is like 0:25:26.640 --> 0:25:29.080 three page cookbook and the first page said butter, the 0:25:29.080 --> 0:25:31.479 second page said salt, on the last page said pepper, 0:25:31.640 --> 0:25:35.840 and that was it. And seen it was like, that's 0:25:35.840 --> 0:25:37.439 what that's what my dad did. So I was wondering 0:25:37.480 --> 0:25:39.760 just being a couple of like generally East Coast kids, 0:25:39.760 --> 0:25:42.160 that that's what. Oh, that's that's that's definitely what it was. 0:25:42.320 --> 0:25:43.919 And I found my own ways of you know, what 0:25:44.000 --> 0:25:45.680 I prefer, and I don't mind it that way at all, 0:25:45.720 --> 0:25:48.440 but it always did crack gap saying no, that's all 0:25:48.440 --> 0:25:50.520 I want. And I'm like, well, it's kind of no wonder. 0:25:50.600 --> 0:25:52.960 My mom, you know, never really liked eating Man. She 0:25:53.000 --> 0:25:54.760 really didn't. She never liked it. She didn't like the 0:25:54.760 --> 0:25:57.560 gaming flavor. And I was like, well, that's because Pop's 0:25:57.600 --> 0:25:59.760 never prepared it any better way, like the kind of 0:26:00.240 --> 0:26:04.000 your flavorings. What if I put, uh differ kind of butter. Yeah, 0:26:04.520 --> 0:26:07.080 you know, get some fancy spices or some ball son 0:26:07.160 --> 0:26:11.440 like Connor, you know, marinate it, you know, yes, something. Yeah. 0:26:11.440 --> 0:26:14.440 I mean, it's it's funny that that generational change. I mean, 0:26:14.440 --> 0:26:17.280 it really is. It's something that I've experienced with my dad. 0:26:17.400 --> 0:26:20.520 My dad. I love my dad to death, and and um, 0:26:20.840 --> 0:26:23.280 there was just a different way, just a different way 0:26:23.359 --> 0:26:27.000 to treat treat the hunting and the meat, which I 0:26:27.000 --> 0:26:29.480 feel like the hunting parts almost more simple, you know, 0:26:29.520 --> 0:26:32.600 it's a simpler effort than some of the things we 0:26:32.640 --> 0:26:38.240 do today. But surely, um the meat still had reverence, 0:26:38.240 --> 0:26:40.679 but it just didn't have the same There wasn't you know, 0:26:41.080 --> 0:26:43.840 there's no fine point on how to on how to 0:26:43.880 --> 0:26:45.960 prepare it. It was for sure, what do you you 0:26:45.960 --> 0:26:47.679 want to stew or I'll pry it up. That's it. 0:26:48.200 --> 0:26:50.640 That's all we got. Yeah, it wasn't any other differences 0:26:50.640 --> 0:26:51.920 in no other way. And I think part of that 0:26:51.960 --> 0:26:53.520 was because my mom didn't need it, so he didn't 0:26:53.520 --> 0:26:55.640 really make it anything. He's like, I'm gonna I like it. 0:26:55.720 --> 0:27:00.720 So but you know, my uh my pops, you know, 0:27:00.720 --> 0:27:03.119 they're pretty poor grown up, especially when the kids. So 0:27:03.200 --> 0:27:04.960 the deer was just all about, you know, just getting 0:27:05.000 --> 0:27:07.280 food and meeting the freezer, feeding the kids. Like That's 0:27:07.280 --> 0:27:08.920 how it was. Even from my bay when he would 0:27:09.000 --> 0:27:11.359 uh go and get the deer, and he was all 0:27:11.359 --> 0:27:15.480 about eating like whatever extra parts and organs and everything else. 0:27:15.560 --> 0:27:18.040 Loved the heart. Heart was his favorite. Yeah, I still 0:27:18.040 --> 0:27:20.600 love the heart myself, and and liver as well, and 0:27:20.680 --> 0:27:22.800 even with the deer that I just killed a h 0:27:23.520 --> 0:27:25.560 on opening season and Kodiak like that was the first 0:27:25.600 --> 0:27:27.520 thing I did, is like all those organ meats and everything, 0:27:27.560 --> 0:27:30.119 and just like I stewed him up and now they're 0:27:30.160 --> 0:27:31.800 you know, they're frozen. I was waiting for, you know, 0:27:31.920 --> 0:27:34.760 the little colder because it was you know warm for Kodiac. 0:27:34.880 --> 0:27:43.560 It was like you know there, yeah, exactly, So in 0:27:43.600 --> 0:27:45.960 my mind I was just thinking, yeah, okay, too warm. Nope, 0:27:45.960 --> 0:27:48.200 I gotta wait for the nice cold, deep heart of 0:27:48.200 --> 0:27:51.199 winter and break that stuff out and yeah, delicious, you 0:27:51.240 --> 0:27:55.760 know it transporting back to the Cody Act across the world, 0:27:55.760 --> 0:27:59.239 basically across the country for sure. Yeah, yeah, as far 0:27:59.280 --> 0:28:01.000 as you can go. Time I've spent time in a 0:28:01.080 --> 0:28:04.960 coastal in a coastal Alaska environment, of any Prince of 0:28:04.960 --> 0:28:07.800 Wales comes to mind, you know, Kodiak comes to mind. 0:28:07.800 --> 0:28:11.240 Of course, the falcon that comes to mind. I always 0:28:11.280 --> 0:28:14.640 come away thinking this is a rich place, like this 0:28:14.720 --> 0:28:18.919 is game rich, wildlife rich. I mean, Prince of Wales 0:28:19.040 --> 0:28:22.119 is just jaw dropping with with what you see and 0:28:22.200 --> 0:28:27.000 experience there from wildlife perspective. But so is Kodiak. Um. 0:28:27.040 --> 0:28:29.760 But the second thing I think is what a harsh, 0:28:30.160 --> 0:28:35.560 harsh environment. Um, and that's you know, I would I 0:28:35.560 --> 0:28:40.000 would say the starkness of that relationship, and in most 0:28:40.000 --> 0:28:44.200 of the coastal Alaska is what draws me to it. 0:28:44.360 --> 0:28:46.920 I'm sure what draws you to it. I mean, you 0:28:46.920 --> 0:28:50.480 can have just amazing When we went to Kodiak with coal, 0:28:50.560 --> 0:28:54.800 I mean, it was bald eagles and blacktail deer and 0:28:55.240 --> 0:28:58.320 silver foxes, and I mean it's just it's it's a 0:28:58.440 --> 0:29:01.880 rich place. But then the river froze and we were 0:29:01.880 --> 0:29:07.440 struggling to get home, so turned a little harsh. Yeah. Um, 0:29:07.720 --> 0:29:10.080 has that been your experience kind of going through the 0:29:10.120 --> 0:29:14.800 seasons on Kodiak. Yeah, there's a lot of similarities to me. 0:29:15.040 --> 0:29:16.760 That's kind of what drove me there in in the 0:29:16.800 --> 0:29:20.600 first place. But Kodiak doesn't really have that that full 0:29:20.680 --> 0:29:24.320 fourth season kind of effect. It's more of winter and 0:29:24.360 --> 0:29:28.120 then summer. The shoulder seasons are just kind of mixed in, 0:29:28.600 --> 0:29:31.160 and the summer there isn't really warm. You know, it's 0:29:31.200 --> 0:29:33.560 just those long days because being close to the you know, 0:29:33.560 --> 0:29:36.840 the Arctic circling up north the poles, you get those 0:29:36.880 --> 0:29:39.680 really really long daylight hours and then they're really really long, 0:29:40.040 --> 0:29:42.680 uh well, dark hours, I guess lack of lack of 0:29:42.760 --> 0:29:47.200 daylight hours. And the harshness is definitely like the driving 0:29:47.200 --> 0:29:49.959 point and in me being there and really testing the limits. 0:29:50.000 --> 0:29:55.120 And it's even in May never grew I never really 0:29:55.120 --> 0:30:00.440 grew up with the the harsh range you get there. 0:30:00.480 --> 0:30:02.160 I say, the rain is like almost the worst. And 0:30:02.200 --> 0:30:04.440 I've never been at Washington Seattle like that kind of 0:30:04.800 --> 0:30:06.680 climate where you just hear about it raining all the time. 0:30:06.760 --> 0:30:09.800 But I swear to God, it will get below thirty 0:30:09.800 --> 0:30:12.160 two degrees in Kodiak and it will still be raining somehow. 0:30:12.520 --> 0:30:14.320 And it's the harshest thing that you ever have to 0:30:14.360 --> 0:30:17.360 deal with. Is especially like out hunting or doing anything 0:30:17.360 --> 0:30:20.800 in in the woods, is be on the kid through 0:30:20.840 --> 0:30:23.280 that because it's just like, how is this even possible? 0:30:23.320 --> 0:30:26.120 And you're just you can't stay dry, It's almost impossible. 0:30:26.160 --> 0:30:29.280 I've tried so many different types of clothing and gear 0:30:29.400 --> 0:30:31.440 and and and you know, that's what I really enjoy 0:30:31.520 --> 0:30:35.280 doing anyway, And man, is it wild being out there. 0:30:35.440 --> 0:30:38.280 And then you just get hit with these you know, 0:30:38.560 --> 0:30:41.960 maritime winds, and it's that really salty air and it's 0:30:41.960 --> 0:30:44.720 just corrods and and crushes everything. They don't even salt 0:30:44.720 --> 0:30:46.360 the roads, but your vehicle has got like a ticking 0:30:46.440 --> 0:30:49.040 time bomb. You know that salty air is gonna, you know, 0:30:49.160 --> 0:30:51.719 do its own damage. But it is. It's a very 0:30:51.800 --> 0:30:53.800 very unique place and the same that you see with 0:30:53.840 --> 0:30:56.360 a snowpack. There, um do a lot of snow work 0:30:56.400 --> 0:31:01.440 and travel, and uh, that maritime snowpack is just you 0:31:01.520 --> 0:31:03.880 might have like a a good day of powder when 0:31:03.880 --> 0:31:06.080 it's like initial and then it just turns the ice 0:31:07.040 --> 0:31:10.640 just this solid crust of ice and um and guys 0:31:10.680 --> 0:31:12.920 get their experience that even if they don't go out 0:31:12.920 --> 0:31:15.120 and hunt really quick as you're familiar with, and and 0:31:15.280 --> 0:31:19.240 flying in and out of coach because it's it's its 0:31:19.240 --> 0:31:22.880 own beasts and you're just you're gonna expect if you're there, 0:31:23.120 --> 0:31:26.160 you will get a delayed flight or canceled flight. Oh 0:31:26.400 --> 0:31:29.400 and bless the pilots that live on Codia. These are 0:31:29.560 --> 0:31:34.880 insane human beings. These people, Yeah, they're they're the most skilled. 0:31:34.920 --> 0:31:38.280 But also I've never met one that wasn't just I mean, 0:31:38.480 --> 0:31:42.840 i'mous crazy. Yeah, I gotta a few of them I met. 0:31:42.840 --> 0:31:46.600 I won't name a name, but one time they uh 0:31:46.840 --> 0:31:49.160 landed us in the lagoon drop us off on the beach, 0:31:49.200 --> 0:31:52.440 had to go hike up after blacktail deer. And we 0:31:52.560 --> 0:31:54.920 landed and kind of tax it up to the to 0:31:55.000 --> 0:31:57.200 the beach there and before we could even get our 0:31:57.240 --> 0:31:59.560 packs or anything out of the out of the plane are, 0:32:00.360 --> 0:32:04.360 our pilot was running up a hill with a pistol 0:32:04.520 --> 0:32:07.680 with like a ten mill chasing a black tail around 0:32:07.720 --> 0:32:10.400 on the beach. Of course he was he was like, hey, 0:32:10.680 --> 0:32:13.200 hold the line, hold the plane here, I gotta I'll 0:32:13.240 --> 0:32:16.360 be back. You think, run up there, like that's about 0:32:16.360 --> 0:32:20.080 far for this course. That sounds the screws are some 0:32:20.120 --> 0:32:22.200 of the screws are a little bit loose. Oh yeah, no, 0:32:22.320 --> 0:32:24.680 And that's that's exactly how you'll just see it happened. 0:32:24.680 --> 0:32:27.000 Like later on in the season. A lot of people 0:32:27.000 --> 0:32:30.360 who really enjoy the hunting and kind of the whole experience, 0:32:30.560 --> 0:32:34.920 you know, going out and trying to find a deer. Ah, 0:32:35.080 --> 0:32:37.000 we'll go out and just brave it and get through 0:32:37.160 --> 0:32:41.280 just the ship terrain that involves. And the terrain is 0:32:41.440 --> 0:32:43.560 hands down the worst part. You have the drain and 0:32:43.640 --> 0:32:47.200 the weather, and really only in Kodiak can you find 0:32:47.720 --> 0:32:51.959 such extremes to have the salt water right there coastline 0:32:52.000 --> 0:32:55.480 and then it just it just explodes up and it 0:32:55.560 --> 0:33:01.960 is extremely extremely steep alpine climates and yeah below the 0:33:02.000 --> 0:33:05.400 alpine climates are like hummocks that you can barely walk 0:33:05.440 --> 0:33:08.800 on when it can and uh as I we talked 0:33:08.800 --> 0:33:12.040 about earlier than my opening uh day hunt and the 0:33:12.560 --> 0:33:15.720 vegetation there's just like jungle like there's certain parts if 0:33:15.760 --> 0:33:17.720 you're not going to the right place, like it's impassable. 0:33:17.840 --> 0:33:20.080 It really is, especially getting a steep train and you 0:33:20.240 --> 0:33:22.880 can't even your body will not push any further, like 0:33:22.960 --> 0:33:29.040 through the uh salmon berries, you know, glorified uh thorn 0:33:29.120 --> 0:33:30.840 bushes you know up there that just like tear you 0:33:30.920 --> 0:33:35.360 up and getting through that's just insane. But the other 0:33:35.560 --> 0:33:39.239 uh ironic part there that most people aren't aware of 0:33:39.440 --> 0:33:42.560 is that unlike Colorado spent a lot of time there, 0:33:42.640 --> 0:33:45.680 the alpine there is usually like eleven thousand feet give 0:33:45.760 --> 0:33:49.960 or take, and in Codiac's eleven feet and that can 0:33:49.960 --> 0:33:51.640 be a blessing and a curse. Like it's a good thing. 0:33:51.680 --> 0:33:54.120 It's like, obviously you're not fighting altitude or anything like 0:33:54.120 --> 0:33:56.760 that high up, it's it doesn't it doesn't affect you. However, 0:33:57.120 --> 0:34:00.760 it's just just shows you that extreme either change that 0:34:00.880 --> 0:34:02.920 just happens in such a short amount of time where 0:34:02.960 --> 0:34:06.480 you're just going from sea level to eleven feet and 0:34:06.520 --> 0:34:10.680 you're just going to be in it like ridiculously high winds, 0:34:10.760 --> 0:34:13.759 like getting blown over. Yeah. I mean in general, that's 0:34:13.800 --> 0:34:18.520 not that far up, not at all. You know, you 0:34:18.560 --> 0:34:21.799 can do two thousand feet in some place in New 0:34:21.880 --> 0:34:24.239 Zealand and other places that it's not really you know, 0:34:24.880 --> 0:34:27.720 not really that harsh. Yeah, But on Kodiak it's different. 0:34:27.800 --> 0:34:32.719 It's it's insane and the So another funny story here. 0:34:32.920 --> 0:34:36.600 The the day that I showed up in Kodiak, you know, 0:34:36.719 --> 0:34:38.880 I kind of went right in. It got with you know, 0:34:38.920 --> 0:34:41.520 some friends that already dow they were there and I 0:34:41.560 --> 0:34:44.240 want to go out and spend some time overnight, uh 0:34:44.280 --> 0:34:47.320 in the field. And it was right around hunting time again, 0:34:47.760 --> 0:34:49.719 hunting season. I got it there in like late July 0:34:49.800 --> 0:34:52.480 and hunting season open on August one, and I was 0:34:52.520 --> 0:34:54.480 really really motivated and like, okay, I don't know this 0:34:54.520 --> 0:34:56.080 are at all. I was talking to some guys like okay, 0:34:56.080 --> 0:34:58.200 where do I go? So they're kind of pointing me 0:34:58.239 --> 0:35:00.200 in this direction, like hey, go go this right out 0:35:00.200 --> 0:35:04.720 and and I'd never experienced the same type of jungle 0:35:05.160 --> 0:35:10.279 ship show as I did uh in Kodiak, and I 0:35:10.280 --> 0:35:11.960 swear to god, I was going out the night before. 0:35:12.000 --> 0:35:14.239 I was like, Okay, I'm gonna go out, bivvy out 0:35:14.280 --> 0:35:16.520 overnight and hunt the following morning, you know, break it down, 0:35:16.600 --> 0:35:18.799 like be upgrady to go. I had a good place 0:35:18.800 --> 0:35:21.840 in mind, like took my maps and everything, and of 0:35:21.880 --> 0:35:23.440 course I wasn't to wear bears at this time or 0:35:23.520 --> 0:35:26.839 either I knew sneer they were there and went out 0:35:27.440 --> 0:35:29.799 and I thought it was a prank. I thought the 0:35:29.800 --> 0:35:32.120 guys are just like they're pulling my chain. They have 0:35:32.160 --> 0:35:34.080 them and over on me, and I was just pissed 0:35:34.120 --> 0:35:36.680 the entire time. I'm like, how do you get through this? 0:35:37.040 --> 0:35:39.239 And like there's no way. They were saying, there's no 0:35:39.280 --> 0:35:40.880 way I can get all the way up there, and 0:35:40.960 --> 0:35:44.880 like in this it was just horrible. They call that, 0:35:45.000 --> 0:35:50.600 they call it the gar hole. I'm like, and they 0:35:50.640 --> 0:35:53.880 actually really meant it. But there was just like I 0:35:54.000 --> 0:35:56.640 really got a full appreciation of deer paths there and 0:35:56.760 --> 0:35:59.200 understanding it's like, Okay, there's definitely a level of suck 0:35:59.280 --> 0:36:01.319 that you're gonna have to put yourself through, but I 0:36:01.400 --> 0:36:04.920 was still experience gonna you know, or of the false 0:36:06.160 --> 0:36:08.799 presumption that I'm like, Okay, I'm gonna go through and 0:36:08.840 --> 0:36:10.319 find a place that just like opens up and I 0:36:10.320 --> 0:36:12.239 can walk in like a origin line or something, and 0:36:12.239 --> 0:36:13.880 it's like it never did. They're like, no, this this 0:36:14.080 --> 0:36:17.120 dear path, like if you step one step sideways, like 0:36:17.160 --> 0:36:19.359 you're off it and you'll never find it again. And 0:36:19.400 --> 0:36:26.879 it's it's just one of those brutal quick learning experiences. Yes, yes, 0:36:26.960 --> 0:36:29.799 And I think maybe the Kodiak Island Tourism Board might 0:36:29.840 --> 0:36:33.560 not like this podcast. Yeah, it's true. Man, if you like, 0:36:33.680 --> 0:36:36.600 if you know, there's there's companies like companies like sick 0:36:36.680 --> 0:36:39.840 of Gear and other companies that that really rely on 0:36:40.080 --> 0:36:43.960 folks like coal and others that that live and hunt 0:36:44.680 --> 0:36:48.000 in that environment to test the gear, because again, it 0:36:48.160 --> 0:36:52.440 is one of the harpstist and harshest environments that you 0:36:52.480 --> 0:36:56.240 will come across in question anywhere in the world, I feel. 0:36:56.480 --> 0:36:59.200 And so I think that's a good setup to get 0:36:59.239 --> 0:37:04.960 into what happened to you. Um, and we also have 0:37:05.000 --> 0:37:07.360 to get into what you know, a falk Knack island. 0:37:07.360 --> 0:37:09.280 I think a falkneck island from a lot of folks 0:37:09.320 --> 0:37:12.360 listening to this and even for those who haven't heard 0:37:12.680 --> 0:37:19.280 the Themitre podcast, which is Steve Rinella um Remy Warren 0:37:19.400 --> 0:37:23.400 in a bunch of camera guys, they're filming the Mediator 0:37:23.400 --> 0:37:27.440 podcast of doing a Medior podcast filming for the Mediator 0:37:27.480 --> 0:37:31.960 TV show on a fog neck. Um. I think this 0:37:31.960 --> 0:37:37.040 would have been last year, and they were charged by 0:37:37.080 --> 0:37:42.440 a big old bear and uh an interesting story ensued. 0:37:42.520 --> 0:37:46.120 Luckily there no one was injured at all, rather than 0:37:46.239 --> 0:37:50.440 some um some mental hurdles to get over after the fact. 0:37:50.560 --> 0:37:53.600 But that's where I first heard about Falkneck, and I 0:37:53.640 --> 0:37:56.200 think that's probably where a lot of people first heard 0:37:56.600 --> 0:38:00.800 about a fog Neck because Kodiak is um a familiar 0:38:00.880 --> 0:38:02.560 name to those in the hunting industry and the fishing 0:38:02.600 --> 0:38:06.000 industry and even you know, just regular folks at large. 0:38:07.239 --> 0:38:10.520 But a fog Neck is just a different place, oh 0:38:10.520 --> 0:38:15.720 for sure, so uh for the people unaware. So everything 0:38:15.840 --> 0:38:18.239 is is a part of Kodiak, but it has so 0:38:18.280 --> 0:38:21.360 many outlying islands, and a fog Neck is kind of 0:38:21.400 --> 0:38:26.640 the northern big island just attached from Kodiak proper. There's 0:38:26.640 --> 0:38:29.200 about a bunch of other islands up there. Raspberries a 0:38:29.200 --> 0:38:31.640 really well known one for its elk and um and 0:38:31.680 --> 0:38:33.880 likewise with a fog neck, and there's also a marmot 0:38:34.000 --> 0:38:37.200 and spruce and all these other ones. But we were 0:38:37.239 --> 0:38:39.760 out on a fog neck specifically for the elk hunting, 0:38:39.800 --> 0:38:43.439 really really well known for its elk population out there, 0:38:43.680 --> 0:38:51.120 and these elk are ah incredible. First of all, we 0:38:51.200 --> 0:38:53.319 had done a hunt me and some of the other 0:38:53.360 --> 0:38:57.320 guys the prior year and just capitalized and it was awesome, 0:38:57.440 --> 0:39:00.920 had a great time and uh, these are just massive. 0:39:01.000 --> 0:39:04.480 They're not like the Colorado or Wyoming type elk w 0:39:04.600 --> 0:39:08.759 you have, you know, the massive racks, but they're just huge. 0:39:09.880 --> 0:39:14.359 One of the biggest body and uh and we had 0:39:14.719 --> 0:39:17.280 a fantastic time. And I got to go with another 0:39:17.320 --> 0:39:22.040 guy um the same year prior to that, and uh 0:39:22.280 --> 0:39:24.680 he he drew, so he had a draw and he 0:39:24.760 --> 0:39:27.239 actually did his on Raspberry and did win there. So 0:39:27.239 --> 0:39:29.080 I've had a couple of good elk hunts there and 0:39:29.520 --> 0:39:32.480 we wanted to repeat this year. So it just puts 0:39:32.520 --> 0:39:34.440 a lot of good meat and the freezer for everybody. 0:39:34.480 --> 0:39:36.680 And I think that answers the question of after I've 0:39:36.960 --> 0:39:40.920 heard Remy and Steve's story. You know, the question becomes 0:39:41.040 --> 0:39:45.120 why a fog mack? Knowing you know the inherent danger 0:39:45.160 --> 0:39:49.640 of the environment. I mean it's harsh, harsh environment, especially 0:39:49.640 --> 0:39:52.040 the times that you were there and when those guys 0:39:52.040 --> 0:39:54.360 are over there. So I mean it's rain, it suck, 0:39:54.640 --> 0:39:57.560 it's hard to move around, it takes you know, oh, 0:39:57.640 --> 0:39:59.200 we only have to get a mile that direction. Well 0:39:59.239 --> 0:40:02.560 that's gonna take us four hours. Um, so it's it's 0:40:03.400 --> 0:40:06.120 we'll get into you know, let you describe a little 0:40:06.160 --> 0:40:07.520 bit of your experience. Is there. But you know the 0:40:07.600 --> 0:40:10.879 question of why becomes it's close to where you live. 0:40:11.080 --> 0:40:14.160 It's a plane right away, and there's giant elk there 0:40:15.239 --> 0:40:16.960 that can give you a year's worth of meat. That's 0:40:16.960 --> 0:40:19.319 probably four pounds of meat, yes easily, you know you 0:40:19.320 --> 0:40:23.120 split it up, and it's it's incredible and uh yeah, 0:40:23.120 --> 0:40:26.400 I know the boys and I, uh so I go 0:40:26.480 --> 0:40:29.040 for an elk hunt and uh we took a boat 0:40:29.080 --> 0:40:32.359 over actually, um and got to our kind of hunting 0:40:32.360 --> 0:40:36.480 spot where we do how uh let's say like an 0:40:36.480 --> 0:40:38.520 hour and a half. That's not long. No, it's not 0:40:38.520 --> 0:40:41.040 it's not bad at all. Um, not from the main 0:40:41.120 --> 0:40:44.680 like Dog Harbor area, and Kodiak anywhere you launched from it. 0:40:44.719 --> 0:40:47.240 That's probably where most people launch from anyways, Dog Harbor, 0:40:47.600 --> 0:40:49.640 And it just kind of depends on, of course, the 0:40:49.640 --> 0:40:53.000 sea state and the tides because there's some passes that 0:40:53.040 --> 0:40:55.480 you can take to get there. Um, they can get through, 0:40:55.560 --> 0:40:57.200 otherwise you gonna go all the way around. They'll take 0:40:57.200 --> 0:40:58.719 a lot longer, but I think about an hour and 0:40:58.719 --> 0:41:00.640 a half that is what it was. And as a resident, 0:41:00.680 --> 0:41:02.759 is it pretty easy to grab a tag to go 0:41:02.840 --> 0:41:08.959 over there? Yeah? No, Um, the registration hunt opens. Um 0:41:09.160 --> 0:41:13.160 all on the kind of for lack of a better term, 0:41:13.200 --> 0:41:16.520 I guess, quota on on how the draw hunts go. 0:41:17.640 --> 0:41:20.719 So the ELK has really really highly regulated, and it 0:41:20.840 --> 0:41:26.200 was let's see two seasons prior to this one where 0:41:26.840 --> 0:41:28.319 none of us actually got to go. We were trying 0:41:28.360 --> 0:41:30.799 to make it work and get everybody organized, and they 0:41:30.840 --> 0:41:33.239 shut it down. So the way it works is the 0:41:33.320 --> 0:41:37.960 draw hunts all happen and then uh, I guess some 0:41:38.080 --> 0:41:40.080 years they might not even open it, but they'll open 0:41:40.120 --> 0:41:43.200 it on the same date. Uh remember what it it was 0:41:43.239 --> 0:41:46.640 this year. I think it's November or something like that. 0:41:46.640 --> 0:41:51.919 That sounds about right. Maybe, Oh, no, October would be October. Yeah, 0:41:52.040 --> 0:41:54.080 it had to be so October I think is when 0:41:54.080 --> 0:41:56.920 it opens for the public and you just go pick 0:41:56.960 --> 0:42:00.399 up your tag. It's free, and every day to call 0:42:00.480 --> 0:42:03.120 in find out if it's still open, and then as 0:42:03.160 --> 0:42:07.560 soon as you do get one, you're required to call 0:42:07.600 --> 0:42:10.120 it in I think within forty eight hours really the 0:42:10.160 --> 0:42:12.560 same day as oftenly what you want to do, um, 0:42:12.719 --> 0:42:14.880 just to let them know what the population is, and 0:42:14.920 --> 0:42:18.120 then whether whatever quota they set fishing game does then 0:42:18.120 --> 0:42:21.279 it's like closed down and unlike all you know, most 0:42:21.360 --> 0:42:23.080 other hunts you have like five days, it's like, okay, 0:42:23.160 --> 0:42:25.319 five days calling, but it's like the Elk is very 0:42:25.400 --> 0:42:28.960 very strict and um because it's all it's all herds 0:42:29.000 --> 0:42:33.840 there and um, I don't know where that's going on that. 0:42:33.920 --> 0:42:36.920 But yeah, October three, and we kind of switched out 0:42:36.920 --> 0:42:39.680 with some other guys on this hunt and sent some 0:42:39.719 --> 0:42:42.799 other guys over there first and then we swapped out 0:42:42.800 --> 0:42:45.120 with them and they didn't have any any luck whatsoever. 0:42:45.920 --> 0:42:49.600 And as you well know, and I know he has 0:42:49.680 --> 0:42:51.520 get some good experience over there. I've seen some of 0:42:51.560 --> 0:42:54.640 the shows and podcasts as well. But the weather is 0:42:54.680 --> 0:42:57.960 just also just as crazy over there, even probably more so, 0:42:58.040 --> 0:43:02.640 I think, um, because there is no roads, no really 0:43:02.920 --> 0:43:06.720 well taken past or trails. Like if you're gonna find something, 0:43:07.120 --> 0:43:10.080 your goal is to kind of get up the ridgeline 0:43:10.840 --> 0:43:12.840 and and then hopefully you can see but at the 0:43:12.840 --> 0:43:14.560 cloud cover is low enough, you're not gonna able to 0:43:14.560 --> 0:43:18.480 see anything, Like you just can't get anywhere. And uh, 0:43:19.560 --> 0:43:22.120 obviously come to find out, it's like the bear population 0:43:22.160 --> 0:43:25.880 there is is well aware of elk and and the 0:43:25.920 --> 0:43:28.120 people there, and they're not city bears. You know, they're 0:43:28.200 --> 0:43:32.840 very u well versed in in being the primal creature 0:43:32.920 --> 0:43:35.799 over there. Did you like when going into this this 0:43:35.840 --> 0:43:39.920 particular hunt and you hunt up before obviously, and um, 0:43:39.920 --> 0:43:42.520 going into this hunt, what's your you know, what's your mindset? 0:43:43.080 --> 0:43:44.840 You know if this would be a lot of questions 0:43:44.840 --> 0:43:48.040 in one but had you had any bear experiences on 0:43:48.120 --> 0:43:52.080 a fog neck prior and going into this hunt? What 0:43:52.120 --> 0:43:55.360 was your preparation as far as communication with the mainland 0:43:56.200 --> 0:44:02.120 um and medical supplies and and protection from bears? I mean, 0:44:02.160 --> 0:44:04.760 I know, like that's informed by just your general knowledge 0:44:04.800 --> 0:44:07.960 of wilderness or medicine and and what you've done in 0:44:08.000 --> 0:44:09.920 the past, but that's also informed by you know what 0:44:09.960 --> 0:44:14.239 you've seen over there, and UM, so yeah, me and 0:44:14.239 --> 0:44:16.839 the boys, Uh, it's always standard for us every time 0:44:16.880 --> 0:44:19.320 we're going out bringing a STAP phone. Um, we always 0:44:19.360 --> 0:44:21.480 have a SAP phone with us. At least one guys 0:44:21.480 --> 0:44:24.359 have that. We actually had multiple dorm in reaches with us. 0:44:25.800 --> 0:44:28.600 A fantastic yeah, and well it's funny enough. I've got 0:44:28.600 --> 0:44:29.799 to get a story on that when we when we 0:44:29.840 --> 0:44:33.520 get to it. UM in comparison, I guess, but uh, 0:44:33.600 --> 0:44:36.000 and then guys have gps is and cell phones as 0:44:36.000 --> 0:44:37.839 well that we use for gps is. All of us 0:44:38.200 --> 0:44:41.000 pretty much use the Guy app on our cell phones. 0:44:41.040 --> 0:44:44.640 It's it's it's great, but no, those are kind of 0:44:44.640 --> 0:44:48.920 our our primary like electronic devices that we use. UM. 0:44:49.000 --> 0:44:51.600 And then we always have a first aid kit that 0:44:51.640 --> 0:44:54.000 everybody has pretty much standard with them as well as 0:44:54.040 --> 0:44:57.359 turning kits. And then every guy's got one of those, UM, 0:44:57.480 --> 0:44:59.480 and then everybody's carrying with them. Some guys will have 0:44:59.480 --> 0:45:02.840 like a little bit more or less depending but you know, everybody, 0:45:02.840 --> 0:45:04.880 everybody's got one of those. The dorm injury which is 0:45:04.920 --> 0:45:08.279 I think we had at least two, and then at 0:45:08.320 --> 0:45:11.000 least like a plethora of rifles. You know, and and 0:45:11.080 --> 0:45:14.240 pistols combos thereof, so I think we pretty much covered 0:45:14.239 --> 0:45:16.640 our bases. And to be honest, like when this all 0:45:16.680 --> 0:45:19.120 went down, I still think it went down textbook like 0:45:19.160 --> 0:45:22.919 couldn't win anybody better under the circumstances, and uh, never 0:45:22.960 --> 0:45:27.560 had any better experiences over there before, and honestly before 0:45:27.600 --> 0:45:31.520 that had never even seen. Yeah, it was kind of 0:45:31.600 --> 0:45:35.360 kind of surprised even us. So the year prior to 0:45:35.520 --> 0:45:40.080 when we did the elk cunt um, we kind of 0:45:40.080 --> 0:45:41.799 came up with this system. We did it all in 0:45:41.840 --> 0:45:46.040 one go and got the elk scunum, brought all the 0:45:46.080 --> 0:45:48.800 meat away from the carcasses, and then built kind of 0:45:48.800 --> 0:45:51.880 a new site with a fire at it. And arthury 0:45:51.920 --> 0:45:53.600 is just you know, having the fire hopefully keep the 0:45:53.640 --> 0:45:55.719 air away or at least kind of determined for a 0:45:55.760 --> 0:45:58.120 little while. And then we just kind of did this 0:45:58.239 --> 0:46:03.319 uh shuffling uh short movements. Um, we just go a 0:46:03.320 --> 0:46:06.640 few hundred yards, make another fire, bring the meat over there, 0:46:06.719 --> 0:46:08.640 and then just cart back and forth and then just 0:46:08.680 --> 0:46:11.520 basically go fire to fire to fire to fire until 0:46:11.560 --> 0:46:14.000 we got back to the boats on the beach. And 0:46:14.200 --> 0:46:17.560 system really really worked good. Never saw any bear. Uh. 0:46:17.600 --> 0:46:19.760 The only thing we saw at that point was foxes. 0:46:19.800 --> 0:46:21.840 The foxes obviously he's like, who meat, you know, like 0:46:23.680 --> 0:46:26.080 on the on these islands. Oh for sure, we've done 0:46:26.440 --> 0:46:29.799 a buffalo hunt. Um. I think first year I was 0:46:29.840 --> 0:46:33.879 there down towards the south end of the island, and uh, 0:46:33.960 --> 0:46:35.600 that was the first thing that I saw pop up. 0:46:35.640 --> 0:46:38.319 As soon as our buffalo wing down, like that great 0:46:38.360 --> 0:46:40.839 fox came like right up to me. Didn't care all, 0:46:40.920 --> 0:46:42.880 he was just like, hey, what's up. It's like just 0:46:43.000 --> 0:46:44.600 nose in the air, like looking it's like, oh I 0:46:44.600 --> 0:46:49.040 smell smell meat and he was ready to go. But uh, 0:46:49.080 --> 0:46:51.719 it never really came up before. But that's another thing 0:46:51.840 --> 0:46:54.839 I think with the wildlife in Kodiak is there's no 0:46:54.920 --> 0:47:01.360 real predators. I think, uh, like other places, the bear, 0:47:02.120 --> 0:47:04.320 as much as I know that they can take down 0:47:04.480 --> 0:47:07.520 like deer, elk and buffalo, it's not really a normal occurrence. 0:47:07.600 --> 0:47:11.160 They rely on you know, meats or meats, berries and 0:47:11.360 --> 0:47:13.560 twigs that they're inland or if that's where they're going 0:47:13.640 --> 0:47:16.000 for and then mainly the salmon of course, and that 0:47:16.080 --> 0:47:18.960 that's always their main food consumption. So I think they'll 0:47:19.000 --> 0:47:21.520 take carcasses and stuff like that when it's when it's 0:47:21.560 --> 0:47:24.160 there and ready, and especially the more hungry they are. 0:47:24.239 --> 0:47:27.680 But I don't know, I think just probably a waste 0:47:27.680 --> 0:47:29.480 of energy for them, so they don't actually try taking 0:47:29.480 --> 0:47:33.120 them down. More scavengers, um, but yeah, no predators there. 0:47:33.719 --> 0:47:37.040 But anyway, uh yeah, back back to the fog neck 0:47:37.120 --> 0:47:40.600 and I would say, like as a um, you know, 0:47:41.960 --> 0:47:44.560 to make your point a little bit, you'll go to 0:47:44.640 --> 0:47:48.799 Kodiak Island and look at how many blacktailed deer there are. 0:47:50.360 --> 0:47:54.440 There's no way that that predation is that strong. What 0:47:54.640 --> 0:47:58.840 you look, the predation numbers can't be that high because 0:47:59.120 --> 0:48:03.319 they're deer every everywhere everywhere. Well I have to go 0:48:03.360 --> 0:48:06.400 on a tangent on this one now, but specifically with 0:48:06.480 --> 0:48:10.160 the deer, it wasn't. This year was great, phenomenal, fantastic 0:48:10.200 --> 0:48:12.279 deer everywhere. The deer looked really really healthy, a lot 0:48:12.320 --> 0:48:15.799 of fat on them. Both mine and the ones other 0:48:15.800 --> 0:48:18.879 guys that I work with killed like really really good, 0:48:18.880 --> 0:48:20.520 healthy deer, which is really great to see because the 0:48:20.600 --> 0:48:26.080 year prior was horrendous. Almost nobody got dear, very very scarce. 0:48:26.600 --> 0:48:30.759 And the reason for that, in my hypothesis and other 0:48:30.800 --> 0:48:32.960 guys that I've talked to, is all because of an 0:48:33.040 --> 0:48:37.799 kind of an early freeze, and it just killed off 0:48:38.000 --> 0:48:40.800 all of the salmon berries. There was no salmon berries, 0:48:41.640 --> 0:48:43.720 uh like on island at all. There was no season 0:48:43.719 --> 0:48:45.200 because a lot of people go out and harvest and 0:48:45.200 --> 0:48:47.160 pick them and you know, make stuff with them, pies 0:48:47.239 --> 0:48:51.319 and juices and whatever else, and completely killed them off. 0:48:51.360 --> 0:48:53.960 And therefore I think that, you know, the deer population 0:48:54.040 --> 0:48:56.040 really hurt, not probably just because of the salmon berries, 0:48:56.040 --> 0:48:58.080 but other things that that that frost could have killed 0:48:58.080 --> 0:49:01.560 as well, just to hurt the population so much. But 0:49:01.680 --> 0:49:04.680 the deer just thrived there. And from what I've been 0:49:04.760 --> 0:49:08.920 told is like the entire population of deer on Kodiak 0:49:09.400 --> 0:49:13.799 started with like seven deer on a separate island on 0:49:13.800 --> 0:49:15.919 Long Island, just off the coast there, and I think 0:49:16.000 --> 0:49:18.279 some down in the south then as well, and they 0:49:18.320 --> 0:49:20.640 just dropped them off. And the deer from Long Island, 0:49:20.840 --> 0:49:23.040 you know, they swam over and the ones in the 0:49:23.080 --> 0:49:25.160 south are like that, all just like populated, just like 0:49:25.239 --> 0:49:30.680 blew up, completely just thrived there, hearty creatures with the 0:49:30.719 --> 0:49:33.560 harsh conditions, but of course with no predators. That's that's 0:49:33.560 --> 0:49:35.840 what takes it down. It's it's it's the harsh conditions 0:49:35.840 --> 0:49:38.719 and the weather and event nevitally that's so it's not 0:49:38.760 --> 0:49:41.040 like they're dealing with coyoutes and wolves and you know, 0:49:41.080 --> 0:49:43.239 other predators to take them. Yeah. I mean with low 0:49:43.239 --> 0:49:47.000 predation generally low predation numbers, and winter kill being you know, 0:49:47.040 --> 0:49:49.719 winter kill and predation being kind of a habitat loss 0:49:49.760 --> 0:49:51.920 kind of being the three things that normally will drive 0:49:52.000 --> 0:49:55.080 population numbers down. There's not a whole lot of any 0:49:55.120 --> 0:49:58.000 of those things other than winter kill going on. But 0:49:58.080 --> 0:50:00.279 do you know I could just scratch the surface. Yeah, 0:50:00.280 --> 0:50:03.000 I mean the one time that I hunted blacktail deer 0:50:03.000 --> 0:50:05.640 and codyak. I mean you could look across the flats, 0:50:05.680 --> 0:50:09.279 look across the Hummack flats and it would be two 0:50:09.760 --> 0:50:13.359 deer and one. I mean, I have photos of two 0:50:13.760 --> 0:50:17.640 deer standing in one flat cheese over there. That's I'm 0:50:17.640 --> 0:50:21.040 swarm of secrets. You can't tell you where's right, I 0:50:21.080 --> 0:50:25.000 get it. But yeah, but but that's you know, that's 0:50:25.080 --> 0:50:27.400 my experience on one small part of the island. But 0:50:27.680 --> 0:50:31.040 for sure is in that harsh environment, to see those 0:50:31.080 --> 0:50:34.320 animals fry like that, that's that's um. It was always 0:50:34.320 --> 0:50:36.839 amazing to me. Yeah, you know they're like you said, 0:50:37.000 --> 0:50:42.320 hardy animals. Back to falkneck another tangent, all good tangents, 0:50:42.719 --> 0:50:45.840 but podcasts are about are all about tings. So so 0:50:46.680 --> 0:50:49.160 you had never you had quite the system for for 0:50:49.160 --> 0:50:54.239 getting your meat out, um, and never had any any 0:50:54.239 --> 0:50:57.640 bare experiences to this point, but still very prepared. I mean, 0:50:58.000 --> 0:51:01.480 you guys are all carrying side arms for not not everybody. 0:51:01.719 --> 0:51:04.399 Some guys that side arms, and uh, some guys had 0:51:04.520 --> 0:51:07.160 rifles and then some guys didn't have anything. At the point. 0:51:07.200 --> 0:51:10.160 It just kind of like because of the situation where 0:51:10.200 --> 0:51:13.200 we did, uh go for the elk, things had kind 0:51:13.200 --> 0:51:15.640 of changed over the course time. At first everybody everybody 0:51:15.640 --> 0:51:18.640 had a rifle on them, um, but our our goal 0:51:18.760 --> 0:51:21.760 had changed, like okay, we're only getting one elk, and 0:51:22.160 --> 0:51:24.879 uh that was really the deals, like okay, we're only 0:51:24.880 --> 0:51:28.560 getting one elk. This times like just bringing out because 0:51:28.640 --> 0:51:31.760 kind of setting up for that. Uh, the guys prior 0:51:31.800 --> 0:51:34.839 hadn't seen anything. The conditions were just horrible. They were 0:51:34.880 --> 0:51:37.360 just got awful, Like it was really really high winds, 0:51:37.360 --> 0:51:41.719 heavy rains, cold, and we just wanted to focus on 0:51:41.840 --> 0:51:46.640 normal conditions, normal normal conditions there and even the cloud 0:51:46.680 --> 0:51:48.759 cover was was low a lot of the times and 0:51:49.040 --> 0:51:53.360 of course affected visibility. So first we were gung ho 0:51:53.600 --> 0:51:55.600 and I think we were there for two days and 0:51:55.600 --> 0:51:57.920 hadn't seen anything. We didn't even see any deer, like 0:51:57.960 --> 0:52:00.440 we're just talking about the deer population. Didn't see any deer, 0:52:00.480 --> 0:52:02.800 didn't see any elk and see any bear, didn't see anything, 0:52:02.920 --> 0:52:05.880 no fox. That's like, I didn't see anything living practically, 0:52:07.040 --> 0:52:09.200 and it's like, you gotta be kidding me. It's like nothing, 0:52:09.200 --> 0:52:11.920 and we're like, okay, that was a little disheartening, and 0:52:11.960 --> 0:52:14.080 the other guys with the same way and like, okay, well, 0:52:14.400 --> 0:52:19.000 it's definitely it's a relatively big island. When you're on 0:52:19.040 --> 0:52:21.759 foot and having to work, like you've mentioned before, it's 0:52:21.760 --> 0:52:25.000 like it takes you hours to go anywhere, so you 0:52:25.080 --> 0:52:27.160 gotta kind of set yourself up, and not knowing where 0:52:27.200 --> 0:52:29.720 the actual like population of elk is like can really 0:52:29.840 --> 0:52:32.720 hurt you. Did you guys bring any like bear fencing 0:52:32.840 --> 0:52:34.560 or when you camped every night or did you just 0:52:34.680 --> 0:52:38.919 no just camping yep, just asses out and hope nothing 0:52:38.920 --> 0:52:41.399 bad happens. Talk about that a lot, because we spent 0:52:41.440 --> 0:52:43.920 a lot of days out in the field, like sleeping overnight, 0:52:43.960 --> 0:52:45.840 and uh, spent a lot of nights out in the 0:52:45.840 --> 0:52:49.360 field in a biddy and just this you know, small 0:52:49.360 --> 0:52:52.000 like rainproof sack and just call a bear burrito because 0:52:52.560 --> 0:52:54.320 it's gonna be a bad day if that bear decides 0:52:54.360 --> 0:52:56.640 that you just fell really good and decides to take 0:52:56.719 --> 0:53:01.360 you open there. Yeah, exactly, And nope, that's all we 0:53:01.360 --> 0:53:03.920 had is just our shelters, and we were down more 0:53:04.120 --> 0:53:06.720 towards the coast, and because of the numbers, we weren't. 0:53:07.000 --> 0:53:09.160 We've never really had issues Before's as soon as you 0:53:09.200 --> 0:53:11.279 have the meat and all that, I think that's when 0:53:11.280 --> 0:53:13.680 it changes everything. They're willing to you know, they're willing 0:53:13.719 --> 0:53:16.200 to inch a little bit further in because of the reward, 0:53:16.360 --> 0:53:17.920 rather than you know, how many guys you have in 0:53:17.960 --> 0:53:22.840 your in your univeing myself, yea five people. That's a 0:53:22.880 --> 0:53:25.760 good determ for a better But when there's the the 0:53:26.000 --> 0:53:28.240 encouragement to come and check that meat out, it's probably 0:53:28.239 --> 0:53:30.120 a little bit more. I think the I don't know, 0:53:30.320 --> 0:53:33.600 people have different theories and their own stories, and I 0:53:33.600 --> 0:53:35.120 think fire always helped to do so. It's like when 0:53:35.160 --> 0:53:36.719 you have a base game, you know, having that fire, 0:53:36.719 --> 0:53:39.480 it's kind of like Okay, I think I don't know 0:53:39.800 --> 0:53:41.880 if you're cooking something that's going to change stuff, But 0:53:41.920 --> 0:53:43.400 as soon as you have a fire in the smoke, 0:53:43.560 --> 0:53:45.440 I would think that, you know, the bears don't really 0:53:45.520 --> 0:53:48.440 like that, but then again, maybe they do. There's some 0:53:48.560 --> 0:53:52.120 theories on the gunshots and Kodiak being like dinner bells. 0:53:53.160 --> 0:53:55.440 You hear that all the time, and it's like, Okay, 0:53:55.520 --> 0:53:57.600 that's the time that you have to be most aware, 0:53:58.000 --> 0:54:00.319 like bear aware, as they saying, because is like as 0:54:00.360 --> 0:54:02.800 soon as that happens, like you're just waiting. Did you 0:54:02.800 --> 0:54:05.719 guys ever consider bear spray as as something you would do? 0:54:05.800 --> 0:54:07.480 Would you do? You know? Like, and I know I 0:54:07.560 --> 0:54:09.360 got a lot of guys use it. I'm not a 0:54:09.440 --> 0:54:12.480 huge proponent of it. Um. I still prefer, you know, 0:54:12.520 --> 0:54:14.799 a side arm if I'm gonna carry something and not 0:54:14.880 --> 0:54:16.759 carry a full rifle. Otherwise I always try to carry 0:54:16.760 --> 0:54:20.759 a full rifle with me. Um. I don't know. The 0:54:21.000 --> 0:54:24.520 bear spray supposedly works, but as we talked about with 0:54:24.560 --> 0:54:27.359 the the guy that was just uh just got mauld 0:54:27.440 --> 0:54:29.480 in Montana, you know, hit twice by that sow and 0:54:29.800 --> 0:54:32.600 she obviously ran straight through the bear spray. And I've 0:54:32.600 --> 0:54:35.560 heard other accounts of that, and I think with the 0:54:35.600 --> 0:54:38.480 bears that are there, if they want you, if they 0:54:38.480 --> 0:54:41.000 want what you have, they're gonna get it. It's only 0:54:41.080 --> 0:54:44.640 for Yeah, I think that kind of bear that's kind 0:54:44.640 --> 0:54:47.400 of curious. That makes you feel more uneasy, like in 0:54:47.440 --> 0:54:49.840 all honestly, like with with a bunch of guys around, 0:54:49.840 --> 0:54:52.759 like you're probably gonna scare the bear off. The bears 0:54:52.800 --> 0:54:55.040 probably not gonna like have any interest and eventually go away. 0:54:55.040 --> 0:54:56.880 He might get close, that might scare you, but like 0:54:57.160 --> 0:54:59.600 you're probably pull out the bear spray. I think in fear. 0:55:00.280 --> 0:55:01.920 And that's why I think a lot of times like 0:55:02.000 --> 0:55:04.759 you hear about the you know, the false charges and 0:55:04.760 --> 0:55:07.439 people shooting bear and it does kind of suck. It's like, yeah, 0:55:07.440 --> 0:55:10.319 of course you can't protect yourself and others, but when 0:55:10.320 --> 0:55:11.839 a bear is just kind of like, hey, you're in 0:55:11.840 --> 0:55:14.400 my area and just kind of like yeah, the charges, 0:55:14.600 --> 0:55:16.839 that's a confused. It's hard and you know, I know 0:55:17.239 --> 0:55:20.240 other hunters have have had those experiences plenty of times before, 0:55:20.280 --> 0:55:24.000 including Coal, as we discussed before. I love the guy 0:55:24.000 --> 0:55:27.600 and you know what's up Coal, But when when he 0:55:27.640 --> 0:55:30.200 actually hitting up path event event when he found out 0:55:30.200 --> 0:55:33.799 and he gave me like, hey, assholes, supposed to be 0:55:33.800 --> 0:55:36.560 me to get to Like I'm the bear guy, Like 0:55:36.600 --> 0:55:38.360 this is supposed to happen to me first, not you. 0:55:39.000 --> 0:55:41.719 So he gave me plenty of ship. But yeah, I 0:55:41.719 --> 0:55:44.200 know it's a very real thing. And the bear spray 0:55:44.520 --> 0:55:47.240 if if you're gonna if that's all you got, awesome, 0:55:47.280 --> 0:55:49.480 you know that that's all you got. But definitely strength 0:55:49.560 --> 0:55:52.759 numbers and you guys always stick together when you're when 0:55:52.800 --> 0:55:55.120 you're in a place, and that was, you know, the 0:55:55.200 --> 0:55:57.600 part of the thing. But um, again, we were just 0:55:57.640 --> 0:56:00.000 focused on the elk then, you know, not seeing anything else. 0:56:00.360 --> 0:56:02.279 The last thing any of us were expecting to run 0:56:02.280 --> 0:56:05.520 into is bear, um in those conditions, and well let's 0:56:05.560 --> 0:56:09.839 let's get into it. Yeah. So so you guys had 0:56:10.040 --> 0:56:13.520 a hunted a couple of days not seeing hot nor hair. Yeah, nothing, 0:56:14.480 --> 0:56:16.320 I think it was and I take that back. I 0:56:16.360 --> 0:56:18.000 think it was the end of the second day, just 0:56:18.040 --> 0:56:20.719 as the sun was going down, where another guy was 0:56:20.800 --> 0:56:23.719 with me, he spotted them. Finally, we're like, we're just 0:56:23.760 --> 0:56:27.040 trying to find different spots, like going through the spruce 0:56:27.080 --> 0:56:29.960 and uh and and finding open areas where you can 0:56:30.040 --> 0:56:32.480 kind of glass and see whatever we can see. And 0:56:32.560 --> 0:56:35.200 finally high up on a ridge line, I saw like 0:56:35.280 --> 0:56:38.680 two to four of them, I think, well now three four, 0:56:38.760 --> 0:56:41.360 like four alcayop on the bridge line. Way, thank god, Okay, 0:56:41.400 --> 0:56:43.640 it's like we finally saw something. We know that they're 0:56:43.680 --> 0:56:48.279 they're awesome. Immediately, like all right, let's break down, let's 0:56:48.280 --> 0:56:50.920 head back, let's see where we can get the boats 0:56:50.920 --> 0:56:52.640 in like with you know, with the surf and the 0:56:52.680 --> 0:56:54.359 wind that the way they were, we want to make sure. 0:56:54.440 --> 0:56:56.360 And I kind of make this plan of attack to 0:56:56.680 --> 0:56:59.839 get up to where they were the following morning. So 0:57:00.000 --> 0:57:02.200 always scolpted it out, looked on some maps, just kind 0:57:02.200 --> 0:57:05.000 of glass the area, and uh found this bridge line 0:57:05.000 --> 0:57:08.479 that we decided to take, and um made our plan 0:57:08.600 --> 0:57:11.000 and you know, set up following morning, got up early, 0:57:11.040 --> 0:57:14.880 early before the sun and started hiking up and certainly 0:57:14.880 --> 0:57:16.720 no easy going there. You know, it took us, took 0:57:16.760 --> 0:57:18.600 us a little while, but we made it up, and 0:57:18.640 --> 0:57:20.400 I think the line was still the best that we 0:57:20.440 --> 0:57:22.919 could have taken. And finally got up on the ridge 0:57:22.920 --> 0:57:27.800 line and hadn't seen anything, and conditions were still terrible. 0:57:28.440 --> 0:57:30.400 I think the weather predicted that, you know, it was 0:57:30.400 --> 0:57:32.720 supposed to be better. Of course it was not the opposite. 0:57:32.720 --> 0:57:36.640 It was actually more rainy, and uh I didn't seem 0:57:36.640 --> 0:57:39.880 at first, and we had our suspicions because if people 0:57:39.920 --> 0:57:42.560 aren't aware, you know, elka very no mac they're not 0:57:42.600 --> 0:57:45.720 like deer would say, oh sun goes down, like they're 0:57:45.720 --> 0:57:47.960 gonna graze a little bit, maybe bed down, like they'll 0:57:47.960 --> 0:57:50.080 probably be there, and then moving the elk and move 0:57:50.200 --> 0:57:52.520 like really great distances like off in the night. And 0:57:53.520 --> 0:57:55.080 so of course we get out there are like, shit, 0:57:55.200 --> 0:57:57.640 my gosh, damn it, like where are they? And I 0:57:57.680 --> 0:58:00.160 started walking the ridge lines more and finally saw them, 0:58:00.200 --> 0:58:03.360 but it wasn't for as the whole herd, and I 0:58:03.440 --> 0:58:06.760 hadn't seen a full herd of elk yet. Um no, 0:58:06.800 --> 0:58:09.520 well in Kodiak anyway, like I've heard it like okay, 0:58:09.560 --> 0:58:11.520 there's always you know, big herds of them, but we've 0:58:11.520 --> 0:58:13.320 always just seen like one of twos and that's what 0:58:13.320 --> 0:58:16.240 we hunted, and honestly that's kind of better just because 0:58:16.240 --> 0:58:18.640 you don't have so many eyes on you. But finding 0:58:18.680 --> 0:58:20.600 the herd was like really really nice to were like, oh, 0:58:20.960 --> 0:58:24.720 we were just extent, you know, really really excited finally 0:58:24.800 --> 0:58:26.919 finding them. So we're at the top of the ridge 0:58:26.960 --> 0:58:30.040 line there at the bottom of the valley, and then 0:58:30.080 --> 0:58:32.360 it was kind of like great, but now what do 0:58:32.480 --> 0:58:36.520 we do? And of course we're just sitting there for 0:58:36.560 --> 0:58:39.720 a while looking around and how far below you are 0:58:39.760 --> 0:58:42.640 they at this point, I don't know what elevation we 0:58:42.640 --> 0:58:44.240 were at. We were pretty high, we had we were 0:58:44.280 --> 0:58:47.480 definitely above alpine, so I don't think we're at the 0:58:47.480 --> 0:58:51.720 top elevation feet or so, and then they were almost 0:58:51.760 --> 0:58:54.240 probably at sea level, yeah, not not very much higher. 0:58:54.280 --> 0:59:00.000 So um, there was very little cover getting down to them. 0:59:00.120 --> 0:59:02.560 A lot of older but not really like good spruce 0:59:02.560 --> 0:59:04.520 where you're gonna get a shot anyway. So that was 0:59:04.640 --> 0:59:06.640 really the talk is like, Okay, how do we get 0:59:06.680 --> 0:59:10.160 down to these elk um within range, get a shot, 0:59:10.520 --> 0:59:13.720 and then of course getting him out else or out afterwards. 0:59:13.720 --> 0:59:16.600 And we figured probably just take the valley out, but uh, 0:59:16.720 --> 0:59:19.040 we decided like, hey, there's five of us, let's split up, 0:59:19.320 --> 0:59:21.560 three go on one side of the herd and to 0:59:21.800 --> 0:59:22.920 stay on the other side of the herd, and we 0:59:23.000 --> 0:59:24.960 basically just kind of trying to make our way down 0:59:25.720 --> 0:59:28.960 and pray that they don't just find out we're there. 0:59:29.040 --> 0:59:30.720 And then jet on the other side of the alley. 0:59:30.880 --> 0:59:32.840 Hopefully they'll just kind of like either move one way 0:59:32.920 --> 0:59:34.800 or the other. Because they weren't really moving too much. 0:59:34.920 --> 0:59:37.760 They were they seemed a little weird, little off. We 0:59:37.800 --> 0:59:41.920 couldn't really tell what it was. And so we're just like, okay, 0:59:41.960 --> 0:59:43.920 let's just split them, get down. Then whoever can take 0:59:43.920 --> 0:59:45.840 a shot. We'll hear the shot and like cool, that's it, 0:59:45.880 --> 0:59:48.640 and then go to the other guys. And uh so 0:59:48.680 --> 0:59:51.280 we started moving, and myself and two other guys with 0:59:51.440 --> 0:59:54.400 the three man group and I started moving to to 0:59:54.520 --> 0:59:57.280 one side of them, making our way across the ridge 0:59:57.320 --> 1:00:01.240 line then eventually down and then of course we run 1:00:01.240 --> 1:00:05.080 into three other hunters and as it seems, oh my god, 1:00:05.120 --> 1:00:07.600 I couldn't believe it. We were just just in awe. 1:00:08.240 --> 1:00:10.440 One we'd already been there two days. Like it was 1:00:10.480 --> 1:00:14.320 definitely like a piste off moment. And they were below us. 1:00:14.480 --> 1:00:18.000 They never saw us, um far far down below it. 1:00:18.040 --> 1:00:21.400 They were just glassing and it's like, okay, rightfully, so 1:00:21.480 --> 1:00:23.400 however they got there, you know, they got there. They 1:00:23.400 --> 1:00:25.800 were clear, they're in front of us. But it piste 1:00:25.840 --> 1:00:30.240 us off because no tact whatsoever right out in the open, 1:00:30.560 --> 1:00:33.200 moving straight towards the alkin like okay, no, one of 1:00:33.280 --> 1:00:34.840 the elk are kind of like weird, you know, their 1:00:34.840 --> 1:00:36.760 eyes are up all on the hills. Were like, well, 1:00:36.800 --> 1:00:42.000 there we go. It's like these you know whatever, gentleman exactly, yeah, gentlemen. 1:00:42.120 --> 1:00:45.120 I don't know who they were, but it was like, yeah, 1:00:45.360 --> 1:00:47.760 definitely annoying. They're probably just they wanted to be fair 1:00:47.840 --> 1:00:50.920 chase yea yeah, right, and uh, you know, they were 1:00:50.920 --> 1:00:52.880 doing their thing and whatever. Maybe it worked out for 1:00:52.880 --> 1:00:55.880 all I don't know, but obviously it ticked us off 1:00:55.920 --> 1:00:58.080 and like, okay, well rightfully, so these guys are lower 1:00:58.160 --> 1:01:00.520 and to get them sort of like the right away, 1:01:00.560 --> 1:01:03.200 but like we're not gonna end here, like all right. 1:01:03.520 --> 1:01:05.480 The three of us decided like, hey, let's book it 1:01:05.520 --> 1:01:07.640 back to the other side, kind of kind of climb 1:01:07.720 --> 1:01:09.800 back up the bridge line, make your way over, trying 1:01:09.800 --> 1:01:11.400 to spook the elk, and then get back with the 1:01:11.400 --> 1:01:13.920 other two guys. We're like, okay, from there, we're just 1:01:13.960 --> 1:01:17.320 gonna try to make our way down and uh get 1:01:17.360 --> 1:01:19.080 on the other side. So it's like, hey, if if 1:01:19.080 --> 1:01:20.800 we get down low enough we take a shot first, 1:01:20.800 --> 1:01:22.560 then so be it. Or if they take a shot. 1:01:22.600 --> 1:01:24.920 Hopefully they'll kind of like push them drive them towards us, 1:01:24.920 --> 1:01:28.040 so we're kind of be ready. So I kind of 1:01:28.040 --> 1:01:30.760 took the lead, running, sprinting my ass off to link 1:01:30.840 --> 1:01:33.439 up with the other two guys, and um, the two 1:01:33.480 --> 1:01:35.040 that were with me were behind me, and we're just 1:01:35.120 --> 1:01:37.439 kind of moving across the bridge line. I start making 1:01:37.480 --> 1:01:40.000 my way across and then eventually down and I'm just 1:01:40.120 --> 1:01:43.120 kind of starting to break down out of alpine into 1:01:43.160 --> 1:01:46.920 the order of the thick brush there, and I saw 1:01:47.240 --> 1:01:49.200 the hats sticking out of the order of one of 1:01:49.200 --> 1:01:50.720 the other guys, so that was kind of my eye. 1:01:51.040 --> 1:01:53.240 And uh, one of the guys that was with me, 1:01:53.320 --> 1:01:56.080 he got my attention. He's like, hey, he's like, we 1:01:56.080 --> 1:01:58.600 want to take another line down. And we were separated, 1:01:59.040 --> 1:02:01.560 you know, a good distance at this point. So I 1:02:01.600 --> 1:02:04.280 started my waking making my way up towards him. And 1:02:04.280 --> 1:02:06.600 this is a really really steep hill and a matter 1:02:06.640 --> 1:02:08.640 of fact, there's a there was a cliff kind of 1:02:08.680 --> 1:02:12.960 separating us. Um, not huge or anything, but it's probably 1:02:13.120 --> 1:02:19.160 you know, thirty wide, maybe like tall, just enough that 1:02:19.200 --> 1:02:20.720 it's like he's not gonna like jump down over it. 1:02:20.720 --> 1:02:22.040 It's like he's going to be above it with the 1:02:22.040 --> 1:02:24.560 other guy, and I'm below it, and we're kind of 1:02:24.960 --> 1:02:27.920 converging at that cliff and then paralleling at that point. 1:02:27.960 --> 1:02:30.440 So I'm kind of just coming up towards the cliff, 1:02:30.800 --> 1:02:32.840 kind of kind of back up the hill at this point, 1:02:32.920 --> 1:02:36.240 and I step over this rock, kind of climb over 1:02:36.400 --> 1:02:39.000 like terrain feature, so to speak. And as soon as 1:02:39.040 --> 1:02:41.600 I do, I stand up and turn and right down 1:02:41.640 --> 1:02:46.640 the older five yards away there she is. And immediately, like, 1:02:46.680 --> 1:02:52.600 you know, just stop frozen and at this like what's 1:02:52.640 --> 1:02:55.880 she doing? She looking at you, she looking away. So 1:02:55.880 --> 1:02:57.480 so that was it was like when I saw it 1:02:57.720 --> 1:03:01.600 was just just a big ball for like, no features, 1:03:01.600 --> 1:03:04.000 no anything. I just see is this big thing of fur, 1:03:04.840 --> 1:03:07.320 and you know, I just I just stopped him, like 1:03:07.640 --> 1:03:10.600 I couldn't really make out anything. And of course everything 1:03:10.640 --> 1:03:13.560 immediately like slows down. And the way I really have 1:03:13.640 --> 1:03:15.800 related the story with other people that I've told is 1:03:15.880 --> 1:03:18.720 kind of like the state of flow, where I'm like, okay, 1:03:18.920 --> 1:03:21.920 everything immediately went slow motion. I got like no concept 1:03:21.960 --> 1:03:25.400 of time from this point on, like everything we slowed down, 1:03:25.560 --> 1:03:29.640 making all the decisions in my head, and um so 1:03:29.800 --> 1:03:32.360 for me, I'm just say you know, the gears are turning, 1:03:33.000 --> 1:03:36.640 and the first instinct I didn't know, you know, I 1:03:36.760 --> 1:03:38.600 just big thing of fur. Okay, what is it? You know? 1:03:38.680 --> 1:03:42.000 My mind's like okay, processing, processing, because I'm not even 1:03:42.000 --> 1:03:43.919 think about Bear. I'm thinking about Elk, and I'm like, okay, 1:03:43.920 --> 1:03:46.600 that's not the right color. And the color was actually 1:03:46.680 --> 1:03:49.880 like grayer. It wasn't really brown like even brown Bear 1:03:50.000 --> 1:03:52.840 and Elk, and I'm like okay, processing. But of course, 1:03:52.880 --> 1:03:55.400 no time whatsoever. I just I just stand up there. 1:03:56.480 --> 1:03:59.520 And as soon as I did, I took a step back, 1:03:59.800 --> 1:04:02.240 and because it kind of dawned at me, finally, okay, this, 1:04:02.400 --> 1:04:04.439 whatever it is, it's not good. I know I know better, 1:04:05.120 --> 1:04:07.840 and took one step back, and whether it was the 1:04:07.880 --> 1:04:10.840 point where she finally heard me or finally smelled me 1:04:10.840 --> 1:04:13.880 and caught wind of me, she just turned her head 1:04:13.960 --> 1:04:18.440 and charged like immediately, and and as soon as I 1:04:18.440 --> 1:04:20.360 took the step back, I knew that was going to 1:04:20.440 --> 1:04:22.960 be the case. Anyway, Like I said, with my experiences 1:04:23.000 --> 1:04:25.600 as the Bear, it's like everything's good, fine and dandy, 1:04:25.600 --> 1:04:28.480 because you don't surprise them like you never surprised at Bear, 1:04:28.680 --> 1:04:31.960 Like they know you're there well before you do otherwise, 1:04:31.960 --> 1:04:34.240 like you're hunting it from like hundreds of yards yards away, 1:04:34.280 --> 1:04:36.120 you know you're glassing them, but like if you're that close, 1:04:36.200 --> 1:04:39.760 like no way they know you're there. And so as 1:04:39.800 --> 1:04:42.120 soon as I did him, like there was no doubt 1:04:42.120 --> 1:04:44.400 in my mind, like this is gonna happen, Like there's 1:04:44.600 --> 1:04:46.520 there's no getting out of it. You don't feel like 1:04:46.600 --> 1:04:50.880 she was processed anything she smelled it was instinct, like 1:04:50.960 --> 1:04:56.760 there was instinctual like there's danger, something's not right. I 1:04:56.840 --> 1:04:59.640 have to address this issue. There was no and and 1:04:59.840 --> 1:05:02.160 be five yards, but I don't have to exaggerate the 1:05:02.200 --> 1:05:04.760 distance where or I know I know five yards very well. 1:05:05.360 --> 1:05:08.920 And for people unaware, you know that talk about running 1:05:08.920 --> 1:05:11.880 away from bears and stuff, bears running thirty plus, Like 1:05:12.280 --> 1:05:14.640 that's that's a leap, you know, a way that the 1:05:15.120 --> 1:05:18.480 bears can just they're insane. That's like somebody fast. You'd 1:05:18.480 --> 1:05:19.920 be in five yards from the hood of a car 1:05:19.960 --> 1:05:22.240 and somebody flooring it. You're thinking you're gonna jump out 1:05:22.240 --> 1:05:25.000 of the way. They could cover a let's see, five 1:05:25.080 --> 1:05:29.479 yards and in a millisecond really well a top speed. 1:05:29.560 --> 1:05:31.200 So yeah, it took a little bit longer than that. 1:05:31.240 --> 1:05:33.880 But in real time, Like that's a second really, and 1:05:33.920 --> 1:05:35.840 how long I mean you're when you're processing you see 1:05:35.840 --> 1:05:39.720 the bear, you're processing it, it's moments until it charges you. 1:05:39.960 --> 1:05:42.160 I mean no, no, it was almost instantaneous. Like I said, 1:05:42.160 --> 1:05:44.280 I stood up, and and I did take a step 1:05:44.280 --> 1:05:47.000 back because it once it immediately clicked, which is you know, 1:05:47.000 --> 1:05:49.960 probably a millisecond. She probably as soon as I stood up, 1:05:50.000 --> 1:05:51.920 probably smelled me or whatever, and it took her probably 1:05:51.920 --> 1:05:54.160 a millisecond to just a turn. So I don't really 1:05:54.160 --> 1:05:57.040 know that the time wise there, but I just knew 1:05:57.040 --> 1:06:00.440 there was no she didn't she wasn't standing up. There 1:06:00.480 --> 1:06:02.800 was no like snore, there was no like you know, 1:06:02.880 --> 1:06:05.480 kind of bluffing beefing up. It was just like like 1:06:05.560 --> 1:06:07.560 it startled her, you know, scared, and she's like what 1:06:07.720 --> 1:06:10.600 is this that just really snuck up behind me because 1:06:10.720 --> 1:06:13.920 just by her head turn she was facing downhill and 1:06:13.920 --> 1:06:15.959 and my suspicion as well these other guys she's probably 1:06:16.040 --> 1:06:18.800 hunting the same elk. We were like I wanted, you know, 1:06:18.840 --> 1:06:20.480 something to do with whether she was going to hunt 1:06:20.560 --> 1:06:23.440 them or like you know, capitalize on something else. She 1:06:23.600 --> 1:06:25.520 was there for a reason, like right near the elk, 1:06:25.600 --> 1:06:27.880 and she was just hunkered down and the older either 1:06:28.000 --> 1:06:30.680 sneaking weight making her way through or just like waiting. 1:06:31.200 --> 1:06:34.520 And so when I came up behind her was sheer surprise. 1:06:34.960 --> 1:06:39.640 So of course instinctively, I immediately yelled out there and 1:06:40.080 --> 1:06:43.440 instinctively was pulling my rifle up. I ripped the scope 1:06:43.440 --> 1:06:46.600 cover off and started presenting, you know, my rifle, and 1:06:46.680 --> 1:06:50.600 I knew. I'm like, this isn't gonna happen, and this 1:06:50.680 --> 1:06:52.520 is the first time and I've I've shot it a 1:06:52.520 --> 1:06:55.080 few times now, But I got a new uh a 1:06:55.120 --> 1:06:58.439 new rifles six five creed More, and I was really 1:06:58.440 --> 1:07:01.720 excited about it because it was insanely like my goal 1:07:01.800 --> 1:07:05.520 is I really like guns, and I huge prom like 1:07:05.840 --> 1:07:08.440 I just love shooting in general. But I built this 1:07:08.480 --> 1:07:11.320 specifically to be extremely light, like the lightest rifle I have. 1:07:11.440 --> 1:07:14.680 The whole thing with five rounds is less than six pounds, 1:07:15.040 --> 1:07:16.880 so it's like a toothpick, you know, you're holding it. 1:07:17.000 --> 1:07:18.640 So it's so great, you know, great's gonna be great 1:07:18.640 --> 1:07:20.520 for goats and future out kinds and everything else. But 1:07:21.440 --> 1:07:23.280 of course it's not gonna take down to bear, never 1:07:23.400 --> 1:07:27.400 in a million years. Every it's for people who don't know. 1:07:27.400 --> 1:07:29.800 It's just a little little, teeny tiny round like it's 1:07:29.920 --> 1:07:33.160 it's goes shoot fast and straight and it's gonna take 1:07:33.160 --> 1:07:34.800 a lot of shot placement, but it's it doesn't have 1:07:34.840 --> 1:07:38.000 a lot of power, and especially for a bear, and 1:07:38.040 --> 1:07:40.040 I knew it. My note, I'm like, okay, if I 1:07:40.080 --> 1:07:42.479 get the hip shot, if anything off, it's just gonna 1:07:42.480 --> 1:07:43.920 piss off. It's not gonna take you down. Then I'm 1:07:43.920 --> 1:07:46.440 gonna take five pounds to the face and the body 1:07:46.480 --> 1:07:48.800 and just I'll end up like one of those stories. 1:07:49.560 --> 1:07:53.000 And all of this is just turning my mind. And 1:07:53.080 --> 1:07:56.080 I knew it. Started raising it, threw it down, and 1:07:56.080 --> 1:07:59.360 then I just Superman down the hill. And of course 1:07:59.360 --> 1:08:01.400 when I say that, it's like, yeah, it's a little 1:08:01.400 --> 1:08:03.560 bit of a drop, but I'm not really going anywhere, 1:08:04.280 --> 1:08:06.360 and uh, I just kind of jumped in the alders 1:08:07.240 --> 1:08:10.160 and covered up my head and neck as best I could, 1:08:10.280 --> 1:08:14.240 and again no concept of time, but it felt like 1:08:14.240 --> 1:08:16.799 I didn't even hit the ground, and she was already 1:08:16.800 --> 1:08:18.599 on me. She had a bite in the back of 1:08:18.640 --> 1:08:22.280 my leg, high up on my right leg, just just 1:08:22.360 --> 1:08:25.439 below my ass, and she picked me up just by 1:08:25.479 --> 1:08:27.880 that and just threw me threw me over that same 1:08:27.960 --> 1:08:29.680 like rock like kind of terrain features that I was 1:08:29.760 --> 1:08:31.760 kind of falling down. I I fall on my head. 1:08:32.600 --> 1:08:34.880 She's just kind of like just throwing me around like 1:08:34.880 --> 1:08:38.799 a rag doll. She picks me up and as I'm falling, 1:08:38.920 --> 1:08:41.960 she's trying to rebite me, and she she bites me 1:08:41.960 --> 1:08:44.360 in the nuts and I'm kind of like head down, 1:08:44.360 --> 1:08:47.200 face down. I just feel top two canines like going 1:08:47.200 --> 1:08:51.120 into the taint and like that's not good, like fall 1:08:51.439 --> 1:08:54.000 and she's just bite me in the leg like traveling 1:08:54.000 --> 1:08:56.080 on the leg. Bites me real hard, almost like kind 1:08:56.080 --> 1:08:59.880 of behind the knee at this point. Unfortunately, like the 1:09:00.000 --> 1:09:01.840 guys were Johnny on the spot, of course, this is 1:09:01.880 --> 1:09:04.680 just like second stances are happening and the guy do 1:09:05.040 --> 1:09:07.559 you remember screaming or yeah I did on the first one. 1:09:07.600 --> 1:09:10.800 But it's it's funny, you know, training dogs. I think 1:09:10.800 --> 1:09:12.200 I had a lot to do it. And when you 1:09:12.240 --> 1:09:15.280 train dogs like for for bite working stuff, uh, it 1:09:15.439 --> 1:09:17.479 drives them. Just like when they say of the animals, 1:09:17.479 --> 1:09:19.439 like the whole playing dead thing, it actually has a 1:09:19.479 --> 1:09:22.960 lot of truth behind it because it is it's just 1:09:23.040 --> 1:09:26.240 kind of like this instinctual prey that when you do 1:09:26.439 --> 1:09:29.120 bite or when they bite, like when you scream, it 1:09:29.200 --> 1:09:31.080 just drives them even more to buy the hardest theff 1:09:31.080 --> 1:09:34.040 first when I yelled out, and I'm like, like that 1:09:34.120 --> 1:09:36.600 was obviously making things way worse than like, okay, this 1:09:36.680 --> 1:09:38.760 is it. It's like this is gonna suck, like it's 1:09:38.800 --> 1:09:40.719 gonna be really really bad. And even when I dove, 1:09:40.840 --> 1:09:43.000 like I knew that, like there's no protecting myself, is 1:09:43.320 --> 1:09:46.400 fully relying on everybody else around me to take over 1:09:46.479 --> 1:09:48.479 this point, I'm like, okay, here's trusting the boys, like 1:09:49.080 --> 1:09:53.400 I know they know their ship, like this is it. Yeah, Yeah, 1:09:53.439 --> 1:09:56.040 I'm just I never let go like just head, you know, 1:09:56.160 --> 1:09:59.280 our hands behind the head and neck and uh you know, 1:09:59.320 --> 1:10:00.920 I kind of got a ash in my eye from 1:10:00.960 --> 1:10:03.080 just getting thrown into some alder or something at some point, 1:10:03.080 --> 1:10:04.760 but I'm like, yeah, I'm not letting go like this 1:10:04.840 --> 1:10:07.120 is you know, this is all I got like to 1:10:07.120 --> 1:10:11.639 to hold onto. And um, right when she was stolen 1:10:11.640 --> 1:10:14.679 the legs, she uh the guy above me took a shot, 1:10:15.120 --> 1:10:18.639 you know, and uh you know, as he tells it too, 1:10:19.479 --> 1:10:21.840 obviously we all collected her own stories after the event, 1:10:21.960 --> 1:10:25.200 and uh he he didn't hear what I said. None 1:10:25.240 --> 1:10:27.320 of them did, Like they're all like somewhat close by, 1:10:27.439 --> 1:10:30.080 but they just they couldn't make out what I said, 1:10:30.120 --> 1:10:34.120 Like I was yelling bear, but I just said at 1:10:34.160 --> 1:10:37.040 once and then I was, you know, mauled, and they 1:10:37.080 --> 1:10:38.760 just heard the scream and then they heard all the 1:10:38.760 --> 1:10:41.720 growling and then then you know, immediately immediately new So 1:10:42.000 --> 1:10:45.000 all I did is get up over the cliff and 1:10:45.160 --> 1:10:46.920 he peered down. He had to kind of make a 1:10:47.000 --> 1:10:49.599 judgment call at that point because I couldn't see me, 1:10:49.920 --> 1:10:52.400 like the bears just like engulfed on me, like couldn't 1:10:52.439 --> 1:10:55.679 see him at all. Made a judgment call and putting 1:10:56.120 --> 1:10:59.120 you know, hiring her back. And wherever that bullet ended up, 1:10:59.120 --> 1:11:00.960 I don't know, but for actually it didn't end up me, 1:11:01.000 --> 1:11:03.200 and and you know I would have done the same thing, 1:11:03.280 --> 1:11:06.680 Like I'm thankful he did it and I didn't kill her. 1:11:06.960 --> 1:11:08.439 You know, it just kind of piste her off and 1:11:08.479 --> 1:11:10.360 not a fear and anger. She beat me again, like 1:11:10.400 --> 1:11:13.120 kind of clawed on my back at this point, and 1:11:13.479 --> 1:11:23.439 backpack definitely stone. I even told calls like hey man, 1:11:23.479 --> 1:11:24.800 like I know you know that all those guys like 1:11:24.880 --> 1:11:27.599 let him know I was like definitely saved my ass um, 1:11:27.640 --> 1:11:30.519 and I got a few claw marks on my back, 1:11:30.600 --> 1:11:33.760 but no, it definitely took some took some heavies and 1:11:33.880 --> 1:11:36.960 uh save me. But she you know kind of got 1:11:37.280 --> 1:11:39.320 uh to the side and then sunk one into my 1:11:39.400 --> 1:11:43.400 arm pretty good, and uh then the second shot went 1:11:43.400 --> 1:11:45.880 out just she just reloaded really quick quick put another 1:11:45.880 --> 1:11:47.479 one in or had a little bit better shot then 1:11:47.600 --> 1:11:50.599 and that one dropped her, you know, kind of at 1:11:50.600 --> 1:11:53.040 that point heard her enough. I heard a very distinct moan, 1:11:53.200 --> 1:11:55.840 kind of that killed shot type type deal, and she 1:11:55.960 --> 1:11:58.000 fell kind of on top of me, but a little 1:11:58.000 --> 1:12:00.360 bit of the side to not really in off of me. 1:12:00.400 --> 1:12:03.519 And ironically it was I was a little more nervous 1:12:03.560 --> 1:12:05.840 at that point, even not being bit, because she was 1:12:06.000 --> 1:12:08.720 right there. I was more nervous about my my the 1:12:08.720 --> 1:12:10.320 back of my head and neck because I couldn't see 1:12:10.320 --> 1:12:12.880 her at all. I'm kind of on my left side, 1:12:12.960 --> 1:12:14.720 you know, with my hands behind my head and neck 1:12:14.760 --> 1:12:16.920 and looking up the hill with the two other guys 1:12:16.960 --> 1:12:21.040 that were with me, um when we split up, and uh, 1:12:21.120 --> 1:12:22.960 all I could see was or all I could just 1:12:23.000 --> 1:12:24.760 feel is just her and like I could hear the 1:12:24.800 --> 1:12:27.160 breath I feel the firm, like, oh god, I'm like, 1:12:27.320 --> 1:12:29.000 just don't bite me, like that's all I kept think. 1:12:29.000 --> 1:12:30.639 I was like, all right, I'm hoping that bite doesn't 1:12:30.640 --> 1:12:33.920 come like on my head or something. Unfortunately, she started 1:12:34.000 --> 1:12:36.880 kind of crawling away. She was obviously really hurting at 1:12:36.880 --> 1:12:40.120 that point and uh barely kind of stumbling crawling away. 1:12:40.560 --> 1:12:42.960 I couldn't see her. I was just still faced uphill. 1:12:43.439 --> 1:12:46.920 But the other guy that was um with me and 1:12:46.960 --> 1:12:49.160 the other one when we split up, he ran down 1:12:49.240 --> 1:12:52.600 the hill and he had a glock uh twenty on 1:12:52.680 --> 1:12:55.320 him with a ten mill, and uh, he just kind 1:12:55.320 --> 1:12:57.960 of got to me, pulled out the clock, ran by 1:12:58.040 --> 1:13:00.679 me and just dumped a mag you know, just magat 1:13:00.760 --> 1:13:02.439 and finished rock make sure she'd be gonna come after 1:13:02.479 --> 1:13:06.360 us anymore. And um, immediately at that point is when 1:13:06.360 --> 1:13:09.080 I just started taking the backpack off on, zipping clothing 1:13:09.160 --> 1:13:11.040 like trying to get things. Couldn't move my leg at 1:13:11.040 --> 1:13:12.640 all at this point. It was just I knew that 1:13:12.680 --> 1:13:16.320 was the worst of it. And a little side note 1:13:16.320 --> 1:13:20.080 on this one, Unfortunately I was completely unaware of what 1:13:20.120 --> 1:13:22.479 I found out afterwards. Is when they took that first shot, 1:13:23.000 --> 1:13:25.600 is uh, you know, put when her in her in 1:13:25.640 --> 1:13:29.000 her back, they saw a cub out of the alder 1:13:29.520 --> 1:13:31.920 So of course, like I've told everybody, was like not 1:13:33.080 --> 1:13:36.040 having the experience that I do with bears, which is 1:13:36.160 --> 1:13:38.519 pales and compared to some to some people of course, 1:13:38.560 --> 1:13:41.120 but they're not aggressive that they're not nasty. It's like 1:13:41.120 --> 1:13:42.920 a been around Stiles and Cause before and just keep 1:13:42.920 --> 1:13:46.040 your distance. But with the conditions the way they were, 1:13:46.120 --> 1:13:48.000 with the heavy rains and the winds, like a come 1:13:48.080 --> 1:13:51.120 up on her and definitely surprised her. She was probably 1:13:51.200 --> 1:13:54.400 hunting territorial and she had a cub. It's like, there's 1:13:54.479 --> 1:13:58.719 no no, I mean, it's perfect, that's the perfect storm 1:13:59.040 --> 1:14:01.120 lack of a better term, and her height and protective 1:14:01.120 --> 1:14:04.439 instincts any surprised she knows the cub and it sounds 1:14:04.439 --> 1:14:07.120 the covers below her probably yeah, so yeah you were 1:14:07.200 --> 1:14:09.800 you know, so you it was you her and the cub. Yeah. 1:14:09.880 --> 1:14:11.559 I never saw the cup at all. You know, it 1:14:11.640 --> 1:14:13.719 was completely out of my sight and out of my mind. 1:14:13.760 --> 1:14:17.880 But ootionally, when people folks think about bear attacks, they're 1:14:17.880 --> 1:14:21.400 thinking about this situation. So cub, yeah it is. It's 1:14:21.400 --> 1:14:23.960 definitely you know, the worst Mama MoMA Baron and cubs, 1:14:24.040 --> 1:14:25.559 like that's what you don't want to mess with. And 1:14:25.600 --> 1:14:28.479 it's that's that's the most precarious when you're getting around 1:14:28.640 --> 1:14:30.760 that type of situation and say, Okay, this isn't just 1:14:30.800 --> 1:14:32.479 a bear like with some fish and like you know, 1:14:32.479 --> 1:14:35.160 it's like you've gotta be more cautious and definitely make 1:14:35.200 --> 1:14:37.120 it aware that you don't want anything to do with them. 1:14:37.320 --> 1:14:42.000 How long do you think the the attack lasted? No 1:14:42.080 --> 1:14:44.680 idea like only seconds, Like I would say, probably still 1:14:44.760 --> 1:14:47.920 under a minute. Um for sure that the whole ordeal 1:14:47.960 --> 1:14:55.479 is probably still only like a minute. And that's that's 1:14:55.479 --> 1:14:58.759 hard to say too. It's a totally different world. Um. 1:14:59.240 --> 1:15:01.680 In plenty of kind of flow type states. In my life, 1:15:01.720 --> 1:15:05.000 we've been under a lot of stress and uh, and 1:15:06.160 --> 1:15:08.360 I don't know. People always ask me too, is like 1:15:08.439 --> 1:15:10.360 did you pass out? Might not? I didn't pass out, 1:15:10.400 --> 1:15:13.120 And I think the adrenaline took over in a lot 1:15:13.120 --> 1:15:15.960 of ways that I wasn't in a lot of pain 1:15:16.000 --> 1:15:18.280 initially either. A lot of it was just like a 1:15:18.479 --> 1:15:21.920 really really heightened sense of what was going on. It 1:15:22.000 --> 1:15:23.519 wasn't the sense where I was like, Okay, I didn't 1:15:23.520 --> 1:15:25.160 know what was gonna you know what I was doing 1:15:25.240 --> 1:15:29.160 or anything. I just knew that my best situation for 1:15:29.240 --> 1:15:33.000 survival was just being extremely keen on everything going on, 1:15:33.120 --> 1:15:35.200 and like, even as the bites are happy, I'm kind 1:15:35.200 --> 1:15:37.080 of thinking to myself like, Okay, I know what those 1:15:37.080 --> 1:15:40.000 wounds could be, like the worst case scenario, like what 1:15:40.040 --> 1:15:41.880 it is, Like, Okay, here that's what I'm gonna have 1:15:41.920 --> 1:15:45.360 to do afterwards the treaty. You're thinking practically, yeah, I 1:15:45.400 --> 1:15:46.840 wasn't thinking. I'm like, oh, this is it, this is 1:15:46.960 --> 1:15:49.240 the end that you weren't thinking about your friends, your family, 1:15:49.400 --> 1:15:51.400 Like yeah, it really wasn't. I was just thinking, like 1:15:51.439 --> 1:15:54.439 this situation as it is just really really in the moment, 1:15:55.320 --> 1:15:59.360 and as everything was going on so naturally. Again, as 1:15:59.400 --> 1:16:01.519 soon as that the other guy that had the pistol 1:16:01.640 --> 1:16:04.000 like ran by me. That's initially it was my first 1:16:04.040 --> 1:16:06.439 thought was like, okay, the the you know, the battles over, 1:16:06.479 --> 1:16:08.320 it's it's it's one, it's done, it's taken care of. 1:16:08.360 --> 1:16:10.400 Now it's like, okay, we gotta we gotta treat this. 1:16:10.960 --> 1:16:12.880 Um everything that's going on with me, and I knew 1:16:12.880 --> 1:16:15.639 the other guys had the same process, like they're figuring 1:16:15.680 --> 1:16:20.080 everything out, and um, did you you know, during during 1:16:20.120 --> 1:16:24.400 the attack, do you remember any distinctive sounds or smells 1:16:24.600 --> 1:16:28.240 or things that that paying your memory back to that. 1:16:28.920 --> 1:16:32.360 I certainly remember the growling and everything the bear was making. Um, 1:16:32.520 --> 1:16:38.080 that's unquestionable. Um. Fortunately, there was no like gnarly bone 1:16:38.120 --> 1:16:41.120 breaks training that I had to endure or hear, or 1:16:41.200 --> 1:16:44.160 crunching or anything like that. It was just her and 1:16:44.240 --> 1:16:48.400 I remember kind of the snorts and the breathing and 1:16:48.840 --> 1:16:52.439 the smells. No, I you know, I know that sounds 1:16:52.520 --> 1:16:54.080 kind of funny because I know smells are some of 1:16:54.120 --> 1:16:57.599 the biggest It's it's the number one cent that recalls memory. 1:16:57.920 --> 1:16:59.639 And no, I don't really have a lot of smells, 1:16:59.680 --> 1:17:01.800 probably because there wasn't a whole lot besides moisture in 1:17:01.800 --> 1:17:04.559 the air, you know for me to smell um, given 1:17:04.600 --> 1:17:06.960 the conditions and the winds, and probably the same reason 1:17:06.960 --> 1:17:09.360 why she didn't smell me either. And that's all I 1:17:09.360 --> 1:17:11.240 can think of. But yeah, I hadn't really thought about 1:17:11.240 --> 1:17:15.240 the smells too much. But but they heard the impact 1:17:15.240 --> 1:17:18.559 of her teeth and yeah, no, it certainly felt it 1:17:18.640 --> 1:17:23.080 and um and and new. But it was, you know, 1:17:23.479 --> 1:17:26.920 definitely kind of surreal and it's it's weird because whenever 1:17:26.960 --> 1:17:29.880 I think back upon it, too, is kind of different 1:17:30.320 --> 1:17:33.280 visions of the same thing. Not necessarily PTSD or anything, 1:17:33.320 --> 1:17:36.679 but I definitely, uh think back on it and different 1:17:36.680 --> 1:17:38.240 points of view of being in the first person and 1:17:38.280 --> 1:17:40.599 also in third person just like experienced the same thing. 1:17:40.640 --> 1:17:45.400 So it's kind of unique, but um yeah, quite quite 1:17:45.439 --> 1:17:49.559 the experience there. The the treatment portion in itself was, 1:17:49.840 --> 1:17:55.120 um pretty funny too. One of the um so the 1:17:55.160 --> 1:17:59.160 other two after everything happening, you know, they finished, Yes, yes, 1:17:59.560 --> 1:18:01.800 return to the timeline. I definitely had to get to 1:18:01.800 --> 1:18:03.840 it because it is kind of funny. And I got 1:18:03.880 --> 1:18:06.000 a really good bunch of group group of guys with me, 1:18:06.080 --> 1:18:08.400 and one of them has some pretty good medical experience 1:18:08.479 --> 1:18:12.240 he's had in his past, and um, he came over 1:18:12.320 --> 1:18:14.840 and everybody's kind of getting their ducts in a row, 1:18:14.960 --> 1:18:19.360 so to speak, and delegating stuff out and uh, guys 1:18:19.360 --> 1:18:22.160 are reloading because they're also we're also thinking, Hey, the 1:18:22.280 --> 1:18:25.479 cub or multiple cubs could still be around, Like, doesn't 1:18:25.479 --> 1:18:27.120 mean they can't come back, Like cub can mess you 1:18:27.200 --> 1:18:29.240 up just as well as you know, MoMA bear could, 1:18:29.960 --> 1:18:31.800 especially when it might be you know, ticked off them 1:18:31.800 --> 1:18:36.160 protective of mom embarrass The guys were, you know, very 1:18:36.200 --> 1:18:38.920 weary of that as well, but fortunately never never saw 1:18:39.160 --> 1:18:43.479 the cub and uh, they immediately just start breaking out 1:18:43.600 --> 1:18:48.400 the UM SATH phone. Dorman reaches and getting on those 1:18:49.200 --> 1:18:51.680 and UH Dorman reached, they activated the S O S 1:18:51.720 --> 1:18:54.080 beacon was on it, and UM, guys are getting on 1:18:54.120 --> 1:18:57.960 the SAT phone making phone calls. So as this was happening, 1:18:58.360 --> 1:19:01.880 you know, as I said, I'm kicking off my clothing, 1:19:01.920 --> 1:19:03.960 it was a kid just like unzipping stuff and then 1:19:03.960 --> 1:19:05.639 trying to get stuff out. And I had my AID 1:19:05.720 --> 1:19:07.599 kit and I'm telling them where that is, and and 1:19:07.640 --> 1:19:10.600 they were using their own aid kits as well. And 1:19:10.680 --> 1:19:12.640 the guy that was working on me, he's, you know, 1:19:13.400 --> 1:19:15.559 starts to get his shears out and he's cutting all 1:19:15.760 --> 1:19:17.880 the clothing off on me and uh and trying to 1:19:17.920 --> 1:19:20.000 get out the wounds. And immediately when he came up 1:19:20.000 --> 1:19:21.160 to me, I told him like, hey, I need to 1:19:21.240 --> 1:19:24.160 trying to get on my right leg. Um, just practice 1:19:24.200 --> 1:19:26.360 that we've done before, because I knew that the leg 1:19:26.400 --> 1:19:28.719 took the worst and I was nervous about any type 1:19:28.720 --> 1:19:32.080 of like heavy artery damage it could be. And UM, 1:19:32.200 --> 1:19:35.240 certainly where the wounds were Fortunately that wasn't the case, 1:19:35.280 --> 1:19:37.920 but it still could have been under the circumstances, especially 1:19:37.960 --> 1:19:40.080 couldn't move my legs. So was there a lot of blood? 1:19:40.080 --> 1:19:44.240 I mean there was significant, but really there wasn't um 1:19:44.520 --> 1:19:46.400 certainly not enough to put me in the shock or anything. 1:19:46.520 --> 1:19:49.960 Just you know a fair bit of blood just from 1:19:50.080 --> 1:19:53.960 you know, the trauma. But but of course I'm like 1:19:54.000 --> 1:19:57.120 wearing you know, uh ones that of pants and then 1:19:57.200 --> 1:19:59.639 rain pants and then gators and then boots, so everything 1:19:59.720 --> 1:20:01.760 is kind covering everything so you can't really see these sides. 1:20:01.840 --> 1:20:04.120 Just a bunch of puncture wounds everywhere, like holes in 1:20:04.000 --> 1:20:07.639 the clothing. So once he starts cutting everything off, he's 1:20:07.680 --> 1:20:10.200 kind of sees him rolls me over and he's like, okay, 1:20:10.880 --> 1:20:12.800 we can take the turniquet off because like it was good. 1:20:12.880 --> 1:20:14.840 We're just gonna pack this. The blood is not that bad. 1:20:15.680 --> 1:20:17.760 And uh, I was like, and the only thing going 1:20:17.760 --> 1:20:19.920 through my head is because I've had some training with 1:20:19.960 --> 1:20:21.960 tourniquets and stuff before, Like, Okay, we're gonna go real 1:20:22.040 --> 1:20:24.400 slow because I don't I want to lose my leg 1:20:25.200 --> 1:20:28.080 because it's happened before where guys have taken tourniquets off 1:20:28.120 --> 1:20:31.840 too fast and that rush of blood back into the appendage. Well, 1:20:31.920 --> 1:20:34.280 just that's how you lose one. So a little nervous 1:20:34.280 --> 1:20:36.680 on that point. But we're kind of we're going through 1:20:36.720 --> 1:20:38.200 and he's looking at the wounds like, Okay, they're not 1:20:38.240 --> 1:20:39.840 that bad, and I'm trying to point out other wounds. 1:20:39.840 --> 1:20:41.400 But I knew that the leg was the worst. But 1:20:41.560 --> 1:20:43.160 as soon as you kind of get through it, I'm like, hey, 1:20:44.200 --> 1:20:46.560 I'm like, but I need you to I need you 1:20:46.600 --> 1:20:48.640 to look at my taint. I'm like, I'm like, I 1:20:48.720 --> 1:20:52.320 know because I remember that. And I was like, ok yeah, no, no, 1:20:52.760 --> 1:20:54.640 I was laughing. I was just saying I'm telling you, 1:20:54.720 --> 1:20:57.760 like I'll have to show you pictures afterwards. But I 1:20:57.840 --> 1:21:00.120 was going through the moment of it and I'm like, okay, no, 1:21:00.280 --> 1:21:01.880 homo here, but I really needs you to check my 1:21:01.880 --> 1:21:03.760 taint and he's like, okay. It's like, you know, you know, 1:21:04.200 --> 1:21:05.960 un does it pulls up my you know, underwear, but 1:21:05.960 --> 1:21:07.519 it's kind of underneath and looks and he's like, no, 1:21:07.600 --> 1:21:10.639 you're good, but my okay, but I knew something was wrong, 1:21:10.720 --> 1:21:13.840 like it doesn't feel right, and he you know, kind 1:21:13.880 --> 1:21:16.320 of goes back, uh, you know, through looking, you know, 1:21:16.320 --> 1:21:21.120 cutting off other pieces of clothing and uh, I might no, man, 1:21:21.240 --> 1:21:22.640 like something's not right. I needs you to I need 1:21:22.720 --> 1:21:26.240 to really. So he cuts off the pants, like to 1:21:26.400 --> 1:21:28.439 my underwear at least this point, and like lift up 1:21:28.520 --> 1:21:30.719 the underwear and even before you can see the underwear 1:21:30.760 --> 1:21:33.080 or just a whole in it with just blood everywhere, 1:21:33.080 --> 1:21:36.720 and like, damn it. So it lifts it up and 1:21:36.800 --> 1:21:39.599 like yep, I'm like just looking down like just as 1:21:39.840 --> 1:21:42.040 you know, looking underneath minder where I'm like, yep, there 1:21:42.040 --> 1:21:45.800 it is. There's my testicle hanging out like great, and 1:21:45.920 --> 1:21:47.559 uh you know he sees it. Two It's like okay, 1:21:47.720 --> 1:21:50.479 and uh you know, I just reached down like I 1:21:50.600 --> 1:21:54.160 gotta put that back in, pretending like that that happened dude. 1:21:54.680 --> 1:21:58.400 And uh so then of course that's all that was 1:21:58.439 --> 1:22:00.640 on the mine. I'm my gosh, damn it. I'm like, 1:22:00.680 --> 1:22:04.040 you gotta be shipping me. And I'm also like still wear. 1:22:04.080 --> 1:22:05.679 I'm like, okay, I know my arm in my back 1:22:05.800 --> 1:22:07.680 is kind of messed up. I'm like, okay, here's one here, 1:22:07.680 --> 1:22:08.960 and I'm like I tell him he cuts it off. 1:22:09.000 --> 1:22:10.680 He's like, yeah, okay, I see it, and you know, 1:22:10.680 --> 1:22:13.720 they're packing those wounds as well, and but it's still 1:22:13.760 --> 1:22:15.439 in my min. I'm like, hey, does anybody have any 1:22:15.520 --> 1:22:17.559 like a sock or something I can sub down there 1:22:17.640 --> 1:22:22.680 like top out again. I was still attached though. Oh 1:22:22.760 --> 1:22:25.400 it was you know, like little nunchucks, you know, hanging out. 1:22:26.280 --> 1:22:30.519 Baby's still down. There's still good. But so you felt 1:22:30.520 --> 1:22:33.439 like it's attached. Yeah, It's like it's gotta be still good. 1:22:34.800 --> 1:22:36.800 And there's just been like a you know, like the 1:22:36.880 --> 1:22:39.760 bubble is burst. Yeah, And I'm like, man, I know 1:22:39.880 --> 1:22:42.280 guys have like bisectovies and stuff, but like it doesn't 1:22:42.280 --> 1:22:44.160 come out. They just like reached in there and you know, 1:22:44.280 --> 1:22:46.640 make a little snip snip and it's good. You know, 1:22:46.720 --> 1:22:49.040 cut the little whatever it is down there, vas difference 1:22:49.120 --> 1:22:51.640 whatever it is. And uh, I'm like, oh man, you 1:22:51.680 --> 1:22:53.920 gotta be kidding me. And so of course it was 1:22:53.960 --> 1:22:56.320 on my mind. I'm like nervous about it coming back out, 1:22:56.439 --> 1:22:59.040 and so I'm like I was asking that he didn't 1:22:59.080 --> 1:23:00.559 get it like a sock. I I just didn't wanted 1:23:00.600 --> 1:23:02.719 to pop out like what I'm getting moved around and stuff. 1:23:02.720 --> 1:23:06.639 I'm like, gosh, damn it, bandana or yeah, exactly something. 1:23:06.720 --> 1:23:09.040 It's like yeah, it's like it's it's in the underwear, 1:23:09.080 --> 1:23:11.120 like it's good, like not gonna focus on it, but 1:23:11.120 --> 1:23:14.519 of course I'm focused on it. And uh, the jokes 1:23:14.560 --> 1:23:17.800 just start coming out immediately, like guys like, don't worry 1:23:17.840 --> 1:23:20.919 about him, man, you need one, like you still have kids, 1:23:21.080 --> 1:23:25.840 like really like lighthearted guys. And I'm just laughing. Honestly, 1:23:25.880 --> 1:23:27.639 I was in really good spirits to the whole thing, 1:23:27.760 --> 1:23:29.920 like he wasn't gonna die. I knew nothing bad was 1:23:29.920 --> 1:23:32.759 gonna happen. I'm laughing too, and we're cracking jokes and really, 1:23:32.960 --> 1:23:36.439 you know, barely made it out. You know, it's made 1:23:36.439 --> 1:23:39.040 bare jokes as you can make immediately, and it just 1:23:39.080 --> 1:23:43.960 started sation hairy situation, and uh it was great. But 1:23:44.880 --> 1:23:47.080 I know they found some like little scary strip type 1:23:47.080 --> 1:23:49.920 things and put that on there. And of course, you know, 1:23:50.320 --> 1:23:52.439 if you have any type of organs are about, you're 1:23:52.439 --> 1:23:53.800 never supposed to put him back in. So that was 1:23:53.840 --> 1:23:56.240 also kind of a thing like no, I'm gonna that's okay, 1:23:56.240 --> 1:23:57.640 I'll put him back in, Like I don't want that 1:23:57.680 --> 1:24:00.200 thing just hanging around willy nilly, I'm putting that back. 1:24:00.400 --> 1:24:03.439 It's going in against the medical advice. I'm putting it 1:24:03.479 --> 1:24:07.760 back in Alright, there's there's no just yeah, I hope. 1:24:07.840 --> 1:24:09.600 I was like, I never want anybody to experience that 1:24:09.640 --> 1:24:11.320 because that's not a fun feeling just seeing it, like 1:24:11.400 --> 1:24:14.559 hanging out as a podcast host speechless, right, yeah, continue, 1:24:14.640 --> 1:24:17.719 I have nothing to add to the conversation. There's nothing 1:24:17.760 --> 1:24:21.960 I can say, so, uh is at this point I'm 1:24:22.040 --> 1:24:25.679 kind of patched up and the guys are getting out there, 1:24:25.720 --> 1:24:28.439 you know, puff Jacketson's leading Jacketson trying to cover me 1:24:28.479 --> 1:24:30.880 back up because I'm essentially kind of naked on one 1:24:30.920 --> 1:24:33.720 half of my body and giving the conditions, it was 1:24:33.720 --> 1:24:37.240 pretty brutal, and I gotta say with the whole experience, 1:24:37.280 --> 1:24:39.719 that was certainly the worst part was just in during 1:24:39.760 --> 1:24:43.840 the cold. And I'm certainly no stranger to cold living 1:24:43.920 --> 1:24:46.439 up there, being from Maine before that and doing a 1:24:46.439 --> 1:24:50.400 lot of type of outdoor training UM and having experiences 1:24:50.720 --> 1:24:54.000 I know, the cold, but that one I was just Jackhamer. 1:24:54.080 --> 1:24:56.680 It was it was hard going UM waiting on the 1:24:56.680 --> 1:25:00.439 coach guard which we had gotten in contact with UM 1:25:00.680 --> 1:25:04.080 via the satphone, So how quickly, how quickly to the 1:25:04.080 --> 1:25:07.000 wounds are dressed as well as they could the test 1:25:07.040 --> 1:25:10.719 goles back in its place. Everything is is you guys 1:25:10.720 --> 1:25:13.720 feel like stable at this point? How quickly did that 1:25:13.800 --> 1:25:17.719 happen until you were making those calls and expecting the rescue. 1:25:18.240 --> 1:25:21.240 So um, we were on the bird. We had no 1:25:21.280 --> 1:25:23.439 idea what to expect with them as time wise and 1:25:23.479 --> 1:25:26.240 how soon that they would get there. Um getting spun up. 1:25:27.160 --> 1:25:29.320 It's it's not a long flight like it's only like 1:25:30.240 --> 1:25:33.599 I want to say, minutes for them to fly um 1:25:33.720 --> 1:25:35.720 from the base to a to a fog neck. As 1:25:35.720 --> 1:25:37.599 we talked about before. It's a scary thing just because 1:25:37.640 --> 1:25:40.360 the weather you don't know, it changed so quickly exactly, 1:25:40.400 --> 1:25:43.840 and there the cloud cover had kind of lifted. It 1:25:43.880 --> 1:25:45.960 wasn't as low as it had been earlier in the day, 1:25:46.040 --> 1:25:49.360 so that was certainly a blessing, but it still wasn't 1:25:49.439 --> 1:25:52.080 great conditions by any means either, And of course they 1:25:52.080 --> 1:25:54.439 still had to find us. But we were walking them on. 1:25:54.720 --> 1:25:58.120 Guys were joining on the spot with grid coordinates, UM, 1:25:58.160 --> 1:26:00.200 passing them like Latin long whenever they needed to in 1:26:00.880 --> 1:26:03.800 and got them to cordings and walked him on there. 1:26:03.880 --> 1:26:06.240 But I did want to touch out on on one 1:26:06.240 --> 1:26:08.240 piece because you mentioned earlier and that was a learning 1:26:08.240 --> 1:26:14.400 point for us. Is the dorm in reach, so the 1:26:14.400 --> 1:26:19.080 in reach SUS button reactivated it nobody is what like 1:26:19.120 --> 1:26:22.680 the dolrum in reach is a it's a GPS slash, 1:26:22.880 --> 1:26:25.600 you know, GPS communicator that you can text on. I 1:26:25.720 --> 1:26:27.960 use it to text my wife still staying good graces 1:26:28.000 --> 1:26:31.360 when I'm on. And on the side of it, there's 1:26:31.400 --> 1:26:33.920 an s OS button. You can peel back this this 1:26:34.040 --> 1:26:37.439 plastic you know, rubber covering and push this SS button 1:26:37.439 --> 1:26:41.759 that's supposed to send a signal out a beacon and um, 1:26:41.800 --> 1:26:44.519 something happened bad, come get me exactly. That's it. And 1:26:44.560 --> 1:26:46.800 you know, we use it for the primary reason just 1:26:46.840 --> 1:26:48.479 like you said, texting is one of the biggest things. 1:26:48.479 --> 1:26:50.280 When we're off there, we can't text any other means 1:26:50.280 --> 1:26:52.680 and we're not gonna waste minutes in time on the 1:26:52.720 --> 1:26:56.439 SAT phone. So it's been great for that. However, we 1:26:56.560 --> 1:26:59.120 never really knew what the SUS going to do, you know, 1:26:59.160 --> 1:27:02.800 like most of the around for somebody comes save me, know, 1:27:02.960 --> 1:27:05.519 save our souls. You know, that's literally what it is. 1:27:05.560 --> 1:27:09.200 And we activated unfortunately had the SAT or the SAT 1:27:09.240 --> 1:27:12.800 phone with us, but when we activated it, come to 1:27:12.840 --> 1:27:16.519 find out afterwards, the State troopers got it first. Um 1:27:16.640 --> 1:27:18.280 talked to State trooper when I was in the hospital 1:27:18.280 --> 1:27:21.120 and he's like, yeah, it's like they got the call first, 1:27:21.560 --> 1:27:23.760 but by the time they got the call didn't really 1:27:23.760 --> 1:27:25.280 know what it was. They just knew was some sort 1:27:25.280 --> 1:27:27.800 of emergency beacon no idea this situation. I think it 1:27:27.840 --> 1:27:31.840 gives him uh GPS coordinate and it just tells him 1:27:31.880 --> 1:27:34.519 something bad has happened. That's pretty much it. And probably 1:27:34.680 --> 1:27:38.960 the user name, I think whatever his information is it 1:27:39.040 --> 1:27:41.360 because it wasn't my my dorm and she's somebody else's 1:27:41.400 --> 1:27:46.599 mind was just bright exactly. And so that went out 1:27:46.720 --> 1:27:49.840 and by the time they had any inclination of what 1:27:49.880 --> 1:27:52.280 was going on what it was, coast guards already spent 1:27:52.360 --> 1:27:54.360 up on our way. So saw like they were really 1:27:54.479 --> 1:27:56.280 you know, quick to react like that they were because 1:27:56.280 --> 1:27:59.680 we had him on the SAT without a phone. Then 1:27:59.680 --> 1:28:01.720 it would have been like, okay, they would have had 1:28:01.760 --> 1:28:03.280 to call the coast guard. The coast guard would have 1:28:03.280 --> 1:28:04.840 had no idea what was going on. They would have 1:28:04.840 --> 1:28:07.559 had reached out on the dolorum, you know, And and 1:28:07.760 --> 1:28:09.519 I don't know if that's by a text how that 1:28:09.520 --> 1:28:12.519 would go down or or what, but it would have 1:28:12.560 --> 1:28:16.440 been a little bit different, maybe even longer. And uh 1:28:16.800 --> 1:28:19.400 so as this was going down, Um, I'm just knna, 1:28:19.439 --> 1:28:21.080 you know, sitting there waiting at this point, there's nothing 1:28:21.080 --> 1:28:24.400 else to do. The guys that weren't on the comms piece, 1:28:24.520 --> 1:28:26.880 we're just kind of cutting branches because we knew, you know, 1:28:27.520 --> 1:28:30.240 getting a burden, they're gonna come lift me out. And 1:28:30.360 --> 1:28:32.200 uh so they're just kind of cutting down branches in 1:28:32.200 --> 1:28:35.160 the area, trying to clear you know, pave away couldn't 1:28:35.160 --> 1:28:41.360 really move. Um I think, you know, given different circumstances, 1:28:41.400 --> 1:28:43.240 I didn't have another bunch of guys around me, and 1:28:43.240 --> 1:28:46.400 if I was, so, it would have been just a 1:28:46.439 --> 1:28:48.960 hoilacious straight like who knows would have what or could 1:28:48.960 --> 1:28:52.000 have happened, you know, But fortunately that was not the case. 1:28:52.520 --> 1:28:54.639 The other two guys and other two guys are hunting 1:28:54.680 --> 1:28:56.880 parties still don't know this is going on, or you know, 1:28:56.920 --> 1:28:59.240 they were with us. The other two that were separate, 1:28:59.280 --> 1:29:02.120 they heard all the commotion, they came up. Yeah it 1:29:02.200 --> 1:29:04.479 was it was that guy or one of the two 1:29:04.560 --> 1:29:06.000 that actually he came up and he was one of 1:29:06.000 --> 1:29:10.920 treating my wounds all together. Yeah, everybody's everybody pitched in 1:29:10.960 --> 1:29:13.160 and it was the other guy from the other party 1:29:13.240 --> 1:29:16.360 that he uh, um was on the sat phone and 1:29:16.439 --> 1:29:18.880 he was doing that piece. So kind of everybody's you know, 1:29:18.960 --> 1:29:21.280 finding a job doing something at this point, like I said, 1:29:21.400 --> 1:29:24.479 really really text but couldn't went down any every any better. 1:29:24.520 --> 1:29:26.519 What's far But he's doing, you know, a job or 1:29:26.560 --> 1:29:30.760 looking for something to do, and uh yeah, at that 1:29:30.840 --> 1:29:32.360 point in time, it was just sit and wait and 1:29:32.400 --> 1:29:35.040 they're talking to him on the bird and bird comes 1:29:35.040 --> 1:29:38.280 in and um, you know, hoist the guy down first. 1:29:38.400 --> 1:29:40.599 And he kind of comes and assesses me and ask 1:29:40.680 --> 1:29:44.840 me questions and I'm completely coherent, answering them good spirits, YadA, 1:29:44.920 --> 1:29:48.479 YadA YadA, checking everything over. They come up with a 1:29:48.479 --> 1:29:50.840 plan of action to get the litter down and then 1:29:51.120 --> 1:29:53.360 put me on the litter and then uh and hoist 1:29:53.400 --> 1:29:56.760 me up. Um. The whole process definitely took longer than 1:29:56.760 --> 1:30:00.400 I would have liked. I think it U did it? Ever, 1:30:00.560 --> 1:30:04.040 I don't I know. The incident happened right around one ten. 1:30:04.400 --> 1:30:07.519 I think it's in The attack happened, and I didn't 1:30:07.640 --> 1:30:09.080 have a chance to check my watch and everything. The 1:30:09.120 --> 1:30:12.080 hospital they took it all off, but it was like 1:30:12.280 --> 1:30:13.960 roughly from what I heard about two and a half 1:30:14.000 --> 1:30:17.599 hours later that I was actually at the hospital. So 1:30:19.240 --> 1:30:21.479 blessing going out to the coast guards. Still save my 1:30:21.520 --> 1:30:25.559 ass but that definitely if it was a fatal wound, 1:30:25.560 --> 1:30:28.519 like you know, there's no question there's been a fatal wounded. 1:30:28.560 --> 1:30:30.760 The well out of the golden hour like one hour period, 1:30:30.800 --> 1:30:32.679 we're like, okay, you know my life might have been safe. 1:30:32.760 --> 1:30:38.120 So still save my ass. Um wasn't too happy about 1:30:39.360 --> 1:30:43.719 their their hoist camera that they have so on there, 1:30:44.400 --> 1:30:48.679 Uh they're they're helicopter they have they have a hoist 1:30:48.680 --> 1:30:50.640 camera like going right down the cable like where it's 1:30:50.680 --> 1:30:54.360 lefting me up and immediately immediately as soon as it 1:30:54.400 --> 1:30:56.719 went down, like they had that camera footage of hoisting 1:30:56.800 --> 1:30:59.320 me up, you know, off the ground and posted on 1:30:59.360 --> 1:31:02.759 Facebook like social media. So I love the coach guys 1:31:02.760 --> 1:31:05.040 still saying my ask that they immediately posted that so 1:31:06.160 --> 1:31:08.360 for what a reason, I don't know, for their own reason, 1:31:08.560 --> 1:31:10.559 like hey, you know, save the hiker you know hunter 1:31:10.680 --> 1:31:16.360 or whatever you know, uh from from and again like 1:31:16.439 --> 1:31:18.360 I give it to him percent. It's like, hey, you 1:31:18.400 --> 1:31:20.800 know I would absolutely give them you know, the save 1:31:20.880 --> 1:31:22.599 the rescue and good for them, but I was kind 1:31:22.600 --> 1:31:25.760 of like, man, to post it immediately, it made me 1:31:25.800 --> 1:31:28.120 and other guys more upset because I had other guys 1:31:28.240 --> 1:31:30.200 you know that I know, and they were out in 1:31:30.200 --> 1:31:34.400 the field and or you know, outside of of work, 1:31:34.400 --> 1:31:37.639 and they found out through Facebook before they found out 1:31:37.640 --> 1:31:41.280 from guys like phone calls like hey, you know, uh, 1:31:41.439 --> 1:31:43.439 guy just got mauled, you know whatever else, like through 1:31:43.479 --> 1:31:48.360 any anything else. And uh, fortunately my my folks didn't 1:31:48.360 --> 1:31:50.280 find out that way. You know, I called and when 1:31:50.280 --> 1:31:51.800 I got to the the hospital. But I'm kind of like, 1:31:51.840 --> 1:31:54.479 that's that's pretty much. That's pretty messed up to do it, 1:31:54.600 --> 1:31:57.200 you know, so so soon. And I'm like, yeah, it 1:31:57.240 --> 1:31:59.080 didn't make me happy, and I do want to give 1:31:59.160 --> 1:32:01.040 him the rescue everything, but I was like, man, that's 1:32:01.320 --> 1:32:05.640 pretty unprofessional. As far as I would agree with that wholeheartedly, 1:32:05.880 --> 1:32:09.400 it's like marketing their bill of the Yeah, and again 1:32:09.439 --> 1:32:12.479 I'm not against them doing they do a lot of things. 1:32:12.520 --> 1:32:15.519 They're like they are the biggest base you know, is 1:32:15.560 --> 1:32:18.559 in Kodiak for the coach guard, and rightfully so, they 1:32:18.640 --> 1:32:20.280 save a lot a lot of I know, like you're 1:32:20.280 --> 1:32:25.600 saying that, yeah, all props for the life saving efforts. 1:32:26.280 --> 1:32:31.720 But come on, ye, streamline, come on streamline that social process. Ye. 1:32:32.320 --> 1:32:34.800 But yeah, it's was there moments in the waiting because 1:32:35.800 --> 1:32:38.120 you know, we talked about like sounds and smells of 1:32:38.439 --> 1:32:41.760 the attack, right, but are there are moments in the 1:32:41.800 --> 1:32:46.040 waiting to be rescued? Um in air quotes? I guess 1:32:47.400 --> 1:32:49.880 where things started to settle in your mind as to 1:32:49.920 --> 1:32:52.320 what happened or was it still a tactical you know, 1:32:52.360 --> 1:32:54.120 I gotta get out of here. I need to stay alive. 1:32:54.160 --> 1:32:56.960 I need to get you know what. You you obviously 1:32:57.000 --> 1:32:59.840 weren't given any duties. You had to you know, lay 1:32:59.840 --> 1:33:03.360 there or be warm and be stable. That's pretty much it. 1:33:03.520 --> 1:33:05.719 So during that time, do you remember your mind drifting 1:33:05.720 --> 1:33:09.880 to any particular things other than you know, I was 1:33:09.920 --> 1:33:13.880 pretty focused in a moment still, Um No, I never. 1:33:15.320 --> 1:33:18.520 I don't know. I'm a very determined, focused kind of individual, 1:33:18.560 --> 1:33:20.639 and guys that know me know the same thing that 1:33:21.560 --> 1:33:25.720 I definitely don't let anybody tell me how things are 1:33:25.720 --> 1:33:27.360 gonna go or how I'm gonna live my life, or 1:33:27.360 --> 1:33:29.240 how things is gonna turn out or odds or anything 1:33:29.240 --> 1:33:31.640 like that really kind of drives me and forces me 1:33:31.720 --> 1:33:35.200 to work even harder so the only thoughts going through 1:33:35.240 --> 1:33:37.080 my mind is like, okay, cool, well, I wonder how 1:33:37.080 --> 1:33:39.040 long this is gonna take before him back to doing 1:33:39.120 --> 1:33:41.880 the same old things I'm gonna be doing. Like nothing 1:33:41.960 --> 1:33:45.040 in my mind was like, oh I'm limp biscuit now. 1:33:45.200 --> 1:33:46.960 Besides like the jokes of like, hm, I wonder if 1:33:46.960 --> 1:33:49.479 I can have kids, but I'm single, Like I don't 1:33:49.479 --> 1:33:52.479 have a girlfriend, you know, no wife, no kids, anybody else. 1:33:52.520 --> 1:33:55.040 It's like it's like, you know what, if I'm gonna 1:33:55.080 --> 1:33:56.920 approved this, I'm gonna prove it. You know, however many 1:33:57.000 --> 1:33:59.000 years down the road, like if that's even gonna happen. 1:33:59.080 --> 1:34:01.639 So uh yeah, the only thing going through my mind 1:34:01.680 --> 1:34:03.000 is like, all right, I wonder how long it's gonna 1:34:03.040 --> 1:34:06.800 take me out of the picture, you know. Just yeah, 1:34:06.840 --> 1:34:09.120 I'm just kind of like, okay, what's next. Like I 1:34:09.240 --> 1:34:13.320 survived like none whatsoever, and I was just I was 1:34:13.439 --> 1:34:16.400 really really proud, I guess of the guys that were 1:34:16.439 --> 1:34:18.599 with me and thankful. It was like, hey, it's like 1:34:19.479 --> 1:34:21.920 kind of got me thinking, and um, you know, I 1:34:22.479 --> 1:34:26.080 know we briefly touched on her earlier, uh when we 1:34:26.120 --> 1:34:28.320 talked about like guns and like everybody having side arms 1:34:28.360 --> 1:34:32.120 and uh uh when certain guys like decided like, okay, 1:34:32.160 --> 1:34:34.000 we're only going after the one elk, not everybody's gonna 1:34:34.000 --> 1:34:36.000 get shoot, and some guys decided like, okay, just leave 1:34:36.040 --> 1:34:39.080 the rifles behind. Because we all knew when we made 1:34:39.080 --> 1:34:41.960 our planet, like we already had a base camp set up, 1:34:42.040 --> 1:34:44.559 that this hunt was going to be like Okay, we 1:34:44.640 --> 1:34:46.439 know where there are, this is gonna be super light, 1:34:46.520 --> 1:34:48.760 just bringing the absolute minimum so we can carry it 1:34:48.800 --> 1:34:50.599 the most amount of meat like all in the goes 1:34:50.640 --> 1:34:52.760 that we can and with the amount of guys, like 1:34:52.800 --> 1:34:54.880 we figured five guys, we can definitely haul a whole 1:34:54.880 --> 1:34:58.120 thing out in one go. Like everybody takes like a 1:34:58.240 --> 1:35:00.640 quarter and then you know whatever organ meats and like 1:35:00.640 --> 1:35:02.479 backstraps and turnalains and all that kind of stuff and 1:35:02.520 --> 1:35:05.360 then the uh, the rack. But we're like, yeah, we 1:35:05.360 --> 1:35:07.439 can do this in one go, so everybody's light lightening 1:35:07.479 --> 1:35:11.679 the load and um definitely kind of eye opening, especially 1:35:11.720 --> 1:35:13.320 even me, Like I said, I was really excited about 1:35:13.320 --> 1:35:14.680 having the six five creem more. But now that I 1:35:14.680 --> 1:35:17.240 think about Mike, Okay, well, I'm not so much of 1:35:17.280 --> 1:35:20.679 a you know, an asset. If there is a bear 1:35:20.720 --> 1:35:22.639 in the area or something like that that would have happened. 1:35:22.640 --> 1:35:26.200 And all of us have talked in the past, you 1:35:26.200 --> 1:35:28.800 know what we're doing with the bear charges, and a 1:35:28.840 --> 1:35:30.439 lot of us spend a lot of time with the range, 1:35:30.439 --> 1:35:33.120 a lot of time shooting, and um, very savvy, I 1:35:33.120 --> 1:35:35.439 would say, but all of us kind of know too. 1:35:35.479 --> 1:35:38.360 Is like, especially in this situation, just as mine, no 1:35:38.439 --> 1:35:39.880 time to take a shot, Like if you have a 1:35:39.880 --> 1:35:41.640 pistol or anything like, maybe you get a couple of 1:35:41.640 --> 1:35:43.920 shots off. You never know, But we always say that, 1:35:44.000 --> 1:35:46.519 like that that pistol or that rightfley you have on you, 1:35:46.600 --> 1:35:48.800 it's not for you, it's for the other guy. Like 1:35:48.840 --> 1:35:50.920 you're always carrying it. So if somebody else is the 1:35:50.920 --> 1:35:52.760 one that gets attacked, you're Johnny on the spot to 1:35:52.840 --> 1:35:56.080 go and and take that thing down immediately. So, yes, 1:35:56.120 --> 1:35:58.880 you're there to defend yourself, but the probability is less 1:35:58.960 --> 1:36:00.479 that you're gonna be able to do that. It's in 1:36:00.520 --> 1:36:04.320 defense of you know, somebody else. So um, huge proponent 1:36:04.400 --> 1:36:06.200 of that and thinking that way, But it also got 1:36:06.240 --> 1:36:08.680 me thinking like, okay, well, yeah, maybe I shouldn't be 1:36:08.720 --> 1:36:11.120 carrying that really really light rifle because of you know 1:36:11.160 --> 1:36:14.599 said cases. And so I think that's kind of changed, um, 1:36:14.680 --> 1:36:19.320 some of our standards, you know, for what we're gonna 1:36:19.320 --> 1:36:21.479 do later on. And and for me, I think one 1:36:21.520 --> 1:36:24.200 of the big lessons after as I said, with the cold, 1:36:24.240 --> 1:36:26.920 were like, Okay, as much as we spend time in 1:36:26.960 --> 1:36:31.120 survival and we're tough bunch of guys and very versed 1:36:31.120 --> 1:36:34.080 in the area, is like from now on, carrying those 1:36:34.080 --> 1:36:38.240 little space blankets, throwing in the first aid get like 1:36:38.280 --> 1:36:40.599 along with everything, ounce and like yeah, okay, a little 1:36:40.640 --> 1:36:43.040 bit like another extra ounce or something and ounces to 1:36:43.200 --> 1:36:46.920 equal pounds. But it's like that would would have been 1:36:46.960 --> 1:36:48.760 a night and day difference for you know, kind of 1:36:48.840 --> 1:36:51.719 keeping me from just jackhammering. Yeah, And I think that's 1:36:52.040 --> 1:36:55.759 you know, things like this, like you know, this isn't 1:36:55.880 --> 1:36:59.040 for me, hearing this story from you is not entertaining. 1:36:59.080 --> 1:37:01.960 Of course, I'm you know, like I can barely struggle 1:37:02.000 --> 1:37:04.920 even to know what to say to you hearing that. 1:37:05.000 --> 1:37:08.600 But but I think for folks listening these that that 1:37:08.680 --> 1:37:12.679 type of insight is what's valuable here, is to hear 1:37:12.720 --> 1:37:16.000 your story and to everybody got holes in their game, 1:37:16.760 --> 1:37:19.519 and in this case, those holes can lead to death 1:37:19.880 --> 1:37:24.240 or life. And your case, had you not had tourniquets. 1:37:24.840 --> 1:37:27.400 Had you not had a sat phone, you know, had 1:37:27.400 --> 1:37:30.559 you not add four other buddies with you, things could 1:37:30.640 --> 1:37:34.040 could win a lot different, totally different. Yeah, the lessons 1:37:34.040 --> 1:37:36.080 are always you know, learning blood and he saw the 1:37:36.320 --> 1:37:38.720 hard ones. People are stubborn, don't want to change. It's 1:37:38.760 --> 1:37:41.080 like until something serious happens, that's when it kind of 1:37:41.240 --> 1:37:44.280 such things in perspective and you forge out there listening 1:37:44.280 --> 1:37:46.000 to this and you're hunting in bear country. I mean, 1:37:46.080 --> 1:37:48.600 these are things that you need to you know, you 1:37:48.640 --> 1:37:50.519 need to think about. You need to think very hard 1:37:50.720 --> 1:37:53.479 about how you prepare and in what holes are in 1:37:53.520 --> 1:37:56.960 your game, and if something should happen, what the contingencies are, 1:37:56.960 --> 1:38:00.759 because this is I mean, this is this is exactly 1:38:00.760 --> 1:38:07.280 what everyone figures absolutely well. Just you know, when you 1:38:07.320 --> 1:38:09.960 ask me to talk about it, I've got no qualms 1:38:10.000 --> 1:38:11.759 telling the story. I love telling the stories other people. 1:38:12.160 --> 1:38:14.200 I've said, it's just practiced for the grandkids, you know, 1:38:14.280 --> 1:38:19.680 somedays you know, really good to tell all about it. 1:38:19.760 --> 1:38:22.400 And but I did think about them, like, okay, it 1:38:22.520 --> 1:38:25.519 is good perspective and by no means any type of 1:38:25.600 --> 1:38:27.439 expert on the matter now, just because you know I 1:38:27.479 --> 1:38:30.479 went through this experience, But I think it does kind 1:38:30.479 --> 1:38:34.519 of open some eyes and doors to what you can 1:38:34.520 --> 1:38:37.040 tell people because so often it's like you just hear 1:38:37.080 --> 1:38:38.519 people talk, you know, it's like, oh, what do you 1:38:38.520 --> 1:38:41.360 do this type of experience, but really don't have any experiences. 1:38:41.439 --> 1:38:43.719 You know, their experiences ended, you know, with a bluff 1:38:43.800 --> 1:38:47.240 charge that they had once and you use what you got. 1:38:47.320 --> 1:38:50.240 And yes, there's a lot of common sense that comes 1:38:50.280 --> 1:38:52.760 into as as a factor for what you're gonna do 1:38:52.840 --> 1:38:55.839 out there. But uh, you know, definitely being through the process, 1:38:55.920 --> 1:38:58.400 I know it won't always go down the same never 1:38:58.439 --> 1:39:01.200 go down exactly that way ever again you know somebody else, 1:39:01.240 --> 1:39:05.679 but um, it is kind of lesson you know, people 1:39:05.680 --> 1:39:07.320 that I work with and talk to and see now 1:39:07.320 --> 1:39:08.800 it's like okay, now I can kind of touch on 1:39:08.840 --> 1:39:11.360 those things and know what's gonna work and probably Okay, 1:39:11.439 --> 1:39:14.280 this isn't the smart thing to be. Yeah, solo hunting 1:39:14.280 --> 1:39:16.599 and bear country exactly. There is a risk, man, It's 1:39:16.600 --> 1:39:20.040 a hard risk for sure. What the story that always 1:39:20.040 --> 1:39:23.439 comes up and I laugh about all the time is, uh, 1:39:23.680 --> 1:39:26.599 Leonardo Dicapri and the Revenant. Everyone brings out up all 1:39:26.640 --> 1:39:29.040 the time. So I've got a great little picture with 1:39:29.080 --> 1:39:31.280 the meme on it says Leo can suck it as 1:39:31.280 --> 1:39:35.120 he's getting attacked by the bear, and uh, I was. 1:39:35.200 --> 1:39:37.599 I was aware of the hue Glass story well before 1:39:37.600 --> 1:39:40.080 the movie, before the event, and uh and knew it well. 1:39:40.120 --> 1:39:43.240 And that guy's for sure badass. And the movie didn't 1:39:43.280 --> 1:39:45.400 quite do adjice on how it really went down. You know, 1:39:45.600 --> 1:39:49.519 um no, and it doesn't in the real story. You know, 1:39:49.560 --> 1:39:51.559 he didn't he didn't kill it or anything. They finished 1:39:51.600 --> 1:39:54.160 off like with twenty plus dudies or whatever, just you know, 1:39:54.600 --> 1:39:57.400 unloading on it with with guns and he got some 1:39:57.479 --> 1:39:59.360 knife strikes in. But you can see how beat up 1:39:59.400 --> 1:40:01.599 he gotten. That's a lot of the things that we're 1:40:01.600 --> 1:40:03.800 going through. My mind is like as badass as the 1:40:03.840 --> 1:40:05.760 story could have been. And probably everybody wants to hear 1:40:05.800 --> 1:40:09.000 me about me like you know, pulling out my knife 1:40:09.000 --> 1:40:10.760 and you know, stabbing the bear and like fighting it off. 1:40:10.800 --> 1:40:14.120 I'm like, this is a five pound animal, seven foot 1:40:14.120 --> 1:40:18.680 bear that it's just born bread and knows how to 1:40:18.720 --> 1:40:20.960 just crush and kill and do everything auntsen. It's like, yeah, 1:40:20.960 --> 1:40:22.519 it would be a great strug, but that's not that's 1:40:22.560 --> 1:40:25.040 not reality. That's the movies for you, you know. And 1:40:25.040 --> 1:40:26.840 and if I was by myself shore like that, we're 1:40:26.840 --> 1:40:28.720 probably would have changed everything and what I had to do. 1:40:28.920 --> 1:40:31.320 And and who knows if it would have left left 1:40:31.360 --> 1:40:34.200 me alone or if I would have had to fight it, 1:40:34.240 --> 1:40:37.200 and if I had to fight it. Man be hard 1:40:37.240 --> 1:40:40.000 to think about, like who certainly in this situation, it's 1:40:40.040 --> 1:40:43.320 not man versus bear because there's nothing. It's you're not 1:40:43.439 --> 1:40:46.439 facing off with this bear. And and and for point 1:40:46.439 --> 1:40:49.120 of fact, you know you guys killed this bear and 1:40:49.200 --> 1:40:51.479 you were telling me afterwards, this is seven and a 1:40:51.479 --> 1:41:01.320 half foot giant, giant giant bear ya um. And the weight, 1:41:02.080 --> 1:41:07.439 the the impact of of that animal, it's not something 1:41:07.439 --> 1:41:09.840 that you can fight back. No, I just can't, not 1:41:09.920 --> 1:41:13.759 at all. And the of course I'm fascinating the subject 1:41:13.920 --> 1:41:16.320 wasn't even before being around bears all the time. But 1:41:16.720 --> 1:41:19.040 you see the mallings and the stories and and most 1:41:19.080 --> 1:41:21.760 people don't survive the mallings. And they do happen, um 1:41:22.280 --> 1:41:24.479 if they're like actually mauled and not just like you 1:41:24.520 --> 1:41:28.760 know shot, um when it happens, they're just if they 1:41:28.840 --> 1:41:32.760 got anything in the front of you, like people's just 1:41:32.880 --> 1:41:35.439 face faces are never the same again, like they ripping 1:41:35.439 --> 1:41:39.519 out organs everything else, and and I knew that. And again, 1:41:39.640 --> 1:41:42.360 like I said, there's no bravado here, Like my bravado 1:41:42.479 --> 1:41:45.240 was thinking about like if I die, I'm no good 1:41:45.280 --> 1:41:47.880 to anybody. It's like, and then everybody else is gonna 1:41:47.880 --> 1:41:49.800 be the force to deal with that. It's like, I know, 1:41:49.880 --> 1:41:51.639 it's like I don't need to fight back here. I've 1:41:51.640 --> 1:41:54.360 got four other guys that are ready to like there'll 1:41:54.360 --> 1:41:56.160 be Johnny us. But that's a lot of like I said, 1:41:56.160 --> 1:41:57.880 a lot of it was just trust and the guys 1:41:57.920 --> 1:42:00.240 that were with me that I'm like, Okay, all you 1:42:00.280 --> 1:42:02.280 do here is last, Like how am I going to 1:42:03.120 --> 1:42:05.839 last through this? To be able to give those guys 1:42:06.439 --> 1:42:09.479 enough kind of awareness and know what's going on and 1:42:09.520 --> 1:42:11.000 be able to get to me in time to do this? 1:42:11.080 --> 1:42:12.760 Like how can I you know, opens up the best? 1:42:12.800 --> 1:42:14.640 Like yeah, of course it's very limited in what I 1:42:14.640 --> 1:42:17.160 could do, but I you know, yelling Albert, hey, at 1:42:17.200 --> 1:42:20.360 least let somebody know or like not that they heard it. 1:42:20.400 --> 1:42:22.200 They just figured it out through everything else, all the 1:42:22.280 --> 1:42:25.160 other commotion is going on. But uh, and then protecting 1:42:25.200 --> 1:42:27.720 myself because it's it's literally all that I could do. 1:42:27.880 --> 1:42:30.760 There is you know, there's no like, oh, I'm gonna 1:42:30.800 --> 1:42:33.439 block this bear, know, do this? And I've got a 1:42:33.479 --> 1:42:36.880 great photo that somebody sent me and it's Um actually 1:42:36.920 --> 1:42:38.799 said just a cold too, and he's like, guess I've 1:42:38.840 --> 1:42:41.080 got that and I've seen that one and it's bare 1:42:41.160 --> 1:42:44.040 jiu jitsu and it's got all these different pictures of 1:42:44.120 --> 1:42:47.080 like doing these movies bears. But it's like one through 1:42:47.120 --> 1:42:49.800 eight and it's like, you know, you know, bear naked joke, 1:42:49.920 --> 1:42:51.639 you know, like all that's thrown in there, and then 1:42:51.680 --> 1:42:55.200 the very real last one is like, realize that you 1:42:55.320 --> 1:42:57.880 messed up at you know, number two and you died. 1:42:58.479 --> 1:43:03.400 It's like you're not gonna fly thing. Yeah, he's not 1:43:03.400 --> 1:43:05.080 gonna happen. How do you I mean, how do you 1:43:05.200 --> 1:43:11.040 feel now as we sit here? Sometime has passed. Um, 1:43:11.200 --> 1:43:12.439 I can know the answer to this, but I asked 1:43:12.439 --> 1:43:14.960 it anyway. How do you feel about that bear? How 1:43:15.000 --> 1:43:17.439 do you feel about that soal like she's dead, you're 1:43:17.479 --> 1:43:22.599 alive and you guys got in a tussle. Yeah, Um, 1:43:23.520 --> 1:43:25.519 how do you how do you feel emotionally about what 1:43:25.600 --> 1:43:29.800 happened like that bear and and her death and the experience? Sure? 1:43:29.920 --> 1:43:33.439 Sure so Um, beaten before I get to the all, 1:43:33.479 --> 1:43:35.559 I tap on this too, because this probably kind of 1:43:35.560 --> 1:43:38.560 helps I think a little bit. But so as we 1:43:38.640 --> 1:43:41.000 found out after it was taking a fishing game and everything, 1:43:41.600 --> 1:43:44.920 which is by law actually but the initial estimate, but 1:43:45.000 --> 1:43:47.800 she was like nineteen years old, and and later on 1:43:47.880 --> 1:43:50.559 the guy asked me, he's like thought maybe four. They 1:43:50.560 --> 1:43:53.240 only lived to like five. So this is a very 1:43:53.280 --> 1:43:58.880 old like angry hags out and you mentioned the grayish color, 1:43:59.720 --> 1:44:01.439 and so I've never seen a bear that all Like 1:44:01.520 --> 1:44:03.479 every bear that I've seen is usually the young uns 1:44:03.479 --> 1:44:06.680 because they're the ones that are more ignorant for lack 1:44:06.720 --> 1:44:09.519 of a better word, that's hanging around the town. Um 1:44:09.560 --> 1:44:12.400 just like old bucks. But um so, knowing that, you know, 1:44:12.400 --> 1:44:14.240 she probably didn't have a lot of time left anyway, 1:44:14.280 --> 1:44:15.800 and you know she's seen a lot and had a 1:44:16.120 --> 1:44:20.120 lot of of cubs before that. And the cubs, from 1:44:20.120 --> 1:44:22.360 what the guy said, we're older. They will hopefully be fine. 1:44:22.960 --> 1:44:30.639 But going through my mind, I I certainly don't um. 1:44:30.680 --> 1:44:32.360 I don't agree with the people that get all butt 1:44:32.439 --> 1:44:34.800 hurt and be like, oh the poor bear and like 1:44:34.880 --> 1:44:36.960 everything else, and Mike, that kind of gets annoying. It 1:44:37.080 --> 1:44:39.680 was like, you know, I just got bald. You know, 1:44:39.720 --> 1:44:41.200 like I don't feel bad for the bear at all. 1:44:42.000 --> 1:44:44.000 What I do feel bad for it's like, okay, yeah, 1:44:44.080 --> 1:44:47.000 the bear could have produced more bears and like and 1:44:47.000 --> 1:44:49.120 and made it for better hunters because, in all honesty, 1:44:49.240 --> 1:44:53.080 the opening season for bear was about to open up. Uh. 1:44:53.200 --> 1:44:58.320 Actually it happened on October six, and I I want 1:44:58.320 --> 1:45:00.840 to say, it was like that day actually bear sheason open. 1:45:00.840 --> 1:45:02.200 It was really it's right around that time. I can't 1:45:02.280 --> 1:45:04.080 quite remember off the top of my head, but it 1:45:04.120 --> 1:45:05.400 opens right up. So I was like, I was looking 1:45:05.400 --> 1:45:07.800 forward to actually going out bear hunting and doing the 1:45:07.840 --> 1:45:09.599 same thing. So she kind of took me away from that. 1:45:10.200 --> 1:45:13.840 But no, I definitely don't. I don't you know, feel 1:45:13.880 --> 1:45:17.080 bad about it or anything besides the fact that it's like, hey, 1:45:18.560 --> 1:45:20.920 it wasn't in the right time, like you know, it 1:45:20.960 --> 1:45:23.080 didn't have my tag or anything to get a bear. 1:45:23.479 --> 1:45:26.640 You know, it definitely was in defense and uh you know, 1:45:26.640 --> 1:45:29.439 it wasn't the bear that you're really seeking. And um, 1:45:29.479 --> 1:45:31.439 a lot of people don't like hunting, but as I say, 1:45:31.439 --> 1:45:33.840 with as many bears are on there, it's like it's 1:45:34.080 --> 1:45:37.080 good control of the bear population. And it's a huge thing. 1:45:37.080 --> 1:45:38.760 That's what I know you talked about a lot, but 1:45:38.840 --> 1:45:42.320 with the real meaning of hunting, especially with an animal, 1:45:42.360 --> 1:45:45.840 you don't you know, you're not gathering meat from um. 1:45:45.840 --> 1:45:49.160 But uh, yeah, it was unfortunate because I know that 1:45:49.240 --> 1:45:51.360 for her just as much survival in sync with me, 1:45:51.520 --> 1:45:54.479 just she's a more primal creature than I am. And 1:45:55.040 --> 1:45:57.760 you know, there's no communicating, that is communicating. And she 1:45:57.840 --> 1:45:59.519 was just like yeah, it's like, yeah, there's no there's 1:45:59.520 --> 1:46:01.280 no getting out of it. So I know this that 1:46:01.479 --> 1:46:05.280 there was the perfect storm and definitely unfortunate circumstances. But no, 1:46:05.360 --> 1:46:07.439 I definitely don't feel bad about it. You know, I'm 1:46:07.479 --> 1:46:10.639 still living, breathing human being and I'm still alive and 1:46:10.640 --> 1:46:15.200 and thank god. Yeah, I mean if you talk to 1:46:15.240 --> 1:46:18.759 your your buddy then took the shots and like, what's 1:46:18.800 --> 1:46:22.679 the as a group, you know, postmortem, what's like, what's 1:46:22.720 --> 1:46:25.439 the feeling? Yeah, And and no, I mean guys are 1:46:25.439 --> 1:46:29.040 all on the same page, like they're ecstatic about it. 1:46:29.080 --> 1:46:32.000 One just I'm alive. And it was very surreal for everybody. 1:46:32.080 --> 1:46:35.360 And in the moment, more so going through his mind 1:46:35.439 --> 1:46:38.479 was like, God, I hope he's alive. And uh, the 1:46:38.479 --> 1:46:41.800 guy who shot the bear first of the rifle, he 1:46:41.840 --> 1:46:44.840 was more nervous when I stopped talking as I said, 1:46:44.840 --> 1:46:46.640 I said, oh, I can't make any more noise, no 1:46:46.720 --> 1:46:48.600 more scream out or anything in pain or agony. I 1:46:48.600 --> 1:46:51.120 gotta keep my mouth shut. That's gonna get worse. And 1:46:51.160 --> 1:46:53.000 when he took the shot, it was like right after 1:46:53.040 --> 1:46:54.960 that too, and he was he was nervous. It's like 1:46:55.000 --> 1:46:56.439 he didn't know if I was still alive from the 1:46:56.439 --> 1:46:59.120 bear killing me or from him killing me from a shot. 1:46:59.520 --> 1:47:01.160 So that was running through his mind too, and of 1:47:01.160 --> 1:47:03.519 course it made it nervous. But I was fully aware, 1:47:03.520 --> 1:47:05.720 awake and like talking and everything else afterwards, and I 1:47:05.720 --> 1:47:07.800 think that was kind of a relief to him. And 1:47:07.920 --> 1:47:10.840 judgment call and even afterwards he we've had our discussions 1:47:10.840 --> 1:47:14.160 and I certainly owned my life, and uh, he said 1:47:14.160 --> 1:47:15.639 the same thing that he knows that but it done 1:47:15.680 --> 1:47:18.080 the same thing and been there for him, and um, 1:47:18.120 --> 1:47:22.560 that's absolutely the case. But I know the consensus in 1:47:22.560 --> 1:47:24.280 the group are still the same thing. But so many 1:47:24.280 --> 1:47:26.720 guys were just kind of surreal and and some of 1:47:26.720 --> 1:47:29.120 the guys hadn't really been through experiences like that for 1:47:29.439 --> 1:47:32.120 really stressful and kind of for them even it was 1:47:32.200 --> 1:47:33.800 kind of like they weren't getting attacked, but it was 1:47:33.920 --> 1:47:36.640 very like real all of a sudden and kind of 1:47:36.680 --> 1:47:39.120 like holy sh it, like this isn't this isn't you know, 1:47:39.800 --> 1:47:45.960 funning games anymore. This just turned really really real? Is real? Yeah? 1:47:46.000 --> 1:47:48.360 I think that's you know, all hunters, all people that 1:47:48.479 --> 1:47:51.759 spend time in wild places, like these things happen, you fall, 1:47:52.439 --> 1:47:55.800 you get attacked like they happened and frequently, hopefully for 1:47:55.840 --> 1:47:58.080 most of us, but but their realities. And that's why 1:47:58.400 --> 1:48:02.519 people love to read books about um animal attacks. They 1:48:02.600 --> 1:48:05.360 love to read, you know, survival stories. And I'm sure 1:48:05.360 --> 1:48:08.120 we'll love to listen to your story here because you know, 1:48:08.240 --> 1:48:12.559 like I would say, you beat the odds. I would say, 1:48:12.920 --> 1:48:15.120 the odds kind of screwge you when you walked up 1:48:15.160 --> 1:48:20.000 on a bear, but after, during and after the attack, 1:48:20.080 --> 1:48:22.679 you beat the odds. I mean, there's so many ways 1:48:22.720 --> 1:48:25.640 it could have turned out um with your death, but 1:48:25.680 --> 1:48:28.920 it didn't. Absolutely. I mean even now, it's just making 1:48:28.960 --> 1:48:30.840 full recovery. And as you can see him, I'm walking 1:48:30.840 --> 1:48:34.320 around your healing and you be signs some you know, 1:48:34.479 --> 1:48:41.479 mier things in a much tighter Nutsack now you know, yeah, 1:48:41.520 --> 1:48:43.360 surgeons of me, they say, you know, some guys pay 1:48:43.400 --> 1:48:45.160 for this, right, I guess they get older and things 1:48:45.160 --> 1:48:47.000 start sigging, They're like, some guys pay for this year. 1:48:47.040 --> 1:48:49.960 It's like you're gonna be getting good to go. Uh 1:48:50.000 --> 1:48:55.519 so that'll be the advertisement for the people to listen 1:48:55.560 --> 1:48:58.760 to this. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, let's let's I mean, 1:48:58.760 --> 1:49:01.520 you know, we're when you came in and we're talking, um, 1:49:01.680 --> 1:49:03.800 you're saying, I still have open wounds. You know, two 1:49:03.840 --> 1:49:05.960 months later, ish a month and a half, two months 1:49:06.040 --> 1:49:09.080 later and you still have open wounds. Your recovery is 1:49:09.120 --> 1:49:12.160 obviously still ongoing. I mean there's probably been a lot 1:49:12.160 --> 1:49:15.680 of rehab, a lot of pain. You know. UM, just 1:49:15.760 --> 1:49:19.200 take you know, briefly, take everyone through what that feels like. 1:49:19.240 --> 1:49:21.760 Because I feel like you have the adrenaline, you've got 1:49:21.760 --> 1:49:25.760 your determination to survive UM and you always hear that 1:49:25.800 --> 1:49:28.120 about life threatening situations. But then when you're in a 1:49:28.120 --> 1:49:31.120 hospital bed or you know, you're waking up every morning 1:49:31.120 --> 1:49:33.160 and pain, I mean I feel like that's where the suffering, 1:49:34.000 --> 1:49:35.760 you know, it really kicks in and where you know 1:49:36.240 --> 1:49:39.000 where the next the next level of of you know, 1:49:39.080 --> 1:49:42.400 difficulties you have to overcome begins when you've got to 1:49:42.400 --> 1:49:43.880 get up out of the bed and like you said, 1:49:43.920 --> 1:49:47.760 get back to your normal life. Yeah. So by the 1:49:47.760 --> 1:49:50.760 time I got the hospital, you know, it was going 1:49:50.880 --> 1:49:53.719 to uh pretty much immediately go into the operating room. 1:49:53.960 --> 1:49:55.920 They were asking a lot of questions wanted to really 1:49:56.000 --> 1:49:58.519 concern with more like food and water because before operating, 1:49:58.560 --> 1:50:00.160 it's gonna make sure I'm pretty much like you aim 1:50:00.200 --> 1:50:06.080 of all that kind of stuff. But uh, um uh sorry, 1:50:06.120 --> 1:50:07.560 And there's another one I get to hit on on 1:50:07.600 --> 1:50:09.240 the ride over. It just kind of cracked me up. 1:50:09.240 --> 1:50:12.040 But I talked about being cold before and this just 1:50:12.040 --> 1:50:14.559 made me think of it again. But um, in the 1:50:14.600 --> 1:50:18.479 bird the helicopter, they were trying to you know, put 1:50:18.720 --> 1:50:20.920 uh you know, I v S and me like get 1:50:20.960 --> 1:50:22.680 some needles in me at first, and just couldn't do it. 1:50:22.800 --> 1:50:24.719 Just so cold, like we won't be able to draw anything. 1:50:24.800 --> 1:50:27.000 Even when I got to the hospital, like I couldn't 1:50:27.080 --> 1:50:28.720 draw anything. The lady was there and she's like, you 1:50:28.760 --> 1:50:31.120 just have a really tough time. Finally eventually got one 1:50:31.120 --> 1:50:32.759 in my hand that she could get some blood flowd 1:50:32.880 --> 1:50:36.840 was just so cold though, and made it happen, But 1:50:36.880 --> 1:50:38.200 it was just kind of one of those things. And 1:50:38.320 --> 1:50:40.040 I get to the hospital and they're just taking everything 1:50:40.040 --> 1:50:42.160 else off me and I found the guy to the 1:50:42.160 --> 1:50:45.680 point I'm like I need a warm blank, Like I 1:50:45.680 --> 1:50:47.640 love you guys, thanks for taking care of me. But 1:50:47.680 --> 1:50:49.360 I'm like I'm at the point where I'm like, okay, 1:50:49.400 --> 1:50:53.120 I am freezing my nuts off here and I seriously 1:50:53.160 --> 1:50:55.640 need a blank or something like cover me back up. 1:50:55.680 --> 1:50:58.320 I'm like I'm really really cold. And so finally that 1:50:58.520 --> 1:51:00.680 definitely toned things down and made stuff better, and I 1:51:00.760 --> 1:51:02.360 was kind of more of a happy place then. But 1:51:02.400 --> 1:51:03.840 I was like, yeah, cold does a lot of things 1:51:03.960 --> 1:51:06.160 to to people. And uh, I was kind of had 1:51:06.160 --> 1:51:08.080 one of those snappy crack moments where I'm just like, Okay, 1:51:08.080 --> 1:51:11.160 I'm cold. I'm like, stop taking clothes off, need more 1:51:11.200 --> 1:51:13.080 calls on me? And I feel like there's like, yeah, 1:51:13.120 --> 1:51:16.600 like the frustration level has got to be because you're 1:51:16.600 --> 1:51:19.719 you at that point. Well really, as the attack begins, 1:51:19.760 --> 1:51:24.000 you have no control really at that point, hands and 1:51:24.000 --> 1:51:25.920 and no, And I wasn't. I wasn't trying to be 1:51:25.960 --> 1:51:27.559 stubborn into the I'm like okay, let people take care 1:51:27.600 --> 1:51:29.080 of me. I wasn't being like one of those guys 1:51:29.080 --> 1:51:32.479 and um, and it was good, and I did getting 1:51:32.840 --> 1:51:35.120 uh into the room, just kind of waiting and finally 1:51:35.160 --> 1:51:37.080 made a phone call to my folks and let them 1:51:37.080 --> 1:51:38.920 know everything was good. You know, guy brought it in 1:51:38.960 --> 1:51:41.360 a phone for me, and so things are good. Let 1:51:41.439 --> 1:51:46.080 them know, and they're all concerned. But even after the 1:51:46.160 --> 1:51:48.040 operating room and I kind of got through a lot 1:51:48.080 --> 1:51:51.400 of the medical testing and guys asking questions and fixing 1:51:51.400 --> 1:51:54.880 me up, I'm very much a proponent of just the 1:51:55.040 --> 1:51:58.160 kind of positive attitude and healing and and uh, just 1:51:58.280 --> 1:52:02.040 keeping the smile going. And I whenever you in those situations, 1:52:02.080 --> 1:52:04.120 all you can do. And I hate negativity. Like the 1:52:04.200 --> 1:52:07.200 last thing, I really really hate pity, and I don't, 1:52:07.400 --> 1:52:10.000 you know, for the same reason, like I don't take 1:52:10.080 --> 1:52:12.880 pity on really anybody else either. It's and I don't 1:52:12.960 --> 1:52:14.920 I don't think people need that. I think you can. 1:52:15.960 --> 1:52:18.880 I'm probably less empathetic than most people either. It's you know, 1:52:18.960 --> 1:52:20.920 probably something I should work on. But at the same time, 1:52:20.920 --> 1:52:22.519 like even for myself, like I don't want that, like 1:52:22.760 --> 1:52:25.160 anybody who's gonna like come in there, Oh, I'm so sorry. 1:52:25.160 --> 1:52:29.280 I'm like no, like fun that It's like if you're 1:52:29.280 --> 1:52:31.000 gonna be like have biddy to be like a soft 1:52:31.000 --> 1:52:32.320 story of me to get the hell out like I 1:52:32.360 --> 1:52:34.280 don't neither, I don't want it, like I'm alive. I 1:52:34.360 --> 1:52:37.559 got shipped to do so. And that was kind of 1:52:37.560 --> 1:52:40.120 my my thought process even in the days in the hospital. 1:52:40.120 --> 1:52:42.439 It's like, yeah, I certainly wasn't feeling good and had 1:52:42.479 --> 1:52:45.040 me on a liquid diet, you know, starting out that 1:52:45.200 --> 1:52:49.360 sucked um because especially I was already hungry, you know, 1:52:49.640 --> 1:52:51.599 being in in the field, like for the first few 1:52:51.680 --> 1:52:54.560 days anyway, as you well know, like you do a 1:52:54.600 --> 1:52:56.960 lot of that hiking into that truf drain, you get 1:52:57.080 --> 1:53:00.280 hungry and like hadn't really drank anything, hadn't really eat 1:53:00.280 --> 1:53:02.840 any anything, and quite some time, and I was definitely 1:53:02.920 --> 1:53:06.240 hungry and like just drinking on bone broth and water 1:53:06.360 --> 1:53:09.800 for for a time or two, is uh not my 1:53:09.920 --> 1:53:13.479 cup of tea. And so that took some time. But 1:53:13.720 --> 1:53:17.840 my one of the biggest driving motivators, given the circumstances 1:53:17.880 --> 1:53:20.519 of what was going when I was going going through 1:53:21.479 --> 1:53:23.200 is I talked to you about this before, but I 1:53:23.200 --> 1:53:26.320 had this puppy and hadn't got it yet. But I 1:53:26.360 --> 1:53:29.639 had made plans to get this puppy that I finally, 1:53:29.720 --> 1:53:31.240 you know, kind of cave down. I was like I 1:53:31.439 --> 1:53:33.439 saw a litter up north and I really wanted it, 1:53:34.800 --> 1:53:38.120 and uh I bought it, made the arrangements. I'm like, okay, great, 1:53:38.160 --> 1:53:40.120 Like this puppy is gonna get shipped on Monday. Well 1:53:40.160 --> 1:53:43.360 this incident happened on Friday, and like okay, making sure 1:53:43.360 --> 1:53:48.240 everything's in a row, and uh again things going through 1:53:48.280 --> 1:53:49.800 my mind. Was just thinking on this and like okay, 1:53:49.800 --> 1:53:51.439 I gotta to get this puppy, like I don't care 1:53:51.479 --> 1:53:53.400 if Friday and like what they're saying, like hollong when 1:53:53.400 --> 1:53:54.960 I keep me in my I have this puppy coming in. 1:53:55.040 --> 1:53:56.280 I had to have to be there. I don't want 1:53:56.320 --> 1:53:58.640 somebody else to do it, like the first kind of 1:53:58.680 --> 1:54:00.360 contact and like I want to be her for it. 1:54:00.439 --> 1:54:03.680 So definitely my driving motivator. But the other thing on 1:54:03.720 --> 1:54:08.000 that story is again kind of going back to the 1:54:08.040 --> 1:54:12.200 whole you know self pity thing um the lady who 1:54:12.280 --> 1:54:18.080 had the breed, the litter um who gave me the puppy, 1:54:18.120 --> 1:54:20.280 like you know, shipped me the puppy. As this all 1:54:20.439 --> 1:54:22.280 is happening, I told her what had happened, what was 1:54:22.320 --> 1:54:24.040 going on that things were still gonna be you know, 1:54:24.040 --> 1:54:26.600 all right, I still wanted the puppy. We'll come to 1:54:26.600 --> 1:54:30.519 find out her husband, Um was just climbing the ladder. 1:54:30.560 --> 1:54:32.120 I don't know if he was. I think he was 1:54:32.160 --> 1:54:33.760 working on a roof with his brother or something like 1:54:33.800 --> 1:54:36.839 that and fell and you know one of the biggest 1:54:37.640 --> 1:54:39.440 you know, cause of accidents in the US, always like 1:54:39.480 --> 1:54:41.160 falls and stuff. And sure enough, like he fell off 1:54:41.200 --> 1:54:43.360 the roof or fell off the ladder and hit his 1:54:43.440 --> 1:54:47.600 head like internal hemorrhaging and like emergency er and didn't 1:54:47.600 --> 1:54:49.040 know if he's gonna make it. Like all this like 1:54:49.160 --> 1:54:50.600 terrible things, and I'm like I'm going through this and 1:54:50.600 --> 1:54:53.920 I'm like, yeah, of course. I'm just saying to myself, 1:54:53.920 --> 1:54:56.960 like there's always somebody else where that's got it worse, 1:54:57.160 --> 1:54:59.080 that's like so much worse than you are. Like the 1:54:59.160 --> 1:55:01.200 last thing that you need is just like this will 1:55:01.240 --> 1:55:04.600 be like oh, like pour me, like why me? You know, 1:55:04.680 --> 1:55:07.240 like all this is like no, just life happens. Ship happens. 1:55:07.840 --> 1:55:09.680 You know, you play with the bully, You're gonna get 1:55:09.680 --> 1:55:12.200 the horns, my father, you do anything long enough, and 1:55:12.240 --> 1:55:15.480 like something's going to happen along those lines and again, 1:55:15.800 --> 1:55:17.920 like looking back is why I don't regret anything when 1:55:17.920 --> 1:55:20.760 doing anything different. It's just an experience. And unfortunately I'm 1:55:20.800 --> 1:55:22.640 still here. God's gonna plan for me like that. I'm 1:55:22.640 --> 1:55:25.400 gonna keep going and doing something because I'm still here kicking. Yeah, 1:55:25.960 --> 1:55:29.000 So like it didn't really like it just enhance your perspective. 1:55:29.000 --> 1:55:30.960 It didn't like change, It didn't at all, Like no 1:55:31.200 --> 1:55:35.320 negativity towards it whatsoever, doing downfall that I'm experienced. He 1:55:35.400 --> 1:55:36.480 right now is not be able to get on the 1:55:36.520 --> 1:55:38.880 horse soon enough to go back out hunting because all 1:55:38.880 --> 1:55:41.280 the seasons are like ending. You want to get back. 1:55:41.320 --> 1:55:43.640 I have no time, and my plan is to go 1:55:43.920 --> 1:55:45.840 right back out and go skiing and ice climb, like 1:55:45.880 --> 1:55:48.560 as soon as after the holidays ends. That's been my 1:55:48.560 --> 1:55:51.280 my next goal. Because I did bring my my puppy 1:55:51.400 --> 1:55:52.920 here with me, and I did get out of the 1:55:52.920 --> 1:55:55.560 hospital on Monday to go get them, despite them kind 1:55:55.560 --> 1:55:57.560 of wanting me, you know, to stay a little longer. 1:55:58.200 --> 1:56:01.560 But yeah, it's been kind of a crawl walk run 1:56:02.000 --> 1:56:05.040 starting out. Couldn't I didn't even leave the hospital bed 1:56:05.080 --> 1:56:08.880 for the first couple of days. Really couldn't. And uh, 1:56:08.960 --> 1:56:11.040 I don't know if there's a second or third day. 1:56:11.680 --> 1:56:16.879 I eventually just got up to like stand up. Definitely 1:56:16.880 --> 1:56:19.920 not fun amount of pain. The blood finally just rushed 1:56:19.920 --> 1:56:21.920 back into the leg again. The leg was certainly the 1:56:21.920 --> 1:56:25.120 worst part. And who yeah, that was yeah, that was 1:56:25.200 --> 1:56:28.360 that was a little pain. And uh, they like no 1:56:28.520 --> 1:56:32.560 surgeries other than just something like no major surgery. Right, yeah, 1:56:32.600 --> 1:56:35.360 I just see me back up and with with animal 1:56:35.400 --> 1:56:37.360 wounds like that, we had talked on it. But for 1:56:37.400 --> 1:56:40.840 the everybody else listening, you never have an animal winning 1:56:41.440 --> 1:56:43.920 train dogs and had animal bites and stuff before. And 1:56:44.360 --> 1:56:46.720 when you go through that, you're trying to keep the 1:56:46.720 --> 1:56:50.160 wound open for risky and infection and for it to 1:56:50.200 --> 1:56:52.840 heal inside out. You know, want some you know cave 1:56:52.920 --> 1:56:56.480 hole inside of you just like festering. So they put 1:56:56.520 --> 1:56:59.520 some stitches on some of the bigger wounds just to 1:56:59.520 --> 1:57:01.520 close them up a little bit because they were so big, 1:57:02.040 --> 1:57:06.080 and uh, the after I don't know, like a couple 1:57:06.080 --> 1:57:07.960 of weeks or so, they cut them off and like 1:57:08.240 --> 1:57:11.320 let them go back to healing open and uh, and 1:57:11.360 --> 1:57:13.760 that's kind of what I'm going through now. But yeah, 1:57:13.800 --> 1:57:18.280 there was eight major punctures on my leg. H two 1:57:18.320 --> 1:57:22.160 on my arms, some superficial like scratches, bite marks wherever 1:57:22.160 --> 1:57:24.920 they were on my back, and then down lower on 1:57:24.960 --> 1:57:27.800 the leg they were like not like full punctures, just 1:57:27.880 --> 1:57:30.440 kind of like still like superficial, but deep enough to 1:57:30.560 --> 1:57:35.400 like warrants some bandages. Um, I think just the clothing alone, 1:57:35.680 --> 1:57:38.400 probably on the lower leg was like the combination of 1:57:38.440 --> 1:57:42.600 like one pair of like soft shell pants, some rain pants, 1:57:43.120 --> 1:57:46.320 uh gators, and boots. Yeah, like just enough that it 1:57:46.440 --> 1:57:47.960 like she squeezed the hell out of it, because I've 1:57:47.960 --> 1:57:50.040 still got nerve damage where I can't feel half of 1:57:50.080 --> 1:57:53.320 my my foot and leg well not really leg but 1:57:53.440 --> 1:57:57.600 lower like heal and achilles, uh calf, that kind of area, 1:57:57.680 --> 1:58:00.200 but did enough to like mess with an her of 1:58:00.200 --> 1:58:03.760 a little bit, not like completely severed or anything, but yeah, 1:58:03.880 --> 1:58:06.160 she she did some damage. Didn't take much of that 1:58:06.160 --> 1:58:08.000 that type of beast. Well, I mean, like you said 1:58:08.000 --> 1:58:09.680 that she still has a little bit to rip through, 1:58:09.800 --> 1:58:12.440 like she could still rip and tear at the clothes 1:58:12.440 --> 1:58:15.960 without really ripping impairing at you. And then I'm sure 1:58:16.000 --> 1:58:20.960 that stone glacier pack you know. For I know those 1:58:20.960 --> 1:58:22.960 guys over there pretty well, they're all good folks and 1:58:23.000 --> 1:58:26.360 they make a nice pack. But I'm sure that impact 1:58:27.320 --> 1:58:30.320 saved you a lot, big, big time. And again that 1:58:30.360 --> 1:58:32.480 went through my mind a lot. And she was a 1:58:32.480 --> 1:58:35.120 little focus on the legs at first, I think, which 1:58:35.240 --> 1:58:37.720 I don't know good or bad. Maybe that's because what 1:58:38.000 --> 1:58:39.920 you know, like you're moving, maybe kicking. Well, it was 1:58:39.920 --> 1:58:41.520 definitely was just the first thing that came to her. 1:58:41.600 --> 1:58:45.120 And the same with my experiences with dogs and like 1:58:45.120 --> 1:58:47.320 like protective, they're gonna go for the first thing, whatever 1:58:47.360 --> 1:58:49.280 it is is like closest out there. To them, it's 1:58:49.320 --> 1:58:51.760 just convenience. That's what they're gonna bite first. And for 1:58:51.800 --> 1:58:54.200 her it was just that was the leg that was there. Again, 1:58:54.240 --> 1:58:56.560 I dove kind of downhill, so she was coming behind 1:58:56.560 --> 1:58:58.480 me at this point rather than like a head on charge, 1:58:59.000 --> 1:59:01.040 and she just grabbed that for that first leg and 1:59:01.080 --> 1:59:02.800 that she she picked me up and just threw me. 1:59:03.240 --> 1:59:06.720 Um so constantly going for the closest thing there and um, 1:59:06.760 --> 1:59:09.280 but the thing with the backpack, it did kind of 1:59:10.120 --> 1:59:12.600 get me thinking. And I know bears are very very 1:59:12.680 --> 1:59:17.120 smart creatures and and um just very keen on everything. 1:59:17.240 --> 1:59:21.480 And I don't think eventually she obviously did you know, 1:59:21.560 --> 1:59:23.760 scratched me in the back and get to the to 1:59:23.880 --> 1:59:26.400 my arm and and the stone glacier back didn't really 1:59:26.440 --> 1:59:28.240 take much damage. And it got me thinking about it too, 1:59:28.240 --> 1:59:32.600 And I had to think that she probably knows that feeling, 1:59:33.840 --> 1:59:35.880 like she knew when she put her paws on me 1:59:35.920 --> 1:59:38.800 and her teeth in me, that like she probably knew 1:59:38.880 --> 1:59:41.920 what flash kind of like feels like, tastes like, all 1:59:41.960 --> 1:59:43.800 that kind of stuff. That like she didn't want anything 1:59:43.840 --> 1:59:45.000 to do it and that's all she was trying to 1:59:45.000 --> 1:59:47.080 do is just kind of brush that out of the side. 1:59:47.360 --> 1:59:49.920 So again it was like all linked together and nothing 1:59:49.960 --> 1:59:52.840 actually happened to the back, which was awesome, But um, 1:59:53.800 --> 1:59:57.600 if I didn't have that there, yeah, I mean fortunately, 1:59:57.600 --> 2:00:00.800 like just the flat back itself doesn't really have features 2:00:00.800 --> 2:00:02.560 to really you know, grab ahold of it. Who knows, 2:00:02.600 --> 2:00:04.480 maybe she wouldn't have either she could have gotten like 2:00:04.560 --> 2:00:09.240 side or something else. Um yeah, and I and and 2:00:09.600 --> 2:00:11.120 that's gone through my mind. But I had to think, 2:00:11.160 --> 2:00:13.160 I'm like, yeah, you know what, like they probably knows 2:00:13.160 --> 2:00:15.360 exactly what flesh and everything like feels like, tastes like. 2:00:15.360 --> 2:00:16.600 And that's where she was going for. She was just 2:00:16.600 --> 2:00:18.920 moving that ship right out of the way. Yeah, I 2:00:18.960 --> 2:00:22.840 mean it's hard you can't put your you can't put 2:00:22.880 --> 2:00:26.920 your mind to what he's going through a bear's mind, 2:00:27.440 --> 2:00:29.840 and that such what she can't I mean, it's impossible, 2:00:31.000 --> 2:00:34.600 and it's such. It was instinctual for you, instinctual for her. 2:00:35.360 --> 2:00:37.840 Like the whole interaction seemed to be just this like 2:00:39.400 --> 2:00:43.200 man versus nature and that's ye. You you know, at 2:00:43.240 --> 2:00:45.800 this this particular time, you ended up ended up bumping 2:00:45.840 --> 2:00:49.320 heads and and um, you came out on the better end. 2:00:49.400 --> 2:00:52.640 But for sure, it's such a eyes wonder about that, 2:00:52.720 --> 2:00:56.160 Like if that were ever to happened to me, how 2:00:56.200 --> 2:00:58.760 it would change me? Like you're way tougher than I am. 2:00:58.800 --> 2:01:00.720 Like you seem like you have a way better perspective, 2:01:01.200 --> 2:01:03.480 you have a way better perspective on on these types 2:01:03.520 --> 2:01:06.720 of things. But I've heard from you know, jhannest tell 2:01:06.760 --> 2:01:08.880 Us and even a little bit from Steven Ella media 2:01:08.920 --> 2:01:12.520 crew they weren't even attacked there. They were charged and 2:01:12.880 --> 2:01:16.400 all came away, you know, fairly unscathed. That it did 2:01:16.520 --> 2:01:18.360 change a little bit about how they felt about one 2:01:18.400 --> 2:01:20.800 in the wilderness. Like they have you know, they have kids, 2:01:20.800 --> 2:01:23.480 they have wives, like they you know, they feel like 2:01:23.560 --> 2:01:26.760 you know, everybody has loved ones family and friends that 2:01:26.840 --> 2:01:30.080 care about them like it. I think it did change 2:01:30.080 --> 2:01:31.400 them a little bit as far as how they think 2:01:31.400 --> 2:01:34.880 about it. Are they not going to go They're going, um, 2:01:34.920 --> 2:01:37.720 just like you are. But you know, I think it 2:01:37.800 --> 2:01:42.440 probably had to change something for you for sure. I 2:01:42.440 --> 2:01:45.960 don't know. Everybody's got their own ways of going through 2:01:46.000 --> 2:01:49.160 life and living and doing their own thing. But it 2:01:49.160 --> 2:01:51.120 life is all about experiences. And you always hear about 2:01:51.120 --> 2:01:53.160 people talking to about being in the moment and all that, 2:01:53.200 --> 2:01:57.920 but I do agree with it. And one they always 2:01:57.960 --> 2:01:59.320 named about it like you're never the same person as 2:01:59.360 --> 2:02:02.320 you were yesterday. Yeah, I constantly like a lot of 2:02:02.320 --> 2:02:05.360 people just don't have those really huge moments I opening 2:02:05.360 --> 2:02:07.160 experience that they think that they do, and like they're 2:02:07.200 --> 2:02:09.920 just those munday tash and everything. But like no matter what, 2:02:09.960 --> 2:02:14.200 like you're getting lessons learning experiences every day, Like they're 2:02:14.240 --> 2:02:16.320 just not as big as as some of the other ones. 2:02:16.360 --> 2:02:18.600 And um, mine was obviously very big, and you can 2:02:18.640 --> 2:02:23.760 take away from that. But uh, ironically, um, I was 2:02:23.760 --> 2:02:27.120 getting some tattoos done and I just had an audible 2:02:27.120 --> 2:02:29.480 book that I was listening to, the Rise of Superman 2:02:29.960 --> 2:02:32.080 and it's all about like the state of flow. And 2:02:32.520 --> 2:02:34.760 I kind of talked about the flow before that, and 2:02:34.800 --> 2:02:37.240 I've read other books spot on and and uh looked 2:02:37.280 --> 2:02:41.120 into the topic and and extremely extremely interesting um for 2:02:41.160 --> 2:02:44.400 people that like look into the subject or not, but um, 2:02:44.560 --> 2:02:47.040 always seeking out those moments where like you learn the 2:02:47.080 --> 2:02:50.600 most because to bump into flow like takes like some 2:02:50.640 --> 2:02:54.280 people have like you know, serious like I don't know 2:02:54.440 --> 2:02:56.360 meditation that they want to do. It takes like hours 2:02:56.360 --> 2:02:57.840 and hours and hours and hours. But then you hear 2:02:57.840 --> 2:03:02.000 about these uh very ad ent you're seeking individuals like 2:03:02.600 --> 2:03:05.720 doing extreme skydiving and free diving and all these other 2:03:05.760 --> 2:03:08.520 adventure type sports and that's where they fine and seek 2:03:08.520 --> 2:03:11.400 flow and big wave riders and mountain bikers and all 2:03:11.400 --> 2:03:12.920 those things. And I love all those things as well. 2:03:12.920 --> 2:03:14.560 And a lot of people think of them as adrenaline 2:03:14.600 --> 2:03:17.880 junkies and it's definitely not the same whatsoever because they 2:03:17.880 --> 2:03:20.200 didn't have any adrenaline during the incident. But I also 2:03:20.320 --> 2:03:24.760 know that the state of flow is definitely definitely going there. 2:03:25.520 --> 2:03:29.440 Um Yeah, it seems like that that that's probably my 2:03:29.600 --> 2:03:31.920 read on it is that's impact you as much as anything, 2:03:32.080 --> 2:03:36.040 and hearing you describe it is having that state of 2:03:36.080 --> 2:03:38.200 flow I mean, you may achieve it while climbing, you 2:03:38.240 --> 2:03:41.040 may achieve it while surfing, but you know, while there's 2:03:41.040 --> 2:03:45.360 some inherent danger there, um, there's some inherent joy there 2:03:45.360 --> 2:03:48.760 as well what you're doing. Um. But in this in 2:03:48.760 --> 2:03:50.440 this case, you achieve that state of flow just in 2:03:50.480 --> 2:03:53.880 a different mental environment where you knew there wasn't any 2:03:53.960 --> 2:03:57.280 good outcome of what was going to happen, and then 2:03:57.320 --> 2:04:00.400 when it was happening. So it seems to me like that, 2:04:00.480 --> 2:04:02.400 you know, having that state of flow and knowing what 2:04:02.440 --> 2:04:07.520 that feels like and moments of extreme stresses is informed 2:04:07.560 --> 2:04:10.800 you in a lot of ways absolutely, Like that's that's 2:04:10.800 --> 2:04:13.120 really where I find that you you really learn the 2:04:13.200 --> 2:04:17.760 most um about yourself and and and other things in life, um, 2:04:17.920 --> 2:04:20.800 is being in those those moments where you just learned 2:04:20.840 --> 2:04:23.840 so much so quick. It's very very eye opening. That's 2:04:23.840 --> 2:04:27.200 why people always seek that, you know, it's not for that. 2:04:27.320 --> 2:04:29.640 It's not the adrenaline rush is like people say, yeah, 2:04:29.680 --> 2:04:32.720 there's definitely adrenaline drunkies. But that's where I find it's 2:04:33.760 --> 2:04:36.400 those individuals are much more short lived than than others 2:04:36.400 --> 2:04:38.320 that just eat that, because then they eventually end up 2:04:38.360 --> 2:04:41.000 just doing something stupid um and not well thought out 2:04:41.120 --> 2:04:43.480 versus other people that have to be they're just kind 2:04:43.520 --> 2:04:46.640 of pushed in those moments, um. And there's nothing wrong 2:04:46.680 --> 2:04:49.040 with like seeking other ways, with whether it is like 2:04:49.080 --> 2:04:51.160 a two and a half hour session of yoga or 2:04:51.400 --> 2:04:55.640 meditation or something and done that before too. But yeah, 2:04:55.680 --> 2:04:59.120 being in that in that moment was extraordinary eye opening. 2:04:59.520 --> 2:05:02.520 And I don't know I can come out positive from 2:05:02.560 --> 2:05:06.360 the experience because one everything went down textbook nothing really 2:05:06.680 --> 2:05:10.040 all that bad happened. And whether you believe in like 2:05:10.080 --> 2:05:13.400 a higher power wherever, um, you know, whether it's God 2:05:13.480 --> 2:05:15.640 just told me just hey, take take a chill pill, 2:05:15.720 --> 2:05:17.440 like slow down for a little bit, you know, like 2:05:17.480 --> 2:05:20.560 take some time. Yeah, exactly, like whatever it is, Like 2:05:20.600 --> 2:05:23.640 I don't know's you know, things happen for a reason. 2:05:23.680 --> 2:05:25.320 Is some people say, I don't know about that, but 2:05:25.480 --> 2:05:28.960 everything always works out in my suppos It's like yeah, 2:05:29.000 --> 2:05:31.600 it's like it's like maybe not the way that you 2:05:31.720 --> 2:05:35.080 planned or wanted to and like, you know, it always 2:05:35.080 --> 2:05:39.120 happens very very unexpectedly. But yeah, no, no, it's been 2:05:39.320 --> 2:05:44.560 a really really good experience. And you know, I'm sure 2:05:44.600 --> 2:05:47.440 there was fear, but like describe it, you know, the 2:05:47.520 --> 2:05:51.120 types of fear that you felt while you were there. 2:05:51.120 --> 2:05:53.280 I mean, there's fear for your life, there's feel for 2:05:53.320 --> 2:05:56.160 your you know, for your friends, there's there's all types 2:05:56.200 --> 2:05:59.360 of soul. It's funny. I've had that conversation before, people 2:05:59.400 --> 2:06:02.440 talked about it and this isn't like a form of 2:06:02.520 --> 2:06:05.880 bravado or like you know, manly is um when I 2:06:05.920 --> 2:06:07.440 when I say this, but I don't really think there 2:06:07.600 --> 2:06:11.000 was fear. And I think that was just experience that 2:06:11.000 --> 2:06:13.560 I've had before and having a clear head, because I 2:06:13.600 --> 2:06:17.240 think fear is very, very irrational. It's something that's concocted 2:06:17.240 --> 2:06:20.080 in your heads, um, like sharks in the water that 2:06:20.120 --> 2:06:21.920 you can't see, like that kind of dealing, like people 2:06:21.960 --> 2:06:24.040 to have a fear of that or fear of heights. 2:06:24.040 --> 2:06:27.480 And I'm sure there can be chemical imbalances with some 2:06:27.520 --> 2:06:30.720 people that like cause them to have irrational fears that, yeah, 2:06:30.760 --> 2:06:32.560 it takes a lot to get over. But when this 2:06:32.640 --> 2:06:34.320 is going down, I don't think it was fear as 2:06:34.400 --> 2:06:39.440 much as like a difference between fear and danger. And 2:06:39.640 --> 2:06:41.880 I don't remember exactly what he said, but it was 2:06:41.920 --> 2:06:44.760 a while ago that I heard Uli Steck talking about 2:06:44.880 --> 2:06:47.120 something similar. A while ago and if people aren't familiar 2:06:47.120 --> 2:06:49.960 with Steck, he did pass away, but he's very well 2:06:50.000 --> 2:06:53.400 known speed climber um, very well known for doing a 2:06:53.440 --> 2:06:56.120 lot of solo crazy stuff and eventually that did uh 2:06:56.360 --> 2:06:58.320 make him pass So you can think about them however 2:06:58.360 --> 2:07:00.280 you want. But he was talking about the different is 2:07:00.360 --> 2:07:06.480 between you know, danger and fear, and when you have fear, 2:07:06.560 --> 2:07:08.600 you're just it's just in your head, like there's no 2:07:08.640 --> 2:07:10.839 reasoning for it doesn't help you out, it doesn't do anything. 2:07:10.880 --> 2:07:14.480 But understanding that when there's dangers is very very real. 2:07:14.560 --> 2:07:18.720 And when that, when that initially happened, of course, everything 2:07:18.720 --> 2:07:21.000 going through you is very instinctiable when you have things 2:07:21.040 --> 2:07:23.520 that you do, and you know, the parasympic UH and 2:07:23.720 --> 2:07:26.520 sympathetic nervous system and fight or flight and freezing like 2:07:26.560 --> 2:07:29.440 all these other different things going on. And I know 2:07:29.520 --> 2:07:32.240 those things obviously happened, but as far as just going 2:07:32.280 --> 2:07:33.880 through my head, I don't think it was like, oh 2:07:33.960 --> 2:07:37.680 my god, I'm gonna die. It's like again, what am 2:07:37.680 --> 2:07:40.400 I gonna do? Like how do I control this situation? 2:07:40.440 --> 2:07:42.920 What control do I have? Do I have any control? 2:07:42.960 --> 2:07:44.839 You know? What are the things that I can control? 2:07:45.320 --> 2:07:47.920 And those were the things going through mind because I 2:07:48.000 --> 2:07:50.920 knew that fear in danger. But but yeah, I think 2:07:50.920 --> 2:07:55.160 it was just very um again, it's all a surreal experience, 2:07:55.160 --> 2:07:59.280 but just knowing that it's what you can and can't 2:07:59.320 --> 2:08:02.880 control and being in that situation to be like understanding 2:08:03.000 --> 2:08:05.520 is really is what it wasn't. It wasn't necessarily like 2:08:05.560 --> 2:08:08.840 oh my god fear like I'll stop what I'm you know, 2:08:08.960 --> 2:08:11.480 like I'm dead kind of deal. Yeah, I don't know 2:08:12.080 --> 2:08:15.120 me Like you just exerted some positivity into the and like, 2:08:16.120 --> 2:08:18.480 you know, it's not like you were like things are great. Yeah, 2:08:18.880 --> 2:08:22.200 well this is sprinkles, that's for sure, but like exerted 2:08:22.360 --> 2:08:25.360 some positive force into what was happening, like not like 2:08:25.440 --> 2:08:27.520 I can't believe I'm so stupid? Why did I hunt 2:08:27.520 --> 2:08:29.640 on a fogneck? Why am I getting mauled right now? 2:08:30.320 --> 2:08:33.160 More of just uh, what's the next thing? What's the 2:08:33.200 --> 2:08:35.080 next thing? What's the next thing I can do? What's 2:08:35.080 --> 2:08:37.840 the next thing that I can um express to my 2:08:37.880 --> 2:08:40.240 friends to help me get to the next to the 2:08:40.280 --> 2:08:42.040 point I have to get to live and be fine. 2:08:42.080 --> 2:08:44.320 And I'm sure that had a lot to do with 2:08:45.120 --> 2:08:47.080 to where we are today. But I guess we can 2:08:47.080 --> 2:08:49.960 close it out by saying, everything's fine. Everything's he's good. 2:08:50.080 --> 2:08:52.360 You look good, man, I mean everything looks fine to me. 2:08:52.640 --> 2:08:55.560 Heal and getting better. Everything downstairs going fine. Yeah, that's 2:08:55.560 --> 2:08:58.760 gonna be as far know, it's it's it's good. Uh, 2:08:58.920 --> 2:09:02.080 wounds are almost deal. I'm hoping on Tuesday will be like, okay, 2:09:02.080 --> 2:09:04.360 everything is close enough to the surface to take advantages 2:09:04.400 --> 2:09:06.520 off and let them do their things. Started physical therapy 2:09:06.560 --> 2:09:09.040 already and kind of got the range of motion back, 2:09:09.200 --> 2:09:11.640 you know, no more canes or walkers or anything. You know, 2:09:11.640 --> 2:09:14.920 I'm getting around and uh yeah, you should make it 2:09:14.920 --> 2:09:18.080 full recovery. Back to skiing, nice climbing, doing fun things. 2:09:18.400 --> 2:09:21.680 Hunting next season, Hunting next season. Well, I'm gonna look 2:09:21.720 --> 2:09:24.720 forward to those updates. But it's admirable the way that 2:09:24.760 --> 2:09:28.560 you approach this. Um. Like I said, this is this 2:09:28.640 --> 2:09:31.800 is everyone's worst nightmare in a lot of ways. UM, 2:09:31.920 --> 2:09:33.760 So I admire the way you approach it. I'm glad 2:09:33.800 --> 2:09:39.880 you're sitting here. Yeah, thanks many thanks. That's it. That's 2:09:39.920 --> 2:09:44.920 all another episode in the books Hunting Collective. Um. What 2:09:45.040 --> 2:09:49.480 I'll say about this story and Brad is that I 2:09:49.600 --> 2:09:55.520 was amazed by I was it was interested in every 2:09:55.560 --> 2:10:00.200 facet of it, and I'm very thankful that he uh 2:10:00.480 --> 2:10:03.360 shows us or was willing to tell that story on 2:10:03.400 --> 2:10:05.640 the air here with me the hunt Collective. I think 2:10:05.640 --> 2:10:08.920 it's one of the more useful stories and educational stories 2:10:09.080 --> 2:10:11.560 you can hear about how he survived, why he survived, 2:10:11.600 --> 2:10:14.680 and why it was the folks he chose to have 2:10:14.800 --> 2:10:20.440 with him that were um key to his survival. So 2:10:21.840 --> 2:10:24.960 thank you, thank you, thank you to Brad. Glad you're live, bro, 2:10:25.680 --> 2:10:28.120 and you're glad, you're feeling good. So get back to it, 2:10:28.400 --> 2:10:30.720 get back to ice climb and get back to ski 2:10:30.760 --> 2:10:34.400 and get back to hunting, get back to life. Appreciate you. 2:10:35.800 --> 2:10:38.360 What else? What else? Into the next thing? We you know, 2:10:38.440 --> 2:10:41.720 we um. We've got a lot of stuff at the 2:10:41.760 --> 2:10:45.240 meat Eator dot com store. Just check that all out. 2:10:46.480 --> 2:10:50.880 Christmas is coming gone, I believe, but there's still lots 2:10:50.880 --> 2:10:53.880 of reasons to buy for yourself and your friends and family. 2:10:54.000 --> 2:10:59.400 So go there. Check out hats, shirts, hoodies, yetie, tumblers, 2:10:59.440 --> 2:11:03.600 all the things with um uh the Hunting Collective the 2:11:03.680 --> 2:11:06.760 logo on them or some kind of awesome pro nuance 2:11:06.840 --> 2:11:09.440 anti bullshit. We've got some other things going up the 2:11:09.480 --> 2:11:12.040 Broadside ELK T shirt, which was a quote quote from 2:11:12.120 --> 2:11:14.840 Ryan Callahan on the podcast. A lot of awesome stuff there, man, 2:11:14.960 --> 2:11:18.000 So go check it out. And while you're there, click subscribe. 2:11:18.120 --> 2:11:22.240 When the the Meat Eater newsletter, we need you to subscribe. 2:11:22.320 --> 2:11:24.720 We loved, like millions of people to get our information 2:11:24.760 --> 2:11:27.240 every week in their inbox. Hopefully you can be one 2:11:27.240 --> 2:11:30.400 of them. But that's all I've got for this time. 2:11:30.720 --> 2:11:33.960 Thank you for everything, all of you. I appreciate you, 2:11:34.240 --> 2:11:37.920 and I'm happy this podcast is growing and and everyone 2:11:38.000 --> 2:11:42.320 is enjoying our efforts because we're trying our best. So 2:11:43.160 --> 2:11:44.720 right in tell us what we're doing, good or bad. 2:11:44.880 --> 2:11:47.760 We look to hear it all. And until next time, 2:11:48.360 --> 2:11:50.560 take her easy, all right,