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Speaker 1: Welcome back to the show, fellow conspiracy realist. The following

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Speaker 1: classic episode may not be appropriate for all listeners, so

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Speaker 1: if you've got some kiddos in the crowd in the

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Speaker 1: road trip with you, maybe check out a future episode

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Speaker 1: or tune into our earlier interview with Aaron Manky. This

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Speaker 1: is the story of Jeffrey Epstein at its way back

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Speaker 1: in what January twenty nineteen.

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Speaker 2: Yes, this is right before the major news started hitting

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Speaker 2: or with Jeffrey Epstein getting arrested and all the stuff

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Speaker 2: that we're not going to spoil right now. Just to

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Speaker 2: listen to this episode because it takes you back to

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Speaker 2: a time when I think maybe we and much of

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Speaker 2: the world was really discovering what this guy was doing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and again, at this time that we recorded it,

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Speaker 1: one of our big questions was why is this guy

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Speaker 1: not arrested? So you can get a snapshot here and

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Speaker 1: tune in for our upcoming episode on the aftermath of

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Speaker 1: the Epstein scandal. From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies,

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Speaker 1: history is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back

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Speaker 1: now or learn this stuff they don't want you to know.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt.

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Speaker 1: My name is Noman. They call me Ben. We are

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Speaker 1: joined with our super producer Paul Mission controlled Decat most importantly,

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Speaker 1: you are here and that makes this stuff they don't

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Speaker 1: want you to know. Before we get started, we have

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Speaker 1: a very important message regarding today's episode.

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Speaker 3: Today's episode discusses very frankly, some horrific sexual crimes against

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Speaker 3: underaged victims, and it's quite disturbing, but I think it's

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Speaker 3: an important discussion to have and we try as always

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Speaker 3: to be as respectful and thoughtful about it as possible.

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Speaker 1: Let's cut straight to the heart of the matter. In

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Speaker 1: an earlier episode, we mentioned the ongoing legal battles of

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Speaker 1: one Jeffrey Epstein. Today we are diving into a sordid

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Speaker 1: tale that will take us from the posh tony area

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Speaker 1: of Palm Beach Island, Florida, to New York, to New Mexico,

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Speaker 1: to Paris, to a private island in the Virgin Islands

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Speaker 1: and a particularly strange series of private plane flights. But

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Speaker 1: first things first, who is Jeffrey Epstein.

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Speaker 2: Oh, the man of the hour. Jeffrey Epstein was born

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Speaker 2: in nineteen fifty three on Coney Island. He went to

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Speaker 2: Lafayette High School. He also attended Cooper Union. He dropped

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Speaker 2: out of Cooper Union. By the way. He also went

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Speaker 2: to New York University's current Institute, which he also left

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Speaker 2: without a degree, surprisingly, especially as we continue to learn

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Speaker 2: a little more about this gentleman.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. For two years, from nineteen seventy three to

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Speaker 1: nineteen seventy five, Epstein taught at a very upscale Ivy

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Speaker 1: League prep school called Dalton School in Manhattan. You'll read

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Speaker 1: accounts that say he taught calculus and physics, and then

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Speaker 1: you'll read accounts that say he taught physics and math.

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Speaker 1: But it was definitely the quantitative, the quantitative disciplines. New

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Speaker 1: York Magazine initially likened his time at Dalton School to

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Speaker 1: the teacher that Robin Williams plays in Dead Poets Society.

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Speaker 1: Do you guys remember that film.

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Speaker 3: Oh Captain, My Captain, Yeah, man, the first really really

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Speaker 3: sad movie I ever saw.

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Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, poetry was made for one reason, boys to.

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Speaker 2: Woo women and also carpe dm Right.

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Speaker 1: So, one parent of a student worked on Wall Street,

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Speaker 1: and this guy was so inspired by Epstein's methods and

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Speaker 1: the math rants that he was known for that he

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Speaker 1: approached Jeffrey Epstein and said, essentially, what the hell are

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Speaker 1: you doing here, buddy, Why are you a teacher? You

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Speaker 1: should be on Wall Street, which lets you know what

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Speaker 1: Wall Street thinks about teachers.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, why would you be inspiring the young people? Just

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Speaker 2: make more money.

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Speaker 1: And so this guy, this parent, doubled out on this

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Speaker 1: and said, no, really, I'm serious, jeff Let me introduce

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Speaker 1: you to my buddy, Ace Greenberg. You've got to call him.

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Speaker 1: Ace Greenberg is a senior partner at the time at

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Speaker 1: bear Stearns. Greenberg really dug Epstein because this guy Greenberg

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Speaker 1: definitely played favorites. And one thing that he was known

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Speaker 1: for was he had a certain type of young employee

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Speaker 1: he liked or knew hire. He didn't want people who

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Speaker 1: were just fattened off inherited money or third generation bankers.

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Speaker 1: He wanted brilliant poor people and poor as anything beneath

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Speaker 1: a millionaire to him, who were very, very hungry. And

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Speaker 1: at the time, Epstein ticked all these boxes. So nineteen

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Speaker 1: seventy six he says, all right, screw teaching, I'm going

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Speaker 1: to work at bear Stearns under as Greenberg. He started

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Speaker 1: from the bottom kind of the way Drake wants you

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Speaker 1: to believe his career began it's untrue, But in Epstein's case,

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Speaker 1: it is. He started as a junior assistant to a

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Speaker 1: floor trader at the American Stock Exchange, and it quickly

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Speaker 1: became apparent that Jeff had a gift for this sort

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Speaker 1: of work.

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Speaker 3: So Epstein was, to be fair either a complete genius

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Speaker 3: or very very close to that. He had a specialty,

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Speaker 3: which was in options, and that was at the time

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Speaker 3: something that wasn't particularly well understood, and he amassed a

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Speaker 3: group of clients, really really quite wealthy clients who thought

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Speaker 3: that his ability to assess the tax implications on large

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Speaker 3: portfolios and then to recommend kind of tax loopholes I

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Speaker 3: guess advantages you could say for some of these transactions.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, this At this level of finance, the way

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Speaker 1: in which you move money and the order of operations

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Speaker 1: can make a huge difference in how much of a

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Speaker 1: cut Uncle Sam gets or the state of New York

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Speaker 1: or whatever.

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Speaker 2: And it's really crazy that it only took him four

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Speaker 2: years to go from assistant to a floor trader all

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Speaker 2: the way up to a full partner.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he beat the game. He became a partner and

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Speaker 1: then what do you do after you beat a game?

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Speaker 1: You stop playing. So he left the firm in nineteen

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Speaker 1: eighty one and set up his own shop. This is

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Speaker 1: really this is really strange and sketchy. Okay. So the

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Speaker 1: premise behind his shop, Epstein and Co. Is that he

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Speaker 1: would manage the individual and family fortunes of clients with

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Speaker 1: a minimum of one billion dollars in their portfolio.

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Speaker 2: Wow. Minimum.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And according to the scuttle butt about this guy

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Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty two, he immediately began collecting clients. And

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Speaker 1: he didn't go out and have some sort of Ted

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Speaker 1: talk or some sort of Steve Jobs big Apple reveal speech.

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Speaker 1: People just started coming to him because they knew he

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Speaker 1: was open for business and he was also very controlling.

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Speaker 1: He had these specific conditions. If you made one billion

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Speaker 1: or more, you could talk, but you also had to

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Speaker 1: accept this. He would not just offer investment advice. He

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Speaker 1: was going to become your financial architect, from soup to nuts,

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Speaker 1: stem to stern, from investments to philanthropy to tax planning

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Speaker 1: to security to a swatching. The guilt and burdens that

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Speaker 1: people felt because they had, you know, inherited wealth that

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Speaker 1: they clearly did not earn. He said to one of

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Speaker 1: his friends at the time, I want people to understand

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Speaker 1: the power, the responsibility, and the burden of their money.

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Speaker 1: He would take total control of the billion dollars. He

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Speaker 1: would charge a flat fee, and he would also get

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Speaker 1: power of attorney to do whatever he deemed necessary to

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Speaker 1: advance his client's financial goals. And he was really strict

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Speaker 1: about all these conditions.

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Speaker 2: And there's this whole thing where he really did stick

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Speaker 2: to this whole. If you're a billionaire, we're cool. If

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Speaker 2: you're not, get the hell out. I mean it's I mean,

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Speaker 2: as crazy as that sounds, like. People would come to

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Speaker 2: him with seven hundred million dollars, put it on the

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Speaker 2: table essentially, and say, Jeff, I need your help, buddy.

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Speaker 2: I've got seven hundred million dollars and I need you

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Speaker 2: to work this through or three and he's like, no,

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Speaker 2: get out, basically, not so kind, no thank you, basically because.

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Speaker 1: They were just a little that billion. Yeah, it's like

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Speaker 1: I don't run a business for hobos. Yeah, And that's okay.

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Speaker 1: So there is a quick pause here because that's a

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Speaker 1: question I have. How many billionaires were there in nineteen

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Speaker 1: eighty one. We know there are more now, you know,

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Speaker 1: partially due to inflation, partially due to rise of business

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Speaker 1: in other countries. But were there that many billionaires in

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Speaker 1: nineteen eighty one, I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I would think not.

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Speaker 1: I would imagine it was a very very rarefied field,

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Speaker 1: right were they couldn't have been that many.

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Speaker 2: I mean that inherited wealth. There are at least several

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Speaker 2: hundred families that have.

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Speaker 1: You know, that's true because I was thinking of individuals.

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Speaker 1: So it might be like a dynasty that collects all

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Speaker 1: of their ill gotten.

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Speaker 2: Gains or happy gotten gains. You know, some billionaires are

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Speaker 2: really sweet and do nice things for the earth and

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Speaker 2: for its inhabitants.

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Speaker 1: Right sure, maybe I don't personally know everybody on the planet,

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Speaker 1: so I want to be fair.

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Speaker 3: Well, there's also probably some that you know, do it

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Speaker 3: with great humility and just don't brag about it, right, right,

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Speaker 3: I would, I would, I would hope.

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Speaker 2: But then you give it to Jeffrey Epstein who says

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Speaker 2: I'll handle you all.

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Speaker 1: And that's, you know, that's the smart thing to do.

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Speaker 1: It just makes me think of that Balls Act quote.

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Speaker 1: Behind every great fortune, there is a crime, you know.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, you guys are absolutely right there are clearly

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Speaker 1: people who you know, if you're born into wealth and

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Speaker 1: you don't have control over your circumstances, then of course

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Speaker 1: there are people who want to do great acts to

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Speaker 1: make the world a better place. Bill Gates took himself

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Speaker 1: down several notches financially to help combat disease. That's that's

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Speaker 1: a stand up thing. I still hate Clippy, but fighting

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Speaker 1: disease is a noble thing.

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Speaker 3: Do you know what? When Josh Chuck interviewed Bill Gates,

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Speaker 3: I actually got to go with them and meet him

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Speaker 3: in a hotel room, and Josh brought up Clippy, and

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Speaker 3: apparently Bill Gates is still quite fond of Clippy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Bill Gates loves Clippy. He has like a relationship

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Speaker 1: with it.

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Speaker 2: Uh, he's the only one.

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Speaker 1: So when I was a kid, I liked it, but

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Speaker 1: it just slowed down the word processor. So, speaking of billionaires,

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Speaker 1: who are Jeffrey's clients? Aside from one client, a billionaire

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Speaker 1: named Leslie Wexler. Epstein keeps his list a closely guarded secret,

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Speaker 1: and he's also sort of evasive about his process and

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Speaker 1: what he does. Yeah, you could call it wealth management,

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Speaker 1: but that's sort of like calling something a structure. A

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Speaker 1: shot can be a structure, so can a skyscraper or

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Speaker 1: a pyramid or a nuclear bunker. There are a lot

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Speaker 1: of things that could be considered that wealth management. So

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Speaker 1: he's firm employees as many or employed as many as

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Speaker 1: one hundred and fifty people, but their tasks were overwhelmingly

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Speaker 1: day to day bureaucracy and admin stuff like accountants to

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Speaker 1: make sure the internal finances of the company are running.

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Speaker 1: All the actual decisions, investment and management decisions were made

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Speaker 1: by Epstein himself, and he's sort of computer phobic, not

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Speaker 1: a big fan of emails and so on, so he's

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Speaker 1: always talking on the phone, which will be important later.

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Speaker 1: So how much money is he making. Some estimates will

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Speaker 1: say he is or was raking in around seventy five

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Speaker 1: million a year, but that's a guestimate, and that's why

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Speaker 1: in a lot of stories about the guy, and there

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Speaker 1: weren't many until fairly recently, you'll hear him described as

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Speaker 1: either a multi millionaire or a billionaire. People don't really know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you have to imagine if he's bringing in even

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Speaker 2: somewhere around seventy five million dollars a year with his acumen,

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Speaker 2: his understanding of investment, he's probably gotten well upward of

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Speaker 2: a billion, I'm assuming.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's like the Putin question. How much money does

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Speaker 1: Vladimir Putin have?

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Speaker 2: Not? I mean, which palace are you going to search?

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Speaker 1: Right? How long do you want to live?

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Speaker 2: Oh jeez? Okay, Well here's the big question. With however

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Speaker 2: much money he's acquired. What does a guy like Jeffrey

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Speaker 2: Epstein do with all of those piles of cash?

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Speaker 1: Beanie babies?

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Speaker 2: He sets them on fire? Oh man, see, buy a

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Speaker 2: bunch of beanie babies, buy them a bunch of magic cards,

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Speaker 2: then set the whole thing on fire.

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Speaker 1: Wear it a cape. What's his monoical top hat position?

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Speaker 2: I don't know. Well, I'll tell you for real what

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Speaker 2: he does is and what anyone should probably do.

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Speaker 1: I want a cape so bad, I'm sorry.

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Speaker 2: Buy a cape first, then just start purchasing real estate,

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Speaker 2: purchasing land, purchasing stuff that goes on land, different structures.

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Speaker 2: Put them on land that you own. That's what you do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so he owns that private island in the US

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Speaker 1: Virgin Islands. We didn't mention what the nickname for this

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Speaker 1: thing is. No, it's Little Saint Jeffrey.

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Speaker 2: Little Saint Jeffrey.

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Speaker 1: Well lit saints, Jeffrey of the US virtu pilots.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but seriously, he owns an island.

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Speaker 1: He owns an island. It's it's who was asking Oh,

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Speaker 1: Jonathan Strickland was asking me about this earlier. And it

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Speaker 1: is in fact not shaped like a skull, which I

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Speaker 1: know is a huge downer for everyone.

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Speaker 2: Do you think he still has a layer though.

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Speaker 1: Yes, he does have a layer. He also has a

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Speaker 1: Japanese bathhouse on this island.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we're gonna learn more about that in just a

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Speaker 2: little bit. But here's the other thing, Noel, he owns

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Speaker 2: on the island of Manhattan, the what is considered the

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Speaker 2: largest private.

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Speaker 1: Residence nine stories tall.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he owns that and an island. It's insane.

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Speaker 1: He also funds extensive, legitimate scientific research through something humbly

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Speaker 1: named the Jeffrey Epstein the six the Foundation.

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Speaker 2: And it's cool. It is genuinely cool.

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Speaker 1: It's genuinely good. Since two thousand, the foundation is given

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Speaker 1: around two hundred million a year per year to people

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Speaker 1: like Stephen Hawking, Marvin Minsky, Eric Lander, George Church, Ben Goertzel,

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Speaker 1: other like numerous Nobel.

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Speaker 2: Laureates, Lawrence Krausman.

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Speaker 1: Lawrence Krauss as well, And over the years, the Foundation

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Speaker 1: has brought a lot of these scientists together and these

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Speaker 1: sort of brainstorming conference situations to get on the same

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Speaker 1: page about fundamental topics like gravity, global threats to Earth,

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Speaker 1: the evolution of language. So you can see some of

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Speaker 1: the implications here. Usually when billionaires or philanthropists are saying,

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Speaker 1: let's understand gravity, they're asking, how can we use it somehow?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, global threats to Earth. I mean, this all goes

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Speaker 1: back to making smart investment choices too. I think the

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Speaker 1: language thing is really interesting. I'm sure there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of group think theory because that would be valuable in

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Speaker 1: the stock market.

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Speaker 2: So this is, in my opinion, one of those things

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Speaker 2: that you do see every once in a while when

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Speaker 2: a certain individual or a group acquires enough wealth that

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Speaker 2: philanthropy is able to kick in at this point, at

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Speaker 2: least to this level where a big, a new creation

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Speaker 2: occurs that is helping that truly is helping humanity in

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Speaker 2: some way, in some small way. In this case, just

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Speaker 2: bringing scientists to a consensus could be massively important to

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Speaker 2: get everyone on the same page to actually get the

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Speaker 2: Earth to start making some big changes, right, Rather than

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Speaker 2: just a country or one small groups. It's tough for

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Speaker 2: me to know this and then also know what we're

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Speaker 2: going to talk about in just a few minutes.

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Speaker 1: Right, Let's stick with the good stuff while we can.

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Speaker 1: You can see the official about age for the Epstein

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Speaker 1: Foundation when he talks about how his funded in two

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Speaker 1: thousand and how it in two thousand and three established

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Speaker 1: a program for evolutionary dynamics at Harvard University with thirty

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Speaker 1: thirty five million dollars seed money gift. The program studies

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Speaker 1: the evolution of microbiology through the lens of mathematics. Then,

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Speaker 1: since its establishment, it's made advances in the treatment of cancer, HIV,

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Speaker 1: infectious diseases. He's also get this well known for his

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Speaker 1: work funding early education for youth in the Virgin Islands

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Speaker 1: to other places other areas of the world.

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Speaker 2: So far, so good, right, Yeah, these are genuinely good things.

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Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein, a self made financial giant. Isn't just killing it.

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Speaker 1: In the world of finance, A lot of finance guys

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Speaker 1: defined success by violent terms. Crushing it, killing it, nailed it,

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Speaker 1: so smashing it, smashing it.

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Speaker 2: Destroyed that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he did all of that stuff. He's also putting

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Speaker 1: a significant amount of capital into globally important issues, though

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Speaker 1: his motivations are not clearly, not entirely true, altruistic, you

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Speaker 1: can make some money off that. Yet, while Epstein remained

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Speaker 1: for many years an international man of intrigue and mystery, tantalizing,

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Speaker 1: bits of information about his private life gradually emerged. And

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Speaker 1: that's when things got ugly.

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Speaker 2: And we'll learn about those things right after a quick

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Speaker 2: word from our sponsor.

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Speaker 1: Here's where it gets crazy.

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Speaker 2: Rumors.

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Speaker 1: We're true, yep, even more so than we thought.

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Speaker 2: Wait waits, there were rumors. Guys.

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Speaker 1: Yes, she was well open secrets. Ah, people called nieces.

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Speaker 1: That's a gross that's a gross detail. First, let's get

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Speaker 1: let's get the one almost side note rumor out of

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Speaker 1: the way. He's a member of a lot of clubs.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. The Trilateral Commission that you may remember from an

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Speaker 2: episode that we've done. We have done an audio episode

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Speaker 2: on Trilateral right, I don't remember. Oh man, it's in

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Speaker 2: a video. Go check out our YouTube channel and watch

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Speaker 2: the Trilateral Commission if you don't know much about it.

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Speaker 2: Also the Council on Foreign Relations also a video also

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Speaker 2: maybe not audio topic yet, honestly, don't know.

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Speaker 1: A ton of people are in the Council of Foreign Relations, and.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, the Trilateral Commission has movers and shakers

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Speaker 2: that kind of come and go over time. But you

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Speaker 2: can imagine how upsetting these two things are for certain

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Speaker 2: a certain number of us within the conspiracy minded world, like,

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Speaker 2: being a part of both of those organizations is pretty bad,

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Speaker 2: because just being part of one is potentially bad. It

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Speaker 2: isn't necessarily a bad thing overall, but for people who

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Speaker 2: believe this, yes it is.

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Speaker 1: Do you think they have capes capes not like in

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Speaker 1: public but when.

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Speaker 2: They're in the meetings. Yeah, I think it's more of

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Speaker 2: like crowns and different masks that they wear.

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Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, yeah, Okay, I mean I feel like that's

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Speaker 1: a big compromise. Okay, maybe you have to be in

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Speaker 1: this straight up illuminati to earn a cape.

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Speaker 2: So that you know, that's one of those things that

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Speaker 2: makes you go ooh, interesting, I wanted to know more

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Speaker 2: about this guy if you're of a certain mind. But

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Speaker 2: there's another thing.

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Speaker 1: And this is we're being relatively lighthearted about the inequality

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Speaker 1: of wealth and the globe and some of the ridiculous

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Speaker 1: things that could happen when you're a billionaire.

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Speaker 2: Because those are the lighthearted things.

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Speaker 1: The multi millionaire. Yeah, but those are the lighthearted things.

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Speaker 1: This is where this is where the disclaimer, the warning

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Speaker 1: we had at the beginning, really comes into effect. From

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Speaker 1: here on out, things are going to be pretty pretty dark.

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Speaker 1: So Secondly, and apparently for decades, Jeffrey Epstein had been

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Speaker 1: routinely seducing, assaulting, and in some cases violently assaulting underage girls.

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Speaker 2: And it goes even further than that. The really upsetting

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Speaker 2: thing is that this whole deal that he had going

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Speaker 2: on seemed to be pretty much an open secret in

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Speaker 2: certain parts of both Wall Street as well as Washington.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we have a quote from current president as we

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Speaker 1: record this, Donald Trump in two thousand and two, talking

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Speaker 1: about his relationship with Jeffrey Epstein.

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Speaker 2: He said, I've known jeff for fifteen years. Terrific guy.

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Speaker 2: He's a lot of fun to be with.

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Speaker 3: It's even said that he likes beautiful women as much

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Speaker 3: as I do, and many of them are on the

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Speaker 3: younger side, no doubt about it.

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Speaker 2: Jeffrey enjoys his social life. Well, that was hard to

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Speaker 2: get through that.

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Speaker 1: I know. You know, that guy's the president. Yeah, that

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Speaker 1: guy's the president. In a two thousand and seven New

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Speaker 1: York Magazine article, Vanity Fair column list Michael Wolfe described

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Speaker 1: flying on Epstein's private plane in the nineties, saying Epstein

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Speaker 1: was followed onto the plane by how shall I say this,

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Speaker 1: by three teenage girls, not his daughters, who were eighteen

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Speaker 1: nineteen twenty. Who knows they were model like. He's never

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Speaker 1: been secretive about the girls, wolf said. At one point,

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Speaker 1: when his troubles began, he was talking to me and said, Hey,

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Speaker 1: what can I say? I like young girls? I said,

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Speaker 1: maybe you should say I like young women.

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Speaker 2: A lot of smoke.

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Speaker 1: A lot of smoke here, A lot of smoke, A

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Speaker 1: lot of smoke. The mainstream public learned of this semi

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Speaker 1: open secret in the early two thousands, thanks in large

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Speaker 1: part to some groundbreaking work by the Miami Herald. These

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Speaker 1: encounters with undraged under A victims the ones that were

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Speaker 1: the subject of the investigation in Florida. They took place

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Speaker 1: from nineteen ninety nine to two thousand and five in

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Speaker 1: mister Epstein's mansions, the one in Palm Beach Island, New York,

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Speaker 1: and the US Virgin Islands. Many of the girls were

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Speaker 1: runaways or foster children. People from broken homes, people of

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Speaker 1: vulnerable situations. And it's important to note Epstein did not

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Speaker 1: work alone, like we remember when Matt earlier said this

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Speaker 1: is just the beginning.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: His his operation functioned like a pyramid scheme. A girl

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Speaker 1: would be approached by one of Epstein's assistants or often

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Speaker 1: a previous victim, and told, hey, you can make pretty

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Speaker 1: good money by giving this middle aged rich guy a massage.

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Speaker 1: Already creepy, right, So once the victim arrives at the mansion,

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Speaker 1: this in the Palm Beach operation, at least not far

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Speaker 1: from Mar al Lago, not very far, she would be

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Speaker 1: escorted to a particular room and then that person would leave,

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Speaker 1: and you can find descriptions of the room in the

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Speaker 1: Miami Herald's piece. Epstein would come in wearing only a

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Speaker 1: towel on the phone, this robe, lay down naked, belly down,

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Speaker 1: belly first, and he would tell the victim to massage

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Speaker 1: his legs. And then you would start escalating this stuff

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Speaker 1: and offering more money. Also, there were sex toys around.

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Speaker 1: And again I cannot emphasize this enough. When we say underage,

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Speaker 1: we're talking about kids who are fourteen and fifteen years old.

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Speaker 2: I can't even say words. I'm going to be making

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Speaker 2: guttural noises for the rest of this.

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Speaker 3: And I know this doesn't make me like special sensitive,

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Speaker 3: but it does a little just having a daughter that's

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Speaker 3: entering into kind of the teenage pre teenage phase.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I mean, I can't even imagine.

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Speaker 1: It's insane things. A lot of these kids are coming

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Speaker 1: from terrible home lives anyway, you know, so.

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Speaker 3: They're even like thinking they might get an opportunity or

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Speaker 3: something that might help them out, and right they're just

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Speaker 3: totally abused and used.

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Speaker 2: The rage, the rage really just immediately sets in. We

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Speaker 2: haven't even gotten like all the way into this.

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Speaker 1: So he would attempt to entice entice some victims to

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Speaker 1: disrobe and do increasingly intimate physical things. He would intimidate others.

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Speaker 1: In at least one case that made it to the

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Speaker 1: public sphere, he did forcibly assault somewhat, and afterwards the

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Speaker 1: girls would be paid two hundred and three hundred dollars

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Speaker 1: so to pay on what they did. The person that

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Speaker 1: he forced himself on says she gave him a thousand

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Speaker 1: bucks and asked her to be quiet, yeah and apologize,

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Speaker 1: so they would get paid and they would be informed

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Speaker 1: that if they'd like to make more money, they could

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Speaker 1: recruit their friends to come visit Epstein, so long as

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Speaker 1: they were around the same age. And some of the handlers,

438
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:23,879
Speaker 1: they're very careful about this. Some of the handlers told

439
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 1: the girls the victims when they first came to Epstein

440
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:31,320
Speaker 1: to say that they were eighteen to him. Who the

441
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 1: idea being that this will providability, Yeah, some kind of

442
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:39,919
Speaker 1: legal defense, but that doesn't fly in Florida. Florida specifically

443
00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:44,000
Speaker 1: has laws say ignorance of that age is not an excuse.

444
00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:47,920
Speaker 2: Geez, man, you can already see in my mind, I'm

445
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 2: picturing something like Nexium that we covered not long ago. Hm,

446
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 2: that kind of extremely wealthy person somehow just with the

447
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 2: enticement of money, and in Jeffrey's case, I guess in

448
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 2: some way not necessarily for the younger girls, but this

449
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:12,200
Speaker 2: aura of a wealthy man that knows what he's doing

450
00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,640
Speaker 2: is going to make more money and like has this

451
00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 2: special place in Palm Beach, but then also knowing that

452
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 2: perhaps he has an island it's and then getting your friends,

453
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:26,120
Speaker 2: like everything just feels so disgusting and icky about this

454
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:27,320
Speaker 2: and calculated.

455
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the thing. It's very calculated. This is not

456
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:34,120
Speaker 1: an impulse decision, you know what I mean. And not

457
00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 1: that not that an impulse decision is in any way better.

458
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:45,800
Speaker 1: It's just that this calculated, organizational systematic approach is it

459
00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 1: is insidious.

460
00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the spider thing in the web.

461
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:52,959
Speaker 1: And so let's look at some of the characters that

462
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:58,160
Speaker 1: become involved in this ongoing story. First is Epstein's associates

463
00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:02,400
Speaker 1: and staff. So one of his assistants was a person

464
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:06,760
Speaker 1: named Sarah Kellen, and Kellen was accused by lawyers and

465
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:11,880
Speaker 1: legal filings of bringing girls to Epstein's mansion to be abused.

466
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, according to the police files, there was this whole

467
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:20,200
Speaker 2: series of alleged victims that told investigators that they were

468
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:24,199
Speaker 2: led like this is the person, Sarah Kellen led these

469
00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:27,119
Speaker 2: girls to the massage room in the mansion where all

470
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 2: this other stuff with the disrobing occurred. And this was

471
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:36,239
Speaker 2: in the Palm Beach mansion. I mean, this literally is

472
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 2: a conspiracy.

473
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 3: There are other players involved that are being used as

474
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 3: pieces in this like elaborate ploy.

475
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 2: I mean, well, and it's so scary because who knows,

476
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,960
Speaker 2: who knows how much of a victim somebody like Sarah

477
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 2: Kellen is of him right early on in some other way,

478
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 2: like she's in his pocket in some way or something. Well,

479
00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:59,160
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, who knows the psychologically trapped. Yeah, that's

480
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:02,200
Speaker 2: not just excusing her of what her actions and what

481
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 2: she did, but still like we don't know the circumstances.

482
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 3: How deep this guy's kind of tendrils go, you know,

483
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:09,520
Speaker 3: absolutely terrifying.

484
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:15,440
Speaker 1: And speaking of that, there's another character, Nada Marstankova or Marchinkova.

485
00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:22,280
Speaker 1: She We'd first learned about her through statements of some

486
00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 1: alleged victims, who one claimed the police that Epstein told

487
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:33,320
Speaker 1: her that he had purchased Nada from her parents in

488
00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: Eastern Europe when she was fifteen. They were described as

489
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:44,080
Speaker 1: Yugoslavian or Slovakian. Another victim alleged that she was forced

490
00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:48,120
Speaker 1: to have sex with Nada marstan Kova and then watch

491
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 1: her have sexual interactions with Epstein. According to the Miami Herald,

492
00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:57,520
Speaker 1: sometimes Jeffrey would instruct a young woman he described as

493
00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:02,160
Speaker 1: his quote Yugoslavian sex slave, not Mrsenkova, who was over eighteen,

494
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 1: to join in, and he took photographs, and he displayed

495
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 1: these photographs around the house. The guys. There's a phrase

496
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 1: noll that you in your roommate used, I think applies here.

497
00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:20,120
Speaker 1: That the guy's proclivities were wide, rife, wide rife throughout

498
00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 1: his house. This was not a secret. There was also

499
00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 1: Ghislaine Maxwell, the socialite and heiress who was occasionally referred

500
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 1: to as Epstein's madam and was asked to turnover records.

501
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:32,200
Speaker 1: And then there's Alan Dershowitz.

502
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,120
Speaker 2: Alan Freakin Dershowitz, whose into.

503
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 1: This like an enormously prestigious lawyer. He worked with Epstein

504
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:43,080
Speaker 1: on the business side. Dershwitz told outfit called Axios that

505
00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:47,320
Speaker 1: Epstein lent his family the Palm Beach, Florida house and

506
00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: that he received a therapeutic massage with an old Russian there,

507
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: but that he'd had no idea anything improper had even

508
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 1: taking place in that house. In twenty eighteen, he said

509
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 1: that Epstein, after this stuff became public, he said, Epstein's

510
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,520
Speaker 1: called me a couple times about legal issues because I'm

511
00:31:04,520 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 1: still technically his lawyer, but I haven't had any social

512
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: or any other kind of contact with him. But you

513
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 1: never stopped being someone's lawyer. And then there's a guy

514
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:16,080
Speaker 1: we got to mention just casually he'll come back. Trust

515
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,360
Speaker 1: us guy named alex Acosta. He was formerly the US

516
00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:23,200
Speaker 1: attorney in South Florida. He's currently the US Secretary of Labor.

517
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:25,600
Speaker 1: We'll get to him in a bit, but just remember

518
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:27,800
Speaker 1: the name alex Acosta.

519
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 2: We shall remember you. So let's talk about the victims here.

520
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 2: The authority has identified more than thirty victims of Epstein.

521
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 2: And then if you look at the Miami Harold in

522
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 2: their latest report, they identified eighty victims and they located

523
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 2: sixty and spoke to four of them officially on the record.

524
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 2: So again, trying to track down all of these people

525
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 2: who are alleged victims, and you know, you can only

526
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 2: get a certain percentage of those people to even talk

527
00:31:56,840 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 2: because this kind of thing is it's so in citia.

528
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 2: Even being able to speak about something like this, especially

529
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 2: on the record, is difficult. So let's go through a

530
00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:13,480
Speaker 2: few of these. The first one is Virginia gfree geuffree

531
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 2: g I U F f r E. She claimed in

532
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 2: court papers that she was recruited into this whatever you

533
00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,920
Speaker 2: want to call child's sex ring that this billionaire was

534
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 2: running when she was only fifteen years old. She was

535
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 2: working as a towel girl at mar A Lago, Oh boy,

536
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 2: and that's how she got wrapped up in it. And

537
00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 2: she also claims that Dershwitz as well as Prince Andrew

538
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,280
Speaker 2: participated in her sexual abuse. What is a towel girl

539
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:46,280
Speaker 2: a towel girl, I'm assuming at mar A Lago because

540
00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 2: there's a vast outdoor area at mar A Lago with

541
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:51,520
Speaker 2: a pool and everything like that, as well as there

542
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,480
Speaker 2: are or what do you call them, all of the

543
00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:57,360
Speaker 2: other things you find out a spa bathhouse kind of thing.

544
00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:00,600
Speaker 2: I can only imagine that a towel girl had the towel.

545
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:03,200
Speaker 1: They bring towels. It's like a like a caddy, but

546
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:04,640
Speaker 1: with towels instead of clubs.

547
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 2: I see. And in this case, she's fifteen, which is fifteen,

548
00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:12,320
Speaker 2: and sixteen is a very common age for these private

549
00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:15,720
Speaker 2: clubs to hire. When I was fifteen, that's no. Yeah,

550
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 2: when I was fifteen I started working at one of

551
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 2: these places.

552
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:20,680
Speaker 1: Not as a towel girl.

553
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 2: I was in I was a pool boy, right, so

554
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 2: I mean.

555
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,360
Speaker 1: And it's a great and it's also that's a great

556
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:28,400
Speaker 1: summer job for kids. Yeah, it is, you know what

557
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: I mean. You make a little scratch, can save up

558
00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:32,240
Speaker 1: for Nintendo Switch.

559
00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 2: Or whatever, especially out in that area. Some of these

560
00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:37,480
Speaker 2: private clubs provide some of the best money for your work. Oh,

561
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:37,840
Speaker 2: I bet.

562
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 1: And then there's Courtney Wilde, who was a victim beginning

563
00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 1: at the age of fourteen. Wild says, by the time

564
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:48,120
Speaker 1: I was sixteen, I had probably brought him seventy to

565
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:51,160
Speaker 1: eighty girls who are all fourteen. I'm fifteen years old.

566
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 1: He was involved in my life for years.

567
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 2: Ugh. Ugh, And do you me just not skip over

568
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 2: the fact that this one person Virginia claimed that both

569
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 2: Dershowitz the lawyer and Prince Andrew Royalty were involved. How

570
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:11,320
Speaker 2: intense is that and especially occurring at mar A Lago

571
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:14,279
Speaker 2: where all of these highly important people are just kind

572
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:18,920
Speaker 2: of coming through whenever whenever, and now we have somebody

573
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 2: who's claiming to have brought him seventy to eighty girls.

574
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:26,200
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, we just had to pause for a moment,

575
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,560
Speaker 2: and now let's continue with the disgustingness.

576
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:33,480
Speaker 1: So there's Jenna Lisa Jones who said that she was

577
00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:38,760
Speaker 1: also she was also assaulted by Epstein when she was fourteen,

578
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:46,319
Speaker 1: and she has a chilling and haunting quote here. I

579
00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:48,879
Speaker 1: was I was somewhat divided over whether we should read

580
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 1: it aloud, but here it is. You can't ever stop

581
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:55,680
Speaker 1: your thoughts. A word can trigger something.

582
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 2: For me.

583
00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 1: It is the word pure, because he called me pure

584
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:01,319
Speaker 1: in that room, and then I remember what he did

585
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:05,279
Speaker 1: to me in that room. Just I don't know gets

586
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 1: to me. And there's Haley Robinson. Virginia Robinson was working

587
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:11,400
Speaker 1: at mar A Lago when she was recruited to be

588
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:16,120
Speaker 1: a massuset to Palm Beach Hedge fund manager Jeffrey Epstein.

589
00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 1: There are tons of Jane does. We don't know how

590
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:22,600
Speaker 1: many there are. We know what the Harald found, right

591
00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:28,080
Speaker 1: The Harold says they found eighty. They located sixty. They

592
00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:31,400
Speaker 1: talked to eight, but only four would go on the

593
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 1: record with their names. And you can understand that too,

594
00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 1: because a lot of these people have been quashed by

595
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:41,320
Speaker 1: settlements and non disclosure agreements. A settlement with a NDA

596
00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 1: or non disclosure agreement means that if someone if someone

597
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:48,359
Speaker 1: alleges a crime and you want to keep it out

598
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:52,399
Speaker 1: of court, regardless of what it is, you can have

599
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 1: a legal team drop a contract that says, without admitting guilt,

600
00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 1: here's X amount of dollars, And in.

601
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:01,920
Speaker 2: Turn, you can't talk about it.

602
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,520
Speaker 1: You agree to never talk about this. The problem is

603
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 1: that a lot of those things, as we see, don't

604
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:09,120
Speaker 1: really hold up in court if you're asking someone not

605
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: to confess a crime, you know what I mean.

606
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:15,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, So.

607
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:19,719
Speaker 1: Those are victims, those are collaborators or as you said,

608
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 1: no old conspirators. But there are some people fighting the

609
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 1: good fight on this side as well.

610
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,880
Speaker 3: So there were several investigators involved in the case. We

611
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,440
Speaker 3: have Joseph for Carey, who was the lead detective for

612
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:36,279
Speaker 3: the case, and in his first interview, he said the

613
00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:40,319
Speaker 3: evidence the department collected to support the girl's stories was

614
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 3: overwhelming and included all kinds of stuff, all kinds of

615
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:46,760
Speaker 3: damning evidence. Phone call records, copies of written phone messages

616
00:36:46,760 --> 00:36:50,359
Speaker 3: from the girls found in Epstein's trash, and Epstein's flight

617
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,279
Speaker 3: logs that showed his private plane in Palm Beach on

618
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 3: the days that girls were scheduled to give massages.

619
00:36:57,719 --> 00:36:58,800
Speaker 1: Pretty damning stuff.

620
00:36:58,880 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

621
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 3: The police also showed how eerily consistent the girl's stories were,

622
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:08,400
Speaker 3: just down to the tee, right down to their detailed

623
00:37:08,400 --> 00:37:11,320
Speaker 3: descriptions of Epstein's genitalia.

624
00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:16,000
Speaker 1: And then there's Michael Writer, who is the former chief

625
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:19,400
Speaker 1: of police in Palm Beach. He was the chief during

626
00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 1: this investigation, and he said detectives were astonished by the

627
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:28,040
Speaker 1: sheer volume of victims coming and going from the house,

628
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:33,360
Speaker 1: the frequency, sometimes several in the same day, and the

629
00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 1: universally young ages of these girls. Michael Writer says, it

630
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:41,959
Speaker 1: started out to give a man backrup but in many

631
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:44,279
Speaker 1: cases turned us so far worse than that, elevated to

632
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:47,520
Speaker 1: a serious crime in some cases sexual batteries. And then

633
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:51,759
Speaker 1: there's another good I mean, this is almost true detective level,

634
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:53,680
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Yeah, as far as the

635
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 1: web that is unearthed here, there's the attorney for the victims,

636
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:02,719
Speaker 1: Skinning Brad Edwards. He's representing several of the young women

637
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 1: who were abused as miners by Epstein. His law office

638
00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:11,200
Speaker 1: is packed with files from the case, and he's been

639
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: fighting the power at every turn, often outnumbered, outgunned, outmanned.

640
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:21,440
Speaker 1: Because you see, that true detective thing is not just

641
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:22,879
Speaker 1: a pop culture reference for us.

642
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:23,080
Speaker 2: Here.

643
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,760
Speaker 1: There are multiple very powerful people that have been implicated

644
00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:32,719
Speaker 1: in one way or another with Epstein, and to be fair,

645
00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:35,560
Speaker 1: a lot of it is not proven, other than the

646
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:38,839
Speaker 1: fact that we know they hung out, they maybe took

647
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 1: his playing place as the plane, which was also informally

648
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:47,040
Speaker 1: known as the Lolita Express. That's true, was in formally

649
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:49,440
Speaker 1: known as that. But who are some of these implicated

650
00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:51,680
Speaker 1: implicated celebrities.

651
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:55,000
Speaker 2: Well, let's jump in first with Bill Clinton, because he

652
00:38:55,120 --> 00:38:57,920
Speaker 2: was known to have taken the Lolita Express to the

653
00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:02,920
Speaker 2: Virgin Islands, to that island that Epstein owns on numerous occasions,

654
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:07,080
Speaker 2: as well as hanging out at the Palm Beach and.

655
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:10,960
Speaker 1: He went to Africa, Yeah, using that plane. I think

656
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:12,799
Speaker 1: Chris Tucker was on the plane too.

657
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 2: There's this huge list of celebrities that have been on there,

658
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:19,880
Speaker 2: you know, but Bill Clinton was definitely one of the

659
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 2: ones that popped out in my mind around the time.

660
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 2: This is awful to say, but it was around the

661
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:27,839
Speaker 2: time that Pizzagate was kind of coming out. That's when

662
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:31,280
Speaker 2: I started to really learn about Bill Clinton's involvement with Epstein,

663
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:35,400
Speaker 2: and that connection was one of those things that freaked

664
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 2: me out a little bit and made me start to

665
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,240
Speaker 2: think there was more to the whole Pizzagate thing, which

666
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 2: I don't necessarily believe, but it's definitely one of those

667
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 2: things that creeped me out.

668
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 1: And then Donald Trump has come up several times here

669
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:52,520
Speaker 1: current President Donald Trump, he had this association.

670
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 2: He made that really creepy quote.

671
00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:58,399
Speaker 1: He made that quotation. He made that quote in two

672
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:03,439
Speaker 1: thousand and two that certainly didn't age well. And there's

673
00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:06,640
Speaker 1: one thing we do have to say in Donald Trump's defense.

674
00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 1: When Trump was when Trump learned that Epstein may have

675
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 1: been romantically entertaining or attempting to recruit underage girls at

676
00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:22,120
Speaker 1: mar A Lago or bringing these young women with him,

677
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 1: these young girls, these children with him and calling them

678
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 1: his nieces, which is so creepy, Donald Trump said, Okay, look,

679
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:34,200
Speaker 1: this can't happen here. You gotta go. So Trump asked

680
00:40:34,239 --> 00:40:36,840
Speaker 1: him to leave. Trump kicked him out.

681
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:38,439
Speaker 2: That's good.

682
00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,840
Speaker 1: I guess I feel like that's the bare minimum of decent. No,

683
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:44,760
Speaker 1: it's not. The bare minimum of decency is calling the police.

684
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:46,960
Speaker 2: Yeah. His his whole thing is just don't do it

685
00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:48,560
Speaker 2: where I can also be implicated.

686
00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:50,400
Speaker 1: It's right, you think that was what it was.

687
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:52,719
Speaker 2: I mean in my opinion, Oh yeah, Oh well, I

688
00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:53,040
Speaker 2: don't know.

689
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:56,680
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't want to throw around implications like that.

690
00:40:56,760 --> 00:41:01,320
Speaker 2: It sure feels like it based on what we know about. Yeah,

691
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:04,760
Speaker 2: the act of kicking someone out or not allowing someone

692
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,279
Speaker 2: to do something illegal in your place of business, but

693
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:10,440
Speaker 2: not alerting the authorities that someone is doing something illegal

694
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,120
Speaker 2: in your place of business. Now, that's that's that's very damning.

695
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:15,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, I see what you're saying. Yeah, that makes sense.

696
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 1: And then we mentioned Prince Andrew, the Prince Andrew, the

697
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:26,600
Speaker 1: allegations that Epstein forced his teenage victims to become physically

698
00:41:26,600 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 1: involved with Prince Andrew on three separate occasions. And the

699
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:35,239
Speaker 1: you know, the UK Press is having a field day

700
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:37,560
Speaker 1: with like tabloids like the Sun or whatever.

701
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:39,439
Speaker 2: Well, what's blowing up right now?

702
00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:41,680
Speaker 1: Well, a lot of I mean also a lot of

703
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:43,839
Speaker 1: royalty are untouchable.

704
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:44,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know what I mean.

705
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:50,960
Speaker 1: When When's when is the next time? When's the last

706
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:52,879
Speaker 1: time a royal family member went to jail?

707
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:57,719
Speaker 2: Prince Charles spent a lot of time in the old Slamma. No,

708
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:00,799
Speaker 2: I'm just kidding any slam.

709
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:07,680
Speaker 1: Little slammery that's what they call it there, right, So okay,

710
00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:11,799
Speaker 1: as we said, the alleged abuse is pretty well documented

711
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:15,400
Speaker 1: by numerous sources going back to at least the nineteen nineties.

712
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 1: And if you want to be less than optimistic, then

713
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:23,880
Speaker 1: you can reasonably say that it's possible it went or

714
00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:28,160
Speaker 1: went back earlier than that. So how did this go

715
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:35,240
Speaker 1: from rumors scuttle button secrecy to an actual legal matter.

716
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:37,640
Speaker 1: How did the cops get involved? Well we'll get to

717
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,000
Speaker 1: that right after a quick break.

718
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 2: So let's start in March of two thousand and five,

719
00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:51,160
Speaker 2: when a woman called the police in Palm Beach, and

720
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:54,799
Speaker 2: after first refusing to give her name, she said that

721
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:58,680
Speaker 2: she believed her fourteen year old stepdaughter had in some

722
00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:03,680
Speaker 2: way been molested by a wealthy man, just a wealthy man. So,

723
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:07,439
Speaker 2: at the time, the victim in this case lived at

724
00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 2: this involuntary admitted juvenile education facility, which I'm assuming is

725
00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:16,560
Speaker 2: some kind of juvi what you would call a juvi

726
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:19,719
Speaker 2: or I guess something to that effect, because she was

727
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:24,719
Speaker 2: having behavioral problems, right, So apparently she shows up at

728
00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 2: this school with three hundred dollars cash in her purse,

729
00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:31,640
Speaker 2: and it became basically the talk of the class. Everybody's saying,

730
00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 2: oh my god, you see that she's got three hundred cash.

731
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 2: Now you get that, dude, that's crazy. And then the

732
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 2: friend called the girl a terrible name, yes we'll say it,

733
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 2: a whore. Another friend put a fist through the wall

734
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:49,239
Speaker 2: in anger, apparently like punched the wall. And then the

735
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:52,959
Speaker 2: girl left school, and then the stepmother gets this call

736
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:56,759
Speaker 2: from another student's mother. So this just this act of

737
00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:59,800
Speaker 2: bringing three hundred dollars into this school was enough to

738
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:04,719
Speaker 2: get basically the entire school talking. Then a policewoman was

739
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:07,560
Speaker 2: talking to the girl with a therapist there, so they're

740
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:10,880
Speaker 2: just having a conversation about what's going on. That's when

741
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:15,840
Speaker 2: this victim she begins crying and breaking down, and she

742
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:18,920
Speaker 2: dug her finger into her thigh and she just began

743
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:24,359
Speaker 2: out telling this entire story about how she was. She

744
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:27,600
Speaker 2: was taken to this big house on the Atlantic in

745
00:44:27,719 --> 00:44:34,600
Speaker 2: the Intracoastal Waterway, which is where Epstein's mansion was located.

746
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:38,719
Speaker 2: She remembers climbing this spiral staircase to the master bedroom

747
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:42,760
Speaker 2: where this woman, a blonde woman who you know, she's

748
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:45,520
Speaker 2: probably in her twenties, twenty five or something.

749
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:46,600
Speaker 1: Is likely Sarah Kellen.

750
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:50,800
Speaker 2: It's probably, yes, exactly, probably Sarah Kellen. She wasn't very friendly.

751
00:44:51,120 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 2: She laid out sheets as she put lotions on a

752
00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:58,320
Speaker 2: massage table, and then she leaves. That's when Jeffrey Epstein

753
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 2: comes in. This is the story. Worry this similar story

754
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 2: that we've already talked about. He's naked except for a towel.

755
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:07,560
Speaker 2: He sternly orders the girl to take off her clothes

756
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:11,120
Speaker 2: and then the rest of the details are pretty much

757
00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:14,680
Speaker 2: what you've heard before and stuff that I honestly don't

758
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:17,080
Speaker 2: want to say here. But the police at this point

759
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:20,280
Speaker 2: were very much convinced that this was at least worth

760
00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:20,879
Speaker 2: looking into.

761
00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:26,960
Speaker 1: And then this girl says that she had been brought

762
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,640
Speaker 1: there by two other girls. Please spoke to those two girls.

763
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 1: Those two girls pointed to two more girls who had

764
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:36,600
Speaker 1: also been there and also recruited them. By the time

765
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:40,000
Speaker 1: detectives tracked down one victim, there were two or three

766
00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:43,040
Speaker 1: more to find, and very very soon there were dozens.

767
00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:46,240
Speaker 1: So also in two thousand and five, the Palm Beach

768
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:50,960
Speaker 1: PD obtains a search warrant and they visit Epstein's mansion.

769
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:55,360
Speaker 1: They cart off massage tables, photos of naked girls, soaps

770
00:45:55,560 --> 00:46:00,719
Speaker 1: shaped like Genitalia. Epstein sent an urgent message to the

771
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:04,080
Speaker 1: detectives through his attorney. It said, the shadiest thing.

772
00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:07,680
Speaker 3: Mister Epstein is this is laughable. I'm sorry, this is

773
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 3: just mister Epstein is very passionate about massages. The massages

774
00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:15,799
Speaker 3: are therapeutic and spiritually sound for him.

775
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:23,520
Speaker 2: That is why he has had many massages. I mean, really,

776
00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:25,600
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, I'm laughing. It's just come on.

777
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:32,040
Speaker 1: It's laughable. It's like it's such a bad attempt at

778
00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:36,120
Speaker 1: an excuse that it sounds like it was poorly translated

779
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:37,280
Speaker 1: from a different language.

780
00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, the craziest thing here is that if you're

781
00:46:42,719 --> 00:46:46,879
Speaker 2: a wealthy individual and you really are passionate about massages,

782
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:51,040
Speaker 2: it makes sense that you have massage therapy equipment in

783
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:54,520
Speaker 2: your home. You can afford that, even rooms dedicated just

784
00:46:54,560 --> 00:47:00,279
Speaker 2: to getting therapeutic massages, and you can also hire a masseuse.

785
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:03,960
Speaker 1: A professional massuse, which she did have. He paid her

786
00:47:03,960 --> 00:47:06,400
Speaker 1: one hundred dollars an hour. There you go, so he

787
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:07,760
Speaker 1: had a professional messuse.

788
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:11,879
Speaker 2: Yes, there are your massages that you're passionate about, enjoy them.

789
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:16,719
Speaker 1: So we shall also note that computers and hardware were

790
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:19,320
Speaker 1: missing in the mansion.

791
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:21,399
Speaker 2: In two thousand and five when the Palm Beach investigators

792
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:21,680
Speaker 2: were to.

793
00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:27,319
Speaker 1: Be taken out pretty quickly, so that's two thousand and five.

794
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:30,600
Speaker 1: They're fighting this in court. As as we said earlier,

795
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:34,520
Speaker 1: the head detective on the cases like we have this,

796
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:37,120
Speaker 1: this is five by five, this is buttoned up, this

797
00:47:37,200 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 1: is game over, you know what I mean. Yeah, But

798
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:43,080
Speaker 1: then quickly what he sees is that there are there's

799
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:49,319
Speaker 1: a network of things, institutions and people stymying the investigation.

800
00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:58,520
Speaker 1: And this is where our previous cast member, Acosta makes.

801
00:47:58,320 --> 00:48:00,560
Speaker 2: A return, good old Alex Costa.

802
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:05,280
Speaker 1: Remember we said he was a state attorney there for Florida.

803
00:48:06,239 --> 00:48:10,960
Speaker 1: He started meeting with Epstein's team, who had such legal

804
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:17,719
Speaker 1: luminaries Zalan Derschwitz, Kenneth Starr from the Clinton investigation. Where

805
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:22,719
Speaker 1: these guys are in terms of their legal reputation, these

806
00:48:22,760 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 1: are very, very influential and prominent lawyers and legal minds.

807
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:31,879
Speaker 1: So Acosta and his team eventually, in two thousand and eight,

808
00:48:31,920 --> 00:48:37,040
Speaker 1: they strike a secret deal with Epstein to shield him

809
00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:41,439
Speaker 1: from federal investigation and prosecution. The victims were not made

810
00:48:41,440 --> 00:48:44,239
Speaker 1: aware of this agreement. It was called a quote non

811
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:47,759
Speaker 1: prosecution deal. Acosta and his team at the time were

812
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:52,120
Speaker 1: in possession of a fifty three page draft indictment charging

813
00:48:52,160 --> 00:49:01,160
Speaker 1: Epstein with serial child abuse child molestation. Instead, he took instead, Acosta,

814
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 1: acting on behalf of the US government, keep in mind,

815
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:14,000
Speaker 1: gave Epstein. This this deal in instead of quurte essentially

816
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:19,120
Speaker 1: immunity pretty much and worse than immunity. So Epstein pled

817
00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:25,840
Speaker 1: guilty to two state level prostitution charges, so not sex trafficking,

818
00:49:25,920 --> 00:49:29,719
Speaker 1: prostitution charges. They essentially made him a john. And what

819
00:49:29,840 --> 00:49:31,160
Speaker 1: did he get in exchange for that?

820
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:35,279
Speaker 3: And man, I mean talk about a sweetheart deal. This

821
00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:41,240
Speaker 3: is a lot immunity from all related federal criminal charges,

822
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:45,640
Speaker 3: not only for himself, but also for any quote, any

823
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:49,040
Speaker 3: potential co conspirators, royalty.

824
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:53,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, oh my god, the President.

825
00:49:53,640 --> 00:49:57,000
Speaker 3: Anyone who might have been involved in these alleged federal crimes.

826
00:49:57,640 --> 00:50:03,799
Speaker 3: This provision would effectively completely shut down any FBI investigation,

827
00:50:04,400 --> 00:50:10,319
Speaker 3: any further investigation into the evidence, the overwhelming evidence, the

828
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:11,880
Speaker 3: piles of evidence.

829
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 2: Of international sex trafficking.

830
00:50:14,160 --> 00:50:18,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, and essentially make it retroactively legal for anyone to

831
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:23,160
Speaker 3: have conspired with him to rape any of the alleged victims.

832
00:50:23,480 --> 00:50:25,280
Speaker 2: Good god.

833
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 1: He did get jail time. He got a thirteen month sentence.

834
00:50:29,680 --> 00:50:33,640
Speaker 1: He served it in a private wing of the county jail,

835
00:50:35,160 --> 00:50:38,600
Speaker 1: and he was there except for the six days a

836
00:50:38,640 --> 00:50:42,520
Speaker 1: week when he was on work release. He would he

837
00:50:42,600 --> 00:50:46,120
Speaker 1: went to he commuted to his private office for twelve hours,

838
00:50:47,480 --> 00:50:50,480
Speaker 1: and his sentence was eighteen months, but he just served thirteen.

839
00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:55,000
Speaker 1: There was also we mentioned this earlier, but there was

840
00:50:55,040 --> 00:51:00,800
Speaker 1: also this important legal snag. There was a commitment verified

841
00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:04,840
Speaker 1: through email chain, that this agreement would be kept secret

842
00:51:04,920 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 1: from the people identifying as victims, so that they would

843
00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:15,480
Speaker 1: not have the opportunity to protest this extraordinary agreement in court.

844
00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:19,160
Speaker 1: And that's despite the fact that keeping a plea agreement

845
00:51:19,200 --> 00:51:23,040
Speaker 1: secret from victims is a violation of the law and

846
00:51:23,080 --> 00:51:25,360
Speaker 1: it should go without saying, this is not the typical

847
00:51:25,719 --> 00:51:31,240
Speaker 1: plea deal. For his part, Acosta and his team would

848
00:51:31,320 --> 00:51:37,000
Speaker 1: later say, all right, we caved on this agreement, but

849
00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:40,279
Speaker 1: we did it because we were being harassed by Epstein's

850
00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:46,560
Speaker 1: high powered legal team. They hired private investigators to defame witnesses,

851
00:51:47,360 --> 00:51:52,600
Speaker 1: to dive into personal lives. They said they felt physically threatened. However,

852
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:58,000
Speaker 1: emails and documents show the lie here. The relationship between

853
00:51:58,239 --> 00:52:03,759
Speaker 1: federal prosecutors in Epstein's was more collaborative than adversarial. They

854
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:07,880
Speaker 1: spent a lot of time figuring out how to settle

855
00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:11,600
Speaker 1: the case with the smallest amount of scandal. They even

856
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:15,000
Speaker 1: decided not to charge them with the sex offense, they

857
00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:19,640
Speaker 1: considered witness tampering and obstruction charges and misdemeanors, and they

858
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 1: wanted to allow Epstein to secretly plead guilty in Miami

859
00:52:22,640 --> 00:52:25,520
Speaker 1: instead of Palm Beach County, where the victims lived, because

860
00:52:25,560 --> 00:52:28,160
Speaker 1: that would limit media exposure and it would make it

861
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:32,880
Speaker 1: less likely for the victims to appear at sentencing. And

862
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:36,400
Speaker 1: they also in these emails, again leaked by the Herald,

863
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:40,400
Speaker 1: they also referenced discussions they wanted to have by phone

864
00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:43,839
Speaker 1: or in person, so there wasn't a paper trail. And

865
00:52:45,400 --> 00:52:50,480
Speaker 1: this agreement, this non prosecution agreement, sealed until after it

866
00:52:50,520 --> 00:52:54,719
Speaker 1: was approved by a judge, made it virtually impossible for

867
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:58,879
Speaker 1: anyone to interfere, including Edwards, the attorney. This all came

868
00:52:58,920 --> 00:53:03,200
Speaker 1: to public attention with the Miami Herald released a comprehensive, damning,

869
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:07,120
Speaker 1: groundbreaking investigation of Epstein's activities and the Pleat deal and

870
00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:10,320
Speaker 1: the corruption and the long term damage to the underage victims.

871
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:14,879
Speaker 1: Yet at this point there's very little indication that that

872
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:19,440
Speaker 1: deal will be thrown out or reneged upon, because he

873
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:25,600
Speaker 1: already fulfilled his part of the agreement. And I guess

874
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:30,480
Speaker 1: we just have to emphasize how extraordinary. It is that

875
00:53:30,520 --> 00:53:33,759
Speaker 1: there's a federal agreement that says, not only do you

876
00:53:33,800 --> 00:53:36,600
Speaker 1: have to do this, not only are suddenly now calling

877
00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:41,080
Speaker 1: abused children prostitutes, which itself is an offensive term, right,

878
00:53:41,480 --> 00:53:43,879
Speaker 1: because that's they're trying to be defamatory. Believe the correct

879
00:53:43,960 --> 00:53:44,840
Speaker 1: term is sex worker.

880
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:45,239
Speaker 2: Right.

881
00:53:46,360 --> 00:53:50,960
Speaker 1: So not only are they doing that, but they're also saying,

882
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:56,279
Speaker 1: if any potential co conspirator worked with you, then they're

883
00:53:56,360 --> 00:53:58,600
Speaker 1: scott free. Yeah, scott free.

884
00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:00,840
Speaker 3: Just by association, like even if they weren't named, like

885
00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:01,959
Speaker 3: they were discovered later.

886
00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:07,479
Speaker 2: Those are the real This is my This is my take.

887
00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:11,040
Speaker 2: It's not about Jeffrey Epstein, and it's not about the

888
00:54:11,080 --> 00:54:15,440
Speaker 2: billions and billions of dollars that he manages. It's about

889
00:54:15,640 --> 00:54:19,280
Speaker 2: the high powered people. In my opinion, this is not proven.

890
00:54:19,719 --> 00:54:22,560
Speaker 2: The high powered people that took trips with him on

891
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:26,400
Speaker 2: that Lolita Express, the high powered people they got massages

892
00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:30,520
Speaker 2: other than Jeffrey Epstein. That's why he got that deal. No,

893
00:54:30,600 --> 00:54:31,200
Speaker 2: I think you're right.

894
00:54:31,239 --> 00:54:33,400
Speaker 3: I mean, because it's just it makes no sense. And

895
00:54:33,440 --> 00:54:36,400
Speaker 3: I believe the lawyer that got him that deal is

896
00:54:36,440 --> 00:54:38,800
Speaker 3: now a member of Trump's cabinet.

897
00:54:38,960 --> 00:54:41,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, Alex Cossa's Secretary of Labor.

898
00:54:41,120 --> 00:54:45,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean once you start getting into those circles,

899
00:54:45,640 --> 00:54:49,719
Speaker 3: those those power circles, there is just so much insulation

900
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:53,479
Speaker 3: that can happen. Favors owed, you know, from high up

901
00:54:53,719 --> 00:54:56,200
Speaker 3: politicians or law enforcement or whatever, and people.

902
00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:58,600
Speaker 2: Call that stuff in it it's real. This is not

903
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:03,880
Speaker 2: tinfoil hat stuff, not imaginary. These people have immunity to

904
00:55:04,080 --> 00:55:09,319
Speaker 2: future international sex trafficking. They have immunity to anything that

905
00:55:09,600 --> 00:55:13,319
Speaker 2: they would catch them up in that And it's like,

906
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:18,080
Speaker 2: it's ten years since two thousand and eight he spent

907
00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:21,080
Speaker 2: his time in prison. Do you guys really think all

908
00:55:21,080 --> 00:55:24,319
Speaker 2: of this, any of this has stopped. I mean, the

909
00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:28,080
Speaker 2: guy is probably under surveillance of some sort, even though

910
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:30,640
Speaker 2: well would he be, because why would you spend your

911
00:55:30,640 --> 00:55:34,080
Speaker 2: money if you're even the FBI or even the CIA

912
00:55:34,200 --> 00:55:37,440
Speaker 2: looking at international stuff going on, which I guess I

913
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:39,360
Speaker 2: don't know how that works with the Virgin Islands because

914
00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:42,320
Speaker 2: technically aren't they part of the United States?

915
00:55:42,760 --> 00:55:44,000
Speaker 1: The US Virgin Islands.

916
00:55:44,040 --> 00:55:51,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, yeah, it's just it's so infuriating to think

917
00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:56,319
Speaker 2: that this kind of terrible abuse is occurring and is

918
00:55:56,360 --> 00:56:01,160
Speaker 2: allowed to occur, and it's simply because have money and

919
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:02,480
Speaker 2: tremendous power.

920
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:05,560
Speaker 1: So maybe an act of Congress could change it, could

921
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:12,520
Speaker 1: trigger it, you know, maybe just legally speaking. Legally speaking,

922
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:17,359
Speaker 1: it's tough to get this. I mean, the DOJ is

923
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:27,440
Speaker 1: in this. You know. I hesitate so often to accuse

924
00:56:27,600 --> 00:56:31,879
Speaker 1: people of operating in large groups and lockstep because, as

925
00:56:31,880 --> 00:56:37,319
Speaker 1: we know, groups of people stink at cooperation after a

926
00:56:37,320 --> 00:56:41,960
Speaker 1: certain threshold has reached. But while we were working on this,

927
00:56:42,160 --> 00:56:48,080
Speaker 1: and while we're looking into it, I honestly started to wonder,

928
00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:53,080
Speaker 1: you know, will there be consequences for us for making

929
00:56:53,120 --> 00:56:57,960
Speaker 1: this episode interesting? Which I rarely think about. And you know,

930
00:56:58,560 --> 00:57:02,080
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody cares what we have to say

931
00:57:02,120 --> 00:57:03,799
Speaker 1: about this, but we do want to get this out

932
00:57:03,840 --> 00:57:08,440
Speaker 1: in the public sphere because regardless of what actually happened,

933
00:57:08,480 --> 00:57:14,160
Speaker 1: even if you want to take this entities side and

934
00:57:14,280 --> 00:57:17,280
Speaker 1: say that this was some sort of hit piece or

935
00:57:17,360 --> 00:57:18,800
Speaker 1: something like that.

936
00:57:18,960 --> 00:57:22,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, since two thousand and five and before that, sure, since.

937
00:57:22,600 --> 00:57:26,480
Speaker 1: The eighties, something happened, Something happened. There wouldn't be a

938
00:57:26,520 --> 00:57:34,320
Speaker 1: deal like that. If there wasn't pernicious, horrific stuff there.

939
00:57:34,760 --> 00:57:38,000
Speaker 1: Powerful people needed to be Powerful people are conspiring right

940
00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:47,600
Speaker 1: and closing ranks. This is infuriating. This is infuriating. We

941
00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:50,840
Speaker 1: want to hear what you think. Thank you for listening.

942
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:55,800
Speaker 1: We want to know what you believe would be the

943
00:57:55,840 --> 00:58:01,200
Speaker 1: next step for a legitimate investigation which did not occur

944
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:05,320
Speaker 1: right at least on Uncle Sam's part. We want to

945
00:58:05,360 --> 00:58:07,880
Speaker 1: know how far you think this goes. We want to

946
00:58:07,960 --> 00:58:10,080
Speaker 1: know who else you think is involved, who are those

947
00:58:10,160 --> 00:58:16,360
Speaker 1: unnamed potential co conspirators, And most importantly want you to

948
00:58:16,440 --> 00:58:19,840
Speaker 1: know that, as we say in any episode that deals

949
00:58:19,880 --> 00:58:26,680
Speaker 1: with the horror of abuse, that if you are if

950
00:58:26,720 --> 00:58:30,600
Speaker 1: you have found yourself in that situation, or if you

951
00:58:30,640 --> 00:58:34,480
Speaker 1: know someone that is in a situation like that, you

952
00:58:34,680 --> 00:58:38,320
Speaker 1: are not alone. You are not powerless. There are people

953
00:58:38,720 --> 00:58:42,200
Speaker 1: who are there to help and support you. You can

954
00:58:42,240 --> 00:58:46,080
Speaker 1: call one eight hundred sixty five six four six seven three.

955
00:58:46,160 --> 00:58:49,480
Speaker 1: That's one eight hundred sixty five six hope and contact

956
00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:52,520
Speaker 1: people at the National Sexual Assault Telephone Hotline.

957
00:58:53,920 --> 00:58:58,880
Speaker 2: I don't know what else to say here. That's thank you,

958
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:03,960
Speaker 2: Ben for that. If you want to learn more, literally,

959
00:59:04,080 --> 00:59:06,760
Speaker 2: just do some Google searches. The Guardian is a good

960
00:59:06,760 --> 00:59:12,040
Speaker 2: place to start. Like we said in New York mag Miami, Harold,

961
00:59:12,080 --> 00:59:14,240
Speaker 2: there are a bunch of places where you if you

962
00:59:14,280 --> 00:59:16,560
Speaker 2: want to continue to follow this story.

963
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:19,400
Speaker 3: You can, and I will say that there's some hope

964
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:22,400
Speaker 3: here because we're obviously in a time where powerful men

965
00:59:22,440 --> 00:59:25,480
Speaker 3: are getting taken to task more so than we've seen

966
00:59:25,480 --> 00:59:28,360
Speaker 3: in the past, certainly, but it still feels like once

967
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:31,480
Speaker 3: you get when you're at a certain level, it's very hard,

968
00:59:31,800 --> 00:59:33,440
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, It's very hard to actually

969
00:59:33,480 --> 00:59:35,520
Speaker 3: make people answer for their crimes, even if it's all

970
00:59:35,600 --> 00:59:37,560
Speaker 3: laid out on the table like this, which is which

971
00:59:37,600 --> 00:59:39,480
Speaker 3: is the most gut wrenching part of this story. That

972
00:59:39,520 --> 00:59:41,920
Speaker 3: it's like there's no doubt in anyone's mind of this

973
00:59:41,960 --> 00:59:44,560
Speaker 3: stuff happened. And like you said, Matt, when you know

974
00:59:45,520 --> 00:59:47,880
Speaker 3: back in the circulation, aside from maybe keeping his nose

975
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:51,240
Speaker 3: clean to appease his handlers for a little while, you know,

976
00:59:51,520 --> 00:59:54,640
Speaker 3: this is a man that has a mission. He's driven

977
00:59:54,920 --> 00:59:57,960
Speaker 3: to behave this way, and the fact that he's allowed

978
00:59:58,000 --> 00:59:58,520
Speaker 3: to be out in.

979
01:00:01,000 --> 01:00:06,439
Speaker 2: Makes me sick, all right? So what do you think?

980
01:00:07,040 --> 01:00:10,680
Speaker 2: Right to us? Find us on social media where conspiracy

981
01:00:10,680 --> 01:00:14,439
Speaker 2: stuff in most places, conspiracy stuff show on Instagram, Join

982
01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:17,040
Speaker 2: us on Facebook and our group. Here's where it gets crazy.

983
01:00:17,160 --> 01:00:19,440
Speaker 2: If you want to get into a discussion about this.

984
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:25,960
Speaker 2: It'll be a difficult one for our mods. Sorry everyone,

985
01:00:26,200 --> 01:00:29,840
Speaker 2: but let's just you know, let's try and have a

986
01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:36,040
Speaker 2: conversation about this that isn't that it doesn't turn into

987
01:00:36,040 --> 01:00:38,640
Speaker 2: a flame war because nothing. We don't have to turn

988
01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:42,240
Speaker 2: discussions about something as word as this into just being

989
01:00:42,280 --> 01:00:44,840
Speaker 2: angry at each other. Let's try and figure out something.

990
01:00:45,120 --> 01:00:47,080
Speaker 2: So let's go have a discussion on here's where it

991
01:00:47,080 --> 01:00:49,480
Speaker 2: gets crazy on Facebook. If you don't want to do that,

992
01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:52,440
Speaker 2: and that's the end of this classic episode. If you

993
01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:56,600
Speaker 2: have any thoughts or questions about this episode, you can

994
01:00:56,640 --> 01:00:59,240
Speaker 2: get into contact with us in a number of different ways.

995
01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:01,000
Speaker 2: One of the best is to give us a call.

996
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:05,200
Speaker 2: Our number is one eight three three st d WYTK.

997
01:01:05,680 --> 01:01:07,480
Speaker 2: If you don't want to do that, you can send

998
01:01:07,520 --> 01:01:08,880
Speaker 2: us a good old fashioned email.

999
01:01:09,160 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 1: We are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1000
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:15,560
Speaker 2: Stuff they don't want you to know is a production

1001
01:01:15,640 --> 01:01:20,200
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1002
01:01:20,280 --> 01:01:23,120
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.